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00:02:04 | petur | bah, I was one word wrong, the 1gb sandisk doesn't comply |
00:03:18 | amiconn | ehhhh... |
00:03:44 | amiconn | Our 'force pio mode' setting checks a rather arbitrary bit... |
00:03:53 | amiconn | It's doing so for years though |
00:04:11 | amiconn | 4 years to be precise |
00:05:10 | petur | all these feature bits are 'not to be depended on' |
00:05:25 | petur | so what do we use.... lousy spec |
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00:06:29 | amiconn | According to the ata specs those words are valid if the indicator bits are set approrpiately |
00:06:46 | petur | for pio modes we should look at word 64 |
00:07:04 | amiconn | Word 64 lists the modes, but not whether modes can be set |
00:07:27 | petur | 'Word 64: Advanced PIO transfer modes supported' |
00:07:32 | amiconn | Modes can always be set, hence there is no indicator bit for that, and Linus used a bit that's (nearly) guaranteed to be 1 |
00:10:07 | petur | so we should check the indicator bits before usin g words 82-84 |
00:11:02 | amiconn | Perhaps. But that a-data card does indicate words 82..84 as valid |
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00:11:17 | petur | yes (I was just typing that) |
00:11:29 | amiconn | Words 85..87 are indicated as invalid though |
00:12:23 | petur | maybe nobody bothers to use advanced powermanagement... |
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00:12:59 | * | petur is doing a battery benchmark on his H10 with and without to see the difference |
00:13:45 | amiconn | H10 is probably a bad target for that test |
00:13:57 | petur | contrary |
00:14:02 | amiconn | Those microdrive do at least partially implement the cf standard |
00:14:26 | amiconn | And on cf apm probably doesn't matter because cf power management is pretty much automatic |
00:14:27 | petur | I am testing the patch that disables powermanagement for CF |
00:14:48 | petur | so I want to know if this influences H10 |
00:15:04 | petur | because the microdrive reports as CF |
00:15:07 | amiconn | It could also influence the mini, or the mrobe100, you never know |
00:15:30 | amiconn | No, it doesn't |
00:15:57 | petur | still need a nano owner to test the modified soft_reset |
00:16:06 | amiconn | The CF signature is word 0 == 0x848A according to the standard |
00:16:25 | amiconn | And the H10's drive reports 0x0C5A |
00:16:47 | petur | I mean the new check which looks at the sector count |
00:16:52 | * | amiconn wants to see this cf check removed |
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00:17:08 | petur | sure.... me too |
00:17:38 | petur | why do you think I bother trying and testing stuff? |
00:18:07 | amiconn | At least in the form of checking words which aren't actually related to the problematic features |
00:18:58 | amiconn | Btw, all the CF cards in the list either report to support the CFA feature set (word 83 bit 2), or have an invalid word 83 |
00:19:15 | amiconn | That also applies to the darn microdrives though |
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00:24:41 | amiconn | There must be a way to reliably distinguish CF and HDD. The CF standard also specifies PIO modes 5 and 6. The ATA standard does not (not even ATA-7) |
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00:27:29 | petur | hear hear |
00:27:42 | petur | you wanted the cf check removed... |
00:28:09 | amiconn | I still want that if at all possible |
00:28:48 | * | petur has an attention problem, looking at a documentary of The Smiths at the same time ;) |
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00:30:39 | * | scorche|sh wonders if petur is a shoplifter |
00:31:26 | petur | no, but devconpub must have caused some panic in the streets of london :p |
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00:33:07 | amiconn | Btw, what's the effect of the apm feature set operation failing? |
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00:33:27 | petur | ABRT |
00:33:38 | petur | 0x04 |
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00:35:05 | amiconn | eh? |
00:35:49 | petur | yes, and SENSE returns 0x1F (unsupported) |
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00:38:25 | amiconn | hmm |
00:38:51 | petur | urgh wrong. it is 'Data Transfer Error / Aborted Command' |
00:40:15 | * | petur moves closer to a power socket. laptop and target both low on battery |
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00:48:22 | petur | why doesn't features[] use a bitmask iso a bitnumber |
00:52:02 | amiconn | Compactness |
00:52:33 | amiconn | Right now one array element is 4 bytes, i.e. a power of 2 |
00:52:59 | petur | I mean use 0x08 and not 3 |
00:53:05 | amiconn | If you relace the bit number (char) with a mask (necessarily unsigned short), it becomes 5 bytes |
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00:53:33 | amiconn | And since that's not a power of 5, addressing array elements needs more code |
00:53:38 | petur | would have been easier to check the validate bits at the same time |
00:53:40 | amiconn | Ehh, a power of 2 |
00:53:58 | petur | ah well |
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00:54:13 | amiconn | That whole check should probably be redesigned based on those new findings |
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00:56:18 | amiconn | petur: What about using the validity bits for these feature *settings* (i.e. word 87 bits 15 and 14) for deciding whether to refrain from setting apm? |
00:56:51 | * | petur checks those values for hdd |
00:57:15 | amiconn | The hdds all have valid word 87 |
00:57:23 | amiconn | _including_ the microdrives |
00:57:29 | petur | hmmm |
00:57:48 | * | amiconn wants more values |
00:58:29 | amiconn | I only have one single CF card - an 1GB Sandisk Ultra II |
00:59:17 | petur | what about all those dumps in the wiki? |
00:59:24 | amiconn | Hmm, the Sandisk Ultra II 2GB in the list indicates word 87 as valid |
01:00 |
01:00:09 | petur | same as my sandisk 1GB |
01:00:13 | amiconn | Those are about a dozen cards and harddisks. Also, for most of them the "pwrmgt fails" column just says "?" |
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01:02:31 | petur | I wonder if the description of bit 3 of word 85 is a typo: talks about 'supported', not 'enabled' |
01:03:24 | amiconn | I am wondering the same, although ata-4, ata-5 and ata-7 all say "supported" |
01:03:26 | petur | those hdd dumps were taken after the set_features was executed :/ |
01:03:38 | amiconn | Yes of course |
01:03:57 | petur | also, word 85 is 0 for those sandisk cards... |
01:04:21 | amiconn | The bootloader already does that (how else would it load rockbox to do the dump?) |
01:04:29 | * | petur looks for a bit that must be set |
01:05:02 | * | amiconn curses thread.c, especially sleep_core() |
01:06:01 | amiconn | That function is one big FOREVER loop - and putting my alignment-changing 'nop's in there causes gcc to shuffle instructions all over |
01:09:27 | * | petur gives transcend x133 2GB a strange look. word 85 = 1 (supports smart???) |
01:09:28 | amiconn | So all I could find out is that the alignment problem is within that function, because correcting the alignment before this call makes it work, and after that call it fails (sleep_core() is inlined within switch_thread()) |
01:09:58 | amiconn | petur: It doesn't. Word 85 isn't valid according to word 87 |
01:10:36 | petur | hmmm my cf spec says nothing about word 87 :( |
01:10:50 | petur | oh it does |
01:11:11 | petur | that stuff should be in nice tables, not text |
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01:13:14 | * | amiconn wonders where the threading guru is when he needs him |
01:13:16 | amiconn | jhMikeS: ping |
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01:15:13 | Jessica464 | Hey folks. Anyone still have an old Archos Jukebox? |
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01:16:31 | pixelma | some do, just ask your actual question and see (have a bit patience too) |
01:17:17 | Jessica464 | I dropped 2500mAh niMH in my jukebox, but the battery life is like 25% what it used to be? any clues? The battery change happened at the same time i installed rockbox. |
01:17:48 | Jessica464 | i figured with 2500mAh the thing would run foreever |
01:18:23 | Jessica464 | Also, anyone replaced the 20GB HD with a newer 160GB? any issues doing so? |
01:19:17 | Jessica464 | thx for the tip, pix. Unfortunately, I catch my flight for Shenzhen in a few hours. At the mo, it seems like it is gonna be a silent flight. |
01:20:32 | amiconn | Did you try charging the batteries in an external charger and check runtime? |
01:20:51 | pixelma | also those high capacity cells often suffer from high self discharge (there is a new generation out there that doesn't) |
01:20:57 | amiconn | Also, what jukebox is that, Player/Studio or Recorder? |
01:20:58 | Jessica464 | doing that now, but I don't know if they'll fully cook b4 i need to leave. |
01:21:04 | Jessica464 | recorder |
01:21:36 | scorche|sh | Jessica464: i have replaced it with a 160, but keep in mind that unless you enable LBA48 support, you will only get 128/137 GiB/GB |
01:21:39 | amiconn | Could be that our charging algorithm doesn't fully charge the batteries. What rockbox build are you running? |
01:22:10 | Jessica464 | hmmm... not sure on the build. lemme check |
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01:25:30 | Jessica464 | the date is 7/24/07 |
01:25:35 | Jessica464 | on my RB build |
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01:26:23 | amiconn | Umm, that's old.... although, it's at least not the 2.5 release from the rockbox stone age |
01:26:34 | Jessica464 | are niMH ok, or should I be using nicad? |
01:26:51 | amiconn | Regarding the high self-discharge rate of high capacity NiMH - I'd recommend everyone to use the new generation cells instead. They are "only" avaliable as 2100mAh cells (Sanyo: 2000mAh), but lengths better than ordinary high capacity cells |
01:26:52 | jhMikeS | amiconn: yez |
01:27:01 | scorche|sh | Jessica464: NiMH only |
01:27:25 | Jessica464 | ok scor |
01:27:26 | * | amiconn experienced ordinary high capacity cells emptyig themselves within 1..2 days |
01:28:01 | Jessica464 | i'm getting 2~3 hours from these 2500mAHs!!!! |
01:28:09 | | Part toffe82 |
01:28:34 | amiconn | Directly after charging? |
01:28:39 | scorche|sh | that definitely seems off if they are brand new...can you get longer runtimes by putting in your old betteries? |
01:29:05 | Jessica464 | amicon, yes |
01:29:22 | Jessica464 | scor: they were new when i put them in the archos |
01:29:32 | Jessica464 | i had to recycle the old ones |
01:30:33 | scorche|sh | Jessica464: well, it *could* be other things as well, but testing different batteries is the easiest thing to check |
01:30:54 | Jessica464 | yeah, shame i have only a couple of hours... |
01:31:04 | Jessica464 | and no other batteries! |
01:32:22 | * | jhMikeS read what amiconn said and experiences a 'wtf' moment |
01:33:01 | amiconn | jhMikeS: Regarding what part? |
01:33:17 | scorche|sh | the charging algorithym? |
01:33:28 | petur | Jessica464: get some non-rechargeables at the airport? |
01:33:49 | scorche|sh | Jessica464: and if you get non-rechargables, make sure not to accidently charge them ;) |
01:33:55 | jhMikeS | amiconn: putting nops in sleep_core having the effect you reported. I think at first commit the function was in IRAM. |
01:33:57 | Jessica464 | pet: like alcaline? |
01:33:57 | pixelma | that could be dangerous if one then inserts a charger... |
01:33:59 | petur | scorche|sh: the threading problem |
01:34:07 | scorche|sh | ah |
01:34:37 | saratoga | jhMikeS: someone suggested you knew something about why the backlight might be very slow to active lately? |
01:34:38 | amiconn | I tracked down the location where the PP5002 obviously originates, but unfortunately it's not very precise, because I cannot put nops *into* sleep_core() without making gcc shuffling instructions all around |
01:35:11 | amiconn | But why does *code* alignment have an effect at all? And why there? |
01:35:41 | amiconn | petur, Jessica464: Alkalines shouldn't be used in the archos |
01:36:07 | jhMikeS | saratoga: it's the priority and a side effect of actually fixing the scheduling. I'd suggest just making it a normal UI prority thread for the time being. |
01:36:12 | Jessica464 | ami, then what non-rechareables should I use? |
01:36:37 | petur | Jessica464: seems I gave wrong advice then... |
01:36:48 | amiconn | Jessica464: None. The archos jukeboxes are designed to run from NiMH. Other batteries will either work poorly, or not at all |
01:36:58 | saratoga | jhMikeS: how are thread priorities adjusted? I'd like to play with this a bit |
01:37:15 | Jessica464 | ok. so it's rechargeables or nuthin |
01:37:49 | Jessica464 | anyone know what voltage and current I should be charging the archos with? |
01:37:55 | scorche|sh | amiconn: i would think lithium would sate the power demands just fine, no? |
01:38:03 | jhMikeS | amiconn: that's weird. Now that you found that I'm brainstorming for an answer on that. |
01:38:05 | amiconn | Most probably not |
01:38:22 | scorche|sh | why not? |
01:38:41 | jhMikeS | saratoga: the create_thread call in backlight.c inside IF_PRIO() |
01:38:50 | amiconn | scorche: The circuitry is designed for the typical openloop voltage of NiMH cells, i.e. 4x 1.2V. Non-rechargeables start at 1.5V |
01:39:07 | jhMikeS | saratoga: use PRIORITY_USER_INTERFACE |
01:39:13 | amiconn | And the jukeboxes need cells with a very low impedance, because of the high hdd spinup current |
01:39:39 | scorche|sh | yes...the lithium should be fine with regards to impedance |
01:39:55 | saratoga | jhMikeS: instead of "PRIORITY_SYSTEM"? |
01:40:16 | jhMikeS | saratoga: yes |
01:40:22 | Jessica464 | lithium wont charge properly in a device designed to charge nimh, will it? |
01:40:37 | scorche|sh | Jessica464: no...i am talking just about usage |
01:40:57 | saratoga | putting lithium in anything but a lithium charger will probably result in an on fire battery |
01:41:06 | Jessica464 | ok |
01:41:30 | Jessica464 | so, for niMH in an archos rockbox, what voltage and current should I charge it at? |
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01:44:13 | saratoga | jhMikeS: that fix seems to have worked fairly well |
01:44:14 | amiconn | When charging them in the device, you should either use the original charger (9V unregulated), or a *regulated* 12V charger. Less won't fully charge the batteries, more will produce unnecessary heat and eventually break the charging circuit |
01:44:15 | * | jhMikeS has to get this priority inheritance done and it's the hardest piece and most time-consuming of programming undertaken yet but what's done works extremely well (and as a bonus alot of kernel stuff is more simple) |
01:44:22 | saratoga | takes about half a second to come on now |
01:44:28 | saratoga | instead of the 2-5 seconds before |
01:44:45 | amiconn | If you charge them externally, use a proper NiMH charger |
01:45:47 | Jessica464 | ami, but at what current? |
01:45:54 | jhMikeS | saratoga: with the changes I've made (somewhat of a 2nd-pass rewrite), even at PRIORITY_SYSTEM, the backlight delay is hardly perceivable :) |
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01:46:48 | * | amiconn managed to track down the crash location a bit further |
01:46:50 | amiconn | jhMikeS: The problem must be somewhere between start of sleep_core(), and the core_sleep() call (line 1466) |
01:47:08 | amiconn | core_sleep() is asm, so I could sneak in 2 extra nops without gcc going wild |
01:48:41 | saratoga | jhMikeS: these are going to be committed relatively soon? |
01:48:58 | saratoga | i'm wondering if its worth working around this issue in SVN in the meantime |
01:49:33 | amiconn | There are 55 instrucitons between the 2 known points |
01:49:56 | jhMikeS | saratoga: I'd just commit it. Really I think all UI-based threads should be equal since they're expected to response well to input. |
01:50:08 | saratoga | ok will do |
01:50:34 | jhMikeS | amiconn: you put nops both at the start and the end? |
01:50:41 | amiconn | yes |
01:51:16 | jhMikeS | that code didn't even exist for PP5002 at the initial commit though. that only came with finishing dual-core support there and the same problem creeps in even if it's the C reference version. |
01:52:04 | amiconn | I first tested the effect of a varying number of nops in main(). With my current build, 0 or 3 nops work fine, 1 or 2 nops make it crash. The effects are modulo-4 |
01:52:38 | amiconn | Then I put 4 nops into main() - everything ok. Then I started moving 2 of the 4 nops around the code. |
01:52:43 | Jessica464 | ami: do you know the current i should be charging this thing at? |
01:53:21 | amiconn | If I moved them too far to the end, it was crashing, moved them back to the beginning, worked again etc (bisecting) |
01:53:37 | amiconn | Jessica464: The current will be determined by the device. |
01:53:55 | amiconn | YOur charger should be capable of providing at least 400mA |
01:54:12 | amiconn | All this must be somewhere in the wiki |
01:54:28 | Jessica464 | err... i no longer have the original charger, and there is no spec on the archos itself. |
01:55:16 | amiconn | jhMikeS: I finally found that putting the nops *directly* before the sleep_core() call in switch_thread(), it works, and if I put them directly after that call, it crashes |
01:55:24 | amiconn | (sleep_core() is inlined) |
01:55:30 | Jessica464 | is there a wiki for the archos? |
01:56:11 | amiconn | And the tiny bit further I got is that if I put the nops into core_sleep() it still crashes, so the problem must be before that |
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01:59:07 | petur | amiconn: uploaded a new CF patch that should be committable, feel free to comment (no hurry) http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8644 |
01:59:15 | amiconn | jhMikeS: http://pastebin.ca/931215 is the whole, inlined sleep_core(). The problem must be somewhere between the beginning and 0x4404c |
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02:00 |
02:00:07 | petur | amiconn: my mk8007gah still reports powermanagement in word 85 even if not set, so looks good :) |
02:00:32 | amiconn | The bootloader would set it... |
02:00:49 | petur | argh... right :/ |
02:01:13 | petur | will play with that tomorrow - bedtime now |
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02:02:55 | jhMikeS | amiconn: why do you cut it off at the nops in core_sleep? |
02:03:04 | amiconn | ? |
02:03:49 | jhMikeS | 0x4404c is the first nop of core_sleep assembly |
02:03:53 | amiconn | yes |
02:04:27 | amiconn | And if I put the 2 extra nops there (my only chance to put extra nops into sleep_core()), it still crashes, so the problem must be before that |
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02:06:08 | amiconn | ...becasue my system of bisecting was designed so that the build crashes if the nops come after the alignment sensitive code, and does not crash if they come before that code |
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02:07:47 | * | amiconn realises that he can put the testing nops a little bit further up |
02:07:48 | jhMikeS | this is twilight zone stuff. 1) Why only PP5002 2) why there of all places |
02:08:52 | jhMikeS | hmmm...one thing happens there that happens nowhere else |
02:10:27 | jhMikeS | it's the place where context is whatever context exists at the time no threads are actually scheduled but it's running in the context of the last thread that became non-runnable |
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02:11:07 | amiconn | eh.... |
02:11:13 | amiconn | Seems we're lucky |
02:11:28 | amiconn | The problem seems to be *in* core_sleep() itself |
02:12:25 | amiconn | Now I'm moving the nops intsruction-by-instruction |
02:16:40 | jhMikeS | usage of str<cond>b instead of str<cond> to the processor control reg? <== big guess |
02:17:35 | * | amiconn suspects that one instructions and skips a few to hopefully get a result earlier |
02:18:10 | amiconn | Does the OF uses 32 bit accesses? |
02:18:13 | amiconn | *use |
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02:18:55 | * | jhMikeS is checking a disassembly if he can locate it |
02:22:02 | amiconn | OF uses either STRH or STR |
02:22:14 | amiconn | Some places also have 3 NOPs before *and* 3 NOPs after t |
02:22:19 | amiconn | *it |
02:22:39 | amiconn | Actually I checked 2nd Gen ROM code |
02:22:42 | jhMikeS | The pipeline seems to be a factor for that |
02:23:38 | jhMikeS | or prefetch. for example, a sleep write immediately followed by a wake write will actually not sleep because the next instruction gets executed after the sleep write before it sleeps |
02:24:20 | amiconn | It's definitely the streqb |
02:24:28 | amiconn | I'm trying streqh next |
02:24:57 | amiconn | If that doesn't help, I'll put 3 nops in front as well (and balance with further nops for my test) |
02:25:41 | jhMikeS | core_wake should also be altered then as well as the CORE_CTL definition |
02:25:48 | amiconn | meh, streqh doesn't like the addressing mode |
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02:27:30 | * | amiconn tries tsreq instead |
02:27:33 | amiconn | *streq |
02:28:58 | amiconn | It's not the byte access - streq also crashes |
02:31:23 | jhMikeS | but that instruction crashes or doesn't crash depending on whether the nops precede or follow? |
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02:33:10 | amiconn | It crashes or doesn't crash depending on how it's aligned |
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02:33:43 | jhMikeS | just the alignment of that one instruction? |
02:33:50 | amiconn | yes |
02:34:29 | jhMikeS | what precise alignment is needed for that? |
02:35:25 | jhMikeS | or did you imply 16 bytes? |
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02:36:27 | amiconn | It must be aligned at xxxxxx4 or xxxxxxx8 in order to work, if I didn't make a mistake |
02:38:58 | jhMikeS | possible to pad before/after with words? I know you can pad with specific byte values in gas. |
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02:46:28 | amiconn | The ROM seems to have this instruction at all possible alignments, although most instances handle the cop only |
02:47:34 | jhMikeS | the cop never has to see any of the thread code for the alignment crashing to surface |
02:48:02 | amiconn | Yes, but the cop also crashes if it's not aligned properly |
02:48:38 | amiconn | It alost seems there's something in the deisgn of the PP5002 that makes it transfer values from cpu_control to the PC |
02:48:51 | amiconn | I'fe seen crash addresses of 0xCF004084 several times now... |
02:49:53 | * | amiconn wonders whether the addressing mode using the shifter is involved |
02:50:08 | amiconn | But I need to stop experimenting for now and get some sleep |
02:50:34 | jhMikeS | the writes to the control register after the first DC commit didn't use that for pp5002 |
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05:12:50 | major_works | Is there a knowledgeable person on who could look at this and help me understand why it's causing a make to fail? |
05:12:54 | major_works | http://pastebin.com/ddaa336c |
05:18:22 | XavierGr | make sure to: have the latest source and update your repository, make clean, reconfigure |
05:18:49 | XavierGr | or even make veryclean |
05:18:59 | major_works | It was the latest source. There are patches applied, however. |
05:19:16 | JdGordon | svn up |
05:19:23 | JdGordon | looks like your not latest |
05:19:29 | JdGordon | or a patch is borken |
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05:20:06 | major_works | Oh yeah, I did have to hand-patch some stuff. Multifont for one; viewports for another. Both are out of sync at this point. |
05:20:39 | major_works | But it was a fairly straightforward hand patch, which is good, because I am not a coder by any stretch. |
05:21:24 | XavierGr | then type svn diff | patch -R to remove all differences and then svn up as JdGordon said |
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05:30:02 | major_works | I'll start over with your suggestions. thanks. |
05:31:07 | JdGordon | svn revert -R <path> is a better way to blow away all changes |
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07:49:19 | Llorean | Okay, in the last couple of days we've had about a half dozen reported data aborts on myriad PP targets on flyspray. |
07:49:44 | JdGordon | yeah, something has gone to shits! |
07:49:54 | | Nick JdGordon is now known as JdGordon|afk (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) |
07:50:38 | | Nick JdGordon|afk is now known as JdGordon (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) |
07:50:41 | Llorean | And the addresses look fairly random to me. At least, they cover a wide range |
07:53:15 | JdGordon | actually, I got a data abort yesterday also, but that was my first in _ages_ and it hasnt happened since |
07:54:15 | LinusN | "hyperdrive"... haha |
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07:55:10 | gidean | hi everyone.... |
07:55:17 | LinusN | that was a funny response, though i feel that we might have to be a little more polite when it comes to silly requests |
07:55:27 | LinusN | gidean: hi |
07:55:34 | Llorean | LinusN: I'm curious where, now. |
07:55:38 | gidean | just got a gigabeat f10 and installed rockbox...looks really good... |
07:56:03 | LinusN | Llorean: the feature request tracker, "USB audio" |
07:56:03 | gidean | then I erased something and now it gives me an error: no system found on HDD :( |
07:56:10 | gidean | any suggestions? |
07:56:16 | LinusN | Llorean: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8695 |
07:56:25 | krazykit | gidean, read the wiki for the recovery instructions for gigabeat |
07:56:42 | gidean | thanks krazykit! |
07:56:47 | JdGordon | LinusN: well even his suggestion was nonsence.. "maybe in the far future... "! |
07:56:57 | Llorean | Ah, closed before it got to my RSS reader. |
07:57:02 | krazykit | gidean, http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/GigabeatFXPort#Gigabeat_Recovery_Procedures |
07:57:17 | LinusN | JdGordon: sure it was nonsense, but meybe he didn't realize that himself |
07:58:12 | Llorean | Actually, for SWUSB targets it's not terribly nonsense, but the request itself was kinda... not requesty. I think we actually may have an outstanding request for that anyway. |
07:58:25 | * | LinusN makes note to self, "it's spelled MAYBE" |
07:58:45 | gidean | One more Q: I don't have the disk... can I find GBSYSTEM? |
07:58:59 | * | Llorean wants his SWUSB targets to all serve as USB displays for Windows Sideshow. |
07:59:12 | gidean | using linux BTW |
07:59:35 | krazykit | gidean, you might be able to use the blank gbsystem files linked immediately above that section. |
07:59:56 | gidean | sweet... |
07:59:57 | Llorean | But seriously, a mini-computer with input, display, audio output, and storage, with a fully under our control USB connection is kinda a flexible doodad. |
08:00 |
08:00:22 | LinusN | JdGordon, Llorean: still i think it would even be better to say "your request is ridiculous, because..." instead of just making fun of him |
08:01:01 | LinusN | especially since it actually might be feasible on some targets |
08:01:12 | Llorean | LinusN: Agreed entirely |
08:02:11 | Llorean | Or perhaps "Rockbox is an audio player firmware, and this feature doesn't really serve that purpose, as it's bypassing Rockbox entirely, so while technically possible, probably isn't suitable for the core" |
08:03:36 | Llorean | On a note unrelated entirely, does anyone know if we've any documented knowledge on 2G Nanos? |
08:04:39 | JdGordon | you guys are no fun :p but yeah ok, i agree |
08:04:51 | * | gidean sighs. |
08:05:02 | gidean | no dice, krazykit... |
08:05:07 | Llorean | They work |
08:05:09 | gidean | bricked |
08:05:16 | Llorean | You don't need any original toshiba files |
08:05:40 | Llorean | As long as you have those files, and Rockbox, in the proper places on your disk, the Gigabeat will boot unless you've damaged it somehow |
08:06:09 | | Quit perrikwp ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") |
08:06:33 | gidean | when on usb it shows the gigabeat usb image...as soon as I unplug: 00010070 no system found on HDD |
08:06:55 | Llorean | And you installed those files AND a Rockbox bootloader AND a Rockbox build? |
08:07:04 | gidean | I was trying to make room and inadvertinly deleted some imprtant stuff.. |
08:07:15 | gidean | used the auto install, yep |
08:07:23 | Llorean | That doesn't install those files. |
08:07:43 | Llorean | You should install those files, and do a manual install to verify all the necessary files exist |
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08:08:16 | gidean | ok...thanks. |
08:08:19 | gidean | brb |
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08:20:24 | markun | gidean: you just need to extract the fake GBSYSTEM zip and then copy the bootloader (FWIMG01.DAT) to GBSYSTEM\FWIMG |
08:21:54 | gidean | bootloader to GBSYSTEM\FWIMG? I'll try real quick.. |
08:22:11 | markun | http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/pub/Main/GigabeatFXPort/GBSYSTEM.zip and http://download.rockbox.org/bootloader/gigabeat/FWIMG01.DAT |
08:22:38 | gidean | ahhhh |
08:22:38 | markun | (extract the zip to your player) |
08:23:20 | markun | and no need for the recovery procedure when you get "no system found" because it enter USB mode, right? |
08:23:27 | gidean | yep |
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08:25:45 | markun | gidean: kkurbjun is working on our own bootloader in flash. It has a few advantages, one is that we don't need the GBSYSTEM folder anymore. |
08:26:55 | gidean | markun: it worked! Thanks so much! I was trying to make space on the GB from the CLI and deleted something I should have... |
08:27:02 | gidean | but Its better now! |
08:27:15 | gidean | Thanks to everyone who responded, too! |
08:27:26 | gidean | just to let everyone know what worked: |
08:29:10 | gidean | As per markun's instructions I copied the fake GBsystem to the player and added FWIMG01.DAT to GBSYSTEM\FWIMG |
08:29:22 | gidean | Again, thanks much! |
08:29:38 | * | Llorean is pretty sure that's what he said to do too. |
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08:30:56 | gidean | i guess you did...eitherway, thanks for the response :) |
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08:32:46 | markun | gidean: glad it worked |
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08:42:40 | markun | LinusN: USB audio is not so far fetched, is it? |
08:42:52 | markun | we've talked about it in here before. Don't see why it's closed. |
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08:48:06 | markun | can I reopen it? |
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08:57:13 | LinusN | markun: i believe it's feasible, i think you should repoen it |
08:57:29 | * | LinusN invents words on a daily basis |
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09:00:47 | amiconn | markun: USB audio? In what direction? |
09:01:07 | LinusN | amiconn: to rockbox |
09:01:23 | LinusN | to use rockbox as a usb audio card |
09:01:30 | amiconn | Hmm. What would that be good for? |
09:01:43 | LinusN | beats me :-) |
09:01:48 | * | petur knows |
09:02:05 | petur | to pirate music (record the output digitally) |
09:02:20 | Zagor | there's much easier ways to do that |
09:02:47 | petur | ok, then I don't know either... because the pc has a lousy audio card? |
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09:03:50 | petur | amiconn: I was thinking about that last CF test yesterday. The bootloader indeed sets the powermanagement, but after the first disk powerdown this is no longer the case, right? |
09:04:44 | LinusN | that is true if you cut the power |
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09:05:39 | petur | on h300, we do that |
09:05:57 | LinusN | petur: however, ata_power_on() calls set_features() again |
09:06:20 | petur | yes, but that will be my modified set_features() |
09:06:27 | petur | not the bootloader one |
09:06:46 | * | amiconn wonders what petur wants to do now |
09:06:55 | petur | the CF mod needs a new bootloader anyway because of this |
09:07:03 | LinusN | petur: but when does the bootloader spin down? |
09:07:18 | petur | amiconn: see my latest patch? |
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09:07:58 | petur | LinusN: this is just for testing, to read the identify info without powermanagement being set |
09:08:21 | petur | I now look at word 85 for powermanagement capability |
09:08:35 | LinusN | i read the irc log |
09:09:54 | petur | btw, I got svn bootloader working on my h380 by adding some printf before ata init... really beats me what is wrong there |
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09:13:38 | amiconn | petur: Identify info is only read once, at ata_init() |
09:14:01 | * | petur slaps forehead |
09:14:06 | amiconn | There is no disk poweroff between the bootloader setting the feature, and ata_init in main rockbox |
09:15:05 | amiconn | "Poor forehead, nobody likes him" ;) |
09:15:33 | * | petur waits until forehead logs in and beats back |
09:19:02 | LinusN | petur: you mean that it needs more time between power on and ata_init()? |
09:20:21 | petur | LinusN: it behaves very odd, and only when that disk is in that h300 - must gbe a timing issue. I also had it hang when inserting usb, which will be the same thing probably. |
09:20:35 | LinusN | ouch |
09:20:54 | petur | For some reason, current svn bootloader no longer boots rockbox _at_all_ on my h380 |
09:20:56 | LinusN | you mean it works in a different h300? |
09:21:09 | petur | after devcon07 it still was 50% |
09:21:27 | petur | yes, I did the test once |
09:21:34 | | Quit aliask ("ChatZilla 0.9.81 [Firefox 2.0.0.12/2008020710]") |
09:22:21 | LinusN | btw, the mk1011gah with zif adapter will not fit in an h300 |
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09:22:58 | petur | no problem, by the time I need a bigger disk, I'll get an 128GB CF card ;) |
09:23:31 | petur | it is a pitty though |
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09:23:38 | petur | oh no |
09:23:44 | * | petur ducks |
09:24:00 | * | forehead attacks |
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09:25:06 | LinusN | :-) |
09:26:05 | petur | LinusN: some people at taperssection have expressed interest in that zif adapter, I hope the mailinglist poster finds a way for people to order... |
09:26:10 | amiconn | LinusN: What about the X5? |
09:26:19 | petur | or maybe they'll show up on ebay |
09:26:37 | LinusN | amiconn: i don't have an x5l to try with |
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09:27:06 | amiconn | Why an L? |
09:27:52 | * | petur rad that as 51 (fifty-one) |
09:27:55 | petur | *read |
09:28:33 | petur | the L only has a bigger battery, no bigger disk, right |
09:28:41 | amiconn | LinusN: How much length does the adapter add? |
09:29:12 | amiconn | (or rather, how much longer is the combination of MK1011GAH+adapter, compared to an ordinary 50-pin disk?) |
09:29:40 | amiconn | petur: The X5 comes as single platter and dual platter models, the X5L comes as single platter only |
09:29:56 | LinusN | amiconn: my bad, i meant i need a dual platter x5 |
09:30:01 | amiconn | The X5 dual platter (60GB) uses the exact same case as the X5L |
09:30:13 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
09:31:09 | amiconn | The L has a second battery in the extra room that the single platter disk in the "dual platter case" leaves |
09:31:32 | amiconn | So you can convert an X5L into an ordinary X5 if you want to fit a dual platter hdd |
09:31:50 | petur | like putting an extra fat battery in an h340 and put a single platter disk in |
09:32:10 | | Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) |
09:32:17 | amiconn | Same applies to M5(L) and M3(L) |
09:32:35 | * | amiconn 's M3 is a (rare) dual platter model :) |
09:34:19 | * | stripwax will upload the tower-of-rockbox and rockhenge photos tonight when his phone is feeling better :( |
09:34:26 | | Quit stripwax (Client Quit) |
09:35:48 | markun | rockhenge, nice! |
09:36:37 | LinusN | amiconn: the mk1011gah+adapter is about 1.3cm longer |
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10:00 |
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10:14:09 | markun | I would like the forum to move threads to the top of the list after editing a post |
10:16:52 | petur | then don't edit |
10:18:02 | markun | I would be double posting if I didn't edit which is forbidden :) |
10:18:29 | petur | delete your post and post again |
10:18:49 | markun | a good one |
10:18:55 | markun | or maybe the forums could be fixed? |
10:19:52 | pixelma | I believe I saw a "forum feature requests" thread, not sure if it's still there |
10:20:11 | LinusN | http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/ZIFToATAAdapter |
10:22:00 | petur | nice |
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10:23:22 | pixelma | LinusN: yes, thanks. Those 20GB in my M5L is a bit sparse but I like the runtime so much and wouldn't want to sacrifice the second battery... |
10:24:41 | petur | pixelma: go CF :) |
10:25:25 | pixelma | also true, 32GB would already be an improvement |
10:25:44 | petur | or wait a bit for 64GB, 128GB, ... :) |
10:25:55 | pixelma | :) |
10:27:04 | pixelma | would 2 card fit? Just got this strange idea to use 2 and a multivolume build (don't have the faintest idea if that would work though...) :) |
10:27:10 | pixelma | *cards |
10:27:45 | pixelma | hmmm, forgot the connection issue probably |
10:28:07 | petur | room is no issue, but I don't know of an adapter that has room for both master and slave |
10:28:48 | petur | and ata.c supports only one of them at the moment |
10:29:56 | pixelma | thanks for the information. It only crossed my mind, I didn't think about it before... |
10:34:25 | petur | pixelma: it does exist, but the angle of the ide connector is wrong |
10:34:27 | petur | http://cgi.benl.ebay.be/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280202934990&ssPageName=MERCOSI_VI_ROSI_PR4_PCN_BIX_Stores&refitem=280198173300&itemcount=4&refwidgetloc=closed_view_item&refwidgettype=osi_widget&_trksid=p284.m185&_trkparms=algo%3DSI%26its%3DI%26itu%3DUCI%26otn%3D4%26ps%3D41 |
10:35:37 | * | petur wonders about the floppy power connector and the master/slave jumper |
10:37:46 | petur | and the ide connector is wrong too :/ |
10:38:11 | LinusN | it annoys me that the ZIF connector faces the wrong direction: http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-1-8-ZIF-harddisk-to-1-8-CF-IDE-hard-driver-adapter_W0QQitemZ310028867728QQihZ021QQcategoryZ41994QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem |
10:39:04 | petur | LinusN: if the flatcable is long enough, you could mount the disk the other way around? |
10:39:39 | LinusN | perhaps, but you don't want a flat cable that long... |
10:40:09 | LinusN | the esskabel adapter is much smarter imho |
10:43:18 | LinusN | i must say that 27 euros is a lot for such an adapter |
10:44:02 | amiconn | Ata allows up to 50cm iirc |
10:45:43 | | Join gevaerts [0] (n=fg@rockbox/developer/gevaerts) |
10:49:29 | | Join tvelocity [0] (n=tony@athedsl-00756.home.otenet.gr) |
10:51:30 | * | gevaerts thinks that usb audio should be doable, and probably not too difficult |
10:52:54 | markun | gevaerts: good to hear :) |
10:54:49 | LinusN | if i only could find a good source of hdd connectors, i could make my own adapter... |
11:00 |
11:01:25 | amiconn | pixelma, petur: I think a dual-CF adapter should be doable, and master-slave support could be added to the ata driver |
11:01:54 | amiconn | It could then either be used with multivolume, or simply by "disk" chaining |
11:02:05 | pixelma | all those possibilities... :) |
11:02:32 | amiconn | Chaining is probably not a good idea because of usb though |
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11:12:47 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
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11:30:49 | | Join pondlife [50] (n=Steve@rockbox/developer/pondlife) |
11:32:13 | | Join MethoS- [0] (n=clemens@host-091-096-208-085.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
11:32:55 | pondlife | Hmm, wonder where GodEater went? |
11:35:23 | petur | he didn't show up? |
11:36:04 | linuxstb | No, and I don't think he's been online since yesterday morning |
11:37:10 | | Join Crash91 [0] (n=Crash@41.232.214.149) |
11:37:15 | linuxstb | BTW, the Cowon D2 seems a nice little device - much smaller than I imagined. |
11:37:18 | petur | they arrested a guy recently for having an mp3 player with him (somebody thought it was a gun), maybe they went after him too (having multiple mp3 players) |
11:37:30 | Crash91 | We want to keep an area on the page which can show people what Rockbox is capable of looking like < /me thinks maybe a slideshow? |
11:37:37 | linuxstb | We did get a lot of questions from passers-by in the pub... |
11:37:37 | pondlife | petur: You should have seen linuxstb's stash last night |
11:38:06 | pondlife | I told the staff they were bombs. I don't think they got the joke. |
11:38:26 | Crash91 | I could also make a little box with all the models in, which the user can scoll through. |
11:38:39 | petur | that kind of jokes doesn't work very good these days |
11:38:57 | pondlife | Luckily they didn't hear me |
11:39:05 | linuxstb | Crash91: I'm not sure if we want to waste valuable space on the home page for that - but maybe somewhere like the "why rockbox?" page. |
11:39:53 | linuxstb | But a nice animated GIF showing Rockbox might be nice.. |
11:40:00 | pondlife | LinusN: Perhaps you could mention on http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/ZIFToATAAdapter that this doesn't fit in an H340? |
11:40:22 | Crash91 | linuxstb: okay, but as for now im concentrating on the main page, i was thinking that a graphical view might be more appealing than "supported models:" |
11:40:40 | pondlife | Just in case someone (like me) assumes the H140 and H340 are the same size. |
11:41:05 | Crash91 | linuxstb: yes, a GIF sounds nice :) thanks for the idea |
11:41:23 | pondlife | Crash91: I'd rather there was no animation on the front page. |
11:41:23 | linuxstb | Crash91: You're suggesting removing the list of supported players? |
11:42:01 | Crash91 | linuxstb: yes, and replacing them with graphics of the player with model number and type |
11:42:24 | linuxstb | So like the download pages? |
11:42:36 | Crash91 | linuxstb: yes, kind of |
11:42:58 | gevaerts | That will take lots more space |
11:43:16 | pondlife | Zagor: Don't suppose you could use the wiki version of the left-hand menu on the other pages too. I know it's an IE weirdness, but as long as removing the breaks doesn't negatively affect other browsers... |
11:43:20 | LinusN | pondlife: i have only an H320, so i can't test, but it still *might* fit |
11:43:20 | Crash91 | thats why i was considering an animation |
11:43:36 | pondlife | LinusN: Ah, good! |
11:43:46 | Crash91 | im going to do a mockup first though |
11:44:20 | pondlife | Crash91: I'd ask for more opinions about animation before you spend too much time on it. |
11:44:30 | pondlife | Maybe I'm odd. |
11:44:45 | * | linuxstb stands next to pondlife in odd corner |
11:44:54 | Crash91 | pondlife: that why im going to do a mockup :) and i understand why some people dislike animations |
11:45:04 | Crash91 | it always comes down to personal preference |
11:45:14 | pondlife | Of course. |
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11:45:46 | * | BigBambi reminds Crash91 about blind people and screen readers |
11:45:51 | amiconn | LinusN: I'm quite sure the adapter won't fit X5/M5/M3. There's simply no room for the added length |
11:46:00 | * | gevaerts thinks that only the MpegPlayerPlugin should do animations |
11:46:39 | LinusN | amiconn: that depends on if you can (like on the H140) put the hdd above the audio connectors |
11:46:46 | Crash91 | BigBambi: <alt> tags, and mostly CSS will make it easy |
11:47:14 | Crash91 | BigBambi: So removing the list isnt such a great idea :) |
11:47:56 | linuxstb | Crash91: Also, where are you getting the graphics from? You can't just take random images from the web... |
11:47:58 | BigBambi | Personally I prefer a list of supported models not an animation - quicker to read, if you glance away you don't have to wait for it to come round again, easier to be specific etc. |
11:48:06 | pondlife | We could have a separate site to "advertise" Rockbox, using Flash and all that. Aimed squarely at getting new recruits. |
11:48:29 | pondlife | www.rockboxrocks.com |
11:48:37 | Crash91 | linuxstb: what about the download page? |
11:48:57 | linuxstb | Crash91: What about it? |
11:49:11 | Crash91 | linuxstb: the graphics from there maybe? |
11:49:24 | BigBambi | I don't object to more pictures on the site in general, I just think replacing certain information with them is a bad idea. |
11:49:26 | linuxstb | Yes, those are fine to use (obviously) |
11:49:52 | LinusN | oh, how great. i found the 1.8" hdd connector, and i can buy them in quantities of 1500 :-) |
11:49:54 | pondlife | Zagor: Also noticred that http://build.rockbox.org/mail/ is a dead link from "The Rockbox Crew" tagline |
11:50:20 | LinusN | i'm not sure i have a need for 1500 ata<->zif adapters :-) |
11:50:22 | pondlife | on http://build.rockbox.org/ Imnean |
11:50:37 | BigBambi | LinusN: Set up a market stall? :) |
11:50:40 | pondlife | LinusN: We could play pass-the-parcel :) |
11:51:08 | pondlife | A very niche market stall... |
11:51:37 | BigBambi | Well, he could expand once it is established |
11:51:57 | linuxstb | Ondio backlight mods? |
11:52:18 | BigBambi | Exactly, H100 RTC chips, ... The list goes on |
11:52:21 | BigBambi | :) |
11:52:48 | pondlife | Or just installing Rockbox for people who can't work out RBUtil |
11:53:07 | LinusN | sounds like a very lucrative business :-P |
11:53:23 | LinusN | or was it "ludicrous"? |
11:53:30 | BigBambi | haha |
11:53:40 | * | linuxstb goes to visit his bank manager for a business loan |
11:54:00 | gevaerts | A coworker just suggested to add joypad support once usb host is in, to make playing doom easier |
11:54:11 | BigBambi | Dear me |
11:54:12 | LinusN | that would be quite cool |
11:54:17 | pondlife | Isn't that on FS already? |
11:54:31 | BigBambi | It would be quite cool for a short time |
11:54:46 | BigBambi | A good advert |
11:54:57 | pondlife | You mean, like Doom is now |
11:55:08 | BigBambi | yeah, but more coolerer :) |
11:55:32 | * | petur still mentions a usb keyboard |
11:56:09 | petur | and a mouse for rockpaint ;) |
11:56:19 | gevaerts | I guess that if we have support for petur's keyboard, joypads and similar are basically free (both are HID) |
11:56:20 | pixelma | LinusN: amiconn once found 8GB MMCs (microdia) which could only be bought in a large amount... not sure what happened to this ;) |
11:56:41 | petur | yes, and HID is a very simple class |
11:57:39 | gevaerts | I still want to add it to the device-stack, to replace the charging-only class (pretend we're a mouse or something, so windows finds drivers). |
11:57:55 | petur | lol |
11:58:17 | gevaerts | And then I have my sansa c200 joypad ;) |
11:59:19 | linuxstb | What about pretending to be a removable drive, but with no media? |
11:59:40 | petur | that would be cleaner |
11:59:52 | gevaerts | That would be even easier (10 minutes work), but it might confuse users |
12:00 |
12:00:15 | petur | and coming up as a mouse wouldn't? |
12:00:18 | | Quit MethoS- (Remote closed the connection) |
12:00:26 | linuxstb | You could even press a button to "insert" your disk whilst charging. |
12:01:56 | gevaerts | petur: I think windows shows the device name on insert, and not the class name (or only the first time, for a very short time) so users only see this "mouse" when they go to the device manager. |
12:02:38 | gevaerts | linuxstb: possible as well. Once we do that I would also suggest to go back to "normal mode" once the OS "ejects" the disk |
12:02:52 | pondlife | Why not keep it as "charging only" when we are just charging? Seems less confusing. |
12:03:17 | gevaerts | pondlife: trouble is that windows then asks for drivers. |
12:03:25 | pondlife | Ah, I see |
12:03:39 | pondlife | It has no built-in support for that? |
12:03:50 | pondlife | What does the OF do? |
12:04:07 | linuxstb | Isn't this what the ipod OF does? IIRC, you can "eject" it from the host OS, and it will leave the disk mode screen, but continue to charge. |
12:04:18 | gevaerts | I would personally prefer linuxstb's solution, but I'm afraid of confused users |
12:05:01 | gevaerts | pondlife: we basically need a device class that does nothing, but nobody specified one. And most OF's don't do harging only as far as I know |
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12:05:22 | pondlife | OK, well I'd do what the iPod OF does then. |
12:08:01 | gevaerts | So the proposal is : on normal insert, present all drives normally and show the USB connection screen. Once the host tells us it doesn't need them any more, go back to normal operation. On "charging" insert, present empty drives, and put a menu item in System (or somewhere else?) to "insert" them, which goes to the USB screen and allows OS access. Also allow this after OS eject. |
12:08:13 | * | gevaerts thinks that shouldn't be too complicated |
12:08:51 | gevaerts | And people who can't find this "pretend to insert" menu can just unplug and plug back in |
12:10:23 | * | gevaerts likes this idea. It gets rid of the "charging only" pseudo-driver, and adds useful functionality. |
12:10:29 | linuxstb | I'm not sure we need a menu option though - unless it's very easily accessible, it will just be easier to unplug and reattach. |
12:11:19 | pondlife | I'd still like an option to invert the charge/connect option... |
12:11:34 | pondlife | i.e. normally charge only, and be a drive if a button is held. |
12:11:37 | linuxstb | If you attach normally, then the host OS ejects the device and Rockbox goes back to normal operation, can we then return to disk mode? |
12:12:14 | linuxstb | pondlife: I wouldn't object - it's been a long-time feature request by many people. |
12:12:21 | gevaerts | linuxstb: that's what we need this menu option for. |
12:12:37 | linuxstb | gevaerts: So it's possible to keep connecting and disconnecting by software? |
12:13:55 | gevaerts | linuxstb: not really connecting and disconnecting, although that should be possible as well, just telling the OS that the user took the (insert removable media type of your choice here) out or put it back in |
12:14:47 | linuxstb | Ah yes, of course... |
12:14:47 | gevaerts | It would also neatly solve this "should we set the REMOVABLE bit or not" discussion |
12:16:52 | gevaerts | s/neatly solve/sidestep/ |
12:17:41 | linuxstb | What about adding the "disk mode" option at the end of the main menu? It will only appear when charging via usb. |
12:18:10 | linuxstb | It sort of fits, as it will take you to the USB screen. |
12:18:11 | pondlife | I don't like options that appear and hide.. |
12:18:31 | pondlife | I was more just thinking of a setting |
12:18:41 | linuxstb | But it's not a setting... |
12:18:54 | pondlife | Ah, I misunderstood |
12:18:57 | linuxstb | It's a "now take me to the usb screen" item |
12:19:36 | linuxstb | My fault for saying "disk mode option"... |
12:19:45 | pondlife | OK |
12:20:20 | pondlife | What about the default action - i.e. make it connect by default (like it does now). That's an option, no? |
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12:20:43 | linuxstb | Yes |
12:20:45 | pondlife | I like the idea of being able to control entry (and exit?) of the USB screen |
12:21:47 | gevaerts | Default connect would be an option in the settings menu, in the future maybe together with the "enable usb audio" and "pretend we're a game controller" options |
12:22:45 | gevaerts | pondlife: forced exit would be possible, but dangerous for your data. I thinl it's better to exit only if the OS tells us to (by the user choosing "eject") |
12:23:06 | pondlife | True |
12:23:23 | pondlife | Tail, meet dog. |
12:24:35 | gevaerts | If we really want to, we could eject/insert devices on a multi-volume system separately, so you can continue playing music from your sd card while updating the rockbox build on internal storage. That would almost certainly be overkill though |
12:25:10 | Crash91 | What colour scheme is preferable for the front page? The current one, or a more cabbie-ish approach? |
12:25:49 | pondlife | Crash91: I'd say the cabbie-ish one, for consistency. But I may be in the minority. |
12:25:59 | pondlife | Not quite so dark though |
12:26:26 | pondlife | I don't actually use cabbie myself, prefering light backgrounds. |
12:26:35 | Crash91 | how about a slightly more lighter version, in grey or blue-grey |
12:26:45 | gevaerts | I would say cabbie-ish as well, for the same reason. I don't really like white-on-black websites though |
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12:27:13 | gevaerts | Crash91: That would give low contrast, which I think is a bad idea |
12:27:14 | * | pondlife would like to see an "inverse Cabbie" theme - i.e. dark text, light background |
12:27:27 | pondlife | Same layout, just different colours |
12:27:27 | | Nick mib_98owc9n4 is now known as GodEater (i=c2cbc962@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-ee4de42f373a9b56) |
12:27:32 | pondlife | aha! |
12:27:41 | pondlife | GodEater: What's up? |
12:27:59 | GodEater | sorry all - a bit of a personal crisis |
12:28:02 | Crash91 | gevaerts: yes, hadnt thought about that, |
12:28:02 | | Join makdaknife [0] (n=makdakni@82-70-146-30.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) |
12:28:09 | GodEater | very sad I couln't make it last night |
12:28:11 | GodEater | :( |
12:28:21 | pondlife | GodEater: No worries, we had a good one. Look after yourself. |
12:28:30 | GodEater | doing my best |
12:28:41 | GodEater | I'm going on a hen night this weekend. Should be, erm, interesting ;) |
12:28:51 | GodEater | so, where are the photos ? |
12:29:09 | pondlife | stripwax took some with his phone, but it was rather dark |
12:29:17 | pondlife | We managed 2 Towers |
12:29:20 | GodEater | can't wait |
12:29:22 | linuxstb | GodEater: We were relying on your camera... |
12:29:35 | pondlife | Or rather a Henge and a Tower.. and a Staircase |
12:29:58 | linuxstb | We had too many rounded corners for a decent tower though... |
12:30:10 | * | gevaerts thinks of a new slogan "Rockbox - the firmware that all RockStairs use" |
12:30:17 | GodEater | sorry :( |
12:30:21 | linuxstb | GodEater: np ;) |
12:30:40 | * | pondlife proposed that RockboxPlayer should have a Lego-style body, for ease of Tower building |
12:30:53 | gevaerts | That would be cheating ! |
12:30:57 | linuxstb | Wasn't google built from lego? |
12:31:00 | GodEater | but innovative... |
12:31:12 | * | GodEater likes that idea and seconds it heartily |
12:31:18 | pondlife | You want to fit a bigger drive in. just add more bricks |
12:31:31 | pondlife | And it would offer a new way to brick your player. |
12:31:36 | Crash91 | play dough, the ultimate in flexibility |
12:31:40 | GodEater | duh dum tsch |
12:31:57 | pondlife | Your DAP would get ever smaller though |
12:32:09 | * | gevaerts is still looking for a brick-patterned skin for his players |
12:32:10 | pondlife | (as bits of it got caught in the carpet) |
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12:33:33 | linuxstb | GodEater: I think this is the only picture to (almost) emerge from last night so far - http://www.beermex.com/rockhenge.jpg |
12:33:40 | pondlife | GodEater: http://www.beermex.com/rockhenge.jpg is one, but in the wrong aspect ratio |
12:33:44 | pondlife | Beat me |
12:34:15 | GodEater | whose site is that ? |
12:34:25 | pondlife | stripwax's, I think |
12:35:04 | GodEater | did he demonstrate any more unusual bugs that no-one believed existed ? :D |
12:35:30 | pondlife | No, but I had to reset with a staple |
12:35:43 | pondlife | H340 crashed in pictureflow |
12:36:07 | * | pondlife resolves to always carry his own staples in future |
12:36:42 | GodEater | brb |
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12:37:07 | | Join GodEater [0] (i=c2cbc962@rockbox/staff/GodEater) |
12:38:11 | * | GodEater discovers that mibbit doesn't work without the https:// from work |
12:38:44 | Crash91 | Does anyone feel that replacing the sidebar with a horizontal one would be unappealing? |
12:38:49 | gevaerts | Slightly gimp-ed version here : http://www.evonet.be/~gevaerts/rockhenge.jpg |
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12:39:30 | | Join Nico_P [50] (n=nicolas@rockbox/developer/NicoP) |
12:39:38 | pondlife | Crash91: I personally prefer the top bar idea, it might work better for Flyspray |
12:40:05 | Crash91 | i found this while looking for layout ideas, and it looks like a simple design http://www.freecsstemplates.org/preview/plainoffice |
12:40:08 | linuxstb | Wouldn't a horizontal bar limit the number of options? |
12:40:31 | linuxstb | Ah, frames... ;) |
12:40:55 | linuxstb | Or I guess you just mean the content of the main frame? |
12:41:06 | gevaerts | linuxstb: think of them as viewports ;) |
12:41:06 | LinusN | any other guys that feel that Neon John stepped over the line in the mailing list? |
12:41:19 | * | GodEater goes to read the ML |
12:41:44 | Nico_P | pondlife: I went to pick up the HD yesterday... working like a charm :) |
12:41:49 | Nico_P | thanks a bunch |
12:41:50 | pondlife | :) |
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12:42:50 | GodEater | hmm, it's a little strong |
12:42:54 | pondlife | Nico_P: In other news, there's still a rare occasion when playback repeats a track when rebuffering occurs. :/ |
12:42:58 | Crash91 | linuxstb: yes it would limit the options, but we can place other links in the rest of the page |
12:43:27 | Nico_P | pondlife: I also got it to stop playback when it should have changed dirs |
12:43:28 | pondlife | LinusN: Where are the ML guidelines? |
12:43:31 | gevaerts | LinusN: I think he definitely did |
12:44:00 | pondlife | Nico_P: Auto dir change is completely knackered on target at the moment. Sadly it works great on sim. |
12:44:06 | linuxstb | Crash91: I personally like the "quick links" section on the ipodlinux.org home page, and would like something similar on rockbox.org |
12:44:23 | Crash91 | LinusN: I like the comparison with pigs :) |
12:44:23 | Nico_P | ah |
12:44:28 | LinusN | on the other hand, i didn't bother for a second that john said "crapple" and "sleazebay" |
12:44:39 | GodEater | nor me |
12:44:40 | * | Crash91 goes to take a look |
12:44:53 | GodEater | fairly descriptive to be honest |
12:45:06 | LinusN | so i think Paul was a little too sensitive there |
12:45:23 | GodEater | I think I'd be more inclined to let blind / foreign people start to complain about words they've not understood |
12:45:29 | GodEater | before jumping in and asking people not to use them |
12:45:36 | LinusN | my thinking as well |
12:45:37 | Crash91 | linuxstb: I like it look, but it takes up more space |
12:45:43 | GodEater | I've never actually seen anyone pipe up and say "what does such-and-such mean?" |
12:46:06 | linuxstb | Crash91: Yes, but IMO it makes good use of space - i.e. the user is drawn to it immediately. |
12:46:16 | Crash91 | the* |
12:46:26 | gevaerts | Maybe, but still he explained, and then went on to give a useful answer, so I don't see any reason for Neon John to reply like he did |
12:46:33 | LinusN | i'd like to keep the policing down a little to keep the friendliness up |
12:46:42 | Crash91 | linuxstb: ok, ill probably go with that |
12:47:33 | LinusN | gevaerts: sure, the "f*ck yourself" was out of line, but for some reason i kind of understand john's reaction |
12:48:59 | LinusN | i think he would have felt otherwise if the complaint would have come *after* the useful response |
12:49:23 | Zagor | neon john has, um, let's call it "personality" :-) |
12:49:29 | LinusN | oh yes |
12:50:44 | LinusN | still, i don't want the rockbox community to be perceived as unfriendly or unwelcoming |
12:51:12 | Zagor | agreed |
12:52:12 | LinusN | i seriously think we need to keep our tone down a little, and that goes for all our channels, including the tracker and the forum |
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12:52:33 | * | linuxstb agrees too |
12:52:34 | pixelma | I don't read Llorean's suggestion to use real words as unfriendly though, but then it seems I'm quite diplomatic... |
12:53:15 | GodEater | LinusN: I've personally found since we've added a few more "Experts" to the forums recently that my blood pressure when dealing with the unwashed masses has gone down considerably. I think we should get a few more promoted to spread the load still more. |
12:53:19 | LinusN | absolutely not unfriendly, but i would call it nitpicking |
12:53:21 | BigBambi | I agree too :) |
12:53:23 | GodEater | hopefully this should help out everyone else too |
12:53:43 | linuxstb | Maybe we just need to be more tolerant of things like "unreal words"... As long as the majority of people write reasonable English, that sets the tone and I would expect most people to follow it. |
12:53:54 | BigBambi | I agree |
12:54:20 | BigBambi | The difficulty comes when you do need to say something, then you get a load of crap abouyt well this person said this, etc.... |
12:54:50 | LinusN | besides, words like "thx" and "lol" etc, are pretty much established nowadays |
12:55:04 | BigBambi | But (speaking for the forums for a minute) I/(we) can be too quick to just enforce rules to the detriment of anything else |
12:55:06 | linuxstb | But there are some incomprehensible posts to the forums occasionally... |
12:55:14 | pixelma | I mean you could read Noen John's made up words as unfriendly too (towards Ipod users etc...) |
12:56:04 | pixelma | if I "understand" them correctly |
12:56:35 | BigBambi | pixelma: You do, and I can see an Apple fan being 'insulted' |
12:56:37 | pixelma | s/Noen/Neon |
12:56:50 | linuxstb | And all ebay users IIUC... |
12:56:53 | BigBambi | Trouble is, intonation is so hard not face to face and just in text |
12:56:58 | LinusN | pixelma: sure, but if a ipod user feels insulted by that, he is the one that needs help |
12:57:10 | GodEater | lol |
12:57:15 | gevaerts | I think it's reasonable that he replied, as Llorean might indeed have been a bit too trigger happy, but in my mind that never can excuse his language. |
12:57:17 | GodEater | never a truer word |
12:57:52 | BigBambi | But it could avoid all feelings of insult, reasonable or not, if people didn't say things like that |
12:58:10 | BigBambi | Still, saying crapple doesn't require a massive go either :) |
12:58:10 | | Quit WatchDragon (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
12:59:35 | * | gevaerts gets out of the discussion, but still has trouble reading grammatically incorrect sentences in _any_ language, so he likes the attitude to not tolerate this... |
13:00 |
13:00:50 | LinusN | in this case, i think "tongue in cheek" describes it pretty well |
13:02:03 | BigBambi | Aye, but lack of intonation, body language etc. over e-mail, IRC, forums etc. doesn't help |
13:02:25 | LinusN | sure, a smiley here and there won't hurt |
13:02:48 | pondlife | :) |
13:02:53 | BigBambi | yep, indicting jokes is a good thing :) |
13:03:10 | Crash91 | :) |
13:03:52 | pondlife | Too many smileys is bad too :) |
13:04:01 | BigBambi | Indeed so |
13:04:18 | LinusN | still, an occasional "lol", "thx", "wtf" here and there, and some top-posting isn't the end of the world |
13:04:43 | LinusN | to me at least |
13:05:08 | pondlife | I find lazy posting (including an entire previous post, or worse, an entire ML digest) the only problem, really. |
13:05:25 | LinusN | same here, more or less |
13:05:40 | BigBambi | I find the mixing of top and bottom posting withing a chain of e-mails makes it very hard to follow the conversation |
13:05:44 | pondlife | People need to be aware that this is a mailing list, not just a newsgroup. |
13:05:45 | | Quit japc (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
13:07:04 | pondlife | <controversial>Why do we need both the forum and the ML anyway</controversial> It's two places to check and to police. Is it not possible to make some kind of accessible interface to the forum? |
13:08:09 | Crash91 | pondlife: such as allowing guests to post? |
13:08:16 | LinusN | i dislike forums, because it forces me to (1) poll actively, and (2) be online to participate |
13:08:47 | | Quit gevaerts (Nick collision from services.) |
13:09:05 | pondlife | Ah, yes. Offline use |
13:09:08 | | Join gevaerts [0] (n=fg@rockbox/developer/gevaerts) |
13:09:25 | pondlife | I prefer the ML to the forum, but I don't like the feeling of duplicatiion. |
13:10:08 | Zagor | integrating lists and forums is something of a holy grail. many have tried, none have succeeded afaik |
13:10:11 | linuxstb | The downside of mailing lists is that you need subscribe to the lists... |
13:10:15 | BigBambi | Well, I guess an advantage to the forum is that if you just want to ask something occasionally you don't get lots of e-mails all the time |
13:10:30 | * | linuxstb wouldn't like the Rockbox forums in his mailbox |
13:10:31 | BigBambi | (without repeatedly subscribing and unsubscribing) |
13:10:36 | BigBambi | hell no |
13:10:43 | gevaerts | But you do get reminded about reading the manual a lot... |
13:10:50 | pondlife | You don't need to use e-mail for the ML. You can access it as a newsgroup. |
13:10:55 | BigBambi | But I don't want the ML either, hence not signing up to it |
13:11:06 | BigBambi | pondlife: And reply? |
13:11:07 | linuxstb | pondlife: Good idea, let's go usenet... |
13:11:10 | pondlife | Yes |
13:11:15 | * | BigBambi didn't know that |
13:11:17 | BigBambi | How? |
13:11:36 | * | pondlife searches the wiki |
13:12:17 | pondlife | Nope, it's not in there... |
13:12:24 | BigBambi | gevaerts: Well that is what the manual is for |
13:12:49 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
13:12:58 | * | gevaerts now regrets not posting his question on the forum yesterday |
13:13:16 | pondlife | BigBambi: Go to news.gmane.org |
13:13:31 | pondlife | Then list the groups with rockbox in |
13:13:33 | BigBambi | pondlife: Cool, cheers |
13:13:51 | pondlife | You need to be subscribed to the ML to post, but you can do that without the e-mail enabled. |
13:14:17 | linuxstb | pondlife: Looks like it needs reclassifying though... comp.systems.archos.rockbox |
13:14:33 | pondlife | It's been there a long time... |
13:14:36 | linuxstb | Is the announce mailing list still active? |
13:14:49 | pondlife | I don't check that one |
13:15:36 | pondlife | The last message was "Rockbox 2.3 released" |
13:15:44 | pondlife | A bit dead, then |
13:16:26 | pondlife | Did Archos ever get round to shipping Rockbox? |
13:17:10 | Zagor | no |
13:17:43 | pondlife | Zagor: I like your "Release" messages, very nice |
13:18:30 | Zagor | it's been a while :) |
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13:18:50 | pondlife | Yes, but a nice little feature list.. |
13:18:58 | * | pondlife gets nostalgic for red led dead |
13:20:34 | * | Crash91 found this online, useful for improving accesibilty http://colorfilter.wickline.org/ |
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13:36:26 | pixelma | heh, the reply to Neon John doesn't argue about the language but demonstrates why abbreviations are bad. Somehow ironic... |
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13:43:14 | pixelma | or maybe this was on purpose |
13:44:23 | * | gevaerts finally figures out what a JBR is... |
13:44:54 | Bagder | hehe, old-school rockbox abbreviation... |
13:45:43 | gevaerts | Maybe one more gsoc student application test ? |
13:46:20 | gevaerts | "check out rockbox and compile for JBR" |
13:46:55 | Bagder | "check out rockbox and compile test_fps for JBR" |
13:50:26 | | Quit jcollie ("Ex-Chat") |
13:50:44 | | Join pondlife [50] (n=Steve@rockbox/developer/pondlife) |
13:51:26 | linuxstb | Or a real test - "check out rockbox and compile test_codec for JBR" |
13:51:37 | gevaerts | Do we actually want to get students ? |
13:52:15 | Bagder | well, last year's students did provide good chunks useful code... |
13:52:35 | linuxstb | Well, two of them did... |
13:53:39 | linuxstb | We were discussing this last night though - none of the projects seem that exciting this year... |
13:54:10 | gevaerts | Maybe get a student to write USB audio ? |
13:54:21 | petur | usb host |
13:54:23 | linuxstb | Is that 3 months work though? |
13:54:28 | linuxstb | (to gevaerts0 |
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13:55:38 | gevaerts | Depends. You can go pretty far with it (support recording from FM,...), and if that still isn't enough work, I hope to have usb host ready by then, so we will want host-side usb audio |
13:57:44 | gevaerts | I think actual USB host would be a nice project as well, except (a) I want to have that earlier, and (b) there's no guarantee that we know enough about the hardware to actually get it to work (and that's not really fair if a student gets evaluated on results), and (c) it requires specific players, which the student might or might not have access to (maybe a weak reason) |
13:58:28 | Bagder | the students get 4500 USD, I do think they can be expected to pay 100-200 USD for a target if they don't have one |
13:58:35 | gevaerts | Also, for audio, the current driver doesn't support isochronous yet, so the student would have to do that as well |
13:58:54 | Bagder | we denied one of the students target funding last year |
13:59:00 | gevaerts | Bagder: yes, that's why that is a weak reason. |
13:59:36 | Bagder | yeps, I just wanted to clarify that I agree ;-) |
13:59:44 | * | gevaerts runs to a university to enroll, just to be able to get paid to work on rockbox for three months |
13:59:50 | * | pondlife too |
14:00 |
14:00:05 | gevaerts | Can you be mentor and student at the same time ? |
14:00:10 | Bagder | no |
14:00:22 | * | gevaerts somehow expected that |
14:00:28 | pondlife | Plus you can't easily get hold of an H300, so the USB port I'd like isn't so easy. |
14:00:55 | Bagder | a worthy gsoc test: "get a h300" ;-) |
14:01:00 | pondlife | hehe |
14:01:03 | gevaerts | pondlife: gigabeat F has it as well. That's the one I plan to work on |
14:01:13 | pondlife | Same Philips chip? |
14:01:31 | * | gevaerts looks |
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14:01:58 | linuxstb | gevaerts: Have you thought about buying a gigabeat S to get USB working there? |
14:02:02 | * | petur would be a bit surprised |
14:02:25 | * | pondlife too |
14:02:32 | gevaerts | linuxstb: as far as I know it just misses the right device enable settings, and I'm no good at those |
14:02:48 | gevaerts | Why is this kind of info not on the DeviceChart page ? |
14:03:03 | linuxstb | Because you haven't added it yet... |
14:03:06 | linuxstb | ;) |
14:04:05 | pondlife | http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IriverH3XXHardwareComponents might be half useful |
14:04:23 | pondlife | Philips ISP1362 |
14:04:44 | petur | pondlife: the gigabeat host controller = S3C2440 |
14:04:54 | * | gevaerts is correcting the datasheet URL now |
14:05:07 | pondlife | Ah. Two halves of a GSoC projects then. |
14:05:13 | pondlife | project, even |
14:05:41 | desowin | gevaerts: students get 500USD at the beginning, so it could be used to buy some target ;) |
14:05:41 | linuxstb | Bagder: Have you submitted the Rockbox SoC application yet? |
14:05:55 | linuxstb | Yep - they don't need food... |
14:06:02 | * | petur clicks http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/pub/Main/GigabeatInfo/partlist.html and is surprised by the page |
14:06:57 | gevaerts | Both the ISP1362 and the S3C2440 seem to be OHCI based |
14:08:36 | LinusN | petur: that is because attaching html documents is a very common wiki spamming method |
14:08:45 | LinusN | so we don't allow it |
14:08:59 | petur | I saw... the attachment link at the bottom works ok |
14:10:56 | * | gevaerts looks forward to reading all 160 pages of the OHCI spec |
14:14:43 | Beta2K | What is GSoC? |
14:15:00 | desowin | Beta2K: code.google.com/soc |
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14:15:41 | * | gevaerts apoligises for using an ETLA |
14:16:49 | | Quit midgey () |
14:17:03 | Beta2K | What's a ETLA? |
14:17:11 | Beta2K | :) |
14:17:34 | gevaerts | TLA is "Three Letter Acronm", ETLA is "Extended TLA", so four (or more) letter acronym |
14:18:22 | petur | so ETLA is an ETLA |
14:18:30 | LinusN | which in turn is a PLJ |
14:18:40 | * | petur catches tail |
14:18:42 | LinusN | Profoundly Lame Joke |
14:18:46 | Beta2K | Hum, wish I'd know about GSoC when I was in school... |
14:19:20 | * | gevaerts notices it's now exactly one month since USB storage started (somewhat) working, and gives everyone a beer to celebrate |
14:19:53 | LinusN | thanks" |
14:20:04 | petur | cheers |
14:20:52 | * | preglow is impressed by aotuv vorbis |
14:21:02 | * | preglow accepts a beer |
14:21:17 | Beta2K | What kind of beer? |
14:21:50 | preglow | a westvleteren, surely :V |
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14:22:04 | Beta2K | Never heard of that one... |
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14:22:17 | petur | even we have troubles getting that one :/ |
14:22:35 | preglow | yeah, those monks are stubborn |
14:23:59 | Beta2K | Who is working on the Gigabeat flash bootloader? |
14:30:48 | * | gevaerts collects all beer that hasn't been picked up, gives half to petur, and drinks the other half |
14:31:11 | * | petur hands half of his share to preglow |
14:31:35 | petur | better take it all, there's a shop around the corner here :p |
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15:00 |
15:04:08 | markun | Beta2K: kkurbjun |
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15:14:11 | Beta2K | Thanks markun |
15:15:03 | LambdaCalculus37 | Morning, everyone! |
15:16:36 | gevaerts | Good afternoon, LambdaCalculus37 ;) |
15:18:13 | | Join pondlife [50] (n=Steve@rockbox/developer/pondlife) |
15:18:40 | pondlife | Good afternoon, everyone! |
15:19:05 | * | petur waits for a goodnight from somebody in india or beyond |
15:19:24 | LambdaCalculus37 | Hi pondlife! |
15:20:18 | pondlife | Hi, and bye |
15:20:25 | pondlife | Lunch time at last |
15:21:18 | LambdaCalculus37 | Enjoy! |
15:24:15 | | Part LinusN |
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15:37:50 | skbohra | hi everyone |
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15:39:48 | linuxstb | Good evening. |
15:40:14 | skbohra | good evening |
15:40:15 | petur | markun: re Meizu, it was the mp3 players they were after: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/03/07/patent_crackdown_at_cebit/ |
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15:43:00 | LambdaCalculus37 | petur: It was all about patents, wasn't it? |
15:43:08 | petur | yup |
15:43:25 | petur | mp3 |
15:44:04 | LambdaCalculus37 | petur: This is one of the reasons why I don't use MP3s anymore. |
15:44:29 | LambdaCalculus37 | Except when it comes to my Archos. |
15:44:37 | preglow | why can't the cabbiev2 volume indicator reach the top on h120? |
15:44:58 | petur | hmmm my whole music collection is in mp3 320kbps vbr... |
15:45:41 | LambdaCalculus37 | Mine is mostly Vorbis Q5 VBR. |
15:45:52 | petur | cabbiev2 volume sucks - /me wants numbers |
15:46:09 | GodEater | so don't use Cabbiev2 ? |
15:46:58 | linuxstb | petur: 320kbps vbr? I thought 320kbps was the max bitrate ? |
15:47:22 | petur | yes, it is vbr without limit ;) |
15:47:29 | petur | ie max 320 |
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15:48:13 | linuxstb | How does the encoder know when to use lower bitrate packets? |
15:48:38 | petur | you give it a quality factor (I used 'best') |
15:48:54 | linuxstb | Isn't 'best' just 320kbps cbr though? |
15:49:17 | petur | no, the files are vbr.... |
15:50:08 | pixelma | preglow: because the .wps has a "bug" - the volume conditional is used wrong which is most noticable on targets which only go up to 0dB |
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15:50:49 | pixelma | just noticed now that I look at the m:robe100 port (which was based off the 160x128 greyscale version) |
15:56:32 | amiconn | linuxstb: Freeformat allows >320kbps |
15:57:07 | amiconn | (but I don't know which player(s) support freeformat bitstreams, if any) |
15:57:35 | LambdaCalculus37 | amiconn: IIRC CDex also allows you to rip CDs at > 320kbps. |
15:58:50 | linuxstb | amiconn: Seems libmad does... |
16:00 |
16:03:47 | preglow | why would you want >320kbps? |
16:04:39 | linuxstb | I doubt many people do... |
16:04:56 | preglow | you'd have to be mad |
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16:05:28 | LambdaCalculus37 | pondlife: Paging Mr. pondlife.... Mr. pondlife, you have a phone call at the front desk. |
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16:17:34 | pondlife | LambdaCalculus37: ? |
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16:18:43 | LambdaCalculus37 | pondlife: Last updated to r16538... still getting the occasional misbehaving with album playback. |
16:19:06 | LambdaCalculus37 | Once in a while, a track will repeat itself and the x of y counter counts up one. |
16:19:36 | | Nick mchua is now known as mchua|away (n=mchua@cpe-66-108-80-238.nyc.res.rr.com) |
16:19:48 | pondlife | Yes, me too |
16:20:09 | pondlife | Exactly the same symptoms as before, but much less often |
16:20:27 | pondlife | Not seen it on the sim yet either |
16:20:51 | LambdaCalculus37 | pondlife: I haven't seen it in the sim, either. |
16:21:18 | pondlife | Perhaps I should undo that fix locally, then it will misbehave more often and in the sim, so I can work on the underlying issue (which must still be there) |
16:21:58 | * | gevaerts reminds people that you can now actually have realtime logf output from PP502x players |
16:22:04 | pondlife | Did this only start happening when Nico_P improved the track skip responsiveness, or did the occasional problem predate that? |
16:22:13 | pondlife | gevaerts: I have no PP player, sadly |
16:22:18 | linuxstb | gevaerts: None of our playback hackers have a PP target though... |
16:22:35 | linuxstb | I think they have Gigabeat Fs though... |
16:22:46 | pixelma | Nico_P now has LinusN's Video... |
16:22:54 | pondlife | The Gigabeat doesn't seem to show this particular issue - not yet anyway. |
16:23:00 | linuxstb | pixelma: Ah yes... No excuse then. |
16:23:03 | pondlife | Like the sim, it's just too fast |
16:23:06 | Nico_P | I've tried the logf |
16:23:30 | Nico_P | it opens a lot of debugginf possibilities, but I don't have much hacking time ATM |
16:24:06 | Nico_P | maybe this week end though |
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16:24:33 | pondlife | Nico_P: Maybe start by attacking auto-change dir? At least that fails often |
16:25:27 | * | LambdaCalculus37 has lag |
16:25:40 | pondlife | I still feel that the auto_change_dir and automatic_skip global vars should vanish, ultimately.. |
16:25:54 | * | pondlife has lag too, he blames DevConPub3 |
16:28:00 | LambdaCalculus37 | pondlife: When Nico_P improved the track skip. |
16:28:34 | pondlife | Are you sure? I recall very occasional problems, which I think predate that. |
16:28:58 | pondlife | Perhaps you could run the previous revision? |
16:30:08 | LambdaCalculus37 | pondlife: I think you may be right, then. |
16:31:16 | pondlife | Hmm, is www.rockbox.org down? |
16:31:35 | pondlife | I'm getting pings, but no site |
16:33:22 | skbohra | its not down |
16:33:35 | pondlife | Is it very slow? |
16:33:48 | pondlife | Like, minutes? |
16:34:07 | gevaerts | I cant't seem to get new connections either. The irc log page I have open still updates though |
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16:34:39 | pondlife | SVN is ok |
16:34:50 | pondlife | I'll use that |
16:34:57 | | Quit axionix_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
16:35:16 | skbohra | ya i think its down right now |
16:35:24 | | Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
16:35:55 | skbohra | *#### |
16:36:13 | gevaerts | I thik it's just extremely slow |
16:36:14 | * | pondlife builds r16422 |
16:36:18 | | Part skbohra |
16:38:27 | makdaknife | open for me... but it did take a while |
16:39:05 | | Join axionix [0] (n=axion@cpe-74-70-239-192.nycap.res.rr.com) |
16:39:37 | pondlife | Seems ok now |
16:41:24 | | Join LambdaCalculus37 [0] (n=44a0430f@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-efecb35798cdfed2) |
16:42:19 | * | LambdaCalculus37 hates severe lag |
16:43:57 | * | LambdaCalculus37 goes to check the log to see what he missed |
16:46:37 | pondlife | LambdaCalculus37: If you could build and run r16422 for a while, that would be useful |
16:47:09 | LambdaCalculus37 | pondlife: I can't build right now (no laptop on me), but I can download it. and run it. |
16:47:24 | pondlife | I can build for you, which target? |
16:47:43 | LambdaCalculus37 | pondlife: iPod video 30GB. |
16:47:52 | pondlife | OK |
16:48:45 | LambdaCalculus37 | pondlife: How do you want to send it? |
16:49:12 | pondlife | I'll make it available for download |
16:49:26 | LambdaCalculus37 | RapidShare? |
16:50:28 | pondlife | Probably not, just super-slow NTHell |
16:50:31 | pixelma | Nico_P: got a wps parser question. I see that the %bp tag is only enabled for targets with CONFIG_CHARGING, wouldn't it make sense for the Ondio too which has no charging but can be run off USB power? |
16:51:00 | Nico_P | probably |
16:51:13 | pixelma | I mean the menu status bar shows that state too |
16:52:27 | * | pondlife wants a WPS tag for CPU boosted or not |
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16:52:40 | pixelma | I'm not sure if a different icon is used there though |
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16:58:19 | pondlife | LambdaCalculus37: Could you try to download http://pondlife.homeip.net/images/rockbox.zip ? |
16:58:29 | pondlife | See what speed you get |
16:58:37 | pondlife | Probably s l o o o w |
17:00 |
17:00:37 | LambdaCalculus37 | pondlife: Oh damn, it's slow. :) |
17:00:46 | LambdaCalculus37 | Averaging 50KB/s. |
17:00:57 | pondlife | 256kbits/s |
17:01:30 | * | LambdaCalculus37 has the file successfully downloaded and is extracting it to his iPod now |
17:01:33 | makdaknife | averaging 25kbps :-( |
17:02:01 | pondlife | LambdaCalculus37: That was quick enough |
17:02:17 | pondlife | Did you get it intact? |
17:02:36 | LambdaCalculus37 | pondlife: Yes, I managed to open it and extract it with no troubles. |
17:03:07 | pondlife | Now play music |
17:03:08 | | Quit Zagor ("Client exiting") |
17:03:20 | pondlife | And see it it does anything silly |
17:03:41 | * | LambdaCalculus37 picks an album and plays |
17:03:49 | pondlife | A long album |
17:04:17 | LambdaCalculus37 | A long album, you say? Will do. |
17:04:32 | pondlife | Well, >32MB |
17:04:32 | LambdaCalculus37 | I know just the album. :) |
17:04:45 | pondlife | One you like all the tracks, and know well |
17:05:28 | LambdaCalculus37 | pondlife: Downloaded Nine Inch Nails "Ghosts I-IV" earlier. Q5 FLAC, 36 tracks, gapless. |
17:05:32 | LambdaCalculus37 | Using that for the test. |
17:11:03 | | Quit gevaerts ("going home") |
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17:12:58 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
17:14:45 | | Quit wisp_sh (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
17:14:53 | LambdaCalculus37 | pondlife: Three tracks in; so far so good. |
17:15:22 | pondlife | I expect we'll need to listen to many albums before it fails. |
17:15:28 | pondlife | (If it fails.) |
17:15:46 | pondlife | With SVN I've only had the problem twice |
17:16:11 | pondlife | And I run playback near-continuously whilst I work |
17:16:52 | LambdaCalculus37 | I'm always listening to music at work, too. |
17:17:28 | pondlife | Problem is, we can never have certainty. Only if it fails can we get a result. |
17:17:48 | pondlife | But if it works ok for a week, that's probably a good sign |
17:18:07 | * | pondlife wonders if he can resist upgrading for a whole week |
17:18:19 | pondlife | Nobody better commit any good features. |
17:18:26 | | Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
17:19:56 | LambdaCalculus37 | Yes, that's right! No one commit any good features that'll make me or pondlife want to update! :) |
17:26:26 | LambdaCalculus37 | pondlife: At track 6 of 36; still watching for any silliness. |
17:35:49 | LambdaCalculus37 | pondlife: Track 10 now; still playing correctly. |
17:36:17 | pondlife | It's ok. you only need to let me know if it fails... ;) |
17:36:26 | pondlife | That's what I'll do. |
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18:00 |
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18:16:46 | * | gevaerts now has an ipid video, and starts coding new interesting features |
18:17:09 | gevaerts | Also an ipod... |
18:18:00 | LambdaCalculus37 | gevaerts: Welcome to the iPod club. :) |
18:19:48 | gevaerts | Building a bootloader now (I don't feel like using a downloaded build) |
18:20:57 | LambdaCalculus37 | gevaerts: I'll help test your work. |
18:21:40 | gevaerts | LambdaCalculus37: you can't, you have to stay on this old revision ;) |
18:21:46 | pondlife | hehe |
18:21:56 | pondlife | LambdaCalculus37: Avoid temptation... |
18:23:55 | LambdaCalculus37 | Must... resist.... |
18:24:23 | LambdaCalculus37 | Can't... lose... control....! |
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18:26:47 | | Nick FOAD_ is now known as FOAD (n=dok@dinah.blub.net) |
18:28:13 | Bagder | "Thank you for signing up your organization with the Google Summer of Code." |
18:28:20 | | Quit midgey () |
18:29:39 | Bagder | application submitted! |
18:31:28 | * | linuxstb sits back and waits for fame, fortune and free labour |
18:31:40 | scorche|sh | so did you end up putting a mentor list on there, or just figure people will apply after we are accepted? |
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18:33:15 | * | linuxstb reads the timeline and sees we have 10 days to wait to know if we're accepted |
18:33:38 | Bagder | scorche: it's easier to just let people add themselves as mentors |
18:33:45 | * | gevaerts now has three players running rockbox |
18:33:54 | Bagder | or at least not do it at this point |
18:34:05 | scorche|sh | alright |
18:34:17 | linuxstb | gevaerts: Not bad for a month's work... |
18:34:25 | LambdaCalculus37 | gevaerts: c200, Gigabeat, and iPod video, correct? |
18:34:27 | scorche|sh | gevaerts: tis a good start ;) |
18:34:46 | gevaerts | I decided to go for a USE_ROCKBOX_USB high-speed build right away |
18:35:03 | gevaerts | LambdaCalculus37: correct. I need to update the RockboxTesting page |
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18:36:11 | gevaerts | The manual is missing "installing from svn" in the installation chapter, for if you don't want to download ipodpatcher |
18:36:55 | linuxstb | cd rbutil/ipodpatcher && make ipodpatcher && ./ipodpatcher -a ../../build-bootloader/bootloader.ipod |
18:37:14 | dave | can somebody help me? i've got a 5.5g ipod and the rockboy is too slow... i dont know why... |
18:37:18 | LambdaCalculus37 | gevaerts: Adding that may drive some new users crazy. As if the manual doesn't do that already. :) |
18:37:19 | gevaerts | I did figure it out ;) |
18:37:33 | scorche|sh | dave: define "too slow" |
18:38:01 | dave | that game is faster on my gba.. |
18:38:07 | linuxstb | dave: I believe it's normal for Rockboy not to be fullspeed |
18:38:09 | dave | so mutch faster |
18:38:12 | scorche|sh | of course it will be... |
18:38:22 | scorche|sh | the gba is running it natively...not emulating |
18:38:34 | dave | yeahyeah i know |
18:38:48 | dave | but the sounds are bad too |
18:38:59 | scorche|sh | that is a known issue |
18:39:02 | LambdaCalculus37 | dave: So shut sound off. |
18:39:04 | linuxstb | dave: Yes, rockboy sucks... |
18:39:12 | pondlife | If you've got a GBA, use that :) |
18:39:19 | scorche|sh | we dont really have any current developers for rockboy at the moment |
18:39:21 | dave | :D |
18:39:38 | dave | ok i see |
18:40:19 | dave | and... how can i install that patches on the rockbox, for ex: doom etc? |
18:40:27 | scorche|sh | I'm sorry dave, we can't let you do that. |
18:40:30 | pondlife | lol |
18:40:42 | scorche|sh | (sorry..couldnt resist) |
18:40:56 | pondlife | dave: Doom is included, you just need the maps |
18:41:27 | pixelma | someone who's seen Rockboy on an Archos Recorder knows what real slow is... ;) |
18:41:43 | dave | okok.. i saw a scroll wheel patch for the doom i want to install it thats all |
18:41:52 | | Quit Siku () |
18:42:00 | scorche|sh | dave: see the SimpleGuideToCompiling wiki page |
18:42:10 | pondlife | OK, you need to be able to compile your own Rockbox first |
18:42:24 | pondlife | s/maps/wads a few lines up |
18:42:40 | LambdaCalculus37 | pixelma: I saw Rockbox on my JBR. *Damn* slow. :) |
18:42:57 | LambdaCalculus37 | *s/x/y |
18:44:08 | * | gevaerts doesn't have enough usb ports on his laptop |
18:44:39 | pixelma | LambdaCalculus37: my Ondio doesn't have it - too few buttons. But I tested ZXBox on it and only later I saw Rockboy on a Recorder and my impression was that ZXBox (which is disabled for all Archos) is even a bit faster |
18:44:44 | * | scorche|sh hands gevaerts a Tardis USB hub |
18:44:50 | | Quit pondlife ("Leaving.") |
18:46:53 | LambdaCalculus37 | Curious: does the H320 have any other method of resetting, besides the reset pin? |
18:47:11 | | Join BigBambi [0] (n=Alex@rockbox/staff/BigBambi) |
18:47:14 | * | gevaerts thanks scorche|sh for the Tardis hub and tries to plug it in, but it seems the cable got lost at some other time |
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18:58:49 | dave | m leaving.. bye all |
18:58:52 | | Quit dave ("CGI:IRC") |
19:00 |
19:00:16 | * | amiconn reminds gevaerts that rockbox' high speed usb mode doesn't seem to like hubs |
19:00:23 | gevaerts | It seems that signal quality is better for my ipod than for my sansa |
19:00:48 | * | gevaerts will go and find his hub soon |
19:00:55 | linuxstb | gevaerts: Did you notice which ipod video it is? (512 or 2048 byte sectors) |
19:01:02 | * | BigBambi is impressed by the rate at which gevaerts' has acquired targets :) |
19:01:28 | gevaerts | linuxstb: 512 byte sectors (I had to check, it was a HFS one) |
19:01:49 | gevaerts | According to the apple website, the serial number says it's a 5G |
19:01:53 | amiconn | 30 or 60 GB? |
19:02:02 | gevaerts | 30GB |
19:03:29 | gevaerts | BigBambi: I'm slowing down now, although H10s seem to be cheap, so I might get one as well |
19:03:46 | BigBambi | Well you can never have too many :) |
19:04:03 | Horscht | no but you can spend too much |
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19:04:48 | * | amiconn needs to find a way to trick gevaerts into buying an iriver H300 ;) |
19:07:05 | * | gevaerts checks ebay, but wants to know what feature amiconn needs |
19:07:16 | amiconn | USB host... |
19:07:54 | amiconn | I don't really use it much, but it's the one feature of the H300 OF rockbox doesn't support yet |
19:08:07 | gevaerts | That should be OHCI (the SoC spec says so), so once it works on my gigabeat, it should be trivial to get it to work on H300 |
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19:08:41 | amiconn | Yeah, provided that we get the inits right |
19:09:08 | * | gevaerts doesn't like these inits |
19:09:16 | amiconn | The gigabeat is also OHCI? |
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19:10:54 | gevaerts | That's what the S3C2440A spec says. It just has one page of register addresses, and refers to the OHCI spec for details |
19:11:49 | amiconn | That means it's fullspeed only, correct? |
19:12:03 | gevaerts | Yes |
19:12:24 | amiconn | ISP1362 is also fullspeed only |
19:13:02 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
19:13:11 | toffe82 | the usb from the cpu is only available on the dock, the other one go through the usb 2 ata bridge |
19:13:21 | toffe82 | http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/viewfile/Main/GigabeatInfo?rev=1;filename=gigabeat_f40_block_diagrams_rotated.pdf |
19:14:25 | | Join bertrik [0] (n=Bertrik_@108-014-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) |
19:14:30 | gevaerts | True. It looks like the gigabeat implements some kind of hub logic in its dock. It _should_ be possible to use host usb directly through the dock connector, of you manage to get 5V from somewhere. |
19:15:05 | toffe82 | ther is no 5v output direct from the connector |
19:15:19 | gevaerts | s/of/if |
19:15:28 | toffe82 | only 4,2V, not enough to power a usb key for example |
19:15:41 | gevaerts | Maybe a battery pack ? 4.2V is indeed out of spec |
19:16:10 | toffe82 | I have all the component to make the interface but never had time to do it, but now that I find the connector, I will try to do it |
19:17:36 | toffe82 | gevaerts: if you are interested , I have all the wiring of the gigabeat F (almost all) didn't put it on the wiki because i is not really finished |
19:18:58 | gevaerts | toffe82: I can't really use it right now. For host support, the dock is sufficient, and I'm not especially handy when soldering is involved. |
19:18:58 | | Quit toffe82 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
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19:22:44 | toffe82 | do I miss something ? |
19:23:10 | bertrik | no |
19:23:10 | Beta2K | Nope |
19:23:31 | * | amiconn recommends the fine logs |
19:23:37 | gevaerts | toffe82: I can't really use it right now. For host support, the dock is sufficient, and I'm not especially handy when soldering is involved. |
19:23:51 | toffe82 | :) |
19:23:56 | * | gevaerts isn't sure if toffe82 got that before |
19:24:09 | * | bertrik is sorry for saying no |
19:25:39 | toffe82 | :) |
19:25:47 | | Quit Arathis (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
19:26:13 | amiconn | jhMikeS: ping |
19:27:56 | | Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@78-22-188-232.access.telenet.be) |
19:28:25 | | Quit tvelocity (Remote closed the connection) |
19:28:45 | * | LambdaCalculus37 managed to make it through an entire album on r16422 without a single problem |
19:30:35 | gevaerts | Half of the h300s on ebay have rockbox installed |
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19:38:02 | LambdaCalculus37 | gevarts: You serious? |
19:38:06 | * | LambdaCalculus37 goes to look |
19:39:27 | SteveGercak | Hello Everyone I am writing here to ask for write permission... I hope I am in the correct area... let me know if I am not |
19:40:46 | gevaerts | LambdaCalculus37: at least for the ones I find (i.e. those that are willing to send to Belgium) |
19:41:06 | LambdaCalculus37 | SteveGerack: You are. Your wiki name? |
19:41:51 | * | LambdaCalculus37 stated the obvious :) |
19:41:52 | SteveGercak | SteveGercak is my Wiki name |
19:41:59 | LambdaCalculus37 | One moment. |
19:42:30 | | Quit Horscht ("I got raided by the FBI and all i got is this lousy quit message") |
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19:43:19 | LambdaCalculus37 | SteveGercak: Done. Welcome to the wiki! No spamming, now! :) |
19:44:13 | SteveGercak | LambdaCalculus37: Thank You and ofcourse not :) |
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19:51:11 | * | gevaerts is now testing with a hub, and sees the problems amiconn mentionned |
19:52:38 | | Quit SteveGercak ("CGI:IRC") |
19:54:14 | | Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@78-22-188-232.access.telenet.be) |
19:56:29 | amiconn | It seems that I have a working solution for the PP5002 crash bug :D |
19:56:42 | amiconn | Oh man, PP5002 is really broken in some areas.... |
19:57:11 | pixelma | low_light: I was just looking around for an m:robe100 owner... |
19:57:15 | LambdaCalculus37 | amiconn: What's your solution? |
19:57:41 | amiconn | The problem is indeed that it crashes if the instruction that puts it to sleep is located at xxxxxxx0, i.e. at a cache line boundary |
19:58:17 | amiconn | So I introduced a short sequence that ensures the instruction that *actually* puts it to sleep is never located at xxxxxxx0 |
19:59:25 | | Join petur [50] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) |
19:59:54 | amiconn | I test the PC register, and use a streq / strne pair so that it always picks the one that's not located at xxxxx0 |
20:00 |
20:00:19 | amiconn | Unfortunately, a simple solution using .align doesn't work, for 2 reasons |
20:01:15 | amiconn | (1) On arm, .align doesn't pad with NOPs in a code section, and the optional padding value is a byte, not a word |
20:02:17 | amiconn | (2) Even if that worked, linking can change alignment later, because code sections aren't padded to cache-lines per object file (like e.g. on SH) |
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20:03:50 | | Join ender` [0] (i=krneki@84-255-206-8.static.t-2.net) |
20:05:22 | * | gevaerts decides he doesn't want a PP5002-based player |
20:07:41 | | Quit japc (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
20:07:50 | * | amiconn would like to see firewire supported on the ipods which have that |
20:08:39 | * | LambdaCalculus37 already has enough PP-based players |
20:09:59 | * | gevaerts won't be tricked into writing firewire drivers |
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20:12:33 | amiconn | Anyone around with a 3rd Gen ipod? |
20:12:41 | | Join nicktastique [0] (n=nick@unaffiliated/nicktastic) |
20:12:41 | * | Beta2K sujests to gecaerts that he write a firewire driver |
20:14:00 | petur | amiconn: fwiw, the battery benchmarks on my H10 with or without powermanagement are identical, so the microdrive does its own thing. I wonder if this setting has any effect on any target (did anybody ever test?) |
20:14:25 | amiconn | It does for sure on targets without hdd poweroff |
20:14:37 | amiconn | Did you didable hdd poweroff for your test? |
20:14:58 | petur | no |
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20:15:11 | petur | that wouldn have been realistic |
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20:15:27 | low_light | pixelma: yes |
20:15:28 | SSnake | hi all |
20:15:55 | amiconn | petur: You need to disable it in order to see a difference... |
20:16:10 | petur | but why? |
20:16:37 | petur | if it doesn't have effect in *normal use*, I don't care about special unrealistic cases |
20:16:49 | amiconn | Not all targets have hdd poweroff |
20:16:57 | petur | hmmmm |
20:17:10 | petur | point taken |
20:17:30 | SSnake | i've a really bad problem with a menu macro:MENUITEM_FUNCTION_DYNTEXT raises an error from the linker |
20:17:48 | amiconn | The Players don't in svn, because some player crash when enabling it (mine doesn't, so my private builds do have it), The FM/v2 don't, for a rather special reason (wrong wiring) |
20:17:51 | SSnake | but all goes good when i try compile a sim build |
20:18:00 | petur | moot point anyway because it looks like the powermanagement detection is good |
20:18:17 | amiconn | The FM/v2 *can* power off the hdd, but if the hdd is powered off, battery voltage cannot be measured |
20:18:27 | | Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@78-22-188-232.access.telenet.be) |
20:19:16 | * | amiconn wonders why mpegplayer refuses to work... |
20:19:46 | SSnake | anyone can help me try to figure out where's the problem? |
20:20:00 | * | amiconn would need an spc file to check whether mpegplayer or dualcore is the problem... |
20:20:17 | amiconn | Afaik spc is the only other place that already uses dualcore |
20:20:18 | SSnake | undefined reference to `memcpy' |
20:20:18 | SSnake | collect2: ld returned 1 exit status |
20:20:28 | gevaerts | SSnake: just to verify, did you run make clean ? |
20:20:37 | SSnake | yes of course |
20:20:49 | SSnake | i've tried deleting all build dir |
20:21:33 | SSnake | it seems nobody used this macro menu in a plugin ever |
20:21:34 | LambdaCalculus37 | amiconn: I can send you an SPC file to test. |
20:22:29 | SSnake | the compilation goes ok, only the linkage brakes when tries to resolve memcpy.... |
20:22:39 | gevaerts | SSnake: memcpy should be there. |
20:22:42 | | Quit nicktastic (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
20:22:54 | pixelma | low_light: PM |
20:23:02 | amiconn | sslashes: So this is in a plugin you're writing? |
20:23:03 | SSnake | but unfornutaley in my code there's no memcpy so some macro may call it and can't find it |
20:23:06 | SSnake | yep |
20:23:26 | amiconn | Well, gcc sometimes uses memcpy internally, e.g. for struct copying |
20:23:28 | SSnake | MENUITEM_FUNCTION_DYNTEXT used in a plugin |
20:24:13 | amiconn | gevaerts: memcpy is one of the 4 essential functions that the environment must provide when compiling with -freestanding |
20:24:37 | | Join Horscht [0] (n=Horscht@xbmc/user/horscht) |
20:25:09 | SSnake | mmmm probably my makefile is not good.....? I've copied it from sudoku and edited accordingly |
20:25:27 | | Join roolku [0] (n=roolku@77-99-112-231.cable.ubr16.edin.blueyonder.co.uk) |
20:25:37 | amiconn | no, that's not a makefile problem |
20:25:42 | SSnake | but the problem is not in cc it's in LD |
20:25:50 | SSnake | the error is raised by the linker |
20:25:51 | amiconn | Your plugin probably has a global plugin api pointer? |
20:25:51 | | Join spiorf [0] (n=spiorf@host76-226-dynamic.25-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
20:25:56 | amiconn | Yes of course |
20:26:14 | amiconn | Gcc uses memcpy, and the linker cannot link to it because it's not there |
20:26:22 | SSnake | yes as usual i created a rb variable declared blobally |
20:26:36 | SSnake | yes exactly |
20:26:51 | amiconn | Then put the following line directly below that (and initialise rb as soon as possible): |
20:26:57 | amiconn | MEM_FUNCTION_WRAPPERS(rb); |
20:27:34 | SSnake | let's see... (cross fingers) |
20:27:37 | * | gevaerts wonders if there's an area of the rockbox code that amiconn isn't familiar with |
20:27:47 | amiconn | sure |
20:29:27 | LambdaCalculus37 | amiconn: Still want an SPC file to test? |
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20:30:02 | zemo | Hello, I was wondering what kind of text files rockbox can read if it can read any at all? |
20:30:14 | LambdaCalculus37 | zemo: Plain text files. |
20:30:47 | zemo | thank you. Is there a specific plugin I need to use or just select the file like a song? |
20:30:58 | LambdaCalculus37 | Just select the file in the file viewer. |
20:31:10 | zemo | Thank you very much. That will be all. |
20:31:12 | amiconn | LambdaCalculus37: Yes please. Would be helpful :) |
20:31:13 | zemo | Have a nice day |
20:31:22 | LambdaCalculus37 | amiconn: PM |
20:31:28 | | Quit zemo (Client Quit) |
20:31:30 | | Quit linuxstb ("Leaving") |
20:32:59 | XavierGr | you must be braindead (or ignorant) having an H300 or H100 and not installing rockbox on it. |
20:33:29 | XavierGr | oops that must have been said 30 minutes ago :\ |
20:34:07 | | Join linuxstb [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
20:37:33 | SSnake | mmmmmmmmmm another problem raised...by the compiler: error: syntax error before '->' token |
20:37:33 | | Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
20:38:12 | SSnake | just in the point where i put MEM_FUNCTION_WRAPPERS |
20:38:40 | SSnake | any suggestion? |
20:39:18 | linuxstb | You _are_ doing MEM_FUNCTION_WRAPPERS(rb) ? |
20:39:19 | | Quit nicktastique (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
20:40:05 | | Join nicktastic [0] (n=nick@c-71-61-58-56.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
20:41:20 | SSnake | struct plugin_api* rb; |
20:41:20 | SSnake | MEM_FUNCTION_WRAPPERS(rb); |
20:41:38 | | Quit nicktastic (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
20:42:57 | SSnake | damn i'm going to be mad |
20:43:35 | low_light | roolku: does power off work for you now? |
20:43:45 | | Join faemir [0] (n=daniel@85-211-114-251.dyn.gotadsl.co.uk) |
20:44:03 | roolku | low_light: I am just about to try |
20:45:07 | | Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@78-22-188-232.access.telenet.be) |
20:45:52 | faemir | Is there anyway to make the rockbox database browse faster? |
20:46:17 | amiconn | Something is definitely hosed wrt dualcore support on PP5002 |
20:46:48 | linuxstb | faemir: Have you enabled the "load to RAM" option? |
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20:48:57 | | Join mirak [0] (n=mirak@m105.net81-66-122.noos.fr) |
20:49:12 | low_light | roolku: power-off has worked flawlessly for me since yesterday. It takes a bit longer than my other targets, probably because of the slow disk. |
20:49:37 | roolku | low_light: yes, it is taking its time, but us coming through eventually :) |
20:50:31 | faemir | linuxstb: yes |
20:51:36 | roolku | low_light: not sure it is about the disk - I have a patch that uses the display LED as a HDD LED and it is not flashing |
20:51:55 | roolku | low_light: but it is great not to have to wear out the reset button :) |
20:52:01 | | Quit mirak (SendQ exceeded) |
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20:54:38 | | Nick mchua|away is now known as mchua (n=mchua@cpe-66-108-80-238.nyc.res.rr.com) |
20:54:38 | SSnake | i tried cleaning & building sim: error: expected '=', ',', ';', 'asm' or '__attribute__' before '->' token |
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20:56:42 | faemir | linuxstb is there anything I can do? |
20:59:07 | Llorean | faemir: What are you finding slow about it? |
20:59:39 | faemir | when I click on database it saying some finding thing for like 1 second, and then just browsing folders feels very unsnappy and slow. |
20:59:46 | | Quit spiorf ("Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)") |
20:59:49 | faemir | Also, scrolling is very slow |
20:59:52 | faemir | and not smooth |
21:00 |
21:00:46 | Llorean | What build version are you on? |
21:00:50 | faemir | latest |
21:00:57 | faemir | I /just/ updated. |
21:01:08 | linuxstb_ | Do you also have dircache enabled? |
21:01:16 | | Quit linuxstb (Nick collision from services.) |
21:01:19 | | Nick linuxstb_ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@i-83-67-212-170.freedom2surf.net) |
21:01:21 | | Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
21:01:21 | * | Llorean really wishes people would just answer a number for that. |
21:01:44 | faemir | linuxstb: dircache? |
21:02:12 | faemir | Llorean: r16544 |
21:02:14 | faemir | :P |
21:02:32 | Llorean | See, now we know you updated properly |
21:02:40 | Llorean | But, just to be technical, that's not the latest. |
21:02:50 | Llorean | So, if the latest commit *had* been a fix for that, you'd have been in trouble. :-P |
21:03:05 | faemir | You are telling me the latest was less than 30 seconds ago? >_> |
21:03:33 | Llorean | The latest is building right now. |
21:03:42 | Llorean | But it's in the changelog, and also available to anyone who builds themselves. |
21:03:52 | faemir | ok, the latest /available/ at the moment via rbutil. Happy? XD |
21:03:58 | Llorean | Anyway, dircache might help, it's explained in the manual. |
21:04:07 | faemir | Okay |
21:04:08 | Llorean | faemir: How 'bout just giving SVN revisions in the future, so there's no confusion? |
21:04:18 | faemir | Llorean: sure thing ;) |
21:04:43 | faemir | Ooo, I see icons by the menu. |
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21:04:44 | linuxstb | faemir: It's called "directory cache" in the manual (I think..) |
21:04:49 | Llorean | People have a variety of meanings for latest. I often run into people who mean "the latest DAILY" with it, and that's all kinds of difficulty. Sorry if I'm a bit touchy on the matter, but it's a vague subject without revisions. |
21:05:23 | faemir | Llorean: yeh, It was my fault, sorry. |
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21:05:44 | faemir | Ooo, I know someone with an mrobe:100, when was that available to put rockbox on? |
21:06:33 | linuxstb | It's not available yet - I think it's just in need of a manual and install instructions though. |
21:07:00 | faemir | Ok |
21:07:16 | faemir | Llorean: I can't find directory cache in the manual, what is the easiest way to search for it in the manual? |
21:07:48 | linuxstb | faemir: What player are you running Rockbox on? |
21:08:01 | faemir | linuxstb: ipod v5.5gen 30gb |
21:08:31 | roolku | faemir: m:robe 100 is not official, but you can already download/install it following the instructions on the wiki. |
21:08:58 | faemir | roolku: cool, I'll probably wait for it to be official, since as my friend will need help setting it up and stuff :) |
21:09:21 | pixelma | roolku: you were interested in the cabbiev2 for the m:robe100... just posted something to the tracker |
21:09:32 | | Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@78-22-188-232.access.telenet.be) |
21:09:40 | * | roolku goes to have a look |
21:10:20 | linuxstb | faemir: Section 7.6.3 |
21:11:11 | | Quit perrikwp ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") |
21:11:48 | petur | amiconn: ran a build that re-reads identify_info after power-on and doesn't set powermanagement, and words 85/87 are the same as with an svn build.... |
21:12:03 | petur | brb |
21:12:32 | amiconn | That doesn't necessarily mean all HDDs will have it enabled by default |
21:13:05 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
21:14:09 | | Quit midgey () |
21:17:03 | | Quit toffe82 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
21:17:15 | petur | anything against committing the patch? Test on ipod nano first? |
21:18:06 | SSnake | I T W O R K S !! Hail to amiconn lord of Rockbox dev :P |
21:18:24 | amiconn | petur: I'd prefer that |
21:18:30 | amiconn | preglow? |
21:18:53 | petur | is he the only one with a nano? |
21:19:02 | | Quit bertrik ("off to play") |
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21:19:09 | amiconn | Llorean also has one iirc |
21:19:16 | | Part PuppiesOnAcid |
21:19:16 | faemir | linuxstb: it's still jerky, or do I have to wait a bit after the reboot? |
21:20:03 | Llorean | petur: If you can provide me a build, I can test for you. can't build right now. Do have a nano |
21:20:16 | Llorean | And oddly enough it's with me, and charged, for the first time in two or three months |
21:20:19 | pixelma | scorche too |
21:20:33 | petur | alright, one nano build coming up... |
21:20:57 | faemir | Also, is it possible to edit the navigation controls for rockbox? |
21:21:28 | linuxstb | faemir: Only by changing the code, there are no settings. |
21:21:42 | faemir | Eh. I can't be bothered :P |
21:21:52 | scorche|sh | yar..i am at work today though, so no nano around |
21:22:09 | faemir | I just prefer the original firmware menu/select instead of rewind/fastfoward. |
21:22:21 | Slasheri | faemir: how do you experience that the performance of the db is poor? |
21:22:21 | jhMikeS | amiconn: estoy aqui ahora :) |
21:22:45 | amiconn | jhMikeS: Did you get your 3rd Gen going again? |
21:22:45 | faemir | Slasheri: it takes ages to navigate through folders, especially while music is playing. |
21:23:02 | Slasheri | faemir: ah, so you mean that the scrolling is slow? |
21:23:19 | jhMikeS | amiconn: not yet. I think I'm going to have to break down and just order the replacement jack module. |
21:23:22 | faemir | Slasheri: that, and when I select folders it saying browsing x files found |
21:23:26 | amiconn | It seems like I have a working fix for the PP5002 crashes. See about 90 minutes back in the logs |
21:23:57 | amiconn | It would be nice if the patch could be tested on a 3rd Gen... |
21:24:11 | Slasheri | interesting.. didn't rockbox on ipod utilise both cores when playing something? |
21:24:23 | amiconn | I can test myself on 2nd Gen (works) and 1st Gen (currently charging) |
21:24:36 | Slasheri | (i haven't had the ipod for long time to try that..) |
21:25:04 | amiconn | It does for SPC files |
21:25:06 | Llorean | Slasheri: Not really, no. Nobody's converted any codecs but SPC to use core 2 |
21:25:14 | amiconn | mpegplayer also uses both cores |
21:25:18 | jhMikeS | amiconn: so the only problem is when a core puts itself to sleep but never any with the instruction that wakes it in core_wake? |
21:25:30 | amiconn | No, it's only the sleep |
21:25:43 | Slasheri | Llorean: ah, i thought the playback thread already runs on the second core |
21:26:05 | Slasheri | (i had that semi-working a long time ago, resulting in ui being as responsive as without playback) |
21:26:09 | | Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
21:26:16 | roolku | pixelma: it looks very good on target, just one comment - the dithering on "box" makes it illegible - maybe try an irregular dithering method (or I think no dithering would be best) |
21:26:32 | petur | Llorean: http://petur.homedns.org:8080/rockbox_nano.zip |
21:26:49 | amiconn | petur: I'm currently looking at your latest patch, and have some questions |
21:27:21 | Llorean | Slasheri: I believe the final decisions was that use of the second core should be left up to the codec itself |
21:27:35 | pixelma | roolku: just saw your latest commit, reminds me that I also want to redo the cards (used in solitaire and blackjack) and didn't think about this first but they should be "inversed" too) :) |
21:27:46 | faemir | Slasheri: soo.. any ideas? |
21:28:13 | * | jhMikeS doesn't recall a "decision" in that regard. |
21:28:14 | roolku | pixelma: I just hope we don't get a monochrome target that isn't reversed - then we are in trouble |
21:28:17 | Llorean | faemir: Get a non-slow MP3 player. |
21:28:31 | Slasheri | faemir: not really. i had a custom scroll acceleration patch on my ipod that worked quite well when playback was not active |
21:28:40 | Llorean | jhMikeS: I swear I saw you (as a plural) discussing it, and eventually deciding that it was more flexible that way. |
21:28:42 | Slasheri | but i have no idea how the scrolling works now |
21:28:49 | faemir | Llorean: if it has 30gb+ then sure I will, just name it :) |
21:28:49 | pixelma | roolku: thanks for the opinion... I'll see what I can do about the logo, just thought that non-dithered makes the logo so important) |
21:28:55 | Llorean | faemir: Gigabeat F series. |
21:29:20 | faemir | Llorean: yeh, I'm waiting for a nice one of those to show up on UK ebay |
21:30:09 | pixelma | roolku: I can't imagine that we get another monochrome target with the exactly same screen size, seems very unusual to me (most things use colour screens now). But you never know... |
21:30:10 | Llorean | petur: What am I looking for? |
21:30:12 | | Join tvelocity [0] (n=tony@athedsl-00756.home.otenet.gr) |
21:30:13 | Slasheri | after having used ipod for a while, it would still think the iriver h140 is the best dap ever made |
21:30:27 | Slasheri | it=I |
21:30:34 | LambdaCalculus37 | faemir: http://cgi.ebay.com/Toshiba-Gigabeat-F40-40GB-Mobile-MP3-Player_W0QQitemZ320225722208QQihZ011QQcategoryZ73839QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem |
21:30:34 | petur | Llorean: just proper operation (no freezing) |
21:30:38 | Llorean | Slasheri: If only it had a bit less hiss. |
21:30:44 | roolku | pixelma: do you have enough pixel for an outline? that might work instead of dithering |
21:30:52 | Llorean | petur: Any specific operations that should trigger one? |
21:31:00 | jhMikeS | Llorean: I think it was more along the lines of the codec should run 2nd core by default but can switch things if needed for its own purpose. |
21:31:23 | Slasheri | Llorean: really? i thought that was one of the best daps in terms of sound quality / snr |
21:31:23 | petur | Llorean: 'disk' access |
21:31:39 | pixelma | roolku: not "everywhere", sometimes it's only 2 pixels wide |
21:31:42 | Llorean | petur: So, if playback starts, things are good? |
21:31:51 | Slasheri | (of course if you don't use the remote..) |
21:31:56 | Llorean | Slasheri: There's a very significant hiss audible at low volumes on low impedance phones. |
21:32:05 | faemir | Llorean: what battery life do they have btw? |
21:32:06 | jhMikeS | A heavy decoding job works best if the COP decodes and the CPU does DSP but if the decoding job is lightweight like (WAV) then all could run on COP. |
21:32:07 | pixelma | roolku: in some places, I meant :) |
21:32:11 | Llorean | faemir: 14-16 hours I'd say |
21:32:19 | petur | Llorean: just general use (browsing, playing) for a while |
21:32:33 | Slasheri | Llorean: hmm, interesting. i have never noticed that, but probably i don't have that low impedances phones either |
21:32:43 | Llorean | jhMikeS: Ah, well that's still though "the codec should decide", right? I didn't say the codecs shouldn't be on the COP. :) |
21:32:44 | roolku | pixelma: yes, I was afraid that would be the case |
21:32:59 | faemir | Llorean: Woah good deal O_O |
21:33:02 | jhMikeS | Llorean: s/should/can :) |
21:33:05 | Llorean | Slasheri: I can hear it with CX300s and some Sure's I've got, and other people have confirmed it on theirs. It's really not a problem if you listen about about -40 |
21:33:09 | Llorean | *above |
21:33:29 | Llorean | jhMikeS: I pretty much agree, they all should do as much work as they can on the COP. ;) |
21:33:43 | faemir | Llorean: I can sell my ipod, and buy that, and keep the change! XD |
21:34:16 | | Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@78-22-188-232.access.telenet.be) |
21:34:37 | SSnake | guys do you prefer a plugin exiting after SYS_USB_CONNECTED ? |
21:34:37 | | Quit low_light ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") |
21:34:38 | Llorean | petur: Browsing around and playback don't seem to cause any obvious problems |
21:34:55 | Llorean | faemir: And you'd come out ahead both in the power of your DAP and in money. :) |
21:34:59 | roolku | pixelma: your USB plug looks great and of the right size without me doing anything about it - I wonder which version it is using |
21:35:04 | jhMikeS | The SPC codec really can only run at all with the heaviest emulations on PP because of the \parallelism. |
21:35:07 | faemir | Llorean: damn it I can't remember my ebay account D= |
21:35:14 | petur | Llorean: in particular (as I see nano has no ata_power_off): leave it idle for some time and then access the flash (load a plugin? credits plugin?) |
21:35:15 | faemir | Llorean: I don't suppose you have one of these? |
21:35:15 | Llorean | faemir: The Gigabeat F is currently the most powerful (in terms of CPU) of working Rockbox targets. |
21:35:27 | amiconn | petur: (1) Any reason why you removed the CONTROL_nIEN bit from perform_soft_reset? This has been there since the beginning of the drivers/ dir... |
21:35:44 | Llorean | petur: "some time" being 30 seconds, 255 second, 5 minutes, or some other number? |
21:35:57 | Llorean | faemir: "one of these"? |
21:36:09 | pixelma | roolku: it's always right aligned, not sure which version it's using, would have to check SOURCES |
21:36:09 | * | petur wonders if the nano does spin down |
21:36:24 | amiconn | petur: (2) The features check for advanced power management is wrong now |
21:36:41 | faemir | Llorean: a gigabeat F |
21:36:48 | Llorean | faemir: I've got two, actually. :) |
21:36:48 | amiconn | (perhaps an oversight from experimenting?) |
21:36:53 | faemir | Llorean: why were they discontinued if they are such good players then? :( |
21:37:37 | Llorean | Because the Gigabeat S is arguably a better one. |
21:38:00 | faemir | Are S series supported by rockbox? |
21:38:06 | LambdaCalculus37 | Not yet. |
21:38:33 | LambdaCalculus37 | There's a few things left to be done on the S to make it fully work. |
21:38:44 | n1s | like making audio work... |
21:38:51 | LambdaCalculus37 | And a USB stack. |
21:39:02 | faemir | n1s: hahaha |
21:39:42 | faemir | Gigabeat S series look very nice :( |
21:39:44 | Llorean | Petur: Seems like leaving it idle for a while has no averse effects. |
21:39:47 | | Quit replix_ ("Verlassend") |
21:40:04 | | Join midgey [0] (n=tjross@westquad-188-46.reshall.umich.edu) |
21:40:28 | petur | amiconn: 1) you're right, that shouldn't have gone out |
21:40:36 | petur | 2) must check |
21:40:45 | LambdaCalculus37 | farmir: You can buy one if you wish, but it may be some time before the port is ready for everyday use. |
21:40:56 | LambdaCalculus37 | For now, stick with a Gigabeat F. |
21:41:14 | LambdaCalculus37 | Or a Gigabeat X, even, if you can find one. |
21:41:27 | roolku | pixelma: usblogo.104x27x1.bmp |
21:41:35 | Llorean | LambdaCalculus37: I'm not *wholly* sure I'd recommend an X |
21:41:45 | roolku | pixelma: seems fine to me |
21:41:53 | Llorean | Because there's no developer with one, and because the hardware differences are subtle, sometimes they seem to experience unexpected (and hard to track) behaviour |
21:42:14 | faemir | LambdaCalculus37: what is the X series? |
21:42:42 | pixelma | that's probably the one made for the Iriver remote (128 pixels wide, monochrome; can be used for the iFP and ahem the Logik Dax, too) |
21:42:48 | pixelma | roolku^ |
21:42:55 | petur | amiconn: re 2) must indeed be word 86, have been looking at the wrong bit :( and that will not work :( |
21:43:00 | petur | brb |
21:43:06 | | Quit hcs ("Leaving.") |
21:43:15 | Llorean | faemir: Gigabeat X |
21:43:20 | jhMikeS | amiconn: is there any precedent in retailos to indicate the sleep shouldn't be at xxxxxxx0? |
21:43:45 | LambdaCalculus37 | Llorean: I only mention the X series since we also support it, even though it's nearly impossible to find. |
21:43:50 | faemir | Llorean: oh right. what is different about it to the F? |
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21:43:59 | | Part hcs |
21:44:30 | amiconn | petur: It must be word 83 |
21:44:39 | Llorean | faemir: Mostly the outside appearance. Different body, slightly bigger screen (but at the same resolution) |
21:44:54 | amiconn | jhMikeS: Not sure, as I don't know how the OF loads, hence whether my addresses are correct |
21:45:05 | amiconn | It might copy parts to iram or relocate them otherwise |
21:46:07 | petur | amiconn: it was 83, and that didn't work. that was the whole point: finding a bit that does reflect the powermanagement support. |
21:46:17 | jhMikeS | does having the sleep in IRAM change the behavior? |
21:46:26 | amiconn | No |
21:46:57 | amiconn | That's something I wanted to ask - whether having core_sleep not inlined might be a problem |
21:47:23 | amiconn | petur: Word 83 indicates whether advanced power management is supported, word 86 whether it's enabled |
21:47:49 | amiconn | So your set_feature would only enable it if it's already enabled - certainly not correct |
21:47:57 | petur | amiconn: so test both 83 and 86? |
21:48:01 | amiconn | no |
21:48:11 | faemir | I think someone should get employed on the iPod team and then steal all of the specifications and stuff. |
21:48:42 | amiconn | Just check 83, and additionally the validity of words 85..87 to sort out those ata devices which don't behave |
21:48:44 | petur | hmmm that bit in 86 being set just reflects that some drives have powermanagement on by default :/ |
21:48:57 | jhMikeS | amiconn: not technically but the inlining was worked out to maximize the speed (my benchmarking) |
21:49:30 | amiconn | jhMikeS: Okay. Then that means having the function in iram still makes it crash depending on alignment (already tried it) |
21:50:00 | dionoea | Hello. |
21:50:00 | amiconn | Anyway, my fix only adds a few instructions and seems to work nicely |
21:51:07 | amiconn | http://pastebin.ca/932570 |
21:51:44 | faemir | Llorean: wanna buy an ipod 30gb 5.5gen? XD |
21:51:44 | | Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
21:52:07 | jhMikeS | I just wonder why the alignment never seemed to show a problem earlier |
21:52:24 | amiconn | The bug is present for quite some time now |
21:52:43 | Llorean | faemir: Sorry, already got the one iPod I'll ever probably own. |
21:52:51 | amiconn | Maybe it only hits if both cores are used. |
21:53:20 | LambdaCalculus37 | I'm not taking another iPod. I'm already getting a third from my dad. |
21:53:50 | faemir | Llorean: which is what? :P |
21:54:00 | Llorean | faemir: Nano, 1st generation. |
21:54:14 | | Quit ender` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
21:54:22 | faemir | Llorean: they any good? |
21:55:13 | jhMikeS | amiconn: it hits no matter what. I checked that. |
21:57:00 | * | petur gets way to many NMI's from real life to concentrate :/ |
21:57:57 | * | LambdaCalculus37 is off to have a beer at the local watering hole |
21:58:03 | LambdaCalculus37 | Bye, everybody! |
21:58:08 | | Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("CGI:IRC 0.5.9 (2006/06/06)") |
21:58:19 | amiconn | jhMikeS: Regarding mpegplayer on dualcore, is the audio decoded on cop and video on cpu, or vice versa? |
21:58:33 | jhMikeS | amiconn: audio = CPU, video = COP |
21:58:47 | faemir | Llorean: why the hell is the shipping $80? |
21:58:52 | amiconn | Ah, that explains the skipping on 2nd Gen... :/ |
21:59:21 | | Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@78-22-188-232.access.telenet.be) |
21:59:42 | amiconn | The greyscale lib is drawing too much cpu now that audio uses core dsp |
22:00 |
22:01:01 | jhMikeS | amiconn: Perhaps allow the greylib timer to run on COP? Much easier I think than trying to move audio to COP since the pcm driver needs some careful rework to have it do it. |
22:01:31 | amiconn | hmm |
22:01:36 | amiconn | Might be possible |
22:01:53 | amiconn | In fact that might also help to further speed up other plugins using the greylib |
22:02:34 | amiconn | The problem is to ensure cache consistency |
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22:03:04 | jhMikeS | but then cache hell rears it's head if the plugin isn't expecting it |
22:03:10 | * | amiconn thinks that could be a feature to be requested from the greylib now that it takes a features bitmap |
22:03:29 | amiconn | s/bitmap/bitmask/ |
22:04:33 | amiconn | hmm |
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22:04:48 | amiconn | The greylib could make sure its buffers are uncacheable |
22:04:48 | jhMikeS | 3g was always iffy with the audio. the final optimizations made some videos work without skips regardless of using the core dsp |
22:05:17 | amiconn | It could just convert all buffer addresses internally to use UNCACHED_ADDR |
22:05:56 | jhMikeS | then they must also be cacheline aligned |
22:06:01 | amiconn | Not all buffers would need that, just the ones accessed by the isr (values and phases) |
22:06:36 | amiconn | That shouldn't be a problem; I'm already aligning modulo 16 on coldfire, for maximum performance |
22:07:56 | * | amiconn wonders how much this would speed up lasma |
22:08:23 | amiconn | Plasma is already so fast on mini that it's very blurry |
22:09:10 | amiconn | mpegplayer buffering is also on cpu I presume? |
22:09:37 | jhMikeS | the alignment should probably go back to 16 for PP, somewhat unrelated: gigabeat F/X and S need 32 (the ata driver on F/X should be considering the cache lines when using DMA and reading). |
22:10:13 | Slasheri | Nico_P: hi, i am just rewriting the playback event handling so you don't need to bother about that :) |
22:10:32 | Nico_P | Slasheri: nice :) |
22:11:15 | amiconn | jhMikeS: Umm, gigabeat shouldn't need to worry, as it's single core... am I missing something? |
22:11:23 | Slasheri | Nico_P: i just added two generic functions: playback_add_event and playback_remove_event |
22:12:40 | jhMikeS | amiconn: same problem there with an uncached buffer sharing a cache line with a cached one |
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22:13:17 | amiconn | Why would you need an uncached buffer at all? |
22:13:28 | jhMikeS | peripheral DMA |
22:13:39 | amiconn | Ah, DMA... |
22:14:30 | amiconn | Does any driver on gigabeat use DMA? Last time I checked, the ata driver didn't |
22:15:47 | jhMikeS | it does but only for even-aligned transfers atm. I have a personal version that always uses it though. |
22:16:56 | amiconn | Is it faster than the cpu polling driver? |
22:17:31 | jhMikeS | the same but it sleeps and waits for an DMA interrupt wake rather than spinning |
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22:17:50 | amiconn | On coldfire, using DMA for ATA turned out to be slower than using the CPU and proper line bursting |
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22:18:22 | amiconn | I also tried DMA auto-align, but that didn't work (data errors, which went away the moment I disabled AA) |
22:18:41 | jhMikeS | I did the same for the i2c there since the fast processors burn alot of cycles busy waiting when they could be powered down waiting for a slow peripheral to complete |
22:22:14 | dionoea | Anyone know of potential problems with High Speed rockbox USB support on the iPod Video? |
22:22:17 | amiconn | Hmm. The timer driver doesn't allow to select the core to use for the timer isr |
22:22:41 | amiconn | That's something that needs to be added... |
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22:23:28 | gevaerts | The manual is missing "installing from svn" in the installation chapter, for if you don't want to download ipodpatcherdionoea: have you already looked at http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/PortalPlayerUsb ? |
22:23:33 | amiconn | I think I'll remove the priority selection. It only applies to SH1, and there's no real use for it. |
22:23:51 | * | gevaerts always gets in trouble when trying to paste something |
22:23:56 | gevaerts | dionoea: have you |
22:23:58 | gevaerts | +already looked at http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/PortalPlayerUsb ? |
22:24:56 | jhMikeS | amiconn: coldfire, s3c2440 and imx31 are also capable of prioritizing interrupts but s3c2440 is a bit restrictive |
22:24:58 | dionoea | gevaerts: so i'm likely to run into the signal power issue but other than that it's pretty much stable and nobody noticed any hd corruption? |
22:25:11 | gevaerts | dionoea: there's some more issues (I will add them soon). (1) it seems to discharge while connected, and (2) it seems unreliable when used behind a hub |
22:25:25 | dionoea | ok. Sounds great :) |
22:26:06 | gevaerts | dionoea: nobody noticed any hd corruption _when directly connected_. I just saw some myself behind a hub ... |
22:26:14 | * | gevaerts doesn't like that |
22:26:19 | jhMikeS | amiconn: if that alignment thing works I'd say to just commit the fix |
22:26:43 | amiconn | I will test on my 1st Gen when it's charged, then commit |
22:27:04 | * | dionoea considers doing a backup before testing more |
22:27:16 | amiconn | gevaerts: For me it simply doesn't work on the hub. So no data corruption |
22:28:10 | gevaerts | amiconn: you're lucky then ;) |
22:28:47 | * | jhMikeS is working on code in those sections so wants to "svn resolve" asap :) |
22:28:47 | gevaerts | Of course, since I only have my ipod since about six hours, maybe I have bad hardware and don't know it yet |
22:28:50 | amiconn | This PP5002 stabilisation is a precondition for my next greyscale library feature... |
22:30:16 | gevaerts | I'll test further once the ipod is charged again |
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22:33:45 | jhMikeS | amiconn: I need to know which arm version is being compiled for in order to use certain instructions (like clz which is arm5). I simply made CPU_ARM be defined as 4, 5, etc if it's defined. Any better way to distinguish that you can think of? |
22:35:17 | amiconn | Hmm, that sounds hackish |
22:35:26 | linuxstb | Why not just introduce a new #define - something like ARM_ARCH? |
22:36:01 | amiconn | There's already CPU_ARM7TDMI - see config.h lines 365ff |
22:36:04 | bluebrother | dang. Half an hour too late :( |
22:36:24 | * | bluebrother almost bought a Gigabeat |
22:36:38 | * | amiconn fetches a beer |
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22:37:26 | jhMikeS | I can do that but to use these instructions I don't want an exhaustive set of tests in the source. arm4, arm5 etc. are better indications of which instructions are useable. |
22:37:36 | PuppiesOnAcid | is anyone working on porting rockbox to the new ipod nanos/classics? |
22:37:59 | Bagder | PuppiesOnAcid: nope |
22:38:16 | PuppiesOnAcid | why not? |
22:38:58 | dionoea | gevaerts: I get quite a few resets. Those are likely to be due to the low signal power issue you mention on the wiki page right? |
22:39:05 | Bagder | PuppiesOnAcid: ask all the owners of those targets why they don't |
22:39:25 | Bagder | PuppiesOnAcid: I can guess on the answer: the encryption part is making it very hard |
22:40:15 | PuppiesOnAcid | ah |
22:42:32 | jhMikeS | mmkay, I'll #define ARM_ARCH 5 for imx31 and #define ARM_ARCH 4 otherwise (are any others not arm4?) |
22:43:09 | linuxstb | Isn't imx31 arch 6? |
22:43:20 | jhMikeS | yes, oops. |
22:43:47 | linuxstb | tcc77x is 5 |
22:43:59 | linuxstb | Not sure about DM320... |
22:44:22 | jhMikeS | what about 780? |
22:44:50 | jhMikeS | more thoroughly CPU_TCC780X |
22:44:54 | linuxstb | I'm not sure - it has two arm cores (different ones...) |
22:45:37 | jhMikeS | are they completely shared memory like PP? |
22:46:11 | linuxstb | tcc77x is ARM946E-S, tcc7801 is ARM926EJ-S + ARM946ES |
22:46:27 | linuxstb | I've no idea. |
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22:48:28 | linuxstb | So that makes the tcc7801 ARMv5... |
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22:48:56 | linuxstb | And the DM320 has an ARM926EJ-S core as well... |
22:49:55 | jhMikeS | both cores seem to be ARM5 though different sub-versions. |
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22:50:38 | jhMikeS | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ARM_architecture |
22:51:39 | linuxstb | You mean the "J" part? |
22:53:19 | jhMikeS | 926je-s has the jazelle DBX stuff/dsp whereas 946e-s only has the dsp (not that I know what that implies atm) |
22:53:50 | jhMikeS | is jazelle the Java instructions? |
22:53:56 | Bagder | yes |
22:54:20 | Bagder | java instruction mode magic something |
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22:58:24 | jhMikeS | I suppose it's not possible to use arm5/6 instructions unless configure uses the correct -mcpu anway and I don't want to mess around that much yet |
22:58:35 | linuxstb | I thought it did? |
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22:59:16 | Bagder | it does |
22:59:26 | Bagder | -mcpu=arm926ej-s etc |
23:00 |
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23:01:21 | n1s | Yes it should be correct for all our arms |
23:02:57 | roolku | gevaerts: I am trying to get the SERIAL_USB to work with windows XP - it tries to install a "composite USB device" but fails with "Device cannot start. (Code 10)". Any ideas, suggestions, things I could try? |
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23:04:45 | gevaerts | roolku: I suspect that our serial class is just not complete enough for windows to like it. Problem is that I get confused whenever I read the USB CDC spec. |
23:05:07 | jhMikeS | why is it defined(CPU_TCC77X) instead of (CONFIG_CPU == TCC77X) ? |
23:05:13 | gevaerts | roolku: the composite device is because you also have storage enabled |
23:06:08 | roolku | gevaerts: I had #define USB_STORAGE commented out, but there is #define USB_CHARGING_ONLY |
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23:08:30 | jhMikeS | ah, never mind...general family |
23:08:36 | gevaerts | roolku: that could cause it as well. Anyway, that's not the problem. I think windows just expects there to be something which we don't do yet, but I don't know what |
23:10:00 | * | gevaerts edits the wiki to mention this |
23:10:26 | amiconn | jhMikeS: Not necessarily. |
23:10:31 | roolku | gevaerts: I found this - not sure if it any help http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/system/bus/USB/USBFAQ_intermed.mspx |
23:11:02 | amiconn | E.g. ARM7TDMI and ARM920 are both armv4, but arm7 needs different optimisations than arm9 |
23:11:04 | jhMikeS | amiconn: I see now it's (CONFIG_CPU == TCC7801) defined CPU_TCC780X etc. |
23:12:00 | amiconn | The architecture versions define which instructions are available, but the instruction timing can change within the same architecture version |
23:12:28 | amiconn | This is some nasty mix-and-match. I don't think there's a simple solution |
23:12:40 | gevaerts | roolku: I looked at that at some point as well I think. The relevant documents are in http://www.usb.org/developers/devclass_docs/CDC1.2_WMC1.1.zip if you want to have a go |
23:13:01 | jhMikeS | of course. this is just complicated to fully specify with all the variation. |
23:13:10 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
23:13:58 | * | gevaerts thinks of doing debug over the HID class, emulating a keyboard. |
23:14:41 | jhMikeS | but some arm5 have DSP instruction and others don't (sort of like coldfire not nescessarily having an EMAC unit) |
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23:15:39 | roolku | gevaerts: thanks, maybe another time... |
23:16:37 | PuppiesOnAcid | is the rockbox project in need of ipods to do research on? |
23:16:47 | amiconn | gevaerts: How is usb over serial supposed to work, btw? Does it emulate some usb-serial bridge chipset? |
23:17:04 | * | amiconn *thinks* there is no standard class for serial, but isn't sure |
23:17:23 | amiconn | I mean serial over usb of course |
23:17:56 | gevaerts | amiconn: there is. The Communications Device Class. |
23:18:18 | amiconn | Hmm. Isn't that meant for modems? |
23:18:44 | gevaerts | amiconn: for everything from serial emulation to ATM, via modems and isdn |
23:19:00 | amiconn | And windows should support that? |
23:19:23 | gevaerts | It should, using usbser.sys. |
23:19:24 | amiconn | I have a usb-serial adapter, which needs a special driver |
23:20:00 | n1s | PuppiesOnAcid: We are in need of motivated skillfull hackers with said ipods and lots of spare time ;) |
23:20:02 | amiconn | (based on the obviously widespread PL2303) |
23:20:37 | * | gevaerts isn't entirely sure of all this, since he hasn't actually seen it work yet. |
23:22:01 | * | gevaerts has actually seen sort-of USB over serial. USB over hand-soldered DB-9 connectors. Our current signalling problems are nothing compared to what that setup gets |
23:22:55 | amiconn | Maybe this is some hint? http://support.microsoft.com/?scid=kb%3Ben-us%3B918365 |
23:24:13 | gevaerts | Not related. We don't have (or need) an IAD (== interface association descriptor, needed if you have some complex device that has several interfaces that belong together somehow) |
23:25:04 | gevaerts | I think I'll ask bertrik next time he's online. Maybe he knows more. |
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23:25:29 | amiconn | Hmm, my system doesn't seem to have usbser.sys |
23:26:04 | gevaerts | XP or Vista ? In Vista I think it's replaced by something else |
23:26:19 | amiconn | xp |
23:28:42 | gevaerts | I tried it by pointing windows to this .inf : http://www.evonet.be/~gevaerts/rockser.inf |
23:30:05 | * | petur has several usb-serial adapters at work, none work 100% stable |
23:30:28 | amiconn | Mine works, but I had to find an up-to-date driver |
23:31:34 | amiconn | There are 2 main versions of the PL2303 driver. 1.x (which many adapter manufacturers still ship, even though it's stone age), and 2.0 (which I found on the prolific homepage) |
23:32:03 | amiconn | 1.x caused frequent bluescreens here. 2.0 is stable |
23:32:38 | amiconn | But that's probably OT... |
23:32:59 | petur | yes on both ;) |
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23:45:28 | SSnake | info needed: when i stop playback to gain memory under plugins....can i fill buffer AND start playback again with an internal menu? |
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23:46:56 | burnninat0r | is there a proper place to put flac files for rockbox on an ipod? |
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23:48:49 | bluebrother | Burnninat0r: the same as for all other files applies ... put them whereever you like |
23:49:17 | Burnninat0r | ok, thanks |
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23:53:58 | Burnninat0r | what is the best way to handle podcasts on rockbox? |
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