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#rockbox log for 2009-09-22

00:00:05 Quit GeekShadow (No route to host)
00:00:12 Quit GeekShad__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:00:16JdGordon|either make the change now and fix every theme out there.. or leave it
00:00:28 Join Topy44 [0] (
00:00:38kugelit can actually be automated for the theme site
00:00:41 Join GeekShadow [0] (
00:01:00 Join polobricolo_ [0] (
00:01:20kugelI don't think we care about other themes that much
00:02:47 Quit bertrik ("De groeten")
00:03:23n17ikhis there a reason rockbox doesn't look for Folder.bmp, according to ?
00:03:42n17ikhit looks for everything-else.(jpg, jpeg, bmp)
00:04:28Tornen17ikh: because windows doesn't look for folder.bmp
00:04:35Torneso there's no point
00:04:44kugeln17ikh: the reason is that strcmp() instead of strcasecmp() is used in the code. I.e. it only recognizes folder.*, not Folder.*
00:04:46JdGordon|thats a silly reason
00:05:00kugelarg, I didn't see the bmp
00:05:05n17ikhkugel: case-sensitiveness aside
00:05:09TorneJdGordon|: i assume that's the reason anyway :)
00:05:21n17ikhI didn't know windows was album-art aware
00:05:25Lloreann17ikh: We support the filenames that we initially used, plus the filenames that other major programs use.
00:05:32Llorean"folder.bmp" doesn't seem to fall into either of those categories.
00:05:45n17ikhbut for the sake of consistency had my bitmap album art covers named the same as my jpeg ones
00:05:54Tornen17ikh: explorer, in thumbnail mode, displays folder.jpg in the icon for a folder
00:05:58kugelJdGordon|: I brought something similar up (it doesn't read in folder.jpeg). they seemed to be keen on the tiny savings in the searching loop
00:06:12n17ikhI see. I thought it was just something someone had made up and it had caught on
00:06:37JdGordon|the way it should work is read albumartsearch.txt so the user can choose how they want it
00:06:38Torneno. it's not just for album art, so it's not called something more music-y
00:06:52n17ikhso, really, I should rename all my album art "cover.jpg"/"cover.bmp"
00:07:23JdGordon|and if that file doesnt exist then just folder.jpg and cover.bmp
00:07:38JdGordon|infact screw cover.bmp
00:08:01n17ikhonly reason I have bmp album art covers is because they're GIF or PNG
00:08:36Tornen17ikh: for the purposes of rockbox you might as well compress them to jpeg, no?
00:08:39 Quit petur ("Zzzzzzz")
00:08:40JdGordon|kugel: ok, you are right that %C and %Cd shuold be seperate... but this really isnt the time to do that change... do it when we support more than one aa image, because then it will very likely need to be broken again anyway
00:08:44Tornes'not like it's displaying them very big :)
00:09:08n17ikhwell... it irritates me to lossily compress something that's already lossy
00:09:18n17ikhI guess it doesn't matter so much for PNGs
00:09:42n17ikhand, really, it doesn't matter at all for rockbox, but it's ostensibly more about portability
00:09:52JdGordon|add pn support to the core.. or as aa codec :)
00:10:23Tornegif isn't lossy (except inasmuch as you need to reduce to 256 colours)
00:10:24kugeln17ikh: png is uncompressed
00:10:24JdGordon|that would be cool actually... swapable image codecs (using the audio codec buffer), they would just need to be damn fast so the audio doesnt underrun
00:10:31n17ikhkugel: Are you sure it's case-sensitive, anyway? All my album covers are Folder.jpg
00:10:44JdGordon|FAT is not case sensitive
00:11:06kugelbut it keeps the case intact
00:11:15Tornekugel: except when it doesn't ;)
00:11:32Tornethe rules for LFN creation on windows are baroque
00:11:45Tornesome names that fit in 8.3 *don't* get a long filename created and thus lose their case
00:11:59Torneand it varies between windows versions as a bonus
00:12:12Tornesee "case" parameter of vfat fs on linux :)
00:12:45Bob_CBaroqueness is how MS got their patents
00:13:02kugelso, it still may happen that strcmp'ing folder.jpg doesn't match a file created as Folder.jpg
00:13:08kugelwe had this reported before
00:13:36Torneit would be all uppercase on disk if it had n lfn
00:13:50Tornelowercase chars are not allowed in actual FAT dir entries
00:14:59 Quit polobricolo (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:15:30n17ikhso it seems like a bad idea to use strcmp instead of strcasecmp, to me
00:15:55Tornekugel: not sure how *our* FAT code handles it tho
00:16:28rasherkugel: in which universe is png uncompressed?
00:16:33kugelalright, I really should look into the code before claiming stuff. there's no strcmp :)
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00:16:52kugelrasher: I mean it's lossless. slightly messed up the term
00:17:16JdGordon|Torne: who you calling FAT?!
00:17:44kugelthat was answering to "well... it irritates me to lossily compress something that's already lossy" which isn't true for png
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00:21:46 Quit TopyMobile (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:22:39kugelJdGordon|: I actually plan to add more AAs somewhere around statusbar patch (I didn't plan multiple AAs per skin though)
00:23:03JdGordon|so do the change then
00:23:23 Quit Lynx_ (" HydraIRC -> <- Po-ta-to, boil em, mash em, stick em in a stew.")
00:23:31 Quit lennyk ()
00:23:49JdGordon|multi-AA per skin would be sweet... front/back/front-smaller
00:24:02JdGordon|have 15MB of images in the buffer...
00:25:59 Quit flydutch ("/* empty */")
00:27:00domonokyJdGordon: how about animated AA, with many pics :-)
00:27:22JdGordon|that too
00:27:27JdGordon|totally doable!
00:28:51*domonoky wants animated AA in the statusbar... on a archos player :-)
00:29:19 Part Bob_C
00:30:26domonokymore serious: wps plugins, ie visualisations drawing into a wps viewport would be uber-cool ..
00:31:43JdGordon|I did some work on that probably 2 years ago.... had a plugin overriding the displayers (I tinhk before the tokeniser changes)
00:31:50*kugel fails to see the point of (animated) visualisation
00:32:47kugelit should be doable with background plugins actually
00:32:54***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:33:09 Join akur1 [0] (
00:33:21 Part akur1
00:33:28kugelthe main problem is that drawing must only happen in the main thread, which kills background drawing
00:33:52 Quit GeekShadow (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:33:59JdGordon|not nessecarily...
00:34:28domonokya tsr plugin with a darwing callback registered somehow could work.
00:34:30kugelthe way to go is probably to add the update functions to the plugin api somehow, and let the plugin do the wps updates
00:34:54kugelwhich could be launched through the wps context menu
00:38:08 Part domonoky
00:42:37 Quit gregzx ("ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox 3.5.2/20090729225027]")
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00:50:40 Part safetydan ("Leaving.")
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00:51:57 Quit Zagor ("Clint excited")
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00:54:56amiconnTorne: The rockbox fat driver simply *always* creates lfn entries when creating a dir entry
00:55:26amiconnAnd for reading, it knows about the undocumented NT case bits for base name and extension
00:57:36 Join Stephen_ [0] (n=S@
01:00:46stripwaxI sometimes get faint audio glitches when playing Bubbles .. not sure what the cause might be, but seems to happen when I press a button => something odd in the button driver or cpu boost ? I first noticed it when testing out the 0ws boost patch, but I recently noticed same on unpatched build too. Very faint glitch (sounds like a handful of samples dropped)
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01:01:09stripwaxWill see if it's there on latest current build too
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01:58:26 Quit n17ikh ()
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02:02:49 Nick The3_14ed|r is now known as Dhraakellian (
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02:13:13*Strife89 would like the juicy details on the issues with iPods charging.
02:13:16 Quit pixelma (Nick collision from services.)
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02:13:46 Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (i=quassel@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
02:16:52Strife89Most notably with the Photo, which is the model I own.
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02:23:10 Quit kugel ("ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox 3.5.3/20090824101458]")
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02:32:55***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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02:47:42mtHas there been any decision on FS #10362 ?
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02:49:20NJointarbo [0] (n=me@unaffiliated/tarbo)
02:50:43mtAnd FS #4831 too ? (too many too-old still-open bugs !)
02:54:32JdGordon|_apparently not :)
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03:10:34dd09Hey all.
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03:17:05 Quit JdGordon|_ ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
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03:52:19JaredHello all,
03:52:35 Nick Jared is now known as Guest99956 (n=47254756@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
03:52:38Guest99956I go to the daily builds page to download the voice files, but I can't find them there.
03:52:48Guest99956where are they?
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03:55:33 Nick Guest99956 is now known as j8048188 (n=47254756@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
03:55:57j8048188does anyone know where to get the voice files?
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04:07:16j8048188TheSeven, do you know where to download the voice files?
04:11:53JdGordonfrom the voice link on the download page
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04:13:30j8048188ok, thanks. found it. The links on the extras page should be fixed to show this. It is not listed on the daily builds page as stated in the wiki.
04:15:40j8048188Can someone give me write access on the wiki?
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04:32:59***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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05:24:50R31Danyone here know internally about the ipod classic ?
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05:32:37JdGordonits got a pcb or two... a battery... some chips
05:32:54JdGordonmaybe a couple dozen resistors and capacitors
05:33:03R31Dim having trouble tring to figure out what is wrong with mine
05:33:11R31Di got a new hdd for it
05:33:28JdGordonwell.. you;re in the wrong place
05:33:41R31Di hear the hdd working but when i go to the diagnostic test for it dont show up
05:33:56R31Dmight be the ribbon to the hdd im htinking
05:34:30R31Dhrmm i was told to come here
05:43:02moosrasher: can you please update your "Languages status" page when you can, it seems out of date
05:43:40moosThanks in advance
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06:33:01***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
06:39:35MataamadI downloaded the trunk from the svn, and tried to compile for nano2g, but it error's when linking, is it not possible to even compile it?
06:41:30R31Dwoot i got my 4th gen into disc mode finally
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06:41:54R31Dx my fingers for a restore
06:42:12R31Ddamn need to download itunes
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07:05:13 Join bluefoxx_ [0] (i=1855fd37@gateway/web/freenode/x-hezquwfedcrzcvik)
07:05:55bluefoxx_Does anybody know if the sansa E200 series SD slot supports SDIO?
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07:06:42JdGordonfor what?
07:06:57bluefoxx_In general
07:07:16bluefoxx_If I wanted to try and hack a SDIO camera or wifi card into it
07:08:50JdGordonwell... its all open source so assuming there is no hardware changes needed you should be able to do it
07:09:16bluefoxx_So the SD controller supports it than?
07:10:22*JdGordon doesnt kno
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07:12:14bluefoxx_As far as I know, the microSD slot on the e200 series is just a reader tacked onto the portalplayer's USB bus
07:12:26bluefoxx_Or something like that.
07:13:08bluefoxx_I'm hoping its advanced enough that I could adapt something like a SDIO wireless card or SDIO bluetooth chip onto it and do some crazy stuff with that...
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07:31:30CIA-43New commit by jdgordon (r22780): add the %St setting to the debug output for checkwps/parser.... needs mroe work to make it more useful
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07:45:45pixelma - can someone explain to me why "Browse Themes" was changed to "Browse Theme Files", rasher? I'm looking at this for the translation update
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08:33:05***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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09:05:09RalpH_himselfhey guys! I want to update my rockbox version to (hopefully) erase some bugs. How do I do that, without deleting all my database, eqs, settings, wps, fonts etc.? Can I use the RockBox Utility?
09:06:57 Join kyle6513 [0] (n=kyle6513@
09:07:06RalpH_himselfor just manually copy some files? wich are the important ones? "rockbox.ipod" and the "codepages" folder, is that already everything? I didn't find anything else that looks important...
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09:13:09RalpH_himselfseems to work fine
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09:19:36RalpH_himselfexcept that I still don't get the bookmarks to work, the "recent bookmarks" item in the main menu always says "bookmarks empty" :-S
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09:27:16amiconnRalpH_himself: That is not enough. It's pure luck that it works. You'll need at least the codecs as well, and depending on whether you use them the plugins as well
09:28:03amiconnEither use rbutil, or just unzip the build on top of your installation. It won't overwrite any files you created
09:28:06RalpH_himselfso the plugins and the codecs are also rebuilt every day?
09:28:37amiconnRegarding this as well as the bookmark functionality, it's all described in our fine manual
09:29:04Dhraakellianquestion: does bookmarking only work when playing tracks from the filebrowser?
09:29:29RalpH_himselfamiconn: I still couldn't figure out the bookmark functionallity...
09:29:37amiconnYes they are. As long as there is no api change, older plugins and codecs will work, but then you'll miss bugfixes in them
09:30:05amiconnDhraakellian: yes
09:30:33RalpH_himselfamiconn: ok then i figured it out, i always use the database :-S
09:31:25DhraakellianI walked in here to ask a question, not knowing that bookmarks were already being discussed
09:35:43RalpH_himselfomg, I just connected my ipod to my mac, it's stuck in the rockbox usb mode, i just turned round the wheel and suddenly the music on the mac became quieter...
09:36:28Dhraakellianhmm... does that work with the e200(v1)?
09:36:50RalpH_himselfi guess that's apple-specific
09:37:23DhraakellianI sadly no longer have my e200, since it was handed down to my brother when I got my fuze rockboxed.
09:37:28RalpH_himselfand I can't do anything else with my rockpod right now, its not operational no more, but not yet mounted as a new volume
09:37:53Dhraakellianand I need to stop talking in here before my tiredness makes me veer offtopic
09:37:57amiconnNo it's not. Recent rockbox works like a mini multimedia keyboard on targets with software usb
09:37:58Dhraakelliangood night/morning
09:38:31RalpH_himselfI see there's still a lot to learn for me...
09:38:49Dhraakellianand it wouldn't work with the Fuze due to lack of USB support at all in the AMS Sansa ports
09:39:18amiconn(in parallel to mass storage mode)
09:41:02pixelmaRalpH_himself: which MacOS version are you running exactly?
09:41:38RalpH_himselfthese updates come earlier with every new major release...
09:43:31pixelmahuh, I had trouble with 10.4 and had to either boor into the original firmware or run a custom version without the USB HID functionality (which gives you the multimedia buttons). I thought everything was working with newer MacOS
09:46:25RalpH_himselfI never used the HID function, so I can't tell if it worked earlier, but I always had to reboot into the original bootloader (which is enough for usb mass storage), otherwise I never got the iPod to mount as an external drive. And see now, it works the first time ever: Usb hid from the rockbox usb-mode, and its mounted ^^
09:46:51RalpH_himselfI though had to reboot while connected to USB, it didn't work out from the beginning
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10:21:35RalpH_himselfright, it finally works. obviously not with the database :(
10:33:07***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
10:35:22AlexPBagder: I don't seem to be able to send a mail to the dev list: My fault?
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10:56:33pixelmaAlexP: isn't this the right domain name (thought it was something at haxx, not sure whether things changed there too)
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11:10:59rasherOh weird, I could've sworn you could use, but it seems that's not the case (or at least no one does)
11:11:31rasherAnyway, something needs to be fixed - all the subscribe/unsubscribe pages are gone ( used to work. If it doesn't work now, that's a config bug
11:19:01rasherPaging Zagor to the front desk
11:24:54moosrasher: hi, re the "language status page", I saw that the page should be updated, but take exemple of polish translation updated in r22654 and don't appearing? Is there a bug somewhere? Is it the case just for polish. Just a minor thing, but we miised the translation call mail thi time...
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11:27:24mooswe made the mistake to count only on it and you was surely busy. I confess that I take the habbit to see the mail from you. Mistake from us, anyone else take the initiative.
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11:29:24rashermoos: I'll look into it
11:30:07moosrasher: Thanks
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11:40:25rashermoos: fixed (svn checkout had been locked)
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11:42:24moosrasher: ah, ok
11:44:43CIA-43New commit by alle (r22781): Show the name of the setting in the WPS debug output
11:48:35pixelmarasher: did you see my question from this morning?
11:49:37rasherpixelma: yeah, there was discussion here.. hang on
11:52:36rasherpixelma: hm, doesn't seem to have been much. Well it was to make clear that these are files, and you will be looking at a file browser
11:52:49rasherpixelma: as opposed to the font browser, which is now special
11:52:54rasher(to the user)
11:55:19rasher but not much there
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12:02:04rasherWhy does LANG_SKIN_RAM_USAGE call it Skin, when everything else calls it theme?
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12:26:10fmlHello. What is the point in this line (skin_parser.c:1557): data->tokens[data->num_tokens++].type = WPS_NO_TOKEN; ?
12:26:43fmlIt obfuscates things in the case of an error (erroneous token is shown as 'No token' in the debug output)
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12:35:40Ackers_has s9 been rockboxed?
12:35:58funmanif it's not on the frontpage, no
12:39:49AlexPpixelma: I tried last night which didn't work (in a different way) and was told in community that it should be but it seems that isn't working either. I know they were moving the lists last night, so I suspect that is the issue
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13:40:51CIA-43New commit by rasher (r22782): Translation updates: ...
13:41:41CIA-43New commit by rasher (r22783): Backport r22782 (translation updates).
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16:40:26funmanwell the AMS guy didn't answer to my request for informations
16:40:34funmanwe'll have to live with it
16:42:17funmanthe AS3531 datasheet has no information on which SD controller is used
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17:17:15funmanif developers are interested into reading the AS3531 datasheet please contact me (and of course keep it private as it is confidential)
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17:50:58javacrisI have Q about h320 cfmod
17:51:33javacrisI have ata error -11... Anybody knows what it's mean?
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18:16:52Blue_DudePosted a dynamic range compressor prototype at FS #10612!
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19:25:42AlexPBagder: I don't seem to be able to send massages to the dev list, and the sign up pages don't work. Hangover from moving them?
19:25:49AlexPer, *messages :)
19:26:10Bagderyes, but the list should work... other lists are working at list
19:26:21Bagderthe plan is to fix the web ui for them tonight
19:26:43pixelmarasher: that makes a bit more sense now (the language change, sorry for late reply) but I wouldn't have guessed :\
19:26:53AlexPBagder: is it or
19:27:03Bagderthe first
19:27:21AlexPI'll try again - I tried last night but it may have been during the move
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19:27:40Bagderah yes, it was completely down for about two hours
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19:28:58AlexPOK, sent - we'll see :)
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19:29:24AlexPThere we go :)
19:29:40Bagderyeps, I noticed the new server passes through the mails faster
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19:33:51amiconnBagder: used to work before the move... I've been using that for years
19:34:44Bagderit still does afaik, but that's more of a coincidence than anything else
19:35:42Zagoramiconn: don't do that. that is not the right address.
19:38:13amiconnUh? I always thought this has been the primary address since we got the domain, and is kept for compatibility and because it reflects the actual host
19:39:00Bagderwhy would it be? that's not mentioned anywhere
19:39:21Zagoramiconn: you are the only one using it...
19:39:46BagderI can imagine a subdomain within for lists, to make it more explicit would make sense. but when we move we move completely.
19:40:09amiconnHmm, weird
19:40:10BagderI mean, like or so
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19:48:11bertrikAlexP, your proposal regarding the CREDITS file gets my vote too
19:49:00*evilnick agrees with bertrik (and by extension AlexP)
19:49:33AlexPrighto :)
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19:54:05jpt9Just noticed the Sansa Clip builds...
19:54:25jpt9I'm annoyed.... now I have to get a Clip :-)
19:54:25jpt9(Just kidding... great to see more platforms supported.)
19:59:00CIA-43New commit by learman (r22784): Update Swedish translation.
20:00:43*pixelma still needs an idea for a nice and short translation of "Skin RAM usage" since that is in the info screen, to German
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20:03:10linuxstbpixelma: Did anyone answer rasher's question from earlier about why that says "Skin", and everything else says "Theme" ?
20:03:46*Lear_ just used the Swedish word for "Theme", and nothing else.
20:03:48pixelmahaven't seen an answer
20:03:52AlexPIt should just say theme IMO
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20:04:32*linuxstb thinks so too, unless anyone can come up with a good argument
20:04:36CIA-43New commit by learman (r22785): Update Swedish translation.
20:04:43pixelmaI'll probably do that too (as "skin" doesn't have a better translation IMO when used in this sense)
20:05:43moos /me thought tha was just WPS RAM usage?
20:06:36pixelmaI guess it's meant to do more later on (and/or is e.g. font buffer already included)
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20:08:02moosok, didn't know that that was planed to make it sum total of all those theme related buffers
20:08:32*moos have to change it this way for french translation then
20:08:53pixelmawhat does the "limit" in the time stretch screen limit?
20:09:38pixelmamoos: that's just what I think, don't know for sure
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20:10:04moospixelma: we have to confirm with JdGordon or kugel
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20:11:22moosAlexP: like I already stated yesterday, +1 here about the credit thing
20:11:57AlexPmoos: Cool - I basically posted just in case there was a good reason for it that I couldn't think of
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20:12:38moosAlexP: but I guess that we still keep a manual credit file anyway, right?
20:12:49AlexPmoos: I don't see why
20:13:03AlexPmoos: I plan to get rid of it (that was the point of the mail) :)
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20:14:20moosok here too, just that rasher ponted a valid point yesterday, if we want to change the license of the manual in the futur for exemple...
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20:15:19AlexPBut we don't know who really wrote anything a
20:15:26AlexPer, bad delete
20:15:51AlexPWhat I meant is that there is always the commits - and plenty of people that have done stuff are not in the manual credits file
20:16:38moosyeah sure that svn history will be still there
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20:19:07JdGordonmoos: skin or theme makes no difference really
20:19:58AlexPJdGordon: Is there a reason it says skin and not theme there (like everywhere else) ?
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20:20:17pixelmait does for consistency
20:20:19moosJdGordon: ok thanks for info. In my mind WPS was part of theme, and "skin" was a reword of our WPS
20:20:24linuxstbJdGordon: Don't they mean different things? i.e. a theme consists of a number of skins, a font (hopefully fonts in the future), icons, colour choices, etc etc?
20:20:39AlexPpixelma: eh? (or did I miss sarcasm)
20:21:02JdGordonlinuxstb: well yes, but in the context of ram usage either would work
20:21:06pixelmaAlexP: that was at JdGordon
20:21:15AlexPah right
20:21:26pixelmamoos' question was also if it was only counting WPS RAM usage or more than that
20:21:29linuxstbJdGordon: So is that setting a setting for skins, or a setting for themes?
20:21:44JdGordonits not a setting at all yet
20:23:46JdGordonright now that info is *just* for the wps which is the only skin being used right now in a theme
20:24:48linuxstbNot the rwps?
20:24:56JdGordonthat also
20:24:58moosok, then like pixelma said. In a soon future this RAM use thing will count all theme things
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20:25:37JdGordonit will count all skin usages, but I dont tihnk users care about the difference
20:25:59JdGordonoutside of the code the word skin isnt used anywhere
20:26:17moosyeah we was thinking translations here
20:26:17JdGordonI guess I'm arguing for it to be changed... what does it display now?
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20:27:14linuxstbJdGordon: You committed it in the first place ;) It says "Skin RAM usage"...
20:27:27moosyou introduced that skin word, then don't count on us to tell you ;)
20:27:33mooshehe, too slow :)
20:27:46JdGordon1) I'm sick, 2) yeah, but I wouldnt trust anything I commit...
20:27:57mooshaha :D
20:28:06*linuxstb reverts all JdGordon's commits...
20:28:09AlexPSo, someone change it to Theme RAM usage :)
20:28:12JdGordonbut yeah, thinking about it thme would make more sense than skin
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20:28:39pixelmayes, with that typo ;P
20:28:53JdGordonlinuxstb: that would put us back into the stone age though.... back to #ifdef hell button handling, boring settings... :p
20:28:58rasherAlexP: Not yet!
20:29:13linuxstbJdGordon: Perfect ;)
20:29:18rasherNo lang changes until after the release, please
20:29:55rasherIt complicates things :\
20:30:05moosrasher: I thought to change this RAM usage item for french, a one line change
20:30:51rashermoos: change it in the translation only then - that'll be fine
20:30:52pixelmaeven if it is "Theme RAM Usage" it's hard to translate into German without writing stories (no difference here between skin and theme)
20:30:55rasherI should say
20:31:00JdGordonthat would be a bit odd... one french line in the base tranaltion!
20:31:02rasherNo english.lang changes until after the release
20:31:35rasherpixelma: Theme size maybe? (although somewhat inaccurate, it might be good enough)
20:31:39JdGordonpixelma: would buffer work better than RAM?
20:31:44rasherFor the translation, that is
20:32:41moospixelma: "buffer" ?
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20:32:59pixelmathat gives some inspiration, thanks. Still no "click" though
20:33:13moosthat's a theme buffer sort of
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20:33:50*moos understand the feeling (about the wrinting stories :)
20:34:54JdGordonjust leave it english
20:38:41pixelmaI still have a few hours for thinking about it ;)
20:39:50moosrasher: Yeah that what I will do. I will not touch english.lang if that's what you are afraid of
20:39:54Blue_DudeHey, could some of you fine folks look over FS #10612?
20:40:04moospixelma: good luck ;)
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20:40:57pixelmaI guess I go with translating "buffer"
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20:42:00moospixelma: that what I did in french
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20:44:15fmlJdGordon: hey! Have you seen this question?
20:44:51fmlTo see what I mean, try to use the %St tag with a dummy setting name
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20:50:46JdGordonfml: bah, no I hadnt
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21:04:25funmanbertrik: do you have / plan to get a Clipv2/Clip+/Fuzev2 ?
21:05:05funmanJdGordon|: had you looked at a recovery mode for Clip+ similar to e200v2 ?
21:05:30JdGordon|there is two solder joints which I tried connecting without much luck
21:05:47funmanwhat about disabling the NAND at boot ?
21:05:53AlexPBlue_Dude: re FS #10612 on H140 - MP3 81.15% realtime, Vorbis 66.4% realtime
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21:06:18AlexPBlue_Dude: Ah, didn't notice you had left
21:06:24AlexPBlue_Dude: re FS #10612 on H140 - MP3 81.15% realtime, Vorbis 66.4% realtime
21:06:39Blue_DudeYep. That's about right...
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21:06:48funmanJdGordon|: you have to connect 2 pins of the NAND, I'm looking for a picture
21:06:56funmanall the pins descriptions are given in the ONFI standard
21:08:46AlexPBlue_Dude: For reference, MP3 with it off is 442.73% realtime :)
21:09:52funmanhum it's not consistent with what I see in ONFI 2.0
21:10:06Blue_DudeWhat's it like with DSP speed test with compression off?
21:10:50funmanJdGordon|: with the mark on the top left corner, try connecting pins 18 & 19, with the top left pin being number 1, and bottom left pin being number 24
21:11:07JdGordon|eek! how?!
21:11:17funmanpin 19 is WP# (NOT write protect) and pin 18 is CLK or WE# (NOT write enable)
21:11:28funmanor knife, anything metallic
21:11:48funmanI had found the info on s1mp3 website, let me find it again
21:11:55JdGordon|how long do the need to be connected?
21:11:58AlexPBlue_Dude: With DSP off MP3 is 464.21%, with DSP but no compressor 442.73%, with compressor 81.15%
21:12:03funmanjust the time for the clip to boot
21:12:15AlexP(DSP for me is replaygain/treble/bass - no equaliser etc)
21:12:16JdGordon|what should happen? connect to usb?
21:12:40Blue_DudeTime to optimize I guess. :)
21:12:42funmanthey use other pins but with the same effect (I had tested both on clipv1)
21:12:48AlexPBlue_Dude: So it seems :)
21:13:01funmanJdGordon|: yes : put it off, connect the pins, plug to usb, wait 5 secodns and release pins
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21:13:46JdGordon|I'll need anaother pair of hands for that :(
21:13:51funmanyou might have to power off and repeat several times in a row
21:14:19funmanwell i would semi-plug the usb core on the clip and keep it ready to insert with one hand, which will also keep the clip stable
21:14:28funmanand use the screwdriver with the other hand
21:14:38amiconnAlexP: Treble/bass is hardware on H1x0
21:14:44funmanor use the same hand to keep stability and hold screwdriver, and the other one to plug usb
21:15:46AlexPamiconn: OK, cheers - just replaygain then
21:16:37Blue_DudeAnd replaygain isn't a process. It just sets the input gain. It's very fast. So a good comparison.
21:18:27 Part Blue_Dude
21:19:54JdGordon|funman: when 'm not full of flu tablets ill try it out... if you or someone wants me to send you then clip that cna be arranged also
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21:23:06funmani'll focus on clipv2 first :)
21:23:17funmanit'd be nice to know how clipv2 & clip+ are similar though
21:23:57BdN3504i need help repairing my sansa e200 v1. it's working fine software/firmware wise but the tactile hardware is messed up. the volume button has overtaken the function of the play button.
21:24:02 Quit Kumool ("WeeChat 0.3.0")
21:24:30BdN3504can this be fixed? got some experience with something similar on that target?
21:24:56JdGordon|funman: they are the same internally no? cliv2 is just missing the sd slot
21:26:22funmanwell i would like to know
21:26:27 Quit matsl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
21:26:46funmanBdN3504: try the hardware section in the forums
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21:54:39CIA-43New commit by pixelma (r22786): Update German translation.
22:03:34 Quit Grahack ("Leaving.")
22:06:02CIA-43New commit by pixelma (r22787): Update German translation in the release branch.
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22:11:59fmlpixelma: is the translation of "While playing screen" to German correct? Doesn't the option show THE wps?
22:14:12pixelmahow do you mean the question?
22:14:47fmlpixelma: I mean that the menu entry doesn't just allow to browse the files but shows the file currently in use
22:15:12 Quit merbanan (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
22:15:26fmlThat's why it now reads "while plaing screen" and not "Browse wps files"
22:15:28pixelmait shows the WPS file browser and was renamed in English since the change to highlight the current WPS (so it looks like a setting not a browser)
22:16:26pixelmawhich is why I left out "Zeige", you can discuss if the rest should be plural then
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22:16:58pixelmaor singular - or even better: maybe you have a better name for "WPS-Datei"
22:17:50JdGordon|fml: adding a if (!fail) before that line should fix your problem...
22:17:54fmlpixelma: yes, I think it should be singular since it's one option
22:19:26fmlJdGordon|: I think there is another problem there. If the parse function fails num_tokens is not incremented which is wrong IMO. But what is the sense of unconditionally adding a NO_TOKEN? Can't it lead to an overflow in a worst case?
22:20:29pixelmaI have to admit that I noticed that too now when looking at the diff through ViewVC... if you have an even better suggestion please let me know
22:20:39fmlJdGordon|: so there are two or three losely related (but very minor) problems in that code area. But I've never had a real problem there so I won't do anything! :-)
22:20:58JdGordon|fml: back in a few min, but no there hsould be no danger of overflow
22:21:37fmlpixelma: WPS-Layout? But it's not very German :-)
22:22:13funmannow that we know the clipv2/fuzev2 aren't as3531 based I'm not sure how to integrate them in the target tree
22:22:38pixelmaI somehow hoped to get rid of the "file" or something else addition, something for the pure "While Playing Screen" as it is done in English
22:23:17funmani would use as3525/ folder with a define, but we need a correct name : HAVE_AS3525+ ? HAVE_AS3525_V2 ?
22:23:28fmlpixelma: Actually, "WPS-Layout" very well describes what it's about
22:23:49fmlAnd it doesn't have "file" in it
22:24:13pixelmait doesn't explain WPS and still has an addition
22:24:17fmlNow we just have to explaint what WPS means :-)
22:25:45fmlpixelma: also, in "Fernbedienungs-Statusleiste", I'm not sure whether the "s" before the "-" is needed. It would be if it was one word, but with a "-"... I'm not sure.
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22:27:42fmlSuch problems can be avoided by reordering the words, e.g. "Statusleiste auf der Fernbedienung" or "Position der Bildlaufleisten"
22:27:56funmanwho are the devs owning a Clipv2/Fuzev2 except me and kugel ?
22:28:03pixelmado you have two displays?
22:28:03JdGordon|fml: it is added because the displayer handles the sblines badly... it dor for(i=start_idx, i<=end_idx,i++) instead of just <
22:28:14fmlI'm never 100% sure how to write such composites
22:28:16Zagorfunman: I have a clipv2
22:29:31 Quit merbzt (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:29:49pixelmawell if you have a remote you have... but then you need 10 seconds until that option scrolled by on that tiny screen (compared to 5 for the other way) ;)
22:29:50fmlJdGordon|: can't we change the semantics of the end_idx to be the "index of the next..."? The we could use "<" and all would be fine
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22:30:24saratogafunman: are you aware we seem to have copied the Sandisk pitch bug when we copied the sandisk clock settings?
22:30:54JdGordon|we could... it just hasnt been done
22:30:58fmlpixelma: he-he
22:30:59funmanZagor: are you interested into reverse engineering the SD driver ?
22:31:08funmansaratoga: no.. which settings did we copy exactly ?
22:31:17JdGordon|although that last token should always be th END_CONDITONAL token anyway
22:31:18Zagorfunman: the result? yes. the work? not so much :-)
22:31:32funmanokok :)
22:31:43fmlJdGordon|: "we" −− maybe, but not me. That delivers the solution of the equation: "you" :-)))
22:31:50shotofaddsJdGordon|: did album art always get drawn over top of the "touch buttons" (eg. in the mrobe500 cabbiev2) or is that a new bug?
22:32:00JdGordon|no idea
22:32:10JdGordon|possibly new
22:32:17JdGordon|probably new
22:32:23saratogafunman: the PLL settings don't evenly divide into 44100 Hz, so the actual sample rate is something like 43500Hz
22:32:30 Quit fml ("CGI:IRC 0.5.9 (2006/06/06)")
22:32:45saratogathe datasheet recommends running the PLL higher and using larger dividers so that you can hit 44100 exactly
22:33:02shotofaddsJdGordon|: any idea how I might fix it? I know practically nothing about the WPS drawing code :/
22:33:26***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
22:34:06JdGordon|ill try to have a look later today if i get a chance... its probbaly a quick fix
22:34:16JdGordon|s/probably/hopefully/ :)
22:34:26funman43.5kHz seems a lot
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22:41:23saratogafunman: the 3525 sheet recommends on page 112 (fig 43) a 384MHz PLL, we use 248MHz
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22:43:05saratogahuh theres code for doing 384 in SVN
22:43:07*kugel dislikes most of the german translation
22:43:08saratogai wonder why it wasn't used
22:43:37pixelmakugel: critizising is easy
22:43:40funmansaratoga: don't remember
22:43:52kugelpixelma: do you prefer connecting substantives with a dash, or did you just do it?
22:43:59funmanah yes: fastest boosted fclk (248MHz, < 250MHz)
22:44:31kugelI personally find it ugly, and would use Bildlaufleistenposition (maybe even "Position der Bildlaufleiste")
22:46:07kugelsaratoga: FlynDice made some profiles
22:46:33saratogaso we'd have to run the CPU clock async to the PLL
22:46:35pixelmakugel: I did it to be consistent with what we have, I don't actually like the look of it but it's not wrong. The composite is better than sentence style because it's shorter
22:46:47saratogawas that slower?
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22:47:11JdGordon|kugel: broken space bar? or is gernam really that awesome? :)
22:47:28funmansaratoga: i find 44034Hz with the current settings
22:47:32pixelmaJdGordon|: the latter
22:47:33kugelwhat are you refering too?
22:48:10funmansaratoga: with 384MHz PLL we'd have 64MHz pclk and 240MHz fclk iirc
22:48:18kugelBildlaufleiste = scrollbar, where's the "broken" in that?
22:48:22saratogafunman: hmm let me double check thats not what I got before
22:48:33ZagorJdGordon|: swedish is like that too. you just string the words together.
22:48:33funmanwith fclk = 5/8 plla
22:48:52kugelpixelma: I prefer easy to read and understand over short. Anyway, could we possibly change all strings to avoid the dash separator? I really hate that one
22:49:01pixelmaJdGordon|: you combine words completely, unfortunately many start to take those apart like it's done in English and that is plain wrong (though modern)
22:49:28funmanvery acceptable (the lower fclk is compensated by higher pclk i think - needs to be verified -, and worth if we get more precise audio clock)
22:49:47*kugel also wouldn't have translated skin, since it actually refers to an internal rockbox term
22:50:18Zagorusers don't care about internal terms
22:50:23kugelbut I'll stop complain now :) better than doing it myself :p
22:50:31pixelmakugel: if you want to have Fernbedienungsbildlaufleiste in one word... also I won't do that now
22:50:56kugelZagor: that's why I didn't touch it. I'm not very good at predicting what the user cares about
22:51:50saratogafunman: ok i'll try to measure it when i get a chance
22:52:07pixelmakugel: if you read logs, the "Skin" there is a strong candidate to be changed anyways...
22:52:22*kugel seems to have missed it
22:52:45funmansaratoga: i did: div = (PLLA+(44100/2))/44100; and freq = PLLA/div/128
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22:52:50AlexPIt seems pretty certsin it will be changed
22:53:34kugelskin is definitely something different as a skin. if skin is to become theme, we need to change the theme term
22:54:03kugelI don't see what's wrong with skin. It's nice and short, and used internally only anyway
22:54:11AlexPIt isn't though
22:54:16pixelmaa what? Can you explain the difference between skin and theme?
22:54:17AlexPIt is in the debug menu
22:54:32pixelmathought it was the Info screen
22:54:32AlexPTo me a skin is one of the screens - wps, rec, fm, etc
22:54:38saratogabah i have matlab right here i'll just measure it exactly
22:54:38AlexPpixelma: sorry, yes
22:54:44kugelAlexP: that's the only place. hardly a reason to change this nice and short term in a dozens of files
22:54:46AlexPtheme is the whole lot
22:54:53AlexPkugel: Nobody said that
22:55:01AlexPkugel: It is just the phrase in the lang
22:55:11kugeloh alright
22:55:14funmansaratoga: look at pcm_dma_apply_settings() in pcm-as3525.c
22:55:52kugelAlexP: the custom statusbar can show in many screens
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22:56:16AlexPkugel: so that is another skin
22:56:30AlexPi.e. there is a skin for the wps, a skin for the statusbar, a skin for fm etc
22:56:33kugelyes, I was refering to "To me a skin is one of the screens - wps, rec, fm, etc"
22:56:38AlexPA theme is the collection of those
22:56:57AlexPanyway, the only thing that has been said here is to change the item in the UI
22:57:02BdN3504would it be possible to run rockbox without the play button on the e200?
22:57:04kugelit is indeed just another skin, but it's not bound to a screen
22:57:19BdN3504which files would i have to edit in the source?
22:58:19AlexPkugel: Sorry, I wasn't being that pedantic - those were just examples
22:58:20kugelan easy way would to swap REC and PLAY if you're not using REC anyway (it'll just be a two liner)
22:59:07AlexPthat's a good plan
22:59:54kugelpixelma: a skin is a file that uses our markup language to interact with the skinning engine. A theme may consist of many themes, a skin may run with many themes. A theme also has other settings. A theme is really "the whole lot" as it has been said
23:00:20BdN3504AlexP: so i simply delete all instances of "BUTTON_UP"?
23:00:44AlexPBdN3504: Surely you want to change the functions normally done by play to other buttons, not just remove them?
23:00:46BdN3504kugel: oh that's a good idea
23:00:56kugeltake a look at firmware/target/arm/sandisk/sansa-e200/button-target.h
23:00:59AlexPIf you don't use rec, follow kugel's suggestion
23:00:59pixelmayes, and what usage is shown there then (once "complete")?
23:01:37kugelhm no
23:02:08kugelactually, button-e200.c. swap the lines that look like "btn |= BUTTON_REC" and "btn |= BUTTON_UP"
23:02:43BdN3504but i don't want button up to be assigned to anything because that button is broken
23:03:18AlexPit doesn't matter
23:03:21kugelif it's broken it can't do anything?
23:03:35AlexPIt'll just "do" what rec once did
23:03:46AlexPi.e. you'll lose the functions on rec
23:03:49BdN3504it works too much, it responds if i only touch it slightly and repeats the action
23:03:54 Quit HellDragon (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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23:04:18BdN3504i never record, so i can live without that. are there other functions rec is assigned to?
23:04:32funmansome plugins use it i think
23:04:33kugelthen change "#define BUTTON_UP 0x00....." to "#define BUTTON_UP 0". That'll get you the button ignored compeltely
23:04:47BdN3504cool, thank you
23:04:47kugelthat change would be in button-target.h
23:04:51AlexPyou probably still want to swap them
23:04:59kugelyea, both changes are needed
23:05:04AlexPAs otherwise you won't be able to do anything that was on play
23:08:40 Quit stoffel (Remote closed the connection)
23:09:28 Quit evilnick (Ping timeout: 180 seconds)
23:09:33funmanthe Clipv1 and v2 OF API for SD access is very similar (high level functions pointers are stored in the same order)
23:11:32saratogafunman: I measure 43,791 Hz
23:12:07saratogaor 0.993 of the target value
23:12:37funmansaratoga: measure = with a DMM ?
23:12:46saratogafunman: PC sound card
23:13:14funmanclock-target.h should make it easy to make several tests
23:13:54saratogathis is consistent with the claimed values for the Sandisk pitch bug
23:15:20funmando you remember in which OF the bug was present/added/fixed? we could compare what they changed
23:15:30BdN3504kugel: AlexP: could you confirm that this is correct?
23:15:42saratogafunman: hmm i 'm wrong i think
23:15:58kugelBdN3504: that's not what I told you to do
23:15:58saratogai get that we're 0.7% higher, not 0.7% slower
23:16:07saratogaIIRC the sandisk firmware undershot
23:16:18kugeljust changing the keymap file won't fix plugins for you
23:16:21saratogafunman: as far as I know they all still have it
23:16:34saratogasupposedly the fuze is getting it fixed in the next release though
23:17:28BdN3504kugel: what do you mean? i changed keymap and button target
23:17:42kugel"actually, button-e200.c. swap the lines that look like "btn |= BUTTON_REC" and "btn |= BUTTON_UP""
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23:19:53funmansaratoga: are you still working on fs 10605 ?
23:20:06 Quit linuxstb (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
23:20:13funmani'm not sure what is needed now, I've been using this patch ok for some days
23:20:22saratogafunman: i am
23:20:27saratogadid it make much difference for you?
23:20:35 Quit Lear_ ("ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox 3.5.3/20090824101458]")
23:20:43funmanno crash at all
23:20:50saratogahow odd
23:21:03funmanwhy? isn't that the intention?
23:21:12saratogai dismissed the second change in that patch (the bounds checking) as ineffective when I tested on the sim
23:21:17saratogasince i still got deadlocks
23:21:24saratogabut i didn't try on the clip . . .
23:21:32funmani only used the first patch
23:21:42BdN3504kugel: is this correct now?
23:21:50funmanwhich is only effective on clip/m200v4/c200v2
23:21:58saratogaoh ok
23:22:02saratogayeah thats what i've been testing
23:22:12saratogaall the deadlocks I got on the sim were from that bug
23:22:15kugelyea, but dont change the keymap file
23:22:26saratogabut that condition should only ever happen on track change, and I often see clip crashes mid track
23:22:30BdN3504ok, thank you!
23:22:32 Quit robin0800 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:22:40funmanyes that did happen
23:22:40saratogaclip deadlocks rather
23:22:59saratogaor if the clip is trying to load a codec mid track that could be a good part of the reason it dies :)
23:23:53 Quit BdN3504 ("CGI:IRC")
23:23:54funmanwhy would such a thing happen? the pcm buffer of the clip is quite small
23:24:08saratogafunman: regarding the first patch, I think buffering codecs on the clip makes little sense so I am ok with that, however its not really a proper solution since 1) its still buffering the codec when it shouldn't be and 2) it shouldn't crash
23:24:08 Quit stripwax ("")
23:24:09 Join roolku [0] (
23:24:51saratogafunman: if you are bored you could try putting a single logf next to the code in that patch and see if you ever get output on your clip while listening
23:25:03saratogait would be intersting to see if its actually reloading the codec mid track
23:25:17saratogai did notice on the sim that if often reloaded the codec on track change even when it didn't need to
23:25:32saratogait should only load a codec from the disk on codec change
23:25:49roolkuZagor: I have put my buildclients online again, but it doesn't seem to make a difference - in fact times have gone up (if one can judge from 2builds)
23:26:03saratogaeven more puzzelingly, when I switched back and forth between WMA, MP3 and AAC rapidly, I could do it 100 times without getting a crash, even though it'd reload the codec file everytime
23:26:21kugelit shouldn't buffer the codec at all in a mp3 only playlist
23:26:31saratogaone would think!
23:26:32roolkuZagor: there are also still builds with truncated log (i.e.
23:27:25funmansaratoga: problem is i'm not bored :)
23:27:31saratogayeah me neither
23:28:00funmananyway it's nice to see things go forward on sansa ams
23:28:19 Quit petur ("Zzzzz")
23:29:18saratogawell we could put a test build for the patch and see what people say
23:29:30saratogai've often observed long periods without a crash on my clip just by chance
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23:34:10funmanwe could do m200v4 in the same process
23:34:26funmantogether with bootloaders?
23:35:16CIA-43New commit by kugel (r22788): Few website/target updates. ...
23:35:26 Quit KylePolansky ()
23:35:28saratogai have no objection
23:35:28kugelyh925 unstable \o/
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23:35:41kugelit just needs a site update from zagor now
23:36:49funmankugel: what about yh820/yh920 ?
23:38:00kugelare they ready?
23:38:06kugelI can't tell
23:38:26funmani don't believe there is a difference with yh925
23:38:27saratogai think so
23:38:38saratogado they install with rbutil in the current release?
23:38:47 Join T44 [0] (
23:38:50kugelone of them didn't even have sound a while ago :)
23:39:01funmani'll build rbutil & see
23:39:12kugeljust download it
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23:39:45funmanwho has a yh820 except lowlight?
23:40:02saratogano rbutil support
23:40:33saratogathe AMS are the only supported devices with rbutil support
23:40:44kugelthose don't even work
23:40:52kugelit looks for the wrong .zip
23:40:55Zagorkugel: updated
23:41:25funmani don't see samsung in rbutilqt
23:41:50kugelZagor: what's needed to change the produced zip to and (more consistent with older sansas + rbutil looks for that filename)
23:41:54kugelthanks for updating
23:42:09 Quit Utchybann ("I like core dumps")
23:42:31rasherWe really need a canonical list of target names, so we can beat everything into submission
23:42:40 Quit esperegu (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
23:42:54kugelZagor: what's wrong wiht the images on the current build page? the samsung is just gone now, ondio sp image is missing since a while already
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23:43:33rasherkugel: works for me
23:43:33Zagorkugel: looks fine for me
23:43:33funmanI don't see Onda either
23:44:18kugelctrl+- (zoom) made them show
23:44:28Zagorfunman: onda isn't in the list
23:44:30kugelstill there after zooming back
23:44:51*kugel blames bugged ff 3.5
23:45:21 Join robin0800 [0] (
23:45:25funmanZagor: [ondavx747] has a brand=Onda entry in rbutil.ini
23:45:59funmanoh they have status=disabled
23:47:21funmanbootloader not found for yh920
23:47:24 Quit bfr (Client Quit)
23:47:39 Quit DarkDefender ("Leaving")
23:47:41funman404 for current build as well
23:49:29 Quit Strife89 (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
23:49:59kugelhm, it's already
23:52:00funmankugel: isn't the bootloadername incorrect for yh925 (in rbutil.ini) : should be /samsung/yh925/bla ?
23:52:06funman(same for yh*)
23:52:27Zagorkugel: yes that changed when the builds file changed
23:52:57kugelfunman: yes
23:53:07kugelwhat's in rbutil.ini?
23:53:24kugelyea that's wrong
23:53:35funmani'll look at it tomorrow, together with bootloader for yh*20
23:53:38kugelarg, no rbutil :(
23:54:17 Join bfr [0] (i=6389c8fa@gateway/web/freenode/x-luleivzmhkdabwoz)
23:55:08bfrHello, I got an error that said bootloader mismatch. aborting.
23:55:08kugelrbutil was released yesterday, it probably won't change for the next week
23:55:34funmanbfr: on which target?
23:55:52funmanoh and yh920 needs greylib
23:55:59bfrcomplete installation?
23:56:08funmanbfr: which audio player ?
23:56:29bfrSansa E280
23:56:30 Quit Topy44 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:57:21saratogafunman: I'm wrong again
23:57:38saratogai redid it correctly this time (i had flipped the sandisk and RB wavs)
23:57:45saratogawe are 0.9985 of the correct sampling rate
23:57:54 Quit roolku ()
23:58:24funmanbfr: OS ?

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