| 00:00:00 | Nico_P | stripwax: it's also free as in free speech |
| 00:00:01 | stripwax | goffa - I think I agree with those key combinations |
| 00:00:24 | rocko_ | so it uses gstreamer then to play mp3 then |
| 00:00:32 | Bagder | rocko_: no |
| 00:00:32 | Nico_P | no it doesn't |
| 00:00:39 | stripwax | Nico_P - I know, I just wanted to understand what "completely free" meant vs "free" :) |
| 00:00:45 | Nico_P | ah :) |
| 00:00:49 | goffa | maybe right after double left could go to the next album rather than a random (in case you screw up by going back) |
| 00:00:59 | stripwax | rocko - rockbox uses rockbox to play mp3 |
| 00:01:02 | Nico_P | stripwax: I had a hard time believing you wouldn't know it |
| 00:01:12 | goffa | that would make it the most intuitive |
| 00:01:17 | rocko_ | gstreamer codecs |
| 00:01:21 | goffa | at least in my mind :) |
| 00:01:22 | stripwax | Nico_P - :) |
| 00:01:29 | Bagder | rocko_: no gstreamer at all is involved |
| 00:01:32 | Llorean | rocko_: I have no idea why you're jumping to that conclusion. |
| 00:01:45 | stripwax | rocko - take a look at the source code for rockbox to find out what it uses |
| 00:01:54 | stripwax | for mp3, it uses libmad |
| 00:02:42 | bluebrother | why the hell do we need to use gstreamer? There's more decoders than that |
| 00:03:02 | rocko_ | because you said that rockbox is completely free as in freedom and not free beer |
| 00:03:04 | bluebrother | for vorbis, there is tremor around −− released by the guys who created vorbis. |
| 00:03:16 | stripwax | rocko - it is |
| 00:03:16 | Bagder | rocko_: free doesn't imply gstreamer... |
| 00:03:25 | * | bluebrother feels an "it's illegal" argument coming up |
| 00:03:26 | gevaerts | rocko_: sure, but there is more free software around than just gstreamer... |
| 00:03:27 | stripwax | rockbox is 'free' to do what it likes |
| 00:03:42 | stripwax | rocko - please google for libmad and tremor |
| 00:03:54 | * | MarcGuay thinks rocco_ has been here before and is looking for a place on the GoldenQuotes page. |
| 00:03:54 | rocko_ | well if you guys use non free codecs then it would make rockbox non free in the guideslines of free software |
| 00:04:04 | Bagder | rocko_: we don't |
| 00:04:05 | rocko_ | foundation |
| 00:04:07 | stripwax | we *dont* use non free codec |
| 00:04:08 | Bagder | we use free source |
| 00:04:18 | stripwax | rocko - *please* google libmad and tremor |
| 00:04:19 | stripwax | ... |
| 00:04:23 | bluebrother | rocko_: please define a "free" codec. |
| 00:04:45 | stripwax | quote: "gstreamer is a multimedia framework with the type system based on GObject".. blah |
| 00:04:48 | rocko_ | free codec meaning that the source code is released |
| 00:04:51 | stripwax | it is |
| 00:04:56 | stripwax | libmad is open source, as is tremor |
| 00:05:00 | stripwax | and all of the other codecs we use |
| 00:05:07 | bluebrother | well, is the source of Rockbox codecs released or not? |
| 00:05:13 | Bagder | rocko_: rockbox is 100% free software, free source, free as in gratis, and libre and open source. And free. |
| 00:05:18 | bluebrother | it doesn't matter what it's based on −− the code is available |
| 00:05:21 | BigBambi | stripwax: Don't be stupid - gstreamer is the only project that has ever released source code :) |
| 00:05:34 | * | stripwax slaps forehead - oh yeah! I remember now! |
| 00:05:38 | goffa | lol |
| 00:05:56 | rocko_ | their is a difference between open source and free software http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-software-for-freedom.html |
| 00:06:00 | stripwax | rocko - do you have much experience of free/open source software? |
| 00:06:02 | gevaerts | Yes, and? |
| 00:06:08 | BigBambi | <rocko_> free codec meaning that the source code is released |
| 00:06:10 | Bagder | rocko_: get real, rockbox is both free software and open source |
| 00:06:17 | BigBambi | Which many more than gstreamer have done |
| 00:06:22 | k4y | this almost smells like a troll... |
| 00:06:30 | BigBambi | or an idiot |
| 00:06:30 | stripwax | rocko - rockbox is *covered by* the GNU license! do some research please |
| 00:06:32 | Bagder | big-time troll |
| 00:06:40 | * | bluebrother goes for popcorn and waits for the "illegal" claim |
| 00:06:43 | k4y | BigBambi: what? you mean those aren't the same things? |
| 00:07:03 | k4y | ;) |
| 00:07:12 | BigBambi | k4y: :) one is both, the other is just itself |
| 00:07:16 | stripwax | rocko - but before this gets too heated, I'm wondering if you had a question you wanted to ask about rockbox |
| 00:07:35 | k4y | BigBambi: and figuring out which is which is left as an exercise to the reader :) |
| 00:07:41 | BigBambi | indeed so |
| 00:08:01 | rocko_ | well that is for rockbox source code not for all the other stuff rockbox uses |
| 00:08:08 | stripwax | wrong |
| 00:08:13 | BigBambi | Everything we use has to be GPL compatible |
| 00:08:18 | BigBambi | Or we couldn't use it |
| 00:08:35 | rocko_ | I know but it still can contain non free software |
| 00:08:40 | BigBambi | how? |
| 00:08:40 | Bagder | rocko_: no |
| 00:08:41 | Llorean | No, it can't. |
| 00:08:44 | Nico_P | rocko_: we happen to know a wee bit about how open source and free software work |
| 00:08:48 | bluebrother | rocko_: what is "the other stuff"? |
| 00:09:05 | Llorean | rocko_: Our core binary is GPLv2 or later, thus any linked code (which is all off it) must be of a compatible license. |
| 00:09:14 | Llorean | We don't use binary codecs. |
| 00:09:54 | stripwax | rocko - did you have a real question you wanted to ask about rockbox, or just open source development in general? It sounds like you need to do some more research about what rockbox is and isn't first, but we can point you in the right direction |
| 00:09:57 | rocko_ | I have no questions about rockbox |
| 00:10:10 | stripwax | Then this is probably not the right place to be ... |
| 00:10:11 | BigBambi | You should do, as you clearly don't know enough bout it |
| 00:10:40 | rocko_ | well I know how to use it |
| 00:11:01 | bluebrother | sooo ... no Rockbox related question? Then it's off topic |
| 00:11:03 | rocko_ | all I was asking is if it following under the guidelines of fsf |
| 00:11:10 | BigBambi | That obviosuly hasn't translated into knowing anything about it |
| 00:11:21 | BigBambi | rocko_: No, you were telling us it doesn't |
| 00:11:21 | Bagder | rocko_: we don't follow FSF at all, we adhere to GPLv2 |
| 00:11:47 | bluebrother | rocko_: I'm still waiting for you to tell us we're doing illegal things |
| 00:12:00 | * | goffa wonders where he should propose his random folder advance behavior ideas (other than here) |
| 00:12:02 | bluebrother | besides I'm waiting for the claim to be gstreamer-based |
| 00:12:03 | stripwax | rocko - assuming you are interested, feel free to browse the freely-available open source code that makes up the rockbox operating system and all of its codecs and plugins at http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi/trunk |
| 00:12:31 | Llorean | goffa: The "Feature Ideas" subforum is a good place to get feedback |
| 00:12:54 | goffa | ok.. i'll head there |
| 00:12:57 | rocko_ | fsf is for gpl |
| 00:13:08 | Bagder | haha |
| 00:13:12 | bluebrother | FSF != GNU |
| 00:13:13 | stripwax | rocko - I think your level of knowledge might be outnumbered here.. |
| 00:13:15 | BigBambi | what does that even mean? |
| 00:13:26 | Bagder | this rocko_ guy is amusing, we should have him here more often ;-) |
| 00:13:27 | rocko_ | I know |
| 00:13:29 | bluebrother | I'm for more beer in this channel |
| 00:13:30 | | Quit ender` (" If you're going to do something tonight that you'll be sorry for tomorrow morning, sleep late.") |
| 00:13:30 | * | stripwax wonders if knowledge can be numbered |
| 00:13:43 | rocko_ | well Bagder: rocko_: we don't follow FSF at all, we adhere to GPLv2 |
| 00:13:44 | BigBambi | stripwax: as in days? :) |
| 00:13:45 | bluebrother | someone take good care of our channel troll :) |
| 00:13:50 | Bagder | rocko_: exactly |
| 00:13:51 | Llorean | rocko_: Unfortunately, it's not our place to attempt to educate you on licenses. Rockbox is licensed under "GPLv2 or later" and that includes all of its codecs and plugins. |
| 00:13:51 | * | petur distributes some beers |
| 00:13:59 | bluebrother | cheers! |
| 00:14:02 | stripwax | BigBambi - yeah, that'll do :) |
| 00:14:09 | BigBambi | petur: many thanks :) |
| 00:14:13 | Llorean | rocko_: Really, that's the key: All code compiled into Rockbox falls under this license. |
| 00:14:35 | gevaerts | stripwax: of course it can. All knowledge is expressable in some language, all languages are expressable in symbols, and all symbol sets can be enumerated. Therefore, all knowledge can be enumerated, or numbered |
| 00:14:49 | rocko_ | so no body knows if it falls under the guidelines of fsf I know it is under gpl |
| 00:14:59 | stripwax | what does that mean? |
| 00:15:09 | Bagder | falls under the guidelines? |
| 00:15:16 | bluebrother | Rockbox is not a GNU project. But it doesn't need to |
| 00:15:30 | rocko_ | fsf guidelines for free software |
| 00:15:40 | | Quit mf0102 ("Ex-Chat") |
| 00:15:40 | bluebrother | rocko_: what on earth is your goal? |
| 00:15:40 | | Quit davina (Remote closed the connection) |
| 00:15:41 | stripwax | gevaerts - ha, nice. except all nonsense can be enumerated at the same time, and you haven't provided a countable rule for separating the two :) |
| 00:15:46 | Llorean | Don't the FSF guidelines apply to licenses? |
| 00:15:47 | BigBambi | I'm hugely confused |
| 00:15:56 | Bagder | what more guidelines would we need than being GPLv2 and entirely free? |
| 00:16:01 | gevaerts | rocko_: the fsf wrote the gpl, so if the gpl doesn't follow their guidelines, that's their problem |
| 00:16:19 | gevaerts | stripwax: possibly, but you didn't ask that ;) |
| 00:16:20 | bluebrother | rocko_: you need to get the licence form first. Otherwise we can't answer you that question. |
| 00:16:33 | bluebrother | you need it filled, stamped three times and signed. |
| 00:17:00 | stripwax | rocko - **please** with two stars, read and understand the significance of what being covered by a GPL license means |
| 00:17:17 | bluebrother | besides, while some codecs use an fft we only need to adhere to the rules of an fft. Not the fsf |
| 00:17:18 | rocko_ | ok so this conversation is over since no one knows have a nice day and great job on making rockbox guys:-D |
| 00:17:29 | stripwax | rocko - everyone knows, unfortunately |
| 00:17:32 | bluebrother | rocko_: remember the fft! |
| 00:17:36 | k4y | stripwax: almost everyone |
| 00:17:40 | stripwax | rocko - see you around! |
| 00:17:41 | bluebrother | and sometimes also the ifft! |
| 00:17:48 | Bagder | one knows? |
| 00:17:50 | BigBambi | I know he makes no sense, if that helps |
| 00:17:51 | bluebrother | (even more important!) |
| 00:17:51 | Bagder | no one even |
| 00:17:55 | | Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@unaffiliated/jhulst) |
| 00:17:59 | | Join gromit` [0] (n=gromit@ALagny-154-1-26-249.w83-112.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 00:17:59 | Bagder | troll... |
| 00:18:05 | bluebrother | BigBambi: do we make sense? ;-) |
| 00:18:09 | stripwax | 7 |
| 00:18:09 | Llorean | Our software meets all four Freedoms they list on their site. I'd say we meet their guidelines just fine. |
| 00:18:16 | BigBambi | bluebrother: Of course! |
| 00:18:21 | bluebrother | 42! |
| 00:18:47 | rocko_ | ok cool Llorean thats what I wanted to know |
| 00:18:51 | bluebrother | our software is even compatible to FAT! |
| 00:18:58 | Bagder | btw, FSF has no such guidelines |
| 00:19:09 | bluebrother | rocko_: are you compatible to FAT? Or fft? |
| 00:19:12 | Bagder | at least not that google can point out |
| 00:19:14 | bluebrother | or even fsf? |
| 00:19:22 | Llorean | rocko_: You might be interested to know that if a software is GPL licensed, it must meet those as the GPLv2 enforces those very freedoms. |
| 00:19:25 | stripwax | probably LGPL |
| 00:19:45 | MU{lappy} | bluebrother: wouldn't he need to be periodic to be compatible w/ FFT? |
| 00:19:49 | MU{lappy} | we could window him :P |
| 00:19:50 | Llorean | Bagder: I can only assume: http://www.fsf.org/licensing/essays/free-sw.html |
| 00:19:58 | stripwax | MU{lappy} - I hope he isn't periodic :) |
| 00:20:06 | bluebrother | MU{lappy}: hopefully not ;-) |
| 00:20:10 | Bagder | Llorean: yes I guess so |
| 00:20:15 | bluebrother | but, thinking of his base frequency ... |
| 00:20:27 | rocko_ | I was just going to post that Llorean |
| 00:20:28 | Bagder | but even MIT licensed code meets those definitions |
| 00:20:35 | k4y | when does GSoC start? |
| 00:20:41 | BigBambi | ages ago |
| 00:20:42 | bluebrother | it already did |
| 00:20:46 | k4y | oh okay |
| 00:20:48 | Llorean | k4y: We're at the midterm now. |
| 00:20:56 | | Quit Lear ("ChatZilla 0.9.83 [Firefox 3.0/2008052906]") |
| 00:21:21 | k4y | so are there some GSoC volunteers working on rockbox at the moment then? |
| 00:21:23 | | Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection) |
| 00:21:27 | rocko_ | well other licenses that are open source can also include non free software like that of mozilla license |
| 00:21:39 | BigBambi | k4y: volunteers generally don't get paid :) |
| 00:21:40 | Bagder | rocko_: yes, but we said 22 times that we are GPLv2 |
| 00:21:42 | stripwax | but, rockbox is covered by GPLv2, so .. |
| 00:21:43 | Llorean | rocko_: We didn't say we were using other licenses. |
| 00:21:54 | bluebrother | indeed, they include Gecko, which is free |
| 00:21:58 | BigBambi | k4y: But yes, there are some students |
| 00:22:02 | k4y | BigBambi: good point |
| 00:22:15 | k4y | BigBambi: i'm not sure what to call them GSoCers |
| 00:22:21 | bluebrother | I think we have 4 student this year |
| 00:22:25 | k4y | oops, missed some punctuation |
| 00:22:33 | BigBambi | Students generally |
| 00:22:34 | rocko_ | firefox is not completely free software http://www.gnu.org/software/gnuzilla/ |
| 00:22:38 | | Quit linuxstb (Connection timed out) |
| 00:22:40 | BigBambi | How is that relevent |
| 00:22:52 | BigBambi | rocko_: ROCKBOX USES GPL V2 OR LATER |
| 00:22:57 | * | stripwax ignores rocko |
| 00:22:57 | bluebrother | yes, the logo is incompatible with Debians licensing-thingy. |
| 00:23:02 | bluebrother | but so is their own logo |
| 00:23:09 | rocko_ | linux kernel is gpl and it can have non free software |
| 00:23:24 | Llorean | rocko_: And the non-free software *isn't* the linux kernel. |
| 00:23:27 | * | Bagder gives in |
| 00:23:29 | gevaerts | rocko_: linux, firefox, and _you_ are off-topic here |
| 00:23:33 | BigBambi | rocko_: read Llorean's previous answer |
| 00:23:56 | k4y | what's the advantage of implementing MTP support in Rockbox? |
| 00:24:03 | BigBambi | rocko_: <Llorean> rocko_: Our core binary is GPLv2 or later, thus any linked code (which is all off it) must be of a compatible license. <Llorean> We don't use binary codecs. |
| 00:24:14 | k4y | or rather, what are some of the advantages of MTP over MSC? |
| 00:24:17 | preglow | k4y: being able to use mtp? |
| 00:24:21 | bluebrother | wow, multiple quotes on irc ... |
| 00:24:26 | gevaerts | k4y: forget it, you won't get on-topic conversation here any time soon unfortunately |
| 00:24:31 | bluebrother | k4y: I don't see any |
| 00:24:45 | * | gevaerts sees one :) |
| 00:24:46 | BigBambi | k4y: Personally, I can't see any ;) |
| 00:24:50 | k4y | gevaerts: hopefully trollo_ will leave soon |
| 00:24:52 | Llorean | k4y: MTP offers some functionality (additional metadata with transferred songs, I believe) that might allow easier use for some users. |
| 00:25:08 | Llorean | The net benefit is very debatable. |
| 00:25:18 | | Join fdinel [0] (n=Miranda@modemcable204.232-203-24.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 00:25:23 | preglow | Llorean: aha, and no need to scan db afterwards |
| 00:25:24 | k4y | okay, that's what i thought; just wanted to check that i wasn't completely wrong |
| 00:25:27 | gevaerts | k4y: mtp allows the device to remain functional while files are being transfered (but I don't know if anyone actually does that) |
| 00:25:34 | preglow | Llorean: am i wrong in saying that mtp has no subdirectory support? |
| 00:25:40 | MU{lappy} | on the order of 1E-10Hz would be acceptable to me ;P |
| 00:25:51 | k4y | wow, i wish one of the GSoC students were doing work on a Sansa Fuze port ;) |
| 00:26:06 | k4y | gevaerts: functional? as in still usable as a media player? |
| 00:26:11 | gevaerts | preglow: AFAIK it uses a hierarchical tree, which can be mapped to subdirectories |
| 00:26:15 | gevaerts | k4y: yes |
| 00:26:18 | preglow | gevaerts: ahh |
| 00:26:26 | rocko_ | well I hope no hard feeling of any kind well I didn't mean for it to get heated or any thing like that just wanted to know thats all |
| 00:26:33 | k4y | gevaerts: oh, i didn't know that. i've never seen a device that does that |
| 00:26:39 | Llorean | preglow: Was gonna say, in using different MTP devices I'm pretty sure I've seen them put files on the player in different "real" layouts |
| 00:27:02 | * | bluebrother looks at the heat in the channel |
| 00:27:22 | MU{lappy} | beast OF doesn't use "real" directories,although i imagine real directories could be mapped to MTP folders easily enough |
| 00:27:28 | * | stripwax still isn't sure what rocko actually wanted to know |
| 00:27:37 | gevaerts | k4y: if we ever do MTP, we will support that |
| 00:27:56 | | Join linuxstb [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
| 00:29:02 | rocko_ | stripwax: I wanted to know it rockbox adheres to the 4 freedoms of gnu fsf http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html |
| 00:29:26 | bluebrother | rocko_: how about reading them yourself? |
| 00:29:57 | rocko_ | it's a simple question |
| 00:30:08 | stripwax | rocko - next time, please make it more clear what it is you want to know, and take our word for it when we give you an answer in the affirmative :) |
| 00:30:09 | bluebrother | seriously, do we care about being compilant to ABC, XAG, FDW, HDQ, LPQ or even HWAQ? |
| 00:30:26 | * | bluebrother steals stripwax a smiley |
| 00:30:34 | gevaerts | rocko_: we also gave you simple answers, which you didn't (want to?) understand. Therefore we very much doubt if you understand the question |
| 00:31:13 | * | bluebrother doubts rocko_ understands these explanations |
| 00:32:20 | rocko_ | well look at the amount of distros supported by gnu as adhering to the 4 freedoms as you can see most distros include non free software http://www.gnu.org/links/links.html#FreeGNULinuxDistributions |
| 00:32:45 | BigBambi | We aren't a linux distro..... |
| 00:32:49 | gevaerts | rocko_: again, what do linux distributions have to do with rockbox? |
| 00:32:55 | BigBambi | Or anything to do with linux |
| 00:33:06 | BigBambi | rocko_: You know Rockbox is not based on linux right? |
| 00:33:17 | bluebrother | rocko_: stop it. Now. |
| 00:33:35 | rocko_ | I know but does rockbox adhere to them I know rockbox is not linux based |
| 00:33:46 | bluebrother | rocko_: stop it. Now. |
| 00:34:04 | | Join jon-kha [0] (i=jon-kha@kahvi.eu.org) |
| 00:34:26 | BigBambi | rocko_: Yes, as you have been told at least 40 times. You don't seem to understand why, but never mind. All done now |
| 00:34:48 | Llorean | rocko_: Rockbox does not include _any_ other software. It is JUST Rockbox. And Rockbox is GPLv2 licensed. Linux "distros" contain a lot of other programs, which is why things work different for them. Rockbox is _one_ program with _one_ license covering the entirety of everything in the program. |
| 00:35:15 | rocko_ | what about the codecs it uses |
| 00:35:21 | Llorean | They're part of the program |
| 00:35:31 | rocko_ | and the programs it comes with |
| 00:35:36 | Llorean | It doesn't come with programs |
| 00:35:49 | rocko_ | like the text editor |
| 00:35:54 | Llorean | That's a plugin, it's part of Rockbox |
| 00:36:01 | rocko_ | ok |
| 00:37:05 | stripwax | rocko - you can answer all of your own questions by going to the link I posted earlier in this conversation. all of the source code, and all of the license information, is there for your viewing pleasure. |
| 00:38:05 | | Quit shotofadds (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 00:38:12 | k4y | i'm guessing that enlightenment is not rocko_'s primary goal here |
| 00:39:00 | * | bluebrother wonders if rocko_ wants to get most annoying person in this channel |
| 00:39:44 | rocko_ | that text editor is killer I really like it I can read project gutenberg ebooks on it plus it starts where I left off when I view the file again |
| 00:40:50 | | Quit petur ("Zzzzz") |
| 00:41:55 | rocko_ | sorry bluebrother |
| 00:42:15 | rocko_ | what do you mean by enlightenment k4y? |
| 00:42:29 | | Quit obo ("bye") |
| 00:42:49 | goffa | wow... rocko's still here |
| 00:42:54 | rocko_ | like buddism enlightment |
| 00:42:58 | goffa | arguing on the internet comes to mind... |
| 00:43:02 | k4y | yes, like that |
| 00:43:11 | BigBambi | Let's try to stay on topic more now please |
| 00:43:22 | rocko_ | ok will do |
| 00:43:43 | * | stripwax wonders 'now, where was I..?' |
| 00:44:10 | | Quit ompaul (Client Quit) |
| 00:44:17 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 00:45:09 | rocko_ | well k4y I do meditate once in a while and do lucid dreams sometimes |
| 00:45:17 | | Quit herrwaldo (Remote closed the connection) |
| 00:45:21 | k4y | that doesn't seem very on topic |
| 00:45:44 | rocko_ | i know about you talked about enlightenment |
| 00:45:45 | BigBambi | rocko_: on topic. Saying you will stay on topic then saying that next line.... |
| 00:46:17 | stripwax | rocko - please remember that this channel is logged, and people come to search the irc logs looking for information about rockbox |
| 00:46:41 | rocko_ | ok I know any one can logged this channel too |
| 00:47:43 | stripwax | rocko - no, I mean we have archives of everything said by everyone in this channel, so staying on topic means those logs remain useful to others |
| 00:47:58 | rocko_ | ok |
| 00:48:39 | bluebrother | rocko_: remember: as this channel is logged people can search the archives and re-read your rather useful questions |
| 00:48:45 | * | bluebrother turns of sarcasm mode |
| 00:49:17 | | Nick cg_ is now known as cg (n=cromos@88.193.143.80) |
| 00:49:17 | rocko_ | so how is rockbox coming along with getting it to work on the latest ipods? |
| 00:49:19 | stripwax | is "open()" for files dircache-safe ? |
| 00:49:36 | rocko_ | man apple is really gay doing that encryption crap |
| 00:49:46 | stripwax | rocko - no-one is doing any such work, as far as I know |
| 00:49:52 | BigBambi | rocko_: For the very last time, stop it |
| 00:50:05 | rocko_ | stop what |
| 00:50:10 | rocko_ | I am on topic |
| 00:50:12 | rocko_ | rockbox |
| 00:50:14 | BigBambi | rocko_> man apple is really gay doing that encryption crap |
| 00:50:25 | BigBambi | That is not helpful, or what we want here |
| 00:50:27 | bluebrother | someone pleeease summon chanserv |
| 00:50:32 | rocko_ | well that is why rockbox has that problem |
| 00:50:45 | rocko_ | wikipedia said so |
| 00:51:00 | stripwax | or, if yuo are Apple, that is how Apple keep users locked into iTunes |
| 00:51:04 | MU{lappy} | if you have to explain how you're on-topic... you probably are not. |
| 00:51:12 | gevaerts | rockbox has no problem whatsoever with the ipods having encrypted firmware |
| 00:51:37 | rocko_ | then why can't it work on the latest ipods |
| 00:52:10 | * | MarcGuay yawns. |
| 00:52:11 | gevaerts | There are thousands of players around. Rockbox runs on about 30 of them. One or two more or less are _not_ a problem |
| 00:52:14 | | Join dataangel [0] (n=prophet@146.113.65.157) |
| 00:52:33 | rocko_ | Work on Rockbox for the iPod nano (second but not third), iPod Touch, and the iPod Classic has not begun due to firmware encryption that Apple places on all new iPods |
| 00:52:44 | * | stripwax actually listens to the test_codec track for the very first time .. what on earth is this?! |
| 00:53:09 | rocko_ | from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rockbox |
| 00:53:22 | stripwax | rocko - yes, rockbox does not run on those, and nobody is working on making it work on those |
| 00:53:23 | bluebrother | rocko_: we know that. No need to repeat it |
| 00:53:35 | stripwax | "we" don't have a problem with it not working on those |
| 00:53:36 | bluebrother | please stop pasting the obvious |
| 00:53:38 | BigBambi | Believe it or not, you don't need to repeat the wikipedia entry to the people who wrote it |
| 00:53:51 | BigBambi | The software that is, not the article |
| 00:54:13 | rocko_ | I stated that because of (05:51:12 PM) gevaerts: rockbox has no problem whatsoever with the ipods having encrypted firmware |
| 00:54:26 | BigBambi | You now need to read his next line |
| 00:54:26 | stripwax | rocko - please read my immediately previous reply |
| 00:54:27 | dataangel | When I plug my 8GB microSD card into my sansa e200, the file viewer only shows the folders on the card. Do I have to get something special to show my files or is it a bug? |
| 00:55:24 | rocko_ | I read that stripwax |
| 00:55:38 | BigBambi | dataangel: What is Show files set to? What did you copy on it? How did you copy them on? |
| 00:55:39 | gevaerts | dataangel: you may be in "show playlists only" modeby accident. Look in Settings->General Settings->File View->Show Files |
| 00:56:12 | stripwax | rocko - so, you understand that it doesn't work, and nobody is working on fixing that, and that we don't mind that nobody is working on fixing that? |
| 00:56:18 | rocko_ | ok thanks for your answers every body |
| 00:56:28 | dataangel | I used a card reader and my pc, copied over an mp3 to the root folder (in case it wasn't looking in subfolders) and also a few folders full of mp3s |
| 00:56:33 | dataangel | lemme check setting... |
| 00:57:07 | dataangel | oh pfft that was it |
| 00:57:31 | | Quit jhulst (No route to host) |
| 00:58:30 | dataangel | thanks |
| 00:58:45 | gevaerts | No problem. Have fun listening |
| 01:00 |
| 01:00:04 | | Join Shaid [0] (n=adam@dsl-202-45-112-116-static.VIC.netspace.net.au) |
| 01:02:27 | stripwax | Does anyone have a good tip for switching between a "test"/profiling build on-device and a "actually want to use" build on device? Other than unzipping the particular rockbox.zip onto the device each time. Do we support multiple .rockbox folders in any way? |
| 01:03:06 | gevaerts | You could rename them on the device (not really that easy...) |
| 01:03:23 | BigBambi | ROLO 9depending on device) |
| 01:03:31 | MU{lappy} | easy on beast! go go bootloader MSC |
| 01:03:36 | BigBambi | s/9/(/ |
| 01:03:58 | stripwax | ROLO supports more than just rockbox.xxxx swapping (e.g. plugins too?) |
| 01:04:00 | BigBambi | MU{lappy}: but bootloader != build, and you still need a PC |
| 01:04:12 | BigBambi | stripwax: Ah, a complete build |
| 01:04:16 | gevaerts | Renaming while connected is easy. It's without connecting that's tricky |
| 01:04:27 | BigBambi | stripwax: No, in that case I don't think so |
| 01:04:45 | * | gevaerts waits for safetydan's lua plugin. That one should make this easy |
| 01:04:59 | | Quit vort3x ("Leaving") |
| 01:05:07 | stripwax | Didn't think so, but thought I'd check, ta |
| 01:05:10 | | Join vort3x [0] (n=vortex@unaffiliated/dfa001) |
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| 01:12:48 | MarcGuay | Lambdacalculus (for the logs): http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/9165, if you've got a minute. |
| 01:14:01 | rocko_ | rockbox rules |
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| 01:43:44 | dave36 | I am a big fan of RUN DMC |
| 01:44:04 | dave36 | so you guys n ladies really like the song rockbox huh |
| 01:44:18 | dave36 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k-hRqN0h9Y8 |
| 01:44:47 | | Part dave36 |
| 01:45:58 | | Quit rocko_ ("Leaving.") |
| 01:50:45 | | Quit Shaid ("*toink*") |
| 01:56:12 | | Join adude [0] (n=shawn@72.25.32.200.dynamic.dejazzd.com) |
| 01:57:03 | shadoxx | Anyone have any tips for finding the key to a .mi4 file to decrypt it? |
| 01:57:18 | | Part pixelma |
| 01:58:35 | shadoxx | I have a firmware that I *can* decrypt using a default key that's in mi4code. But a later version of the firmware doesn't decrypt with the same key. |
| 01:58:52 | shadoxx | I've tried looking for the key for the later version somewhere in the decrypted version, but I've only come up empty |
| 02:00 |
| 02:00:11 | linuxstb | shadoxx: Do you have the matching bootloader for that mi4 file? |
| 02:00:40 | linuxstb | IIRC, mi4code can scan a bootloader to look for the key. |
| 02:00:43 | shadoxx | No. :( I've been trying to find it, but I keep coming up empty. I can't figure out a way to get to the flash on this MP3 player |
| 02:01:04 | shadoxx | and from what I can tell, Samsung was really good about keeping their bootloaders secret |
| 02:01:18 | shadoxx | I can't even figure out how to *flash* the bootloader on this thing. |
| 02:01:43 | linuxstb | What hardware is in your player? |
| 02:02:14 | shadoxx | It's a Samsung YH-820, PP5020 |
| 02:02:23 | linuxstb | hard disk, or flash? |
| 02:02:36 | shadoxx | hard disk, with a 4MB flash chip on the PCB |
| 02:02:44 | shadoxx | I think that's where the bootloader is stored |
| 02:03:35 | shadoxx | I've tried booting it without the harddrive, but that only makes it come up with the error, "Could not initialize hard disk. Shutting down." |
| 02:03:58 | linuxstb | Then the existing hard disk (ATA) driver in Rockbox for the PP5020 is likely to work. You can then dump parts of memory (the flash will almost certainly be mapped to address 0x0) to disk.) |
| 02:04:31 | shadoxx | There are a bunch of testpoints on the PCB, but I couldn't even begin to know which ones I should short. |
| 02:04:33 | shadoxx | And hmm |
| 02:05:15 | linuxstb | Do you know how the firmware upgrade works? Is there some kind of recovery mode which would allow you to run test code? |
| 02:05:19 | | Join goffa_ [0] (n=goffa@216.220.23.105) |
| 02:05:41 | shadoxx | Another thing I'm trying to figure out. It seems to update the firmware, there are two .mi4 files you put in /SYSTEM |
| 02:05:55 | | Join stripwax_ [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
| 02:06:24 | stripwax_ | What does it mean when objdump reports a function in the ".iram" section, rather than say ".icode"? |
| 02:06:28 | shadoxx | the one you find on the samsung website (FW_820.mi4) and their MTP update (YH820_J.mi4) |
| 02:06:53 | shadoxx | along with some the font file in /System/Font |
| 02:07:19 | | Quit jhulst (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 02:07:25 | linuxstb | shadoxx: Do the files get deleted after you copy them to the device? |
| 02:07:56 | shadoxx | FW_820.mi4 does once you turn it on after putting them in /SYSTEM and deleting everything else |
| 02:08:06 | shadoxx | which leaves the 'Janus' firmware |
| 02:08:22 | shadoxx | The one which enables the player with DRM, for subscription services |
| 02:08:24 | linuxstb | And are you sure the flash is 4MB (i.e. megabytes) and not 4Mbit (megabits - i.e. 512KB) ? |
| 02:08:42 | shadoxx | yeah, nvm. it's mbit |
| 02:08:44 | shadoxx | Access time: 70ns; 4M-bit (512K x 8/256K x 16) CMOS single voltage 3V only flash memory Operational temperature range from -40°C to 85°C. |
| 02:08:56 | shadoxx | Info on the flash chip |
| 02:09:04 | linuxstb | And I'm guessing the .mi4 file is larger than that? |
| 02:09:26 | shadoxx | much. the FW_820.mi4 file is around 2MB. the YH820_J.mi4 file is around 4 |
| 02:09:44 | linuxstb | OK, so they must be being copied to a hidden part of the hard disk... |
| 02:10:01 | shadoxx | hmm |
| 02:10:20 | shadoxx | I'll /dev/sda1 to a file, and do some poking |
| 02:10:27 | shadoxx | i'll cat /dev/sda1 * |
| 02:10:36 | linuxstb | There's no /dev/sda2 ? |
| 02:10:37 | shadoxx | rather, /dev/sda |
| 02:10:57 | shadoxx | nope |
| 02:11:41 | linuxstb | It's possible (the Sansa E2x0R models do this) that that part of the disk isn't made visible over USB. The only way to access it would be to remove the disk from your player and hook it up to a computer |
| 02:12:45 | shadoxx | haha. Only problem is the connector. I'd have to find a connector to fit it |
| 02:13:45 | shadoxx | I'm thinking if I figured out the testpoints, I might be able to put it into debug mode. |
| 02:14:06 | shadoxx | There's an email in the decoded FW_820.mi4 file. I should send him a line. haha |
| 02:14:31 | shadoxx | along with what looks like an extention to his desk |
| 02:14:38 | linuxstb | ;) |
| 02:14:40 | | Quit stripwax (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 02:16:08 | linuxstb | shadoxx: But anyway, if you haven't done so already, you may want to start a thread in the "New Ports" Rockbox forum - other people may have some ideas, and it could attract other YH820 owners. |
| 02:16:31 | | Quit goffa (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 02:16:51 | | Quit dataangel (Remote closed the connection) |
| 02:17:04 | shadoxx | I think I'll do that. Looks like a few other people have inquired about this player, and I'm the first one to actually crack it open and have at it. |
| 02:17:21 | | Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@unaffiliated/jhulst) |
| 02:19:38 | shadoxx | Also, did I mention I have little to no experience coding in C? This should be interesting. |
| 02:20:48 | linuxstb | Rockbox is a fun way to learn C... |
| 02:20:51 | * | linuxstb sleeps |
| 02:24:08 | stripwax_ | Finally got the profile_reader working properly with my arm profile output. Some bugs in the perl. Will upload a patch tomorrow but not sure how to detect the 'right' objdump to use for a given target : perl just calls "objdump" but I need "arm-elf-objdump". Any way I can detect that from the build directory, or just have a mapping for each target? |
| 02:24:31 | stripwax_ | by "the perl" I mean tools/profile_reader/profile_reader.pl |
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| 02:44:22 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
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| 03:00 |
| 03:00:12 | | Join ivor [0] (n=i@c-75-72-187-145.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 03:03:59 | ivor | Hello, can anyone refer me to a WPS that uses the conditional viewport tags (%Vl, %Vd) |
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| 03:35:17 | | Nick JdGordon|zzz is now known as JdGordon (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) |
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| 03:59:48 | * | JdGordon slaps MarcGuay |
| 03:59:56 | JdGordon | something cant be new and improved! |
| 04:00 |
| 04:02:13 | * | MarcGuay is rudely awakened. |
| 04:02:34 | MarcGuay | It's both, I'm that amazing. |
| 04:02:44 | goffa_ | :) |
| 04:03:51 | MarcGuay | It's an improvement on nothing. |
| 04:04:03 | * | MarcGuay is grasping at logical straws. |
| 04:04:21 | JdGordon | im all for commitiing it btw |
| 04:04:44 | goffa_ | so i'm missing what's new and improved |
| 04:04:48 | goffa_ | i must have missed some stuff |
| 04:05:45 | MarcGuay | JdGordon: Did you give it a test run or just look over the code? |
| 04:05:54 | JdGordon | just looked at it |
| 04:06:03 | MarcGuay | goffa_: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/9165 |
| 04:06:07 | JdGordon | I dont tihnk there are many ipod recerders and it looks ok |
| 04:06:26 | MarcGuay | JdGordon: You want to do the manual update? :) |
| 04:06:26 | JdGordon | but posting on the ml/forums about it before comimting is a good idea |
| 04:06:33 | goffa_ | ah.. doesn't affect me |
| 04:06:44 | JdGordon | :D |
| 04:07:06 | goffa_ | down to 2 breeds, iaudio and gigabeat |
| 04:07:38 | MarcGuay | I'm off again tomorrow so I'll ask around before committing it and work on the manual in the interrum. |
| 04:09:28 | MarcGuay | JdGordon: There was talk earlier about the way random folder goes random backwards, and how http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/9152 might be caused by that short-long dir in gwps.c. |
| 04:10:00 | | Quit tvelocity ("Αποχώρησε") |
| 04:10:01 | MarcGuay | Although I couldn't see how it behaves any differently from the combo press - they both simply call the same function. |
| 04:11:05 | JdGordon | hmm... I can guess why... |
| 04:11:18 | JdGordon | ill have a looky |
| 04:11:27 | JdGordon | but first.. breaky time |
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| 04:44:24 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 04:45:50 | JdGordon | something is not right with the build servers :( |
| 04:51:10 | | Quit ivor ("Leaving") |
| 04:51:17 | wpyh | Buschel: I've ran the last test and got very weird results: the total runtime doesn't change (it actually shortens by a few seconds) when I used 128kbps mp3 instead of 192 kbps mp3. |
| 04:51:57 | | Quit AndyIL (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 04:52:37 | goffa_ | JdGordon: so.. you think you know what's wrong with the short long/right? |
| 04:52:56 | goffa_ | short/long left, combo left, and combo right all behave |
| 04:53:22 | JdGordon | i have an idea |
| 04:53:26 | goffa_ | its just the short/long right that screws up |
| 04:53:26 | JdGordon | could be very wrong though |
| 04:53:30 | goffa_ | i was in here earlier |
| 04:53:41 | * | JdGordon thought it was short/long left that was broekn |
| 04:54:37 | goffa_ | well.. depends on your deffinition of broken :) |
| 04:56:32 | | Quit miepchen^schlaf_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 04:56:41 | goffa_ | short/long left goes to a random dir |
| 04:56:45 | goffa_ | but there is no issue with sound |
| 04:56:53 | goffa_ | to me i think it should go to prev |
| 04:57:06 | JdGordon | hmm.. yeah its a bug for nico... playback probably gets stuck because audio_next() is called before the dir change |
| 04:57:22 | JdGordon | I saw your forum thread on that and disagree |
| 04:57:52 | goffa_ | any reason why? |
| 04:58:15 | JdGordon | because if random is enabled then going forward or backwards shold still be random |
| 04:59:22 | goffa_ | well to me that is redundant |
| 05:00 |
| 05:01:11 | goffa_ | only thing i wonder about the proposed change is this: how far back could you go? and how much would that tax the system |
| 05:01:54 | goffa_ | to me back should be back no matter what.. should just be a degree of how far back do you want to go (left, or combo) |
| 05:02:18 | goffa_ | but.. i will say.. that is working 100% from an audio playback standpoint |
| 05:03:28 | goffa_ | i know rockbox isn't a lemming... but all other players go back to where they came from in random :) |
| 05:03:43 | goffa_ | even rockbox's random allows you to go back if you're in a playlist |
| 05:06:15 | JdGordon | well... the previous directory _could_ be stored.. but beyond that it would have to be scanned for which means it wontr happen |
| 05:06:34 | goffa_ | yeah |
| 05:06:43 | goffa_ | well 1 dir would be sufficient anyway |
| 05:06:52 | JdGordon | then its inconsistant |
| 05:07:28 | goffa_ | the only reason i'd go back is because i accidentally went forward |
| 05:07:41 | goffa_ | and don't want to access the file browser to go to the previous directory |
| 05:07:49 | goffa_ | assuming i kept track of what it was |
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| 05:08:01 | | Quit stripwax_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 05:08:22 | goffa_ | like i heard a song i wanted to hear, but didn't know who it was by.. and advanced to fast :) |
| 05:08:37 | JdGordon | yeah, that can be annoying |
| 05:08:42 | | Join nplus [0] (n=nplus@141.25.globcom.net) |
| 05:09:35 | goffa_ | that does pose a problem with my double left too.. i'm assuming |
| 05:10:01 | goffa_ | but that could just load prev dir |
| 05:14:43 | goffa_ | i mean double left from the 1st track in the dir too |
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| 05:39:27 | MarcGuay | I want to close http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8394 as there's no way that title has been true for this long without a torrent of users looking for support. |
| 05:41:21 | | Part stimulus |
| 05:43:09 | JdGordon | yeah, I saw that one yesterday and wanted to close it also |
| 05:43:33 | JdGordon | also, I'm thinking he is usang an old bootloader... |
| 05:43:44 | JdGordon | since when has the ipod loader said version 2.0? |
| 05:44:56 | MarcGuay | JdGordon: No idea about the version number. Close it and request a re-open if it's still happening? |
| 05:45:06 | JdGordon | yeah |
| 05:48:50 | JdGordon | MarcGuay: that runtime task is debatable weayther it should have been closed... each target needs to be calibrated individually... |
| 05:50:31 | MarcGuay | JdGordon: My bad, then. I read the "h300" too quickly. Should have stayed with my first instinct from a few months ago. |
| 05:50:41 | JdGordon | leave it closed |
| 05:52:34 | MarcGuay | JdGordon: Too late. |
| 05:52:40 | MarcGuay | Flyspray spam is tasty. |
| 05:52:42 | JdGordon | close it :D |
| 05:54:11 | JdGordon | out of 18000 emails in my gmail account.... 8200 are FS... ! |
| 05:54:12 | MarcGuay | Any X5 owners want to confirm/deny this: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/6590 please? |
| 05:54:42 | MarcGuay | Some of my best friends are spammers? |
| 05:55:11 | goffa_ | lol..i don't know if i dare upgrade the firmware |
| 05:55:40 | goffa_ | that'd mean plugging the machine into a filthy windows box if it doesn't work |
| 05:56:07 | goffa_ | let me go grab the x5 |
| 05:56:57 | MarcGuay | goffa_: You are a hero. 50 virgins and a bag of chips await you in the afterlife. |
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| 05:57:27 | goffa_ | why are they virgins? |
| 05:59:16 | homielowe | gevearts: for the logs , reading about the issue with the gigabeat S not playing nice with mac osx, it works fine on my mac, osx 10.5.3 . It will show two separate drives with the same name. |
| 06:00 |
| 06:01:43 | MarcGuay | Gigabeat F users, show some love: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7184 |
| 06:02:09 | | Join troy___ [0] (n=toppy@89.243.152.249) |
| 06:07:46 | MarcGuay | Didn't the H10 battery get an overhaul recently as part of the PP power-saving deal? Is this still relavent? http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/6552 |
| 06:16:54 | | Join troy____ [0] (n=toppy@78.146.83.201) |
| 06:17:37 | delorean90 | i have always had terrible battery life with my h10, even after the 1700mAh battery swap |
| 06:18:48 | | Quit troy__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 06:21:49 | MarcGuay | delorean90: Does that have anything to do with that FS entry or is it just a fact of life? |
| 06:22:58 | MarcGuay | goffa_: Do you feel you've tested enough to close it? |
| 06:23:35 | MarcGuay | It sucks when the original reporters disappear, but what can you do... |
| 06:27:54 | goffa_ | MarcGuay: i think so |
| 06:28:10 | goffa_ | hooked it up to 3 boxes |
| 06:28:19 | goffa_ | unfortunately they are all running the same distro |
| 06:28:33 | goffa_ | so i can't give a wide range of data as to which machines are affected |
| 06:28:49 | MarcGuay | goffa_: Excellent, thanks... Is it the same one that Rani mentions in the last comment? |
| 06:29:04 | goffa_ | nope |
| 06:29:06 | goffa_ | archlinux |
| 06:29:22 | goffa_ | 2.6.25 |
| 06:30:01 | MarcGuay | Mind leaving a comment on the task before I close it? |
| 06:30:16 | goffa_ | sure |
| 06:31:08 | goffa_ | slapped something quick and dirty up there |
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| 07:00 |
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| 07:27:05 | MarcGuay | wpyh: Does Bubbles on the ipod use the wheel to move the aimer left and right? |
| 07:28:12 | wpyh | MarcGuay:yes |
| 07:28:13 | MarcGuay | Looking at http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8950 if you're wondering why i'm asking you seemingly random questions. |
| 07:28:36 | wpyh | MarcGuay: I think that's the first question you asked me ;) |
| 07:28:50 | wpyh | uh, that bug |
| 07:28:54 | wpyh | it's a menu bug |
| 07:29:00 | MarcGuay | And the directions are fine in the game, just backwards in the menu level selection? |
| 07:29:04 | wpyh | yes |
| 07:29:16 | wpyh | IIRC this was discussed a while a go |
| 07:29:18 | wpyh | *ago |
| 07:29:29 | | Join thegeek_ [0] (n=nnscript@s080a.studby.ntnu.no) |
| 07:29:30 | wpyh | the problem is that Bubbles uses the pluginlib |
| 07:29:41 | wpyh | which doesn't expose the buttons but instead provide actions |
| 07:30:04 | wpyh | and IIRC as well, there is a discussion about using a new system for input for plugins in the devcon |
| 07:30:09 | MarcGuay | According to the code only the e200 is defined to use the wheel. |
| 07:31:41 | wpyh | you mean the Bubbles code? |
| 07:32:14 | MarcGuay | Yep. #if CONFIG_KEYPAD != SANSA_E200_PAD |
| 07:33:02 | wpyh | hm... |
| 07:33:19 | * | wpyh has played through all 100 levels on his nano, using the wheel |
| 07:33:41 | MarcGuay | But there are several instances of PLA_LEFT/RIGHT in pluginactions... It's hard to know which ones are being used at what time... |
| 07:35:08 | | Quit EspeonEefi ("さよなら") |
| 07:35:08 | wpyh | nano has this:#define CONFIG_KEYPAD IPOD_4G_PAD |
| 07:35:25 | MarcGuay | This can't be worth the headache... :) For another day. Thanks for the input, have a good night.. |
| 07:35:45 | wpyh | it's noon over here ;) |
| 07:36:47 | wpyh | hm... yeah, reading the source code, this plugin uses the rewind/forward buttons to control the aimer |
| 07:37:02 | wpyh | but I think we should revamp the whole interface (using the menu based interface) |
| 07:37:14 | wpyh | I was looking into that code when I realized that we also need a generic text viewer |
| 07:37:20 | | Quit MarcGuay ("ChatZilla 0.9.83 [Firefox 2.0.0.14/2008040413]") |
| 07:41:40 | amiconn | wpyh: You mean for help texts? |
| 07:42:23 | wpyh | yes, for help texts |
| 07:42:41 | amiconn | There is a minimalistic one in solitaire. Maybe that's sufficient |
| 07:42:58 | amiconn | It does word wrap and hard line breaks |
| 07:43:49 | wpyh | yes, I looked at that one before |
| 07:44:03 | wpyh | however, it seems that it needs two steps |
| 07:44:13 | wpyh | one step for "init" and another step for showing |
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| 07:47:58 | | Quit pabs (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 07:50:55 | JdGordon | is that a problem though? |
| 07:51:06 | amiconn | wpyh: Yes it does. This way the formatting only has to be done once |
| 07:52:56 | wpyh | yeah, but it's a bit weird:p |
| 07:53:05 | wpyh | guess I'd have to get used to it... |
| 07:53:35 | | Join pabs [0] (n=pabs@ip68-98-178-202.dc.dc.cox.net) |
| 07:53:36 | * | wpyh is not used to programming daps... |
| 07:53:54 | amiconn | The code was written this way in order to be small, simple and fast |
| 07:54:20 | amiconn | It's a bit nasty because it modifies the string in-place, hence it can't be 'const' |
| 07:54:50 | amiconn | But it doesn't need additional storage, and text length is only limited by available (plugin) ram, both in size and in number of lines |
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| 07:57:38 | JdGordon | is the whole plugin lib linked in every .rock? or just the barts oof the lib that is used? |
| 08:00 |
| 08:02:11 | | Quit BigBambi (Remote closed the connection) |
| 08:02:39 | wpyh | amiconn: yeah |
| 08:02:43 | wpyh | it seems good |
| 08:02:59 | wpyh | (from an embedded device's point of view) |
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| 08:23:45 | JdGordon | morning B4gder, something went funny with the builds again... took over an hour to finish |
| 08:26:08 | B4gder | ouch |
| 08:26:27 | * | GodEater crosses his fingers that it wasn't his fault |
| 08:27:38 | GodEater | though from looking at the logs, I can't tell *what* the problem was |
| 08:28:14 | B4gder | the build system doesn't keep the logs from the previous failed attempt so I can't really tell now either |
| 08:28:19 | GodEater | ah |
| 08:28:43 | * | GodEater hopes his server will get a bit faster, ccache should be filling up nicely now |
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| 08:30:15 | | Quit jhulst (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 08:30:49 | kushal_12_27_200 | How can I get rockbox to remember playback position in sansa c250 after I pause the song and listen to another song before coming back to the previous song? |
| 08:31:02 | B4gder | bookmark |
| 08:31:21 | JdGordon | not if its a db playlist though |
| 08:31:40 | | Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection) |
| 08:32:26 | B4gder | a true |
| 08:34:26 | kushal_12_27_200 | what I have are 30 ~50 minute audio files from lit2go. Can I have rockbox remember the playback position on each of the songs (I might need to listen to something else, or turn off the device between two sessions of listening)? |
| 08:34:44 | | Join Rob2222 [0] (n=Miranda@p4FDCE0D9.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:35:05 | B4gder | multiple bookmarks |
| 08:35:58 | kushal_12_27_200 | thanks let me see in the manual ... |
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| 08:49:46 | kushal_12_27_200 | could someone walk me through installing rockbox in automated mode in sansa c250? |
| 08:50:41 | JdGordon | download rbutil |
| 08:50:45 | JdGordon | click install |
| 08:50:49 | B4gder | kushal_12_27_200: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/GraphicalInstall |
| 08:51:12 | JdGordon | B4gder: can that page get linked from the front page? |
| 08:51:27 | B4gder | I think it should, yes |
| 08:51:34 | B4gder | "install" or something like that |
| 08:53:08 | kushal_12_27_200 | i downloaded it, mounted the disk image, plugged in my sansa, and double clicked the rqbuild file. nothing happened |
| 08:53:23 | | Quit Rob2223 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 08:53:31 | kushal_12_27_200 | I mean rbutilqt |
| 08:53:50 | | Join pixelma [50] (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) |
| 08:54:06 | JdGordon | kushal_12_27_200: on osx? |
| 08:54:17 | kushal_12_27_200 | yes JdGordon |
| 08:54:51 | kushal_12_27_200 | I have had a failed installation attempt before |
| 08:54:57 | JdGordon | hmm... thats not good |
| 08:55:05 | JdGordon | rbutil wouldnt open at all? |
| 08:55:06 | B4gder | that Maurus is on fire! |
| 08:55:23 | B4gder | mighty rocking mips work |
| 08:55:44 | kushal_12_27_200 | it won't open at all |
| 08:56:09 | JdGordon | how big is the .dmg? |
| 08:56:30 | kushal_12_27_200 | 11.9 mb |
| 08:57:00 | JdGordon | on intel or ppc? |
| 08:57:02 | kushal_12_27_200 | the app is 27.4 mb (Intel) |
| 08:58:29 | kushal_12_27_200 | I am on an Intel macbook |
| 08:59:05 | GodEater | JdGordon: I think we've had reports that the current RBUtil doesn't work on all versions of OSX |
| 08:59:24 | kushal_12_27_200 | mine is 10.4.11 |
| 08:59:30 | GodEater | whatever that means |
| 08:59:37 | * | GodEater knows nothing about OSX really |
| 08:59:50 | JdGordon | sounds like it isnt being built statically.... works fine on my box.. but thats also the one it was built on |
| 08:59:52 | GodEater | which is sort of the problem, none of the developers here use it |
| 09:00 |
| 09:00:36 | * | JdGordon would like to setup osx in a vm |
| 09:01:57 | kushal_12_27_200 | JdGordon, are you on leopard? |
| 09:02:02 | JdGordon | yes |
| 09:02:43 | kushal_12_27_200 | rbutilqt opens fine? |
| 09:03:07 | kushal_12_27_200 | http://download.rockbox.org/rbutil/macosx/rbutilqt-v1.0.6.dmg |
| 09:03:21 | JdGordon | yes, but like I said.. this is the mac that it was built on.. |
| 09:03:36 | JdGordon | if its not being fully compiled statically for some reason, any missing libs will be available |
| 09:03:49 | | Quit scorche (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 09:03:53 | kushal_12_27_200 | hmm |
| 09:04:59 | | Join scorche [0] (i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche) |
| 09:05:17 | B4gder | kushal_12_27_200: tried the 1.0.5 version? |
| 09:05:29 | kushal_12_27_200 | not yet, do you want me to do it? |
| 09:05:33 | B4gder | just replace the 6 with a 5 in the url |
| 09:05:47 | B4gder | it'd be interesting, that was built somewhat differently |
| 09:06:16 | * | B4gder does a little rockboxdev.sh build of mipsel-elf in the background ... |
| 09:06:21 | kushal_12_27_200 | its only 5.4 mb big |
| 09:06:25 | B4gder | yes |
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| 09:07:58 | | Join scorche [0] (i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche) |
| 09:08:05 | kushal_12_27_200 | working ... |
| 09:08:22 | | Join petur [50] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) |
| 09:08:44 | kushal_12_27_200 | It does not open either ... |
| 09:08:49 | B4gder | :-/ |
| 09:09:54 | kushal_12_27_200 | I know 1.0.3 opens but that was a long time ago |
| 09:10:12 | kushal_12_27_200 | http://download.rockbox.org/rbutil/macosx/ |
| 09:11:37 | kushal_12_27_200 | JdGordon, do you think its not opening because I have Tiger or because there might be some libraries missing? |
| 09:12:21 | JdGordon | im not sure... |
| 09:15:03 | kushal_12_27_200 | do we have the same issues reported for windows and linux? |
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| 09:16:48 | adamgolding | i have a weird ipod problem: rockbox will install and boot ok, but the OF never will−−i get a continuous boot even after doing 'restore' in itunes |
| 09:18:44 | midgey | for what it's worth, rbutil 1.0.6 from download.rockbox.org is working fine on my mac. Intel Macbook 10.4.11 |
| 09:19:05 | | Join Schmogel [0] (n=Miranda@p3EE20C8F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 09:20:10 | kushal_12_27_200 | thanks midgey |
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| 09:21:55 | | Join scorche [0] (i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche) |
| 09:23:20 | JdGordon | midgey: do you have the qt libs isntalled? |
| 09:25:00 | | Join shodanX [0] (n=shodanX@jazz.informatik.uni-erlangen.de) |
| 09:25:37 | midgey | JdGordon: i think I may have set them up a while back. Is there a quick way to tell? |
| 09:25:49 | JdGordon | no idea |
| 09:25:56 | JdGordon | i tihnk you can find it under frameworks somewhere in system info? |
| 09:26:04 | midgey | 'which qmake' yields /usr/local/trolltech/qt-4.3.0/bin/qmake |
| 09:26:56 | GodEater | that would imply you have them installed :) |
| 09:27:08 | midgey | In System Profiler > Frameworks I have QTKit listed |
| 09:28:37 | | Quit kushal_12_27_200 ("Leaving") |
| 09:29:09 | midgey | err, QTKit is for quicktime |
| 09:30:53 | * | midgey sleeps |
| 09:31:02 | | Quit midgey () |
| 09:32:49 | | Join lolmaus [0] (i=lolmaus@83.167.114.28) |
| 09:41:40 | JdGordon | kushel left :( |
| 09:45:39 | amiconn | Bagder: You could change the individual letter for m68k to 'c' (coldfire), and then use 'm' for mips |
| 09:45:50 | * | JdGordon guesses the problem with rbuitlqt |
| 09:46:07 | amiconn | And the wording for 'all' is a bit weird now: 'all three' ;) |
| 09:46:19 | B4gder | amiconn: i just didn't want to modify any of the existing ones |
| 09:46:33 | B4gder | but if the mips stuff works I guess I'll poke on it again |
| 09:53:44 | JdGordon | ok, im 99% sure the rbutil problem is its not statically linking libusb... but i dont know how to fix that |
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| 10:00 |
| 10:04:29 | | Join safetydan [0] (n=safetyda@rockbox/developer/safetydan) |
| 10:11:03 | * | JdGordon just cant win with the talking clock |
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| 10:23:17 | gevaerts | homielowe: thanks. Good to know. Now I just have to find a volunteer with 10.4 and a GBS to try |
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| 10:26:20 | | Quit stripwax ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
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| 10:29:10 | | Join pondlife [50] (n=Steve@rockbox/developer/pondlife) |
| 10:29:39 | pondlife | JdGordon: ping |
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| 10:43:11 | Nico_P | what does the anti-skip buffer setting change? the size of the PCM buffer? |
| 10:44:30 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 10:46:38 | pondlife | I've long wondered.... |
| 10:53:43 | B4gder | it just changes the margin to when it starts filling up again |
| 10:54:10 | B4gder | at least it does in hwcodec |
| 10:57:08 | | Join crope` [0] (n=crope@dyn3-82-128-188-122.psoas.suomi.net) |
| 10:57:52 | JdGordon | pondlife: pong |
| 10:59:12 | | Quit Schmogel (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 11:00 |
| 11:02:09 | pondlife | JdGordon: Not a biggie, but wondered if you were planning more work on the voiced time in the info screen. |
| 11:02:32 | pondlife | Currently I get the worst of both worlds - the time doesn't update visually, and only speaks after a long delay. |
| 11:02:46 | pondlife | I mean, it only updates visually when I move the cursor bar |
| 11:03:00 | pondlife | (This is on a sim, fwiw.) |
| 11:05:56 | pondlife | This also happens with or without voicing enabled. |
| 11:06:15 | pondlife | I can attack it if you're not already on it. |
| 11:07:31 | * | pondlife continues to talk to himself... |
| 11:08:55 | JdGordon | sortry... one min |
| 11:10:42 | pondlife | No worries |
| 11:11:49 | JdGordon | ok... |
| 11:12:11 | JdGordon | yeah, I just cant win with that screen |
| 11:12:28 | JdGordon | can we rip the time/date out of that and make a new screen for it and the alaram/shutdown timers? |
| 11:12:29 | pondlife | On another topic, to any WPS experts, I'm not able to get a default bitmap to "fill in" my progress bar now. |
| 11:12:47 | pondlife | I'm using %pb|-|10|4|218|-| |
| 11:13:19 | pondlife | I guess I should pop my entire WPS and its bitmaps up somewhere though |
| 11:14:04 | JdGordon | whats it doing? |
| 11:14:29 | pixelma | and what "default bitmap"? |
| 11:14:46 | pondlife | Displaying the WPS ok, but no progress bar is being drawn - only the "empty" bitmap I have defined |
| 11:14:57 | pondlife | So I see an empty progressbar all the time. |
| 11:15:25 | pondlife | It used to supply a solid bar, but I don't know if I need to put a bmp in for that now. |
| 11:15:43 | JdGordon | - for the bitmap should show the old bar |
| 11:15:55 | JdGordon | its not showing anything? |
| 11:16:00 | pondlife | No |
| 11:16:26 | pondlife | I'll xip up the WPS |
| 11:16:29 | pondlife | zip, even |
| 11:18:13 | pondlife | pondlife.homeip.net/images/wps.zip">http://pondlife.homeip.net/images/wps.zip |
| 11:19:15 | JdGordon | which sim? |
| 11:20:02 | | Join Genre9mp3 [0] (n=yngwiejo@rockbox/contributor/Genre9mp3) |
| 11:21:22 | pondlife | H300 |
| 11:23:26 | JdGordon | is that 4 correct for y? |
| 11:23:39 | pondlife | It was before |
| 11:23:49 | pondlife | I just inserted some | and - chars |
| 11:24:10 | JdGordon | before when? |
| 11:24:19 | pondlife | Before %pb was changed |
| 11:24:34 | JdGordon | the meaning of the params changed |
| 11:24:38 | pondlife | Ah, ok |
| 11:24:42 | JdGordon | |bmp|x|y|width|height |
| 11:24:50 | pondlife | What was it before then? |
| 11:25:00 | JdGordon | top|left|right|height i tihnk |
| 11:25:33 | pondlife | top = y and left = x ? |
| 11:25:39 | JdGordon | yes |
| 11:25:58 | pixelma | the y-position must have been one of the later parameters |
| 11:26:53 | pondlife | x and y are in pixels? |
| 11:26:55 | pixelma | %pb|height|leftpos|rightpos|toppos| from an old revision of CustoWPS |
| 11:27:04 | pixelma | *CustomWPS |
| 11:27:36 | pixelma | pondlife: yes |
| 11:29:19 | JdGordon | %pb|-|4|100|214|10| is what you want |
| 11:30:15 | | Join goffa [0] (n=goffa@216.220.23.105) |
| 11:30:37 | pondlife | Not %pb|-|4|-|214|10| ? |
| 11:30:42 | pixelma | I thought replacing the 100 with - should put it on the right line as it was before if you didn't specify the "toppos" |
| 11:31:43 | pondlife | Great, %pb|-|4|-|214|10| works |
| 11:31:51 | pondlife | Thanks |
| 11:32:09 | JdGordon | using the number is more likely not not break if the font changes |
| 11:34:14 | | Join MethoS- [0] (n=clemens@dyndsl-085-016-164-057.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 11:35:37 | JdGordon | pondlife: im actually a little surprised that works (having the pb overwrite the bmp) but its nice that it does |
| 11:35:56 | pondlife | It's a long-established technique ;) |
| 11:36:16 | JdGordon | oh ok.. then its nice to see it still working :P |
| 11:38:10 | pixelma | JdGordon: regarding the "not breaking" depends on what you want - stating the number could break it too if you use a different font height because font could overlapp progress bar then |
| 11:39:17 | pondlife | Another catch-up question - how's the smooth seeking meant to work? I find it slows down as it goes on, which is the opposite of what I'd want. |
| 11:39:20 | | Join Lear [0] (i=chatzill@rockbox/developer/lear) |
| 11:39:47 | pondlife | i.e. it seeks fast to start with, then slower |
| 11:40:59 | | Quit goffa_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 11:42:41 | JdGordon | doesnt it only starts slowing down when it gets near the end of the track?? |
| 11:43:16 | pondlife | Maybe, but if you rewind from the end to the start of the track it's rather slower than it used to be |
| 11:43:24 | pondlife | (even with settings on max) |
| 11:44:11 | pondlife | Maybe the setting is the problem... I'll try turning it down! |
| 11:45:23 | pondlife | Nope, that just makes it slow all the way |
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| 11:53:02 | | Quit homielowe () |
| 11:55:04 | pondlife | OK, popped a report on http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/9168 - maybe markun could explain what I've got wrong... |
| 11:55:27 | * | amiconn compared smooth seeking and the old one at devcon |
| 11:55:37 | pondlife | What did you find? |
| 11:55:52 | amiconn | Smooth seeking was significantly faster than the old one for very long files, and about the same for shorter ones |
| 11:55:54 | pondlife | I'm only going on gut reaction, having just updated my sim, so not very scientific. |
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| 11:56:17 | pondlife | I've only tried short files, and it definitely seems slower |
| 11:56:18 | amiconn | I did this on hwcodec and swcodec |
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| 11:56:33 | pondlife | Only tried on H300 sim so far, I have no working target at the moment. |
| 11:56:35 | | Nick petur3 is now known as petur (n=petur@ip-212-239-214-166.dsl-static.scarlet.be) |
| 11:56:50 | pondlife | Suffering from mass Li-Ion failure :/ |
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| 11:58:03 | pondlife | I don't want it to slow down at all, just always accelerate |
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| 11:58:43 | amiconn | It does slow down towards the end of the track. That's nothing new |
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| 11:59:11 | pondlife | Maybe the slowing down is just more pronounced now, so it feels slower even though it's not. |
| 11:59:43 | pondlife | It's very obvious when rewinding too though. |
| 12:00 |
| 12:00:18 | amiconn | Maybe the sim is different. On target it's definitely not any slower |
| 12:00:49 | pondlife | Well, I have got a new H300 battery, so should be able to test this afternoon. |
| 12:03:02 | markun | pondlife: I didn't change anything to the 'slowdown' code at the end of the track, or are you not talking about that |
| 12:03:18 | pondlife | Is the slowdown deliberate? |
| 12:03:32 | pondlife | If so, maybe it's too slow... |
| 12:03:32 | | Join Tuplanolla [0] (n=jani@unaffiliated/tuplanolla) |
| 12:03:54 | pondlife | I should do a comparison on target. |
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| 12:05:44 | markun | pondlife: the slow down was there before my change and is indeed deliberate |
| 12:05:56 | | Part Guest24416 ("I'm not here right now.") |
| 12:06:02 | markun | but maybe it should start slowing down later or allow for a higher max speed |
| 12:06:18 | markun | I can't check the code right now. |
| 12:06:18 | pondlife | OK, maybe it's just that the smooth seek is faster so it makes the slowdown feel slower |
| 12:06:29 | GodEater | Bagder: will the build servers be expected to have the mips compilers on them now too ? |
| 12:06:48 | pondlife | I'd prefer it not to slowdown at track transitions at all, I think... will play. |
| 12:06:49 | markun | pondlife: do you like the smooth seeking otherwise? |
| 12:06:53 | pondlife | Yes |
| 12:07:34 | pondlife | I tend to have books broken up into lots of shorter tracks, for historical reasons. |
| 12:08:20 | pondlife | (Hence continuing acceleration across tracks would be nice if possible.) |
| 12:09:47 | markun | pondlife: I think that should be an option :) |
| 12:10:01 | markun | (if implemented) |
| 12:10:08 | pondlife | Of course |
| 12:13:50 | | Quit petur2 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 12:14:32 | markun | pondlife: btw, it's the max_step variable in apps/gui/gwps-common.c which controls the slowdown |
| 12:14:41 | pondlife | Thanks |
| 12:18:36 | PaulJam | Nico_P: afaik the anti skip buffer setting determines how early rebuffering happens when the buffer for compressed audio gets low. |
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| 12:36:16 | B4gder | GodEater: no, since there's no build table build actually using mips yet |
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| 12:44:31 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
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| 13:00 |
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| 13:43:18 | linuxstb | amiconn: I noticed your nice commit to the bitmap drawing functions and have a couple of questions: 1) Do you now have some kind of "test_bitmap" plugin? 2) Did you benchmark the ARM optimisations enabled for the gigabeat in lcd_bitmap_transparent_part? |
| 13:45:02 | | Join LambdaCalculus37 [0] (i=44a0430f@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-9f6db421c0562bce) |
| 13:45:46 | LambdaCalculus37 | JdGordon: Ping |
| 13:49:20 | LambdaCalculus37 | Or can someone take a look at some WPS tags for me? http://pastebin.com/m6a284d42 |
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| 13:50:06 | | Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@rockbox/developer/mcuelenaere) |
| 13:50:35 | pixelma | LambdaCalculus37: took a look. What am I supposed to see? ;) |
| 13:51:01 | LambdaCalculus37 | pixelma: What tags need fixing to comply with the new WPS syntax? |
| 13:51:04 | amiconn | 1) yes 2) no |
| 13:53:07 | | Join desowin [0] (n=desowin@atheme/member/desowin) |
| 13:54:05 | pixelma | LambdaCalculus37: most likely candidate: the two %pb tags - there should only be one now and you also have to check the used parameters (also see today's log 11:something) |
| 13:55:36 | B4gder | btw, I suggested Rockbox as suitable topic for a future "FLOSS Weekly" show |
| 13:56:44 | mcuelenaere | B4gder: last time I tried the rockboxdev.sh for compiling the mipsel cc it gave me nothing but errors, let's hope your version works :) |
| 13:57:04 | B4gder | mcuelenaere: I built one successfully before I committed it |
| 13:57:10 | mcuelenaere | k |
| 13:57:17 | B4gder | so I hope it works |
| 13:57:23 | gevaerts | What? You test before you commit? |
| 13:57:46 | B4gder | when I want to show-off ;-) |
| 13:58:02 | * | gevaerts is shocked |
| 13:58:46 | mcuelenaere | I suppose that's GCC v4.0.3 which rockboxdev compiles? |
| 13:59:00 | B4gder | yes it is |
| 13:59:14 | B4gder | we can of course change that if we want a newer one for mips |
| 13:59:50 | B4gder | but I bet the MIPS development in gcc isn't racing these days |
| 13:59:51 | mcuelenaere | that's not necessary I think, it's just that I'll set the right version in tools/configure |
| 14:00 |
| 14:00:03 | mcuelenaere | the one I have is GCCv4.2 |
| 14:00:16 | mcuelenaere | so no big difference I presume |
| 14:00:58 | * | LambdaCalculus37 yawns |
| 14:01:13 | LambdaCalculus37 | Too early in the morning to be fixing WPS tags... |
| 14:01:17 | * | mcuelenaere wonders whether rockboxdev.sh should state mipsel instead of mips in the choice screen |
| 14:01:50 | B4gder | mcuelenaere: if 4.0.3 works fine I think we can run wit that for now, for consistency |
| 14:01:59 | B4gder | and yes, it should say mipsel I guess |
| 14:02:08 | mcuelenaere | k |
| 14:02:17 | B4gder | we also talked about switching the coldfire to use c and let mips use m |
| 14:02:30 | mcuelenaere | yes I saw that |
| 14:02:43 | mcuelenaere | to me, it doesn't matter; so do as you please :) |
| 14:03:28 | B4gder | I'm mostly intersted in getting to know that it builds a toolchain that works for you :-) |
| 14:03:58 | mcuelenaere | well, currently it's building :) |
| 14:04:19 | mcuelenaere | I remember mine was stuck at GCC itself, so it got past binutils |
| 14:04:48 | pixelma | LambdaCalculus37: in one of JdGordon's wps patch tasks there was also a script that should fix old WPSs for the new syntax. You could try that but if you want that revert the first %pb (the one with the bitmap name) to %P |
| 14:05:57 | LambdaCalculus37 | pixelma: Which patch task is that? |
| 14:07:11 | pixelma | FS #9027 |
| 14:07:15 | * | mcuelenaere wonders what he did wrong last time; B4gder's mipsel cc builds fine |
| 14:07:33 | * | B4gder used his secret super-powers |
| 14:07:49 | LambdaCalculus37 | pixelma: Thanks; checking it out now. |
| 14:08:08 | * | gevaerts points out that while it builds fine, it may not actually generate mips binaries |
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| 14:08:33 | * | mcuelenaere points out it doesn't have to generate mips binaries, as long as it does mipsel it's fine for him |
| 14:08:36 | B4gder | you think my powers have glitches? ;-) |
| 14:08:45 | B4gder | haha |
| 14:08:52 | * | LambdaCalculus37 can't seem to bring up FS #9027 in Flyspray |
| 14:09:10 | * | gevaerts doesn't care about endianness naming things |
| 14:09:27 | LambdaCalculus37 | Ahh... got it now. |
| 14:11:10 | * | mcuelenaere wonders whether there's a difference between elf32-littlemips and elf32-tradlittlemips |
| 14:13:10 | mcuelenaere | "ld terminated with signal 11 (Segmentation fault)" |
| 14:13:55 | * | gevaerts looks at B4gder |
| 14:14:18 | B4gder | that's not gcc ;-P |
| 14:14:21 | | Join MethoS_ [0] (n=clemens@91.97.240.196) |
| 14:14:54 | B4gder | mcuelenaere: annoying... |
| 14:15:10 | B4gder | probably we should try a more recent binutils then |
| 14:15:17 | B4gder | what version did you use before? |
| 14:15:32 | mcuelenaere | B4gder: it occurs whenever I add *(.sbss*); to boot.lds |
| 14:15:45 | mcuelenaere | but if I don't, it complains about missing .sbss.line regions |
| 14:15:51 | mcuelenaere | GCC4.2 |
| 14:15:58 | mcuelenaere | ah binutils |
| 14:16:13 | B4gder | "ld −−version" |
| 14:16:31 | B4gder | or mipsel-elf-ld rather |
| 14:16:33 | mcuelenaere | 2.18.0.20080103 |
| 14:16:39 | mcuelenaere | mipsel-linux-ld −−help |
| 14:16:55 | B4gder | ah right, linux... |
| 14:16:57 | mcuelenaere | mipsel-elf-ld −−help: 2.16.1 |
| 14:17:08 | mcuelenaere | so -elf is your version, -linux is the one I got from emdebian |
| 14:17:13 | B4gder | yes |
| 14:17:23 | mcuelenaere | (actually it's -gnu but I symlinked -linux to -gnu) |
| 14:17:50 | LambdaCalculus37 | pixelma: My WPS is fixed now. Thanks again! :) |
| 14:18:33 | mcuelenaere | B4gder: if I try with mipsel-linux-ld it gives me a segfault too |
| 14:18:46 | mcuelenaere | ah no srry |
| 14:19:26 | | Part toffe82 |
| 14:20:07 | mcuelenaere | does make cache Makefile's? |
| 14:20:58 | B4gder | no |
| 14:21:34 | B4gder | but the root Makefile contains info about the toolchain it uses |
| 14:21:44 | mcuelenaere | hmm mipsel-linux-ld gives me a segfault too.. |
| 14:22:01 | B4gder | oh |
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| 14:22:45 | mcuelenaere | or I don't know who it is, mipsel-linux-gcc calls mipsel-linux-ld; right? |
| 14:22:53 | B4gder | yes |
| 14:23:04 | mcuelenaere | ok then both gives segfaults |
| 14:24:38 | mcuelenaere | yep, double checked |
| 14:26:34 | | Quit freqmod_qu (Remote closed the connection) |
| 14:27:02 | * | mcuelenaere wonders whether the configuration error at RBUtil first startup shouldn't be a configuration warning or something else more user-friendly |
| 14:27:22 | * | gevaerts points mcuelenaere at the svn version |
| 14:27:36 | B4gder | :-) |
| 14:28:02 | mcuelenaere | gevaerts: was there a change? because I only looked at GraphicalInstall and m1.0.6 |
| 14:28:12 | gevaerts | mcuelenaere: yes. Last night |
| 14:29:10 | mcuelenaere | gevaerts: ah ok, so that's what you changed :) I only skimmed through the SVN log but didn't really try to understand what I was reading I presume :) |
| 14:29:46 | gevaerts | mcuelenaere: yes. I made the mistake to complain about it here :) |
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| 14:31:39 | mcuelenaere | then I really wasn't paying attention yesterday :) (too busy with new MIPSel targets ;) ) |
| 14:31:41 | Nico_P | a quick wizard could be nice |
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| 14:35:15 | mcuelenaere | what's bad about using the newest version of GCC for cross compilers? e.g. 4.3 |
| 14:35:56 | | Join kawds [0] (n=kawds@static-87-79-236-141.netcologne.de) |
| 14:35:56 | B4gder | traditionally all new version bumps have caused minor hiccups we've needed to address |
| 14:36:16 | B4gder | but there's nothing in particular that must go wrong |
| 14:36:36 | mcuelenaere | ok then I'll start with 4.1 |
| 14:37:18 | * | gevaerts warns Nico_P about that sort of comments. It can lead to work |
| 14:38:18 | * | mcuelenaere changes his mind, let's see what version Ingenic recommends |
| 14:39:42 | mcuelenaere | either 3.3.1 or 4.1.2 |
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| 14:40:37 | amiconn | mcuelenaere: Sometimes (read: not unlikely) newer versions produce slower and/or broken code, at least for the 3 architectures we're using for a while. And SH needs a special patch that needs to be ported |
| 14:41:39 | | Quit perrikwp (Client Quit) |
| 14:41:43 | mcuelenaere | from what I see not only SH needs a patch |
| 14:42:00 | B4gder | no, there's a few different patches needed |
| 14:42:25 | | Join Synthpop [0] (n=Synthpop@c213-100-135-215.swipnet.se) |
| 14:42:45 | B4gder | but we can always just start with letting mips use the particular version you deem the one to use |
| 14:42:53 | Synthpop | Question can i disable refresh database on sansa c250 firmware? |
| 14:42:55 | B4gder | s/mips/mipsel ;-) |
| 14:42:58 | mcuelenaere | :) |
| 14:43:05 | Nico_P | gevaerts: hehe, I guess you speak from experience ;) |
| 14:43:27 | mcuelenaere | for that, I first need to learn a bit of UNIX Shell |
| 14:43:27 | gevaerts | Nico_P: it happened to me not very long ago :) |
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| 14:44:22 | kawds | is there a sleeptimer in rockbox? i can not find it |
| 14:44:32 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 14:44:38 | GodEater | kawds: what target ? |
| 14:44:46 | kawds | ipod nano 1gen |
| 14:45:14 | B4gder | mcuelenaere: just add binutils="2.18" and gccver="4.1.2" before the "target=mipsel-elf" line |
| 14:45:44 | B4gder | then it'll only use them for that particualr choice |
| 14:45:50 | PaulJam | kawds: should be in the system entry of the main menu. |
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| 14:46:01 | kawds | will check asap |
| 14:46:21 | mcuelenaere | B4gder: ah yes, of course :) stupid me |
| 14:46:31 | kawds | found it, thx |
| 14:46:35 | Synthpop | I get a 9mb of DBSPACE.BIN on my sansa c250 i have database refresh off on rockbox , still it refreshes database everytime i unplug the charger |
| 14:46:36 | mcuelenaere | I was going to do some if (string == "mips") checking |
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| 14:49:32 | Synthpop | i run c250 EUROPE (No FM) - 01.01.00e for Europe without FM with rockbox. |
| 14:50:27 | pixelma | Synthpop: the auto-update of Rockbox database has nothing to do with the original firmware's. Unfortunately I don't know of a way to suppress it completely unless you compile your own build with the experimental Rockbox USB stack enabled (which can have drawbacks too). But if you don't care that the original firmware doesn't find music files you can at least shorten this update |
| 14:52:27 | Synthpop | how i do that? |
| 14:53:05 | Synthpop | i mean make files undetectable to original firmware |
| 14:53:14 | PaulJam | Synthpop: i think there is a way to supress the database update by write protecting some files, i don't know which, though. maybe you find something in the forums. |
| 14:53:26 | Synthpop | oh ok |
| 14:53:56 | Synthpop | i was thinking overloading my player |
| 14:54:03 | Synthpop | would help |
| 14:54:29 | pixelma | Synthpop: set the SYSTEM directory to read only, the OF will start the update, find that it can not write to this directory and complains about "not enough space for the music db" or something like that and stop there |
| 14:55:15 | pixelma | this recipe is in the forums too where I found it |
| 14:56:50 | kawds | yay, played doom |
| 14:56:54 | kawds | :-D |
| 14:56:59 | Synthpop | it refreshes anyway |
| 14:57:00 | kawds | but can not quit |
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| 14:57:50 | kawds | how can i quit doom= :-O |
| 14:58:03 | gevaerts | kawds: the manual should have that info |
| 14:58:17 | kawds | off course X-) |
| 14:59:51 | webguest02 | hi, i have been away from rockbox for about 4 years and I am having problems using it now... |
| 15:00 |
| 15:00:12 | markun | webguest02: a lot has changed in 4 years.. |
| 15:00:28 | B4gder | 4 years! |
| 15:00:54 | webguest02 | yes B4gder, I remember you.. I really want to know what version I should use that is stable enough for my archos V1R? |
| 15:01:28 | B4gder | you should know that when you ask us here we'll say the latest build... |
| 15:02:40 | webguest02 | you may laugh, but I had to go back to a daily 20030406 to get it to work how I'm used to! |
| 15:03:41 | LambdaCalculus37 | What!? Why deny yourself all of the good stuff Rockbox has gained in the last four years? |
| 15:03:45 | B4gder | well, I don't even remember that long back ;-) |
| 15:04:09 | gevaerts | Then I'm pretty sure that there will be some changes for you to get used to by now |
| 15:05:43 | webguest02 | yeah I know there has been so much done since the early days, I even had to re-check that i was actually running rockbox when i first put the new version on it. |
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| 15:08:22 | * | gevaerts wonders if he should tell webguest02 that rockbox now also supports non-archos players ;) |
| 15:08:23 | | Quit kawds ("ChatZilla 0.9.83 [Firefox 3.0/2008052906]") |
| 15:08:53 | * | LambdaCalculus37 thinks we should tell webguest02 about all of the new compatible players ;) |
| 15:09:27 | webguest02 | yeah I saw that gevaerts, but i still can't bring myself to buy an ipod, they go against everything i beleive in! |
| 15:09:52 | webguest02 | is there any non ipod device that i should get? |
| 15:09:58 | LambdaCalculus37 | webguest02: Gigabeat! |
| 15:10:42 | PaulJam | iriver H100 or H300! |
| 15:10:54 | LambdaCalculus37 | iAudio X5, M5, or M3! |
| 15:11:26 | webguest02 | I thought i'd be opening a can of worms with that question... i have been using a nokia 6120 with 8gb card for mp3 duties lately, but i need more space. |
| 15:11:28 | Synthpop | hehe thanx guys |
| 15:11:41 | Synthpop | not enough space please free memory :D |
| 15:11:51 | Synthpop | no more Refresh database =) |
| 15:12:01 | markun | webguest02: http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/BuyersGuide |
| 15:12:24 | webguest02 | wow, documentation, things hreally have moved on!!! |
| 15:12:30 | markun | ;) |
| 15:12:52 | LambdaCalculus37 | webguest02: We told you so. ;) |
| 15:15:28 | webguest02 | LambdaCalculus3: since you brought it up, does a gigabeat have a 2.5" or 1.8" hdd? |
| 15:15:44 | LambdaCalculus37 | 1.8" hard drive. |
| 15:15:52 | linuxstb | webguest02: Only the Archos devices have 2.5" drives (out of supported Rockbox devices) |
| 15:16:52 | markun | mcuelenaere: your MIPS based player doesn't have any other processor/DSP right? |
| 15:17:09 | | Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.) |
| 15:17:14 | webguest02 | whats the biggest 1.8" hdd available these days? |
| 15:17:15 | | Join amiconn [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) |
| 15:17:17 | B4gder | 240MHz mips should be enough for Rockbox I'd think ;-) |
| 15:17:47 | GodEater | webguest02: that's a complicated question to answer, since they come with multiple interfaces, not all of which are possible to use in current Rockbox targets |
| 15:18:02 | mcuelenaere | markun: it does have some kind of multimedia acceleration, but AFAIK those are just extra instructions |
| 15:18:03 | PaulJam | webguest02: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/WebHome?topic=HardDriveReplacement |
| 15:18:30 | petur | webguest02: afaik, 160GB |
| 15:19:27 | | Quit MethoS_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 15:19:44 | mcuelenaere | B4gder: up to 360Mhz even ;) |
| 15:20:16 | B4gder | right, I noticed there are two kinds |
| 15:21:21 | webguest02 | i'm almost speachless about the excellent info you guys have in the wiki. |
| 15:22:02 | GodEater | almost but not quite :) |
| 15:22:53 | webguest02 | I will be now - im gonna go read some more now, thanks for all the help. bye. |
| 15:24:29 | | Quit Arathis (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 15:25:48 | mcuelenaere | markun: the Jz4740 does have a coprocessor, the IPU which seems to be some kind of YUV->RGB convertor and other stuff |
| 15:25:48 | | Quit webguest02 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 15:26:50 | | Quit Genre9mp3 () |
| 15:29:09 | B4gder | well, let's hope we get some use for the AS3517 data sheet now too |
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| 15:39:36 | webguest84 | guys, im back again with my v1r, the latest build just aint working for me... |
| 15:39:52 | pondlife | In what way? |
| 15:40:21 | pondlife | Do you get the start menu displayed? |
| 15:41:10 | webguest84 | oh ive just worked it out, now i knoow what "repeat a-b" does - doh |
| 15:43:25 | | Nick Lear_ is now known as Lear (i=chatzill@rockbox/developer/lear) |
| 15:43:25 | linuxstb | GodEater: I'm assuming you still haven't investigated optimised video playback in Linux on the PS3? |
| 15:43:32 | linuxstb | oops... |
| 15:43:59 | webguest84 | !one more thing... is the a/c plug icon missing now? |
| 15:44:52 | pixelma | where? Do you mean in the while playing screen? |
| 15:44:56 | petur | none of our targets has airconditioning... |
| 15:45:07 | webguest84 | pixelma: yeah |
| 15:45:22 | LambdaCalculus37 | petur: Would be nice if they did. ;) |
| 15:45:45 | pondlife | LambdaCalculus37: Well there's an idea for a patch... ;) |
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| 15:46:12 | LambdaCalculus37 | pondlife: Along with the coffee plugin and beer plugin? ;) |
| 15:46:32 | pondlife | Beer, yes. Not sure about coffee though. |
| 15:46:56 | pixelma | webguest84: hrmm... I thought it should work in the new default theme but had no means to test. You could try other themes/WPSs, e.g. the "rockbox default" which shows the text based one with the statusbar enabled if you didn't turn it off globally. |
| 15:48:03 | pixelma | doesn't the battery icon at the bottom change if you plug in the charger? |
| 15:48:49 | pixelma | in the new default WPS (the graphical one) I mean |
| 15:49:21 | | Quit MethoS- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 15:49:35 | webguest84 | pixelma: im having hardware issues with my plug i think, it is very intermittant - and mostly not working, so it is hard to test just now. |
| 15:50:18 | pondlife | markun: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/9169 gives an option to NOT limit seek speed. I like it (on sim at least). |
| 15:51:11 | pondlife | Oops, I accidentally capitalised some other english.lang stuff in there, will tidy up... |
| 15:51:37 | webguest84 | pixelma: ok yeah, the battery symbol changes - when it temporarily made contact. thanks for the help. |
| 15:52:13 | pixelma | hmm, ok. Thanks for testing it too. :) |
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| 15:53:11 | pondlife | Do we normally capitalise all settings? e.g. "Disable Resume On Startup If Phones Unplugged" rather than "Disable resume on startup if phones unplugged" ... |
| 15:54:39 | pixelma | webguest84: I _think_ I read somewhere (forums, wiki or here) about bad solder points (especially battery contacts) being typical on the RecordersV1. Can't tell you more unfortunately. |
| 15:55:26 | | Quit MethoS_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 15:55:42 | webguest84 | pixelma: thanks, i think i have narrowed it down to the cable rather than the plug, thankfully. |
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| 15:58:46 | webguest84 | rockbox is so cool, i love havng my v1r still perfectly usable (with 100gb hdd installed) even after what... 6 years of use! |
| 15:59:22 | pondlife | Also, still gaining new features after 6 years is pretty cool ;) |
| 16:00 |
| 16:00:49 | webguest84 | We all need to thank archos for making such pathetic stock firmware, otherwise rockbox may never have happened. |
| 16:01:09 | | Quit desowin (Excess Flood) |
| 16:01:13 | pondlife | True, but there have been worse stock firmwares since |
| 16:01:30 | | Join desowin [0] (n=desowin@atheme/member/desowin) |
| 16:02:40 | GodEater | and depressingly I suspect there's still worse to come |
| 16:03:07 | webguest84 | are you sure pondlife, the stock archos didn't even acutally work for more than 2-3 songs without crashing. and you could forget about using playlists bigger than 10 songs too! |
| 16:03:32 | pondlife | Yes, I had a V1R for many years...! |
| 16:03:36 | * | gevaerts doesn't find that depressing. The worst the OFs are, the more people who want to fix things by working on rockbox |
| 16:03:47 | pondlife | I rue the day I sold it now.. |
| 16:03:51 | gevaerts | s/t/e/ in the right place... |
| 16:05:16 | webguest84 | pondlife: how long did it take you to find rockbox after getting your stock v1r? it took me 3 days - and then only because i had to wait the weekend to go to work and look on the internet! |
| 16:05:43 | pondlife | I actually bought my Recorder because of Rockbox - a friend already had it. |
| 16:05:52 | pondlife | So, I never used the OF much |
| 16:06:12 | webguest84 | 3 days was way to long to use it! |
| 16:06:17 | | Quit goffa (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 16:09:29 | | Quit MTee (Client Quit) |
| 16:09:47 | LambdaCalculus37 | I bought mine especially for Rockbox. |
| 16:10:12 | LambdaCalculus37 | But I'm a bit of a latecomer with the Archos. ;) |
| 16:13:39 | | Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") |
| 16:14:27 | webguest84 | how much is a v1r worth these days, i bet it aint anywhere near the 280 quid i forked out. |
| 16:14:46 | | Join LambdaCalculus37 [0] (i=44a0430f@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-1aa6152de567c9c2) |
| 16:15:20 | LambdaCalculus37 | Mine was under $20 USD. |
| 16:16:16 | * | linuxstb can't remember how much he paid, but suspects it was close to 280 GBP... |
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| 16:18:23 | MarcGuay | LambdaCalculus37: Got your laptop today? http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/9165 |
| 16:21:27 | LambdaCalculus37 | MarcGuay: Yep. Will test. |
| 16:23:18 | pondlife | MarcGuay: Were we standardising on all settings text being capitalised? |
| 16:24:18 | MarcGuay | pondlife: There was a task for it and most were changed to that format. I noticed on the h300 that some are still using "sentence" style... |
| 16:24:39 | pondlife | OK, I'll carry on in that direction then |
| 16:25:11 | pondlife | http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/9169 contains some (somewhat accidentally) |
| 16:27:34 | * | JdGordon thinks MarcGuay should stop setting "version 3.0" unless he plans to sart fixing them :p |
| 16:27:45 | | Quit webguest84 ("CGI:IRC") |
| 16:28:20 | MarcGuay | JdGordon: I'll fix them if you provide the manual .diffs |
| 16:28:32 | JdGordon | touche' ! |
| 16:30:37 | MarcGuay | JdGordon: Just following on Llorean's suggestion. I have a feeling he'll end up being the release coordinator whether he likes it or not. |
| 16:31:15 | JdGordon | what was his suggestion? |
| 16:32:01 | JdGordon | pixelma: (or someone with a c200)... is 9018 still/really an issue? |
| 16:32:06 | MarcGuay | JdGordon: Mark things that you think are important to a release as 3.0 and we'll pare the list down when it comes time. |
| 16:33:09 | JdGordon | yeah, ok, thats fair enough |
| 16:33:18 | JdGordon | I was just making a bad joke re more FS spam |
| 16:33:30 | MarcGuay | JdGordon: Tasty. |
| 16:36:45 | pixelma | JdGordon: yes, happens to me too that the OF doesn't detect the USB connection if I insert USB and forgot to take out the card before but I don't think that Rockbox can do much about it. I suspect that it is a timing problem in the OF (which becomes more noticable with the "additional" Rockbox bootloader) because this also happens to me sometimes without the card when connecting to an old laptop with USB1.1 ports |
| 16:37:20 | pondlife | MarcGuay: Re your Data Abort bug (FS #9153) - could you try Lear's buffering patch - http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/9164 ... |
| 16:37:40 | JdGordon | does replugging the usb connector make it connect? that happens on the e200 sometimes also |
| 16:38:05 | MarcGuay | pondlife: It'll take a few days to say if it's working, but yes, I'll give it a go. |
| 16:38:12 | pondlife | Sounds very similar |
| 16:38:22 | pixelma | JdGordon: not a real issue to me - because you can take the card out before or just replug (OF already started) and some people don't have that problem at all |
| 16:38:29 | pixelma | so yes |
| 16:38:54 | JdGordon | ok then |
| 16:44:33 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 16:45:05 | LambdaCalculus37 | JdGordon: I haven't had any issues with my c240 regarding FS #9018. |
| 16:46:45 | pondlife | Nico_P: Could I close http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8102 (audio glitch at beginning of new playlist) - it's not been happening for me for a long time now. |
| 16:46:58 | | Nick JdGordon is now known as JdGordon|zzz (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) |
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| 16:48:42 | Nico_P | pondlife: you used to be able to reproduce? |
| 16:49:01 | pondlife | Not sure, but I used to get a glitch at start of playback sometimes |
| 16:49:15 | pondlife | It's not happened for months now though |
| 16:49:34 | pondlife | Just wondered if you still had an issue |
| 16:50:08 | Nico_P | I only got it when I tried, and I didn't try very often... I've never even tried on the ipod |
| 16:50:12 | Nico_P | let me check |
| 16:55:24 | | Quit MethoS-- (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) |
| 16:59:40 | MarcGuay | pondlife: I do use dircache and album art - that definitely sounds like the same thing. |
| 17:00 |
| 17:02:00 | Nico_P | pondlife: I couldn't reproduce the glitch on the ipod |
| 17:02:08 | Lear | MarcGuay: Can you relatively easily re-produce it? I can do it sometimes with certain tracks... If you can, I have another patch that might help (without any extra mutex locking). |
| 17:02:16 | Nico_P | maybe it still exists on the gigabeat, but I don't have mine |
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| 17:02:21 | pondlife | Nico_P: Feel free to close the bug then..? |
| 17:02:43 | Nico_P | pondlife: I'm hesitant |
| 17:03:08 | MarcGuay | Lear: I could never find a way to reproduce it, unfortunately. The only way to test is to use it regularly for a few days. |
| 17:04:01 | pondlife | Nico_P: You can always reopen it... |
| 17:04:51 | Lear | MarcGuay: Still, sounds like it happens more often than for me. :) |
| 17:05:19 | Nico_P | pondlife: you're right |
| 17:05:33 | pondlife | Lear, MarcGuay: If you're both running the patch, we'll get a more solid idea of fixiness... |
| 17:08:25 | Nico_P | Lear: what's the current state of your patch? no more mutex calls? |
| 17:09:42 | MarcGuay | Lear: Could it have something to do with the size of the files (I experience it mostly with FLAC), or the size of the album art (mine is quite large)? |
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| 17:13:30 | Lear | MarcGuay: I've seen it with Vorbis and 120x120 album art. My guess is that it is timing sensitive somehow, but I don't know what that timing affects... |
| 17:16:07 | MarcGuay | Lear: It definitely occurs when play is pressed during or immediately after the splash screen. |
| 17:17:05 | pondlife | What if you set the start screen to be the WPS? |
| 17:17:23 | Lear | MarcGuay: Hm, that could be worth trying... |
| 17:17:54 | | Join Horschti [0] (n=Horscht@p4FD4BCB1.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:17:59 | pondlife | Anyone know where RBUtil gets the wordlist from when it creates a voice file? |
| 17:18:40 | | Quit Horscht (Nick collision from services.) |
| 17:21:37 | pixelma | wordlist? |
| 17:25:03 | MarcGuay | Anyone with an iPod care to test the most benign patch ever? http://pastebin.com/d19af04e3, It should fix http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8950. |
| 17:25:57 | MarcGuay | pondlife, Lear: Try as I might I can't find a recipe for the data aborts. |
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| 17:26:22 | pixelma | please, no messing with PLA :\ |
| 17:27:01 | MarcGuay | pixelma: Sorry? |
| 17:28:04 | pondlife | The PLA was already in there... :/ |
| 17:28:13 | pixelma | your patch, exceptions here and there |
| 17:28:49 | MarcGuay | Is pluginactions outdated? |
| 17:29:49 | pixelma | on DevCon it was agreed on that if a plugin doesn't work correctly with pluginlib actions, then it should rather use normal button defines again to make it work correctly. The problem with pluginlib actions is that it introduces hidden dependencies |
| 17:30:34 | MarcGuay | It's the first time I've stuck my head into the plugins. So you're saying a larger rework of the buttons is needed, not just a fix of what's already there? |
| 17:30:49 | pixelma | or use the "actions" system (not pluginlib actions) but define its own, not in a library |
| 17:33:08 | MarcGuay | pixelma: Could you point me to an example of the right way? |
| 17:33:23 | pixelma | MarcGuay: I wouldn't be surprised if your patch breaks something else or on another target, e.g did you try on e200 and Ipods (even in a sim), are you sure that "PLA_DOWN" etc. is the same on all scrollwheel targets? |
| 17:34:19 | MarcGuay | pixelma: Tested on the e200 and always forget the sims. I did check as much as possible, which I why I coded it that way. |
| 17:35:22 | MarcGuay | pixelma: See line 99 of pluginlibactions |
| 17:36:18 | | Quit Nico_P ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") |
| 17:36:45 | MarcGuay | Unfortunately if you look at line 2290 of bubbles.c, an exeption is made for the e200 which makes the whole thing rather messy. |
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| 17:38:01 | gevaerts | That's why a lot of people don't like this PLA thing |
| 17:38:13 | MarcGuay | gevaerts: It's pretty dirty. |
| 17:38:24 | pixelma | bubbles was the first plugin to be _converted_ to pluginlib actions and if that doesn't work without exceptions... |
| 17:38:39 | MarcGuay | Good concept but clearly it's failing... |
| 17:40:28 | | Nick MarcGuay is now known as MarcGone (n=chatzill@ip216-239-77-80.vif.net) |
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| 17:56:43 | MarcGuay | pondlife, Lear: So if I were to test a patch for the data aborts would the one posted at FS #9164 be the one to go with? |
| 17:57:03 | pondlife | Lear will know... |
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| 17:59:00 | mcuelenaere | Bagder, B4gder: GCC4.1.2 doesn't compile for me, so for the moment I'm going to stick with the binaries of emdebian |
| 17:59:19 | Lear | MarcGuay: Yes, I guess so. Though Nico_P doesn't think that much locking is needed... I don't have anything better for now (thought I had, but...). |
| 18:00 |
| 18:00:12 | MarcGuay | Lear: Would it make sense to wait given that I'll have to use it for a few days before knowing anything? |
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| 18:02:10 | doldi | testing? |
| 18:02:21 | doldi | Hi@all |
| 18:02:29 | doldi | some people here? |
| 18:02:49 | MarcGuay | doldi: 138 of us. Ask away. |
| 18:02:57 | | Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye") |
| 18:03:01 | Lear | MarcGuay: I'd say go ahead and test if you want. I don't know when (or if) I'll come up with anything better. It's tricky when you don't really know what the problem is. :) |
| 18:03:14 | doldi | Hi Mark |
| 18:03:18 | MarcGuay | Lear: But the results would still be useful? |
| 18:03:31 | | Quit markun (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 18:03:35 | doldi | i have Problems with current build for archos Player |
| 18:03:46 | | Join midgey [0] (n=tjross@c-71-205-31-207.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) |
| 18:03:55 | scorche|sh | doldi: i still dont see a question/problem... |
| 18:04:09 | LambdaCalculus37 | What is the exact problem you're having with your Archos? |
| 18:04:13 | doldi | if i put in the charger ther is Panic ata11 on display |
| 18:04:14 | Lear | MarcGuay: Yes, it would say something. |
| 18:04:40 | doldi | with build 2.5.1 they will work perfect |
| 18:04:59 | MarcGuay | doldi: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7960 |
| 18:05:15 | | Join Nico_P [50] (n=nicolas@rockbox/developer/NicoP) |
| 18:05:16 | doldi | I'm reworking 6 Players here in Germany - flashing no prob - but whats that? |
| 18:05:31 | * | MarcGuay knows the task list a little too well |
| 18:06:42 | doldi | thx |
| 18:07:09 | doldi | @all - an sorry, i'm not the fastest of the world :-) |
| 18:07:17 | | Join Arathis [0] (n=doerk@p508A42E4.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 18:07:58 | MarcGuay | doldi: No reason to apologize. |
| 18:09:08 | doldi | lol, no no - i'm only think - doldi is to stupid to flash :-))) |
| 18:09:40 | * | pondlife is pleased we only have 18 bugs to fix before 3.0 ;) |
| 18:10:44 | PaulJam | if i understand correctly none of those are show stoppers. |
| 18:11:18 | LambdaCalculus37 | \o/ |
| 18:11:20 | pondlife | Well, they're marked to be fixed before release 3.0. |
| 18:11:36 | doldi | great information, thx |
| 18:11:38 | pondlife | Of course, we'll whittle the list down first too. |
| 18:12:01 | Nico_P | pondlife: IIRC there were 23 last time I looked... have you been closing some? |
| 18:12:09 | doldi | charging_lockup_partial.patch (2.7 KiB) |
| 18:12:11 | MarcGuay | pondlife: I've been marking stuff that falls into the "this isn't insignificant" category. |
| 18:12:42 | pondlife | http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7672 is interesting, both my H300 and Gigabeat have recently suffered from batteries that appear to die quickly, but the OF on the H300 still works |
| 18:12:55 | doldi | Its right - if i install this it will helpfull? |
| 18:13:29 | doldi | Yes of course - holding the (-) Buttom will also help on AJB |
| 18:14:21 | doldi | and of last: build 2.5.1 will also work an may Players and Recorders |
| 18:16:24 | doldi | Thank you all for information, greetings from germany |
| 18:16:40 | PaulJam | hmm, i have seen the volume increasing by itself on my H300, but i thought this was some weird hardware issue, because it only happened with the remote connected. |
| 18:16:50 | | Quit bertrik ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 18:16:59 | scorche|sh | doldi: keep in mind that 2.5.1 is an unofficial build |
| 18:18:32 | doldi | i know - but it works for me ;-) |
| 18:18:59 | scorche|sh | that may be, but we try not to discuss such things around here and keep to the official stuff |
| 18:19:07 | | Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection) |
| 18:19:14 | doldi | sorry |
| 18:19:58 | Llorean | pondlife: Bugs marked "Due in 3.0" aren't showstoppers, just ones we'd like to call interest to (either for reproducing, documenting, or fixing). Right now, afaik, there aren't any showstoppersl |
| 18:20:33 | pondlife | I didn't say there were, just that they'd been marked to look at. |
| 18:20:52 | * | scorche|sh reminds scorche to do some tests with the newest build to see if any playback oddness is seen |
| 18:21:05 | Xerion | yay my franken-h160 works :P |
| 18:21:31 | Xerion | built from h140 and h160 parts, a new battery and a 60 GB hd :p |
| 18:21:38 | Xerion | err h140 and 120 parts |
| 18:21:41 | Llorean | PaulJam: The volume increasing by itself on the H10 is actually a hardware flaw |
| 18:21:55 | PaulJam | Llorean: H300 |
| 18:21:56 | | Quit bughunter2 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 18:22:04 | Llorean | PaulJam: When the power gets too low the touchpad acts erratically. In lists it'll scroll past the top, in the WPS it'll increase volume |
| 18:22:18 | Llorean | PaulJam: I'm suggesting your H300 is almost certainly not related to that linked flyspray task |
| 18:22:28 | | Join Mathiasdm [0] (n=Mathias@vpne203.ugent.be) |
| 18:23:10 | PaulJam | Llorean: ok, sorry. i didn't realize that this FS entry is H10 specific. |
| 18:23:10 | Llorean | You may have a problem, but the H10 one is of a known cause, while yours is something different. |
| 18:23:22 | | Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye") |
| 18:23:35 | Llorean | Just trying to clarify. :) |
| 18:31:04 | MarcGuay | When building a simulator it no longer asks for a simulator type. Should all references to choosing SDL be removed from the docs? |
| 18:32:08 | gevaerts | Probably |
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| 18:39:10 | Galaxor | Hey. This isn't linux, is it? |
| 18:39:19 | gevaerts | no. Why? |
| 18:39:46 | Galaxor | I just assumed it was. So this is a totally new os? |
| 18:40:18 | gevaerts | For some values of "new". Rockbox started more than 6 years ago |
| 18:40:46 | Galaxor | Right. Here, "new" = "from-scratch". |
| 18:40:59 | gevaerts | ok, then yes |
| 18:40:59 | scorche|sh | it is made "from scratch" for such purposes as a DAP firmware..."new os" goes a bit far, as i dont knwo why anyone would want to use it for something else |
| 18:41:41 | Galaxor | Doesn't it have to provide many of the interfaces that an os for a pc would? |
| 18:41:51 | scorche|sh | ...no? |
| 18:42:01 | scorche|sh | not sure what you are getting at there |
| 18:42:24 | Galaxor | I don't know. I just thought this was some linux port. Now I'm extra impressed. |
| 18:43:00 | MarcGuay | LambdaCalculus37: I'm getting errors trying to run the sim, would you mind testing that patch? Sorry to be a PITA. |
| 18:43:47 | LambdaCalculus37 | MarcGuay: Need to update my SVN trunk. |
| 18:44:35 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 18:49:20 | Llorean | pondlife: With your "seeking slows down" flyspray you're kinda unclear on what's happening. |
| 18:49:38 | Llorean | Seeking always, for me, slows down as you approach the end of the track. It should accelerate, peak, then decelerate |
| 18:49:56 | pondlife | Yes that's how it normally happens. |
| 18:50:11 | pondlife | The patch adds an option to remove the deceleration |
| 18:50:27 | Llorean | And with that option on, it's broken? |
| 18:50:32 | pondlife | ? |
| 18:50:39 | pondlife | No, it's a new feature |
| 18:50:45 | Llorean | The feature is *smooth* acceleration |
| 18:50:48 | pondlife | I don't like the deceleraetion |
| 18:51:04 | Llorean | It should still follow the arc, just with a gradual increase/decrease instead of large steps |
| 18:52:10 | pondlife | Yes, that works fine. But, I personally don't like the deceleration. I only found out that was deliberate today though. |
| 18:52:34 | pondlife | The deceleration has been in there since before smooth acceleration, IIUC. |
| 18:53:02 | LambdaCalculus37 | MarcGuay: Unless you can roll a build for me with the patch applied. |
| 18:53:16 | pondlife | I wanted the ability to just seek faster and faster until I released the key, that's what the patch adds. |
| 18:53:23 | * | LambdaCalculus37 has to recover from the shock of his Gigabeast's OF suddenly deciding to wipe his drive |
| 18:53:50 | Llorean | pondlife: I was referring to your closed bug report, not opened patch. Somehow I didn't notice it was closed. |
| 18:53:55 | pondlife | Ah, sorry. |
| 18:54:09 | pondlife | That was me getting confused earlier. |
| 18:54:29 | pondlife | The nice new acceleration just made the deceleration even more obvious. |
| 18:54:43 | Llorean | Your new patch changes a LOT of unrelated language strings. |
| 18:54:51 | pondlife | I know, I'll remove them |
| 18:55:04 | pondlife | See logs above - needs splitting when I get time |
| 18:55:19 | pondlife | Also needs the manual entry doing |
| 18:56:29 | Llorean | Without speed limiting, getting through a very long track and still finding a point within about 5-10% of the end would be impossible, btw. |
| 18:56:37 | Llorean | Seeking isn't exactly meant for regular use on short files. |
| 18:56:47 | MarcGuay | LambdaCalculus37: A VM reboot got the sim working, thanks anyway. Starting to wonder what's going on with that. |
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| 18:57:01 | Llorean | Well, not impossible, I guess. You could stop seeking, then re-start to throttle the acceleration |
| 18:57:04 | Llorean | That'd be a hassle. |
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| 18:57:17 | LambdaCalculus37 | MarcGuay: Sorry, I'm just rather miffed right now because I've now got to recover all of my music again. |
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| 19:00 |
| 19:01:33 | * | LambdaCalculus37 wonders where jhMikeS has been lately |
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| 19:10:14 | MarcGuay | Hmm. Regarding my last commit, the buttons now match the background images, but it would be better if the images were changed to match those of the e200 so that 8 is Up and 2 is Down. |
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| 19:15:39 | pixelma | MarcGuay: does that mean 8 and arrow up now moves down? |
| 19:16:10 | MarcGuay | pixelma: Yes, but that's what the background image describes. |
| 19:16:21 | pixelma | I think I've been told that it was changed from that before and only the background image wasn't changed... |
| 19:16:28 | MarcGuay | pixelma: The fix should really be in the background image. |
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| 19:17:00 | pixelma | why isn't it then? |
| 19:17:37 | * | MarcGuay looks to see if the layered image files are in SVN... |
| 19:19:06 | MarcGuay | I only see bitmaps. Any idea who has the working copies? At least right now the background image isn't providing false instructions. |
| 19:20:20 | pixelma | MarcGuay: see http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi?view=rev&revision=8690 |
| 19:20:22 | linuxstb | Isn't the problem more than that? i.e. that "scroll forward" and "scroll back" are sometimes "down and up" (e.g. in lists), and sometimes "up and down" (e.g. the volume control), and sometimes "right and left"... |
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| 19:21:40 | MarcGuay | Seems as though every time I try to make a "small fix" it opens a can of worms. |
| 19:21:52 | linuxstb | MarcGuay: That's why no-one else has done them... ;) |
| 19:22:02 | pondlife | They are always clockwise and anti-clockwise (or whatever terms we decided on)... |
| 19:22:08 | scorche|sh | MarcGuay: do tests before committing? ;) |
| 19:23:03 | MarcGuay | I thought I did... Grr. |
| 19:23:19 | pondlife | Happens to the best of us... ;) |
| 19:23:30 | amiconn | Mapping scrolling to buttons isn't easy |
| 19:23:43 | * | amiconn should have the original layered images for ipods |
| 19:24:11 | shadoxx | Is there a template for config-*.h somewhere? |
| 19:24:15 | Llorean | Scrolling should be mapped ti 7 and 9 (or buttons in some way horizontal) to go with the "clockwise" "anticlockwise" rather than caring about up/down |
| 19:24:21 | Llorean | *to |
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| 19:24:42 | MarcGuay | linuxstb: It looks like the menus and the volume are synced up. |
| 19:24:49 | linuxstb | shadoxx: No... Just pick an existing target that seems very similar to your device. |
| 19:24:58 | amiconn | Yes, I have those for G3, color and nano at least. They're in .psd format |
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| 19:25:29 | shadoxx | linuxstb: kk |
| 19:25:48 | linuxstb | shadoxx: Do you have a list of components somewhere for it? What is the LCD size/resolution? |
| 19:25:57 | linuxstb | I meant size/depth... |
| 19:26:03 | pixelma | Llorean: 2 and 8 leaves you the possibility to use the up and down arrow keys alternatively when it's used for up and down in a list which might be the reason why it was chosen... *hopes he reads logs* |
| 19:27:20 | MarcGuay | amiconn: If you could throw me those files I'll see if I can find time to work on it. Any idea who might have the others? |
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| 19:28:24 | amiconn | I think the images weren't changed because the idea was to redo them from the .svg files |
| 19:29:19 | MarcGuay | amiconn: Are those available? |
| 19:29:40 | MarcGuay | I could grab them from the manuals. |
| 19:29:44 | amiconn | But this isn't a simple conversion, as the sides of devices with buttons on those need to be drawn as side views |
| 19:29:58 | amiconn | The manual/ dir is where they are. |
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| 19:31:30 | amiconn | The manual build itself uses preconverted .pdf versions (pdf manual) resp. png versions (html manual) of those |
| 19:31:44 | amiconn | manual/rockbox_interface/images |
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| 19:34:01 | pixelma | I drew the side buttons bigger than they would naturally be seen in a top view on purpose to avoid drawing side viewa |
| 19:34:06 | pixelma | *views too |
| 19:34:56 | pixelma | but the 3rd and 4th gen Ipod svgs aren't nice (because I made a wrong assumption when drawing them) |
| 19:35:48 | MarcGuay | On another topic: Is recording on the 3G ipods supported? |
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| 19:40:35 | gevaerts | I'd like to commit FS #8747 (appear as a do-nothing usb audio device), which would solve the "unknown device" dialogs for portalplayer/windows users, but the delta is pretty big: Binary size 1024 bytes, Actual size 352 bytes, and RAM usage 432 bytes (whatever those numbers may mean exactly). Any opinions ? |
| 19:40:43 | gevaerts | (delta measured for c200) |
| 19:41:14 | amiconn | Hmm, no 'do-nothing' hid device instead? |
| 19:41:35 | * | amiconn thinks hid might be more compatible with various os'es than usb audio |
| 19:42:21 | MarcGuay | It's absent from the manual and the sim but the device is apparently capable of it. I'll leave it be.. |
| 19:42:49 | amiconn | jhMikeS or DerPapst should be able to tell |
| 19:43:03 | gevaerts | You could be right. |
| 19:43:09 | amiconn | Unfortunately I haven't seen them for quite a while |
| 19:46:46 | gevaerts | amiconn: the main problem with HID is that the usb stack doesn't do interrupt transfers yet (which I think HID needs, even for dummy). |
| 19:47:03 | amiconn | hmm |
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| 19:48:53 | gevaerts | And I won't have time for about a month to implement this, so if we want this in 3.0 (which I think is useful), and if 3.0 is pretty soon, it won't be HID. |
| 19:49:32 | gevaerts | Of course, maybe it's preferable to release with the current "ugly dialog" thing than with a maybe-incompatible usb audio |
| 19:50:07 | * | gevaerts also finds the delta a bit big for something that is right now purely cosmetic |
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| 19:53:07 | amiconn | gevaerts: Audio needs isochronous though, doesn't it? |
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| 19:54:06 | gevaerts | amiconn: audio _streaming_ needs isochronous. This patch doesn't do streaming (it basically declares a speaker and a microphone connected to eachother, without any host controls) |
| 19:54:54 | gevaerts | Maybe the same applies to HID, but I don't know yet |
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| 20:03:33 | * | gevaerts is a bit worried about the fact that we don't have any signs of a release coordinator yet |
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| 20:04:25 | MarcGuay | pixelma: Concerning the ipod sims we have two choices right now, either revert the change and have the keys work intuitively (8=up,2=down) but have the background images give false directions or leave it and have the inverse. If there was an easy way to update the images I would, but it seems to not be the case. |
| 20:05:16 | MarcGuay | gevaerts: Let the RSB decide. :) |
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| 20:06:37 | gevaerts | We should never have decided to start going for a release as soon as Nico_P had fixed the blocker bugs. That motivated him a bit too much, so he was too quick, and now we're in a scheduling vacuum |
| 20:07:05 | Llorean | gevaerts: Are you saying we should declare more blockers? |
| 20:07:26 | * | gevaerts likes that idea ;) |
| 20:08:39 | gevaerts | Actually, I think we need to start thinking about getting someone to volunteer for the release coordinator job. Someone needs to make decisions about bugs |
| 20:09:24 | Llorean | Giving them priority, or what? |
| 20:10:07 | pixelma | MarcGuay: I'd prefer the keys being intuitive slightly, there are also people who use the sim withou the background picture. The images were wrong for a long time, maybe I could look into fixing them </personal opinion> |
| 20:10:10 | Llorean | I kinda felt that since whether bugs will be fixed or not depends on the will of those with the appropriate knowledge of that code, we're basically not going to be able to make *too* many decisions until we get closer to the wire, and start saying "okay someone needs to disable this feature" |
| 20:10:11 | gevaerts | That's the easy bit. Removing buggy features will be harder |
| 20:10:41 | MarcGuay | pixelma: That's fine with me. I should have consulted for the history lesson before committing. :) |
| 20:10:44 | Llorean | Most buggy features can be disabled by removing them from the menu and the manual method of setting via .cfg, so they just stay with their default. |
| 20:11:04 | Llorean | I don't think we need to remove the code, just the ability to turn them on. |
| 20:11:11 | pixelma | maybe others can state their opinion too ;) |
| 20:11:17 | Llorean | Less other things you can accidentally break that way |
| 20:11:20 | amiconn | I don't think we have that many broken features which are optional, but rather we have some broken targets which are either fix-or-leave-out for a release |
| 20:12:02 | * | amiconn mainly thinks of power management |
| 20:12:39 | * | gevaerts needs to listen to the devcon recordings again |
| 20:12:51 | Llorean | I'm still in favour of a tiered release, with some targets as "3.0 Release" and some getting a 3.0 binary, but not being release targets (just so there's a "known good" binary for people to use who want to have one) |
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| 20:17:27 | Llorean | gevaerts: Another thing, actually: Before we pick a release coordinator, we should probably have an outline of what he's expected to do. People have mentioned I'll probably end up being suggested, and I'm uncomfortable with it. |
| 20:17:37 | Llorean | Not because I'm uncomfortable with the work, but because I have no idea what it is. |
| 20:18:11 | gevaerts | Llorean: True. That is indeed pretty essential |
| 20:18:13 | Llorean | So far, I've just been seeing things I think needs done, and trying to get them done. Which isn't something you can do wrong, really, because there's nobody with an expectation on them, just me saying "I think this needs done" and doing it. |
| 20:18:40 | Llorean | It's the same thing everyone does with the code, essentially. There's no "Playback coordinator" but Nico_P does do an awful lot of playback related work. |
| 20:19:00 | Llorean | Though I do an awful lot less related to the release than he does to playback. |
| 20:19:06 | Llorean | I just have a loud "yank" voice. :-P |
| 20:19:48 | gevaerts | So how do we get this release coordinator job description going? |
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| 20:21:00 | Llorean | Well, there are a couple ways, I suppose. |
| 20:21:08 | Llorean | We could collaborate on a wiki page for a couple days, then discuss |
| 20:21:14 | MarcGuay | I think the answer is in the job title, no? |
| 20:21:22 | Llorean | We could put out a mail to the -dev list asking everyone what they think the duties should be. |
| 20:21:55 | Llorean | Or we can ask for volunteers to say what they're willing to do to help coordinate the release, and then pick someone to keep track of communication between those volunteers. |
| 20:21:57 | gevaerts | MarcGuay: that's the summary, but it's a bit vague |
| 20:22:29 | Llorean | Basically, for example, MarcGuay is more or less our "Manual Coordinator" whether he likes it or not at the moment. Or perhaps "Documentation Coordinator" |
| 20:22:31 | gevaerts | Maybe we should start with a wiki page detailling what needs to be done for the release |
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| 20:22:54 | Llorean | gevaerts: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/ReleaseTodo |
| 20:22:56 | * | gevaerts grabs an l back |
| 20:23:02 | Llorean | Feel free to add/modify a lot. |
| 20:23:18 | Llorean | I just trashed the old 3.0 stuff and added a bit of summary |
| 20:23:43 | Buschel | bertrik: the batterybench with your patch worked. the bench stops at 2%, therefor i'll recharge the player and start a second bench... |
| 20:23:46 | MarcGuay | I think that whoever feels drawn to the position of release coordinator will be capable of deciding what that job entails. |
| 20:24:01 | * | MarcGuay works backwards. |
| 20:24:08 | * | Buschel guesses betrik's bench is not the reason for the bad runtime :/ |
| 20:24:12 | * | gevaerts will be the release coordinator, and the job entails lying on a beach |
| 20:24:14 | Llorean | MarcGuay: But you also think I should do it and are developing a justification for that. :-P |
| 20:25:08 | pixelma | Llorean: wasn't it you who suggested a release coordinator? ;P |
| 20:25:08 | MarcGuay | Llorean: :) I was mostly kidding. I wouldn't ask that anyone be forced to do something. |
| 20:25:28 | Llorean | That being said, I'm pretty sure we could slap the number 3.0 on a current build from the last day or two and start compiling "known issues" and still satisfy a large portion of our users. |
| 20:25:44 | Llorean | pixelma: Nah, iirc Cassandra was suggested as RC last time. |
| 20:26:05 | Llorean | pixelma: I just suggested that the job needs to be cutting things rather than getting things done if we really want to see a release happen. |
| 20:27:54 | gevaerts | Yes, and cutting things (potentially) means being unpopular with some people. That's why I think it can't really be done in an ad-hoc way by whoever feels like it that day |
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| 20:28:23 | * | pixelma digs in the mailing list and finds a hint to a ReleasePlanning page... |
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| 20:29:23 | adamgolding | i have a weird ipod problem: rockbox will install and boot ok, but the OF never will−−i get a continuous boot even after doing 'restore' in itunes |
| 20:29:41 | Llorean | gevaerts: Well, I can handle the unpopular thing. But, like amiconn said, it may just be that we're really only cutting targets now. |
| 20:30:00 | Llorean | JdGordon|zzz: Note for the logs, unrelated: People seem to still be unhappy with the current time screen. |
| 20:30:13 | xqtftqx | GUys whats the MIPS thing do? ive bean looking and im getting mixed resaults, a assume its the Proccer Speed one? |
| 20:30:17 | Llorean | adamgolding: If you've done a restore in iTunes then it's not Rockbox related. |
| 20:30:25 | Llorean | xqtftqx: "proccer"? |
| 20:30:41 | gevaerts | xqtftqx: mips is a cpu architecture, like arm or x86 |
| 20:30:46 | LambdaCalculus37 | MIPS is another architecture. |
| 20:30:53 | * | LambdaCalculus37 is too slow with his enter key ;) |
| 20:31:04 | xqtftqx | Oh, so its gonna open ports to new devices? |
| 20:31:30 | scorche|sh | define "it" |
| 20:31:32 | Bagder | well, since there's such a port in progress we needed the toolchain for it... |
| 20:31:35 | gevaerts | More the reverse. Someone is working on a device using mips |
| 20:31:47 | Bagder | see http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=17245.0 |
| 20:31:56 | xqtftqx | Ok thanks |
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| 20:32:47 | linuxstb | adamgolding: So the OF boots after a restore from itunes, but then after you install Rockbox, the OF stops working? Or the OF never works? |
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| 20:33:59 | amiconn | Llorean: It could also work like: We're freezing now, and want 3.0 to come out in 2 weeks. If target X and target Y don't have working powermanagement by then, they won't be included in the release |
| 20:34:31 | Llorean | amiconn: I think that's how it's going to work. |
| 20:34:48 | adamgolding | linuxstb OF never works |
| 20:34:49 | amiconn | Based today's status, G1/G2 and M3 should be excluded |
| 20:35:00 | Llorean | But I still think we should make "3.0" builds for them, as ones that users can known have "decent" playback working. |
| 20:35:07 | Llorean | Just don't call them "3.0" |
| 20:35:15 | Llorean | Or don't call them "Release" or something |
| 20:35:28 | amiconn | X5/M5 powermgmt isn't great, but it's usable, and charging in the cowon loader works without special tricks |
| 20:35:46 | gevaerts | "Unsupported" would be a good term, if it wasn't already so overloaded |
| 20:35:59 | adamgolding | also, installed a hacked ipod touch firmware to my 5.5G at least booted (although it didn't appear to interface with itunes properly) but restoring OF in itunes still wouldn't boot |
| 20:36:22 | Llorean | I like "Beta" because at least to normal users it means "something you can try, it should be usable, but don't expect it to be perfect" |
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| 20:38:31 | gevaerts | I'd say a good sequence could be "freeze, decide on what gets thrown out, branch to do the throwing out cleanly (but no more), and release" |
| 20:38:34 | Llorean | gevaerts: For non-Sansa portalplayer targets, how comfortable would you be with USB being included, with a known issue of "USB is known to occasionally be unreliable on some HUBs or ports. If you experience problems connect to a rear-port on your PC. If you still experience problems, please reboot into the original firmware for file transfers."? |
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| 20:40:34 | linuxstb | Llorean: For ipods at least, I don't think there's a need for Rockbox USB - the reboot-to-diskmode works well enough. |
| 20:40:54 | Llorean | linuxstb: But people don't realize that's not part of Rockbox. As well, on the Nano it can be ridiculously slow. |
| 20:41:22 | linuxstb | Llorean: But it's stable... There is also the option of booting into the OF. |
| 20:41:47 | linuxstb | As long as it's documented, I don't see it as being important for a release. |
| 20:41:50 | gevaerts | Llorean: for non-sansa, sure. For sansa, there is the SD bug, and I'm not sure how well that works with the current patch. |
| 20:42:00 | Llorean | gevaerts: That's why I was specific about non-Sansa |
| 20:42:07 | | Join delorean90 [0] (n=Delorean@70-101-164-164.dsl2.mon.ny.frontiernet.net) |
| 20:42:08 | Llorean | gevaerts: Any ideas of a good way to test that patch, btw? |
| 20:42:21 | | Join bluebrother [0] (n=dom@rockbox/staff/bluebrother) |
| 20:42:30 | Llorean | linuxstb: Well, the Rockbox USB code has worked pretty reliably for my Nano. I'm curious about how widespread the problems with it are likely to be. |
| 20:42:55 | linuxstb | Llorean: I just don't like the idea of code that can cause filesystem corruptions being included in a release. |
| 20:43:02 | Llorean | linuxstb: it only can on Sansa. |
| 20:43:09 | Llorean | Which is why I said "for non-Sansa" |
| 20:43:19 | gevaerts | I still want to try something though. Currently USB and SD access can happen together. I think I tried to serialize them once and that that didn't help, but I can try again |
| 20:43:32 | * | bluebrother uses the usb code on his mini since quite a while now |
| 20:43:32 | Llorean | linuxstb: The corruption comes from a bug in the SD driver rather than the USB code. |
| 20:43:35 | linuxstb | Llorean: So what does "USB is known to occasionally be unreliable on some HUBs or ports" mean? |
| 20:44:15 | Llorean | linuxstb: There are signal quality issues. You'll get device resets iiuc. |
| 20:44:35 | gevaerts | There is another issue still. Sometimes rockbox doesn't see new or changed files properly after disconnect, possibly related to lack of FAT mount reset things. |
| 20:44:37 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 20:45:03 | Llorean | Anyway, I still think we should target the freeze at mid-august after we have a steering board and they've settled in a little. |
| 20:45:22 | Llorean | That doesn't mean we need to use mid-august code though, we can work on a branch from now if things get any worse around then. |
| 20:47:38 | | Join stoffel [0] (n=sfr@p57B4FA82.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 20:48:15 | gevaerts | Sounds good to me at least |
| 20:52:06 | * | amiconn only uses rockbox usb sometimes, due to the resets slowing down things |
| 20:52:54 | | Quit thegeek (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 20:52:59 | pixelma | linuxstb: the automatic reboot works reliably on Ipods? I just wonder because it doesn't maybe half of the times I forgot to turn off my c250 before connecting to USB... |
| 20:54:37 | gevaerts | Maybe we should expand the c200 reboot sequence a bit : turn backlight on, show a message "rebooting. Hold power for 30 seconds if it doesn't work", and then reboot |
| 20:54:52 | pixelma | bluebrother: what I wanted to ask you - does the Rockbox Utility guide the Iaudio user through the bootloader installation? |
| 20:55:05 | bluebrother | pixelma: I think so, but I need to check |
| 20:55:13 | | Join kushal_12_27_200 [0] (n=kushal@c-67-173-249-88.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 20:55:35 | pixelma | I mean the disconnecting and inserting charger that's necessary after putting the files in the correct place |
| 20:56:18 | bluebrother | yes it does. |
| 20:57:55 | bluebrother | ok, there is a problem with that: while it gets displayed the directions get kinda drowned during small / full installation by the following messages. |
| 21:00 |
| 21:00:16 | | Join thegeek [0] (n=nnscript@s080a.studby.ntnu.no) |
| 21:00:39 | pixelma | bluebrother: I see... was asking because of this post http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=17603.msg129419#msg129419 (and I also didn't see it mentioned on the GraphicalInstall page but didn't look closely yet) |
| 21:00:47 | | Quit ze (Remote closed the connection) |
| 21:00:51 | | Join ze [0] (i=ze@cpe-75-82-143-231.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 21:02:08 | bluebrother | GraphicalInstall could get quite improved about this ;-) That's the reason why I directed to the manual at the end −− I mainly wanted to have a simple walkthrough for the majority of users |
| 21:02:17 | bluebrother | which is, as far as I understand, Ipod and Sansa. |
| 21:02:50 | Llorean | The H120 should have a similar issue, with the message to install the patched .hex |
| 21:02:55 | | Quit xqtftqx ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") |
| 21:03:02 | pixelma | well, the manual only deals with these details in the "manual installation" part, if I remember correctly :\ |
| 21:03:10 | Llorean | Does RBUtil retrieve the .hex for you from the iriver download site, or do you have to provide it manually? |
| 21:03:37 | domonoky | Llorean: the user has to provide it.. |
| 21:03:58 | bluebrother | we need some more guiding messages during bootloader installation. |
| 21:04:40 | Llorean | domonoky: Okay. Does it give a clue where to find it? |
| 21:05:10 | | Quit Buschel () |
| 21:05:16 | domonoky | no :-) |
| 21:05:52 | | Join low_light [0] (i=c730190b@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-0bb88942a9c8a929) |
| 21:06:17 | Llorean | Ah |
| 21:07:01 | gevaerts | The wiki does. And as this is something that seems to change regularly without warning, I think the wiki is the right place for it |
| 21:07:24 | gevaerts | Of course rbutil could refer to that wiki page |
| 21:07:26 | | Join kushal1 [0] (n=chatzill@c-67-173-249-88.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 21:07:46 | Llorean | Yeah, that would be good I think |
| 21:08:22 | Llorean | As previously someone mentioned, ideally RBUtil should be usable without reading first. I just think we shouldn't encourage it to be used that way by putting it before the documentation. :) |
| 21:08:25 | pixelma | bluebrother: did you also read today's logs (I think still before noon) when RBUtil on OSX was discussed? |
| 21:08:40 | bluebrother | not yet. Will check them |
| 21:09:09 | low_light | can TCC77x (Sansa c100/m200) owners test my patch at FS #9096 |
| 21:09:25 | kushal1 | I have a sansa c250 |
| 21:09:57 | kushal1 | low_light, does sansa c250 have TCC77x? |
| 21:09:57 | pixelma | low_light has one too (maybe it was a c240 though) ;) |
| 21:10:02 | low_light | wrong cpu |
| 21:10:11 | gevaerts | Does DAX apply? |
| 21:10:20 | kushal1 | sorry for the interruption, carry on |
| 21:10:33 | low_light | gevaerts: sure |
| 21:14:14 | Synthpop | hi anyone working on xm codec? |
| 21:16:08 | gevaerts | low_light: you made the printf a bit too long for the dax, so I had to change it a bit. Do you want the values here, or in the tracker? |
| 21:17:01 | LambdaCalculus37 | Synthpop: Nope. |
| 21:17:03 | | Quit thegeek_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 21:17:04 | low_light | actually I just wanted to know if it worked for other player ;) |
| 21:17:28 | Synthpop | hmm mod and xm are similiar formats |
| 21:17:29 | | Quit Tuplanolla ("k mui") |
| 21:17:29 | * | gevaerts gets EC D3 51 95 58 |
| 21:17:43 | Synthpop | i guess just a matter of time before other tracker formats gets supported |
| 21:17:57 | | Join krz [0] (n=irc_by@turbo.sml.by) |
| 21:18:00 | LambdaCalculus37 | Synthpop: It's a matter of people working on codecs for other tracker formats. |
| 21:18:45 | Synthpop | yea i got alot of trackersongs that just wait for it :) |
| 21:19:03 | Synthpop | im making xm's |
| 21:19:03 | low_light | gevaerts: 0xEC is a samsung id. Might as well post them on FS. |
| 21:19:09 | gevaerts | ok |
| 21:19:22 | low_light | LambdaCalculus37: do you still have a m200 v1? |
| 21:19:43 | Llorean | Synthpop: The point is this: If everyone just waits, like you, it'll never happen. Don't expect it to happen. |
| 21:19:56 | LambdaCalculus37 | low_light: Not at the moment. I sent mine to shotofadds, and I'm getting his in return. |
| 21:20:12 | gevaerts | So _someone_ has it :) |
| 21:20:12 | LambdaCalculus37 | Mine was NAND, which he was looking for. His is Tri-Flash. |
| 21:20:25 | Synthpop | hehe ok i guess i wont expect too much |
| 21:20:38 | scorche|sh | low_light: i have 2 in my possession, but they are at home |
| 21:20:49 | LambdaCalculus37 | gevaerts: shotofadds already got it. scorche is sending me the m230 shotofadds had. |
| 21:21:02 | scorche|sh | and i gave one of mine to Bagder (HARP) |
| 21:21:08 | Synthpop | im only tracking songs i do not code so i wouldn't be able to make it happen anyway |
| 21:22:06 | * | gevaerts thinks that the travels of this cohort of m200s are going to be even more impressive than LinusN's ipod |
| 21:22:36 | low_light | ok. if anyone wants to test FS #9096 can post results. |
| 21:27:35 | | Quit Lear ("ChatZilla 0.9.83 [Firefox 3.0/2008052906]") |
| 21:29:17 | | Quit adamgolding () |
| 21:30:07 | amiconn | LambdaCalculus37: Does that mean there are actually 3 different versions of the m200? |
| 21:31:43 | LambdaCalculus37 | amiconn: Yep. Rev. 1/2 are NAND, Rev. 3 is HARP, and Rev. 4 is AMS. |
| 21:32:41 | | Join shotofadds [0] (n=rob@rockbox/developer/shotofadds) |
| 21:33:14 | shotofadds | low_light: nice work! I'll give it a try on my M240 shortly (now that I have the hardware...) |
| 21:34:26 | shotofadds | I've added a short list of work to be done on the CowonD2Info page - anyone who feels like helping out should now know where to look |
| 21:34:43 | shotofadds | Hopefully now we have all these TCC77x devices around it'll help somewhat too |
| 21:35:57 | | Join Nasty [0] (n=472013e8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-a32c8f300e09850d) |
| 21:36:36 | Nasty | Hey i got some questions about the rockbox software and my 80 gb Ipod classic, can somebody help me on this? |
| 21:37:01 | LambdaCalculus37 | Yes. The answer is: Rockbox will not work on it. |
| 21:37:19 | Nasty | Really? |
| 21:37:29 | LambdaCalculus37 | Really. |
| 21:37:51 | Llorean | Nasty: That's why it's not in the list on the front page. |
| 21:39:02 | bluebrother | that's why it's mentioned in the "not on the ..." part on the frontpage |
| 21:39:43 | markun | Nasty: nobody has figured out how to get passed apple's encryption. An maybe we never will/ |
| 21:40:14 | Nasty | So the only difference is the encryption, right? |
| 21:40:23 | | Join tucoz [0] (n=martin@rockbox/staff/tucoz) |
| 21:40:30 | tucoz | hi guys |
| 21:40:38 | | Join mirak [0] (n=mirak@81-66-107-251.rev.numericable.fr) |
| 21:40:47 | Synthpop | hi |
| 21:41:13 | | Join hannesd [0] (n=light@p5B16186D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 21:41:13 | PaulJam | Nasty: also entirely different (and undocumented) hardware. |
| 21:41:40 | Llorean | Nasty: The iPod Classic is basically an entirely new player, not like the other iPods at all on the inside. |
| 21:42:09 | Nasty | I see, thanks for your help guys! :) |
| 21:43:17 | | Quit Nasty ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 21:44:07 | Synthpop | Don't ipods break all the time? |
| 21:44:29 | Synthpop | so i've heard. |
| 21:44:30 | gevaerts | Only if you drop them all the time |
| 21:44:43 | Synthpop | well i heard they have problems |
| 21:44:53 | * | gevaerts doesn't see why ipods would break more often than other players |
| 21:45:13 | Synthpop | they don'tlive long enough |
| 21:45:32 | | Join tvelocity [0] (n=tony@athedsl-119910.home.otenet.gr) |
| 21:45:40 | Synthpop | oh ok. some tech guys at a hifi store told me that |
| 21:45:44 | | Quit thegeek (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) |
| 21:45:48 | Llorean | It's probably more that iPods have more users, and thus if 1% of all players break early, a LOT more iPod users will be speaking about it than other players. |
| 21:46:01 | | Join thegeek [0] (n=nnscript@s080a.studby.ntnu.no) |
| 21:46:10 | tucoz | just what i was thinking |
| 21:46:16 | Synthpop | why did ipod get that many users anyway`? |
| 21:46:22 | Llorean | Doesn't matter here. |
| 21:46:38 | Synthpop | ok |
| 21:46:57 | Synthpop | gotta run guys happy coding |
| 21:47:00 | | Part Synthpop |
| 21:47:01 | tucoz | marketing, and that they keep releasing new players branded ipod i guess |
| 21:47:16 | | Quit hannesd ("Client suicide") |
| 21:48:32 | kushal_12_27_200 | so, anyone from last night, was there a problem with the mac os x version of rbutil (dmg) or was it just me? |
| 21:49:06 | tucoz | Is there a date set for the documentation clean-up weak? |
| 21:49:25 | tucoz | *week |
| 21:49:36 | pixelma | hey tucoz, long time... :) |
| 21:50:01 | Llorean | tucoz: Not yet. Sometimes soon though. |
| 21:51:00 | tucoz | pixelma: hi. yeah, it's been ages. |
| 21:51:13 | | Quit delorean90 () |
| 21:51:54 | | Nick dxl is now known as svens (n=dxl@cl-2490.ham-01.de.sixxs.net) |
| 21:52:15 | tucoz | i follow the development, but haven't used my player for ages. |
| 21:53:39 | tucoz | Llorean: ok. hopefully i will be able to help out there, if it doesn't interfere with my vacation... |
| 21:54:04 | | Join Kinky [0] (n=Kinky@12-217-215-99.client.mchsi.com) |
| 21:54:22 | tucoz | I would really like to see a 3.0 manual to follow the upcoming 3.0 release |
| 21:54:22 | Llorean | tucoz: I'd like to see it no later than either the week of the 20th or maybe the 27th, just because we also need to do a tracker cleanup, and prepare for the feature freeze. There's a lot on the table right now |
| 21:55:54 | gevaerts | Llorean: maybe it would be a good idea to put those dates on the wiki somewhere |
| 21:55:57 | kushal_12_27_200 | rbutilqt 1.0.6 is not working on my macbook 10.4.11 Any ideas? |
| 21:56:12 | Kinky | mine either and thats why I came here |
| 21:56:12 | * | gevaerts expects to be told on what page they have already been for more than a wekk |
| 21:56:36 | Llorean | gevaerts: I don't think they're put anywhere. I just picked them based on "I'd like it done by the end of the month, if possible" |
| 21:57:08 | Llorean | kushal_12_27_200: Have you filed a bug report, documenting what doesn't work, what happens, and what type of processor your mac has? |
| 21:57:10 | | Join GodEater_ [0] (n=ge@rockbox/staff/GodEater) |
| 21:57:17 | Kinky | I was really hoping for some help.... I just got my e280r and can't for the life of me get rockbox installed |
| 21:57:40 | Kinky | I'm not convinced yet that it's my mac, I am leaning more toward user error haha |
| 21:58:14 | kushal_12_27_200 | Intel processor, I came here for followup. I was talking to JdGordon (who appears asleep now) when I got kicked off the Internet |
| 21:58:40 | Llorean | kushal_12_27_200: I didn't ask what processor you had. I asked that you include that information in a properly filed bug report. |
| 21:58:49 | Llorean | Kinky: What happens with you? |
| 21:58:58 | | Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") |
| 21:59:27 | Kinky | I have gone thru all the steps listed on the install and such for the R model and I still boot into the regular software, not rockbox |
| 21:59:35 | Kinky | i've tried it on my mac as well as vista |
| 21:59:40 | tucoz | kushal_12_27_200: it says on http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/RockboxUtility#Change_Log that e200r isn't supported by rbutil. not sure if your player falls under that category |
| 21:59:42 | Kinky | got the same thing both times |
| 21:59:56 | Kinky | hmmmm |
| 22:00 |
| 22:00:18 | kushal_12_27_200 | well, I mounted rbutilqt and opened the app, but the app itself does not open |
| 22:00:26 | Kinky | ahhhh |
| 22:00:52 | Llorean | kushal_12_27_200: File a bug report, please. |
| 22:01:09 | Llorean | Describe everything, in detail, so that when the people who actually work on RBUtil are around they can read about it. |
| 22:01:10 | * | domonoky is sorry for the non-working rbutil mac version.. |
| 22:01:16 | kushal_12_27_200 | at least one other person said that it works on his/her tiger (10.4, which is what I have) so I am unsure if it is missing lib .... ok I will file it |
| 22:01:22 | gevaerts | Kinky: you can still install rockbox, but not using rbutil |
| 22:01:38 | Kinky | I have leopard, I'm going to mount it again and see what happens there, just for the other one needing info |
| 22:01:49 | bluebrother | hello tucoz :) |
| 22:01:52 | Kinky | gevaerts: I tried it manually too |
| 22:01:55 | tucoz | hi bluebrother :D |
| 22:01:56 | domonoky | could you try a older rbutil macosx version ? ie 1.0.5 ? |
| 22:02:05 | bluebrother | kushal_12_27_200: are you able building it yourself? |
| 22:02:12 | bluebrother | tucoz: nice to see you again |
| 22:02:43 | kushal_12_27_200 | I don't have the compiler, bluebrother, but I will download it if someone walks me through the process |
| 22:02:48 | gevaerts | Kinky: did you follow the instructions at http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaE200RInstallation ? |
| 22:03:00 | tucoz | bluebrother: nice to see you too. great work on rbutil. |
| 22:03:02 | pixelma | Llorean, kushal1: it's been discussed earlier in the day and JdGordon|zzz had some ideas - his last was http://www.rockbox.org/irc/log-20080708#09:53:44 |
| 22:03:12 | | Quit mf0102 ("Ex-Chat") |
| 22:03:16 | domonoky | the non-working rbutil-mac version is my fault... :-/ but i am struggling to build a correct one.. |
| 22:03:33 | * | bluebrother finally goes reading those logs |
| 22:03:50 | domonoky | kushal_12_27_200: please try the rbutil_m1.0.5 version, and tell me if this one works .. |
| 22:03:58 | Kinky | it opens on my mac kushal1 |
| 22:04:15 | kushal_12_27_200 | kinky, do you have the libutil? |
| 22:04:30 | domonoky | the problem is libusb.. |
| 22:04:33 | kushal_12_27_200 | I mean some libraries that may be missing on the dmg |
| 22:04:33 | Kinky | probably, I have fink, fuse, and a few others already installed |
| 22:04:38 | Kinky | ahhhh |
| 22:04:51 | pixelma | domonoky: already did - scroll up a bit from the point I linked to |
| 22:05:21 | | Join doldi [0] (n=5b13a1b7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-016b1928e74346bb) |
| 22:05:22 | Kinky | and yes, I followed that page of the wiki |
| 22:05:36 | | Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
| 22:05:36 | Kinky | and it still boots to rapsody |
| 22:05:39 | kushal_12_27_200 | I tried it yesterday, domonoky. it did not work |
| 22:05:44 | | Join Strangelet [0] (n=nicholas@38.96.139.93) |
| 22:06:02 | bluebrother | kushal_12_27_200: I think m1.0.4 should be build "better". Have you tried that? |
| 22:06:20 | kushal_12_27_200 | I have not built anything |
| 22:06:27 | Kinky | rhapsody and paly for sure are still the only things listed in "mode" |
| 22:06:29 | domonoky | oki, so i need to somehow findout how to correctly build a universal static lib of libusb on mac.. .-/ |
| 22:06:33 | Kinky | and it boots to rhapsody |
| 22:06:48 | kushal_12_27_200 | let me try 1.0.4 |
| 22:07:04 | Strangelet | I am using an iPod 4th gen grayscale. Rockbox has a tendency to be a bit 'laggy' when selecting songs. Is this a disorder? Or simply an issue that hasn't yet been fixed by the devs.? |
| 22:07:10 | Kinky | I'm wondering if I did it on linux if it would work |
| 22:07:41 | gevaerts | Strangelet: you could try enabling dircache (if I understand the problem correctly) |
| 22:07:43 | kushal_12_27_200 | If I am the only person with problem with the dmg, its probably something I got wrong |
| 22:07:53 | Kinky | try redownloading it |
| 22:07:56 | Kinky | maybe it was corrupted |
| 22:07:59 | Strangelet | gevaerts: dircache? What is that? |
| 22:08:23 | domonoky | kushal_12_27_200: is your mac a ppc or a intel ? |
| 22:08:33 | Kinky | It frustrates me haha, I can build a computer from scratch, and yet can't get rockbox to install correctly..... thats why I'm sure it's user error |
| 22:08:36 | bluebrother | Strangelet: it caches the directory structure in RAM which makes browsing much faster if your player has a slow hard disk |
| 22:08:48 | gevaerts | Strangelet: Settings->General Settings->System->Disk->Directory Cache |
| 22:09:00 | kushal_12_27_200 | domonoky, sorry for late response. it is an intel macbook with 10.4.11 |
| 22:09:02 | Strangelet | gevaerts, bluebrother, thank you both. :) |
| 22:09:44 | bluebrother | domonoky: is there an ldd equivalent on mac to check the libraries it's linked again? |
| 22:09:52 | Kinky | I was able to get the correct files transferred to the sansa because my version dropped from the current one to 1.0.2.31 and before the install it was higher than that |
| 22:10:24 | | Quit doldi ("CGI:IRC") |
| 22:10:40 | Kinky | when I used the patcher it says it's done and correct, but each time I boot it's still rhapsody |
| 22:10:49 | | Join BdN3504 [0] (n=55b23b9d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-65d210f378a99f51) |
| 22:11:04 | domonoky | bluebrother: i dont know, i only have remote access to a mac to build rbutil, so i can even try rbutil on the mac :-) |
| 22:11:09 | gevaerts | Kinky: did you follow Step 2? |
| 22:11:11 | domonoky | s/can/can not/ |
| 22:11:17 | Kinky | yes totally to the end |
| 22:11:24 | Kinky | and it even reboots after I disconnect the usb |
| 22:11:27 | | Join m0f0x_ [0] (n=m0f0x@189-47-55-190.dsl.telesp.net.br) |
| 22:11:32 | Kinky | but still boots into the old software |
| 22:11:43 | bluebrother | domonoky: on linux there's "ldd" which simply prints the libraries a binary is linked with. No need for GUI access ;-) |
| 22:11:49 | | Quit BdN3504 (Client Quit) |
| 22:12:02 | bluebrother | it's quite helpful to check if libusb has been linked statically or not. |
| 22:12:25 | Strangelet | gevaerts: The dircache has removed the lag while in the 'Now Playing' screen. Though, lag still exists when browsing the database. Is there a cure for that? :P |
| 22:12:39 | shotofadds | gevaerts: could you possibly try my updated patch in fs#9096? |
| 22:12:45 | bluebrother | Strangelet: load the database to RAM |
| 22:12:59 | bluebrother | it's documented in the manual (and IIRC also in the FAQ) |
| 22:13:03 | gevaerts | Strangelet: try Settings->General Settings->Database->Load to RAM |
| 22:13:40 | Kinky | I have also tried by updating the sansa to the current firmware on the sansa site |
| 22:13:43 | Kinky | to no avail |
| 22:13:49 | gevaerts | Kinky: unfortunately I've never done an e200r install myself, so I can't really help morew |
| 22:14:27 | | Quit SirFunk__ ("Ex-Chat") |
| 22:14:46 | Kinky | me either :( |
| 22:14:53 | | Join SirFunk__ [0] (n=Sir@206-159-155-246.netsync.net) |
| 22:15:09 | | Join BdN3504 [0] (n=55b23b9d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-daddddf0af937953) |
| 22:15:17 | | Quit dabujo ("( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.2 :: www.regroup-esports.com )") |
| 22:16:38 | BdN3504 | hey, i'm using vmware to compile and am able to create working builds for my targets. Now i want to create a simulator, but i don't understand how to do that... |
| 22:17:17 | gevaerts | shotofadds: that patch doesn't apply cleanly |
| 22:17:55 | shotofadds | gah, forgot the "svn up" first :/ |
| 22:18:07 | BdN3504 | i want to create a standalone simulator for windows xp. i read about it here http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/UiSimulator#Building |
| 22:18:49 | bluebrother | BdN3504: you need to cross-compile for windows then. I don't think the vmware image contains the w32 cross compiler |
| 22:18:50 | * | gevaerts blames MarcGuayAway for all this |
| 22:19:26 | bluebrother | it might be much easier to build the sim on cygwin |
| 22:20:05 | shotofadds | gevaerts: try again. that hunk was only there cos of the damn tabs... |
| 22:20:20 | BdN3504 | when i try this http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/UiSimulator#Building_Windows_sim_in_Linux i get the error: configure: error: |
| 22:20:23 | BdN3504 | *** Your compiler (gcc) does not produce Win32 executables! |
| 22:20:36 | bluebrother | kushal_12_27_200: does 1.0.4 work for you? |
| 22:20:53 | | Quit linuxstb (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 22:21:04 | | Quit crope` ("Leaving") |
| 22:21:11 | BdN3504 | where do i get such a cross compiler? is there an image already containing one? |
| 22:21:20 | bluebrother | BdN3504: as I said, I don't think the vmware image contains the needed compiler. Check this line: You will need the Mingw32 compiler environment |
| 22:21:22 | amiconn | bluebrother: Mine does. I wonder whether scorche got anywhere with it |
| 22:21:37 | gevaerts | shotofadds: that works |
| 22:21:44 | shotofadds | \o/ |
| 22:21:47 | bluebrother | amiconn: so that's not the one we officially distribute? |
| 22:21:57 | bluebrother | BdN3504: check apt-get |
| 22:22:06 | shotofadds | some of the code in lowlight's patch looks a bit .. suspicious |
| 22:22:11 | amiconn | bluebrother, BdN3504: You need both the mingw32 crosscompiler, and sdl for mingw32. If you have both it's pretty easy |
| 22:22:39 | amiconn | bluebrother: No, it's the one I prepared for devcon, |
| 22:22:57 | amiconn | It might be a bit big for distribution |
| 22:23:06 | | Quit m0f0x (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 22:23:45 | BdN3504 | i'm a complete linux noob and have succeeded only because i followed the http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SimpleGuideToCompiling step by step... |
| 22:24:16 | BdN3504 | how do i get the mingw32 crosscompiler? |
| 22:24:30 | | Join ender1 [0] (i=krneki@foo.eternallybored.org) |
| 22:24:42 | | Quit ender` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 22:24:49 | domonoky | bluebrother: otool -L show that current rbutil mac uses lib usb as a shared lib :-/ |
| 22:25:13 | bluebrother | domonoky: sounds like this is not what you want it to be ... |
| 22:25:16 | | Join homielowe [0] (n=homielow@d207-81-80-78.bchsia.telus.net) |
| 22:25:18 | tucoz | see you later |
| 22:25:20 | | Part tucoz ("Ex-Chat") |
| 22:26:23 | BdN3504 | maybe i'm in the wrong place for my problem, can you suggest any other place where somebody could help me? |
| 22:27:24 | bluebrother | BdN3504: google for apt-get, and try "apt-cache search mingw" or similar |
| 22:27:51 | bluebrother | I _think_ it should be possible installing the missing packets that way. |
| 22:29:24 | | Nick linuxstb_ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
| 22:30:01 | Kinky | ok I think I may have discovered something by total accident |
| 22:30:29 | Kinky | when I have the sansa locked, and plugged in the usb cable, I inadvertantly had my thumb on the record button and that put it into the usb mode! |
| 22:30:54 | Kinky | it's telling me on the lcd that it's the recovery mode however I have no idea what to do with it from here haha |
| 22:31:10 | domonoky | hm, so how can i force rbutil to link to the static lib of libusb. ld on mac doesnt know -Bstatic |
| 22:32:19 | | Join bughunter2 [0] (n=Jelle@77.164.66.126) |
| 22:32:33 | Kinky | oo I just found this for you domonoky |
| 22:32:40 | Kinky | http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/RockboxUtilityDevelopment |
| 22:32:45 | Kinky | go down to the part about mac |
| 22:32:46 | bluebrother | domonoky: check the older revisions of rbutilqt.pro. I simply added it as link object earlier. |
| 22:33:00 | bluebrother | Kinky: he knows about that ... he's one of the devs of rbutil |
| 22:33:07 | Kinky | haha sorry |
| 22:33:13 | * | Kinky is newwwwwwwb |
| 22:33:22 | domonoky | :-) |
| 22:34:02 | BdN3504 | i tried this user@debian:~$ apt-get install mingw32 |
| 22:34:14 | BdN3504 | and get this: E: Could not open lock file /var/lib/dpkg/lock - open (13 Permission denied) |
| 22:34:29 | gevaerts | BdN3504: try "sudo apt-get install mingw32" |
| 22:34:37 | bluebrother | domonoky: http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi/trunk/rbutil/rbutilqt/rbutilqt.pro?r1=17462&r2=17555 |
| 22:34:42 | shadoxx | linuxstb: yesterday you talked about connecting my YH-820's HD to my PC. Any ideas on how I would do that? |
| 22:34:43 | | Quit stoffel ("leaving") |
| 22:35:33 | linuxstb | shadoxx: No... You would need to investigate what interface it's using, and try and buy/build some kind of adapter. Do you know the model number of the drive? |
| 22:35:45 | shadoxx | yeah. ST650211CF |
| 22:37:23 | linuxstb | shadoxx: Ah, so a CF interface... |
| 22:37:26 | BdN3504 | when i try this: user@debian:/$ sudo apt-get install mingw32 |
| 22:37:28 | shadoxx | Oh crap. Look at that |
| 22:37:40 | BdN3504 | i get this -bash: sudo: command not found |
| 22:37:55 | shadoxx | linuxstb: there was a little adapter on it that let it connect to the yh-820's motherboard |
| 22:38:05 | shadoxx | i pulled it off |
| 22:38:06 | shadoxx | sweet |
| 22:38:16 | * | bluebrother notices that wavtrim.c uses CamelCase :/ |
| 22:38:28 | bluebrother | BdN3504: try "su -" |
| 22:38:53 | linuxstb | shadoxx: Would be interesting to try higher capacity cards... |
| 22:38:55 | BdN3504 | same |
| 22:39:06 | shadoxx | linuxstb: very. :D this is turning into something fun. |
| 22:39:31 | BdN3504 | no wait |
| 22:39:34 | linuxstb | shadoxx: Do you have a CF adapter for your PC? |
| 22:39:35 | bluebrother | I highly dount this |
| 22:39:40 | bluebrother | *doubt |
| 22:40:00 | shadoxx | linuxstb: I've done some embedded device hacking. i have a mini itx system that just so happens to take CF |
| 22:40:08 | shadoxx | I'm checking right now to see if it'll just slip right in |
| 22:40:23 | shadoxx | haha |
| 22:40:25 | shadoxx | and it will |
| 22:40:48 | shadoxx | God I love technology. |
| 22:41:18 | BdN3504 | installing that crosscompiler right now i think... but i don't understand what it says on the wiki |
| 22:41:22 | | Join Lear [0] (i=chatzill@rockbox/developer/lear) |
| 22:41:26 | BdN3504 | ./configure −−host=i586-mingw32msvc −−prefix=${HOME}/mingw32-sdl |
| 22:41:37 | BdN3504 | You can change the argument to −−prefix to wherever you want the mingw32 version of SDL installed, but you really should set a prefix, since the sdl-config will overwrite your native sdl-config otherwise |
| 22:41:43 | BdN3504 | what does that mean? |
| 22:42:10 | * | amiconn put it under /opt |
| 22:42:38 | bluebrother | you can leave it that way, but you really should use −−prefix in the configure run |
| 22:44:40 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 22:44:48 | BdN3504 | first of all, in which directory should i execute these commands? does that matter? i executed the apt-get command in under this input: debian:/# apt-get install mingw32 |
| 22:45:01 | BdN3504 | should i change to the rockbox directory? |
| 22:46:01 | gevaerts | BdN3504: that configure line has some context on the wiki |
| 22:46:39 | shadoxx | linuxstb: I just realized though. The MP3 player still boots even if it doesn't have a HD in it. It just says that it couldn't initialize the HD and shuts off. I'll see what putting it in my embedded system does though |
| 22:47:13 | linuxstb | shadoxx: That will be an error from the bootloader (stored in flash ROM). That bootloader will load the mi4 file from somewhere on the hard disk. |
| 22:47:15 | gevaerts | BdN3504: or did you mean that entire block? |
| 22:47:16 | | Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) |
| 22:47:41 | domonoky | bluebrother: now rbutil wants to link against the static libusb but ld errors: Undefined symbols: "_strerror$UNIX2003", referenced from: _usb_strerror in libusb.a(error.o) :-/ |
| 22:47:52 | BdN3504 | i mean the two lines i just posted |
| 22:48:12 | kushal_12_27_200 | bluebrother, I had to run off for a bit. yes, 1.0.4 does work for me |
| 22:48:18 | BdN3504 | is {HOME} just a placeholder? |
| 22:48:18 | linuxstb | shadoxx: If I was you (and you have enough disk space), I would make a full backup now of your card - i.e. "dd if=/dev/sdX of=backup.bin" |
| 22:48:32 | bluebrother | domonoky: on linux I just build libusb and put libusb.a in the rbutilqt folder. Not much of idea on mac ... |
| 22:48:46 | shadoxx | linuxstb: thanks. will do |
| 22:48:56 | bluebrother | kushal_12_27_200: ok, nice to know. Then libusb seems to be at least the main issue |
| 22:49:29 | gevaerts | BdN3504: ${HOME} is an environment variable that expands to your home directory. By the way, there is no need to do these steps as root, so if you still are root (# prompt), type exit first |
| 22:50:36 | gevaerts | BdN3504: then just go to your home directory, and follow the steps exactly, starting from the wget command |
| 22:50:48 | BdN3504 | ok thanks i will try |
| 22:50:51 | BdN3504 | that |
| 22:50:53 | * | gevaerts apologizes to Bagder. Someone else put that wget there |
| 22:51:09 | Bagder | :-) |
| 22:51:13 | shadoxx | linuxstb: and putting that card in my pc returned a dma timeout |
| 22:51:34 | | Quit davina ("GNU/Linux the free alternative to Windows") |
| 22:51:42 | gevaerts | shadoxx: can you turn off dma? Maybe it's a bios setting |
| 22:51:53 | shadoxx | very true |
| 22:52:02 | shadoxx | i could boot my kernel nodma |
| 22:52:16 | linuxstb | hdparm may help as well. |
| 22:52:21 | gevaerts | that too. After all, you don't need performance here |
| 22:53:11 | | Join sitwon [0] (n=adam@static-71-166-233-112.washdc.east.verizon.net) |
| 22:53:25 | BdN3504 | i get all kinds of permission denied messages when i try it now... |
| 22:53:30 | kushal_12_27_200 | bluebrother, have there been other cases about it? Do I need to file a bug report? is there already a byg report about it? |
| 22:53:55 | gevaerts | BdN3504: what is the output if you type "pwd" ? |
| 22:54:01 | | Quit ender1 (" I will not turn into a snake. It never helps. -- Evil Overlord List #34") |
| 22:54:56 | BdN3504 | user@debian:/$ pwd |
| 22:55:14 | BdN3504 | it is / |
| 22:55:49 | shadoxx | Ok, disabled UDMA in my bios. now it should only try PIO mode |
| 22:55:50 | gevaerts | OK. Then first type "cd", without any arguments. That should take you to your home directory. Then try the wiki steps again |
| 22:56:18 | bluebrother | kushal_12_27_200: I think domonoky is aware of it ;-) |
| 22:56:37 | shadoxx | And I'm still getting dma timeouts. |
| 22:57:04 | gevaerts | Then I'd say try the hdparm way |
| 22:57:41 | kushal_12_27_200 | bluebrother, there should not be much difference in the way linux and os x work. they are both Unix[-like], aren |
| 22:57:49 | kushal_12_27_200 | 't they? |
| 22:58:20 | gevaerts | kushal_12_27_200: as far as I know the only problem is one of these few spots where they are different] |
| 22:58:44 | shadoxx | win. passing hdc=nodma to the kernel allowed it to be detected |
| 22:58:45 | kushal_12_27_200 | bummer |
| 22:58:51 | | Join markun_ [0] (n=markun@bastards.student.ipv6.utwente.nl) |
| 22:58:53 | bluebrother | the problem is that they aren't the same ;-) |
| 22:59:10 | shadoxx | No. nvm. It's still saying dma timeout error. status=0x58 |
| 23:00 |
| 23:00:13 | | Join Nico_P [50] (n=nicolas@rockbox/developer/NicoP) |
| 23:00:18 | gevaerts | BdN3504: any specific reason to not use the sims from rasher.dk/rockbox/simulator/">http://rasher.dk/rockbox/simulator/ ? |
| 23:01:32 | BdN3504 | i want to make a sim for my own build |
| 23:01:54 | BdN3504 | or is there a way to include patches to rasher's sims? |
| 23:02:13 | gevaerts | No. I just wanted to be sure that you were aware of them |
| 23:02:19 | BdN3504 | all goes well until now... thank you. but what does this mean? Now, just compile as normal, with the path to the mingw32 sdl-config in your path: |
| 23:03:12 | BdN3504 | PATH=${HOME}/mingw32-sdl/bin:${PATH} ../tools/configure |
| 23:03:17 | gevaerts | What it says :) Just go to your rockbox source tree, and run configure with exactly that line |
| 23:03:27 | | Join ender` [0] (i=krneki@foo.eternallybored.org) |
| 23:03:30 | | Quit markun (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 23:03:41 | | Quit midgey () |
| 23:03:46 | | Nick markun_ is now known as markun (n=markun@bastards.student.ipv6.utwente.nl) |
| 23:04:23 | BdN3504 | excuse my dumb question but: with what line? |
| 23:04:34 | gevaerts | The line you quoted |
| 23:05:05 | shadoxx | linuxstb: looks like all this for nothing. boot rom isn't stored on a hidden place on the hd. still only 1 partition |
| 23:05:06 | | Quit kushal1 (Remote closed the connection) |
| 23:06:27 | kushal_12_27_200 | what does http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/pub/Main/RockboxUtility/graph.gif mean in http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/RockboxUtility ? |
| 23:07:27 | | Quit krz (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 23:07:32 | linuxstb | shadoxx: Does that partition cover the entire geometry of the disk? |
| 23:07:38 | BdN3504 | ahahaha! but i now choose sim, not normal in the configure tool, right? |
| 23:07:44 | gevaerts | Yes |
| 23:07:53 | bluebrother | kushal_12_27_200: an improvement |
| 23:08:03 | kushal_12_27_200 | thanks |
| 23:08:10 | shadoxx | linuxstb: well, it only lists /dev/hdc |
| 23:08:17 | shadoxx | no /dev/hdc1 |
| 23:08:42 | linuxstb | shadoxx: Have you tried mounting /dev/hdc? |
| 23:08:48 | gevaerts | Did you check for hidden files ? |
| 23:08:50 | BdN3504 | does the '&&' in 'make && make install' mean that these commands are exe |
| 23:08:58 | BdN3504 | cuted one after another? |
| 23:09:10 | scorche|sh | BdN3504: didnt we send you off to go look at a basic linux tutorial last time? |
| 23:09:15 | gevaerts | It means that the second one is executed if the first one succeeded |
| 23:09:19 | bluebrother | no. The second one only gets executed if the first succeds |
| 23:10:13 | shadoxx | linuxstb: yeah. it's the same listing as when I plug it in via usb with the mp3 player. |
| 23:10:24 | kushal_12_27_200 | does anyone here have write access to http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/RockboxUtility ? if so please change "updateing" in m1.0.6 to "updating" thanks |
| 23:10:25 | BdN3504 | ok thanks alot, i think you already told me to make myself familiar with linux basics... but i'm a bit lazy/busy (depends on how you look at it) |
| 23:11:07 | Llorean | BdN3504: I don't understand how you being lazy means other people should spend their time instead. Just take what little time you have, and eventually it'll add up to enough. |
| 23:11:16 | domonoky | kushal_12_27_200: could you please try this version of rbutil ? jdgordon.info:8080/~domonoky/rbutilqt-v1.0.6.dmg">http://jdgordon.info:8080/~domonoky/rbutilqt-v1.0.6.dmg |
| 23:11:26 | kushal_12_27_200 | ok |
| 23:11:41 | linuxstb | shadoxx: I don't know anything about FAT filesystems, but I'm guessing it might be possible for the filesystem to not cover the entire drive. i.e. leaving some unused space at the end... |
| 23:11:59 | shadoxx | most definately. that's what I'm about to check, since you mentioned it. :) |
| 23:12:02 | kushal_12_27_200 | dang, its fast, 400 KiB per second and increasing |
| 23:12:18 | kushal_12_27_200 | :( it slowed down |
| 23:12:20 | | Quit Mathiasdm ("Yuuw!") |
| 23:12:24 | gevaerts | shadoxx: I would suggest dd-ing the entire disk to somewhere, and working on the image. Nothing like being sure :) |
| 23:13:15 | | Quit BdN3504 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 23:15:10 | kushal_12_27_200 | domonoky, once it finishes downloading, all I have to do is mount it and open the app, right? |
| 23:15:37 | domonoky | jup, try to open the app :-) i hope it works now :-) |
| 23:17:03 | | Quit gevaerts ("Changing server") |
| 23:18:11 | | Join BdN3504 [0] (n=55b23b9d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-2bea91f6c961b567) |
| 23:19:00 | | Join gevaerts [0] (n=fg@rockbox/developer/gevaerts) |
| 23:19:29 | | Nick MarcGuayAway is now known as MarcGuay (n=chatzill@ip216-239-77-80.vif.net) |
| 23:19:32 | BdN3504 | Sorry, but i'll have to bother you one last time: i get 'zip error: Internal logic error (incorrect compressed size)' |
| 23:20:00 | BdN3504 | unzip: cannot find or open ../rockbox-full.zip, ../rockbox-full.zip.zip or ../rockbox-full.zip.ZIP. |
| 23:20:09 | BdN3504 | make: *** [install] Error 9 |
| 23:20:13 | MarcGuay | gevaerts: What are you blaming on me? I was Away, I couldn't possibly have done anything. :) |
| 23:20:18 | BdN3504 | upon running make install |
| 23:20:38 | linuxstb | BdN3504: Did you get any other errors before that? |
| 23:21:12 | MarcGuay | linuxstb: From several hours ago, I just realized what you meant by up-down in the menus being different from volume up-down, and I retract my "they're synced". Going for walks occasionally is useful. |
| 23:21:17 | BdN3504 | actually i see that now, yes: cp: writing `.rockbox/rocks/wav2wv.rock': No space left on device |
| 23:21:20 | gevaerts | MarcGuay: You committed some changes to telechips.c while updating the manual. That broke some people's test patches (fixed now) |
| 23:21:44 | BdN3504 | how do i give the vm more space? |
| 23:21:51 | MarcGuay | gevaerts: Arr. I suck. Next time = more careful. |
| 23:21:59 | gevaerts | BdN3504: you need to free up some space. I would suggest to remove the sdl build directory and source tarball |
| 23:22:11 | kushal_12_27_200 | the jdgordon file doesn |
| 23:22:17 | kushal_12_27_200 | doesn't open either |
| 23:23:34 | MarcGuay | Lear: I got a "Undefined Instruction" error when trying to reproduce the data aborts. Not sure how helpful it is, but it happened after pressing play twice quickly on the splash screen. |
| 23:24:03 | linuxstb | MarcGuay: I like to do "svn diff" right before an "svn commit" - a sort of preview of what will be committed... |
| 23:24:26 | gevaerts | Or even "svn diff|diffstat| |
| 23:24:36 | gevaerts | s/|$/"/ |
| 23:24:55 | MarcGuay | linuxstb: I'm getting in the habit of doing "svn commit" with no parameters to see which files will be changed. |
| 23:25:21 | Llorean | I just do "svn st" to see which files are changed. |
| 23:25:25 | * | gevaerts <3 diffstat |
| 23:25:44 | linuxstb | MarcGuay: "svn diff" is also useful for spotting things like inadvertant whitespace changes, or leftover debug code. |
| 23:26:14 | MarcGuay | linuxstb: And haven't done much with the c100 port while you were gone, by the way. I tried to find the shutdown routine but came up empty. |
| 23:26:20 | BdN3504 | thank you very much gevaerts, everything worked. |
| 23:26:21 | MarcGuay | Thanks for the tips everyone. |
| 23:26:47 | | Quit Zagor ("Client exiting") |
| 23:26:54 | bluebrother | colorsvn is also a great filter script. Makes the output much nicer to spot issues |
| 23:27:24 | | Quit mcuelenaere () |
| 23:27:42 | Bagder | I do "svn st -q" first |
| 23:27:47 | Bagder | then svn diff to see the specifics |
| 23:27:53 | linuxstb | Bagder: Will the voting for the RSB be ranked? e.g. a voter assigning points from 1-5 for each of their votes? |
| 23:28:24 | scorche|sh | linuxstb: we said no to that at devcon |
| 23:28:43 | scorche|sh | each will be an equal vote and then the votes will just be tallied |
| 23:29:02 | Bagder | I'm open for suggestions, but we discussed simply 1 point each to the 5 people you'd like |
| 23:29:07 | Llorean | Though we should establish a tie-breaker plan in advance. |
| 23:29:20 | scorche|sh | Llorean: i am willing to cross that bridge if we get there |
| 23:29:26 | | Quit low_light ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") |
| 23:29:35 | scorche|sh | a "vote-off" would be simple enough |
| 23:29:53 | Llorean | Probably |
| 23:30:00 | linuxstb | Hmm, I would have preferred some way to say that I want person X a lot more than person Y... |
| 23:30:13 | Llorean | linuxstb: Easy, don't vote for person Y. |
| 23:30:26 | | Quit alleyoopster (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 23:30:32 | linuxstb | Llorean: And that I want person Y more than everyone else... |
| 23:30:37 | Llorean | The steering board is going to have 5 people, so you vote for the five people you most want on it. If there's less than five, vote for less than 5. |
| 23:30:45 | | Quit bughunter2 ("bye") |
| 23:31:58 | | Quit BdN3504 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 23:32:06 | Llorean | If votes were weighted, three "want mosts" could outweigh five "want leasts" so even if someone had more votes from individuals, they'd still fall behind someone else who had less people on the count. That seems like it'd be problematic. |
| 23:32:15 | Llorean | And if weighted votes *aren't* worth more votes, then they don't matter. |
| 23:32:53 | linuxstb | That sounds fair to me though - three "want mosts" outweighing five "want leasts".... |
| 23:33:45 | Bagder | then there's of course the question of how much more to weigh #1 compared to #5 |
| 23:33:50 | Llorean | The person with five want leasts represents the overall views of five people, though. |
| 23:34:05 | ze | sounds like they'd need a numerical value to make sense |
| 23:34:25 | | Quit sitwon ("Leaving") |
| 23:35:06 | Bagder | or, you can get 15 points to split on 5 people... |
| 23:35:14 | Llorean | Or 5 points to split on 5 or less people. |
| 23:35:17 | | Quit axionix (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 23:35:51 | gevaerts | I don't really like most of those ideas. If we do ranking, I want to be able to vote _against_ someone, otherwise I think I prefer 5 equal votes |
| 23:35:51 | Llorean | So that if you want to boost someone beyond the average amount, you have to sacrifice the number you can vote for. |
| 23:36:19 | MarcGuay | I got an email from someone asking me "How can I join the developers group? What does it gives me? Will I be able to commit fixes by myself then?". Is there a standard response for this? |
| 23:36:22 | Llorean | gevaerts: Five equal votes where more than one of those votes can go to the same person is a meeting halfway of the two ideas. |
| 23:36:26 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
| 23:36:58 | ze | how about you just rate each and every candidate from 1 to 10 |
| 23:36:58 | ze | :p |
| 23:37:01 | Llorean | MarcGuay: "Committers are chose based on their overall contributions. Submit good patches to the tracker, and be active in the development community and you'll get noticed" I think |
| 23:37:19 | Bagder | yeps |
| 23:37:22 | * | scorche|sh deletes his comment saying pretty much the same |
| 23:37:31 | MarcGuay | Llorean: Sounds good. He also wanted me to consider his patch @ http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/9142, which I am doing right now. |
| 23:37:33 | * | Bagder cut out a comment saying the same, only less good |
| 23:38:54 | Bagder | but the answer to the last question would be "yes" ;-) |
| 23:38:55 | gevaerts | Llorean: I'm not convinced. Let's have the RSB decide on this |
| 23:39:03 | MarcGuay | Seems useful and harmless. Should be made universal before committing, though. |
| 23:39:19 | | Join bughunter2 [0] (n=Jelle@77.164.66.126) |
| 23:39:20 | * | gevaerts spots an error in his reasoning |
| 23:39:21 | linuxstb | gevaerts: Or a vote on how the vote will work... |
| 23:39:25 | Llorean | gevaerts: Hah. Maybe "5 votes, any of which can either be for or against a candidate, and there is no restriction that they have to be for unique candidates" just to make the numbers even more confusing. :-P |
| 23:39:42 | * | MarcGuay loves bureaucracy. |
| 23:39:44 | * | domonoky wants negativ numbers :-) |
| 23:39:46 | * | linuxstb prepares to nominate his voting systems |
| 23:40:10 | MarcGuay | Sorry, "democracy". |
| 23:40:10 | stripwax | That's only fair, vote for the voting system first |
| 23:40:11 | scorche|sh | lets just not have the voting systems be electronic diebold machines |
| 23:40:18 | gevaerts | I wouldn't spend too much time working out voting systems. There are enough of them around, so no need to make up our own :) |
| 23:40:19 | MarcGuay | scorche: zing! |
| 23:40:20 | * | scorche|sh glares at Bagder suspiciously |
| 23:40:25 | ze | how about each candidate gets rated -3 to +3 and the top scores win :p |
| 23:40:41 | * | linuxstb reads http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voting_system |
| 23:41:04 | * | gevaerts helps adding to wikipedia's logfiles |
| 23:41:13 | * | Bagder joins in |
| 23:41:24 | | Quit domonoky (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 23:41:28 | scorche|sh | ze: i have a better idea...how about we just do things as we decided at devcon! ;) |
| 23:41:38 | ze | scorche|sh: :p |
| 23:41:52 | shotofadds | scorche|sh: you have a HARP m200, right? when you get a chance could you maybe try fs#9096 - just for confirmation that we actually can't read the NAND directly. |
| 23:41:58 | gevaerts | The devcon people where not elected! |
| 23:42:18 | * | gevaerts hopes that nobody will spot that h :( |
| 23:42:57 | scorche|sh | shotofadds: yes...i will see about it after i get home and do some cleaning up/unpacking |
| 23:43:06 | scorche|sh | although i did give one to Bagder as well ;) |
| 23:44:38 | | Join midgey [0] (n=tjross@c-71-205-31-207.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) |
| 23:44:47 | * | linuxstb likes the look of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ranked_pairs and wishes Bagder luck in administering it ;) |
| 23:45:15 | Bagder | yay |
| 23:45:25 | * | gevaerts points out that that is a single-winner voting system |
| 23:45:42 | Bagder | the winner picks the other 4? ;-P |
| 23:45:55 | * | bluebrother thinks this is getting too complicated |
| 23:46:13 | Bagder | it got too complicated 15 minutes ago |
| 23:46:34 | linuxstb | gevaerts: And then we do it again for #2... |
| 23:46:54 | * | linuxstb gives up and accepts the devcon propsal |
| 23:47:56 | | Part Kinky |
| 23:48:26 | shotofadds | scorche|sh: sure. i'm just trying to work out whether we really did need to swap those m200s... |
| 23:50:38 | kushal_12_27_200 | Apple wants me to update the software. It will require me to restart the computer. |
| 23:51:33 | scorche|sh | kushal_12_27_200: ...and what about that is relevant in here? |
| 23:51:56 | kushal_12_27_200 | oops, sorry wrong channel |
| 23:52:16 | * | gevaerts decides to stop reading up about voting systems, and hopes that he will be able to access his mail regularly so he can actually vote |
| 23:52:30 | | Quit gregzx ("ChatZilla 0.9.83 [Firefox 3.0/2008052906]") |
| 23:52:37 | MarcGuay | Llorean: From a few days ago - There is no keyclick when recording starts and stops (H300), but it would be a good idea. |
| 23:52:42 | | Join Zarggg [0] (n=z@65-78-69-194.c3-0.eas-ubr6.atw-eas.pa.cable.rcn.com) |
| 23:53:13 | MarcGuay | Llorean: That blind user on the mailing list could obviously use such a feature. |
| 23:54:21 | MarcGuay | shotofadds: My c100 is showing 0x00 values for the NAND. Have I missed something? |
| 23:56:09 | | Quit bughunter2 ("bye") |
| 23:56:25 | | Join nicktastique [0] (n=nick@unaffiliated/nicktastic) |
| 23:56:41 | * | petur looks at his bankaccount and wonders what tockbox travel expenses are :) |
| 23:57:21 | * | gevaerts recommends complaining to zagor about not having received anything for rockbox expenses :) |
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