| 00:00:14 | * | BigBambi was just about ask if you were familiar with Rockbox :) |
| 00:00:25 | linuxstb | phinze: Do any of the ideas on our wiki interest you? Or do you have your own suggestion(s)? |
| 00:00:44 | phinze | one question that popped into my mind was about the scrollbar on the H10, which is still only implemented as up/down buttons... what's preventing that from working as it is meant to? |
| 00:01:38 | | Quit piga ("Leaving") |
| 00:01:46 | linuxstb | I know there are issues with the button driver, but I'm not sure what you mean by "meant to"? |
| 00:02:00 | | Join CyBergRind|w [0] (n=cbr@212.98.160.130) |
| 00:02:27 | BHSPitLappy | dangit, this guy's gonna knock me out of the running |
| 00:02:35 | phinze | well... as i don't have an ipod i don't know how the scroll wheel works in rockbox... but i would imagine it would be similar |
| 00:02:54 | phinze | moving your finger up and down the tracking area moves the cursor |
| 00:03:01 | phinze | rather than the top just being up and the bottom being down |
| 00:03:17 | BigBambi | the scroll wheel scrolls as you move your finger round it |
| 00:03:48 | Nico_P | phinze: there's a patch in the tracker that attempts to improve that, but it's not good enough yet |
| 00:03:54 | markun | phinze: the gigabeat could also use any such improvements |
| 00:03:59 | markun | and soon the meizu |
| 00:04:01 | phinze | BigBambi: right, so the scroll bar would be like the scroll wheel unrolled and mounted vertically |
| 00:04:21 | phinze | gotchya |
| 00:04:30 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 00:04:37 | BigBambi | the gigabeat could do with the stupid cross being ripped out and replaced by something sensible (like a tactile one) |
| 00:04:42 | bluebrother | don't forget the mrobe100 ;-) |
| 00:04:56 | phinze | haha |
| 00:04:57 | markun | BigBambi: you buy another player man |
| 00:05:06 | BigBambi | markun: I have 5 |
| 00:05:14 | phinze | one for each finger? |
| 00:05:30 | gevaerts | BigBambi: that means you're the type to buy another one |
| 00:05:30 | markun | (if you have only 1 hand) |
| 00:05:35 | scorche | BigBambi: you only have...bah |
| 00:05:40 | BigBambi | And when the beast port is completed it'll replace the F as my day-to-day player |
| 00:06:16 | BHSPitLappy | scorche, how much is being looked for in the abstracts/descriptions? |
| 00:06:35 | scorche | BHSPitLappy: in terms of number of chars? |
| 00:06:44 | gevaerts | phinze: anyway, I don't think getting a scrollbar working is worth a GSoC project ;) |
| 00:06:50 | BHSPitLappy | scorche, well, I know the character limits :) |
| 00:06:57 | BHSPitLappy | general detail level / wordcount |
| 00:07:13 | phinze | gevaerts: thanks that's what i was wondering |
| 00:07:29 | scorche | be as detailed as you can without going over the limit |
| 00:07:38 | BHSPitLappy | phinze, perhaps try porting rockbox to run on Linksys routers |
| 00:07:43 | * | phinze goes back to the list and strokes his chin |
| 00:07:47 | phinze | BHSPitLappy: haha |
| 00:07:54 | phinze | that would be ... interesting |
| 00:07:55 | scorche | if you answer our template and have a bit more, that should put you around the limit |
| 00:08:27 | gevaerts | phinze: have you ever done anything with USB ? |
| 00:08:42 | phinze | i haven't, but that doesn't me that i can't ;) |
| 00:08:46 | phinze | *mean |
| 00:09:07 | phinze | thinking about MTP? or iPod fakery? |
| 00:09:33 | gevaerts | I think iPod fakery might be hard (and I personally don't care about that) |
| 00:09:49 | * | scorche would rather see soemthign useful to most/all targets |
| 00:09:59 | * | phinze agrees |
| 00:09:59 | markun | like usb audio :) |
| 00:10:18 | phinze | markun: what does that entail? |
| 00:10:26 | * | gevaerts counts portalplayer targets |
| 00:11:24 | markun | phinze: being able to use a player as a soundcard, when you are at a place where there is none (like my office PC) |
| 00:11:39 | phinze | ooo |
| 00:11:44 | phinze | fancy |
| 00:11:49 | gevaerts | It should be possible |
| 00:12:59 | phinze | hmm... |
| 00:13:06 | gevaerts | Basically, it would work on PortalPlayer targets, and the Gigabeat S (once people find out how to enable USB there). |
| 00:14:24 | | Join z35 [0] (n=z@149.123.33.65.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 00:14:28 | phinze | so the player needs to show up to the host as a USB soundcard? |
| 00:14:56 | gevaerts | There are two caveat with that : we still have reliability problems with USB, and we have no idea when those will be solved. Another is that it uses USB isochronous transfers, which is something we have not done yet, so it might present unexpected difficulties |
| 00:16:10 | gevaerts | phinze: yes. I actually will probably commit some changes soon that makes the player show up as a USB soundcard without any features (no output, no input,...). That's the easy part... |
| 00:16:47 | phinze | gevaerts: those sound like Rather Serious Issues, especially USB reliability |
| 00:17:00 | phinze | how often do problems show up? |
| 00:17:54 | | Quit donutman25 ("ChatZilla 0.9.81 [Firefox 2.0.0.13/2008031114]") |
| 00:18:39 | gevaerts | phinze: depends. What actually seems to happen is that the USB controller can't access RAM fast enough (DMA) if the CPU is doing too much at the same time. It seems more of a problem on PP5022 than on PP5020, so it might work pretty well on H10 |
| 00:18:44 | | Quit cbr|w (Connection timed out) |
| 00:19:55 | gevaerts | phinze: right now, it means that USB storage works well for some people, reasonably well for some others, and not at all for others |
| 00:20:02 | phinze | gotchya, so the result would then be corrupted data? is it detectable? |
| 00:20:39 | phinze | gevaerts: i've never had trouble with mounting my H10 |
| 00:20:53 | | Quit perrikwp (Remote closed the connection) |
| 00:21:15 | BigBambi | phinze: Have you enabled the USB stack then? As by default it isn't on (and you have had to transfer via the OF) |
| 00:21:23 | gevaerts | Not corrupted data. What happens is that USB packets get shortly interrupted, which makes the entire packet fail if the host enforces strict timing constraints. If that happens too often there is basically no connection |
| 00:22:09 | * | gevaerts adds one caveat. If the connection drops halfway through, and doesn't recover, of course you can have some corrupted data... |
| 00:22:11 | phinze | BigBambi: this is where my lack of knowledge of rockbox's internals is going to embarrass me |
| 00:22:17 | | Quit mimimati (Remote closed the connection) |
| 00:22:24 | phinze | BigBambi: OF? refers to emergency connection mode? |
| 00:22:28 | gevaerts | phinze: what revision are you using ? |
| 00:22:56 | BigBambi | phinze: To use the recently new USB stack, you need to add a couple of defines to the make file before building (or to the platform config file) |
| 00:22:56 | * | phinze pulls out h10 |
| 00:22:57 | | Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection) |
| 00:23:00 | * | gevaerts remembers the bug that enabled usb storage on H10 unintentionally. |
| 00:23:05 | BigBambi | phinze: OF = original firmware |
| 00:23:21 | phinze | BigBambi: thanks :) |
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| 00:24:27 | gevaerts | With USB audio, you could do all sorts of things like using the FM radio as input, or even using codec output as PC input, adjusting volume on the player remotely,... |
| 00:25:26 | phinze | gevaerts: that does sound pretty cool. so in your mind importance(USB Audio) > importance(MTP) ? |
| 00:25:36 | gevaerts | Actually, we don't seem to have those reliability problems on outgoing packets, which are what you use if you want to play music, so these problems might not really be an issue |
| 00:26:16 | gevaerts | phinze: for me personally, yes. I don't care about MTP. Of course others may disagree... |
| 00:26:38 | * | gevaerts adds a disclaimer : he has only be on the project for less than two months, and has only done USB |
| 00:26:45 | * | BigBambi couldn't care less about MTP, but isn't a dev, so don't put any weight on my opinion :) |
| 00:27:49 | gevaerts | I think MTP is not useful as such, but it would allow to update the database for new files more efficiently, which is interesting |
| 00:28:19 | phinze | yeah that makes sense. so significantly less exciting. ;) |
| 00:29:03 | phinze | BigBambi: running r16756 |
| 00:29:15 | linuxstb | I think that if you're syncing from a database-driven media player on a PC, to Rockbox (and you want to use Rockbox's database), MTP makes sense. Not that I would use it... |
| 00:30:50 | phinze | BigBambi: i always use emergency connection (aka OF) before connecting... you're telling me i can connect without rebooting? |
| 00:31:14 | * | phinze bounces up and down in anticipation |
| 00:31:15 | szLacko | GSOC question: If I'm interested in more then one project of Rockbox, should I prepare applications for every projects, or one summing all my interest is enough? |
| 00:31:15 | gevaerts | phinze: if you make your own builds, and set the correct stuff, you can |
| 00:31:32 | | Quit lee-qid (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 00:31:33 | scorche | szLacko: one per project please |
| 00:31:36 | BigBambi | phinze: Not by default, Rockbox's USB mode isn't yet anabled (for the reason gevaerts has said) |
| 00:31:41 | phinze | sweet! |
| 00:31:52 | BigBambi | s/anabled/enabled |
| 00:31:53 | phinze | i'd love to test it at the very least |
| 00:31:58 | szLacko | scorche: Thanks! |
| 00:32:02 | gevaerts | phinze: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/PortalPlayerUsb has the details |
| 00:32:42 | phinze | gevaerts: it's all making sense now... i read that page and i was like, "but USB works fine for me" |
| 00:32:58 | phinze | now i get that it's OF USB i was using |
| 00:33:16 | phinze | always learning (and making a fool of myself in front of the rockbox community) ;) |
| 00:33:21 | BigBambi | :) |
| 00:33:30 | gevaerts | We all do from time to time |
| 00:33:42 | * | phinze runs afk for 2 min |
| 00:33:43 | | Join preglow [0] (i=thomj@tvilling2.pvv.ntnu.no) |
| 00:33:55 | bluebrother | interesting. Building cli interface of rbutil shows warnings on voicefont that the gui build doesn't |
| 00:35:26 | | Quit countrymonkey ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
| 00:40:19 | * | phinze is loving that rockboxdev.sh will build a crosscompiler for him |
| 00:41:45 | scorche | it makes things a bit easier :) |
| 00:42:23 | phinze | gevaerts: alright, i'm digging this idea... do you think it's a feasible GSoC project scope-wise? |
| 00:42:38 | phinze | (or anyone who might have knowledge) |
| 00:43:58 | gevaerts | It's hard to be sure. I think it can be done, but I'm not sure if it will be enough work for GSoC. Of course, it's been a while since I was a student, and I know USB reasonably well, so I might be wrong |
| 00:44:40 | gevaerts | But I don't think you need to know that much about USB for this... |
| 00:45:00 | phinze | right, i'd have to get up to speed on USB... but i'm a pretty fast learner (as they all say i'm sure heh) |
| 00:45:14 | * | gevaerts is notoriously bad at estimating workloads |
| 00:45:36 | phinze | gevaerts: can you quick 'splain the difference between mass storage support and logf()? |
| 00:46:33 | gevaerts | Easy. Mass storage is what gives you a drive, logf is the internal debug message mechanism, which you can route over USB these days. You won't need logf for now |
| 00:47:50 | | Quit Rincewind ("bye") |
| 00:48:42 | * | bluebrother wonders if gevaerts had usb debugging hardware while implementing the driver |
| 00:49:44 | | Quit gregzx ("ChatZilla 0.9.81 [Firefox 2.0.0.13/2008031114]") |
| 00:49:46 | * | gevaerts had (and still has) access to hardware usb tracers |
| 00:50:13 | bluebrother | ah. Nice :) |
| 00:50:41 | * | bluebrother was working with a firewire tracer during internship a few years ago |
| 00:51:09 | | Quit waldo ("Konversation terminated!") |
| 00:51:14 | gevaerts | This is of course an issue, but I think that the modern linux usbmon+wireshark setup works pretty well (or corresponding tools on Windows). They don't really help you for low-level issues, but this project shouldn't run into those |
| 00:51:43 | phinze | gevaerts: so the USB driver is essentially *yours*? |
| 00:52:04 | | Quit goffa (Remote closed the connection) |
| 00:52:12 | BigBambi | And no-one else can use it! :P |
| 00:52:35 | linuxstb | Yes, he's introduced a bug to stop others using it... |
| 00:52:59 | amiconn | There must be some bus priority registers... |
| 00:54:37 | gevaerts | depends on how you look at it. The controller driver was basically there when I started (i.e. the low level hardware stuff), but I did a bit of work on that. The layer up (chapter 9 in USB terms) was also mostly there, and the changes I did there are bigger. The usb storage driver was started when I came into the project, but did not contain very much. I basically finished what others started |
| 00:55:14 | phinze | linuxstb: well i'll be seeing about that once this crosscompiler finishes building :) |
| 00:55:20 | gevaerts | amiconn: yes, but where ? |
| 00:55:39 | amiconn | Somewhere in the system controller range, I'd guess |
| 00:55:45 | phinze | sounds like the H10 is a good platform to try it on though |
| 00:56:00 | * | gevaerts was very happy that other people typed in all these boring register address #defines for him :) |
| 00:56:37 | * | phinze hopes that devs don't give their SoCer all that typing work ;) |
| 00:57:05 | gevaerts | They do :) |
| 00:57:46 | amiconn | Either somewhere in the 0x600060xx range, or (more likely, guesses) the 0x700000xx range |
| 00:58:32 | gevaerts | Indeed. So now someone has to look through some OF to find all accesses in those ranges and cross out those that are known I guess |
| 00:59:22 | amiconn | Either that, or try to run some OF's diskmode on the emulator and log the register accesses |
| 00:59:43 | | Quit OlivierBorowski (Remote closed the connection) |
| 01:00 |
| 01:00:08 | amiconn | There are whole ranges which are known to exist but unresearched otherwise |
| 01:01:10 | * | gevaerts really needs to learn to understand ARM fluently |
| 01:02:54 | | Quit ender` (" Some people have some weird fetishes. Which is fine. Then they take photos of them, which is not.") |
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| 01:03:46 | * | amiconn learned all 3 asm dialects, as well as disassembly-based RE, during his rockbox work |
| 01:03:48 | Branden\Shower\ | Hi there, can someone tell me if this will work on the iPod Classic 5th Generation? |
| 01:04:00 | | Nick Branden\Shower\ is now known as Branden (n=Branden@pool-72-72-57-104.bstnma.east.verizon.net) |
| 01:04:40 | kugel | Yes for 5th Gen, no for Classic ;) |
| 01:05:03 | Branden | aw. :( Is there any hacks for the Classic? |
| 01:05:10 | bluebrother | Branden: no |
| 01:05:11 | gevaerts | amiconn: are you using IDA ? I'm considering it, but I really don't know how useful it is |
| 01:05:22 | kugel | What are you using now? I was expecting 5th gen |
| 01:05:27 | gevaerts | Branden: is it 5th gen or classic ? |
| 01:05:41 | Branden | :S Good question, I feel dumb, how can I find out? |
| 01:05:53 | kugel | When did you buy it? |
| 01:05:55 | bluebrother | is it 160GB? Then it's a classic |
| 01:05:58 | Branden | Best Buy. |
| 01:06:05 | Branden | Its an 80 Gig. |
| 01:06:05 | kugel | "When" |
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| 01:06:15 | Branden | Oh, sorry. Less then a year ago. |
| 01:06:22 | Branden | Acauly, like in January. |
| 01:06:35 | bluebrother | the IpodFAQ page also holds a link to an apple page which describes the differences |
| 01:06:59 | bluebrother | http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=61688 |
| 01:07:19 | kugel | Branden: Do a google image search for ipod 5th gen and ipod classic to determine alternativly |
| 01:07:22 | Branden | ty |
| 01:07:43 | bluebrother | the apple page makes it even easier: check the serial number |
| 01:07:45 | kugel | Apple's page should be more reliable though |
| 01:07:59 | bluebrother | (it also holds images of the various players ;) |
| 01:08:34 | Branden | Its classic. :[ |
| 01:08:35 | stripwax_ | If the front is completely flat, it's a 5g. if the top and side edges of the front panel are rounded down towards the sides then it's a classic |
| 01:08:53 | | Nick stripwax_ is now known as stripwax (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
| 01:09:15 | | Quit bluebrother ("sleep ...") |
| 01:09:52 | Branden | Yeah, its a classic, are there any hacks for the classic to change the colors and stuff? |
| 01:10:04 | stripwax | not here in rockbox |
| 01:10:05 | | Quit axionix (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 01:10:30 | stripwax | i don't know if there are any non-rockbox 'hacks' available, either |
| 01:10:35 | Branden | Ok, thanks. |
| 01:10:38 | | Quit Branden () |
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| 01:12:17 | | Nick gevaerts_ is now known as gevaerts (n=fg@195-144-092-177.dyn.adsl.xs4all.be) |
| 01:12:19 | | Quit knittl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 01:13:23 | | Join saratoga [0] (n=41becb3b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-9f13aebb8ae5c76e) |
| 01:13:54 | saratoga | so how are the GSOC applications looking? |
| 01:14:16 | BHSPitLappy | working on mine... |
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| 01:14:55 | gevaerts | We have 8 real ones, some better than others |
| 01:15:09 | BHSPitLappy | is there a predefined number of slots for rockbox's presence? I think we mentioned this last night, but I was tired :) |
| 01:15:17 | gevaerts | No |
| 01:15:29 | saratoga | i think its based on how many people apply |
| 01:15:47 | saratoga | though i didn't get a straight answer when i asked |
| 01:16:01 | BHSPitLappy | so if I apply from a bunch of dummy accounts, I'll have a better shot at getting my real app accepted? :P |
| 01:16:04 | kugel | Just a question: Why didn't project news say that m:robe and iaudio m3 are now officially suported? |
| 01:16:29 | saratoga | probably no one remembered to update it |
| 01:16:29 | | Quit saratoga (Client Quit) |
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| 01:16:58 | kugel | someone should do it imo, new targets are allways an important news |
| 01:18:23 | * | phinze pats his poor little G4 as it compiles gcc... and burns his hand |
| 01:18:31 | gevaerts | :) |
| 01:18:48 | saratoga | so are any of the applications looking interesting? |
| 01:19:22 | | Quit daurnimator (No route to host) |
| 01:19:47 | scorche | saratoga: the process is linked to from the FAQ |
| 01:20:18 | | Quit BHSPitLappy (Remote closed the connection) |
| 01:21:00 | saratoga | also i'm surprised to hear resampling mentioned as a task, i'd think a simple cubic or even lancoz resampler should be straightforward |
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| 01:23:50 | * | gevaerts will have to go to sleep Real Soon Now :( |
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| 01:24:51 | saratoga | gevaerts: i've been meaning to ask you, did you ever look at using that USB analyser tool again ? |
| 01:25:20 | gevaerts | saratoga: I'm not sure what you mean... |
| 01:25:50 | saratoga | you had mentioned using some sort of analyiser to look at signal quality for rockbox usb |
| 01:26:02 | * | gevaerts remembers |
| 01:26:28 | saratoga | i'm curious what happened with that |
| 01:27:29 | gevaerts | That was basically a "normal" oscilloscope. I tried using it, but doing signal quality tests requires a working usb test mode which we don't have. However, we are now reasonably confident on where the problems come from |
| 01:28:29 | * | phinze wonders if gevaerts noticed his pm |
| 01:29:02 | gevaerts | It's basically timing. The USB controller can't access RAM fast enough when other parts of the system are also doing RAM-intensive things. The current guess is that there is a register somewhere that sets the priority for RAM acceses |
| 01:29:12 | saratoga | gevaerts: how does that mode work? just produce a few test tones of known voltage and frequency? |
| 01:30:06 | gevaerts | saratoga: actually there are several. Some are just a fixed level (logical 0 or 1), others are worst-case signal patterns |
| 01:30:16 | gevaerts | phinze: I didn't get anything |
| 01:30:43 | saratoga | also, perhaps a stupid question, but you can't use the 48-80kb of IRAM available on the PP targets instead of DRAM? |
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| 01:31:00 | phinze | gevaerts: odd... well i just wanted to ask before you headed to bed if you'd mind my getting in touch with you if i had any questions while fleshing out this proposal |
| 01:31:17 | gevaerts | saratoga: I tried. That doesn't seem to work at all |
| 01:31:21 | phinze | as you seem to be the Resident Expert in the area :) |
| 01:31:34 | saratoga | how odd, i would expect IRAM to work better then DRAM |
| 01:31:35 | | Quit stripwax ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 01:31:41 | amiconn | I guess the usb dma can't access iram then |
| 01:31:47 | scorche | phinze: you need to be registered and identified on freenode in order to send PMs to all...otherwise, you can only send them to folk who filter their PMs which all do by default...i am guessing that gevaerts hasnt changed that to unfiltered |
| 01:32:02 | phinze | scorche: ahh thank you |
| 01:32:04 | gevaerts | Indeed. |
| 01:32:21 | amiconn | Not uncommon that some memory areas aren't dma capable (e.g. also the secondary block of iram in the mcf5249 and mcf5250) |
| 01:33:32 | gevaerts | Anyway, feel free to contact me. |
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| 01:36:13 | * | phinze is now an Official Freenode User :) |
| 01:37:14 | | Join bird603568 [0] (n=bird@c-71-58-107-102.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) |
| 01:38:17 | bird603568 | im just wondering have you guys figured out the encoding on the sansa v2 yet? |
| 01:38:49 | kugel | Bagder: Just read your blog about the fuze. Did I understand it correctly, that the fuze is pretty much the same player as the e200 v2? |
| 01:40:16 | kugel | I'm wondering about the display. It has the same resolution as the e200's, just rotated. May it even be the same display? |
| 01:41:14 | | Quit n1s () |
| 01:41:17 | | Join _Bagder_ [0] (n=daniel@1-1-5-26a.hud.sth.bostream.se) |
| 01:41:17 | saratoga | bird603568: Bagder, I and one other person figured out most of it and posted about it to the V2 thread in the New Ports forum, but no V2 owners took interest so I don't believe anyone has done much with it |
| 01:41:39 | bird603568 | what do you need help with? |
| 01:41:44 | phinze | so i believe i've built HEAD with the USB stack |
| 01:42:05 | phinze | and alas, no mount on OS X 10.4.11 |
| 01:42:07 | bird603568 | <−− v2 owner and intrested but dont know if i can help |
| 01:42:21 | gevaerts | What happens instead ? |
| 01:42:24 | phinze | i get a little icon when i plug in USB, but nothing on my mac |
| 01:42:33 | | Quit MethoS- (Remote closed the connection) |
| 01:42:36 | | Quit sarixe ("(EE) Failed to load "quit" module") |
| 01:42:38 | phinze | nothing immediately noticeable that is |
| 01:42:46 | saratoga | bird603568: much of the firmware update format is understood, but not all |
| 01:43:00 | saratoga | someone needs to take an interest in it, finish the work, and then start porting rockbox |
| 01:43:01 | phinze | unless... double checking instructions |
| 01:43:02 | bird603568 | errr i dont think i can helo there |
| 01:43:08 | * | gevaerts remembers suddenly |
| 01:43:13 | bird603568 | help* |
| 01:43:26 | gevaerts | phinze: on H10 I believe you have to hold "right" while plugging in |
| 01:43:31 | bird603568 | damn and i was looking forward to a rockbox port too |
| 01:44:02 | | Quit Thundercloud_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 01:44:23 | * | phinze had just clicked "reconnect mass storage" on debug menu and got a large USB graphic |
| 01:44:37 | * | phinze now attempting plugin with button hold |
| 01:45:06 | phinze | bingo! |
| 01:45:54 | gevaerts | So now I can go to sleep safely ? |
| 01:46:17 | phinze | real 0m0.778suser 0m0.045ssys 0m0.083s |
| 01:46:22 | bird603568 | saratoga: whats "the work" |
| 01:46:25 | phinze | ls -R over /Volumes/H10 |
| 01:46:32 | kugel | bird603568: I'd probably getting a Fuze (which uses to have the same SoC as the e200 v2), if an upgrade from e200 v1 would be worth it |
| 01:46:34 | phinze | gevaerts: i think so, thanks again for everything |
| 01:46:42 | * | gevaerts goes to sleep |
| 01:46:47 | phinze | night! |
| 01:46:49 | | Quit gevaerts ("sleeping time") |
| 01:47:00 | bird603568 | what? |
| 01:47:10 | saratoga | bird603568: figure out the firmware update process well enough that modified firmware can be loaded |
| 01:47:29 | saratoga | have you read the 2 threads on the V2 sansas in the New Ports forum? |
| 01:47:36 | bird603568 | man i wish i knew how to do that |
| 01:47:37 | bird603568 | nope |
| 01:47:49 | bird603568 | havent really been following it |
| 01:47:57 | bird603568 | just popped in to see how things are going |
| 01:48:32 | bird603568 | ill go look now |
| 01:49:36 | saratoga | how cheap can you get a V2 sansa anyway? |
| 01:50:02 | bird603568 | i have a sansav2 |
| 01:50:09 | bird603568 | i got the 8 gig for 120$ i think |
| 01:50:39 | saratoga | thats not very cheap |
| 01:50:46 | bird603568 | there are smaller ones |
| 01:50:59 | bird603568 | i wanted 8 gigs since thats holds almost 1/2 of my music |
| 01:51:06 | bird603568 | and it was 10$ more than the 4gig |
| 01:51:12 | bird603568 | i think the 1 gig is 90$ |
| 01:51:27 | | Join arnath [0] (n=arnath@d5153706E.access.telenet.be) |
| 01:51:47 | arnath | hi, anyone know if the sansa e200v2 series will be supported any time soon? |
| 01:51:47 | | Quit Bagder (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 01:51:51 | bird603568 | lol |
| 01:52:06 | krazykit | arnath, there are no time frames for new ports. |
| 01:52:28 | arnath | krazykit: but there must be a list of what is actively being developped, right? |
| 01:52:31 | | Join Bagder [241] (n=daniel@rockbox/developer/bagder) |
| 01:52:48 | krazykit | arnath, please read the pertinent wiki page and threads on the New Ports forum for everything that's been done |
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| 01:53:07 | bird603568 | the 2gb version is 75$ saratoga |
| 01:54:21 | arnath | krazykit: ok thanks |
| 01:54:23 | saratoga | arnath: we're talkign about that right now, and as I just said, theres no one working on the V2 |
| 01:54:29 | | Quit szLacko (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 01:54:32 | arnath | o :( |
| 01:54:45 | arnath | what are the odds that if i step into a store tomorrow, that it's still a v1? |
| 01:55:05 | arnath | (i looked on the site of the store, but it doesn't mention the firmware it seems) |
| 01:55:13 | bird603568 | very low |
| 01:55:23 | bird603568 | they stopped selling them in december |
| 01:55:31 | bird603568 | i thought id luck out and get a v1 but didnt |
| 01:55:53 | saratoga | V1s are still all over ebay |
| 01:55:53 | bird603568 | its the hardware |
| 01:56:06 | saratoga | i think no one is working on the V2 since the V1s are so easy to get |
| 01:56:22 | arnath | ebay is a bit trickier over here (belgium) :P |
| 01:56:36 | arnath | besides, electronics stuff, i rather get new then second hand |
| 01:56:43 | bird603568 | exactly |
| 01:56:45 | | Quit Bagder_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 01:57:30 | arnath | too bad though, i really want a sandisk and i really want rockbox :( |
| 01:58:16 | ukl | me too. |
| 01:58:20 | | Quit keanu (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 01:58:21 | scorche | do you want it bad enough to learn C and get working? ;) |
| 01:58:28 | bird603568 | i know c! |
| 01:58:33 | bird603568 | not very well tho |
| 01:58:52 | scorche | do you want it bad enough to learn to write C better and get working? ;) |
| 01:59:01 | linuxstb | ukl: Did you buy a C240 from bigpockets.co.uk in the end? |
| 01:59:04 | arnath | i know C rather well actually :> |
| 01:59:07 | bird603568 | oh it works it just might be ugly as sin |
| 01:59:40 | arnath | hmm, what exactly is involved in porting it? rewriting drivers...? |
| 01:59:42 | bird603568 | ive never programmed firmware tho |
| 01:59:54 | scorche | good time to start.. |
| 02:00 |
| 02:00:18 | bird603568 | i would assume its not that different from other things |
| 02:00:18 | ukl | linuxstb: no, I did not... I wasn't sure if it would be fast enough... |
| 02:00:22 | scorche | arnath: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/NewPort |
| 02:00:35 | ukl | Can anyone of you confirm if the bigpockets C240 is v1? |
| 02:00:40 | linuxstb | ukl: Fast enough for what? |
| 02:00:53 | linuxstb | ukl: Mine was, and others have reported the same. |
| 02:00:58 | ukl | I'm not in the UK anymore |
| 02:01:21 | | Quit BitTorment ("Do directly to guantanamo bay. Do not pass go. Do not collect your human rights.") |
| 02:01:22 | ukl | hmm too bad should have done it. |
| 02:02:02 | arnath | Porting Rockbox can be everything from hard work to extremely hard and time consuming work. Try to gather as many interested friends and fans as possible so that the whole burden isn't put on one single human. |
| 02:02:07 | arnath | sounds a bit depressive :| |
| 02:02:14 | arnath | especially since i don't have any friends that can code a damn :( |
| 02:02:46 | saratoga | well the first step (and a good way to get others interested) would be to take a look at the firmware reverse engineering already done in the V2 thread and get Bagder's Sansa V2 patcher code working |
| 02:02:51 | linuxstb | Make some new friends ;) e.g. on forums where owners of the device hang out. |
| 02:03:23 | scorche | there have been a few ports done by folks by themselves |
| 02:03:24 | kugel | linuxstb: Do you have a build/sim with my customlist patch handy? |
| 02:03:29 | ukl | I'd love to meet people in a pub to work on something. Unfortunately I lack projects and people (and knowledge/abilities). |
| 02:03:33 | saratoga | i know dan_a was interested, and maybe others would be too if there was some progress |
| 02:04:03 | linuxstb | kugel: Not the latest version, no. |
| 02:04:08 | | Quit _Bagder_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 02:04:31 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 02:04:37 | linuxstb | Yes, I'm sure others would buy V2s once a port was underway (i.e. code was being run on the device) |
| 02:04:57 | kugel | A user of my build spotted a possible bug (though, my build contains much more patches). Scrolling not working with pointer line selector |
| 02:05:18 | kugel | I'm not booted into linux today, that's why I can't test myself |
| 02:05:22 | arnath | bah, not even sure if i have the time, got a masterproof to finish up, exams coming my way... :( |
| 02:05:35 | | Join keanu [0] (n=keanu@unaffiliated/keanu) |
| 02:05:38 | bird603568 | saratoga: does he need testers because ill test on mine |
| 02:05:43 | phinze | markun: you still around? |
| 02:06:55 | | Quit fehmicans (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 02:09:31 | kugel | I was wondering if anyone is interested in anti-aliased fonts |
| 02:09:32 | | Quit desowin (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 02:09:58 | kugel | I have a working patch (I don't take the credit though) |
| 02:10:08 | kugel | which runs surprisingly well |
| 02:10:34 | scorche | is this in the tracker? |
| 02:10:45 | kugel | No |
| 02:10:49 | scorche | ...why not? |
| 02:10:57 | kugel | I was hoping that the creator would upload it |
| 02:11:08 | kugel | But he doesn't seem to be interested in it anymore |
| 02:11:27 | saratoga | bird603568: does who? |
| 02:11:43 | scorche | did he GPL the code or just write it? |
| 02:13:00 | kugel | he wrote it for rockbox |
| 02:13:24 | kugel | I'd need to look in the patch again |
| 02:13:35 | kugel | he doesn't answer me, so I can't ask him directly |
| 02:14:33 | kugel | scorche: But he allowed me to have it in my build |
| 02:14:49 | kugel | scorche: since my build is gpl, doesn't it mean that the patch is gpl too then? |
| 02:15:10 | scorche | do you have his full name? |
| 02:15:12 | krazykit | no, it means if it's not GPL, you're violating it |
| 02:16:08 | saratoga | technically you can't add patches from other people unless they license them under the GPL |
| 02:16:48 | kugel | krazykit: he allowed to have it my build |
| 02:17:00 | kugel | Jonas Hurrelmann is his real name |
| 02:17:08 | scorche | people write patches "for" projects all the time and dont GPL them...just because he wrote it "for" your build, doesnt mean it is under the GPL |
| 02:17:27 | kugel | ah ok |
| 02:17:58 | kugel | he talked about some devs some while ago about this patch, and I just found the site |
| 02:17:59 | saratoga | assuming he was aware you were using GPL code, and he gave you permission, you're probably ok |
| 02:18:07 | kugel | http://sse2.net/rb/ |
| 02:18:07 | saratoga | but we certainly can't do that for SVN |
| 02:18:22 | saratoga | we need to be black and white |
| 02:18:57 | kugel | saratoga: As you can see in the link, the convtff.c (the tool to convert ttf to anti-aliased .fnt) is GPL'd |
| 02:19:42 | saratoga | he just emailed that to you? |
| 02:19:50 | kugel | the link? |
| 02:20:16 | kugel | He doesn't answer me at all. |
| 02:20:17 | saratoga | thats an email in there right? |
| 02:20:27 | saratoga | "Subject: [PATCH] Framework for anti-aliased font support on lcd-16bit devices." |
| 02:20:38 | saratoga | wheres it from? |
| 02:21:01 | kugel | he used a git repository for his rockbox source afaik |
| 02:21:13 | scorche | why did he contact you about this and not even mention it to us? |
| 02:21:16 | kugel | not sure where that framework comes from |
| 02:21:27 | kugel | he did |
| 02:21:32 | saratoga | also odd that he would add the rockbox header but remove the GPL from his makefile |
| 02:21:38 | kugel | I think he talked with amiconn and other devs about this patch |
| 02:21:57 | kugel | his IRC name is jott and/or j0tt |
| 02:22:24 | scorche | saratoga: that is odd |
| 02:22:33 | scorche | i seem to remeber the name.. |
| 02:22:41 | kugel | but the convttf.c says that it's GPL'd |
| 02:22:52 | kugel | he made pictureflow ;) |
| 02:23:32 | linuxstb | I remember him discussing the patch here on IRC |
| 02:23:35 | kugel | http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8308 he also made that |
| 02:26:47 | kugel | Any idea what to do about this patch? I'd gladly upload it, but if you fear license and copyright issues I understand that |
| 02:27:25 | kugel | I could possibly contact him, I know which university he's on |
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| 02:29:26 | scorche | ah...i remember it now.. |
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| 02:32:23 | | Join Casainho [0] (n=chatzill@87-196-13-226.net.novis.pt) |
| 02:32:35 | Casainho | heelo RB people :-) |
| 02:32:41 | Casainho | Bagder: are yo uthere? |
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| 02:34:25 | saratoga | its the middle of the night in europe right now so hes probably asleep |
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| 02:35:08 | kugel | saratoga, scorche: What to do about this patch? I used it for a long time and it's nice. Don't want to waste his work |
| 02:35:12 | Casainho | saratoga: okok :-) |
| 02:35:16 | | Join JdGordon|uni [0] (i=82c20d65@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) |
| 02:35:44 | kugel | Maybe I'm gonna call the university and try to get him on the phone |
| 02:35:59 | Casainho | I read now a message on forum, about an good offer: http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=6751.msg120826#msg120826 |
| 02:36:20 | | Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.) |
| 02:36:20 | Casainho | I would like to know If thats true... or I am dreaming... |
| 02:36:26 | | Join amiconn [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) |
| 02:36:44 | Casainho | I was looknig for an advice, about what to answer |
| 02:37:20 | krazykit | Casainho, you could PM him for more information and then check it out on google... |
| 02:37:57 | Casainho | I will go answer now, hope not write some "bad" ideas. |
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| 02:39:02 | kugel | Ok, I'm gonna off now. Decide what to do with the patch. Just remember the site: http://sse2.net/rb/ |
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| 05:46:59 | blckpythn | anyone on right now? |
| 05:47:09 | blckpythn | and not afk |
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| 05:49:13 | scorche | if you have a question, juts ask it |
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| 05:57:05 | blckpythn | will there be a version of rockbox for sansa c200 v2 series? |
| 05:58:28 | scorche | if someone works on it |
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| 06:10:26 | TaylorKillian | hey, would anybody mind taking a look at my application before i turn it in? http://www.wright.edu/~killian.6/rockbox-application.pdf |
| 06:10:33 | TaylorKillian | anything i should add or fix? |
| 06:11:53 | JdGordon | *wall of text!* :) |
| 06:12:06 | JdGordon | gimme 20min and ill read if when i get back if your in no hurry |
| 06:14:47 | TaylorKillian | no hurry, thanks :) |
| 06:22:29 | scorche | TaylorKillian: *very* nice proposal, but sadly, my biggest concern is with the idea itself |
| 06:22:56 | TaylorKillian | darn :/ |
| 06:23:42 | scorche | provided the users use their tags properly, rockbox does just fine with users using iTunes as our Database already scrapes the files |
| 06:24:30 | TaylorKillian | ah :/ |
| 06:24:44 | scorche | the main things i think that the users have issues with are iTunes playlists and iTunes's dislike for file-based organizing |
| 06:25:31 | scorche | the latter we cant fix, and the former is just making Rockbox able to read those playlists |
| 06:25:37 | TaylorKillian | i could include a section about allowing upload of drm'ed songs, however i don't know if people would object to that or not |
| 06:26:00 | scorche | as in giving Rockbox the ability to play DRMed files? |
| 06:26:07 | TaylorKillian | yeah |
| 06:26:24 | TaylorKillian | the iPod drm has already been reverse engineered |
| 06:26:35 | scorche | yeah...that is a no-do |
| 06:26:43 | TaylorKillian | i figured |
| 06:26:58 | scorche | DRM and open-source doesnt quite mesh together well |
| 06:27:34 | TaylorKillian | heh |
| 06:27:59 | TaylorKillian | ah well, maybe my other proposal will have a shot ;) |
| 06:28:48 | scorche | hrm...well, we could always find something else for you to work on, as you seem quite able :) |
| 06:30:20 | TaylorKillian | yeah, i applied to do the arm emulator, however I don't think that i'll get it |
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| 06:38:06 | | Quit TaylorKillian (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 06:40:14 | * | JdGordon ended up being too slow :( |
| 06:40:31 | scorche | that guy has such potential...he just could have benefitted from coming and talking to us about the idea before writing up the proposal =/ |
| 06:41:10 | | Join saratoga [0] (n=9803c6dd@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-bd6bd03f0dbe5c1a) |
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| 06:41:29 | * | scorche kicks a can that he finds on the ground |
| 06:41:29 | | Quit saratoga (Client Quit) |
| 06:41:40 | JdGordon | :) yeah |
| 06:41:49 | JdGordon | still.. the arm emulator would be nice anyway |
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| 06:42:28 | scorche | eh....i dont really see how we can accurately emulate something we dont fully know...then again, there are probably concepts that evade me |
| 06:42:46 | JdGordon | oh lord... I just lost faith in him from the aplication title! :p |
| 06:42:48 | | Join saratoga4 [0] (n=9803c6dd@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-749d466de648b46e) |
| 06:43:44 | saratoga4 | that ipod proposal was a bit odd |
| 06:44:02 | saratoga4 | he proposed all that without looking up the problem and realizing that it was all documented elsewhere |
| 06:44:26 | saratoga4 | however, its good to hear he applied for the emulator |
| 06:44:30 | saratoga4 | i really want that project |
| 06:44:35 | saratoga4 | just not enough to do it myself |
| 06:44:40 | scorche | which part was documented? |
| 06:44:50 | saratoga4 | the process by which itunes syncs the ipod |
| 06:44:57 | scorche | ah |
| 06:45:08 | saratoga4 | no need to use a USB sniffer to figure that out |
| 06:45:08 | JdGordon | isnt just the db documented? |
| 06:45:18 | scorche | i just have issues with the idea itself rather than the process |
| 06:45:32 | saratoga4 | itunes actually just copies files, updates teh db, copies album art and thats more or less it |
| 06:45:43 | saratoga4 | the only nonstandard part is syncing the clock and updating firmware as I recall |
| 06:46:07 | scorche | yeah, but do we really want to add all that just for the ipods? |
| 06:46:26 | saratoga4 | presumably it could be used for any player though |
| 06:46:38 | saratoga4 | or at least those with a software USB stack |
| 06:46:42 | JdGordon | well... if it worked oyu could trick itunes into thinking any target is an ipod |
| 06:47:13 | saratoga4 | thinking about it more, it might be necessary to reverse engineer how itunes identifies an ipod |
| 06:47:21 | | Quit saratoga33 ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
| 06:47:24 | saratoga4 | if it does more then just check the USB id string |
| 06:47:28 | saratoga4 | so maybe he was onto something |
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| 06:49:05 | scorche | comment added |
| 06:49:12 | | Join goffa [0] (n=goffa@216.220.23.105) |
| 06:49:27 | saratoga4 | is there anyway to see the GSOC applications ? |
| 06:49:33 | saratoga4 | i want to read the emulator one |
| 06:49:45 | scorche | only if you are a mentor |
| 06:49:49 | saratoga4 | ah |
| 06:50:08 | | Quit w0rd54 (Client Quit) |
| 06:50:14 | scorche | eh...you are a dev...let me put it on a private pastebin for you |
| 06:50:22 | scorche | please dont share though |
| 06:50:44 | saratoga4 | thanks |
| 06:51:34 | * | scorche should get his own pastebin up...maybe a rockbox one... |
| 06:51:43 | JdGordon | whats the point? |
| 06:51:48 | JdGordon | there arnt enough already? |
| 06:51:54 | * | scorche shrugs |
| 06:51:58 | | Join w0rd54 [0] (i=blackdev@100mbit.top-site.us) |
| 06:51:59 | scorche | paranoia? |
| 06:52:03 | JdGordon | hows the theme site coming along? |
| 06:52:26 | JdGordon | paranoia?? someone might look at our open code and convos!! |
| 06:52:32 | scorche | oh no!! |
| 06:54:44 | scorche | JdGordon: well, i have the version i was currently working on up, but linuxstb was nice enough to offer his services and work on a much much better version than what i can produce |
| 06:54:53 | scorche | saratoga4: Pm sent if you didnt notice |
| 06:57:09 | saratoga4 | thanks |
| 06:57:47 | saratoga4 | looks good, though be sure you guys ask him abotu his cpu arch and/or assembly experience |
| 06:58:00 | saratoga4 | since i don't see anything about that in his application |
| 06:59:35 | scorche | dont want to mentor? :) |
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| 06:59:47 | saratoga4 | i'm still thinking about applying for a project |
| 06:59:51 | scorche | ah |
| 07:00 |
| 07:00:02 | saratoga4 | though if i don't i'll probably pitch ina little with the emulator |
| 07:00:14 | saratoga4 | it just sounds like so much fun |
| 07:00:33 | | Quit Rob2223 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 07:01:00 | scorche | could you explain this to me?...i dont get how we can write an emulator to emulate something that we dont fully know... |
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| 07:02:16 | scorche | (referring to devices like the sansa and ipods rather than the gigabeat which is in the proposal) |
| 07:04:13 | saratoga4 | we can emulate the parts supported by rockbox just by doing whatever the drivers in SVN expect |
| 07:04:24 | saratoga4 | thats good enough for some basic stuff like optmization |
| 07:04:42 | saratoga4 | next we can try and run the OF |
| 07:05:04 | saratoga4 | this will probably fail initially, but you can see where it fails by logging all the memory addresses it accesses |
| 07:05:23 | saratoga4 | hopefully you could eventually implement everything well enough that it runs |
| 07:05:40 | saratoga4 | particularly for targets like the Gigabeat where most or all of the hardware is documented |
| 07:06:42 | saratoga4 | furthermore, the things that don't work in the emulator but do work in rockbox are probably things we'd be interested in improving in rockbox, so its still interesting even if it can't run the OF completely |
| 07:06:57 | | Quit Rob2222 (Connection timed out) |
| 07:08:15 | saratoga4 | and for a lot of things, just emulating a bootloader is enough (figuring out checksums, hardware init sequences, etc) |
| 07:08:47 | saratoga4 | Toni for instance was able to get some of the addresses for the AS chip before we had the datasheet just by watching what the OF wrote to it in his emulator |
| 07:09:06 | saratoga4 | and his emulator didn't even really work |
| 07:09:38 | scorche | ah...so is mainly a way to debug/log the OF since we cant through the device |
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| 07:10:04 | saratoga4 | yeah |
| 07:11:13 | scorche | so what are you thinking about applying for? |
| 07:13:28 | saratoga4 | H.264 decoding |
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| 07:30:05 | washtenaw | hello... I didn't came here for only thing... to post a link to something relevant. |
| 07:30:06 | washtenaw | http://www.rockbox.org/irc/rockbox-20080225.txt |
| 07:31:05 | washtenaw | I want to leave now, but I don't want to be rude, so I will stay for a minute. |
| 07:31:42 | JdGordon | what about that link? |
| 07:31:51 | bd_ | ...? |
| 07:31:53 | washtenaw | I guess you already know about this. |
| 07:32:10 | JdGordon | which part? |
| 07:32:12 | | Quit HowdyDoody (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 07:32:19 | bd_ | http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/IrcGuidelines "The channel is logged." |
| 07:32:27 | washtenaw | Right... |
| 07:32:42 | washtenaw | Well... I must go... later jo. |
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| 07:38:57 | * | scorche boggles |
| 07:39:43 | Chronon | odd |
| 07:41:08 | JdGordon | does this sound like a fair assumption.... |
| 07:41:53 | JdGordon | arg.. |
| 07:41:57 | * | JdGordon not sure how to word this |
| 07:42:21 | JdGordon | at the end of the playlist.. there would rarely be more than 3 or 4 tracks in the buffer? |
| 07:42:51 | JdGordon | at most 8 tracks? |
| 07:43:15 | JdGordon | i.e up to the point where playlist keeps telling playback there is nothing left to buffer |
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| 07:43:56 | * | JdGordon thinks it may still be too early to ask questions :p |
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| 07:56:03 | cool_walking_ | I think there needs to be a "Connectivity" section in the manual detailing how people should copy music onto their player, especially the fact that there is no UMS on some targets. |
| 07:58:23 | cool_walking_ | Anyone agree? |
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| 08:00 |
| 08:00:53 | JdGordon | feel free to write it and stick it on the tracker |
| 08:01:42 | cool_walking_ | Alright but it won't be pretty since I've never done LaTeX before, and I'm not very good at writing. |
| 08:03:19 | cool_walking_ | and I only have an iPod |
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| 08:29:52 | amiconn | JdGordon: When playback gets near the end of the list, as soon as the whole rest completely fits into RAM, the playlist code will tell playback there's nothing more to buffer. Don't make any assumptions as to how many tracks before the end this happens. Could be as a fraction of a track (e.g. a long FLAC track), as well has hundreds of tracks, even right at the start of a playlist (e.g. a language course with tiny snippets, speex compressed) |
| 08:31:40 | JdGordon | yeah, im trying to remove gaps between playlists by setting it up so a playlist could never actually end (for dirplay anyway) |
| 08:31:49 | JdGordon | that speex example is a bit worrying thoughg |
| 08:32:33 | JdGordon | if there is only a few tracks still in the playlist then moving buffers around wont be noticably slow... if it needs to move hundreds around that could be bad |
| 08:32:41 | amiconn | This indefiniteness is one of the main reasons for MoB... |
| 08:33:17 | amiconn | Gaps between playlists? |
| 08:34:09 | JdGordon | so playback already starts buffering the next playlist while the current one is finishing |
| 08:34:18 | JdGordon | its very noticable with dirplay |
| 08:34:32 | | Join GodEater [0] (i=c2cbc962@rockbox/staff/GodEater) |
| 08:34:38 | JdGordon | .. also the point is moving the dirplay functionality out of playback |
| 08:34:43 | amiconn | Ah, that. Another feature I never use |
| 08:34:49 | * | amiconn always forgets about it |
| 08:34:54 | | Part bughunter2 ("Leaving.") |
| 08:36:05 | * | JdGordon curses the speex example! |
| 08:36:39 | amiconn | Well, it's known as the 'norvegian language course problem' in the rockbox world for years |
| 08:37:47 | JdGordon | ok, I'm tihnking that if too much of the playlist buffer is being used then just tell playback the playlist isnt finished but its not ready to find the next playlist yet |
| 08:37:59 | JdGordon | which ideally wouldnt be a usual case |
| 08:38:34 | JdGordon | otherwise, the new playlist would be created with the old current one being shown as "queued" |
| 08:38:48 | amiconn | Very short snippets can exhaust almost any finite number of slots. When snippets are so short that 16 of them will fit into the buffer on archos, the hwcodec playback engine will fail (about the only problem in that engine) |
| 08:39:18 | amiconn | It won't crash though, but repeat the 16th track over and over until you manually skip it |
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| 08:44:57 | JdGordon | hmm... is it worth splitting the dirplay filenames up so the directory is stored once instead of each file storing the full path? |
| 08:46:04 | LinusN | JdGordon: how would you do that? |
| 08:46:23 | JdGordon | im not entirely sure just yet |
| 08:46:49 | JdGordon | it probably isnt worth the effort |
| 08:52:02 | LinusN | my thought too |
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| 08:56:42 | mrkiko | Hi all! I will not be able to use rockbox for long I think - my player has been totally disassembled during a car accident :) |
| 08:57:21 | mrkiko | I haven't tried to get it running - I think at least the internal hard disk is damaged... |
| 08:57:44 | cool_walking_ | You think this... yet you haven't tried? |
| 08:58:15 | Galois | did you get disassembled? |
| 08:58:23 | jhMikeS | mrkiko: as long as you weren't disassembled during the car accident be greatful for that |
| 08:58:30 | mrkiko | ehehe... even if I try to be optimistic, it seems hard this has not happened |
| 08:58:53 | Galois | I had a laptop hard drive that survived a bad car crash |
| 08:59:01 | mrkiko | No - the only sign of the accident is a big sign on the front |
| 08:59:03 | mrkiko | of my face |
| 08:59:08 | Galois | the laptop itself was toast, but repairable |
| 08:59:10 | mrkiko | (I don't know how to say it in english) |
| 08:59:24 | mrkiko | My laptop was not with me... |
| 08:59:27 | Galois | scar? |
| 08:59:54 | mrkiko | scar -> scared? |
| 09:00 |
| 09:00:02 | mrkiko | Yes, I was very very scared up... |
| 09:00:11 | mrkiko | My brother is at hospital actually... |
| 09:00:17 | mrkiko | but it seems nothing grave happened |
| 09:00:52 | mrkiko | Since the next two hours I'll know if the player actually can run again... |
| 09:01:06 | Chronon | Maybe the accident discussion can happen in #rockbox-community. . . |
| 09:01:16 | Chronon | Good to hear that you're okay, though |
| 09:01:57 | | Part tru2kungfu |
| 09:02:24 | mrkiko | Chronon: thank you |
| 09:02:38 | Chronon | :) |
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| 09:41:56 | BHSPitMonkey | bah |
| 09:42:27 | BHSPitMonkey | How much detail can I possibly give, without diving into the research part of the project already :/ |
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| 09:55:37 | pondlife | Morning all - don't suppose any iPod owner could tell me if Buschel's crossfade fix has cured the keyclick screech-from-hell? |
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| 09:59:12 | pixelma | hmm.. could try it on Sansa... |
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| 10:00 |
| 10:01:41 | pondlife | pixelma: Was it a problem on Sansa before? |
| 10:01:52 | pondlife | If so, then yes please |
| 10:02:06 | pixelma | yes, I could make it "beeep" |
| 10:02:16 | pondlife | I wonder if pcmbuf_beep needs similar alignment work |
| 10:02:45 | pondlife | The noise GodEater described sounded more nasty than "beeep"... |
| 10:03:11 | pondlife | I think the click is still too long on some targets (so sounds like a beep), but that's a different issue I think. |
| 10:04:19 | pixelma | it doesn't stop until you move to a next line and is very loud (not bearable with earphone in the ear and you could hear it outside) |
| 10:04:30 | pondlife | Ah, maybe that's the one |
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| 10:08:45 | pixelma | pondlife: don't you have a c240 too now? |
| 10:09:05 | pondlife | I do, but I didn't know that this problem affected it too |
| 10:09:16 | pondlife | It's not with me at the moment, either |
| 10:09:50 | pondlife | I can play tomorrow, but would be interested in the information. |
| 10:09:58 | pixelma | I think I told you (at least I mentioned it here :P ), currently building |
| 10:10:24 | * | JdGordon will check his e200 which used to very easily show the problem |
| 10:11:58 | JdGordon | pondlife: which revision had the change you want tested? |
| 10:12:06 | | Join MethoS- [0] (n=clemens@host-091-096-213-143.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 10:12:32 | JdGordon | r16891 beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeepz |
| 10:12:47 | pondlife | JdGordon: Thanks, that answers it :) |
| 10:13:15 | * | pondlife tries to get his head around http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi/trunk/apps/pcmbuf.c?r1=16889;r2=16890;pathrev=16890 |
| 10:13:50 | * | JdGordon passes |
| 10:14:12 | pondlife | pcmbuf_beep() mirrors the old version of that somewhat |
| 10:15:41 | pondlife | JdGordon: Is it only a problem if music is not already playing? |
| 10:15:52 | pondlife | Or does it do it when playing or stopped? |
| 10:16:02 | JdGordon | i was testing with music stopped |
| 10:16:28 | pondlife | There are two different code paths :/ |
| 10:16:31 | | Join nplus [0] (n=nplus@141.25.Globcom.Net) |
| 10:17:26 | JdGordon | wow.. my sansa is fucked up! im getting wierd garbage out of the headphones instead of music (the wps says its stuck at 1:43)... |
| 10:18:06 | JdGordon | yep, cant reproduce while music is playing |
| 10:18:18 | pondlife | Thanks |
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| 10:29:16 | amiconn | pondlife: The hanging beep on pp is definitely not an alignment issue |
| 10:29:22 | pondlife | OK |
| 10:29:33 | amiconn | If it were, it would cause a data abort |
| 10:29:52 | amiconn | Btw, imho the current implementation of keyclick is completely useless |
| 10:30:08 | pondlife | I find it very useful |
| 10:30:16 | pondlife | It's far from ideal |
| 10:30:57 | amiconn | It's not at all related to actually registering the button event |
| 10:30:58 | pixelma | pondlife: I remember that having voice enabled also prevented it from beeeeping |
| 10:31:20 | pondlife | Yes, if pcm_is_playing() it's not an issue, only if it has to kick off pcm playback |
| 10:31:36 | pondlife | Voice/fades may mask the issue too |
| 10:32:02 | pondlife | amiconn: No, it's related to the button event being dequeued |
| 10:32:17 | pondlife | Slower, but in some ways more useful |
| 10:32:33 | pondlife | i.e. you know that the client received the input |
| 10:32:46 | pondlife | Ideally it should be in firmware |
| 10:33:07 | pondlife | And should use piezo if possible, PCM if not |
| 10:34:22 | amiconn | No, you know that rockbox processed the event... but that's something I'll notice without any beep |
| 10:34:41 | pondlife | Depends if you're looking at the display, maybe |
| 10:34:44 | kugel | JdGordon: Have you allready taken a look at FS #8799 ? |
| 10:34:56 | JdGordon | 8799? |
| 10:35:01 | amiconn | The beep would be helpful when queueing button events (especially since the ui gets more and more laggy) :( |
| 10:35:27 | pondlife | Yes, that could improve perceived responsiveness |
| 10:35:50 | pondlife | Feel free to work out how it could fit into firmware, yet still use pcm |
| 10:36:01 | kugel | JdGordon: Ehm, yes |
| 10:36:15 | JdGordon | which is...? |
| 10:36:15 | pixelma | kugel: sorry to say but that comment is worth less than $0,02 - as I said myself I'm not completely happy with it either and it's there for discussion. If you couldn't try on the target yourself I can't take it seriously, at least now I know someone discovered it |
| 10:36:45 | kugel | pixelma: Ok |
| 10:37:40 | pixelma | I hoped for some ideas of others too |
| 10:37:47 | kugel | JdGordon: Just browse to it, or can't you atm? It's my custom list patch |
| 10:38:04 | JdGordon | kugel: arg.. yes, i looket at v8 yesterday... didnt give it a full look though |
| 10:38:45 | JdGordon | imho it would be a better use of time fixing the rest of the screens to work with viewports than fidling with this atm |
| 10:39:01 | kugel | JdGordon: Not sure, but you might think about the one todo: that it's ineffective the reparse the viewport structure from settings at every redraw |
| 10:39:27 | amiconn | JdGordon: Btw, one lagginess increase seems to be due to viewported lists |
| 10:39:42 | JdGordon | kugel: I know... another reason to leave that aside |
| 10:39:52 | JdGordon | amiconn: in which lists? |
| 10:39:54 | kugel | JdGordon: I wanted that feature more than viewports for other screens, that's why I focussed on that first. I can take a look at viewportifying other screens though |
| 10:39:57 | * | JdGordon hoped he got the worst of it |
| 10:40:20 | amiconn | Now when booting an archos, the screen goes completely blank after the rockbox logo at boot for a fraction of a second |
| 10:40:36 | JdGordon | only at boot? |
| 10:40:42 | amiconn | ...before the list is shown (I've set it to boot into file browser) |
| 10:40:48 | * | kugel just wanted to mention it, and goes of now |
| 10:40:52 | | Quit kugel ("ChatZilla 0.9.81 [Firefox 2.0.0.13/2008032514]") |
| 10:41:12 | amiconn | I only observed it at boot so far. Can't test atm |
| 10:41:54 | JdGordon | about HZ/2? |
| 10:42:10 | JdGordon | there is no drawing in the tree untill after the button press which would explain it |
| 10:42:37 | JdGordon | although vp shouldnt have shown it up... |
| 10:42:53 | pixelma | the statusbar update lag got worse too (noticed last week) - when going from WPS to the browser, the statusbar doesn't update immediately (was there before) but in the statusbar area you can still see that part of the WPS (before you had a blank space for a short while) |
| 10:47:38 | | Quit MethoS- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 10:48:16 | | Quit mrkiko (Remote closed the connection) |
| 10:48:36 | amiconn | Statusbar also takes ages to update after boot (check with any soft-led target...) |
| 10:48:51 | pixelma | JdGordon: could be Hz/2. I can't remember the details but this is recent thing because it makes Rockbox feel slower than before |
| 10:48:58 | Casainho | hello |
| 10:49:57 | Casainho | I am looking for guidance about what to do after an offer from a commercial company that sells, re-brande DAPS, said that would like to produce rockbox player |
| 10:50:18 | LinusN | good question :-) |
| 10:50:19 | pondlife | JdGordon: Simulator takes about 2 seconds to display the file browser on boot at the moment too. |
| 10:50:36 | Casainho | can someone give opinions about: http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=6751.msg120826#msg120826 |
| 10:50:39 | JdGordon | ugg |
| 10:51:08 | JdGordon | pondlife: which sim? |
| 10:51:14 | pondlife | H300 |
| 10:51:30 | pondlife | Set it to start in the file browser |
| 10:51:50 | JdGordon | sim shouldnt make a diff.. but e200 sim worked fine.. compilng h300 sim now |
| 10:52:09 | * | petur wonders what rockbox has to do with google android |
| 10:52:13 | pondlife | You may need to set it to use a slow drive for your root... I use either a network drive, or my real H300 |
| 10:52:15 | | Join ceclin [0] (n=clincher@96.240.96.79) |
| 10:52:41 | JdGordon | then its more likely jhMikeS's threading changes... |
| 10:52:45 | | Quit szLacko (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 10:52:50 | pondlife | Maybe, will binchop |
| 10:52:51 | JdGordon | prioritys and such |
| 10:53:02 | * | JdGordon loves passing the buck :D |
| 10:53:23 | amiconn | I doubt that |
| 10:53:45 | | Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) |
| 10:53:49 | pixelma | JdGordon: threading changes - when? And do they affect Archos too? |
| 10:54:06 | JdGordon | in the last few days, dunno |
| 10:54:34 | JdGordon | maybe they put speed in the water there so everything feels much sloweer for you guys.... |
| 10:54:46 | JdGordon | pondlife: dump your config.cfg please |
| 10:54:52 | JdGordon | s/dump/;pastebin |
| 10:55:29 | pixelma | I first noticed this effect with a build that had the .rockboxoldconfig.cfg (or so) in it, hadn't updated for a while before that |
| 10:55:45 | pondlife | JdGordon: http://www.pastebin.ca/964501 |
| 10:56:59 | JdGordon | no problems with that config.cfg here |
| 10:57:45 | pondlife | You need to use rockboxui.exe −−root x: |
| 10:57:54 | pondlife | where x: is a slow drive with lots on |
| 10:58:18 | * | JdGordon has no such disk and doesnt belive this is a vp issue anymore |
| 10:58:45 | pondlife | I'll come up with a revision number |
| 10:58:50 | JdGordon | ok |
| 11:00 |
| 11:00:08 | * | JdGordon loves how this is the first I'm hearing of the issue and it supposedly first showed up a week ago |
| 11:01:37 | pixelma | I complained about this last week here and got no reaction :\ |
| 11:02:28 | JdGordon | on the tracker? |
| 11:02:34 | JdGordon | not everyone reads the logs... |
| 11:04:31 | * | amiconn actually reads the logs more often than the tracker :\ |
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| 11:06:10 | pixelma | I also hoped for comments by others (seen it too, stuff like that) |
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| 11:20:49 | mrkiko | Hi all again! |
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| 11:30:36 | B4gder | whoa gsoc apps are pouring in now |
| 11:30:58 | petur | deadline rush :) |
| 11:31:25 | B4gder | indeed |
| 11:31:38 | B4gder | 10 hours to go isn't it? |
| 11:32:55 | GodEater | I'm still not overly struck by the quality mind you |
| 11:33:10 | petur | hmmm three usability studies :/ |
| 11:33:11 | B4gder | I agree |
| 11:33:20 | B4gder | and 4 theme editors |
| 11:33:24 | pondlife | :) |
| 11:33:27 | GodEater | one proposal which includes no project idea at all |
| 11:33:37 | merbzt | same for ffmpeg |
| 11:34:01 | gevaerts | I think it's something like 14:27 to go |
| 11:34:18 | * | linuxstb hopes a rockbox-as-app app appears... |
| 11:34:23 | B4gder | ah yes, I can never learn time zones |
| 11:34:35 | gevaerts | At least we should end up with a theme editor with a really well designed UI :) |
| 11:34:45 | * | gevaerts points to date -u |
| 11:35:00 | B4gder | cheater! |
| 11:35:08 | | Part linuxstb ("Leaving") |
| 11:35:30 | pondlife | gevaerts: "a really well designed UI" is not likely to be a statement we can all agree on. |
| 11:35:33 | pondlife | :) |
| 11:35:41 | | Nick linuxstb_ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
| 11:35:51 | gevaerts | I can even make sense of the PDT times on the GSoC page :) I have both PDT and CET in my clock applet |
| 11:36:52 | B4gder | yeah, I use this fancy firefox clock thing on one of my browsers and it helps a lot |
| 11:37:04 | linuxstb | I've been helping scorche with the PHP for the new themes site - here's what I've come up with so far - http://linuxstb.cream.org/themes/ (it's using the old rockbox-themes.org content for testing - that will need to be cleared) |
| 11:37:32 | gevaerts | Especially if you're working with people from different timezones it helps to always know what time they have |
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| 11:38:35 | B4gder | linuxstb: it looks nice and a good start! |
| 11:38:56 | pondlife | linuxstb: I like the standard-left-menu |
| 11:39:08 | B4gder | it would be cool with some rating and download counters to get to see "most popular" etc |
| 11:39:08 | linuxstb | B4gder: "a good start" ? That's all there will be... ;) (at least for v1) |
| 11:39:14 | pondlife | Anything in particular that needs testing |
| 11:39:23 | B4gder | linuxstb: isn't v1 the start? ;-) |
| 11:39:30 | disorganizer | are more than 2 screenshots supported? |
| 11:39:32 | JdGordon | linuxstb: can you get it to use the full browser width? |
| 11:39:33 | gevaerts | The front looks familiar :) |
| 11:39:35 | linuxstb | pondlife: The upload facility will need testing, but I'm still working on it. |
| 11:39:39 | pondlife | OK |
| 11:40:04 | JdGordon | linuxstb: i.e more than 3 themes per ro |
| 11:40:05 | JdGordon | w |
| 11:40:16 | pondlife | We're still going to restart with no content and carefully filter for compatibilty, right? |
| 11:40:30 | * | disorganizer hopes so |
| 11:40:42 | B4gder | I'm sure we'll get content fast enough anyway |
| 11:41:11 | linuxstb | JdGordon: How would you do that/ |
| 11:41:29 | * | JdGordon doesnt do web development... |
| 11:41:34 | linuxstb | pondlife: Yes, the intention is for the site to start blank, and for the uploads to stictly validate submissions (including running checkwps) |
| 11:41:39 | gevaerts | linuxstb: you could just put them all in a list and use CSS to make it look like a table |
| 11:42:10 | linuxstb | gevaerts: Patches welcome ;) (I'm intending to put the PHP in SVN) |
| 11:42:30 | disorganizer | and let the user decide how many themes per row ... if possible? and sorting, of course :-) |
| 11:43:12 | linuxstb | The important thing is to collect the metadata accurately, and to make sure the theme .zip files are correct. We can play with display options and filters/sorting etc later. |
| 11:43:14 | gevaerts | linuxstb: maybe I'll have a look at it some time, if nobody beats me to it. I know a bit about css, but I have to look things up a lot |
| 11:43:48 | gevaerts | Have there been thoughts about automatically generating the screenshots ? |
| 11:44:11 | disorganizer | then indeed i would prefer one theme per row because imho its easier toscroll through the site with that |
| 11:44:23 | * | gevaerts diverts the discussion from actual UI design to lower-level and more interesting things |
| 11:44:56 | linuxstb | gevaerts: Sounds like a fun feature to add to checkwps... |
| 11:45:31 | | Quit tessarakt ("Client exiting") |
| 11:45:50 | linuxstb | gevaerts: But don't we have a theme editor on its way that could make screenshorts? ;) |
| 11:45:56 | disorganizer | problem is: if a theme has 2 timed sets of what its displaying, for example playlist-count for 5 seconds and playlist-name for 10 seconds (just an example), would we allow more than 2 screenshots? |
| 11:46:36 | gevaerts | linuxstb: some of them have a screenshot feature listed. If they can make that functionality available in a headless mode, we're done |
| 11:47:16 | * | gevaerts didn't mean to suggest that linuxstb had to implement it himself :) |
| 11:48:07 | linuxstb | For the moment, I just want to make sure we're collecting the right data about the theme - here's the current version of the upload form - http://linuxstb.cream.org/themes/upload.php |
| 11:48:57 | B4gder | linuxstb: what about a given password or similar in case the user wants to update the theme? |
| 11:50:01 | B4gder | of course nobody will remember theirs anyway |
| 11:50:04 | disorganizer | linuxstb: as said, what if 2 wps screenshots would make sense? |
| 11:50:06 | linuxstb | B4gder: I was thinking the email address could be used for that - to email the user a password |
| 11:50:13 | pondlife | linuxstb: If I were to specify "Target Device: FM Recorder" I assume it would be made available to Recorder v1/v2 users too? |
| 11:50:13 | B4gder | good idea |
| 11:50:29 | * | gevaerts might test-submit a theme tonight (if that's already supposed to work..) |
| 11:50:30 | Llorean | I don't even know if you'd need to do passwords |
| 11:50:32 | linuxstb | pondlife: Yes, that's the intention. |
| 11:50:34 | disorganizer | b4gder: what about using the wiki permissions? they have a password attached to it, the email-address (afaik) and even the realname |
| 11:51:02 | Llorean | B4gder, linuxstb: Why not, when someone tries to upload a theme with the same name and target, it simply uses the email address to mail a confirmation link of some sort for overwriting? No password to remember / deal with. |
| 11:51:03 | disorganizer | linuxstb: i will also upload a theme later |
| 11:51:11 | linuxstb | gevaerts: No, the upload doesn't work yet - but hopefully I'll get that finished this evening. It's a lot of work as I'm highly paranoid about the contents of the zip, and also want to very strictly validate it. |
| 11:51:13 | Llorean | linuxstb, B4gder: Sorry, *original* email address |
| 11:51:18 | gevaerts | disorganizer: different server, so possible data availability problems ? |
| 11:51:30 | B4gder | Llorean: indeed, since the address isn't shown that's a pretty good idea |
| 11:51:51 | disorganizer | linuxstb: ok. just mention it in the irc log when the upload should work with a link |
| 11:52:18 | linuxstb | disorganizer: Don't worry, I will do. The upload is going to need testing... |
| 11:52:23 | disorganizer | any restrictions on zip formatting? (folder structure, naming etc) |
| 11:52:23 | gevaerts | linuxstb: of course. I do expect a reasonable amount of paranoia from this kind of system. Nobody wants viruses and trojans in it... |
| 11:53:01 | disorganizer | could we use the forum useraccount for access validation? (and for nicknames) |
| 11:53:04 | Llorean | disorganizer: It should be the "proper" theme structure (when extracted to the root of the device, the images, .wps, .cfg, etc all end up in the appropriate subfolders) |
| 11:53:30 | disorganizer | llorean: ok. so that should be linked from the submit page or mentioned there *g* |
| 11:53:37 | * | gevaerts will of course upload a black-on-black theme that turns voice off, sets weird equalizer settings, and sets the brightness to minimum |
| 11:53:47 | pondlife | linuxstb: Will you be able to validate the zip format? |
| 11:53:57 | Llorean | disorganizer: I believe *somewhere* we've got a document containing the intended submission guidelines for this new site. Dunno where though. |
| 11:54:06 | disorganizer | gevaerts: why not a theme replacing the bin with a empty file? |
| 11:54:14 | linuxstb | pondlife: Yes, that's what I'm working on at the moment. |
| 11:54:18 | pondlife | Great |
| 11:54:37 | disorganizer | will the submitter get a kind of information why his theme was rejected? |
| 11:54:45 | linuxstb | disorganizer: Of course |
| 11:54:46 | gevaerts | disorganizer: that's no fun. I will however try to replace cabbiev2 with my theme, to make resetting settings not work :) |
| 11:55:14 | disorganizer | gevaerts: you, sir, are definitely evil by heart |
| 11:55:16 | Llorean | gevaerts: And that's *exactly* why we also need a .cfg validator that removes all "non-theme" lines from .cfg files. Thanks for volunteering. :) It should also be easy to update with its own list of which lines are valid, for when settings change without needing to recompile. Thank you very much. :-P |
| 11:55:54 | disorganizer | llorean: in fact we just need to check than NO original files of the svn are overwritten :-) |
| 11:56:20 | Llorean | disorganizer: Well, the real problem is that a .cfg can change any setting, not just theme settings. |
| 11:56:30 | Llorean | Any theme should have an explicit list of settings (no more, no less). |
| 11:56:32 | disorganizer | we have a kind of factory reset though |
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| 11:56:48 | Llorean | If a setting should be "as default", it should still be there, but should set the default value (or no value in the case of backdrops) |
| 11:56:55 | disorganizer | and we would need a "complain" button on the dl-page of course so users can complain to admins if such a theme is upped |
| 11:57:11 | gevaerts | Llorean: I fully agree that this theme must be rejected. I fear that I'm not the right person to decide what settings to allow (I know nearly nothing about that area) |
| 11:57:29 | | Join roolku [0] (n=roolku@77-99-112-231.cable.ubr16.edin.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 11:57:42 | disorganizer | imho we could do something else: |
| 11:58:02 | gevaerts | linuxstb: maybe reject a theme if it's filenames clash with any other theme ? |
| 11:58:02 | | Quit psychorabbit (Client Quit) |
| 11:58:11 | Llorean | gevaerts: Well, a .cfg validity check script or app shouldn't be too hard to write anyawy. |
| 11:58:12 | Llorean | anyway. |
| 11:58:13 | disorganizer | we could allow only color and viewport and wps setting as well as fonts. if a theme needs something else, people need to request it explicitly and the devs can decide |
| 11:58:25 | JdGordon | gevaerts: that wont work.. alot of themes are just updates of existing ones |
| 11:58:42 | linuxstb | Llorean: Then I look forward to it from you ;) PHP would be pefect... |
| 11:58:48 | Llorean | disorganizer: I already said there's an explicit list of "theme" settings which are the only ones it should be allowed to change. |
| 11:59:02 | JdGordon | Llorean: yes... yes it is hard to write |
| 11:59:12 | Llorean | JdGordon: Depends on what you consider "valid" |
| 11:59:18 | gevaerts | JdGordon: if they're updates, IMHO they should be handled as such. What I want to avoid is getting incompatible unrelated themes |
| 11:59:33 | JdGordon | no... depends how up-to-date you want the config to be |
| 11:59:39 | Llorean | JdGordon: I consider "valid" as long as it has one line beginning with each of the settings. I don't care what the values are, because confirming the validity of those is ridiculous. |
| 11:59:54 | linuxstb | gevaerts: Each theme name (the name of the zip/wps/cfg etc) will be checked for uniqueness for that LCD size. |
| 12:00 |
| 12:00:07 | Llorean | JdGordon: Basically, it's as simple as counting the lines in a file, then making sure each of a list of substrings begins one, and only one, line. If that's not true, toss it. :-P |
| 12:00:08 | pondlife | Where's the definition of which .cfg fields are considered part of a theme? |
| 12:00:11 | disorganizer | i wonder how we handle the situation where "old" themes need an update and someone else (not the original author) wants to do it. will the "old" theme be moved and the update be submitted as new? |
| 12:00:14 | gevaerts | OK. That should do the trick |
| 12:00:48 | Llorean | linuxstb: I was thinking of it as an excuse to try to learn something new, but if not, I may go back and try to do it in PHP so it can be injected into the upload process. |
| 12:01:05 | Llorean | JdGordon: So how about "my vision of validation is relatively simple"? |
| 12:01:41 | pondlife | Maybe, when we add a new theme option(e.g. viewport: ), could the hosted themes be bulk-updated to select the prior default? |
| 12:01:50 | linuxstb | pondlife: That's the idea ;) |
| 12:01:57 | pondlife | Even betterer |
| 12:01:57 | amiconn | linuxstb: Don't forget that there sometimes could be 2 theme variants for the same lcd size (rtc vs. non-rtc) |
| 12:02:22 | Llorean | pondlife: Since .cfg files are just text files, you should be able to just append the "default" line on the end. Especially if the settings use "viewport:" without parameters to reset the default, since then it doesn't even need target-specificity. |
| 12:02:23 | disorganizer | also, if themes are not valid any more (for whatever reason), will they be completely dropped or "parked" somewhere for a later update? |
| 12:03:10 | pondlife | Llorean: Yes, absolutely - I was just wondering if the "validity parser" should/could contain functionality to do this appending. |
| 12:03:23 | Llorean | pondlife: I think it's a job for a separate app. |
| 12:03:37 | pondlife | So, if someone uploads an old theme, that is fine but has some recent stuff missing, it would get fixed up. |
| 12:03:53 | pondlife | You're probably right though |
| 12:04:03 | Llorean | Your point on "old themes" is possibly true. |
| 12:04:17 | Llorean | But I *think* people should just be rejected with information like "missing viewportlist line" |
| 12:04:18 | pondlife | It could save a bit of time |
| 12:04:21 | Llorean | So they know it exists. |
| 12:04:38 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 12:04:45 | pondlife | I'd warn them, then ask if they'd like a default line adding. |
| 12:04:50 | Llorean | Possibly |
| 12:05:08 | pondlife | Problem is, they would probably not test the modified theme...# |
| 12:05:11 | JdGordon | Llorean: well yes, that is pretty simple |
| 12:06:06 | disorganizer | also if they need to do it manually, they learn to do it every time and how it works *eg* |
| 12:06:11 | linuxstb | amiconn: Yes. And I think there are other hardware-specific things such as the virtual disk LED, hold buttons, tagcache, sw/hwcodec, pitch-screen, ..... |
| 12:06:21 | linuxstb | (... charging...) |
| 12:06:55 | pondlife | So you need a set of feature bits as well as LCD details.. |
| 12:07:03 | linuxstb | pondlife: I would rather not start modifying the uploaded file - at least not initially. |
| 12:07:09 | pixelma | hold state is now shown on software hold targets too |
| 12:07:10 | pondlife | OK, just a thought |
| 12:07:12 | Llorean | pondlife: Also, my slight worry, is that if we add default lines they may also go and upload the same theme (without defaults) to another theme site. Then someone complains that a theme is breaking their device usability, and it's one we find on our site, and gets us confused. |
| 12:07:30 | Llorean | pondlife: So, I'd rather "force" them to take the time to fix their theme, even if it does sound a little contrived and "mean spirited" perhaps |
| 12:07:45 | pondlife | No, at least they fix their copy then |
| 12:07:58 | pondlife | In other words, I agree |
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| 12:08:32 | Llorean | JdGordon: I think going much beyond that is actually making the system more fragile. If you try to check to make sure the list viewport is big enough to be usable, or that the colors of fg/bg aren't unreadable, you end up with either an overly-restrictive system (erring on the side of caution) or a system that isn't restrictive enough, but people still expect to work. |
| 12:08:58 | Llorean | JdGordon: So I kinda think "just make sure it has all the lines, and trust the user to set appropriate values" is the right kind of check for .cfg. At least, in my mind |
| 12:10:02 | JdGordon | I was thinking more of the problem of going from settings_list.c -> parser, we've agreed before trying to keep 2 files in sync is too much effort |
| 12:10:56 | pondlife | We only just got rid of FILES :) |
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| 12:16:45 | | Join Nico_P [50] (n=nicolas@rockbox/developer/NicoP) |
| 12:17:32 | * | Nico_P got his sansa in the post |
| 12:17:46 | JdGordon | no barry :( |
| 12:17:58 | pondlife | Nico_P: V1? |
| 12:18:02 | Llorean | JdGordon: Well, the interesting thing is, when a new setting shows up, we're going to have to write some sort of script to update all the existing themes with a default value(s) |
| 12:18:07 | Nico_P | pondlife: checking |
| 12:18:16 | Llorean | JdGordon: When doing so, the same script can add it to the definition file the checker program uses for all future themes submitted. |
| 12:18:47 | Llorean | So while it does require keeping two in sync, it could be a lot worse. The update for existing themes is basically going to have to be triggered manually anyway |
| 12:19:14 | Nico_P | version 01.01.00F... I guess it's a V1 then? |
| 12:19:18 | pondlife | :) |
| 12:20:06 | pondlife | Nico_P: You must have quite a collection of targets now |
| 12:20:08 | JdGordon | does anyone mind me fixing this diff from BOOTLOADER to SANSA_E200? http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi/trunk/firmware/target/arm/usb-fw-pp502x.c?r1=16816;r2=16817;pathrev=16817 |
| 12:20:35 | JdGordon | and can someone with a c200 check if plugging in usb to reboot into the OF crashes like the e200 does? |
| 12:20:40 | Nico_P | pondlife: Gigabeat S and F, LinusN's ipod and the sansa. |
| 12:21:43 | linuxstb | JdGordon: A few days ago (last Wednesday I think), I tested an SVN bootloader on the c240, and it failed to detect USB. It didn't crash though. |
| 12:22:23 | JdGordon | before or after "revision 16817, Wed Mar 26 10:37:17 2008 UTC" ? |
| 12:22:24 | linuxstb | Nico_P: All ARM targets... |
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| 12:22:36 | | Join LinusN [0] (n=linus@rockbox/developer/LinusN) |
| 12:23:07 | Nico_P | I have an H320 when I'm in Paris, although it's officially my mothers |
| 12:23:33 | linuxstb | JdGordon: I'm not sure... |
| 12:23:46 | Nico_P | time to install rockbox on the little one now :) |
| 12:24:18 | linuxstb | Nico_P: Don't forget to put the OF in MSC mode - it's not the default. |
| 12:24:32 | Nico_P | ah, thanks |
| 12:24:40 | JdGordon | linuxstb: have you got a min to check if r16816 can load the OF? (or try a quick patch) |
| 12:24:54 | linuxstb | JdGordon: You mean risk needing e200tool? ;) |
| 12:25:15 | JdGordon | well no... |
| 12:25:22 | JdGordon | the only change is reverting that diff |
| 12:25:40 | B4gder | it seems a lot of other projects share our current gsoc experience |
| 12:25:51 | B4gder | less applications with a so-so quality |
| 12:25:56 | petur | indeed |
| 12:26:09 | petur | the mentor list is full of them |
| 12:26:15 | B4gder | yeps |
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| 12:27:03 | * | GodEater wonders if the lack of quality is a sign of the dollars weakness |
| 12:27:21 | B4gder | that's an interesting angle |
| 12:27:34 | B4gder | how much less is it counted in euros compared to last year? |
| 12:27:40 | GodEater | a lot less |
| 12:28:10 | * | Nico_P got ~3500€ last year |
| 12:28:15 | GodEater | I could probably dig out the FX rate from this time last year |
| 12:28:57 | B4gder | and its ~2800 euros now |
| 12:29:05 | B4gder | 4500 USD I mean |
| 12:29:29 | Nico_P | wow, not much indeed |
| 12:29:36 | GodEater | that's a pretty significant drop |
| 12:30:09 | Nico_P | rbutil tells me "the bootloader is already installed and up to date"... |
| 12:30:23 | * | GodEater used sansapatcher |
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| 12:30:59 | Nico_P | I replaced it all the same |
| 12:31:03 | pixelma | JdGordon: on a c200 plugging in USB to reboot into the OF *sometimes* crashes, sometimes works. It has always been like that... |
| 12:31:22 | pixelma | from a running Rockbox that is of course |
| 12:33:10 | * | gevaerts thinks that 2800 euros before taxes for twelve weeks is not very much |
| 12:33:24 | * | GodEater agrees |
| 12:34:25 | GodEater | it'd be about 2270 GBP |
| 12:34:32 | GodEater | which is also pretty miserable |
| 12:34:45 | GodEater | I think I did better than that stacking shelves when I was a student |
| 12:35:04 | gevaerts | Probably, but stacking shelves is less interesting work :) |
| 12:35:23 | gevaerts | Of course, you can get stack overflows in both areas |
| 12:35:46 | petur | rofl |
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| 12:36:28 | GodEater | gevaerts: it also wasn't a 40hour a week job though :) |
| 12:36:40 | JdGordon | linuxstb: pixelma: anyone with a min and a c200... can you test http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8506?getfile=16326 bootloader and main build please |
| 12:36:49 | GodEater | and google hadn't even been born back then, much less GSoC |
| 12:37:00 | GodEater | I don't even think I had a home internet connection back then |
| 12:39:39 | Nico_P | I didn't pay any taxes on google's money... |
| 12:39:44 | JdGordon | hmm... maybe not... killed usb detection in the bl :( |
| 12:41:03 | * | JdGordon wonders if DEV_USB0 really is DEV_USB0... |
| 12:42:12 | | Quit B4gder ("It is time to say moo") |
| 12:42:21 | linuxstb | JdGordon: Sorry, I can't do any testing at the moment... |
| 12:43:07 | JdGordon | righto... dont test that patch anyway... its forced me to use rec mode |
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| 12:47:15 | BigBambi | GodEater: I've just been reading the logs - that £2270 for 12 weeks at 40 hours per week is £4.73 an hour - compare with minimum wage at £5.52 for over 21 and £4.60 for 18-21 |
| 12:47:41 | GodEater | so pretty shocking then ;) |
| 12:47:57 | BigBambi | yup |
| 12:48:05 | gevaerts | Of course, we do it for free :) |
| 12:48:13 | GodEater | well there is that yes ;) |
| 12:48:18 | BigBambi | True |
| 12:48:56 | BigBambi | But a full summer job paying less than the minimum wage isn't very enticing from a purely earning money point of view |
| 12:49:27 | BigBambi | (or I guess for most students it is the minimum wage, not less than) |
| 12:51:40 | * | GodEater wonders what minimum wage is in the USA |
| 12:51:52 | GodEater | assuming there is one :) |
| 12:52:14 | linuxstb | GodEater: http://www.dol.gov/esa/minwage/america.htm |
| 12:52:33 | * | gevaerts wonders if this dollar rate theory has been mentionned on #gsoc |
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| 12:52:55 | BigBambi | GodEater: A lot less than ours |
| 12:53:07 | BigBambi | Add that to the very weak dollar as you said |
| 12:53:13 | linuxstb | Between about $5 and $8 depending on state... |
| 12:53:35 | linuxstb | Or $4 in Montana... |
| 12:55:25 | GodEater | gevaerts: I've not mentioned it personally. It seems crass. It's not Google's fault that the USD has tanked. |
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| 12:56:02 | disorganizer | they should do it like when selling hardware. 3000$ for us residents, 3000e for european residents :-) |
| 12:56:09 | gevaerts | Of course not, but if it is a major reason for fewer applications than last year, an extension won't help |
| 12:58:24 | pondlife | Nico_P: RbUtil did the same for me, FWIW |
| 12:58:51 | BigBambi | pondlife, Nico_P: I think there has been a recent fix for that comitted to SVN |
| 12:59:03 | pondlife | Yes, but not released yet. |
| 12:59:21 | GodEater | gevaerts: perhaps you should mention it then ;) |
| 12:59:21 | * | pondlife would love to be able to build RbUtil for Windows |
| 12:59:46 | * | gevaerts heads over to #gsoc |
| 13:00 |
| 13:00:02 | Nico_P | I haven't rebuilt rbutil recentky |
| 13:00:15 | BigBambi | pondlife: No, not released. I was just pointing out the problem was known and fixed |
| 13:00:19 | BigBambi | http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi?view=rev;revision=16851 |
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| 13:12:58 | * | BigBambi kicks the forums in the nuts |
| 13:13:13 | BigBambi | Are they buggered for anyone else? |
| 13:13:27 | pixelma | same here |
| 13:13:38 | BigBambi | OK, cheers |
| 13:13:45 | * | gevaerts joins the club as well |
| 13:14:34 | gevaerts | BigBambi: you shouldn't have kicked so hard |
| 13:15:03 | BigBambi | Sorry. I was just frustrated gov |
| 13:15:27 | * | BigBambi tentativly pats the forums |
| 13:16:11 | BigBambi | gevaerts: Bloody hell, that worked |
| 13:16:23 | * | gevaerts notes that it's now at least monday everywhere, so the beer offer is over |
| 13:16:34 | gevaerts | BigBambi: see ? |
| 13:16:43 | * | BigBambi remembers in the future that the forums obviously respond better to the carrot than to the stick |
| 13:18:35 | pondlife | Nico_P: In case it's new information... I've just had a "repeated track". It was at the rebuffer point (maybe the last old track + the first new track). Also the next track info displayed the same as the current track before it repeated (so I knew it was about to repeat). |
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| 13:52:58 | webguest70 | just dropping in to say I've also had repeated tracks recently, not sure which version I'm running but it's about a week old |
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| 13:55:30 | webguest70 | not much time now, but I'll check the logs later and try to add some info that's actually useful if needed :-) |
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| 14:00 |
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| 14:05:31 | gevaerts | One application less to consider... |
| 14:10:02 | petur | it was already quite hopeless... |
| 14:10:33 | gevaerts | petur: should I just mark it as ineligible ? |
| 14:11:51 | petur | I was thinking the same, but ineligible is probably to be used for something else. But it would make it easier to get it out of the list |
| 14:13:09 | gevaerts | The two that are already marked ineligible are for the same reason (not rockbox-related) |
| 14:13:25 | petur | well in that case.... |
| 14:13:45 | gevaerts | done |
| 14:14:01 | JdGordon | should the resume one be ineligabelised also? |
| 14:14:13 | * | JdGordon didnt realise we could discard them so early |
| 14:14:39 | GodEater | I don't see why not - it doesn't include a project idea. |
| 14:14:41 | petur | done |
| 14:15:01 | petur | it can always be undone... |
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| 14:19:25 | arnath | hmm which would be best: iriver E100 or the sansa E250? |
| 14:19:38 | pondlife | For Rockbox, the Sansa |
| 14:19:48 | pondlife | The Iriver doesn't run Rockbox |
| 14:19:51 | arnath | pondlife: the sansa is v2 though :s |
| 14:20:00 | pondlife | Ah, neither then :) |
| 14:20:08 | arnath | aw :( |
| 14:20:16 | pondlife | Unless you want to do the port |
| 14:20:19 | arnath | and quality wise any suggestions? :> |
| 14:20:31 | * | petur would like to see the E100 supported - it has line-in and radio |
| 14:20:42 | pondlife | No idea, best ask in a relevant place |
| 14:21:23 | arnath | pondlife: know of any such relevant places on freenode? :> |
| 14:21:33 | pondlife | Sorry, no |
| 14:22:03 | pondlife | Maybe on #rockbox-community |
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| 15:39:16 | pixelma | linuxstb: to avoid duplicating efforts... I started converiting iCatcher to using bitmap strips |
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| 15:45:23 | linuxstb | pixelma: OK, thanks |
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| 15:47:35 | JdGordon | ... serious quesiton which may provoke some angry repsonses.... what the heck is the point of the queue insert options? |
| 15:48:09 | JdGordon | the only reason it would be useful is if the playlist is saved to a m3u, in which case the file could be removed easily with a text editor |
| 15:48:11 | PaulJam | to keep the playlist clean? |
| 15:48:18 | JdGordon | how? |
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| 15:48:40 | JdGordon | and who cares how "unclean" the played part of the playlist is? |
| 15:50:18 | PaulJam | for example if you use the play next functionalitty for an album then the playing track gets only queued, so the playlist index is the same as the track number for the album. |
| 15:51:22 | JdGordon | so? |
| 15:51:48 | JdGordon | its dawned on me we waste a fair bit doubling up those instert optoin |
| 15:51:51 | JdGordon | options |
| 15:53:52 | PaulJam | i don't really care myself if the queue options would get removed. i just think in some (rare) occassions they could be useful. |
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| 15:57:56 | PaulJam | but it would propably be good if you bring that topic up the mailinglist for discussion before you remove the options. |
| 16:00 |
| 16:00:03 | * | JdGordon never said anything about removing anything |
| 16:00:36 | amiconn | The queue options make very much sense if you run a playlist in 'repeat all' mode |
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| 16:10:04 | JdGordon | I disagree... why would you add a track into a possibly long playlist on repeat all, but not want to leave it in for next time? |
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| 16:17:03 | Rincewind | JdGordon: if you have all your music in a big playlist on shuffle repeat all and you want to listen one specific track without weighting the shuffle because of duplicate tracks afterwards |
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| 16:28:37 | MethoS-- | could somebody please rename the rbutil-9999.ebuild attachment for RockboxUtility to rbutil-9999.ebuild.old . I would like to upload an updated version |
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| 16:36:35 | MethoS-- | oh, just realized that different revisions of the same file can be handled... |
| 16:36:47 | MethoS-- | no renaming needed anymore :) |
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| 16:57:31 | * | scorche|sh sees he missed some theme site discussion =/ |
| 17:00 |
| 17:00:24 | scorche|sh | Llorean: you can find the guidelines on themes.rockbox.org (that is just my current version which will probably be thrown out when linuxstb gets his done) For anyone else listening, please no linking to this and no uploading, as this is not "live" yet. |
| 17:02:20 | | Join midgey [0] (n=tjross@67-194-5-4.wireless.umnet.umich.edu) |
| 17:02:42 | mrkiko | :D |
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| 17:11:22 | zlined | is it possible to access daily builds from a couple yrs ago? |
| 17:11:29 | disorganizer | scorche: and how should we test the upload feature if we are not allowed to test-upload anything? or was this just for non-testers? |
| 17:11:47 | | Quit toffe82 (Connection reset by peer) |
| 17:12:58 | scorche|sh | disorganizer: because this isnt the version that will be up |
| 17:13:25 | renkho | hello all |
| 17:13:36 | renkho | anyone here with an iriver h3x0? |
| 17:13:38 | LambdaCalculus37 | zlined: Why would you want old builds for, especially from a couple of years ago? |
| 17:14:15 | zlined | i'm finding the current builds are very slow loading the songs |
| 17:14:15 | | Join toffe82 [0] (n=chatzill@h-74-0-180-178.snvacaid.covad.net) |
| 17:14:24 | zlined | this is for the iriver h10 |
| 17:14:39 | LambdaCalculus37 | zlined: Which H10? 5/6GB or 20GB? |
| 17:14:48 | zlined | 5gb |
| 17:14:50 | mrkiko | renkho: I have one |
| 17:15:32 | LambdaCalculus37 | zlined: What SVN version do you have? System > Rockbox Info from the main menu; starts with an r. |
| 17:16:27 | zlined | i've turned the shuffle off as well, using r16899-080331 |
| 17:16:58 | mrkiko | renkho: What's the problem? |
| 17:18:08 | LambdaCalculus37 | zlined: One of the devs should be able to help you pinpoint it. Can you give us more information about what kinds of files you're trying to load, and if this happens with playlists as well as individual files? |
| 17:18:17 | disorganizer | scorche: so there will be a link to the "official" test-upload later? did someone really use the link in here to upload? (i think linuxstb explicitly told people not to use it) |
| 17:18:55 | scorche|sh | disorganizer: i would imagine i would be able to do all the test uploading myself, but... |
| 17:19:04 | renkho | mrkiko: i just got mine, and a friend toldme about the rockbox firmware |
| 17:19:08 | renkho | he has an h120 |
| 17:19:09 | scorche|sh | as for the rest of it, i ahve no idea what you are going on about |
| 17:19:19 | renkho | but my firmware is actually 1.31K |
| 17:19:24 | renkho | and after some research |
| 17:19:37 | renkho | i found that isn't supported for patch the bootloader |
| 17:19:47 | renkho | but the info that i found was from 2006 |
| 17:20:03 | renkho | but i didn't find anything new |
| 17:20:03 | mrkiko | mhm... right |
| 17:20:18 | scorche|sh | renkho: |
| 17:20:19 | | Join PaulJam [0] (n=PaulJam_@p54BCD8D3.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:20:20 | scorche|sh | please |
| 17:20:21 | scorche|sh | do no |
| 17:20:21 | renkho | should i downgrade the firmware? |
| 17:20:23 | scorche|sh | type |
| 17:20:25 | scorche|sh | like this |
| 17:20:30 | scorche|sh | ;) |
| 17:20:34 | renkho | scorche|sh: ups sorry |
| 17:20:45 | * | gevaerts points scorche|sh to the topic ;) |
| 17:21:22 | mrkiko | renkho: eh.... probable |
| 17:21:40 | mrkiko | I recommend you aniway |
| 17:21:57 | mrkiko | to get a copy of your actual firmware prior to start doing anything. |
| 17:23:01 | mrkiko | Then: if you want I have an already patched and working h300.bin file, I know it's illegal to pass it to you, but if you dn't have time to do differently, then I 'm available; My h300.hex file |
| 17:23:06 | mrkiko | contains a 1.29EU fw + bootloader |
| 17:23:49 | renkho | 1.29 EU :o |
| 17:23:56 | renkho | does it plays videos and stuff? |
| 17:24:09 | zlined | LambdaCalculus37: well the problem comes when i'm skipping through songs in a playlist and loading songs individually. once the song loads (takes >15s) then skipping 3-4 songs back and forth is fine |
| 17:24:23 | renkho | 'cause i used the 1.31K 'cause i found a lot of people who recommend that one |
| 17:25:10 | zlined | but skipping more than that takes longer. i'm guessing this is a harware limitation/implementation problem |
| 17:26:02 | PaulJam | the only difference between 1.31k and 1.29k is the minesweeper game afaik. so you won't loose anything important (you propably won't use the OF anymore) |
| 17:26:24 | Nico_P | zlined: that's with the current SVN? |
| 17:26:54 | Nico_P | oh yes r16899, didn't see tha |
| 17:26:55 | zlined | if i remember right i don't think it took as long to load a song in the r16xx? version...i think...hence why i was after old svns to check against |
| 17:27:18 | zlined | yeah that's right |
| 17:27:22 | | Quit PaulJam (".") |
| 17:27:27 | pixelma | linuxstb: just saw a weird effect when loading my edited Nano iCatcher - I had a typo in "codec.bmp" (was only "codec" without the".bmp" but loading this .wps did not fail completely (just this bitmap and the background was missing). Thought the WPS parser should have rejected it? |
| 17:27:33 | | Join DerDome [0] (n=DerDome@dslb-082-083-245-106.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 17:27:48 | renkho | OF? |
| 17:27:50 | Nico_P | zlined: in my tests it's only sometimes that an unbuffered song takes a long time to load... is it all the time for you? |
| 17:27:50 | zlined | and before i meant r10xx or something i think, it was a yr or two old the last version i remember |
| 17:28:13 | zlined | for me it's 90% of the time |
| 17:28:28 | Nico_P | ouch |
| 17:28:59 | Nico_P | do you skip around a lot? and fast? |
| 17:29:35 | zlined | depends what mood i'm in:P |
| 17:29:41 | zlined | but yeah i do sometimes |
| 17:30:13 | zlined | i just tested now and loading an unbuffered song takes 30s |
| 17:30:29 | Nico_P | is there a kind of skipping pattern that you find leads to the most waiting? |
| 17:31:10 | Nico_P | normally skipping to an unbuffered song should be quite OK if you take the disk startup into account |
| 17:32:35 | zlined | hmm not sure if it's the other random files stored on the drive that's causing a problem |
| 17:32:50 | zlined | or disk fragmentation |
| 17:33:36 | zlined | there's no pattern to it, it'll just take a long time to load so long as you're going to an unbuffered song |
| 17:34:11 | Nico_P | I'm sure you realize it's expected for unbuffered songs to take longer than buffered ones? |
| 17:34:49 | Nico_P | 30 secs is too much though, I have to agree |
| 17:35:07 | renkho | mrkiko: is there any risk in downgrade the firmware from 1.31K to 1.29K? |
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| 17:35:44 | zlined | yeah i know, but it is a bit long as it is at the moment. i'm not sure if the code is writtem such that you buffer 5songs then play the first song |
| 17:35:47 | mrkiko | renkho: no risks I know. |
| 17:36:09 | | Join SirFunk [0] (n=Sir@206-159-155-246.netsync.net) |
| 17:36:22 | zlined | and the old code maybe buffer the first then play it. then buffer the rest of the songs in time |
| 17:36:36 | Nico_P | zlined: it plays the first song as soon as it has enough data |
| 17:36:52 | Nico_P | but I've seen some cases where for some reason it waits for all the data of the song |
| 17:36:55 | mrkiko | renkho: aniway - if you need the .bin file please tell me. I'm using actually a boot loader wich is not affected by the problems I encountered with non-lcd remote controllers. |
| 17:37:01 | Nico_P | so that's probably what's happening to you |
| 17:37:11 | mrkiko | I risk'ed with my iRiver applying a svn boot-loader and it worked |
| 17:37:18 | | Join domonoky [0] (n=Domonoky@rockbox/developer/domonoky) |
| 17:37:39 | mrkiko | renkho: but I recommend you strongly to get a copy of your firmware prior to start |
| 17:37:46 | mrkiko | Just to be sure you can go back |
| 17:37:52 | | Part pondlife |
| 17:38:21 | mrkiko | renkho: aniway be advised - if something goes wrong during the flash process, no one except someone with a BDM hardware can help you. |
| 17:38:44 | mrkiko | Aniway - if I've done it successfully, probably anyone can do it :) |
| 17:38:49 | | Join Buschel [0] (n=AndreeBu@p54A3E59F.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:38:49 | zlined | Nico_P: yeah i'll do a clean wipe and install tomorrow morning to rule out any weird stuff |
| 17:38:52 | | Quit gevaerts (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 17:38:57 | Nico_P | zlined: thanks |
| 17:39:08 | mrkiko | I've done it during a school lesson hiding myself from the prof :) |
| 17:39:16 | Nico_P | I'll still try to hunt down the case Iw as mentioning |
| 17:39:32 | zlined | Iw? |
| 17:39:42 | Nico_P | "I was" |
| 17:39:54 | zlined | ah lol |
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| 17:40:48 | zlined | thanks for the help, you're a dev i'm guessing? |
| 17:41:26 | Nico_P | zlined: yes, I worked on the playback engine so this sort of bug is kinda my responsibility ;) |
| 17:42:04 | mrkiko | Nico_P: regarding playback... |
| 17:42:27 | mrkiko | Nico_P: as I said some days ago I noticed that on my plater at least, sometimes when the disk has to spin up |
| 17:43:11 | mrkiko | the playback instead of going to the next song as it should, re-starts the actual song. I can reproduce it very reliably when auto-change dir is enabled and I'm asking the player to switch from the last song on a dir and start on the next of the other. |
| 17:43:33 | mrkiko | Nico_P: Then, interestingly, it skips the first song of the destination dir, and passes to the second one. |
| 17:43:38 | | Quit midgey () |
| 17:44:02 | Nico_P | mrkiko: you mean like in FS #8513 ?? |
| 17:44:28 | * | mrkiko searches for FS #8513 |
| 17:44:30 | zlined | Nico_P: haha i'm just glad there's an alternative firmware. you guys have done an awesome job so far...so props and keep up the good work. i'm off to bed and i'll get back to you tomorrow with any updates |
| 17:44:50 | zlined | night guys |
| 17:44:57 | Nico_P | zlined: thanks, and good night |
| 17:45:18 | | Quit zlined () |
| 17:45:54 | mrkiko | FS #8513, the right one, yes... |
| 17:46:13 | mrkiko | Nico_P: but I dislike websites so much |
| 17:46:19 | ceclin | yay gsoc application extension |
| 17:46:21 | ceclin | *phew* |
| 17:46:26 | ceclin | wake up to good news :D |
| 17:46:28 | mrkiko | may be because actually I don't have a vocal synthetizer |
| 17:46:41 | Nico_P | mrkiko: oh sorry I should have given you the link |
| 17:47:10 | mrkiko | Nico_P: oh no problem! It's not a duty ! :) |
| 17:47:24 | Nico_P | mrkiko: I'll try it... reproducing is the first step towards fixing :) |
| 17:48:04 | mrkiko | Nico_P: I don't have a flash-based player that can run rockbox for now, so I can't help you. |
| 17:48:04 | | Quit gevaerts ("CGI:IRC 0.5.9 (2006/06/06)") |
| 17:48:19 | mrkiko | Nico_P: aniway I suspect it appears only on disk-based ones |
| 17:48:41 | Nico_P | mrkiko: you've already helped me |
| 17:49:12 | mrkiko | rhenko: another difference between 1.29 and 1.31 is that 1.31 doesn't have the photo mode, present in 1.29 and removed for license issues. |
| 17:49:42 | | Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("CGI:IRC") |
| 17:49:57 | mrkiko | Nico_P: since the bug is here since a lot of time I was thinking that not many people is having it ... |
| 17:50:01 | | Join LambdaCalculus37 [0] (n=44a0430f@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-ad3b6cd5c16e1b00) |
| 17:50:50 | Nico_P | mrkiko: it's been annoying quite a few people but it's been very hard to track down |
| 17:51:02 | pixelma | I can reproduce the autoskip directory part (maybe it's a different issue) very reliably on my c250 (flash-based) when I actually skip "across the directory border" from the end of one playlist |
| 17:51:24 | pixelma | if I don't let it just play |
| 17:51:24 | | Join davina [0] (n=davina@cpc1-sout6-0-0-cust616.sotn.cable.ntl.com) |
| 17:52:01 | mrkiko | Nico_P: the problem is that I can reproduce it even when repeat is enabled, but with much less frequency |
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| 17:59:07 | XavierGr | ah GSoC applications were extended by one week, I guess I will wait a little bit for my sansa v(unkown) to arrive, in order to not submit 2 applications |
| 17:59:37 | * | domonoky now sees 12 open applications and 5 ineglible ones for rockbox gsoc... and deadline was extended so hurray :-) |
| 18:00 |
| 18:00:52 | | Join thegeek_ [0] (i=thegeek@s220b.studby.ntnu.no) |
| 18:01:04 | dionoea | 5 ineligible out of 17 ?!? |
| 18:01:15 | | Quit davina ("GNU/Linux the free alternative to Windows") |
| 18:01:17 | petur | yes, crap applications |
| 18:01:38 | domonoky | yes, 5 completly irrelevant applicatons, those students must be mad.. :-) |
| 18:01:38 | dionoea | Like "omg i love rockbox and want to contribute" ? |
| 18:01:43 | dionoea | ok :) |
| 18:02:08 | petur | no, like "I want to write a video streaming application on PC and call it rockbox" |
| 18:02:21 | petur | probably in java |
| 18:02:33 | LambdaCalculus37 | petur: Madness! |
| 18:02:49 | domonoky | dionoea: or a rfid fright tracking with mobile phones.. *what rockbox?* :-) |
| 18:03:17 | domonoky | there is even a application, without mention of any project.. :-) |
| 18:03:38 | dionoea | hehe, those sound like fun projects :D |
| 18:04:51 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 18:04:59 | mrkiko | Nico_P: as you probably know then, someone seems to have understood why the bug occurs; |
| 18:05:02 | mrkiko | see comments |
| 18:05:23 | mrkiko | Nico_P: you probably can understand then more than me... |
| 18:06:12 | * | domonoky sees 4 Theme editor applications, (2 Qt, 1 Wx, 1 java) :-) |
| 18:07:00 | LambdaCalculus37 | domonoky: A WPS editor app makes a little more sense. |
| 18:07:03 | Nico_P | mrkiko: which comments are you reffering to? those from Tony DeFusco ? |
| 18:07:26 | domonoky | LambdaCalculus37: they are all WPS and Theme editor proposals.. |
| 18:07:47 | mrkiko | Those from Nick Alcock |
| 18:08:58 | petur | a theme edit plugin would be nice for those who want to tweak certain things while away from pc (colors, ...) which would allow us to remove all theme stuff from the settings menu and replace it with an 'edit theme' entry |
| 18:09:38 | | Join davina [0] (n=davina@cpc1-sout6-0-0-cust616.sotn.cable.ntl.com) |
| 18:10:19 | domonoky | a few of those also speak of a doing both: theme editor plugin, and full WPS/Theme editor on PC... so its going this way ..:-) |
| 18:10:22 | mrkiko | It would be very nice to add the runtime tts functions, but I know it's a very very hard job; |
| 18:10:26 | * | mrkiko thinks he is a little OT |
| 18:10:51 | domonoky | mrkiko: you mean a TTS plugin for rockbox ? |
| 18:11:00 | mrkiko | yes |
| 18:11:06 | domonoky | (this was a failed project last year) .. :-) |
| 18:11:15 | petur | domonoky: both in one summer, that will not be ready in time.... |
| 18:11:25 | mrkiko | It would be nice if rockbox could be read entirely with a true screen-reading system. |
| 18:12:01 | | Quit piga (Remote closed the connection) |
| 18:12:06 | domonoky | petur: depends on how you do it.. if you extract the WPS / Theme core out of rockbox as a lib, you could use it in a plugin and on PC... |
| 18:12:14 | Nico_P | mrkiko: do you use fade on stop/pause? |
| 18:12:21 | Nico_P | pixelma: do you? |
| 18:12:35 | pixelma | no, I don't |
| 18:12:47 | renkho | is this possible: resize the partition of my iriver h320, and leave 7 GB free space, and then use that space for a linux "live" install , for after that that will be abble to boot? i mean if i install a linux bootloader on that partition and mark it as a booteable..? |
| 18:12:48 | domonoky | mrkiko: sure it would be good, go forward and port a TTS :-) |
| 18:13:03 | Nico_P | hmm I guess he meant crossfade and not fadeout... |
| 18:13:04 | pixelma | Nico_P: nor any other fading |
| 18:13:15 | Nico_P | pixelma: I guessed so :) |
| 18:13:19 | Nico_P | same here |
| 18:13:32 | mrkiko | Nico_P: No |
| 18:13:38 | mrkiko | Nico_P: I disabled it |
| 18:13:59 | domonoky | renkho: should be possible, at least rockbox just mounts the first Fat32 partition, so will ignore the linux one.. |
| 18:14:30 | mrkiko | renkho: why should you want to do this? |
| 18:14:44 | mrkiko | renkho: to use the iRiver as an external boot disk for your pc? |
| 18:15:25 | | Quit ukl_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 18:16:17 | renkho | mrkiko: not for my pc |
| 18:16:23 | mrkiko | domonoky: I would do this; I will if I will have some day an idea on how to do it well? |
| 18:16:47 | mrkiko | renkho: and not for the internal player CPU i hope... |
| 18:16:48 | renkho | i usually have a little pendrive usb of 2 GB |
| 18:17:01 | renkho | and i have there a linux live dristro |
| 18:17:23 | renkho | i use that thing for work, i mean go to anywhere and boot the distro with all my tools and stuff |
| 18:17:31 | renkho | but 2 GB are kinda small |
| 18:18:08 | renkho | so i was thinking if i can "migrate" from that old usb of 2GB to my iriver with a partition of at least 7GB =D |
| 18:18:19 | | Quit thegeek (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 18:18:48 | renkho | *i could |
| 18:18:53 | mrkiko | renkho: I can't find any motivation you won't be able to do this. |
| 18:19:33 | renkho | i was thinking about the mbr thing |
| 18:19:47 | domonoky | renkho: just try it, and stay on topic here :-) |
| 18:19:56 | | Join omnisilver_ [0] (n=omnisilv@gre92-6-82-231-206-43.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 18:20:02 | omnisilver_ | hi |
| 18:20:18 | mrkiko | renkho: the on-disk mbr is completely ignored by the iRiver |
| 18:20:38 | mrkiko | and by the OF (original firmware) |
| 18:20:55 | mrkiko | As I know, what is important is what you have on the flash |
| 18:22:16 | | Quit TMM (Client Quit) |
| 18:22:41 | renkho | i see |
| 18:24:02 | omnisilver_ | i have a question : a got a mp3 player who didn't run because the firewire suxx, and i don't succeed to upgrade it. I would install rockobx on it, but it is'nt supported. If i give this unusefull player to the rockbox project, would they adapt rockbox to this one ? It's the Samsung YP-MT6. |
| 18:24:07 | renkho | if i make it work this iriver will convert into my new personal swiss army knife :D |
| 18:24:33 | domonoky | omnisilver_: very unlikly |
| 18:25:23 | mrkiko | renkho: probably it will work. Probably aniway the hard drive will not be happy. |
| 18:25:36 | LambdaCalculus37 | omnisilver_: Ports are started by people who own a particular player, and are itching to get the work started themselves on making a port happen. |
| 18:25:38 | omnisilver_ | domonoky: because the samsung are not supported ? |
| 18:25:39 | markun | omnisilver_: what you could do is find out as much info about the player you can find and hope that someone joins in to start a port |
| 18:25:50 | omnisilver_ | ok |
| 18:26:07 | | Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (n=miepchen@p54BF7C99.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 18:26:10 | markun | omnisilver_: do you know which CPU it uses? |
| 18:26:15 | LambdaCalculus37 | omnisilver_: Start by reading this: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/NewPort |
| 18:26:44 | domonoky | omnisilver_: if you player was supported, there would be no need to port.. but porting is a heavy job, so not much people do it.. (and only for players they own) |
| 18:26:46 | | Quit petur ("work->home") |
| 18:27:03 | omnisilver_ | markun: nop, i don't know (i presume i should open it to know) |
| 18:27:20 | markun | omnisilver_: yes, you could start a page like this one: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SamsungYPT7 |
| 18:27:51 | mrkiko | ehehe... How much high is the knowledge level needed to make a new port? |
| 18:27:52 | mrkiko | :) |
| 18:28:12 | omnisilver_ | i think this knowledge is too high for me ;-) |
| 18:28:34 | mrkiko | omnisilver: ... don't put you down... |
| 18:28:38 | Nico_P | omnisilver_: hi, are you the person who commented on the DLFP news item? |
| 18:28:40 | LambdaCalculus37 | omnisilver_: Here's something else you should do; get a firmware update for your player here: http://erms.samsungusa.com/customer/sea/jsp/faqs/faqs_view.jsp?PG_ID=3&AT_ID=30746&PROD_SUB_ID=46&PROD_ID=46 |
| 18:28:45 | domonoky | mrkiko: level 42 is needed :-) |
| 18:28:49 | omnisilver_ | Nico_P: yes :-) |
| 18:28:56 | LambdaCalculus37 | And see how the update process works. |
| 18:29:00 | markun | omnisilver_: well, a start is to find or take pictures of the insides |
| 18:29:14 | Nico_P | omnisilver_: I wanted to answer your question but couldn't because I'm not registred and didn't have time register |
| 18:29:26 | Nico_P | coming here was the best thing to do ;) |
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| 18:38:11 | omnisilver_ | re (tel) ^^ |
| 18:38:55 | omnisilver_ | Nico_P: yes, i see it ! |
| 18:40:33 | Nico_P | omnisilver_: if you don't feel up to the task of starting a port, your best option is to find a rockboxable player... some are quite cheap |
| 18:40:46 | omnisilver_ | Mmm so i can : 1/ Try to upgrade again the firmware 2/ If it failed again, open my player and take pictures of it, and create a wiki page with them, to help somebody who wants to port rockbox ont this model (i have a few time, i think it would be too long for me) |
| 18:42:15 | omnisilver_ | Nico_P: yes, i think i will should do it, but as i get this unusefull player and i'm maybe not the only one, i would help other people to make it usefull :-) |
| 18:42:51 | | Quit omnisilver_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 18:43:27 | mrkiko | Is it foul to do |
| 18:43:34 | mrkiko | dd if=/dev/sdb of=/dev/null |
| 18:44:16 | dionoea | It's not very usefull (except maybe to test reading errors) |
| 18:44:23 | domonoky | mrkiko: that wont do anything really.. :-) |
| 18:44:40 | LambdaCalculus37 | mrkiko: No, it's more foul to do dd if=/dev/null of=/dev/sdb. |
| 18:45:07 | | Join bertrik [0] (n=Bertrik_@182-015-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) |
| 18:45:14 | mrkiko | domonoky: how can test the physical integrity of a drive |
| 18:45:29 | domonoky | fsck.vfat ? |
| 18:45:45 | mrkiko | That test only the fs structure integrity. |
| 18:46:33 | * | domonoky doesnt know if there is some check util for bad blocks on linux.. ask google ? |
| 18:46:39 | | Quit DerDome (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
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| 18:47:04 | mrkiko | badblocks for example :) |
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| 19:00 |
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| 19:27:39 | mrkiko | I can't find voice files |
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| 19:31:38 | | Quit ol_schoola () |
| 19:31:43 | pixelma | what's a common file extension for speex files - spx? Trying to find something for the iCatcher's codec icons |
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| 19:35:13 | PaulJam | pixelma: i think /apps/filetypes.c lists all the fileextensions that rockbox recognizes. |
| 19:36:45 | pixelma | I see an "spx" there and assume that it's the right one, thanks |
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| 19:39:41 | LambdaCalculus37 | pixelma: Yes, spx is right extension. |
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| 19:43:31 | DerPapst | good afternoon |
| 19:43:34 | DerPapst | :-) |
| 19:45:52 | | Quit piga ("Leaving") |
| 19:46:56 | * | DerPapst is still catching up onthe logs... |
| 19:47:52 | | Quit helseekspresse1 (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 19:48:27 | mrkiko | Can someone explain a little better to me what means "empty skip buffer" setting? |
| 19:48:32 | DerPapst | sagrota (for the logs): the firmware update is easy. twice dd and a fast format of the fat partition. and identifying the ipod is documented here: http://ipodlinux.org/Device_Information |
| 19:48:44 | DerPapst | :-) |
| 19:50:11 | PaulJam | mrkiko: did you mean "anti skip buffer"? |
| 19:51:48 | PaulJam | mrkiko: i think this setting determines how early rockbox begins to rebuffer when the buffer becomes empty |
| 19:52:10 | | Quit A-4 () |
| 19:53:03 | mrkiko | mhm... |
| 19:53:09 | mrkiko | thank you for your reply |
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| 19:58:27 | | Join Buschel [0] (n=abc@p54A3E59F.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:58:50 | Buschel | hi folks |
| 19:59:22 | LambdaCalculus37 | Hi Buschel! |
| 19:59:34 | mrkiko | Hi Buschel! |
| 19:59:53 | Buschel | question: do we know where the CPU load goes while playback (except decoding of course)? |
| 20:00 |
| 20:00:37 | mrkiko | probably this is a target specific question, right? |
| 20:00:42 | Buschel | it seems like ~4MHz are used in addition to the codec itself, ~1MHz of it is the dsp-stuff (withput any EQ-stuff) |
| 20:00:53 | Buschel | ah yes, talking about PP502x |
| 20:01:24 | | Join Horscht [0] (n=Horscht@xbmc/user/horscht) |
| 20:01:56 | Buschel | i did the following: test_codec with mpc -> needs about 24MHz from the calculations |
| 20:02:21 | Buschel | then playing back the same file and wait until all is buffered. |
| 20:02:49 | Buschel | go into the debug menu and check the boost ratio, calculate the average needed clock from it |
| 20:02:51 | mrkiko | Buschel: with ape? How is the situation? |
| 20:03:08 | Buschel | i did only test for mpc and mp3 |
| 20:03:24 | Buschel | same situation (but mp3 needs more cpu for the codec) |
| 20:04:25 | Buschel | e.g. pure decoding mpc (~24MHz), mp3 (~37MHz), playback mpc (~28MHz), mp3 (~41MHz) |
| 20:04:54 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 20:05:09 | Buschel | this is when letting the debug menu update each 10s to avoid CPIU load through LCD updates |
| 20:05:17 | Buschel | *CPU |
| 20:05:38 | | Join tessarakt [0] (n=jens@e180065155.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 20:05:54 | Buschel | so: where do the residual ~3Mhz go? I2S/DMA? |
| 20:06:37 | mrkiko | Another "interesting" question: how much speech require the cpu to work? |
| 20:06:51 | Buschel | ? |
| 20:07:01 | domonoky | maybe general os jobs.. but it seems a bit strange to measure this in mhz.. :-) |
| 20:07:12 | | Quit linuxstb (Nick collision from services.) |
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| 20:07:51 | mrkiko | speech -> roockbox voice subsystem |
| 20:07:51 | Buschel | domonoky: os jobs are also done when performing test_codec |
| 20:08:18 | | Join oofus [0] (n=chris@oofus.demon.co.uk) |
| 20:08:28 | domonoky | ah, so you are comparing decoding vs playback ? |
| 20:08:34 | Buschel | yep |
| 20:08:44 | mrkiko | Is here accounted even device drivers work and interrupts? |
| 20:09:22 | Buschel | it should be taken into account as the overall clock is estimated |
| 20:09:42 | domonoky | the the 3Mhz are surely used by the "playing" of the sound, so playback managment and transport of audio data (i2s etc) |
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| 20:10:11 | Buschel | domonoky: that's my understanding. |
| 20:10:38 | mrkiko | Buschel: aniway some time ago here was a discussion regarding the complexity of playback.c |
| 20:10:59 | domonoky | maybe also WPS ? does running the testcodec show a WPS ? |
| 20:11:44 | Buschel | domonoky: no, only the debug menu for the audio thread (update each 10s) |
| 20:12:20 | Buschel | WPS is another 4-5MHz on 5G iPod |
| 20:12:37 | domonoky | does the testcodec use the normal buffering ? |
| 20:13:28 | Buschel | i hoped to reduce the "residual" playback-load via the dsp-optimization, but when I began to work on it I saw that dsp only needs ~1Mhz of the 4MHz |
| 20:14:28 | Buschel | domonoky: no. but in my measurements on playback the buffering was finished |
| 20:15:32 | Buschel | so, in fact: nobody did any profilings yet :( |
| 20:15:42 | domonoky | so it would be interesting to know how much the audio transport costs, ie a measurement without i2s |
| 20:15:52 | | Quit PaulJam (".") |
| 20:16:46 | domonoky | a long time ago, someone made some attempts to profile rockbox, there is even code for this in svn, but i dont know if this still works |
| 20:17:12 | | Join jasonisback [0] (n=5c020c01@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-d429cd1412e6cc22) |
| 20:17:58 | jasonisback | Rockbox on the iPod Touch would be cool |
| 20:18:02 | | Join petur [50] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) |
| 20:18:18 | scorche|sh | jasonisback: feel free... |
| 20:18:28 | mrkiko | :) |
| 20:18:49 | jasonisback | i would if i knew how to programme...... |
| 20:19:10 | scorche|sh | then learn! |
| 20:19:41 | * | Buschel away to watch the last episode of supernatural. will be back |
| 20:19:44 | jasonisback | lol if i had the time i would! |
| 20:20:01 | * | bluebrother wonders what happened to gevaerts' beer offer |
| 20:20:03 | jasonisback | i can program how to draw a circle (though this was back on an old Amstrad back in 1985) |
| 20:20:16 | Chaotic | when I skip songs (or pause) on my ipod photo, it takes up to 5 seconds to respond. Is there something I need to do differently to make it respond as fast as the Apple firmware? |
| 20:20:40 | bluebrother | Chaotic: what file types? Also, is it buffering the same time? |
| 20:20:44 | scorche|sh | bluebrother: well, no date yet so.... |
| 20:21:12 | bluebrother | scorche|sh: I thought so. But I too would like to have a date ... |
| 20:21:16 | scorche|sh | jasonisback: oh...well, you are in luck!...rockbox is just a series of tiny circles! |
| 20:21:21 | jasonisback | heehee |
| 20:21:23 | jasonisback | yea right |
| 20:21:31 | Chaotic | bluebrother: MP3 files, usually 3-5 minute songs, playing on random or sequential from the database (not filesystem) |
| 20:21:50 | scorche|sh | bluebrother: location would be nice too |
| 20:21:58 | jasonisback | I may start by writing a WPS first |
| 20:21:59 | bluebrother | scorche|sh: indeed. |
| 20:22:14 | pixelma | bluebrother: I believe that the best way to achieve this would be if someone plays dictatot |
| 20:22:18 | pixelma | *dictator |
| 20:22:18 | scorche|sh | perhaps i can apply a cattle prod to the situation when i get home |
| 20:22:24 | scorche|sh | pixelma: yeah... |
| 20:22:39 | scorche|sh | things just wont happen if left out in the open |
| 20:22:57 | jasonisback | though I wonder why the iPod Rockbox has 'recording' when it does nothing of the sort |
| 20:23:17 | scorche|sh | jasonisback: some ipods can...including yours |
| 20:23:31 | bluebrother | well, what's still open for locations for DevConEuro? Stockholm and Berlin? |
| 20:23:35 | jasonisback | how do you know which iPod i have? |
| 20:23:44 | jasonisback | and i do not have a Touch |
| 20:23:48 | scorche|sh | bluebrother: seems like it |
| 20:23:50 | jasonisback | i have a 60GB Video |
| 20:24:04 | scorche|sh | jasonisback: i dont, but if you have that option, then your ipod can record |
| 20:24:10 | jasonisback | ok |
| 20:24:19 | bluebrother | maybe our possible hosts should propose a date. And fight for the location ;) |
| 20:24:24 | Chaotic | anyone else get the slowness when skipping tracks? |
| 20:24:25 | jasonisback | I wonder if mikeholden and midknight2k3 still work on here |
| 20:24:39 | | Quit linuxstb (Remote closed the connection) |
| 20:24:48 | bluebrother | Chaotic: skipping can be slow if the player is buffering / needs to rebuffer at the same time. |
| 20:24:53 | mrkiko | Tomorrow I will bring rockbox with me in spain :) |
| 20:25:09 | bluebrother | but this is nothing that usually will happen upon every song |
| 20:25:16 | * | domonoky votes for Berlin :-) |
| 20:25:25 | | Join linuxstb [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
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| 20:25:29 | Chaotic | how can I tell if it needs to buffer? Why does it not buffer the next song as it's playing? It tells me the name of the next track |
| 20:25:31 | * | bluebrother would prefer Berlin too due to distance :D |
| 20:25:41 | jasonisback | id love to have the wheel clicker in rockbox |
| 20:25:54 | bluebrother | but going to Stockholm would be nice too. Otoh we could do that next year ;) |
| 20:26:06 | bluebrother | jasonisback: there is a keyclick option |
| 20:26:12 | jasonisback | ok where is it? |
| 20:26:16 | bluebrother | but iirc that was buggy on Ipods. |
| 20:26:20 | Horscht | Chaotic, it buffers a certain amount of tracks |
| 20:26:24 | bluebrother | somewhere in the settings menu :D |
| 20:26:30 | mrkiko | Implementing things as ciclers is very hard |
| 20:26:35 | scorche|sh | i think it should be more a matter of who cant make it if it is at x location than what people prefer |
| 20:26:39 | Horscht | when that buffer runs out, it has to rebuffer. |
| 20:26:45 | Chaotic | this happens on the very first track |
| 20:26:50 | Chaotic | and all tracks |
| 20:26:54 | | Quit miepchen^schlaf_ () |
| 20:26:57 | Chaotic | it's like it doesn't buffer at all |
| 20:27:19 | scorche|sh | i would much rather have more people unhappy with the location than less people attending |
| 20:27:23 | bluebrother | scorche|sh: I agree. We should figure who can make it |
| 20:27:25 | Chaotic | when it goes by itself to the next track (i.e. playing a song through to the end), it has no delay |
| 20:27:37 | domonoky | Chaotic: is your rockbox build uptodate ? if not update first :-) |
| 20:27:48 | mrkiko | Chaotic: I spoke with Nico_p about this problem first |
| 20:27:56 | scorche|sh | bluebrother: i will send a mail off to the dev list when i get home if no one gets to it first |
| 20:28:02 | Chaotic | but when I choose to skip the track, the display shows the new track, but it keeps playing the old track for up to 5 seconds |
| 20:28:06 | Horscht | Chaotic, what target are you using? |
| 20:28:15 | Chaotic | My build is less than 2 weeks old |
| 20:28:26 | Horscht | ah |
| 20:28:30 | bluebrother | Chaotic: that's outdated in our terms |
| 20:28:33 | jasonisback | oh yea the click is there but it playes the sound through the headphones, not through the iPod |
| 20:28:34 | domonoky | Chaotic: thats old in rockbox time, please update |
| 20:28:49 | mrkiko | Chaotic: try to see if the problem is this, http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8513 |
| 20:29:01 | Chaotic | how often do I have to update it? I thought it said "no major problems" on the build |
| 20:29:31 | | Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection) |
| 20:29:37 | bluebrother | you don't need to update regularly. But if you experience problems please update. |
| 20:29:42 | domonoky | Chaotic: you dont have to update often, but if you find a bug or something strange, first check the newest build |
| 20:30:00 | Chaotic | no, that's not the same issue, though it does that on rare occasions |
| 20:30:05 | | Join spiorf [0] (n=spiorf@host140-214-dynamic.20-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 20:30:06 | Horscht | to check wether or not it has been fixed already |
| 20:30:06 | bluebrother | and "no major problems" means mostly that it's working, not that it's optimal working |
| 20:30:19 | Chaotic | but this was happening the day I downloaded it. |
| 20:30:37 | Horscht | it could be fixed by now |
| 20:30:46 | Chaotic | :( |
| 20:30:53 | | Quit jasonisback ("CGI:IRC") |
| 20:31:16 | Chaotic | ok. I'll redo everything. If it's still having the same problem, what would be the best course of action? |
| 20:31:43 | Horscht | i'd say report it on the flyspray tracker |
| 20:31:59 | Horscht | but better wait what a dev has to say :) |
| 20:32:04 | markun | Chaotic: trying older builds so we can find out which commit introduced the problem |
| 20:32:33 | Chaotic | oh, one more thing that I did - I told it to load the database into RAM. It seemed like the appropriate thing to do for battery use, but was that a possible cause? |
| 20:33:30 | | Join n1s [0] (n=nils@nl104-208-191.student.uu.se) |
| 20:34:31 | Chaotic | I have approximately 2800 songs on an iPod Color (photo) |
| 20:35:51 | | Quit bertrik ("off to play") |
| 20:36:42 | Horscht | iiuc, "load to ram" is only usefull if you browse the library often, i.e. often go to the library view |
| 20:38:16 | * | bluebrother notices that flights from berlin seem to be more expensive than from frankfurt |
| 20:38:41 | | Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection) |
| 20:38:41 | Horscht | sounds weird, Frankfurt is a bigger airport |
| 20:38:51 | Horscht | is it realy Frankfurt am Main? |
| 20:38:53 | mrkiko | bluebrother: I wouldn't say it, but for things not regarding rockbox you should use rockbox-community. |
| 20:39:04 | bluebrother | I was looking for LH flights to Stockholm :) |
| 20:39:17 | bluebrother | mrkiko: this is Rockbox related. Devcon related to be exact |
| 20:39:43 | Horscht | devcon is in stockholm? |
| 20:40:00 | domonoky | location is still not fixed, |
| 20:40:02 | bluebrother | no ... stockholm is a possible location |
| 20:40:19 | | Join gregzx [0] (n=chatzill@drg244.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 20:40:20 | bluebrother | but it seems that only berlin and stockholm are left. |
| 20:40:24 | mrkiko | Sorry for my ignorance - what is exactly devcon? |
| 20:40:30 | mrkiko | a player maker? |
| 20:40:37 | bluebrother | Developer Conference. See DevCon2008 in the wiki |
| 20:41:05 | Chaotic | thanks all, I'll load the newest build, turn off RAM flashing, and will file a bug if needed. |
| 20:41:30 | | Quit Chaotic ("CGI:IRC") |
| 20:41:57 | | Join spiorf [0] (n=spiorf@host140-214-dynamic.20-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
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| 20:42:39 | fml | bluebrother: ping |
| 20:42:59 | bluebrother | fml: pong |
| 20:43:30 | fml | bluebrother: could you please try to build the manual chapter from http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8829 ? |
| 20:43:45 | bluebrother | sure ... give me some minutes |
| 20:45:54 | Horscht | ok, does rockbox support dynamic/inteligent playlists? |
| 20:45:58 | | Quit UncleRemus ("leaving") |
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| 20:46:10 | bluebrother | gigabeat also uses OF usb mode, right? |
| 20:46:51 | | Join tvelocity_ [0] (n=tony@athedsl-02068.home.otenet.gr) |
| 20:47:04 | linuxstb | bluebrother: Which gigabeat? |
| 20:47:38 | linuxstb | The F/X has a hardware USB bridge, which is supported in Rockbox. |
| 20:47:49 | bluebrother | F60 −− see FS #8831 |
| 20:47:58 | bluebrother | ok, in that case this definitely isn't a bug |
| 20:48:07 | linuxstb | Rockbox can't even dual-boot on the F/X |
| 20:48:09 | | Quit stripwax ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 20:48:11 | bluebrother | fml: shortcuts plugin is a viewer, right? |
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| 20:49:00 | | Quit fml ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
| 20:49:10 | bluebrother | dang, he left. |
| 20:49:24 | Horscht | he'll be back |
| 20:50:56 | scorche|sh | they always come back! |
| 20:51:01 | Horscht | anyways, I can't seem to find info on the wiki on dynamic playlist |
| 20:51:25 | | Join fml [0] (n=4fd3da9d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-e914d692d156f91d) |
| 20:51:46 | bluebrother | Rockbox always uses a dynamic playlist. Not sure if you're referring to something different with that term ... |
| 20:52:16 | fml | bluebrother: shortcuts has two parts: appender and the "viewer". "Viewer" is what is executed when a link file is played. |
| 20:52:22 | Horscht | playlists, that for example define "play all songs from 1969" |
| 20:52:50 | Horscht | based on the tagcache, of course |
| 20:52:52 | bluebrother | you forgot to add it to the plugins chapter. I was wondering where I should put it. Added it to the viewers section for now. |
| 20:53:08 | bluebrother | Horscht: you can't do that with playlists but with a custom search in tagcache |
| 20:53:40 | fml | bluebrother: have you seen the second patch? |
| 20:53:42 | Horscht | ok, so the answer is no :), thanks |
| 20:53:53 | bluebrother | fml: btw, you didn't use typographic quotes. I simply added them |
| 20:54:06 | bluebrother | fml: no :( |
| 20:54:30 | fml | bluebrother: then you should look at it :-) |
| 20:54:39 | | Join kraizee [0] (n=irc_by@turbo.sml.by) |
| 20:55:04 | | Join ali_as [0] (n=as@ambix.plus.com) |
| 20:55:16 | | Quit phinze_ () |
| 20:56:05 | | Quit krz (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 20:59:45 | | Join pondlife [50] (n=Steve@rockbox/developer/pondlife) |
| 20:59:51 | | Quit mf0102 ("Verlassend") |
| 21:00 |
| 21:00:05 | bluebrother | fml: looks fine. Will check if it builds fine for all manuals now and commit if it does. |
| 21:00:15 | pondlife | Hi all, anyone know which key is meant to stop playback on a Sansa C200? |
| 21:00:27 | pondlife | The keymap seems rather wacky |
| 21:00:36 | | Join argumentD [0] (n=argument@ip8061f45f.host.ucla.edu) |
| 21:00:39 | pixelma | long play |
| 21:00:52 | pixelma | pondlife: maybe it's in the manual ;) |
| 21:00:52 | pondlife | Aha |
| 21:01:03 | pondlife | True, but I wanted to bitch a little too :) |
| 21:01:25 | pixelma | and there's also FS #8824 for discussion ;) |
| 21:01:55 | pondlife | Does that make long select access the context menu, perhaps? |
| 21:02:04 | pixelma | no |
| 21:02:07 | * | pondlife goes to look |
| 21:02:12 | pondlife | Pity |
| 21:02:58 | pondlife | Having used the H300 and Gigabeat (and not the Sansa OF), the mapping seems very odd |
| 21:03:03 | pixelma | the WPS was the one thing that did not annoy me too much yet though, so I didn't change anything there. I believe Llorean has some plans |
| 21:03:38 | | Quit tvelocity (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 21:03:40 | pondlife | I'd hope we can have standard keys for PLAY, SELECT, MENU and STOP |
| 21:04:09 | pondlife | I did expect the power button to be STOP |
| 21:04:25 | | Join MethoS- [0] (n=clemens@host-091-096-212-056.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 21:04:33 | pondlife | It seems to be SELECT |
| 21:04:45 | pondlife | Ah, no.. MENU |
| 21:05:47 | | Join phinze_ [0] (n=phinze@pcp027324pcs.jesres.mu.edu) |
| 21:05:51 | fml | bluebrother: ok |
| 21:06:02 | | Quit perrikwp ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") |
| 21:06:39 | bluebrother | XavierGr: seen Daniel's mail? SoC applicaton period has been extended |
| 21:06:42 | | Join xander1 [0] (n=nomen@cc245288-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl) |
| 21:06:49 | | Join kakazza [0] (n=kakazza@unaffiliated/kakazza) |
| 21:07:36 | pixelma | pondlife: unfortunately it seems quite hard to find a proper keymap for a target that has 9 buttons while I find the keymap on the Ondio which has much less possibilities feels intuituve to me... |
| 21:08:20 | kakazza | Hi, I got a problem with rockbox. I am using a 2nd gen iPod Mini with Cabbie 2.0 unifont skin. Now japanese filenames work like a charm with the scrobbler.log, but umlauts like äöü don't work at all. |
| 21:08:28 | bluebrother | fml: ... and committed. |
| 21:08:30 | pondlife | I suspect the main problem is the little label marked "menu" under the power button. Ignore that and it becomes easier |
| 21:08:33 | | Join perrikwp [0] (i=98213942@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-c31e3b51909bb26c) |
| 21:09:09 | kakazza | F�r immer Dein Feind |
| 21:09:11 | kakazza | ^−−- |
| 21:09:14 | fml | bluebrother: do you have such a powerfull PC? There are many manuals to build! |
| 21:09:51 | bluebrother | haven't watched the time, but I think it was something less than 10 minutes. |
| 21:10:11 | fml | he-he, powerfull = full of power :-) |
| 21:10:21 | bluebrother | I'm building natively on linux, no idea how fast cygwin is (I guess it's slower). My machine is like 4 years old *g* |
| 21:10:44 | | Join xander2 [0] (n=nomen@cc245288-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl) |
| 21:11:25 | | Part pixelma |
| 21:11:34 | | Quit phinze_ () |
| 21:15:21 | | Part pondlife |
| 21:15:49 | fml | bluebrother: will there be a tracker cleaning week/month/...? |
| 21:16:57 | * | bluebrother accuses jhMikeS of top-posting :) |
| 21:17:31 | bluebrother | fml: maybe. I think it's about time to have one, but I haven't gotten around discussing it a bit more and announcing one (and nobody else did) |
| 21:17:50 | bluebrother | wouldn't mind if someone else started one. |
| 21:18:41 | bluebrother | domonoky: btw, is the voice clipping bug in rbutil now fixed? Or have you identified it? |
| 21:18:50 | | Join Zagor [242] (n=bjst@rockbox/developer/Zagor) |
| 21:19:14 | domonoky | i have now i talkfile which also clips for me, also in the sim, but i didnt found the bug.. |
| 21:19:39 | domonoky | the clipping talkfile: http://www.retrospektiwe.de/The%20Last%20Supper.mp3.talk |
| 21:19:59 | domonoky | it decodes fine with rbspeexdec, so i dont know whats wrong.. |
| 21:20:19 | * | linuxstb tries to advertise the Rockbox-as-Application SoC project to any students reading this... |
| 21:20:20 | domonoky | its not "clipped" its cut off, to be correct.. |
| 21:20:49 | | Quit perrikwp (Remote closed the connection) |
| 21:21:23 | | Quit MethoS-- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 21:22:01 | * | jhMikeS wonders where he's been top posting (unless stupid OE is botching something up) |
| 21:22:23 | kakazza | Can anyone help me with my unicode/umlaut problem? |
| 21:22:59 | Horscht | üöä |
| 21:23:10 | kakazza | Almost |
| 21:23:13 | jhMikeS | the dev ml posts look okay to /me |
| 21:23:26 | | Quit xanderw (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 21:23:49 | bluebrother | jhMikeS: http://www.rockbox.org/mail/archive/rockbox-dev-archive-2008-03/0073.shtml |
| 21:24:14 | * | bluebrother shudders when thinking of OE |
| 21:24:27 | jhMikeS | bluebrother: I'm looking at the page now - it look very much bottom-posted there |
| 21:25:39 | bluebrother | unless I'm mixing something up your latest response is at the top |
| 21:25:46 | kakazza | Hi, I got a problem with rockbox. I am using a 2nd gen iPod Mini with Cabbie 2.0 unifont skin. Now japanese filenames work like a charm with the scrobbler.log, but umlauts like äöü don't work at all. |
| 21:25:57 | kakazza | :x |
| 21:25:59 | fml | Ladies and Gentlemen, may I announce that the tacker cleaning week has just begun? |
| 21:26:00 | LambdaCalculus37 | kakazza: Yes, you said that already. |
| 21:26:24 | fml | bluebrother: you said you wouldn't mind ;-) |
| 21:26:30 | jhMikeS | bluebrother: never mind...I hardly know what anyone calls anything anyway :p guess I know now. :) |
| 21:26:31 | | Quit xander1 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 21:27:10 | bluebrother | jhMikeS: may I politely ask you to trim quoted text to the required minimum next time? ;-) |
| 21:27:33 | bluebrother | fml: sure, if noone objects. You might want to go and announce it on the lists as well |
| 21:28:06 | bluebrother | but maybe it would be a good idea to announce it a bit before it actually starts and ping Bagder so he can put it to the front page (in case that is wanted)? |
| 21:28:49 | jhMikeS | ok. by now it must be obvious I don't ever do much with mail lists and such (I have a single purpose - to code :) |
| 21:29:37 | bluebrother | hehe. It's not that I bother too much about that mail, it just looks weird if we ask users to not top-post and do it ourselves. |
| 21:30:08 | | Quit fml ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 21:30:33 | jhMikeS | true, I pay little attention to the internet culture and online activity in general. It must look weirder when a developer is getting a spanking for it. |
| 21:33:56 | kakazza | Question tho, where should I put the music files in rockbox. Just in the X:/ directory or in a special folder? |
| 21:34:31 | linuxstb | Wherever you wish. |
| 21:35:04 | | Join shotofadds [0] (n=rob@rockbox/developer/shotofadds) |
| 21:35:09 | linuxstb | Personallly, I create a "Music" directory and put everything inside there |
| 21:35:14 | | Quit shotofadds (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 21:35:35 | | Join shotofadds [0] (n=rob@rockbox/developer/shotofadds) |
| 21:35:37 | | Quit shotofadds (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 21:35:46 | kakazza | So you use drag&drop instead of a music management program? |
| 21:36:03 | BigBambi | kakazza: Yes, yes, a million times yes |
| 21:36:05 | Horscht | yes |
| 21:36:24 | Horscht | tbh, that is the only reason I use rockbox :) |
| 21:39:11 | * | DerPapst notices linuxstb has removed the top navigation bar scorche and him made ;-) |
| 21:39:16 | * | gevaerts looks sideways at Horscht |
| 21:39:19 | DerPapst | from the theme site that is. |
| 21:39:27 | * | jhMikeS is grateful he learned something today and has gtg for a bit :) |
| 21:39:30 | scorche|sh | DerPapst: eh...he started off fresh |
| 21:39:42 | scorche|sh | i told you it was probably going to get redone ;) |
| 21:39:55 | | Join bertrik [0] (n=Bertrik_@182-015-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) |
| 21:40:09 | DerPapst | was fun though ;-) |
| 21:40:11 | * | Horscht mounts gevaerts sideways to -community |
| 21:40:13 | scorche|sh | :) |
| 21:41:05 | | Join shotofadds [0] (n=rob@rockbox/developer/shotofadds) |
| 21:41:25 | | Join perrikwp [0] (i=98213942@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-97e5eb97fd99ca37) |
| 21:42:39 | | Quit shotofadds (Client Quit) |
| 21:44:13 | | Join shotofadds [0] (n=rob@rockbox/developer/shotofadds) |
| 21:44:20 | | Join waldo [0] (n=waldo@ip-81-11-220-223.dsl.scarlet.be) |
| 21:49:11 | amiconn | DerPapst: Are you around? |
| 21:53:32 | | Join ommegang [0] (n=brian@pool-72-93-35-42.bstnma.east.verizon.net) |
| 21:53:51 | | Join ompaul [0] (n=ompaul@gnewsense/friend/ompaul) |
| 21:55:59 | ommegang | whats up with rockbox and the problems with the database updating |
| 21:56:05 | | Quit Buschel () |
| 21:56:13 | | Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("CGI:IRC 0.5.9 (2006/06/06)") |
| 21:56:17 | n1s | ommegang: please be more specific |
| 21:57:03 | ommegang | it takes me like 10 minutes of messing with the database configuration to get it to work |
| 21:57:19 | ommegang | i am sure, i am not the only one with this problem as its been like this since the early rel's |
| 21:57:44 | linuxstb | There's only about 3 options - what do you do for 10 minutes? |
| 21:58:21 | ommegang | each option repeated alot :) |
| 21:59:37 | kakazza | What files do I need to delete to wipe the database? |
| 22:00 |
| 22:00:06 | scorche|sh | ommegang: you are being awfully vague |
| 22:00:13 | scorche|sh | kakazza: all the *.tcd files |
| 22:00:19 | n1s | kakazza: anything *.tcd in .rockbox |
| 22:00:27 | kakazza | Thanks |
| 22:00:50 | ommegang | hmm let me try and delete those files maybe it will update. |
| 22:01:00 | ommegang | also how do i play gameboy roms? |
| 22:01:10 | scorche|sh | ommegang: that is discussed in the manual |
| 22:01:18 | | Join phinze [0] (n=phinze@pcp027324pcs.jesres.mu.edu) |
| 22:01:18 | DerPapst | amiconn: yupp |
| 22:01:42 | amiconn | Do you have one of your 3rd Gens handy? |
| 22:01:48 | kakazza | Hmm, rockbox still hates Umlauts :/ |
| 22:02:04 | scorche|sh | are you using a unicode font? |
| 22:02:31 | * | amiconn found out how to improve display quality on the greyscale ipods |
| 22:02:40 | markun | amiconn: how? |
| 22:02:42 | DerPapst | nice amiconn :-) |
| 22:02:59 | DerPapst | kakazza: umlaust such as öäüß work fine for me |
| 22:03:04 | bluebrother | kakazza: are your files tagged using the correct codepage? |
| 22:03:10 | kakazza | They should be, yes. |
| 22:03:15 | kakazza | I used foobar2000 |
| 22:03:27 | kakazza | Supposed to be ID3v2.4 |
| 22:03:34 | bluebrother | and Rockbox is set to use the same codepage as your tags do? |
| 22:03:38 | markun | kakazza: what do you see instead of umlauts? |
| 22:03:51 | amiconn | I'm fiddling with the LCD controller. Mainly, I chose the proper drive bias for the given duty cycle. Then I had to adjust some other parameters |
| 22:03:55 | kakazza | I am using a special WPS tho, cabbie 2.0, unifont. Which made Japanese files work, but made Umlauts not work. |
| 22:04:10 | kakazza | markun - I see a [?] |
| 22:04:17 | amiconn | Looks like we can do away with all that special casing... |
| 22:04:38 | markun | kakazza: this should give you some clues: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/UnicodeGuide |
| 22:04:58 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 22:05:31 | markun | kakazza: which codepage are the tags in? |
| 22:05:34 | amiconn | Hmm, looks like that needs a bit more fiddling. |
| 22:06:04 | markun | amiconn: does it give a better contrast? |
| 22:06:18 | DerPapst | amiconn: let me know if you have a patch cooked upfor some testing :-) |
| 22:06:55 | kakazza | markun, what program can I use to check? |
| 22:07:17 | markun | I don't know. Doesn't foobar give you a choice? |
| 22:07:48 | ommegang | scorche|sh mind guiding me to where it explains emulation> |
| 22:07:54 | kakazza | Nope, but should be unicode |
| 22:08:30 | scorche|sh | ommegang: it explains what a viewer is and how to use them |
| 22:09:52 | markun | kakazza: did you see my PM? |
| 22:10:59 | ommegang | ok, i see that. |
| 22:11:03 | ommegang | does it play nes also |
| 22:13:09 | kakazza | markun, I think I fixed it now, checking with scrobbler.log now |
| 22:13:31 | markun | scorche|sh: we don't have any fonts which display japanese but not latin1... |
| 22:13:38 | markun | scorche|sh: oops :) |
| 22:14:00 | markun | forgot to scoll back down and thought you had just said something :) |
| 22:14:08 | | Join crzyboyster [0] (n=6210f0bf@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-436f761e02a0e77a) |
| 22:14:20 | markun | kakazza: what did you change? |
| 22:14:31 | kakazza | I resaved the tags with mp3tag instead of foobar2000 |
| 22:14:35 | kakazza | Gotta try now |
| 22:15:08 | crzyboyster | I just read this page > http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=15709 and was wondering why these app ports aren't being developed more? From what I could understand, the port itself is pretty far ahead. |
| 22:15:11 | markun | foobar2000 didn't save the tags as APEv2 tags, did it? |
| 22:15:24 | kakazza | Nope |
| 22:15:29 | | Part ommegang |
| 22:15:51 | crzyboyster | And what exactly is the "coupons code" thing on the left hand side of the main rockbox page? |
| 22:16:24 | kakazza | yay, works now~ |
| 22:16:31 | markun | kakazza: so, what did you change? |
| 22:16:37 | markun | ah, my memory :) |
| 22:16:42 | Bagder | crzyboyster: paid ad |
| 22:16:42 | markun | ignore me |
| 22:16:45 | BigBambi | crzyboyster: You need to ask the people working on the Motorola port (who seemed to turn up once and not be too interested in contributing back) |
| 22:17:16 | crzyboyster | I once went to the forum page of that port (on another forum, I mean). Let me see if I can dig it up again... |
| 22:18:02 | crzyboyster | And I am going to start compiling together all of the cabbiev2unifont versions today. |
| 22:19:02 | crzyboyster | And it would be great if a wps file (say cabbiev2_unifont) could link up with a wps images folder called say, cabbiev2 so that the only thing we would need to offer for downloading is the wps file in a zip. |
| 22:19:10 | crzyboyster | Feature request? |
| 22:20:51 | | Quit crzyboyster ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 22:22:22 | BigBambi | Anyone else agree I can reject this as not going to happen? http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8772 |
| 22:22:49 | BigBambi | He wants playing an album through the database to ignore the global shuffle setting |
| 22:23:01 | BigBambi | (if an additional setting is enabled) |
| 22:23:29 | * | DerPapst converts FS #8772 into a gsoc app |
| 22:24:55 | phinze | DerPapst: what's your timeline look like? ;) |
| 22:24:55 | | Join pixelma [50] (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) |
| 22:25:06 | bluebrother | BigBambi: I think the quick menu can do the same |
| 22:25:16 | Horscht | basicaly, he wants an "shuffle album" shuffle option |
| 22:25:23 | BigBambi | bluebrother: I just don't see us ever doing it |
| 22:25:27 | Horscht | *album shuffle |
| 22:25:33 | BigBambi | And as you say the quick menu is pretty quick |
| 22:25:55 | bluebrother | yep −− using the quick menu isn't really more complicated |
| 22:25:56 | kugel | BigBambi: I'd reject it too |
| 22:26:05 | BigBambi | Horscht: Well he really wants an additional option to disable shuffle when playing albums |
| 22:26:19 | gevaerts | phinze: obvious. Debate about it for 11 weeks and then implement a bad compromise in the last week :) |
| 22:26:34 | Horscht | no, he wants rockbox to shuffle his albums, BigBambi |
| 22:26:35 | Horscht | as in |
| 22:26:50 | BigBambi | Horscht: No, he doesn't |
| 22:26:53 | Horscht | pick randum album #1, play it in order, then pick album #2 |
| 22:27:16 | bluebrother | Horscht, BigBambi: if the request is that unclear that we need to discuss it this much it's worth closing ;-) |
| 22:27:21 | phinze | Horscht: you're right. he doesn't state it very well, but that's what he's asking for |
| 22:27:27 | BigBambi | Horscht: He wants shuffle on if he selects any other item except for album in the database, in which case he does not want to shuffle |
| 22:27:41 | BigBambi | Read his comment, he clarifies it |
| 22:27:50 | Horscht | he is definately refering to apple firmware |
| 22:27:58 | kugel | For it doesn't really matter. I'd reject both :) |
| 22:28:05 | kugel | s/it/me |
| 22:28:07 | Horscht | apple firmware does what I described. |
| 22:28:12 | bluebrother | if he sorts his music in an artist / album fashion he can randomly shuffle albums using the random folder feature |
| 22:28:13 | | Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (n=miepchen@p54BF7C99.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:28:18 | markun | Horscht: but nothing about selecting a random album |
| 22:28:33 | BigBambi | Horscht: MarkGuey describes what you just said in his comment, and the gyt said that wan't what he meant |
| 22:28:41 | bluebrother | who cares about AppleOS anyway? |
| 22:28:52 | markun | Apple? |
| 22:29:02 | BigBambi | Anyway, it is shut now |
| 22:30:59 | BigBambi | Setting a limit for max volume has been discussed and rejected before now as well I think hasn't it? |
| 22:31:17 | BigBambi | With the compromise that you can use eg precut to limit max volume |
| 22:32:06 | phinze | bluebrother: where would the random folder feature be found? |
| 22:32:55 | phinze | i know when browsing the db you get <Random> when you're sitting inside a folder... is that what you're referring to? |
| 22:33:47 | | Quit DerPapst (Nick collision from services.) |
| 22:33:51 | | Join DerPapst [0] (n=DerPapst@p5B23D843.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:34:58 | BigBambi | phinze: Run the random _folder_advance_config plugin to set it up |
| 22:35:43 | BigBambi | and then set auto-change diectory to random |
| 22:35:56 | BigBambi | (this is in the file browser playback, not database) |
| 22:36:01 | | Join bughunter2 [0] (n=Administ@ip565fbeaa.direct-adsl.nl) |
| 22:36:47 | phinze | BigBambi: thanks, looks cool |
| 22:37:49 | | Join ol_schoola [0] (n=meatwad@c-67-167-20-91.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 22:39:07 | | Join kugel_ [0] (i=kugel@e178121005.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 22:39:18 | | Quit kugel (Nick collision from services.) |
| 22:39:19 | | Nick kugel_ is now known as kugel (i=kugel@e178121005.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 22:39:28 | | Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 22:40:23 | kugel | Probably not ontopic, but I was just reading the post about the rockbox sim on motorola mobile phones (http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=14165.0), and I wonder why the post count of the topic starter is still at 1. Is that a bug in the forum? |
| 22:41:38 | scorche|sh | posts in the unsupported builds forum are not counted |
| 22:41:39 | BigBambi | kugel: Post count does not incremement for posts in the unsupported builds forum |
| 22:41:51 | kugel | ah ok, I didn't know that |
| 22:42:05 | | Join MethoS-- [0] (n=clemens@dyndsl-085-016-162-108.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 22:43:56 | domonoky | bringing this motorola port/fork back into svn would be a nice gsoc project ! :-) |
| 22:44:34 | | Join Chipsaru [0] (n=chips_ru@193.138.147.102) |
| 22:44:45 | shotofadds | Bagder: here? |
| 22:44:46 | scorche|sh | i think it would be too much work to remove all the patches he put in there ;) |
| 22:44:53 | Bagder | shotofadds: just a bit |
| 22:45:33 | shotofadds | what do you think about adding the D2 builds to the table soon? the menu and plugnis are functional now |
| 22:45:41 | | Part xander2 |
| 22:45:52 | Bagder | I'd love to, I believe in adding early |
| 22:46:02 | Bagder | as long as it doesn't have a bazillion warnings |
| 22:46:22 | shotofadds | plenty of warnings still though (mostly those stupid '#warning not implemented' that I added...) |
| 22:46:30 | shotofadds | hehe.. |
| 22:46:42 | Bagder | the whole triplet bootloader, normal and sim? |
| 22:46:46 | scorche|sh | could release it tomorrow ;) |
| 22:47:12 | Bagder | oh the sim is already there |
| 22:47:23 | kugel | shotofadds: does the nand driver work now? |
| 22:47:31 | shotofadds | it's something like 0/17/47 warnings at the last count (sim/boot/main). I think I need to work on those... |
| 22:47:37 | | Join matsl [0] (n=matsl@1-1-4-2a.mal.sth.bostream.se) |
| 22:48:00 | Bagder | well, having it in the table also helps when working on the warnings |
| 22:48:29 | shotofadds | kugel: mostly. there are still some issues related to recently-written blocks, but not it's workable. |
| 22:48:34 | Bagder | but I'm really off to bed now, if I don't add it tomorrow please remind me! |
| 22:48:43 | * | Bagder runs away |
| 22:48:50 | pixelma | Bagder: could you check (and hopefully) put the voice download links... |
| 22:48:53 | shotofadds | Bagder: that's why I asked, it provides an incentive to fix them :-) |
| 22:50:05 | kugel | shotofadds: I very much appreciate your work on that player. I definitely allready bought one to help you if it wasn't too expensive for me. But in general, I think rockbox on d2 is just great |
| 22:52:31 | shotofadds | kugel: I think it's nice to be able to play with a new architecture. It also opens the door to a number of similar Telechips players in the future :-) |
| 22:54:53 | kugel | samsungs, f.e. ;) |
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| 23:00 |
| 23:00:40 | | Quit kugel ("ChatZilla 0.9.81 [Firefox 2.0.0.13/2008031114]") |
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| 23:10:39 | amiconn | DerPapst: still here? |
| 23:11:25 | gevaerts | phinze: did you manage to look into this usb audio thing yet ? |
| 23:12:23 | phinze | gevaerts: only preliminary investigation. i was planning on hiding from all normal classwork to power through an application by tonight, but getting word of the week extension to the GSoC deadline meant life can go on as normal |
| 23:12:34 | phinze | so i'll be looking into it in the next day or two :) |
| 23:12:54 | | Quit mrkiko ("Lost terminal") |
| 23:13:13 | n1s | amiconn: did you see my suggestion for how to do localization in plugins in the wiki (LocalizablePlugins)? You seemed to be interested in the subject and I would like comments :) |
| 23:13:35 | gevaerts | phinze: Great. I would recommend some usb introductory text, but unfortunately I don't really know of any (I learned it myself by reading the spec seven or eight years ago) |
| 23:13:38 | n1s | I will probably try to implement it next week (if I can convince genlang to play nice...) |
| 23:14:09 | DerPapst | amiconn: yes |
| 23:14:36 | phinze | gevaerts: looks like the library at my uni has a couple... i'll go look into it |
| 23:15:00 | bertrik | there's a really great USB introduction text called "USB in a nutshell" |
| 23:15:26 | bertrik | http://www.beyondlogic.org/usbnutshell/usb1.htm but there's a PDF somewhere on the website too |
| 23:15:37 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
| 23:15:46 | * | gevaerts goes to learn about usb |
| 23:15:56 | amiconn | DerPapst: http://amiconn.dyndns.org/lcd-gray.diff |
| 23:15:56 | phinze | Universal Serial Bus System Architecture c2001 |
| 23:15:57 | phinze | USB Complete : Everything You Need To Develop Custom USB Peripherals c1999 |
| 23:15:57 | phinze | USB Complete : Everything You Need To Develop Custom USB Peripherals c2005 |
| 23:15:57 | DBUG | Enqueued KICK phinze |
| 23:15:57 | phinze | USB Design By Example : A Practical Guide To Building I/O Devices c2001 |
| 23:15:58 | phinze | USB Explained |
| 23:16:05 | phinze | those are the five i have available |
| 23:16:05 | bertrik | and I heard the books by Jan Axelson are good too |
| 23:16:22 | amiconn | Please note that the default contrast changed. It's now 46 for G1..G3 |
| 23:17:04 | amiconn | If you have a different contrast set and can't see the menu, either delete the contrast: line from your config, or reset settings |
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| 23:17:38 | phinze | gotta run to class. later all |
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| 23:18:04 | amiconn | If it works, it would be nice if you could also build the test_scanrate plugin and check the internal scan rate of the G3 LCD. I expect around 96Hz |
| 23:18:08 | DerPapst | amiconn: will do |
| 23:18:21 | DerPapst | (both) |
| 23:18:51 | amiconn | This patch will be a nice simplification - if it works... |
| 23:19:04 | | Quit DerDome (Nick collision from services.) |
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| 23:19:29 | DerPapst | i assume you've tested it on your G2 already? |
| 23:19:35 | | Quit DerDome (Client Quit) |
| 23:20:13 | amiconn | G2 and G1 |
| 23:20:42 | DerPapst | does test_scanrate work on all bitmap targets? |
| 23:20:47 | amiconn | no |
| 23:21:13 | DerPapst | ok |
| 23:21:37 | amiconn | It works on all targets which have lcd_blit_mono(), i.e. all monochrome and greyscale targets, but not yet m:robe 100, iFP7xx and logikdax |
| 23:21:45 | DerPapst | #if defined(HAVE_LCD_BITMAP) && (LCD_DEPTH < 4) && !defined(SIMULATOR) ;-) |
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| 23:26:22 | | Join phinze [0] (n=phinze@pcp027324pcs.jesres.mu.edu) |
| 23:26:38 | DerPapst | your classes are pretty short phinze |
| 23:26:39 | | Join Massa_ [0] (n=chatzill@213602.static-p6.dus.net) |
| 23:26:57 | phinze | DerPapst: it's an embedded systems seminar... laptops acceptable ;) |
| 23:27:06 | DerPapst | heh |
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| 23:30:41 | domonoky | embedded systems... tell them about applying to rockbox gsoc :-) |
| 23:31:59 | gevaerts | depends on what kind of embedded systems. Rockbox is huge compared to some |
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| 23:32:37 | domonoky | or small compared to some other embedded system.. :-) |
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| 23:33:17 | gevaerts | Also true :) |
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| 23:34:36 | gevaerts | phinze: you can probably ignore most (or all) of the mechanical and electrical bits in usb. |
| 23:34:38 | bluebrother | bertrik: http://www.beyondlogic.org/usbnutshell/usb-in-a-nutshell.pdf |
| 23:34:49 | DerPapst | meh.. at least one second per compiled c file on cygwin :-/ |
| 23:36:20 | kakazza | How long should "building database" take with 944 Elements? |
| 23:36:23 | bertrik | DerPapst: indeed, compiling with cygwin takes about 3 times as long as it does under linux |
| 23:36:24 | phinze | bluebrother: that looks like a good start, and I'll pick up USB Complete by Jan Axelson from the library as per bertrik's recommendation |
| 23:36:30 | kakazza | >5 Minutes? |
| 23:38:05 | | Join moos [0] (i=moos@m170.net81-66-158.noos.fr) |
| 23:38:31 | domonoky | phinze: to apply successfully to rockbox gsco you have to convice at least 5 other students to apply.. ;-) |
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| 23:38:49 | phinze | domonoky: bwah? |
| 23:38:51 | phinze | ;) |
| 23:38:54 | bluebrother | domonoky: don't scare him away! ;-) |
| 23:39:15 | Ctcp | Ignored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood |
| 23:39:15 | * | domonoky just wanted to start some pyramid scheme :-) |
| 23:39:21 | moos | BigBambi, linuxstb: hi, received yours c240? came a v1 one here |
| 23:39:42 | linuxstb | moos: Yes, mine arrived last week - also a v1. |
| 23:39:54 | BigBambi | moos: It has been delivered, but not to the same country as me yet, but yes, it is a v1 :) |
| 23:39:58 | bluebrother | domonoky: remember, too many cooks ... |
| 23:39:58 | moos | nice :) |
| 23:40:25 | gevaerts | bluebrother: ... spoil the TV schedule ? |
| 23:40:35 | bluebrother | yeps |
| 23:40:44 | kakazza | Where are the changelogs for the releases? |
| 23:41:15 | BigBambi | What releases? |
| 23:41:27 | BigBambi | You can see the changes to SVN via the front page |
| 23:41:37 | BigBambi | And there is also a MajorChanges wiki page |
| 23:41:47 | BigBambi | But there hasn't been a release in years |
| 23:42:04 | BigBambi | A new build is produced on every source code change though |
| 23:42:10 | domonoky | rockbox has given us this release thing, it doesnt work :-) |
| 23:42:15 | phinze | domonoky: only if there's an iPod involved :) |
| 23:43:14 | domonoky | s/us/up .. :-) |
| 23:43:50 | DerPapst | ah bummer. i thought the holy rockbox gve it to us :-( |
| 23:43:53 | DerPapst | *gave |
| 23:45:07 | | Quit domonoky (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 23:45:33 | DerPapst | hmm... "test_viewports.c:32:7: warning: extra tokens at end of #else directive" |
| 23:48:01 | * | amiconn fetches beer |
| 23:49:53 | amiconn | DerPapst: There's a bug in my patch. Line 142 of lcd-gray.c must read: |
| 23:49:55 | amiconn | #if defined(IPOD_1G2G) || defined(IPOD_3G) |
| 23:49:56 | markun | amiconn: cheers! |
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| 23:50:05 | DerPapst | heh ok |
| 23:50:10 | pixelma | iCatcher also has the "no real 0db icon" problem but it's not so obvious why to do with it in this case :\ |
| 23:50:15 | amiconn | Otherwise you won't get the new default contrast on G3 |
| 23:50:18 | pixelma | *what |
| 23:50:36 | DerPapst | need to figure out why test_whatever hasn't been compiled |
| 23:50:55 | DerPapst | ok |
| 23:51:32 | bertrik | DerPapst: I think the #else if should be changed to #elif |
| 23:51:45 | * | amiconn should probably stop using the short form #ifdef, and always use #if defined instead |
| 23:52:16 | gevaerts | phinze: Once you more or less understand usb, I guess you'll need to know how USB audio works. The specs are at http://www.usb.org/developers/devclass_docs but I can probably give you a brief overview based on what I understand about it. Just yell whenever you want that |
| 23:52:30 | DerPapst | bertrik: haven't used #elif |
| 23:52:48 | phinze | gevaerts: will do |
| 23:53:53 | bertrik | DerPapst: I mean in test_viewports.c line 32 |
| 23:54:08 | DerPapst | ah :-) |
| 23:54:09 | DerPapst | heh |
| 23:54:30 | * | gevaerts spots something suspect on the last page of that usb introductory pdf |
| 23:54:35 | amiconn | jhMikeS: The new WAIT_FAILED macro in kernel.h collides with a mingw definition |
| 23:54:49 | amiconn | (when compiling the sim on cygwin) |
| 23:55:31 | bertrik | gevaerts: what? |
| 23:55:58 | DerPapst | amiconn: i hope i'm not being stupid now but doesn't #if defined(HAVE_LCD_BITMAP) && (LCD_DEPTH < 4) [..] have to be #if defined(HAVE_LCD_BITMAP) && defined(LCD_DEPTH < 4) [..]? |
| 23:56:16 | DerPapst | in test_scanrate.c line 22 |
| 23:56:17 | amiconn | Where is that? |
| 23:56:44 | | Part Chipsaru |
| 23:56:48 | phinze | gevaerts: something wrong with the enumeration description? |
| 23:56:56 | amiconn | Umm, not here.... |
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| 23:57:19 | | Quit Tavnos () |
| 23:57:29 | bluebrother | DerPapst: sounds strange −− defined(foo < bar) doesn't make sense to me |
| 23:57:39 | amiconn | DerPapst: I misread. The line is correct in test_scanrate.c |
| 23:58:09 | DerPapst | ah ok |
| 23:58:30 | amiconn | You need to enable it in apps/plugins/SOURCES. All test plugins aren't enabled by default |
| 23:58:31 | gevaerts | bertrik, phinze steps 3,4 and 8 seem wrong (unless old versions of windows really behaved that way...). IIRC in step 3 it asks for 8 bytes on low speed. Step 4 sounds plain wrong to me, and in step 8 it asks for whatever wTotalSize was, not 255 |
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