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#rockbox log for 2008-10-31

00:03:27 Quit {phoenix} (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:06:02funmanthere is a function which I didn't analyzed - just before the nand/sd initialization
00:06:40funmanit calls billions of other functions, depends on zillions of values in non initialized RAM, messes with interrupts all over the place
00:07:10funmanperhaps in the middle of this lay the solution ..
00:07:43***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:07:46mc2739or more likely near the end
00:08:07 Quit Acknix (Remote closed the connection)
00:08:57funmanone of the called functions stores a non #0 number in RAM, and loop, reading this RAM location until the number is #0
00:09:22funmanI believe one of the isr will modify it but I can't find any other code which modifies this location
00:09:46 Quit ender (" Where there's a will, there's an inheritance tax.")
00:10:13 Quit Rob2223 ()
00:12:52 Quit domonoky (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:15:02 Quit tyfoo ("Carpe diem")
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00:25:44*Bagder suddenly mentions that no gsoc shirt has reach him...
00:25:47 Quit domonoky (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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00:27:30*bluebrother digs after
00:28:29 Join cool_walking_ [0] (i=cb3b81c3@gateway/web/ajax/
00:30:49Lloreanbluebrother: I think that patch is at least suggestive of the way we should be heading
00:31:09Bagder"Please note that we will not begin shipping replacements until the week of 1 December" :-(
00:33:28 Quit havspace (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:33:49bluebrotherLlorean: me too
00:34:40bluebrotherIMO it made the menus much clearer, and that's much more important than shuffling around the items (IMO)
00:34:59BagderI always liked that kind of inlined settings
00:36:09bluebrotherI'm really surprised nobody brought it up again afterwards. Instead people discuss how to rearrange the items
00:36:26Lloreanbluebrother: I think properly arranged items would benefit both that system *and* our current system anyway
00:36:37bluebrotherbut anyway, as I posted the link to the menu reorganization thread on the ML I really hope there will be more discussion on the lists.
00:37:22bluebrotherLlorean: I agree that properly sorted items would help too. Just don't make Repeat a subitem of Playlist −− that's just confusing :)
00:39:58LloreanWell, "Shuffle", "All", and "None" all affect playlist, while "One" affects an entry in the playlist. :-P
00:40:06LloreanBut he agrees that was sorta a bad name for the category
00:40:51bluebrothercall that category "Playback"? ;-)
00:41:33bluebrotherregardless I would really like to get the inline settings up to discussion again.
00:42:55LloreanAny reorganization should take into account an assumption of eventually inline settings, at least for "yes/no" settings.
00:43:51linuxstbHow did that patch actually work? i.e. how do you change the value of a setting?
00:45:05bluebrotherlinuxstb: can't remember exactly, but from the faded memory: on h100 you selected the item with up / down, then the value using left / right. Select confirmed the value afterwards.
00:45:20bluebrotherand any up / down left the setting unchanged.
00:45:41LloreanI think for multivalue items it should still pop up a full list if you tap "select" on it, while for toggles, "select" should simply alternate the two values.
00:46:00 Quit domonoky (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:46:09LloreanI'm not sure if a final version should take over left/right, since it's nice to be able to navigate the menus (at least left) easily
00:46:12bluebrotherfor all menus with subitems (or too long lists) it displayed the > character and opened the usual list.
00:46:48bluebrotherLlorean: not sure if I'm remembering correctly. It could be possible that changing the value required you to press select first
00:47:03Lloreanbluebrother: That would be acceptable to me.
00:47:09LloreanIn fact...
00:47:35LloreanA tap of select should let you left/right through them, a long-select (which would normally be context menu) should bring up the full list so you can scan values.
00:47:38bluebrotherI might try to grab an old version and check that patch again. But not today, it's already rather late
00:48:03bluebrotherLlorean: that sounds even better :)
00:48:20bluebrother(the list "popup" idea)
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00:50:14 Quit tvelocity (Connection timed out)
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00:50:33bluebrotheranyway, I'm out for today. See you tomorrow (and hoping for quite some discussion of that idea on the ML ;)
00:50:36 Quit bluebrother ("leaving")
00:52:17pixelmame wonders how that left/right thing should work on Ondio
00:53:07pixelmahmm... maybe I'm just imagining it wrong at the moment though
00:53:08Lloreanpixelma: For you poor, button-deprived ondio users we can just make it always pop up all the options, basically working like the menus do now, only showing the current value (and toggling if it's a yes/no option) :-P
00:53:50 Join ajonat [0] (n=ajonat@
00:53:58pixelmawhile the Ondio doesn't have many buttons it has quite a nice keymap currently...
00:55:35LloreanI think the keymap wouldn't have to change for ondios, if it's not possible to add the new functionality.
00:55:53LloreanIt could work exactly as it does now, except that "yes/no" options never show a list, they just change on/off
00:56:17pixelmabtw. I don't like the look of _these_ inline settings much because it can vary from "option: value" (where that is even too long and option or so needs scrolling) to "option: value" depending on length of the option name, font, screen
00:56:54LloreanI thought it was:
00:56:54Llorean" value"
00:57:06pixelmathat's even worse
00:57:21LloreanI don't think two-line settings are too bad.
00:58:34 Nick JdGordon|zzz is now known as JdGordon (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)
00:59:31pixelmathey waste space - you will only have 3 (or 4) settings on 64 pixels high displays with a 8 pixels tall fonts and Archos screens are not the only ones this small and I could imagine that this is even a problem on very large screens because you can easily loose focus (which value belongs to what option)
01:00:48JdGordonthat [atch was brought up[ again and should be easy to redo... iirc i still have a patch for that on the tracker
01:02:19 Nick Maha` is now known as maha (i=juma@gateway/gpg-tor/key-0xB9002659)
01:04:08pixelmaLlorean: I think I wouldn't like this for other than enable/disable settings anyways - the reason is that I like being able to see the list of options at once (it helps for deciding how to quickly reach and set them)
01:04:25pixelmaor at least many of them
01:04:36Lloreanpixelma: As I proposed though, you'd have the option to get to the list at any time, you'd just always also be able to see what they're all set at already.
01:04:51LloreanSo, for example, you could see your crossfeed settings immediately, and know whether to just turn it on, or whether you need to tweak it first.
01:04:55 Quit moos ("Rockbox rules the DAP world")
01:05:39pixelmaI know that I always have crossfeed disabled :P
01:06:02LloreanI don't use it either, but I think it's an overall benefit to be able to immediately tell what a variety of settings are set to.
01:06:21LloreanAnd, with my suggestion at least, you'd always be able to access the full list *nearly* as easily as you can now.
01:08:22 Join Nico_P [50] (n=nicolas@rockbox/developer/NicoP)
01:12:29JdGordonwhat was your suggestion?
01:12:38 Nick HBK- is now known as HBK (
01:12:56pixelmamaybe... by the way, the old trigger settings screen used inline settings (on one line) and it didn't look good as some options and values almost clashed with each other (yes, on my Ondio with nedore-9 at this time)
01:13:19JdGordonthe new trigger screen also uses inline settings (doesnt it?)
01:13:43JdGordonalso, any patch which adds inline settings almost definatly can be done in a way to enable/disable it
01:14:00pixelmawasn't sure, need to look
01:14:38LloreanJdGordon: "tap select" 'selects' the option, then left/right scroll through the available choices. "Context menu" takes you to a full list of the values so you can see them all.
01:15:02pixelmaah yes, 2-line settings - no clash but I only have 2 options at once on the screen
01:16:15JdGordonLlorean: and select again to unselect?
01:17:25pixelmaand if I go up I only see one... because it first goes only one line up so I see the second (value) line of the previous option, then one option completely, finally the first (option) line of the next option
01:18:15LloreanJdGordon: Yeah.
01:18:51funmanfdinel: your IM client sends me 404 errors
01:19:36funmanI was saying for i2c_read/write : r0 is the saddr, and r1 is the pointer to the read/write array
01:19:48funmanbut i2c_write takes a 3rd argument I can't understand
01:19:52pixelmathere also seems to be a button action problem - changing the value with left/right changes the value and leaves the trigger settings screen
01:20:17pixelma(with right)
01:20:51JdGordonLlorean: yeah, that could work.. definetly better than how it used to be on the rec screen
01:20:57JdGordon(dunno how it is now)
01:21:17JdGordonpixelma: yeah, apparently noone uses the trigger screen so its bound to have button issues
01:21:17LloreanJdGordon: Up/Down should probably also un-select, so you don't have to remember to do it to move on to other options.
01:21:53*pixelma knows someone who used it (not me)
01:23:32*linuxstb looks at the build table and sighs...
01:25:18 Quit kkurbjun ("Leaving.")
01:25:33pixelmaJdGordon: the button problem seems to not be there on my c200 and M5, maybe I'll have a look myself but not now
01:26:07JdGordonits a usual keymap problem.. sim isnt always good enough to figure out the needed keymap
01:29:05pixelmayeah, I think I know what's going on but don't want to have a closer look at half past one (AM)
01:36:20funmanduring the night, all the bugs are grey
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01:54:53Avalon_ScytheUgh I need MAJOR HELP!
01:55:31 Quit tvelocity (Connection timed out)
01:55:43cool_walking_Avalon_Scythe: It would help if you actually described the problem...
01:56:09Avalon_ScytheI eneterd Manufcaturing Mode on my sansa e200
01:56:22Avalon_ScytheI downloaded Ubuntu so i can get the terminal
01:56:44 Join BHSPitMonkey [0] (n=stephen@unaffiliated/bhspitmonkey)
01:56:54Avalon_ScytheBut When I did all the steps in manufacturing mode, my sansa went all like 0LUN
01:57:13Avalon_Scythethen it went unlock lock unlock lock for a few times
01:57:20krazykitthat's normal
01:57:32Avalon_Scytheand then my sansa e200 txt file came up and it was still CURROPTED
01:57:37Avalon_Scythewhat did i do worng?
01:59:05*Avalon_Scythe waits patiently for an answer
01:59:37Avalon_ScytheIt also said load main image failed
01:59:46Avalon_Scythewhen i tried to start it up
02:00:39linuxstbWhat do you mean by "my sansa e200 txt file came up" ?
02:01:25Avalon_Scythewhen u enter recovery mode the txt file comes up as version
02:01:39funmanAvalon_Scythe: did you follow the steps at , for "v0.1.3 or later" ?
02:02:14funmandid you read the wiki page I just mentioned ?
02:02:49funmanwell it says to not follow the instructions on website, so you got a point :P
02:03:33Avalon_Scytheoh crap
02:03:42Avalon_Scythei was baout to download it too =p
02:04:07Avalon_Scytheso what do i do?
02:04:30funmanfirst calm down, then read and follow the instructions
02:04:46Avalon_Scythei did and i told you that didnt work
02:04:55funmando it again
02:05:12Avalon_ScytheOMG DUDE i did it.....6 times
02:05:28funmanthen I don't know ..
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02:07:44Avalon_ScytheI wana cry
02:07:46***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:08:25Avalon_Scythecan anyone help me D;
02:08:44 Quit krazykit ("nope")
02:09:23funmanAvalon_Scythe: perhaps this can be useful:
02:10:38mc2739Avalon_Scythe: did you hold the rec button as it said on the wiki page? you need to hold it until the 16mb partition is visible
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02:11:44Avalon_Scytheyes I did I held it and whiel i was holding it it went 0LUN unlock 0LUN lock then it showed up fucked up
02:12:15Avalon_Scythewith wierd chracters which mean a corrupted txt. file which i was trying to fix
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02:12:49kugelAvalon_Scythe: this means you're in recovery mode
02:13:36kugel0LUN unlock 0LUN lock shows up in the recovery mode. Just throw the bootloader and firmeware file at the 16MB FORMAT drive now
02:14:42Avalon_ScytheI did but when I did that like I said 6 times or more it kept showing a bad txt file
02:16:39mc2739Avalon_Scythe: maybe try this -
02:17:09Avalon_Scythei read it
02:18:10Avalon_Scythewait hold on
02:18:13Avalon_Scytheleme read some more
02:19:01kugelAvalon_Scythe: I don't quite understand. What shows you which bad txt file, and how??
02:20:46Avalon_ScytheOkay You Know How You Get Into Recovery Mode and it Brings up the 16-MB Format Disk
02:20:49kugelYou just put those 2 files onto the 16MB drive, and safely disconnect the sansa (and then let it do the recovery). There's no text file involved
02:21:15Avalon_Scythei'm doing that
02:22:25Avalon_ScytheOMG u see
02:22:29Avalon_Scytheit still said that
02:22:32Avalon_Scytheidk why
02:22:58Avalon_Scythemy blank txt file which i renamed sansa.fmt and it became and fmt file
02:23:00kugelWhat said what?
02:23:22Avalon_Scythei but the rom and the mi4 but it still said load main image failed switch to recovery mode
02:23:25 Quit DerDome ("Leaving.")
02:23:27kugelAnd please follow the guidelines and use proper words
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02:24:50kugelwhich files did you use exactly? where did you get them from?
02:25:25mc2739Avalon_Scythe: here is another thread about corrupt version.txt -
02:25:32Avalon_Scythefrom the link mc2739 game me
02:25:39Avalon_Scytheand here is another one
02:25:47kugelhave you put a sansa.fmt on the drive? Make sure windows (if you use that) doesn't hide the file extention (chances are it's named sansa.fmt.txt, which doesn't work)
02:28:14Avalon_Scytheno no i fix that hold on this link mc2379 gave me is the same problem i have
02:28:36Avalon_ScytheLOL bingo i need a new version txt file it says =D
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02:32:38mc2739Avalon_Scythe: here is a link to what claims to be the solution for the corrupted version.txt
02:33:13mc2739the author modified the e200tool for that very purpose
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02:41:12mc2739_you're welcome, hope it works
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02:51:02Avalon_Scythei dont have a 4gig
02:53:47 Quit mc2739 (Nick collision from services.)
02:53:58Avalon_Scythethe person wh made the thread has a 4gig and he wrote down...I am not sure if this file will work for other versions like e250(2GB), e270(6GB) or e280(8GB). You will have to request someone who owns these players to provide you with the dump file, at anythingbutipod forums or at the rockbox forums.
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02:55:20mc2739Avalon_Scythe: which model do you have?
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02:55:58Avalon_ScytheSansa e260
02:56:15Avalon_ScytheA 2G
02:56:32Avalon_Scytheoh wait i ment E250
02:56:34mc2739the e260 is a 4gig not a 2gig
02:56:41Avalon_ScytheA 2GIG
02:56:58Avalon_Scythesorry but it's E250
02:57:06Avalon_ScytheOpps type to slow
02:57:43mc2739sorry, I can't help with that, I have the e280 (8g)
02:57:46Avalon_ScytheSo Can I Get A Dump File For That? And Oh yea Do I use e200toolplus or e200toolplus-dev
02:58:31mc2739just use the plus - the dev is source, etc. in case you need to recomplie
02:59:29Avalon_Scytheokay so how do i get a 2gig Dump FIle
03:02:19mc2739you might try leaving a message in that thread (or in the rockbox forum) and see if someone with an e250 can help
03:02:41Avalon_ScytheHow Long Do You Belive It Might Take To Answer
03:03:50mc2739i have no idea - it could be quick, or it could be never
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03:04:28Avalon_ScytheI'm Losing Hope Fast
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03:08:41saratogaAvalon_Scythe: why do you capitalize words incorrectly?
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03:13:01*Avalon_Scythe wonders why saragota cares >.>
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04:07:48***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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05:37:04kronflux!seen LambdaCalculus37
05:37:20kronfluxhm. that doesnt work. :p
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05:59:36*JdGordon will be back in 15 if that commit doesnt come out green
06:07:49***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
06:11:47*JdGordon wonders why the eltas for the video and video 64mb builds arent the same?
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07:22:28JdGordonZagor: I'm getting when i try adding comments to flyspray... they comments do get added though?
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08:06:25 Join Zagor [0] (n=bjorn@rockbox/developer/Zagor)
08:07:50JdGordonmorning Zagor, I'm getting when i try adding comments to flyspray... they comments do get added though?
08:07:52***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
08:08:31 Quit miepchen^schlaf_ ()
08:08:55Zagorperhaps related to the update i ran yesterday
08:09:31JdGordonalso, the frontpage isnt updating the mail area? maybe related?
08:10:29Zagorthat's odd
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08:21:10ZagorJdGordon: have you recieved any mails since the last ones on the front page?
08:22:50Zagorehe, sendmail is not running...
08:23:30Zagorhence the flyspray error when it tries to mail notifications
08:23:41Zagorand the missing mail updates
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08:47:43JdGordonZagor: I havnt received, but ive sent 2 to -dev
08:48:05JdGordonoh too slow.. all fixed :)
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10:07:54***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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10:10:47Zagorgenerated files sure make things messy when running "make -j"
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10:30:35LloreanAnyone know much about the MP4 length limitation?
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10:31:38linuxstbI think you need Lear
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10:32:19LloreanI was just curious if it's a kind of "we may be able to improve the maximum length but there will always be a cap" or if we'll one day be able to use arbitrary length files.
10:33:25linuxstbI think it's something that needs investigating as part of a codec memory-reduction blitz.
10:34:54amiconnThere will always be the FAT file size cap
10:35:07LloreanWell, "arbitrary up to the filesystem limit" then
10:35:34amiconnCurrently it's 2GB due to our file api implementation. Can (and imo should) be increased to 4GB
10:36:30LloreanAt least it now skips long m4a files rather than locking up, but it seems to skip the other file in the playlist too so I'm not quite sure what it's doing.
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10:55:58LinusNdoes anyone have a spare (broken?) Western Digital WD1200 hard drive for me?
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11:32:06J-23hmm, how does e200v2 SD test work?
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11:33:16J-23it runs forever for me
11:34:28domobileand what does it display ? just the looping and response ff8000 ?
11:34:48blkhawkI would like to test that :)
11:34:52blkhawkI have a v2 too
11:35:05blkhawkso screen access works?
11:35:25domobileafaik it only works for th sd card for now..
11:35:55domobileyes, lcd should work
11:36:00blkhawkthats not an obstacle really
11:36:30J-23yes, it shows only "0xFF8000".
11:37:20J-23card is 2GB formatted with FAT16
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11:38:40domobileyou have to modify the code to test the external sd
11:39:23J-23external SD? So what this code does currently test?
11:40:22domobilethe internal sd memory ? the code, and you will see
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11:51:57RomanianHello all.
11:53:24ze /math 1419/60
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11:55:18RomanianAnyone here have an X5/L?
11:57:12advcomp2019Romanian, whats your question.. depends on it, someone will help or not
11:58:02RomanianOh, I was just wondering if anyone had one. Suppose I ought to be in #rockbox-community then.
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12:07:59***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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12:38:00Alfahi, I've got a Sansa E260R, and currently have Rockbox installed on it. Do I need an E200R specific file to update to version 3 or just the standard E200 one?
12:38:22linuxstbJust the standard one. It's only the bootloader installation method that differs between the R and normal E200s.
12:38:47Alfacool, thanks
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14:29:08moospreglow: hi, around?
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14:31:44moosThat's about the "skip lenght" option. /me don't understand the skip track entry
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14:42:03moosI think that this "skip track" option can be confusing and maybe a bit useless. All thoses discussions about seetings those days...
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14:43:17mooscan we change it to: normal skip, or disable or something, or even remove it :)
14:43:27Strife89moos: I believe its main purpose is to help navigate through long audio files (such as audio books).
14:43:58moosI know that is the purpose of the skip lenght option...
14:44:20linuxstbmoos: It was originally committed in a drive-by commit, then there was a long discussion about it, and preglow changed it to how it is now.
14:44:22Strife89It's also helpful in that, while the setting is active, an accidental button press doesn't make you lose your spot (by much).
14:44:27moosI was speaking about the "skip track" sub menu
14:44:51linuxstbIsn't that what was called "study mode"?
14:45:00mooslinuxstb: I vaguely remenber, yup study mode :)
14:45:26moosbut I really think that this first entry is a bit useless
14:46:10moosor at least confusing ;)
14:46:38*Strife89 opts for a minor renaming. :)
14:47:27moosI can think people wanted to disable this option if they was using it, then a normal skip or disable could do the trick...
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14:48:23*moos was about to do so in francais.lang, hence this thought :)
14:50:08mooswhat do you think? can I change the english lang entry to, to "normal skip" or "Disable" or something you find better? :)
14:51:42linuxstbI'm not sure what the current options are... Are you saying that the setting name is "Skip length", with the first option being "skip track" ?
14:52:18linuxstbAnd the other options are time intervals?
14:52:34moosexact, then the confusing....
14:53:30linuxstbThen yes, I think it could be improved. Maybe wait to speak to preglow or Llorean - IIRC, they were the two people discussing it the most when preglow changed it.
14:54:04moosOK, hence my first ping for preglow :)
14:54:37*linuxstb thinks he's got a grip on the Fuze LCD functions in the OF - it shouldn't be too hard to write a driver now, even though the LCD is unknown...
14:55:23moosCongratulations ! \o/
14:59:23dany_21a_linuxstb: wow... cool - As i recently killed (still dont know why/how) my e200v2, maybe ill buy a fuze soon :)
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15:40:15linuxstbdomonoky: Did you use the m200v1 keymap for your m200v2 (v4?) sim?
15:41:05domonokylinuxstb: yes, but it seems the m200 map was just a copy from a c200, with very strange button actions :-)
15:41:32linuxstbSounds very possible ;)
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15:45:54Code8404Will rockbox be made available for Gen 4 ipod nano
15:46:20linuxstbIf some owners of that device port Rockbox to it, yes.
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15:46:42linuxstbBut no-one seems to be working on it currently.
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16:04:35funmanisn't there confusion between backlight & buttonlight in the source ?
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16:04:54funmani.e. buttonlight assumes (lcd?) backlight support
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16:09:08funmanin settings_list.c line 1327
16:09:21funman#ifdef HAVE_BUTTON_LIGHT , but the function use backlight_* functions
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16:15:54funmandoes the e200 have a 'repeat' button ?
16:16:26funmanor BUTTON_REPEAT means 'press 2 times in a row' ?
16:16:48*funman will probably have a lot of questions until the clip simulator builds
16:17:27funmanI've found a great picture: but there is no licence on the page where I found it
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16:19:30funmanI'm sure it's a promotional image of SanDisk but I can't find the original publication
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16:22:11salty-horsehi. in the past week anonymous svn has been really slow. do you know of any problems?
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16:31:40linuxstbfunman: Yes, BUTTON_REPEAT isn't a real button - it is bitwise or'ed with the real button to indicate that it's a repeated button press (if a button is held longer than X ms, then repeat events will be sent).
16:32:58linuxstbfunman: Regarding a photo for the sim - we've always been cautious before, and just used our own photos of our own devices.
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16:35:42kugellinuxstb: sounds grad (lcd for fuze). I help if I can
16:36:00kugeldany_21a_: heh, sad, but the fuze is a better player anyway :P
16:36:15kugeldany_21a_: how did you manage to kill it?
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16:42:05saratogakugel: how did you break the scroll wheel on your old fuze anyway?
16:43:18funmanlinuxstb: I just took a shoot :)
16:43:52kugelsaratoga: the connection on the cable broke
16:44:16kugelit was pretty hard to insert it again, and when I got it, it was already too late
16:44:36saratogakugel: so you tore the cable in two?
16:44:38kugeldid you reassemble sucessfully?
16:44:54saratogabut i bought another fuze with a broken scroll wheel cable
16:45:05saratogafor spare parts, but i'm curious what that means exactly
16:45:11saratogai don't see anyway to break the cable?
16:45:33saratogaon mine its just a cable into a ZIF slot
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16:45:51kugelno, the connection part on the cable (gold?) rubbed off
16:46:35kugelwell, I definitely wouldn't call it zif
16:46:43kugelor, I just failed horribly
16:47:29kugelI couldn't get it in easily, especially since the front plate was just blocking everywhere
16:52:52linuxstbWhat's the difference between the fuze and the e200?
16:54:41kugelthe buttons. Especially the scroll wheel, which is just way better on the fuze
16:55:03kugeland if they didn't upgrade the display from e200v1 to v2, the display is quite better too
17:01:35funman < not too ugly for the simulator ?
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17:02:18gevaertsfunman: go for the iaudio7 approach!
17:02:40kugelfunman: if possible, scan your fuze
17:05:36funmanI have no scanner
17:05:56kugelgevaerts: lol
17:06:36kugelfunman: There's should be a plenty of shots from the clip which we can use on the www
17:07:27funmanI couldn't find any with an appropriate licence
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17:09:46kugelfunman: digicam?
17:10:06funmanI'm a bad photographer
17:10:28funmanthe only correct picture I made was full of light reflection
17:10:36funmanand you can see my fingerprints :(
17:10:49kugelso? I bet the photo will still be way better than the sketch
17:13:28funmanis the e200 side button 'rec' ?
17:13:50funman < here is my best picture
17:14:14kugellooks nice
17:14:33kugelreal pics are always preferable imho
17:14:43*gevaerts adds the fingerprints to his database
17:14:50bmblYou should take the picture without flash and with enough light in the room
17:14:51kugelyou could clean it before though :)
17:15:51peturbeer time
17:15:54funmanbmbl: that was the case: the light is the room light
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17:16:44kugelfunman: I don't find the light bad, only the finger prints
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17:21:11bmblfunman: then use some indirect light
17:25:42funmandon't have
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17:29:15advcomp2019funman, is this how you want a photo: advcomp2019/IMG_2189.jpg">
17:29:21funmanjust every other picture I take is blur - I'll leave this task to someone else: )
17:29:46funmanadvcomp2019: yay, looks like made by a pro ;)
17:30:37funmancan I use it under the gplv2 or later, bla bla bla ?
17:31:25advcomp2019if you need it, sure then
17:32:11funmanthanks ;)
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17:37:05kugelgpl is doubtfully suitable for pictures
17:38:10rasherYeah, it's not a great fit
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17:42:48bmblfunman: I'll photoshop one when I find the time ;)
17:43:20funmanbmbl: what do you think of advcomp2019's picture?
17:43:48funmanI should just zoom it until the screen's size is an integer coefficient of the real (pixel) size
17:44:09bmblAh didn't see it
17:44:13bmblcould work yes
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17:50:44funmanfirmware/drivers/lcd-16bit.c : line 93 , lcd_set_enable_hook() is defined conditionally on HAVE_LCD_ENABLE
17:51:12funmanapps/plugin.c : line 137 , lcd_set_enable_hook is referenced conditionally on the same define
17:51:28funmanbut it should check also if lcd-16bit.c has been built as well
17:52:07funmanaka LCD_DEPTH == 16
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17:53:13kugelfunman: don't other lcd-Xbit.c files also have this function?
17:53:40domonokyisnt lcd-16bit only compiled when LCD_DEPTH == 16 ? the the check is not really needed...
17:54:48kugeldomonoky: I think he means when a non-16bit targert uses the function. It checks only for LCD_ENABLE
17:55:20domonokyah, plugin.c would need the additional LCD_DEPTH check...
17:55:58linuxstbShouldn't that function be implemented in the other (high-level) LCD drivers? I'm guessing that currently only 16bpp LCDs have LCD_ENABLE defined.
17:56:01n1swhy? all targets that hane the enable function should define LCD_ENABLE.
17:56:06kugelor implement it for non-16bit targets
17:56:34funmanI found another problem in backlight.c : confusion between backlight and buttonlight
17:56:54funmanwell not only in backlight.c
17:57:35domonokywe probably only switch the color lcds off, as you can not read them without backlight... b/w lcd stay always on, because they are usefull without backlight..
17:58:35domonokyso we only need the LCD_ENABLE for color lcds :-)
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18:00:19kugelthe term color is going to be inappropriate with the clip ;)
18:00:46funmandomonoky: doesn't switching the display off save battery
18:00:50*domonoky replace color with 16bit -lcds .. :-)
18:01:12kugelfunman: yes, but only for targets where you need the backlight to read the screen
18:01:36domonokyfunman: yes, it saves a little bit, but less on bw/greayscale... and it saves more if you dont switch the backlight on.. :-)
18:01:53funmanfor the clip there is no backlight at all since it's an OLED display
18:03:13kugelfunman: You should fix config-clip.h then
18:03:21funmanAnd remove lcd_enable ?
18:04:09kugelI don't know if the clip display can be turned off. But as it has no backlight, you should not define HAVE_BACKLIGHT (and _BRIGHTNESS)
18:04:11bmblfunman whats the pixel size of the clip?
18:04:16funmanwhich function will disable/enable the screen ?
18:04:28funmanbmbl: 128 * 66
18:04:31domonokyfunman: at least remove the "have backlight" :-)
18:04:40funmankugel: it can be turned off
18:04:47funmanand HAVE_BACKLIGHT is not defined
18:04:51kugelfunman: then don't remove it :)
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18:05:02funmanI'm very confused
18:05:44kugelfunman: /* Define this for LCD backlight available */
18:05:45kugel#define HAVE_BACKLIGHT
18:06:13funmanright I removed it in my tree ;)
18:06:15domonokyatleast svn has this backlight defines..
18:06:38funmanI also removed HAVE_BUTTON_LIGHT
18:06:43domonokybut the question is really how to handle this display best, as its like a new type in rockbox..
18:07:19*kugel expects problems with LCD_ENABLE defined but HAVE_BACKLIGHT not
18:07:47domonokybut for the start we can let it just stay always on..
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18:08:13funmanwell for the simulator build the only problem was in the file I Mentioned
18:08:31kugelthe clip doesn't have button light?
18:08:34funmanit does
18:08:40*domonoky would just remove the LCD_ENABLE and the BACKLIGHT defines, that can be fixed later..
18:08:52funmanbut there is spread confusion between backlight and buttonlight
18:08:58funmanin fact it seems backlight is assumed everywhere
18:09:07funmans/everywhere/in some places/
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18:09:48*gevaerts isn't surprised
18:10:00*domonoky thinks there is only 1 port without backlight (ondio)
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18:17:53funmanapps/plugin.c : line 150 until 161 should be enclosed in a #ifdef HAVE_BACKLIGHT , no ?
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18:26:18domonokylooks like it should... i wonder how this works on the ondio
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18:32:15funmanperhaps it defines empty stubs
18:34:46pixelmaI recently stumbled upon this too and amiconn explained me why it is done this way... * trying to remember *
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18:35:12funmanI have a problem with the simulator keypad ..
18:35:13IudeXfunman: do you wand a clip scan? I have scanner :)
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18:37:14funmanIudeX: currently I have this image:
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18:37:46IudeXfunman: och. Dont bad :) Are u working on Clip simulator?
18:38:07funmanyep, but I can't scroll down :(
18:38:29kugelfunman: my fuze sim worked fine :)
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18:39:34funmankugel: let me look at your wor
18:39:52funmanby the way did you flash a firmware with mkamsboot ? (I pushed the diff for the fuze)
18:40:11IudeXfunman: what ver of clip is that? Red?
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18:40:32kugelIudeX: looks pretty red to me
18:40:44kugelfunman: no sorry, i haven't had time yet
18:41:08funmanIudeX: yep, picture contributed by advcomp2019
18:42:00pixelmafunman: amiconn also said it could still be usefull to implement backlight functions for the oled display, if only I could remember... :\
18:42:04IudeXbatter and date will be on yellow part of OLED?
18:42:11funmanis it possible to close FS #8843 ?
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18:42:25funmanIudeX: I'm not sure .. that's pixelma's work if I understand correctly ;)
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18:42:38funmanpixelma: thanks I'll try to catch him
18:43:29IudeXok i'm looking in Clip OF
18:44:30bmblfunman: would you still want a photoshopped Clip if I made one (just started to see how far I get ;))?
18:44:55IudeXbmbl: Where is the home button?
18:45:04bmblnot there yet
18:45:08moosfunman: done, ask for flyspray rights to Bagder or Zagor
18:45:21bmblwanted to make the "ground" first
18:45:21funmanbmbl: nice, but I think the real picture looks better
18:45:23funmanmoos: thansk
18:45:48bmblfunman: it's not ready yet :P
18:45:52funmanwell the current picture has not the button light on ;)
18:45:57kugelfunman: does it look ok (should run through every gpio a pin)
18:46:04kugelto get the button light pin
18:46:43funmankugel: no, the macro doesn't resolve at runtime but at build time
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18:47:08kugelso? it's a loop
18:47:12funmanand I really advise you to do one pin by one, to be sure of your findings
18:47:22funmankugel: i must be fixed, not dynamic
18:47:35advcomp2019funman, you need one with it on? ;)
18:47:36IudeXJ23 will ask what can he test :)
18:47:57funmanadvcomp2019: well I'm happy with what I have now :)
18:48:32advcomp2019o ok
18:48:38IudeXI can scan a better Clip picture
18:48:46pixelmabmbl: if you want to go further with that - there are SVGs of most of the players for the manual. It looks like you could reuse some of the signs and symbols of the e200 and c200 version, seems Sandisk didn't change much
18:49:35bmblNever looked at making SVGs
18:50:17 Quit aarcane (Client Quit)
18:50:43kugelfunman: but this will work, yes? pastebin updated
18:51:32pixelmabmbl: they are in the source under manual/rockbox_interface/images
18:51:53funmankugel: what's the new url?
18:52:15kugelfunman: "pastebin updated" aka the same as before
18:52:26funmanwell I ask because it looks the same
18:52:38funmanah -> 'descendants'
18:52:58funmanyes this works
18:53:09funmanbut I wonder how you will do precise timing to determine which pin it was
18:53:35kugelafaik the 0x10000 delay is ~5s?
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18:54:05J-23hmm, what does SD code test on e200v2's?
18:55:04funmanJ-23: internal SD
18:55:16J-23internal SD?
18:55:49funmanthe storage which is not in your e200's SD slot
18:59:00funmanhum I can not browse the start menu with down key ..
18:59:51funmanI have made the mapping between SDL keystrokes and Clip's PAD in uisimulator/sdl/button.c
19:00:23funmanwhere is the mapping between Clip's PAD and rockbox meaning ? I suppose apps/keymap/* is only for applications (rocks?)
19:02:13J-23what is internal SD used to?
19:02:20kugelfunman: looks good, doesn't it?
19:02:22pixelmafunman: no, apps/keymap is for core rockbox. Plugins define their own (either in the plugin itself or in the... don't remind me)
19:02:23funmanJ-23: put music for example
19:02:24domonokyfunman: the keymaps does this... plugins (rocks) mostly have their own mapping...
19:02:34domonokybut we leave plugins out for now..
19:02:47kugelafter ./mkamsboot fuzef.bin bootloader-fuze.sansa _fuzef.bin
19:03:00funmanso the bug is likely in my keymap-clip.c
19:03:04J-23funman: is there any relation between internal SD and iNAND chips?
19:03:15IudeXSo fuze will be rockboxed too :)
19:03:16funmankugel: yes looks good
19:03:23kugelfunman: I suggest you mess with plugins later and don't build them for now
19:03:25funmanJ-23: it's the same
19:03:57J-23so are you currently trying to hack iNAND memory in these players?
19:04:05kugelfunman: *** THIS CODE IS UNTESTED - DO NOT USE IF YOU CAN NOT RECOVER YOUR DEVICE *** doesn't sound promising though :P
19:04:08funmanJ-23: yes
19:04:15kugelI thought it is tested
19:04:25funmankugel: well checking with a disassembler / emulator isn't worthless
19:04:38funmanit is tested, but it's to afraid newbies :)
19:04:57kugelfunman: well, if you volunteer to check it, I'll send it
19:05:06kugelotherwise I'll just patch my fuze now
19:05:32funmankugel: patch it :) it was already tested in the emulator, and the dual boot works fine
19:05:33pixelmafunman, domonoky: I *believe* the explanation for the backlight functions in plugin.c was that they are there so that backlight modded Ondios can still use these with a normal (not backlight enabled) build at all just without backlight of course. While a stock Ondio doesn't have backlight it can be modded and there are some things left for convenience so you can use a SVN build, also even download a SVN voice file
19:05:43funmankugel: as long as we check gpio A3 , no problem
19:06:15funmanpixelma: oh ok .. quite complex :)
19:06:16kugelthe check is not in sansa-as3525.c which I modified only
19:06:26funmankugel: it's in mkamsboot/dualboot.S
19:06:59pixelmaI think though that a small comment couldn't hurt...
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19:08:37kugelmeh, my 8.10 doesn't automount my fuze anymore ;(
19:10:59 Quit J-23 (Remote closed the connection)
19:13:48kugelfunman: I'm not sure if the code worked
19:14:07kugelI turned it on (waited 1min or so) and nothing happened
19:14:25kugelthen I inserted the USB cable and it booted into the OF
19:14:33kugelwithout me turning the fuze off
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19:19:15funmanmaybe one of the pins is 'power_off' ?
19:19:25 Join J-23 [0] (
19:20:02 Part dany_21a_
19:20:02funmanyou should better harass linuxstb to reverse engineer the lcd :)
19:20:23funmanis the entry menu a 'context' ?
19:22:02kugelfunman: I don't reverse engineer the display, I just want to find the button light pin :(
19:22:11funmanmaybe there is no
19:22:39funmanthe fuze already proved to be different from the other models with respect to the buttons
19:23:35kugelfunman: bad news. my fuze isn't starting anymoe
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19:24:06funmandon't panic
19:24:23funmanpress power for 10s and replug it
19:24:33kugelI've done that dude....
19:24:36funmanmkamsboot just proved to work 10s earlier
19:24:55funmanI had the same feeling yesterday and everything was right
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19:25:17funmanhow filled was your battery before you flashed the fuze ?
19:25:23domonokyfunman: i think the manin menu uses the standard context..
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19:25:33kugelfunman: don't know
19:25:49kugelnot full, but not low enough to crash while updating
19:26:03 Quit IudeX ("CGI:IRC")
19:26:18funmanthe fuze has the same 'safety power off' than other models, right ?
19:26:39funmanso try again, smoke a cigaret, and try again ;)
19:26:51kugeli've tried it 6-7 times now
19:26:53domonokyfunman: set ACTION_STD_PREV to your up button and AcTION_STD_NEXT to the down button :-)
19:28:03kugelfunman: I haven't looked on the screen while updating, maybe it was too low and crashed during update?
19:28:37funmankugel: while updating it should be powered by USB I believe
19:28:57kugelhow that?
19:29:00funmanoh after unplugging you mean - if that's the case, SanDisk really badly did their job
19:29:05kugelit updates after I disconnect the cable
19:29:28kugelit won't turn on :(
19:29:53funmando something else and try again in 15 minutes
19:30:10funmandomonoky: right, now it's fine
19:30:31funmanbut when I do button_up (ACTION_STD_PREV) I see 'Nothing to resume' appear and disappear on screen
19:30:40J-23what does it mean? SD test runs forever at 0xFF8000 for me
19:30:41 Quit FOAD (Remote closed the connection)
19:30:51funmanJ-23: read the code, or don't run it
19:31:08domonokyfunman: maybe the same button is also mapped to some other action ?
19:31:19funmannot in the standard context
19:31:48kugelfunman: dmesg shows nothing. and there's no additionial device note after plugging it in
19:32:05funmanit's only mapped to PREVREPEAT, but orred with BUTTON_REPEAT
19:32:18funmankugel: I said 15 minutes, not 1 minute !
19:32:55kugelmeh, I try to let it run out of battery
19:33:14 Join FOAD [0] (
19:33:40kugelmaybe the hardware poweroff isn't as hardware as we thought (I highly assume my fuze is still on)
19:34:49domonokyfunman: these contexts can be chained (see LAST_ITEM_IN_LIST__NEXTLIST), so maybe the main-menu uses another context witch chains to CONTEXT_STD
19:35:02pixelmafunman: the contexts can be connected (that's what the LAST_ITEM_IN_LIST__NEXTLIST does - sounds like it is also mapped to "Resume" (Up = Play, could serve as resume on the e200 if you are moving up and down with the wheel in the list)
19:35:13*domonoky is also struggeling with the keymaps for m200v2...
19:35:17*pixelma too slow
19:39:00 Quit soap ()
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19:39:27funmanit was ACTION_TREE_WPS
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19:39:49*kugel had no problems with the keymap on the fuze :P
19:41:36*gevaerts is confused
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19:42:33kugelcu later guys
19:42:35 Quit kugel ("ChatZilla 0.9.83 [Firefox 3.0.3/2008101315]")
19:42:38gevaertsWhy does debug_menu.c have the "Dump ROM contents" menu conditional on !HAVE_ATA_SD?
19:43:20 Join faemir [0] (
19:44:36funmandumping ROM content was not possible for a target which had ATA_SD ?
19:45:38domonokyisnt ATA_SD only for the ifp ? * me tries to remember*
19:45:55gevaertsMy guess is that the ROM dumping is either irrelevant or not implemented on sansa, but what does the availability of SD hardware have to do with it?
19:46:08gevaertsdomonoky: no. That's ATA_FLASH
19:47:54pixelmamaybe someone wanted to get Rockbox compiling when porting and then forgot about it?
19:48:10gevaertsProbably, like in so many places
19:48:54domonokywe should probably introduce a HAVE_ROM_DUMP for this :-)
19:49:27 Quit webguest96 ("CGI:IRC")
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19:54:45*funman committed clip simulator
19:55:06Bagderfunman: I made you 'developer' on flyspray now
19:55:12funmanBagder: thanks
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19:56:41funmannow I would like the yellow/blue display :)
19:57:23 Join lasser [0] (
19:57:51amiconnfunman: The backlight functions are left in the plugin API for the Ondio for a reason.
19:58:19 Join Romanian [0] (
19:58:20funmanamiconn: pixelma explained me that it was for modded ondio
19:58:32amiconnThe Ondio doesn't have backlight by default, but can be modded to have backlight relatively easy (backllight is prepared on the board)
19:58:38funmanamiconn: are you referring to r18947 ?
19:58:57amiconnI'm referring to IRC
19:59:00gevaertsfunman: yellow/interval/blue would be useful
19:59:19amiconnBut that too. It should be reverted
19:59:23pixelmafunman: why did you commit that then?
19:59:26domonokyamiconn: but shouldnt the ondio then declare HAVE_BACKLIGHT ?
19:59:40amiconndomonoky: No, not in SVN
20:00:10amiconnHAVE_BACKLIGHT being undefined hides the backlight settings from the user, and makes the api functions empty functions
20:00:17funmanpixelma: hum I thought ondio defined HAVE_BACKLIGHT anyway
20:00:22domonokyah, so you have to add this and compile yourself for modded ones ?
20:00:22amiconnfunman: nope
20:00:27amiconndomonoky: yes
20:00:49funmanso should I add empty backlight functions for the Clip ?
20:01:58amiconnThe functions (and .lang strings) should be unconditional in order to allow mixing plugins without causing hard crashes, and also to not need separate voice files
20:02:13amiconnThe backlight strings aren't that many
20:02:23pixelmaI was probably not too good in explaining
20:02:24amiconnfunman: The clip is the one with the OLED display?
20:02:48amiconnSo I'd expect it to have backlight control functions
20:02:53funmangevaerts: yes that's what I want to do
20:02:59amiconn(which would enable/disable the display)
20:03:04funmanamiconn: I understood that OLED displays had no backlight
20:03:16funmanbut yes, there is a function to enable/disable the display
20:03:30amiconnNo, but they have light, and displaying something on them costs a non-negleictible amount of power
20:03:37 Join {phoenix} [0] (
20:03:56funmanI 100% agree - so should we call that a 'backlight' even if it isn't ?
20:04:12amiconnWe should probably call it different in the .lang files
20:04:41amiconnBut in the code we should just use HAVE_BACKLIGHT imho
20:05:20amiconnIn fact I don't like some of the HAVE_* macros being in config-<target>.h
20:05:41amiconnHAVE_BACKLIGHT adds settings, i.e. it is user-visible
20:05:57amiconnBut HAVE_LCD_ENABLE doesn't (or at least shouldn't, also imho)
20:07:35amiconnBtw, all the LCD_* macros are wrong for the clip, if you want it 100% exact
20:08:07***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
20:08:15gevaertsapps/plugins/mpegplayer/stream_mgr.h calls ata_spin() depending on HAVE_DISK_STORAGE. Since storage_spin() will be an inline function that's empty in the non-HAVE_DISK_STORAGE case, shouldn't I remove the #ifdef HAVE_DISK_STORAGE there?
20:08:28 Join IudeX [0] (n=52a0f8f7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
20:08:34pixelmafunman: are you going to revert 18947? :)
20:08:50IudeXHow can I compile Clip simulator?
20:09:04pixelmabut... would be nice if someone could add a comment there
20:09:09funmanpixelma: yes, I just wanted to do it in the same time with a correct fix for the Clip
20:09:34funmanbecause now it brings me to undefined reference to 'lcd_set_enable_hook'
20:09:56amiconngevaerts: It cannot be an inline function for plugins
20:10:02funmanamiconn: lcd_set_enable_hook is only defined in drivers/lcd-16bit.c
20:10:23funmanand mentioned in plugin.c line 137
20:10:40*amiconn doesn't know that function
20:10:55gevaertsamiconn: hm, ok. Now I get to find out why it actually compiles...
20:12:15amiconngevaerts: At the moment you reference a function via a pointer, you'll cause a non-inlined copy of the function to be included in the binary
20:12:20funmanit's r17640
20:12:34funmanby jethead71
20:13:22gevaertsamiconn: true. I'll think about this a bit more
20:13:37amiconnfunman: What does that have to do with the clip?
20:13:55funmanamiconn: the clip defines HAVE_LCD_ENABLE, but doesn't use the lcd-16bit.c driver
20:14:03amiconnWhy does it?
20:14:13amiconnDoes the enable require a redraw?
20:14:28funmanfor mpegplayer according to the commit message
20:14:44amiconnThat's not what I mean...
20:15:10 Quit gevaerts (Nick collision from services.)
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20:15:35funmanwhat do you mean ?
20:16:05IudeXcan anybody help me?
20:16:16funmanmaybe what I called lcd_enable I should call backlight_on/off()
20:16:28amiconnI mean whether the clip oled display requires resending the contents when being reenabled, or whether you can redraw normally while the leds themselves are off
20:17:18funmanI don't know, let's see
20:18:18amiconnmpegplayer on 16 bit is special because it uses lcd_blit_yuv(), which is no-op while the lcd is off
20:18:48amiconnSo mpegplayer is responsible for redrawing the video after the lcd is reenabled
20:18:50funmanwhat is the difference between lcd_enable() and backlight_on/off() anyway ?
20:19:27amiconnDon't the names tell it?
20:19:38bertrikI think it's because some lcd's can still be visible even with backlight off
20:19:58amiconnbertrik: No, those don't have lcd_enable() at all
20:20:01funmannot really - I'm very confused by backlight for models with no backlight
20:20:23amiconn_imo_ a separate lcd_enable() (on the api level) is unnecessary
20:20:45amiconnBut some devs disagree
20:20:48IudeXCan anybody tell me how to open the clip simulator?
20:21:01funmanIudeX: just run tools/configure and choose a simulator build
20:21:11funmanthen make ; make install; ./rockboxui −−background
20:21:27amiconnKeeping the lcd enabled with backlight off doesn't make much sense on most colour targets.
20:21:28domonokyreplace ; with && :-)
20:21:42IudeXin RBUI?
20:21:54IudeXbut im using windows
20:22:10amiconnHowever, there's the effect that getting the display contents back from LCD disabled state takes slightly longer than if the lcd is kept enabled
20:22:36BigBambiIudeX: So are you using vmwre or cygwin to compile?
20:22:41*pixelma recommends the UiSimulator wiki page
20:23:08amiconnThe X5 even has a setting for this (which imo is overkill). It cn be set to disable the LCD together with the backlight, after an additional (selectable) delay, or never
20:23:24pixelmadoes it really have the setting?
20:24:00pixelmaI would have that those things get removed but you never know
20:24:19pixelmaadd a "thought" where fits
20:24:49amiconnYes it does
20:24:55IudeXCan I use windows for this?
20:24:59funmanamiconn: pixelma, is this comment explicit enough ?
20:25:10IudeXBecause i don't want to turn on my second computer :P
20:25:40IudeXCan anybody compile this? :/
20:29:40amiconnfunman: If you would put the clip's oled enable on the backlight api, it would have the advantage that all targets have (at least optional) backlight
20:29:53funmanamiconn: that's exactly what I'm doing
20:29:59 Quit GodEater_ (Remote closed the connection)
20:30:35pixelmafunman: could the comment somehow explain why it is needed code-wise? (Although I obviously can't do that)
20:31:03amiconnImo the enable hook should only exist for 16 bit targets, and the plugin api and mpegplayer ifdefed accordingly
20:31:33amiconnBut if for some reason you also want it on the clip, then the hook stuff would need to be implemented in the other lcd driver(s) as well
20:33:52*gevaerts has an idea on how to split his FS #9500 patch in obviously-harmless and probably-harmless parts
20:34:19IudeXok so I'll use cygwin to compile..
20:35:42funmanpixelma: sure, I think it's to keep binary compatibility with the plugins across Ondio with or without backlight - but amiconn might correct me
20:35:45*amiconn isn't 100% sure whether this special treatment of backlight is justifiable
20:36:40amiconnThere are other features which can be added via hardware mod, where we don't keep the strings and functions when the feature isn't there. (e.g. RTC mod on H1x0, alarm mod on recorder v1)
20:37:38amiconnIf someone uses such a mod with the (necessary) modified build, both the api and voices become incompatible (without the api check noticing) as well
20:38:54funmanamiconn: in fact if you don't see a problem I'll let you revert r18947 with a comment and I'll fix the Clip simulator after that
20:39:31amiconnThere are some differences between backlight and the other mentioned mods. (1) When treating backlight on Ondio like we do now, backlight is an all-target features (except the settings in the UI). None of the other mentioned mods is otherwise all-target
20:39:48amiconn(2) Backlight adds relatively few strings and api functions
20:40:40amiconnfunman: You might still want an extra feature for an OLED target, e.g. for selecting different string for the "backlight" settings in the UI in .lang files
20:42:03amiconnfunman: I could do that. Do you also want a comment mentioning the Clip?
20:43:27funmanyes : just tell that it simulates the backlight by switching the whole display ON/OFF (and has the same objective: reduce power consumption)
20:43:57funmanamiconn: I'll think about wording when I mess with the .lang files ;)
20:44:39funmanmaybe %s/HAVE_BACKLIGHT/HAVE_BACKLIGHT_SETTINGS/g is a proper fix if I understand correctly
20:45:48IudeXso i have to download all to cygdrive?
20:46:42amiconnActually not. It's just the api (and lang/voice strings) which are kept. The actual backlight functions become empty if it's not defined, and the backlight thread is also absent
20:46:47 Join Avalon_Scythe [0] (n=18630b99@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
20:47:28Avalon_ScytheI have a request to make
20:47:58bertrikplease state your request
20:47:58Avalon_Scythedoes anyone have a hidden patrition dump file for a sansa e250
20:49:27Avalon_Scythei need that so i can finish step 5 using the e200plus on my sansa e250
20:49:39*amiconn thinks that the peculiarities of all the various HAVE_* macros should probably be documented somewhere
20:49:43funmanIf the backlight/buttonlight functions are actually 1 or 2 lines, should I declare them as static inline in the header and not create a separate .c file ?
20:50:08bertrikI may have one, or I could make a fresh dump. I have an e260, not an e250 though
20:50:19Avalon_ScytheAW DAMN
20:50:23Avalon_Scythethats the problem
20:50:33Avalon_Scythethe person in the forum has an e260
20:50:45Avalon_Scytheand i need a e250 to finish the step 5
20:50:53Avalon_Scytheif i do this my sansa e200 will work
20:50:58IudeXWhat I have to do when I installed a CYGWIN??!! Please help me ! (of course, if you can)
20:51:33 Quit robin0800 (Remote closed the connection)
20:53:51IudeXnobody wants to help me :(
20:54:04 Quit Avalon_Scythe ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
20:54:40amiconnfunman: Btw, some remarks regarding r18947 unrelated to backlight: (1) If you change the plugin API, you need to change both plugin.h and plugin.c. (2) Whenever you cange the API, you need to bump the API version number(s). This is documented in plugin.h
20:54:48funmanIudeX: the clip simulator is not very interesting : better use another simulator
20:55:02funmanamiconn: thanks
20:55:04bertrikIudeX, what do you want to accomplish? there should be a couple of wiki articles to do rockbox development
20:55:13amiconnDue to not following (1) you caused a lot of yellow, as the build table tells you...
20:55:21funmanI noticed ^^
20:56:01 Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("Ka-chunka")
20:56:19IudeXnow nothing.
20:57:54 Quit IudeX ("CGI:IRC")
20:57:59 Join Avalon_Scythe [0] (n=18630b99@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
20:58:03Avalon_ScytheAh crap
20:58:06Avalon_ScytheI disconnected
20:58:24Avalon_ScytheSo does anyone have a hidden patrition dump file for a sansae250?
20:58:57gevaertsAvalon_Scythe: asking every five minutes won't make that dump magically appear
20:59:04funmanAvalon_Scythe: Maybe you should ask on the SanDisk forums, there is a e200 specific board : more change to meet e250 owners
20:59:08funmanmore chance*
20:59:38bertrikis there actually much difference between hidden partition contents of e250 and e260?
21:00:24Avalon_Scytheyou can't fit a hiiden patrtion into a e250 16-MB FORMAT because the e260 is 20MB while the e250 is 17MB
21:01:17gevaertshuh? What does the 16MB recovery partition have to do with this?
21:02:45gevaertsI'd like to change HAVE_ATA_SD to HAVE_STORAGE_SD, HAVE_MMC to HAVE_STORAGE_MMC and HAVE_ATA to HAVE_STORAGE_ATA. Any reason why I shouldn't?
21:04:55funmangevaerts: because you didn't browse the whole source for all the places where these are used?
21:05:08gevaertsfunman: I did :)
21:05:19 Quit Avalon_Scythe ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
21:05:21funmanthen I see no other reason :)
21:05:54 Join Strife89 [0] (n=michael@
21:07:05amiconngevaerts: You could make it a (bitwise) CONFIG_* multivalue, like the tuners
21:07:54gevaertshm, indeed.
21:07:55amiconnCONFIG_STORAGE, with STORAGE_ATA = 0x01, STORAGE_MMC = 0x02, STORAGE_SD = 0x04, STORAGE_UMSHOST = 0x08 etc
21:08:16funmanpersonally I find (1<<0) (1<<1) (1<<2) more readable
21:09:11amiconnWell, that's just a developer preference; shouldn't matter
21:09:31amiconnThen e.g. a Tatung elio would set CONFIG_STORAGE = STORAGE_ATA|STORAGE_SD
21:09:56amiconnThe H300 would (hopefully, one day) set CONFIG_STORAGE = STORAGE_ATA|STORAGE_UMSHOST etc
21:10:15gevaertsIt also gets the thing out of the HAVE_* feature space where it doesn't really belong
21:10:27*gevaerts will do this
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21:11:05amiconngevaerts: Did you already adjust the ata driver to get rid of the sector count limitation?
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21:21:39*bluebrother wonders if a customizable quickscreen isn't a step towards customizable buttons and menus (which we don't want)
21:22:08pixelmaI wondered the same
21:22:10*amiconn would rather want to get rid of the quickscreen, even though he is using it from time to time
21:22:59bluebrotherperhaps we should bring this somewhat more to the mailing lists ...
21:24:07pixelmabetter: definitely
21:24:29*bluebrother goes writing an email
21:25:05amiconnThere once was that idea of a user-configurable user menu instead of the quickscreen
21:25:21amiconnNot in the form of a quickscreen, butas a real menu
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21:28:10pixelmathere always was the argument that you can already have this in a way with cfg files
21:28:16bluebrotheramiconn, pixelma: please speak up on the ML ...
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21:31:29bluebrothertoo bad. Nobody answered to my proposal of inline settings menu like this 2 years old patch added. I can't believe there is no interest
21:32:50pixelmathe discussion went on for a bit after you left yesterday
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21:33:37bluebrotherah, should check the logs. I still think we should take such stuff more to the ML
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21:34:20pixelmawhat should we discuss here then? ;)
21:35:50bluebrotherthe same stuff that was discussed on irc? ;-)
21:36:00bluebrotherargh, got you wrong.
21:36:15bluebrotherhow to implement it maybe? ;-)
21:36:41*amiconn wouldn't like having to duplicate statements
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21:37:50amiconnSure we can discuss stuff on the ml, but this channel is logged as well
21:37:53bluebrotherme neither, but irc seems a bit of a problematic channel due to its synchronous nature for the more questionable issues
21:38:37bluebrotherwell, you can post your thoughts to a thread that was "active" a couple of hours ago. You can't easily join an irc discussion that happened like 4 hours ago
21:39:14bluebrotherplus, you need all people involved to be online the same time. Which has issues with timezones and RL occupation
21:39:48 Quit faemir (Remote closed the connection)
21:40:04amiconnYes, but stuff that was discussed here shouldn't need to be duplicated
21:40:48amiconnIt's certainly possible to write a mail referring to an irc discussion (even linking to the log viewer)
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21:41:02bluebrotherwell, then discussions need to get taken to the ML in the first place. Currently stuff is usually discussed here
21:41:12amiconnThe other way round is more problematic though - if a mail raises an irc discussion
21:41:20bluebrothertrue, but is it that likely to get responses to such a mail?
21:41:43*amiconn thinks that irc is much better for discussion than the ml
21:41:52amiconnIf you're around, that is.
21:42:19amiconnMail causes long, sometimes excessive, response times
21:42:46bluebrotherwell, if it was possible to have all interested people around all the time, including those people having time to actually put their attention to irc, it's better.
21:42:56bluebrotherbut this is usually not the case
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21:43:52bluebrotheris it that bad to have a longer discussion for the more questionable issues? That could help preventing shoots from the hip
21:43:57*amiconn already experienced the long ml delay several times
21:44:16amiconnIt happened that a mail was being discussed here that I didn't even receive yet
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21:44:50amiconn(and that mail was sent >1 hour ago)
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21:48:06funmanamiconn: If I draw something on the Clip's OLED screen while it's off, it will be present when I switch it on
21:48:26amiconnAh okay
21:49:01amiconnBtw, even then you could (and probably should) stop sending updates to the display controller while the display is off
21:49:29amiconnIt only burns cpu cycles for nothing. Just send a full update when reenabling the display
21:49:55amiconnThis is how the colour LCD drivers (which handle lcd disable/enable) do it
21:50:25amiconnThe enable hook is only necessary for (native) lcd blit functions, i.e. mpegplayer on 16 bit targets
21:50:45amiconnOn the clip, mpegplayer could use the greylib like on monochrome LCDs
21:50:58amiconn(which would be a "bluelib")
21:50:58funmanhm so I should use lcd_enable() and make lcd_update*() return immediately if the display is off ?
21:51:10funmanblue_and_yellowlib :)
21:51:19amiconnIt should probably be confined to the lower (blue) part of the display
21:51:37amiconnThe upper part could be used for the wvs
21:51:40funmanI'm not very excited at the idea of viewing 128x48 videos on a ~1" screen
21:52:10 Quit tchan (Remote closed the connection)
21:52:22amiconnWell, on the archos, video works quite well - and that's 112x64
21:52:39pixelmait's for showing off ;) maybe for completeness as well
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21:53:23amiconn(Archos cannot use mpegplayer due to lack of CPU power, but it has video.rock which feeds a precomputed stream of frames to the LCD, achieving the same effect as the greylib)
21:53:39funmanamiconn: I didn't understand exactly what the lcd_set_enable_hook was for
21:54:39amiconnfunman: The usual lcd functions draw into lcd_framebuffer. This means that the LCD contents can be refreshed even if something was drawn while the lcd was off
21:55:25amiconnHowever, mpegplayer uses lcd_blit_yuv(), which takes a yuv bitmap, converts it and directly sends it to the lcd without going through lcd_framebuffer (for speed reasons)
21:56:34funmanquestion is on what should that function be conditional
21:56:38amiconnSo YUV content cannot be updated automatically if it changed while the lcd was off, hence the responsible application (mpegplayer) needs to be notified that a redraw is needed
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21:57:00funmanyesterday it was on HAVE_LCD_ENABLE but the Clip target makes this wrong
21:57:10amiconnThe greylib doesn't have that problems sinec it continuously redraws anyway while it's running
21:57:22funmanif we make it conditional on HAVE_LCD_ENABLE and LCD_DEPTH == 16, it's just reporting the problem
21:58:08amiconnI would make it depend on HAVE_LCD_COLOR for now
21:58:17amiconn(and HAVE_LCD_ENABLE of course)
21:58:32 Quit reacocard (".")
21:58:58mc2739what is the process to get a disassembly of the e200v2 firmware?
21:59:26funmanmc2739: you must first extract the firmware block from the Original Firmware file
21:59:53funmanits size is specified in the 1024 bytes header, and the data begins right after these 1024 bytes
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22:01:38amiconnfunman: You could also undefine HAVE_LCD_ENABLE for the clip - not sure whether that's better
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22:02:12amiconnIt always causes problems when the meaning of a macro changes later, even if it changes only slightly
22:02:22mc2739funman: do the charts on the SansaV2Firmware wiki work for the e200 too?
22:02:28funmanamiconn: well if I want to 'disable' lcd_update() when the display is off I see no other solution than use HAVE_LCD_ENABLE and make the backlight_* functions call lcd_enable()
22:03:29funmanmc2739: yes, the only model for which it differs (a bit) is the mysterious Clipv2
22:04:05amiconnhmm, true
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22:04:40funmanwell or I could define a custom function in the lcd driver which would be used by the Clip's backlight code
22:04:44amiconnGuess defined(HAVE_LCD_ENABLE) && defined(HAVE_LCD_COLOR) is ok at least for now
22:05:13funmanthis last approach is less intrusive
22:05:41mc2739funman: what is next after extracting the firmware?
22:06:07amiconn(at least it's better than LCD_DEPTH == 16, because there could be a 24 or 32 bit target in the near future)
22:06:13funmanmc2739: open it with a disassembler of your choice
22:08:12***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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22:13:58funmanamiconn: if I modify the condition for lcd_enable_hook() should I bump the plugin version ? The intended behaviour is to have no effect at all until I add HAVE_LCD_ENABLE back for the Clip
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22:14:38amiconnWell, sine it only affects the Clip and there is no public Clip build yet, I don't think you need to bump the version
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22:18:26funmanI wonder if I should use defined(HAVE_LCD_COLOR) inside lcd-16bit.c since it's obviously defined
22:20:07funmanstill .. I wonder if it's a worth workaround
22:21:18amiconnWell, all displays need to be updated after being reenabled, if only for saving power by not updating it while being disabled
22:22:32amiconnChecking for HAVE_LCD_COLOR in lcd-16bit.c is unnecessary, because 16 bit implies colour.
22:25:10 Quit faemir (Remote closed the connection)
22:27:52funmanWhat about /* && defined(HAVE_LCD_COLOR) */ for the next person who will look for this setting across all the files ?
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23:09:18funmannow to learn SDL to make a realistic 2 colors simulator :)
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23:23:25mcuelenaereBagder: around?
23:23:40Bagdera little ;-)
23:23:56mcuelenaere:) have you set up the plugin API generator cron job?
23:24:48mcuelenaerecould you do this sometime?
23:25:06Bagderthat's my plan, yes
23:29:06 Quit Zarggg ()
23:31:45XavierGrwho is this rocker guy on the dev ml? The way he responds is pretty agitating.
23:32:15BagderI believe he's blind
23:32:57XavierGrwell he missed entirely the mailing list's point and attitude I think
23:33:02BagderI mean, being blind is a good excuse for producing funny-looking mails
23:33:39BagderI think he's pretty harmless even if his mails don't add a lot of value
23:35:11XavierGrof course he is harmless, it is just that his responces seem out of context
23:35:52bertrikpfff, some parts of the sd spec are confusing
23:35:59XavierGrthey are more IRC like
23:36:33funmanbertrik: are you trying to develop further the sansav2 driver?
23:36:49bertrikyes, looking into the sd card driver
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23:44:50rasherBagder: Most blind users manage to post readable mails
23:56:17rasherSeems fine now - last I saw, he wasn't quoting at all, just putting his reply in the middle of posts.

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