| 00:00:26 | gevaerts | Zagor: It's clean and unclean in different ways I think. I like this ability to look at SOURCES to see what gets built, and in that sense the new doom solition isn't very clean. It's all a set of tradeoffs of course |
| 00:01:21 | Zagor | good point |
| 00:03:20 | Unhelpful | Zagor: the pluginlib bmp loader needs to call the scaler, which doesn't even exist in core on mono. |
| 00:03:52 | Zagor | Unhelpful: yes but why doesn't it exist? isn't that by your choice? |
| 00:04:27 | Zagor | I mean why do we compile the same code in different ways on mono only? |
| 00:06:00 | Unhelpful | Zagor: the scaler is only used in core by albumart, which is essentially not worth doing on mono without greylib - i tried, dithering it to mono is just not nice at the resolutions our mono targets have. |
| 00:06:48 | amiconn | Also mono often means lowmem - and that's not only the archoses |
| 00:07:18 | Zagor | which plugins use it on mono? |
| 00:08:46 | Unhelpful | none at all, since it's not available at all on mono right now - which is why i'm trying to make it available in pluginlib |
| 00:09:49 | Unhelpful | i think that using the core object "directly" should be fine for resize.o, and having a pluginlib bmp.o that depends on the core bmp.o will work as long as their deps are the same |
| 00:10:50 | Zagor | don't add .o -> .o deps. if you make a #include "file.c" solution, add the container.c to OTHER_SRC so it gets its' own deps. |
| 00:11:41 | saratoga | it definately looks like at least some of the nk.bin file is still on the gigabeatS firmware partition after installing rockbox |
| 00:12:19 | saratoga | my partition dump has >100KB segments of the nk.bin still on the firmware partition |
| 00:13:14 | Unhelpful | and i suppose .c -> .o deps are bad, as well... i don't really like including a C file, though. :/ |
| 00:14:01 | Unhelpful | although, the wrapper file would also solve the issue of the pluginlib having another bmp.c already |
| 00:14:37 | saratoga | is there some good tool for comparing binary files? |
| 00:15:25 | Zagor | saratoga: does the partition use a file system or is it dd dump-and-run? |
| 00:15:37 | Unhelpful | it's TFAT |
| 00:16:03 | Unhelpful | Zagor: couldn't the #include solution just put the wrapper in SOURCES, and call it done? |
| 00:16:42 | Zagor | Unhelpful: yes it would. for your case, I'd say that is the best solution. everything else gets messy. |
| 00:17:19 | Unhelpful | i think i have it pretty much solved... resize.o and albumart.o will just be built directly from the core files, as you did with doom. bmp.c gets a wrapper. seems least messy overall. |
| 00:17:44 | Zagor | saratoga: in that case, isn't natural that pieces of old files remain on the partition? |
| 00:19:08 | saratoga | Zagor: I think most of the file is there |
| 00:19:11 | saratoga | in order |
| 00:19:28 | saratoga | at least the header is located in the dump file_length bytes away from the footer |
| 00:19:38 | saratoga | though i haven't yet figured out a good way to test if its all there |
| 00:20:10 | Zagor | that too doesn't feel strange to me. first write new file, then flag old as deleted. especially for a transaction-safe system, that ought to be the norm. |
| 00:20:31 | saratoga | yes this is exactly what I was hoping ! |
| 00:20:34 | n1s | Zagor: that's what we're hoping for |
| 00:20:46 | Zagor | aha, haha. I misunderstood. |
| 00:20:50 | | Join MethoS-- [0] (n=clemens@host-091-097-240-179.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 00:20:56 | saratoga | if so we can resolve the dual booting issue on the gigabeat |
| 00:21:12 | n1s | and the uninstallation |
| 00:21:39 | n1s | provided the user doesn't lose his backup :) |
| 00:21:40 | saratoga | is there an easier way to dump the middle of a very large binary file other then writing c code to do it? |
| 00:21:49 | n1s | dd |
| 00:22:10 | Bagder | or even hexdump |
| 00:23:22 | amiconn | n1s: That's something we need to document. If the user then doesn't keep it, it's his own fault. Same situation as with the original flash dump when flashing an archos |
| 00:23:35 | saratoga | is hexdump less confusing then DD? |
| 00:23:44 | Bagder | yes |
| 00:24:10 | Unhelpful | saratoga: man split |
| 00:24:11 | saratoga | less confusing enough to figure out how to get it in cygwin? |
| 00:24:36 | Bagder | I have no idea ;-) I figure it would be available there |
| 00:25:17 | Unhelpful | or split −−bytes=<blocksize> -d <input> |
| 00:26:39 | | Join Beta2K [0] (n=beta@d36-78-228.home1.cgocable.net) |
| 00:27:52 | | Quit agaffney (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 00:28:07 | | Join agaffney [0] (n=agaffney@gentoo/developer/agaffney) |
| 00:29:33 | | Join unstable [0] (i=unstable@tor/regular/sid) |
| 00:29:40 | | Quit {phoenix} (Remote closed the connection) |
| 00:29:53 | unstable | bleh, this RefreshDatabase delay on e280 v2 is terrible, I've been waiting 5 minutes so far. |
| 00:30:12 | unstable | Is there a long delay like this on the e280 v1, with or without rockbox? |
| 00:31:42 | ameyer | there is a longish delay. I'd say more like 30s with a filled 2gb card |
| 00:31:46 | | Quit t0mas ("bedtime!") |
| 00:32:01 | unstable | It's an 8gb card, with only 200 megs on there. |
| 00:33:31 | ameyer | also, I *think* the of refreshes the internal memory too, but the rockbox bootloader does something to stop that |
| 00:33:39 | ameyer | on the v1 I mean |
| 00:33:45 | unstable | right |
| 00:34:25 | ameyer | 5 minutes seems a bit long |
| 00:34:56 | unstable | I have nothing on the internal memory, i just have music on the external. This refreshdatabase sits there for several minutes, I haven't been patient enough to get past 6 minutes so far. heh |
| 00:35:32 | | Quit MethoS- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 00:37:09 | bertrik | unstable, reading the sd card on my nintendo ds got a lot faster after reformatting with a larger sectors/cluster amount, maybe this helps on the sansa OF too |
| 00:37:39 | unstable | bertrik: How big? you have a mkfs.vfat command you used? |
| 00:38:20 | bertrik | no, I formatted it on windows |
| 00:39:11 | | Join krazykit [0] (n=kkit@adsl-76-240-198-230.dsl.ipltin.sbcglobal.net) |
| 00:40:27 | unstable | This chipset on the e280 v2, is the same as the fuze? |
| 00:40:42 | Bagder | unstable: yes |
| 00:41:00 | unstable | So if rockbox dev team gets fuze to work with rockbox, this e280 v2 will work as well? |
| 00:41:10 | | Quit Beta2K_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 00:41:11 | Bagder | probably, yes |
| 00:41:17 | Bagder | they're not identical |
| 00:41:45 | | Join domonoky1 [0] (n=Domonoky@g230009202.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 00:42:13 | unstable | Is there a page somewhere saying what is done, and what needs to be done? Does rockbox run on it and do basics like play music? |
| 00:42:39 | Bagder | there's a wiki page and a forum thread for that |
| 00:42:54 | * | Bagder runs off to bed |
| 00:48:49 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 00:49:08 | saratoga | YES |
| 00:49:23 | saratoga | i just recovered an nk.bin from a gigabeatS without taking it apart |
| 00:49:46 | Zagor | yay |
| 00:50:02 | saratoga | ended up just using fopen to do it :) |
| 00:50:33 | Llorean | Excellent |
| 00:50:48 | saratoga | very nice of toshiba to defracgment their fat firmware image before flashing it |
| 00:51:44 | saratoga | it was as simple as searching for the start of the file, then copying file_length bytes to a new file |
| 00:51:57 | | Quit flydutch ("/* empty */") |
| 00:55:14 | Llorean | So we can probably have our own tool create a dual booting GigabeatS without needing a separate nk.bin file around? |
| 00:55:25 | saratoga | Llorean: correct |
| 00:55:51 | saratoga | sendfirm could probably just dump the nk.bin during the install easily enough |
| 00:56:44 | saratoga | silly question: can I just fopen the sdb1 directly without needing to dd it? |
| 00:58:57 | | Quit domonoky (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 01:00 |
| 01:00:13 | | Quit n1s () |
| 01:03:52 | Zagor | saratoga: at least open(), but fopen ought to work too. |
| 01:04:08 | Zagor | in linux, that is. cygwin might be different. |
| 01:04:46 | saratoga | i'm switching over to linux now |
| 01:06:54 | | Quit ender` (" The problem with political jokes is they get elected. -- Henry Cate, VII") |
| 01:13:58 | | Join Setox[tm] [0] (n=who@ool-4570cc2e.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 01:14:29 | Setox[tm] | hey anyone awake and know about the iriver h320? |
| 01:15:26 | Setox[tm] | i got a small issue maybe someone will know what to do or know i just trash it finally |
| 01:15:45 | Setox[tm] | ok so i wanted to put new mp3s in my iriver h320 when i decided to format it since i was going to load it with all new songs i formated it though the computer other than doing it though the iriver it self.. i come back and i see it is stuck at the main screen saying VER 1.29 K |
| 01:15:45 | Setox[tm] | LOADING... |
| 01:17:30 | gevaerts | Have you tried resetting it? |
| 01:18:26 | Setox[tm] | yeah and still same thing |
| 01:18:58 | Setox[tm] | when it first happened i said ok reset but its like it just wont boot over to the os at all |
| 01:19:13 | gevaerts | How did you format it? |
| 01:19:42 | Setox[tm] | i had it hooked up though windows and i went to the drive and told windows to format it |
| 01:20:15 | Setox[tm] | i been looking around that maybe there is something i can press while i turn it on to force into a mode or something |
| 01:20:20 | | Join Strife89 [0] (n=michael@204.116.245.152) |
| 01:20:22 | gevaerts | OK. My guess is that you formatted it as NTFS instead of FAT32. |
| 01:20:26 | Setox[tm] | but i have been unable to find anything |
| 01:21:03 | Setox[tm] | i might have u know i did not even pay much attention |
| 01:21:23 | Setox[tm] | that makes sense on why it is stuck at loading... |
| 01:22:17 | | Quit Zagor ("Leaving") |
| 01:22:22 | Setox[tm] | i guess my only options is get a external case to format it to fat32 or another hd |
| 01:22:36 | * | gevaerts doesn't know |
| 01:23:52 | gevaerts | Those options would certainly work, but maybe there is an easier way |
| 01:24:30 | Setox[tm] | yeah thats what i been trying to figure out |
| 01:24:47 | Setox[tm] | if they only built a usb safe mode or something into this |
| 01:24:55 | gevaerts | The rockbox bootloader has a USB mode... |
| 01:25:04 | saratoga | could someone suggest why this tiny bit of simple c code doesn't work for me: http://pastebin.com/m3f37840d |
| 01:25:14 | saratoga | it thinks every block is a match to the header |
| 01:25:23 | saratoga | maybe I'm just not doing memcmp right? |
| 01:25:23 | | Quit tessarakt (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 01:25:49 | Setox[tm] | u know i was thinking about that but it would need to connect to it though usb and cause of the way i formated it won't even show up as a drive |
| 01:27:04 | gevaerts | Why wouldn't it? |
| 01:27:29 | gevaerts | saratoga: memcmp returns 0 on match |
| 01:27:35 | saratoga | ugh |
| 01:27:59 | Setox[tm] | dunno when i put the usb in it just goes to the loading... and wont show up as an external hd |
| 01:28:27 | * | gevaerts decides to leave this to the h300 experts |
| 01:29:02 | Setox[tm] | haha like who? |
| 01:30:40 | Setox[tm] | so now all day i been looking for new mp3 player thats cheap and i found the V-Touch vl-875 but i can't find out whats the limit that i can put as for size of the expandable memory |
| 01:31:39 | Llorean | Setox[tm]: Things like that don't really belong here. This channel is for questions relating to Rockbox and using Rockbox. |
| 01:32:40 | Setox[tm] | yeah i know it does not and all the places that have things about the h320 are dead though the rockbox project is still alive and there is a rockbox for the 320 and maybe someone has come accross this |
| 01:32:44 | Setox[tm] | that is why i am here |
| 01:33:00 | Llorean | Setox[tm]: This isn't a place for "I didn't know where to ask" questions. |
| 01:33:38 | Setox[tm] | ok how about i had the rockbox in there |
| 01:33:41 | Llorean | If you're having problems with the original firmware installed, you should google for communities around that player, or contact the makers of the player. |
| 01:33:42 | Setox[tm] | does that help ya? |
| 01:34:01 | gevaerts | Setox[tm]: if you had rockbox installed, you wouldn't have this problem... |
| 01:34:09 | Setox[tm] | i did look around and did not find much help at all and this is a discontinued item |
| 01:34:43 | | Nick JdGordon|zzz is now known as JdGordon (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) |
| 01:34:56 | Llorean | Setox[tm]: Just because it's discontinued doesn't mean you should come here and ask about it. If you're going to bother someone who doesn't support it, at least bother iRiver because they actually *made* the software it's running and know how it works. |
| 01:35:43 | | Join ChadFM [0] (n=ChadFM@ip68-0-34-107.hr.hr.cox.net) |
| 01:35:58 | | Quit Llorean (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 01:36:20 | | Join Llorean [0] (n=DarkkOne@ppp-70-132-143-243.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net) |
| 01:39:50 | saratoga | this is driving me nuts |
| 01:40:08 | saratoga | I read a char * array from the disk |
| 01:40:28 | saratoga | how should I compare that to the hex string I've taken from the top of the nk.bin file? |
| 01:41:21 | | Join fenugrec [0] (n=ABC@modemcable247.111-201-24.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 01:42:29 | saratoga | maybe i'm thinking about this wrong |
| 01:43:01 | gevaerts | saratoga: why don't you initialise the header from hex values instead of as a string? |
| 01:44:28 | | Quit Setox[tm] () |
| 01:46:49 | gevaerts | saratoga: something like http://pastebin.com/m32da413d |
| 01:47:59 | | Quit MethoS-- (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 01:48:41 | | Join MethoS- [0] (n=clemens@host-091-097-240-179.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 01:49:02 | | Quit domonoky1 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 01:50:34 | | Quit Schmogel ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 01:52:15 | saratoga | gevaerts: that did it, thanks |
| 01:52:33 | saratoga | i was just too lazy to convert all those symbols |
| 01:52:55 | saratoga | though i guess it would have been a pretty simple regex |
| 01:53:10 | * | gevaerts pretends to have converted them by hand |
| 01:57:37 | | Quit tvelocity (Remote closed the connection) |
| 01:58:44 | * | Strife89 wonders how the v2 ports are coming. :) |
| 01:59:31 | _Auron_ | slowly but surely from what I can tell |
| 02:00 |
| 02:01:28 | | Quit tyfoo ("Carpe diem") |
| 02:01:52 | saratoga | anyone with a gigabeat S around? |
| 02:02:03 | Strife89 | _Auron_: Good to hear. :) |
| 02:04:35 | | Join Thundercloud [0] (n=thunderc@84-51-130-71.judith186.adsl.metronet.co.uk) |
| 02:05:39 | | Quit gregorovius () |
| 02:06:03 | | Join Blackfrosch [0] (n=Blackfro@p57A77DEB.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 02:07:53 | | Quit Blackfrosch ("Leaving.") |
| 02:10:19 | gevaerts | saratoga: I have one, but I'm going to sleep now. I can test things tomorrow though |
| 02:12:48 | | Quit Strife89 ("Shower time. :D") |
| 02:22:14 | | Quit bertrik ("Leaving") |
| 02:22:21 | saratoga | gevaerts: ok i'm going to commit what i have for the night |
| 02:22:38 | | Join lee321987 [0] (n=chatzill@node233.34.251.72.1dial.com) |
| 02:23:05 | lee321987 | Say I put a 1000 song playlist on my DAP in a format that RB decodes at 250% realtime. I fully charge my player, start the playlist, turn off all lights/displays, set the DAP down and let it play till it's drained. Then I do the same thing only with a codec that RB decodes at 500% realtime. How much difference might there be in play time? |
| 02:23:32 | JdGordon | none |
| 02:23:52 | JdGordon | if its that high neither should do any boosting |
| 02:24:18 | Llorean | JdGordon: Depends on the player. I'd imagine 250% realtime still means some boosting on coldfire. |
| 02:25:22 | JdGordon | ah yeah... |
| 02:26:06 | lee321987 | How much difference could a codec that needs boosting vs. one that doesn't make? |
| 02:26:32 | JdGordon | if its always boosting vs never.. then could be almost half the runtime... |
| 02:26:38 | Llorean | lee321987: In a practical sense it's impossible to predict, since % realtime doesn't map directly to % time spent boosted, and VBR can change this (since "never boosting" at a CBR doesn't mean a ABR of that rate means it'll never boost) and your WPS etc can also affect things. |
| 02:26:51 | | Join kiddecks [0] (n=k@adsl-065-015-197-221.sip.msy.bellsouth.net) |
| 02:28:15 | lee321987 | System > Debug > CPU Frequency −−- is where I find out if I'm boosting right? |
| 02:28:25 | | Join OverThere [0] (n=d0f80ecf@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-c4d55d9db1fe04f4) |
| 02:28:34 | | Join HellDragon [0] (n=jd@modemcable100.136-203-24.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 02:28:46 | JdGordon | yeah, but the info in the audio debug screen is more useful if you really care that much |
| 02:29:07 | JdGordon | in that screen it will esitmate how much your boosting while decoding |
| 02:29:31 | OverThere | The WPS for the dark geek nano theme won't load. Rockbox will, however, load any WPS besides that one. Does anyone know what the problem might be? |
| 02:29:42 | lee321987 | "View Buffering Thread" right? |
| 02:30:01 | JdGordon | OverThere: most likely its using old tags, so it needs to be updated |
| 02:30:03 | saratoga | why does SVN want to say a text file I created is executable |
| 02:30:04 | JdGordon | lee321987: yes |
| 02:30:07 | Llorean | OverThere: It's probably outdated and needs to have an old tag fixed. The CustomWPS wiki screen contains current syntax. |
| 02:30:08 | saratoga | and how do i reverse this |
| 02:31:16 | OverThere | JdGordon: okay, thanks |
| 02:34:39 | | Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) |
| 02:35:31 | | Join MysticKitsune1 [0] (n=Gareth@adsl-75-33-88-223.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:36:29 | lee321987 | my screen cuts off part of the "boost ratio" −− it reads: "0.0% (3" −− what might the rest of that line read? And if it stayed at 100% that would cut my run time in about half right? |
| 02:37:06 | saratoga | depends on the target |
| 02:37:24 | MysticKitsune1 | this is an intriguing bug: if your playing any file from the external card on an e250, then stop partway through, shut the dap off, then turn it on again and go to resume playback, or hit play, the file wont resume, but if its in internal memory, it plays |
| 02:37:36 | lee321987 | c200 |
| 02:37:48 | saratoga | you'll get about 65% of the runtime for mp3 in that case |
| 02:38:10 | JdGordon | MysticKitsune1: silly question... but is the card still in the dap? |
| 02:38:20 | MysticKitsune1 | .... |
| 02:38:31 | MysticKitsune1 | yes |
| 02:38:52 | MysticKitsune1 | BTW its Gartral, just on an Alt |
| 02:38:54 | kadoban | saratoga: svn propdel svn:executable <filename> should turn off executable i think |
| 02:39:42 | JdGordon | works fine here... |
| 02:40:16 | lee321987 | thanks for info guys. I wish you all a good year. |
| 02:40:16 | saratoga | alright thanks |
| 02:40:22 | | Quit lee321987 ("ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.4/2008102920]") |
| 02:40:23 | | Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 02:41:12 | MysticKitsune1 | hmm, ohh, let me update, cause it doesnt work as of 19663 |
| 02:41:27 | MysticKitsune1 | yepp, works great now |
| 02:41:50 | | Quit moos ("Rockbox rules the DAP world") |
| 02:43:36 | MysticKitsune1 | i wonder what caused it in the first place, cause it dosnt look like you changed any playback or resume functionallity |
| 02:44:51 | JdGordon | glitch in the matrix or planets out of alignement :p |
| 02:45:30 | MysticKitsune1 | JdGordon: your always complaining about ME being OT, now its my turn! |
| 02:45:56 | Llorean | He was answering your question. Basically, what caused it was likely some random fluke problem. |
| 02:46:43 | MysticKitsune1 | not likly, cause i managed to reproduce it 4 times before i updated |
| 02:47:15 | Llorean | You reproduced it 4 times on the same flaky build, though. |
| 02:47:54 | MysticKitsune1 | nope, accross 19661-19663 |
| 02:48:14 | MysticKitsune1 | but 19664 works, so the points moot now |
| 02:48:27 | Llorean | Well, if you think it wasn't random flakyness you should track down when it started. |
| 02:48:46 | Llorean | If it's a real bug that's just covered up at the moment, it should be documented by someone who can reproduce it. |
| 02:48:50 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 02:49:14 | MysticKitsune1 | too do that ill need to dig through the archives |
| 02:49:26 | Llorean | And? |
| 02:49:29 | MysticKitsune1 | if you even maintain a complete archive |
| 02:49:42 | Llorean | SVN is a complete archive. |
| 02:50:18 | MysticKitsune1 | cant compile |
| 02:51:03 | Llorean | If you can install software on the computer you're using, you can. |
| 02:51:32 | MysticKitsune1 | if you would be so kind as to compile... say the last 10 builds, ill try it, or if you can provide me a compiling enviroment that works on a PSP... |
| 02:51:58 | MysticKitsune1 | or morespecifically, the PSPs hardware |
| 02:54:35 | MysticKitsune1 | and my main system isnt thermally stable enough to mingwm with gcc, i tryed, and i cant compile a third of anything without it shutting down from overheating, or freezing up due too the same reason |
| 02:55:46 | * | scorche|sh hands MysticKitsune1 a fan |
| 02:56:21 | MysticKitsune1 | i have an internal firon coolant pump and bridges, 2 system fans, and a cooling plate, and it STILL overheats |
| 02:56:29 | Llorean | MysticKitsune1: Might I recommend you actually clock it as a stable rate then? |
| 02:56:43 | MysticKitsune1 | its not the proc, its the MOBO |
| 02:57:00 | | Join Willwolfe [0] (n=chatzill@net35-14.netkaster.ca) |
| 02:57:04 | kadoban | MysticKitsune1: sounds like either your heat sink isn't seated corrected/wrong amount of thermal paste/or you're overclocking too hard |
| 02:57:24 | MysticKitsune1 | no overclocking, in fact, i had too underclock it |
| 02:59:12 | Llorean | Still, why'd you try mingw anyway? That's not one of the recommended methods in the first place. |
| 02:59:27 | MysticKitsune1 | and i know what the problem is, its too many high powered componts crammed too close together, i was worried when i built it, and it has serious stability issues at "native" clocks, and the proc has a fan sink, with nearly a whole tube of thermal paste, way more than it needed for the size |
| 03:00 |
| 03:00:01 | MysticKitsune1 | cause cigwin bluescreens it |
| 03:00:11 | | Join itcheg [0] (i=62db4767@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-ee171b1ae61ac7c1) |
| 03:00:21 | MysticKitsune1 | and VMware runs ungodly slow |
| 03:00:47 | MysticKitsune1 | it took me 4 days to compile about 12% under vmware |
| 03:01:23 | Unhelpful | sounds like you made some bad choices... and vmware shouldn't be that slow even before x86 supported VM properly... but maybe you should try colinux? |
| 03:01:30 | scorche|sh | ...something isnt right there...cygwin should be loads slower than vmware |
| 03:01:51 | scorche|sh | assuming you have any modern sense hardware |
| 03:02:43 | | Quit OverThere ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 03:02:44 | MysticKitsune1 | it was built to game on, and it works, mostly, for that, i have no idea why its so slow with any hybrid systems, but all i know is, it wont compile anything |
| 03:02:48 | kadoban | MysticKitsune1: "way more thermal paste than is needed" is NOT a good thing |
| 03:02:55 | MysticKitsune1 | may i post the specs? |
| 03:03:00 | kadoban | below or above the recommended amount is bad |
| 03:03:17 | scorche|sh | we should probably move this to #rockbox-community at this point.. |
| 03:03:24 | Llorean | This is wandering far from topic, since these are really problems above and beyond the usual compiling issues |
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| 03:09:33 | OverThere | Hi again. Can the %bc tag for WPS screens be used as a conditional like %?bc<true|false> |
| 03:20:04 | Unhelpful | it looks more and more like the wrapper C files are the only solution that allows conditional compilation and preserves the dependency chain |
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| 03:31:36 | OverThere | the %bt tag is showing 0h0min on a full charge. i'm using a nano. pleas help? |
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| 05:20:21 | nevr | What is the first partition for on a 1st gen iPod nano? |
| 05:28:38 | Llorean | The firmware, if it's windows formatted. |
| 05:31:38 | nevr | If that was trashed, would the device be recoverable? |
| 05:31:54 | | Quit Nimdae (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 05:34:08 | Llorean | Yes |
| 05:34:51 | nevr | Excellent, thanks for the info |
| 05:34:54 | Llorean | Disk Mode is stored in a ROM so you still have access through that. |
| 05:38:07 | nevr | Could that be done away with, made in to one partition, and have rockbox installed in that? (I'm just trying to get a feel of how the iPod hardware is set up) |
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| 05:51:15 | nevr | I guess I could try it...nevermind the question... |
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| 06:01:43 | JdGordon | anyone want to talk about possible theming options? |
| 06:02:22 | JdGordon | How does a WPS tag to say "put the menu in this viewport" and the rest of the screen will keep getting updated as the WPS regardless of which screen you are on? |
| 06:02:58 | JdGordon | the other option is "this vieport is the statusbar" tag and that is the only viewport updated automatically |
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| 06:20:07 | Llorean | JdGordon: I like a "draw the menu in this viewport" tag. |
| 06:20:14 | Llorean | i've been in favor of it since viewports were first discussed. |
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| 06:25:08 | Unhelpful | giving up on this for now... scaling for mono targets is working in sim, but fails to build for target because somehow my objects have refs to memset and memcpy... i don't even use the latter, and checking the preprocessed source shows that i'm only accessing the former through the plugin API |
| 06:25:20 | Unhelpful | any ideas? maybe gcc is doing something clever? |
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| 06:32:26 | * | JdGordon has no idea how to do this :p |
| 06:32:32 | JdGordon | especially with remote lcds... |
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| 06:38:24 | saratoga | Unhelpful: doesn't gcc need memcpy for all files? |
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| 07:41:35 | JdGordon | hmm... now I just need someone who can be bthered fiddling with the .wps :p |
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| 08:04:32 | JWest | Hello All.. |
| 08:04:40 | lucent | how'dy |
| 08:04:46 | JWest | Newbie for Rockbox! |
| 08:04:56 | lucent | what do you want |
| 08:05:07 | JWest | Just D/L and installed latest/stable on my Cowon iAudio 5XL. |
| 08:05:27 | lucent | hm, I'm not familiar with that target. is it working? |
| 08:05:29 | JWest | I have done the download, but dont have the charger... so I can't complete the last step. |
| 08:05:50 | JWest | Install went fine. Did all the parts... the bootloader, fonts, etc... |
| 08:06:08 | JWest | but the last step is to restart on the charger.. which I dont have with me. |
| 08:06:23 | JWest | So.. it boots up under the Cowon sourced firmware instead. |
| 08:06:48 | JWest | The last step is to shutdown, and restart on the charger... i guess thats a trigger somehow? |
| 08:07:12 | lucent | you could try rebooting while it's plugged into a computer that is loaded only in the BIOS setup screen? maybe that acts like a charger |
| 08:07:14 | JWest | Anyhoo.. how can I restart w/o a charger? It seems happy to charge off USB... FWIW... |
| 08:08:45 | ameyer | some computers provide USB power while turned off. |
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| 08:13:52 | JWest | Sorry there.. my web client locked up.. |
| 08:15:52 | JWest | If I Shutdown...any restart will take it into Cowon FW. |
| 08:17:41 | JWest | Any hoo... Has anyone a clue how to invoke the Boot loader when the 5XL is seen under /media/IAUDIO? |
| 08:17:57 | JWest | Fedora 10, Kernel 2.6.27.something. |
| 08:18:51 | JWest | Anyone on line tonight? |
| 08:21:14 | kadoban | what do you mean by "invoke the bootloader" exactly? |
| 08:22:12 | JWest | Well... I have loaded the software on the device, I see the .firmware in /media/IAUDIO... and hte other installables went fine (as far as I know!). |
| 08:22:41 | JWest | Just now sure how to invoke the Rockbox bootloader ... |
| 08:23:22 | JWest | When its connected to USB.. it (Cowon FW) says (Connected)... and it I turn it off, it says (CHarging). |
| 08:23:59 | JWest | The instructions say to use the Power Supply and restart, but I don't have that with me now. |
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| 08:24:36 | lucent | JWest: when you get the power supply, could you please test and then let us know if there is a need to use the power supply? |
| 08:24:44 | JWest | So when I turn it on and off, it doesn't boot from Rockbox, it boots from Cowon. |
| 08:25:17 | JWest | OK.. was hoping to find a way to boot to Rockbox :^) |
| 08:25:33 | JWest | I guess Power Supply is the trick here? |
| 08:26:12 | lucent | I own a Sansa Fuze, I don't know about your target |
| 08:26:36 | JWest | Ahh... hoping to get on Rockbox. Looks neat. |
| 08:26:49 | JWest | Consensus is to follow directions... (DUH :^) |
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| 08:29:08 | JWest | Thanks. Good night. |
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| 08:30:25 | bluefoxx | is there a tool out there for converting a wps file to the new standard? |
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| 08:47:36 | trippedoutspider | hi all |
| 08:48:34 | lucent | hi |
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| 08:50:31 | trippedoutspider | any1 here able to help me install rockbox on a sansa c250? |
| 08:53:30 | kadoban | the installation instructions are on the website. you can always ask questions if you don't understand something or run into trouble |
| 08:53:41 | trippedoutspider | ok well i ran into trouble lol |
| 08:54:03 | kadoban | hehe, what happened? i don't have that player, but i'm sure someone will be able to help |
| 08:54:35 | trippedoutspider | i had to switch from auto detect to msc so it would give me a letter drive to enter into the utility |
| 08:54:58 | trippedoutspider | but when i go to install i says disc access denied |
| 08:55:24 | trippedoutspider | however there is no security tab under properties for (L:) |
| 08:57:35 | ameyer | I think you may need admin/root/(the equivalent for your OS of choice) rights, depending on your setup. |
| 08:57:37 | trippedoutspider | so i tried the manual install, it only had one directory on it "tmp" should i extract into the directory? |
| 08:58:16 | kadoban | trippedoutspider: you generally extract into the root of the drive (so into L:\ in your case) |
| 08:58:48 | kadoban | so not in tmp, but you extract to the directory above that |
| 08:59:05 | ameyer | hrm, any chance your c250 is a v2? |
| 08:59:27 | trippedoutspider | no it 100004a or |
| 09:00 |
| 09:00:21 | * | ameyer wonders what sort of error message you'd get if you tried to use rbutil to install on a v2 sansa |
| 09:00:49 | * | JdGordon thinks the wps is going to need some work to get wps-"statusbar" working nicely |
| 09:00:51 | trippedoutspider | 01.00.04A |
| 09:01:24 | kadoban | trippedoutspider: good sign |
| 09:01:29 | trippedoutspider | lol |
| 09:02:22 | trippedoutspider | my user acount is admin, only account on pc, but im running vista |
| 09:02:54 | Llorean | ameyer: I think we detect v2 Sansas and report to the user that they're not compatible. |
| 09:03:26 | kadoban | trippedoutspider: does it work when you do the manual install? (in other words, does it allow you to copy over the files?) |
| 09:03:44 | Llorean | kadoban: A manual install isn't simply copying over files. |
| 09:04:05 | kadoban | Llorean: i know, i meant the first step that he was trying |
| 09:04:16 | Llorean | trippedoutspider: When you run RBUtil does it pop up the little UAC request for admin rights (or have you run it by right clicking and choosing to run as administrator)? |
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| 09:05:23 | trippedoutspider | yes it lets me extract to drive L; |
| 09:06:20 | trippedoutspider | at this point my sansa "drive L:" has two folders .rockbox and tmp |
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| 09:11:01 | trippedoutspider | i think i got it workin now |
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| 12:29:00 | gartral | im not sure if this is known, but the e200's rtc is updated by the OFW when its connected via MSC |
| 12:29:56 | bertrik | I'll try it out, but I don't know of any mechanism that could be responsible for synchronising the RTC |
| 12:30:21 | bertrik | I can imagine that MTP offers some kind of mechanism for that, but not MSC |
| 12:30:26 | Llorean | bertrik: iPods are updated from iTunes through a custom SCSI inquire, if I recall. Maybe if the sandisk software is running? |
| 12:31:03 | gartral | right, thats what i mean |
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| 12:32:08 | Llorean | gartral: You mean MTP, or you mean "when the sandisk software is running"? |
| 12:32:37 | gartral | well, its done it in MSC so far, havent tryed MTP yet |
| 12:32:38 | bertrik | hmm interesting, but I won't believe it until I see it :) |
| 12:36:29 | gartral | ok, does NOT do this in MTP mode |
| 12:37:00 | gartral | at least, mine does |
| 12:38:56 | bertrik | gartral, MSC didn't update my RTC, but I don't have any sandisk software installed. What sandisk software do you have installed? |
| 12:45:21 | gartral | none, just connect via USB >.> |
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| 12:45:59 | kadoban | wait...how would that work? it must have been a coincidence |
| 12:46:27 | gartral | OFW is 01,02.18A |
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| 12:46:57 | gartral | ,/. |
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| 12:49:54 | JdGordon | Zagor: if you come online tonight... is it still broken? can you give me more info? which wps your using etc... |
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| 12:54:01 | bertrik | gartral, if it's being done with a SCSI command, it should be easy to capture it with a USB sniffer |
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| 13:04:10 | obo | rasher: do you have an example track that triggers FS #9747? |
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| 13:15:27 | pixelma | obo: does the scrobbler log get its data from the database? Because I think that the database has some weird tag guessing... |
| 13:17:00 | obo | pixelma: it gets it directly from the ID3 struct... which I'd guess is where the database also gets its info from |
| 13:23:26 | gartral | would it be at all possible to kill the scroll wheels backlight on the e200s at rolo? |
| 13:23:49 | _Auron_ | heh |
| 13:24:33 | gartral | its just... uncomfortably bright for me |
| 13:24:51 | _Auron_ | very blue |
| 13:25:16 | gartral | very very bright, iv compared it too my moms, mines alot brighter |
| 13:26:29 | Llorean | gartral: What do you mean by "at rolo"? |
| 13:26:38 | gartral | but hers has "plasticy" scroll wheel, mines slightly newer, and has the smooth spinning wheel |
| 13:26:44 | gartral | at bootloader |
| 13:26:45 | Llorean | RoLo is the part of Rockbox that executes firmware images from within Rockbox. |
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| 13:26:51 | Llorean | The bootloader is _not_ RoLo |
| 13:27:04 | gartral | oh, i was undr the impression it was bootloader |
| 13:27:11 | gartral | sorry |
| 13:28:00 | Llorean | People often get this impression. Did it come from some specific document? |
| 13:28:46 | gartral | nah, me masr the connection between LiLo=LInuxLoader RoLo=ROckLoader |
| 13:28:57 | gartral | made* |
| 13:30:05 | Llorean | Try to stick to the terms we use in the manual for things, it'll make you much easier to understand. |
| 13:30:14 | gartral | but anyway, is there a way to accomplish the effect im looking for, should i make a formal feature request? |
| 13:30:31 | Llorean | There are no longer "feature requests" anyway. |
| 13:30:48 | gartral | the option still exists in FS |
| 13:31:34 | Llorean | You sure you can actually create one? |
| 13:32:00 | gartral | ohh, nvm, wow, shows how much attention i pay when i made bug requests, lol |
| 13:32:20 | * | gartral thwacks himself with his DAP |
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| 13:35:32 | gartral | anyway, is it possible to disable scroll wheel backlight in the bootloader? |
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| 13:39:58 | Unhelpful | saratoga: "need" in what way? i wasn't getting unresolved symbols at link time for memcpy and memset before moving these files into pluginlib... i still can't figure out why the objects expect to find either :/ |
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| 13:48:53 | kadoban | Unhelpful: i'm not sure i understand your problem (and probably wouldn't even if you explained it), but it couldn't be fixed by the weird MEM_FUNCTION_WRAPPERS in apps/plugin.h, right? |
| 13:50:08 | Unhelpful | that it might... hrm. |
| 13:51:32 | gartral | does anyone know if the bootloader can even interact with the scrollwheels backlight? |
| 13:51:52 | Unhelpful | the comment seems to suggest that i have the problem those are trying to solve |
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| 13:53:27 | Llorean | gartral: The bootloader is just a stripped down version of Rockbox, in a way. It can be made to do anything we know how to make Rockbox do, if it becomes necessary to do so. We usually try to have it do a minimal amount |
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| 13:57:19 | gartral | i know, but wouldnt it be fairly simple to make it not power the scroll-wheel backlight? |
| 13:57:43 | Llorean | If you knew all that, why'd you ask if it was even possible? |
| 13:57:51 | gartral | im willing to do it, if i could ask somone to build it |
| 13:57:53 | Llorean | Please, ask the question you mean to ask. I can't guess what you're really asking. |
| 13:58:28 | gartral | ok, point, how would i do that? |
| 13:59:48 | Llorean | Find the code that does what you want and figure out where you want to put it? I'm not sure what you're asking. |
| 14:00 |
| 14:00:15 | gartral | i would assume the code is in button-e200.c, assume me a coding noob... |
| 14:00:30 | gartral | this is my first procect in real C |
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| 14:03:03 | Llorean | I'm not really gonna walk you through this. Investigate and spend some time reading through the code and such. |
| 14:03:54 | gartral | well i am, and it didnt expect you to walk me through, just point me in the direction |
| 14:05:32 | gartral | and thank you for being so patient with me, i relise im tough too deal with... |
| 14:06:50 | kadoban | grep -R BUTTON | grep LIGHT comes up with some interesting things. i'd start there if you don't know what to do |
| 14:07:00 | kadoban | grep -r sorry |
| 14:07:10 | gartral | no grep, winblows |
| 14:07:23 | gartral | manual looking >.> |
| 14:07:47 | pixelma | baregrep... |
| 14:09:23 | t0mas | who's in charge of the default settings at the moment btw? :-) |
| 14:09:28 | | Nick JdGordon|zzz is now known as JdGordon (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) |
| 14:10:00 | t0mas | I found one that imho needs changing.. |
| 14:10:01 | Llorean | t0mas: Nobody specific. We just discuss them (best on the list where it can be discussed non-realtime) |
| 14:10:27 | * | t0mas unsubscribed from the list a year ago.. so I'll hop on again |
| 14:10:43 | Llorean | Which setting? |
| 14:10:59 | t0mas | on ipods the "load database in memory" setting should be on by default |
| 14:11:23 | Llorean | This can use a considerable amount of RAM |
| 14:11:39 | t0mas | true, but that is something an experienced user can decide for themselves.. |
| 14:11:45 | t0mas | normal users are probably not going to change it (it sounds intimidating) |
| 14:12:11 | kadoban | gartral: windows should be able to search in files, at least it could in XP last time i used it. but at the risk of hand holding a bit too much, i'd look in export/config-e200.h and see if it's as easy as not defining something (no idea if it'll work, haven't tried) |
| 14:12:14 | Llorean | t0mas: Maybe the description in the manual should be improved then? |
| 14:12:18 | t0mas | and when you're playing a song, press select to go to the database.. and press back to get to another folder (common use path? selecting a new song?) you have to wait quite long when it is disabled |
| 14:12:29 | gartral | it also dosent work too well on the e200s, all i found it did was slowed things down |
| 14:12:35 | t0mas | or... change the default to on on small players like the ipod nano? |
| 14:13:15 | t0mas | because waiting so long for the next screen to appear makes normal users press the button twice.. which skips back to far after an even longer delay? |
| 14:13:30 | t0mas | (at least that's what my girlfriend did) |
| 14:13:52 | Llorean | Maybe there should be a splash to let them know it's doing something, then. |
| 14:14:05 | t0mas | that would be oke too |
| 14:14:24 | t0mas | like.. the splash it shows when you select a song.. |
| 14:14:31 | t0mas | "searching..." or something like it? |
| 14:14:32 | gartral | kadoban: if i make the appropriate changes, would you be so kind as to build it? |
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| 14:15:35 | gartral | BGrep said that file doesnt exist |
| 14:15:36 | kadoban | gartral: sorry, i can't really. i don't have a clean copy of the svn at all, and i have few ways to share the results, and i don't have my e200 with me |
| 14:16:08 | gartral | kadoban: email? lol |
| 14:17:38 | kadoban | meh. you really just need to find a way to build :) you end up doing it a million times to figure out anything non-trivial |
| 14:18:54 | Unhelpful | seriously, it's already very easy to spend more time building that coding *without* having to send it off to somebody else to do |
| 14:18:59 | gartral | well, vmware worked... paaaaiiiinfully slowly, it wouldve taked 8 days to compile the whole rockbox firmware for JUST the e200s |
| 14:20:14 | kadoban | i have no idea how it can even possibly take that long. i have an old 200 mhz pentium 2 or something laptop that can do builds, and it doesn't take anywhere near that... |
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| 14:20:44 | gartral | kadoban: could it be qemu? |
| 14:21:12 | Llorean | gartral: If you're using qemu, you're not using vmware... |
| 14:21:22 | gartral | vmware image... |
| 14:21:55 | Llorean | Yes, but it's emulated differently. It's a different situation. |
| 14:22:05 | Llorean | Telling us "vmware is slow" when you're not even actually running the application is misleading. |
| 14:22:22 | gartral | sorry... |
| 14:22:31 | Llorean | Have you even actually tried vmware? |
| 14:22:54 | t0mas | gartral: what kind of setup of qemu do you have? |
| 14:23:11 | t0mas | it can run in actual x86 emulation mode (indeed painfully slow.. and not intended for what you are trying to do) |
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| 14:23:32 | t0mas | or in some accelerated mode iirc.. which is intended for just running another OS |
| 14:23:43 | gartral | yes, vmware itself ran into the thremal stability problem i was talking about last night, causing my system too overheat |
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| 14:24:18 | gartral | accelerated mode, but it was still SLOW |
| 14:24:22 | kadoban | i imagine that anything that actually runs well enough to task the processor is going to run into that...i guess you need to fix that first |
| 14:24:51 | Llorean | gartral: Well, I'd recommend not getting into trying to code anything until after you've got compiling working locally |
| 14:25:10 | gartral | only real fix is a new proc, and i have 0 money this monthtoo spare, for anything |
| 14:25:14 | Llorean | You're probably going to need a lot of compile/test/improve cycles. |
| 14:25:58 | t0mas | gartral: but you are running Windows right? |
| 14:26:08 | gartral | yes, at core |
| 14:26:10 | n1s | gartral: sounds more like you need to fix the cooling but this is off topic here |
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| 14:26:16 | t0mas | isn't the cigwin toolset still availible? |
| 14:26:25 | t0mas | *available |
| 14:26:36 | n1s | yes it is |
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| 14:26:52 | gartral | cigwwin seems too have too little ram with just one gig, and adding more ram would only further heat troble |
| 14:27:04 | gartral | trouble |
| 14:27:13 | t0mas | what? 1gb not enough? |
| 14:27:19 | t0mas | have you disabled the windows swap file? |
| 14:27:40 | t0mas | (disclaimer: I'm not a windows user.. last time I booted windows was months ago..) |
| 14:28:06 | t0mas | but it has some option to enable the "pagefile" as it's called in windows.. set it to automatic? |
| 14:28:22 | t0mas | and make sure you have some diskspace left.. then it should run.. |
| 14:28:24 | Llorean | I've successfully used cygwin with 1gb of RAM plenty of times. |
| 14:29:03 | gartral | 300 gigs externally, 60 internally, 2 for page file on each |
| 14:29:23 | t0mas | no way you can't run cygwin then.. |
| 14:30:08 | Llorean | t0mas: His system is massively unstable and he's apparently got a nonstandard Windows install. Basically, it's best just to leave it at "he can't compile and can't fix it." |
| 14:31:15 | gartral | yea, thats good |
| 14:31:24 | t0mas | gartral: http://www.ubuntu.com or http://www.opensuse.org/ ? |
| 14:31:34 | gartral | as i said last nigh, "it works for what it was built for" |
| 14:32:00 | t0mas | take a week to learn to use it.. hang around in their respective IRC channels.. and you'll have a stable and working system :-) |
| 14:32:37 | t0mas | but indeed don't try to do any development while unable to actually build.. nobody is a good enough programmer to write code without testing |
| 14:33:38 | gartral | right, but im shur the issue is its an OLD "newark" 64 bit proc |
| 14:33:57 | t0mas | maybe Linux can handle that better? :-) |
| 14:34:50 | gartral | it wont get past lilo, or grub... |
| 14:35:19 | t0mas | you did install for the right architecture? |
| 14:35:23 | gartral | and noone i talked too said they could do anything |
| 14:35:35 | gartral | yes, 64 bit win |
| 14:35:56 | t0mas | ok.. over to #rockbox-community? |
| 14:36:13 | gartral | 64 bit ubuntu, slack, debian, solaris, and zenwalk is ambigus |
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| 14:45:29 | Unhelpful | how much memory does our vmware image expect? |
| 14:47:02 | gartral | 512 |
| 14:47:07 | gartral | megs |
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| 14:57:15 | * | Unhelpful is not really liking this MEM_FUNCTION_WRAPPERS business... |
| 14:57:29 | Unhelpful | i just don't see how any plugin can know whether or not it will need them. :/ |
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| 15:06:00 | * | Unhelpful notices that, at least in sim, calling rb->button_get(true) no longer seems to work... |
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| 15:24:44 | | Part gartral |
| 15:35:19 | ajb` | Who looks at build fixes? I've just uploaded FS #9758 to fix a problem with non git-svn repos. |
| 15:35:59 | * | Unhelpful is sure he already has a patche for that |
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| 15:44:49 | Unhelpful | ooh, but this is nicer/more complete |
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| 15:58:16 | Unhelpful | ajb: it looks good, but i don't have time to do a proper read now |
| 16:00 |
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| 16:06:43 | ajb` | Unhelpful: no rush - at least my build works now |
| 16:07:10 | | Nick esthar is now known as lymeca (n=esthar@student165-92.hampshire.edu) |
| 16:07:13 | ajb` | Are many core devs using git now? |
| 16:09:10 | Unhelpful | i use git via git-svn, i know that at least GodEater uses "pure" git, and i've seen more than a few patches that clearly came from git |
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| 16:11:52 | ajb` | Any more comments on FS #9677 (Change erase dynamic playlist warning)? |
| 16:12:30 | Unhelpful | i haven't seen it. i'll have to look later. |
| 16:13:30 | Unhelpful | if anybody would care to comment on FS #9759... there are parts that are ugly hacks a bit, but the other equivalent hacks were uglier. |
| 16:18:04 | ajb` | The conditional stuff seems to grow doesn't it |
| 16:18:43 | ajb` | I guess a lot of this is boilerplat for becomming a Plugin? |
| 16:19:48 | Unhelpful | in many ways. plugins don't have direct access to core functions |
| 16:20:52 | Unhelpful | so a source file that depends on any functions at all from core is pretty much going to need a solution like that API macro to build in plugins or core |
| 16:21:25 | | Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection) |
| 16:23:27 | Unhelpful | gevaerts: maybe this belongs here, and not the other channel. could the rule used for pluginlib sources be rewritten so as to apply to any .o in plugins/lib that builds from any .c file? and would that build command then apply if a rule just added a dep for a new .o file on a .c file somewhere? |
| 16:23:37 | ajb` | I would posit the BMP_LOAD macro is extraneous |
| 16:24:16 | Unhelpful | it isn't. the core bmp loader is different from the pluginlib one. |
| 16:24:38 | Unhelpful | would an ifdef around the actual call be better? |
| 16:25:32 | Unhelpful | i'll have to check back later, but i'll scroll back for suggestions |
| 16:25:42 | ajb` | Unhelpful: possibly, as you already have an #if LCD_DEPTH == 1 there |
| 16:26:25 | ajb` | it's a styalistic thing at most. Which is about all I can comment on at the moment. Otherwise the changes look OK to my unexperienced eye |
| 16:27:07 | gevaerts | Unhelpful: I don't know. I'd have to study the rule in detail, but I'm not really makefile guru |
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| 16:55:15 | toffe82 | anybody with a gigabeat S ? I would like to know what version of libmtp is working fine. |
| 16:55:32 | Unhelpful | gevaerts: apologies, i thought you were one of the people who "got" make... i often don't. |
| 16:55:46 | toffe82 | I have it working with the last version 0.3.0 but it give some error message |
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| 16:58:47 | LqR | I'm researching possible new DAPs (or preferrably old, used devices), which ones work best with rockbox these days? |
| 17:00 |
| 17:00:34 | LqR | I've heard the iPod video port would be working nicely, but since my catastrophic experiences with iPod Photo a couple of years ago I've developed a bit of an iPod phobia. |
| 17:00:39 | toffe82 | LqR: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/BuyersGuide |
| 17:00:59 | LqR | Ah, I knew there was a guide somewhere. Thanks! :) |
| 17:01:52 | toffe82 | LqR: you can have a look there also : http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/TargetStatus |
| 17:02:25 | toffe82 | there are more player but not supported for the moment , like the gigabeat S |
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| 17:20:52 | t0mas | help! ;-) |
| 17:21:18 | t0mas | I am trying to get the ipod to work on an alarm-clock (made for ipod) when using Rockbox |
| 17:22:05 | t0mas | the problem is that the device pauses the player when it goes to "alarm clock" mode.. and then enables it at the wake-up time |
| 17:22:21 | t0mas | the apple firmware gets this in some way, pauses.. and starts playing when the alarmclock asks it to |
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| 17:22:36 | t0mas | but rockbox returns to the menu.. and does nothing when the alarmclock tries to start playing |
| 17:23:23 | t0mas | any suggestions as to how to debug this? It seems to trigger a "headphones_inserted" when the alarm sounds.. and a headphones disconnected when it shuts off to wait for the correct time |
| 17:26:57 | | Quit bertrik (Remote closed the connection) |
| 17:29:34 | stripwax | t0mas - are you using the 'pause on headphone unplug' / 'resume' settings in rockbox? |
| 17:29:54 | stripwax | actually - how are you sure it's triggering a 'headphones_inserted'? |
| 17:30:53 | t0mas | I am using that indeed |
| 17:31:01 | t0mas | and that's why I know it's triggering them |
| 17:31:35 | t0mas | if I switch to a song manually.. and then wait for the alarm time to roll around (before the player shuts down for inactivity) it start playing |
| 17:31:53 | t0mas | that might be because it "presses the play button" |
| 17:32:27 | t0mas | but I'm not sure how it does it with the apple firmware.. might be using other external commands (I guess it can send a lot of commands?) |
| 17:32:30 | stripwax | t0mas - it sounds like it might be. but ipod accessories usually use the accessory protocol to pause/unpause |
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| 17:32:57 | t0mas | ok, how does Rockbox react to that? |
| 17:33:00 | stripwax | seems odd that it would use the headphone unplug as a way to pause (unless that's a side effect of something else). |
| 17:33:01 | t0mas | when it's in the menu? |
| 17:33:15 | t0mas | well.. unplug is a pause trick in apple firmware |
| 17:33:23 | stripwax | t0mas - if rockbox is already playing a track when you insert it into the dock, does it work? |
| 17:33:35 | stripwax | the apple firmware already has a 'pause' command in the accessory protocol |
| 17:33:37 | t0mas | wait.. I'll get it an try some of those things |
| 17:33:53 | stripwax | i don't remember offhand what the status of the apple accessory protocol in rockbox is |
| 17:33:54 | t0mas | does the play command from an accessory work as a "resume" in rockbox? |
| 17:34:13 | t0mas | there is quite a list of working accessories.. which is why I wanted to check if this one worked :-) |
| 17:34:15 | stripwax | should work as play or unpause |
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| 17:35:36 | t0mas | ok, but not resume? |
| 17:36:06 | stripwax | Maybe I'm not sure what you mean by resume |
| 17:36:16 | stripwax | if it's stopped, play plays. if it's paused, play should unpause |
| 17:36:17 | t0mas | stripwax: do you know where it's handled? I'm looking for it in the code.. but didn't find any protocol handling yet :) |
| 17:36:40 | stripwax | t0mas - here's the thread with the serial protocol patch discussion. the patch seems to be closed, but I don't know what the current status is |
| 17:36:41 | stripwax | http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8624?project=1&string=ipod+accesory&type%5B0%5D=4&sev%5B0%5D=&pri%5B0%5D=&due%5B0%5D=&reported%5B0%5D=&cat%5B0%5D=&status%5B0%5D=&percent%5B0%5D=&opened=&dev=&closed=&duedatefrom=&duedateto=&changedfrom=&changedto=&openedfrom=&openedto=&closedfrom=&closedto=&order=dateopened&sort=desc |
| 17:36:54 | stripwax | wow, that's some crazy link |
| 17:37:07 | t0mas | I mean: if it is in the main menu, does a play/unpause command from the accessory-port start some music? |
| 17:37:10 | stripwax | ah. patch was committed in r19585! |
| 17:37:32 | stripwax | t0mas - I don't know, but I would expect it to |
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| 17:39:05 | t0mas | I'll get the radio/alarm thingy and try |
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| 17:42:39 | toffe82 | this is the error I have using sendfirm with the last version of libmtp : http://imagebin.ca/view/yfLY98.html |
| 17:42:55 | t0mas | stripwax: pause/play and skip work as intended when the ipod is on the WPS |
| 17:43:14 | stripwax | t0mas - hm, from the patch thread link I posted - there's this comment - "There is limited support for any IAP commands outside of the while-playing-screen. It sounds like sometimes the iPod is receiving the keydown command but not the keyup command. Not sure why that is happening, the best way to diagnose is to insert a hardware serial logger in between the devices; that's how I do it." |
| 17:43:14 | t0mas | but.. when it is in some kind of menu.. the pause/play button seems to work as a "select" |
| 17:43:40 | t0mas | ok.. |
| 17:43:52 | toffe82 | to make it work I just delete the last parameter of the Send_File_From_File as it is not use anymore |
| 17:43:58 | t0mas | hmz.. |
| 17:44:07 | stripwax | maybe the rockbox support is only fully enabled while on the wps screen. that's a guess, and sorry I don't have better info |
| 17:44:46 | t0mas | stripwax: when I press pause/play in the main menu it definitely works as "select" |
| 17:45:07 | t0mas | but skip-back/previous doesn't work to exit a menu |
| 17:45:15 | t0mas | while the button on the ipod does |
| 17:45:31 | saratoga | toffe82: for what its worth, I used the precompiled sendfirm on windows last night without issue |
| 17:46:01 | toffe82 | saratoga: it is on linux with ubuntu 8.10 |
| 17:46:13 | stripwax | t0mas - I'm reading the thread just as quickly as you are, to see if there are any clues. |
| 17:46:16 | t0mas | stripwax: I guess I'll have to change some menu-code to get it to do the effect of selecting "resume playing" or "now playing" |
| 17:47:24 | stripwax | Looks like Ryan Sawhill has exactly the same problem on 29 October 2008 |
| 17:48:19 | stripwax | And Ryan Press' response immediately after it, saying there is limited support for accessory protocol commands outside of WPS. |
| 17:48:36 | t0mas | jup |
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| 17:50:08 | stripwax | but quite why play gets interpret by rockbox as Select when in a menu, I don't know. Actually, probably what's happening, is that the protocol sends a different code for Play than pressing the real Play button. in the WPS, both are interpreted as Play. in the menu, the accessory Play button is actually mapped, in the rockbox code, to Select |
| 17:50:22 | stripwax | i'm guessing. I should shut up and look at the code |
| 17:50:41 | saratoga | looks like the Zune 2009 bug happens on the Gigabeat S too because of shared code with MS |
| 17:50:43 | | Quit ender` (" Light a fire for a man, and he's warm for a day. Light a man on fire, and he's warm for the rest of his life.") |
| 17:50:58 | saratoga | maybe this will mean cheap Gigabeasts on ebay |
| 17:51:09 | toffe82 | how do you see it ? |
| 17:51:18 | t0mas | saratoga: lol.. that was the bug of the week man.. why in hell would they have put that while loop around the leap-year calculation? expecting years of 800 days? :P |
| 17:51:37 | t0mas | stripwax: so it seems.. I'm looking into what the patch changed.. seems to do some button mapping |
| 17:52:04 | stripwax | well, that patch is now in svn :) |
| 17:52:23 | t0mas | uhu.. but it's easier to search in the patch |
| 17:52:41 | stripwax | :) true. probably firmware/export/iap.h and apps/keymaps/keymap-ipod.c are the main ones here |
| 17:53:11 | stripwax | ok, i'm going to stop saying stuff until I've looked at a piece of code this year :) |
| 17:53:41 | stripwax | saratoga - what's the bug |
| 17:53:42 | t0mas | I'm reading iap.c |
| 17:54:02 | Llorean | saratoga: Well, the bug cures itself a day later anyway, apparently. |
| 17:54:22 | saratoga | stripwax: the clock driver freezes the player |
| 17:54:29 | stripwax | ha |
| 17:55:08 | saratoga | theres a bunch of people posting yesterday and today about it on ABI, so maybe the Toshiba one doesn't fix itself |
| 17:55:35 | t0mas | stripwax: ok.. I've got something in keymap-ipod.x |
| 17:55:37 | t0mas | *.c |
| 17:55:53 | toffe82 | ther is no date or calendar on the S so how can it be affected ? |
| 17:55:54 | t0mas | in remote_button_context_standard |
| 17:56:01 | t0mas | it maps BUTTON_RC_PLAY to ACTION_STD_OK |
| 17:56:11 | t0mas | which is not really "ok" for an ipod I guess |
| 17:58:06 | t0mas | stripwax: the normal play button does map to "start playing and show the WPS" from the menu.. so if the mapping of the BUTTON_RC_PLAY would be the same as the normal play button it should work |
| 17:58:14 | stripwax | yep |
| 17:58:21 | t0mas | now the big question is.. why is it mapped to SELECT / OK instead of PLAY? |
| 17:58:27 | * | stripwax shrugs |
| 17:58:38 | t0mas | as the button is labeled play |
| 17:58:46 | Llorean | t0mas: In what screen? |
| 17:59:06 | t0mas | main menu |
| 17:59:13 | Llorean | Does the remote have an okay button? |
| 17:59:21 | Unhelpful | ajb`: i see what you mean now. i would still prefer the macro, since it doesn't duplicate all of the function arguments. that seems like it will be better if the loader arguments change, down the road. |
| 17:59:40 | Llorean | Okay is more essential than Play in the menu, because you can choose "Resume Playback" with a 'select' but you can't do anything BUT resume playback with a Play |
| 17:59:57 | t0mas | Llorean: mine doesn't |
| 18:00 |
| 18:00:08 | t0mas | but it doesn't work in a menu anyway |
| 18:00:17 | t0mas | because next/previous don't work for selecting menu items |
| 18:00:18 | Llorean | t0mas: You can't "select" menu items? |
| 18:00:29 | Llorean | So it seems that's the real problem. |
| 18:00:33 | t0mas | no.. |
| 18:00:39 | t0mas | because the buttons aren't supposed to do that.. |
| 18:00:45 | t0mas | at least.. not in the apple firmware |
| 18:00:53 | Llorean | We aren't trying to duplicate the apple firmware... |
| 18:01:05 | t0mas | I know |
| 18:01:07 | Llorean | The goal should be to expose as much of Rockbox's functionality still. |
| 18:01:21 | Llorean | This means they should allow navigation of the menu if there's enough buttons. |
| 18:01:26 | t0mas | this is not a "remote" in the sense that you put it inbetween the player and the earbuds.. |
| 18:01:48 | Llorean | If you just want to control playback, don't leave the WPS, though... |
| 18:01:49 | t0mas | but accessories aren't actual remotes with buttons in that sense of the word |
| 18:01:52 | t0mas | they send commands.. |
| 18:02:02 | t0mas | and if an accessory sends the "play" command.. the ipod should play music |
| 18:02:19 | t0mas | that's what it does with the OF.. and that's what people creating those accessories intended right? |
| 18:02:36 | stripwax | Llorean - the remote unpauses the ipod. on original firmware, that works, because play does the unpause. on rockbox, when you stop you leave the wps |
| 18:02:47 | t0mas | because accessories like alarm-clocks send a play command after booting the player.. |
| 18:03:11 | Llorean | t0mas: Rockbox has its own wake-up alarm |
| 18:03:18 | Llorean | So that's not a very good argument at all. |
| 18:03:28 | stripwax | yeah, the real problem is that the command is sent automatically by the remote, not when you press a button. |
| 18:03:42 | Llorean | It's send automatically if you use an unnecessary feature from the sound of it. |
| 18:03:53 | Llorean | Can't the iPod itself handle waking up with our firmware? |
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| 18:04:25 | t0mas | Llorean: that wouldn't work.. because the device it's in is an alarm clock |
| 18:04:30 | stripwax | t0mas - if you set the wakeup alarm in rockbox itself, does it still work if docked and the alarm goes off? |
| 18:04:38 | t0mas | which powers up the ipod.. enables it's speakers.. and then sends a "play" command |
| 18:04:42 | Llorean | t0mas: You mean to say you can't just play music in the device? It ONLY works as an alarm clock? |
| 18:05:05 | t0mas | if the device is set to ON.. and not to alarm-clock.. I can get rockbox to play music |
| 18:05:06 | Llorean | Is there some reason the alarm clock's speakers need to be powered down beforehand? |
| 18:05:13 | t0mas | and then play/pause and next/previous work |
| 18:05:16 | Llorean | Then set the device to ON, then set Rockbox's alarm... |
| 18:05:18 | t0mas | there is.. |
| 18:05:23 | t0mas | it emits a lot of light when it is on |
| 18:05:27 | t0mas | which is irritating for an alarm-lcok |
| 18:05:29 | t0mas | *clock |
| 18:05:46 | Llorean | I don't see why all other remotes should be crippled just because you don't want to put a little electrical tape over some lights. :-P |
| 18:05:54 | t0mas | hehe |
| 18:06:13 | t0mas | but.. the remotes don't work for using a menu now anyway.. |
| 18:06:19 | saratoga | presumably some sort of workaround here is possible |
| 18:06:29 | saratoga | couldn't you just remap the command if you're not in the WPS? |
| 18:06:37 | t0mas | indeed.. sync clocks in rockbox and the alarm.. set rockbox to alarm 1 minute after the alarmclock |
| 18:06:38 | Llorean | saratoga: That's the problem |
| 18:06:56 | Llorean | saratoga: If you're not in the WPS, "Play" on the 'remote' currently acts as 'select' acts on the physical unit, it sounds like. |
| 18:07:01 | t0mas | so the clock powers it up.. asks it to play (and fails because Rockbox doesn't respond to play commands) and then rockboxs decides to play because of it's own clock |
| 18:07:06 | t0mas | but that seems rather user-unfriendly? |
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| 18:07:18 | t0mas | Llorean: indeed |
| 18:07:33 | t0mas | and it should not respond to "play" commands by selecting a menu option.. |
| 18:07:39 | t0mas | actually.. the button is not mapped in the code at all |
| 18:07:48 | t0mas | but in some way it acts as select |
| 18:07:50 | Llorean | t0mas: I think most iPod remotes would allow navigating the menus |
| 18:07:58 | | Quit gregzx ("ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.5/2008120122]") |
| 18:07:59 | Llorean | It's non-remote docks that don't |
| 18:08:09 | Llorean | Since they rarely adjust the iPod's volume |
| 18:08:10 | t0mas | ok.. I'm going to make it worse.. |
| 18:08:14 | t0mas | there's a remote with this thing too :P |
| 18:08:21 | t0mas | which actually has way more buttons |
| 18:08:39 | Llorean | The iPod remote has +, -, >>, <<, and "Play" |
| 18:08:40 | t0mas | but with that too.. there is no way to navigate the menu's at the moment |
| 18:08:48 | t0mas | this device too |
| 18:08:52 | Llorean | + and - should let you navigate the menus |
| 18:08:55 | Llorean | Right? |
| 18:09:01 | Llorean | If they control the iPod volume, and not the dock volume |
| 18:09:02 | t0mas | vol+, vol-, skip-next, skip-back, play/pause |
| 18:09:11 | t0mas | they control the dock volume I guess |
| 18:09:12 | Llorean | The problem is, yours probably control your speaker volume |
| 18:09:36 | saratoga | do ipod remotes use the iap? |
| 18:09:42 | Llorean | saratoga: They use the dock port |
| 18:09:45 | Llorean | I can only assume they do. |
| 18:09:54 | t0mas | ipod volume has no effect on the dock.. in the apple firmware you can't change the volume when it's in this dock iirc.. in rockbox I can change the volume.. but it has no effect |
| 18:10:02 | saratoga | hmm |
| 18:10:21 | Llorean | t0mas: But the apple remote can change the headphone volume. |
| 18:10:28 | saratoga | even if they use the iap they almost certainly use a different iap mode number, so perhaps the button could be remapped for whatever mode clocks and stereos use |
| 18:10:28 | Llorean | Remember, we're not JUST talking about docks here. |
| 18:10:39 | Llorean | saratoga: They probably use simple remote. |
| 18:10:53 | Llorean | saratoga: there's not necessarily a reason for clocks to use advanced remote. |
| 18:10:58 | saratoga | Llorean: IIRC even in simple theres a lot of different modes |
| 18:11:18 | Llorean | I just don't think it's necessarily good to assume they'll use a different mode. |
| 18:11:32 | Llorean | Instead we should do something like renaming "car adapter" mode to "wake-up" mode |
| 18:11:46 | Llorean | And having it ignore "Play" commands issued within X seconds of bootup (user configurable?) |
| 18:12:04 | Llorean | Since it'll resume playback itself anyway in that mode, IIRC. |
| 18:12:14 | t0mas | wait.. I can try that |
| 18:12:20 | t0mas | how do I get it to car adapter mode? |
| 18:12:41 | Llorean | There's an option somewhere, should be in the manual. I never use it, and it may not be finished for iPods yet. |
| 18:12:53 | Llorean | It's an old feature that hasn't necessarily been tweaked for newer hardware much. |
| 18:13:49 | t0mas | ok.. maybe a new option? |
| 18:14:05 | t0mas | because when I set the "startup screen" to "resume playing" it works fine as an alarm clock |
| 18:14:12 | t0mas | because the clock starts the ipod |
| 18:14:34 | t0mas | so a mode of "shutdown and resume playing only the next time we boot" but then named better might be a solution :) |
| 18:14:56 | Llorean | Why not just fix/improve car adapter mode? |
| 18:15:07 | t0mas | I'm looking for it :) |
| 18:15:17 | t0mas | I guess it's supposed to do something like that |
| 18:15:24 | Llorean | Except it's not one-time only |
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| 18:26:25 | stripwax | what's SYS_FOURHERTZ ? |
| 18:26:46 | * | stripwax apologises for being away from rockbox for so long.. happy new year! |
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| 19:10:45 | t0mas | stripwax: I've been away longer I guess.. about since ehm.. 2006 or something |
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| 20:36:41 | * | amiconn starts to think that SYS_FOURHERTZ is somewhat nasty, and there should be another solution |
| 20:38:48 | * | likemindead is installing 3.1 & is xexcitedx |
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| 20:44:02 | Keripo | I happened to stumble across engadget's article on the Cowon S9 and I was wondering about people's opinion on it as an MP3 and video player |
| 20:45:00 | Keripo | Been looking for a good FLAC player for a while since my iPod's dying - opinions on the Cowom S9? |
| 20:45:40 | | Part massiveH ("Leaving") |
| 20:45:52 | krazykit | Keripo, it doesn't run rockbox. |
| 20:46:23 | krazykit | and, as noted in the IrcGuidelines, non-rockbox discussion is offtopic. |
| 20:47:09 | likemindead | I'm using the latest Rockbox Utility in Linux and I'm getting "Permission for disc access denied!" |
| 20:47:10 | Keripo | ah, I was kinda unsure whether to ask here or in #rockbox-community |
| 20:48:16 | krazykit | likemindead, are you running with administrator/root permissions? |
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| 20:49:34 | likemindead | Doubtful. |
| 20:49:54 | | Part Keripo |
| 20:50:03 | krazykit | then do so |
| 20:50:28 | domonoky | likemindead: rbutil needs raw-disc access to install the bootloader on some players, so you should run it as root. (or add the correct rights to your user) |
| 20:50:52 | likemindead | Will do. |
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| 20:55:38 | likemindead | Okay, progress is at 100%, but the icon below still says "Abort." Do I close the window or wait a bit longer? |
| 20:59:31 | likemindead | Ah.... nevermind. It finally finished after the themes not being available error. Thanks! |
| 21:00 |
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| 21:08:41 | kugel | jhMikeS: was there a decision on the backlight now? |
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| 21:14:36 | saratoga | does anyone remember where the MrH document about PP's memory and cache performance was put? |
| 21:16:07 | linuxstb | saratoga: Maybe one of these? http://daniel.haxx.se/sansa/ |
| 21:16:13 | mcuelenaere | saratoga: http://daniel.haxx.se/sansa/memory_controller.txt ? |
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| 21:19:43 | saratoga | mcuelenaere: thanks |
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| 21:22:30 | saratoga | shame he doesn't compute the MB/s though |
| 21:22:50 | notlistening | USB or parallel port ARM JTAG cables, any huge differences between them ? |
| 21:23:32 | saratoga | USB ones are really expensive, otherwise i don't think so |
| 21:23:36 | Unhelpful | aside from the obvious ones? and the usb one *might* do some of the work for you? |
| 21:23:57 | saratoga | does the Ipod Video have 128k of IRAM? |
| 21:24:30 | notlistening | ah well the obvious ones? I have never used JTAG before :P |
| 21:24:34 | Unhelpful | saratoga: the parallel one will have you twiddling bits... then again, it's hard to say if the USB one will have any kind of intelligent controller in it, or if it will have you twiddling bits over USB? |
| 21:25:00 | Unhelpful | notlistening: the obvious difference would be that one requires a parallel port, the other a usb port. obviously. ;) |
| 21:25:10 | saratoga | ah it defines PP5022 |
| 21:25:45 | notlistening | oh haha thought there might be something more technical than that ;) |
| 21:25:48 | saratoga | either way your software will handle the actual USB or parallel interface |
| 21:25:56 | saratoga | so you shouldn't have to care about the differences |
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| 21:26:44 | Unhelpful | i've only used it for a bricked wrt router before... actual debugging and such is another matter |
| 21:26:50 | notlistening | Would someone mind looking at a website and suggesting if the parallel ones is suitable, it has been suggested that speed might be an issue? |
| 21:27:26 | notlistening | http://www.coolcomponents.co.uk/catalog/index.php?cPath=32&osCsid=f01436cc4b2a25ba67da5ee2a267c78a |
| 21:27:36 | Unhelpful | only for large volumes of data. you do *not* want to have to flash a device over it. |
| 21:28:04 | notlistening | nah not doing that just debugging |
| 21:29:02 | notlistening | I am just being tight about the cost ;) |
| 21:29:52 | Unhelpful | i'd imagine parallel will likely suffice, if you have an old beater of a PC around with the port |
| 21:30:11 | Unhelpful | it will likely require the "newest" bidirectional PP standards ;) |
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| 21:33:43 | notlistening | about a 2000 / 2001 machine i have dedicated to development, umm is there a way to tell? |
| 21:35:20 | kugel | saratoga: I'd have a plugins patch, but it's quite inconsistent |
| 21:35:36 | kugel | for the fuze |
| 21:36:19 | gevaerts | Unhelpful: I do know make a bit, and I can understand it with some effort, but I've never really looked at the rockbox build system |
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| 21:36:39 | Unhelpful | i'd imagine your software might say what you need, probably EPP or ECP... i'd be shocked to find a system with a parallel port that doesn't support them |
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| 21:37:31 | notlistening | thanks Unhelpful |
| 21:37:44 | Unhelpful | gevaerts: the only thing i can think of is to stuff the pluginlib object commands into a variable, and use that for the extra pluginlib objects from core. i don't think there's any other way for rules with different target/dep patterns to have the same build command? |
| 21:38:27 | gevaerts | I can't think of a way |
| 21:38:30 | * | kugel tries pf on his fuze |
| 21:38:33 | Unhelpful | that aside, there's also the issue of not being able to cleanly support building those objects conditionally in the makefile - SOURCES is preprocessed, so any of the config defines are available there |
| 21:38:51 | Unhelpful | kugel: it has what, 2MB RAM? good luck. ;D |
| 21:38:58 | kugel | 8MB |
| 21:39:03 | kugel | full plugin buffer |
| 21:39:35 | Unhelpful | ohhhh. yeah, should work fine, then. why did i think it was some ultra-lowmem thing? |
| 21:39:50 | kugel | hmm |
| 21:39:52 | kugel | it's slow |
| 21:40:01 | kugel | it boosts, doesn't it? |
| 21:40:37 | | Join Nico_P [50] (n=nicolas@rockbox/developer/NicoP) |
| 21:40:52 | Unhelpful | kugel: it does. the dynamic reflections add 3 multiplies per reflection pixel. i might be able to take it down to two with enough precision to still work. |
| 21:41:07 | kugel | well |
| 21:41:12 | kugel | it's slower than the e200 |
| 21:41:24 | kugel | who has 1/4 MHz |
| 21:41:38 | kugel | same architecture |
| 21:41:50 | Unhelpful | not transposing also adds a multiply per output pixel. i know a cleaner way to transpose the images, with a scaler output plugin... i just need to write one. |
| 21:43:43 | | Quit Blackfrosch (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 21:44:36 | kugel | Unhelpful: another note: none of the covers is obviously broken |
| 21:45:14 | Unhelpful | gevaerts: i'll go ahead and commit the c-file-include version, then. if somebody comes up with a nicer way, later, at least the part for making it compilable in the right place is already "done" |
| 21:45:19 | Unhelpful | kugel: should they be? |
| 21:45:43 | kugel | Did you forget the bug? |
| 21:46:16 | Unhelpful | OH. did you back out the chunk-size change? |
| 21:46:38 | Unhelpful | BM_MAX_WIDTH applies to *all* bitmap loads |
| 21:46:57 | kugel | what I have now is svn+plugins |
| 21:47:22 | Unhelpful | hrm. are the background/wps bmps still bad? |
| 21:48:00 | kugel | y |
| 21:48:34 | Unhelpful | i'd be surprised if they "just got better" in svn, unless somebody found whatever the issue was, and fixed it... |
| 21:50:21 | unstable | Not using git or mercurial yet? |
| 21:51:34 | Unhelpful | the "central" repo is still subversion. at least some of the devs use git on their end. |
| 21:51:48 | gevaerts | saratoga: I've just run beastdump on my beast and I get (not unexpectedly) a different md5sum. This is of course a beast with previously installed rockbox and a slightly more complex history than the average one |
| 21:53:42 | | Quit fredddy (Remote closed the connection) |
| 21:54:54 | kugel | Unhelpful: my unscaled 150x150 covers are fine too |
| 21:55:26 | Unhelpful | kugel: they will be, it's just that the scroll animation will cause some z-axis issues |
| 21:55:33 | kugel | even though I can't view all for sime reason, pf stops substituting the empty slide with the covers at the end |
| 21:56:17 | Unhelpful | basically, the side images are rendered from the outermost in, and then the center image last. if they're small enough that the slides never intersect, fine. |
| 21:56:33 | notlistening | another quicky is a 128x128 pixel LCD with 4096 colours okay for rockbox same as nokia 6610? |
| 21:56:53 | Unhelpful | if not, there's a point in the animation where the previously-center cover suddenly "pops" behind the new one, because it just got demoted from center to stack cover |
| 21:56:54 | kugel | Unhelpful: I don't understand |
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| 22:02:00 | kugel | Unhelpful: I was saying that all pixels of my 150x150 covers seem to be fine |
| 22:02:01 | | Join blithe [0] (n=blithe@li35-144.members.linode.com) |
| 22:02:24 | * | Unhelpful has misunderstood, then :) |
| 22:06:20 | kugel | Unhelpful: doesn't that make you curious? |
| 22:06:47 | kugel | from what I've seen, every yellow is yellow, ever black and grey is black and grey |
| 22:07:13 | Unhelpful | it does. what happens to the broken bg bitmap if you load another theme, then load cabbie again? |
| 22:09:17 | kugel | Unhelpful: hm, I have my doubts about a storage bug |
| 22:09:28 | Unhelpful | but, *where*, then? |
| 22:09:43 | kugel | Unhelpful: I did a small experiment |
| 22:10:14 | kugel | I rotated the cabbiev2 bg from my e200 (same resolution, but portrait). |
| 22:10:25 | kugel | I don't get the weird pixels |
| 22:10:36 | kugel | but the same behavior at the rockbox logo which I get in the wps |
| 22:10:46 | | Part cmdbbq ("later") |
| 22:11:05 | kugel | see here: |
| 22:11:07 | kugel | http://www.alice-dsl.net/simonemartitz/rockbox/wps.png |
| 22:11:24 | kugel | the ROCK in rockbox is weird |
| 22:11:41 | kugel | that's exactly what I get with the rotated e200 cabbie bg |
| 22:11:45 | Unhelpful | yes, it looks to me like some of the lines have been offset a pixel or two? |
| 22:11:55 | | Join mcuelenaere_ [0] (n=mcuelena@rockbox/developer/mcuelenaere) |
| 22:12:13 | kugel | yes |
| 22:12:21 | Unhelpful | the curious thing about that is that the entire line is read in at one go... |
| 22:12:45 | | Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 22:13:22 | Unhelpful | it's almost like a couple of bytes have been dropped from the line on read |
| 22:13:37 | domonoky | notlistening: of course its ok, rockbox also runs on players where only a 2 line character display is available.. |
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| 22:13:56 | | Nick FOAD_ is now known as FOAD (n=dok@dinah.blub.net) |
| 22:14:09 | kugel | Unhelpful: so, that shows that this behavior is exactly reproduce-able on 2 different files |
| 22:14:30 | jhMikeS | kugel: I thought something had been agreed upon with #defines already. |
| 22:15:00 | kugel | jhMikeS: yea, but I'm still curious about the bool setting thing |
| 22:15:31 | kugel | I could integrate that in my code police patch if wanted |
| 22:16:36 | kugel | Unhelpful: and if the same behavior on 2 different files can be noticed, it's unlikely a storage issue, is it? |
| 22:16:50 | | Quit mcuelenaere_ (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 22:16:56 | jhMikeS | I'm not sure we need a fading define at all for a custom algorithm but just a setting type define. In common cases, the setting type define can be implied by it. |
| 22:17:37 | Unhelpful | ... i don't see why that makes it not storage. if large reads are losing/corrupting data, why would it only affect one file? |
| 22:17:38 | kugel | exactly, your define is basically only needed for the setting |
| 22:17:57 | kugel | Unhelpful: because the curroption is exactly the same? |
| 22:18:17 | | Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@rockbox/developer/mcuelenaere) |
| 22:18:21 | kugel | if the corruption was different, ok, but this is entirely the same |
| 22:18:31 | Unhelpful | looks like lines shifted horizontally? all that takes is losing two bytes. |
| 22:18:42 | | Join Zagor [242] (n=bjst@rockbox/developer/Zagor) |
| 22:19:00 | kugel | plus, all my album art is read correctly |
| 22:19:31 | kugel | hundreds of bitmaps, 2 with the same corruption, every other without |
| 22:19:39 | kugel | that doesn't seem like a storage problem to me |
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| 22:20:16 | kugel | meh, but it stills seems to be limited to the fuze, that's so weird |
| 22:20:25 | Unhelpful | i have a really hard time believing it's a loader problem, though, when simply changing the chunk size "fixes" it |
| 22:22:10 | kugel | Unhelpful: want a screendump from the rotated e200 bg? The weird pixels in the Rockbox lettering are at the same position |
| 22:22:54 | Unhelpful | sure. i'll take a look, but i'm still pretty sure this is not my bug. |
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| 22:30:28 | kugel | Unhelpful: http://www.alice-dsl.net/simonemartitz/rockbox/mainmenu4.png |
| 22:33:04 | kugel | Unhelpful: hm, your last commit looks weird to me |
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| 22:33:26 | kugel | I don't think #ifdef PLUGIN and the stuff within should be in a core file |
| 22:33:45 | Unhelpful | kugel: no way not to, other than having two files. |
| 22:34:58 | kugel | looks nasty :/ but if you say so it's probably right |
| 22:35:34 | Unhelpful | it does look nasty... but i rather thought that forking all of bmp.c and resize.c was nastier. |
| 22:36:39 | kugel | hm, couldn't you include a api.h which only has the #define API which is different in a plugin? |
| 22:37:14 | kugel | but I see there's more dependent on plugin |
| 22:37:26 | kugel | anyway, have you compared the images? |
| 22:38:37 | | Join ameyer [0] (n=ameyer17@75.57.201.238) |
| 22:38:49 | Unhelpful | yes, a few things are different about the bmp loader, also the API define has to be set when the bmp.c/resize.c are compiled - the pluginlib versions of them can't go directly to core for their files. |
| 22:38:59 | n1s | notlistening: we already support a player with 128x128pixels lcd the H10 5/6GB |
| 22:39:12 | Unhelpful | erm, s/files/functions |
| 22:39:43 | n1s | Llorean: I think the only thin "Car adapter mode" does is turn the player off if the charger is removed so it powers down when you shut down the car |
| 22:40:15 | kugel | Unhelpful: hum? if you define API in the plugin lib file it's available at compile time? |
| 22:41:23 | Unhelpful | bmp.c and resize.c need to be compiled with the proper version of API defined, and they're compiled into pluginlib, not as part of a plugin |
| 22:41:59 | | Part blippe |
| 22:42:36 | Unhelpful | API *also* needs to be defined when they're built in core, though |
| 22:43:31 | moos | Unhelpful: just in case you miss them, yellow builds |
| 22:43:34 | Unhelpful | but first, i need to fix some yellows :/ |
| 22:43:42 | moos | hehe :) |
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| 22:44:32 | kugel | I thought the pluginlib is compiled into any plugin it uses it |
| 22:45:10 | Unhelpful | kugel: it's compiled into a library, and linked into any plugin that uses it. |
| 22:45:21 | kugel | yea, I meant that |
| 22:45:47 | Unhelpful | i think i yellowed every *non*-mono target? |
| 22:45:54 | Unhelpful | or many of them, anyway |
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| 22:48:10 | * | Unhelpful sees the problem :) |
| 22:49:10 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 22:51:52 | Unhelpful | kugel: moving the API define into somewhere like plugins/lib/core.h or similar would be a nice cleanup, to avoid defining it twice... but there's really no way to get around using the API macro in the core files, aside from maybe an include that would wrap the functions in API calls under their original names... the plugin would then need to make sure that it includes that :/ |
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| 22:53:26 | | Join casainho [0] (n=chatzill@89.181.95.119) |
| 22:53:47 | | Quit Zagor ("Leaving") |
| 22:53:59 | kugel | Unhelpful: yea, I see the api need |
| 22:54:09 | casainho | hello :-) |
| 22:54:13 | | Quit MethoS- (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) |
| 22:54:33 | kugel | but apps/plugins/lib/core_bmp.c could like like http://pastie.org/352420 |
| 22:55:11 | casainho | I am evaluating an chip stereo audio dac and I would like to know if an IC with SPI bus protocol at 10MHz would be sufficient? |
| 22:55:30 | Unhelpful | kugel: i like that... but we'd have to then put the API define somewhere in core, right? |
| 22:56:00 | | Quit MethoS_ (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 22:56:16 | kugel | the api could be in bmp.h/c |
| 22:56:28 | kugel | that's what's the #undef is fore |
| 22:56:35 | kugel | for* |
| 22:57:44 | | Quit XavierGr (Nick collision from services.) |
| 22:57:55 | | Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@rockbox/staff/XavierGr) |
| 22:58:11 | Unhelpful | it appears in resize.c as well... that's where i was going with the plugins/lib/core.h idea, that an #undef/#define like that could happen there, and that the API define for core could be somewhere "else" |
| 22:58:24 | kugel | sure |
| 22:59:18 | Unhelpful | albumart.c will need to get the same treatment to support pictureflow-on-mono, which is the request that this is trying to fill, anyway... so the question then is, where does the macro belong? |
| 22:59:35 | kugel | Unhelpful: why is much code #ifndef PLUGIN? only because what you did is only for mono? |
| 22:59:58 | kugel | bmp.h? they all include it afaik |
| 23:00 |
| 23:00:03 | | Quit {phoenix} (Remote closed the connection) |
| 23:00:18 | kugel | or some "api.h" |
| 23:00:24 | | Quit m0f0x (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 23:00:42 | Unhelpful | yes, that's where i was going, there should be a "proper" place for such a def if we want to make more core code shared with plugins. |
| 23:01:30 | scorche|sh | domonoky: ping |
| 23:01:31 | Unhelpful | the #ifndef plugin is mostly stripping out the native-output code. scaled native output is worthless on mono, and unscaled native output is available from the core bmp loader |
| 23:01:48 | Unhelpful | the pluginlib one can be smaller if it only supports scaled loads |
| 23:01:53 | kugel | so only to make plugins a little smaller? |
| 23:02:12 | kugel | good enough I suppose |
| 23:02:29 | * | Unhelpful sees that he got dinged by some spurious yellows again |
| 23:02:40 | kugel | jhMikeS: so there was no definite decision about dropping the setting, right= |
| 23:03:37 | kugel | rather, simplifying to yes/no |
| 23:05:22 | | Join Rob2222 [0] (n=Miranda@p4FDCDDBB.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:10:24 | | Quit petur ("Zzzzzz") |
| 23:10:58 | * | pixelma wonders about Febs' mail in the dev list |
| 23:11:21 | Bagder | it puzzles me too |
| 23:11:33 | Bagder | I figure he meant to actually add contents too... |
| 23:12:26 | | Join tyfoo2 [0] (n=tyfoo@dyndsl-095-033-076-186.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 23:13:23 | pixelma | or he accidentally pressed "reply" or some such |
| 23:15:28 | casainho | Bagder: can you please help me on audio codec IC? |
| 23:15:57 | Bagder | casainho: I don't think I'm the man to ask for that, sorry. |
| 23:16:01 | casainho | Bagder: I would like to know if this module would be ok to play audio: http://www.olimex.com/dev/mod-mp3.html |
| 23:16:11 | | Quit einhirn (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 23:17:01 | | Join countrymonkey [0] (n=4b05639a@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-47171942608bbd89) |
| 23:17:05 | casainho | Bagder: don't you know about the audio "engine" on Rockbox? - I just would like to know if audio goes to audio drivers in PCM or something like that |
| 23:17:11 | Bagder | hardware decoder sounds wrong though |
| 23:17:33 | Bagder | yes, the audio chip basically gets pcm |
| 23:18:12 | casainho | Bagder: so, that module may work, as it can work as a slave and get PCM from a master :-) |
| 23:18:43 | casainho | Bagder: what about LCD? Do you think this would work? http://www.olimex.com/dev/mod-nokia6610.html |
| 23:18:52 | Bagder | "Not recommended for new projects" |
| 23:18:59 | Bagder | (http://www.vlsi.fi/en/products/vs1002.html) |
| 23:19:35 | Bagder | 12bit color is unusual, but sure |
| 23:19:54 | | Quit bmbl ("Woah!") |
| 23:20:51 | casainho | Bagder: well, it's just a prototype, I just need to convince Olimex or other big company to workout a hardware player after seeing our prototype, I don't mind if I use an "old" stereo IC codec |
| 23:21:23 | casainho | Bagder: I would like to know if other targets uses SPI or I2C for LCD..? |
| 23:21:28 | saratoga | gevaerts: that makes sense, I'd only expect this to work if you haven't written anything else to the firmware partition |
| 23:21:33 | Bagder | well, making a new design with a chip that already is discontinued seems like a risk to me |
| 23:21:54 | gevaerts | saratoga: it does indeed. It was worth a try though |
| 23:21:57 | toffe82 | I have a strange bbehavior on 2 gigabeat S, the battery is almost full, I switch off the player and try to switch it on and I have the icon of the OF on black background showing empty battery and the screen flashing between white and black like a full discharge battery |
| 23:22:01 | | Quit countrymonkey ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
| 23:22:23 | Bagder | casainho: btw, the irivier h1x0 series have the S1D15E06 LCD which might be similar (controller-wise) |
| 23:22:29 | casainho | Bagder: but is just temporary, we will never make the final prototype −− the company that will build it must do it!! and is more a question of making new drivers |
| 23:22:44 | | Join Davide-NYC [0] (n=Davide-N@user-12ld9li.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 23:23:18 | casainho | Bagder: hmmm, okok. I started today reading the drivers of LCD on RB source... :-) |
| 23:23:18 | saratoga | i still need someone with a fresh gigabeat to try it and confirm that my results are typical |
| 23:23:38 | casainho | Bagder: okok - thanks, it's all for now :-) |
| 23:23:51 | saratoga | anyway assuming this all works, what is needed to get the gigabeat S supported |
| 23:24:07 | Unhelpful | saratoga: i could restore mine with the "stock" firmware, then install the bootloader... but i guess that's not fresh enough? :/ |
| 23:24:30 | | Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection) |
| 23:25:03 | toffe82 | saratoga: would it be a problem if the nk.bin installed on the player is already the rockbox one, the md5 will not be the same ? |
| 23:25:03 | saratoga | Unhelpful: i think we'd really need to restore it with an image dumped from a fresh gigabeat firmware partition |
| 23:25:41 | saratoga | toffe82: this only works if you've installed the rockbox bootloader a single time and then not touched the firmware partition at all |
| 23:26:10 | saratoga | if you just installed and then didn't do anything else to the firmware partition, it should work |
| 23:26:21 | saratoga | if you've reinstalled the bootloader it probably will not |
| 23:26:22 | Unhelpful | saratoga: ... actually, it can recover from a wiped partition table... is "after it formats itself" good enough? |
| 23:26:51 | toffe82 | saratoga: what do I have to do to try ? |
| 23:26:51 | | Quit tyfoo (Connection timed out) |
| 23:26:51 | saratoga | Unhelpful: it can do that after you've erased the original nk.bin? |
| 23:26:51 | | Nick tyfoo2 is now known as tyfoo (n=tyfoo@dyndsl-095-033-076-186.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 23:27:17 | saratoga | toffe82: compile and run the beastdump.c program in utils/MTP |
| 23:27:22 | Unhelpful | i would assume it did that without accessing the files, since it detected the table being corrupted :/ |
| 23:27:46 | | Join saratoga2 [0] (n=9803c6dd@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-40cbaeeb122f900d) |
| 23:28:02 | saratoga2 | where does it get the new nk.bin from then? |
| 23:28:02 | | Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 23:28:35 | Unhelpful | it starts recovery mode, and asks you to give it one... so it would still be the one that was dumped, which i have a copy of from before we "removed" it from wiki |
| 23:28:59 | saratoga2 | Unhelpful: ah ok, you can try that but i'm not sure if its the same as a fresh image |
| 23:29:12 | saratoga2 | this program assumes that the nk.bin file is not fragmented |
| 23:29:16 | gevaerts | It would be very useful to know... |
| 23:29:34 | saratoga2 | which is may be if you readd the nk.bin rather then directly flash the entire partition |
| 23:29:54 | kugel | saratoga2: is one allowed to wrote to the OF partition on the beast? |
| 23:30:11 | saratoga2 | kugel: yes its just a normal tfat partitoin and it mounts in windows by default |
| 23:30:18 | saratoga2 | at least when in bootloader usb mode |
| 23:30:29 | kugel | without rockbox too? |
| 23:30:31 | Unhelpful | are we sure that they *do* image the whole drive?... then again, the recovery process is not convenient to use for initial install, i suppose |
| 23:30:41 | saratoga2 | without rockbox you can get no UMS mode |
| 23:30:58 | toffe82 | saratoga2: you have to put the player in recovery ? |
| 23:30:59 | kugel | if the nk.bin dump is safer if one isn't allowed to write OF partition, why allow it? |
| 23:31:00 | Unhelpful | kugel: without rockbox, you can send an appropriate file via MTP, which it will treat as the new firmware |
| 23:31:15 | kugel | on the v1 sansas you cannot write to it either |
| 23:31:36 | gevaerts | kugel: you can... |
| 23:31:43 | saratoga2 | Unhelpful: I expect that they image all drives the same out of the factory, but thats only an assumption |
| 23:31:52 | Unhelpful | kugel: if you try to mess with the on-disk partition table too much, the OF will format it for you. |
| 23:32:11 | Unhelpful | saratoga2: yes, thinking about it, the idea of using the device format/restore feature in the factory is absurdly silly |
| 23:32:19 | kugel | gevaerts: you can? you mean it's mounted in windows/whatever if you use usb with rockox? |
| 23:32:42 | saratoga2 | kugel: its not partitioned so you can't mount it in windows |
| 23:32:42 | gevaerts | kugel: it's not FAT, so you don't get a filesystem, but you can access it |
| 23:32:46 | saratoga2 | but you can still write to it |
| 23:32:46 | * | Unhelpful vaguely remembers talk of filtering the MBR portion of the drive in rockbox usb? |
| 23:33:01 | * | gevaerts vaguely remembers that as well :) |
| 23:33:10 | Unhelpful | back in the very early days of beast usb support |
| 23:33:14 | kugel | well, anyway, I was talking about to hide it for the normal user, so the dump will be fine for the time being |
| 23:33:15 | saratoga2 | anyway, what needs to happen to get the beast supported? |
| 23:33:20 | kugel | isn't that possible? |
| 23:33:24 | gevaerts | I still don't really like the idea of not showing what's really on disk |
| 23:33:38 | saratoga2 | kugel: i think the best bet is to just dump the nk.bin during the install so they don't get a chance to screw it up |
| 23:33:47 | Unhelpful | gevaerts: nor do i, and there's no way at all to do the "right" thing if they try to write to it. |
| 23:34:17 | Unhelpful | saratoga2: it would have to be on first boot, i'd think - the "new" firmware doesn't have disk access until it's installed and booted |
| 23:34:37 | kugel | saratoga2: what's better? hiding 150MB of storage, or have users not being able to uninstall rockbox because they lost the dump for some reason? |
| 23:34:40 | saratoga2 | Unhelpful: the install instructions say it reboots after sending the new firmware, at which point it comes up in UMS |
| 23:34:40 | gevaerts | kugel: it is possible, by presenting a fake MBR. It won't help though, as once rockbox is installed that partition isn't pristine anymore anyway |
| 23:34:48 | kugel | (150MB is what I remember) |
| 23:34:54 | saratoga2 | this didn't happen to me, I had to manually force a reboot, but in theory it could all be done at once |
| 23:35:05 | toffe82 | saratoga2: how do you compile it ? :) |
| 23:35:16 | gevaerts | kugel: if you upgrade the rockbox bootloader just once, you've lost recoverability |
| 23:35:17 | saratoga2 | gcc beastdump.c |
| 23:35:49 | kugel | gevaerts: why? |
| 23:36:04 | Unhelpful | saratoga2: the util could also send the rockbox.tar before sending the firmware |
| 23:36:06 | saratoga2 | then after you run it type "md5sum nk.bin" to make sure your nk file is ok |
| 23:36:10 | kugel | is the bootloader overwriting parts of the OF? |
| 23:36:13 | | Quit casainho ("ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.5/2008121622]") |
| 23:36:41 | saratoga2 | kugel: this is absically an undelete utility |
| 23:36:46 | | Join itcheg [0] (i=62db4767@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-d3e389e71f093182) |
| 23:36:54 | saratoga2 | you can only undelete a file if you haven't touched the file system since deleting it |
| 23:37:04 | saratoga2 | otherwise it gets overwritten by subsequent files |
| 23:37:11 | kugel | yes, I know |
| 23:37:29 | * | gevaerts thinks |
| 23:37:34 | Unhelpful | kugel: if you write to the partition later with an OS filesystem driver, the remnants of the old nk.bin may be overwritten |
| 23:37:35 | kugel | and if you don't overwrite it ever, it will always be recoverable |
| 23:37:52 | gevaerts | How destructive is the firmware patching? Can't the rockbox bootloader be patched out cleanly again? |
| 23:38:03 | kugel | Unhelpful: and that's why I propose hiding that partition |
| 23:38:18 | Unhelpful | gevaerts: we can't *make* the patched rockbox bootloader without an original nk.bin |
| 23:38:21 | kugel | at least in a way that it doesn't get automounted for the normal user |
| 23:38:44 | gevaerts | Unhelpful: sure, but right now we're talking about trying to make sure the user doesn't lose the file afterwards |
| 23:38:46 | Unhelpful | kugel: and then your bootloader is install-once? i know they don't move as fast as the real thing, but bootloaders *are* still a moving target. |
| 23:39:24 | gevaerts | kugel: just writing the patched bootloader during normal install will probably already make recovery impossible |
| 23:39:28 | Unhelpful | gevaerts: the point is, you have to install a firmware the first time that contains no part of the original nk.bin |
| 23:39:52 | Unhelpful | once that boots, you can try to recover nk.bin and create a dual-boot bootloader... |
| 23:39:54 | * | gevaerts is slowly getting his head around it all |
| 23:39:56 | kugel | Unhelpful: well, that's why I was asking if it's needed that the bootloader overwrites parts of the of (Sorry, I'm not into patching the beast so much) |
| 23:40:13 | gevaerts | kugel: yes it is |
| 23:40:31 | Unhelpful | gevaerts: your question is, then, "could we extract nk.bin from the dual-boot bootloader"? |
| 23:40:32 | gevaerts | "overwriting parts of the of" means writing to a FAT partition in this case |
| 23:41:00 | saratoga2 | when the gigabeast formats itself is the data partition lost or only the firmware partition? |
| 23:41:04 | gevaerts | Unhelpful: yes. That way keeping the file safe for a longer time is less of a problem. |
| 23:41:05 | kugel | so it would be at least nice to have a safe nk.bin until the bootloader is updated |
| 23:41:24 | gevaerts | saratoga2: don't count on keeping the data partition once the OF starts having fun |
| 23:41:37 | amiconn | Why not undelete the original nk.bin on the fw partition, but naming it differently? |
| 23:41:47 | gevaerts | kugel: yes, but that's part of the installation process |
| 23:42:14 | Unhelpful | amiconn: if the device goes into recovery mode, it's probably gone, then :/ |
| 23:42:36 | amiconn | Yeah, hence I think that just dumping it onto the pc is better |
| 23:42:52 | amiconn | But the fw partition should be hidden regardless, if only to reduce confusion |
| 23:43:16 | * | kugel agrees |
| 23:43:19 | amiconn | This can be done by just modifying the partition type on-the-fly (to "hidden fat32") |
| 23:43:33 | Unhelpful | i don't know how flexible recovery mode is. i know it can format the data partition without needing a fresh nk.bin upload. i know it can recover from the partition table being corrupted (thanks gevaerts ;), presumably without accessing data on the partitions |
| 23:43:38 | amiconn | This way someone who knows what he's doing can still mount it |
| 23:43:39 | kugel | Unhelpful: recovery mode is something from the of I suppose? |
| 23:43:57 | kugel | in that case, you can just undelete/dump it again after recovery mode, can't you? |
| 23:44:02 | | Quit stripwax (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 23:44:18 | | Quit merbanan (Remote closed the connection) |
| 23:44:42 | Unhelpful | kugel: recovery mode is clearly started from something earlier than the OF nk.bin. i would think flash. |
| 23:45:00 | saratoga2 | does it save the nk.bin when it formats? |
| 23:45:03 | kugel | ah ok |
| 23:45:28 | Unhelpful | saratoga2: if there is one already? i would rather doubt it does, and i'm not sure how to check |
| 23:45:40 | toffe82 | saratoga2: in recovery, it just erase the nk.bin |
| 23:46:22 | Unhelpful | i *suspect* that it formats the fw partition when it decides you need to reinstall the fw |
| 23:47:06 | saratoga2 | then it asks you for a new nk.bin? |
| 23:47:17 | Unhelpful | right. |
| 23:48:24 | Unhelpful | and right now, the only way to have a beast nk.bin is to take the drive out, or get one from somebody who has :/ |
| 23:49:11 | saratoga2 | how odd that they would do that but not give a link to replacement nk.bin files |
| 23:49:42 | gevaerts | I think we should look at actual "normal" FAT undelete. If that works it's likely to be more reliable than current beastdump |
| 23:49:47 | amiconn | Not the only oddity in the beast's OF... |
| 23:50:02 | saratoga2 | gevaerts: will they work on TFAT? |
| 23:50:15 | Unhelpful | i agree, there. the process is clearly designed to be relatively user-friendly, it has nice on-screen prompts that detail what it's doing, and what it needs you to do |
| 23:50:16 | gevaerts | saratoga2: "if that works" :) |
| 23:50:19 | toffe82 | there is a MTP function which seems to be supported by the beast, it is copy, I tried to use it to copy the nk.bin to the other partition but couldn't do it or perhaps didn't understand really how it works |
| 23:50:50 | saratoga2 | beastdump works if the file is intact and continous, I'm curious when a regular undelete utility would do any better for TFAT? |
| 23:51:01 | kugel | saratoga2: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/9617 |
| 23:51:30 | Unhelpful | toffe82: no good, really, since MTP doesn't expose the "true" filesystem, but rather a collection of file objects |
| 23:51:50 | gevaerts | saratoga2: I don't know. Another way would be storing md5sums of all disk blocks (clusters?) of nk.bin, and scanning the entire firmware partition |
| 23:51:51 | Unhelpful | beast doesn't even store them in the folders that it tells you you're creating or copying to |
| 23:52:08 | Unhelpful | gevaerts: that seems safest. |
| 23:52:22 | gevaerts | Unhelpful: the problem is that we're talking about 6000 or so blocks |
| 23:52:29 | toffe82 | Unhelpful: but if you know the id of the files it could work ? |
| 23:52:37 | saratoga2 | gevaerts: that could be done |
| 23:52:48 | saratoga2 | but i figured it wasn't worthwhile |
| 23:52:55 | Unhelpful | toffe82: not all disk files are MTP files. |
| 23:53:26 | saratoga2 | i think that would only help if you installed rockbox, uninstalled using your saved file, then lost it and finally decided to reinstall |
| 23:53:29 | Unhelpful | the beast in OF exposes a music and a pictures folder, and an albums folder, and not a whole lot else. |
| 23:53:48 | | Join new [0] (n=58f417e5@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-9964e7b28bc5e34c) |
| 23:53:49 | toffe82 | yes, but the firmware is transfered by mtp and have an ID |
| 23:53:50 | | Join solexx [0] (n=jrschulz@e176103112.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 23:53:52 | gevaerts | saratoga2: it all depends on how many people reinstalled their OF from whatever source and then lost their nk.bin file |
| 23:53:53 | saratoga2 | i'm content for now to simply tell people to not lose the nk.bin if they want to reinstall |
| 23:53:56 | new | hi there |
| 23:54:07 | new | i need some help could you help me? |
| 23:54:24 | Unhelpful | toffe82: when you send it a new firmware file, it is a new mtp file, yes, but the installed firmware is not exposed as an mtp file |
| 23:54:29 | saratoga2 | and anyway, if someone lost the nk.bin they could always download a new one using google |
| 23:54:45 | saratoga2 | what matters is that we have a legit way to do it so that we don't tell people to distribute nk.bin files |
| 23:54:59 | saratoga2 | if other people want to do that then its there business as far as I'm concerned |
| 23:55:09 | gevaerts | new: it would help if we knew what sort of help :) |
| 23:55:59 | new | i installed rockbox, it works but when i join games or applications like metronome i can't exit |
| 23:56:15 | new | i'm reinstalling right now |
| 23:56:31 | Aurix_Lexico | what player do you have? |
| 23:56:40 | Unhelpful | there aren't actual "music" or "pictures" folders on disk at all, either, those are just names for collection objects in the mtp object hierarchy. the beast version stores all MTP objects under /contents ore such, in folders with hex names that i would imagine are partial file hashes or similar |
| 23:56:52 | new | ipod nano 2 GB |
| 23:56:58 | * | amiconn points new to the fine rockbox manual |
| 23:58:59 | new | i tried again |
icon identifies that the person is a core developer (has commit access).