| 00:00:55 | domonoky | pixelma: the problem is, that we as developers are too familiar with those words, so we are bad a creating good description for users.. |
| 00:01:21 | saratoga | wincent: so hopefully you'll be able to remove all fp code from performance sensitive parts of pd? |
| 00:01:36 | domonoky | i just cant image a better word for the place where your device is connected, which fits mac/linux/windows. |
| 00:01:55 | | Quit jgarvey ("Leaving") |
| 00:02:40 | saratoga | flyback: my point is that if no one is working on a port to your device then it is not a good bet that there will be a port to your device |
| 00:02:44 | saratoga | unless you're planning to do it |
| 00:03:09 | flyback | I understand that |
| 00:03:11 | pixelma | does it need to be "mount point" there too? Although I guess for bootloader installing things on the player there should be some precision... |
| 00:03:14 | flyback | I have no problem with that :) |
| 00:03:40 | wincent | saratogalab: It's done already. I wanted to say that the performance of one oscillator is already tested. Most likely the system is much more capable, only I have not tested it yet. |
| 00:04:07 | saratoga | wincent: so what does the floating point code actually handle? |
| 00:04:54 | wincent | saratogalab: Control signals, like the value of frequency for an oscillator. |
| 00:05:14 | wincent | saratogalab: In the example it is a constant. |
| 00:05:34 | domonoky | pixelma: if you think you can improve the texts, please do it :-) |
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| 00:06:07 | saratoga | wincent: are you sure that doesn't impose a performance cost? likely that value would be feed into a call to cos(), which will be extremely painful on ARM |
| 00:06:21 | saratoga | or does the code implement its own fixed point trig functions? |
| 00:06:30 | pixelma | domonoky: not sure I actually can but I'm trying to keep that in mind |
| 00:06:33 | | Quit barrywardell (Remote closed the connection) |
| 00:07:24 | domonoky | pixelma: i also appreciate non-code patches, just tell us the dialog/desciription and the new text :-) |
| 00:08:59 | pixelma | the German translation of "mount point" though... it was even less descriptive to me but I don't know of many "clean" German computer terms... |
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| 00:11:16 | wincent | saratogalab: It converts the frequency value from floating-point to fixed-point one, using a floating-point addition and a shift. The oscillator itself uses a very big cosine table. |
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| 00:11:49 | gevaerts | wincent: so basically you only do floating point when something changes? |
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| 00:12:11 | wincent | saratogalab: Also, I implemented a floating-point sine and cosine as polynoms. |
| 00:12:54 | wincent | gevaerts: Yes. And it changes mostly when doing something in GUI, which is not implemented yet. |
| 00:13:30 | * | gevaerts always knew that GUIs slow things down! |
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| 00:14:08 | wincent | gevaerts: Of course! And AUIs do not! :-) |
| 00:16:05 | bertrik | yay, adc on meizu works (really easy though) |
| 00:17:01 | linuxstb | bertrik: Do you mean the audio adc, or the other? |
| 00:17:14 | | Quit HBK () |
| 00:17:40 | bertrik | linuxstb, the other, the one that reads battery voltages and such |
| 00:18:33 | gevaerts | bertrik: if you get stuck without a nand driver, maybe the ramdisk driver can help |
| 00:18:39 | bertrik | I wonder if I should use more interrupts and less polling ... |
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| 00:20:37 | bertrik | I mean simple interrupts where we go to sleep while waiting for the hardware and let the interrupt wake us up |
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| 00:26:54 | bertrik | gevaerts, I'm quite sure now that the nand/ftl will be the point to get stuck |
| 00:28:44 | | Quit martian67 (Connection timed out) |
| 00:30:01 | gevaerts | bertrik: if you manage to get the main rockbox binary running with usb, you can use the ramdisk driver to get a full rockbox on it to work on plugins and codecs. it needs some tricks in main.c (basically enable early USB for software USB), but it works |
| 00:31:03 | bertrik | ah, interesting idea! |
| 00:31:47 | gevaerts | I've done it at some point on my ipod mini |
| 00:31:48 | bertrik | like give it 2 MB RAM for running rockbox and 14 MB for the RAM filesystem |
| 00:32:10 | gevaerts | yes. I'd probably go for 8/8 or 4/12, but that's the general idea |
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| 00:33:53 | shotofadds | bertrik: have you seen http://www.iphonelinux.org/index.php/Critical_Drivers#NAND_.28Partially_Done.29 ? seems they have "enough of the FTL that we can read from the filesystem"... |
| 00:33:58 | gevaerts | The only problem is that it's not persistent, and it's bigger than the nor flash, so you have to fill it over usb |
| 00:34:11 | bertrik | I was also toying with the idea of replacing the RAR in the DFU image with a rockbox binary |
| 00:34:44 | bertrik | shotofadds, I knew iphones also used whimory, but didn't know they were already that far |
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| 00:35:01 | shotofadds | netiher did I, I just used the power of Google ;) |
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| 00:37:36 | bertrik | well, let's do that part last, maybe the iphone people figure out more ! :P |
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| 00:50:30 | amiconn | http://rockbox.pastebin.ca/1488935 call for opinions (regarding create_numbered_filename()) |
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| 00:54:56 | linuxstb | amiconn: What does it change? |
| 00:56:23 | linuxstb | BTW, why is that function in firmware? hwcodec recording? |
| 00:57:35 | amiconn | It changes the behaviour so that it catches pre-existing numbers regardless of length |
| 00:57:42 | gevaerts | amiconn: I think it makes sense |
| 00:58:50 | gevaerts | linuxstb: things like if it's considering to write "file01.whatever" and "file1.whatever" is already there, it will go on to 2 |
| 00:59:40 | amiconn | It was moved to firmware/ because screendump uses it, and was also moved to firmware/. See http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi?view=rev&revision=19967 |
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| 01:29:50 | CIA-71 | New commit by amiconn (r21732): Numbered filename creation: Make the search for pre-existing files independent of the requested number length. This way it will also increment ... |
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| 01:45:05 | amiconn | Hmm, new build system shows slightly different deltas from classic one. The deltas seem to be somewhat broken in the new system still. See e.g. ipod G3... |
| 01:50:17 | rasher | slightly different deltas happen in the old build system as well |
| 01:50:27 | rasher | Depending on which client built |
| 01:50:31 | rasher | a missing delta is more worrying though |
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| 02:40:55 | notByan | has anyone heard of an issue where the person has to use the official firmware for usb transfer to work? |
| 02:42:05 | notByan | if I plug it into the USB while on rockbox, it boots up that black and white apple stuff and anything trying to access the drive becomes unresponsive until it is disconnected |
| 02:42:11 | notByan | this is a 5.5G ipod |
| 02:47:24 | notByan | and this only happens about 50% of the time. |
| 02:47:33 | notByan | seems like more often than that lately |
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| 03:00 |
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| 03:14:09 | JdGordon | is there any known issues with the svn ams bootloader? |
| 03:14:20 | JdGordon | do i need to get the branched one? |
| 03:17:57 | saratoga | JdGordon: they should be the same aside from the version string |
| 03:18:30 | JdGordon | ok, just making sure.. dont want to brick my new toy :p |
| 03:18:59 | * | JdGordon really wishes it had microSD though |
| 03:19:23 | saratoga | JdGordon: you can't really brick a sansa by using a bad bootloader, the dual boot code is built into mkamsboot, not the bootloader |
| 03:19:33 | JdGordon | ok sweet |
| 03:19:37 | saratoga | so you should be able to recover even if you flash a blank bootloader |
| 03:20:04 | JdGordon | does anyone need bits for a 5.5g video? it doesnt turn on but the lcd and batt are fine (presumably) and hdd is good |
| 03:20:08 | dz | and there's always manufacturing mode |
| 03:20:20 | saratoga | dz: you're thinking of the e200 |
| 03:20:23 | dz | ah, true |
| 03:20:45 | dz | I was thinking the rest had that too |
| 03:21:19 | saratoga | dz: none of the AMS players have it, its a feature on PP only |
| 03:21:32 | dz | ah, I completely missed the AMS bit |
| 03:22:55 | dz | perhaps the fuel fumes are messing with my head |
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| 05:21:19 | Unhelpful | what do people think about trying to mostly eliminate -mlong-calls on ARM targets? as i understand it *most* calls could be made short, and short calls are faster, and smaller code, since they eliminate a load-from-memory for the function address... |
| 05:21:54 | JdGordon | whats the down side? |
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| 05:24:19 | Unhelpful | JdGordon: the down side is that calls that are "too far" must be made long calls. on the beast at least, this means calls between iram and dram (call site is in one, target function in the other). such calls would need to be explicitly made long... jhmikes had worked up a long call macro for this purpose a while ago, while trying to make a specific function short-called, because there were a few places where it couldn't be. |
| 05:24:38 | FlynDice | Unhelpful: I thought funman did that along with the mmu/dcache patch, is there something that leads you to beleive he did not? |
| 05:25:33 | Unhelpful | FlynDice: did he? it looks like many arm targets still use it... |
| 05:25:56 | Unhelpful | or are those specifically the MMU-less ones? |
| 05:27:00 | FlynDice | He rearranged the iram and dram virtual addresses to get rid of the long calls I think, I could be mistaken but I beleive it is so. |
| 05:28:08 | FlynDice | well for AMS he did, I am rather single minded... |
| 05:29:18 | Unhelpful | it looks like for the gigabeats long calls are gone. they are still there for all arm9 targets (i think none of these are supported?) and for any arm7tdmi target that doesn't call arm7tdmicc with a "short" argument in tools/configure |
| 05:29:43 | Unhelpful | the only target that uses arm7tdmicc short is ifp7xx |
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| 05:31:19 | Unhelpful | i'm assuming we *can't* do short calls everywhere via address fixing on the remaining arm7 targets, but it would still be possible if it's only an issue for iram<->dram calls to use a long call macro that is defined to do nothing special on other targets |
| 05:31:20 | JdGordon | rasher: ping? |
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| 06:00:40 | JdGordon | anyone know what the story with the clip keymap is? it seems to be a bit wierd on first use? |
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| 06:01:18 | Llorean | It is a bit weird, yes. It's a bit hard to improve it well. |
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| 06:02:33 | JdGordon | I find it odd that a button has been assinged for the rec screen which isnt enabled... |
| 06:02:58 | Llorean | That is weird, yes. |
| 06:03:00 | Llorean | Didn't know that. |
| 06:03:02 | Llorean | Which button? |
| 06:03:10 | JdGordon | long home |
| 06:03:13 | Llorean | Ah |
| 06:03:26 | JdGordon | based off the e200 keymap apparently |
| 06:04:33 | JdGordon | eek, its a mess :p |
| 06:04:47 | JdGordon | I want a go to wps button, but home doesnt really work there |
| 06:05:10 | Llorean | Yeah. |
| 06:05:25 | Llorean | I really think we should co-opt the volume buttons for lists. |
| 06:05:33 | JdGordon | I was thinking the same |
| 06:05:40 | Llorean | But there have been some arguments against it. |
| 06:05:47 | JdGordon | with an option so users can use them for volume if wanted |
| 06:06:04 | JdGordon | they are a bit hard to reach in the right hand though |
| 06:06:12 | Llorean | You could even have a combination to use them for volume. Long-home could maybe do that? |
| 06:06:40 | JdGordon | probably not.. buttons are too close |
| 06:06:42 | JdGordon | together |
| 06:06:50 | r4v5 | I'm still not sure why 2d scrolling (i.e. text input box) works the way it does on the e200, speaking of keymaps |
| 06:07:39 | JdGordon | the keyboard doesnt work at all on wheel targets... |
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| 06:09:42 | JdGordon | Llorean: do you know if home can be used in combos with the directions? |
| 06:09:55 | Llorean | JdGordon: No clue. |
| 06:10:25 | JdGordon | I'm tihnking home+up for WPS, home+down for quickscreen |
| 06:10:45 | Llorean | I wouldn't object to that if it works. |
| 06:12:00 | * | JdGordon forgot how paintful modifying keymaps was |
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| 06:19:36 | Unhelpful | hrm, actually, i think this can be made *fairly* non-invasive if we just add an __attribute__((long_call)) to ICODE_ATTR on targets that currently use -mlong-call. doing that and removing -mlong-call should remove quite a few long-calls, though possibly not quite all that could be removed. |
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| 07:24:21 | Unhelpful | ugh. the long_call attribute makes pointers incompatible :/ |
| 07:26:06 | Unhelpful | that, and the need to make sure anything with IBSS_ATTR has LC_ATTR wherever it's declared makes this a bit more invasive than i'd hoped |
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| 07:26:21 | drteazy | woo |
| 07:27:59 | Unhelpful | woo, indeed. need anything? |
| 07:28:57 | drteazy | I guess my Sansa e260 is jacked up. One day, I plugged it in to find the dreaded "USB Device Not Recognized" error. I thought it was the cable so I bought another and no go. Now, I have a question - I booted in to Recovery Mode and it said "PC Communication: Fail". Probably not good, eh? |
| 07:29:34 | | Quit r0b- (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) |
| 07:30:08 | drteazy | oh and another thing. I managed it to get it to be recognized in Windows the other day, but oddly the transmission speeds were awfully slow. |
| 07:30:42 | Unhelpful | it starts rockbox normally? |
| 07:30:58 | drteazy | Yes |
| 07:31:11 | drteazy | it works great. Just cant connect to my Dersktop add/delete files. |
| 07:31:22 | drteazy | err, Desktop. |
| 07:32:28 | Unhelpful | you could try starting the sansa firmware to do usb transfers. *if* the problem is in rockbox USB, that should still work. otherwise, the problem is either with your player, or your OS. |
| 07:32:54 | drteazy | Upon connecting the device to my Desktop, usually one of two things happens: 1) absolutely nothing (no "USB Device" errors, no device listed in My Computer) and 2) the "USB Device not recognized" error, coupled with an Unknown Device in Device Manager. |
| 07:32:56 | drteazy | ok. |
| 07:33:06 | drteazy | How would I go about booting to the original firmware? |
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| 07:33:25 | | Quit pixelma (Nick collision from services.) |
| 07:33:39 | | Nick pixelma_ is now known as pixelma (n=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) |
| 07:33:44 | | Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.) |
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| 07:34:08 | | Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) |
| 07:34:13 | Unhelpful | check the sansa manual for that - they're linked from www.rockbox.org |
| 07:34:20 | drteazy | k. |
| 07:34:35 | drteazy | thank u |
| 07:36:07 | Unhelpful | it should be in the "Quick Start" section :) |
| 07:43:06 | tmzt | how is the manual going to help with that? he doesn't have the rockbox bootloader installed? |
| 07:43:19 | tmzt | oh, rockbox manual for Sansa |
| 07:43:54 | | Join Thundercloud [0] (i=thunderc@persistence.flat.devzero.co.uk) |
| 07:50:10 | r4v5 | drteazy: should be left arrow/rewind in the bootloader |
| 07:50:49 | drteazy | I got it. Thanks fellers. |
| 07:51:08 | drteazy | this thing is totally jacked up. I think I need a new Sansa. |
| 07:51:54 | | Join __lifeless [0] (n=lifeless@188.16.67.103) |
| 07:52:40 | drteazy | anyone recommend a solid MP3 player (aside from the apple ones)?' |
| 07:53:02 | drteazy | I could get another e260, but that would be b-orrring. |
| 07:58:20 | cool_walking_ | drteazy: http://rockbox.org/wiki/BuyersGuide I quite like my e200 and Gigabeat S (though that's not a supported target yet, and the battery life is sucky compared to others). If you want to watch videos, the iPod Video can be a hassle for that 'cause Rockbox can only run them at about 15fps. |
| 08:00 |
| 08:07:51 | | Quit _lifeless (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 08:09:33 | Unhelpful | UGH. can't force gcc-inserted memset/memmove/memcpy calls to be long calls. |
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| 08:16:23 | amiconn | Unhelpful: Gcc is weird wrt short/long calls on arm. Imo it is not possible to get rid of long calls on arm targets where memory can't be mapped close enough |
| 08:17:31 | | Quit kachna|lappy (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 08:17:47 | amiconn | I mean getting rid of more long calls than would be necessary |
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| 08:19:09 | | Quit _Auron_ (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 08:19:15 | amiconn | For this to work properly, gcc would need to take both the section of the caller and callee into account so that one could specify those section pairs which need long calls, but it doesn't do that |
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| 08:19:20 | Unhelpful | the only way i can see at this point is to insert our own memset/memcpy/memmove calls... but then somebody could add code that introduces a new auto-call to one of them, and it will be broken for no reason they're likely to understand. |
| 08:20:09 | Unhelpful | or to use a solution like the mem function wrappers that the plugins used to have |
| 08:22:35 | * | amiconn accepted that there is no solution to this using gcc quite a while ago |
| 08:22:46 | amiconn | Maybe gcc 8.0 will allow that... |
| 08:25:43 | amiconn | It's not like all functions are long called atm. Static functions are always short-call. This is a gcc bug and the reason why STATICIRAM exists |
| 08:27:08 | Unhelpful | no, i'm getting the impression we couldn't drop -mlong-call. we could go the ridiculously invasive route, and add short_call attributes everywhere, and use a macro to perform explicit long calls when calls cross in/out of iram. to get a benefit out of that we'd end up having to go through adding those attributes to every non-static function, though. :/ |
| 08:30:23 | | Quit drteazy ("Page closed") |
| 08:30:44 | GodEater | Unhelpful: I'm not expert, but could the short calls be bundled into one location and wrapped with a #pragma no_long_calls instead ? |
| 08:30:52 | GodEater | s/not/no |
| 08:31:13 | GodEater | instead of adding short_call attributes to them all individually ? |
| 08:36:27 | amiconn | The fundamental flaw here is that gcc only looks at single functions, not at caller/callee pairs |
| 08:37:12 | amiconn | An iram function could be short-called from another iram function, but must be long-called from a dram function. |
| 08:37:25 | amiconn | Same for the opposite direction |
| 08:37:42 | Unhelpful | amiconn: yes, but if we can easily mark the bulk of functions as short-called, that leaves a fairly small number of cases to fix up. and as long as gcc-inserted mem* calls are affected by -mlong-call... |
| 08:39:00 | | Quit safetydan ("Leaving.") |
| 08:41:11 | Unhelpful | jhmikes had worked up a long-call macro a while ago, because he'd wanted to flag some particular function as short-called, but had one instance where it needed a long call. it's, um, more than a little ugly, but you get the same asm out of gcc with it as you would if the function were labeled as long-called |
| 08:42:34 | | Nick J-23|away is now known as J-23 (n=zelazko@unix.net.pl) |
| 08:42:37 | Unhelpful | it's non-trivial get gcc to call a function by address when it thinks it should call it by offset. he and i both tried a number of approaches and never came up with a pure-C approach - in the end it took an inline asm with "ldr %0, =function" that assigned its address to a pointer. |
| 08:43:59 | amiconn | hmm |
| 08:44:26 | amiconn | Just a quick idea - would it be possible to have a macro that turns an ordinary function call into a call-via-pointer? |
| 08:44:53 | Unhelpful | that is pretty much exactly what i have.... let me pastebin the ugly thing, just a sec |
| 08:44:56 | amiconn | Calling a function pointer is essentially a long call |
| 08:45:30 | amiconn | You need a pointer of the correct function type - and in an automatic way |
| 08:46:44 | | Quit BHSPitMonkey ("Ex-Chat") |
| 08:46:53 | Unhelpful | yes, and it's pretty easy to do that with inline ASM, if you abuse statement expressions and typeof |
| 08:46:53 | Unhelpful | http://pastie.org/539686 |
| 08:47:28 | Unhelpful | basically L_CALL(func) produces a pointer to func that you can call without gcc replacing it with a short call |
| 08:47:40 | Unhelpful | and without gcc generating any weird extra code compared to a normal long call |
| 08:50:07 | JdGordon | rasher: how much of your itunes patch is specific values for the mini? I did the changes for ata-sd-pp.c in ata.c (doing this on the 5.5g) and dmesg shows a mini trying to connect but it doesnt get a ums connection at all.. and I dont know if rockbox freezes or crashes, but it needs to be reset after disconnect |
| 08:50:10 | | Join ender` [0] (i=krneki@84.255.206.8) |
| 08:50:46 | rasher | JdGordon: You'd need to ask gevaerts - it's his thing, I just tested and put the patch on FS |
| 08:50:56 | JdGordon | oh, ok |
| 08:51:03 | rasher | He's going to kill me for saying that though |
| 08:53:14 | Unhelpful | if that #pragma can be used to force all explicit function calls to be short, it shouldn't be hard to add L_CALL() around the ones that we know cross in or out of iram. and of course L_CALL could be a no-op for platforms where it's not needed. |
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| 08:54:50 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 08:55:33 | * | JdGordon will annoy gevaerts about it tomorow :) |
| 08:56:56 | Unhelpful | a quick test shows that that should work. it may work better than we want it to, as apparently putting it in some always-included header will lead to it being impossible to force long call except by using an explicit function pointer. it even disables the long_call attribute, it would appear. :) |
| 09:00 |
| 09:00:22 | amiconn | Why do you need the asm at all? |
| 09:01:41 | * | amiconn admits that he doesn't understand that thing completely |
| 09:02:00 | Unhelpful | i tried just producing a pointer to the function in the statement expr. gcc converts that to a short call. casting to uintptr_t and back also still gets you a short call, even if the uintptr_t is a separate temp variable. |
| 09:02:30 | Unhelpful | it seems to be much smarter than we'd like in this case... which is funny considering how often it can fail to figure out similar problems. |
| 09:02:52 | amiconn | Hmm, that's a block... |
| 09:03:12 | amiconn | Did you try including the function's arguments in the macro? |
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| 09:03:45 | Unhelpful | and just calling the pointer that i create with __VA_ARGS__? i can try :) |
| 09:03:56 | amiconn | yes |
| 09:04:51 | amiconn | Another thing to try would be using the volatile qualifier for the pointer variable. This should stop gcc from converting the call, unless there's a bug |
| 09:05:29 | | Quit bagder_droid (Client Quit) |
| 09:05:29 | Unhelpful | that added extra code compared to a normal long call... although i must confess i'm not sure that i had the volatile in the right place. |
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| 09:06:42 | amiconn | Such manual solution have a fundamental problem anyway: they become ugly very quickly |
| 09:07:07 | | Part _Auron_ |
| 09:07:14 | amiconn | We have code where some functions are in iram on one arm target, but in dram on another, for performance and/or iram size reasons |
| 09:07:44 | amiconn | These places need ifdefing the macro (or maybe we accept a few extraneous long calls) |
| 09:08:10 | amiconn | (the macro *call* of course) |
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| 09:11:41 | Unhelpful | naturally gcc is going to make i liar out of me... i apparently have it working with a simple copy of the pointer, by atting the long_call attribute to the copy's declaration. |
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| 09:18:12 | Unhelpful | this appears to work properly: http://pastie.org/539708 |
| 09:18:13 | Unhelpful | removing the attributes causes gcc to use a short call |
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| 09:21:56 | bagderoid | trying this Android irc client... |
| 09:22:28 | * | rasher suggests bagderoid is in the wrong channel |
| 09:23:23 | Unhelpful | are there any C files that *don't* include config.h (or something else that includes it)? |
| 09:23:25 | * | GodEater likes bagderoid's nick |
| 09:26:35 | amiconn | Unhelpful: Does that also work for static functions? |
| 09:28:07 | | Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection) |
| 09:28:43 | Unhelpful | amiconn: as a replacement for the STATICIRAM hack? i'm not sure. i'm just testing with a c file that declares a few externs, and a few functions that do nothing but call them. |
| 09:31:24 | Unhelpful | the simple pointer-copy version doesn't work with a static function |
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| 09:35:57 | Unhelpful | the inline-asm version works with a static function as well... and generates identical code to a call to an extern long_call function |
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| 09:45:05 | Unhelpful | ok, i added a firmware/export/shortcalls.h with #pragma no_short_calls in it, and arm7tdmicc adds a -include shortcalls.h along with -mlong-calls... which of course leads to relocation errors, but i knew it would take hand-work to get the long calls forced where they're needed. |
| 09:45:59 | Unhelpful | just adding the #pragma to config.h got me warnings about conflicting definitions - obviously it's *not* always included. |
| 09:53:02 | Unhelpful | if i know that *all* calls to a function should be long, is it cleaner to change the pragma around its definition, or to L_CALL all of the calls to it? |
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| 10:10:28 | | Quit cool_walking_ (Ping timeout: 180 seconds) |
| 10:12:47 | * | bubsy eats GodEater |
| 10:14:51 | * | GodEater hopes bubsy gets indigestion |
| 10:15:08 | bubsy | do go on, think thoughts inside my body |
| 10:15:10 | bubsy | it won't help |
| 10:15:13 | bubsy | you're dead soon :> |
| 10:15:27 | * | scorche thinks bubsy has the wrong channel |
| 10:15:48 | * | bubsy thinks scorche thinks too much |
| 10:16:51 | scorche | bubsy: what i meant by that is that this channel is reserved for discussion about Rockbox...we have another channel for people to discuss social/offtopic items |
| 10:17:16 | bubsy | Yeah, I comprehended that, but somehow I didn't register it |
| 10:40:21 | amiconn | Unhelpful: The inline asm version looks like it's doing double assignment |
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| 10:51:46 | Unhelpful | amiconn: really? nothing like that happened with my test case, it looked exactly like the code generated by other long calls |
| 10:54:20 | Unhelpful | the asm generated in rockbox appears sane to me, as well, but gcc is making trouble... it's not putting its generated constants pool close enough to the loads from it. :/ |
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| 10:57:07 | Unhelpful | http://pastie.org/539760 from apps/codecs/sid.c |
| 11:00 |
| 11:01:36 | Unhelpful | i'm not sure what's up with the mov r5, r6 though... i can't find that it uses the saved value again. |
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| 11:13:14 | amiconn | Unhelpful: In http://pastie.org/539686, the line declaring _ptr assigns to it, and the asm statement assigns to it again |
| 11:13:37 | amiconn | I think that gcc optimises the first assignment away, but then you shouldn't write it in the first place |
| 11:13:55 | --> | "ident nec01nec" received from checkup (n=strac02@194.55.1.242) |
| 11:16:55 | | Join kachna [0] (n=kachna@r3g248.net.upc.cz) |
| 11:18:05 | Unhelpful | oh! i see what you mean. i have that fixed on my end already, but there's still the constant pool problem, which is pretty much a stopper for that version of L_CALL. and the simple assign-to-temporary version of L_CALL produces a short call if the no_long_calls pragma is in effect :/ |
| 11:18:42 | amiconn | Solution: do not use #pragma. |
| 11:19:41 | Unhelpful | which gets us back to explicitly marking any function for which we want short calls, with an attribute. |
| 11:19:43 | amiconn | gcc is already buggy enough without it |
| 11:19:46 | | Quit GodEater (Remote closed the connection) |
| 11:20:04 | amiconn | Why? Just remove -mlong-calls |
| 11:20:32 | Unhelpful | that's no good. gcc then generates short calls to memcpy and friends. |
| 11:21:19 | amiconn | Even if they're declared with __attribute__((long_call)) ? |
| 11:21:54 | Unhelpful | as far as i can tell its generated calls to them only care about the compiler flag. |
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| 11:24:45 | Unhelpful | the temporary-pointer version works in *any* case if i make the pointer volatile, but it generates some rather ugly excess code |
| 11:24:48 | Grahack | When I ACTION_STD_NEXT in the file browser, I select the next file. Now if I ACTION_STD_NEXTREPEAT, it scrolls down slowly and then faster. Could someone tell me where is this 'faster' thing is implemented in the C code ? |
| 11:25:57 | Unhelpful | it uses a pc-relative load to get the address, but then it moves the stack pointer (as a separated sub instruction), stores the address to the stack, reads it back from the stack, and then does the call. |
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| 11:26:33 | Unhelpful | and then uses an add to increment the stack pointer again. ick. |
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| 11:54:52 | Unhelpful | amiconn: double-checked with a short function that uses a char array with a short string initializer. gcc generates a memset call for this, and it only respects the command-line option for how to call it. adding a declaration for a long_call memset changes nothing, gcc still produces "bl memset" for the call |
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| 12:05:07 | Unhelpful | it's a shame that there's not a pragma that operates on the call the same way that long_calls/no_long_calls operate on the declaration... could just use that with _Pragma() and L_CALL wouldn't need any weird hacks. |
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| 12:52:56 | Torne | opinions on having an actual feature to have bookmarks resume X seconds before the actual saved position (for the benefit of audiobooks) vs telling people to just hit rewind themselves? :) |
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| 12:54:58 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
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| 12:57:32 | robin0800 | Torne, as long as it can be set on or off |
| 12:57:42 | Torne | yah, i was expecting it would be a number of seconds |
| 12:58:18 | Torne | the only cost would be the binsize, which would be "a setting" and then probably one line of code somewhere. |
| 12:58:45 | Torne | (assuming that it's okay to not bother to wrap to previous track) :) |
| 13:00 |
| 13:00:22 | robin0800 | Torne, a setting in music to go back to the beginning of the track? |
| 13:01:17 | Torne | a setting in bookmarks for how many seconds befor ethe bookmark to resume, i meant |
| 13:01:37 | * | Torne shrugs. I dunno if it's worth it or not tbh :) |
| 13:03:08 | | Quit AlexP (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 13:03:17 | robin0800 | Torne, The user would not know that for music so that would only be useful for audio books? |
| 13:03:18 | | Join AlexP [0] (n=alex@rockbox/staff/AlexP) |
| 13:03:41 | Torne | wouldn' tknow what? |
| 13:03:52 | Torne | and yes, it's intended to be useful for audio books |
| 13:04:39 | robin0800 | Torne, How long from start of track to bookmark position |
| 13:05:06 | Torne | i don't see what the start of the track has to do with anything |
| 13:05:17 | Torne | and it would just be *one setting* applied to all bookmarks |
| 13:05:25 | Torne | not for each bookmark, otherwise you'd just set the bookmarks earlier :) |
| 13:06:13 | robin0800 | Torne, that's where I would like the bookmark to resume from |
| 13:06:16 | | Quit daurn (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 13:06:34 | Torne | oh, you mean you'd want to set it to "beginning of track" |
| 13:07:02 | Torne | that's trivial also, but might make it two lines :) |
| 13:09:35 | robin0800 | Torne, at the moment every time you turn the dap on you have to hold rewind to do this or if possible only turn off at the end of a track |
| 13:10:15 | Torne | this isn't anything to do with resuming playback |
| 13:10:19 | Torne | this is specifically for bookmarks |
| 13:11:29 | robin0800 | Torne, This is bookmark on stop and resume last bookmark |
| 13:12:06 | Torne | well, whatever. i was just asking if anyone cared at all. you do :) |
| 13:13:09 | robin0800 | Torne, YES IF YOU COULD IMPLEMENT IT FOR MUSIC AS WELL |
| 13:13:41 | * | Torne arghs |
| 13:13:44 | GodEater | robin0800: you do know rockbox can't tell the difference between an audiobook and music don't you ? |
| 13:13:51 | Torne | there's no difference between.. oh there we go |
| 13:13:57 | Torne | if it was implemented it would apply to everything |
| 13:14:06 | GodEater | sheesh |
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| 13:21:30 | gevaerts | Torne: one problem would be that (as far as I understand) with many codecs you can't really just tell them to go back three seconds |
| 13:21:53 | gevaerts | well, you can tell them, but you can't really predict where exactly they will end up |
| 13:21:58 | Torne | gevaerts: i don't think it would work any worse than bookmarks already do |
| 13:22:06 | | Quit __lifeless (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 13:22:10 | Torne | wha ti was imagining is just literally subtracting the time from the bookmark position before doing anything |
| 13:22:18 | gevaerts | bookmarks also keep a byte offset I think (or was it number of frames?) |
| 13:22:25 | Torne | really? |
| 13:22:40 | gevaerts | I'm not sure, but I seem to remember they do, yes |
| 13:22:55 | * | Torne looks |
| 13:23:16 | Torne | damn, so they do |
| 13:23:23 | Torne | well, they keep "a big load of numbers" |
| 13:23:43 | GodEater | presumably because of that very problem with codecs |
| 13:23:45 | gevaerts | I really would like the feature, I just have my doubts on how feasible it is |
| 13:24:11 | Torne | if you tell a codec to go back three seconds is it likely to end up going back *less*? |
| 13:24:19 | Torne | or hugely, uselessly more? :) |
| 13:24:37 | Torne | cuz i wouldn't really care if it went back six seconds instead |
| 13:25:16 | GodEater | Torne: as I understand it the problem can be hugely exacerbated in long audio book mp3s, where you can end up going back minutes |
| 13:25:30 | GodEater | Llorean has more experience of it though I think |
| 13:25:49 | Torne | ah. |
| 13:27:01 | Torne | it probably violates my effort/caring ratio threshold then |
| 13:27:10 | GodEater | :D |
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| 13:27:30 | Llorean | Torne: I've tried to rewind two seconds only to end up three minutes *later* in a file |
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| 13:28:00 | | Part TheSeven |
| 13:28:47 | Torne | Llorean: ouch |
| 13:28:54 | Llorean | Yes |
| 13:29:10 | Llorean | It's quite frustrating, but apparently difficult to solve |
| 13:29:23 | Llorean | Sadly the time displayed in WPS is also somewhat unreliable. |
| 13:29:57 | | Nick Guest62011 is now known as dfkt (n=dfkt@chello062178002170.1.11.univie.teleweb.at) |
| 13:30:19 | Llorean | If I seek to 2:10:22, it'll actually show a different time (sometimes several minutes different) after the seek (which is the part that confuses me most - if we end up at the wrong time in the file we shouldn't *know* it's wrong or we could correct it) |
| 13:31:42 | * | gevaerts thinks that Torne shouldn't give up on this. He should just start by fixing the codecs to seek properly :) |
| 13:32:42 | Torne | gevaerts: you're not gonna get me like that again |
| 13:33:02 | Torne | i'm reading the entire bloody code for the beast flash. what more do you want! :) |
| 13:33:36 | gevaerts | lots :) |
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| 13:37:04 | linuxstb_ | gevaerts: Seeking's easy if you drop support for VBR mp3... |
| 13:37:33 | gevaerts | let's do that then |
| 13:37:41 | * | linuxstb_ doesn't object |
| 13:37:57 | * | Llorean gets the pitchforks and torches. |
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| 13:45:27 | mcuelenaere | Unhelpful: can't you just use the MMU to map the IRAM close to the SDRAM address? (on targets that have MMU's of course) |
| 13:46:00 | Torne | mcuelenaere: i would guess that we were already doing this on targets that have MMUs. Lots of them don't :) |
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| 13:46:21 | mcuelenaere | I don't think any of them do that, except for the Sansa AMs ones |
| 13:46:24 | mcuelenaere | AMS* |
| 13:50:22 | Unhelpful | the gigabeats apparently no longer use -mlong-call, either. it looks, though, like nearly all other supported arm targets do. there's a "short" argument to arm7tdmicc to drop tho -mlong-calls option, but only ifp7xx appears to use it. |
| 13:50:47 | | Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) |
| 13:52:07 | Torne | it seems rather stupid that gcc can't decide whether it needs long calls based on section |
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| 13:54:36 | KoRnAgE | Heya |
| 13:55:02 | Torne | hang on. can't you just get the linker to insert stubs using ip? |
| 13:55:09 | Unhelpful | Torne: even if it can, it appears to use internal delcarations for memcpy and friends. if you don't pass it -mlong-calls, it always generates short calls for these functions when inserting them automatically. |
| 13:55:37 | | Quit _lifeless (Remote closed the connection) |
| 13:55:41 | Torne | Unhelpful: it can't. it treats all functions with an explicit section as long calls, according to the docs |
| 13:55:49 | Torne | which means it will long-call between them too even in the same section |
| 13:56:04 | Torne | and yah, it's not going to listen to what you claim memcpy does. :) |
| 13:56:13 | Torne | sadly it assumes you are a standard C implementation for all that kind of thing |
| 13:57:05 | Unhelpful | right, and the unnneed long-calls within the same region of memory are what i want to try to reduce. it may well be that the best we can hope to do is look for select often-called functions and give them a short_call attribute. |
| 13:57:27 | KoRnAgE | ;~; *scratches head* |
| 13:57:45 | | Quit Tristan (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 13:58:03 | Unhelpful | KoRnAgE: this is a development and support channel for rockbox. expect programmer talk. :) |
| 13:58:18 | KoRnAgE | Yup ^^ I know x3 |
| 13:59:00 | Torne | erm |
| 13:59:13 | Torne | the docs for ld say the linker automatically inserts stubs for function calls which turn out to be too far away |
| 13:59:23 | Torne | which is as i thought :) |
| 13:59:32 | KoRnAgE | Rockbox can view images without plugins. right? o3o I'm sorry for such a noob question but I've been pissed at how putting my photos on the ipod firmware takes up more space than my HDD :s |
| 13:59:33 | Unhelpful | Torne: really, the most ideal would be to re-do the calls at link time based on their actual relative addresses. i don't think that gcc is capable of modifying anything but addresses/offsets at link... |
| 13:59:51 | Torne | Ooh, aha |
| 13:59:53 | Torne | there we go |
| 13:59:54 | Unhelpful | Torne: if it's doing that, i wonder why i get so many relocation errors at link? |
| 14:00 |
| 14:00:00 | Torne | it only works for EABI |
| 14:00:08 | Torne | We need to fix rockbox to use an EABI toolchain then :) |
| 14:00:30 | Unhelpful | try changing configure to use "arm7tdmicc short" for, say, e200. ;) |
| 14:00:32 | Torne | then you can have no long calls and it will generate them when needed at a small cost in binsize |
| 14:01:07 | Torne | it doesn't rewrite the instructions, sadly, becaus ethat's too hard :) |
| 14:01:53 | Torne | "Farcalls stubs insertion is fully supported for the ARM-EABI target only, because it relies on object files properties not present otherwise." |
| 14:02:15 | Unhelpful | well, a short call is fewer instructions, since a long one much load an address |
| 14:02:29 | Torne | yes. |
| 14:02:31 | | Quit Sajber^ (Success) |
| 14:02:38 | Torne | it inserts stub functions which the short calls are redirected to call instead |
| 14:02:49 | Torne | the stub loads the address of the far function into ip and then branches to ip |
| 14:02:56 | Torne | thi sis what ip is for in the AAPCS |
| 14:03:41 | * | Torne will test this out usin ghis eabi toolchain |
| 14:03:49 | Torne | i have no idea what issues we might face trying to build rockbox with eabi though |
| 14:04:30 | Torne | (or how *much* binsize increase we might be talking about) |
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| 14:25:58 | Torne | well i can't get it to work |
| 14:26:03 | | Quit KoRnAgE ("ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox 3.5/20090624025744]") |
| 14:26:04 | Torne | but variou sthings imply it should :) |
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| 14:29:11 | | Join Syrius [0] (n=Syrius@unaffiliated/syrius) |
| 14:29:15 | Syrius | hello all |
| 14:30:20 | Syrius | I have restored my ipod via linux awhile back and have rockbox on it and I was wondering how do I get it to detect on windows vista that it is a storage device ? |
| 14:30:36 | Syrius | because when i use musikcube I am unable to see it |
| 14:31:10 | Syrius | it says that any portable media player is visible if windows sees it as a storage device |
| 14:31:30 | Syrius | that it would be should under the devices menu in musikcube |
| 14:31:46 | Syrius | showed* |
| 14:32:33 | Syrius | I can access it of course via windows just like any device |
| 14:32:46 | Syrius | I am just wondering why it is not showing up in musikcube |
| 14:33:12 | Syrius | I can play music from my ipod if I add the directory |
| 14:33:19 | Syrius | in musikcube though |
| 14:33:48 | Syrius | maybe I need it in disk mode |
| 14:34:02 | | Join LambdaCalculus37 [0] (i=44a0430d@gateway/web/freenode/session) |
| 14:34:35 | MarcGuay_ | Syrius: Perhaps musikcube is expecting an MTP connection? |
| 14:34:45 | MarcGuay_ | When Rockbox provides a MSC? |
| 14:36:02 | Torne | Unhelpful: OK, autogeneration of stubs on ARM requires binutils 2.19 and *possibly* to be using eabi rather than oldabi, though i'm not sure about that |
| 14:36:23 | Syrius | maybe |
| 14:36:25 | Torne | Unhelpful: it doesn't work for me because my arm-eabi toolchain i have handy only has binutils 2.18.1 :) |
| 14:36:33 | Torne | rockbox's is even older |
| 14:36:48 | Torne | so i guess on that front it's back to revisiting how to get rb to build with current gcc/binutils? :) |
| 14:36:57 | Torne | (which would probably also help compiling as thumb and various other things) |
| 14:38:44 | Syrius | maybe MarcGuay |
| 14:39:31 | Syrius | that would be cool if programs would offer a plugin to detect rockbox firmware and to treat the device as a storage device and to scan it for playable audio files |
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| 14:39:54 | Syrius | I think they should seriously do that now since rockbox is user friendly now |
| 14:39:57 | Torne | musikcube doesn't do MTP, it works fine with MSC |
| 14:40:00 | Torne | according to their website |
| 14:40:05 | Torne | so something else is wrong. |
| 14:40:10 | Syrius | hmm |
| 14:40:17 | Syrius | what do you think it is Torne |
| 14:40:28 | Torne | site says it treats any removable drive with music on equally |
| 14:40:32 | Torne | so doesn't matter if it's rockbox or not |
| 14:40:39 | Syrius | I see |
| 14:40:39 | Llorean | Well, if it's an iPod, it may be trying to treat it as an iPod rather than straight MSC. |
| 14:40:40 | Syrius | hmm |
| 14:40:48 | Torne | Ah, there is that |
| 14:41:11 | Syrius | how could I get it to think it is not an ipod ? |
| 14:41:28 | Syrius | in vista explorer window it shows up as removable disk |
| 14:41:33 | Torne | website also implies that it doesn't have ipod support |
| 14:41:35 | Syrius | not as ipod |
| 14:41:37 | Torne | but that's less clear |
| 14:41:59 | Syrius | maybe I should email them |
| 14:42:00 | Llorean | Syrius: iPods always show up as a removable disk, or should. |
| 14:42:06 | Torne | if it shows up in windows as a disk then it's pretty much guaranteed to be the program's fault, not ours |
| 14:42:25 | Torne | either the program is treating it as an actual ipod and looking for iTunesDB, or it's just broken in some other way |
| 14:42:30 | Syrius | well I wouldn't know I haven't used windows in years Llorean |
| 14:42:49 | Syrius | well I am not saying it is Torne |
| 14:42:59 | Torne | yah, i'm just saying |
| 14:43:09 | Torne | there's not a lot we can suggest other than trying to disable any ipod support it might have |
| 14:43:17 | Syrius | I just thought you guys would be knowledgeable enough to know how to fix this problem |
| 14:43:34 | Torne | it's unlikely that anyone here has used that program, so probably not :) |
| 14:43:38 | Llorean | Unfortunately, we can't fix problems with other software. |
| 14:43:51 | Syrius | I love that program for windows |
| 14:44:00 | Llorean | Our software tries to do things "right" and hopes other software doesn't make bad assumptions, some software does. |
| 14:44:10 | Syrius | it is the best software libre program for music player I have seen for windows |
| 14:44:32 | Torne | we're not criticising your choice of audio player :) |
| 14:44:45 | Syrius | I highly recommended it |
| 14:44:56 | Syrius | I don't like itunes |
| 14:46:51 | Syrius | do you think I should change my ipod to manually manage music in itunes Torne ? |
| 14:47:12 | Syrius | I hope that works in wine I really don't want to install that on my windows box |
| 14:47:21 | Torne | that doesn't change anything on the ipod |
| 14:47:25 | Torne | that's just a setting for how itunes treats it |
| 14:47:33 | Syrius | okay |
| 14:47:43 | Syrius | hmm |
| 14:47:53 | Llorean | The iTunes setting shouldn't change anything. |
| 14:48:00 | Llorean | You need to find out if your software gives special treatment to iPods, and if it does, ask them to fix it to be more strict on what it decides is an iPod. |
| 14:48:41 | Syrius | okay Llorean |
| 14:48:51 | Syrius | thanks for your help and suggestions |
| 14:50:02 | Syrius | I think it is pretty cool that I can view images and play videos on a grayscale ipod but then again their was the grayscale gameboy |
| 14:50:17 | Syrius | I still have one of those a grayscale gameboy |
| 14:50:54 | Syrius | it still works too |
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| 14:51:44 | Torne | is there anything specific stopping us from using gcc 4.x other than "some things may not build properly for the usual reasons" :) |
| 14:52:58 | rasher | 4.x is used on a majority of archs. Om sh 4.x produces larger binaries iirc |
| 14:53:07 | rasher | On* |
| 14:53:57 | Syrius | Llorean what media player do you use for you media device in linux also what media player do you use ? |
| 14:54:03 | Syrius | I mean media device |
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| 14:54:55 | Torne | rasher: ok, i'm blind somewhat, though i actually mean 4.3 or whatever, but still |
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| 14:55:09 | Torne | how about a newer binutils, is the actually relevant one |
| 14:55:50 | Torne | binutils 2.19 on ARM for automatic far call stub insertion :) |
| 14:56:08 | Llorean | Syrius: Many people here have found they don't need a media manager. |
| 14:56:30 | Syrius | so what do you use then Llorean ? |
| 14:56:41 | Syrius | do you just play them from the disk |
| 14:56:53 | Torne | rasher: i guess i should just try it :) |
| 14:57:01 | Syrius | well I would like to play the music on my computer from the media device |
| 14:57:23 | Syrius | I already move the music to its own folder on my ipod |
| 14:57:48 | | Quit HBK (Connection timed out) |
| 14:57:59 | Syrius | but I don't want to waste up memory of audio files on my computer |
| 14:58:20 | Llorean | Syrius: This channel is about Rockbox. If you're asking how to play music on your computer, that's really a question for something else. |
| 14:58:28 | Llorean | None of Rockbox's features require management software. |
| 14:58:53 | Syrius | okay |
| 14:59:46 | Syrius | yeah but rockbox allows the ipod the ability to put music in a folder on your ipod which makes accessing the music different thus that is why I am asking here Llorean |
| 15:00 |
| 15:00:11 | Torne | it makes it the same as every other mp3 player :) |
| 15:00:15 | Syrius | because you don't need the apple itunes database file any more |
| 15:00:51 | Llorean | Syrius: But PC-side stuff like that is still off topic here. it's the same as playing music from any hard disk, internal or external. |
| 15:01:00 | GodEater | Syrius: relying on your ipod to keep your entire music collection is bad idea. You *should* keep all your music on your PC as well. Otherwise you risking losing it all one day when you drop the ipod and spack the hard drive in it. |
| 15:01:25 | Syrius | um GodEater I back it up on dvds |
| 15:01:34 | GodEater | excellent idea :) |
| 15:02:24 | Syrius | but most media player software for linux detects that it is an ipod and automatically treats it as such so then I can't play my music on it Llorean |
| 15:02:50 | Llorean | Syrius: And in every single one of those cases, you should be reporting the problem to the software provider. |
| 15:02:56 | Syrius | I am asking for a media player for linux that treats it and automatically detects the device as removable storage |
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| 15:03:31 | Syrius | then scans it for audio files |
| 15:03:39 | Syrius | then makes an index file |
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| 15:05:57 | GodEater | Syrius: Amarok does that |
| 15:06:45 | Torne | the ones which detect it as an ipod cna generally be told not to, either by disabling/removing the ipod plugin or by putting a special file on the device that says what kind of player it is and wat formats it supports |
| 15:07:21 | Syrius | I don't use kde GodEater |
| 15:07:38 | n1s | Torne: the reason that we've stuck with the gcc versions that we use is basically "they work" and the reward for an upgrade has been small to non existant, as in some cases things break, get slower/larger etc... |
| 15:07:38 | Syrius | thanks Torne |
| 15:08:10 | Torne | n1s: right. i guess sometime i'll try and see if it seems to work with binutils 2.19 |
| 15:08:14 | n1s | btw coldfire is the only arch using 3.4 all others are 4.x |
| 15:08:22 | GodEater | Syrius: what's that got to do with it ? Neither do I. |
| 15:08:28 | Torne | and if so then it may be possible to make it generate longcall stubs on ARM at link time |
| 15:09:11 | Syrius | because it requires kde libraries GodEater |
| 15:09:21 | GodEater | that doesn't mean you need to run kde |
| 15:09:29 | Syrius | doesn't go well with gtk |
| 15:09:47 | n1s | Torne: i tried to build the coldfire gcc with binutils 2.19 but bumped against some incompatibilities, not that that matters for arm... |
| 15:09:50 | Syrius | I don't want to install kde libraries |
| 15:10:06 | Torne | n1s: it might also need to be built for arm-elf-eabi instead of arm-elf :) |
| 15:10:09 | Torne | n1s: not clear on that one |
| 15:10:11 | GodEater | it works FINE with GTK |
| 15:10:33 | Syrius | I mean it does look good |
| 15:10:36 | Llorean | GodEater: The two of you seem to be wandering further off topic |
| 15:10:37 | Syrius | it doesn't match |
| 15:10:58 | Syrius | I think it has to do with rockbox |
| 15:11:05 | Syrius | I have already explained above |
| 15:11:10 | gevaerts | Syrius: it has *nothing at all* to do with rockbox |
| 15:11:17 | * | n1s still want's to try 4.4 with coldfire but it will take a whole day |
| 15:11:23 | Syrius | gevaerts you should scroll up |
| 15:11:32 | n1s | ... to build on this netbook |
| 15:11:39 | Llorean | Syrius: He's read your explanation. You're wrong in terms of what this channel considers "on topic" |
| 15:11:52 | Syrius | hmm |
| 15:11:58 | GodEater | Syrius: you're talking rubbish. I use Amarok just fine with all my Rockboxed players, including my ipod. |
| 15:12:19 | Syrius | I don't want to use kde GodEater |
| 15:12:26 | Syrius | kde apps |
| 15:12:53 | GodEater | well I think this conversation has gone as far as it needs to then. |
| 15:13:19 | Syrius | okay Llorean |
| 15:18:50 | * | Syrius sorry guys I was being stupid I am tired also I noticed that I didn't have the show devices checked :( |
| 15:18:58 | Syrius | I solved my problem |
| 15:21:20 | Syrius | thanks Torne I also solved my rythmbox problem |
| 15:22:03 | Syrius | I disabled the ipod plugin and enabled the MTP plugin :D |
| 15:22:32 | Syrius | rhythmbox* |
| 15:23:56 | * | Syrius is a happy camper now |
| 15:26:59 | rasher | Torne: I think the newer versions either produce larger binaries or slower code, pretty much across the line. Go figure |
| 15:27:35 | Torne | rasher: of binutils? |
| 15:27:54 | Torne | it shouldn't be needed to actually change gcc version now that i realised arm is already on 4.0 :) |
| 15:28:27 | rasher | Torne: Yeah, and 4.3 or 4.4 produce slower binaries iirc. |
| 15:28:37 | Torne | right. |
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| 15:29:11 | Torne | having ld 1.19 do the longcall stub trick should probably be a net win for binsize/speed though |
| 15:29:20 | n1s | rasher: in some cases at least i think we have not seen any comprehensive benches |
| 15:29:24 | Torne | since you can go back to -mno-long-calls |
| 15:29:33 | Torne | and it will just put in the stubs for the cases where it's needed |
| 15:29:42 | Torne | which is likely to be smaller and faster than having -mlong-calls for everything |
| 15:31:32 | teru | I'd like to commit FS #9383. any objection? |
| 15:34:27 | gevaerts | teru: if it fixes the issue, why not? |
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| 15:36:02 | amiconn | Unhelpful: The beast has no code in iram, hence the long-call problem doesn't exist |
| 15:36:20 | amiconn | ifp7xx is able to map iram close enough to sdram, and does that |
| 15:36:26 | CIA-71 | New commit by teru (r21733): fix FS #9383 (chessclock freezes on deleting a player), patch by Yoshihisa Uchida. |
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| 15:38:06 | Torne | GodEater: reproduced the ipod DMA problems using just the one patch :) |
| 15:38:14 | Flasher | godeater could you help me use the flashwriter plugin? i can't compile it, i get all sorts of "missing *.h file" errors. where do i have to place th.c file provided in that task? http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7505 |
| 15:38:21 | GodEater | Torne: yay =/ |
| 15:38:31 | Torne | GodEater: it seems very likely to be cacheline interference |
| 15:38:39 | * | GodEater wonders why he got picked out for this onerous task ? |
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| 15:38:56 | Torne | i'll have a look in the code. :) |
| 15:39:33 | GodEater | Flasher: if you can't compile that on your own, you're not the right person to be playing with such dangerous code in the first place. |
| 15:40:35 | Flasher | do i have to compile it patching svn? |
| 15:41:53 | Flasher | i though this was a promgramme on its own |
| 15:42:31 | GodEater | Flasher: seriously, if you don't know what you're doing, leave it alone. |
| 15:43:34 | Flasher | wtf i got three gigabeats it doesn't matter to me if one gets broken, so why not just help me out? i won't blame anyone if anything doesn't work anymore, it's my responsibilty |
| 15:44:35 | GodEater | perhaps because it's an involved process, and I had REAL LIFE to deal with ? |
| 15:46:42 | Flasher | i don't understand? what do you mean by involved process? i just read you had success using it, that's why i ask you. i tried contacting karl but didn't get any response. you're in the irc richt now, aren't you, so why do you tell me about real life at this moment of time? |
| 15:50:10 | | Quit Flasher ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 16:00 |
| 16:05:51 | | Quit rodpod (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 16:06:19 | Torne | is there some reasonably easy way to disable the cache on PP? |
| 16:06:26 | Torne | (just to test something) |
| 16:08:40 | * | GodEater conducts the Summoning jhMikes ritual |
| 16:08:52 | Torne | heh, apparently i'm still blind |
| 16:08:56 | GodEater | Torne: you might want to join in =/ |
| 16:09:08 | Torne | "comment out init_cache()" should do it :) |
| 16:09:13 | GodEater | hahaha |
| 16:09:14 | GodEater | ok |
| 16:09:20 | * | GodEater cancels the ritual |
| 16:09:22 | Torne | i was looking too early |
| 16:09:33 | Torne | in the asm bits |
| 16:09:37 | Torne | and it's just not done until later :) |
| 16:10:41 | Torne | GodEater: this is the brute force way to check if it's cache line interference :) |
| 16:11:38 | saratogalab | what do you mean by cache line interference? |
| 16:12:09 | Torne | saratogalab: the DMA code doesn't account for the memory not being cache line aligned and thus possibly containing other data |
| 16:12:38 | Torne | depending what this other data is and when it gets accessed, the cache operations in the dma code might trash it |
| 16:14:22 | Torne | yah. the player is unusably slow without the cache but the albumart doesn't get corrupted and it doesn't seem to crash |
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| 16:16:24 | saratogalab | Torne: would it be possible to round to the nearest cacheline and then truncate? |
| 16:16:50 | Torne | saratogalab: how to do it has been discussed in the tracker, you'd just use PIO for the start and end of the copy if they weren't aligned |
| 16:17:00 | Torne | and only DMA for cachelined aligned bits in the middle. |
| 16:17:12 | Torne | that code just needs writing :) |
| 16:18:01 | Torne | oh great usb doesn't work now |
| 16:18:07 | Torne | i guess the system is too slow :) |
| 16:18:12 | * | Torne boots emergency disk mode. :) |
| 16:26:44 | Syrius | how can you check the version of rockbox from the command line Torne ? |
| 16:26:58 | Torne | look in rockbox-info.txt |
| 16:27:04 | Torne | has all the parameters it was built with |
| 16:28:19 | Syrius | Torne should I remove the .rockbox folder before I upgrade to 3.3 if my Version: r19569-081223 ? |
| 16:28:46 | Torne | shoul dbe fine to jus textract it over the top |
| 16:28:56 | Syrius | okay |
| 16:28:59 | Torne | if you removed the .rockbox folder you would lose all your settings etc |
| 16:29:06 | Syrius | yes I know |
| 16:29:12 | Syrius | okay just making sure |
| 16:29:35 | Syrius | cause I know with a lot of software it has problems if you do not first remove the software |
| 16:29:40 | n1s | Syrius: it should always be fine to just extract over the old .rockbox |
| 16:29:54 | Syrius | I had problems with that with deluge |
| 16:30:06 | n1s | in some rare cases of files being moved or renamed a few old will remain but it is harmless |
| 16:30:14 | Syrius | I just removed the preferenced folder and reinstalled and it was fine |
| 16:30:35 | Syrius | okay cool thanks Torne nls |
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| 17:00 |
| 17:00:10 | | Join stoffel [0] (n=quassel@p57B4F908.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:09:56 | | Join BryanJacobs [0] (n=bryanjac@e33.cs.rochester.edu) |
| 17:16:26 | * | Torne hacks in the stats patch and tries using dma for only requests which happen to be cacheline aligned by fluke. :) |
| 17:18:24 | gevaerts | Torne: that will be all USB tranfers, purely by fluke indeed :) |
| 17:19:24 | Torne | oh, really? |
| 17:19:29 | Torne | that's possibly quite useful then |
| 17:19:55 | | Quit teru ("Quit") |
| 17:21:49 | gevaerts | Torne: cbw_buffer = (void *)UNCACHED_ADDR((unsigned int)(audio_buffer+31) & 0xffffffe0); |
| 17:22:16 | Torne | aha |
| 17:22:23 | Torne | so i can test dma a bit like that |
| 17:22:57 | Torne | i'm assuming cachelines are 32 bytes on PP5020? :) |
| 17:23:40 | gevaerts | I think so, yes. Have you looked at http://daniel.haxx.se/sansa/memory_controller.txt ? |
| 17:23:55 | Torne | i haven't, no |
| 17:23:58 | Torne | and that says 16 byte cachelines |
| 17:24:19 | Torne | i'm just Trying Things to see if i can get dma to work |
| 17:24:53 | | Quit MarcGuay_ ("ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox-3.5 3.5.1pre/20090704164440]") |
| 17:29:05 | gevaerts | Torne: the USB thing is for similar reasons, i.e. this way it worked. And if you're using 128k buffers anyway, aligning them to 32 bytes won't waste much anyway |
| 17:29:07 | Grahack | mcuelenaere: trying to install a pure lua lib which has this structure: libname/init.lua, I noticed that the Lua plugin couldn't reach it. http://www.lua.org/manual/5.1/manual.html#pdf-package.loaders says package paths can end with `?/init.lua` so we could go `#define LUA_PATH_DEFAULT "$/?.lua;" "$/?/init.lua;" VIEWERS_DIR"/?.lua;" VIEWERS_DIR"/?/init.lua;"` in rockconf.h. Works for me. |
| 17:29:25 | Torne | gevaerts: yeah. the problem with the ata code is it reads into all kinds of places in memory |
| 17:29:53 | Torne | you can fiddle to get the audio buffer cache line aligned, but that won't help anything that calls read() |
| 17:30:07 | Torne | anywya the stats patch appears to work now i've painfully resynced it :) |
| 17:30:24 | mcuelenaere | Grahack: ok, I wondered why I removed that init part.. |
| 17:30:28 | mcuelenaere | wonder* |
| 17:30:39 | * | Torne tries some usb to get some DMA going :) |
| 17:31:07 | gevaerts | Torne: I think that if USB and the audio buffer use aligned reads, we can do things like only using dma if things are aligned |
| 17:31:25 | Torne | gevaerts: that might be ok, yah, at least until someone is prepared to write the code to top-and-tail requests with PIO |
| 17:32:01 | mcuelenaere | Grahack: do we want the VIEWERS_DIR"/?/init.lua;" part though? I'm not sure that putting lots of Lua libs in VIEWERS_DIR is a good idea.. |
| 17:32:09 | * | gevaerts doesn't think that "if you want performamce, align the thing" is really bad |
| 17:32:30 | * | Torne checks the stats |
| 17:33:15 | | Part linuxstb_ ("Leaving") |
| 17:34:23 | Grahack | mcuelenaere: why could it be bad ? |
| 17:34:43 | | Join Strife89 [0] (n=Michael@168.16.239.88) |
| 17:35:08 | mcuelenaere | Grahack: I think putting those in a separate 'Lua' dir would be more appropriate |
| 17:35:19 | Torne | gevaerts: ok, the audio buffer is getting DMAs about 10% of the time with the code i have here |
| 17:35:27 | Torne | i think i need to fiddle with the buffer alignment patch |
| 17:35:39 | Torne | the usb code does indeed do it basically all the time |
| 17:36:05 | Torne | if i can get this looking like it's working then i'll throw it into my real build and use it for a week or two |
| 17:36:23 | | Join riek42 [0] (n=erik-ubu@BAJ1a9b.baj.pppool.de) |
| 17:38:17 | Grahack | mcuelenaere: agreed, I was wondering from the start why putting actions.lua here, but where to put this Lua dir ? .rockbox/rocks/viewers/lua ? |
| 17:39:18 | mcuelenaere | Grahack: well I didn't want to fiddle with the build system to make a separate folder etc. but now I'll take a look |
| 17:39:49 | mcuelenaere | .rockbox/lua/ or .rockbox/rocks/viewers/lua/ sounds good to me |
| 17:41:03 | Grahack | I personaly prefer the latter |
| 17:41:16 | | Part riek42 |
| 17:41:20 | Torne | so does the info on firmware/export/ata.h.orig |
| 17:41:22 | Torne | oops |
| 17:41:43 | Torne | so does the info on http://daniel.haxx.se/sansa/memory_controller.txt (which talks about PP5024) definately apply to pp5020? |
| 17:41:50 | Torne | i have no idea wha tthe PP model numbers mean :) |
| 17:42:16 | saratogalab | PP5022 and PP5024 are the same basically aside from the DAC |
| 17:42:27 | mcuelenaere | Grahack: I'll look into this later, am busy atm |
| 17:42:32 | saratogalab | PP5020 is an older model thats fairly close to PP5022 |
| 17:42:50 | saratogalab | PP5002 is the oldest and is much different and very slow, its only in the Ipod 3G and older |
| 17:42:53 | Torne | i can't imagine an olde rone having bigger cachelines |
| 17:43:02 | Torne | so it's probably ok to check for 16-byte alignment only |
| 17:43:19 | saratogalab | i think we can only do DMA on PP5020 and abvoe anyway |
| 17:43:26 | Torne | yeah, it's in ata-pp5020.c |
| 17:48:59 | Torne | ok, i don't understand buffering.c :) |
| 17:51:12 | BryanJacobs | Torne: ask |
| 17:51:58 | * | BryanJacobs thinks there should be a master's degree in Rockbox buffering |
| 17:52:28 | Torne | BryanJacobs: i want to arrange for the buffering code's calls to the storage layer to request reads into 16-byte aligned regions :) |
| 17:53:12 | BryanJacobs | that would be in buffering_thread |
| 17:53:20 | BryanJacobs | look for that method |
| 17:53:33 | BryanJacobs | probably near Q_BUFFER_HANDLE it'll call buffer_handle |
| 17:53:44 | BryanJacobs | and then in the body of buffer_handle you'll find the storage-layer calls, eh? |
| 17:54:26 | BryanJacobs | line 635, exactly |
| 17:55:40 | BryanJacobs | the issue is that the read request could be for < 16 bytes and you can't just waste space in the buffer - the codecs expect contiguous regions - so you can't actually guarantee aligned reads |
| 17:55:59 | | Quit Grahack ("Leaving.") |
| 17:55:59 | | Quit n00b81 ("Leaving") |
| 17:56:54 | Torne | it won't be unless it's the end of the file or the end of the buffer, though, no? |
| 17:57:10 | BryanJacobs | correct |
| 17:57:19 | BryanJacobs | otherwise it'll be BUFFER_DEFAULT_FILECHUNK bytes |
| 17:57:32 | BryanJacobs | err BUFFERING_DEFAULT_FILECHUNK |
| 17:57:54 | Torne | so it doesn't need to realign itself at any point codecs would care about |
| 17:58:03 | Torne | as long as it was aligned correctly at the start of each handle and ata the wraparound point |
| 17:58:48 | BryanJacobs | yes, so you could just make the memory_handle correctly sized and alter add_handle to align it |
| 17:59:59 | Dhraakellian | is it possible to specify one font for the menu system and one for the wps? |
| 18:00 |
| 18:00:05 | Torne | Dhraakellian: no |
| 18:00:09 | Dhraakellian | okay |
| 18:00:33 | Dhraakellian | then I guess it's fortunate that Plain Text VP looks okay(ish) with the built-in font |
| 18:00:49 | * | BryanJacobs would like to have a different menu font as he likes the NerdSketch theme |
| 18:01:03 | * | BryanJacobs also has good eyesight and so likes small menu text |
| 18:01:07 | Torne | BryanJacobs: fix the multifont code to be acceptable then :) |
| 18:01:16 | * | BryanJacobs remembers that patch and shudders |
| 18:01:20 | Dhraakellian | heh |
| 18:01:22 | Torne | or just write a new one ;) |
| 18:01:40 | BryanJacobs | I think I'll do the work that pays the bills first |
| 18:01:47 | BryanJacobs | like the summer of code stuff :-P |
| 18:01:57 | Torne | bah, being paid :) |
| 18:02:14 | Dhraakellian | my brother likes PlainTextVP with 08-Rockfont (which I set up for him), but he wants the (larger) default helvetica for the menu system |
| 18:02:30 | saratogalab | hes out of luck for now |
| 18:02:39 | Dhraakellian | what font is the built-in? |
| 18:02:46 | Dhraakellian | is it the same as schumacher clean? |
| 18:03:06 | Torne | yes |
| 18:03:14 | Dhraakellian | ah |
| 18:03:15 | Dhraakellian | good |
| 18:04:01 | Dhraakellian | because the PlainText VP theme specifies Schumacher Clean (although it looks better with 08-Rockfont) |
| 18:04:24 | BryanJacobs | I like how line 1281 has "register_buffering_callback" and "unregister_buffering_callback" listed but those functions don't actually exist in buffering.c |
| 18:07:18 | Torne | anyway, i need the *other* kind of alignment first, i think |
| 18:07:43 | Torne | but there's already a patch for that, it's just out of date :) |
| 18:11:18 | | Join toffe82 [0] (n=chatzill@74.0.180.178) |
| 18:12:18 | Torne | well that doesn't seem to have changed anything for better or worse. |
| 18:13:04 | BryanJacobs | no noose is good noose |
| 18:14:23 | | Quit Strife89 ("Leaving") |
| 18:14:54 | | Quit saratogalab ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 18:19:40 | Torne | BryanJacobs: is it sufficient to align new_widx in add_handle to a multiple of 16 instead of 4? |
| 18:21:33 | Torne | no, not new_widx, that's wher ethe handle gets put |
| 18:21:49 | Torne | buf_widx, after it gets incremented by sizeof(struct memory_handle) |
| 18:25:10 | Torne | ..ok, i'm gonna stop for now. :) |
| 18:41:43 | bertrik | is there a rule of thumb for when to use a simple polling wait loop, and when to use a wakeup_wait/wakeup_signal? |
| 18:42:28 | mcuelenaere | bertrik: I think wakeup_wait is always preferred |
| 18:42:43 | mcuelenaere | well of course not for very tiny microloops or so |
| 18:44:44 | bertrik | I would guess anything longer than the interrupt latency could use a wakeup* |
| 18:55:05 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
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| 19:00 |
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| 19:14:49 | BryanJacobs | Torne: until shrink_handle, yes |
| 19:15:28 | BryanJacobs | wait... no |
| 19:15:46 | BryanJacobs | buf_widx gets incremented as data are read into the handle |
| 19:16:14 | BryanJacobs | so it'll be fine unless the handle is moved or shrinks |
| 19:16:46 | BryanJacobs | if you align it there on line 252 you guarantee that every new handle is created with its data on a 16-byte alignment |
| 19:18:28 | BryanJacobs | however, if you call read(),bufadvance(),shrink_handle(),and read(), the last read won't necessarily be aligned |
| 19:19:27 | | Quit flydutch ("/* empty */") |
| 19:22:25 | bertrik | mcuelenaere, we currently use busy loops for i2c on meizu and ams sansa, those could take up to 75 us |
| 19:22:38 | | Quit KBH () |
| 19:22:50 | bertrik | more like, _at least_ 75 us |
| 19:23:04 | | Join domonoky [0] (n=Domonoky@rockbox/developer/domonoky) |
| 19:23:46 | bertrik | and I think a full LCD update on the fuze or e200v2 for example takes 10 ms |
| 19:23:47 | | Join HBK [0] (n=hbk@pool-71-96-74-73.dfw.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 19:25:32 | bertrik | I plan to commit the adc code for the meizus tonight, maybe also some more timer code |
| 19:25:43 | | Join JdGordon| [0] (n=Miranda@nat/microsoft/session) |
| 19:26:42 | bertrik | perhaps convert some busy-wait loops into wakeup_wait |
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| 19:31:59 | JdGordon| | can home+up be used as a combo on the clip? |
| 19:33:13 | bertrik | you mean if it is technically possible? |
| 19:33:17 | JdGordon| | yes |
| 19:33:44 | JdGordon| | home+down does work so I'm not sure if its a keymap thing or its hardware |
| 19:34:34 | bertrik | it think it should be possible |
| 19:35:57 | | Join jgarvey [0] (n=jgarvey@cpe-098-026-065-013.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 19:36:20 | bertrik | but I don't like to use combos :P |
| 19:36:50 | JdGordon| | yeah yeah :) |
| 19:37:34 | JdGordon| | so obviously being late to the party... why isnt the clip supported yet? |
| 19:37:45 | JdGordon| | or are we still blocked with no manual and rbutil? |
| 19:39:59 | bertrik | playback stops spontaneously sometimes on the clip |
| 19:40:32 | | Join petur [0] (n=peter@rockbox/developer/petur) |
| 19:41:54 | JdGordon| | it does that on my ipods also :p |
| 19:44:33 | Dhraakellian | hmm... the button(s) for marking a number as possible in sudoku on the fuze is/are select+up currently |
| 19:44:40 | Dhraakellian | would it be better for them to be long select? |
| 19:44:48 | LambdaCalculus37 | JdGordon|: I think it's because there are still some SD driver bugs to work out. |
| 19:45:05 | | Join _lifeless [0] (n=lifeless@90.150.113.130) |
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| 19:58:47 | kugel | JdGordon|: do you have a clip now? |
| 19:59:06 | JdGordon| | yes :) |
| 19:59:48 | kugel | so why don't you just try whether home+up is possible? It should be |
| 20:00 |
| 20:00:07 | JdGordon| | I did... and like i said, i wasnt sure if it was a keymap or hardware issue... |
| 20:00:15 | JdGordon| | I'll play more tonight |
| 20:01:34 | kugel | work on the keymap is surely welcome |
| 20:01:44 | | Join barrywardell [0] (n=barrywar@79.97.85.223) |
| 20:01:51 | kugel | it's heavly based on the c200 keymap |
| 20:01:58 | JdGordon| | yeah, it sucks :D |
| 20:02:11 | JdGordon| | I started last night but ended up doing stuff... ill play tonight properly |
| 20:03:03 | JdGordon| | the comments say its based on the e200 doesnt it? |
| 20:03:11 | | Quit BryanJacobs ("Java user signed off") |
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| 20:09:58 | kugel | JdGordon|: the c200 keymap probably also says this |
| 20:10:13 | JdGordon| | :) |
| 20:10:27 | kugel | adding keymaps is always c&p, hence barrywardell has done so many of them :) |
| 20:10:53 | | Quit einhirn ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 20:16:50 | bertrik | I think the clip keymap is quite OK already |
| 20:17:35 | kugel | you don't use plugins, do you? :p |
| 20:17:57 | kugel | btw, I'm also against volume-in-lists |
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| 20:18:27 | kugel | I'd rather put goto-wps and quickscreen (i.e. what UP and DOWN do on e200/fuze) on those |
| 20:18:45 | kugel | although, that won't work for the wps I guess |
| 20:19:04 | JdGordon| | I'm putting the wps on home+up and quickscreen on home+down... the logic is pressing home makes the button do what the image on it is |
| 20:19:30 | JdGordon| | there shuld be a setting to use the volume buttons as volume or as page up/down in the lists thoughg |
| 20:19:47 | kugel | couldn't toggling wps and main menu be on plain home? |
| 20:20:00 | | Join kushalone [0] (n=kushal@12.169.180.141) |
| 20:20:05 | kugel | as in configurable buttons? :/ |
| 20:20:09 | | Join Thundercloud [0] (i=thunderc@persistence.flat.devzero.co.uk) |
| 20:20:19 | JdGordon| | some drongo ( :D ) put goto rec on long home.... |
| 20:20:54 | kugel | I was surprised that it was Llorean's idea, I remember him to be against configurable btutons |
| 20:21:00 | JdGordon| | and short home should usually go to the menu, but keeping with every other target, pressing it again should go back to the previous screen from the top menu, so it cant really be goto wps from there |
| 20:21:16 | JdGordon| | what was Llorean's idea? |
| 20:21:30 | kugel | the setting for volume in lists |
| 20:21:59 | JdGordon| | i dont think he said anything about making it an option... |
| 20:22:09 | kugel | What's co-opt then? |
| 20:22:38 | kugel | isn't it already doing volume in lists? |
| 20:22:45 | JdGordon| | yes |
| 20:23:26 | kugel | maybe I got him wrong then |
| 20:24:47 | Dhraakellian | long record going to the record screen was annoying with the e200 |
| 20:25:00 | * | JdGordon| does want single finger goto wps and menu |
| 20:25:37 | bertrik | so we can map that on HOME, right? |
| 20:25:50 | * | gevaerts suddenly remembers that he got annoyed a bit by the D2 keymap yesterday. Stop is too close to hold-off... |
| 20:26:03 | JdGordon| | bertrik: |
| 20:26:05 | JdGordon| | bah |
| 20:26:16 | JdGordon| | no, because home is goto menu/previous |
| 20:26:22 | Dhraakellian | question regarding Fuze Sudoku binds: how deliberate are they? Is there any particular reason for them to not be closer to the e200? |
| 20:26:25 | JdGordon| | or should be |
| 20:27:38 | bertrik | HOME could be goto wps (or goto FM) when you are in the menu |
| 20:28:08 | | Join shotofadds [0] (n=rob@80-44-101-38.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 20:28:28 | JdGordon| | in keeping with every other target it shuold go to previous (which it does) |
| 20:28:48 | JdGordon| | maybe long home goto wps |
| 20:29:12 | shotofadds | gevaerts: do you think it would be better if a short POWER press went to the menu instead? |
| 20:29:26 | shotofadds | i agree it's annoying the way it is currently |
| 20:29:37 | gevaerts | shotofadds: maybe. I haven't thought about it much |
| 20:29:57 | gevaerts | Or maybe my fingers can just get used to it |
| 20:30:05 | bertrik | JdGordon, well what do you like more, single-finger WPS or goto-previous? |
| 20:30:08 | shotofadds | I still find it annoying now... |
| 20:30:44 | JdGordon| | bertrik: I dont tihnk it would be an issue if home in the wps went to the menu instead of down |
| 20:30:53 | gevaerts | I think stop is useful to have on a physical button though, and there aren't that many of those |
| 20:31:05 | JdGordon| | home does SFA i tihnk |
| 20:31:13 | shotofadds | gevaerts: well, there's always long POWER ;-) |
| 20:31:23 | gevaerts | shotofadds: that will stop it all right :) |
| 20:31:49 | kugel | JdGordon: the volume buttons........ |
| 20:32:14 | kugel | who *needs* volume in lists really of the wps is 1 press away. |
| 20:32:22 | kugel | if* |
| 20:32:25 | JdGordon| | kugel: I think if we did that, volume should be up/down and the actual buttons do what they say |
| 20:32:40 | JdGordon| | but that should be configurable... :D |
| 20:32:56 | kugel | I disagree, but still better than what's now |
| 20:37:02 | * | pixelma scrapped forced horizontal scrolling on the c200 recently to get a "go to WPS button" which is "long right" now |
| 20:37:51 | pixelma | although I also found it quite nice to have "volume up" for it and then have no volume in lists |
| 20:38:41 | kugel | JdGordon: using volume buttons for up/down is a major annoyance. you'd need to move the finger from the side to the middle and back constantly while browsing |
| 20:38:54 | Dhraakellian | the only difference between the e200 and c200 is that the wheel is replaced by two volume buttons, right? |
| 20:39:04 | JdGordon| | the thing is tiny, so you have to rearrange your girp anyway |
| 20:39:26 | JdGordon| | and where does the brain mapping come in for up being wps and down being qs? |
| 20:39:32 | bertrik | JdGordon, I won't |
| 20:39:54 | JdGordon| | ? |
| 20:39:59 | Dhraakellian | JdGordon|: up = play = go to the display of what's playing? |
| 20:40:27 | JdGordon| | the play picture is on the other button though |
| 20:40:31 | pixelma | Dhraakellian: yes but that is a quite important difference, especially since the volume button is quite a bit away from the main pad |
| 20:40:31 | bertrik | Dhraakellian, the clip has no rec button and having no wheel means there nothing in the way of the left/right/up/down buttons |
| 20:41:12 | JdGordon| | the buggers should have put a microSD slot in and a wheel! |
| 20:41:17 | pixelma | he asked about the c200 though |
| 20:41:28 | kugel | JdGordon|: you're too focussed on the pictures on the buttons...we ignore those on many targets |
| 20:41:38 | JdGordon| | no we dont... |
| 20:41:46 | * | Dhraakellian is watching the convo out of curiosity and such |
| 20:41:47 | JdGordon| | we go by them on far more than ignoring |
| 20:41:57 | kugel | I didn't say most |
| 20:42:24 | kugel | a keymap which isn't totally insane is much more preferrable |
| 20:42:41 | JdGordon| | there needs to be some logic to it though... |
| 20:42:54 | JdGordon| | I shoudlnt have to open the manul to figure out how to use it |
| 20:43:21 | kugel | oh yea, and putting up/down which are on the side is clearly logical |
| 20:43:30 | kugel | s/which ar// |
| 20:43:56 | JdGordon| | its a verticle bar... yes its bloody logical |
| 20:44:04 | JdGordon| | far more than using it for arbitrary commands |
| 20:44:09 | bertrik | I have a very hard time seeing the logic in it |
| 20:44:24 | bertrik | it even says "volume"! |
| 20:44:34 | kugel | show me a player which doesn't have the navigation buttons on the front |
| 20:44:35 | bertrik | at least my clip does on those buttons |
| 20:45:30 | * | JdGordon| is now confused |
| 20:45:46 | JdGordon| | is bertrik agreeing with me or kugel? |
| 20:45:51 | JdGordon| | or neither |
| 20:46:05 | kugel | JdGordon|: He's not seeing the logic in your proposal |
| 20:46:36 | kugel | because there is no logic. even if we go that route to map functions to the fancy pictures, it doesn't work for volume |
| 20:47:02 | JdGordon| | it is ALOT harder to see the volume text than it is to see the pictures |
| 20:48:40 | bertrik | I want up/down/left/right navigation on the buttons around the select button, not up/down on volume. I prefer the volume buttons to control volume. |
| 20:49:04 | kugel | but the PICTURES! |
| 20:49:21 | * | kugel stops being sarcastic |
| 20:49:30 | * | JdGordon| punches kugel in the nose |
| 20:49:39 | JdGordon| | I'm not saying we have to use the picutres.. |
| 20:49:50 | JdGordon| | I'm saying having those actions on the volume button makes no sense |
| 20:49:54 | amiconn | Dhraakellian: The built-in font uses the same glyphs as 08-Schumacher-Clean, but only the ISO8859-1 codepoints |
| 20:49:55 | bertrik | the pictures should have meaning in the WPS, not in the menu IMO |
| 20:50:09 | amiconn | The loadable 08-Schumacher-Clean goes beyond that |
| 20:50:33 | JdGordon| | HOME should goto the main menu though... not the bottom button which should be the context menu button |
| 20:50:35 | Dhraakellian | amiconn: ah |
| 20:50:53 | * | shotofadds starts his first D2 battery_bench (mp3 from SD). I'm going for a *pessimistic* 18hrs, since I've seen RB play FLACs from internal flash for a solid 24hrs, and that wasn't even on a full charge... |
| 20:51:09 | shotofadds | s/going for/expecting |
| 20:51:14 | Dhraakellian | heh. |
| 20:51:24 | * | Dhraakellian should do a batterybench on his Fuze |
| 20:51:56 | Dhraakellian | load up the 10-symphony Bruckner cycle (q6 Vorbis) on repeat |
| 20:52:02 | Dhraakellian | see if it makes it all the way through |
| 20:52:30 | pixelma | shotofadds: tell us if it beats the M5L record :) |
| 20:52:37 | kugel | JdGordon: why should the bottom one context menu? It's on long select on the majority of targets |
| 20:52:49 | kugel | we even changed it from bottom to long select on the e200 |
| 20:52:59 | pixelma | and the c200 |
| 20:53:10 | JdGordon| | then both should goto menu |
| 20:53:24 | shotofadds | pixelma: now that would be impressive! |
| 20:53:29 | Unhelpful | amiconn: right... and if we start using iram on beast we can map it wherever we want. can we possibly move iram's mapping on the other arm7tdmi targets, or is that not under our control? |
| 20:53:32 | JdGordon| | how HOME can do anything but goto the main menu is beyond me |
| 20:53:48 | * | JdGordon| gets his first audio fubar on the clip |
| 20:54:09 | Zambezi | I have stable 3.0. It might be time for a flash. :-) |
| 20:54:10 | amiconn | Unhelpful: IRAM on PP cannot be remapped afaik, and also SDRAM cannot be mapped anywhere above 0x40000000 |
| 20:54:18 | * | gevaerts still wants to know how long the M5L lasts with FM |
| 20:54:27 | kugel | JdGordon|: no-one is arguing against home for menu I think |
| 20:55:09 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 20:55:38 | kugel | shotofadds: does the d2 have some sort of sd_enable() to power down the sd when unused? |
| 20:56:19 | shotofadds | at the moment we just turn the clocks off. I assume there's some way to power it down, but it's not done yet |
| 20:57:10 | Dhraakellian | hm... I've found that my e260 and Fuze don't appear to get full charge from my computer (only getting up to 95ish, give or take, according to the statusbar) |
| 20:57:12 | amiconn | SD cards do auto power down. So the only part that might need explicit powerdown would be the controller |
| 20:57:32 | amiconn | But if you stop clocks, remaining power consumption should be very low |
| 20:57:53 | shotofadds | we could disable the controller block, but like you say, I doubt it would make much difference |
| 20:58:27 | kugel | I think we're not doing much more on the samsas |
| 20:58:54 | * | shotofadds just copied the PP code ;-) |
| 20:59:23 | domonoky | kugel: please use sansa AMS instead of samsa. :-) |
| 21:00 |
| 21:00:31 | | Quit Xerion (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 21:00:49 | Dhraakellian | samsa:sansa AMS::sammich:sandwich? |
| 21:01:13 | | Join Xerion [0] (i=xerion@82-170-197-160.ip.telfort.nl) |
| 21:01:51 | Unhelpful | amiconn: the best thing i've tried so far, i think is just removing -mlong-call. we'll need stubs to handle gcc-generated calls to mem*, since we can't control how those are called, and there might *still* be some problems with static functions. it looks as if without -mlong_calls there's almost no way to get make a long call to a function that happens to be defined in the same file. |
| 21:01:59 | kugel | shotofadds: I suspected that when looking at the commit diff :) |
| 21:02:23 | amiconn | What about this eabi/binutils 2.19 thing? That sounds like a nice way to go - if it works |
| 21:05:17 | Unhelpful | amiconn: i'm not sure. i don't really like the idea of having bunches of autogenerated stubs whenever a function is called that's too far away. |
| 21:06:44 | amiconn | Better than unnecessary long calls I would expect |
| 21:07:29 | Torne | it should be reasonable, i think |
| 21:07:47 | * | shotofadds really should disable long-calls for the D2 build, since we don't use IRAM (yet) |
| 21:08:03 | Torne | it will try and use the same stubs as much as it can |
| 21:08:46 | Torne | the stubbed branches obviously are one more instruction but a regular branch is cheap |
| 21:09:39 | amiconn | http://sourceware.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb.cgi/src/ld/NEWS?annotate=1.105&cvsroot=src line 72 |
| 21:11:05 | Unhelpful | so we'd be adding one instruction per function when some code calls that function out of range. and the speed cost is one relative branch per actual out-of-range call. |
| 21:11:21 | kugel | domonoky: for deb packaging |
| 21:11:25 | kugel | not for us.. |
| 21:11:46 | Torne | you'd be making most functoins smaller, not bigger |
| 21:11:59 | domonoky | kugel: it not problem to build rbutil non-statically... so that can be the blocker.. |
| 21:12:05 | kugel | assuming he also wants it to be in the debian/ubuntu/whatever repos |
| 21:12:10 | domonoky | s/can/cant |
| 21:12:25 | Torne | N calls to a far function becomes N+2 instructions instead of 2N instructions |
| 21:12:37 | domonoky | the bigger problem is, that rbutil still changes often.. |
| 21:12:59 | Torne | and yes, the far calls are slower by one relative branch, but it means that every other call can always be relative |
| 21:13:28 | kugel | domonoky: I don't think that's a problem, except for debian stable maybe. |
| 21:14:43 | kugel | this eabi thing seems to have a number of other differences to the old abi |
| 21:14:45 | Torne | (in fact 2N instructions plus at least one copy of the actual address depending how smart it manages to eb with the constant pools) |
| 21:14:49 | Unhelpful | so, it's a code-size win vs long calls everywhere, except for functions that need exactly one long call. it's not *quite* as big a win as if we can use long calls exactly where we need them. the situation for speed is probably similar, since we're removing probably rather a few unnecessary long calls. |
| 21:15:05 | domonoky | kugel: so if that also isnt a problem, its only lazyness that nobody made a package. :-) But i would expect that if we have packages, people will often use old rbutil versions, as the repositorys probably will have quite some lag. |
| 21:15:11 | Torne | kugel: it's not clear from the docs whether it's actually mandatory for it to be EABI for it to work |
| 21:15:16 | Torne | the source implies it might work anyway |
| 21:15:23 | Torne | i've not got a suitable binutils installed so i've not tried it yet |
| 21:15:33 | kugel | I'm worried about the struct alignment thing |
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| 21:16:48 | SeismicMike | has anyone ever installed on a Sansa e260? I'm having some trouble |
| 21:17:10 | SeismicMike | I'm in Windows and I don't know what to put down for the mount point because it doesn't give the device a drive letter |
| 21:17:19 | SeismicMike | I can't figure out how to give it a drive letter. |
| 21:18:18 | SeismicMike | wait... nm.. that's when it was in MTP mode |
| 21:18:27 | SeismicMike | I just switched it to MSC mode and it has a drive letter now... |
| 21:18:35 | SeismicMike | :) |
| 21:18:40 | Torne | kugel: EABI structs are often *smaller* though |
| 21:18:51 | Torne | kugel: we might have to fix places that were making assumptions about packing |
| 21:18:57 | Torne | but you may find it's actually a memory win :) |
| 21:19:19 | Unhelpful | asm that touches structs may be in trouble. |
| 21:19:31 | Torne | yes, |
| 21:19:32 | kugel | I'd willing to pay a bit memory for speedup due to alignment |
| 21:19:45 | kugel | Unhelpful: Do we have those? |
| 21:19:48 | Torne | kugel: what? no, it never packs stuff below its natural alignment |
| 21:20:16 | Unhelpful | kugel: i'm responsible for at least one instance, jpeg_idct<width>h asm. |
| 21:20:39 | kugel | "Under the EABI there is no minimum and the alignment is determined by the types of the components it contains. " not sure what it means |
| 21:20:40 | Unhelpful | since the output is to an array of struct{ char;char;char; } |
| 21:21:14 | Torne | Unhelpful: so that ends up with 4-byte alignment atm, yes? |
| 21:21:33 | kugel | could it mean the alignment is determined by the biggest datatype? |
| 21:21:48 | Torne | kugel: it means the alignment of the whole struct is whatever makes the types in it all aligned at once. |
| 21:21:50 | bertrik | is there anything special about the wakeup_XXX functions? I see they are only defined for some specific CPUs |
| 21:21:51 | kugel | char;char;char would be 3, but char;char;int would be 4? |
| 21:21:55 | Unhelpful | Torne: correct. the particular code in question would not be harmed speed-wise by making tose 3-byte aligned |
| 21:21:55 | kugel | 8* |
| 21:22:26 | Torne | kugel: char;char;int; ends up with size 8, alignment 4 |
| 21:22:33 | Torne | two bytes of padding before the int |
| 21:22:37 | kugel | eh |
| 21:22:50 | kugel | yea, I don't know why I was correcting myself to 8 :/ |
| 21:22:52 | Torne | that's the same under both abis |
| 21:23:15 | Torne | char;char;char; in oldai is size 4 align 4, in eabi it's size 3 align 1 |
| 21:23:18 | kugel | "can break code that writes binary files by dumping and reading structures." <−− rockblox does that :( |
| 21:23:36 | Torne | the new struct rules never make anything bigger unless you have 64-bit fields |
| 21:23:39 | | Part SeismicMike |
| 21:23:43 | kugel | Torne: hm, it seems reasonable then |
| 21:23:53 | Torne | it requires higher stack alignment :) |
| 21:23:56 | Torne | which may break asm |
| 21:23:59 | Torne | and may use more stack |
| 21:24:15 | kugel | Why that, btw? |
| 21:24:17 | Torne | asm functions can't push odd numbers of registers and then call C funcitons |
| 21:24:21 | mcuelenaere | bertrik: that's to decrease binsize |
| 21:24:23 | mcuelenaere | AFAIK |
| 21:24:26 | Torne | so that 64-byte types are naturally aligned on the stack |
| 21:24:34 | Torne | 64-bit even |
| 21:25:05 | kugel | still not really logical to me |
| 21:25:09 | Unhelpful | but the source says that we *might* get the stubs generation without all of these ABI changes? |
| 21:25:26 | Torne | Unhelpful: it might. one thing at a time, i guess |
| 21:25:52 | Unhelpful | presumably if that's the case all one really need do is changes the binutils version for ARM in rockboxdev.sh? |
| 21:25:54 | kugel | You don't have 64bit registers, i.e. you need to load/pop 2x32bit, I don't see a need for 8byte alignement |
| 21:26:12 | Torne | LDRD needs 8 byte alignment |
| 21:26:17 | bertrik | mcuelenaere, ok, just surprised that so few targets seem to use it, and slightly unsure if it requires something that I'm not aware of yet |
| 21:26:28 | | Quit courtc (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 21:26:28 | Torne | so does VFP double format |
| 21:26:31 | Torne | and some other things |
| 21:26:34 | mcuelenaere | not that I know of, at least I didn't need to do anything special to use them |
| 21:26:40 | * | gevaerts thinks that code that reads and writes structs to disk for long-term storage without packing them is broken |
| 21:26:46 | * | Dhraakellian changes some buttons for Sudoku on the Fuze and checks to see how they work out |
| 21:26:56 | * | Unhelpful agrees with gevaerts on this |
| 21:27:33 | Unhelpful | it's also nearly impossible to change what is/isn't stored without simply discarding old saves... this is why i changed pictureflow to use a configfile. |
| 21:28:17 | * | Unhelpful has already modified rockboxdev.sh and is building :) |
| 21:29:01 | Torne | Unhelpful: let me know how it goes, i gotta go do stuff :) |
| 21:29:12 | amiconn | Torne: LDRD is said to need 8 byte alignment, but in fact it works with 4 byte alignment as well |
| 21:29:22 | kugel | gevaerts: you're saying the struct should have __attribute__((packed))? |
| 21:29:54 | gevaerts | kugel: yes, with possibly manual padding |
| 21:30:18 | | Join courtc [0] (n=court@unaffiliated/courtc) |
| 21:30:32 | Unhelpful | kugel: if it doesn't, an abi change could break old saves. it's not like we've promised *never* to update gcc/binutils. |
| 21:30:39 | kugel | amiconn: the docs suggest it's not (or at least suggest it's not guaranteed to be atomic anymore) |
| 21:30:47 | Unhelpful | however, adding that attribute will of course break it now. :) |
| 21:31:12 | kugel | maybe it will just work also? :) it has only ints and an array of shorts |
| 21:31:59 | amiconn | Iiuc the only differences between old arm abi and eabi are floating point related, and we don't use that |
| 21:32:15 | * | Unhelpful sincerely hopes that everywhere that does this at present will be smart enough to at least check the size of the read |
| 21:32:29 | Unhelpful | then you just get your old save or config invalidated, but nothing will crash |
| 21:32:38 | kugel | amiconn: http://wiki.debian.org/ArmEabiPort |
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| 21:34:04 | Unhelpful | i believe what i recall seeing in the manual was that ldrd works with four-byte alignment but does an extra read in this case |
| 21:34:05 | kugel | Unhelpful: rockblox checks, but I don't think checking for sizeof(struct) after telling read() to read sizeof(struct) bytes help for this case |
| 21:34:07 | bertrik | kugel, the wakeup_signal/wait mechanism could also be used in the fuze LCD driver (instead of polling for the volatile flag) |
| 21:34:46 | kugel | bertrik: so you're telling you're volunteering to write the code? :D |
| 21:34:56 | Unhelpful | kugel: ah... if the "new" size is shorter, it will still succeed. |
| 21:35:01 | Unhelpful | go use configfile! ;) |
| 21:35:18 | bertrik | kugel, no, well maybe |
| 21:35:23 | kugel | hehe |
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| 21:35:45 | kugel | Unhelpful: why? the size parameter of read() and the check after have the same size |
| 21:35:46 | bertrik | I also looked into the button code and I don't quite understand it |
| 21:36:29 | Unhelpful | kugel: i mean that the *test* will succeed. it will read exactly the number of bytes it wanted, and not know that it's discarded some. :/ |
| 21:36:43 | kugel | the test will always succeed, that's what I'm saying |
| 21:36:56 | amiconn | Hmm. Iiuc eabi will alomost automatically support vfp - might be interesting for special purposes on the beast |
| 21:37:11 | Unhelpful | i didn't think the beast had vfp? |
| 21:38:15 | bertrik | kugel, even at 100 fps LCD update rate, a full update takes 10 ms, that's quite a long time to block |
| 21:38:26 | | Quit balug_ (Client Quit) |
| 21:38:48 | kugel | yes, but we can't help it, can we? |
| 21:39:10 | bertrik | so some yielding or switching threads while waiting for the interrupt would be nice |
| 21:39:23 | kugel | huh |
| 21:39:34 | kugel | the ISR is blocked |
| 21:40:04 | kugel | Or what interrupt are you refering to? |
| 21:40:37 | bertrik | the DBOP FIFO (almost) empty interrupt |
| 21:40:50 | kugel | oh with my patch |
| 21:41:13 | kugel | I think I have tried yielding without slow down |
| 21:41:27 | kugel | but the issues is with the blue bars anyway |
| 21:41:55 | bertrik | kugel, I suspect the blue bars have something to do with the button readout |
| 21:42:14 | kugel | Why do you think that? |
| 21:42:38 | kugel | on the e200, there's no button readout if the lcd is currently busy with updating, it still has the bars |
| 21:42:57 | kugel | no readout on dbop, at least |
| 21:43:34 | bertrik | because the blue bar changed slightly when pressing buttons, and because I see two different button readout functions that are not obviously protected from running together with LCD update (to me at least) |
| 21:43:55 | kugel | look at lcd_button_support() |
| 21:44:33 | Dhraakellian | what do you guys think of http://pastebin.ca/1489985 for a Sudoku button change on the Fuze? |
| 21:44:40 | kugel | the fuze still reads the scrollwheel, that's correct. But the e200 doesn't even try to touch dbop in during updates |
| 21:45:23 | amiconn | This eabi thing is definitely something we should try |
| 21:45:41 | bertrik | as far as I can see, the the button_gpio function is not protected from running at the same time as lcd update |
| 21:45:57 | bertrik | why are there two button read functions anyway? |
| 21:46:03 | kugel | yes, because it doesn't change the fifo |
| 21:46:06 | Dhraakellian | menu is a short click on the home button (quit is still long home). I moved menu away from the power/hold slider on the side |
| 21:46:23 | Unhelpful | per infocenter: "ARM1136JF-S processor has a floating point coprocessor." without any mention of VFP... but then the VFP11 docs state: "This manual only describes the implementation of the VFP11 for the ARM1136JF-S processor." |
| 21:46:32 | kugel | it's running in an interrupt, and sets the state of the gpios back |
| 21:47:04 | kugel | Unhelpful: the vfp is the fpu, IIUC |
| 21:47:42 | bertrik | kugel, but button_gpio changes the function of the DBOP hardware ports, right? |
| 21:48:05 | kugel | bertrik: why should it be one? They're getting at the hardware with different approaches. Also, the dbop function runs more often |
| 21:48:23 | amiconn | kugel: There also was FPA for older ARMs |
| 21:48:34 | kugel | this would show below 100fps too I think |
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| 21:48:52 | kugel | amiconn: yes, I know. I was refering to the arm11 Unhelpful mentioned |
| 21:49:08 | bertrik | I don't see the need for two button read functions |
| 21:49:12 | kugel | even more below 100fps, since the update needs longer |
| 21:49:28 | kugel | bertrik: "Also, the dbop function runs more often" |
| 21:49:32 | * | Unhelpful doesn't see "has an FPU" and automatically assume it's SIMD :) |
| 21:50:36 | kugel | I don't see what's wrong with it, are you trying to safe 2 instructions? |
| 21:50:45 | bertrik | I don't understand, this looks hopelessly complex to me |
| 21:51:21 | bertrik | but maybe I don't know all the weird things this hardware has ... :P |
| 21:52:12 | kugel | the dbop function is called twice per tick, 1x in button_read_device() and 1x in the timer interrupt outside of call_tick_tasks() (the timer is configured to interrupt every 5ms) |
| 21:52:23 | bertrik | I think it would be bad if button_gpio would be called when LCD update was in progress. Is there any mechanism to prevent this? |
| 21:52:41 | kugel | I doubt this, but one could try |
| 21:53:01 | kugel | lcd_button_support() returns false if an update is running |
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| 21:57:04 | kugel | bertrik: don't you think it would show even more with lower fps, the update takes longer then (i.e. possibly button_gpio is called twice during an update) |
| 21:58:10 | bertrik | yes, possibly. |
| 21:58:57 | bertrik | I can't really explain that, but I still suspect we're doing something wrong now |
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| 22:00 |
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| 22:16:38 | Unhelpful | hrm... i had to add a -Wa,-meabi=4 to GCCOPTS. trouble now seems to be that libgcc was not similarly compiled... |
| 22:17:51 | CIA-71 | New commit by bertrik (r21734): S5L8700: Implement ADC driver |
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| 22:23:48 | mcuelenaere | bertrik: is it possible that adc_read() is accessed from different threads? |
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| 22:24:27 | bertrik | mcuelenaere, not sure, but could happen I think |
| 22:24:44 | bertrik | do you think it's not necessary? |
| 22:25:11 | mcuelenaere | ah /me sees that the Onda does the same |
| 22:25:11 | bertrik | to protect multiple access I mean |
| 22:25:45 | bertrik | now that I think of it, it's probably only the power thread that uses it to read the battery voltage |
| 22:25:46 | mcuelenaere | no, it's just that battery_adc_voltage() on the Onda VX747 is a bit hackish implemented, and I was searching for a reason what was causing the problems I had |
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| 22:39:43 | kugel | mcuelenaere: should be safe |
| 22:40:00 | kugel | it has mutexes |
| 22:40:38 | mcuelenaere | kugel: you mean battery_adc_voltage() on the VX747? see the 'primitive wakeup event' thingy .. |
| 22:40:39 | kugel | at least, if your i2c uses them. the generic, and as3514 i2c have this mutex |
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| 22:41:35 | mcuelenaere | kugel: huh? i2c? |
| 22:41:48 | mcuelenaere | (btw I just see those don't use mutexes) |
| 22:42:11 | kugel | I'm have no idea how mutexes work, but those are meant to block threads out of code that's currently in use by another thread, IIUC |
| 22:42:21 | kugel | mcuelenaere: which "those"? |
| 22:42:29 | mcuelenaere | i2c-jz4740.c |
| 22:42:53 | mcuelenaere | (the functions in them, hence the plural ;) ) |
| 22:43:19 | kugel | ah, they probably should just have the mutex and be thread safe :) |
| 22:44:01 | * | mcuelenaere enlarges his TODO list ;) |
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| 22:47:08 | amiconn | Bagder: The client reconnect problem is still there (dunno if it's supposed to be fixed) |
| 22:47:25 | Bagder | I don't think anyone has tried to fix it yet |
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| 22:55:12 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
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| 23:04:49 | bertrik | Hillshum, you meant FS #10210? |
| 23:05:53 | Hillshum | Yes, though I'm not sure. Did it change the keymap on the screen where one browses the video? |
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| 23:07:01 | * | Hillshum compiles a sim |
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| 23:24:45 | funman | hello |
| 23:25:22 | funman | is it possible to download current builds for an old svn revision ? (r21710) |
| 23:25:40 | Hillshum | I think only the daily build is archived |
| 23:26:47 | Bagder | correct |
| 23:26:51 | funman | i could build this revision myself but the i think the addresses inside rockbox.elf could change with a different gcc version |
| 23:27:45 | Hillshum | Did you find out the version it used to build it? |
| 23:28:17 | funman | no, but the gcc version is mentioned in rockbox-info.txt, i'll ask the person |
| 23:28:33 | Hillshum | it might be on the build table |
| 23:29:10 | funman | penultimate entry ;) |
| 23:29:28 | kugel | http://www.rockbox.org/dl.cgi?bin=sansafuze :( |
| 23:31:08 | obo | I now have the LCD controller datasheets, as well as the routines to write to the display, but I can't actually get it all to tie together and display anything... :( |
| 23:31:21 | | Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) |
| 23:31:30 | Hillshum | bertrik: Nevermind, mpegplayer's fine |
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| 23:32:00 | Bagder | obo: so did you then find the init sequence in the OF that matches the datasheet? |
| 23:32:32 | obo | Bagder: pretty much - I've found several init routines for that controller, and most, but not all of the values tend to match |
| 23:33:04 | obo | some of those don't seem to matter too much, since they're gamma curves etc |
| 23:33:40 | Bagder | so could it be a separate power-on to the LCD or similar that needs to be done? |
| 23:33:52 | obo | I've attached the datasheets plus my attempt to the GSoCSansaView wiki page if anyone fancies a look? |
| 23:34:06 | obo | Bagder: since I'm running after the OF bootloader, shouldn't that be done already? |
| 23:34:23 | Bagder | right, one would think so... |
| 23:34:30 | Hillshum | Doesn't it depend on when the OF inits? |
| 23:34:51 | kugel | obo: I assume you have a all white display right now? |
| 23:35:06 | obo | kugel: no, still the OF bootlogo |
| 23:35:21 | kugel | oh, that's funny too :) |
| 23:35:30 | obo | I can create a white display by flipping a GPIO bit... |
| 23:36:03 | kugel | can you somehow "manually" clearing the hw-framebuffer then a lcd update? |
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| 23:37:24 | Dhraakellian | I have a little patch to move the sudoku menu on the Fuze from the power button (on the side) to the home button (on the front). Should I make a bug report for it? |
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| 23:38:22 | Hillshum | Dhraakellian: put it on Flyspray yes, but mark it as a patch\ |
| 23:38:42 | Hillshum | *patch |
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| 23:39:00 | obo | kugel: I'll need to find out how to do that... |
| 23:39:21 | kugel | You have the ds, haven't you? |
| 23:39:29 | obo | yes |
| 23:39:42 | kugel | the registers of the memory should be there |
| 23:40:04 | obo | the init routine sets them to 0x0 |
| 23:41:48 | * | Dhraakellian ponders also including some column formatting in the patch |
| 23:42:33 | Hillshum | whitespace changes? |
| 23:43:18 | obo | kugel: 0x20 and 0x21 are both set to 0x0 (horiz and vert GRAM address set) |
| 23:43:19 | kugel | obo: huh? you can change the location of the output memory? |
| 23:43:21 | Dhraakellian | yeah. all the other sections that are lined up as columns appear to do it with spaces. the Fuze section uses tabs |
| 23:43:49 | Hillshum | yes, four spaces are to be used in place of tabs |
| 23:44:07 | kugel | obo: I think that's only interesting for doing partial updates. I mean the actual memory |
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| 23:45:55 | obo | kugel: it has a completely different set of registers for partial updates? (0x80 to 0x85), and 0x51 and 0x53 also set the display size... |
| 23:46:04 | kugel | hmm, I think I'm confusing things |
| 23:46:27 | Dhraakellian | Hillshum: http://pastebin.ca/1489985 vs. http://pastebin.ca/1490086 |
| 23:46:49 | kugel | obo: "0x20 and 0x21 are both set to 0x0 (horiz and vert GRAM address set)" this is probably the start pixel for updates |
| 23:47:51 | kugel | is your lcd_update() maybe buggy? |
| 23:48:21 | Hillshum | Dhraakellian: I don't know which is better |
| 23:48:27 | obo | kugel: that's entirely possible( if not probable) |
| 23:49:43 | kugel | although I guess the e200's lcd_update should work |
| 23:50:45 | Dhraakellian | Hillshum: they should be the same except that the second one just has some extra whitespace stuff to line the columns up better |
| 23:51:11 | obo | kugel: it doesn't seem to work like the e200 controller? AFAIK you don't point the controller to your buffer the way the e200 does? |
| 23:51:27 | kugel | Why that? |
| 23:51:31 | Hillshum | Yes, but I don't a whole lot about the whitespace rules |
| 23:51:47 | Dhraakellian | ah |
| 23:51:59 | kugel | How would that work? You need to pass the data from the rockbox framebuffer somehow |
| 23:52:12 | obo | I've not seen that in any of the init routines that are floating out on the web for this controller... |
| 23:52:36 | obo | kugel: yes, more like the way the c200 works... |
| 23:54:32 | kugel | basically, you have at least make sure to set the window position (i.e. start pixel and end pixel) write a command that updates |
| 23:54:34 | kugel | +and |
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