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#rockbox log for 2008-04-14

00:00:18 Quit velixzeen ("[hienoa] - your ass is glowing!")
00:00:28BigBambir0rshach: Anyway, it isn't a problem, it is just a setting you may have to change :)
00:00:38r0rshachthe 100 gig drive is 161
00:00:43BigBambi161 what?
00:00:54BigBambir0rshach: This is a very international channel...
00:00:55amiconnbananas ;)
00:01:23r0rshachbut it seems dumb to go from 60 to 80...
00:01:35r0rshachbut 80 is quite big....i suppose
00:01:59 Join CyBergRind|w [0] (n=cbr@
00:02:39amiconnHmm, interesting effect... if I increase the wait-for-voltage-to-stabilize sleep() after ide_power_enable() in ata.c to HZ/10, the dropout goes away
00:02:42BigBambir0rshach: Have you looked at to make sure you get the correct connector?
00:02:58amiconnHZ/20 isn't enough (SVN uses HZ/50)
00:03:29amiconnNot the question is - why does this cause a dropout if only reading non playback related data??
00:03:37r0rshachthanks bambi
00:03:48BigBambino probs
00:03:54amiconn(in my case, any dr listing, while music is playing and buffer is still well filled)
00:06:41 Quit Thundercloud (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
00:06:54bertrikthere's an "#else if" line in viewports_test.c, it causes a compiler warning and I think it should be #elif, shall I fix it?
00:07:06 Quit tessarakt ("Client exiting")
00:07:20DerPapstbertrik: please do
00:08:32 Join Casainho [0] (
00:09:37peturjhMikeS: in thread.c line 2025, if it breaks at that point, does that mean irq stays off (I might not understand that code completely, just asking). At the other break point (line 2042) irq is switched on again.
00:09:51 Join jcollie_ [0] (
00:11:28r0rshachactually bambi i take that back i just double check and there is only one model that appear to fit in my player
00:11:36r0rshachso itll be harder to shop around
00:11:54CasainhoBagder: :-) - just to say that in the make file of u-boot, were defined the cross_compiler as "arm-linux-" and I changed that to "arm-elf-" :-) −− It did build the example hello world code... but, after gives an error saying "ar-elf-ld: libgcc.a uses hardware FP wheras u-boot uses software FP :-( :-(
00:12:19BigBambir0rshach: That page may not be complete, but you need to make sure that whatever you get has the same connector (and thickness) as the current one
00:12:45DerPapstfloating point
00:12:45Bagderu-boot doesn't use floats, does your app?
00:13:27*DerPapst wonders why he typed that...
00:13:37peturjhMikeS: nevermind me, overlooked that inner look :/
00:14:03gevaertsDerPapst: because you weren't sure if Bagder knew that ?
00:14:45 Quit perrikwp (" ajax IRC Client")
00:14:57DerPapsti just read the FP? and not the name. I'm sure he knows that and alot more :-D
00:15:40 Join days_of_ruin [0] (n=Sturm@
00:16:01days_of_ruinIs this model of sansa compatible?
00:16:14 Join rasher_ [0] (
00:16:20Bagdermodel of what?
00:16:42BagderI don't think we all know every possible model and serial number in existence
00:16:44days_of_ruinsansa e280 8gb
00:16:46DerPapste200 it seems
00:16:55 Quit rasher ("Reconnecting")
00:17:02CasainhoBagder: no, my app is just returning, not floats....
00:17:03DerPapstthe e280 V1 is compartible with rockbox
00:17:09DerPapstbut not the V2
00:17:19 Quit serdarakkan ()
00:17:34days_of_ruinI am browsing it on amazon and am not sure if its v2 or not
00:17:40days_of_ruinI read the guidelines
00:17:41Bagderdays_of_ruin: I don't think we know of the model from the model/serial number
00:17:52Bagderdays_of_ruin: what firmware version is it?
00:18:03days_of_ruinThats what I cant figure out?
00:18:15days_of_ruinThere are user uploaded pics running rockbox
00:18:22BigBambidays_of_ruin: Sadly, the firmware version is the only sure way
00:18:37days_of_ruinbut the product discription mention Play for sure
00:18:38 Quit cbr|w (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:18:40BigBambiAlthough personally I would guess a new one from somewhere like Amazon would be v2
00:18:44 Quit gromit`` (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:18:53days_of_ruinSeller is Electronic Expo
00:19:17Bagdermostly it is impossible to tell v1 or v2 by reading seller pages
00:19:23 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
00:19:29 Join amiconn [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
00:19:49CasainhoBagder: do you think that I must build u-boot if I want to build an external application?
00:20:14BagderCasainho: quite possibly, yes. but I'm not sure. It's been a while since I did that
00:20:39days_of_ruinI read a discussion and they said v2
00:20:43CasainhoBagder: okok, thanks - I will work on that
00:20:47Casainhogood night :-)
00:20:56 Quit Casainho ("Ex-Chat")
00:21:07days_of_ruinCan I get rockbox to work with v2?
00:21:23days_of_ruinI saw some links on the site
00:21:26saratogasure, port it
00:21:28LloreanIt needs a lot of work to be done.
00:21:56saratogamaybe soon the supply of V1s will dry up and someone will be motivated to do the V2 port
00:22:44 Join Mathiasdm [0] (
00:22:52*amiconn is hesitating to just increase the ata poweron voltage stabilisation time to the required amount found by testing on his mini
00:23:12days_of_ruinAny idea on when it will be ready?
00:23:15amiconnThere must be a reason why too early accesses make rockbox glitch
00:23:43Bagderdays_of_ruin: that's not possible to tell
00:23:43krazykitdays_of_ruin, there is no timeframe for new ports.
00:24:40peturamiconn: surprise surprise, if I alter that sleep it changes my bootloader crash too, but it is not caused by it I think, just influences it.
00:25:00 Join raptoid [0] (n=raptoid@unaffiliated/raptoid)
00:25:04 Part raptoid
00:25:15amiconnThis is on ipod, where ata_reset() is empty
00:27:55amiconnAnd it seem to only happen on my mini - not on any of the other 3 PP targets I have, nor on linuxstb's Color
00:27:55days_of_ruinI might by it anyhow since its 8gb for $90 usd
00:27:55days_of_ruinor is it that cheap everywhere now?
00:27:55Bagderfriendlyzookeeper should just educate himself instead of filling that thread
00:28:29 Quit LinusN (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:29:24 Quit saratoga (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:30:24DerPapstsounds like a "i'm outta ere" message. But i have my doubts :-P
00:31:08BagderI read it more like "I need to educate these guys about that ARM cores can be used in different chips"
00:31:55LloreanBagder: I still think he expects rockbox to be an app running on Linux, or some such.
00:31:58BagderI need a mute function for specific threads in the forum!
00:32:09Bagderthat hides them from me
00:32:17LloreanBagder: I THINK I can arrange that, if you really want it.
00:32:30Bagdernah, I need to learn how to mute in my head
00:32:46Bagderthere's just too many voices there! ;-P
00:32:51*amiconn found the ata hard reset in the mini ROM :)
00:33:21LloreanBagder: Bah, there's just an ignore feature, or ignore board, mod, no ignore thread mod yet it seems
00:34:23*Llorean doesn't want to install the "ignore user" feature for fear that too many people will simply choose to ignore him.
00:34:50DerPapstcan't you just guide the zookeeper out of this thread somehow? e.g. it's locked for him but not for the rest :-P
00:34:52BigBambihaha :)
00:35:28 Join perrikwp [0] (i=4aa794a0@gateway/web/ajax/
00:35:56days_of_ruinhmm doesn't v2 have hcsd support?
00:36:04days_of_ruinWell it appears this one doesn't
00:36:32BigBambidays_of_ruin: The OF is of to particular concern here
00:42:08 Join Shaid [0] (
00:44:01 Quit ender` (" Programming is like sex becuse: 20. It doesnt go so well when youre drunk, but youre more likely to do it.")
00:44:02peturBigBambi: he meant to use this as a way to discover if it is a V2
00:44:25BigBambipetur: Ah, OK
00:44:30BigBambidays_of_ruin: My apologies
00:47:49 Quit perrikwp (" ajax IRC Client")
00:48:09DerPapstGood night all :-)
00:48:33 Quit DerPapst ("So Long And Thanks For All The Fish!")
00:50:41 Quit bertrik ("bye")
00:51:18days_of_ruinnight?what side of the world are you on?:P
00:51:52 Quit days_of_ruin ("Leaving")
00:53:02peturthe good side?
00:53:19Bagderthe dark side?
00:53:35peturright now, yes
00:53:54*petur gives his h2380 an angry look
00:53:59peturerr h380
00:54:08scorche380 gigs?!?
00:54:18*scorche wants
00:54:31BigBambia H100 with a colour screen and 380 GB - wow
00:54:44peturno, 2080 GB
00:54:47*BigBambi is imagining a H100/H300 hybrid
00:56:20 Nick rasher_ is now known as rasher (n=rasher@rockbox/developer/rasher)
00:56:26peturI'm beginning to be quite convinced that my bootloader crash is actually a hardware issue.
00:57:55peturor maybe not
00:58:10 Quit Mathiasdm ("Yuuw!")
00:58:11*petur unsure again...
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00:59:15 Quit waldo (Remote closed the connection)
00:59:52*petur wonders if ide_power_enable() could cause some power fluctuation that causes a crash
01:00:16 Join saratoga [0] (n=9803c50e@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
01:01:00amiconnWell, there's at least one Archos Player that crashes when using ide_power_enable(). That's why it's not enabled for Player in SVN
01:01:18amiconnMy Studio 10 works fine with it enabled
01:01:46peturI'm testing more, but I seem to always get up to right before that, and it fails if I print after it
01:02:13 Nick pathobitch is now known as pathogen (i=juma@gateway/gpg-tor/key-0xB9002659)
01:02:13amiconnThe crash in this case means that the whole thing powers off when the disk is powered on again after being switched off
01:02:20peturnow I'm putting variation on the time elsewhere to see if this observation is correct
01:02:48peturhere I once saw my printf text garbled.
01:02:54peturbut no reboot
01:04:23 Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@unaffiliated/jhulst)
01:07:15 Quit kakazza ()
01:07:54peturwow, yet another IllInstr, but it arrived to just before the power_enable
01:08:38 Quit domonoky (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:08:55peturwhoa, happens every time...
01:12:45peturhmmm this crash happens accessing a struct in the IBSS...
01:13:10 Join perrikwp [0] (i=4aa794a0@gateway/web/ajax/
01:14:18peturanybody with an h300 want to try a bootloader to see if it crashes?
01:14:33 Quit lee-qid (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:17:28 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (
01:17:58***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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01:20:01*amiconn thinks this is for someone with a BDM within reach....
01:21:10*petur delays the investigation until devcon
01:22:01 Quit petur ("Zzzzz")
01:24:04 Quit gevaerts ("nearly monday morning")
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01:24:27 Quit gevaerts (Client Quit)
01:25:08soapWhy isn't Rockbox built for the 4G grey?
01:26:32amiconnMentioned a hundred times at least - nobody implemented the display data conversion for those
01:27:48amiconnjhMikeS: I now have a new version of my clock skipping udelay, making it a regular iram function
01:28:21saratogaamiconn: do you expect a significant improvement in power use from clock skipping?
01:28:35amiconnAn interesting detail is that H10 uses *a lot* more udelay than mini G2 - my old patch increases H10 binsize by 1304 bytes, the new one decreases it by 568 bytes
01:28:45 Join JdGordon_ [0] (
01:28:56amiconn...whereas the same number for mini are only +288 bytes and -36 bytes
01:28:59 Quit JdGordon (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:32:45amiconnsaratoga: A bit, perhaps. There must be a reason why portalplayer implemented clock skipping...
01:34:43saratogaI'll have to do new current measurements when its ready
01:35:26amiconnI will do 2 runtime tests, with and without patch, before committing
01:35:42saratogado you want me to do current measurements now?
01:36:06 Quit mirak ("Ex-Chat")
01:36:17amiconnNormal current consumption won't change. The deal is that average consumption will be lowered a little, because the cpu will be throtled during udelay
01:36:24 Quit barrywardell ()
01:36:35saratogaidle current should be lower though?
01:36:45 Quit BHSPitLappy (Remote closed the connection)
01:36:57amiconnDepends on whether there are udelay calls
01:37:21amiconnNormal sleep() clock-skips for ages
01:37:32saratogai didn't realize that
01:37:58 Join linuxgeek [0] (
01:38:06linuxgeekhi there :)
01:38:18amiconnHence, I'll do the tests on H10 (because of its much larger amount of udelay calls)
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01:55:50r0rshachmy creative zen (30 gig) drive has no been installed and added to my x5 (formerly 60 gig)
01:56:02 Quit bughunter2 ("Leaving.")
01:56:05r0rshachthis will due for now, until i get that 80 gig
01:58:25 Quit Mathiasdm ("Yuuw!")
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02:48:53 Join x86ia [0] (n=chatzill@
02:49:16x86iahi,i got the ipod back,im webguest49
02:49:53x86iais there a diagnostic mode in the ipod? would tell you so..
02:50:50x86iahahaha,ok anyways thx
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03:18:02***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
03:22:16saratogai think i'm down to a single WMA problem sample
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04:33:03soapcongrats, saratoga
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05:18:03***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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06:00:51RoC_MasterMindI am considering getting a Toshiba Gigabeat F40 instead of an iPod 4th Gen...I see the LCD driver and usb handler aren't complete...what's the experience with rockbox like right now?
06:03:41scorcheit will be a much better device than an iPod 4th gen
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06:25:40RoC_MasterMindwhy is that scorche ?
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06:46:25 Join [TiZ] [0] (
06:47:35[TiZ]Hey, guys.
06:48:14[TiZ]I already know where this is going to go, but I'd like someone to take a look at my readme file and point out what I did wrong with it. I'm sure I messed something up.
06:48:43[TiZ]Is this better in #rockbox-community?
06:49:28Llorean[TiZ]: I see at least one of your images has the -attribution clause. Have you found out explicitly what form of attribution the author of such images requires?
06:49:54[TiZ]They're all on Flickr, so I hope just a link to the page works.
06:50:05[TiZ]And they all have at least the attribution clause.
06:50:36LloreanThe attribution clause say, and I quote, "You must attribute the work in the manner specified by the author or licensor"
06:50:58LloreanThis means you need to do it in the way the author says, which means you need to find out exactly where the author says what way they want attributed.
06:52:33[TiZ]None of them seem to say anywhere.
06:52:46[TiZ]Perhaps I should just submit my WPS without backdrops.
06:52:56krazykit[TiZ], you should ask them, then.
06:53:30[TiZ]Yahoo accounts work on Flickr, don't they?
06:54:23[TiZ]I'm sorry if I seem like a jerk right now. I'm still really sore about those backdrops I made.
06:54:53[TiZ]And I know it's not your fault.
06:55:35[TiZ]Anyways, I'm off-topic now. I'll stop here.
07:04:03 Quit [TiZ] ("ChatZilla 0.9.81 [Firefox]")
07:14:07ia86xoff now
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07:18:08***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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07:22:50LloreanBagder: You around, and may I PM you?
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08:06:42markunmorning people
08:07:26markuntoffe82: do you know if the Gigabeat S exploit works on the Gigabeat U as well?
08:08:31toffe82I don't think so, it is not windows base
08:08:48toffe82or do you mean the V ?
08:08:58markunah no, the T sorry
08:09:05markunall these models :)
08:09:50toffe82I want to try on the V, but didn't have time, I need to contact zunepet to ask him
08:09:56 Quit jhulst (Remote closed the connection)
08:10:11toffe82the version of windows is the same
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08:10:42toffe82the version of windows on the T is not the same as the S and V
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08:11:42toffe82there is no update available, the only information I found is that in japan they have to send it back to toshiba to get an update
08:11:59 Quit jcollie ("Ex-Chat")
08:13:45Gartralhi: im awear of a wps script builder... but i cant find it, could i get a link?
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08:19:37markunGartral: sorry, I don't know
08:20:49JdGordonGartral: what script builder are you thinking off? I cant tihnk of any up-to-date wps builders...
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08:25:55GartralEZ WPS builder... or something like that
08:27:18JdGordonI dont tihnk thats up to date...
08:27:27JdGordonif it even works at all anymore
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08:42:16Gartralso therees no current tools?
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08:43:40GodEatercurrently there are only notepad and it's brethren
08:45:41*scorche really doesnt appreciate the new who-girl
08:46:21GodEaterCatherine Tate ?
08:46:34GodEaterwrong channel surely ? :)
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08:51:16mrkikoHi all!
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08:54:17MakuseruHi, does anyone know how to restore the bootloaded on a Toshiba Gigabeat F40, i bricked it and cant seem to get it back
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08:55:30 Nick Bagderr is now known as B4gder (n=daniel@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
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08:56:12markunMakuseru: if you just use rockbox you can use our dummy GBSYSTEM folder + the rockbox bootloader (FWIMG01.DAT). Both can be found here:
08:57:04markunMakuseru: and if you can't get into USB mode try:
08:57:43markunI have to leave. Good luck.
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09:07:14LinusNit feels almost surreal to be able to read the forums at this time of day without timeouts :-)
09:07:39scorchefaster than normal even by my view :)
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09:12:21JdGordonwho did the simulator backgrounds?
09:13:01B4gderpixelma is our graphics ninja
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09:16:15Gartralive never had a problem with RB forums
09:17:02markunI've had problems almost every morning
09:18:09***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
09:20:33LinusNme too
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09:21:13LinusNGartral: that's probably because you 1) live in another timezone and 2) never search the forums
09:21:37LinusNjust a guess
09:22:54markunLinusN: how did jeff take it?
09:23:04LinusNwell, i think
09:24:15markunit was really very nice of him to host our forums for so long
09:25:04pondlifeWhere is the forum hosted now?
09:25:29*petur points at scorche
09:25:37*scorche waves
09:25:47pondlifescorche: In the US?
09:25:52Shaidhe's running a wireless connection interfacing into his left fingernail
09:26:11Shaidthe forums run out of his left kidnet
09:26:33LinusNmarkun: it sure was nice of him
09:26:52scorcheif only he didnt...well...blah
09:28:23Gartralwich toenail holds the CPU stack?LOL
09:29:49Gartralwhats it mean when stuff is red in the INFO window of RBUtil?
09:30:03Gartraldoes that mean its broken?
09:31:28Gartraldamn caps key
09:32:56Makuserusomeone wouldnt happen to know where to DL a version of gigabeat firmware where you dont need to install windows media player? i accidently reformated my gigibeat, so i need to install the original firmware to put rockbox back on it, but the update you get form the site says you need mediaplayer 9
09:34:01markunMakuseru: do you use the original firmware?
09:34:21markunthen you can do what I suggested earlier
09:34:47Makuseruwheres the dummy GBSYSTEM folder?
09:35:41markunthen just place inside GBSYSTEM/FWIMG/
09:36:20Gartralwhats it mean when stuff is red in the Info screen in RBUtil?
09:36:46markunGartral: I don't know, sorry
09:37:51Makuserumarkun: thank you very much
09:39:02markunMakuseru: I should probably write this info in the wiki separately as the question keeps coming up.
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10:13:06*Gartral yargs and growls at pidgins stupid crash into windows
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10:37:17B4gderto rockbox committers: only about twelve hour left to vote for the gsoc project priority
10:44:33Gartralohh this years gonna be fun
10:45:28*Llorean looks forward to a final GSOC decision.
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10:49:37*Gartral jumps up and down ready too work on USB stacks
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10:57:17B4gderGartral: what are you referring to then?
10:59:15Gartrali just want them working so the DAPs dont have too reboot to OFW to transfer files
11:00:22B4gderbut the only submitted usb work in gsoc is for usb audio...
11:01:59Gartralim an owner of a Sansa E250.... and i noticed when in OFW the firmware splits the proccessors attention between driveing the lcd, and transfering files
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11:04:06Gartrali think thats stoopid... if i want confirmation the files are moving... ill look at the transfer screen
11:04:38gevaertsWhat exactly did you notice ?
11:04:58Gartraland like right now.... the sansa says "wrighting", i dont have anything open that could possible look in the sansa
11:06:42Gartraland it would also make more sense too turn the whole LCD driver off when in charge/wright mode
11:06:50gevaertsWhy ?
11:07:05Gartralsave power, more focus to the battery
11:08:22Gartralcus i noticed in rock box, if i leave the scroll wheel and backlight on in charging mode, then switch both off... it does charge faster
11:08:26 Join Thundercloud [0] (
11:08:37Gartralespecially w/o the wheels light
11:09:09Lloreanpondlife: Can you understand what that guy actually wants to *do* with the new version of "Follow Playlist" he's proposed?
11:09:34pondlifeNot yet, anyway
11:09:35gevaertsYou get 500 mA from USB. They probably cheat and get some more. LCD and wheels light use about 40mA. That's less than 0%
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11:10:12LloreanAs far as I can see, he just wants a shortcut to "View Current Playlist", but he seems to think that it'll let him add songs, so I fear he expects you to be able to launch a song from within a playlist, without launching the playlist, then hit select to go back to that playlist...
11:10:19Gartralit still baught 15 mins off charging time from dead
11:10:29LloreanKinda like a "Genre" filter in the database, where the filter itself is separate from the playlist.
11:10:40gevaertsOnly if the battery can actually take that extra charging current
11:11:03LloreanSo he could insert songs from "Blues.m3u" and "Rock.m3u" then hit select on a song that came from "Blues.m3u" and end up back there.
11:11:47Lloreangevaerts: Rockbox gets less on the e200 because we don't tell the power control chip to charge, iiuc.
11:12:29pondlifeAlso on H300, I believe...
11:12:40Gartralit seems it does... cus in OFW the wheel light stays off untill you touch it... then its perma on untill reboot, and ive charged in OFW and between WL on and off, there is a difference, im not shure how much, seeing as the BL on the screen never turns off
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11:13:17Lloreanpondlife: I'd heard there was an option somewhere on H300. Don't have one m'self though
11:13:42pondlifeUSB charging on/off only - i.e. 0mA or 100mA.
11:13:56Gartraland theres always activity in the OFWs charge/transfer mode, waisting more power
11:13:56pondlifeI don't think we sussed out how to get 500mA
11:15:30peturthe OF of the h300 has a setting to select connection to PC or hub
11:16:47pondlifepetur: Does that control charging? I wondered...
11:17:32peturI think it does, but even LinusN half forgot how it was...
11:17:52peturit controls the amount of current allowed
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11:18:31pondlifeI guess we need to get the USB controller to request 500mA?
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11:20:34MartinRFS #8363 fixed the charging for me.
11:22:11pondlifeLlorean: I think that he's wanting the file browser to be capable of treating playlists like directories... so having originally selected PARTY.m3u, you'd be able to browse inside it, and then follow playlist would go to the selected entry.
11:22:22pondlifeDoes that make any more sense?
11:22:30amiconnpondlife: On H300 we can't as the usb controller is hardware, and the pin that could tell us isn't connected afaik
11:22:49amiconnOn iaudios (same bridge), the pin is connected
11:23:02pondlifeHmm, so the OF doesn't do 500mA either?
11:23:19amiconnIt does, that's what the hub/pc setting is for
11:23:30pondlifeOK, so can we not do the same?
11:23:38amiconnAfaik we do, but I'm not sure
11:23:49*amiconn always charges with the charger
11:23:56petursame here
11:24:02Lloreanpondlife: Treat them like directories, and allow you to insert from them into the dynamic playlist, but allow returning to them with "Select" anyway, yes.
11:24:04pondlifeMe too. It definitely seems to charge faster with the charger
11:24:20amiconnDrawing 500mA without asking is a violation of the usb standard, but it works on most ports
11:24:20pondlifeLlorean: Yes. I quite like the idea
11:24:42pondlifeLlorean: Obviously, default action would still play the playlist..
11:24:46LloreanI'd rather "Select" always return you to the physical file, if "Follow" was on.
11:24:51*gevaerts puts on his USB spec pedant hat
11:25:00amiconnOf course. USB cannot provide more than 500mA. The initial charging current a LiIon of that capacity can take is much higher
11:25:08LloreanI don't mind allowing them to be viewed easily (make it the second option in the context window) and inserted from into the current one, for example.
11:25:20gevaertsPC/Hub makes no difference at all on what current you're allowed to draw.
11:25:25amiconnThere's a reason why the iriver and iaudio chargers are rated 1.8...2.0 A
11:25:25LloreanBut I really don't like the idea of "Following" to a place within a playlist.
11:25:38pondlifeThat would be a 3rd option on Follow Playlist.
11:25:55LloreanSince then you'd have to track every playlist that every song in the dynamic playlist came from.
11:25:56gevaertsIf you happen to use a bus-powered hub, it's 100mA, period.
11:26:01LloreanWhich seems rather silly.
11:26:09amiconngevaerts: They do, although that setting is somewhat confusing. A passive hub can never provide 500mA
11:26:25Lloreanpondlife: Why would you want "Follow" to do that, anyway?
11:26:36pondlifeI wouldn't, but "Mike" does
11:26:41amiconnThat's what that setting actually means. "Hub" limits to 100mA
11:26:53Lloreanpondlife: You said you liked the idea though. So I'm asking you why you like it.
11:27:04pondlifeI like the idea of integrating into the file browser
11:27:14pondlifeNot so much the follow playlist change
11:27:21LloreanAh, then we're more or less agreed.
11:27:41pondlifeIt would make it easy to do the other request (to insert/queue from a saved playlist)
11:28:05LloreanI don't necessarily think it should be "integrated into the browser", but I think viewing a playlist that isn't currently playing, and inserting from it, should be made as painless as possible (while being distinct enough that you know you're manipulating playlist entries, and not physical files)
11:28:51pondlifeLlorean: No, the idea was that you could (apparently) browse into a saved playlist, then select a file in there and queue it, for example
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11:29:11pondlifeIt would appear to be just like browsing into a subdir
11:29:17LloreanI don't like that.
11:29:20LloreanAt all
11:29:28pondlifeWhy not?
11:29:39pondlifeI don't have time to argue now, I should warn you!
11:29:47LloreanBecause the filetree shouldn't transparently shift into non-filetree operations.
11:29:51LloreanIt's a file browser, explicitly
11:30:07LloreanI can see the database having an option to index your M3Us in a "Playlists" filter, and let you browse the like that, perhaps
11:30:16pondlifeYes, maybe
11:30:49pondlifeBut it shouldn't matter which browser really... if you have an M3U file selected, the context menu should offer the same options
11:31:15LloreanSelecting it from the context menu isn't the same as browsing into it, though.
11:31:16pondlifethat's all I'm talking about really, a context menu option to view playlist
11:31:31pondlifeLike I said, the default action should not change
11:31:37pondlifei.e. it should play the playlist
11:31:44MonkeytamerHi, I have a quick question concerning bitmap strips if someone would be so kind. Does it matter what bit depth for which the strips are saved? I noticed that cabbiev2 has the title 240x320x16, and I was wondering if it matters whether the bit depth is 16 or 24
11:31:50Lloreanpondlife: Then I *think* we agree on this one
11:32:16LloreanI was confused for a bit, because you said "no" and I guess I misunderstood which statement you said it to.
11:32:40pondlifeThe playlist viewer should offer the same per-file options as the browsers anyway, so it should appear consistent. I expect it's not quite there at the moment...
11:32:42LloreanMonkeytamer: The screens are only 16-bit.
11:32:54Lloreanpondlife: Well, they don't make any sense at the moment.
11:32:59pondlifeI know...
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11:33:14pondlifethe playlist viewer is really a 3rd browser
11:33:35MonkeytamerOh, I understand that, but I've always saved album art at 24-bit, and wasn't sure if there really was a difference, though I made copies in both depths.
11:34:05LloreanMonkeytamer: If you save it in 16-bit, you know exactly what it'll look like. If you save it in 24-bit, you have to trust how Rockbox will decrease the color depth.
11:34:37Monkeytameroh ok, thank you for the detailed information.
11:35:54MonkeytamerI assume that means were I to recreate all of my album art, I would be ably to save a few bytes by dropping to 16-bit as well
11:36:04Monkeytamer*able even..
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11:43:56 Join Nico_P [50] (n=nicolas@rockbox/developer/NicoP)
11:48:07pondlifeNico_P: Morning, I've been using your pastebin patch all weekend with no mishaps.
11:52:56Lloreanpondlife: More or less spot on with what he wanted to do with it.
11:52:58Nico_Ppondlife: good news :)
11:53:26Nico_PI've fixed the next track info for the end of the buffered data
11:53:30LloreanI've just realized, though, for the purposes of "insert", a .m3u file with a single entry is for most intents and purposes a shortcut to an actual audio file.
11:53:44Nico_PI just need to fix the playlist index display and clean up
11:53:48pondlifeLlorean: Yes, but that should come out in the wash
11:54:05Gartralyou know... thats annoying
11:54:21pondlifeNico_P: Committing soon then?
11:54:27Nico_Ppondlife: I hope, yes
11:55:26Gartrala shortcut that points to 1obj.m3u is nothing but a redundant shortcut... this sounds like what vista does!
11:55:49pondlifeLlorean: I think that Mike's requests are both valid, but they need to the playlist viewer in the core.
11:56:33Lloreanpondlife: Tracking what playlist every song was inserted from?
11:57:04pondlifeAh, no!
11:57:30pondlifeBut tracking the current playlist
11:57:35pondlifei.e. which file it's in.
11:57:49LloreanHe wants it to remember which .m3u file each one was inserted from, if I'm reading him right, so that he can click select while it's playing, and be back "browsing" within that M3U.
11:57:57LloreanDoesn't "View Current Playlist" show you which file you're on?
11:58:05pondlifeYes, it does.
11:58:14LloreanOkay, I'm missing what you mean by "which file it's in" then
11:59:03pondlifeI was only thinking of allowing this with the current playlist (if it's saved), not any playlist
11:59:41Gartraltheres an indicater beside the file thats currently playing in your playlist veiw
11:59:41LloreanI really don't understand then.
12:00:12LloreanIf it's a saved playlist, then all files are still in the .m3u, and "View playlist" is good enough, right?
12:00:20pondlifei.e. he can return to the playlist viewer within the current playlist.. then exiting the viewer would respect Follow Playlist and return to the file browser where it lives
12:00:33pondlifeSo, it's a tweak to the playlist viewer mainly
12:00:47LloreanSo make "Follow Playlist" work both when exiting the WPS, and when exiting the playlist viewer?
12:00:48pondlifeCurrently it's rather linked into the WPS
12:00:54pondlifeYes, kind of
12:01:22LloreanPerhaps a context menu option in the playlist viewer "Browse To", that takes you to the browser at the location of that file?
12:01:27pondlifeI'd like the playlist viewer to be a browser in its own right, not so context-y
12:01:28LloreanSince you have a full path anyway.
12:01:52pondlifeYes, that would do too, but a left click is easier
12:01:59LloreanI don't see how the playlist viewer can be a browser... you don't have any hierarchy, just a flat list of files.
12:02:19pondlifeIt's a rather limited browser, sure
12:02:59pondlifeBut it seems "Mike" runs everything through saved playlists
12:03:02LloreanBut I think I understand what you're suggesting. "When you use 'left' to leave the viewer, if (option X) is enabled, be where the highlighted file is located, rather than where the playlist viewer was invoked from"?
12:03:09pondlifeYes, basically.
12:03:38pondlifeI'd like it to *appear to be* part of the file browser, I guess.
12:03:59LloreanMike seems to want it to remember which .m3u file each entry in the dynamic playlist was inserted from, so he can have "Follow" show him the contents of that m3u file, if I've got a grasp on his requirements in conjunction with his other feature request.
12:04:14pondlifeThat's not going to happen
12:04:53Gartralthat would be tideous
12:05:02Gartralvery tideous
12:05:06Lloreanpondlife: See, I really don't like the idea of things appearing to be part of the file browser when they're not. I wouldn't mind seamless launching of the viewer, and leaving from it back into the file browser, but I think it should be distinct that you're not working with files any more.
12:06:19pondlifeI don't have a big opinion on this, but I think the appearance of a seamless browse into m3u and out again is nice.
12:06:40pondlifeThe heading (if you have it enabled) would have .m3u on it...
12:07:19pondlifeAnd you are working with files really. The targets of the m3u
12:07:26LloreanBut not really.
12:07:30Llorean"Delete" removes it from the playlist, not the disk.
12:07:39Llorean"Move" moves it within the playlist, not to another location on disk.
12:07:49pondlifeTrue, but I'd like to see that integrated properly.
12:07:51LloreanYou're working with strings in a text file.
12:08:05LloreanThey in fact don't even necessarily represent files currently on the disk
12:08:14pondlifeIndeed, they may not exist
12:08:31pondlifeBut for a UI, it's nice to be able to select Insert etc.
12:08:57LloreanI don't see what that has to do with making it appear to be part of the file browser, though.
12:08:59pondlifeWe should offer all sensible per-file options.
12:10:01LloreanI just think that if it appears to actually be part of the file browser, you're going to get people who think it is part of the file browser, and that will cause more confusion than just making it easily available, but distinct.
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12:10:25Gartrali agree
12:10:42Gartralthat would certainly confuzzle the fur of my tail
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12:13:47pondlifeAll I'm talking about is adding the ability to return from the playlist viewer to the file browser, and maybe making context menus more consistent. Nothing more.
12:14:07pondlifeAnd I don't want it myself, but I think it might help "Mike".
12:14:57Lloreanpondlife: The playlist viewer's always going to have different context menu options. Even if it gets Insert/Queue ones, it will still need ones for reorganizing the playlist, etc.
12:15:08pondlifeOf course
12:15:14LloreanBut I can agree that the ability to return to the file browser would be nice.
12:15:59LloreanI don't see that being able to do so necessarily has anything to do with having it 'appear to be' part of the file browser though.
12:16:05pondlifeIt doesn't
12:16:30*Llorean is just lost.
12:16:34*pondlife too
12:16:39pondlifeBack later
12:16:46LloreanYou said earlier you want it to appear to be part of the file browser.
12:17:14LloreanBut then your list of individual wants all seem to be functionality based rather than appearance based.
12:17:57*Llorean can't tell if we're in agreement or at odds...
12:20:44pondlifeI think we agree, but I was unclear earlier, so don't worry
12:21:46JdGordonhas anyone done a flash replacement on a e200?
12:22:25LloreanI haven't heard of anyone in here doing it, but I've seen mention of someone doing it in either our forums or abi, I can't remember which.
12:22:38LloreanSomeone replaced an e250 with the flash from a 270R iirc.
12:23:16JdGordonim swaping my dads 4gb into my 2gb.. the blue lihgt is on but nothing on the screen?
12:23:53LloreanManufacturing or pre-boot mode then
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12:27:23*gevaerts hands e200tool to JdGordon
12:28:36JdGordon:) na, im safe... too much protective crap.. the flash wasnt inserted fully
12:28:42JdGordon2 working e200s again :)
12:29:04JdGordon1 with a dud headphone jack
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12:32:20*JdGordon wonders why isnt doing any builds
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12:51:39JdGordonPOS router doesnt seem to be playing nice :(
12:51:51Shaidis it a dlink?
12:52:47Gartralor belkin?
12:54:30Gartral-refits his brothers e250 with a Bomb, instead of battery-
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13:06:03*Gartral presses power and chucks it and ducks as it explodes, leaving a cratoer where we once stood
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13:18:13***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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13:22:36linux_manjuHi All..
13:22:59linux_manjuI followed..
13:23:11linux_manjuCompilation is successfull..
13:23:37linux_manjuHowever I dont see any file bootloader-ipod1g2g.ipod
13:23:48linux_manjuCan anyone help me please
13:27:58gevaertsWhen I try this it works, so I assume you must have done something wrong
13:30:44 Quit ali_as ("Reboot.")
13:32:33linuxstb_linux_manju: What files do you see in your build directory? I see the following after building the bootloader - autoconf.h bootloader/ bootloader-ipod1g2g.ipod firmware/ librockbox.a Makefile rockbox-info.txt sysfont.h
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13:47:03Gartralwhat would the room recoment as far as video rerendering for RB?
13:48:35linuxstbffmpeg or one of its front-ends.
13:48:47Gartralwinblows clone?
13:49:07linuxstbBut it doesn't really matter - Rockbox plays standard mpeg 1/2 files, so you can use any mpeg encoder.
13:49:21*domonoky doesnt know what winblows is, but suggest winff :-)
13:50:32Gartralright... but ide like one that doesnt take 3 hours too encode a movie... im transfering my ISOed dvd collection too RB playable files (YES I FREAKING OWN THE DISKS)
13:50:59B4gderGartral: transcoding is quite cpu intensive
13:52:17Gartrali have a four proc dule core cluster,each core is at 3GRZ... proc time is no object to me
13:52:17linux_manjulinuxstb: Sorry.. I was on a call..
13:52:26linux_manjuIn mu build directory..
13:52:42linux_manjuroot@geekbox build]# ls
13:52:43linux_manjuMakefile autoconf.h firmware librockbox.a rockbox-info.txt sysfont.h −−> Please ignore.. I guess that was created when I did make zip Just out of frustration
13:53:47LloreanGartral: On a dual core 1.6ghz computer, transcoding from a ripped DVD to a format Rockbox can play takes about 60-70% of the length of the movie in time, if memory serves.
13:53:49Gartrali just want a transcoder that has a fast algorythm for its job....
13:53:50linuxstbLooks like something went wrong - you should have a bootloader directory. Are you sure there were no errors?
13:53:55 Quit miepchen^schlaf_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
13:53:58domonokylinux_manju: and no bootloader dir ?
13:54:27Gartralthats with a single proccessor, at half the speed a single core of my cluster runs
13:54:33linux_manjuThis is what I did..
13:54:39linux_manjuI checked out from svn
13:54:47linux_manjuand them cd to the rockbox
13:54:50linux_manjumkdir build
13:54:53linux_manjucd build
13:55:01linux_manju../tools/configure selected my model
13:55:07linux_manjuand B for boot loader
13:55:37linux_manjulinuxstb: I am pretty sure there were no errors..
13:55:41linuxstbCan you delete your build directory and try again, but type "make &> log.txt" and upload that log file somewhere? The output of configure might also be useful.
13:55:57LloreanGartral: My point is, ffmpeg doesn't take 3 hours on my computer. I can decrypt, rip, AND encode a movie in around that time frame on this computer, so I don't see what your response to the suggestion that you use ffmpeg was.
13:56:18linux_manjulinuxstb: Delete build directory and create it in the svn root folder?
13:56:38linuxstblinux_manju: Yes - just recreate it in the same place.
13:56:50linux_manjulinuxstb: Sure.. One sec .. thanks
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14:00:48Gartralok... what do i need too to tell Winff what to do?
14:01:12linuxstbHow to use winff is described on the PluginMpegplayer wiki page
14:02:10linux_manjulinuxstb: Should I do make clean..
14:02:23linux_manjuSorry for the dumb question.. But somehow I did not do that
14:02:24 Part LinusN
14:03:00linuxstblinux_manju: No need to do make clean if you deleted your build directory.
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14:03:29Gartralthat link refers too a file with a bunch of source code scripts
14:04:12gevaertsGartral: if you ever looked at the wiki, PluginMpegplayer should be more than enough to help you find the page
14:04:50linux_manjulinuxstb: Ok.. I did delete and re run configure and make
14:05:16linux_manjuThis time also there is not bootloader directory
14:06:29linuxstbCan you paste (to pastebin) the output of ../tools/configure ?
14:06:39LloreanJdGordon: How slow is "not very often"? Once per second, once per tenth, once per hundredth?
14:06:49Gartral <−− link you provide for older WinFF does not work
14:07:32linux_manjulinuxstb: Sure.. one sec
14:07:41BigBambiGartral: So fix it - it is a wiki
14:08:58Gartrali dont know where one that works IS
14:08:59linux_manjulinuxstb: Configure complete screenshot
14:10:02LloreanGartral: The internet is chock full of video encoders, there are probably hundreds, maybe even thousands, of the things. We tell you all the information you need to know about the desired output format, so you can decide on your own among them.
14:10:10Gartralas the wiki mentions, its a special preset file... i know not here too find this old WinFF version, nor how to update the new Preset.xml file
14:10:57gevaertslinux_manju: that looks correct. One piece of advice though : it's usually not considered a good idea to do all this as root
14:11:19LloreanGartral: I assure you, the original creator of the preset file had just as much knowledge of WinFF as you do now not more than a day before creating those presets.
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14:12:56linux_manjugevaerts: Thanks.. I will keep that in mind in future
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14:15:44gevaertslinux_manju: can you put the output of your latest 'make' try (the one after you deleted everything) on a pastebin ?
14:17:29linux_manjugevaerts: I have already done that. One sec.. Let me paste the pastebin url
14:17:42GartralWinff wont open the iso...
14:18:04BigBambiGartral: This isn't a video conversion help channel
14:18:13linux_manjugevaerts: make output
14:18:25B4gderartral: maybe its time you ask questions in a forum related to the tool(s) of your choice
14:18:30B4gderGartral even
14:18:49Gartralthen prohaps you should point me too one, instead of feeding me redundant knowledge
14:18:59B4gderget lost
14:20:19Gartrallinux_manju: whats the file for, i dont have a build enviroment up
14:20:34LloreanGartral: Nowhere does it say anyone in this channel is obligated to give you any information. What it does say, however, is that this channel is here for a specific purpose and target. You're beginning to irritate the wrong people, and are likely to be removed if you don't follow the guidelines.
14:20:41linux_manjuGartral: Sorry.. Band fingers.. It was supposed to be for gevaerts
14:21:59gevaertslinux_manju: that output looks really weird to me. Was that after deleting the build directory and recreating it ?
14:22:11linuxstblinux_manju: That output is very strange... After line 84, it should start building the bootloader files, but it appears to be doing something else...
14:23:00linux_manjugevaerts: Yes.. I deleted build and then recreated build
14:23:07linux_manjugevaerts: and ran ../tools/configure
14:23:17linux_manjugevaerts: I did not do a make clean FYI
14:23:37linux_manjugevaerts: Trying with the fresh checkout from SVN
14:23:43gevaertsIf build/ was empty, make clean is not needed
14:23:48*gevaerts is out of ideas
14:24:03Lloreanlinux_manju: "make clean" should only affect files in the build directory, so with a new build directory it wouldn't change anything.
14:24:11linuxstblinux_manju: If I was you, I would delete your entire rockbox folder, change back to a normal user, and try checking out SVN again.
14:24:24Gartralthe reason i asked here, is because i asked before and got a yes: winff will open isos... now its not.... i just want to know what i have too do to it too get it too work
14:24:30linux_manjugevaerts: I guess.. intially I by mistake did ./tools/configure and make make zip in the svn checkout root
14:24:48linuxstblinux_manju: That will explain it then...
14:24:56linux_manjulinuxstb: Llorean gevaerts Trying with a fresh checkout...
14:24:57linuxstbIt would have corrupted the makefiles
14:25:09linux_manjuSorry to eat up you people valuable time...
14:25:14LloreanGartral: And we've told you. You should go ask some experts, somewhere where they're supposed to know about that software.
14:25:44LloreanGartral: Possibly the reason you were given bad information is that you asked someone who has no reason to know about the software, and they were simply wrong.
14:25:55Gartraland i asked if you know the direct channel name
14:25:59linux_manjuThanks alot guys.. I will try again and update you
14:26:02linuxstbGartral: might be a good place to start... (Google found me that)
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14:26:16Gartrali cant use google :(
14:26:27linux_manjulinuxstb: One last question..
14:26:33linuxstbGartral: Why not?
14:26:33Gartralthey banned my ip... im still trying too figure out why
14:26:44linux_manjulinuxstb: whats the exact sequence of compiling it...
14:26:56domonokythey probably know why.. :-)
14:26:59linux_manjulinuxstb: bootloader and then make zip for file?
14:27:04Gartraland winff only has the stuff for NEW winff releases... not the one YOU recomend
14:27:11*BigBambi is surprised google would do that, but if they were to, he is less surprised at the recipient
14:27:49B4gderGartral: please stop discussing winff here, it's not our tool and we don't do support for it. It works fine for some people and thus it is mentioned.
14:27:50linuxstblinux_manju: Just what you've been trying to do - apart from the initial mistake ;)
14:27:51 Quit perplexity (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
14:27:53LloreanGartral: That page is not a "YOU". That page is created by users who submit their own personal suggestions, because it's a wiki. WE don't recommend anything specific as a whole.
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14:28:21B4gderBigBambi: I doubt they do
14:28:26BigBambiWinFF 0.291 is available on their download page....
14:28:27Gartrali think someone was abuseing a proxy i had set up a few months back, but google refuses too talk too me, they just say im in there black list
14:28:30BigBambiB4gder: me neither
14:28:47domonokyGartral: please stay on topic now !!
14:28:54Gartralyou refers too the entire development community
14:29:06BigBambidomonoky: losing battle....
14:29:10Mode"#rockbox +o B4gder " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
14:29:26LloreanGartral: And as I said, we don't recommend anything specific. Some random person added it to the wiki, to try to be helpful. That's all.
14:29:32linux_manjulinuxstb: Well.. Actually.. I am trying to reverse engineer the Ipod Nano 2nd gen 2GB
14:29:57linuxstblinux_manju: Then the 1g2g bootloader is no help to you - the newer ipods have completely new hardware...
14:30:05BigBambiI would like to point out again, that the version listed on the wiki IS AVAILABLE FROM THE WINFF DOWNLOAD PAGE
14:30:12BigBambiIt is not difficult to find
14:30:35Gartralall i want too know is if anyone knows of an irc channel that IS a support channel for winff.... the sooner i get that, the sooner i stop bugging you, and waisting everyones time, right?
14:30:38B4gderok let's drop the winff subject now and return to rockbox
14:30:45BigBambiI went to the extreme lengths of going to then clicking download, then scrolling down
14:31:04linux_manjulinuxstb: But I have an Ipod Nano.. which says.. manufacturing date as 2007 and 2nd Gen
14:31:12linuxstblinux_manju: Yes...
14:31:42linuxstbThe 1g2g bootloader is for the original 1st and 2nd generation ipods - i.e. those made about 5 years ago
14:32:06linux_manjulinuxstb: So which one ... ?
14:32:14LloreanGartral: You're on the edge of getting yourself removed. There are dozens of search engines out there, make use of them. But stop asking off topic questions, because it really sounds like someone's going to lose their patience with you.
14:32:19linuxstblinux_manju: None...
14:32:23LloreanAnd "where do I find off-topic info" is off-topic.
14:33:00B4gderlinux_manju: you're best off finding a more suitable target
14:33:41Gartrali just want one little shred of information... instead im fed all this run around, i am awear im getting off-toic, but theres also absolutly no need to bar me from the one peice of infromation im asking for, either
14:34:08linux_manjulinuxstb: B4gder So.. Does that mean.. I have no luck with the piece of hardware what I have :(
14:34:21B4gderlinux_manju: unfortunately, yes
14:34:50Gartralim sorry if im ticking people off... but please try too feel for other people too...
14:34:53LloreanGartral: 1) We don't know. 2) Even if we did know, that doesn't make it okay for you to ask after being told the channel rules forbid it.
14:36:11linuxstblinux_manju: The (first) problem with the 2nd gen Nano is the firmware is encrypted (it wasn't on earlier ipods), so we can't a) run our own code; b) reverse-engineer the original firmware.
14:37:29linux_manjulinuxstb: So I should I forget / sacrifice rockbox ??... Please.. Please.. tell me a workaround ?
14:37:48BigBambilinux_manju: There is no work around
14:37:58BigBambiIf there was, we'd have done it
14:38:20Gartrali love rockbox, ide like too help develop it, but ive always had too fight you devs for information, any information, all i want to do is co operate, im sorry for getting off topic, but really.. your the ones applying resistence here, i love your code, but your people skills need work
14:38:20 Part Gartral
14:38:27gevaertslinux_manju: it is theoretically possible to get around these problems, but it requires a lot of hard workand a lot of luck
14:40:02markunjust as a sidenote: the latest winff version has all the rockbox presets already included when you install it. Nice guys :)
14:40:06linux_manjugevaerts: Any compatible device.. I can shell out few more $s for rockbox..
14:40:57gevaertslinux_manju: may help. You will probably have to buy second-hand or refurbished though
14:41:31Lloreanmarkun: Yeah, apparently the WinFF author got in contact with someone (can't remember who) and asked for permission to include them
14:41:35linux_manjugevaerts: Thanks alot
14:41:56linux_manjuthanks #rockbox
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14:43:25BigBambiThat's cool - I'll go and change the wiki to point to it, seems much easier
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14:45:40*Llorean tried to get the WinFF guy to get in contact with him about using some updated presets instead, but never got a response.
14:46:10LloreanThen again things vanish sometimes in the internet.
14:46:19BigBambiYes, I just installed it and noticed some where missing
14:46:27BigBambiLlorean: Did you try via his blog?
14:46:45JdGordonLlorean: like I said... I havnt tested on target at all so I could be wrong
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14:48:25*JdGordon gets to work testing on target to shut everyone up :D
14:48:29LloreanJdGordon: Well I was just curious if you knew how fast the actually polling was.
14:48:42*LambdaCalculus37 estimates his Gigabeat S should be arriving either today or tomorrow
14:48:52JdGordonyeah, no idea at all
14:49:00LloreanBigBambi: Nah. Besides, I haven't made the updated ones yet (it'd only take about an hour for me to do it starting from an old one).
14:49:25BigBambiYeah, I was just checking out the xml from the wiki vs the included
14:49:26LloreanBigBambi: The resolutions on the old ones were based on the old requirements of mpegplayer being a multiple of 16, for example.
14:49:44LloreanAnd the bitrates for targets I didn't own were more or less "I *guess* this might be good"
14:49:53BigBambiLlorean: So are the presets.xml on the wiki and the included ones currently identical in every way?
14:49:58LloreanNo clue.
14:50:03BigBambiOK, I'll check
14:50:09LloreanThey should be unless someone's updated the one on the wiki.
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14:50:49*Llorean bets they don't have c200, but doesn't know if the wiki does either
14:50:57BigBambiIf so, I'll replace the recommendation on the wiki to use the newest version without needing to replace the presets, and then when someone adds the new targets we can add the replacemement presets back to the wiki
14:51:27LloreanBigBambi: My updated ones were going to use a constant quantizer instead of a target bitrate. More consistent quality (in theory), and if I picked a good one, probably some filesize savings over the old presets anyway.
14:51:37*Llorean just never got around to it.
14:51:39LloreanBigBambi: Sounds good
14:51:43BigBambiOK, cool
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14:52:10JdGordonLlorean: yep, I was right... no worky (at least on mr500 on my first attempt :p )
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14:52:48*JdGordon takes that back
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14:53:26LambdaCalculus37jhMikeS: Ping!
14:55:22*JdGordon takes back his taking back
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14:59:21JdGordonLlorean: :) this might actually work... BUTTON_REL isnt being triggered when moving from one to another.. that also makes the keymaps a bit simpler
14:59:40*JdGordon hates being wrong!
14:59:49JdGordonalthough... it does hap[pen so infrequently:D
15:00:31LloreanJdGordon: Still, that's 12 more assignable actions right there, if you end up needing them and if it works.
15:00:52JdGordonit works :D
15:01:50LloreanI'll give you time for another take-back or two before I believe it does. :-P
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15:02:24BigBambiLlorean: done
15:02:39LloreanBigBambi: Thanks
15:02:50BigBambiNo probs
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15:09:14*BigBambi belatedly passes on hearty congratulations to jhMikeS for his latest beast commits :)
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15:16:53*LambdaCalculus37 gives jhMikeS kudos for his Beast work as well :)
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16:39:25JdGordonwell thumb scrolling takes a bit of getting used to... but it works
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16:44:29markunJdGordon: what is it exactly?
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16:44:46markunsliding over the pad to scroll?
16:45:14markundo you need to switch from button mode to scroll mode?
16:45:31JdGordonno, this is combiing buttons
16:45:47markunperhaps we could do it for the Gigabeat and H10 as well
16:46:26markuncan I see your code?
16:46:57JdGordonyeah, 1 min
16:47:29JdGordonare their sliders split into multiple button areas?
16:47:57markunthe gigabeat has 13 separate sensors which form the pad
16:48:05markundon't know about the H10
16:48:21markunI wrote a driver to get a value from -6 to 6 for X and Y for the Gigabeat
16:48:43JdGordonI'm using the actions system to do it, not the button driver
16:49:15markunok, even better I guess
16:49:25markunless code for to implement in the button driver
16:50:15JdGordonits using top->center transiion and center-> bottom from scroll up, and vice vera for scroll down
16:50:21JdGordonor other way around...
16:50:24JdGordonone of them ;p
16:52:39JdGordoncant use the center button for anything though which isnt very nice... lots of accidental actions if you stop/start in the middle
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16:52:58markunI was hoping that the speed or position of the scrolling was determined by the position on the pad..
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16:53:31JdGordonI'm sure that will come sometime though
16:53:37JdGordonthis is poor mans gestures :p
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16:55:11markunthe way it works in the OFs of the meizu and gigabeat is this:
16:55:32markunif you press and release within a timeout it's a keypress
16:55:51markunif you press and hold it past a timeout it's a keypress with repeats
16:56:05markunif you press and move within the timeout it's some slide action
16:56:49markunworks quite well I think. The only thing is that you miss the initial keypress if you want to press with repeats
16:57:04JdGordonim fairly positive that once one of the touchscreen targets are properly working someone wil come along with a patch to do just that
16:59:02*JdGordon is going to bed
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16:59:06markungood night
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16:59:54peturmarkun: I've been tinkering with something like that for H10, but got buggered by the instability of the touchpad
17:00:21peturjust touching gave readings as if the user was moving
17:00:44markunwhat's the resolution of the pad?
17:01:12petur0x40 - 0x400 I think are the readouts
17:01:37peturbut depending on the pressure the readout varies greatly
17:01:58markunhow much?
17:02:19peturso on touchdown you always get an increase, I think 0x20 easily
17:02:35peturtoo long ago and not near my notes atm
17:03:11markunif we device by 0x20 we still have 30 steps
17:03:48markundivide :)
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17:16:44pondlifeMaybe should be re-opened, so people can find it if they search...
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17:25:34BigMacHey, have a quick question about the microSD card in the sansa e200 line
17:25:44BigMacI have a 4 gb microSD card
17:26:02BigMacWill it be readable?
17:26:09Tuplanollawhy wouldn't it be?
17:26:10scorche|shi dont see why it wouldnt be
17:26:18B4gderbut not with the OF
17:26:23Mode"#rockbox -o B4gder " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
17:26:30BigMacthe FAQ jumps from 2gb cards to the SDHC
17:26:35BigMacso I wasn't quite sure
17:27:37BigMacAnyone recommend the sansa? I am looking for a flash based DAP with a large amount of space and has to be able to play ogg
17:27:54BigMacAnd the e280+4gb seems to fit
17:28:04LambdaCalculus37BigMac: Just remember that the Sansas have a new "v2" model which is unsupported by Rockbox.
17:28:18LambdaCalculus37In other words: Rockbox doesn't work on the v2 Sansas.
17:28:29BigMacSo make sure it is a v1 first?
17:28:35pondlifeI thought 4GB would have to be SDHC... am I out of date?
17:28:51B4gderthey are hc
17:29:05BigMacI am pretty sure is is just a regular microSD, nut not sure
17:29:06B4gdertheoretically they don't need to be but I've never seen any non-hc 4gb ones
17:29:24LambdaCalculus37BigMac: The firmware version number is a dead giveaway.
17:29:31BigMacI bought it for my phone which only supposrts up to the 4gb
17:29:46LambdaCalculus37If it reads something like 01.xx.xx, it's a v1. If it's 03.xx.xx, it's a v2.
17:30:00BigMacWell I wouldn't know that until I bought it, right LambdaCalculus37?
17:30:43LambdaCalculus37BigMac: If you buy it new, you're most likely going to get a v2.
17:30:50LambdaCalculus37But you can try eBay.
17:31:06BigMacThats is what I was planning on, but I will check ebay
17:31:34BigMacon the plus side I will probably donate my gigabeat to rockbox since that is the reason I got it in the first place
17:31:43LambdaCalculus37BigMac: What model Gigabeat?
17:31:49BigMacF40 I believe
17:32:05LambdaCalculus37Why not keep it? It's always good to have at least two targets. :)
17:32:17BigMacI am tired of hdd daps
17:32:19LambdaCalculus37If one goes on the blink, you have an extra one.
17:32:20B4gderyeps, for that mini-tower!
17:33:23BigMacI like the f40, but it just doesn't suit the times I listen to it
17:34:40BigMacSo I figure since the SOC is coming up, might as well give a budding programmer a target to work on
17:35:29BigBambi_Very generous of you :)
17:35:43BigMacThe least I could do
17:35:52*amiconn wonders why the v2 firmware versions start with 03.
17:36:08BigMacHave been using rockbox for enough time where it would be inconsiderate to me to do otherwise
17:36:10gevaertsDon't give it to a SoC student... They get paid for rockbox work :)
17:36:26B4gderonly the c200 and e200 v2 firmares are v3
17:36:39*amiconn thinks it might be actually a v3, with v2 being some interim dev hardware that was never released
17:36:58B4gderthey have v1 and v4 as well
17:37:00BigMacbut they would have to buy the target otherwise gevaerts
17:37:43gevaertsBigMac: sure. Most of us have to buy :). I hope you'll at least have them pay the shipping costs...
17:38:22BigMacHaha perhaps, but it wouldn't bother me either way
17:38:35BigMacYou guys don't make any money off of this really
17:38:41*gevaerts pretends to be a GSoC student
17:38:55BigMacStart with the coding and I will start with the sending
17:39:12BigMacI am a wee bit ashamed though
17:39:13*B4gder mostly just talk
17:39:22gevaertsActually I already have a gigabeat F. Wouldn'tknow what to do with a second one
17:39:26BigMacmy build is like 3-2 months old
17:39:33BigMacMate them gevaerts, duh
17:40:07gevaertsI first have to write USB host support to be able to do that :)
17:40:27BigMacI built it with all the patches I liked
17:40:51BigMacand now am not even sure which are depreciated, which are integrated, and what are still ongoing
17:42:00BigMacShould find that out one day
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18:03:11 Quit gevaerts ("work->home")
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18:06:29venoxhey there. is there anyway to make rockbox read my folder.jpg files as album art?
18:07:02 Join MethoS- [0] (
18:07:10domonokyvenox: mass convert them to cover.bmp .. :-)
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18:18:00*Nico_P crosses fingers after the big commit
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18:22:31gastBuschel: if you read the logs, could you have a look at ?
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18:41:51jhMikeSNico_P: does that commit mean the hack stuff can be removed?
18:42:08Nico_PI don't know
18:42:16Nico_PI need to test without the hack
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18:43:14jhMikeSshouldn't take 2min to #if 0 that block in ata.c :)
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18:46:44jhMikeSwhy was the irregularity needed (buffering the 1st metadata on audio) ?
18:46:54*gevaerts can't connect to the forums...
18:47:02Nico_PjhMikeS: it's the last
18:47:13*jhMikeS must've misread something
18:47:55jhMikeS"first unbuffered track" <= ??
18:48:10linuxstbgevaerts: Me neither... scorche?
18:48:25Nico_Pah, that's not very clear indeed. it's the one after the last track that fits into the buffer
18:48:31BigBambi_gevaerts: Nor me
18:48:40pondlifejhMikeS: Doesn't the hack also help where buffering is fighting with dircache scan and/or database update?
18:48:44bluebrotherGartral: noticed that the DockPod Aqua issue was fixed in rbutil? I've updated the w32 binary yesterday evening
18:49:10pondlifebluebrother: Is the updated binary on the wiki?
18:49:14jhMikeSgevaerts: will using the ULPI invalidate any of the PP driver
18:49:37jhMikeSpondlife: technically it shouldn't help anything. my sense is something deeper is broken there.
18:49:41bluebrotherpondlife: no, I've put it on my (still working) uni webspace
18:49:49pondlifebluebrother: linky?
18:49:55gevaertsjhMikeS: PP also seems to use ULPI
18:50:04 Quit crwll (Remote closed the connection)
18:50:07pondlifebluebrother: Thanks
18:51:05Nico_PjhMikeS: I get dropouts without the hack now
18:51:05jhMikeSgevaerts: ok, but they must have it set that way by default. I read out some regs and it needs explicit configure on S.
18:51:24gevaertsjhMikeS: that's possible.
18:51:28Nico_PjhMikeS: they happen on each metadata loading call
18:51:44jhMikeSEvent though it's serialized?
18:52:12pondlifebluebrother: I like the "Abort" -> "OK" button change, thanks
18:52:52Nico_PjhMikeS: yes. strangely it seems to stop happenning at one point
18:53:03gevaertsjhMikeS: you might have to write some config to REG_PORTSC0
18:53:07jhMikeSNico_P: is it possible to build with 32MB ram?
18:53:31Nico_PjhMikeS: I'll try
18:53:38jhMikeSgevaerts: What's PORTSC1 being used for?
18:54:21*jhMikeS wonders how many PORTSCx are being used
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18:54:34gevaertsjhMikeS: the controller supports two ports (for host). I don't know of any device that uses more than one though
18:54:53Nico_Phmmph. audio_current_track is wrong on a backskip
18:54:55bluebrotherpondlife: you're welcome :)
18:55:19pondlifeNico_P: That commit has made the UI much snappier (compared to SVN)
18:55:31Nico_Pcool :)
18:55:37bluebrotherI think we should still try to push a release out the next few days ... maybe some minor issues pop up so we can even include more fixes? ;-)
18:55:41*pondlife heads over to the forum....
18:55:48 Part orblivion-work
18:56:11pondlife...but the forum isn't there!
18:56:15 Join krz [0] (
18:56:42BigBambi_Um, is working for anyone?
18:56:59BigBambi_Sorry, works now seems ok is not
18:57:28bluebrothersame here. Just wanted to ask about ;-)
18:57:37BigBambi_No, the forums aren't
18:57:46scorchehold on...
18:57:55LambdaCalculus37BigBambi_: Same here.
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18:58:42*amiconn has the suspicion that something became very fishy in the ata driver with jhMikeS' locking changes
18:58:46scorchei love how this happens *after* stuff goes live
18:58:49scorcheWe were just alerted to a circuit-worth of machines being down, most likely because ThePlanet's techs are in our cage installing new equipment and probably knocked something out (as usual Sad) We're working on getting these machines back online as soon as possible.
18:58:49scorcheUpdates in a bit.
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19:01:10jhMikeSgevaerts: I'm not clear here on how PORTSCx selects for a specific port (I'm only now on the learning curve).
19:01:42gevaertsjhMikeS: for device, it's always PORTSC0
19:02:47Nico_PjhMikeS: 32 MB is no better I fear
19:02:50jhMikeSthe pp driver labels it "PORTSC1" though ?? *confused*
19:03:16*gevaerts looks
19:03:17amiconnNico_P: I get dropout on mini G2 as well
19:03:18 Nick shenson_not_here is now known as shenson (n=shenson@nat/redhat/x-8d2d9b67ba79f9d0)
19:03:29krzgevaerts: hi, can we make an interview now? or in the nearest time?
19:03:50jhMikeSNico_P: ok, thanks. /me scratches head
19:03:50gevaertskrz: it's not just me...
19:03:53Nico_Pamiconn: with my latest commit, or since before that?
19:03:57 Join raptoid [0] (n=raptoid@unaffiliated/raptoid)
19:03:57amiconnEverytime the disk has to spin up for an access, there's a short dropout, unless I increase the power-on voltage settling delay
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19:04:13krzgevaerts: ok
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19:04:45amiconnI'll test a few revisions soon. I suspect this corelocking stuff that replaced the plain old mutexes...
19:04:59*amiconn will try 16104 and 16105 first
19:05:01jhMikeSmutexes are plain old
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19:05:28 Part raptoid
19:05:45gevaertsjhMikeS: you're right. I was confused. The PORTSCx numbers seem to be 1-based
19:06:07gevaertsjhMikeS: So everywhere I said PORTSC0, substitute PORTSC1
19:06:54scorcheserver is rebooting
19:06:58jhMikeSamiconn: there's definitely no contention for a corelock if only 1 core is ever accessing the object. the corelock only protects the plain-old mutex itself from true concurrency.
19:07:16jhMikeSgevaerts: ah, thanks
19:07:19Buschelforums are dead?
19:07:34gevaertsjhMikeS: the best place for this ULPI init is probably near the PORTSCX_PORT_FORCE_FULL_SPEED stuff in usb_drv_init()
19:07:39BigBambi_Buschel: see logs ten minutes ago
19:08:40*pondlife heads over to the forum (again)
19:08:43Nico_PjhMikeS: without the hack, the codec seems to starve while the buffering thread is reading the metadata. with the hack, this doesn't happen
19:09:02BigBambi_All back now :)
19:09:12jhMikeSNico_P: so the buffering proceeds but the codec starves?
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19:09:25Nico_PjhMikeS: yes
19:09:28pondlifeSomething isn't yielding...
19:09:48*amiconn now observed a positive effect of Buschel's PP502x optimisations for the first time
19:09:50jhMikeSthat would explain the UI unresponsiveness since it's trying to increase it's priority but not running enough.
19:09:56Nico_PI did have some yields in the MP3 metadata parser
19:10:06amiconnRuntime of my small H10 increased from ~5 hours to ~7 hours
19:10:12asdrubalQuestion about sansa c200... if I mkfs.vfat -F 32 -n "c240" ... will the sansa machine restore everything for me or do I need to back it up?
19:10:35amiconn(with mostly plain svn)
19:10:47amiconnNext test will be my clock-skipping udelay
19:10:52*Nico_P hopes he won't get bashed for the weird display on back skipping, but he doesn't have time to fix it for now
19:10:58asdrubalin other words, if I format my sansa, will it become bricked?
19:11:07gevaertsasdrubal: that should be fine as far as the OF is concerned
19:11:26*pondlife bashes Nico_P for some wacky metadata display on back-skipping ;)
19:11:34asdrubalgevaerts just make sure I do the first partition and not the second?
19:11:37Nico_Pouch :)
19:11:37gevaertsasdrubal: make sure you don't format the second partition by accident, or the entire disk...
19:11:46pondlifeIt's just display though, right?
19:11:48asdrubalgevaerts K thanks
19:12:02Nico_Ppondlife: yes. it displays the next track metadata for a sec
19:12:04jhMikeSNico_P: were things like dircache/database and such turned off in the test?
19:12:17Nico_PjhMikeS: no, sorry
19:12:24pondlifeShould that matter?
19:12:37pondlifeI mean, as long as you're comparing like-for-like
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19:12:53jhMikeSit may tell something anyway
19:13:39pondlifeThe best performance test would be with everything hitting the disk at once...
19:14:03jhMikeSif contention for the disk is irrelevent, then this bug isn't really a mutex problem
19:14:29jhMikeSsince a mutex is basically an immediate return if not already claimed by another thread
19:15:15pondlifeBut what if the disk is meant to be the bottleneck, yet mutex code changes result in performance changes...?
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19:15:43pondlifeI guess that indicates anti-social code somewhere higher up?
19:17:00jhMikeSthese things happen too quickly compared to disk access speeds (scheduling times are microsecond level). It's only called aprox 1K-2K times to fill all of the buffer.
19:18:17***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
19:19:45jhMikeSpondlife: mutex may result is scheduling order changes but each thread gets it's turn no matter what and that's only if there's a waiter
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19:20:11amiconnProvided there's no bug in the scheduler...
19:21:28jhMikeSif there were one of that magnitude, all targets would see it. one minor thing fixed recently did affect all of them.
19:22:32jhMikeSand if there really is one I want to find it surely
19:23:42Nico_PjhMikeS: have you started working on USB for the S?
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19:24:13jhMikeSNico_P: started poking at it, yes
19:24:24Nico_Pcool :)
19:24:56jhMikeSmaybe this thing will just drop in without much to do (esp. since it's works already with ULPI)
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19:25:13Nico_Pthat would be nice
19:25:16 Nick _ved_ is now known as ved (
19:25:22vedhello ><
19:25:25Nico_Pis there much work needed to get audio going?
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19:26:01jhMikeSNeed an i2c driver
19:27:21jhMikeSI suppose an i2c driver isn't so hard though. It's the (S)DMA stuff that has me a bit confused.
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19:31:12jhMikeSNico_P: you didn't bother to check with only buffering accessing the drive?
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19:33:11jhMikeSor were you in-process? :)
19:36:55LambdaCalculus37jhMikeS: My Gigabeat S should be arriving either today or tomorrow. I therefore commit myself to help test the port as much as possible. :)
19:42:21jhMikeSLambdaCalculus37: nice. :) and yes, do test like crazy.
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19:44:11LambdaCalculus37jhMikeS: Will do!
19:44:33LambdaCalculus37jhMikeS: What's the status of the port thus far?
19:44:40*LambdaCalculus37 knows sound isn't ready yet
19:45:51 Quit MethoS- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
19:47:08jhMikeSLamdaCalculus37: At least you can move about the menus, use some plugins, the battery level works, detecting the charger...really basic stuff to have it just run.
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19:48:40*jhMikeS forgot a "b" in there
19:49:02*jhMikeS wonders what amiconn is "hmpf"-ing at
19:49:39amiconnThe dropout problem is pre-r16104
19:49:51*amiconn wonders why he never noticed it before
19:50:25*amiconn also doesn't understand how that weird dropout happens at all
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19:51:31*jhMikeS wonders why threads have to always be the scapegoat :p
19:52:21amiconnNo, really. Do you have an idea why spinning up the disk causes an audio dropout, even if that access doesn't have to do with buffering?
19:52:53amiconnAnd increasing the delay after ata power-on to HZ/10 makes it go away...
19:53:02amiconn(SVN has HZ/50 delay there)
19:53:33amiconnIt also goes away when building without ata poweroff
19:53:46n1samiconn, maybe the dac is super sensitive to voltage fluctuations?
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19:54:38amiconnAnd that's on mini G2... that microdrive has the fastest spin-up time of all hdd based targets
19:55:14amiconnIt also draws significantly less power than a 1.8" gdd
19:56:01amiconnI would think that hitting the disk too early causes ata errors - but why would this influence pcm?
19:56:26jhMikeSdo ata errors prevent a yield from executing?
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19:57:00amiconnThat's a good quesion...
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19:58:44krzgevaerts: any changes? :-)
19:58:44amiconnI could just increase that delay globally, but I want to understand what happens...
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20:00:20jhMikeSanother thing is could an ata error cause a mutex call imbalance too?
20:01:02jhMikeSthough that should get caught by the integrity checks if they're enabled but only for an extra unlock call
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20:03:09domonokykrz: afaik you still have to wait a bit.. :-)
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20:04:42amiconnHmm, even the first PP502x ata poweroff revision (r15444) has that problem...
20:05:37*amiconn can't imagine having overlooked this problem for that long
20:05:45*amiconn calls for mini G2 owners
20:09:39jhMikeSblocking with a mutex vs. just spinning in a switch_thread loop also has an effect that any thread still runnable gets scheduled sooner since fewer thread are available to schedule
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20:14:20jhMikeSamiconn: were dropout just initial powerup related or did they occur even if not powered down again?
20:14:37gevaertskrz: did you get my message ?
20:14:56amiconnThey only happen on actual power-on. If the disk isn't powered down, all is well
20:17:53*jhMikeS wonders if 5.5g 60/80 might have some kind of hw-related "dark" issue with ata as well
20:18:27Horschtit's hiding a dark secret
20:20:51amiconnThere is no G5.5/60 ...
20:21:04jhMikeSwell, the fact that it's the pcm buffer that drains there and not the buffering itself slowing down should raise a red flag
20:21:40amiconnBuffering iisn't active at that time at all...
20:22:27amiconnIt happens even if the buffer is filled plenty, disk spun down, and then entering a browser, loading a plugin or sth like this requires a spinup...
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20:25:46jhMikeSwhat I'm getting at is the codec priority should be able to raise enough to largely "starve-out" threads accessing the disk by far which really indicates a lack of cooperation to me
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20:28:01Buschelhmm, seems like the dock detect bit can be used to detect connected accessoires (
20:28:08Buschelat least on 5G
20:29:18amiconnIt almost looks like something stops yielding for too long if there are ata errors
20:29:22Buschelwhat would be a good place to check this bit? is there any tick thread that does such polling/checking?
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20:30:20amiconnIt doesn't matter what is causing the spinup. Observed it with file browsers, loading plugins, and also buffering itself (and I'm certain that the latter doesn't suffer from main buffer underrun. Not with only ~500ms spinup time)
20:30:41amiconnThe dropouts are pretty short, about 1/4 second (estimated)
20:32:41pondlifeAny Archos users able to confirm that voice menus are working ok with current code? A chap on the ML is having trouble..
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20:33:27pondlifejhMikeS: Any ideas as to why the hackery was only needed on the 64MB models?
20:34:01pondlife(in case that's relevant here)
20:35:36*LambdaCalculus37 has been very naughty and hasn't updated his JBR build in Eris knows how long :)
20:36:28Horschtwho's Eris?
20:36:47gevaertsSomeone who knows things ;)
20:37:03LambdaCalculus37More specifically:
20:37:30Horschtshe looks fugly
20:37:46pondlifeIt's not her best side.
20:38:06gevaertsIt was a cheap portrait artist
20:38:54LambdaCalculus37But before we anger Her... back to the topic?
20:39:07vedgevaerts: hi, do You have pms turned off? Or should I just wait ?
20:39:27pondlifeYes, we don't want to start a war between the Releasians and the Incrementalians...
20:39:29jhMikeSpondlife: not at all...though maybe we're onto something with this ata error business
20:39:31Horschtdoes it really occur on 64MB Ipod videos only?
20:40:17pondlifeI guess we need some kind of measure of how long any particular thread is running for....but absolutely no pre-emption ;)
20:40:24jhMikeSHorscht: I have my sister's 5.5g 30GB for testing and it's runs flawlessly with literally everything running right at boot
20:41:01amiconnIs it limited to 64MB, or actually the G5.5/80 only?
20:41:02*jhMikeS preempts ponlife
20:41:10gevaertsved: sorry. I had messages from unregisterd users filtered
20:41:12*amiconn thinks someone should test on G5/60
20:41:29gevaertsved: you can try again now
20:41:37HorschtI think Buschel has one of those
20:41:59Buschelno, I've also got a 5.5G 30GB
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20:42:10Horschtah, ok. sorry
20:42:24*jhMikeS adds in thread.c switch_thread_interrupt
20:42:24amiconnI know LinusN has one
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20:43:18LambdaCalculus37I only have a 5.5G 30GB as well.
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20:46:32HorschtG5.5/80 here :/
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20:48:12jhMikeSpondlife: it's profile_thread but I don't know if that even works now since I've never bothered with it.
20:48:26pondlifeAh, yes - profiling....
20:48:36pondlifeI forgot we (used to) have that
20:49:09RoC_MasterMindI am considering getting a Toshiba Gigabeat F40 instead of an iPod 4th Gen...I see the LCD driver and usb handler aren't complete...what's the experience with rockbox like right now?
20:49:15jhMikeSI can't imagine it shouldn't since the index was just replaced with (thread - threads[0])
20:49:28pondlifeRoC_MasterMind: The F40 works fine
20:49:49RoC_MasterMindcool pondlife ...any thoughts on the physical design like the + button?
20:49:59RoC_MasterMinddoes it have a hold switch too?
20:50:10LambdaCalculus37Every DAP that I've seen does.
20:50:15pondlifeIt's an excellent target for Rockbox, but I don't like the + much myself - it's not very tactile and I have fat fingers
20:50:22pondlifeIt does have a hold switch
20:50:41RoC_MasterMindhmm....anything you don't like about it?
20:50:52pondlifeJust that I prefer clicky tactile buttons.
20:50:58pondlifeOtherwise it's great
20:51:22pondlifeI would totally recommend it
20:51:22LambdaCalculus37RoC_MasterMind: The Gigabeat doesn't have FM radio or recording. But it's one of the fastest Rockbox targets, so audio and video playback are superb.
20:51:29jhMikeStoo all concerned: the gigabeast can pull a trick and start placing the files put on the device in a different directory and the untarring won't work
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20:51:53LambdaCalculus37jhMikeS: Have a beer! :)
20:51:59*LambdaCalculus37 gives jhMikeS a beer
20:52:21 Quit nplus_ (Remote closed the connection)
20:52:59*jhMikeS takes the beer with gratitude (and now has to sober-up before trying to program more)
20:53:14RoC_MasterMindoh it does video?
20:53:44pondlifeMost Rockbox targets do
20:53:54pondlifeBut the Gigabeat does it very well
20:54:15LambdaCalculus37pondlife: You mean "with gusto". :)
20:54:23jhMikeSIt plays NTSC at 320x240 just fine
20:54:43Nico_PLambdaCalculus37: what are you cheering about? have I missed something?
20:54:44RoC_MasterMindi had the 4th gen ipod greyscale...obviously it didn't
20:55:25jhMikeSthough that framerate does use most of its potential
20:55:40LambdaCalculus37Nico_P: Actually, I think I prematurely cheered. :)
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20:56:20jhMikeSNico_P: The gigabeast tricking you
20:56:56Nico_Pbtw, I just updated my beast and it's nice to see the battery level and shutdown working :)
20:57:04jhMikeSI had to do a quick reformat of storage to bring it back
20:57:08 Quit MethoS- (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
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20:57:11RoC_MasterMindwhat kind of runtimes does the battery get on the f40 with rockbox?
20:57:22Nico_PjhMikeS: do you know where the files were stored?
20:58:04jhMikeS /Content/0b00/01/
20:58:37jhMikeSit incremented it at some point for some reason (maybe too many times writing it)
20:58:43Nico_Pmaybe it does that afer you send a certain number of files
20:59:41Nico_PI think I've sent more than that amount
20:59:51jhMikeSI'm sure that's the reason. One thing that would be easier is if it would do that same thing if just rockbox.gigabeat were present
21:00:08jhMikeSsame thing = copy firmare
21:00:25Nico_Pyes, it would be much faster
21:00:34Nico_PI might hack it in tomorrow
21:00:43Nico_Pbut feel free to ;)
21:03:15 Part pondlife
21:04:48 Quit bluebroth3r (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
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21:06:24jhMikeSNico_P: does the latest bl still work? I haven't tried a one based on latest.
21:08:12*jhMikeS still wonders why he's getting "unhandled IRQ in irq_handler" occasionally since that vector isn't used with the avic enabled
21:08:18 Quit MethoS-- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
21:09:48jhMikeSwhen it happens, it's always when untarring
21:10:35 Quit krz (" ?")
21:11:14bertrikjhMikeS: I'm working with LPC2xxx microcontrollers, ARM-based and some have a bug causing a spurious interrupt in very rare cases (IIRC, when peripherals give very short interrupts). Perhaps you're running into a similar bug.
21:12:40jhMikeSthe only peripheral giving interrupts should be the tick. is there a workaround?
21:15:12jhMikeSof course something could go wrong when switch from the normal mechanism to the avic and ints are enabled in other modules at the time
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21:15:58bertrikIIRC, the fix is simply to have a default IRQ handler that does nothing but acknowledge the interrupt in the VIC
21:16:22bertrikI'm not familiar with the avic
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21:17:17jhMikeSinterrupts are all acked in their own module registers meaning that there's no global register that acks them on imx31
21:18:06*jhMikeS will double-check that
21:18:21***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
21:19:13bertrikgevaerts: any luck with the USB problem you were investigating?
21:19:32gevaertsbertrik: not yet, except that I suspect that some of my debug code was wrong...
21:19:45gevaertsBut no real clue
21:20:06jhMikeSnope, no global INTPND or anything like s3c2440, or MCF52xx
21:20:23gevaertsbertrik: I've been kind of busy with gsoc things
21:21:49jhMikeSthe problem is that it happens in usual irq_handler not in an unused vector in the table (which would tell the interrupt name)
21:22:29Nico_PjhMikeS: I haven't updated my BL in a while
21:22:49jhMikeSthough the avic registers will tell it anyway now that I think about it
21:23:11*Nico_P leaves
21:23:23jhMikeSNico_P: it's a bad process on windows atm
21:24:54*jhMikeS shuts up and works on USBeast
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21:25:57jhMikeSgevaerts: what needs to be defined in order to include all the stack stuff?
21:26:02 Quit mirak (Success)
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21:27:34gevaertsjhMikeS: I think you need HAVE_USBSTACK, USB_VENDOR_ID and USB_PRODUCT_ID for enumeration to work. If you want working mass storage, you also need USE_ROCKBOX_USB
21:28:15 Quit mirak (SendQ exceeded)
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21:29:49jhMikeSgevaerts: what about serial number?
21:30:25amiconnLambdaCalculus37: Not all daps have hold switches
21:30:32gevaertsjhMikeS: if you don't provide specific serial number code, the stack makes one up from the HD serial number
21:30:33*amiconn has 4 targets withou tone
21:30:39 Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection)
21:30:39amiconn*without one
21:31:12LambdaCalculus37amiconn: I know the Archos devices don't.
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21:34:14John64i noticed that you are looking for people to test Rockbox Utility under vista. I am running vista and an 80GB iPod and it seems to be working about as well as it does in Linux
21:34:27bluebrotherJohn64: nice to hear :)
21:34:31amiconnAnother remark is that all rockbox targets with just one single exception play video (in rockbox)
21:34:47 Quit FOAD (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
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21:34:49*linuxstb wonders if that will always be the case... ;)
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21:35:12John64though, every time i try to play a song, rockbox is saying "Codec Failure"
21:35:14amiconnlinuxstb: what?
21:35:23linuxstbvideo on the Player...
21:36:34amiconnUhmmm... at 20x14, with a few extra gaps inbetween?
21:37:15 Join ap0 [0] (
21:37:25Buschelsorry to repeat myself: is there a proposed place/thread in the source where polling for GPIO (accessory detect) and setting some power control for iPod could be nicely included?
21:37:37*Buschel doesn't want to make an ugly solution
21:39:26John64ok, now it is saying rockbox can't load the codecs in /.rockboc/codecs/flac.codec
21:39:51bluebrotherJohn64: sounds like you have two installations mixed up. Try reinstalling
21:39:53John64it is doing the same for mp3's
21:39:56John64ok, thanks
21:40:11PaulJamBuschel: did you see that he reported that the remote has no sound with r17111? so maybe your commit wasn't the cause for that.
21:41:12John64is there a lot of working happening with ipod battery life?
21:41:39John64more appropriately, is that a priority of the project?
21:42:30amiconnBuschel: Probably another thing for the powermgmt rework...
21:42:30BuschelPaulJam: to be honest, i don't trust his second test too much.
21:42:43PaulJamBuschel: i just see that the current build page is still at r 17110.
21:43:10John64bluebrother: it seems to still be happening. i downloaded the latest build and extracted it, there is only one installation there and i am getting the same issue. It is giving me the correct bitrates
21:44:22BuschelJohn64: there were several optimizations beginning of February, and there is still some room for improvement
21:44:37John64Buschel: thanks
21:44:40PaulJamBuschel: so i guess he didn't check the rockbox info screen and is really at r17110.
21:45:26BuschelPaulJam: i think so. but i'm wondering why his GPIO's didn't change in his last test −− i guess he didn't test correct
21:45:42John64if the bootloader gets me into rockbox, it wouldn't be the source of my problems would it? I have run this ipod with rockbox before
21:46:20BuschelJohn64: what was the last version before yoiu've updated? maybe the bootloader is out of time?
21:47:00John64i installed the latest bootloader
21:47:36Buschelamiconn: maybe I'll just implement an evil proof-of-concept patch before the sophisticated solution
21:48:31BigBambi_John64: Just to be sure, could you remove the .rockbox folder (having saved any cfgs etc. you want to keep), then re-extract
21:48:44John64BigBambi_: i have already done that a couple times
21:48:57BigBambi_Weird then
21:49:03John64i do have the 1.3 apple firmware for the Video
21:49:23BigBambi_Codec errors are usually a mismatch between rockbox.ipod (or whatever) and the rest of the install
21:49:51 Quit perrikwp (" ajax IRC Client")
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21:50:09John64i am going to do a restore in iTunes and try again from scratch, should i remove rockbox's bootloader first
21:50:32LambdaCalculus37iTunes will wipe it as well.
21:50:42LambdaCalculus37So just restore and start clean.
21:51:18 Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@rockbox/developer/mcuelenaere)
21:52:00John64now windows is saying i need to format the drive. this is odd
21:52:22BigBambi_John64: You have connected via the OF or OF disk mode?
21:52:22 Join TMM [0] (
21:52:28 Quit ompaul (Client Quit)
21:52:34John64disk mode
21:54:20 Join Peregrina [0] (
21:54:49Buschelregarding another issue: gui boost (aka "battery-life-for-mpc-and-flac", aka "use-far-less-than-30MHz-as-default-clock") -> it should be sufficient to boost cpu when scrolling in lists, not on each button activity. correct?
21:55:20 Join webguest38 [0] (n=d83620e2@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
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21:57:15John64is flac a low overhead codec?
21:57:30John64ok, this rockbox is looking heathier already
21:57:36Buschelwe know that mpc decodes @24MHz + 2.5MHz (dsp/i2s), flac at even less (~12MHz + 2.5MHz)
21:57:52John64is there a way i can set the clock rate manually while playing
21:58:08earHurtsanyone know who fixed the ipod scroll accell? It works better than mine did
21:58:11John64that is insane btw, flac is my favorite codec, and why i don't like the apple firmware
21:58:31linuxstbearHurts: Hi - welcome back ;) I think that was jhMikeS's implementation that finally got in.
21:58:37BuschelearHurts: the scrollwheel accel in svn?
21:58:49earHurtsyes, in the latest build
21:59:03John64it works wonderfully
21:59:06earHurtshi linuxstb ;)
21:59:15Buschelbasic idea came from jhMikeS (sansa), I've adapted it for iPods
21:59:21BigBambi_John64: FLAC uses very little CPU to decode, but has to hit the disk more often
21:59:29John64right, makes sense
21:59:31earHurtsJohn64: yes, it does. I had submitted a patch that worked not as well
21:59:42BigBambi_But overall is pretty efficient
21:59:57John64what frequency is required for mp3/aac?
22:00:05earHurtsI am interested in browsing the svn to see the code, but how do I browse svn with a web browser?
22:00:18BigBambi_John64: Depends on DAP - I think there is a wiki page somewhere
22:00:20Buschelmp3 needs about 40MHz overall (no WPS)
22:00:50LearBuschel: Regarding the accessory presence detection, using the same place as the headphone detection makes sense, imho. That means the button tick task.
22:00:54 Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:01:21earHurtsoh, there seem to be some bugs in databse; specifically in reading tags. Anyone currently working on that?
22:01:33BuschelLear: that is my favorite for a quick-and-dirty version. let's see how it works :)
22:02:20 Join TaylorKillian [0] (
22:03:59LinusNwelcome TaylorKillian
22:04:09 Join DavidSG [0] (
22:04:29John64is a reallllllly slow copy rate a sign of a dieing ipod?
22:05:12TaylorKillianHey LinusN
22:05:49TaylorKillianI believe that I am ready for my interview
22:06:08gevaertsGreat :)
22:06:33 Join petur [50] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur)
22:07:24troy_any one in here have experience on craking firmware in .bin format i need to make a keygen for an akai mpc2500 drummachine
22:07:44TaylorKillian(Note that I am on my phone, so typing will be slow.)
22:07:53 Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@rockbox/developer/mcuelenaere)
22:08:20LinusNTaylorKillian: just stay tuned
22:08:57troy_any one
22:09:08gevaertstroy_: that's off-topic here
22:09:14BigBambi_troy_: This is really only a rockbox channel
22:09:15PaulJamtroy_: this channel is about rockbox
22:09:27BigBambi_Any more? :)
22:10:01troy_ok @bigbambi do you know of a chanel where i can find some hackers ?
22:10:08BigBambi_No, sorry
22:10:20troy_any one
22:10:35Buschelbye folks, gotta get some sleep. see you!
22:10:39BigBambi_troy_: As we say, this is an on-topic channel
22:10:39gevaertstroy_: asking about other channels is also off-topic
22:10:42 Quit Buschel ()
22:10:45LinusNthis channel is full of hackers, maybe just not the kind that you look for :-)
22:11:13troy_ok sorry
22:11:41vedstart with IDA disasm ;]
22:12:25troy_ill pay
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22:15:39John64in terms of audio quality and rockbox compatibility what is the best device to get?
22:16:07LinusNJohn64: i would say iriver H100 series
22:16:37linuxstbI would rate the H100 quite low for sound quality - I find it very noisy.
22:16:55*amiconn still didn't get used to the ipod scrollwheel acceleration :(
22:17:09LinusNamiconn: you're too old :-)
22:17:14amiconnIt overshoots a lot for me...
22:17:19BigBambi_For features and rockbox compatibility I'd say iriver H1x0, but much as I love it I'm not sure I would say it was best for sound quality
22:17:47LearWith high impedance earphones, noise isn't a problem, in my experience.
22:18:02linuxstbJohn64: If you want a hard disk target, I would say the Gigabeat F series is excellent value for money.
22:18:05John64well, i care more about audio quality than compatibility then i guess
22:18:09amiconnThe old 1st/2nd Gen without scrollwheel acceleration are a lot easier to operate imo
22:18:11John64i will check that out
22:18:12ZincAlloyI still think a scrollwheel is a bad way to navigate an mp3 player...
22:18:16BigBambi_It isn't bad at all, having said that
22:18:29PaulJamsame for h300. i was a little bit disappointed when i got some in ear headphones.
22:18:29*bluebrother was not impressed by the sound quality of the Ipod compared to the h100
22:18:39BigBambi_The F is nice too, but misses recording and radio
22:18:48BigBambi_bluebrother: I had already dismissed them in my head :)
22:18:54linuxstbbluebrother: Which ipod? The 5g (and I assume later) is significantly better than my Color.
22:18:55John64is the irivier h3xx series alright for sound? I hate the sound on my iPod
22:19:03John64i have a 5.5g
22:19:04amiconnNo overshooting, and yet fast enough for all my lists. The only disadvantage of that wheel driver is that it doesn't handle repeat, hence no dynamic wrap-protection in lists
22:19:04bluebrotherI only know the mini.
22:19:06ZincAlloyno problem with my Koss Porta Pros and my h300
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22:19:24John64i <3 my Denon HD-A1000
22:19:26gevaertsTaylorKillian: did you get my message ?
22:19:44amiconnTo me it seems that dap sound quality degrades with every new generation... :/
22:19:45bluebrotherbut I'm looking for a gigabeat.
22:19:49vedZincAlloy: definitelly wheel sux for doom play
22:20:14vedhard to click direction buttns hehe
22:20:23BigBambi_I would claim that Doom is not the primary aim of an audio player....
22:20:36John64BigBambi_: really?
22:20:37ZincAlloyved: for sure! I hardly ever play doom, but I think it's also uncomfortable for browsing
22:20:46 Quit ze (Remote closed the connection)
22:20:49 Join ze [0] (
22:20:50BigBambi_John64: Yeah, contrary to what some seem to think :)
22:21:10John64i assume you have seen Quake3 on the touch?
22:21:11linuxstbI quite like the wheel - it's nice to have all buttons together. (I prefer it to the gigabeat/H100 etc)
22:21:13vedyea, this diamong dame ftw
22:21:16 Nick BigBambi_ is now known as BigBambi (n=Alex@rockbox/staff/BigBambi)
22:21:17 Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:21:28vedjewels ;]
22:22:00John64i bet they don't make the gigabeat f anymore do they :'(
22:22:08John64it looks sweet
22:22:15vedamiconn: I never know whether it is dap, poor damn mp3 or headphones ;/
22:22:19BigBambiI'm not fond of the wheel on the e200 - I find it awkward to press the surrounding buttons, but I hate the faux-cross on the gigabeat F. The beast cross is nice though
22:22:40*linuxstb was talking ipod wheel
22:22:41BigBambiJohn64: No, but they pop up on ebay fairly regularly, and fairly cheap
22:22:47ZincAlloylinuxstb: I can't get used to constantly turning the wheel. pushing a button is so much easier in my opinion
22:23:02linuxstbZincAlloy: I have very short lists, so it's not a problem.
22:23:18ZincAlloylinuxstb: I see...
22:23:35John64BigBambi: i will keep an eye out for one. i just noticed there isnt a single rockbox target in production
22:23:46amiconnved: Well, I can compare the sound of all my targets using the same phones/ hifi ...
22:23:48BigBambiNot, not anymore
22:23:52John64so sound is good on the GB F
22:24:10BigBambiJohn64: I think so, but it all depends on ears and earphones
22:24:13linuxstbJohn64: How would you rate your 5.5g?
22:24:32BigBambiI have decent earphones (sennheiser cx95), but cloth ears :)
22:24:32John64compared to my HDA laptop
22:24:53John64i have Denon over ear headphones which i can pick up every little thing from the ipod
22:25:14John64my desktop has an X-Meridiand which sounds infinitely better than the ipod
22:25:18BigBambiI suspect you will notice something from most DAPs then
22:25:38ZincAlloyfor sure!
22:26:16John64when are they going to make a dap that caters to the audiophile. all i as for is a good audio, flac support and decent battery. It could be 2lbs and the size of a brick for all i care
22:26:51John64good news though, rockbox is working again :D
22:26:55scorche|shthe H100 is as close as you get for that sort of thing...SPDIF..
22:27:14BigBambiYes, optical + line in + out on the H100 is nice
22:27:37John64wow. now, do they make pocket sized battery powered dacs? :P
22:27:43BigBambiThat is
22:27:55BigBambiI misread dac for dap
22:28:23linuxstbJohn64: Do you know about ?
22:28:40John64yep, i am a member but i don't really care for that site much
22:28:49markunJohn64: with sensitive earphones you can hear noise from the HDD in the audio coming from the Gigabeat
22:28:58John64oh :(
22:29:01John64that is a deal breaker
22:29:11markunyou'll find that with many DAPs
22:29:16BigBambiI really think you will struggle with any DAP though
22:29:29*bluebrother starts to get annoyed by the repeated port requests in the tracker
22:29:38BigBambiThe screeching noise on reading the flash in the e200 for instance
22:29:41John64i get that in my ipod
22:29:43markunbluebrother: ipod classic?
22:30:01bluebrothermarkun: various.
22:30:03*bertrik must be deaf for stuff like that
22:30:21vedBigBambi: maybe Im deaf but e200 played without scratches for me ;)
22:30:22bluebrotherit's just really getting annoying −− we have tracker guidelines for this :(
22:30:31markunbertrik: you can't hear it with every headphone (at least I can't)
22:30:47 Part rasher
22:30:50BigBambived: Depends on sensitivity of earphones as well - it is definitely there
22:31:01*gevaerts must be deaf. He can't hear anything wrong when listening to his mono 56kbps transcoded mp3s
22:31:09BigBambilol :)
22:31:21vedcant hear anything
22:31:28gevaertsEven the music in those is just fine
22:31:38markungevaerts: casette tape rips?
22:31:39John64how clean is rockbox code in overall design. i want to start playing around with more low level code (java programming spoils you)
22:31:47BigBambigevaerts: I hope you transcoded up from 32kbps for better quality?
22:31:57gevaertsBigBambi: of course :)
22:32:03BigBambiJohn64: I guess that depends on what part of the code
22:32:06John64is rockbox supposed to make the ipod sound better :P
22:32:08vedJohn64: amazing how many ifdefs can ppl make in one function :DDD
22:32:09BigBambiBest just dive in!
22:32:09bertrikJohn64: quite clean IMO, but there's a lot of #ifdefs
22:32:26John64preprocessors don't scare me
22:32:52markunJohn64: some people claim rockbox sounds better, but if you measure it the produce the same sound
22:32:53gevaertsActually, they are time-shifted realaudio things, often 40 or 50 kbps
22:32:55veddo{} while(0) tricks on daily basis? :)
22:32:56bertrikmosquitoes don't scare me, but they are surely annoying
22:32:57scorche|shJohn64: objective tests show that they sound pretty much identical, but people say it sounds better (as well as the opposite)...however Rockbox for sure has many more ways of adjusting the sound to your taste
22:32:59BigBambiJohn64: MP3 decoders are much of a muchness, and we can't do anything about the hardware, but I guess the 5 band parametric equalizer can help
22:33:44John64well, for one the crossfeed makes sure i don't vomit from dizzyness
22:34:03John64that is an improvement, i find without crossfeed i get dizzy
22:34:59markunme too
22:35:06 Quit Mathiasdm ("Yuuw!")
22:35:26*gevaerts has no dizzyness issues when listening to those files of his
22:35:40*amiconn neither
22:36:13amiconnI tried crossfeed once... sounds rather strange to me, and noticeably degrades sound quality
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22:36:44markungevaerts, amiconn: I have a song for you to try if you want :)
22:36:59vedI wonder if someone start making mp3 players on DSP, all filers and equalizers for free
22:37:07ZincAlloyprocessing an mp3 with eq is not really a good idea for you're trying to eq things that the mp3 codec left away because they *should* be inaudible...
22:37:28 Quit Peregrina ("ChatZilla 0.9.81 [Firefox]")
22:38:16toffe82markun: did you write a song ? ;)
22:38:41markuntoffe82: unfortunately this song which makes you vomit is not made by me :)
22:38:49*gevaerts suspects he probably won't like that song, even with crossfeed
22:39:11amiconnAfaiu, crossfeed should reduce perceived stereo width a bit, but for me it doesn't seem to do that, and it produces muffled, imprecise sound instead..
22:39:14whoever_hi together. I have a small problem. my filesystem of my iAudio is destroyed (ehm - not completly destroyed - just a bit)! so i want to formate my iAudio. does this function after that? can I just create the old folders and rockbox run again?
22:39:21whoever_sorry for my english, but I'm german
22:39:29markunit's a Badly Drawn Boy song called "This Song"
22:40:01vedsuspicious title
22:40:02*amiconn actually uses *increased* stereo width (just the opposite-phase thing) when listening with earphones
22:40:07*gevaerts grabs his web browser
22:40:26ZincAlloyamiconn, crossfeed works pretty good for me. I can localize the music in front of me instead of inside my head
22:41:29amiconnYeah, it seems it's supposed to do that too, but for me it doesn't do that at all
22:41:30markunZincAlloy: unfortunately it's impossible to make one which work the same for everybody since it depends on the shape of your head and ears etc
22:42:04amiconnThe localisation with and without crossfeed is exactly the same for me, just the sound quality degrades with it enabled
22:42:06ZincAlloyamiconn: increasing the stereo width should make everything sound even more imprecise. especially things in the center of the stereo mix..
22:42:24amiconnBut then, in-head localisation is no problem imho...
22:42:52amiconnZincAlloy: Yeah, but it doesn't, or at least much less than the frequency-dependent crossfeed
22:43:07ZincAlloyI think it is. that's not how a stereo mix is meant to be heard
22:43:46*amiconn prefers speakers over head-/earphones anyway, ond only uses the latter if speakers are impracticable
22:44:21amiconnWhat puzzles me though is that crossfeed doesn't have the effect it should have *at all* for me...
22:44:48markunamiconn: you just have a difficult head to model in such a simple filter :)
22:45:51amiconnWell, what I would expect if the filter isn't ideal for the individual head is that it has at least a partial effect in the right direction
22:45:58ZincAlloyamiconn: just trying to widen things up.... I think it sounds pretty horrible compared to 100% stereo width. 100% on headphones is extremely wide anyway...
22:46:36*ved goes eat a horse
22:46:47 Quit Lear ("ChatZilla 0.9.81 [Firefox 3.0pre/2008041408]")
22:46:47markunved: bon apetit
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22:49:21ZincAlloyamiconn: you could never get that much channel seperation on speakers... that's why we have crossfeed... I think it helps overly wide recordings with weired panning of instruments (think 1960ies music) - though it sure isn't perfect..
22:50:39John64gotta love how half the band is on one channel and the other have on another
22:51:15markunWhen preglow and I worked on the crossfeed effect we tested it with "Lucy In The Sky With Diamonds" :)
22:51:20ZincAlloythat's mostly records that were meant to be mixed for mono
22:51:45John64rockbox really is confusing to navigate until you get used to it
22:52:10*John64 is too used to the ipod's navigation
22:53:23ZincAlloyJohn64: I think the menus are pretty tidy. I can find everything very fast - but then again I have been using rockbox for years :D
22:53:52 Quit m0f0x ()
22:54:12ZincAlloymarkun: classic example for a recording that was meant for mono. a shame that the mono mix isn't available on CD
22:54:28 Quit ved (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:54:37markunI only have Pet Sounds in mono
22:54:54John64i have used it for 10 hours in my whole life
22:55:43markunJohn64: in that case: welcome to the wonderful world of rockbox!
22:55:45ZincAlloymy Pet Sounds CD has both, the mono and stereo mix. the stereo mix is rather new and not bad at all. nicely balanced
22:56:23markunanyway, this is getting pretty off-topic
22:56:31ZincAlloyJohn64: welcome! you'll sure get used to it. have you read the manual?
22:57:28 Quit fehmicans (Remote closed the connection)
22:57:42ZincAlloymarkun: true. back to topic: crossfeed makes Lucy in the sky much more listenable.
22:57:57John64no, it is easy enough to use, it is just stuff like remembering the menu button works differently
22:58:08scorche|shback to off-topic you mean? ;)
22:58:08John64is that a mono album?
22:58:13 Quit whoever_ ("Bin dann mal weg - allen noch 'nen schönen Tag")
22:58:22DavidSGhello, I am ready for my interview whenever you are.
22:58:39ZincAlloyisn't crossfeed ontopic?
22:59:38gevaertsDavidSG: a few more minutes please :)
22:59:53DavidSGgevaerts: ok not a problem
22:59:59markunamiconn: I was working on some ideas I had to make more use of the touchpad on the gigabeat, but it's not working very well with the current button.c
23:00:15 Quit n1s (" Like's GUI? Then try HydraIRC -> <-")
23:00:22John64if my files use a smart directory structure, is it a good idea to forgoe the database?
23:00:48BigBambiJohn64: It is up to you, but personally I prefer using a file tree, yes
23:00:56ZincAlloyJohn64: I think so, but it depends on ones personal preferences
23:01:38John64i have the files layed out exactly as i would use them, so i guess less overhead is good
23:02:23 Quit lee-qid (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:02:30troy_this is off topic
23:02:51gevaertstroy_: why is it ?
23:03:03 Join Rince_ [0] (
23:03:14 Quit bughunter2 ("Leaving.")
23:03:23BigBambitroy_: I would say a discussion on how to use rockbox is fairly on-topic myself
23:03:34troy_but say i have correct user name and password for a program . is it possible to make a keygen with out hacking the sortware ?
23:03:45 Quit Rincewind (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:04:02John64ok, that is way off topic
23:04:21 Join Rincewind [0] (
23:04:24troy_sorry but i cant find the answer any where
23:04:51John64something tells me rockbox won't either. try efnet warez
23:05:06BigBambitroy_: Seriously, just because you can't find something elsewhere, don't just ask us
23:05:11troy_thanks john
23:05:18BigBambiJohn64: And plase don't suggest anything like that, even in jest
23:05:26troy_sorry again
23:05:33BigBambiWe take copyright seriously
23:05:38scorche|shone more mention of it, and whoever says it is gone...
23:06:41troy_i wont say it again
23:06:42 Quit earHurts ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
23:07:16John64what are the treble and bass cutoffs for? They have 1-4 as options?
23:07:17markunscorche|sh: man.. this is so tempting.. :)
23:07:39 Nick shenson is now known as shenson_not_here (n=shenson@nat/redhat/x-8d2d9b67ba79f9d0)
23:07:58markunJohn64: I guess those are setting from the wolfson DAC
23:08:15markunwe probably should put numbers there in Hz
23:08:46John64would 1 be a lower frequency or a higher level of cutoff
23:10:01markunI guess you will have to check the datasheet for that :(
23:10:39LloreanSince the frequencies used change with sample rate, iirc, we just gave them arbitrary designations
23:10:43LloreanI believe 1 is lower and 4 is higher.
23:10:55John64lower frequency for where the cutoff is?
23:10:56 Part TaylorKillian
23:11:07LloreanYes, lower frequency...
23:11:44LloreanThe best solution would be just to test and verify that it is, though
23:12:13John64i was wondering what the number represented, and i now know (abitrarity)
23:13:14 Quit Makuseru (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:13:25LloreanWell, displaying the actual frequencies added a complication, and if you pick a frequency, you might find yourself frustrated to discover that it wasn't that frequency for all your music (assuming the possibility of a mixed sample rate collection)
23:13:32 Join Makuseru [0] (
23:15:56amiconnmarkun: The Hz settings were changed into simple numbers on purpose
23:16:19markunamiconn: sorry, didn't know that
23:16:19amiconnThe frequencies aren't fixed, but change with sample rate
23:16:33markunbut we always use 44100Hz
23:16:52markunis this in preparation for dynamic samplerates?
23:18:15ZincAlloydynamic sample rates?
23:18:17John64what does data abort at 00065D70 (0) mean?
23:18:24***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
23:18:26amiconnWe use 44100Hz for music playback, yes. But most DACs are capable of multiple sample rates, and at least some targets allow to select sample rate
23:18:38amiconnNot used for music, but e.g. for midi, or doom
23:18:51LloreanZincAlloy: Several of our players should be able to playback at multiple sample rates rather than having to resample with our somewhat low quality resampler.
23:19:01amiconnI'd like to see multiple sample rates supported for music playback as well
23:19:47 Join kushal_12_27_200 [0] (n=kushal@
23:20:03amiconnThe transition cannot be gapless of course, but then a sample rate change within an album is extremely unlikely
23:20:56 Quit Rince_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:21:38amiconnSound quality for non-44100Hz files would improve noticeably, I think, even icompared to a better resampler than we have
23:24:23 Part LinusN
23:24:49John64well, i should get back to studying, thanks everyone for the help, things are a lot more clear now
23:25:25ZincAlloybye, John!
23:25:40markunJohn64: hope to see you soon again
23:26:16John64you will, i am really liking the progress rockbox has made, i am going to keep it on my player this time i think. Hopefully i can wrap my head around the code pretty quickly too
23:26:42markungood luck with your studies
23:27:00 Quit bluebrother ("leaving")
23:27:45 Nick John64 is now known as John64_away (n=4c458061@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
23:33:25 Join LambdaCalculus37 [0] (n=1800dac6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
23:42:29*LambdaCalculus37 shows jhMikeS his shiny new Gigabeast :)
23:43:09LambdaCalculus37jhMikeS: It arrived today.
23:44:10 Quit Mouser_X (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:47:56 Join ved [0] (
23:48:42 Join Zarggg [0] (
23:49:19moosLambdaCalculus37: Congratulations !
23:49:20 Quit jgarvey ("Leaving")
23:49:54moosit came with a good timing (ragarding amazing progresses that jhMikeS is making :)
23:50:05 Quit DerPapst (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
23:50:20LambdaCalculus37moos: Damn good timing, I say. :)
23:52:10moosmine came a bit too early and then did stay in deep sleep until jhMikeS made it up again ;)
23:52:19scorche|shamiconn: do you think Berlin is still an option, or should we just go with Sweden again?
23:52:55LambdaCalculus37moos: The GigabeatSInfo wiki page mentions an nk.bin file in the source that does not allow dual booting, but can run Rockbox.
23:53:18BigBambiLambdaCalculus37: You want dual booting for now
23:53:34LambdaCalculus37BigBambi: Of course. :)
23:53:48LambdaCalculus37Let me get my beast.
23:53:58moosLambdaCalculus37: I don't use OF at all then no need for me, but I guess dualboot is availiable
23:54:01amiconnscorche: It's an option, but somehow we need a decision
23:54:35BigBambimoos: I was thinking of USB (crippled as it is in the OF) for now
23:55:09scorche|shamiconn: you think you could put out a mail to the list similar to Bagder's and perhaps say a bit about the area/location?
23:55:58moosBigBambi: yeah still depending of it for now like others software USB targets, let's hope in our USB stack. (I don't use my beast yet...)
23:55:59 Join r0rshach [0] (n=chatzill@
23:56:02jhMikeSwell, it locks up when plugging USB so I suppose that's progress :p
23:56:11mooshehe :)
23:57:37LambdaCalculus37Well, I plugged in via USB and got a "Connected" screen, but no devices are showing up in Linux.
23:57:52r0rshachdo you need to format the drive?
23:57:54BigBambiLambdaCalculus37: Of course not
23:57:59BigBambiLambdaCalculus37: It is MTP crap
23:58:11gevaertsLambdaCalculus37: try lsusb (as root)
23:58:18r0rshachewww mtp
23:58:35LambdaCalculus37gevaerts: Yes, it shows up.
23:58:42BigBambiLambdaCalculus37: you can mount it with fuse (or whatever it is called), but you still have to reconnect it after every operation (for me anyway)
23:58:54LambdaCalculus370930:0010 Toshiba Corp.

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