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#rockbox log for 2010-02-23

00:00:08stripwaxhm, fft plugin is pretty weird actually
00:00:11pamaurysaratoga: the problem is the semantic. what if there are two files with the same names ? And two directories ?
00:00:28saratogawe've been over this a lot of times now
00:00:35stripwaxit seems to think rb->pcm_get_peak_buffer returns interleaves samples, but it does not
00:00:48saratogayou merge directories, and if you have two files with the same name you ignore one duplicate
00:01:14pamaurywhich one ?
00:01:19saratogai don't think it matters
00:01:21linuxstbsaratoga: How do you know they're duplicates?
00:01:27saratogathey have the same name
00:01:34saratogaXBMC does this for music and it works great
00:01:35pamaurysaratoga: I disagree. You could have a priority scheme.
00:01:52pamauryYou could probably do clever things with that
00:02:04saratogawell yeah thats probably more efficient then calling rand, but i don't see that its all that important what the scheme is
00:02:27*JdGordon1 adds it
00:02:33pamauryBecause you don't want a random fs !
00:02:41JdGordon1why not?
00:02:52pamauryThen call it randomfs :)
00:03:16saratogaif you have the same folder and file name on both your SD and internal memory, its probably because you accidentally copied the same album to both
00:03:34saratogai don't see that the choice of which to play really matters, unless internal is somehow faster or more efficient then external
00:04:19 Quit veeloc (Remote host closed the connection)
00:04:46pamauryFor example (not audio file), you could have a fallback version on the internal storage and an up to date version on your SD card. If you insert the SD, you have the up to date version, if not, you still have the fallback version.
00:05:31JdGordon1yes, and especially in the bootloader. boot from sd if its there, or internal otherwise
00:05:42saratogaI think people using rockbox as a text editor are few and far between
00:05:48JdGordon1or read from internal and write to sd
00:05:53saratogaso we should probably be assuming people use it for media files
00:06:41pamaurysaratoga: I personnaliy don't like the unionfs idea but some schemes make much more sense than just "pick a random one"
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00:10:41saratogai didn't say to use random, I said it doesn't matter what you decide to do
00:10:47linuxstbAs gevaerts said, we just need to clearly define the semantics up front, and try to think of all these corner cases. I can see it being useful (although I don't use any targets with card slots)
00:11:30pamauryThe semantics can be user defined ! We which config file to use then ;)
00:11:35pamaury*But which
00:12:06pamauryAnd how do you decice ?
00:12:15pamauryMake a user defined priority between then ;-)
00:12:36JdGordon1with boot arguments of course!
00:13:04*pamaury don't understand
00:13:14JdGordon1(thta was a silly response)
00:13:28JdGordon1either seperate bootloaders hardcoded to choose
00:13:33linuxstbA button press on boot.
00:13:34JdGordon1or a button press chooses the order
00:13:44pamaurySomething like "press ^ << >> ^ ^ on boot to have internal priority"
00:16:26pamauryOr on each boot, the device call saratoga to ask him ;)
00:16:28Buschelgood night!
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00:30:51stripwaxah, I think I've found the problem in fft plugin. kiss_fftr performs TWO real-valued ffts, and it assumes that the two real-valued ffts are interleaved. But, because the fft plugin just copies one channel into the (complex) buffer, it means the sampling frequency is half what the author thinks it is, causing the frequency reflection.
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00:45:41CIA-5New commit by stripwax (r24865): kiss_fftr appears to perform two real-valued ffts in parallel −− so feed it only one signal of size N/2 (as opposed to splitting a single signal of ...
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00:54:21Casainhohello :-)
00:54:48Casainhocan anyone tell me if ARM Cortex M3 would run Rockbox? or Rockbox just run on ARM9?
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00:56:29Casainhoand could Rockbox run with 2MB RAM? or 4MB ram?
00:56:53TheSevenCasainho: cortex m3 should be compatible with older arm cpus, right?
00:57:10TheSevenit would need some fine-tuning as usual, but it should be doable
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00:57:24CasainhoTheSeven: I don't know if is compatible or not. Maybe Rockbox have asm code just for ARM9?
00:57:37TheSeven2mb would be a little tight, but rockbox is running on some 2mb devices (with limited features, buffering etc.)
00:57:59TheSeven4mb should be fine
00:58:08Casainhobecause ARM Cortex is now cheap and run at 100MHz... and it is easy to make a board for it instead ARM9
00:58:24TheSevenCasainho: afaik every arm9 instruction will also work on cortex
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00:59:22CasainhoI wish I could build a board with Cortex M3 at 100MHz, 2MB external RAM, SD Card, little color LCD, buttons and audio codec ic...
00:59:41Casainhoat least I can print now my plastic enclosure for it
01:00:54perfectdrug_what to do with obviously out of date wikipages? or even ones with undesired feature requests? or
01:03:05stripwaxCasainho - rockbox certainly doesn't *only* have code for ARM9. e.g. ipod video and older..
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01:03:45stripwaxIf you a building an M3 board, why only 2MB ram .. ??
01:04:00saratogastripwax: why not just remove kiss_fft entirely
01:04:03saratogawe have a better option now
01:04:39Casainhostripwax: to be cheap
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01:05:16stripwaxsaratoga - true, but it's not exposed to plugins (yet). and we only have ifft not fft. Also the author stated that the actual fft calculation is not the bottleneck of the fft plugin - getting the raw pcm data from the peakbuffer is (allegedly) the bottleneck
01:06:15stripwaxNot that that's any excuse to use 100% CPU when you *do* get the data, of course.
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01:06:41saratogawouldn't an iFFT work as well here ?
01:06:55stripwaxplus kiss_fftr is a real-valued helper function. we should add one of those too, really.
01:07:15stripwaxsaratoga - isn't the split-radix indexing different inverse vs forward?
01:07:26stripwaxoh, but maybe that doesn't matter
01:07:34saratogait is, but the normalized power spectrum should be the same IIRC
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01:08:40saratogathough i'm not sure if plugins are allowed to call code linked in the codecs
01:08:56saratogai guess it shoudl work though
01:09:11linuxstbDo you mean codeclib code?
01:09:35stripwaxit's just a lib, so I guess it ought to work.
01:09:57linuxstbYou'll need to be careful the codec lib isn't using anything from the codec API.
01:10:33linuxstbOr rather, the parts of the codec lib you want to use in a plugin.
01:15:03saratogaI don't think the fft depends on the codeclib at all
01:15:20saratogaor at least it shouldn't
01:17:59stripwaxagree, it shouldn't, hopefully it doesn't
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02:00:23CIA-5New commit by funman (r24866): sd-as3525v2: unaligned transfers are handled properly (with memcpy)
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02:01:08funmanFlynDice: i found a problem is SD/Clip+ with clocks initialisation
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02:01:43funmanin CGU_MEMSTICK and CGU_BASE+0x3c the dividers are not shifted properly (and not checked for overflow)
02:02:44funmanAnd we need to use 400kHz clock for identification phase, but i think none of these clocks can be so low so perhaps we must use MCI_CLKDIV (OF sets CLKENA to 0, modify CLKDIV, and set back CLKENA)
02:03:17funmanlinux code doesn't modify MCI_CLKDIV because of some problem, they switch the original clock to 400kHz instead
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02:23:50soapperfectdrug_, Prune the deadwood
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02:24:42soapThen merge the good stuff with more appropriate pages. Then make new pages containing the good stuff remaining, if need be,
02:25:25soapHopefully at the end of pruning and merging there will be little (if anything) left.
02:25:35perfectdrug_I haven't touched it to not make it prominent again
02:25:53soapFor if there is a lot left then the page probably wasn't ready for the bonfire yet, anyhoo.
02:26:35soapIf you feel the page is full of depreciated info mark it as such with a header asking the page not be added to.
02:27:05soapI wouldn't fear random people adding to a page just because it shows up under the recently edited list.
02:28:26perfectdrug_what would you do with this one ?
02:28:50perfectdrug_most of it is implemented
02:29:04soapIt would be nice if we had a subset of Wikipedia's Policies we could slap on pages needing revision.
02:30:18soapI'd personally shit can it.
02:30:21perfectdrug_I dont know how a wiki is supposed to work anyway, it is just that this page shows under the docs index, is every page added to it?
02:30:44soapAgain - would be nice if we had a tag, as in "Nominated for shitcanning <here is why>"
02:31:26soapsomeone's personal dream list of Rockbox features doesn't belong in the wiki, IMHO.
02:32:17perfectdrug_it is just confusing that LinusN replied to it but it is very old so a nice historical reference
02:32:35soaphistorical reference to /what/?
02:32:49soapJust because it's old doesn't mean it's valuable, IMHO.
02:32:58linuxstbhistorical references are nice, but they do get in the way. So I agree with soap...
02:33:10perfectdrug_i think it is funny to imagine features like aligning text was some time missing and requested
02:33:24JdGordonwtf is that wiki page?!
02:33:58perfectdrug_but it is not important at all and shouldn't be in the docs index, again is every page automatically added to it?
02:34:05JdGordonfrom 2005 :D
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03:40:36Rob2222can anybody help me identify the type of an audio stream?
03:44:03Rob2222ah i think its a windows media stream MP3. rockbox cant play it :(
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04:27:46UnhelpfulRob2222: "windows media stream MP3"?
04:28:07Rob2222yeah, it seems so
04:28:14Rob2222header includes mpeg 1 layer 3
04:28:23Rob2222but it sounds jerky when i call it mp3
04:28:36Rob2222i just write a board post requesting help
04:28:43Rob2222i surrender on this :(
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04:29:17Unhelpfulif it's really mp3 audio, in some funny container, you just need to get it out.
04:30:06Rob2222my favorite internet radio just changed from a shoutcast mp3 stream to a mms:// "windows media stream" that includes mp3 as it seems.
04:30:07Rob2222I can save it with mplayer to a file.
04:30:07DBUGEnqueued KICK Rob2222
04:30:07Rob2222I would like to have that stream to play with rockbox without re-encoding.
04:30:07Rob2222If I name this file .wma I can play it with VLC and Winamp5.
04:30:07***Alert Mode level 1
04:30:07Rob2222If I name this file .mp3 I can play it also, but it sounds jerky.
04:30:07***Alert Mode level 2
04:30:07Rob2222The file header talks about mpeg 1 layer 3.
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04:30:08***Alert Mode level 3
04:30:08Rob2222Unfortunately rockbox isnt able to play it as wma. Only jerky as mp3.
04:30:08***Alert Mode level 4
04:30:08Rob2222I already spent hours to get it done. Here I really need help. :(
04:30:09***Alert Mode level 5
04:30:09Rob2222Can you maybe check, what filetype it is?
04:30:09***Alert Mode level 6
04:30:09Rob2222Can I maybe remove/change some headers to make it rockbox playable?
04:30:10***Alert Mode level 7
04:30:10Rob2222Can I extract the MP3 frames to get a real MP3 without reencoding?
04:30:10***Alert Mode level 8
04:30:10Rob2222If everything goes wring, i have to reencode it with lame.
04:30:11***Alert Mode level 9
04:30:11Rob2222Here is a short sample:
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04:30:34Rob2222i wanted to post link
04:30:50UnhelpfulRob2222: i can't really imagine why you shouldn't be able to extract the mp3 frames.
04:31:02Rob2222i dont know what container it is
04:31:10Rob2222so i dont know which tool im searching for
04:31:16Rob2222didnt want to program a onw
04:31:37Rob2222if you want, you can take a look at tis sample file
04:35:34Rob2222Unhelpful: you have any idea what this is?
04:36:57Unhelpfulmplayer -identify since you know mplayer ;)
04:37:28Rob2222not that good. will try
04:37:45Unhelpfulmpeg audio, ASF container.
04:38:34Rob2222yes, mplayer just says asf
04:38:56Unhelpfulmplayer -dumpaudio stream.wma did... something, anyway.
04:39:03Rob2222it is mpeg 1 layer 3, or?
04:40:12***Alert Mode OFF
04:40:32Rob2222thats it!
04:40:44Rob2222Unhelpful: i love you!
04:40:54Unhelpfulappears to be. ffmpeg -i <infile> -acodec copy <out>.mp3 also works
04:40:58Rob2222dont get it wrong :D
04:41:14Rob2222is ffmpeg no re-encoder?
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04:41:18Rob2222i thought
04:41:25Unhelpfulif you captured it in mplayer with -dumpstream you might be able to save directorly to mp3 with -dumpaudio.
04:41:43Unhelpfulthe "copy" codec doesn't transcode.
04:43:22Rob2222well, -dumpaudio instead of -dumpstream didnt work directly on the online stream
04:43:37Rob2222correcture it works
04:44:04Rob2222damn mplayer is a nice tool
04:44:31Rob2222Unhelpful: thank you very much. was very helpful. you need to change your nick :D
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07:59:56CIA-5New commit by funman (r24867): Clipv2/Clip+: no need for -mlong-calls
08:00:01CIA-5New commit by funman (r24868): as3525v2: share more of system_init() between the 2 SoCs ...
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08:08:36CIA-5New commit by funman (r24869): sd-as3525v2: correct CGU_MEMSTICK setting, shift divider ...
08:13:03S_a_i_n_tIs there a way I can manually set a new keymap for Rockboy *without* using the (buggy as hell...for iPod at least) "Set Keys" function in the Rockboy menu?
08:13:20S_a_i_n_t"Set Keys" doesn;t seem to register taps on the clickwheel...
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08:20:46amiconngevaerts: Did you experiment with -fPIE and -Wl,pie ?
08:23:00amiconnIt also seems that you need to use -fpic (and perhaps -fpie) for coldfire (i.e. not their capitcal-letter equivalents)
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08:29:12amiconngevaerts: -Wl,-pie of course
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08:29:53CtcpIgnored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
08:29:53*amiconn just found an interesting assembler option for sh...
08:34:08amiconnHmm, seems it's redundant
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10:15:22gevaertsamiconn: yes, if I do that I need to declare a lot more sections (6 or 7 IIRC) that I have to figure out the meaning of first
10:15:56gevaertsat least on m68k
10:34:42S_a_i_n_tcan %mv (volume increasing/decreasing) be used conditionally in a WPS?
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11:30:31cfpHello everyone!
11:32:26cfpI'm developing a plugin, and I'd like to fire an event periodically (say, every 10 minutes for example). In the meantime, I just need my plugin to wait. Is there a way to do this? I've found the timer_register function, but I don't quite understand how it works. Plus, I don't really know what to put in my main loop so as not to eat up all system ressources...
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11:56:52pamaurycfp: I don't know anything about timer_register but if you grep "timer_register" in the plugins, you'll see that several of them use it, so can probably inspire from them. There are:
11:57:25pamauryalpine_cdc.c, video.c, test_scanrate.c, doom/i_system.c, metronome.c
11:57:31pamauryPerhaps look at metronome
11:57:44Tornecfp: what you probably want to do is to not use that at all
11:57:52Tornecfp: presumably there is a button or similar to exit your plugin
11:57:58Torneso just wait for a button action, with a timeout
11:58:12Tornewhen that returns, check if it's time for the periodic event yet
11:58:17Torneand if not just adjust the timeout and wait again
11:59:01Tornetimer_register is to have callbacks that operate asynchronously from your plugin's main thread of execution, you probably don't need it
12:02:56cfp@Torne good idea indeed
12:03:14cfpbut how do I set a timeout?
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12:05:27Torneor similar :)
12:05:28cfpfor now, I'm simply using rb->get_button()
12:05:50Tornework out when the next event should happen
12:06:00Tornethen each time around, subtract the current time from that and use it as the timeout
12:06:22cfpgot it :) Thanks.
12:06:24Torneif the user presses a button you don't use, or similar, you might get it returning even though neither an interesting button nor the timeout have occurred
12:06:34Torneso you may have to do it multiple times with varying timeouts :)
12:06:41linuxstbAnd if you want to be nice, you should also check for USB being inserted.
12:06:53cfpI've got another question though
12:07:28cfpIIn fact, my plugin checks for the time, and if it's later than a specific time, resumes playback.
12:07:38cfpHow can I do that (resume playback)?
12:08:19linuxstbThere's a playback menu in the plugin lib (apps/plugins/lib/) - that may help
12:08:50gevaertsI suspect audio_resume()
12:08:53cfpI know of this menu indeed. Shall check the code then, thanks :)
12:09:19cfpwell I guess I've got everything I need
12:09:28cfpThansk again everyone
12:09:43cfpThis project is just great =)
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12:57:41p00yahi, i've just installed rockbox onto an ipod 3g, it no longer appears as a volume or in /dev/ (os x 10.5)
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12:58:45p00yahow do i transfer to it? do i have to reboot in the default firmware?
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12:59:22linuxstbYes. Although Rockbox should reboot into disk mode automatically for you. Are you using Rockbox 3.5 or a current build?
13:00:10p00yawhen i plug it in it turns on automatically but just in the default rockbox menu
13:01:09linuxstbWhat if you turn it on, and then plug it in? Also, are you using a USB or firewire cable?
13:03:21linuxstbp00ya: Hmm, looking at the code in Rockbox, it seems that USB detection has not been implemented. So you'll need to always reboot manually. If you turn the hold swich on before inserting USB (when your ipod is off), then it will start the Apple firmware for you.
13:03:49linuxstbFirewire detection seems to be implemented though, if you can use a firewire cable.
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13:05:19amiconnFirewire is also much faster than USB on ipod G3. The usb i/f is only usb 1.1
13:12:40p00yathanks, all working in apple firmware
13:14:02p00yayeah if i had an ieee1394 cable i'd use it ;)
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13:59:31Tornelinuxstb: hm, do we just not know which gpio it is?
14:05:35linuxstbTorne: I've no idea about the 3G. amiconn may do.
14:07:16linuxstbTorne: According to this page, a GPIO pin indicates "USB power", which I think is all we have on later ipods - But on later ipods, we do (or should) try and distinguish between usb power and a proper connection.
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14:21:43Lloreanlinuxstb: I think when swusb came the distinguishing got lost for a while.
14:21:46LloreanI'm not sure if it's back yet.
14:21:54*Llorean hasn't updated in some time.
14:25:51TorneIt's distinguished on the later ipods for sure, yes
14:25:58Tornethere is a seperation between usb attached and usb inserted
14:26:31LloreanI just remember that for a while my nano was requiring me to hold Menu when inserting a charger again.
14:26:35LloreanBut that was some time back now
14:29:00Torneit should work, anyway :)
14:29:21LloreanWell, it might. :)
14:29:45Tornethat's what should means, no? :)
14:29:52Torne"it might, but we mean for it to" :)
14:31:37Llorean"should" never associates with whether it is or isn't in my head, I guess.
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14:31:56Llorean"It doesn't work, but it should" and "Well it should work, and yes, I guess it does" both are valid statements. :-P
14:32:27rasherSomeone should possibly create a matrix on the wiki with the various stuff you can insert and a note whether or not Rockbox DTRT
14:32:50LloreanLike the accessories page?
14:33:26rasherExcept just for chargers/data connections
14:33:28Tornetoo complicated
14:33:42Tornei still need to do that usb power rework ;)
14:33:57Torne(too complicated == accessories page)
14:34:34Torneit would be quite good to know which targets support some kind of power control, also
14:34:42Tornethough that would be a matter of asking devs rather than users
14:35:21rasherThere seems to be no one with clear knowledge of which devices do what
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14:35:35Tornewell no, but lots of people know whether *one* device does something
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14:35:52Tornei know what the PP ipods do, TheSeven knows what nano2g does, etc :)
14:35:52rasherExactly my point
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14:37:04*Torne pulls up his usb power branch and tries to remember what he was doing
14:37:07gevaertsWhat we need is a mailing list with devs on it where you can ask that sort of thing
14:37:10Tornegevaerts: hehe
14:37:10gevaertsOh, wait...
14:37:27Tornelots of the people who actually know useful stuff for specific targets are not around any more though it seems ;)
14:39:06TheSevenhey, big news!
14:39:34TheSevenwe have a working exploit for *all* the ipod classics and the nano3g/4g!
14:39:55TheSeveni'm porting ibugger right now
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14:41:28rasherTheSeven: awesome
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14:44:53TorneTheSeven: yay! :)
14:44:57linuxstbTheSeven: Ah nice. I should be able to help with the 2g classic.
14:45:01Tornehow was that found?
14:45:15*linuxstb offers TheSeven a beer
14:46:24TheSevenD:\Daten\Projekte\iPod\tools>ibugger dumpstate
14:46:25TheSevenConnected to iBugger Loader v0.1.1 on iPod Nano 3G, USB version 00.01
14:46:27TheSevenGetting target state...
14:46:28TheSevenError: Device doesn't support this function!
14:46:45TheSevenwoah, working almost out of the box! (it's normal for a loader to not support that function
14:47:38*GodEater looks forward to irritating Mrs GodEater even further by installing Rockbox on every single device she owns
14:48:20TheSevenlinuxstb: do you have your classic around again?
14:48:43linuxstbTheSeven: I'll have it from this weekend.
14:51:18*TheSeven just dumped the nano3g bootrom
14:53:46linuxstbTheSeven: So is this exploit just uploading something to the ipod whilst its in DFU mode? i.e. it doesn't (directly) enable any kind of permanent installation of code?
14:54:50TheSevenlinuxstb: the "permanent" firmware image is probably verified by the same code, with the same bug :-)
14:55:14TheSevenwe won't be able to sign a valid firmware like we did for the 2g, but we can probably make it automatically exploit itself on boot
14:55:47TheSeveni'll write a loader app to do that, which will then run a normal bootloader in a sane way, the bootloader itself won't need to deal with this
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15:01:08linuxstbTheSeven: So is your USB code the same as the nano2g, or have you already changed things for the Classic/later ipods?
15:01:31TheSevenit's a hybrid between nano2g and nano4g code that appears to work on the nano/classic
15:01:55TheSevenand of course some drivers stripped at the moment
15:02:30linuxstbAt least on the Classics, disk access will (hopefully) just be standard ATA, so none of that FTL nonsense to worry about.
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15:07:28amiconnlinuxstb: Afaik the G3 can't be powered from USB, hence there is no gpio pin to detect that
15:07:37amiconnWe'd need an usb stack...
15:07:48linuxstbamiconn: So the IPL wiki is wrong?
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15:13:24amiconnNot sure. The pin might actually indicate usb power, but the ipod G3 cannot be powered/charged from usb
15:13:51amiconnWe should still distinguish between an usb charger (even if it cannot charge) and a real usb port
15:14:11amiconnUnfortunately there is no active dev who has an ipod G3, afaik
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15:30:25AlexPTheSeven: Great news, congrats :)
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15:33:58ZagorTheSeven: would some more hardware help you? the rockbox fund is eagerly standing by!
15:34:44TheSevenZagor: probably not much. time would be better :-)
15:35:05TheSeventhere's still enogh work ahead on the nanos to keep me busy for a year
15:35:21Zagora slave or two, then?
15:35:39topikinvest in cloning research
15:35:40TheSevenwell, they would need to be pretty knowledgeable slaves :-)
15:35:50TheSevenyes, clones would be an idea
15:35:56topikmature-ish clones
15:35:57parta development grant is what you need
15:36:02AlexPJust order them to be knowledgeable
15:36:06AlexPslaves have to obey
15:36:20topikobey or revolt
15:36:37AlexPThe Rockbox fund can supply whips :)
15:37:51partmy sansa e200 hold key broke today, and I was wondering if a software keylock has been implemented on any other targets
15:38:03linuxstbpart: Yes
15:38:11partoh, cool, which target?
15:39:10linuxstbAll the Archoses I think
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15:40:49partlinuxstb: thanks, I'll take a look
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15:42:10pamauryTheSeven: cloning is easy no ? TheSeven->clone();
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15:42:29linuxstbpart: It seems to be enabled if you undefine HAS_BUTTON_HOLD - see apps/action.c
15:42:44linuxstbAnd you need to search for "lock", not "hold"
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15:56:30pamauryTheSeven: on which nanos are you working ?
15:57:05TheSevenmainly 2g and 4g, right now i'm trying to make ibugger work on the 3g to be able to pass that one to others
15:57:25pamaurywhat is ibugger ?
15:57:49TheSevenmy usb-based debugger for the nanos
15:58:33pamauryah, so you are able to run code on the 2g and 4g already ? (I know nothing about the current nano status :))
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16:03:22AsaelReiterI can't load rockbox on clipv2. Is that expected?
16:04:12pamauryTheSeven: is there any documentation or are you mostly doing reverse engineering ?
16:05:52TheSevenpamaury: 90% reverse engineering
16:05:53linuxstbAsaelReiter: I think so, yes.
16:06:17TheSevensome inaccurate preliminary datasheet for a similar chip exists, but... you know
16:06:19UnhelpfulAsaelReiter: clipv2 is not usable yet
16:06:26FlynDiceAsaelReiter: yes but getting closer!
16:06:50AsaelReiterthanks all
16:07:04pamauryTheSeven: I guess it's hard work then
16:07:24AsaelReiter(I saw that funman did a lot of work, and I hoped...)
16:09:38pamauryAre you the only one working on that ?
16:09:48 Quit AsaelReiter (Quit: CGI:IRC)
16:10:55TheSevenit seems like i'm the only one who is actually writing code and reading disassemblies
16:11:08TheSeventhere are some others who are helping with the testing at least
16:12:31pixelmaI seem to remember preglow asking about the 3rd gen Nano (though I could remember wrong)
16:14:48pamauryTheSeven: is it possible to help things ?
16:16:06linuxstbpamaury: Do you own any of the newer ipods? (3g/4g nano or any of the Classics)
16:17:01pamauryNo, so I guess it's hard to do something ;)
16:17:19linuxstbStep 1 would be to go out and buy a new toy...
16:18:33rasherZagor: svn www/playerpics seems rather outdated
16:19:04Zagorreally? how?
16:19:20rasherHm, hang on a moment
16:19:48rasherAh no, nevermind me
16:20:38linuxstbIs there still a problem with the e200r on the site - i.e. it shouldn't have its own main build or voice files.
16:21:41Zagorwas that a question or a statement? :)
16:24:17*linuxstb adds a "?"
16:24:48linuxstbI don't think this page should show the e200r -
16:25:26linuxstbAnd the v3.5 e200r-specific voice file should be removed from the download server.
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17:23:07TheSevendo we implement the full ipod accessory protocol as listed here?
17:24:02pamauryTheSeven: which skills are required to work on theses devices ?
17:25:35pamauryPerhaps some points of the protocol are not necessary to implement. I see things about images which are not crucial is this protocol
17:25:41TheSevenit's mostly a matter of reading disassemblies and then writing some demo/testing code to understand the hardware interfaces
17:28:13TheSevenand when you have worked it out, implementing a rockbox driver for whatever you were working on, or building a standalone tool for accessing it (depending on what it is)
17:28:41pamaurydoes it require to open it or not ? (depends on the device version ?)
17:30:14TheSevenwe have reached a stage where opening it shouldn't be neccessary for most things
17:30:33rasherpamaury: I'm sure people would like these image things to work though
17:31:20pamauryrasher: true but it's not the most important thing to work one. Music is more important than pictures for a DAP first :)
17:32:55pamauryapple discontinued the nano3g/4g, isn't it ?
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17:43:23pamauryhum, I'm tempted but I don't know if I have the necessary skills to work on it.
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17:51:39gevaertsthevillain: if you have a question, just ask!
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18:00:57mitkHi. I want to add polish letters to Nimbus-12 font. Is it allowed? Are there any legal issues with it?
18:02:59rashermitk: none at all - knock yourself out!
18:03:10rashermitk: And please post the updated file on the patch tracker
18:03:39mitkOk. Thanks
18:04:04*iq wonders after reading the 'Rockbox Architecture' page that why bootloader is not treated as a part of firmware.
18:04:56linuxstbiq: The bootloader is about 95% code from firmware, plus 5% the code in bootloader/. What do you mean by "treated as a part of firmware" ?
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18:06:07Tornethe bootloader is an app that sits on top of th efirmware, the same as "app" is an app that sits on top of firmware
18:06:15Torneit just happens that bootloader's main() does something different
18:08:32iqI am new to this so please forgive my ignorance :-)
18:09:22iqSo the bootloader here is the output of mkamsboot, which is Original Bootloader + RockBox Bootloader + Original Firmware ?
18:10:43mitkrasher: One more question. Updated file or diff?
18:11:04iqRockBox bootloader decides which firmware to load, either Original firmware or the RockBox firmware.
18:11:37iqRockBox firmware has many threads and one of the thread is RockBox application?
18:12:27iqlinuxstb, I didn't find the word 'bootloader' on the Architectuer page
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18:12:57rashermitk: diff is slightly preferable, but it's not so important with fonts
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18:13:51linuxstbiq: In general, "bootloader" is what gets compiled when you select "B" in tools/configure - i.e. the code for your target in bootloader/
18:14:46linuxstbiq: mkamsboot is very specific to the AMS Sansa devices, and contains a very simple "pre-bootloader", which then either boots the Rockbox bootloader, or runs the original firmware.
18:14:56topiki think he's asking about the different parts involved in the mechanism to run rockbox, linuxstb
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18:15:08iqlinuxstb, ya, that I understood. I did that for my Clip+ and it worked just fine.
18:15:31iqtopik, yes, that's correct :)
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18:18:51topikthe distinction between rockbox and its bootloader is not as big as you make it out
18:19:13topikas i believe it, the bootloader is just enough code to start rockbox
18:19:37topikrockbox is not one of many threads, it is the complete firmware replacement
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18:21:44iqthanks topik - BTW, I was on this page:
18:21:58topikthat page is somewhat dated though i suppose, but gives a good start on some of the project specific words
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18:23:16iqOkay. So maybe I should move on :) Because, according to this page RockBox is split into two main sections, Firmware and Application.
18:23:47rasherNo, this is correct
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18:24:05iqAnd under Multithreading section, it says "the application itself being contained in a single thread also known as the Main thread."
18:24:12topikthe firmware (core) is device speficic and contains things like drivers for the hardware
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18:24:53topikapplication contains a lot of things like user interface, codecs, applications etc
18:24:53iqSo, that's what made me think that the RockBox App runs as one of the thread of Firmware/OS
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18:25:35BiontI have an idea for the base skin and main menu. extending the %cs functionality and getting rid the main menu displaying the top row (Rockbox/Settings/Playlist/...). Would that be feasible? That would open up possibilities for themers and could even save screen space (by using multifont or images)
18:25:59topikit _is_ the firmware/os and starts threads for tasks like playing music etc
18:26:11iqtopik, okay - got it :)
18:26:52Biontdoes that sound good? should I open a forum discussion about that?
18:27:19iqSo now I know why bootloader is not part of the OS because it is more like GRUB that loads the OS.
18:27:31Torneiq: most of the threads belong to the firmware because they handle hardware specific things
18:27:44Torneiq: and ther eis one main thread which runs the applicatoin, but the application also creates a few other threads.
18:28:30Torneour bootloader is more like, er, linuxbios than grub
18:28:56iqTorne, that makes sense
18:28:57Torneit's a "real" copy of the OS, with the same drivers/etc as the main app
18:29:10Tornewell, some of the same drivers
18:29:11topiksurely only the drivers for stuff that matter early on
18:29:13Torneit doesn't include them all
18:29:19Tornebut the ones that are included are the same
18:29:58Tornewhereas grub has no code in common with linux :)
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18:30:48iqTorne, That's a major difference - very helpful -thanks :)
18:31:00topikiq, this page even has a pretty diagram!
18:31:38iqcool :)
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18:44:17AlexPBiont: You can already turn the top line off no?
18:44:45AlexPsettings/general/file view/show path
18:44:59AlexPoh, sorry, you mean in the menus
18:45:01AlexPignore me :)
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19:59:57BiontalexP: sorry for answering so late.If you can already turn off the top row, that's great. All that'd be left are some improvements of the %cs-tag . cool
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20:07:52AlexPBiont: I don't think you can, I misread what you said
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20:08:56*JdGordon_ spots talk of %cs and wonders if he should read the log?
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20:22:55BiontAlexP: so do you think it's a good idea? I think it would allow for lots of new theme layouts
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20:23:38AlexPBiont: I'm not too bothered really :)
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20:26:16BiontAlexP: No problem :) I can still start a forum discussion
20:27:12JdGordon_how annoyed would everyone be if I turned the standard list into a skinable list? so you could position the items and icons and title anywhere you wanted, and different colours/fonts? :)
20:28:38BiontJdGordon_: I thought it would be great if there could be an option to turn off the top row of the main menu in favour of an improved %cs tag
20:29:30JdGordon_how are the two related at all?
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20:30:46BiontThe top row displays rockbox/settings/theme settings and so on, which would also be possible with %cs. But that top row is not accessible for themers, while the %cs tag is
20:31:16Biontmaybe I'm wrong, but that's about what %cs is for, it just doesn't "support" too many screens atm
20:31:27JdGordon_yeah, pretty much
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20:31:44JdGordon_I thing I asked in one forum thread (or irc maybe) how much flexibility we want that tag to have
20:31:55 Quit gevearts (Client Quit)
20:32:15BiontI love the idea of displaying images or some sort of "adress bar" instead of a fixed part of the main menu
20:32:55BiontDunno if it's feasible, though. I'm just a theme designer :D
20:36:13JdGordon_I'm tempted to make the title text avialable to skins and fix it so the title can be removed in the menus so you could almost do whatever you wanted
20:37:42JdGordon_I'm not sure how to do that though
20:41:46 Quit Zagor (Quit: Clint excited)
20:41:52JdGordon_any forum admins online? scorche`?
20:44:05JdGordon_checkwps is bloody usueless!
20:44:16 Quit sudoman (Quit: Page closed)
20:44:43gevaertsYou broke it again? ;)
20:46:21JdGordon_no, it builds, its just useless
20:46:38JdGordon_it doesnt dump the debug info when a parse fails?!
20:48:10 Quit advcomp2019 (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
20:53:42JdGordon_a #define isnt set correctly apparently
20:55:14JdGordon_#if defined(DEBUG) || defined(SIMULATOR) fails for checkwps!
20:55:21JdGordon_except -DDEBUG is in checkwps.make
20:56:07JdGordon_anyone who knows make files got a minute to check that?
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20:58:46linuxstbJdGordon_: Which file is that line in?
20:58:49gevaertscheck what precisely?
20:59:08***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
20:59:48JdGordon_DEBUG should be defined in the makefile so the debug stuff gets built, which it apparently is
21:00:02JdGordon_how do I get it to display the cc command for each.c file?
21:00:35gevaertsit's not defined properly
21:00:37gevaertsmake V=1
21:01:52 Quit cjcopi (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
21:02:25JdGordon_-DDEBUG isnt there untill the LD step
21:03:24gevaertsHow about ?
21:04:15JdGordon_it hit my #error :)
21:04:48JdGordon_that worked
21:05:10gevaertsEither that or add __PCTOOL__ to the list in the source
21:05:11JdGordon_can you ci it please :) I'm supposed to be working
21:05:56CIA-5New commit by gevaerts (r24870): Add -DDEBUG to the checkwps build. The tool is supposed to give debug info
21:06:10 Quit krazykit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
21:06:49JdGordon_ERR: Failed parsing on line 0 : ERR: Conditional syntax error after token 0: "No token"
21:06:52JdGordon_hardly helpful :p
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21:25:52JdGordon_kugel broke checkwps with r24814 :<
21:26:08JdGordon_it now fails to parse if images arnt loaded, which is always in checkwps
21:26:52linuxstbDidn't checkwps load images in the past?
21:27:04JdGordon_I dont think so
21:27:13linuxstbI'm sure it did.
21:28:04JdGordon_well, it tries to, but it looks like the themesite isnt putting the images int he right folders
21:28:22linuxstbWell, the theme site is something else...
21:28:32JdGordon_rasher: which file is the checkwps check called in>?/
21:29:16BiontJdGordon_: Should I consider starting a forum discussion about the %cs/main menu thing?
21:29:32JdGordon_you can consider it
21:30:00BiontI'll consider it. See you, then, I'm off ;)
21:30:27 Quit Biont (Quit: CGI:IRC)
21:32:23JdGordon_domonoky: rasher: ping?
21:32:57domonokypong ?
21:33:30JdGordon_am I reading this correctly? each theme is unzipped and then checkwps is run from that themes folder alongside its .rockbox dir?
21:35:16JdGordon_and if so, would it be better to cd into .rockbox/wps before running checkwps, or pass in the wps folder as a checkwps argument?
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21:37:34domonokyJdGordon_: yes, each theme is unzipped to a temp folder, cd into tempfolder, and execute: "<path to checkwps>/<specific checkwps binary> <file to check>
21:37:47JdGordon_thats causing issues now
21:38:03JdGordon_checkwps currently expects the wps images to be in the cwd
21:38:20JdGordon_so one of my above suggestions need to happen
21:38:29rasherJdGordon_: I'd say fix checkwps
21:38:50rasherto expect cwd to be the root folder
21:39:06JdGordon_well no, thats annoying for regular users
21:39:23rasherAnd what happens when checkwps starts checking other files?
21:39:33gevaertsyou mean those regular users who haven't ever noticed that checkwps was broken?
21:39:53JdGordon_ok, fair enough
21:40:10domonokycant it get the images from the dir relativ to the file we point it to ? ie search images at <Path to file>/../wps/<themename> ?
21:40:18gevaertsThose have a .rockbox directory anyway as well, otherwise you can't test for real
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21:41:14JdGordon_./ is easiesr than ./ .rockbox/wps/
21:41:25JdGordon_maybe the first can be made to work thgouh
21:42:32domonokyJdGordon_: both versions could work, if the images are searched relative to the sbs/wps file.
21:45:37JdGordon_:( I dont know if my very simple change to checkwps.make fixed this or not
21:47:11JdGordon_removeing -DWPS_DIR=\".\" from the FLAGS line in checkwps.make
21:47:47iqDo you run just once when build a new machine?
21:47:58punktJdGordon_: Hi, can I bug you to commit either patch in FS #10982 (%Tk or armed-touchregions)?
21:47:59JdGordon_usually twice
21:48:15*JdGordon_ always forgets to manually fix the make line the first time
21:48:28 Quit AsaelReiter (Quit: CGI:IRC)
21:48:30JdGordon_punkt: which would you prefer?
21:48:41iqJdGordon, are you serious :) ?
21:48:54punktI prefer the armed touchregions.
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21:50:14JdGordon_patch looks fine, but I'm at work soo cant really do anything about it now :p
21:50:47punktJdGordon_: Ok, thanks.
21:53:31*iq thinks he asked a really silly question
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21:56:34foalyHey, has the process for installing a voice file changed? I've tried both generating one and downloading one from the site and putting it in my .rockbox/langs directory (english.voice for the gigabeatf) and am not getting any speech. Did I break something?
21:56:55JdGordon_is the voice menus setting enabled?
21:57:06foalyThis is a fresh install, btw. I compiled it from the latest svn source.
21:58:11foalyI think so. Just to make sure I added "talk menu: on" to the config.cfg file and rebooted, but it didn't fix it
21:59:58foalyI can play files just fine, not sure if it helps any.
22:01:31foalyNo idea what could be causing it, both the english.lng and english.voice are in the .rockbox/langs directory and by default the voice menus option should be enabled I think?
22:03:35gevaertsprobably a silly question, but the language is set to english, right?
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22:04:32pixelmaanother silly one: and it is a voice file for the Gigabeat F?
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22:06:52foalyYes to both of those. I even removed the .rockbox directory and tried again, to ge trid of any old stuff that might be messing it up. Didn't work
22:07:06foalyur, s/ge/get
22:11:09foalyDoes it matter that root owns the .voice file?
22:11:10 Quit Grahack (Quit: Tu m'as vu ?)
22:11:55gevaertsit's FAT, so that's meaningless
22:12:41 Quit Luca_S (Quit: CGI:IRC (EOF))
22:12:50*gevaerts tries to reproduce
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22:19:08ArmandiuxFFT is very good, good job.
22:20:05gevaertsfoaly: voice does indeed seem to be broken. I have voice with 3.5 and not with the current build
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22:21:01JdGordon_well thats only 300 or so commits to figure out which broke it
22:21:10*domonoky has voice with current build on h120..
22:21:48domonokygevaerts: on which target did you try ?
22:21:53gevaertsgigabeat f
22:21:54TheSevengevaerts: voice didn't work at all?
22:22:06TheSeveni had voice on nano2g only some days ago, and it seemed to work
22:22:10gevaertsI heard nothing at least
22:22:31*gevaerts decides to start by blaming r24712
22:22:34domonokythere is also a forum post about no voice on gigabeat S
22:23:01gevaertsah, any revision there?
22:23:26*foaly peers at svn changelogs to see if he can find anything.
22:23:43gevaertsI don't remember any voice changes
22:23:46domonokyhe mentions its broken somewhere before r24843,
22:23:58domonoky"a couples of days ago"
22:24:21gevaertsI think the most likely culprit is the mdct merge. That at least touches codecs
22:26:14domonokyso "someone" who expiriences the problem, should do some bisecting to find the exact revision where it broke :-)
22:26:52foalyShould I try compiling r24712?
22:27:07gevaertsI'm bisecting now
22:28:05Armandiuxcan the FFT plugin have a preset suport for make more visualizations, maybe a gui (or command line) for make a script, etc??
22:28:11JdGordon_which codecs though?
22:28:20gevaerts24711 still works
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22:29:59foalyShould I go back to r24711 for now?
22:30:17gevaerts24750 also works
22:30:20CIA-5New commit by tomers (r24871): Quickscreen: Hande case where not all quick settings are defines ...
22:30:26 Quit parafin (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
22:30:59domonokyfoaly: or help us to find out which revision broke it :-)
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22:31:48gevaertsA voice tells me that 24810 is OK
22:31:56CIA-5New commit by FlynDice (r24872): sd-as3525v2: Add some register bit descriptions.
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22:32:30domonokyArmandiux: feel free to extend the plugin, and provide a patch :-)
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22:33:05AlexPWhat is the fft plugin? Is it in the manual?
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22:34:35AlexPI can't find it in the manual :/
22:34:43AlexPunless I'm searching for the wrong thing
22:34:54gevaertshm, IIRC archivator provided a manual patch, or at least some text
22:35:02domonokylooks like its still missing in the manual.
22:35:45domonokyFS #11005 has the start for a manual entry about this new plugin.
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22:36:37AlexPOh, I remember
22:36:45AlexPThat patch is pretty pointless
22:37:02AlexPA very non-standard button table and no description of what the plugin actually is
22:37:07AlexPOr screen shots etc
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22:38:35AlexPAnd those lines with several hundred targets in an opt are nasty :)
22:39:25AlexPIf he/someone could write something about what it actually does I'd do the manualification
22:41:15gevaertsr24816 is the one that broke voice
22:42:26gevaertsfoaly: the last working revision is r24815
22:44:09gevaertsfoaly: if you set the language explicitely to english, it will magically start working again
22:44:47foalyAh in config.cfg?
22:45:17*foaly looks at the log for r24816
22:45:28 Quit tomers (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
22:45:49*foaly wonders how that broke speech support
22:46:33gevaertsfoaly: if you do it by editing config.cfg, you need "lang: /.rockbox/langs/english.lng" I think
22:46:47TheSeven is *sloooow*!
22:47:08gevaertsIt breaks voice by setting the default language to "-" instead of ""
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22:48:03JdGordon_bloody hell
22:48:09foalygevaerts: thanks!
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22:48:14JdGordon_that shuold be a simple fix at least
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22:55:54JdGordon_anyone know where lang_core_load() is?
22:56:21JdGordon_and talk_init()
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22:58:06CIA-5New commit by gevaerts (r24873): Fix voice with unset "lang" setting which was broken by r24816. ...
22:58:15JdGordon_I think the simplest fix is to change the lang_file line in the r24816 diff back to how it was
22:59:07gevaertsIf it'
22:59:12***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
22:59:17gevaertss not the proper fix, kugel can improve on it later :)
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22:59:44Bagdergevaerts: thanks for volunteering someone!
22:59:56gevaertsBagder: he's the one who broke it!
23:00:20Bagdershouldn't we then roll him in a tarpit first as well?
23:00:31*foaly giggles
23:00:38JdGordon_can we? :)
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23:03:20Stephen__anyone know who removed the ultima theme for ipod video ?
23:05:46AsusFreakHi. I have a question. Today I wanted to download my new D2/Ipod Video theme. While uploading I got a parsing error of the checkwps instance. I currently use the daily build just to get the multifont support. I suppose that the checkwps tool of the uploading side checks against the last stable build V3.5. Is this right? I remember in the past it was possible to upload themes for the actual build in spite of not being compatibl
23:06:05JdGordon_checkwps is currently broken
23:06:11gevaertsAsusFreak: no. It checks against current and last release
23:06:31gevaertsAnd as JdGordon_ says, current checkwps isn't feeling too well
23:06:42AsusFreakso in which way am i able to check why it went wrong?
23:06:59JdGordon_try again tomrowow
23:07:13AsusFreakOk - that's easy. Thanks.
23:07:55domonokyStephen__: that was me.
23:08:50Stephen__do i just need to credit the people in the theme description ?
23:09:03*domonoky thinks that would be fine.
23:09:12Stephen__ok will i reupload ?
23:09:57domonokyif you give me the revised description, i can also edit and unhide the theme if you want.
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23:10:34Stephen__basically i was just gonna copy wha tit had in the old description ? ->
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23:11:19Stephen__just credit the makers
23:11:47domonokyStephen__: please pastebin me a nice text with the correct credits :-)
23:11:55Stephen__ok 2 mins
23:15:26Stephen__domonoky, that ok ?
23:15:52domonokya bit short, but ok :-)
23:16:13Stephen__short bu sweet, and thanks. i'll be sure to add it to the descriptions in future
23:16:18Stephen__a few more ipod themes to update
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23:22:42Stephen__domonoky, can you also update with the info from
23:24:55Stephen__thanks.i have some other ones i've done from the theme site and not given propercredit
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23:29:22eng1234how are you
23:30:02Stephen__this channel is logged please only discuss rockbox related things
23:30:16eng1234yes i know
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23:32:57eng1234hi dear in my hand mp3 player usb broken
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23:39:08linuxstbeng1234: Do you have a question?
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23:47:29iqWhen I build Simulator of a device, does the firmware become part of the output/build?
23:50:03iqI guess it does. Otherwise why would it work.
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23:50:48gevaertswhat does "firmware" mean in simulator context?
23:55:00iqI am trying to understand this line "Code in firmware/ and apps/ are subject to get simulated", on this document:
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23:55:56iqSince it is a simulator not emulator we do not have the exact firmware as we will have for a real device/hardware.
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23:57:07Tornelots of things in firmware are either not compiled at all for the sim, or are compiled in a radically altered form
23:57:38Tornesince there is no real hardware to have drivers for, and only some possible deviecs make sense to simulate in terms of host OS funcitonality
23:58:05 Quit Farthen (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6/20100115144158])

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