#rockbox 2009-09-10

Previous day | Jump to hour: 01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 | Next day

Seconds: Show Hide | Joins: Show Hide | View raw
Font: Serif Sans-Serif Monospace | Size: Small Medium Large

Click in the nick column to highlight everything a person has said.
The Logo icon identifies that the person is a core developer (has commit access).

#rockbox log for 2009-09-10

00:00:07	rasher	well, you can do them, but you'd have to insert a blank line after it to get the effect you want
00:00:07	pixelma	rasher: this is your WPS and I could use the same argument against yours
00:00:10	*	domonoky1 suggest just normal inline comments with # (linefeed not eaten if it isnt a full comment line) and some other token to continue the line, like "\"
00:00:31	domonoky1	this also prevent current wps from breaking.
00:00:33	rasher	pixelma: You're going to claim widecabbie.wps is "too simple"?
00:01:13		Join truthtaco_ [0] (n=truthtac@adsl-74-12-230.aby.bellsouth.net)
00:01:17	JdGordon\|	domonoky1: that would break current wps.. but yes thats my suggestion also..
00:01:23	JdGordon\|	i tinhk
00:01:33	gevaerts	except for the \ :)
00:01:38	rasher	This wouldn't exactly be the first time we have broken wpses, even in non-obvious ways
00:01:41	JdGordon\|	% makes more sense for us
00:01:47	pixelma	rasher: no, but it's only one example
00:02:00	rasher	pixelma: You only need one example to disprove a negative.
00:02:11	domonoky1	JdGordon\|: why would it break ? Are inline comments expected to eat newlines at moment ?
00:02:42	JdGordon\|	yes
00:02:43	rasher	pixelma: you claimed, basically, that inline comments are useless and can't be used in real wpses. I've shown you a real wps where they could easily be used. Case closed.
00:02:46	*	domonoky1 thinks % strange, it look like a token without identifier..
00:02:47		Quit p3tur ("Zzzz")
00:03:33	gevaerts	domonoky1: that's exactly why it's the best character for this
00:04:03	rasher	It's already part of the WPS "language"
00:04:08	rasher	Makes sense to me
00:04:13	JdGordon\|	it is the wps language
00:04:20		Part zzy
00:04:23	gevaerts	All other characters would need some way of escaping them
00:04:39	rasher	Oooh, very good point
00:04:59		Quit archivator (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:05:21		Join archivator [0] (n=Delyan@77.70.28.57)
00:06:06	pixelma	rasher: I just couldn't understand why you want to use them as for me they aren't easier to read but I didn't say they were "useless"
00:06:32	pixelma	oh well
00:06:44	domonoky1	do inlined comments end at a continued lines ?
00:07:01	JdGordon\|	?
00:07:24	domonoky1	ie if you break up a long line, and add comments to each section.
00:07:30	rasher	pixelma: Then I fail to understand your point, unless it's just "I wouldn't use inline comments"
00:07:44	JdGordon\|	domonoky1: "onetwo#comment\nthree" is "onetwothree" as far as the tokeniser is concerned
00:07:52	domonoky1	%t0.1%?bc<%xdea\|>; #first subline %
00:08:12	rasher	shouldn't that be
00:08:18	rasher	%t0.1%?bc<%xdea\|>; %#first subline %
00:08:24	*	rasher shrugs
00:08:37	JdGordon\|	no the % before the # makes it a literal #
00:08:46	rasher	%t0.1%?bc<%xdea\|>; % #first subline %
00:08:51	rasher	gar
00:08:53	rasher	without the last &
00:09:00	rasher	Maybe I should just stop typing.
00:09:12		Join soap [50] (n=soap@rockbox/staff/soap)
00:09:32	domonoky1	but the current parser wont see the ending % and leave a newline there.
00:09:42		Join zzy [0] (n=opera@c-71-202-247-23.hsd1.ca.comcast.net)
00:09:49	*	rasher maintains that the current parser is pants
00:09:58		Part zzy
00:10:12	pixelma	rasher: yes that was - which is why I didn't understand why the current behaviour needs changing (especially as I saw it as a downside having to know now that # after some WPS code is different to # on its own line)
00:10:18	domonoky1	maybe we should just introduce a new wps lanugage :-)
00:10:30	rasher	pixelma: Because someone else would like to use newline comments.
00:10:38	soap	LUA!
00:10:43	soap	;)
00:10:45		Join webguest73 [0] (n=18ec7c6f@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-cekzcmuuymftwtse)
00:10:55	rasher	pixelma: you keep claiming it's different. I say that the current behaviour is magic
00:11:05	JdGordon\|	magic! haha
00:11:09	domonoky1	yes, LUA wps, with selfcreated aninmations :-)
00:11:15	pixelma	that's the programmer's point of view
00:11:19	JdGordon\|	soap: na, xml!
00:11:36		Join Rob2222 [0] (n=Miranda@p4FDCDF3A.dip.t-dialin.net)
00:11:37	JdGordon\|	pixelma: no, the programmer says its well defined.... its the user that thinks its magic
00:11:44	domonoky1	rml = rockbox markup language :-)
00:11:46	rasher	What JdGordon\| said.
00:11:56	rasher	Saying "oh that's just consistent" is the programmer's view
00:12:27	pixelma	but how comments work in other languages is not the non-coder
00:12:33	JdGordon\|	ok, so go back to domonoky1's suggestion... inline comments wont eat the \n if it ends with # maybe?
00:12:39	pixelma	knowledge
00:12:41	webguest73	The current e200v1 build seems to be broken. Attempting to play from the file menu freezes. Going back to daily build 20090908 fixes it
00:12:48		Quit webguest73 (Client Quit)
00:13:13	JdGordon\|	6 thumbs waaay up for webguest73~
00:13:30	rasher	pixelma: It's not even related to how it works in other languages. Eating \n is just magic unless you think the programmer way
00:14:06		Quit niekie (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:14:19		Join niekie [0] (n=niek@dreamworld.bergnetworks.com)
00:15:41		Quit Lynx_ (" HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Po-ta-to, boil em, mash em, stick em in a stew.")
00:15:45		Quit bertrik ("De groeten")
00:16:10		Join MG_Man [0] (n=MGMan@11.208.101.97.cfl.res.rr.com)
00:16:12	pixelma	I don't think I'm thinking the coder's way... I just think it's easier to just say "# always eats the newline" than "lines starting with # will ignore the newline, if you put the # after your WPS code the newline will not be ignored"
00:16:18		Quit parafin (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
00:16:32	rasher	pixelma: Just the fact that you're using the word "newline" shows you are thinking coder's way
00:16:50	rasher	The ordinary user doesn't know of the newline at all
00:17:12	rasher	He just sees "this is a comment that should get ignored"
00:17:17		Quit TruthTaco (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
00:17:28	domonoky1	users think like: i put a comment somwhere and it should just work :-)
00:17:50	gevaerts	Apparently, there are just three themes on the theme site that use inline comments at all, with two of them in a way where it makes no difference whether the EOL is eaten
00:17:56	*	JdGordon\| doesnt understand why people tink themers are regular users...
00:18:45	rasher	JdGordon\|: I don't think themers necessarily understand the finer points of newlines
00:18:50	pixelma	so, just because I have a certain word for it in a basically foreign language (because I don't know a different one) means I'm thinking the coder way? How else would I speak about it here?
00:18:58	rasher	Proving this hypothesis shouldn't be hard
00:19:35	rasher	pixelma: I mean that the whole concept of the newline being a separate entity is something that most people don't think of
00:19:46	gevaerts	And the third looks a bit weird. '%ar%# %pp/%pe\n%ar%pt'
00:19:52	domonoky1	can we just stop the silly discussion, and return to making a sane wps language without breaking too much current wps ?
00:20:02	pixelma	gevaerts: that's not a comment
00:20:11	pixelma	that's a displayed #
00:20:13	gevaerts	pixelma: ah indeed. Well spotted
00:20:21		Join parafin [0] (i=parafin@paraf.in)
00:20:52		Quit petur ("Zzzzz")
00:21:04		Quit Rob2222 (Remote closed the connection)
00:21:05	gevaerts	OK. So my conclusion is that exactly zero themes on the theme site depend on how inline comment end of lines are handled, so if we want, we can change their behaviour
00:21:07	JdGordon\|	domonoky1: I dont tihnk the laguage is insane...
00:21:23		Join Strife89 [0] (n=Strife89@adsl-154-25-9.mcn.bellsouth.net)
00:21:25	JdGordon\|	it should be consistant though
00:21:37	pixelma	domonoky1: what is "works" in regards to inline comments or comments on their own lines, what would the "user" expect?
00:22:04		Join stripwax_ [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk)
00:22:09	rasher	JdGordon\|: It is consistant. I'll give pixelma that much. But it shouldn't be when it breaks a use-case
00:22:09	domonoky1	nothing unexpected, the comment shouldnt change anything displayed.
00:22:14	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:22:23	*	gevaerts is now in favour of never eating line endings unless there is an "eat-line-ending" character present
00:22:40	*	domonoky1 is with gevaerts
00:22:42	rasher	gevaerts: Line ends in #?
00:22:47	pixelma	gevaerts: then you change all the half-broken WPSs
00:22:59	gevaerts	pixelma: there are none of them on the theme site
00:23:17	domonoky1	pixelma: there are no wps witch rely on this feature at moment..
00:23:34	domonoky1	so fixing them is easy :-)
00:23:35	pixelma	huh, am I misunderstanding again?
00:23:35	JdGordon\|	gevaerts: I agree... but opposite
00:23:44	JdGordon\|	always eat unless there is a # at the end
00:24:23	gevaerts	pixelma: no. I'm confused...
00:24:26	pixelma	I don't believe no-one used "comments on their own lines"
00:24:40		Quit saratoga (orwell.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
00:24:40	NSplit	orwell.freenode.net irc.freenode.net
00:24:48	domonoky1	pixelma: no one wants to change full comment lines.
00:24:58	*	gevaerts does some new analysis
00:25:18	pixelma	that's how I understood gevaerts' statement
00:25:37	gevaerts	please ignore my recent statements for now. I'm working on a revised edition
00:25:54		Join kugel [0] (n=kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel)
00:25:57	*	domonoky1 thinks comment should act as their werent there. so full comments eat newlines, inline comments dont. add a new token to split long lines.
00:26:38	*	kugel thinks that a) comments should always eat \n and a special char would invert that, or b) comments never eat \n and a special char would invert that
00:27:05	*	kugel prefers b)
00:27:27	JdGordon\|	domonoky1: thats what the patch did, but I dont like the 2nd part anymore... the reason to split the line should be to add a comment so we should just keep it as is
00:27:28	*	domonoky1 thinks b) breaks current wps
00:27:29	kugel	I can't make any sense of it that comments have different behavior depending on where they are
00:27:34	pixelma	a is the current situation (without the inverting) and would need less changes
00:27:51	pixelma	and what domonoky1 said
00:27:54	rasher	Then you get the "when do I need to add the X character to the end of my comments?" issue
00:28:02	kugel	so?
00:28:20	domonoky1	the behavior of comments should be to not do anything, eating newlines or not is just a implementation detail.
00:28:21	rasher	It wouldn't be necessary if the language was sane :\|
00:28:28	kugel	I don't think most themers never heard of the "newline problem".
00:28:31		Quit niekie (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:28:34		Join niekie_ [0] (i=quasselc@dreamworld.bergnetworks.com)
00:28:37	kugel	and if not, we can make them sensible for it
00:29:15	kugel	I rather think most wps coders are familiar with other script/markup or even real languages
00:29:26	pixelma	forcing every third to update his WPS isn't nice
00:29:36		Join PaulJam [0] (n=Paule@p54BEE436.dip.t-dialin.net)
00:29:38	kugel	looking at abi, half of the themes were done by 2 people where one can code, and the other can photoshop
00:30:01	Zagor	isn't it better to add a "line continuation tag" to allow line-splitting instead of fidgeting with the comments?
00:30:05	kugel	pixelma: didn't gevaerts just conclude that 0 themes on the theme site need to change?
00:30:09	pixelma	(the "third" is just a guess but I think a lot use full line comments)
00:30:17	*	rasher is wary of using abi as an example of anything
00:30:18	Zagor	sort of like you split #defines with \ in cpp
00:30:20		Join Strife1989 [0] (n=Strife89@adsl-154-11-147.mcn.bellsouth.net)
00:30:22	gevaerts	kugel: I concluded that everything I said was suspicious
00:30:34	JdGordon\|	Zagor: I did but, but dont like it anymore
00:30:38	*	domonoky1 is with zagor..
00:30:43	pixelma	kugel: he was confused and needed exami...
00:30:45	*	kugel is too
00:30:48	Zagor	JdGordon\|: why?
00:31:06	kugel	I quite like "\"
00:31:23	JdGordon\|	because the reason to split lines should be to add a comment, or make it easier to read... using the comment token is a good way to make themers think about writing something there
00:31:23	rasher	kugel: there's no good reason to use \ rather than %. And a good reason not to.
00:31:38	*	kugel isn't against % either
00:31:49	pixelma	Zagor: we already have that (by the means that # always eats newlines)
00:31:54	gevaerts	OK. No theme uses partial-line comments in a way that cares about whether or not they eat the \n, so changing those not to eat them (and leaving full-line comments unchanged) would not break anything
00:32:11	Zagor	mixing tags is asking for trouble. don't add "features" to the comment tag
00:32:13	*	JdGordon\| slaps gevaerts
00:32:17	JdGordon\|	comments SHOULD eat the \n
00:32:21	domonoky1	JdGordon\| but what would happen if you have just two lines of wps code with a inline comment at the end of the first.. they would get joined if we eat the newline there.
00:32:26	kugel	so we're basically free to change stuff? (ignoring other theme repos)
00:32:30	rasher	JdGordon\|: not partial-line comments
00:32:40	Zagor	JdGordon\|: possibly, but comments should not be the mechanism for line splitting
00:32:44	rasher	kugel: Weren't we always?
00:32:57	JdGordon\|	Zagor: I can accept that
00:32:58	rasher	Zagor: That's the current situation.
00:33:02	gevaerts	JdGordon\|: I don't care what they should do. I'm trying to evaluate the cost of all options
00:33:07	kugel	rasher: 2-3 people are apparently caring about not braking themes here
00:33:10	JdGordon\|	so how about always eat unless % is the last char of the line?
00:33:10	Zagor	rasher: that it is, or isn't?
00:33:16	kugel	s/themes/0 themes/
00:33:21		Quit matsl (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
00:33:21	rasher	Zagor: It is. You can use # to split lines.
00:33:34	Zagor	rasher: yes, but can you use anything else?
00:33:58	kugel	Zagor: that's my opinion too. comments shouldn't be making up line splitting or not
00:33:59		Quit Riku (Nick collision from services.)
00:34:06	rasher	kugel: If breaking a few themes (or many) is the cost of fixing a bug (I still regard this as a bug), I don't have any issue with that.
00:34:12	pixelma	you wouldn't need to and I think it's not the question
00:34:21	kugel	imo comments should behave independantly of their position, and an explicit char should handle \n
00:34:27		Join Lss__ [0] (n=Lss@cm204.delta92.maxonline.com.sg)
00:34:27	domonoky1	JdGordon\|: i think that then you would % in the normal case (just indipendend lines with comments at the end) and the special case wont need one.
00:34:39	gevaerts	kugel: an explicit char handles \n. It's \n
00:34:57	pixelma	those are two chars
00:34:59	bughunter2	fixed my bricked e200v2 :)
00:34:59	kugel	gaah
00:35:05	bughunter2	lesson learned: do not spam the root directory with 40 thousand files
00:35:06	bughunter2	:D
00:35:18	Zagor	bughunter2: haha
00:35:28	bughunter2	rockbox handled it well btw, it just said "Dir Buffer is Full"
00:35:30	bughunter2	the OF failed
00:35:31	bughunter2	hard
00:35:31	bughunter2	:P
00:35:52	bughunter2	using recovery mode + winhex allowed me to remove all the entries
00:36:00	pixelma	kugel: I'm definitely against changing the behaviour of full line comments
00:36:01	gevaerts	Changing the way full-line comments behave will break nearly all themes
00:36:18	bughunter2	TheSeven: ^ :D
00:36:38	*	domonoky1 is still with: comments on full lines act as they werent there (ie thy eat the newline), inline comments act as they werent there (ie they dont eat newlines) and add a new char for line joining :-)
00:36:50	kugel	pixelma, gevaerts: I'm ok with that
00:37:05	gevaerts	kugel: it breaks them in a way that cannot be automatically detected
00:37:07	*	gevaerts is with domonoky1
00:37:09	Zagor	domonoky1: I agree
00:37:10	TheSeven	bughunter2: it just crashed?
00:37:16	bughunter2	no I fixed it ;)
00:37:31	bughunter2	the OF hung when rebooting
00:37:37	bughunter2	instead of saying "Not enough free space to create database"
00:37:38	bughunter2	hehe
00:37:43	gevaerts	kugel: so you're basically saying we should just purge the theme site
00:37:54	JdGordon\|	sounds like a good idea!
00:37:55	kugel	gevaerts: read my 2 suggestions
00:37:56	bughunter2	bought a set of micro screw drivers to fix the player (I anticipated this happening, luckily)
00:38:19	TheSeven	bughunter2: you need to OPEN that thing to fix a fs-level issue!?
00:38:23	JdGordon\|	domonoky1: I can live with that.... but then you have to ask, why not allow comments to be closed with a # also then?
00:38:25	domonoky1	if we really want to make such a incompatilbe change, we should take the chance and make a new wps language :-)
00:38:29	*	kugel isn't with domonoky1, but that topic doesn't touch me enough anyway
00:38:31	bughunter2	TheSeven: yes, RB doesn't have a native USB driver for this player yet
00:38:32	JdGordon\|	which seems to make more sense
00:38:32		Quit stripwax (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:38:34	*	TheSeven is glad he has an ipod...
00:38:36	bughunter2	so that's why I needed the OF
00:38:38	bughunter2	but the OF failed
00:38:39	bughunter2	:P
00:38:39	pixelma	gevaerts: nah, I think he means "I'm fine with that" that he's fine with not changing the behaviour of full-line comments
00:38:52	Zagor	JdGordon\|: sure you can close it, but it doesn't make a difference in the newline issue
00:38:57	bughunter2	TheSeven: anything but iPod imo :), I like this player a lot :)
00:38:58	gevaerts	kugel: I'm trying to find them again in this mess :\
00:38:58	pixelma	maybe not
00:39:02		Quit Strife1989 ("If you hold a Unix shell to your ear, you can hear the C.")
00:39:03	domonoky1	JdGordon\|: that would be a fine extension too. (but only close the comment, no action on line joining or alike)
00:39:14	bughunter2	I bricked (and fixed) it myself, after all :)
00:39:17	kugel	"kugel thinks that a) comments should always eat \n and a special char would invert that, or b) comments never eat \n and a special char would invert that"
00:39:23	gevaerts	thanks
00:39:23	JdGordon\|	#% is going to look totally fucked thoguh!
00:39:36	TheSeven	bughunter2: I won't buy a player where you need to void warranty in order to fix such a thing
00:39:53	bughunter2	TheSeven: they can't know whether the warranty was voided
00:40:06	pixelma	JdGordon\|: would that be a new inline comment marker (sorry I missed the first mention of this)
00:40:11	bughunter2	anyway, DRM is disabled after installing RB, for yet unknown reasons, so by that they might be able to detect it, though
00:40:23	TheSeven	well, opening it is also always another bricking risk
00:40:24	bughunter2	TheSeven: btw, it might have happened with your ipod as well
00:40:28	gevaerts	kugel: as far as I'm concerned, (b) is out because of breaking everything. (a) would work, but I think it's ugly
00:40:31	bughunter2	depends :)
00:40:52	JdGordon\|	pixelma: no that would be something like this line..... "%ia #some comment but dont end the line #%"!
00:40:53	TheSeven	bughunter2: there is no way we know of putting an ipod in such a borked state
00:41:00	bughunter2	I'm sure I could help :D
00:41:20	bughunter2	making drivers go nuts is dangerous ;)
00:41:23	domonoky1	kugel: this would also mean comments act different on where they are placed regaring the produced wps..
00:41:28	Zagor	JdGordon\|: sure, but why add the complexity? just add the line-continue tag before the comment
00:41:37	TheSeven	you would at least to either mess up the FTL entirely in a manner that locks up FTL code (which I don't htink is possible) or you need to damage the NOR flash contents while keeping the checksum intact
00:42:11	gevaerts	Zagor: won't that complicate the parser
00:42:11	TheSeven	nothing else can put an ipod into a non-recoverable (via key combos + usb) state
00:42:11	gevaerts	?
00:42:14	JdGordon\|	Zagor: thats even more dangerous.... "%# this is a comment" would get displayed!
00:42:27	Zagor	can we use %\ ?
00:42:28	TheSeven	bughunter2: we should move this discussion to -community, though, i think
00:42:49	bughunter2	done
00:42:51	JdGordon\|	Zagor: % is our \.... %\ is a literal \
00:42:53		Join kugel_ [0] (n=kugel@e178089197.adsl.alicedsl.de)
00:42:55		Quit kugel (Nick collision from services.)
00:42:58	Zagor	ah right
00:43:05		Nick kugel_ is now known as kugel (n=kugel@e178089197.adsl.alicedsl.de)
00:43:35	gevaerts	JdGordon\|: huh? Why is %\ a literal \? \ doesn't need to be escaped, does it?
00:43:52	pixelma	just wanted to ask the same
00:43:55	JdGordon\|	thats the example
00:44:05	JdGordon\|	but yeah, \ is a regular char
00:44:11	rasher	%\ should be an error, right?
00:44:19	gevaerts	so %\ is available for special things
00:44:20	JdGordon\|	yeah
00:44:41	kugel	domonoky1: how would they act different?
00:44:48	domonoky1	so we could use "... %\ # comment" to have a joined lined with a comment at the end.
00:45:13	gevaerts	I'd just go for %\ being a "joined-line comment" then
00:45:33	JdGordon\|	ah, from a code POV it will be difficult to work if the join-line token is not right before the \n
00:45:37	gevaerts	or rather a non-joined-line comment, so # keeps its current meaning
00:45:46		Quit Strife89 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:45:47	Zagor	gevaerts: no. separate line-joining and comments. even if it technically could act as it. but don't document that!
00:45:47	domonoky1	kugel: in your ways it would modifiy the linejoining depending on comment position.
00:46:01	JdGordon\|	also, control stuff should be 1 char... not two
00:46:33	kugel	domonoky1: I still don't understand
00:46:53	Zagor	we only have a single comment char: # the %\ tag is strictly for line joining. don't drag our themers into this confused debate :)
00:47:00		Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk)
00:47:37	gevaerts	Zagor: ok. That keeps the problem of compatibility though
00:47:44	JdGordon\|	I think % by itself is a better line joiner than \ and definetly %\
00:47:57	JdGordon\|	but it wont work right before comments :(
00:47:57	gevaerts	Which you solve by using a non-join character
00:47:58	domonoky1	kugel: a) would mean you have to place a newline-eating char at full comments, but not on inline comments. b) the otherway round.
00:47:58		Quit ender` (" We are surprised at our own versatility in being able to fail in so many different ways. -- Samuel McChord Crothers")
00:48:08		Quit thegeek_ (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
00:48:17	Zagor	gevaerts: what compatibility?
00:48:21	rasher	If the end result is (what we "agree" is) more sane, then I don't see breaking compatibility as a big problem.
00:48:30	pixelma	domonoky1: no. that's not what he meant (I think)
00:48:50	kugel	domonoky1: depends on what you want (you want different things if you use different comment styles). the comments would behave the same
00:49:14	gevaerts	Zagor: currently all comments join lines implicitely. Changing that is tricky, because it's impossible to look at a file and decide which behaviour it wants, so you can't autoconvert
00:49:39	Zagor	gevaerts: you're thinking in code. stop it! :-)
00:49:55	*	domonoky1 just wants that comments dont change anything, and i also dont want to use a different notation beween full comments and inline comments.
00:50:16	*	gevaerts doesn't mind wps changes that break themes in a way that they stop loading, but he does mind changes that break themes by subtly changing their effect
00:50:17	Zagor	gevaerts: I still want full-line comments to be ignored completely, just like domonoky1 said
00:50:30	Zagor	just don't think of it as line joining
00:50:49	gevaerts	Zagor: ok. So you want domonoky1's proposal plus a continuation character for partial-line comments?
00:50:57	Zagor	yes
00:51:02	pixelma	Zagor: the problem is if you change # to not eat the newline even for full-line comments, every WPS that uses full-line comments will have displaced lines
00:51:10	domonoky1	ignoring a full-line comment completly doesnt count as line-joining from the users-perspective.
00:51:27	Zagor	pixelma: I just said I do want full-line comments to be completely ignored (the whole line).
00:51:53	gevaerts	I agree that this is the most sensible thing to do
00:51:57	Zagor	I refuse to mix comments and line joining, conceptually. it will only end in massive confusion
00:52:14	pixelma	domonoky1: might be important to mention in this discussion here - proof: I misunderstood Zagor
00:52:48	*	domonoky1 thinks there is many missunderstandments here, and we all want the same :-)
00:53:22	pixelma	Zagor: but you have to if you make differences between full-line and inline comments
00:53:28	*	gevaerts wants to get rid of wps files and get javascript+css instead :)
00:53:50	*	domonoky1 slaps gevaerts
00:54:21	gevaerts	pixelma: not really. You strip away the comment, and if there's something left on the line the line counts, if there's nothing left, the line is fully ignored
00:54:33		Join thegeek [0] (n=nnscript@s243b.studby.ntnu.no)
00:54:35	Zagor	pixelma: not really. all comments are deleted by the parser. if there is anything left on the line after that, it is treated as a line.
00:55:15	pixelma	and what about blank lines on purpose?
00:55:23	JdGordon\|	gevaerts: but thats what we are arguong about.. what ends the comment? the \n of the char before \n?
00:55:31	Zagor	pixelma: " # this line is intentionally blank"
00:55:31	JdGordon\|	ideally comments should be endable
00:55:54		Quit domonoky1 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:56:05	Zagor	pixelma: you have a point there. we don't ignore empty lines today...
00:56:22	Zagor	JdGordon\|: why?
00:58:06	NHeal	(timeout) orwell.freenode.net irc.freenode.net
00:58:29	pixelma	which is on purpose to position text without putting everything into an own viewport (and they didn't always exist). I guess it's still used sometimes if it is easier and you'll get the effect you wanted anyways
00:59:21	JdGordon\|	Zagor: sorry.. why what?
00:59:23	gevaerts	it's definitely used
00:59:44		Nick truthtaco_ is now known as TruthTaco (n=truthtac@adsl-74-12-230.aby.bellsouth.net)
00:59:51	Zagor	JdGordon\|: why should comments be endable? do you really want to put tags after a comment?
01:00
01:00:25	JdGordon\|	no, but thats exactly how you would have to use the joiner tag if you wanted a comment also (unless you want to make the parser more complicated)
01:00:47	Zagor	huh? why not %\ # comment
01:00:55	kugel	gah
01:01:01	*	JdGordon\| agrees with kugel :p
01:01:08	Zagor	what's wrong?
01:01:10	kugel	can't we just have c-style, or even c++ style comments?
01:01:17		Part TruthTaco ("Leaving")
01:01:27	JdGordon\|	OK... how about ## doesnt eat the line # does though!
01:01:37	pixelma	kugel: how does that solve the newline issue?
01:01:59	gevaerts	JdGordon\|: 25 themes from the theme site have '##'
01:02:00	kugel	c-style need to be closed explicitely
01:02:15	JdGordon\|	shuush kugel
01:02:23	Zagor	why do you want to require %\ to be last on the line?
01:02:35	JdGordon\|	purely from a code P.O.V
01:02:43		Quit stripwax_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:02:46	JdGordon\|	the parser is dead simple
01:02:56	Zagor	JdGordon\|: %\ = ignore rest of line, including newline
01:02:58	*	gevaerts thinks that continuation lines should be done by starting the continuing line with a backspace character
01:02:59	JdGordon\|	I also dont agree that %\ is a good joiner
01:03:19	Zagor	I have no opinion about which tag to use
01:03:38	JdGordon\|	gevaerts: that will be a total mess to implement
01:04:05	gevaerts	JdGordon\|: yes, but that's nicely balanced by also being a pain for the theme authors :)
01:04:17	JdGordon\|	EXCELLANT!
01:05:27	JdGordon\|	there is some logic to using ^ to say "join onto the previous line" though
01:05:40	gevaerts	Do people actually want continuation lines combined with end of line comments?
01:06:00	JdGordon\|	thats the best time to use them
01:06:31	Zagor	gevaerts: I though that was the big point of splitting lines?
01:07:30		Quit KBH ()
01:07:43	gevaerts	it's the big point of splitting lines, sure (except in some of my experimental wpses that have 500-character lines...), but splitting lines are not the only reason for end-of-line comments
01:08:31	Zagor	of course
01:08:49	Zagor	hence my insistance that we don't mix the two functions
01:10:06	JdGordon\|	you know what... screw it... we should use % to tell it to ignore the \n, and just hope themers are smart enough to put a space between it and #
01:10:22	PaulJam	kugel: did you notice that your custom SB patch is broken with the current SVN revision?
01:10:38	pixelma	if you transfer kugel's c reference to WPS - you could see the /* as the # and you would only need a */ equivalent for someone who wants inline comments, no?
01:11:06	kugel	PaulJam: yes, I think it's this bug actually: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/10596
01:11:11		Join HBK [0] (n=hbk@rrcs-97-77-51-170.sw.biz.rr.com)
01:11:24	JdGordon\|	pixelma: please dont entertain that idea!
01:11:30	gevaerts	JdGordon\|: so '<whatever valid wps code> % #comment' for continuation?
01:11:41	JdGordon\|	yeah
01:11:43	rasher	pixelma: it's not a good comparison, since blank lines in C don't have any significance
01:12:02	kugel	we could also say the current situation isn't bad, and tell everyone to insert a blank line who wants inline comments which doesn't eat newlines?
01:12:18	JdGordon\|	NO!
01:12:38	gevaerts	JdGordon\|: that would only break for new themes if people aren't careful, and I'd expect people to look at the wps screen before uploading, so I think that's fine
01:12:44	pixelma	well, just thought it would be an easier solution - maybe I shouldn't have drawn the analogy
01:13:17	JdGordon\|	we could do %* blaaaa *% though :p
01:14:17	JdGordon\|	I tinhk that is actually more understandable than an extra line joiner tag
01:14:46	JdGordon\|	nice and easy to implement also
01:14:49	Zagor	how does that do away with the line joiner tag?
01:14:56	*	gevaerts thinks that JdGordon\|'s '% #' proposal is fine. It doesn't fully meet Zagor's wish for total independence of comments and continuation handling, but it seems impossible to meet that while keeping compatibility
01:15:28	JdGordon\|	no more ambiguity over what comments do # is the rest of the line, %* *% is everything between them
01:15:32	JdGordon\|	it also allows you to comment out blocks
01:15:37	*	kugel thought compatibility isn't an issue?
01:16:07	Zagor	JdGordon\|: so you're commenting out the newlines? hmm...
01:16:46	JdGordon\|	you're commenting out everything....
01:16:50	kugel	JdGordon\|: that's c-style!
01:16:53	JdGordon\|	between and including the tags
01:16:56	*	JdGordon\| knows :(
01:16:58	JdGordon\|	it works though
01:17:03	kugel	what I said
01:17:05		Quit bubsy (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
01:17:43	JdGordon\|	it could even just be a single % on either end... but that might be harder to follow
01:17:55		Quit archivator (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:18:45	kugel	block comments would be nice for debugging
01:19:31	Zagor	I don't quite see it as a convenient replacement for a line joiner
01:19:59		Quit gregzx ("ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox 3.5.2/20090729225027]")
01:20:06	*	kugel votes for the empty line line-joiner :p
01:24:12	kugel	JdGordon: did my commit break non-backdrop themes?
01:24:29	JdGordon\|	your whowho did what now?
01:24:45	kugel	:?
01:24:54	JdGordon\|	which commit?
01:25:07	kugel	r22662
01:25:44	JdGordon\|	I dont tihnk so?
01:26:51	kugel	my statusbar patch worked with r22657
01:27:15	kugel	I'm thinking PaulJam's problem is because sbs don't have backdrops
01:27:54		Quit faemir ("Leaving")
01:28:53	kugel	all commits inbetween are mine :p
01:29:00	JdGordon\|	oh good... your bug then :)
01:29:07	JdGordon\|	I cant imagine why that would have broken it though
01:30:59	kugel	I'm wondering why data->num_tokens is incremented once more since r22618, and why it's incremented after setting the current token to WPS_NO_TOKEN
01:32:55	kugel	also (for the album art problem), didn't the token always return "C"? Why is the C showing now, but didn't before?
01:34:39		Quit PaulJam (".")
01:34:48	JdGordon\|	I'm not entirely sure...
01:35:12	JdGordon\|	that first bit I have to look at... but im at work still
01:36:29	kugel	what does %x\|a\|filename\|x\|y\| do?
01:36:44	kugel	dancingpuffdou has this, for the backdrop apparently
01:36:48		Quit Zagor ("Clint excited")
01:36:53	pixelma	statically load a bitmap
01:37:05	kugel	not %xl
01:37:30	pixelma	which would be dynamically loaded bitmaps...
01:37:41	kugel	what's the difference?
01:37:45		Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection)
01:37:52		Part toffe82
01:38:04	kugel	CustomWPS doesn't tell anything about it
01:38:04	JdGordon\|	no l means its always displayed
01:38:40	pixelma	the %x bitmap is always shown whereas you can control whether the %xl bitmap is shown or not with the%xd tag
01:39:39	*	kugel didn't connect loading statically or dynamically with that
01:40:04	pixelma	and it's often used in monochrome WPSs instead of backdrops (DancePuffDuo is basically a monochrome WPS, works on greyscale and colour too of course
01:40:13	kugel	ah, but I just see CustomWPS does tell about it, I'm apparently blind
01:40:54	pixelma	well you load it in a way of "do something with it now and be done with it" or "load it but let's use it later"
01:41:43	JdGordon\|	so what did we decide re the comments?
01:43:22	pixelma	I see the album art problem now with my WPS that worked fine before (some early 22600 rev) -> blank space at parts of the screen (as you said at the left corner of the screen) just updated when there are other bitmaps or dynamically updating WPS tags in that area
01:43:23	kugel	hrm, the test wps at fs#10596 doesn't parse here
01:43:47	pixelma	kugel: my WPS has no backdrop so that's not the problem
01:44:14	kugel	does it have viewports?
01:44:21	pixelma	lots
01:45:10		Quit froggyman (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:45:36	kugel	that wps isn't invalid, is it?
01:45:45		Quit dfkt ("-= SysReset 2.53=- Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn.")
01:45:48	kugel	it really doesn't parse successfully on my e200 sim
01:45:52	pixelma	mine?
01:46:17	pixelma	please be carefull with "it" and "that" ;)
01:46:23	kugel	the one at fs#10596
01:47:48	kugel	it seems a wps starting with a vp doesn't work
01:48:37	kugel	oh, nevermind
01:48:48	kugel	that wps works fine here :S
01:57:02	kugel	my custom statusbar patch also still works :/
01:59:07		Quit JdGordon\| ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org")
02:00
02:00:51	kugel	pixelma: you mean you see the "C" now?
02:01:04	kugel	would be interesting which commit introduced that
02:03:45		Quit DerPapst ("Leaving.")
02:14:38		Join JdGordon_ [0] (i=ad7fa80e@gateway/web/freenode/x-prefxzgxvqmrxomd)
02:15:19	JdGordon_	it should be obvious which commit made C show
02:15:22		Quit stripwax (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
02:15:41	JdGordon_	the one I changed when drawing AA was moved to after images
02:17:08	kugel	JdGordon_: have you actually been able to repro the crash at FS #10596?
02:17:44		Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk)
02:17:50	JdGordon_	I havnt tried.. those 2 fixes where literally while i was havcing breakfast
02:18:38		Join AndyI [0] (n=pasha_in@212.14.205.32)
02:18:41	JdGordon_	you cant repro?
02:18:54		Quit robin0800 (Remote closed the connection)
02:19:00	kugel	no
02:20:21		Quit bughunter2 ("Leaving.")
02:21:09		Quit mcuelenaere ()
02:21:16		Quit Klowner (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:22:15	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:23:20	*	JdGordon_ thinks about displaying the whole line of a broken wps with a fancy arow pointing to the problem in the debug output
02:24:54	kugel	hrm, UnhelpfulAA seems to crash
02:25:11	JdGordon_	going by its name, that is unsurprising
02:25:51	kugel	did we freeze already, btw?
02:26:34	JdGordon_	I was wondering the same
02:26:44	*	JdGordon_ is in no rush to send out the freeze email :p
02:29:38	kugel	JdGordon_: is the skin buffer not free'd properly?
02:30:14	JdGordon_	what gives you that idea?
02:30:18	kugel	strange
02:30:36	kugel	under gdb, the skin buffer overflowed after changing wpses a few times
02:31:05		Quit stripwax ("http://miranda-im.org")
02:31:30		Quit AndyIL (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:31:50	kugel	it also shows 2 "Skin buffer usage: XX" lines per wps change
02:32:05	JdGordon_	that shouildnt be possible...
02:32:19	JdGordon_	which target?
02:32:30	kugel	e200 sim
02:32:38	JdGordon_	does the skin load?
02:32:40	kugel	I didn't get the skin buffer overflow again yet though
02:32:46	JdGordon_	or is the 2nd one the default?
02:33:20	JdGordon_	OH yeah! it probably isnt freeded after a failed load
02:34:46	kugel	something is really strange here
02:34:59	kugel	it crashes at another position now if I go to wps from theme settings
02:35:17	JdGordon_	svn? or your patched?
02:35:20	kugel	svn
02:36:15	kugel	http://pastie.org/611805
02:36:40	JdGordon_	img == 0
02:37:14	JdGordon_	pastebin the wps?
02:38:22	kugel	JdGordon_: http://pastie.org/611808
02:38:36		Join Strife89 [0] (n=michael@adsl-154-11-147.mcn.bellsouth.net)
02:38:49	kugel	that doesn't even have images
02:39:40	JdGordon_	yeah
02:39:41	JdGordon_	wtf?
02:40:16	JdGordon_	something is not right
02:41:34	JdGordon_	back in 15
02:42:19	kugel	if (data->tokens[i].type == WPS_TOKEN_IMAGE_PRELOAD_DISPLAY) shouldn't be true if there's no images
02:44:35		Quit JdGordon_ (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
02:50:46	JdGordon	correct
02:53:35		Join fdinel [0] (n=Miranda@modemcable204.232-203-24.mc.videotron.ca)
02:54:15	kugel	JdGordon: anyway, I added a if (img == NULL) check, the other crash remains
02:54:31	JdGordon	that shouldnt happen so the check is bad
02:54:35	JdGordon	it hides a real issue
02:54:44	kugel	yes..
02:54:56	kugel	I'm saying it wouldn't even fix the other problem
02:55:30	kugel	the other crash is more fishy anyway. get_token_value returns a strange address (gdb just says "Address out of bounds")
02:59:47	kugel	it crashes on any token, apparently, I commented all out -> no crash, commented all but one out -> crash, commented all but (another) one out -> crash too
03:00
03:06:26	kugel	is there an easy way to get from a number to the enum memberß
03:06:37	JdGordon	nope
03:15:23		Quit thegeek (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
03:23:26	kugel	JdGordon: getting more strange: if I comment everything but 1 line out, it crashes. if I actually delete everything but that line, it runs
03:24:50	kugel	I wonder why my breakpoint is hit 4 times even though I have only 1 token
03:24:58	kugel	before it crashes
03:26:01		Quit MG_Man (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
03:26:15	JdGordon	fuck
03:27:28	kugel	haha
03:28:02	JdGordon	its only that wps though yeah?
03:28:04	kugel	I have to correct myself. It only does't crash with everthing but 1 line removed if I leave an empty line at the very beginning
03:28:25	JdGordon	AAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
03:29:21	kugel	http://pastie.org/611837
03:29:28	kugel	it might be a hint :p
03:30:08	JdGordon	curr_line->curr_subline->last_token_idx = wps_data->num_tokens - 1;
03:30:19	JdGordon	last_idx is -1 !
03:30:35	JdGordon	which is probaly why that wasnt there to start with :)
03:30:41	*	JdGordon curses this sub/.line handling
03:30:42	kugel	how?
03:30:51	JdGordon	num_tokens at that point is still 0
03:31:44	kugel	how does the empty line make a difference there?
03:37:06	JdGordon	where the heck is tokens[-1] land?
03:37:14	JdGordon	it still gets done
03:37:21	JdGordon	actually... well...
03:37:29	JdGordon	it should still start at 0 and get no further
03:39:18	kugel	ah, a newline char increases num_tokens
03:40:22	kugel	so, starting with a vp is a bad idea
03:41:25	kugel	I'm thinking num_tokens should start with 1. if even an empty line increases it
03:42:22	kugel	it doesn't crash if I do that
03:43:05	JdGordon	that will cause other problems
03:43:10	kugel	or, it could also be changed to increase num_tokens before parsing
03:43:57	kugel	going into vp parsing with num_tokens == 0 doesn't seem totally correct to me
03:44:10		Join Eosphere46 [0] (i=Eosphere@74.197.221.60)
03:45:22	kugel	quick fix seems to cap last_token_idx to 0 in viewport parsing?
03:50:43	JdGordon	yeah
03:50:51	JdGordon	something like that
03:50:55		Join Canabama [0] (n=andrew@207.157.10.2)
03:51:18	JdGordon	I think we need to start adding every token to the array, regardless of it its used or not...
03:51:22	JdGordon	need to think about it
03:51:27	JdGordon	heading out now
03:51:48		Part Canabama
03:53:07		Join Dhraakellian [0] (n=ntryon@cpe-72-226-197-191.rochester.res.rr.com)
03:54:18	Dhraakellian	I have an artist that shows up in the database without its album or tracks
03:54:29		Nick advcomp2019_ is now known as advcomp2019 (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019)
03:54:34	Dhraakellian	I think there may have been an error when I restarted after updating the database
03:55:36	Dhraakellian	so when I go to export modifications before doing a reinitialize, I get a data abort at 30040958
03:55:58	Dhraakellian	Sansa FuzeV1, r22667
04:00
04:04:58		Quit Eosphere46 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
04:06:12		Quit TheSeven (Nick collision from services.)
04:06:27		Join The_Seven [0] (n=theseven@dslb-084-056-169-196.pools.arcor-ip.net)
04:06:35		Nick The_Seven is now known as TheSeven (n=theseven@dslb-084-056-169-196.pools.arcor-ip.net)
04:07:30	*	kugel doesn't feel good at this fix
04:08:06		Join Eosphere46 [0] (i=Eosphere@74.197.221.60)
04:11:55		Join froggyman [0] (n=chatzill@pool-72-69-75-180.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net)
04:14:47		Quit froggyman (Client Quit)
04:20:05		Quit Strife89 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
04:20:10		Quit Eosphere46 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
04:21:48		Join Eosphere46 [0] (i=Eosphere@74.197.221.60)
04:22:19	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
04:22:41		Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net)
04:23:51		Quit liar (Remote closed the connection)
04:30:20		Quit HellDragon (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
04:30:32		Join HellDragon [0] (i=jd@modemcable178.248-201-24.mc.videotron.ca)
04:37:01		Quit Eosphere46 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
04:39:14	kugel	JdGordon: Why is num_tokens right for the index if the viewport is the first thing to parse, but off by one anytime after (which was the reason for the -1)
04:43:23		Quit Rondom (Nick collision from services.)
04:43:33		Join Rondom [0] (n=Rondom@dslb-084-057-162-243.pools.arcor-ip.net)
04:46:08		Quit kugel (Remote closed the connection)
05:00
05:24:47		Join Klowner [0] (n=klown@71-215-18-224.dvnp.qwest.net)
05:27:37		Quit panni_ ("( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 3.81 :: www.XLhost.de )")
05:36:02		Join JohnTeddy [0] (i=unstable@tor/regular/sid)
05:36:40	JohnTeddy	If I have playlists on rhythmbox, is it easy to make a playlist on rockbox the same?
05:42:12	n1s	rockbox uses m3u playlists, so if rythmbox can create those it should be pretty easy
05:45:11	JohnTeddy	n1s: yes, It can save m3u playlists. but the directories for my playlist is stuff on my laptop hard disk, I don't have playlists for the directory structure on my rockbox
05:45:49	JohnTeddy	I could mimick it though, and make symbolic links. Does rockbox fs support symbolic links?
05:46:01	JohnTeddy	So do like /home/johnteddy/Music/.
05:46:06	n1s	no, rockbox uses FAT
05:46:25	JohnTeddy	Are there shortcuts of any kind?
05:46:53	JohnTeddy	otherwise everytime I have to play my music, I have two directories to click into. /home/johntedy
05:47:48		Quit Horscht ("Verlassend")
05:48:00	n1s	there are shortcuts of one kind, implemented using some plugin but IIRC they don't do what you want, an m3u can use relative paths though so if you manage to get rythmbox to save it like that and uses the same dir structure on your DAP it shoukd work i think
05:48:27	JohnTeddy	actually whatever, it's easy to modify
05:48:41	JohnTeddy	gedit can just change all '/home/johnteddy' to '', in one second
05:48:45	JohnTeddy	and save the file
05:48:50	n1s	sure
05:51:32	JohnTeddy	I just put the m3u anywhere?
05:51:41	JohnTeddy	I can make like a 'playlists' directory or something?
05:52:47	n1s	yes and no :) it depends on how it is created... if the paths are relative it has to be in the right place, if they are absolute (which i guess yours are) you can put it anywhere
05:53:32		Quit Overand_ (Client Quit)
05:53:35		Join Overand [0] (i=overand@crappy.domain.name)
06:00
06:06:52		Join Andy [0] (n=461682be@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-aqbmhuesjavkljxw)
06:08:25	Andy	can anybody tell me where a full list of supported players are?
06:08:53	scorche	www.rockbox.org
06:09:28	Andy	damn, is that it?
06:10:20	Andy	I thought the zen vision M would definatly be supported
06:10:37	scorche	well, it isnt ;)
06:10:57	scorche	there is a port in development, but it is not near up to the usable level
06:11:17	Andy	maybe I'm mistaken but isn't it the most popular next to the ipod?
06:11:37	Andy	in fact it's the only one I've people actually using besides an ipod
06:11:43	Andy	seen*
06:11:45	scorche	i seriously doubt that, but popularity does not dictate which devices work with rockbox
06:16:53		Quit Andy ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
06:19:51		Join _Tristan [0] (i=tristan@i.dont.want.to.die.virgin.net.in)
06:22:24	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
06:22:29		Join webguest58 [0] (n=4b3e7fdc@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-upzygppxqqmpspbg)
06:24:05		Quit fdinel ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org")
06:29:21	TheSeven	scorche: it's rather popularity within rockbox developers that dictates it, right? :-)
06:29:52		Quit webguest58 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
06:32:28		Quit Tristan46 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
06:35:17		Join LinusN [0] (n=linus@rockbox/developer/LinusN)
06:39:16		Join shoe_ [0] (i=4b3e7fdc@gateway/web/freenode/x-ggcyvrgnzvzzimfv)
06:49:51		Nick niekie_ is now known as niekie (i=quasselc@dreamworld.bergnetworks.com)
06:51:07		Quit gevaerts (Nick collision from services.)
06:51:19		Join gevaerts [0] (n=fg@rockbox/developer/gevaerts)
06:56:13	shoe_	Hi I'm having trouble installing the bootloader on a Gigabeat S using the precompiled sendfirm.exe. It reports success but the player does not reboot as it should. I can provide more details if anyone can help.
07:00
07:18:42	pixelma	JdGordon (kugel): I don't see a "C" now, but I preload album art at a position of x=1 and y=1 but don't show it in a viewport that's in the upper right corner of the screen. This worked without any glitches before, now if album art should be shown, parts of the screen get blanked ou. It looks like an area the size of my album art and position x=1, y=1 of the screen is affected, not everything vanishes though - dynamic bitmaps are still drawn (a
07:18:42	pixelma	satic one is affected), everything of the textual info (partially from tags) vanishes except the time info (current playtime and length of the track)
07:19:29	pixelma	first "don't" shouldn't have been there... also, I guess I can provide a screenshot if you like
07:24:44		Quit shoe_ ("Page closed")
07:27:36		Quit n1s (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out))
07:45:35		Join stoffel [0] (n=quassel@p57B4E3B4.dip.t-dialin.net)
08:00
08:09:34		Join flydutch [0] (n=flydutch@host214-146-dynamic.15-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)
08:10:46		Quit antil33t ()
08:17:47		Part safetydan ("Leaving.")
08:21:20		Quit z35 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
08:22:27	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
08:24:39		Join antil33t [0] (n=Mudkips@119.224.12.185)
08:25:04		Join Zagor [242] (n=bjorn@rockbox/developer/Zagor)
08:32:13		Join ender` [0] (i=krneki@foo.eternallybored.org)
08:37:07		Join bertrik [0] (n=bertrik@87.211.49.117)
08:41:54		Join GodEater__ [0] (n=9372e2b6@rockbox/staff/GodEater)
08:46:22		Join petur [50] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur)
08:53:07		Join decayedcell_ [0] (n=decayed_@60-241-92-53.static.tpgi.com.au)
09:00
09:01:10		Join pamaury [0] (n=pamaury@140.77.26.69)
09:01:34	pamaury	pcc1: hello
09:06:02		Quit fyrestorm ("lamers envy me like they envy bill g -- main boot xp, just the way it should be!")
09:07:04		Quit bertrik ("De groeten")
09:11:21		Join daggett [0] (n=denis@lab.openpattern.org)
09:21:17		Join PaulJam [0] (n=Paule@p54BEEBAB.dip.t-dialin.net)
09:21:21		Join Thundercloud [0] (i=thunderc@persistence.flat.devzero.co.uk)
09:24:47		Join DerPapst [0] (n=DerPapst@91-64-221-175-dynip.superkabel.de)
09:32:20		Quit pamaury ("exit((int )0 / 0);")
09:43:59		Join n1s [0] (n=n1s@rockbox/developer/n1s)
09:47:17		Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection)
09:55:14		Join pamaury [0] (n=pamaury@140.77.26.69)
09:56:44		Join robin0800 [0] (n=robin080@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust436.brig.cable.ntl.com)
09:58:54	robin0800	JdGordon: problem in album art display this conditional %?C< displays album art if true think only %C should do this?
10:00
10:01:10	pcc1	pamaury: hello
10:01:26	pamaury	hello
10:01:41	pamaury	I've wommited some thing about object properties on github
10:02:42	pcc1	yes, I saw that
10:03:00	pamaury	I've still not checked date work correctly because mtpfs does not retrieve date and times. PErhaps there is anoter mtpfs implementation that does it
10:05:35	pcc1	so mtpfs uses the date/times in ObjectInfo? or not at all?
10:05:49	pcc1	(I've been testing with gphoto2)
10:07:37	pamaury	Not at all as far as I could see it. Basically, all dates are set to 1970, ... It's possible that it is a bug in my implementation and that the objets properties regarding date/time are buggy but as I'm sure they work for size, I would be strange
10:14:07	pcc1	hm, I was testing my SendObjectInfo implementation and got a message on screen: "PANIC Stkov usb (0)". anyone familiar with this?
10:15:14		Quit HBK (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
10:21:00	pamaury	is it a kernel message or a libmtp one ?
10:21:18	pamaury	Ah you mean on your device ?
10:22:01	pamaury	Perhaps you send empty messages, I read somewhere that some usb hardware didn't like them
10:22:29	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
10:23:28	pcc1	yes, on the device
10:24:11	pcc1	some googling indicated stkov stood for stack overflow
10:34:16	pcc1	hm, I may have made a silly mistake
10:39:54		Quit PaulJam (Nick collision from services.)
10:40:01		Join PaulJam_ [0] (n=Paule@p54BEEBAB.dip.t-dialin.net)
10:49:32		Join liar [0] (n=liar@83.175.83.185)
11:00
11:08:35		Quit Llorean ("Leaving.")
11:09:09		Join Llorean [0] (n=DarkkOne@adsl-99-4-146-40.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net)
11:09:47		Join DarkDefender [0] (n=rob@78.69.30.229)
11:18:08		Quit stoffel (Remote closed the connection)
11:20:26		Part decayedcell_
11:20:55		Join decayedcell_ [0] (n=decayed_@60-241-92-53.static.tpgi.com.au)
11:21:08		Part decayedcell_
11:43:35		Quit tarbo_ (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
11:43:46		Join Zarggg_ [0] (n=zarggg@65-78-69-194.c3-0.eas-ubr6.atw-eas.pa.cable.rcn.com)
11:45:47		Quit ehntoo (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
11:45:57		Join ehntoo [0] (n=ehntoo@adsl-99-156-196-216.dsl.applwi.sbcglobal.net)
11:47:35		Quit aevin (Remote closed the connection)
11:48:27		Quit jfc (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
11:49:20		Join jfc [0] (n=john@dpc6682208002.direcpc.com)
11:50:47		Join aevin [0] (i=eivindsy@unaffiliated/aevin)
11:53:49		Join tarbo [0] (n=me@unaffiliated/tarbo)
11:54:58		Join matsl [0] (n=matsl@dhcp126.contactor.se)
12:00
12:02:14		Quit Zarggg (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
12:07:03		Quit pamaury (Remote closed the connection)
12:19:12		Quit gevaerts (Nick collision from services.)
12:19:22		Join gevaerts [0] (n=fg@rockbox/developer/gevaerts)
12:22:32	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
12:27:34		Quit shodanX (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
12:44:24		Quit robin0800 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
12:44:57		Quit PaulJam_ (".")
12:45:14		Join PaulJam [0] (n=Paule@p54BEEBAB.dip.t-dialin.net)
12:46:45	Llorean	GodEater__: Off of the statement in -community, I actually wonder why "autorock" is still a define, and not simply an option in the "startup screen" choices.
12:47:04	GodEater__	good point
12:47:07	Llorean	I seem to recall it's not normally defined so as to skip looking for that file and slowing bootup, but now that there's a start-screen choice, it kinda makes sense to have it as an option, and drop the define.
12:47:18	GodEater__	indeed
12:47:37	GodEater__	I'd use my new found commit powers to change it, only I have of course no access to svn during the day, and I'll have forgotten by tea time ;)
12:47:40	Llorean	Especially now that we have one plugin that could realistically be a useful startup
12:54:13		Join webguest [0] (n=464605b9@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-mkdwobdndsatibjm)
12:56:32		Quit webguest (Client Quit)
12:58:47	AlexP	Llorean: Rockbox1D? :)
12:58:51		Join jfc^2 [0] (n=john@dpc6682208002.direcpc.com)
12:58:54	AlexP	er, blox
13:00
13:02:25	Llorean	I guess it would also need a context menu option for .rock files to "set as autorock" or something
13:02:33		Join FOAD_ [0] (n=dok@dinah.blub.net)
13:05:44	GodEater__	not particularly hard to implement though I wouldn't have thought
13:10:55		Join bubsy [0] (n=Bubsy@94.139.72.137)
13:11:50	Llorean	I can't imagine it would be. It's basically the same functionality as setting the default recording folder should be I think - store a path somewhere.
13:14:28		Quit jfc (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
13:14:52		Quit FOAD (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
13:14:52		Nick FOAD_ is now known as FOAD (n=dok@dinah.blub.net)
13:16:41	amiconn	Llorean: It's not entirely the same. Autorock should allow to set it to nothing, skipping the check altogether
13:19:47	Torne	amiconn: you don't actually need that if it's a start screen choice though, no?
13:19:52	Torne	you can just set the start screen back to main menu
13:20:07	amiconn	Hmm, yes
13:20:09	Torne	there's no technical reason to need to clear the autorock setting
13:20:14	Torne	though aesthetically might be nice ;)
13:20:19	*	amiconn has it normally set to 'file browser' though
13:20:53	*	GodEater__ has it set to WPS
13:21:13	Llorean	Is there a way to unset the recording folder / set it to root?
13:22:17	AlexP	Delete the directory :)
13:22:42	GodEater__	stkov
13:22:46	AlexP	Llorean: http://download.rockbox.org/manual/rockbox-h100/rockbox-buildch10.html#x13-15400010.9
13:23:24		Quit bubsy ("I'll be back somewhere in time...")
13:26:52		Join bughunter2 [0] (n=bughunte@unaffiliated/bughunter2)
13:39:36		Quit PaulJam (Nick collision from services.)
13:39:45		Join PaulJam_ [0] (n=Paule@p54BEEBAB.dip.t-dialin.net)
13:47:32		Quit PaulJam_ (Nick collision from services.)
13:47:34		Join PaulJam__ [0] (n=Paule@p54BEF705.dip.t-dialin.net)
13:50:16		Quit ch4os (Remote closed the connection)
13:52:43		Quit DarkDefender (Remote closed the connection)
13:52:49		Quit bughunter2 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
13:53:21		Join bughunter2 [0] (n=bughunte@ip4da4427e.direct-adsl.nl)
13:56:26		Quit bughunter2 (Client Quit)
13:58:36		Join dfkt [0] (i=dfkt@unaffiliated/dfkt)
13:59:52		Join DerPapst1 [0] (n=DerPapst@91-64-221-175-dynip.superkabel.de)
14:00
14:03:59		Join bubsy [0] (n=bubsy@94.139.72.137)
14:11:10		Quit DerPapst (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
14:11:12		Join shodanX [0] (n=shodanX@jazz.informatik.uni-erlangen.de)
14:13:55		Join gregzx [0] (n=chatzill@dsv220.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl)
14:22:35	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
14:27:34		Part LinusN
14:27:52		Quit bubsy ("I'll be back somewhere in time")
14:27:55		Join bubsy [0] (n=bubsy@94.139.72.137)
14:28:00		Quit linuxstb (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
14:30:24		Join LambdaCalculus37 [0] (i=44a0430d@rockbox/staff/LambdaCalculus37)
14:33:52		Join z35 [0] (n=z35@ool-45701ce5.dyn.optonline.net)
14:34:03		Join bubsy_ [0] (n=bubsy@94.139.72.137)
14:34:22		Quit bubsy (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
14:38:36		Join robin0800 [0] (n=robin080@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust436.brig.cable.ntl.com)
14:44:25		Join Strife89 [0] (n=michael@168.16.238.225)
14:54:22		Quit bubsy_ (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
14:54:30		Join bubsy__ [0] (n=bubsy@94.139.72.137)
14:55:09		Join linuxstb [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
14:56:38		Join barrywardell [0] (n=barrywar@rockbox/developer/barrywardell)
14:59:49		Quit bubsy__ ("I'll be back somewhere in time")
14:59:52		Join bubsy [0] (n=bubsy@94.139.72.137)
15:00
15:17:22		Join TopyMobile_ [0] (n=topy@chello084010205095.chello.pl)
15:19:05		Quit TopyMobile (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
15:20:22		Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net)
15:24:41		Quit Strife89 ("They say that if you hold a Linux shell to your ear, you can hear the C.")
15:32:00		Join decayedcell_ [0] (n=decayed_@60-241-92-53.static.tpgi.com.au)
15:34:59	CIA-43	New commit by zagor (r22671): Committing current state of buildserver scripts.
15:42:19		Quit BulldogPO (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
15:51:17		Join ch4os [0] (n=ch4os@gentoo/user/ch4os)
15:53:59		Join evilnick [0] (i=0c140464@gateway/web/freenode/x-fqsifjurrujthjoh)
15:57:16		Quit robin0800 (Remote closed the connection)
16:00
16:02:30		Quit bubsy ("I'll be back somewhere in time")
16:02:34		Join bubsy [0] (n=bubsy@94.139.72.137)
16:04:13		Part decayedcell_
16:07:36		Join kugel [0] (n=kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel)
16:07:45		Join JohannesSM64 [0] (n=Johannes@cm-84.208.207.140.getinternet.no)
16:22:39	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
16:28:04		Join chandoo [0] (n=chandoo@ool-4353b978.dyn.optonline.net)
16:33:37		Join toffe82 [0] (n=chatzill@12.169.218.14)
16:33:46		Quit gregzx ("ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox 3.5.2/20090729225027]")
16:45:04		Quit matsl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
16:45:59		Quit evilnick (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
16:49:27		Nick jfc^2 is now known as jfc (n=john@dpc6682208002.direcpc.com)
16:53:04		Join archivator [0] (n=Delyan@77.70.28.57)
16:53:31		Join robin0800 [0] (n=robin080@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust436.brig.cable.ntl.com)
17:00
17:00:16		Quit petur ("plop")
17:04:14		Quit killan_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
17:04:35		Quit kugel (Nick collision from services.)
17:04:39		Join kugel [0] (n=kugel@e178066030.adsl.alicedsl.de)
17:05:46		Join evilnick [0] (i=0c140464@gateway/web/freenode/x-umhublhkbzlqtccq)
17:07:18		Quit Zagor ("Don't panic")
17:11:06		Join xavieran__ [0] (n=xavieran@ppp118-208-209-164.lns10.mel6.internode.on.net)
17:13:51		Quit Lss__ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
17:18:24		Join thegeek [0] (n=nnscript@129.241.139.243)
17:19:33		Quit GodEater__ ("CGI:IRC")
17:20:06		Join GodEater__ [0] (n=9372e2c1@rockbox/staff/GodEater)
17:20:36		Quit BlakeJohnson86 (Remote closed the connection)
17:22:44		Join explore [0] (n=msparker@173.57.115.183)
17:24:18		Quit xavieran_ (Read error: 105 (No buffer space available))
17:24:20		Quit ehntoo (Read error: 105 (No buffer space available))
17:24:37		Quit kugel (Nick collision from services.)
17:24:41		Join kugel [0] (n=kugel@e178077144.adsl.alicedsl.de)
17:26:25		Join mt [0] (n=Miranda@rockbox/developer/mt)
17:29:29		Join bughunter2 [0] (n=bughunte@unaffiliated/bughunter2)
17:36:59		Join daurn\| [0] (n=daurnima@freenode/staff/daurnimator)
17:37:48		Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net)
17:41:27		Quit bughunter2 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
17:46:49		Quit kugel (Remote closed the connection)
17:47:05		Join DarkDefender [0] (n=rob@78-69-30-229-no36.tbcn.telia.com)
17:48:10		Quit GodEater__ ("CGI:IRC")
17:50:04		Join Shlee [0] (n=Shlee@115-166-22-228.ip.adam.com.au)
17:50:35		Join DerPapst [0] (n=DerPapst@91-64-221-175-dynip.superkabel.de)
17:52:52		Quit daurn (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
17:54:32		Join kugel [0] (n=kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel)
17:59:40		Quit JohannesSM64 (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
17:59:53		Join JohannesSM64 [0] (n=Johannes@cm-84.208.207.140.getinternet.no)
18:00
18:01:05		Quit DerPapst1 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
18:04:37		Quit evilnick (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
18:05:27		Join HBK [0] (n=hbk@rrcs-97-77-51-170.sw.biz.rr.com)
18:18:17		Join domonoky [0] (n=Domonoky@rockbox/developer/domonoky)
18:18:27		Quit archivator ("Leaving")
18:18:31		Join fyrestorm [0] (n=nnscript@24.90.84.240)
18:19:10		Join thegeek_ [0] (n=nnscript@s243b.studby.ntnu.no)
18:22:43	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
18:28:42		Quit HBK (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
18:29:16		Join archivator [0] (n=archivat@77.70.28.57)
18:29:35		Join moos [0] (i=mostafa@85.171.100.120)
18:29:55		Join HBK [0] (n=hbk@rrcs-97-77-51-170.sw.biz.rr.com)
18:34:52		Quit antil33t (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer))
18:35:06		Join antil33t [0] (n=Mudkips@119.224.12.185)
18:36:35	JdGordon	(07:39:15 PM) kugel: JdGordon: Why is num_tokens right for the index if the viewport is the first thing to parse, but off by one anytime after (which was the reason for the -1) <−−- because %V is not put into the tokens array so num_tokens isnt incremented... later on when %V happens there are toens there and we need to tell the previous line to finish on the (i thought) current toekn
18:38:23		Quit thegeek (Read error: 105 (No buffer space available))
18:40:33		Join merbanan [0] (n=banan@c-83-233-172-245.cust.bredband2.com)
18:46:04		Quit JohannesSM64 (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
18:46:41		Join JohannesSM64 [0] (n=Johannes@cm-84.208.207.140.getinternet.no)
18:49:43	kugel	JdGordon: you're saying the "-" is done before the "?:" ?
18:50:21		Quit fyrestorm (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer))
18:50:22		Join fyre^OS [0] (n=nnscript@cpe-24-90-84-240.nyc.res.rr.com)
18:50:39		Quit fyre^OS (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
18:50:54		Join fyrestorm [0] (n=nnscript@cpe-24-90-84-240.nyc.res.rr.com)
18:51:06		Join panni_ [0] (i=hannes@ip-95-222-19-21.unitymediagroup.de)
18:51:37		Quit bubsy ("I'll be back somewhere in time")
18:52:10	kugel	amiconn: ping
18:53:42	robin0800	kugel: amended what I wrote in the bug I meant %?C<t10.... does this which I think should not
18:54:15	kugel	depends on what the rest of the line is...
18:54:26		Quit archivator (Remote closed the connection)
18:55:25	robin0800	kugel: There is ni %C in it or any where else in the wps and I have album art displayed
18:55:54	JohnTeddy	Is it possible to have my ipod charging, and playing music at the same time? with rockbox
18:58:01	domonoky	JohnTeddy: sure, you have to press the right button while you inster usb. see manual for the correct button.
18:58:28	robin0800	kugel: This is the wps http://paste.ubuntu.com/268664/
18:59:03		Join Grahack [0] (n=chri@ip-222.net-82-216-222.rev.numericable.fr)
18:59:05	pixelma	kugel, JdGordon: did anyone of you see my description (answer to this night's question)? That was with rev. 22668 (downloaded from the site) on my c200
18:59:10	JohnTeddy	domonoky: Is it possible to have this activity by default?
18:59:30	kugel	pixelma: I saw that, but I didn't understand it
18:59:32	JohnTeddy	I have my ipod plugged into my car 24/7. I want when I start my car, it turns on and starts playing music basically.
19:00
19:00:11	robin0800	JohnTeddy: Car mode
19:00:27	JohnTeddy	aww, you guys rock. literally
19:00:28	JohnTeddy	thanks
19:00:47	pixelma	I'm not sure that works as expected on an Ipod but you can try
19:01:05		Join bubsy [0] (n=bubsy@94.139.72.137)
19:04:23		Quit Shlee ()
19:05:39	JdGordon	robin0800: try this http://pastebin.com/m723b8cdd
19:07:07		Join saratoga [0] (i=9803c6dd@gateway/web/freenode/x-nkptzyqeccsxioxx)
19:07:46	kugel	gcc 4.4.1 + binutils 2.20 seems successful so far, doing a few test_codec runs rightnow
19:08:12		Join stoffel [0] (n=quassel@p57B4CEA1.dip.t-dialin.net)
19:08:19	kugel	JdGordon: "JdGordon: you're saying the "-" is done before the "?:" ?"
19:08:40		Quit panni_ (Connection reset by peer)
19:08:42	JdGordon	yeah, just checked the precedance table and i tihnk thats correct
19:08:53		Join panni__ [0] (i=hannes@ip-95-222-19-21.unitymediagroup.de)
19:08:56	kugel	the one on wikipedia?
19:09:01	JdGordon	no
19:09:19	JdGordon	http://docs.roxen.com/pike/7.0/tutorial/expressions/operator_tables.xml
19:09:32		Join Johannes[SM64] [0] (n=Johannes@cm-84.208.207.140.getinternet.no)
19:09:56		Quit Johannes[SM64] (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
19:10:25		Quit Sajber^ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
19:11:29		Join bertrik [0] (n=bertrik@ip117-49-211-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl)
19:19:37		Quit linuxstb (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
19:22:32		Join Horscht [0] (n=Horscht2@xbmc/user/horscht)
19:23:46	PaulJam__	kugel: btw, i inserted a blank line at the top of the .sbs file and now it works again with a current revision (no freeze).
19:29:21		Quit daggett ("Ex-Chat")
19:31:40		Join bughunter2 [0] (n=bughunte@unaffiliated/bughunter2)
19:35:00	pixelma	kugel: http://imagebin.org/63345 (I darkened the light blue a bit to make it better visible): album art is preloaded with %Cl\|2\|1\|40\|40\| at the start of the file with other bitmap definitions but only shown in a conditional viewport starting at x=89, y=1. With current SVN an area gets blanked out that has the dimensions of the album art at the position x=2, y=1 of the screen. That is a bit hidden by the fact that dynamic info/bitmaps/progressbar
19:35:00	pixelma	is getting drawn on top of it again
19:36:26	kugel	interesting
19:36:55	kugel	saratoga: ping
19:37:15		Join linuxstb [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
19:37:20	saratoga	kugel: pong
19:37:27	pixelma	the "i" bitmap is a statically loaded one so vanishes too
19:38:08	kugel	saratoga: I'm running a build with gcc 4.4.1 (release) and binutils 2.20 (snapshot). Everything seems to run fine, and codecs seem a bit faster.
19:38:36	saratoga	any test_codec results?
19:38:42	saratoga	and AMS?
19:38:58	kugel	I'm doing tests on my e200 right now
19:39:41		Quit barrywardell (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out))
19:39:57	kugel	I haven't done the tests on a normal build (apparently my FS just broke), but comparing to CodecPerformanceComparison all my tested codecs seem to be faster by about 1MHz
19:40:19		Join rvvs89 [0] (n=ivo@pdpc/supporter/base/rvvs89)
19:45:06		Quit explore ("leaving")
19:47:47		Join Lss [0] (n=Lss@cm204.delta92.maxonline.com.sg)
19:58:12		Quit PaulJam__ (".")
20:00
20:04:45	kugel	saratoga: hrm, only mp3 is slighly faster
20:05:01	kugel	aac/ogg is slightly slower
20:05:07	kugel	flac is noticeably slower
20:07:56		Join bluebrother [0] (n=dom@rockbox/developer/bluebrother)
20:08:02		Join petur [0] (n=peter@rockbox/developer/petur)
20:10:22		Join Thundercloud [0] (i=thunderc@persistence.flat.devzero.co.uk)
20:17:39		Join gregzx [0] (n=chatzill@dsv220.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl)
20:18:36		Join matsl [0] (n=matsl@1-1-4-2a.mal.sth.bostream.se)
20:21:38		Quit flydutch ("/* empty */")
20:22:46	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
20:25:34		Join gregzx_ [0] (n=chatzill@cmn229.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl)
20:28:15		Quit gregzx (Nick collision from services.)
20:28:20		Nick gregzx_ is now known as gregzx (n=chatzill@cmn229.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl)
20:30:37	amiconn	kugel: pong
20:32:16	kugel	amiconn: I just had the (small?) problem that under my gcc 4.4.1 setup (see -dev ml) doom was linking gcc-support from the plugin lib. that resulted in 2 memcpy versions (doom has it's own wrapper for rb->memcpy). That doesn't happen under 4.0.3
20:32:33	kugel	removing the wrapper from doom obviously solved the problem
20:33:18	kugel	that was the only thing I needed to change in the source for gcc 4.4.1
20:33:18	kugel	I only build for arm
20:33:39	amiconn	Well if that actually works, it should be done in svn too imo
20:36:18	kugel	I didn't run doom, nor applied that change to SVN doom for building with 4.0.3, but the wrapper is the same
20:37:04	kugel	I was just wondering how that happened, why doom links that under 4.4.1
20:37:48	amiconn	That's probably due to linking order
20:38:12	amiconn	I think this wrapper in doom is an oversight from before the "automatic" wrappers
20:38:47		Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net)
20:39:55		Quit gregzx ("ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox 3.5.2/20090729225027]")
20:42:16		Join JdGordroid [0] (n=jdg@m4b0436d0.tmodns.net)
20:45:47		Join explore [0] (n=msparker@pool-173-57-115-183.dllstx.fios.verizon.net)
20:47:13		Quit explore (Client Quit)
20:47:28		Join explore [0] (n=msparker@pool-173-57-115-183.dllstx.fios.verizon.net)
20:49:46		Quit pixelma (Nick collision from services.)
20:49:48		Join pixelma_ [0] (i=quassel@rockbox/staff/pixelma)
20:50:08		Nick pixelma_ is now known as pixelma (i=quassel@rockbox/staff/pixelma)
20:50:58		Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
20:51:00		Join amiconn_ [0] (i=quassel@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
20:51:20		Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (i=quassel@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
20:54:43		Join stripwax_ [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk)
21:00
21:01:48		Join drakonik [0] (n=moot@72.40.159.202)
21:02:08	drakonik	I have a question about how Rockbox's database scanning works.
21:02:25	drakonik	When the db scanner is working, it finds a new file, and adds it to some kind of queue that gets processed on the next bootup.
21:03:23	drakonik	Or rather, on shutdown or completion of the ENTIRE scan, it adds the files to the commit queue.
21:03:53	drakonik	I want to change it so that each file gets added to the queue after it's found. What kind of slowdown would I see? Would it be a horrible horrible idea?
21:06:12	bertrik	kugel, nice job on the gcc comparison
21:07:01	bertrik	do newer gcc's still need to be patched like our current dev setup?
21:10:10		Join gregzx [0] (n=chatzill@cmn229.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl)
21:15:00	kugel	I think so
21:16:38	robin0800	JdGordon: cant get that pastbin to patch isit right?
21:17:33		Quit JdGordroid (Remote closed the connection)
21:25:44	robin0800	JdGordon: i've got "patch: **** Only garbage was found in the patch input"
21:26:33	Slasheri	drakonik: what do you mean with that? each file _is_ added to the queue, or actually a temp file after it's found
21:27:00	kugel	robin0800: that's because JdGordon can't learn to not post patches at pastebin.com
21:27:47	drakonik	Slasheri: I'm just inferring what I can. See, for whatever reason, the scanner crashes my ipod at random points, and NO files are added. So I'm assuming that the files are added to the db-commit-queue when the scan is completed or on sane shutdown of the ipod.
21:28:11	robin0800	kugel: Was it for me anyway?
21:28:23	drakonik	So, I want to change the scan process to add a file to the commit queue as each file is succesfully scanned.
21:28:34		Quit TopyMobile_ (Success)
21:28:47	drakonik	That way, even if it crashes, on next bootup, it will be able to commit the files it DID manage to scan to the DB.
21:29:10	Slasheri	drakonik: ah, actually the temp file will be appended after each file is found
21:29:32		Quit kugel (Remote closed the connection)
21:29:32	Slasheri	but that file probably gets corrupted until it's closed properly (when the entire scan finishes)
21:29:36	drakonik	Hm.
21:29:40	drakonik	Okay.
21:29:46	drakonik	I understand now.
21:30:19	drakonik	So I just need to figure out how to safely close (and presumably reopen) the file for each individual file scan.
21:30:19	drakonik	=\
21:30:34	Slasheri	anyway, you might try to look at the end of the file with a hexedit to get a clue
21:30:46	drakonik	Probably won't be very fast, but it'll work.
21:30:49	drakonik	Where's the file?
21:30:53	gevaerts	drakonik: it sounds much more sensible to me to try to find out why it crashes
21:30:59	drakonik	gevaerts: I have tried.
21:31:05	drakonik	Extensively.
21:31:10		Join JdGordroid [0] (n=jdg@m4b0436d0.tmodns.net)
21:31:20	drakonik	There's just nothing conclusive.
21:31:37	Slasheri	drakonik: rockbox/database_tmp.tcd
21:31:46	drakonik	Hm.
21:31:50	drakonik	No such file.
21:31:52	Slasheri	it's a binary file
21:33:02	drakonik	Let's see if I can MAKE it by initializing my DB
21:33:22	Slasheri	you have to look for it immediately after the crash. otherwise that file will vanish
21:33:27	drakonik	right
21:33:35	drakonik	workin' on it
21:33:58	Slasheri	and by using the bootloader disk mode (before rockbox boots up and removes the file)
21:34:16	drakonik	Aha
21:34:39	drakonik	Is there an upperlimit on how many files the scanner can handle, maybe?
21:35:03	Slasheri	not any absolute limit
21:35:28	drakonik	I've used the simulator, and when I tried to scan my DB, in the db scan debug screen, it mentioned something about too many items or something. tbh, it's been maybe six months since I actually did it so I can't remember precisely what it said.
21:35:33	Slasheri	crashes during database scan are most likely caused by a bad file (or bad tags)
21:35:42	drakonik	See, I thought that
21:35:48	drakonik	But I eliminated that.
21:36:05	drakonik	Unfortunately.
21:36:05	Slasheri	how did you eliminate that?
21:36:25	drakonik	Breaking down my music collection. Taking half of it out of the scan, seeing if it still crashed,
21:36:46	drakonik	And halving each half
21:37:04	Slasheri	and finally having just a single file and still a crash?
21:37:44	drakonik	That was the problem. I used the db scanner debug window, and made note of what file caused the crash. And it's completely random.
21:37:46	Slasheri	then i would suggest checking the file system for errors
21:37:50	drakonik	I have.
21:38:06	Slasheri	okay, that's bad
21:38:10	drakonik	Yeah
21:38:18	drakonik	Someone sugested that it was a hardware problem.
21:38:20	Slasheri	might be something wrong with you hardware, cpu, memory and so on
21:38:22	drakonik	And I understand why.
21:38:48	drakonik	But I'm inclined to believe that if there were hardware issues, my ipod wouldn't work flawlessly, the way it has until I started trying to use rockbox.
21:38:50	Slasheri	indeed, i would thought a hardware problem also if the crashing is completely random
21:39:49	drakonik	kay, database_tmp.tcd is 0kb
21:40:01	drakonik	I realy don't think I even need to bother opening it.
21:40:44	pixelma	what type of files are those and how are they tagged?
21:40:49	drakonik	mp3s
21:41:14		Join bmbl [0] (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/bmbl)
21:41:18	drakonik	And...normally? I dunno, how many ways are there to tag an mp3?
21:41:22		Join archivator [0] (n=archivat@77.70.28.57)
21:41:33	drakonik	Wait. What's nvram.bin?
21:41:50	drakonik	I don't think I remember seeing that a moment ago.
21:42:00	archivator	Hey all, Is there an alternate keymap for the simulator that doesn't use the numpad?
21:42:45	domonoky	nvram.bin is just a file to store some settings, nothing todo with database.
21:42:46		Part Grahack
21:42:49	pixelma	well, e.g. Rockbox only supports only the "native" tagging format which is ID3 for mp3, some PC programs allow Ape tags too
21:42:52	drakonik	Okay.
21:42:57	drakonik	Ah.
21:43:03	drakonik	Nope. IDv3 all the way
21:43:15	domonoky	the 0kb database_tmp file is probably because the file wasnt closed correctly at the crash.
21:43:22	drakonik	Right.
21:43:29	drakonik	I gathered that much.
21:43:49	drakonik	I guess all I can do is get into the source and see what I can see.
21:43:57		Join froggyman [0] (n=chatzill@pool-72-69-75-180.chi01.dsl-w.verizon.net)
21:44:21		Join kugel [0] (i=kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel)
21:44:25	domonoky	yes, a try with opening/closing the temp file beween scanned files, might help to find out more.
21:45:12	drakonik	Off the top of your head, does anyone know what file/function I should look for? I can find it fine on my own, I just wanna save some time
21:45:36		Quit JohannesSM64 ("Leaving")
21:46:28		Quit bmbl (Client Quit)
21:46:34		Join KBH [0] (n=hbk@rrcs-97-77-51-170.sw.biz.rr.com)
21:49:47	archivator	by the way, does anyone else use an alternate keymap? I'm using opti.kbd but I seem to have found a bug - the first time the virtual keyboard is displayed, everything's fine. The second time, however, it's only 3 rows (as opposed to 5) and the line spacing is all messed up. Am I doing something wrong or is it a bug?
21:50:51	n1s	archivator: sounds like a bug, i don't think it's a very commonly used feature
21:51:08	domonoky	drakonik: apps/tagcache.c/h
21:51:20	drakonik	Thank you
21:51:56		Quit stripwax_ ("http://miranda-im.org")
21:52:41		Quit n1s ("L�mnar")
21:53:09	drakonik	Text flowchart. I like it.
21:53:16	domonoky	looks add_tagcache() is the recursive function which adds the entrys to the tempfile. also enabling the logging at the top of this function might help to find out where it stops.
21:54:05	drakonik	urgh
21:54:14	drakonik	my C is way rustier than it has any business being
21:54:46	drakonik	I guess line 1660 is the function definition?
21:55:35	domonoky	yes
21:55:40	drakonik	ky, I got it
21:55:42	drakonik	Thanks.
21:57:20		Join safetydan [0] (n=deverton@rockbox/developer/safetydan)
21:59:10		Quit LambdaCalculus37 ()
21:59:13	archivator	Where can I find the keymaps for the simulator?
22:00
22:00:23	domonoky	uisimulator\sdl\button.c
22:00:46	*	domonoky opens beer :-)
22:01:49	archivator	The resident file-finder strikes again :)
22:02:25		Join killan [0] (n=nnscript@c-0efa70d5.06-397-67626721.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se)
22:02:27		Quit liar (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
22:04:48	drakonik	Hm.
22:05:26		Quit HBK (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:07:25	bertrik	bughunter2, could you try another patch?
22:07:55	bughunter2	bertrik: roger that
22:08:01		Join AsaelReiter [0] (n=d44c6ebe@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-xjvtjttelexjwxme)
22:08:25	bertrik	bughunter2, can you handle a source code patch or do you need a binary?
22:08:43	bughunter2	atm. a binary would be best (sorry for the inconvenience)
22:09:33	AsaelReiter	betrik: will a test on Clip help you?
22:09:51	bertrik	AsaelReiter, no
22:10:11	drakonik	Okay. I'm not seeing anything that resembles a "close temp db file" in this function. =\
22:10:33	drakonik	I see where I should put it. But I don't know where the file is being opened or where it's being closed.
22:10:49	domonoky	drakonik: you wont find one there. its done at the place where this function is called.
22:10:56	drakonik	I am looking there.
22:11:13	drakonik	I admit, my C-fu is pretty weak, so I might just be missing it.
22:11:20	drakonik	around line 4170
22:11:38	domonoky	drakonik: but you could also try to enable the logging (ifdef for sim at moment) to find out more.
22:11:48	drakonik	Alright.
22:11:49		Quit Thundercloud (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
22:12:35	drakonik	Wait. This just write the file being scanned, doesn't it?
22:13:05	domonoky	drakonik: yes, so you can findout where it fails.
22:13:15	drakonik	Ah
22:13:21	domonoky	tagcache_build() contains the opening and closing of the temp file.
22:13:22	drakonik	Yeah.
22:13:32	drakonik	This is pretty useless. I've used that logger before.
22:13:44	drakonik	And it never stops at a consistent file.
22:14:21		Quit stoffel (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:14:27	domonoky	if it stops, does it completly crash, or what does exactly happen ?
22:14:38	bertrik	bughunter2, this is the binary http://filebin.ca/amkevz/rockbox.sansa
22:14:40	drakonik	My ipod screen flashes white and then powers down completely.
22:15:14	bughunter2	bertrik: what should I look out for?
22:15:36	drakonik	Interesting, but unrelated, is the fact that when it reboots, evne if the battery indicator showed 100% charge before the crash, after the crash, it invariably shows 0 charge and very quickly shuts itself down.
22:16:07	domonoky	drakonik: and it also crashes with only one file ?
22:16:40	drakonik	I never quite got it down to that point.
22:16:51	bughunter2	bertrik: anyway, it runs...
22:17:01	drakonik	Because of that battery issue, I'd have to charge it for an hour or two after a crash.
22:18:26	*	domonoky wonders why the battery would be emtpy from scanning only a few files. sounds strange.
22:18:33		Join TopyMobile_ [0] (n=topy@chello084010205095.chello.pl)
22:20:20	bughunter2	bertrik: I've just checked out the sources in a VM, compiling them now with gcc 3.3.5
22:22:09	JohnTeddy	How can I skip through lists more quickly?
22:22:36		Quit killan (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:22:49	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
22:22:56		Join Thundercloud [0] (i=thunderc@persistence.flat.devzero.co.uk)
22:23:59		Quit JdGordroid (Remote closed the connection)
22:24:07	Slasheri	drakonik: hmm, maybe the battery is finished? the db scanning is very hard for the battery
22:24:24	drakonik	I really doubt it
22:24:29	drakonik	It's got fine battery life
22:24:46		Quit AsaelReiter ("CGI:IRC")
22:24:46	drakonik	But it's possible
22:24:48	drakonik	I dunno man.
22:27:18	drakonik	So if I understand this code...tagcache_build() is called on bootup or when a scan is completed. And I guess the argument is where to find the database_tcd.tmp file...
22:28:35	domonoky	no tagcache_build scans for files, the parameter is the startdir..
22:28:38	Slasheri	drakonik: the argument tells from what directory to start scanning
22:28:40	drakonik	Aha
22:28:52	drakonik	Just shows how bad my C is.
22:28:54	drakonik	Alrighty.
22:29:13	domonoky	it may also commit the changes. but that depends on different things..
22:29:38	Slasheri	tagcache_build will create the temp file, and when it's proper time, also commit that file into a database
22:30:06	domonoky	its tagcache_build() -> check_dir() -> add_tagcache() for the scanning process.
22:30:17	drakonik	Got it.
22:31:15	bughunter2	bertrik: still there?
22:35:53	drakonik	Welp,this is pretty much beyond my ken.
22:41:47		Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk)
22:42:33		Join stoffel [0] (n=quassel@p57B4CEA1.dip.t-dialin.net)
22:47:10		Quit gregzx ("ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox 3.5.2/20090729225027]")
22:48:05	bughunter2	bertrik: what should I test? :)
22:48:23	bertrik	just see if the buttons/wheel still work
22:48:27	bughunter2	they do
22:49:13	bughunter2	btw, when I said scrolling really really fast didn't work too well, that's when I put the player on my desk and gave the wheel a quick spin
22:49:22	bughunter2	with normal use it's fine I guess
22:54:17		Join killan [0] (n=nnscript@c-0efa70d5.06-397-67626721.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se)
22:59:15	bughunter2	bertrik: if you have anything else, I might help testing tomorrow :)
22:59:16	bughunter2	night all
22:59:32	bertrik	thanks so far
22:59:38	bughunter2	np :)
22:59:53		Quit bughunter2 ("Leaving.")
23:00
23:00:49		Join Eosphere46 [0] (i=Eosphere@74.197.221.60)
23:05:06		Quit panni__ (Client Quit)
23:05:50		Join panni_ [0] (i=hannes@ip-95-222-19-21.unitymediagroup.de)
23:08:47		Join liar [0] (n=liar@83.175.83.185)
23:11:09		Quit merbanan (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:11:35		Join BlakeJohnson86 [0] (n=bjohnson@c-24-118-162-123.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
23:15:17		Join Zagor [242] (n=bjst@46.35.227.87.static.tab.siw.siwnet.net)
23:16:30		Quit Eosphere46 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:18:27		Join Eosphere46 [0] (i=Eosphere@74.197.221.60)
23:20:31		Quit archivator ("Leaving")
23:23:38		Quit bluebrother ("leaving")
23:26:26		Quit stoffel (Remote closed the connection)
23:26:56		Join FOAD_ [0] (n=dok@dinah.blub.net)
23:32:00		Quit bertrik ("De groeten")
23:32:15		Quit Eosphere46 (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
23:35:23		Join Eosphere46 [0] (i=Eosphere@74.197.221.60)
23:36:32		Quit stripwax ("http://miranda-im.org")
23:36:58		Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk)
23:40:13		Quit Eosphere46 ("It's a dud! It's a dud! It's a du...")
23:42:15		Quit FOAD (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:42:16		Nick FOAD_ is now known as FOAD (n=dok@dinah.blub.net)
23:44:32		Quit stripwax ("http://miranda-im.org")
23:45:38		Quit petur ("Zzzzz")
23:58:20		Quit domonoky (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))

Previous day | Next day