| 00:03:02 | Unhelpful | pixelma: so, a reasonable mapping on ondio would be short press power for PF menu, long press quit PF, short press mode to select in album view, long press for context |
| 00:05:04 | Unhelpful | it's not doing anything on context yet, but i think it best to get the mappings set in this patch, then add bindings to bring up the context menu later, without having to worry then about finding a mapping for it, and possibly remap other buttons |
| 00:11:07 | Horscht | ok, seems i was able to sucessfully build the "database" tool. Only 2 major quirks: |
| 00:11:26 | Horscht | 1. It only built a linux version, i'd need a windows .exe |
| 00:11:50 | Horscht | 2. I don't know how to use it. It doesn't seem to have a help switch |
| 00:12:40 | pixelma | Unhelpful: one problem with this is that I'd expect different mappings in the track list (as lists in core rockbox - context menu on long right, menu on long mode). But I imagine this mapping to work best in the album view which has quite a different way of scrolling... |
| 00:14:13 | pixelma | maybe leave menu on long mode, and "up" for select (maybe additionally) and long "up" as context menu? As if the controls were rotated? |
| 00:14:26 | Unhelpful | pixelma: the core mapping will still be there in track view, since both views' mappings inherit STD_CONTEXT. i'm inserting the new mappings in the track list, so that you can use the same buttons for both if you want to, but if the core select and context actions seem more natural to the user, they should still work in the track list |
| 00:14:47 | | Quit bmbl ("Woah!") |
| 00:15:01 | Unhelpful | i could do up for select, as well - iirc that's what ended up being used on ondio with the PLA-based keymap |
| 00:15:42 | amiconn | Unhelpful: After cleaning up my album tagging and preparing 100x100 bmp files, I ran some further speed tests of PF on my recorder |
| 00:16:41 | Unhelpful | the bitmap size should only change the cache build time |
| 00:16:46 | amiconn | With 100x100, the cache build takes 7:50 (~230 albums) |
| 00:17:32 | amiconn | Interestingly, it still takes 5:00 when the bitmaps arent there, i.e. all the database querying is a significant part of the total cache build time |
| 00:18:04 | pixelma | Unhelpful: I could imagine that to be working (different actions in different screens), perhaps it feels weird though to have it on different buttons in the same plugin, oth "up" just sounds so unintuitive to me until I start thinking "well, scrolling is rotated too". I guess only trying out both will tell |
| 00:18:10 | | Join mrkiko [0] (n=IRCExplo@host33-108-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 00:19:27 | amiconn | This is with plain SVN; I should try the multiplication patch |
| 00:19:39 | | Quit ender` (" Pets are better than children because: 11. If they get pregnant, you can sell their children.") |
| 00:20:32 | Unhelpful | up current does nothing at all in album view... i could always make up the select/context button in album view only, use right for select/context in track view only, and use menu/mode for select in either. that would pretty much cover every reasonable way you might expect it to work, and the user can use whichever of those buttons seems most natural. |
| 00:20:41 | | Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection) |
| 00:20:54 | | Quit {phoenix} (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 00:20:55 | | Join Thundercloud [0] (i=thunderc@persistence.flat.devzero.co.uk) |
| 00:20:57 | Unhelpful | amiconn: i haven't even gotten around to making sure that that math works on the sim, although i'm reasonable sure it should. |
| 00:21:48 | | Join MethoS- [0] (n=lem@host-091-096-214-065.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 00:24:05 | | Join countrymonkey [0] (n=4b05639a@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-b5edea1560d134c4) |
| 00:25:54 | | Join wincent [0] (n=5b612bdf@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-86293daf5d708eff) |
| 00:26:04 | | Join killan_ [0] (n=nnscript@c-02fc70d5.06-397-67626721.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 00:26:34 | | Join pixelma_ [50] (n=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) |
| 00:26:34 | | Quit pixelma (Nick collision from services.) |
| 00:26:36 | | Join amiconn_ [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) |
| 00:26:36 | | Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.) |
| 00:26:46 | | Nick pixelma_ is now known as pixelma (n=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) |
| 00:26:46 | | Quit wincent (Client Quit) |
| 00:26:54 | | Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) |
| 00:27:51 | | Join Llorean [0] (n=DarkkOne@adsl-99-21-142-126.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 00:28:13 | | Join Thundercloud_ [0] (i=thunderc@persistence.flat.devzero.co.uk) |
| 00:29:05 | | Quit countrymonkey ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
| 00:29:45 | pixelma | Unhelpful: the only reason I thought "up" was to free "long mode" for the main menu again but it seems you can't avoid one difference between the two screens (use of right to scroll and select/context) if the track list should be intuitive... |
| 00:30:07 | | Join chrippa- [0] (n=chrippa@evangelion.se) |
| 00:30:34 | * | pixelma suggests rotating the track list too, not seriously ;) |
| 00:30:36 | gevaerts | bluebrother: could rbutil make use of an ipod-style SCSI extension with extra data, like the exact build revision and things like that? |
| 00:30:53 | Unhelpful | i think context should be a long press on the same button as select, whichever button that is. if menu has to share an button, it should be with quit, not select or context |
| 00:31:05 | gevaerts | I mean something like http://www.ipodlinux.org/wiki/Device_Information only probably a lot shorter |
| 00:31:05 | rasher | gevaerts: It already uses rockbox-info.txt |
| 00:31:25 | gevaerts | rasher: yes, but that could be from a different build if it |
| 00:31:39 | gevaerts | rasher: yes, but that could be from a different build if the DAP belongs to someone like me :) |
| 00:32:01 | gevaerts | Of course, maybe I'm not the exact user to optimise for |
| 00:32:18 | rasher | Maybe not |
| 00:32:32 | bluebrother | gevaerts: well, theoretically it could do that. I just have no idea how this would work on w32 and if that's another thing that requires root permissions on linux (I'd guess so) |
| 00:32:36 | linuxstb | I remember trying to find ways to implement that scsi command on the three main OSes - I was struggling... |
| 00:32:40 | Horscht | rasher, you pointed me towards the "database" tool earlier. I was able to build it, but it only compiles a linux binary, i'd need an .exe |
| 00:32:53 | Horscht | also, how do I use the tool? it doesn't have a help switch |
| 00:32:58 | gevaerts | ok. I'll forget that then |
| 00:32:59 | rasher | Horscht: No idea... |
| 00:33:01 | | Quit Thundercloud (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) |
| 00:33:02 | | Quit kushalone (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) |
| 00:33:05 | | Quit tarbo_ (Connection timed out) |
| 00:33:17 | rasher | Horscht: I've never actually used it. |
| 00:33:26 | bluebrother | gevaerts: how about putting the build info in the config.cfg file and write that to disk when connecting usb? |
| 00:33:37 | Horscht | ok, thanks |
| 00:34:11 | linuxstb | bluebrother: Implementing that scsi inquiry would be nice for rbutil though - it would allow differentiating the 32MB/64MB ipods |
| 00:34:35 | | Join wincent [0] (n=5b612bdf@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-172454dabebbd7e6) |
| 00:34:39 | Llorean | linuxstb: The OF reports the RAM size? |
| 00:34:57 | linuxstb | Llorean: Yes, see the URL gevaerts posted (search for RAM in that page) |
| 00:35:20 | Unhelpful | it seems to work in my sim - you can use short off for menu, long off for quit, and any of right, menu/mode, or up to select, except that up is scroll in track view, and right is scroll in album view |
| 00:35:30 | bluebrother | linuxstb: true. |
| 00:35:31 | Llorean | linuxstb: If the iPod "knows" this about itself, shouldn't the information also be somewhere in the firmware image file? |
| 00:35:47 | gevaerts | Llorean: it can probe I guess |
| 00:35:54 | | Part toffe82 |
| 00:35:56 | Llorean | So why can't we probe? |
| 00:35:59 | linuxstb | No, there's just one firmware image for the 5.5g |
| 00:36:09 | linuxstb | Llorean: We can probe... |
| 00:36:15 | Llorean | So why don't we? |
| 00:36:16 | linuxstb | Or rather, Rockbox can, rbutil can't. |
| 00:36:20 | | Quit killan (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 00:36:45 | bluebrother | hmm, does 4G+ also include mini2G? |
| 00:36:51 | Llorean | The 32gb build could just probe on boot, and update rockbox-info.txt, then on next update with util, the info file will tell which build to use. |
| 00:37:07 | Llorean | Then we drop the 32/64gb choice, always install 32, and have RBUtil check the .txt file before updates? |
| 00:37:16 | Llorean | install 32 *first time* I mean |
| 00:37:26 | linuxstb | Or just implement that scsi inquiry... |
| 00:37:34 | bluebrother | well, I'd use config.cfg to store the data though |
| 00:37:49 | gevaerts | bluebrother: I'd expect so. 4G is PP5020 and mini 2G is PP5021 |
| 00:37:50 | Llorean | bluebrother: Well, wherever you'd store it. :) |
| 00:37:52 | bluebrother | linuxstb: can I sg_inq on linux as user? |
| 00:38:32 | linuxstb | bluebrother: I don't know. Possibly not... |
| 00:38:36 | | Join kushalone [0] (n=kushal@12.169.180.178) |
| 00:39:01 | | Join tarbo [0] (n=me@unaffiliated/tarbo) |
| 00:39:27 | pixelma | Unhelpful: what button calls the menu in track list? |
| 00:39:48 | rasher | bluebrother: Seems you can |
| 00:39:55 | rasher | I just did, at least. |
| 00:40:03 | Unhelpful | the plugin menu is always a short press on off, a long press exits |
| 00:40:23 | linuxstb | rasher: And what does "ls -l /dev/sdX" show? |
| 00:40:40 | rasher | brw-rw−−−− 1 root floppy |
| 00:40:50 | linuxstb | Are you in the floppy group? |
| 00:40:51 | rasher | I happen to be a proud member of the floppy group |
| 00:41:03 | | Join Raminios [0] (n=561b7a65@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-4a15f274f3893dbd) |
| 00:41:06 | Raminios | hey |
| 00:41:08 | linuxstb | So the answer is probably no then, for most installs... |
| 00:41:10 | rasher | But through no action of mine, so it's likely most are? |
| 00:41:13 | Raminios | can anyone help me? |
| 00:41:37 | rasher | Well, maybe. I guess I might have changed that |
| 00:41:38 | linuxstb | rasher: Maybe so then... I remember adding myself to that group in the past though. |
| 00:41:49 | | Quit chrippa (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 00:41:51 | Raminios | Cany anyone help me out? |
| 00:41:56 | gevaerts | linuxstb: if the permissions are the same as for the block device, it's fine. You need write access there for the bootloader anyway |
| 00:42:11 | Raminios | hello? |
| 00:42:13 | bluebrother | rasher: well, didn't work for me |
| 00:42:16 | linuxstb | gevaerts: Yes, but this is for a main Rockbox install, which doesn't need root |
| 00:42:18 | Llorean | Raminios: 1) Have patience. 2) Read the channel guidelines linked in the topic. |
| 00:42:21 | gevaerts | Raminios: that's not easy to say. We have no idea what your problem is |
| 00:42:31 | linuxstb | Raminios: 3) Ask a question ;) |
| 00:42:32 | Raminios | okay |
| 00:42:32 | Raminios | sorry |
| 00:42:41 | Raminios | im trying to get iboy on to my ipod with rockbox |
| 00:42:43 | Llorean | linuxstb: I *think* that's actually in the guidelines. |
| 00:42:49 | Raminios | and when i try to use it the roms dotn appear? |
| 00:42:52 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 00:42:53 | Llorean | Raminios: Do you mean the Rockbox gameboy emulator? iBoy is the iPodlinux one. |
| 00:42:56 | linuxstb | Llorean: You mean you haven't read them? ;) |
| 00:42:58 | | Quit wincent ("CGI:IRC") |
| 00:43:04 | bluebrother | 4) interrupt discussions :) |
| 00:43:05 | Llorean | linuxstb: Sometimes they change when I'm not looking... |
| 00:43:16 | bluebrother | or is that not part of the guidelines? :P |
| 00:43:20 | linuxstb | 5) Make pointless lists |
| 00:43:27 | Raminios | well i looked at a tutorial that said that iboy should work with rockbox |
| 00:43:36 | gevaerts | linuxstb: true, but this is mostly needed for the first install, which is *probably* the same run as the bootloader. Also we have the nice fallback of just installing the 32MB build |
| 00:43:51 | Llorean | Raminios: iBoy does not, and should not. It runs in iPodLinux. Please see the Rockbox manual for instructions on how to use our gameboy emulator. |
| 00:44:00 | Raminios | I cant use your one |
| 00:44:05 | Raminios | ive got a mini which isnt supported |
| 00:44:06 | | Join wincent [0] (n=5b611b3c@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-f08e5ef28bef2ff9) |
| 00:44:15 | | Join T-Man [0] (n=anthnsct@76.177.217.42) |
| 00:44:28 | Raminios | And ipodlinux has shut its premade binary thing down which is annoying |
| 00:44:30 | linuxstb | Raminios: Then you will need to install ipodlinux (or if you're a programmer, fix our emulator). |
| 00:44:32 | T-Man | Having trouble here.. hopefully some help |
| 00:44:40 | Raminios | thats the thing |
| 00:44:42 | gevaerts | so how do you propose to run an ipodlinux program on rockbox? |
| 00:44:43 | Llorean | Raminios: Where on our website does it say the Mini isn't supported? |
| 00:44:45 | Raminios | i cant install ipodlinux either |
| 00:44:53 | Llorean | Or do you mean Rockboy doesn't run on it? |
| 00:45:05 | Raminios | thats what i mean |
| 00:45:12 | linuxstb | Raminios: We can't help you with ipodlinux though - this is strictly a Rockbox channel. |
| 00:45:19 | Raminios | Yeah |
| 00:45:24 | Llorean | Well, iBoy cannot run in Rockbox without rewriting the program. |
| 00:45:31 | T-Man | Im sure you've heard of this... I have a clone ipod.. Lisong Wilson .... 4 gb.. want to replace the firmware with rockbox.. this possible??? |
| 00:45:39 | Raminios | How would i do such a thing? |
| 00:45:42 | rasher | T-Man: No. |
| 00:45:44 | Llorean | T-Man: No. Most clones are entirely different on the inside. |
| 00:45:55 | T-Man | k.. |
| 00:45:59 | linuxstb | Raminios: Do what? |
| 00:46:00 | T-Man | so i'm stuck with it? |
| 00:46:05 | bluebrother | T-Man: yes |
| 00:46:11 | Raminios | rewrite the program |
| 00:46:12 | pixelma | Unhelpful: that's what I meant when thinking about "mode" vs. "up" in the album view. In the track list I would expect menu to be on long mode, so if one uses "up" in the album view you can have long mode for calling the menu in both screens. And even if a short mode isn't used then, I'd at least expect long mode for menu to be working in this case because that's how lists work in the core (short menu is resume) |
| 00:46:12 | T-Man | no other firmware can replacet this firmware? |
| 00:46:13 | | Quit robin0800 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 00:46:14 | Llorean | Raminios: If you have to ask the question, you probably can't do it. A lot of the work is the process of actually answering that question. |
| 00:46:25 | Raminios | okay |
| 00:46:38 | Raminios | So is there no other way to play game boy with rockbox? |
| 00:46:46 | bluebrother | Raminios: by using a text editor and a compiler |
| 00:47:01 | Raminios | How would i do that? |
| 00:47:07 | pixelma | Unhelpful: at least additionally. But as you can see, I'm undecided... |
| 00:47:45 | bluebrother | hmm, my mini2g doesn't like sg_inq -p 0xc0 :( |
| 00:47:55 | Raminios | Anyone? |
| 00:48:08 | Llorean | Raminios: Remember that "patience" thing I mentioned right at the beginning? |
| 00:48:22 | | Join moos [0] (i=Mustapha@rockbox/staff/moos) |
| 00:48:31 | gevaerts | Raminios: the easiest way would be to fix rockboy to work on the mini |
| 00:48:36 | T-Man | so the firmware chip on the ipod close is different from the Ipod?? |
| 00:48:36 | bluebrother | hmm, using −−hex helps :) |
| 00:48:43 | Llorean | Raminios: You cannot play gameboy games without an emulator. You cannot get a working emulator on your iPod without solving the programming problems. You need to know C, at the very least, and how to program for Rockbox. |
| 00:48:52 | Raminios | yeah i dont know if ive disconnected or anything |
| 00:49:11 | Raminios | this is the first time ive ever been on one of these things (llorean) |
| 00:49:14 | | Quit wincent ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 00:49:22 | bluebrother | Raminios: patience. You could also experience a lag between irc servers |
| 00:49:32 | Llorean | T-Man: All of the hardware is different. |
| 00:49:43 | Raminios | bluebrother: ^ |
| 00:50:00 | T-Man | I figured the device are the same.. except for the firmware |
| 00:50:13 | Llorean | No. |
| 00:50:18 | Llorean | We've never encountered one that is the same. |
| 00:50:53 | midgey | i think I posted a patch to add rockboy for the greyscale ipods |
| 00:51:08 | Raminios | midgey: Oh? |
| 00:51:09 | pixelma | Rockboy on Mini would need two fixes - one is the graphics driver and the other is 1st gen Minis which don't have a "touch" wheel |
| 00:51:18 | Raminios | im a 2nd gen mini |
| 00:51:38 | midgey | FS #7546 |
| 00:51:50 | midgey | it's not complete and its been over a year since I've tried it |
| 00:52:26 | Raminios | What do i do with this then? |
| 00:52:36 | Llorean | Raminios: You still need to be able to compile Rockbox. |
| 00:52:36 | Raminios | all this text i mean |
| 00:52:38 | midgey | apply the patch, and compile rockbox |
| 00:52:38 | Unhelpful | pixelma: so you would suggest that the off button be used for dedicated quit, long press of mode for the menu, right for select/context in track list, up for select/context in album list? that's very close to what PLA would do, if the contexts had each only provided the actions that each view needed... |
| 00:52:39 | | Quit T-Man () |
| 00:52:49 | | Join wincent [0] (n=wincent@host-091-097-030-116.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 00:52:55 | | Part wincent ("Kopete 0.12.7 : http://kopete.kde.org") |
| 00:52:59 | Raminios | but i mean what do i do with the text?? |
| 00:53:11 | Raminios | im completely new to this so sorry if im useless |
| 00:53:17 | Llorean | Raminios: It's a patch. Learn to compile, read about what patches are. |
| 00:53:24 | Raminios | okay |
| 00:53:26 | Raminios | where? |
| 00:53:29 | Raminios | :P |
| 00:53:40 | Llorean | Search for compiling in the Rockbox wiki. |
| 00:53:50 | Raminios | thanks |
| 00:54:01 | Llorean | It's possibly going to require at least *some* knowledge of C to get the patch cleaned up. |
| 00:54:09 | Raminios | Whats c? |
| 00:54:17 | | Join saratoga [0] (n=9803c6dd@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-48ecee00b4a0386a) |
| 00:54:22 | pixelma | Unhelpful: I'm not sure, I'd like to try both and see how it feels... as I said my first reaction was that "up" is unintuitive to select something - until you start thinking about it |
| 00:54:59 | Raminios | Oh and theres no compiling wiki |
| 00:55:07 | Raminios | i searched and got nothing |
| 00:55:33 | saratoga | did you guys really just tell some guy who can't work a wiki to learn to program? |
| 00:55:49 | | Join wincent [0] (n=wincent@host-091-097-030-116.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 00:55:49 | Raminios | ah never mind |
| 00:55:53 | saratoga | honestly, that seems almost malicious |
| 00:55:58 | Raminios | Hm |
| 00:56:05 | Raminios | Im irght here by the way |
| 00:56:14 | Llorean | saratoga: No, I told him he's going to need to learn to program to accomplish his goal. |
| 00:56:18 | Raminios | im not a complete computer retard |
| 00:56:29 | saratoga | you should probably have told him he is incapable of accomplishing his goal |
| 00:56:30 | Raminios | im just completely neew to rockbox |
| 00:56:32 | Llorean | Raminios: I didn't say to search for a compiling wiki. I said to search the Rockbox wiki FOR compiling. And I know that gets results. |
| 00:56:45 | Raminios | so do i now :D |
| 00:57:06 | Llorean | Number of topics: 33 |
| 00:57:13 | Llorean | C is a programming language |
| 00:57:17 | Llorean | The internet is covered in information about C. |
| 00:57:22 | Raminios | okay |
| 00:57:53 | gevaerts | saratoga: have you had a chance to try FS #10015 ? |
| 00:58:09 | Raminios | is there no simple way for me to use this text that midgey uploaded? |
| 00:58:23 | midgey | not really |
| 00:58:27 | saratoga | gevaerts: sadly i've only been home for a few hours since you last asked me, i used them to sleep |
| 00:58:37 | gevaerts | saratoga: always wise :) |
| 00:58:44 | BigBambi | Raminios: That isn't "text", it is a source code patch, and no |
| 00:58:56 | Raminios | well its writtne in words and symbols |
| 00:59:12 | BigBambi | ... |
| 00:59:17 | Raminios | ... |
| 00:59:20 | bluebrother | omg |
| 00:59:29 | Llorean | Raminios: Source code is written in words too. It's |
| 00:59:45 | Raminios | i know, but the source code patch is written in text |
| 00:59:52 | bluebrother | no |
| 00:59:58 | Raminios | i just couldnt be bothered to type source code patch |
| 01:00 |
| 01:00:06 | Raminios | its too late and im tired |
| 01:00:11 | bluebrother | it's a special format that holds the difference between two source files |
| 01:00:16 | | Join Thundercloud__ [0] (i=thunderc@persistence.flat.devzero.co.uk) |
| 01:00:18 | bluebrother | it's called "unified diff" to be exact. |
| 01:00:22 | | Quit tvelocity (Remote closed the connection) |
| 01:00:23 | Raminios | okay |
| 01:00:25 | saratoga | hey can you guys take this to some other channel |
| 01:00:33 | Raminios | how would i do that? |
| 01:00:37 | BigBambi | Everything is written in text in that it is symbols and words |
| 01:00:44 | Raminios | exactly |
| 01:00:49 | bluebrother | commonly known as diff or patch as that is the program that can apply a diff |
| 01:00:53 | Llorean | saratoga: Well, getting started with compiling is kinda on-topic here when it's Rockbox compiling. |
| 01:01:09 | saratoga | honestly, compiling seems like it could go in community anyway |
| 01:01:10 | Llorean | Raminios: At this point though, you really need to stop and learn about the basics via the internet, and come back when you have questions about Rockbox-specific parts of it. |
| 01:01:15 | saratoga | no need to log it |
| 01:01:47 | Raminios | im learning now |
| 01:02:05 | Raminios | im only ever going to use this source code patch anyway |
| 01:02:15 | bluebrother | learning ... 1% ... 2% ... 3% ... |
| 01:02:28 | BigBambi | saratoga: It has already been discussed many times and decided that support should remain in #rockbox, has it not? |
| 01:02:30 | mrkiko | :) |
| 01:02:40 | | Join Thundercloud [0] (i=thunderc@persistence.flat.devzero.co.uk) |
| 01:02:42 | Llorean | Raminios: The point is, though, this channel here isn't to teach you fundamentals. It's here for stuff that only applies to Rockbox,. |
| 01:02:50 | saratoga | yes but this isn't rockbox support |
| 01:02:56 | Raminios | okay |
| 01:03:03 | Raminios | it was originally |
| 01:03:12 | BigBambi | saratoga: No, but compiling Rockbox is |
| 01:03:15 | Raminios | i asked how to get game boy emulator onto rockbox |
| 01:03:24 | amiconn | Unhelpful: Looks like the math is working, but there is no measurable speed advantage. My two tests in fact show the opposite - 8:25 with the patch |
| 01:03:28 | | Quit Thundercloud_ (Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable)) |
| 01:03:35 | bluebrother | well, and you got the answer that you need to do programming work to get that done. |
| 01:03:44 | | Quit bertrik ("Leaving") |
| 01:03:46 | | Quit flydutch ("/* empty */") |
| 01:04:11 | amiconn | Could be uncertainties due to the fact that the .pfraw files might end up differently on the file system when they're rewritten |
| 01:04:18 | | Quit Thundercloud__ (Success) |
| 01:04:20 | mrkiko | Rockbox is not symbian - people needs to code cleanly... :) |
| 01:04:35 | Raminios | is cygwin the best one to use? |
| 01:04:53 | bluebrother | the best to use for what? |
| 01:04:59 | Unhelpful | amiconn: that's bizarre! the asm certainly looked like we were changing a call to the multiply routine into a single hardware multiply, i can't imagine how that can be a loss :/ |
| 01:05:02 | amiconn | Unhelpful: Eh, ignore that, /me silly |
| 01:05:05 | Raminios | compiling |
| 01:05:16 | bluebrother | well, it works. |
| 01:05:35 | * | amiconn built without the patch |
| 01:05:53 | amiconn | −−dry-run, then svn upped, the forgot to patch for real... |
| 01:06:18 | | Quit bluebrother ("leaving") |
| 01:07:08 | | Quit ze ("moving into new case") |
| 01:08:14 | * | linuxstb did that once when testing something for jhMikeS... |
| 01:11:03 | saratoga | in codecs, is it bad form to pass the ci pointer into the depths of the codec library? |
| 01:11:26 | saratoga | i'm wondering about requesting compressed audio from the codec buffer specifically |
| 01:11:48 | linuxstb | I would just declare it as a global variable in the main .c file, and reference that from the other files, if needed. |
| 01:12:11 | Unhelpful | saratoga: i believe it doesn't ever need to be passed, it's a loader-initialized global |
| 01:12:20 | * | linuxstb forgot that... |
| 01:12:42 | saratoga | do have to declare it as an extern in each file then? |
| 01:12:55 | saratoga | i can never remember how c variable scoping works |
| 01:12:59 | * | Unhelpful is pretty sure the codecs header covers that |
| 01:13:30 | linuxstb | saratoga: Or extern in a commonly included .h |
| 01:13:31 | saratoga | you mean put hte header in more then just the main codec file? |
| 01:14:00 | Unhelpful | i don't think you could reasonably declare it extern without including that header, anyway, since it's a massive/complex structure. |
| 01:14:25 | saratoga | Unhelpful: you're talking about CODEC_HEADER or just including codecs.h? |
| 01:15:54 | Unhelpful | saratoga: huh. i'm rather surprised to see it not declared extern in codecs.h |
| 01:16:04 | amiconn | Unhelpful: 8:15 now with the patch. Tiny speedup.... |
| 01:16:52 | Unhelpful | amiconn: probably still worth applying, i'd expect it's a tiny size savings as well. probably *not* worth coding that 16x32->32 multiply to use in the v-scaler |
| 01:17:03 | amiconn | I think the db search is killing it |
| 01:17:46 | amiconn | Looks like the album art search function sets up a new db query for each album |
| 01:18:10 | * | amiconn wonders whether Mr. tagcache has a better idea |
| 01:18:13 | amiconn | Slasheri:? |
| 01:18:46 | Unhelpful | any ideas how best to remedy? the tagcache is a bit of a mystery to me, when i tried to write code that touched it, the result had huge performance differences across my two targets |
| 01:19:56 | amiconn | Btw, the initial cache loading in PF takes about 20 seconds on the recorder when I don't scroll around meanwhile |
| 01:20:24 | amiconn | Dunno how many slides are loaded |
| 01:21:35 | Unhelpful | i'm not sure how big the audio buffer is, but the slide cache has a hard limit of 64 items, and i would be surprised if the audio buffer doesn't have enough space to fill it |
| 01:21:59 | amiconn | Disk starts spinning after I pressed 'Right' 35 times |
| 01:22:28 | amiconn | Hmm, but when moving further, it starts again every other slide? |
| 01:23:35 | amiconn | That's even independent of the direction... |
| 01:23:36 | Unhelpful | yes, right now the cache is *always* kept centered when it's not pinned against one of the ends of the album list. i was working on changing that, but got a bit sidetracked by keymap stuff |
| 01:24:20 | | Part wincent ("Kopete 0.12.7 : http://kopete.kde.org") |
| 01:24:41 | | Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection) |
| 01:30:07 | | Join Reptile211 [0] (n=chatzill@host-216-66-248-9.static.linkline.com) |
| 01:31:48 | | Quit Raminios ("CGI:IRC") |
| 01:32:10 | Unhelpful | amiconn: right... the "right" way, i think, is to let the cache "float" until the center slide comes within a certain margin of the cache edge, and then recenter it in one big load. |
| 01:32:16 | gevaerts | What does Prefetch abort mean? i.e. where do I look for the problem? |
| 01:33:05 | amiconn | Unhelpful: Yes, perhaps even biased a bit depending on the direction the user is moving into |
| 01:34:44 | Unhelpful | i don't know if that's actually needed, because if the user is holding the scroll button, it is unlikely the disk would *ever* get to spin down. the same goes for color targets with small plugin buffers, where the cache size will always be too small for a margin to be kept. |
| 01:42:32 | amiconn | No, but if you're going slowly through the collection, the disk will spin down inbetween. And applying a bias will make it spin up less often, provided the heuristics are correct (user won't change direction too often) |
| 01:42:45 | | Quit Reptile211 ("ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.7/2009021910]") |
| 01:44:24 | | Quit MethoS- (Remote closed the connection) |
| 01:44:38 | | Quit mrkiko (Remote closed the connection) |
| 01:46:57 | Unhelpful | i checked with upscaling, as well, using a 16x16->32 multiply doesn't break either scaler, at least when i force the sim to use the same C math. i'll go ahead and commit the optimization, even if it's entirely hidden by query / file search delay right now :/ |
| 01:50:16 | | Quit gevaerts (Nick collision from services.) |
| 01:50:25 | | Join gevaerts [0] (n=fg@rockbox/developer/gevaerts) |
| 01:51:14 | Ctcp | Ping from gevaerts!n=fg@rockbox/developer/gevaerts |
| 01:52:41 | | Join gartral [0] (n=gareth@75.33.64.115) |
| 01:52:44 | | Part gartral |
| 01:54:26 | | Quit gregorovius () |
| 01:58:14 | | Quit midijunkie (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 01:59:22 | | Part eragon|busy |
| 02:00 |
| 02:08:38 | | Quit moos ("Rockbox rules the DAP world") |
| 02:11:49 | | Quit tessarakt (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 02:16:49 | | Nick krazykit` is now known as krazykit (n=kkit@adsl-69-219-239-157.dsl.ipltin.sbcglobal.net) |
| 02:20:28 | | Join lightbul1jim [0] (n=jim@203.171.93.108.static.rev.aanet.com.au) |
| 02:22:34 | | Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (n=miepel@p579EC886.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 02:25:54 | | Join lightbul2jim [0] (n=jim@203.171.93.108.static.rev.aanet.com.au) |
| 02:27:21 | | Join Thundercloud [0] (i=thunderc@persistence.flat.devzero.co.uk) |
| 02:32:09 | | Quit lightbul1jim (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) |
| 02:35:56 | | Join midgey_ [0] (n=tjross@71.238.148.140) |
| 02:36:02 | | Quit lightbulbjim (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 02:36:24 | | Join lightbulbjim [0] (n=jim@203.171.93.108.static.rev.aanet.com.au) |
| 02:37:45 | | Quit BUMBACL0T () |
| 02:42:54 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 02:45:07 | | Join Strife89 [0] (n=nds@204.116.244.200) |
| 02:48:23 | | Quit Lss () |
| 02:48:49 | | Quit midgey (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 02:48:57 | | Nick midgey_ is now known as midgey (n=tjross@71.238.148.140) |
| 02:51:21 | | Quit lightbul2jim (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 03:00 |
| 03:02:10 | | Quit yhuang ("Leaving") |
| 03:13:34 | | Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection) |
| 03:16:50 | | Join planetbeing [0] (n=planetbe@pool-173-74-164-158.dllstx.fios.verizon.net) |
| 03:18:04 | | Part Strife89 |
| 03:20:03 | | Quit StealthyXIIGer (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 03:20:12 | | Join StealthyXIIGer [0] (n=stealthy@c-68-62-18-116.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) |
| 03:26:51 | | Join Aurix_Lexico [0] (n=comrade@c-68-56-205-239.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 03:30:32 | | Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 03:31:01 | | Join BUMBACL0T [0] (n=ORF@unaffiliated/bumbacl0t) |
| 03:36:46 | | Part midgey |
| 03:43:05 | | Quit advcomp2019 (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 03:43:28 | | Join advcomp2019 [0] (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) |
| 03:45:22 | | Join Darksair [0] (n=user@123.112.113.41) |
| 04:00 |
| 04:03:08 | | Quit Aurix_Lexico ("Leaving.") |
| 04:12:19 | | Quit planetbeing () |
| 04:13:49 | | Quit XavierGr () |
| 04:18:20 | | Join jordoex [0] (n=quassel@d154-20-41-212.bchsia.telus.net) |
| 04:21:15 | | Join HelpMe [0] (n=47b4e387@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-a3aba06f243b8149) |
| 04:21:22 | HelpMe | hello |
| 04:21:45 | | Quit HelpMe (Client Quit) |
| 04:21:48 | rasher | Zambezi: check the IpodAccessories wiki page |
| 04:21:50 | | Join HelpMe [0] (n=47b4e387@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-26ef551ae13a6b74) |
| 04:22:11 | | Quit dfkt ("-= SysReset 2.53=- Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn.") |
| 04:22:21 | | Join blkhawk- [0] (n=blkhawk@f051142246.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 04:22:26 | rasher | Zambezi: But note that many of the tested accessories were tested before Rockbox got any sort of support for the accessory protocol |
| 04:22:36 | HelpMe | i need help |
| 04:22:52 | HelpMe | downloaded bootloader but wont detect ipod |
| 04:23:09 | rasher | Which iPod, and what are you using to install? |
| 04:23:21 | HelpMe | 5th gen 80gb |
| 04:23:32 | HelpMe | i download the ipodpatcher |
| 04:23:39 | rasher | I suggest using rbutil |
| 04:23:43 | HelpMe | says no ipod found |
| 04:23:51 | HelpMe | what rbuti |
| 04:23:56 | HelpMe | oh yeah |
| 04:23:58 | HelpMe | i tried that |
| 04:24:11 | HelpMe | i used auto detect and it stilll said no ipod connected |
| 04:24:27 | rasher | Is it formatted as fat32? |
| 04:24:36 | HelpMe | how do i check |
| 04:25:14 | rasher | No idea, to be honest. |
| 04:26:23 | | Quit sarixe ("Leaving") |
| 04:26:55 | | Join AndyIL [0] (i=AndyI@212.14.205.32) |
| 04:28:39 | rasher | HelpMe: What is the exact output of ipodpatcher, and which OS are you running it on? |
| 04:29:06 | rasher | Put the output on a pastebin |
| 04:29:11 | soap | rasher: if he has a mini, none of the remotes should work. |
| 04:29:38 | soap | as, IIRC, only the dock serial port is supported. But now that I say that something is itching the back of my brain. |
| 04:29:42 | rasher | soap: Ah, didn't notice it was a mini (nor did I know that those don't work) |
| 04:30:19 | soap | Don't the minis use the 4 pin remote socket next to the headphone jack? |
| 04:30:48 | soap | HelpMe: what material is the front of your iPod? Plastic or metal? |
| 04:31:08 | HelpMe | its 5th gen im positive |
| 04:31:42 | HelpMe | ipodpatcher v3.0 with v3.0 bootloaders - (C) Dave Chapman 2006-2007 This is free software; see the source for copying conditions. There is NO warranty; not even for MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. [INFO] Scanning disk devices... [ERR] No ipods found, aborting [ERR] Please connect your ipod and ensure it is in disk mode [ERR] Please refer to the Rockbox manual if you continue to have prob |
| 04:31:45 | soap | HelpMe: what material is the front of your iPod? Plastic or metal? |
| 04:32:16 | HelpMe | plastic i think =/ |
| 04:32:27 | HelpMe | im on vista alos |
| 04:32:29 | HelpMe | also |
| 04:33:34 | soap | http://www.ipodlinux.org/wiki/Generations#Fifth_Generation_.285G.29_.2F_Fifth_Generation_Enhanced_.285.5G.29 |
| 04:33:38 | soap | 5th or 6th? |
| 04:33:48 | HelpMe | its fifth |
| 04:33:51 | soap | And if fifth, are you running as admin? |
| 04:33:58 | | Join faemir [0] (n=quassel@host86-130-15-147.range86-130.btcentralplus.com) |
| 04:34:28 | HelpMe | yes |
| 04:34:56 | soap | ipodservice.exe running? |
| 04:35:18 | HelpMe | uhm hold on |
| 04:35:33 | HelpMe | no |
| 04:36:05 | soap | ituneshelper running? |
| 04:36:21 | HelpMe | yes |
| 04:36:39 | soap | kill it |
| 04:37:02 | HelpMe | ok |
| 04:37:24 | HelpMe | patcher still not working |
| 04:37:37 | soap | connecting through a hub or a front usb port? |
| 04:37:47 | HelpMe | front usb |
| 04:37:49 | | Quit AndyI (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 04:38:22 | soap | move the cable to the back |
| 04:38:28 | HelpMe | ... |
| 04:38:30 | HelpMe | ok |
| 04:39:04 | | Quit blkhawk (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 04:39:20 | | Nick blkhawk- is now known as blkhawk (n=blkhawk@f051142246.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 04:40:40 | HelpMe | ok |
| 04:40:50 | soap | and as soon as your player is detected by windows, in disk mode according to the iPod screen, and shows up as a drive letter try again. |
| 04:40:55 | Zambezi | I'm looking for a mp3-player, Rockboxsupported, with the possibilty to replace/add my CF-card and common, not refubrished. Any recommendation? |
| 04:41:30 | HelpMe | same |
| 04:41:58 | HelpMe | same results as before |
| 04:42:56 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 04:43:30 | soap | and what does RBUtil say? |
| 04:43:59 | | Quit HelpMe ("CGI:IRC") |
| 04:44:10 | | Join HelpMe [0] (n=47b4e387@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-2f33974d6fcf952e) |
| 04:44:14 | HelpMe | sorry |
| 04:44:17 | HelpMe | hold on |
| 04:44:21 | HelpMe | hold on |
| 04:45:05 | HelpMe | no ipod detected! |
| 04:46:12 | soap | rockbox utility −−> about −−> system info |
| 04:46:21 | soap | paste that to pastebin.ca and post the link here. |
| 04:47:24 | HelpMe | http://pastebin.ca/1360466 |
| 04:48:40 | soap | dang - I'm grasping at straws now. |
| 04:48:52 | soap | did you try to manually pick your iPod mountpoint and iPod type? |
| 04:48:58 | soap | (with RBUtil) |
| 04:49:12 | rasher | soap: I don't think that'll help the bootloader install |
| 04:49:30 | HelpMe | yeah i tired |
| 04:49:35 | HelpMe | stil didnt detect |
| 04:50:22 | soap | linux stb and bluebrother will be in in the (european) morning. They are the creators of the respective software (space inserted to avoid pinging this late) |
| 04:51:36 | HelpMe | what time is it there now |
| 04:51:41 | HelpMe | \im on est |
| 04:52:08 | soap | 5am |
| 04:52:46 | HelpMe | ok then =/ |
| 04:52:48 | soap | regardless - let's check one last thing. Does iTunes recognize the iPod and does the Apple firmware work correctly? |
| 04:52:55 | HelpMe | thanks for the help attempts |
| 04:52:57 | | Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable)) |
| 04:53:20 | HelpMe | yeah itunes detcts it |
| 04:53:38 | soap | poop |
| 04:54:10 | HelpMe | ok thanks |
| 04:54:18 | HelpMe | ill try to check tomorrow |
| 04:54:25 | | Quit HelpMe ("CGI:IRC") |
| 04:54:37 | | Join sarixe [0] (n=sarixe@68.239.154.103) |
| 04:56:39 | | Quit Darksair ("Do you hear that? This is the sound of inevitability. This is the sound of your death, Mr. Anderson.") |
| 05:00 |
| 05:01:39 | | Join ze [0] (i=ze@76.91.72.105) |
| 05:04:04 | | Quit ze (Client Quit) |
| 05:07:08 | | Quit advcomp2019 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 05:07:29 | | Join advcomp2019 [0] (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) |
| 05:08:19 | | Quit advcomp2019 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 05:08:39 | | Join advcomp2019 [0] (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) |
| 05:09:23 | | Quit advcomp2019 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 05:09:43 | | Join advcomp2019 [0] (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) |
| 05:12:20 | | Join lightbul1jim [0] (n=jim@203.171.93.108.static.rev.aanet.com.au) |
| 05:18:43 | | Join insanepotato [0] (n=chatzill@c114-77-52-42.brodm3.vic.optusnet.com.au) |
| 05:19:47 | insanepotato | hello, can someone please inform me about the status of the beatbox plugin? i noticed that the copy from svn doesn't compile, and there is no flyspray |
| 05:19:48 | | Join lightbul2jim [0] (n=jim@203.171.93.108.static.rev.aanet.com.au) |
| 05:25:47 | | Quit lightbulbjim (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 05:31:41 | | Quit efyx (Remote closed the connection) |
| 05:33:36 | | Quit faemir ("No Ping reply in 30 seconds.") |
| 05:33:50 | | Join faemir [0] (n=quassel@host86-130-15-147.range86-130.btcentralplus.com) |
| 05:36:14 | | Quit lightbul1jim (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 05:41:06 | | Quit kushalone ("Leaving. I cannot promise to be back but most likely will.") |
| 05:46:47 | | Join ze [0] (i=ze@76.91.72.105) |
| 05:51:26 | Llorean | insanepotato: The status of SVN compiling can be seen in the build table... |
| 05:52:40 | Llorean | insanepotato: I wasn't even aware there was a "beatbox" plugin in SVN. What are you referring to, exactly? |
| 05:53:03 | | Join BHSPitLappy [0] (n=BHSPitLa@unaffiliated/bhspitmonkey) |
| 05:53:28 | insanepotato | when i check out the source from svn, the plugin in apps/plugins/beatbox |
| 05:53:51 | | Quit ze ("damn warm gpu") |
| 05:54:41 | Llorean | That one isn't supposed to compile, that's why it's commented out. |
| 05:54:58 | | Join midgey [0] (n=tjross@71.238.148.140) |
| 05:55:52 | insanepotato | is that due to lack of interest or because of something else? because i was thinking of posting a patch to get it working =D |
| 05:56:19 | rasher | insanepotato: Lack of work put into it. |
| 05:58:01 | insanepotato | from what i saw, all that it needs to work is keymaps, and a few minor erros. i got it running on my c200 =] |
| 05:58:28 | Unhelpful | well, if somebody steps up to do the work, there might be a reason to not comment it out :) |
| 05:59:01 | insanepotato | i'll make some keymaps =] |
| 06:00 |
| 06:08:31 | | Quit z35 ("Leaving") |
| 06:10:29 | | Join dmb [0] (n=dmb@unaffiliated/dmb) |
| 06:10:42 | dmb | hey, any of you familiar with the sansa e200 v2? |
| 06:10:49 | dmb | i'm trying to build the development version |
| 06:11:00 | dmb | can't quite figure out how to put the build on the device though :/ |
| 06:11:53 | | Join ze [0] (i=ze@76.91.72.105) |
| 06:13:14 | insanepotato | dmb: "make zip"? |
| 06:13:28 | dmb | insanepotato, that makes a zipfile |
| 06:13:38 | dmb | the AMS device requires a .bin file to replace the firmware |
| 06:14:17 | insanepotato | sorry, i thought it would be simple like other devices ^^" |
| 06:15:10 | dmb | yeh, this device isn't fully supported yet |
| 06:15:16 | dmb | interested in development of it though |
| 06:17:36 | | Join SUSaiyan [0] (n=SUSaiyan@cc84863-b.zwoll1.ov.home.nl) |
| 06:18:24 | | Quit SUSaiyan` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 06:22:07 | | Quit lightbul2jim (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 06:22:15 | Llorean | dmb: There should be instructions on the wiki pages for the AMS sansa targets. If you read through the thread and pages it should be explained somewhere. |
| 06:25:29 | dmb | i just found a 40 page thread |
| 06:25:31 | dmb | but thats about it |
| 06:26:31 | rasher | dmb: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaAMS#Bootloader_Installation |
| 06:26:31 | Llorean | There are also wiki pages about them |
| 06:26:48 | dmb | rasher, thanks, i missed that |
| 06:26:55 | dmb | thanks for the help both of you |
| 06:26:56 | Llorean | dmb: Remember, it's a development version. There's tons of work to be done, and you really should familiarize yourself with the various documentation to see where you can pitch in. |
| 06:31:14 | rasher | Looks like the AMS install method is similar to the coldfire irivers |
| 06:33:43 | | Quit StealthyXIIGer (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 06:33:58 | | Join StealthyXIIGer [0] (n=stealthy@c-68-62-18-116.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) |
| 06:35:13 | | Quit StealthyXIIGer (Client Quit) |
| 06:42:58 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 06:47:00 | | Join sir_yodle [0] (n=theyon@pool-141-152-46-244.rcmdva.btas.verizon.net) |
| 06:49:32 | | Join midijunkie [0] (n=Miranda@pD95442C7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 07:00 |
| 07:20:20 | | Quit midijunkie (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 07:27:06 | midgey | gevaerts: (for the logs) I've been messing around with your itunes work a bit more. If I use your work as is and pretend to be an ipod mini (changing ata.c config-ipod4g.h etc) it is not recognized as an ipod. |
| 07:27:28 | midgey | As soon as i change product to "iPod" iTunes detects the device but cannot read it and gets stuck |
| 07:28:12 | midgey | unplugging the ipod gives the message "An iPod has been detected, but it could not identified properly. <snip>" |
| 07:29:04 | midgey | also, I dumped the xml info from my 4g since it's different than the one in your patch - it made no difference |
| 07:29:48 | midgey | also the OF and RB use different endpoints, but I don't think that matters. same with bcdDevice, but once again probably not important |
| 07:30:12 | midgey | i'll check the logs tomorrow |
| 07:31:14 | midgey | (also this is on OS X 10.5.6, iTunes 8.1) |
| 07:33:31 | rasher | I'm pretty sure I was using iTunes 7.something |
| 07:33:47 | rasher | Though you'd think they'd act similarly |
| 07:34:21 | | Quit kachna (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 07:42:05 | | Quit Foxx- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 07:45:06 | lucent | kugel: Hi, I will attempt to review rockbox on 8gb fuze in March month, but not tonight |
| 07:45:36 | lucent | kugel: I am delayed by ext4 filesystem debugging and some other unrelated data loss problems |
| 07:46:02 | lucent | (for the logs) |
| 07:52:37 | | Quit BHSPitLappy ("Ex-Chat") |
| 08:00 |
| 08:13:58 | | Quit Seed ("cu, Andre") |
| 08:19:44 | | Join Seed [0] (n=ben@bzq-84-108-232-45.cablep.bezeqint.net) |
| 08:35:50 | | Join flydutch [0] (n=flydutch@host238-166-dynamic.15-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 08:37:31 | | Join lightbulbjim [0] (n=jim@203.171.93.108.static.rev.aanet.com.au) |
| 08:42:59 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 08:44:30 | | Join Rob2222 [0] (n=Miranda@p4FDCCEA3.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:45:42 | | Join bertrik [0] (n=bertrik@ip117-49-211-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) |
| 08:58:15 | | Join Foxx- [0] (n=Foxx@pool-141-157-246-7.ny325.east.verizon.net) |
| 09:00 |
| 09:04:33 | | Join nibbler_ [0] (n=Nibbler@pD9E32709.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 09:14:29 | | Quit Rob2223 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 09:14:51 | | Quit awake_ () |
| 09:17:00 | | Join lightbul1jim [0] (n=jim@203.171.93.108.static.rev.aanet.com.au) |
| 09:17:16 | | Join Malqw[DEATH]P1ka [0] (i=pikachu@host-137-79.siberianet.ru) |
| 09:18:26 | | Part Malqw[DEATH]P1ka |
| 09:20:55 | | Quit insanepotato ("ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.7/2009021910]") |
| 09:22:04 | linuxstb | midgey: Still around? |
| 09:22:23 | | Join bmbl [0] (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/bmbl) |
| 09:32:27 | | Quit lightbulbjim (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 09:38:32 | | Join tessarakt [0] (n=jens@e180075037.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 09:46:49 | | Quit lightbul1jim (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 09:51:32 | | Quit midgey () |
| 09:57:28 | | Join n1s [0] (n=n1s@rockbox/developer/n1s) |
| 10:00 |
| 10:00:49 | | Quit Seed ("cu, Andre") |
| 10:07:29 | | Join lightbulbjim [0] (n=jim@203.171.93.108.static.rev.aanet.com.au) |
| 10:09:17 | amiconn | jhMikeS: Hmm, different clock frequencies don't change beast runtime at all?? |
| 10:10:00 | | Join kachna [0] (n=kachna@r4ax178.net.upc.cz) |
| 10:10:36 | | Join Seed [0] (n=ben@bzq-84-108-232-45.cablep.bezeqint.net) |
| 10:11:05 | pixelma | hasn't that been reported for the Gigabeat F too? |
| 10:11:33 | markun | that's what we noticed, yes |
| 10:11:36 | * | Unhelpful thought it didn't *actually* scale, yet... |
| 10:11:58 | amiconn | It doesn't, but you can change the clock at build time |
| 10:12:29 | * | amiconn tested ape -c5000 at 528MHz this way |
| 10:12:30 | Unhelpful | what about the core voltage? doesn't the hardware have the ability to scale that, as well? |
| 10:12:35 | pixelma | I thought scaling was tried but not put into SVN because it didn't make a difference |
| 10:13:46 | n1s | pixelma: yes that is true for the gigabeat F |
| 10:13:48 | markun | pixelma: we actually committed it, but reverted it later again. I always thought I just made a mistake somewhere. |
| 10:14:12 | | Quit nuonguy ("This computer has gone to sleep") |
| 10:14:25 | amiconn | If clock scaling doesn't make a difference, it means that the stop clock is very efficient on those SoCs. |
| 10:14:35 | Unhelpful | maybe the CPU idles "better" than other ARM targets? so that it doesn't matter how fast it's running, so much as how much work it's actually doing? |
| 10:14:59 | amiconn | It means that if we want to save more battery power, we have to add voltage scaling |
| 10:15:50 | n1s | i hope we get voltage scaling because the battery time on the beast is pretty bad |
| 10:16:05 | amiconn | Unhelpful: I think those SoCs have separate clock generators for the core and the peripherals. Combined with an efficient idle mode you won't see a runtime difference |
| 10:16:51 | * | amiconn actually expects the same result on the AMS targets |
| 10:17:49 | | Quit CaptainKewl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 10:17:52 | * | amiconn should perhaps measure beast runtime with -c4000 ape files |
| 10:18:22 | | Quit nibbler_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 10:19:04 | amiconn | markun: Do you know whether the S3C2440 supports voltage scaling? |
| 10:30:53 | | Quit Seed ("cu, Andre") |
| 10:33:40 | markun | amiconn: I don't think it does. At least I've never read anything about it. |
| 10:34:01 | markun | I can check the manual |
| 10:41:07 | | Quit _lifeless (Remote closed the connection) |
| 10:41:24 | | Join _lifeless [0] (n=lifeless@94.51.254.193) |
| 10:41:26 | Unhelpful | amiconn: i would think that measuring runtime with varying CPU loads would give you a good idea of how efficient the sleep mode is. maybe a synthetic workload would be better, though? a calibrated busy loop + sleep(n) would let you load the CPU as much or as little as you want, in a way that should be measurable... |
| 10:41:48 | markun | amiconn: the only thing I found was "In the DVS(Dynamic Voltage Scaling) VDDi & VDDiarm can be supplied with 1.0V in Idle mode. Refer the Application Notes for detailed information." |
| 10:42:10 | markun | but I don't think I have those Application Notes |
| 10:43:01 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 10:43:24 | markun | amiconn: do you have the tools to measure the current directly instead doing runtime tests? |
| 10:53:52 | | Quit faemir (Success) |
| 11:00 |
| 11:00:20 | | Join midgey [0] (n=tjross@71.238.148.140) |
| 11:01:07 | | Join jaykay [0] (n=chatzill@p579E691A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:02:53 | amiconn | Well, there are no special tools needed, just a half-decent multimeter |
| 11:03:24 | amiconn | The difficult part is to hook it up. Difficulty varies with target |
| 11:03:41 | amiconn | I did it on my 1st Gen |
| 11:05:43 | amiconn | Wow, PF achieves 60fps on mini G2 |
| 11:09:10 | | Join gartral [0] (n=gareth@adsl-75-33-64-115.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net) |
| 11:09:13 | | Part gartral |
| 11:17:33 | | Join tvelocity [0] (n=tony@adsl24-106.her.forthnet.gr) |
| 11:28:02 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
| 11:40:27 | | Join MethoS- [0] (n=lem@host-091-097-241-041.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 11:43:56 | | Join Thundercloud [0] (i=thunderc@persistence.flat.devzero.co.uk) |
| 11:45:30 | | Join MTee [0] (n=MTee@41.233.154.103) |
| 11:57:46 | | Join PaulJam [0] (n=Paule@p54BEC4B3.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:57:57 | | Quit midgey () |
| 12:00 |
| 12:01:59 | | Quit jaykay (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 12:07:07 | | Join Seed [0] (n=ben@bzq-84-108-232-45.cablep.bezeqint.net) |
| 12:10:41 | | Quit stripwax ("http://miranda-im.org") |
| 12:12:11 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
| 12:13:42 | | Quit stripwax (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 12:16:17 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
| 12:20:25 | jhMikeS | amiconn: Maybe 10 minutes if you overlap the curves by voltage. Everything is written to keep the core asleep as much as possible so it doesn't seem too surprising (more MHz=finishes activity sooner and sleeps longer). It seems there's some rather substantial power suck since I can't imaging cutting power usage in half with the core alone. |
| 12:27:32 | jhMikeS | Also, more MHz also doesn't improve disk speed except for Create, Open and Dirscan by 20%. No effect all for aligning any buffers. The major bottleneck is the disk itself now. |
| 12:34:30 | markun | jhMikeS: do you remember anything about voltage scaling in the Gigabeat F? |
| 12:35:39 | | Join bs66_1 [0] (n=sysuser@94.191.168.225.bredband.tre.se) |
| 12:38:49 | jhMikeS | markun: No. I don't remember the manual mentioned anything. |
| 12:43:03 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 12:43:18 | | Join MethoS-- [0] (n=lem@host-091-097-245-201.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 12:44:18 | | Join gartral [0] (n=gareth@adsl-75-33-64-115.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net) |
| 12:45:13 | gartral | hmm.. the sponsor section of the main page only shows the rockbox team |
| 12:45:46 | gartral | i'm sorry, Rockbox Crew |
| 12:53:05 | | Quit bs66_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 12:54:56 | | Quit MethoS-- (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) |
| 12:59:40 | | Quit MethoS- (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 13:00 |
| 13:03:41 | | Part gartral |
| 13:05:53 | jhMikeS | amiconn: are those nop's in ata_read_sectors really needed? It's far less than 400ns for anything but a SH processor. |
| 13:06:54 | | Join tyfoo [0] (n=tyfoo@77-20-31-238-dynip.superkabel.de) |
| 13:07:39 | | Quit Horscht ("Verlassend") |
| 13:08:30 | | Join T-Man [0] (n=anthnsct@cpe-76-177-217-42.natcky.res.rr.com) |
| 13:09:13 | T-Man | got a question to ask |
| 13:09:28 | bubsy | go ahead |
| 13:09:46 | T-Man | it's about the firmware I have on my cheap clone ipod |
| 13:10:03 | | Quit jordoex (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) |
| 13:10:03 | T-Man | any way I can take it out and replace it with a different firmware? |
| 13:10:31 | bubsy | if they supply firmware upgrades, then it should be easy to crack it |
| 13:10:43 | bubsy | I don't think firmware encryption is their first priority |
| 13:10:55 | bubsy | I mean hack it, not crack it |
| 13:11:35 | T-Man | know any software or utilities that will do that? |
| 13:11:36 | bubsy | I doubt it's a known device, so its documentation may lack details |
| 13:12:37 | bubsy | I doubt it |
| 13:12:42 | T-Man | actually it looks just like Ipod.. im thinking it's either the same device except for the firmware |
| 13:13:01 | bubsy | well |
| 13:13:09 | bubsy | I'm 90% sure it's different inside :) |
| 13:13:43 | T-Man | ok |
| 13:14:11 | bubsy | thus the mapped addresses might be different, different hardware chips and so on |
| 13:15:05 | bubsy | you see, since it's such a unknown device, I think people don't care to spend their days hacking it and supply a heavy documentation for it, so I guess you're out of luck |
| 13:15:22 | bubsy | maybe, but I can't tell |
| 13:15:23 | | Join tyfus [0] (n=teves@host-89-167-45-123.nplay.net.pl) |
| 13:16:18 | | Part tyfus |
| 13:16:53 | | Quit bubsy ("Mrrrrreow!") |
| 13:17:28 | | Join Horscht [0] (n=Horscht@xbmc/user/horscht) |
| 13:18:17 | | Join bubsy [0] (i=Bubsy@81-31-244-19.net.nc-systems.no) |
| 13:21:18 | markun | T-Man: a good start is to open it and make photographs of the chips so they can be identified |
| 13:21:29 | markun | and/or find a firmware update as bubsy suggested |
| 13:34:48 | | Quit Seed ("cu, Andre") |
| 13:34:51 | | Quit FlynDice (Remote closed the connection) |
| 13:43:42 | linuxstb | bluebrother: (for the logs...) ping |
| 13:45:36 | | Join Seed [0] (n=ben@bzq-84-108-232-45.cablep.bezeqint.net) |
| 13:48:55 | | Join Darksair [0] (n=user@221.221.164.84) |
| 13:49:31 | | Join Aurix_Lexico [0] (n=comrade@c-68-56-205-239.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) |
| 13:55:04 | | Quit T-Man () |
| 13:55:28 | | Quit Horscht ("Verlassend") |
| 13:57:32 | | Join Ubuntuxer [0] (n=johannes@dslb-092-073-028-248.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 13:58:53 | | Quit flydutch ("/* empty */") |
| 13:59:50 | | Quit |ahmina| (Connection reset by peer) |
| 14:00 |
| 14:00:01 | | Join Horscht [0] (n=Horscht@xbmc/user/horscht) |
| 14:08:02 | Ubuntuxer | The game menus arent't translated. Why? I'm currently working on brickmania, but I don't know how to include translation. |
| 14:09:02 | | Quit BigBambi (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 14:13:26 | PaulJam | Ubuntuxer: i think localisation for plugins isn't implemented yet. have a look at this page: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/PluginLocalization |
| 14:13:30 | bertrik | Ubuntuxer, games are plugins and plugins don't have translations yet AFAIK |
| 14:16:06 | | Quit sir_yodle ("Leaving.") |
| 14:18:01 | | Quit Seed ("cu, Andre") |
| 14:20:59 | | Join Seed [0] (n=ben@bzq-84-108-232-45.cablep.bezeqint.net) |
| 14:21:05 | | Join sir_yodle [0] (n=theyon@pool-141-152-46-244.rcmdva.btas.verizon.net) |
| 14:25:19 | | Quit Horscht ("Verlassend") |
| 14:26:32 | | Join BigBambi [0] (n=alex@152.27.192-77.rev.gaoland.net) |
| 14:28:10 | BigBambi | Ubuntuxer: Plugin translation isn't currently supported |
| 14:28:42 | BigBambi | er, it appears I've been offline (logs here I come) |
| 14:29:35 | | Quit Ubuntuxer (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 14:29:40 | BigBambi | Ubuntuxer: Anyway, it appears you have been answered - plugin localisation was a GSOC project last year that didn't get completed yet |
| 14:29:41 | | Join Horscht [0] (n=Horscht@xbmc/user/horscht) |
| 14:40:02 | * | linuxstb has implemented the ipod Device Information in ipodpatcher for Linux and win32 - anyone know how to do "SCSI Inquiry" on OS X?... |
| 14:43:06 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 14:45:01 | | Join faemir [0] (n=faemir@88-106-169-118.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 14:45:55 | linuxstb | Any Windows users willing to test ipodpatcher's output of the ipod's XML info? http://linuxstb.cream.org/rockbox/ipodpatcher.exe |
| 14:46:21 | linuxstb | It's just a test at the moment - I would suggest typing "ipodpatcher −−list", and you should get an XML file printed to the screen, in the middle of the other info. |
| 14:47:42 | bertrik | linuxstb, does os x have the sg_inq utility? |
| 14:48:27 | rasher | http://developer.apple.com/qa/qa2001/qa1179.html ? |
| 14:49:13 | rasher | Not great news it seems |
| 14:49:19 | | Quit sir_yodle (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 14:51:09 | rasher | http://74.125.77.132/search?q=cache:GL-1kGqm348J:developer.apple.com/DOCUMENTATION/DeviceDrivers/Conceptual/MassStorage/06_LUD_Example/chapter_6_section_5.html+site:apple.com+scsi+commands&cd=3&hl=da&ct=clnk&client=iceweasel-a (pardon the awful link, but the page doesn't seem to exist anymore) |
| 14:53:07 | * | linuxstb finds http://www.thismuchiknow.co.uk/?p=28 |
| 14:58:08 | * | linuxstb wonders why Apple makes life so hard... |
| 15:00 |
| 15:02:56 | | Join Horschti [0] (n=Horscht@xbmc/user/horscht) |
| 15:05:26 | | Join efyx [0] (n=efyx@lap34-1-82-224-140-171.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 15:20:32 | | Join sarixe` [0] (n=sarixe@68.239.154.103) |
| 15:20:46 | | Join archivator [0] (n=archivat@77.70.28.57) |
| 15:20:57 | | Quit Horscht (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 15:25:42 | | Join stripwax__ [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
| 15:27:44 | | Join CaptainKewl [0] (i=jds@207-237-172-77.c3-0.nyr-ubr4.nyr.ny.cable.rcn.com) |
| 15:29:07 | | Join casainho [0] (n=chatzill@bl11-200-31.dsl.telepac.pt) |
| 15:29:16 | casainho | hello :-) |
| 15:30:08 | casainho | I would like to have opinions, about the idea of creating an external web site for Lyre DAP (old Rockbox Player project) |
| 15:32:55 | | Join robin0800 [0] (n=quassel@general-ld-216.t-mobile.co.uk) |
| 15:35:57 | | Quit stripwax__ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 15:36:04 | | Quit sarixe (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 15:38:04 | | Join Ubuntuxer [0] (n=johannes@dslb-094-220-239-192.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 15:38:27 | | Join gregzx [0] (n=chatzill@drq228.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 15:39:21 | | Join stripwax__ [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
| 15:39:32 | linuxstb | casainho: That sounds sensible to me - it's not really a part of the Rockbox project itself (which is just a software project). |
| 15:39:49 | linuxstb | (at least, the hardware parts of it are not - the software obviously will be.) |
| 15:41:15 | | Quit Ubuntuxer ("Leaving.") |
| 15:41:55 | | Join taylor_ [0] (n=taylor@c-24-91-82-205.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 15:42:59 | taylor_ | I'm looking at the forums lately..and it doesn't look like much progress has been made for the v2 sansas. i.e Fuze) Is this true or am I missing something? |
| 15:43:51 | linuxstb | You should also look at the Rockbox SVN changelog, and the patch tracker. |
| 15:44:08 | linuxstb | But no, there aren't many people working on the Fuze port. |
| 15:45:26 | casainho | linuxstb: other developers are suggesting to create the website... so, I guess we will do it. |
| 15:46:04 | taylor_ | Thats too bad |
| 15:46:25 | taylor_ | should have gotten a e200 :) |
| 15:46:33 | casainho | for me software looks much more important... that's why we are now working on getting a first simple patch using the new name - Lyre. |
| 15:47:18 | taylor_ | do you guys support nextar? or will in the future? |
| 15:48:01 | casainho | anyone can suggest a way for we call it? Lyre DAP? Lyre Player? |
| 15:48:12 | stripwax__ | Rockbox Lyre? |
| 15:48:27 | casainho | because DAP is just digital audio player, and we will record also... |
| 15:50:37 | casainho | stripwax__: we can't, please refer to this message from Rockbox: http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=6751.msg146274#msg146274 |
| 15:52:48 | | Quit Seed ("cu, Andre") |
| 15:53:13 | | Quit PaulJam (".") |
| 15:55:49 | rasher | How about using the hardware revision in the name? Lyre v1 or something like that? |
| 15:56:05 | rasher | I guess that gets old after a while |
| 15:56:15 | | Join MethoS- [0] (n=lem@host-091-097-241-093.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 15:57:41 | casainho | well, I would like that in the name we get the idea of what it does... that's why I think DAP is ok, but it also record sound, so, it is not just a player... maybe there is some good word for pass the idea of what it is −− I am not American or English, so, it's not easy for me... |
| 15:58:21 | linuxstb | casainho: There is no easy way to describe it in English either. |
| 15:58:58 | casainho | so maybe we will stick with the DAP: "Lyre DAP" |
| 15:59:07 | rasher | Including the function in the name seems a bit weird to me. Very very few do this |
| 15:59:53 | casainho | hmmm |
| 16:00 |
| 16:00:12 | robin0800 | casainho: music player/recorder |
| 16:00:20 | casainho | or maybe we can use this phrase: "Lyre - digital audio player and recorder running Rockbox" |
| 16:00:37 | rasher | Yes, as a catch phrase it's fine |
| 16:01:00 | rasher | But as part of the product name, it gets weird if you ask me |
| 16:01:20 | casainho | rasher: okok :-) |
| 16:01:47 | rasher | This is just an opinion of course |
| 16:01:47 | casainho | so, maybe the catch phrase is the importante, and so the nme, just Lyre. :-) |
| 16:02:40 | | Join MethoS-- [0] (n=lem@host-091-096-215-190.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 16:03:10 | casainho | hmmm, and as robin said... −− music player/recorder or audio player/recorder ?? |
| 16:03:34 | linuxstb | casainho: For a domain name, maybe something like lyra-project.org |
| 16:03:47 | casainho | I prefer audio, but may not be better than music... |
| 16:04:31 | casainho | linuxstb: I will follow that idea to others ;-) |
| 16:05:35 | casainho | okok - I will now contine reading about the TLV320 DAC :-) bye bye |
| 16:05:41 | | Quit casainho ("ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.7/2009030422]") |
| 16:05:47 | linuxstb | okok |
| 16:06:31 | | Quit bmbl ("Woah!") |
| 16:07:40 | | Join Seed [0] (n=ben@bzq-84-108-232-45.cablep.bezeqint.net) |
| 16:07:41 | | Quit stripwax ("http://miranda-im.org") |
| 16:08:30 | taylor_ | http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/8843 - - little confused. Does this mean code has been run? |
| 16:09:29 | linuxstb | Yes, we're happily running code on those devices, but that code isn't complete yet, and has problems/bugs. |
| 16:09:58 | taylor_ | But at least it __HAS__ happened. And I can help out more if I buy a fuze? |
| 16:10:33 | linuxstb | Sure. The more hackers the better. |
| 16:11:36 | taylor_ | cool. Im going out today. I might go to Staples and pick up one ;) |
| 16:15:55 | taylor_ | does anyone know - as I dont have much research..... Is the firmware encrypted in the fuze v2? and does it have a DFU? |
| 16:16:46 | | Quit MethoS- (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 16:17:35 | rasher | taylor_: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaAMS and its sub-pages explain a good deal |
| 16:18:00 | rasher | Other than that, I think flipping through the forum thread is most valuable |
| 16:18:44 | taylor_ | rasher: thats very valuable, thanks |
| 16:18:58 | taylor_ | I'll have to be careful I won't brick it |
| 16:21:13 | taylor_ | But if the rockbox GUI has already been ported, I can probably launch code from the menus and be safe |
| 16:21:32 | linuxstb | taylor_: It's pretty safe, unless you make a mistake compiling/installing the bootloader (which is quite hard to do) |
| 16:21:42 | linuxstb | (I mean, it's quite hard to make a mistake doing that) |
| 16:22:02 | taylor_ | Yeah |
| 16:22:25 | taylor_ | I If I do get one...I will definately have one of you step me through the process! |
| 16:22:58 | linuxstb | But no, there's no kind of built-in recovery mode available on the fuze. There is one on the e200v2, but that requires physical disassembly and shorting two pins... |
| 16:23:29 | | Quit Llorean (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 16:25:29 | linuxstb | Hmm, seems the name Lyra is already taken... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RCA_Lyra |
| 16:25:40 | rasher | Isn't it Lyre anyway? |
| 16:25:42 | * | linuxstb realises he misspelt lyre... |
| 16:25:59 | linuxstb | ;) I knew Lyre sounded familiar though... |
| 16:26:35 | | Quit stripwax__ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 16:28:08 | taylor_ | MTABLE.SYS.fuze8gb.bz2 (39 kb) Im guessing thats the bootloader? |
| 16:28:27 | linuxstb | taylor_: I would suggest reading the Rockbox wiki, not guessing... |
| 16:28:41 | taylor_ | ok |
| 16:29:07 | linuxstb | Specifically, the page rasher linked you to about 10 minutes ago. |
| 16:29:18 | Bagder | "It really isn't very good." |
| 16:29:19 | Bagder | a.l |
| 16:29:25 | Bagder | almost golden quote material |
| 16:29:49 | Bagder | http://apple.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1160561&cid=27191767 |
| 16:32:47 | taylor_ | I strongly disagree with that statement |
| 16:33:23 | taylor_ | If he/she wants a better GUI then they can write it themselves ;) |
| 16:35:17 | BigBambi | The problem is improving the UI without losing the options and flexability |
| 16:35:41 | BigBambi | Most of the time "more intuitive" means "remove most of the options and use it how I think you should" |
| 16:36:00 | linuxstb | gevaerts: Any thoughts about implementing that scsi inquiry stuff for real? I've started work on implementing it in ipodpatcher, but that could get confusing if Rockbox USB doesn't provide the info ipodpatcher wants. |
| 16:36:07 | taylor_ | Yeah. Well thats just 1 persons opinion |
| 16:36:19 | | Quit SirFunk (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 16:36:22 | | Join stoffel [0] (n=sfr@p57B4D72D.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:36:26 | bertrik | I do think the rockbox menus look a bit "techy" and not very spiffy |
| 16:36:34 | taylor_ | I still think it is a very good alternative OS |
| 16:36:37 | archivator | My only concern with the Rockbox GUI is the lack of multifont but I realize how large a task that is, so I don't complain.. |
| 16:36:45 | gevaerts | linuxstb: for ipodpatcher purposes I guess a very slimmed down version would be sufficient? |
| 16:36:48 | | Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (n=miepel@p579ECB7D.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:37:02 | linuxstb | gevaerts: Yes. I'm just intending to use it for the RAM size for the Video. |
| 16:37:05 | | Join SirFunk [0] (n=Sir@208-15-25-145.netsync.net) |
| 16:37:13 | BigBambi | taylor_: Well clearly so do we, but there is always room for improvement |
| 16:38:02 | linuxstb | gevaerts: And I guess I'll probably just do a "strstr" to search for <RAM>, rather than any real XML parsing. |
| 16:38:24 | gevaerts | linuxstb: ok. It should be doable then without too much overhead (a few hundred bytes?) |
| 16:38:49 | linuxstb | gevaerts: I guess the question is do we want to implement enough for itunes to be happy? |
| 16:39:39 | linuxstb | Can the Rockbox USB stack grab about 10KB of RAM somewhere to create this XML dynamically? |
| 16:40:07 | linuxstb | I guess it will still need some kind of description of what to create though... |
| 16:40:15 | gevaerts | sure. It grabs the audio buffer but it only uses 32 to 130k of that (depending on whether you have FS #10015) |
| 16:42:42 | gevaerts | I'm undecided about whether we want real ipod emulation. For non-ipods I'm pretty sure it isn't worth the hassle (fake USB IDs, fake partition tables, ...), and on real ipods I'm not sure if we can get it good enough to fool all versions of itunes reliably |
| 16:42:46 | taylor_ | Yes I know. But people need to keep in mind that this is a __non-profit__ project and just because someone wants something doesn't mean you can just make it happen in two seconds. |
| 16:42:55 | | Quit miepchen^schlaf () |
| 16:43:08 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 16:43:25 | linuxstb | gevaerts: I'm not sure there's much more to it than that scsi inquiry. Rasher's problems last night seemed to be because a) he was using a Sansa; b) he didn't have the iPod_Control folder created. |
| 16:44:09 | gevaerts | linuxstb: yes, but OF restores still fail. Maybe not a major issue, but it's still there |
| 16:44:11 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
| 16:44:19 | linuxstb | They do? |
| 16:44:27 | gevaerts | IIRC yes |
| 16:44:43 | linuxstb | IIUC, an OF restore is simply "dd'ing" the firmware to the firmware partition. |
| 16:44:51 | rasher | Is that a problem? If you want to update the OF (and are actually running an ipod...) you can boot the OF? |
| 16:46:07 | linuxstb | IIRC, ipods in the OF will reboot on disconnect if the firmware partition is written to in UMS. Maybe it's related to that. |
| 16:46:29 | Bagder | http://daniel.haxx.se/blog/2009/03/14/rockboxitunes/ |
| 16:47:24 | rasher | Oh dear |
| 16:47:57 | linuxstb | rasher: ? |
| 16:49:18 | bertrik | Bagder, gevaerts' name needs another e in the article |
| 16:49:28 | gevaerts | ah yes |
| 16:49:34 | * | gevaerts didn't even see that... |
| 16:49:59 | Bagder | oops |
| 16:50:43 | taylor_ | At least I can dual boot with OF so there should not be many troubles |
| 16:51:22 | bubsy | hehe, apple might get pissed |
| 16:52:14 | gevaerts | well, as long as it's only on ipods I don't see why they would care |
| 16:52:16 | taylor_ | bubsy: hmm? |
| 16:52:36 | gevaerts | And doing this on non-ipods is just silly IMHO |
| 16:52:58 | bubsy | taylor_: reverse engineering the protocol |
| 16:53:07 | taylor_ | Ah |
| 16:53:12 | bubsy | ... ok, we already reverse engineered quite much of the iPod, heh |
| 16:53:34 | taylor_ | Except the new ones still remain "untouched" |
| 16:53:43 | gevaerts | Getting an XML file using a SCSI INQUIRY command isn't rocked science... |
| 16:54:33 | archivator | Are you kidding, that's the best Apple could come up with? Jeez, that's just.. wrong. |
| 16:54:51 | bubsy | heh |
| 16:54:54 | | Join SirFunk_ [0] (n=Sir@208-15-25-145.netsync.net) |
| 16:55:26 | taylor_ | Well, considering that the ipod crashes with a notes file with more than 255 bytes in a link, you could say they've made some pretty sloppy choices :p |
| 16:56:32 | rasher | gevaerts: Why do you think doing it on non-ipods is silly? Having the "convenience" (in the eyes of some people) of iTunes without being tied to specific hardware would be swell (again, for some)? |
| 16:57:19 | taylor_ | I dont get what the point of using itunes with rockbox if you can just drag and drop music on the flash? |
| 16:57:59 | gevaerts | rasher: it's very few people (I hope!), and it's extra complexity (fake USB ids, fake partition tables, whatever). |
| 16:58:15 | gevaerts | taylor_: to prove that it can be done! |
| 16:58:18 | rasher | taylor_: some (I'd hazard a guess and say most) people prefer a syncing app over drag and drop |
| 16:58:58 | taylor_ | I suppose. How did you do that though? itunes writes to an encrypted itunesDB on the flash? |
| 16:59:05 | archivator | rasher: the moment they connect to iTunes, the player should display a list of OSS syncing apps. Then, it'd be useful. |
| 16:59:23 | gevaerts | we don't care about the itunesDB, so it can write to that as much as it likes |
| 16:59:34 | rasher | archivator: Because you get to decide which apps a user should use? |
| 16:59:41 | * | rasher thinks this is just bone-headed elitism |
| 16:59:59 | | Quit SirFunk (Connection timed out) |
| 17:00 |
| 17:00:29 | taylor_ | so rockbox contains an itunesDB file to mimick the ipod? |
| 17:00:38 | archivator | rasher: of course not. That was said tongue-in-cheek, just thought you might appreciate the irony. Oh, well. |
| 17:00:51 | rasher | taylor_: The disk has one. Rockbox doesn't care about it |
| 17:01:03 | | Quit archivator (""Off now."") |
| 17:01:47 | taylor_ | I get it: "hacked itunes" −−−−> itunesDB −−−−−−> rockbox reads itunesDB. correct? |
| 17:02:02 | BigBambi | intunes isn't hacked in any way |
| 17:02:05 | BigBambi | *itunes |
| 17:02:09 | taylor_ | hold on |
| 17:02:14 | BigBambi | And Rockbox never reads the itunes db |
| 17:02:34 | taylor_ | Itunes writes to itunesDB. But rockbox doesn't care about that and reads the mp3s instead? |
| 17:02:47 | BigBambi | yes |
| 17:03:04 | BigBambi | taylor_: If you want to hack on Rockbox you should probably read up on it a bit :) |
| 17:03:07 | taylor_ | gutcha. Im just trying to understand this all |
| 17:05:24 | taylor_ | So how did you get itunes to recognize the Sansa with rockbox? |
| 17:05:30 | rasher | gevaerts: I think you underestimate how high regard some people have of iTunes. Of course, I might be overestimating it. |
| 17:05:41 | | Join Lss [0] (n=Lss@cm246.delta91.maxonline.com.sg) |
| 17:05:46 | rasher | taylor_: by acting like an ipod |
| 17:05:49 | BigBambi | rasher: I think you are sadly right |
| 17:06:13 | | Join toffe82 [0] (n=chatzill@ppp-71-138-19-90.dsl.frs2ca.pacbell.net) |
| 17:06:56 | gevaerts | rasher: if you can get it to work without the firmware partition (and with the standard sansa partitions), you might be able to convince me, although I still won't like the idea of using ipod USB ids on non-ipods |
| 17:07:12 | taylor_ | Thats descriptive :P rasher: People should use gtkpod :) |
| 17:07:41 | BigBambi | People should use whatever they want, not what somebody else decides |
| 17:07:43 | gevaerts | If we have to do all sorts of weird things with the disk, I don't think it's worth it |
| 17:08:06 | gevaerts | taylor_: http://www.ipodlinux.org/wiki/Device_Information has all the info we used to do this |
| 17:08:20 | rasher | gevaerts: Perhaps the firmware partition isn't even needed? |
| 17:08:50 | gevaerts | rasher: that's the big question. If it isn't, this is a lot more practical |
| 17:09:53 | taylor_ | gavaerts: thanks. @BigBambi: I know, I just persnally think GtkPod is faster and easier to use, but, as you said, its other people's decision |
| 17:12:52 | linuxstb | There could be some useful changes we could make to the XML though. e.g. if a user uses itunes, but not the OF, we can reject Audible files, and DRM'd AAC. |
| 17:13:47 | | Join Ubuntuxer [0] (n=johannes@dslb-094-220-229-238.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 17:14:10 | | Join unknown [0] (n=unknown@ip56539ae4.direct-adsl.nl) |
| 17:14:19 | taylor_ | That XML is very useful. linux4nano-dev has done much work with that file. |
| 17:14:52 | taylor_ | We have also figured out which chip on the motherboard we are close to _sure_ decrypts the code at runtime |
| 17:15:26 | linuxstb | taylor_: Huh? Are you sure you're talking about the same XML? How can it help with running code? |
| 17:16:31 | taylor_ | I think you got the two mixed up; sorry. XML and the chip are two separate things. I meant we found the chip that decrypts the firmware. The XML is separate. |
| 17:17:00 | BigBambi | Of course they are - XML is a markup document... |
| 17:17:30 | BigBambi | Have you read the page gevaerts linked you to? |
| 17:17:35 | taylor_ | yes |
| 17:17:38 | taylor_ | thank you |
| 17:17:49 | BigBambi | So it is nothing to do with any hardware |
| 17:17:52 | taylor_ | I know about the XML. I didn't know it was used for that purpose though |
| 17:18:04 | taylor_ | YES I __know___that |
| 17:18:13 | linuxstb | taylor_: What did you mean with "That XML is very useful. linux4nano-dev has done much work with that file." ? |
| 17:18:17 | BigBambi | So how does it help with running code? |
| 17:18:24 | taylor_ | I just put two and two in the same sentence |
| 17:18:33 | BigBambi | eh? |
| 17:19:03 | taylor_ | Im sorry., I think I totally messed you two up. Give me a second to re word this so it makes sense |
| 17:20:23 | | Quit stoffel ("leaving") |
| 17:20:34 | taylor_ | We worked with this XML (how iPL got the info). But that doesn't have to do with the chip. I put both statements in one thought so it sounded like they both had to do with each other, sorry. |
| 17:20:50 | taylor_ | the XML can NOT run code |
| 17:20:59 | BigBambi | well clearly |
| 17:21:26 | taylor_ | unless of course, there was a buffer overflow in the markup code. But of course even then it would be useless! |
| 17:21:31 | rasher | Well, there's good news and bad news. My SD card with just a single fat32 partition *is* detected as an ipod, but it tells me it's in recovery mode, so it must check the partitioning somewhat |
| 17:21:39 | rasher | Question is how much, I guess |
| 17:22:15 | taylor_ | SD cards are formatted differently than the ipod |
| 17:22:26 | taylor_ | you will need to format it using the HFS+ |
| 17:22:30 | BigBambi | yes, we know |
| 17:22:40 | rasher | Please don't go off on things you have no idea about |
| 17:22:42 | BigBambi | No you don't |
| 17:22:56 | BigBambi | And the format is nothing to do with the partition layout |
| 17:23:20 | | Join LambdaCalculus37 [0] (n=rmenes@rockbox/staff/LambdaCalculus37) |
| 17:23:29 | taylor_ | Wait a second...whose talking to who here? You need to direct your comments with name: |
| 17:23:43 | linuxstb | taylor_: Who was that directed to? |
| 17:23:47 | BigBambi | taylor_: The whole point of this is to see if itunes will recognise a sansa as an ipod based on USB fiddling and not also on the partition layout |
| 17:23:54 | BigBambi | taylor_: I was talking to you, as was rasher |
| 17:24:02 | taylor_ | Ok thank you |
| 17:24:15 | rasher | I guess "a single partition" looks like recovery mode, so there needs to be something that looks like the firmware partition. I wonder how little we can get away with |
| 17:24:38 | BigBambi | Can you fake that via USB? |
| 17:24:48 | taylor_ | You should be able to |
| 17:25:03 | rasher | BigBambi: Depends what iTunes does with it, I guess |
| 17:25:07 | taylor_ | It depends on which "ipod" you want it to recognize as. |
| 17:25:17 | taylor_ | They all have different partition structures |
| 17:25:30 | BigBambi | taylor_: That doesn't matter here |
| 17:25:41 | BigBambi | rasher: yes, if it is just to identify then OK |
| 17:26:10 | taylor_ | Well, no I guess it doesn't, but you still need to make it look like a valid ipod. I would start with splitting the SD card into two partitions to replicate a 2g |
| 17:26:27 | BigBambi | taylor_: WE DON'T WANT TO HAVE TO DO THAT |
| 17:26:42 | taylor_ | Well then, you CANT DO IT THEN!! |
| 17:26:49 | BigBambi | taylor_: Please read back, you are continually missing the point |
| 17:26:54 | taylor_ | Unless you modify itunes |
| 17:27:08 | * | BigBambi gives up |
| 17:27:18 | taylor_ | HOLD ON A SEC , please |
| 17:27:20 | * | stripwax suggests everyone takes a step back and a deep breath |
| 17:27:46 | taylor_ | First of all, you need to give EVRYONE some credit because talking online isnt the easiest thing to do |
| 17:28:24 | taylor_ | Ok, lets start back. We are trying to have iTunes recognize a mp3 player with a SD card as an "ipod" correct? |
| 17:28:45 | unknown | What is the status of the Sansa Fuze? the wiki doesn't seem uptodate and the svn log says something about fixing the scroll wheel |
| 17:29:25 | | Quit stripwax (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 17:29:45 | rasher | GREAT SUCCESS |
| 17:30:03 | rasher | A tiny empty partition at the end of the disk (or anywhere, I bet) is enough |
| 17:30:07 | rasher | Of type 0 |
| 17:30:16 | BigBambi | interesting |
| 17:30:26 | rasher | Should be perfectly possible to fake |
| 17:30:40 | krazykit | unknown, the wiki, svn, and forum thread have all the latest information. the status is "not ready for general users" and will continue to be so until noted on the front page |
| 17:30:43 | BigBambi | And it doesn't try to write to it? |
| 17:30:53 | rasher | BigBambi: Seems not |
| 17:31:02 | BigBambi | That's nice |
| 17:31:13 | rasher | I only made it half a megabyte |
| 17:31:29 | taylor_ | And it works 'AOK' ? |
| 17:32:01 | rasher | taylor_: Yes. |
| 17:33:37 | taylor_ | interesting |
| 17:34:00 | rasher | gevaerts: iTunes appears to check at least the following: 1) SCSI inquiry stuff 2) File structure 3) The existance of a firmware partition (which can be anywhere and any size, it seems, and doesn't need to contain anything) |
| 17:34:13 | taylor_ | We should add this to linux4nano wiki. However, it doesn't really help in the matter of hacking anything |
| 17:34:24 | taylor_ | but still interesting |
| 17:35:50 | BigBambi | feel free |
| 17:36:19 | taylor_ | It just proves how "hackish" itunes security check is |
| 17:36:33 | rasher | It's not really a security check of any kind |
| 17:37:01 | rasher | Just a general "is this an ipod" sanity check |
| 17:37:16 | taylor_ | Well, when I mean "security" I mean "valid ipod check" |
| 17:38:03 | rasher | Being more strict would just lead to more people having their valid ipods rejected. I think it's a reasonable amount of checks. |
| 17:38:37 | unknown | krazykit: and for non-general users? |
| 17:38:37 | taylor_ | yes |
| 17:38:51 | taylor_ | this is useful for iPL users too |
| 17:39:16 | BigBambi | taylor_: This is #rockbox |
| 17:39:19 | rasher | gevaerts: And of course the USB vid/pid and vendor/product stuff - I don't quite remember if all of that was needed before iTunes would even fire off the scsi inquiry, but I believe it was? |
| 17:40:00 | taylor_ | BigBambi: Yes. I know?? |
| 17:40:27 | krazykit | unknown, unless you're planning on developing, it's not ready even for testing |
| 17:40:51 | taylor_ | BigBambi: What do you mean? |
| 17:40:59 | BigBambi | So please stop with the off-topic remarks like "We should put this on x wiki" and "this'd be useful for x" - it isn't relevant and is off-topic |
| 17:41:44 | gevaerts | rasher: we added a bunch of things at once, so maybe it is worth testing disabling things one by one. Maybe iManufacturer/iProduct is enough and vid/pid doesn't matter? |
| 17:41:57 | rasher | gevaerts: Possibly. Let me try. |
| 17:42:01 | taylor_ | Well, I am talking about the same thing as everyone else, so I guess you could say this is "on-topic" |
| 17:42:41 | BigBambi | taylor_: It only is if related to Rockbox, so please confine it to that |
| 17:43:10 | taylor_ | The more people who know, the better. Yes, I know, and obviously if I every put something on the wiki we would credit 'you' |
| 17:43:59 | BigBambi | I'm not bothered about that, this channel is logged for support and development, so we keep it clear of anything not related. Something we are failing at now. Please respect our guidelines |
| 17:44:20 | BigBambi | taylor_: ou can put it where you want, you just don't need to announce your thoughts here |
| 17:44:55 | taylor_ | Ok, I apologize |
| 17:46:39 | | Join MethoS- [0] (n=lem@host-091-097-243-171.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 17:46:45 | unknown | krazykit: ok, no time for developing :( thanks for the info |
| 17:46:55 | taylor_ | regarding any of the mp3 players rockbox has been ported to. I am sure at least one contain an encrypted firmware? |
| 17:46:56 | rasher | gevaerts: vid/pid seems to be needed. |
| 17:47:44 | | Quit robin0800 ("No Ping reply in 30 seconds.") |
| 17:48:15 | | Join robin0800 [0] (n=quassel@general-ld-216.t-mobile.co.uk) |
| 17:48:48 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
| 17:49:16 | rasher | gevaerts: weird, it still does the scsi inquery, even with the wrong vid/pid, but it doesn't show up in iTunes |
| 17:50:18 | gevaerts | rasher: interesting... |
| 17:51:14 | | Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.) |
| 17:51:20 | | Join jhMikeS [50] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS) |
| 17:51:46 | | Quit SirFunk_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 17:52:28 | | Join SirFunk_ [0] (n=Sir@208-15-25-145.netsync.net) |
| 17:52:47 | | Join robin0800_ [0] (n=quassel@general-kt-199.t-mobile.co.uk) |
| 17:53:11 | | Join saratoga [0] (n=41becb3b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-e5cede6fbd63a113) |
| 17:55:40 | | Quit stripwax (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 17:57:29 | | Quit Darksair ("Everything that has a beginning has an end.") |
| 17:58:04 | | Quit tessarakt ("Client exiting") |
| 17:58:12 | | Join tessarakt [0] (n=jens@e180075037.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 18:00 |
| 18:01:57 | | Quit MethoS-- (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 18:02:42 | | Quit tyfoo (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 18:07:01 | rasher | gevaerts: think it's worth collecting different ipods' inquiry responses? |
| 18:07:15 | taylor_ | yes |
| 18:07:29 | rasher | Didn't ask you. |
| 18:07:30 | taylor_ | actually..its too bad we can't see what itunes is doing? |
| 18:07:37 | LambdaCalculus37 | taylor_: rasher was asking gevaerts. |
| 18:07:42 | LambdaCalculus37 | Let gevaerts answer. |
| 18:08:27 | taylor_ | Yes, I know, its just my opinion. No one told him he had to listen to me. Everyone relax. |
| 18:11:03 | | Join StealthyXIIGer [0] (n=stealthy@c-68-62-18-116.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) |
| 18:11:24 | | Quit Ubuntuxer (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 18:12:30 | | Join n00by [0] (i=185b52cd@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-632e324c813b72ae) |
| 18:12:38 | | Join FlynDice [0] (n=FlynDice@12-46-54-184.seatac.seattwa.wayport.net) |
| 18:13:22 | n00by | Hi y'all −−- when will the fuze be supported? |
| 18:13:43 | taylor_ | Oh man...that question has been asked SOO many times :) lol |
| 18:14:06 | rasher | n00by: Impossible to predict. |
| 18:14:18 | taylor_ | n00by: The bootloader has been ported, but there are still many kinks to work out |
| 18:14:22 | rasher | Could be a month, could be never. |
| 18:14:26 | | Quit robin0800 (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 18:14:33 | taylor_ | http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaAMS#Unbricking |
| 18:14:41 | taylor_ | Take a look at that, n00by |
| 18:18:16 | n00by | Anyone heard of n00b81? |
| 18:19:07 | LambdaCalculus37 | n00by: No, and keep it on-topic. |
| 18:19:33 | n00by | He found a 'overflow' or something in the notes? is that useful? |
| 18:19:40 | taylor_ | n00by: no |
| 18:20:02 | LambdaCalculus37 | n00by: Are you talking about someone in #linux4nano-dev? |
| 18:21:05 | n00by | n00b81? |
| 18:21:35 | taylor_ | n00by: thats me. and no, its not useful, sorry |
| 18:21:44 | taylor_ | my old 'nick' |
| 18:22:44 | n1s | taylor_: i'm curious, how did you come to the conclusion that this notes bug can not be exploited? |
| 18:23:00 | taylor_ | We dont have a mem dump |
| 18:23:13 | taylor_ | Its impossible to brute force 4 billion return addresses |
| 18:24:37 | taylor_ | we don't even know if it is a BOF |
| 18:24:45 | taylor_ | without a debugger its sort of useless |
| 18:25:31 | saratoga | debugger? |
| 18:25:38 | saratoga | you mean disassembly right? |
| 18:26:03 | LambdaCalculus37 | I thought someone had been attempting to disassemble the firmware already. |
| 18:27:42 | taylor_ | Yeah we all were. But tracking down 400 statically linked functions is not an easy task! |
| 18:28:24 | taylor_ | n00by: hard to tell |
| 18:28:25 | n00by | So you think ipods 3g and 4g will never have rockbox? |
| 18:28:47 | taylor_ | n00by: who knows |
| 18:29:39 | taylor_ | my guess is 'no' |
| 18:29:39 | | Join Llorean [0] (n=DarkkOne@adsl-99-21-142-126.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 18:30:01 | | Quit Llorean (Client Quit) |
| 18:30:14 | | Join Llorean [0] (n=DarkkOne@adsl-99-21-142-126.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 18:30:30 | | Part n00by |
| 18:31:16 | taylor_ | I guess that made him upset ;) |
| 18:31:40 | saratoga | taylor_: what device is this? |
| 18:31:48 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
| 18:31:59 | taylor_ | You mean the ones that are affected? |
| 18:32:19 | saratoga | the one you dissassembled |
| 18:33:01 | taylor_ | 5g |
| 18:33:06 | taylor_ | or 5.5g |
| 18:33:38 | taylor_ | both have the problem. Actually ALL have the problem. But you can't obviously dissasemble the 3g nano or 4g :) |
| 18:34:04 | taylor_ | we picked 5g because it crashes the same way as the 3g and 4g nano |
| 18:34:20 | saratoga | so what did you mean by "We dont have a mem dump"? |
| 18:34:44 | taylor_ | When I mean mem dump, I want a whole dump of the corrupt registers |
| 18:34:56 | taylor_ | like with PSP-link (for the psps) |
| 18:35:06 | taylor_ | essentially a "debugger" or emulator |
| 18:35:11 | taylor_ | both we don't have |
| 18:35:40 | saratoga | you can probably get that from an ipod since we can run code on them but i'm not sure how thats going to help |
| 18:36:03 | taylor_ | It would help, BadBlox made a mem dumper, but only for the games area |
| 18:36:20 | saratoga | it sounds like you need to dissassemble the firmware, find the fuction that overflows, and see if you can exploit it |
| 18:36:26 | taylor_ | Yes |
| 18:36:28 | saratoga | dumping the program state is unlikely to help you with that |
| 18:36:35 | taylor_ | It would |
| 18:36:37 | taylor_ | BUT |
| 18:36:57 | taylor_ | looking through the firmware of thousands of functions? thats just not realistic |
| 18:37:10 | saratoga | you'd have to find the function first anyway |
| 18:37:28 | taylor_ | Yes |
| 18:37:33 | taylor_ | thats the problem |
| 18:37:41 | taylor_ | we believe it occurs in strcpy() |
| 18:37:43 | saratoga | so how would dumping the state help you at all? |
| 18:37:59 | taylor_ | it would let us know if a return address has been overwritten |
| 18:38:11 | taylor_ | or a stack pointer |
| 18:38:16 | saratoga | ? |
| 18:38:59 | saratoga | oh you mean once you've found the program and confirmed theres an exploit? |
| 18:39:01 | taylor_ | stack pointer. Points to stack. |
| 18:39:05 | taylor_ | yes |
| 18:39:08 | saratoga | i suppose it would be helpful to debug your hack |
| 18:39:12 | taylor_ | Yes |
| 18:39:36 | saratoga | well once you get that far you can probably inject code into the apple firmware to do that |
| 18:39:51 | taylor_ | As I've said before, it would at least be a little comforting to know it __IS__ exploitable before we spend a great deal of time |
| 18:40:59 | taylor_ | We haven't found anyone really interested in helping us (yet) |
| 18:41:11 | taylor_ | As we all are not ARM experts |
| 18:42:46 | | Quit Conic (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 18:43:12 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 18:43:47 | | Part unknown |
| 18:47:01 | gevaerts | rasher: maybe it would point to patterns, yes. You never know what it's good for |
| 18:50:08 | saratoga | are rockchip players ARM? |
| 18:51:06 | | Join gregzx_ [0] (n=chatzill@dtf192.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 18:52:57 | | Join Rondom [0] (n=Rondom@dslb-084-057-138-062.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 18:53:05 | rasher | Rbutil says that the "complete installation" will install a current build. It doesn't, it installs a release version. |
| 18:56:07 | | Quit jhMikeS (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 18:56:13 | LambdaCalculus37 | saratoga: IIRC they are. |
| 18:56:21 | | Join jhMikeS [50] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS) |
| 18:56:24 | LambdaCalculus37 | I know the Actions chipsets have a Z80 core. |
| 19:00 |
| 19:00:02 | | Join EDOMPILF [0] (n=ORF@ip72-218-112-46.hr.hr.cox.net) |
| 19:01:56 | | Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 19:08:13 | | Quit HellDragon (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 19:08:17 | | Quit gregzx (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 19:08:26 | | Quit BUMBACL0T (Connection timed out) |
| 19:11:03 | | Quit robin0800_ (Remote closed the connection) |
| 19:13:25 | | Quit bubsy ("Mrrrrreow!") |
| 19:13:30 | | Quit stripwax (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 19:14:40 | | Join bubsy [0] (i=Bubsy@81-31-244-19.net.nc-systems.no) |
| 19:14:48 | | Quit bubsy (Remote closed the connection) |
| 19:15:29 | | Join bubsy [0] (i=Bubsy@81-31-244-19.net.nc-systems.no) |
| 19:17:41 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
| 19:19:34 | | Join SirFunk__ [0] (n=Sir@208-15-25-145.netsync.net) |
| 19:21:20 | | Join Conic [0] (n=conicpp@c-75-68-165-66.hsd1.vt.comcast.net) |
| 19:22:13 | | Join ender` [0] (i=krneki@foo.eternallybored.org) |
| 19:24:42 | | Join BHSPitLappy [0] (n=BHSPitLa@unaffiliated/bhspitmonkey) |
| 19:25:58 | | Quit SirFunk_ (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) |
| 19:25:59 | | Join nuonguy [0] (n=john@c-24-6-174-132.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 19:40:45 | | Quit SirFunk__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 19:41:05 | | Quit stripwax (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 19:41:53 | | Join SirFunk [0] (n=Sir@208-15-25-145.netsync.net) |
| 19:45:35 | FlynDice | Can someone save me some time here real quick. How do I pass the value in r0 back to the main c program at the end of some asm? |
| 19:45:39 | | Join tyfoo [0] (n=tyfoo@77-20-31-238-dynip.superkabel.de) |
| 19:48:17 | rasher | linuxstb: I have absolutely no idea where to start |
| 19:49:15 | | Quit FlynDice (Remote closed the connection) |
| 19:49:23 | linuxstb | For non-community people - ipodpatcher is failing to compile on 64-bit linux with http://pastebin.ca/1360814 |
| 19:50:05 | linuxstb | It looks like uint16_t for some reason... |
| 19:50:25 | rasher | Debian Unstable, specifically |
| 19:50:50 | linuxstb | ipodpatcher uses stdint.h - maybe it should be inttypes.h ? I never know the difference... |
| 19:51:35 | linuxstb | Hmm, it seems inttypes.h should include stdint.h - so maybe changing to inttypes.h is correct. |
| 19:52:14 | | Join jordoex [0] (n=quassel@d154-20-29-131.bchsia.telus.net) |
| 19:52:52 | | Join petur [50] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) |
| 19:59:50 | | Join bluebrother [0] (n=dom@rockbox/developer/bluebrother) |
| 20:00 |
| 20:01:20 | | Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.) |
| 20:01:26 | | Join jhMikeS [50] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS) |
| 20:01:39 | | Join casainho [0] (n=chatzill@89.180.211.249) |
| 20:02:29 | casainho | hello :-) −− ca nsomeone please explain to me what is: clean_dcache_range(start, size); ?? on pcm-meg-fx.c ? |
| 20:02:29 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
| 20:03:46 | bertrik | I guess that makes sure that any cached data from that specific range is discarded from the data cache |
| 20:05:57 | casainho | hmmmm... data cache? is something specific to ARM? |
| 20:06:24 | linuxstb | no |
| 20:09:02 | casainho | so, do I really need to do that clean data cache? |
| 20:09:03 | jhMikeS | it flushes out any pending writes in that range to that physical memory contents are coherent for DMA transfer |
| 20:09:21 | linuxstb | bluebrother: I've started work on implementing http://www.ipodlinux.org/wiki/Device_Information in ipodpatcher. Linux is working, win32 is written but untested, OS X appears to be hell... |
| 20:09:45 | bluebrother | linuxstb: oh. I could test windows later I guess |
| 20:09:48 | | Join pdesjardins [0] (n=chatzill@modemcable105.248-56-74.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 20:09:52 | pdesjardins | hi |
| 20:09:53 | LambdaCalculus37 | I could try out OS X later. |
| 20:10:05 | pdesjardins | any one can help me with Voice option with RockBox? |
| 20:10:07 | linuxstb | bluebrother: My intention is just to add a "ramsize" field to the ipod struct - so rbutil can differentiate the 5g/5.5g builds. |
| 20:10:22 | linuxstb | LambdaCalculus37: You would need to implement it first... |
| 20:10:39 | | Join saratoga [0] (n=9803c6dd@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-1dcb2f68cc7f97d2) |
| 20:10:42 | bluebrother | that would be nice. Any other useage for that inquiry thing in ipodpatcher? |
| 20:11:04 | | Nick pdesjardins is now known as daok (n=chatzill@modemcable105.248-56-74.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 20:11:06 | LambdaCalculus37 | linuxstb: I'll see what I can do. |
| 20:11:15 | bertrik | casainho, have you been able to get your lcd_update routine optimised? |
| 20:11:23 | linuxstb | Not really. Although it allows more reliable detection of devices, so I may be persuaded to implement restore features |
| 20:11:29 | bluebrother | isn't there a similar API on osx? At least in the past OS X was much more similar to linux than windows :) |
| 20:11:43 | bertrik | (so it can also do partial screen updates instead of always full screen updates) |
| 20:11:48 | casainho | bertrik: no, I am working on audio DAC drivers now. LCD is working perfect... :-) |
| 20:12:25 | casainho | bertrik: I now know that maybe I can use DMA for sending the data to LCD.... |
| 20:12:31 | linuxstb | bluebrother: Someone has implemented this on OSX, so it's not impossible - http://www.thismuchiknow.co.uk/?p=28 |
| 20:12:39 | linuxstb | It just looks a little painful... |
| 20:12:53 | daok | I have build a small utility that create .mp3.talk and It works on the computer but once in the RockBox, it's silence even if I have set to read the Voice Talk file in the setting, any one know why? |
| 20:13:12 | Llorean | daok: What player are you trying to use? |
| 20:13:18 | linuxstb | And it looks like it doesn't use the /dev/diskN device, so ipodpatcher will need to map between the two. |
| 20:13:27 | casainho | bertrik: first I want to put audio working, after, I will see what I will do... if we change that LCD, then no need to spend time optimizing that code... |
| 20:13:29 | daok | I am using GigaBeat F20 |
| 20:13:31 | Llorean | daok: We use Speex for the non-Archos players. |
| 20:13:34 | Llorean | Not MP3 |
| 20:14:03 | linuxstb | daok: You need to encode from WAV to ".talk" with tools/rbspeexenc |
| 20:14:09 | bertrik | casainho, ok, sounds fair |
| 20:14:24 | daok | alright let me search it I'll be back to give you some news |
| 20:15:02 | casainho | jhMikeS: do you think that the code can work without doing that flush? |
| 20:15:10 | | Join fdinel [0] (n=Miranda@modemcable204.232-203-24.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 20:15:27 | casainho | bertrik: do you think is possible to use DMA for sending data to SPI? did you saw it before? |
| 20:16:52 | jhMikeS | casainho: It can work but if you have a data cache+DMA there's no guarantee the audio transferred will be flawless. |
| 20:19:55 | bluebrother | that code looks ugly. Reminds me of w32api somehow *shudder* |
| 20:22:03 | daok | it's working!!!! |
| 20:22:05 | daok | Thank you guy! |
| 20:22:57 | linuxstb | bluebrother: Yes, I don't know why Apple needed to reinvent the wheel... |
| 20:25:28 | casainho | jhMikeS: I don't know If I have cache.. is something dependent of MCU?? |
| 20:25:36 | casainho | jhMikeS: or ARM core? |
| 20:26:09 | | Quit stripwax ("http://miranda-im.org") |
| 20:26:27 | linuxstb | bluebrother: I forget - do you have a Mac? |
| 20:27:10 | bluebrother | linuxstb: no. |
| 20:27:36 | | Quit avis (Remote closed the connection) |
| 20:27:42 | | Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@rockbox/staff/XavierGr) |
| 20:28:54 | bertrik | casainho, caching is a general concept and is probably explained together with the capabilities of your specific processor |
| 20:29:41 | | Quit gregzx_ ("ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.7/2009021910]") |
| 20:30:11 | casainho | bertrik: ah, okok, so I will look at datasheet for it :-) −− but I am almost sure that there is no problem with working on DMA, because I didn't saw any reference to it before. I will continue working now :-) −− thanks :-) |
| 20:30:18 | | Join gregzx [0] (n=chatzill@dtf192.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 20:30:55 | * | linuxstb starts a wiki page for all this ipod<->itunes stuff, and considers IpodItunesCommunication - any better ideas? |
| 20:32:10 | Llorean | Sounds good enough, at least |
| 20:32:21 | Horschti | is this for using the itunes library in rockbox? including the artwork database? |
| 20:32:37 | Llorean | Horschti: No. |
| 20:32:53 | saratoga | casainho: all arm9 processors have both an L1 Data and L1 Instruction cache I think |
| 20:33:25 | saratoga | thats the main difference between 7 and 9, 7 has just one cache |
| 20:33:52 | bertrik | casainho, you use the at91sam9260, right? it has 8 kB icache and 8 kB dcache |
| 20:34:08 | linuxstb | Horschti: I guess that's a good point - it's not about the itunesdb, but that name can imply that... Maybe I'll use something like IpodUsbInfo |
| 20:34:25 | Llorean | linuxstb: Maybe just IpodXMLInfo ? |
| 20:34:51 | linuxstb | Llorean: It's for more than just that - I want to document exactly what itunes needs from a USB device to think it's an ipod. |
| 20:35:06 | linuxstb | (USB IDs, partition layout, etc) |
| 20:35:12 | saratoga | ItunesUsbInfo |
| 20:35:20 | Llorean | I don't think "IpodItunesCommunication" really suggests anything about the database anyway. |
| 20:36:37 | linuxstb | Llorean: No, and it will be obvious when the page is read.... So I'll stick with that. |
| 20:36:47 | Horschti | no it doesn't actualy... i was just hoping |
| 20:36:57 | | Quit daok ("ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.7/2009021910]") |
| 20:37:24 | * | linuxstb wonders who created those wiki pages starting IPod... |
| 20:38:09 | Llorean | Probably someone tried iPod and just capitalized the I when it complained |
| 20:38:18 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) |
| 20:38:33 | casainho | saratoga: bertrik : yes, I am using that AT91SAM9260, ARM9. So, I don't know yet how to use that icache and dcache...... |
| 20:39:22 | casainho | what this function must do? :: pcm_play_dma_get_peak_buffer() ?? −− I don't understand it... |
| 20:40:30 | | Join bmbl [0] (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/bmbl) |
| 20:42:26 | casainho | if someone wants to look at my audio drivers: http://pastebin.com/mee6309f |
| 20:43:15 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 20:43:51 | bertrik | casainho, it will work fine for the moment without icache and dcache, just a bit slower. I'm no arm expert though. If I understand correctly, on the sansa clip (which also has an arm9) the icache is normally already enabled but the dcache has to be enabled explicitly |
| 20:44:41 | bertrik | IIRC, the peak buffer is used to determine the peak level for the peak meter, it's not critical for playback I think |
| 20:44:53 | casainho | bertrik: okok, thanks. LAter I will read more about this subject. |
| 20:45:18 | casainho | bertrik: oh, nice :-) Then I will use the empty stub :-) |
| 20:45:37 | | Quit stripwax ("http://miranda-im.org") |
| 20:45:55 | casainho | I will test the code on hardware, right now :-) |
| 20:46:26 | bertrik | but you have to return *something*. I think you can have a look at what it does on other players, for example the ams sansas |
| 20:46:49 | casainho | okok :-) |
| 20:48:53 | bertrik | oh you may be able to get away with it for now by setting *count to 0 |
| 20:50:07 | | Join avis [0] (n=ident@pdpc/supporter/student/avis) |
| 20:52:49 | casainho | well, I got an hang on undefined vector.... |
| 20:53:50 | | Quit casainho ("ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.7/2009030422]") |
| 20:53:52 | | Join lymeca [0] (n=lymeca@213-213-141-71.xdsl.is) |
| 20:58:41 | saratoga | linuxstb: how hard would it be to get iTunes working correctly with other devices? just change the USB id, generate the XML file, and show a fake parition at the end? |
| 21:00 |
| 21:01:19 | | Quit parafin (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 21:06:08 | | Join domonoky [0] (n=Domonoky@rockbox/developer/domonoky) |
| 21:14:10 | | Quit CaptainKewl ("( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: www.XLhost.de )") |
| 21:14:10 | rasher | bluebrother: http://pastebin.ca/1360814 |
| 21:14:17 | rasher | bluebrother: When compiled on amd64 |
| 21:15:00 | | Join MethoS-- [0] (n=lem@dyndsl-085-016-167-088.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 21:20:58 | | Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (n=miepel@p579ECB7D.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:21:29 | | Join gartral [0] (n=gareth@adsl-75-33-64-115.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net) |
| 21:22:27 | | Quit fdinel ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 21:23:00 | | Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.) |
| 21:23:06 | | Join jhMikeS [50] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS) |
| 21:24:25 | gartral | i know it isn't trivial, but im experimenting, and i want to know how to interrupt the power off function called by long press on the power button in a plugin, or is this not possible |
| 21:25:04 | | Join CaptainKewl [0] (n=jason@207-237-172-77.c3-0.nyr-ubr4.nyr.ny.cable.rcn.com) |
| 21:26:22 | | Quit taylor_ ("Leaving") |
| 21:27:53 | | Quit MethoS- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 21:28:21 | | Join MethoS- [0] (n=lem@dyndsl-085-016-160-247.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 21:28:51 | saratoga | gartral: probably not possible |
| 21:33:05 | gartral | hmm, ok, well, for now, i added BUTTON_REL too a few of the commands in solitaire.c. I saw a fix me on a sansa keypad, and wanted to know if it could be reproduced on a sim, if so, i may try a stab at getting it straightened out |
| 21:34:27 | | Quit MethoS-- (Connection timed out) |
| 21:35:29 | | Join casainho [0] (n=chatzill@89.180.211.249) |
| 21:36:11 | casainho | does anyone imagine why the player hangs here? http://blip.tv/file/1878330?filename=Jpcasainho-lyreHangs252.flv |
| 21:37:33 | casainho | I were working on audio drivers, and I thought before that it was hanging because of missing audio drivers, however, even now with drivers it is hanging like that... I would like to know it is hanging on that phase... |
| 21:38:45 | | Join MethoS-- [0] (n=lem@dyndsl-085-016-163-042.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 21:44:24 | * | Unhelpful can only imagine that it will be easiest for somebody with the hardware in question to debug the hang |
| 21:45:06 | Llorean | Is there some reason the images go slightly off the left edge of the screen? |
| 21:45:49 | casainho | Llorean: there is some problem with this LCD drivers... I am not much worried about it right now. |
| 21:46:35 | linuxstb | saratoga: rasher has already succeeded in getting itunes to sync to his Sansa (with some USB patches by gevaerts) |
| 21:47:06 | saratoga | ah ok |
| 21:47:15 | casainho | Unhelpful: I am doing JTAG debug, it jumps to interrupt handler... but I can't see it running any C code... :-( |
| 21:50:00 | saratoga | linuxstb: is there an FS entry for it? |
| 21:50:48 | rasher | saratoga: there are some patches on gevaerts' web space.. it's not really suitable for FS |
| 21:51:00 | rasher | gross hacks |
| 21:51:27 | saratoga | nothing wrong with hacks on FS, keeps things in the open where everyone can look at them . . . |
| 21:51:52 | * | gartral is pressed to find a reason people would want itunes as a general music manager... |
| 21:52:16 | Llorean | gartral: They still use the iTunes store. And criticism of it is off-topic in here. |
| 21:52:20 | | Nick EDOMPILF is now known as BUMBACL0T (n=ORF@ip72-218-112-46.hr.hr.cox.net) |
| 21:52:49 | bluebrother | casainho: have you checked the call stack? |
| 21:52:55 | Llorean | rasher: Really, Flyspray is supposed to be development, so things starting from hacks and iteratively evolving/polishing is kinda the point. |
| 21:53:30 | casainho | bluebrother: call stack? what is that and how can I check it? |
| 21:53:36 | gevaerts | If the consensus is that we really want to consider including this sort of functionality, it should be on flyspray I think |
| 21:54:30 | Llorean | gevaerts: Well, having it to look at and discuss on flyspray might help us reach a consensus. |
| 21:55:56 | | Quit MethoS- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 21:56:14 | casainho | bluebrother: It hangs on undefined vector interrupt address :-( |
| 21:58:32 | gevaerts | rasher: can you put the working patch on FS? I'm not sure if you changed things afterwards |
| 21:59:03 | rasher | Hang on.. |
| 21:59:22 | rasher | Are there different displays in the PP Sansas? |
| 21:59:54 | rasher | I'm sitting here with my father's and my own e200 here, and the colours look different |
| 21:59:57 | | Quit keby (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 22:00 |
| 22:00:42 | | Quit CaptainKewl (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) |
| 22:01:52 | Llorean | rasher: I know there were two different versions of the e200v1 at least (two different plastic parts of the scrollwheel) I don't know if they had any *actual* differences like that though |
| 22:09:11 | rasher | FS #10023 |
| 22:10:03 | gevaerts | nice title :) |
| 22:10:20 | rasher | Haha |
| 22:17:18 | rasher | Llorean: There's no doubt they're different. The colour I use in widecabbie (B58E00) looks sickly on my father's e280, but more warm on mine |
| 22:17:42 | | Quit nuonguy ("This computer has gone to sleep") |
| 22:18:58 | saratoga | rasher: do you have different back light settings in rockbox? |
| 22:19:09 | | Join CaptainKewl [0] (i=jds@207-237-172-77.c3-0.nyr-ubr4.nyr.ny.cable.rcn.com) |
| 22:19:11 | rasher | Hm, possibly |
| 22:20:46 | rasher | Brightness was different, but it still doesn't make the screens quite similar |
| 22:21:00 | Llorean | Do the e200s have a contrast value? |
| 22:21:20 | rasher | Not that I know of |
| 22:22:54 | toffe82 | can we fiound something about the encryption of the firmware of the hdd070 with this |
| 22:22:57 | toffe82 | http://pastebin.com/m658f347 |
| 22:23:09 | saratoga | you could try removing the OF bootloader on both to see if its the result of different initialization by different OF versions |
| 22:23:31 | saratoga | i suppose we might not init every voltage on the AS chip in rockbox |
| 22:23:43 | toffe82 | this is a dll used in the upgrade of the hdd070 |
| 22:26:40 | casainho | bluebrother: do you have any idea of what can be causing that problem? |
| 22:33:25 | rasher | saratoga: good idea, no time to check that I'm afraid :\ |
| 22:33:47 | | Quit casainho (Remote closed the connection) |
| 22:35:36 | | Quit XavierGr (Nick collision from services.) |
| 22:35:47 | | Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@rockbox/staff/XavierGr) |
| 22:36:52 | | Join midgey [0] (n=tjross@71.238.148.140) |
| 22:36:53 | | Join jaykay [0] (n=chatzill@p579E7949.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:36:59 | | Join casainho [0] (n=chatzill@89-180-211-249.net.novis.pt) |
| 22:39:40 | | Join sir_yodle [0] (n=theyon@pool-141-152-46-244.rcmdva.btas.verizon.net) |
| 22:40:53 | sir_yodle | #ubuntuforums-beginners |
| 22:40:59 | sir_yodle | whoops. |
| 22:42:10 | | Join arohtar [0] (n=faemir@88-106-169-118.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 22:42:10 | | Join lrnz [0] (n=lrnz@host-84-221-102-91.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) |
| 22:42:14 | | Nick lrnz is now known as asymmetric (n=lrnz@host-84-221-102-91.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) |
| 22:42:33 | | Nick asymmetric is now known as logiq (n=lrnz@host-84-221-102-91.cust-adsl.tiscali.it) |
| 22:42:46 | logiq | hi |
| 22:43:16 | sir_yodle | howdy. |
| 22:43:18 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 22:43:46 | logiq | i'd like to write a script to import sansa clip's ratings to itunes.. |
| 22:43:59 | krazykit | logiq, how is that related to rockbox? |
| 22:44:11 | logiq | lol, just a sec |
| 22:44:25 | logiq | in this thread people are discussing MTABLE.SYS file |
| 22:44:27 | logiq | in this thread people are discussing the |
| 22:44:33 | logiq | http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=14064.690 |
| 22:44:50 | Llorean | logiq: This is #Rockbox. It's for support questions and development on the topic of Rockbox. |
| 22:45:34 | | Part gartral |
| 22:46:15 | logiq | yeah i understand, but i thought maybe you could give me a hand, since i'm talking about a thread on your forums |
| 22:46:18 | | Join einhirn [0] (n=Miranda@p4FC60C8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 22:46:36 | | Join gartral [0] (n=gareth@adsl-75-33-64-115.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:46:45 | Llorean | That thread is about porting the Rockbox software to those players. |
| 22:46:48 | Llorean | Your question, isn't. |
| 22:46:50 | saratoga | logiq: try rockbox-community |
| 22:47:02 | logiq | kthx |
| 22:49:37 | | Quit gartral (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 22:51:02 | | Join gartral [0] (n=gareth@adsl-75-33-64-115.dsl.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net) |
| 22:51:18 | | Join jordoex_ [0] (n=quassel@d154-20-29-131.bchsia.telus.net) |
| 22:56:51 | | Part gartral |
| 22:58:58 | | Quit faemir (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 22:59:07 | midgey | inuxstb: you said you had a version of ipodpatcher that could dump the xml info? |
| 22:59:19 | | Quit arohtar (Client Quit) |
| 22:59:24 | linuxstb | Yes, for Linux and (maybe) win32. |
| 22:59:31 | | Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("Fwump") |
| 22:59:31 | | Quit jordoex (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) |
| 22:59:37 | | Join faemir [0] (n=faemir@88-106-169-118.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 22:59:42 | linuxstb | The win32 version needs testing... |
| 23:00 |
| 23:00:14 | | Quit jaykay (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 23:00:22 | | Quit Seed ("cu, Andre") |
| 23:00:22 | midgey | do you have binaries or a patch posted anywhere? |
| 23:01:44 | linuxstb | I have a patch and a win32 binary - http://linuxstb.cream.org/rockbox/ipodpatcher.exe and http://linuxstb.cream.org/rockbox/ipodpatcher-sginq.diff |
| 23:02:12 | linuxstb | To run it, do "ipodpatcher −−list" - that will dump the xml (it's not finished yet...) |
| 23:02:47 | rasher | The bit about the ipod serial number seems interesting also, assuming that's what the USB iSerial is set to |
| 23:02:52 | rasher | On http://www.thismuchiknow.co.uk/?p=28, sorry |
| 23:03:06 | midgey | I dumped the 4G xml by hand, but I'd like to check it |
| 23:03:52 | * | amiconn wonders whether the G1/G2 also provide that XML |
| 23:04:04 | rasher | I've added a 3g-nano dump to that page |
| 23:04:29 | linuxstb | amiconn: According to the IPL wiki, no. But it would hurt to test. |
| 23:05:20 | * | linuxstb remembers there's no USB... |
| 23:05:25 | amiconn | Does sending raw scsi commands via firewire work? |
| 23:05:46 | linuxstb | I expect so. You can use "sg_inq" in Linux. |
| 23:05:58 | amiconn | I *think* that firewire also uses the scsi protocol like usb msc |
| 23:06:10 | | Quit einhirn (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 23:06:13 | amiconn | No firewire controller in my linux box... |
| 23:06:49 | bluebrother | firewire uses SPB-2 which is basically SCSI |
| 23:08:42 | bluebrother | it's SBP-2 actually. Linux kernel module description says "SCSI over IEEE1394" |
| 23:12:35 | midgey | through my vmware install of windows, ipodpatcher gets a 0 byte XML |
| 23:12:51 | linuxstb | midgey: Does it give any errors? |
| 23:12:56 | midgey | no |
| 23:13:35 | midgey | the xml should start at page 0xc0 but it's much shorter than the 5th gen xml |
| 23:14:18 | linuxstb | I've tested it on my Photo and a 5g, and the high-level logic seems fine. It's just the actual SCSI inquiry which is OS specific. |
| 23:14:56 | midgey | if i get around to it, i'll try it on native winxp |
| 23:15:25 | linuxstb | But the rest of ipodpatcher works OK in vmware? |
| 23:16:12 | midgey | it was able to scan my 4g successfully |
| 23:18:32 | | Quit casainho ("ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.7/2009030422]") |
| 23:19:58 | rasher | The xml in FS #10023 might be a bit stupid. I think it denies AAC support |
| 23:20:44 | linuxstb | I guess storing/generating the xml is going to be the hard part - i.e. how to do it with miminal ram usage... |
| 23:21:06 | Llorean | We could just save it in an external file. |
| 23:21:09 | Llorean | Load it when disk mode starts. |
| 23:21:24 | rasher | Llorean: that just means ram usage |
| 23:21:43 | Llorean | rasher: For what? |
| 23:21:48 | rasher | For the entire file |
| 23:22:11 | Llorean | Can't we use the audio buffer during USB mode? |
| 23:22:18 | gevaerts | It's doable, with a bit of manual memory allocation |
| 23:22:19 | midgey | only load it on those two scsi commands |
| 23:22:19 | gevaerts | Llorean: we do |
| 23:22:33 | rasher | midgey: we can't touch the disk when in msc mode |
| 23:22:43 | linuxstb | Storing on disk seems messy - and makes it harder to manipulate... |
| 23:22:44 | midgey | bah, forgot |
| 23:23:12 | rasher | linuxstb: I imagine it'd be ideal for initial experimentaiton |
| 23:23:18 | linuxstb | e.g. it needs to include the ipod's serial number |
| 23:23:18 | | Part sir_yodle |
| 23:23:56 | rasher | linuxstb: not really. |
| 23:23:59 | linuxstb | Hmm, it's going to need us to know what each OF version says... |
| 23:24:03 | rasher | linuxstb: It's just set to XXXXXXXXXX in the patch |
| 23:24:34 | linuxstb | rasher: That may confuse itunes though - e.g. syncing with two different serial numbers, or DRM things. |
| 23:25:03 | midgey | gevaerts: same error, iPod detected, but cannot be identified |
| 23:25:06 | * | linuxstb is starting to think this might be more trouble than its worth... |
| 23:25:10 | midgey | i can try in windows real quick |
| 23:25:49 | rasher | I guess that's open for experimentation. iTunes doesn't care for one-ipod-use it seems - http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/Zen4Di8TqGdTDuUfcShcYA?authkey=Gv1sRgCKC8w6HrhOThuwE&feat=directlink |
| 23:25:51 | Llorean | Does iTunes need the whole XML |
| 23:25:59 | Llorean | Or can we just send it small parts of it that we care about? |
| 23:26:45 | | Join deweycooter [0] (n=chatzill@64.91.195.155) |
| 23:27:13 | rasher | Llorean: we don't know |
| 23:28:19 | midgey | gevaerts: good news |
| 23:28:30 | midgey | seems to work fine on vista with itunes 8 |
| 23:28:57 | midgey | ipod is detected as a mini, itunes tells me a software update is available |
| 23:29:03 | midgey | database can be read |
| 23:29:17 | gevaerts | so it's only OS X? |
| 23:29:22 | midgey | seems so |
| 23:29:30 | midgey | mayeb osx doesn't use scsi? |
| 23:29:44 | gevaerts | it does. MSC *is* scsi |
| 23:29:59 | midgey | sorry, i meant those specific queries |
| 23:30:22 | rasher | midgey: you can check logf |
| 23:30:47 | rasher | It should be enabled and logging something like cmdblck[2] = c0 |
| 23:30:53 | gevaerts | I'm pretty sure it does. It may rely on more specific things though, like caching mode pages and things like that |
| 23:30:55 | rasher | When c0 is requested |
| 23:31:06 | * | midgey will have to learn |
| 23:32:51 | | Join keby [0] (n=keby@cpe-24-243-7-225.satx.res.rr.com) |
| 23:34:51 | rasher | midgey: after a fresh boot, plug in usb, unplug. Then go to the debug menu and do logfdump. The logf contents are now in /.rockbox/logf.txt |
| 23:39:05 | | Quit ender` (" Be nice to the USA, or they'll bring you democracy.") |
| 23:41:29 | soap | Llorean: rasher gevaerts, IMHO If Rockbox USB is going to be in official releases for iPods either Rockbox duplication of the iTunes communication OR a very explicit section in the manual is needed. I think it is quite a lot to ask of new users otherwise. |
| 23:42:35 | | Quit bmbl ("Woah!") |
| 23:42:45 | soap | The difference between Rockbox booting into Apple's Emergency Disk mode and Rockbox switching to Rockbox's Extreme Disk mode is subtle enough for the casual user that the "breaking" of iTunes compatibility should be addressed, again IMHO. |
| 23:43:16 | Llorean | soap: It's a lot to ask them to say "Rockbox is a replacement firmware, and your iPod will not work like an iPod while running it (both in terms of the options it will offer you on the player, and the ways in which it may communicate with software on the computer)"? |
| 23:43:31 | rasher | soap: I think a manual section would be fine and reasonable. |
| 23:43:42 | gevaerts | I'm opposed to committing this itunes code now. It's not going to be tested enough in one week, even if we get it ready and fully working this weekend |
| 23:43:46 | Llorean | I don't think we need to go into any explicit details beyond simply saying "Rockbox is different, and will work different" in a clear enough way in the introduction. |
| 23:44:14 | gevaerts | The release notes should have a paragraph explaining the implications of the change I think |
| 23:44:16 | rasher | gevaerts: Very much agreed. |
| 23:44:35 | | Quit linuxstb (Remote closed the connection) |
| 23:45:37 | gevaerts | I'm actually still not convinced that we should release with the rockbox USB stack. saratoga's (and other people's) issues are pretty serious IMHO |
| 23:46:46 | soap | Llorean: My argument rests solely on the fact that this is _new_ behavior by Rockbox - the breaking of iTunes recognition. |
| 23:47:11 | soap | Someone comming from 3.1 to 3.2 would not expect existing functionality to break. |
| 23:47:16 | | Join linuxstb [0] (n=linuxstb@94-193-103-239.zone7.bethere.co.uk) |
| 23:47:45 | Llorean | The only functionality that's broken is "automatic rebooting into the OF" |
| 23:48:03 | soap | You are describing the cause - the effect is what end-users see. |
| 23:48:09 | Llorean | Transfers in the OF are still fine, so we probably need a disclaimer in red somewhere saying "To use your iPods with iTunes it will now be necessary to manually boot the original firmware" |
| 23:48:19 | linuxstb | gevaerts: I think I agree - there seem to be enough people having problems with USB to prevent its release. |
| 23:49:35 | gevaerts | I have the impression that it's fine on ipods, but then the ipod reboot is fast enough that people don't even know we reboot |
| 23:50:05 | | Quit petur (Remote closed the connection) |
| 23:50:27 | linuxstb | But then we have the itunes issue - users are bound to ask why itunes doesn't work with their ipods after installing Rockbox... |
| 23:50:34 | saratoga | gevaerts: did you see my note about your patch on the tracker? |
| 23:51:25 | gevaerts | saratoga: yes. I think it's good to know, and it may provide clues but I don't think a disconnect every 5GB is good enough |
| 23:52:20 | saratoga | how many people have problems with it? |
| 23:53:11 | * | bluebrother wonders if those targetid numbers are still needed in rbutil |
| 23:54:12 | linuxstb | So does anyone think USB should be enabled for the release? |
| 23:54:37 | | Join parafin [0] (i=parafin@paraf.in) |
| 23:54:58 | soap | Is there a solid breakdown of where it fails? Are the failures tied to target, PC OS, use of hub/etc, etc? |
| 23:55:27 | saratoga | soap: mine is definately related to my PC, as it happens in windows and linux on the same machine, but on no others |
| 23:55:34 | gevaerts | saratoga: at least two have reported it (you and Martyn). FS #10011 seems to point to MartinR also having problems. |
| 23:56:18 | gevaerts | Also, I could reproduce this a few days ago until I reformatted the sansa. I still don't understand that |
| 23:58:28 | gevaerts | My vote would be to disable USB again on the 3.2 branch |
| 23:58:59 | linuxstb | My feeling is the same - now we have regular releases, we should be aiming for a high standard. |
icon identifies that the person is a core developer (has commit access).