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#rockbox log for 2009-11-12

00:00:15liarTheSeven: <= this is fully working for me and __grant
00:00:36bluebroth3rmc2739: thanks, missed that :o
00:00:47TheSevenliar: this is a hack.
00:01:13TheSevenand you're still both having that usb problem, aren't you?
00:01:27TheSevensomething is wrong with your ipods... :-P
00:01:29liarTheSeven: yep, but i dont think its because of the nand
00:01:54TheSevenbut it's weird that either none or both of those bugs appear on a given device
00:02:16TheSevenwe should find the root cause...
00:02:43liarif you read it: "not the best solution"
00:03:19liarTheSeven: i have a different ipod with the usb problem but not the nand problem
00:04:08*TheSeven feels like digging up the usb problem first to possibly find something triggering this
00:04:23TheSevenit is like your ipod would have some clocking issues or similar
00:04:55 Part adiroiban
00:05:05TheSevenboth of these things seem to be caused by some timing constraint
00:05:17TheSeventhe processor is too slow for the usb and too fast for the nand :-)
00:05:35mc2739bluebroth3r: no problem
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00:18:49CIA-5New commit by rob (r23616): D2: Add a key combination (PLUS+MENU) to go to the WPS while in menus.
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00:23:09 Quit ender` (" The reward for work well-done is more work.")
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00:26:10durandhi, I have rockbox on my sansa fuze and I was wondering whether it interfered with the forced MSC procedure because it doesn't seem to be working at all.
00:26:59 Nick durand is now known as durand1 (
00:28:23 Quit B4gder ("It is time to say moo")
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00:37:02CIA-5New commit by mc2739 (r23617): Fix missing space caused by incorrect usage of the \dap macro (FS #10773 by Diego Herranz).
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01:07:28JoboIs there someone here who could help me with a sansa e280?
01:07:28 Quit The (Client Quit)
01:07:50TheSunGodhi all
01:08:19TheSunGodhi all
01:09:06TheSunGodid just like to say that you guys are doing a great job
01:09:29TheSunGodim using rockbox on my sansa fuze and its amazing!
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01:10:09Jobocan someone help me with my sansa e280??
01:10:15 Nick pixelma_ is now known as pixelma (i=quassel@rockbox/staff/pixelma)
01:10:15 Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (i=quassel@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
01:10:18TheSunGodi wish i could help with the developement but i dont know how to program. eventually im gonna start learning c++ though
01:10:47JoboI tried to format it and now its stuck... I can boot back the old sansa firmware but its in another language and I cannot read it
01:11:02TheSunGodwell keep up the good work
01:12:21JdGordon|dont bother learning c++
01:12:28JdGordon|c# or java, and c
01:12:55TheSunGodwhy not?
01:13:28***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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01:29:23 Join benedikt [0] (
01:29:55benedikti have rockbox on an ipod nano. There is something blinking in the right upper corner and looks like a lightning bolt. What is is it?
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01:30:32JdGordon|disk access
01:31:05 Join GodEater [0] (
01:32:01benediktok.. Im having some problems to. I loaded a few .ogg songs today, everything worked fine. Then I accidently booted the ipod firmware and since then the .ogg songs dont show up. I tried rm-ing them and them cp-ing them back again, but the dont show up i rockbox, only their parent dirs.
01:32:51TheSevenbenedikt: you're talking about a first- or second-gen ipod nano?
01:32:59benediktFirst one
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01:33:38TheSevenhave a look at the quickscreen, what's the "show files" setting?
01:33:42TheSeven"all files" or "supported"?
01:33:49TheSeventry all files and see if they show up
01:34:17TheSevenif yes, I guess something's screwed with your codecs or rather the association of file name extensions to codecs...
01:34:45benediktTheSeven: i always accidently get that up when i try to shut it off. And now i cant work out how to bring it up.
01:35:09TheSevenif it is the same keymap as on the 2g, it's holding center for about a second
01:35:34benediktholding menu
01:35:49benediktshow files was set to meny
01:35:54TheSevenah, right, of course
01:36:05benediktand it was set to "playlists"
01:36:14TheSevenok, that may explain the problem then
01:36:14benedikti must have accidently done that trying to shut it off
01:36:34benediktyes it did. classic pebcak
01:36:39*TheSeven wonders why he start to mix up ipod buttons...
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01:39:21benediktThe_Seven: just noticed you were a developer. Good work !
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01:51:19Jobowhat does it mean if it says unable to extract file when installing?
01:53:24Jobounable to create or open file?
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02:59:40UnhelpfulTorne, kugel: thanks, using ldr lr, =_vectorstart seems to get beaft building. :)
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03:01:04Unhelpfulour old toolchain or the old abi must be more lax about the same-section requirement for adr. would be nice if there were an option to do things that way, surely there should be some way to get the assemble to assume that the programmer knows what they're doing, and then just generate an error at link if the address is out-of-range.
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03:13:30***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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03:36:30 Join boby [0] (
03:36:42bobyim an idiot im a idiot!!!
03:36:51bobyanyone can help me please??
03:37:15 Join StealthyXIIGer [0] (
03:38:24bobyi instaled rb a month ago at my friend house cause my computer is an piece of crap it cannot instal or unistall rb
03:39:04bobynow i tried to remove it by an manual way (i found it myself =/) by delete all rb things manualy
03:39:43bobywhats happened when i start it boot loader started and now i got any file to boot it and it stuck with that
03:39:51bobywhat can i do?? please!
03:40:09bobyit's an ipod 30gb 5gen
03:44:57bobyi try to reboot my ipod cuz it crashed and... it start with my crashed rb software ='(
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03:50:19bobyis there anybody can help me!!!????
03:50:31TheSevenboby: you will probably just want to restore it using itunes...
03:50:43bobyno here is the problem
03:51:04bobynow rockbox booting system is always on then itunes don't see my ipod!
03:51:34bobyit say hold select and play to turn on disk mode i did it a lot of times
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03:51:39bobynothing happened
03:51:40TheSeventhen use the usual way to recover things not seen by itunes, as documented by apple
03:52:04bobyits totaly my comp don't see it!
03:52:17bobyim lucky to have 2 ipod's =D
03:52:30bobybut then i will discharge it and retry it
03:52:33TheSevenif you do that right, your computer *will* see it
03:53:17TheSevendischarging it won't help at all, this may only worsen the situation, as it may not start at all if the battery is empty
03:54:02bobyohh thanks you a lot guy
03:54:05bobyi lovee you!
03:54:13bobyit's work
03:55:18bobynow i can use itunes to reset it =D
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04:04:09bobythen i repeat it thanks a lot your my god!!!
04:04:19bobynow it works
04:04:21bobysee ya
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04:08:23Unhelpfulkrazykit: here are those gigabeat f test builds: the eabi build already includes codecs built with -O, the two codecs tarballs can be unpacked over it to test codecs built with -O2 and -O3. my experience testing on e200 was that -O2 is almost always the fastest.
04:10:11krazykitso what all am i reporting to you?
04:10:28 Quit fdinel ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
04:11:41Unhelpfulif you have time, test_codec output for the testfiles with the svn build, and with the eabi build, and with each of the O2 and O3 codec sets installed over the eabi build. and obviously whether or not you can even run the eabi build, and whether it crashes when you try to run test_codecs. ;)
04:12:40krazykitit's been ages since i've run test_codec. does it dump a log file or does it simply report back the info?
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04:19:13Unhelpfulit dumps a log file, and it even numbers them sequentially. easiest way to bench all testfiles is to put them in a directory together, open one "with" test_codec, and select "speed test folder"
04:19:44krazykitconvenient that i put them all in one directory together then :)
04:19:54Unhelpfulif you run do the installs + runs with svn first, then eabi, then eabi+O2, then eabi+O3, that should make it easy to keep track of which logfile is which
04:20:01Unhelpfulhopefully it doesn't blow up on eabi :/
04:20:37 Join BigBox [0] (
04:20:38krazykithopefully it doesn't trash the filesystem
04:21:13Unhelpfulis that a *problem* often on beaft?
04:21:38BigBoxHi, is there some way to view html files using rockbox? (the offline version of wikipedia in fact)
04:22:05krazykitwell, i'd have to open it up and do the recovery, which is inconvenient for me :P
04:23:23Unhelpfuli mean, is that something that happens pretty easily? i'd expect your best chances at failure are likely to be 1) it won't boot 2) it will boot, but crashes on one of the codecs - these are cases kugel and i have seen on e200 and fuze.
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04:25:11BigBoxi used to crash my sansa r250 trying to psh rockbox to read a video file
04:25:33BigBoxit was a hell to put the original firmware haha
04:27:53BigBoxkrazykit: what is happening with your player? ( i missed this part of the subject)
04:28:32Unhelpfulnothing's happening with it, he's testing some builds for it with a new cross-compiler
04:29:12krazykitno, it shouldn't do anything damaging unless something is really screwed up
04:33:31Unhelpful*BOOM* :)
04:34:42krazykitit's working on APE now, so it'll take a few more minutes before i get to eabi :)
04:35:24Unhelpfula few. it should go a bit faster than on e200, at least
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05:07:21krazykitwell, the eabi build booted, at least. now to run test_codec for that
05:12:03saratogaif you're lazy, just one test file per codec and not all the bitrates is fine
05:13:34***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
05:13:46krazykitit's not like it takes much effort to run test_codec :)
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05:14:24saratogatrue, and the gigabeat will be quite alot faster . . .
05:17:37JdGordonanyone know how long a ipod vid takes to charge enough to be usable over usb?
05:17:49JdGordonits connected with "very low battery" on the display...
05:19:54saratogaif a lipoly battery is discharged below whatever the danger threshold is (3.3-3v on most systems I think), most charges trickle charge at a few mA worth until it gets back up to decrease the risk of it exploding
05:20:22saratogathough i don't know what the apple firmware considers "very low"
05:20:33JdGordonbah... and how oten would they actually explode?!
05:21:06saratogai don't know about explode but they can be destroyed by discharging too deep apparently
05:21:10*JdGordon really wanted to commit this patch tonight
05:21:18saratogaat least thats what spec sheets say, i've never tried it
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05:24:43CIA-5New commit by blue_dude (r23618): pcmbuf: consolidated some crossfade code
05:27:26JdGordonanyone have a "4G,5G,color,Nano 1G" and a dock of some sort to test 10494 on?
05:29:29LloreanIsn't the latest patch there for an FM remote?
05:29:51JdGordonmaybe im wishfully tihnking that it ads more dock support?
05:30:58LloreanI don't have a dock anyway. =/
05:31:04krazykitoh, hello eabi panic. *PANIC* \ Updating size on empty dir entry 27(weird dotted square) after unplugging it from usb
05:31:36CIA-5New commit by blue_dude (r23619): Added crossfade tag to lang file strings
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05:35:48JdGordonblue_dude: you need to be more careful to not break voice files....
05:36:12JdGordonthat will break old .lang files also
05:38:59 Join Blue_Dude [0] (n=chatzill@rockbox/developer/Blue-Dude)
05:39:23Blue_DudeThat was weird. Is Recorder -8 MB a swcodec target?
05:40:36Blue_DudeYeah, we discussed the voice file problem this afternoon. The consensus was that since it would only break old voice files for three unstable targets, go ahead and do it.
05:41:52saratogaRecorded 8MB is HWCODEC
05:42:38Blue_DudeThen something is wrong with the Recorder 8MB config file. It thinks it has crossfade.
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05:43:30Blue_Dudeswcodec is required for crossfade, and it's only when I made the crossfade tag for the lang files that it showed up...
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05:53:13Blue_DudeIs Recorderv2 the only hwcodec target with memory > 2?
05:55:52saratogaBlue_Dude: IIRC its a mod of the v2 to have more memory
05:56:56Blue_DudeThat explains the problem. Currently all targets with memory > 2 HAVE_CROSSFADE. That should be reserved for swcodec targets. I'll fix it...
05:58:13saratogaBlue_Dude: maybe this should be in config files?
05:58:32Blue_DudeThe problem is in config.h, so yeah.
05:59:02saratogai was thinking the individual config files, but i suppose any target with more then 2MB of RAM and SWCODEC is likely to define it anyway
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06:02:45Blue_DudeIt's already in config.h as any target with memorysize > 2. I put it later in the file so that the define only applies to swcodec targets.
06:04:24CIA-5New commit by blue_dude (r23620): Fix HAVE_CROSSFADE definition in config to apply only to swcodec targets
06:05:19Blue_DudeThat ought to save some memory on recorder v2.
06:05:42Blue_DudeAnd fix its manual, etc.
06:06:49BigBoxHi, has there been any plugin done to browse an offline website with rockbox? (html mostly text & links into diferant subpages)
06:07:27BigBoxthought so -_-
06:07:46BigBoxyet i know i could use the textreader plugin - but that doesnt solve linkage
06:13:49BigBoxthere are topics talking wikipedia+sansae200 ... Thats pretty close to what i want to achieve
06:14:22Blue_DudeGreen. Going to bed!
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06:21:13krazykittest_codec has done this twice now, on svn and on the eabi build. it runs through all the files, shows a blank screen, then starts running through them all again. it fails to write anything into test_codec_log_01 but 02 has the information
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06:24:07krazykitand i'm running test_codec with "speed test folder" with the test files all in one directory
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07:02:52JdGordonif you do a patch where its adding a new file, and the file exists already... does it copy the new text onto the beggingin or end of the file?
07:05:24saratogakrazykit: so any results?
07:05:24Unhelpfuli *think* it should fail on apply?
07:06:02krazykitjust finished -02
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07:07:13krazykitagain, log_01 is a blank file and the second run actually wrote into a file
07:07:15Unhelpfulkrazykit: i've had funny stuff happen if i touch buttons during test_codec run. i think it's getting queued button events when it finishes the codec run... if don't touch buttons until it's done the problem seems to go away, obviously you'll need first press activates backlight only or backlight on while plugged in to be able to tell when it's finished :/
07:07:34Unhelpfulor use a "safe" button to wake it up, one of the scrolling buttons maybe.
07:08:07saratogakrazykit: i've never seen that happen after doing about a thousand test codec runs on my sansa
07:08:19saratogaso maybe its a gigabeat issue
07:08:55saratogakrazykit: do you have results for current svn?
07:08:55krazykitwell, it's happened three times now, and i've only been hitting the volume buttons. i'll enable first press activates backlight and see if that helps
07:09:01krazykityeah, lemme upload them
07:09:19Unhelpfulsaratoga: i have... if you press select to light it up again, it can start over. i suspend the empty file might be due to some issue with regard to running more than one benchmark per test_
07:09:29Unhelpfulper test_codec session. grr.
07:10:51saratogathe last gigabeat f results are from summer 2007
07:10:56krazykit has the log files, named in the same manner as Unhelpful's builds
07:11:38*Unhelpful isn't expecting anything magical to happen with regard to codec performance on gigabeat f, since it didn't on e200... and it also doesn't get a huge binsize cut from eabi like e200.
07:11:42saratogakrazykit: the svn link is bad
07:11:54krazykitoh, permissions issues
07:12:42krazykitall fixed
07:13:36***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
07:13:59saratogaheh all my work and WMA is just 20% faster on the gigabeat
07:14:08saratogait seems quite resistant to optimizations
07:14:55Unhelpfulhrm, i'm surprised to see so many good codec scores at -O for beaft.
07:15:53Unhelpfulthe lossless codecs seem to do the same funny thing they do on e200 - -O is slower than svn with 4.0.3, -O2 is faster. on e200 almost every codec does this, though... :/
07:16:38krazykiti'll let you know when -03 finishes
07:17:43saratogaUnhelpful: AAC seems a lot faster
07:17:59saratogaHE by 8 MHz(!)
07:19:03saratogamp3 got a bit faster too
07:19:14saratoganew gcc seems to work fairly well on the gigabeat
07:19:18Unhelpfulsaratoga: does aac have any -O tuning for svn at present?
07:19:34saratogaUnhelpful: I don't think so
07:19:43saratogabut it didn't seem to make a difference when I checked IIRC
07:20:12saratogafor 4.0.3
07:20:24Unhelpful-O2 seems to be generally a bit better on 4.4.1-eabi than 4.0.3
07:20:39saratogaalthough most of the improvement in AAC is probably just because its so poorly optimized
07:20:45saratogaand that can yet be fixed
07:20:52Unhelpful-O3, how can i put it nicely, pessimizes most of our codecs :/
07:21:36saratogaUnhelpful: also for what its worth, all the mdct codecs just use -O now I think for hte mdctlib
07:22:26saratogaand mdct is typically about 50% of run time, although its got a lot of ASM so its probably not too sensitive to O2
07:23:18saratogai want a GSOC student who just does codec clean up work, we'd have enough for a dozen of them
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07:42:33krazykitah, that's nice. enabling first press activates backlight let it write out the file on the first try.
07:44:47krazykit is up now :)
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07:54:49Unhelpfulabout as expected, although there are a few small improvements with -O3, it's mostly not worth it. aache needs .7MHz less, but i believe that's the same codec as other aac?
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08:27:28JetsetlemmingCould somebody help me? My Sansa e200 Rockbox install has stopped working, I don't know why. It freezes when I try to turn it on, use the default firmware mode, or plug it into the computer.
08:30:27Unhelpfulfreezing on starting the OF, unless you've recently been messing with the bootloader, suggests something seriously wrong
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08:31:17JetsetlemmingI haven't done anything config wise, or update-wise, in a while. Just listened to music with it and used it was a microsd reader.
08:32:07JetsetlemmingIt was working just a short while earlier today, but I put it on my desk, went to make dinner, and when I came back it wouldn't boot, even when plugging it in or holding the left button
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09:25:30Unhelpfulurgh, i put my e200 benchmarks into a spreadsheet and set up conditional formats to highlight the best time for eabi with bold type, and make it red if it's still worse than oldabi. the results are not exactly what i'd like :/
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10:23:15Unhelpfulkugel: did you ever check to see if the offset issue that caused the codec problems on e200 might be the cause of your fuze boot failure on eabi? in the codecs *sometimes* the iram section load address didn't actually equal iramcopy. this didn't happen when i built for fuze, but maybe it happened when you built it, our toolchains aren't *exactly* the same...
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10:28:34kugelUnhelpful: nope
10:29:30Unhelpfuli'd really like to see it working on fuze, now that it's working with codecs on e200 and gb-f :/
10:30:14kugeldid you solve the update problem?
10:30:26kugelbtw, I used your patch to build my current version of the toolchain
10:31:45Unhelpfulupdate problem? :/
10:36:13kugelUnhelpful: I meant offset problem, sorry
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10:36:56Unhelpfulkugel: i figured out how to paper over it. it's almost certainly a compiler bug.
10:37:37Unhelpfulerm, linker bug, rather.
10:37:48Unhelpfuli'd like to be able to cook up a *simple* test case
10:50:44kugelI can try your fix later if you post it somewhere
10:52:23kugelUnhelpful: flac is faster with eabi now?
10:52:46kugelah, only with -O2. what does SVN do?
10:53:04Unhelpful-O, but on my e200 flac was faster with -O2 than svn with -O2
10:53:18markunwhat's eabi?
10:54:02kugelUnhelpful: ah interesting. we might enable -O2 then? I wondered why flac is so slower with gcc4.4.x, the O level might explain it
10:55:01Unhelpfulmarkun: a newer ABI with smaller struct packing, short enums by default, and (the main reason) linker-generated veneers for out-of-range calls
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10:57:53Unhelpfulkugel: on gigabeat F 4.4.1-eabi is faster than svn for nearly everything we have a testfile for, and the things it does slower are not by >2% :)
10:58:51Unhelpfulon e200 wma might get to be as much as 4% slower.
10:59:34Unhelpfulthe slowdown goes up with bitrate, so i suspect it may be the bitstream or container code that's being pessimized
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11:07:49kugelUnhelpful: when is 4.4.3 due?
11:08:35kugelwe should maybe try to use 4.4.3 which hopefully fixes the compilation problems we have with 4.4.2
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11:16:04Unhelpfultry a snapshot for it, maybe?
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12:08:35Unhelpfulhrm, i'm *pretty* sure the e200 screen has horizontal subpixels in RGB order. it's rather hard to be sure, they're *quite* tiny.
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15:28:43amiconnUnhelpful: Wouldn't it be better to use gcc 4.3.x for eabi? In my experience it's never very wise to use cutting edge gcc due to too many bugs
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16:42:41CIA-5New commit by blue_dude (r23621): Crossfade: fix shuffle OR manual skip functionality, verbiage and manual
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20:59:34funmanfreddyb: ping
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21:04:40osotogarihi, after plugging my ipod into my computer via usb it continually reboots the ipod
21:06:04n1sosotogari: what model of ipod is it and which version of rockbox do you use?
21:07:55osotogarihi n1s, rockbox v3.3 and its an ipod 4th gen
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21:08:35funmanfirst update to rockbox v3.4
21:08:52gevaertsosotogari: what do you mean by "continually reboots"?
21:08:57liarTheSeven: can you have a look at FS #10775 again? i found a better solution
21:09:45osotogarigevaerts, it will display the rock box logo, go into the rockbox menu, the usb connection icon appears and then it resets the ipod
21:10:13gevaertsosotogari: if it then goes to the Apple disk mode, that's normal
21:10:52osotogarigevaerts, no it continues in that fashion
21:11:02osotogarii will update it first
21:11:05osotogarithen try again
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21:17:56kugelliar: good work
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21:22:18bertrikliar, do you really need to check both the empty and hempty bits?
21:22:39liarno just the hempty
21:23:54liari posted it too fast :)
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22:27:33kotnikinstalled rockbox on my sansa e260v2!
22:27:37kotnikworks like a charm Č=
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23:11:26scorcheI hope this email finds you doing well. We have begun the planning
23:11:27scorchefor the 8th annual Southern California Linux Expo and I wanted to
23:11:27scorcheformerly invite Rockbox to participate again at our show.
23:11:53scorchei will have to look at plans and such, but i think i can likely do this again....just an FYI...
23:13:44B4gderFebruary 19-21, 2010 apparently
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23:17:19 Quit n1s ("Lämnar")
23:18:04scorcheB4gder: yeah...during my birthday again =/
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