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#rockbox log for 2010-01-26

00:06:34 Quit Oxymis (Remote closed the connection)
00:08:03 Quit Zagor ("Clint excited")
00:09:17AlexPdomonoky: It seems multiple themes at once is the problem - if I try to do that nothing happens and I have to clear cookies/cache again before I can do anything else
00:09:18 Quit simabeis (Remote closed the connection)
00:11:23CIA-44New commit by Domonoky (r24334): Dont show themedetails of hidden themes.
00:12:40 Quit Barahir (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
00:13:23 Quit n17ikh (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:15:43 Join simabeis [0] (
00:16:02Mode"#rockbox +v simabeis " by rb_voicebot (
00:16:20domonokyAlexP: good to know. But i dont know what could go wrong there. If some PHP skilled person wants to look: the code in questions is at the top of private/admin.php
00:16:56 Quit GeekShadow (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
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00:17:48 Join GeekShadow [0] (i=Antoine@reactos/tester/GeekShadow)
00:18:08Mode"#rockbox +v GeekShadow " by rb_voicebot (
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00:21:48Mode"#rockbox +v n17ikh " by rb_voicebot (
00:27:37Unhelpfulamiconn: if iram is not used, neither is the table. i can make the use of rsbs conditional, though...
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00:42:24Mode"#rockbox +v Strife89 " by rb_voicebot (
00:46:47 Join funman [0] (n=fun@rockbox/developer/funman)
00:47:05funmansaratoga: FS #9332 doesn't seem to affect battery life
00:47:07Mode"#rockbox +v funman " by rb_voicebot (
00:47:26saratogafunman: good to know
00:47:50saratogaso either we're not powering down the flash correctly, or sandisk designed the hardware to work efficiently without a memory buffer
00:48:40 Quit pamaury ("abort();")
00:49:01 Part froggyman
00:49:03funmanwe could try to really power it down with MCI_POWER
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00:51:55Mode"#rockbox +v fdinel " by rb_voicebot (
00:52:00funmani'll try to remember it tomorrow when my clip's charged
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00:56:42 Quit bimbel ("Bye!")
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01:34:10Unhelpfuloooh, i found a magic number for ffs that has zeroes for the first *three* table entries... i think i might be able to do the pow2 division case without having to form the address of the table in a register
01:53:24***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
01:54:36 Quit JdGordon| ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
02:00:10 Join Oxymis [0] (
02:00:30Mode"#rockbox +v Oxymis " by rb_voicebot (
02:00:37Unhelpfulhrm, this seems innocent enough... why the data abort at the ldrb? add r2, pc, r2, lsr #26; ldrb r1, [r2, #.L_udiv_pow2_table-.-4]
02:01:03Unhelpfulthere's a 64B table at .L_udiv_pow2_table... it looks just fine in objdump :/
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02:15:23Mode"#rockbox +v JdGordon1 " by rb_voicebot (
02:19:34Unhelpfulamiconn: pow2 test gets me about a .22MHz improvement, if i remove the small-divisor test from the table lookup path, and if i move the 0-divisor test into the pow2 part
02:22:16Unhelpfuli've not looked at the distribution of divisors on any finer resolution than blocks of 256, so it may be that although the first block is a huge portion of the divisors in practice, 1 is not terribly common. also the reciprocal LUT had to lose 64 entries ;)
02:22:26*stripwax cannot see amiconn's replies for some reason
02:22:54JdGordon1rasher: can you langtool not change the dest: field for a string?
02:25:33Unhelpfulstripwax: well, he's said nothing for almost 3hr by my rceckoning. he'd suggested a good ways back that i try testing for power-of-two divisors in the specialized divider that the ape codec uses...
02:26:40*Unhelpful wishes there were a way to decode range coding with all of this division :P
02:26:41rasherJdGordon1: What are you trying to do?
02:26:52stripwaxs/with/without/ ?
02:27:14JdGordon1maybe I should deprecate the string instead of just changing the values
02:27:57Unhelpfulstripwax: obviously that is what i meant! ;)
02:29:25JdGordon1also, there are 60+ deprecated strings, maybe its time to rip them out?
02:31:06 Quit stripwax ("")
02:37:59rasherJdGordon1: It doesn't save much space at all
02:38:11JdGordon1so, I know
02:38:21JdGordon1its just at some point we need to break it
02:38:26JdGordon1may as well be now :)
02:38:28rasherNot really worth it to break backwards compatibility
02:39:20rasherAnyway, still not sure what you were trying to do with the dest. Generally, if dest changes, we need translators' eyes on the thing
02:39:43JdGordon1would it be possible to have the themes site create a forum thread (if wanted) automatically for discussion?
02:40:01JdGordon1at least to have it clear the dest so its not translated anymore
02:40:21rasher−−deprecate does that, doesn't it?
02:40:36JdGordon1that seems to be overkill, but yeah i guess so
02:41:09rasherI think I still don't quite understand what you're trying to do
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02:41:28 Quit stephen___ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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02:41:48JdGordon1rename all references to custom satutsbar with the least amount of needed changes, which is bassically change the string in english.lang
02:41:51JdGordon1back in 10
02:42:08Mode"#rockbox +v stephen___ " by rb_voicebot (
02:42:23rasherChange it to what?
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02:45:29Mode"#rockbox +v robin0800 " by rb_voicebot (
02:50:00JdGordoni dont know
02:50:21JdGordonsomething more meaningful
02:52:59rasherWell then you're potentially changing the meaning of the string, which means that translators need to see it. So just change it in english.lang
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03:07:21 Quit JdGordon1 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
03:10:22soapJdGordon, In your recent WPS forum post asking for suggestions on renaming the custom status bar - how about a quick and dirty summary about what it _can_ do and what it _can't_ do - and perhaps how you (personally) think about the collection? (ie why "custom statusbar" is an outright lie!)
03:16:16 Join c200v1user [0] (i=44e61c9c@gateway/web/freenode/x-edaoogsckwwgohfq)
03:16:36Mode"#rockbox +v c200v1user " by rb_voicebot (
03:17:11c200v1userhi guys, i did the complete uninstallation of rockbox and now i have the error: can't load rockbox.mi4
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03:17:28c200v1useri can access to the c200v1 only via mini-b -> device mode
03:17:34c200v1usercan i restore something from there?
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03:20:21Mode"#rockbox +v Hillshum " by rb_voicebot (
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03:53:27***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
03:54:57JdGordonsoap: ok, fair enough
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05:04:39 Quit fdinel ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
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05:26:38diz_ChildI got a moto m500 mp3 player, but the firmware(v1.01) from is not stable, (with the problem that once it go to the playing mode, it restarts again and again...), it's a STMP3550 based board, what can i do with it?
05:27:49krazykit`well, you can't install rockbox, unless you're planning on doing a new port. as for reparis, that would be offtopic for this channel
05:29:46diz_Childhow can i do a new port?
05:31:17diz_Childany guidence?
05:31:18krazykit`you'd need to know c, and read this:
05:31:30diz_Childoh, thanks~
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05:53:30***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
05:54:23S_a_i_n_tIs there a better way to change how the version information is displayed on the splash screen? right now I've just changed line 123 in main.c to "const char appsversion[]="My Custom Build;" (just to see how it'd work out), but it displays as "Ver. My Custom Build" instead of just "My Custom Build" there a way I can drop the "Ver. " altogether?
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05:56:10Mode"#rockbox +v GodEater " by rb_voicebot (
05:57:39S_a_i_n_tAlso, is there a way to change the time period for which the splash screen is displayed? Presently it's literally just a brief flash, I'd like to make it display for around 3~4 seconds perhaps...or to display until first button press.
05:59:52JdGordon1924no and yes
06:00:00JdGordon1924but im not telling you how, because thats bloody annoying!
06:03:04S_a_i_n_tso no to being able to drop the "Ver. "? Hmmm....I'll have to think of something that suits it a bit better. and yes to the splash screen timeout, but no to explaining it? :P
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06:17:21Mode"#rockbox +v HBK " by rb_voicebot (
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07:10:25 Part CGL ("Saliendo")
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07:11:19Mode"#rockbox +v CGL " by rb_voicebot (
07:14:10CGLHi everyone, i wanna know why i can't play a ogg file in my e200? It's works fine in vlc player but not in the rockbox... Any suggest? Thanks!
07:14:39scorchean ogg file? you mean vorbis?
07:16:04 Nick krazykit` is now known as krazykit (
07:16:07CGLIt's a podcast, and it works fine in windows with vlc player
07:16:47scorchecan you point me to this podcast?
07:19:16CGLpoint you? My english is not so good, sorry
07:19:36CGLdo you mean, send you?
07:20:52scorchei was just curious about the file itself...if it was a podcast, i assumed i could easily download it and examine it myself
07:21:53CGLThis is the link
07:22:16CGLBut it's 155 mb :S
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07:29:02CGLscorche, Are you downloading the file?
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07:49:47amiconnUnhelpful: Ahem, it's still not used
07:50:30amiconnIn your paste, you do rsbs r1, r1, #0 / tst r0, r0
07:51:33amiconnThe flags produced by the rsbs are never used
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07:53:32***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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07:59:54scorcheCGL: well, i looked into the file a bit...there shouldnt be an issue with it being 48kHz (rockbox should re-sample that), but i transcoded it to 44.1kHz and it worked....there is a current bug with playback of chained vorbis files, but i do not really know myself how to tell if this is one of them or if the only reason that it worked when i transcoded it is if it was no longer chained
08:00:08scorcheyou might havt to wait for someone who knows more about the format to come around..
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08:01:58yzflcyqSo Mr./Mrs. AlexP,I'm the creater of the 'Windows Media Player 11 (Preview)' theme.
08:03:30yzflcyqWhy was my theme Windows Media Player 11 (Preview) removed from the Rockbox theme site.
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09:04:20*dys` just opened his Nex II
09:04:22 Nick dys` is now known as dys (
09:04:39dysI found a lonly TI DSP 320VC5416PGE without external memory
09:05:20dysit has 256kB internal ram, but I'm afraid this is not enough for porting rockbox?
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09:11:03Zagordys: perhaps not with all featurse, but you should be able to get some core stuff running at least
09:12:22dysi see. so the main obstacle is probably getting gcc running on this dsp
09:16:20amiconnIirc the Neo had 256kB RAM as well, and openneo is a fork of (early) rockbox
09:16:26amiconnBut the Neo is hwcodec
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09:23:18Zagordys: oh, I didn't see that it was a DSP. yeah, that's an obstacle.
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09:53:33***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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09:55:36mtsaratoga: I have checked the output from the ATRAC3 decoder to look for the bug about audible noise in output. I wrote a wav file using test_codec and another wav file using ffmpeg, analyzed the spectrum of both, and from comparison, it seems that we're only a few db higher (~5-6db) in frequencies lower than 35HZ, Beyond that, I can't spot a difference between both.
09:58:03linuxstbscorche: (I see CGL left) - Rockbox doesn't support chained ogg files, and probably never will.
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09:58:42scorchelinuxstb: i see that, but i was not even sure if this file was a chained ogg file
09:58:57Mode"#rockbox +v terrakok " by rb_voicebot (
09:59:21*scorche doesnt really now how to check for this sort of thing
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10:00:01linuxstbscorche: "ogginfo"
10:00:16linuxstb(that file is chained - I downloaded the first few MB)
10:01:18linuxstbA chained ogg file is simply "cat file1.ogg file2.ogg file3.ogg > chained.ogg" - so Rockbox would need to scan the entire file to find all the sub-files.
10:02:03terrakokhello! a file manager can be installed on rockbox-debian?
10:02:11*scorche apt-gets vorbis-tools
10:02:23linuxstbterrakok: What's "rockbox-debian" ?
10:02:34scorcheterrakok: on the virtual image, i assume?
10:03:15scorcheterrakok: sure, though it is generally assumed that one would be using either the command line or windows via samba share to do such things
10:03:26scorcheapt-get install thunar (or something like it)
10:04:55scorchelinuxstb: thanks for cluing me in to how to see this sort of thing - ogginfo/vorbis-tools certainly shows such things =)
10:05:24*linuxstb wonders if there are any simple tools to split a chained ogg file
10:06:41scorchelinuxstb: i saw a lot of mention about OggSplit, but do not know how good it may be
10:06:49terrakokI installed mc, but changed gcc-Library
10:07:28terrakokand not work compilation
10:08:39scorcheterrakok: this really is more of a debian issue than a rockbox issue at this point
10:08:49scorchealso, you may be using a very old image...
10:09:54terrakokdownloaded yesterday ...
10:10:17scorchethat doesnt mean you downloaded a newer one ;)
10:11:34mtThe bug about rebuffering deleted files isn't reproducible in the sim, is it ?
10:11:36terrakok) where new?
10:12:16linuxstbmt: Do you know if the buffering code keeps the file "open" ?
10:12:51linuxstbOr does it close and re-open it between buffering sessions?
10:13:51scorcheterrakok: here is a newer one, but it is getting a bit old now as was never officially put up as I didn't have the time to test it and others didnt test fully, so your results may vary:
10:14:03*scorche should probably whip up a new one once he has time
10:14:39mtlinuxstb: No, I don't know about that.
10:15:38linuxstbmt: What is the actual bug?
10:17:02mtlinuxstb: FS #10874 -
10:18:15scorcheterrakok: you may be better off simply making your own image...
10:19:44terrakokscorche: I understand it)
10:20:30terrakokstrange that no mc
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10:21:08scorchenot would just be another thing taking up yet more room and is something that isnt really needed
10:21:39*gevaerts never used mc, and he finds it strange that people want it :)
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10:24:33 Quit S_a_i_n_t ("S_a_i_n_t [St.]")
10:29:46terrakokhow do I configure qemu, to establish contact with him through krusader?
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10:31:46scorcheterrakok: this channel is for rockbox support only - you might be better served to ask a qemu or debian/etc channel for help with such issues
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10:35:36kugelthere is a strange bug in buffering
10:35:37Mode"#rockbox +v kugel " by rb_voicebot (
10:35:43kugelit's reproducable in the sim
10:35:59Bagdernot time or date set yet
10:40:18kugelfirst_handle is being trashed
10:41:02kugelwatching it in gdb I can't see where it's getting a wrong value, so it seems to happen indirectly
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10:45:36kugelanyway, it crashes my fuze pretty badly
10:45:41Mode"#rockbox +v NickRx " by rb_voicebot (
10:45:57mtkugel: is that about FS #10874 or something different ?
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10:49:21 Quit liar ("Verlassend")
10:53:21pixelmamt: the crash doesn't happen on hwcodec btw. which is not very surprising as it uses a different playback engine and buffering. I just checked in case to safely exclude something unexpected
10:54:20mtpixelma: Thanks :)
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10:58:44amiconnlinuxstb: What's the problem with chained ogg files? Sure rockbox won't know its proper playtime without scanning the whole file, but I would expect it to play...
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11:00:10kugelmt: no, that's a different one
11:01:15linuxstbamiconn: I don't know exactly what happens - I've never tried it. Maybe the metadata parser rejects it.
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11:03:26kugelmaybe related or not, the changes to make buffering on the clip work don't look 64-bit safe at all
11:08:23 Quit stacker55 ("ircN 7.27 + 7.0 for mIRC (2002/01/10 00.00)")
11:08:47NickRxIve been looking through the forums for a while now and still havent seen what I am looking for, basicaly im looking to buy a new mp3 player, but the one i have in mind isnt supported by rockbox, I have been studying electronics but I cant figgure out how you guys actualy reverse engineer the mp3 players. Can someone point me in the right direction?
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11:10:18kugelint* here = 0x14720; int* there 0xff9569a3ff95998b [both are totally insane values]; int* end = 0x9668f0; int*begin = 0x9698d8 [the latter two are OK]
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11:14:27NickRx:( I answered my own question, thanks though :D
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11:15:24kugeldebugging this is going to be a pain
11:16:32ZagorNickRx: we simply examine the hardware and stock firmware and try to come up with a way to upload code to it that it will run. then we try to create code that it can run.
11:16:54Zagorit's not a simple step-by-step process
11:17:15Zagorin spite of my overuse of "simple" :-)
11:17:48linuxstbNickRx: See ?
11:18:40mt_linuxstb: looking at the buffering thread, it seems that it actually keeps the file open and keeps trying to rebuffer. Even when I selected another file for playback (which doesn't play, as per the bug report) - the buffering thread seems to be still "stuck" with the previous file which has been deleted.
11:19:11 Nick mt_ is now known as mt (n=mtee@
11:19:51linuxstbmt: Have you checked if behaviour is different with and without dircache?
11:21:23NickRxI was just looking for the wrong thing >.<
11:21:32linuxstbBut that sounds like the problem. Also, it will probably be fine in a (Unix at least) sim - if you delete a file in Linux which is currently opened, then the file is only deleted when the last process closes it.
11:25:54 Quit bluebroth3r (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
11:26:24amiconnlinuxstb: So our sim needs fixing in order to behave more target like
11:26:38amiconnIn windows you can't delete an opened file at all
11:26:58NickRxlinuxstb that page is really helpfull, the only thing i dont understand (I program on AVR chips, and im not sure if it has it) is how to get the original firmware off the chip (is this actually needed??)
11:27:01mtlinuxstb: Behaviour is the same with dircache on.
11:27:13 Quit derpeter_ ("ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.5.7/20091221164558]")
11:27:27linuxstbNickRx: We normally don't extract the firmware from the device, we work with firmware upgrade files provided by the manufacturer
11:28:07NickRxif they dont have any firmware upgrades im sol?
11:28:29linuxstbI can't recall any Rockbox ports that have succeeded without them...
11:28:52Bagderwith some devices extracting them off the player have been easy
11:29:17NickRxBagder how was this done?
11:29:32Bagderfile copy in most cases
11:29:34linuxstbThat's true. I guess the first thing is to examine the device and see if you can find the firmware files anywhere - i.e. on the disk.
11:30:06linuxstbSome devices have separate firmware partitions where the firmware is stored. These may or may not be accessible via USB.
11:30:11BagderNickRx: most players actually only have a bootloader in the "permanent" flash and then they load the OS part from somewhere else at start
11:30:46Bagderused to be disk, these days mostly nand flash
11:30:58linuxstbNickRx: Which player are you looking at?
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11:32:48NickRxTheres a 16gb version on a bunch of sites, but they all point to different companies, i sent an email to see if they do have a 16gb model, if they do I will buy it
11:33:31NickRxIt looks like the old os from my old mp3 player, which I didnt like at all, so if I buy it my first concern will be changing it
11:33:52NickRxoh and adding a tilt sensor
11:33:57Bagdermy guess that's a chinese player
11:34:25Bagderthus most likely one of the Chinese SoCs
11:34:26NickRxus based company in cali
11:34:38BagderNickRx: that actually makes it?
11:34:50Bagdernot just selling or branding it?
11:35:03NickRxhow would i go about checking it?
11:35:10Bagderask them?
11:35:12mtShould we be looking at changing the buffering behaviour to handle rebuffering for deleted files, or should we disallow deleting a file that's currently playing at all ?
11:36:19Zagormt: I'd say skip the file if we discover it has been deleted
11:37:37NickRxits in cali, and a bunch of processors/microcontrollers are made there so i would guess its a US built product
11:38:29Bagderoh well, it doesn't matter too much at this point anyway
11:38:59BagderNickRx: there's not a lot more to do/guess until you have an actual unit
11:39:06Bagderor find a downloadable firmware upgrade file
11:41:01NickRx>.< Thanks for all the info guys, I always wanted to figgure out how they made custom firmware
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11:43:17NickRxok so i got the processor
11:45:00BagderRK is Rockchip
11:45:20Zagorthat site smells of spring rolls, I mean
11:45:50NickRxis there any other player that is supported by rockbox that uses that kind of chip?
11:46:05ZagorI doubt very much a US company would be that sloppy and clone-happy
11:46:05NickRxor one like it?
11:46:11Bagder"The RK2705 is an integrated system-on-chip with Dual Core architecture"
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11:46:47BagderDual Core Architecture (ARM7EJC+DSP)
11:47:29Bagderthat's pretty bad news imho
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11:48:51NickRxhow would i be bad news?
11:49:23Bagderthe DSP part tend to be obscure and hard to get to
11:49:40Bagderand the ARM7 part feels like underpowered to do a lot on its own without the DSP
11:50:11NickRxComplies with the Universal Serial Bus specification Rev. 2.0, Supports USB Full Speed (12Mb/sec) and High Speed (480 Mb/sec), is Backward compatible with USB1.1 (This is good though right?)
11:50:28Zagorthat doesn't mean anything
11:50:34Bagderyes, that means it does usb fine
11:50:54Bagder"If someone familiar with rk2705 firmware can suggest a small piece of DSP code, I'll try to find some ZSP G2 instructions, perhaps hack a simple (open source) disassembler because there doesn't seem to be one. "
11:51:08Bagderlike that...
11:51:17TorneThe ARM7 is not that small actually
11:51:26TorneIt's one of the retrofitted ARMv5TE ARM7s :)
11:51:31Torneand it lists its max clock as 240Mhz
11:51:53Bagderthat might not be too shabby then
11:52:08Tornewhether you cna clock it that fast in a real device is different but hey
11:52:14ZagorI don't think I've ever seen a non-chinese player based on rockchip
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11:52:47TorneIt certainly seems *feasible* we could run on it, at least
11:53:03Mode"#rockbox +v lostlogic " by rb_voicebot (
11:53:06Torneit's not a tiny crippled thing like the s3 chip
11:53:08ZagorBagder: archos has a rockchip player?
11:53:10BagderZagor: there's clearly archos players with RK2705 or 2706
11:53:11Tornes1 even
11:53:28Bagderat least if the forums are right, they may not be
11:53:35***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
11:55:54Bagderah yes it does say ARM7EJC 240MHz
11:56:11BagderDSP 176MHz
11:56:37TorneARM7EJC is a weird one
11:56:57Torne5 stage pipeline but all the ARMv5TE instructions :)
11:58:09Bagder has this info btw
11:58:22Bagdera good old us domain ;-)
11:58:38Bagderbut it is clearly a leaked docs
11:59:21 Quit derpeter_ ("ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.5.7/20091221164558]")
11:59:35NickRxits the one i am looking at
12:00:09Bagderon the forums there is talk of a leaked RK sdk but I couldn't find the actual download
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12:00:41linuxstbZagor: (I'm guessing you know Rockbox's FAT code) - would it be feasible for Rockbox to behave the same way as Unix does with respect to deleting open files? i.e. for as long as the buffering code has the file open, it can still read from it, even if it's been deleted?
12:01:03Zagor"visual land are famous for not giving out firmeware at all so i would not hold out much hope there" −−
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12:01:44Zagorlinuxstb: we'd have have to introduce a virtual filesystem layer to keep track of that
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12:02:30ZagorI don't quite see why we want to support deleting files that are being played?
12:03:55NickRxZagor, I usualy just toss a bunch of mp3's on my players and then i go through them, find the ones i dont like and delete them (its nice to be able to delete it when its on the screen, like a quick option)
12:04:33ZagorNickRx: but surely you don't expect it to keep playing efter you delete it?
12:04:51NickRxnope, i expect it to go to the next song
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12:21:01TorneNickRx: ah, PUDN :)
12:21:28Torne"please upload some stolen code/datasheets to get download access to other stolen code/datasheets"
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12:37:10 Part LinusN
12:37:38kugelmy bug seems to only happen when having skip length set to skip to outro (to skip to 5s before the end) and/or when skipping back from the end of a song
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12:51:36Assemblerim back in a less laggy computer....
12:52:46Assemblerwhats the easiest wy to compile rockbox on windows?
12:53:33amiconnlinuxstb: I'd rather make the sim behave like target (file is gone after deletion)
12:54:02Stephen__using the virtual linux way is said to be the quickest
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12:54:29Assembleryeah justaa finished reading hat one
12:54:41Assemblerjusta finished reading it
12:55:37Assemblerthink its a wise idea to install porable virtualbox on a 4gb flash drive and xbuntu on it to have the compiler portable?
13:02:59linuxstbamiconn: How would you do that?
13:03:48linuxstbamiconn: But it sounds like a solution would be to force the playback code to skip to the next track before deleting it. That would also seem to be what a user would expect to happen, and would avoid the issue.
13:06:09amiconnClose the file on the OS side before deleting it
13:06:30linuxstbAssembler: "easiest" is probably Cygwin. "quickest" (i.e. the time to do one build) is with a Linux VM.
13:08:18linuxstbamiconn: What do you mean with "OS side" ?
13:08:48amiconnThe OS "below" the sim
13:16:58linuxstbYou mean Linux (e.g.). Or the uisimulator/ code?
13:22:49kugelmove_handle() seems to be on fault
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13:53:38***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
14:07:18*kugel has a suspicion
14:07:43kugelit seems that there can be a case, where move_handle() with wrapping overwrites an existing handle
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14:08:22kugelI'm debugging the linked list, and it breaks sometimes with the next pointer being total garbage
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14:09:38kugelI can imagine this problem is more likely to happen when the buffer size is roughly enough to hold a single song + a bit other data
14:10:22Assemblerhiya :)
14:10:49Assemblercan someone explain me why cant sansa fuze run the GBA emulator?
14:11:09gevaertswhat GBA emulator?
14:11:22Assembleri mean gameboy advance
14:11:34Assembleri heard lots of people telling fuze is too slow
14:11:41Assemblercant get why
14:11:54Assemblerits 250 mhz 1 mb of RAM
14:12:24AlexPWe don't have a GBA emulator
14:12:31AlexPThat might bepart of it
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14:13:00Unhelpfulamiconn: yes... and that beq .L_div0 needs to be moved up, actually, since right now it will trigger when dividing zero, instead of when dividing *by* 0
14:13:04Assembleryeah i kno you dont ahve one
14:13:13Mode"#rockbox +v maveas " by rb_voicebot (
14:13:14AlexPSo that is why you can't install it - it doesn't exist
14:13:35Assemblerhay are you a developer?
14:13:43*gevaerts waits for Assembler's reasons why the fuze should be fast enough for a GBA emulator
14:13:50AlexPWell, only of the manual :)
14:14:26Assemblerim wondering if i can start mking plugins
14:14:34AlexPI suspect you can, yes
14:14:37Assembleri only have basic knowlage of C
14:14:58AlexPHave a look how the existing ones are done, and there is some info on the wiki
14:15:25Assemblerthanks il try it :P
14:15:39Torne1MB of ram is not enough for a GBA emulator :)
14:15:44Torneregardless of processor speed.
14:15:48Unhelpfulgevaerts: well, they're both same/similar architecture - isn't gba arm7tdmi? you could probably get away with not emulating, provided the hardware stuff is reasonably well-separated (calls to a ROM BIOS of some sort instead of inlined)
14:15:57TorneUnhelpful: No, the hardware stuff is none of the sort
14:15:59AlexPTorne: That needs :( not :) surely! :)
14:16:08TorneYou would need to stop emulating every dozen instructions or so
14:16:11gevaertsUnhelpful: the GBA doesn't have any graphics or sound hardware? :)
14:16:14UnhelpfulTorne: inline stuff al over? :/
14:16:17Tornethe GBA has extremely magical and specialised graphics and sound hardware
14:16:18Assemblerhow good is the nanos RAM?
14:16:25Assembleri heard it has 80 Ghz
14:16:26TorneWhich is accessed by direct register reads/writes, constantly
14:16:36AlexPThe nano has 32 MB of RAM
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14:16:45AlexP1st gen anyway
14:16:54Unhelpful80GHz? of RAM?! you sure you're not trolling? :P
14:16:56AlexPAnd a dual core 80 MHz processor
14:16:59Assemblerit really is better
14:16:59TorneUnhelpful: There are no libraries for this stuff on GBA :)
14:17:00Mode"#rockbox +v fyrestorm " by rb_voicebot (
14:17:11TorneUnhelpful: games program the hardware directly
14:17:11Assembleri mean 80 Ghz processor speed silly XD
14:17:39AlexPAnd it has a dual core 80 MHz CPU
14:17:56Torneanyway, for GBA you will need at least 8MB of ram, realistically
14:18:08Torneeven the smallest GBA carts are 2MB, most are 4/8, some are 16
14:18:09Assembleryeah that explains the price
14:18:20 Part maveas
14:18:26AlexPI'm talking nano 1st gen here
14:18:40Assemblerhay do you guys have eny idia what does sandisk think of rockbox?
14:19:07UnhelpfulTorne: stop emulating every dozen instructions or so, or else pre-scan code and substitute calls to hardware emulation in place of direct access. and of course trap self-modifying code. messy... :/
14:19:14BagderAssembler: everyone loves us!
14:19:21TorneUnhelpful: The problem is that that's quite a lot :)
14:19:30Torneit really does do it constantly
14:19:39Torne"port gpSP" is the best answer
14:19:47Tornesince that's the most optimal gba emulator on ARM by a long way
14:20:00Tornebut still you aren't going to do it on a platform with RAM smaller than the size of a rom
14:20:18UnhelpfulTorne: sure we can, just use swap ;)
14:21:18TorneYou'd probably have to swap ram also :)
14:21:24Tornesince there's 386KB of writable memory on the GBA
14:21:45 Quit bmbl ("Bye!")
14:22:00Unhelpfulthat wouldn't be slowly destroying the storage ;)
14:22:54Assemblerthinki can change my fuzes baterry with a small phone baterry? i wana impovre its battery life
14:23:12TorneAssembler: anyway, porting gpSP or similar would be possible, but a lot of work and the result would not work on targets with such small ram, and would work very slowly on the targets without processors in the several hundred MHz :)
14:23:29AlexPSo, just the beast again :)
14:23:31Torneso, it might be halfway tolerable for RPG type games, maybe, on the Beast and similar
14:23:44Tornebut i would be surprised if even the beast could play many games in realtime
14:24:00Tornethe GBA graphics hardware really is hilariously awkward to emulate
14:24:03*GodEater still thinks the best way to play GBA games is on a GBA!
14:24:17Torneindeed :)
14:24:20AlexPGodEater: What a novel plan
14:24:27GodEaterit has, like, all the right buttons and stuff
14:24:51GodEaterI think I even have one at home somewhere
14:24:51 Part Bagder
14:25:46Tornenext you'll be telling me we don't need Frotz because you have a z-machine at home somewhere!
14:25:49Torneoh wait
14:26:01Assembleryeah i got lots of crazy ideas for plugins
14:26:01gevaertsTorne: no, but he has a chip-8!
14:26:10Tornethe chip-8 isn't a real platform either!
14:26:38Assemblerlike will it be possible to use a port as an antenna to set up networking/
14:26:51Assemblera pin
14:27:03Assemblerconnect a wire to a choosen pin
14:27:06TorneAssembler: anyway, there is a big difference between what is theoretically possible on one or more targets, vs what will actually work on most of them, vs what anyone is likely to bother to do ;)
14:27:38Torneer, you mean wifi? :)
14:27:53TorneOnly if you can modulate that port at 2.4GHz..
14:28:03 Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@
14:28:10Tornewifi radios are not generally optional :)
14:28:18Assemblermaybe bluetooth?
14:28:35Torneit is not possible to emit signals at that frequency from anything that's not supposed to be a radio.
14:29:22Assemblermaybe we can use a USB bluetooth rescuver?
14:29:22gevaertsTorne: don't you need to modulate at twice that?
14:29:48Assemblerjusta throwng all cool ideas i had
14:30:10Assembleri like programming and i like such challanges
14:30:11Tornea target that has USB host could use, in theory, any usb device someone wrote a driver for.
14:30:33Tornenot too many targets have usb host, though
14:30:38Tornewe have no usb host stack
14:30:43Torneand we have no drivers for any usb devices
14:30:46Torneand we have no network stack.
14:30:50Torneso that would be quite a big project ;)
14:30:59GodEaterseveral quite big projects
14:31:00Assemblermaby we can setup the fuze to use USB?
14:31:10Tornedoes the fuze have usb host?
14:31:23TorneThen no
14:31:30Assemblerbutbut we can make a converter
14:31:34TorneNo you can't.
14:31:54Assembleruse 4 pins and connect it to a USB device?
14:32:05TorneThe difference between host and device is not what kind of plug they have
14:32:13Torneit's what actual electronics are connected :)
14:32:38Tornethe only thing which can connect two USB devices "together" is another microprocessor with a USB Host interface.
14:32:42Tornei.e. a computer
14:32:42Assemblerdidnt really think bout that
14:33:08Assemblerbut the fuze has a USB charge cable
14:33:29Assemblerif it can transfer data with a PC means it has a USB interface doesnt it?
14:33:30TorneAll of our targets are USB devices
14:33:35TorneUSB interfaces are *not symmetrical*
14:33:42Tornea USB device chipset is different from a USB host chipset
14:34:03TorneSome of our targets have a USB host chipset as well, or have a USB OTG chipset which can function as either, but most of them don't.
14:34:11Assemblero ure really smart
14:34:16Assembleror im really dumb
14:34:18TorneNo, this is extremely basic knowledge
14:34:29Assemblerim really young
14:34:33Assemblerim just learning
14:35:10TorneEmbedded programming is difficult compared to most other things.
14:35:26Tornegenerally this is not a great way to learn.
14:35:40Assemblerum what is embedded? im israeli...
14:36:08Tornedeveloping low-level features for mp3 players is exceptionally hard, because we frequently have no documentation and must painstakingly reverse engineer everything from the original firmware, and because there are often limited or no debugging facilities.
14:36:51Assemblerim justa really interested in it
14:36:58Assemblerit looks really cool
14:37:17Assemblerand like challanges so it really does looks difficult
14:37:28Tornestart with something easier :)
14:37:38Assembleri mean in that kind of development even hello orld can be hard
14:37:44TorneAdding new hardware capabilities to the targets we support is about an eleven out of ten for difficult
14:38:03Assemblerim startig making plugins
14:38:15TorneDo more of that :)
14:39:25Assemblerwait cant you use the simulator as a debugging faxility?
14:39:37GodEaterfor applications yes, for hardware features, no.
14:39:57GodEaters/applications/plugins and such like
14:40:15Tornethe simulator doesn't simulate the actual hardware
14:40:26Torneso you can't test drivers or anything that wayl.
14:40:29kugelI have the strong feeling that while debugging the data abort that happens on target I also fight with 64bit-unsafety of some code
14:40:59Tornekugel: oh dear :)
14:41:24kugelit does pointer arithmetic with int32_t there :(
14:42:18kugelwell, int32_t*; and that shouldn't be a problem after all, but it's suspicious and I seem to get more crashes on the sim than on target
14:43:13Assemblerhow can i impovre the fuzes baterry life?
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14:44:40TorneDepends what is causing it to have short battery life.
14:44:51TorneBut a first guess is "you can't"
14:45:18Assemblerit lasts for less than a day
14:45:21Tornemost targets where our battery life is not as good as the OF, it's because there is some power saving feature of the hardware whcih we are not using.
14:45:40Torneso, fixing that generally requires that someone reverse engineer a bunch more stuff to work out how to be more power efficient.
14:45:49Tornei don't know what's up with the fuze specifically, though
14:45:54Tornei don't have one ;)
14:46:12Assemblerso what port do you have?
14:46:37Tornei have an ipod video, a gigabeat s, and a clipv2
14:46:45Torneoh, and an iriver h120
14:46:59Assemblerwo you have lots
14:47:11Assembleri only have a fuze and i quite like it :P
14:47:14Tornenot really. some devs have a lot more than four :)
14:47:24GodEateryeah, I think amiconn has like 19
14:48:00Assemblerits so fun spending time with you guys
14:48:42Assembleri mean ure the only ones i kno who really have some bit of idea about all that stuff and are ready to share it ith me
14:50:49kugeluse real words please
14:50:59kugeli.e. "ure' is forbidden
14:51:20Assemblerdont you like chat language?
14:51:26kugelyes, read the irc guidelines linked to in the topic
14:53:41gevaertsAssembler: that sort of thing makes the channel really hard to read for people who don't know English well or who use text to speech systems
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15:09:44UnhelpfulTorne: surely the pin could just feed data to a wifi or bt radio that you graft on... but if he wants to save batter, not a great idea ;)
15:09:57TorneYou could use a serial wifi radio, yah
15:10:02Tornebut they're not very good ;)
15:11:01kugelI can't reproduce any crash on r23679 (the revision before the buffering fixes for the clip)
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15:13:42kugelI also don't understand why it's coyping data backwards (*there−− = *here−−)
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15:14:09Tornekugel: where?
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15:14:23kugelbuffering.c, move_handle()
15:14:57Unhelpfulkugel: if you're doing it with indexes instead of pointers, the compiler can optimize away the loop test (on some platforms) ;)
15:15:15kugel;r2=23680;pathrev=23680; the removed comment mentions what I suspect to be still not fixed
15:17:09Unhelpfulalso you might do that in an overlap-safe memmove-type function, if you *also* have a branch that copies it forward instead
15:18:12kugeloptimization isn't my problem right now
15:21:12Unhelpfulyou asked why you'd copy backwards. copying backwards is safe if the start of dest overlaps with the end of source
15:22:04kugelah I missed that part of the second sentence
15:22:29kugelI think it's overlap-with-itself-safe, but not overlap-with-existing-data safe :)
15:22:47kugelalthough I think I managed that data abort on the clip to
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15:44:57codeswingCan I install rockbox on ipodf Shuffle
15:45:15evilnick_Bcodeswing: no
15:45:19Tornesupported devices are listed on the front page
15:45:24codeswingoh no
15:45:31codeswingis downloading it
15:46:17codeswinghey ..
15:46:21codeswingis it for real
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16:32:34Unhelpfulamiconn: this just boggles me... without the LUT, pow2 special case seems to make the divider slightly slower....
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17:18:42Unhelpfulactually, no, the same table size is slightly slower with the pow2 special case, even though the test adds only 1 instruction compared to the low-divisor test that's used to handle 0-2 if the pow2 code is disabled. i should build with and without pow2 again with the table code removed, instead of comparing with-pow2 to an old time for the table-less code... maybe i changed something else without realizing it.
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17:33:12pamaurygevaerts: will your usb storage *fix* of yesterday make any noticeable difference ?
17:33:54gevaertsit will probably make things slightly slower. It didn't fix any user-visible issue for me
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17:54:08Assembleri need help
17:54:16Assemblerenyone familiar with xubuntu?
17:54:35linuxstbAssembler: Welcome to #rockbox
17:54:51TheSevenAssembler: => #rockbox-community, please
17:56:16TheSevenor even #ubuntu maybe
17:56:41Assemblerhow can i change the # thing?
17:57:12linuxstbAssembler: This channel is for Rockbox questions. You will be ignored or shouted at if you ask off-topic questions.
17:57:36Assemblerwell actually my question is about rockbox...
17:57:51Assemblerwell be right back
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17:59:27TheSevenso, what *is* your question?
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18:00:58JdGordon1how about "base skin" as a replacement name for the sbs?
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18:28:16Assemblerim back
18:29:14Assembleri cant download the subversion package from the simple guide to cimpile for linux
18:30:07Torneyou mean sudo apt-get install subversion ?
18:30:11TorneDo you have Debian/Ubuntu?
18:30:18Torneother distributions don't use apt-get
18:30:46Assembleri have xubuntu
18:30:57Assemblerwait i think it just worked!
18:31:07Assemblerphew for 5th time now...
18:31:32kugelJdGordon1: is there any need to change the .sbs extension? Why break all existing sbs themes for something that's arbitary anyway?
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18:53:18pixelmakugel: it at least needs a more descriptive name in the menu - "custom statusbar" is totally misleading
18:53:36kugelyea, I can see that
18:53:51kugelI meant the file extension particularly
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18:55:07JdGordonkugel: we dont need to, it would make more sense to, but its not required
18:55:20JdGordonand if we did, we oculd easily script it to fix all the themes
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19:01:13domonokyJdGordon: and carefully fix all places which already deal with .sbs files. (themesite,checkwps,etc)
19:01:52JdGordonwhy are they using it?
19:02:04JdGordoncheckwps especially
19:02:17JdGordonit should just verify the text is legal,nothing else
19:02:34domonokyit checks them, dont know if checkwps really cares about the file ending.
19:03:18domonokyalso if the themes are batch-fixed on the themepage, it means they nolonger work for older binarys (ie last release).
19:04:10JdGordonthats not a reason to not do this though
19:05:10domonokydepends on when we want todo that. directly after a release might be bad :-)
19:05:52JdGordonwe shold have done this weeks ago :/
19:08:25JdGordonoh well... we branch today yeah?
19:08:28domonokymaybe we should come up with a name, which we can still short to .sbs :-) like "special base skin"
19:08:57JdGordonskin base skin?
19:09:05JdGordonsuper boring screen
19:09:26JdGordonskinned base screen?
19:09:35domonokythat good.
19:09:44JdGordonin which case calling it "base skin" in the menu wouldnt be terrible
19:09:50JdGordonback in 10 = Sound like Bag of Shit :-)
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19:15:10 Quit dys (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
19:15:32bluebrotherlinuxstb: is there a way to fake a nano2g similar to the other ipods? I'd like to check against this rbutil crash with the nano2g bootloader
19:16:15TheSevenhow does it detect an ipod?
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19:17:14bluebrotherhaven't checked but I guess it's doing it the same way as for the other ipods, which is checking the partition layout and the firmware partition
19:22:54komputesGeneral question for everyone using Linux: What jukebox software do you use to sync your playlists to your rockbox device?
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19:23:38JdGordon|rsync or cp
19:24:14komputesare you guys serious, you manually copy files to the device?
19:24:25gevaertssure, why not?
19:24:32komputesman, that would drive me nuts
19:24:34JdGordon|blasphemy, but heck, thatss just me!
19:24:41komputesi need to listen to it, make a playlist
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19:27:21komputesAnyhow, RB 3.4 using RB-UTIL 1.2.3 fails to install on my iPod Nano 1G :(
19:27:39komputesanyone available to walk me through it and report whatever issues may arrise
19:28:05AlexPkomputes: I copy and paste
19:28:25komputesAlexP: nice variation :D
19:28:35AlexPyep, I'm all about the gui me
19:28:45saratogaare we ready to branch for 3.5?
19:28:56AlexPsaratoga: yeppers
19:29:07AlexPkomputes: So what is up with rbutil?
19:29:14AlexPWhat os firstly?
19:29:56komputesAlexP: Ubuntu 10.04 Lucid Lynx
19:30:12AlexPAh, an early alpha?
19:30:20AlexPAre you running with sudo?
19:30:48komputesAlexP: yep, I'm all about the beta testinz me
19:30:56AlexPheh :)
19:31:12gevaertswhy are you trying to install 3.4 then, instead of the current build? ;)
19:31:29komputesAlexP: hold up, last time I tried this I bricked the iPod, let me do it again. right now the ipod has the 1.3.1 apple fw
19:31:33JdGordon|yeah! its all about the 3.5 now
19:31:40AlexPkomputes: You didn't brick it
19:31:47AlexPkomputes: Brick means unrecoverable
19:31:59komputesAlexP: the temporarily made it unusable w/o a mac ;)
19:32:08AlexPAh, so it is a Mac Pod?
19:32:13saratogai don't even think thats possible for an ipod 1g
19:32:17AlexPThat won't work, it needs to be a winpod
19:32:19saratoganano 1g
19:32:25saratogathey always have USB mode
19:32:30komputeslet me check the filesystem
19:33:05domonokykomputes: did rbutil gave any error messages ?
19:33:35komputeshfs+, damn
19:33:54komputesdomonoky: don't remember, was a while ago
19:34:04AlexPkomputes: Just formatting it won't work either
19:34:08domonokythats a macpod. But rbutil should have told you that
19:34:28komputesok, so let me winbod this b-och and I'll be back to test 3.5
19:34:28AlexPkomputes: Either restore it with windows itunes, or there is a manual method on the wiki somewhere
19:36:59 Quit JdGordon (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
19:39:49bluebrotherkomputes: if it fails again please save the system trace (in About / Troubleshoot / System Trace) after the problem occured and post it somewhere.
19:40:13komputesbluebrother: will do thanks for the tip
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19:41:30gevaertssaratoga: didn't you have a patch for continuous logf saving?
19:41:42saratogagevaerts: yeah
19:41:48saratogaits not clean enough to commit though
19:41:50Mode"#rockbox +v TheSeven|Mobile " by rb_voicebot (
19:41:51kugelAlexP, saratoga: I'm not
19:41:56kugel(ready for branch)
19:42:24kugelgetting there, though
19:42:54gevaertssaratoga: forget it. I forgot that I'm logging MSC things, no disk access from within rockbox :(
19:43:16*gevaerts decides to grow the buffer instead
19:43:21saratogayeah thats what i would do
19:43:33saratogalog to disk is only useful if you expect rockbox to crash or to log for a very long time
19:44:43kugelsaratoga: regarding funmans messurement; I do believe that there's little to zero difference with the flashbuffering patch on the clip because it rebuffers every other second anyway. But I have had a very significant reducement on the e200v1
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19:45:35saratogakugel: 350KB is still ~20 seconds of buffer
19:45:40saratogathe difference is probably the clip hardware
19:45:56saratogaor that we're not powering down the flash at all
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19:46:14saratogawhich actually wouldn't be surprising, it took us years to realize we didn't power down the flash on the e200v1
19:46:20Mode"#rockbox +v Zarggg " by rb_voicebot (
19:46:23kugelsaratoga: other question, are we releasing for the clip?
19:46:33saratogai don't see why not
19:46:38saratogathough i would keep it unstable
19:47:06liardo you release 3.5 for the nano2g?
19:47:33kugelif not, I would suggest reverting r23680; there's a regression on at least the fuze
19:47:49kugel(reverting in the release branch)
19:48:00gevaertsliar: much too unstable
19:48:56saratogadon't all the unstable targets get "released" in 3.5?
19:49:08kugelsaratoga: you should be able to reproduce it easily if you set skip length to skip to outro, skipping to near the end and back to the beginning gives a data abort quite likely
19:49:17saratogai thought the idea was to have a known good (or bad) build available
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19:50:05*TheSeven|Mobile would like to have more details of the nano2g problems
19:50:09Mode"#rockbox +v dantje_ " by rb_voicebot (
19:50:10gevaertssaratoga: we've never done that before
19:50:24saratogawe never had unstable targets before
19:50:30TheSeven|Mobileboth the usb and flash issues seem to affect only very few people
19:50:45kugelenough to be unstable
19:51:15kugelis liar's patch accepted?
19:51:30TheSeven|Mobilewhich one?
19:51:37kugelthe flash/nand one
19:51:39TheSeven|Mobilethe obvious usb bug was fixed, yes
19:51:46saratogakugel: buffering on the fuze was always a little iffy, i don't think reverting that commit in the release makes sense
19:51:58kugelit was?
19:52:05TheSeven|Mobilethe nand one not, as it only affects very few people and the patch will probably break it for even more of them
19:52:05saratogayou'd just be trading one crash in a specific circumstance with a randomly occuring, but rare crash in normal buffering
19:52:12kugelI can definitely say r23680 is introducing the regression
19:52:16gevaertssaratoga: if we make 3.5 builds for unstable targets, people will use them. Do we really want that? For e.g. the D2 I can see the benefit, but for most of them, I'd want people to use the latest current build
19:52:47kugelthe specific crash is *way* more likely to happen
19:52:49TheSeven|Mobilekugel: I know why nano2g is still unstable, and I don't object to that
19:52:51kugeland perfectly reproducable
19:53:02saratogagevaerts: good point
19:53:05liarTheSeven|Mobile: i would not say the flash affects very few people
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19:53:21TheSeven|Mobilei only wanted to note that i would need more detailed reports/research to finally sort it out
19:53:24liarflash bug*
19:53:28saratogayeah but if its reproducible it should be avoidable :)
19:53:34kugelsaratoga: the rare crash in normal buffering never affected the fuze really
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19:53:42saratogahow hard would a real fix be for it?
19:53:46***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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19:54:01kugelI've spend 4h trying to find the root cause, without success
19:54:16saratogaand you're sure it doesn't happen without matsch's changes?
19:54:46TheSeven|Mobileliar: i only have 2 reports of that bug, while i have lots of success reports
19:54:50saratogai don't mind reverting it in the release if we choose to have 3.5 for the fuze
19:54:59kugelwell, I'm not entirely surte
19:55:22kugelit could be that matsch introduced additional 64bit sim instability which wouldn't happen on target
19:55:47kugel(his changes don't look very 64bit safe to me, but I may be wrong)
19:55:51saratogakugel: i tested that patch on the 64 bit sim and didn't ahve any trouble
19:56:02saratogait actually fixed the occasional crashes I got with small audio buffer in the sim
19:56:10bertrikdoes anyone recognise the logo on the chip in this image: ?
19:56:13TheSeven|Mobileand if your patch was likely to work for all flash types, i would accept it
19:56:13TheSeven|Mobileit's just that i trust the apple code a lot more than the datasheet
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19:56:23saratogawhat didn't look 64 bit clean?
19:56:28kugeldo try to reproduce it on your e200v2, I expect it to happen ther e too
19:56:43Mode"#rockbox +v TheSeven|Mobile " by rb_voicebot (
19:56:53saratogaso skip to the end, then skip to the beginning?
19:57:08kugelsaratoga: casting pointer differences (64bit) to size_t (32bit) for example
19:57:25kugelsaratoga: yea, with skip lenght set to skip to outro
19:57:59liarTheSeven|Mobile: fs#10775, 10 if i've counted right
19:58:06kugelI suspect it happens in move_handle, so you need to trigger that. I think skipping the whiole file only triggers rebuffering
19:58:29saratogakugel: its a cast to (int32_t *) which i thought was ok?
19:58:52saratogait'll still be 8 bytes long, just it points to an int32
19:59:16kugelas I said, I may be wrong
19:59:22JdGordon|isnt int32_t always 4 bytes?
19:59:34kugelsaratoga: "oldpos = (void *)src - (void *)buffer;" for example
19:59:44kugelwith oldpos being size_t
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20:00:20kugelJdGordon|: not pointer to it
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20:01:07*TheSeven|Mobile needs to look at that flyspray again when he's at home
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20:02:31saratogar24134 seems to work fine (skip forward and get the outro, then seek to the first 5 seconds)
20:02:38saratogaalthough i get quite a lot of screen corruption doing so
20:02:48kugelyea, that also happens
20:03:22saratogai had no idea we had skip to outro
20:03:22kugelI've also seen the next track info being garbled
20:03:38kugelanyway, the memory is corrupted, with or without data abort
20:03:48liarwith USE_ROCKBOX_USB disabled and the nand patch i would even call the nano2g stable :). but i only know about those 3 nano2gs i have access to
20:04:29JdGordon|garbled next track info? should I be paying attention?
20:05:20gevaertsliar: I guess we'll disable USE_ROCKBOX_USB for other ipods anyway :)
20:05:41saratogaAFAIK size_t should be 64 bit, and of course the (void *) will be too, so I think this is 64 bit safe
20:06:13saratoga"The type's size is chosen in such a way as to allow you to write the maximum size of a theoretically possible array into it. On a 32-bit system size_t will take 32 bits and on a 64-bit one - 64 bits. "
20:06:22linuxstbbertrik: It doesn't answer your question, but a useful page if you haven't seen it before -
20:06:44gevaertsWhy do some HID transfers complete with 0 bytes sent?
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20:09:37Mode"#rockbox +v TheSeven|Mobile " by rb_voicebot (
20:10:43kugelsaratoga: ah ok, thanks for the clarification
20:13:06kugelsaratoga: on the sim you can see that one of the memory_handles in the linked list is pointing to something random with its next pointer
20:13:37linuxstbbertrik: A more comprehensive page -
20:13:52bertriklinuxstb, thanks
20:15:34linuxstbbertrik: I can't find your logo there though...
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20:18:18bertriklinuxstb, can't find it either, I think this is some kind of capacitive touch sensor controller. The picture is from a samsung yp-t10, which has touch keys just like my samsung yp-s3.
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20:19:01bertrikI already reverse-engineered it, but I would still like to know the manufacturer and possibly a data sheet of the touch sensor controller
20:19:19Mode"#rockbox +v DerPapst " by rb_voicebot (
20:20:45JdGordon|bertrik: its synaptics
20:20:59*JdGordon| decided to try the obvious company first :p
20:21:14bertrikah yes it is, thanks
20:25:12bertriktoo bad the resolution of the photo is just a little too low to figure out the part number
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20:46:44kugelfractals looks strange colorwise
20:47:52pixelmafractals just gives a blank screen on my Ondio :(
20:48:09pixelmamore precise: a full black screen
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20:56:50bertrikyay, I think I found a datasheet at the synaptics web site with a description of the protocol
20:57:34funmani'm testing on clip & fuze to see if/how it affects battery life. Seemed to work ok on Clip but *very* slowly on fuze
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20:59:03Mode"#rockbox +v derpeter_ " by rb_voicebot (
21:00:17funmankugel: is the regression introduced by r23680 reproducible only on Fuze ? i don't see any target specific code
21:00:56kugelyes, no target specific code
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21:01:11kugelthe clip seems to show it too
21:01:14funmani'll try on yh920
21:01:17kugelI haven't tried any other target yet
21:01:31kugelit might be related to the audio buffer size
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21:04:32gevaertssaving the logf dump is slow :(
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21:07:34Mode"#rockbox +v Farthen " by rb_voicebot (
21:10:10funmankugel: how do you reproduce the bug ?
21:10:52kugel"you should be able to reproduce it easily if you set skip length to skip to outro, skipping to near the end and back to the beginning gives a data abort quite likely"
21:11:10saratogaFWIW I didn't get that work on the e200v2 but its probably just due to me not doing it right
21:11:30saratogaif its a buffering bug it probably happens whenever you try to seek past the edge of whatever is in the buffer
21:11:36saratogaactually i may have just used too short of a song
21:11:49kugelI thought you saw display corruption?
21:12:02funmankugel: what is "skip length to skip to outro" ?
21:12:09saratogai think the display corruption is unrelated
21:12:11kugelsettings->playback->skip length
21:12:12saratogai get it whenever i seek
21:12:18kugelsaratoga: I think it's the same
21:12:24saratogaprobably the same as in mpegplayer
21:12:29kugelmemory corruption can have the wildest symptoms
21:12:59kugelit's possible that some songs are more likely to trigger it than others
21:14:16kugelI have one here that is 100k smaller than the entire audio buffer (4.05MB vs 4.14MB), that one reproduces it almost 100% of the time
21:14:45CIA-44New commit by kugel (r24335): Accept the last patch FS #10797 with a few changes by me (fixing side effects and adding the new backdrop_hide() to the multi screen api). It changes ...
21:14:57funmani can reproduce on yh920
21:15:16*JdGordon| thinks he is going to annoyed with that commit
21:15:44kugelwhoops I meant FS #10775
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21:16:16JdGordon|why did you add backdrop_hide to the plugin api?
21:16:23kugelI didn't
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21:16:30Mode"#rockbox +v TheSeven " by rb_voicebot (
21:16:35JdGordon|oh, misread
21:16:37 Quit Zarggg (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
21:16:42JdGordon|screen api != plugin api
21:16:45Mode"#rockbox +v Zarggg_ " by rb_voicebot (
21:17:18JdGordon|ok, now can we branch so I can oblitarate those changes with correct fixes? :)
21:17:30kugelno, the other fix should go in before too
21:17:32TheSevenliar: can you please give me the fs number again? I'm at home now...
21:18:04liarTheSeven: its fs#10775
21:18:18kugelfunman: if it's reproducable on large-mem targets as well we should probably revert it for at least the release branch
21:18:31JdGordon|kugel: which other fix?
21:18:50kugelI wrote it in the ml
21:19:21JdGordon|can you put the change on pastebin or soemthing before you do?
21:19:46saratogathat commit really isn't all that complicated, so I think it shouldn't be too hard to figure out what its breaking
21:20:25funmankugel: i think it should be reverted on trunk, probably better to ask matsch
21:20:30saratogaactually i bet its the change to playback.c that causes the problem, rather then buffering
21:20:48saratogai don't think we should revert on trunk since that will break the clip almost entirely
21:21:04*bertrik spots red
21:21:09saratogabut for release maybe its a good idea
21:21:54 Quit Horscht ("Verlassend")
21:22:07kugelis that my red?
21:22:17kugeldid I now make rockbox too big for the ondio?
21:22:17saratogai'm going to guess the problem is moving the "buf_set_base_handle(CUR_TI->audio_hid); " from the track change to the end of buffering
21:22:35saratogait probably corrupts a handle if you seek back before the track change
21:23:01kugelI'll have a look
21:23:01JdGordon|kugel: red
21:23:15kugelJdGordon1: see 4 lines above
21:24:25kugelI'm not sure if my commit was the cause
21:25:18JdGordon|dodgey compiler maybe?
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21:26:14pixelmabroken rombox
21:26:27Mode"#rockbox +v Horscht " by rb_voicebot (
21:26:35gevaertsWhy is REG_ENDPTCOMPLETE not 0?
21:26:50pixelmawhy does this patch add so much to targets that don't have a backdrop anyways?
21:27:10*gevaerts suspects that we miss something
21:27:17kugelsaratoga: still happens
21:27:36JdGordon|pixelma: is that the last of the rombox'es that still build?
21:27:39JdGordon|or was?
21:27:58pixelmaPlayer still has it - and flashed H100s
21:28:11JdGordon|+hwcodec/bmp then :)
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21:28:38kugelit added a tiny bit, because of the new functions in the multiscreen api
21:28:43saratogakugel: still hapens with that change reverted?
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21:28:46Mode"#rockbox +v einhirn " by rb_voicebot (
21:29:22JdGordon|kugel: wach a #if blaa around it then,
21:29:41TheSevenliar: obviously there are still problems with that patch... I know, there are also a bunch of issues without it, but I would rather like to first fully figure out what's going on instead of risking to break it on devices that worked previously
21:30:08pixelmakugel: well, it seems much to me after reading the commit message and thinking that backdrop handling shouldn't add anything to targets that don't have backdrops
21:30:53saratogakugel: it might also be worth testing it with this patch:
21:31:03saratogasince I think it adds additional checks when overwriting data
21:31:40pixelmaI don't understand the delta - colour targets saw some decrease and greyscale increase
21:32:43kugelpixelma: it's not clear to me why the others got a decrease as well
21:32:55JdGordon|but crap, are we that close to losing the ondio rombox?
21:33:00kugelputting #ifdefs around defeats the purpose of the api
21:33:08JdGordon|no it doesnt
21:33:10JdGordon|not entirely
21:33:20JdGordon|do it to make evryone happy... I'll be removing it anyway
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21:33:44JdGordon|I'm entirely changing the backdrop API anyway
21:33:58Mode"#rockbox +v stripwax " by rb_voicebot (
21:34:00TheSevenliar: I see that you patch has shrunken quite a bit though
21:34:40TheSeventhere are still some hunks which will need further explanations
21:35:07pixelmaJdGordon|: OndioSP even. OndioFM seems to have lost it for a while (don't know exactly because it was broken on mine for even longer due to the backlight mod)
21:35:49JdGordon|you could get it back probbaly by stripping down the skin parser to a more minimal version
21:36:00kugelso, it would've been broken within the next week or two anyway, most likely
21:36:11JdGordon|it gets alot of tags which only work on bitmap, but really need a larger screen
21:36:16pixelmanice argument :\
21:36:35kugelmaybe shrink some static buffers instead
21:36:45JdGordon|will that help?
21:37:02kugelnot sure, bss probably doesn't count, does it=?
21:37:47pixelmanah, band aid "fixes" aren't worth it either
21:38:07gevaertshm, this could be a HID bug
21:38:44JdGordon|#if HAVE_FULL_SKIN_PARSER around most of it and you should get back a bit, enough to live for a few more weeks anyway
21:39:50pixelmaI wonder which tags you are thinking of. And I also think an arbitrary differentiation (and code complication) isn't worth it
21:40:02kugelwe could maybe make it survive 3.5, but I'm sure we cannot have in for 3.6 without cutting majorly
21:40:39JdGordon|the playlist viewer, that added 2k or something didnt it?
21:41:05JdGordon|of course removing the database will get you more
21:41:14*JdGordon| has numbers in the forums somewhere
21:41:40gevaertsWe're talking about a few hundred bytes, for the release?
21:41:59pixelmawell, if the OndioSP is broken now which is the least feature packed of the targets with the smallest ROM size (IIRC)...
21:42:02kugelit seems like an increase in that magnitute broke it yes
21:42:08JdGordon|less than 200 by the looks of it
21:42:27pixelmagevaerts: only OndioSP, it was broken for others for a long time :\
21:43:09TheSevensounds like this should be fixable by some optimization, without dropping functionality
21:43:28gevaertsTheSeven: I think HID is buggy, and there are some cases where it calls usb_drv_send_nonblocking() more than once without waiting for the result
21:43:31kugelyes, but only in the short term
21:43:55gevaertsI'll do my best to fix it soon...
21:43:57JdGordon|#if the api and get rid of the stubs... it shouldnt be difficult
21:44:17 Quit einhirn ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
21:44:49gevaertsTheSeven: you were also able to break usb with HID activity while doing MSC, right?
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21:45:53TheSevengevaerts: I tried to reproduce the crash yesterday and couldn't
21:46:29TheSevenit was just dropping lots of events if there was MSC traffic in parallel
21:46:46TheSeven(which is especially nasty if key release events get lost)
21:47:10gevaertscould still be the same. I hope to have a patch to test *very* soon
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21:52:49gevaertshm, it's not that simple
21:53:50***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
21:53:53*bertrik wonders about mcuelenaere's volume problem
21:55:13TheSevenliar: around?
21:57:44liarTheSeven: yep
21:57:48kugeldoes the red need to be fixed now? I'm feeling it will break a few times during the next week
21:58:23gevaertsit looks like I'm missing an interrupt or something like that :\
21:58:53AlexPkugel: In the branch?
21:59:12bertrikthe solution suggested was to do a multiply at a very low level, but isn't that going to take a lot of processing power?
21:59:16kugelif 150bytes break it, any commit can break it
21:59:33kugelwe didn't get many translation updates in, right?
22:00:11 Quit Strife89 ("Going home.")
22:00:26kugelno call for translators mail too
22:00:29TheSevenliar: There are still some things I don't really like about that patch
22:00:51TheSevenWhile I think that most of it can't hurt, there are some questionable things
22:01:05komputesOk, done formatting my iPod under windows, is this 3.5? ->
22:01:14TheSevenone of those is removing the reset from the chip type detection
22:01:17saratogawe haven't released 3.5 yet
22:01:53 Quit robin0800 (Remote closed the connection)
22:02:30TheSeventhe type detection will not be called often (before your patch), as it is only being done during initialization, where we should really reset the flash, and this won't be a noticable performance hit
22:03:24gevaertskomputes: using rbutil will be easier
22:03:29pixelmakugel: it would be nice if the release could have rombox on the OndioSP still. And I have a German update almost ready, just waiting for the "custom statusbar" decision
22:04:00komputesgevaerts: rbutil 1.2.3 comes with rb 3.5?
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22:04:02bertrikmultiply factors for volume are logarithmic, so perhaps the volume multiply can be done with a couple of lookup tables and a shift instead
22:04:13gevaertskomputes: see what saratoga just said
22:04:22Mode"#rockbox +v moos " by rb_voicebot (
22:04:36TheSevenhowever, your next hunk makes it being called after every powerup, *without* resetting the chip first, which may be in an unknown state after powering it up
22:04:39kugelpixelma: nothing is going to change for the sbs for 3.5 IIUC
22:05:01AlexPkomputes: And Rbutil doesn't "come" with anything, it will install either the current build or the latest release
22:05:07komputessaratoga: gevaerts: I understand it's not officially out, but I was told to install that instead of 3.4
22:05:11AlexPkomputes: 3.5 will be released in a week
22:05:19TheSevenalso, I'm wondering what the reason for the second nand_set_fmctl0 in the type detection function is
22:05:28gevaertskomputes: you were told that if you like beta testing, you should install a current build
22:05:47saratogakomputes: if you understand that it doesn't exist maybe asking us why you can't install it isn't the best course of action
22:05:54pixelmaalthough I wouldn't like "fixing" by disabling things and making up unnecessary differences. If that would be the only way, I'd prefer consistenx
22:05:54saratogajust install the current build if you want the latest build
22:05:56komputesAlexP: so I could just wait until then, or if given instructions I can beta test 3.5
22:06:07pixelmaconsistency over rombox
22:06:20AlexPkomputes: Just install a current build
22:06:36AlexPWhich rbutil will do
22:07:37kugelJdGordon|: do you want to see that paste or can I commit it?
22:07:44TheSevenI don't like the thing you did in the powerup function at all. I would rather store the number of detected chips during initialization and then reset that number of chips, instead of detecting them every time (which will run into timeouts on every powerup on devices where not all banks are populated)
22:07:48pixelmakugel: I thought that the menu item rename should especially be *for* 3.5, so that the first release with the feature has it with a correct (and more descriptive) name
22:07:50JdGordon|kugel: can i see it?
22:07:52kugelit's just clearing the screen and forcing a sbs update in enter_wps
22:08:08kugelI posted the link, but you're at work right?
22:08:18JdGordon|im on lunch break :)
22:08:26AlexPpixelma: I agree, the rename should be pre-3.5
22:09:04JdGordon|me too, but I dont like any of the suggestions so far :)
22:09:17TheSevenliar: If those things are fixed, and it received some (successful) testing by users of ipods that didn't have any problems before, I'm about to commit it.
22:09:53JdGordon|kugel: that actually works? backdrop show needs to be before the clear
22:10:08 Quit saratoga ("Page closed")
22:10:09kugelactually it has to be the other way around
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22:10:22JdGordon|that makes no sense
22:10:29kugelbecause clear() overwrites the framebuffer with the backdrop data
22:10:40Mode"#rockbox +v S_a_i_n_t_ " by rb_voicebot (
22:10:48 Quit stripwax ("")
22:10:49JdGordon|right, so you get the old backdrop
22:11:07kugelyes you're right
22:11:28JdGordon|yeah, ok commit that, once you swap the order
22:11:36JdGordon|it shoudlnt be needed though, but whatever
22:11:47kugelwell it is
22:12:35liarTheSeven: that second nand_set_fmctl0 is a bank reselect(datasheet...) but not necessary. i'll fix those things.
22:12:51JdGordon|pixelma: AlexP: what do you tinhk of "Base Skin"? it is slightly more accurate
22:12:55kugelno code path is doing it except if vpm_enable_theme() actually toggles anything
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22:13:31TheSevenliar: oh, that's interesting
22:13:37AlexPJdGordon|: I don't know - I haven't commented principally as I can't think of a decent suggestion.
22:13:37JdGordon|kugel: ok, so you have a specific problem when the wps doesnt disable the sbs and you change the backdrop
22:13:49*kugel thought we wanted to keep the term skin away from the user
22:14:04TheSevenactually the bank should be reselected after doing the chip detection, as we will know the correct timings at that point
22:14:10kugelit also happens with the builtin statusbar
22:14:11TheSevenjust ignoring it won't hurt though
22:14:25TheSevenit will just be a little slower until the next bank select :-)
22:14:28gevaertsI'd call the things petroglyphs
22:14:44JdGordon|petroglyphs it is then!
22:16:08JdGordon| not much there to work with
22:16:35JdGordon|how about "this makum rockbox pretty"?
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22:17:10kugelI think base skin is fine
22:17:11Mode"#rockbox +v einhirn " by rb_voicebot (
22:20:31JdGordon|ok, either way, thats better than custom statubsar (for what its describing), so change ti only in the menu for 3.5
22:20:45JdGordon|unless we do the setting also and break all themes on the site?
22:20:56JdGordon|which we never guarentee they will continue working anyway
22:22:14kugelit would be nice to have working themes if we introduce a new theme-feature with a release
22:22:44gevaertsI don't see a good reason to change the extension
22:22:44JdGordon|I dont think many will break
22:22:59JdGordon|no, the extension is fine, the setting name though
22:23:04JdGordon|or is it just sbs:?
22:23:05gevaertssbs obviously stands for (main) screen base skin
22:23:24kugelyea, it's so obvious!
22:24:18*froggyman didnt know that about .sbs
22:24:41froggymanI never got why it wasnt .csb for custom status bar
22:24:48JdGordon|statusbar skin
22:25:00JdGordon|screen base skin cream makes much more sense
22:25:07amiconnkugel: If you're dealing with address differences, use intptr_t. That's what it's meant for
22:25:23kugelor ptrdiff_t
22:25:28pixelmain that the file extension was slightly less confusing than the setting name
22:26:37JdGordon|ok, the setting name is just "sbs" so that doesnt need to change either
22:26:57JdGordon|so its just change the menu item name to "Base Skin" and thats it?
22:27:15JdGordon|the "custom" option stays in the statusbar setting?
22:27:35 Quit S_a_i_n_t (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
22:29:10CIA-44New commit by kugel (r24336): Fix wps showing parts of the main backdrop in some circumstances.
22:31:55CIA-44New commit by kugel (r24337): Update on even pixel boundaries on the e200v2 for best performance (was forgotten in r24198).
22:35:10CIA-44New commit by kugel (r24338): Fuze: Change pause/exit button in chopper to short home as it's nearly impossible to hold it ...
22:36:32kugelcan I reduce the duration the "saving..." splash shows in bubbles without getting bashed?
22:36:54kugelit's 1s currently (that also means it delays the actualy saving by 1s)
22:37:26funmankugel: can you change the fuze manual for chopper?
22:37:33pixelmaremiinds me of this row hright thing :\
22:37:44pixelmaor height
22:37:44kugelit's not a real bug, but an annoyance (and the change is a no brainer)
22:38:52kugelfunman: it seems the fuze has no button tables for chopper
22:39:37funmanhm a lot of plugins are missing
22:40:10kugelI don't have the tools installed
22:40:27funmanforget about it then, i thought plugins keymaps had been added to the manual
22:40:28kugelthat should work though:
22:40:38funmanwhen is the branch planned ?
22:41:15kugelso, does anyone object to the bubbles change?
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22:51:36gevaertsmaybe a stupid question, but what is the exact effect of disable_irq_save()?
22:52:06gevaertsI mean, what happens to interrupts that would have happened?
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23:00:21kugelcan anyone reproduce FS #10926?
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23:17:23bertrikkugel, I won't mind the bubbles change
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23:21:48kugelFS #10874 - I think I found the cause: the file isn't closed if it wasnt buffered completely
23:22:27gevaertsoh, nice find!
23:24:47linuxstbDidn't mt say that this morning?
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23:30:01kugelgevaerts: the trick is that it handles renaming by not closing apparently
23:30:29gevaertsah, that sounds reasonable (on its own)
23:31:42kugelwhich is why I fail to reproduce it by simply renaming :)
23:31:54kugellinuxstb: indeed, mt found that too
23:32:17gevaertskugel: try moving to a different disk :)
23:32:21kugelI think it should be closed no matter of the renaming thing; that's probably not intended anyway
23:33:25kugelgevaerts: indeed
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23:39:27kugelcool, fixing that (2-liner) makes it behave ok
23:39:32Mode"#rockbox +v CIA-5 " by rb_voicebot (
23:40:14kugelit now skips to about 2s before the end emptying the pcm buffer, then stops. after that the playback engine is still functional
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23:49:57gevaertskugel: so now it also skips on rename?
23:50:20*gevaerts doesn't think we've ever promised it wouldn't
23:52:02gevaertshm, closing the file might have an interesting side effect. If you happen to run a plugin that opens lots of files, couldn't that make rebuffering break?
23:52:21DEBUGEOF from server (Success) (snapshot: netstuff.c line 545)
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23:52:34gevaertsIf it can, it's probably already possible now of course, although maybe harder to trigger
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23:57:11kugelwhat the heck, I can't manage to extract a new :/

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