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#rockbox log for 2010-07-21

00:01:11Buscheln1s: another question. will the compiler work when removing "D+=16, V++" from the loop? we could use increment and in/out for [V] and [D]...
00:02:03n1syeah, that should work
00:02:35 Quit milz (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
00:02:40 Join kyle__ [0] (
00:03:01***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:03:26n1si have a real asm function written/converted now, will just need to get it to compile and test/debug
00:03:30Buschelwhat is the syntax for the increment when loading? something like "move.l (%[V])+, %%a5"?
00:03:50Buschelsame for multiple loads?
00:04:40 Quit S_a_i_n_t (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
00:04:56n1sno, movem can not postinc, it can use only straight (%aX) or a 16 bit signed offsett (1234, %aX) / 1234(%aX)
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00:07:59n1sah, i spotted the bug in my asm :)
00:10:47 Quit jfc (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
00:11:04Buschelneed to go to bed now, will be a hard day tomorrow...
00:11:18 Join mt [0] (~mtee@rockbox/developer/mt)
00:11:38Buscheln1s: will read the logs ;o) good luck with the asm! :)
00:12:13 Quit Buschel (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.6/20100625231939])
00:16:36n1sha, it works now
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00:30:14darkenvywhat channel can I get a forum admin or moderator?
00:31:01*gevaerts isn't a moderator, but maybe he can help
00:31:17darkenvyIm trying to sign up for the forum but the capcha is giving me a hard time
00:32:11 Join krazykit [0] (~kkit@
00:32:17Tornetry the audio one, or just give up for ten mins
00:32:25darkenvy(yes I have requested new images, I type tem as I see it but it comes up 'incorrect')
00:32:28Tornethere's some bug in the captcha generator
00:32:39Tornedoes it look like just one character and then maybe a little garbage?
00:32:52darkenvyyea I dont know why I dont get an audio feed either :\
00:33:00darkenvythe first one yes
00:33:24Torneunfortunately all you can do is try later ;)
00:33:29Tornewe're not sure what's wrong with it
00:33:37darkenvyoh I got it
00:33:52Torneyeah, if you eep trying it will give you a non-broken one eventually
00:34:35darkenvywell hey since Im here on a rockbox topic, I just got a ipod classic. We are so many generations later, cant we crack it yet?
00:36:04darkenvyrockbox belongs on the 120gb
00:36:22Torneit is cracked
00:36:30Torneyou can run stuff on it via the notes exploit
00:36:33gevaertsFrom what I understand, there has been some progress, and it is believed that a classic port is doable, but nobody seems to be interested in actually doing it
00:36:37 Quit S_a_i_n_t (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
00:36:54Tornenot sure if ibugger works on it yet
00:37:24darkenvysomeone please tell me more, I'll do official testing if we make progress on this
00:37:34Tornethere's nothing more to tell
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00:37:50darkenvyWhats the notes exploit?
00:37:50Tornesome people cracked the security on the new ipods, i think for all the models except the newest nano
00:38:00Tornebut nobody has done any work to port rockbox to anything except the nano2g
00:38:09darkenvyif I wanted to persue my own cracking....
00:38:22Torneyou need something to actually run, to use the exploit for anything
00:38:51Torneso at minimum you would need ibugger which is the tool people used to load other stuff onto the nano2g in the early stages before it was possibel to boot rockbox directly
00:39:54Torneit needs lots of reverse engineering and development effort, basically
00:40:23Tornei would guess even if someone started right now it'd be a couple months before it was worth a non-developer testing it
00:40:29Torneand nobody has started yet ;)
00:40:39darkenvywill anyone start?
00:40:45Tornei can't predict the future
00:41:24Tornei can only tell you that *I* won't )
00:41:27Tornei can't speak for anyone else
00:41:31darkenvywell... I mean if we can run code on it, even if it was innefficient I would imagine we could get it running as a port
00:41:54 Join planetbeing [0] (
00:42:07Torneget *what* running as a port?
00:42:31Tornethe drivers and basic hardware functionality for rockbox have to be implemented more or less from scratch on each different kind of hardware
00:42:44darkenvyisn't rockbox ported to each generation of each diffrent mp3 player?
00:42:54darkenvyyea I was afraid of that
00:43:00TorneYes. None of that work has been done, so there's nothing to get running
00:43:07Torneunless you're going to actually *write the port*
00:44:35darkenvyhmmm if I had someone to work with then perhaps. I have a little programming knowlege but only enough to assist not do it myself unfortunatly
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01:10:33saratogadarkenvy: please don't post in New Ports without reading the rules for that forum, they're strictly enforced to keep that place readable
01:11:42darkenvyYea it seems like a request but I myself want to persue running code through the exploit. there has to be others interested
01:11:57darkenvyIf its the wrong place bump the thread somewhere else?
01:12:11saratogacheck the rules ...
01:12:34darkenvySo you count that as a request then dont you?
01:12:54darkenvythats the only thing I COULD see that violates it
01:13:23saratogai would probably have counted that as rules 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5
01:13:49saratogabut really I just deleted it because you're the third person in a week to propose putting together a team of people to do a port for him
01:14:15 Quit M3DLG (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
01:14:47darkenvyhey im just as interested in getting invovled
01:15:38darkenvyor is it consiured 'doing a port for them' if I havn't yet contributed anything useful?
01:16:14 Quit togetic (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
01:16:29darkenvyI understand the nature of the rules to filter out crap but the least you could do is moved my thread so I can get somewhere with this saratoga
01:16:38darkenvyoh hey do you live in sarasota?
01:18:16Tornei explained more or less what is involved
01:18:23Torneit's not a matter of "getting a team together"
01:18:57Tornestarting a port, in the early stages, is bascially a matter of one person making a heroic individual effort to reverse engineer enough of the OF that we can get a cutdown bootloader to run
01:19:13kugeln1s: I like real asm better than large inline asm
01:19:19Torneif you don't have the skills to do that then i'm sorry, but you are not in a position to contribute at this stage
01:20:31n1skugel: yeah, mee too, for small functions inlining might be important though...
01:20:48 Quit kyle__ (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
01:20:57saratogai tend to line inline a little better, its just that it breaks every other gcc version . . .
01:21:09kugeln1s: yes, for small stuff inline asm is alright. I only meant the big ones :)
01:22:17 Quit JdGordon (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
01:22:33darkenvyI'll see where I get. Im still interested in running some code on it
01:22:49Tornewrite soem code then
01:23:07n1sgcc doesn't like when we take away all the register :)
01:23:09Tornelinux4nano project has the details of the exploits
01:24:46darkenvyokay thanks
01:26:30kugelIMO inline asm syntax is odd, and it reads worse than plain asm and for large assemblies inline asm loses its advantages
01:35:12CIA-6New commit by nls (r27504): Convert inline coldfire assembler to a 'real' assembler function, with tweaks by Buschel. Speeds up mpc decoding by ~1% on h300.
01:35:47*n1s forgot to mention the gcc problems in the commit message :/
01:36:50CIA-6r27504 build result: All green
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04:56:41qumakhi, any fuze v2 rockbox users?
04:57:48qumakEnismirdal, do you have the v3?
04:58:12funmanalways assume yes, if you have a precise question just ask
05:00:23 Quit CGL (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
05:00:26qumakmy question is an imprecise one mostly, i just got the fuze today and it is a v2, i want rockbox on it, have been reading the manual and looking at forums, but am still unsure if i should use the stable release or do a manual install of the current build
05:00:36qumakor any other advice
05:00:57funmanthere's no stable release for fuzev2
05:01:26qumakoh ok problem solved :)
05:01:38funmanyou can install a current build and bootloader using the RockboxUtility
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05:02:42funmanit will not work on newer fuzev2 though, we still need to update the bootloader and RockboxUtility. Just try and see if it works
05:03:20Enismirdalfunman: Does that imply that a bootloader built from SVN would work on a newer Fuze v2?
05:03:39funmanyes it will work if you build mkamsboot from svn as well
05:03:53qumakfunman: thanks i am downloading the stuff now
05:04:12EnismirdalI assume that the latest daily build of the firmware itself would be sufficient?
05:04:18EnismirdalOr would I be incorrect?
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05:05:27funmanprefer the current build but yes it should work too
05:07:53EnismirdalThanks for the info
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05:24:33cpnfantstkI am using the latest build on my gigabeat F40. I notice that battery consumption has improved greatly. I used to get 15hr and now its over 20hrs. What changes were made for this improvement? Thanks
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05:53:00*qumak got rockbox installed on the fuze v2 and is quite happy with it so far aside from one freeze which was fixed by power cycling
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06:27:42kifoHello, I have an ipod nano 1g with the current Rev, and I've been experiencing a lot of lock-ups whenever I play music, I've googled around and played with some settings, and nothing has really helped, I was wondering if there is anything in specific I could look into, or anything you guys may know of that could help
06:29:03S_a_i_n_tHave you tried checking the dick for errors?
06:29:13S_a_i_n_t*sorry :P
06:29:36kifoHow do I do that? Just fsck it or is there anything in rockbox I can use
06:30:06S_a_i_n_tfsck, an "in core" disk check would EAT the battery
06:30:12S_a_i_n_tand, doesn't exist ;)
06:30:22kifoYea i figured
06:32:33S_a_i_n_tmaraz: Did you not have similar issues with your Nano1G?
06:32:38S_a_i_n_t(see above)
06:33:04S_a_i_n_tI have several Nano1gs running recent-to-latest rev, and all are fine...I don;t know what to say.
06:33:29kifoWell ive had this problem before, but on a sansa clip plus, and it was fixed by just turning auto database update off
06:34:19kifoI'll have to try the disk check thing as soon as i figure out how to do it on a vista machine ha
06:34:27kifoI'm on a neighbors comp, one second
06:34:54S_a_i_n_tright click on the drive in my computer.
06:35:15kifooh i think i found it
06:35:33kifono errors found
06:35:33S_a_i_n_tIt is called differently on Vista to XP, so I can say for sure sorry
06:35:58kifoI'm not used to windows :at all:
06:36:00S_a_i_n_tHmmm, one more thing I can suggest is to back up your config file, and do a clean install
06:36:20S_a_i_n_tie: delete .rockbox, instead of we-writing overtop of it
06:36:28 Quit panni_ (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
06:36:47kifoshouldnt be a problem if i save my themes/wps right
06:38:28S_a_i_n_tbackup "themes", "wps" and "config.c.g"
06:39:38S_a_i_n_tYou don't need to "back it up", just move it out of the .rockbox folder
06:40:30qumakon the fuze v2 current build the resolution seems to be a bit bigger than my screen, ie the very top is slightly cut off, am i alone in experiencing this / is there an easy fix or would it mess up all the themes and such even if i could adjust somehow?
06:41:19kifoI have that problem with my nano 1g but its only smaller by about 2px so not an issue at all
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06:42:00S_a_i_n_tqumak: kifo: Are you able to take a screendump that shows the problem?
06:42:17S_a_i_n_thint: turn on screendump in the system/debug menu
06:42:35kifoI'll take a look as soon as im done re-installing
06:43:44kifoIts possible I'm just out of my mind also, I guess you dont really notic on the normal firmware because of the screen color
06:43:47kifobut ill take one
06:43:53funmanqumak: the problem is Sandisk didn't put the screen in place
06:44:12funmani believe the OF blacks out the top/bottom lines to workaround this problem
06:44:43qumakS_a_i_n_t: is that in the default install?
06:45:03S_a_i_n_tbut, funman just answered your question I think
06:45:09qumakkifo: this isn't a showstopper at all, probably about that too, just something that if fixable i'd fix :)
06:45:12S_a_i_n_tthe problem is screen placement apparently
06:45:17S_a_i_n_tnot pixel alignment
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06:45:24qumaki see
06:45:31funmanmore case design
06:45:49qumakso then the 'fix' would be just to change the themes or something?
06:46:36S_a_i_n_tmore of a workaround, but...I guess so
06:48:00qumakok that's cool, thanks
06:48:11S_a_i_n_tFor the main menu, it's as simple as changine the default viewport
06:48:12kifomy god its been deleting .rockbox this entire time
06:48:22kifowhat is wrong with this computer
06:48:31S_a_i_n_tkifo: Something is wrong...
06:48:40kifodoesn't take this long on my box
06:48:47S_a_i_n_tit should take less that a minute, in theory
06:48:53kifoit does
06:48:57kifoon my computer at home
06:49:03S_a_i_n_teven deleting it through RB would have been faster
06:49:26S_a_i_n_t(and yes, you *can* delete the .rockbox folder through Rb) ;)
06:49:28 Quit Enismirdal (Quit: CGI:IRC (EOF))
06:49:45S_a_i_n_tIt doesn't really seem to like it that much though
06:50:00kifoit'd probably freeze during the process on this thing hah
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06:53:01kifodeleted so far 6.4mb
06:53:37S_a_i_n_tEeeek, something is *really* wrong.
06:53:44S_a_i_n_tIt does seem like disk error
06:53:51S_a_i_n_tor, a *really* crap machine
06:54:20S_a_i_n_tIs the machine yo're doing this on highly overtasked at the moment?
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06:55:11kifotvsorry client issues
06:55:22kifotvwell i did some stuff on my computer earlier today and it was fine
06:55:31kifotvmainly writing music and setting up some .kbd's
06:55:37kifotvfast as it always is
06:55:53S_a_i_n_tI have e few .kbd setups if you're interested.
06:56:01S_a_i_n_tfor 15~16pt fonts
06:56:04kifotvi was using opti for a while
06:56:07kifotvoh i use 8pt
06:56:38kifotvgot used to 8pt on the clip plus
06:57:09kifotvhooray 16 minutes to extract .rockbox
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07:03:01kifothis is pointless
07:03:04kifoworthless computer!
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07:16:56kifodone reinstalling, copying themes, wps, and config back over
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07:23:22kifocan i just enable screendump and it will take a snapshot?
07:23:29kifoor do i have to do something additional
07:25:39kifoman my themes are busted
07:25:44kifothat may be what is doing it
07:25:54kifochanging themes doesnt change base skin, doesnt chang wps screen
07:26:02kifochanging wps sreen doesnt do anything
07:27:40S_a_i_n_tAre you possibly mixing old theme format with the new builds?
07:27:48S_a_i_n_ttheme syntax changed some time ago
07:28:02kifoits possible
07:28:13kifocould I maybe just delete themes/wps dirs and replace them again
07:28:17kifowithout backing them up i mean
07:28:42S_a_i_n_tsure. but, I'd like to know that's the problem first ;)
07:29:07S_a_i_n_tDCC me one of the .wps files that is busted, and I'll take a look
07:29:38S_a_i_n_tor, upload to a fileshare sit, pastebin/whatever
07:30:08 Quit mt (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
07:30:10kifoI could screen dump?
07:30:26kifoi dont really know which one is causing the problem
07:30:35kifothey all seem to default to some really basic wps
07:30:40kifosorta looks like jack basic
07:30:56kifothe wps is set to the one i chose in config.cfg though
07:31:01S_a_i_n_tthen, I'm pretty sure that the problem is the theme syntax.
07:31:10S_a_i_n_tyeah, you'll need to replace them.
07:31:16kifoill just clear them
07:31:24kifoso just delete those two dirs and replace right
07:31:49S_a_i_n_tThe themes on the themesite are all updated, and rbutil will grab the correct themes for the appropriate build also
07:31:53kifoalso, it appears vistas lovely hidden "remote differential compression" feature was causing some of the issues
07:32:11kifoi can just use themes/wps from the current build right
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07:32:47S_a_i_n_tif screendump is enabled, you wont get a USB connection btw.
07:33:02S_a_i_n_tit captures the screen image to disk when USB is inserted.
07:33:17S_a_i_n_tso, if you enabled it, disable it and you'll get USB connection again.
07:34:10kifowhere does it put the screen image
07:34:45bug2000Hey. Is the broken hard boot still attacking over samsa v2?
07:35:15S_a_i_n_tkifo: It dumps the image to the root of the device
07:35:44S_a_i_n_tIIRC, it should blatantly be called "screendump<some numbers>.bmp"
07:35:58S_a_i_n_t(or something very similar)
07:36:56kifoweird so it used to switch to the crappy ipod stock Do not disconnect screen on connecting it
07:37:17kifosince enabling/disabling screen dump it goes to usb keypad mode multimedia
07:37:28kifoits :slightly: faster :D
07:37:32S_a_i_n_tyes, this is because you've installed a current build, as opposed to the release build
07:37:45S_a_i_n_tcharging is not implemented in the release build.
07:37:52S_a_i_n_t(but will be in 3.7)
07:38:19S_a_i_n_tAnd, actually...the RB USB is slightly slower...but, weird.
07:38:24CIA-6New commit by funman (r27505): rockboy manual ...
07:38:33kifoyea nevermind its bogged down again
07:38:50kifowindows is trying its damndest to turn off its stupid hidden feature
07:39:02S_a_i_n_tOn the upside, it charges properly now, no need to see the Apple disk mode again ;)
07:39:07kifochanging settings this may take several years
07:39:59pixelmafunman: not all bitmap targets but the Ondios have rockboy
07:40:13CIA-6r27505 build result: All green
07:40:48 Quit mt (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
07:40:50funmanhm i missed the overly complex SUBDIRS condition
07:41:29kifough i am deleting only themes/wps directories and so far it reports its deleted 275 files
07:42:12funmanpixelma: can we check lcd pixel format and lcd height/width in manual ?
07:42:14pixelmasome Ipods also don't have it due to a different pixelpacking or whatever that is called which needs a new screen driver - and some old Ipods will also have problems with the controls because Rockboy on Ipods currently uses touch areas for controls and the older ones don't have touch sensitive wheels
07:43:36pixelmahmm, well maybe we could now that someone implemented some displaywidth etc. optionbut that won't help there
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07:44:48pixelmaeven if you don't like it but I would just add the Clips to the line (the old one)
07:45:01funmanthere's no manual for ipodmini2g ?
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07:45:24funmanpixelma: i'll use something similar to the condition in SUBDIRS
07:45:46pixelmano, not a reason to differentiate between the Minis so far
07:46:08pixelmafunman: how will you do that? I think it was good as it was
07:46:09funmanplatform/ has ipodmini1g.tex, perhaps worth renaming it to 'ipodmini.tex'
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07:49:03S_a_i_n_tkifo: I realise that your PC is making this a big pain in the ass, so, when you do get the new theme/wps dirs on, report back success/fail.
07:49:04pixelmathere are no pixel-packing options yet and I really don't see adding them just for this will make it any better
07:49:10pixelmafunman: ^
07:49:19funmani won't add them but enumerate the models and add a comment
07:50:16pixelmawhat do you mean with enumerate the models?
07:50:24funman\opt{lcd_bitmap}{\nopt{ ondio, % m200, % not enough buttons for keymap ipod1g2g,ipod3g,ipod4g,ipodmini1g, % horizontal pixelformat not implemented
07:52:25funmani don't know how to express the last condition though (COLOR || (HEIGHT == 64 && DEPTH == 1) || (HEIGHT == 128 && DEPTH == 2))
07:52:36 Join Buschel [0] (
07:53:48funmani mean, how to express 'OR' and '=='
07:54:24Buscheln1s: synth_filter.c looks much cleaner now. thanks for moving the inline asm to an own function
07:55:42pixelmafunman: there is no comparison in our manual (and I assume it's not easily doable in tex)
07:55:58Buschelbtw, question to all the CF asm experts: does the number of cycles needed for mac.l depend on the size of the operands (similar to ARM)?
08:01:00kifoso on ipod nano 1g changing to a theme that has a different base skin, and the changing it to one that has the original base skin
08:01:22kifodoesnt change the base skin, only the 'theme'
08:02:33 Quit storm` (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
08:03:12***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
08:04:49kifotheres a screen dump of the weirdness
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08:05:53CIA-6New commit by funman (r27506): rockboy: simplify build condition ...
08:06:00CIA-6New commit by funman (r27507): manual: rockboy isn't built on all lcd bitmap targets ...
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08:07:07 Quit mc2739 (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
08:07:31CIA-6r27506 build result: All green
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08:09:09CIA-6r27507 build result: All green
08:16:16S_a_i_n_tkifo: The base skin is defined by the theme .cfg
08:16:44S_a_i_n_tA lot of themers forget to put a "-" in place for the base skin, so that the theme redefines the base skin to "none"
08:17:04S_a_i_n_tIf one is defined by an old theme, and not cleared by the new theme, then, it stays there
08:17:29kifoyea this reinstall seems to have fixed it
08:17:50S_a_i_n_tIt's a simple one line fix in the theme .cfg though, just copy a base skin like from another theme cfg, and change the base skin to "-"
08:17:55S_a_i_n_t(without the ""'s
08:19:10S_a_i_n_tBasically, if a theme doesn't include an .sbs, and the themer doesn't *want* it to include an .sbs, thay still need to set a base skin value, but set it as "-"
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08:20:04S_a_i_n_tI'm pretty sure that all the "default" themes are supposed to use the inbuilt statusbar though.
08:20:10S_a_i_n_tOr, be able to at least.
08:20:43S_a_i_n_tIt's something I'm not *too* clear on, my themes all have their own .sbs
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08:26:54pixelmafunman: your \opt looks wrong - the M5s (supported grey format) and X5s (colour) do have Rockboy. there is also something about spaces after the commas in the \nopt list
08:27:08pixelmano time to explain now, will look into it later
08:28:02funmanah i grepped for the remote lcd pixelformat
08:29:38pixelmayou would just have to look at the originial \opt line (which was more readable in my eyes) even if it was not explanatory
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08:30:33funmani think it's not more reasonable
08:30:53funmannegative discrimination helps when adding new targets
08:31:35funmanpositive discrimination (a list of models for which the manual is built) siltently disables the manual section, so it can easily go unnoticed (like it did for clip)
08:34:42CIA-6New commit by funman (r27508): manual: include rockboy on m5 and x5 (mistakenly disabled in previous commit) ...
08:36:14CIA-6r27508 build result: All green
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08:39:44kifotime for sleep
08:42:30amiconnpixelma: Regarding rockboy and the mini2g manual - if the screen driver for greyscale ipods gets done but there is no solution for the touh areas, it will need one
08:45:54bug2000I shall ask again, as I got no reply. Is there any progress with the hard lockdown for Sansa AMS v2?
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08:46:54funmanbug2000: no, how often / in which conditions do you experience it?
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08:48:56bug2000funman: I don't. It's just still listed on the project page, so I'm afraid to push a new revision to my friend.
08:49:36bug2000funman: I don't want him to end up with a jammed player for a couple of days because of me. [After all, his current revision does work pretty much fine for him]
08:51:06funmana new revision shouldn't make the problem more or less likely i think
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09:08:48pixelmafunman: silently including could also be wrong and unless you have the same list of options to evaluate you need to manually edit anyway
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09:10:11funmancan you elaborate?
09:11:20Clippergood morning!
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09:11:56funmanpixelma: silently including is not possible: the manual build will break because of undefined keymap
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09:12:36pixelmanow, if you add a new target it will always get the Rockboy section. No it won't
09:12:55funmanhm that's right
09:13:26funmanfeel free to change then
09:13:47funmanif we can't check display properties then there's no clean way to do it
09:13:50pixelmathat depends on how the button table is written
09:14:27pixelmathe lines with two % always throw me off
09:14:38Clipperanyone still got the strange beep after pause on the clip+?
09:14:45funmancomment in a comment :)
09:14:52funmanClipper: no
09:15:17Clipperwhen it has been fixed?
09:15:34funmani never experienced it, so i don't think it has been fixed
09:16:02Clipperah ok.. anyone of the devs got a beeping one?
09:16:42pixelmacould there be some setting enabled that causes trouble? Keyclick or so
09:16:44funmani'm not aware of this problem so i assume that no. check if it happens after you reset your settings
09:17:38Clipperunfortunatly you can only switch it on or off, there are no settings like for crossfading
09:18:14Clipperno, keyclicks are disabled
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09:18:48funmanreset your whole config to be sure
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09:23:39pixelmaamiconn: yes, but that will be quite easy.
09:25:42Clipperok, i gonna try it
09:26:40Clipperanother question: is there any shortcut for switching to the now-playing mode?
09:27:02Clipperthx funman
09:28:31funmanwe need new AMSv1 bootloaders with USB enabled so we can make a new mkamsboot release without OF-boot on USB
09:28:56funmanUSB seems stable so far
09:29:33Clipperwhat about appling it to double pressing the power button?
09:29:51funmanrockbox doesn't handle double press so no
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09:31:32pixelmathat's not true in general
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09:34:00Clipperhi dfkt
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09:36:52Clipperdoes anybody know when usb vor asm2 targets will be available?
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09:39:45Clipperthx dfkt for your custom build!
09:42:39*S_a_i_n_t thought RB *could* do double presses.
09:42:54S_a_i_n_tthe menu for doom on iPod seems to suggest so
09:43:10amiconnThe action code doesn't directly support double clicks
09:43:36S_a_i_n_tHmmm...perhaps I'm looking at that differently though.
09:44:07S_a_i_n_tDoom probably isn't the best example for anything ;)
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09:45:16amiconnThere is a very simple reason for this: A double click only makes sense as a kind of protection against accidental operation where a single (short) click on the same button is not used
09:45:34CIA-6New commit by bieber (r27509): Theme Editor: Implemented download and decompression of font pack in the preferences dialog. Dialog will also allow the user to set a directory for a ...
09:46:22amiconnIf you want to discern single/ double click, you'll have to wait a bit after the first click whether a second one will follow. This may lead the user to think the (intended) single click didn't work, making him click a second time
09:46:29pixelmaS_a_i_n_t: isn't the doom menu available by switching the hold on Ipods?
09:47:14CIA-6r27509 build result: All green
09:47:43amiconnThat said, we do have one place where we do use a double click on one target: In the FM screen on Ondio FM
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09:48:19amiconnIt is used exactly for what it is useful: to prevent inadvertent operation
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09:49:17pixelmathe skip to next/previous directory in the WPS is some kind of double-click on many targets too (holding, then pressing the next/previous button)
09:50:06S_a_i_n_tpixelma: Yeah, when I thought about it properly I realised it wasn't really the case in question. The whole "switch hold on, then off again" to use the menu confused me a while.
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09:50:40S_a_i_n_t'till I realised that, of course you need to switch it off again to use the buttons other than hold for said menu.
09:51:01S_a_i_n_twasn't really what I was thinking at all.
09:52:09JaykayJdGordon| if you give me a build for e200v1 and tell me what to test, i would test your skin engine patch
09:52:23JdGordon|ok cool... I'll do a build
09:52:31mitkFuze uses slider to power on/off/DAP lock. It's hard to make "double move" with slider and it can be easy broken.
09:55:45JdGordon|Jaykay: building
09:56:18pixelmac200 uses "Long Right" for resuming (go to WPS from menu, lists), maybe that would be a possibility for the other non-wheel Sansas too?
09:57:37JdGordon|dont they all have a |> button?
09:57:56pixelmathe Fuze shouldn't have a problem with keymaps there if it is the same as an e200 (up/down in lists with the wheel frees the "Play" buttonfor resuming
09:58:32pixelmaJdGordon|: on non-wheel Sansas "Play" is "Up" because it's the upper button on the crosspad
09:58:39JdGordon|Jaykay:"> if it works you shouldnt see any difference.
09:59:06JdGordon|pixelma: ah right, trying to remember my clip keylayout
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10:02:53mitkJdGordon|: Can you compile 11470 also for Fuze v1 and clip+. Or tell me how to and against which svn rev I should use your patch. No success with current svn.
10:03:12JdGordon|ignore the two files it says are already patched
10:03:13***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
10:03:22JdGordon|and yeah, one min, I'll do them
10:03:35mitkJdGordon| ok, I will try then
10:05:02amiconnpixelma: Using long right for this removes the ability to do horizontal list scrolling
10:05:45JdGordon|mitk:"> and in a few minutes
10:07:54mitkJdGordon|: getting fuze, clipp is showing 404
10:08:00JdGordon|just uploaded
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10:13:25JaykayJdGordon: i played around for some minutes and didnt notice any differences... should i test e.g. some other themes?
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10:18:30kifohey, I was looking for the little virtual machine rockbox things for testing out wps's and such, was this what I'm thinking of?
10:19:04n1sthat's a simulator, on which you can test wps'es but it's no VM
10:19:22kifoyea i wasnt really sure what to call it :p
10:19:40S_a_i_n_tkifo: What you *really* want, is in the extras page
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10:20:07S_a_i_n_tthere: ^
10:20:10kifoyea thats what i was looking for
10:20:22kifonot sure if you got my last pm
10:20:33kifoi was looking for a current text based cram as much info as possible wps
10:20:36kifoi think ill just make one
10:20:36S_a_i_n_tThe other page is just about how to build one of those
10:21:09S_a_i_n_tThere's a *really* horrible one (IMO) on the Nano theme page
10:21:14S_a_i_n_tright near the bottom.
10:21:23S_a_i_n_tcalled "infoscreen" or something
10:21:23kifoyea i dont like any of the current ones
10:21:28kifojack info is alright
10:21:34kifobut it isn laid out how i want it
10:21:58*S_a_i_n_t looks for the one he's thinking of
10:22:12JdGordJaykay: the more themes tested the better.
10:22:58S_a_i_n_tHmmm...looks like it failed the update, I could probably fix it though
10:23:06S_a_i_n_tit's not listed on the "new" themesite
10:24:57 Quit JdGord (Quit: Bye)
10:25:24S_a_i_n_tGAH! are the "hidden" themes listed anywhere I can access without getting hold of a swede?
10:25:43S_a_i_n_t(ones that failed the update/checkwps)
10:26:12S_a_i_n_tThe theme I'm thinking of must have failed the 3.5-3.6 change
10:26:52bieberBagder: Can I get a little space on to host the target database file for the Theme Editor?
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10:29:38S_a_i_n_tkifo: Does interest you?
10:29:53S_a_i_n_tit's currently broken, but I could probably fix it.
10:30:21S_a_i_n_tI think it's hideous, but, it has a LOT of info
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10:32:11kifoS_a_i_n_t: not really into colors
10:32:21kifobut closer i suppose
10:32:35kifoi think i can find an example in a clipP theme
10:33:47kifothats closer
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10:37:58Jaykayi just noticed that quita a few themes use adobe helvetica.fnt, although its already included in the standard build...
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10:49:01kifoim running into some trouble with a wps
10:49:43kifoinvalid paremeter list for token 1: "backdrop image"
10:50:07 Quit scorche (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
10:50:39kifo%Xd then ha
10:51:18kifoer nvm
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10:51:37kifosame error
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10:53:30S_a_i_n_tkifo: Gimme the exact line that is erroring
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10:53:57JaykayJdGordon: scrolling lines in BlacknBlue Glass dont work anymore
10:54:19JdGordonpost in the tracker with a link to that theme
10:55:00S_a_i_n_tkifo: For the backdrop, the syntax is "%X(filename.bmp)"
10:55:07S_a_i_n_tnot "%Xd"
10:55:43S_a_i_n_tAlmost all the things you have learnt with the previous syntax has changed
10:56:17kifoso if i dont want to use one then i just make a blank bmp the size of the viewport?
10:56:37S_a_i_n_tIf you don;t want to use one, don't declare one ;)
10:57:04kifothat gives the error though
10:57:19JdGordonwhats this "almost all tihngs"?
10:57:22JdGordonalmost onthing changed!
10:57:28S_a_i_n_tHmmm...then, something else is wrong
10:57:34kifoinvalid parameter list for token 1 "backdrop image"
10:57:42kifoyea when i start the simulater it gives me a similar
10:57:48pixelmaS_a_i_n_t: %Xd is for disabling a menu backdrop IIRC
10:57:55kifoinvalid parameter list for token one "no token"
10:58:16kifo%Xd is listed there
10:58:18kifounder images
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10:58:27S_a_i_n_tpixelma: Isn't disabling the backdrop exactly the same as not including one though?
10:59:13kifoso i guess the question is whats up with the error on startup
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10:59:54S_a_i_n_tI honestly can't remember...I thought if you didn't include the %X(blah) line, you didn;t get a backdrop.
11:00:04S_a_i_n_tBeen a long time since I made a theme without one
11:00:15kifowait changing the themes and wps fixed the error on startup
11:00:19kifomust be something with my wps
11:00:39S_a_i_n_twhat is the line that is failing, can you paste it here
11:00:53S_a_i_n_t(if it's more than one line, pastebin it)
11:01:22kifois there a bot function or i can do it externally lol
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11:02:00JdGordon%X(d) says "dont show any background image, use the backgorund colour instead"
11:02:03S_a_i_n_tThe "new" theme tags give no mention of "%Xd"
11:02:09JdGordon%X(-) says use the backdrop setting
11:02:09S_a_i_n_tcould be missing from the manual.
11:02:14JdGordon- is the same as no %X
11:02:21S_a_i_n_tI'm just concerned about using the CustomWPS page
11:02:31S_a_i_n_tsome of the syntax there is blatantly wrong
11:02:40kifowell is there some more current one somewhere heh
11:02:46kifoim sort of new at this
11:02:54S_a_i_n_tIn the manual
11:03:02kifooohhhh right duh
11:03:44S_a_i_n_tJdGordon: So, %X(-) == No backdrop?
11:04:35S_a_i_n_tAH, right...just re-read it.
11:04:35JdGordonin the wps %X(-) means find the first of sbs, backdrop setting which is set
11:04:55S_a_i_n_tSo, I was right? If you don't want a backdrop, don't worry about any backdrop related tags?
11:05:48*S_a_i_n_t thinks customWPS needs to be updated, or deleted.
11:05:57S_a_i_n_tInfo in two places is confusing as hell
11:06:28kifoso the font syntax was wrong i guess
11:06:35kifochanged that but still getinng that weird backdrop error
11:06:50S_a_i_n_tkifo: just delete the %Xd
11:06:55S_a_i_n_tsee if that works
11:07:08S_a_i_n_tIIUC, it is not needed
11:07:08kifoi did
11:07:14kifoi dont have any %X
11:07:28kifoit also gives me that token error
11:07:30kifoon start up
11:07:46S_a_i_n_tI'm just guessing now really, it'd be good to see your wps.
11:07:48kifoinvalid parameter list for token 1 "no token"
11:07:53S_a_i_n_tcan you pastebin it?
11:07:55kifoyea lemme post the new one
11:08:01kifoi did like 25 lines up but its changed now
11:09:43JaykayJdGordon: posted in fs. i tested 10 themes, eveything exept scrolling (in half of the themes) works.
11:10:27S_a_i_n_tfont was wrong
11:10:33S_a_i_n_tno ' ' 's needed
11:10:59S_a_i_n_tAh, you also need a viewport to call an additional font
11:11:15S_a_i_n_tthe font you're calling isn't being used anywhere
11:12:30S_a_i_n_t+should work
11:12:36S_a_i_n_tkifo: ^
11:13:22S_a_i_n_tAn additional font needs to be called by the viewport. In this case I just added a viewport that takes up the whole screen.
11:14:18kifoi think im going to start with something a little easier than a max info wps :D
11:14:37S_a_i_n_tthis is about as easy as it'll get. ;)
11:14:47S_a_i_n_ttry my last pastebin, should work fine
11:15:31kifodo i need to list the full path for the font
11:15:57S_a_i_n_tThe sim may not have the font you want included though
11:16:05S_a_i_n_tit doesn;t come with the fontpack instaleld
11:16:06kifoits in the sim disc
11:16:42S_a_i_n_tthen %Fl(identifier,fontname.fnt) is the correct syntax
11:16:51S_a_i_n_tit is correct in the pastebin I posted
11:17:21*S_a_i_n_t kicks self
11:17:26kifo/kick self
11:18:24S_a_i_n_tthe font needs to be declared *before* the viewport that uses it.
11:18:33S_a_i_n_t...end of kicking self
11:18:36kifolol @ slirnram
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11:21:10kifonot loadin for me
11:21:10 Quit JdGordon (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
11:21:14kifothe link i mean
11:21:21S_a_i_n_t(realised I had the %wd in the wrong place)
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11:22:23S_a_i_n_tthe one I pasted last, the link above?
11:22:31kifooh the link works
11:22:33*S_a_i_n_t thinks we should maybe move this to PM
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11:37:22*n1s managed to ICE gcc4.4.4 with inline asm now :)
11:37:42n1susing 15 regs :)
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11:39:46S_a_i_n_tJdGordon1: Is there a list of *absolutely* every theme tag there is?
11:40:18S_a_i_n_tall the missing ones from the manual, and the afct the customWPS has blatantly wrong syntax is pissing me off.
11:40:47S_a_i_n_tSo, I guess (sigh) that makes me the ideal person to do something abot it.
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12:41:11kugeln1s: ICE?
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13:04:40n1skugel: Internal Compiler Error
13:05:55 Join JdGordon [0] (~jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)
13:06:02JdGordonS_a_i_n_t: yes and no
13:06:19 Quit halmi_ (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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13:10:22JdGordonS_a_i_n_t: is *the* place which will always have the up to date list of tags and what they expect
13:11:08JdGordonI thought we agreed (maybe only in priciple) to buid a plain text file which outlines what each tag does and how to use it so it can be used by the manual and editor and everything?
13:11:22JdGordonI guess we just need to decide on the format for that file and then someone to do it
13:11:47JdGordonxml to the rescue!
13:14:12JdGordon maybe
13:15:01JdGordonI'm sure there is a xml->TeX script and the editor should be easily able to use that for help text... bieber pixelma?
13:16:45 Join AndChat| [0] (
13:17:09JdGordonand if we do decide to do that then we should build a script to even go xml -> c to build the table linked above
13:17:40JdGordonthen we only ever need to edit one file there to make new tags work (on the lib/doc side anyway)
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13:21:58JdGordonmitk: which theme?
13:22:00JdGordon(data aborts)
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13:29:07webguest81hey quick guestion will rockbox delete my music
13:30:30pixelmawhat do you mean? If you want to delete the track or ?
13:31:27pixelmaJdGordon: I'm not aware of a premade script we could just use as is, but it's probably doable
13:31:58JdGordondoes it sound like something worth doing?
13:32:39JdGordonand does the above xml seem like it would be sufficient?
13:32:40*JdGordon doesnt even know if that is valid xml
13:33:59pixelmawould be nice I think, I don't know if xml is the way to go. Maybe bluebrother could answer that better as he knows more about TeX's internals
13:35:43JdGordonI want to stay as close to plain text as possible... I could easily see us wanting to use $param_name in the text and haveing a script replace that, but other than that the formatting should be entirely seperate
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13:38:24pixelmawe parse features.txt, so I guess some formatted text could do, something like e.g. one tag + description on one line, tag at the beginning, description follows and is enclosed in {} or something
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13:40:09JdGordonah crud.. forgot about #ifdef and target dependadnt stuff
13:40:15JdGordonI suppose we oculd add that
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13:41:04mitkJdGordon: tried DAP with no config.cfg so I assume it was cabbie and then Unicatcher after that
13:44:59JdGordonmitk: can you try some quick fixes? my fuze is currently charging
13:48:15mitkJdGordon: I have 15 minutes now, I'll be back in 3 hours. Is it good for you to test after I'm back?
13:48:58JdGordonI'll probably be asleep... see how we go
13:49:44mitkJdGordon: pls describe fixes now, I will apply them later
13:50:40pixelmamitk: please type out please ;)
13:50:54JdGordontrying to work out what the cause is, so no idea yet
13:50:59mitkAs you wish: please
13:51:43mitkJdGordon: Then put it for the logs, please :)
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14:06:19 Nick YPSY is now known as Ypsy (
14:08:51YpsyWhen I was in holiday I accidentaly pulled some water over my sansa fuze with rockbox on it, I let it dry and when I started it again the next day it only started the original firmware
14:09:10YpsyI tried completely removing rockbox and reinstalling it with the utility but it still only starts the original one
14:09:15Ypsyany idea what could have happened?
14:11:20gevaertsa bad contact so it always sees some buttons pressed maybe?
14:11:40Ypsyholy... you're a genius
14:11:47Ypsythe left button isnt working anymore
14:11:49Ypsythats probably it
14:12:00Ypsynever thought of it *g*
14:12:34Ypsyhmm but making it work again will be hard wont it?
14:13:22 Quit Beta2K_ (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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14:14:26gevaertsyou might get rockbox running again by building a special bootloader that doesn't use "left" as the OF selector
14:14:50Ypsythat's an idea
14:15:00gevaertsAfter that you'd probably still need a rockbox build with a changed keymap that doesn't use that button
14:15:29Ypsyis it possible to get the button working again?
14:15:59gevaertsno idea
14:16:26gevaertsIt could just be a dirty contact, or maybe that part isn't fully dry yet
14:16:58*gevaerts recommends asking funman. He has lots of experience with opened and broken fuzes...
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14:17:49Ypsyokies thanks a lot ill ask him next time, need to leave now
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14:41:39aglaeaI have a question about the shorcuts.
14:42:03aglaeacan I directly start an plugin application, from a link file?
14:44:36aglaeaFor example I would want pictureflow to be displayed under the main menu or the file dir.
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14:46:06Torneyou can make a shortcut to a .rock i think, yes; that will then show up in the file browser
14:46:24Torneshortcuts are just files on disk, though, they don't show up in the menus
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14:47:36aglaeaI already made a link file, which ends up at the plugin itself, but is there a way to start the plugin throughout a .link file?
14:48:37aglaeaalso, currently I can't place a link file under the menu?
14:48:47TorneOh, it just takes you to the directory? Yeah, that's not so useful
14:48:51Torneand no, you can't edit the menus in any way
14:49:07Tornethe link files are files. they show up in the file browser whever you put them.
14:49:13aglaeaThat's a shame. So, how can I start it directly? :)
14:50:13aglaeaI'll just keep the link files in the root, so, the point is, the explanation in the manual is rather short.
14:50:17Torneyo ucan set hte WPS hotkey to be jump to pictureflow
14:50:26Tornethen pressing it while on the WPS will launch pictureflow again
14:50:26aglaeawhen I use the line: "/.rockbox/rocks/demos/pictureflow.rock" it ends up at the dir.
14:50:29Tornethis was implemented recently
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14:51:59aglaeaWPS stands for? I'm sorry.. not that familiar with terms.
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14:52:35JdGordonwhile playing screen
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14:53:55aglaeaAlright, that's usefull, but I'll have to access a song first.
14:54:14aglaeaMind helping me with the .link first? haha :)
14:55:05gevaertsHelp how?
14:55:15aglaeacomes down to, how do I execute a .rock file throughout a .link
14:55:29gevaertsyou don't apparently
14:55:38aglaeaIt isn't possible?
14:55:53Tornewell, i haven't tried, but i would've done what you did
14:56:05Torneif all that does is open the file browser to the file, then that's all it's going to do.
14:56:13gevaertsand as far as I can see, that's perfectly reasonable (and therefore most probably intended) behaviour for the usecase shortcuts were designed for
14:56:49aglaeathat means that there are no special parameters for the .link file to execute?
14:57:08Torneif the manual doesn't mention them, probably not
14:57:30Tornethe explanation in the manual is rather short because the shortcut plugin doesn't do very much
14:57:42aglaeaYeah, that's probably why. ;)
14:57:52S_a_i_n_tNo, it's not possible
14:58:21aglaeaThanks either way, I'll look up the WPS hotkey, since which build has it been implemented?
14:58:23S_a_i_n_tI've tried and tried, even modifying how the shortcuts work luck ;)
14:58:34aglaeaalright saint, good to know.
14:58:44gevaertsDon't hotkeys also work in the file browser?
14:58:47Torneaglaea: weeks/months ago, it should be ok
14:58:55S_a_i_n_tgevaerts: yes
14:59:00Tornegevaerts: i don't think there's any way to set the file hotkey to be that, though, is there?
14:59:07Tornethe jump to pictureflow thing is only on the wps context menu
14:59:11aglaeaI'm using an older version, since I have some nand errors with the latest releases.
14:59:11gevaertsno idea
14:59:11Torneor am i wrong ;)
14:59:41aglaeaFile hotkey, let me look that up.
14:59:56S_a_i_n_tgevaerts: Though, there isn't a Menu hotkey for pictureflow though
15:00:07S_a_i_n_tit'd be *really* trivial to add though
15:00:41*gevaerts won't stop people adding it, but he *really* doesn't understand why people want pictureflow so much...
15:01:24aglaeaseems the hotkey works the same as in WPS, so it should work.
15:01:35Torneit works the same, yes, but the set of options is not the same
15:01:50Tornepictureflow might be available, though, i don't know offhand
15:01:58JdGordongevaerts: with WPS integration, and working cover images AND your reguar usage is playing albums then it is a ncier database viewer than the text list
15:01:59aglaeaI'll check in a min.
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15:02:44gevaertsJdGordon: if you have five albums, sure, but if you have five hundred?
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15:02:57aglaeaDatabase viewer works perfect too, but album viewer is more.. interesting.
15:03:02JdGordonbluebrother: lib would be an ideal place to put imported code which doesnt really belong in the core codebase or rbutil/theme base.. like that zip lib which bieber imported
15:03:09francesco_is there a way to hide/disable voices from the main menu?
15:03:21TorneJdGordon: the text list is much faster :)
15:03:45[Saint]francesco_: Yes.
15:03:49JdGordonI didnt say it was faster :) I said it was nicer
15:03:52aglaeaIt is, but it would be pretty if you could use the pictureflow for a specific artist.
15:04:13francesco_[Saint]: without editing cpp source code?
15:04:17[Saint]francesco_: Settings/General Settings/Voice
15:04:32TorneJdGordon: also i don't recognise very many album covers ;)
15:04:34*[Saint] also hands francesco_ a copy of the manual
15:04:36aglaeaThere usually don't go up to 15 max. albums, so for that, pictureflow might be useful.
15:04:53 Quit S_a_i_n_t (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
15:05:04TorneJdGordon: so it's much harder to use than a text list, since i can only see one title at a time ;)
15:05:11aglaeaTorne, if you display the album art in your WPS, you might get the hang of it.
15:05:13[Saint]Is this a "is pictureflow usefull" discussion?
15:05:20[Saint]if so == heck yeah!
15:05:26[Saint]*and*, it's cool ;)
15:05:29Torneaglaea: i do have album art displayed.. but whe nwould i look? :)
15:05:31aglaeaIt is. :)
15:05:32Tornei don't look at the screen
15:05:34JdGordonor if you BUY cds....
15:05:45Tornei buy music on the internet
15:05:48aglaeaWell, torne.
15:05:53Torneit comes with an album cover, but i don't look at it :)
15:05:54francesco_[Saint] : misunderstood. i need to hide menu items
15:06:03aglaeawhen I want a specific song, I'm used to browsing albums.
15:06:13aglaeaIt's in my nature, not used to browse songs.
15:06:15[Saint]francesco_: Define please?
15:06:36[Saint]as in, stop them from being voiced, or, move them completely?
15:06:41gevaertsaglaea: I could see pictureflow being useful if such filters/selections were there, but now?
15:06:48[Saint]if the latter, no.
15:06:52francesco_[Saint]: i'm not using half of the functins of rockbox (FM radio for ex). I'd like to hide that option from the main menu
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15:07:05Tornefrancesco_: not without editing the osurce code and doing a custom build, no
15:07:09[Saint]not without editing the source anyway
15:07:21[Saint]which, you *probably* don;t want to do I'm guessing
15:07:22aglaeaGeva, you have the hotkey in WPS. for example, when you play a specific artists, e.g. The Doors.
15:07:32francesco_Torne, [Saint] : thanks
15:07:38gevaertsYes, but I *never* play anything from The Doors!
15:07:47gevaertsAnd my name is not Geva :)
15:07:56[Saint]The menu is coded in quite a few places, I've done so myself...but, Iwouldn;t advise it.
15:07:57aglaeaAnd you use the hotkey, (assign a parameter (artist name)) you could limit the selection of the picture flow.
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15:08:18gevaertsaglaea: yes, but *that's not there*! How is it useful *now*?
15:08:45aglaeaYou mean, the current functionality of Picture Flow?
15:08:49[Saint]does pictureflow use Idv3 tags, or it's own obscure something-or-other?
15:09:38aglaeaWouldn't know.
15:09:44[Saint]In theory, it *could* sort the same as the database...but, not without someone willing to do it.
15:10:13*gevaerts doesn't understand why people want easy access to pictureflow because maybe some day someone will add features that make it useful
15:10:42[Saint]We *have* the code already ;)
15:10:46gevaertsaglaea: this is #rockbox. Any talk about pictureflow here is going to be about the one in rockbox
15:11:05aglaeaYes, but the one in rockbox is based on the one from google.
15:11:23aglaeaIf I'm correct.
15:11:40gevaertswhat does that change? Pictureflow in rockbox has the features of pictureflow in rockbox
15:12:09JdGordonpictureflow uses the database
15:12:31[Saint]JdGordon: So, it *could* sort by artist etc. it just...doesn't.
15:12:42[Saint](if I get inspired one day...maybe)
15:12:53JdGordonin theory
15:13:03JdGordonwell it uses the db to get the cover images so I assume it does for everythign
15:13:39[Saint]Hmmm...I'm *guessing* it's a little out of my league, but, I've been surprised by what I can do before.
15:14:02[Saint]Or, how simple some things really are rather, my skills are crap :P
15:14:11JdGordonit is only slightly more complicated than rearranging the menus...
15:14:26aglaeaTorne, can't you add names to the albums in pictureflow?
15:15:17[Saint]Not specifically to albums in pictureflow, but to albums globally...yes
15:15:50 Quit saratoga (*.net *.split)
15:15:50aglaeaWhich can be displayed in picture flow also, right?
15:16:37[Saint]you'd need to add the artist name to the album name tag though...which will mess up database sorting
15:16:39aglaeaSo now Torne doesn't have to worry anymore about not knowing an albums art.
15:16:59[Saint]I assume he didn;t anyway
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15:18:03francesco_where can i find the editable source code?
15:18:04[Saint]To get it to sort the way you want, the "Album" metadata would have to be <Artist - Album>
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15:18:14[Saint]which, is just..yuck IMO
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15:19:01[Saint]francesco_: You'll also need to set up a development environment
15:19:05[Saint]which OS do you run?
15:19:13 Quit joecool (Quit: bbl work occurs)
15:19:50[Saint]It's not as simple as "edit this file, put it on my player"
15:19:54[Saint]see here:
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15:20:26JdGordondo segfaults always show up on target as data abort?
15:20:40JdGordontrying to dereference 0x0...
15:21:19 Quit leavittx (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
15:22:11kugelJdGordon: null pointer dereference often doesn't show up at all on targets (not on arm at least) :)
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15:22:46JdGordoncan you tell I'm getting sleepy? :) that is probably the problem then
15:23:53[Saint]yes, we're here
15:24:02[Saint]Ask a question if you have one
15:24:28Michael777darn lags
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15:25:18Michael777anybody there?
15:25:28[Saint]124 people in fact
15:25:31[Saint]Ask a question if you have one
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15:27:58aglaeaGuys, I'm out, thanks either way. ;)
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15:30:34[Saint]maraz: Ping?
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15:30:50[Saint]any other Nano1g user: Ping?
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15:34:02JdGordonshould themes really hard fail if a font doesnt load?
15:34:18Torneprobably.. there's no guarantee it's even readable with sysfont, surely? :)
15:34:27*[Saint] thinks they should just default to userfont, if not userfont, sysfont
15:34:38Tornewhat would you do instead?
15:34:52Torneif you just skip extra fonts and use userfont lots of themes will be broken/unreadable
15:35:02Tornebecause of fonts being too large/small for their intended viewports
15:35:30Torneit's useful to point out to the user that they have a missing font, rather than the theme just being crappy
15:36:07[Saint]But, it doesn't point it out.
15:36:10[Saint]It just fails.
15:36:19[Saint]A splash would be nice
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15:36:23Tornewell, that sucks
15:36:25Torneyes, a splash would be good
15:36:35Tornebut a splash and then going on to load the theme anyway seems sucky, user might miss it
15:36:44[Saint]Error: Missing font <fontname>
15:37:09[Saint]iff enough screen: download themepack from <url>
15:37:22[Saint]*err, fontpack even
15:38:08[Saint]Torne: What the themes do now if they fail anything is default to the hardcaoded theme IIRC
15:38:27[Saint]haven't seen that on device in a while though
15:38:31*JdGordon thinks he might have fixed the reported data abort :)
15:38:33Tornehm, that's also kinda sucky :)
15:38:40[Saint]just a little
15:38:45Tornenot sure how to fail nicely, though
15:39:02[Saint]you get no *reason*, it just fails silently.
15:39:10[Saint]well, semi-silently.
15:39:24[Saint]you get rewarded with a horrible default theme for the trouble ;)
15:39:48JdGordonwell we could add debug output but there will be a fairly big bin hit doing that
15:40:17[Saint]that's whyI hadn't suggested that yet
15:40:24[Saint]Would a splash be any cheaper?
15:40:25JdGordonbieber: you're parser sucks! it doesnt check for out of memory enough!! :)
15:40:43JdGordon[Saint]: the point with proper output is that it would say what failed
15:40:49TorneJdGordon: right, but you could at least differentiate file-not-found/etc
15:40:51JdGordonbut then that is what the theme programs are for
15:41:26[Saint]theme program can't pick up if you get everything right on the sim/editor, then don;t have the font on device
15:41:39[Saint]as I understand it, the editor automatically gets the fontpack
15:42:05[Saint]So, a new user still wouldn;t know *why* it failed.
15:42:14TorneJdGordon: would it be that big to remember what filename it failed to load? I dunno.
15:42:48JdGordonnot at all... the filename is loaded into ram and stored anyway
15:43:29Tornei mean, through the whole process
15:43:36Torneso you can just hav eone splash at the top level somewhere
15:43:44TorneI dunno. It seems worth having a *little* feedback
15:43:46JdGordonsure, easy
15:44:22JdGordonhow though? unless we hack together a full screen error message, splash is going to be too small
15:44:40Tornei're the ui guy :)
15:44:48[Saint]Is there any way I can enable skin debug output on device? I don't care if I have to piss around to build it. I have an .sbs that fails to load on device, but the sim/editor load it fine.
15:44:59[Saint]it's *really* pissing me off I can't debug it.
15:46:20JdGordon[Saint]: test it in my patch...
15:46:32JdGordonif it loads there then forget about it... old parser is dead
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15:47:36JdGordonbieber: is there any error checking at all in the parser?
15:48:11[Saint]JdGordon: It didn't. :/
15:48:35JdGordonzip it up and pass it here
15:48:38[Saint]I tried that as a last hope, but, I haven't built with your patch since a few updates ago
15:50:58[Saint] <−− JdGordon
15:51:14JdGordonnano I assume?
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16:01:32mc2739JdGordon: got a patch for testing?
16:01:49JdGordonbieber: looks like the theme editor wont open a .WPS file... .wps only?
16:02:05JdGordonmc2739: no.. still workiong on it.. looks like filling the skni buffer is fatal
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16:11:20mitkJdGordon: for clip+ got data abort at 30026EF8, FSR 0x8 (domain 0, fault 8) address 0xEA000053
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16:11:57JdGordonyeah ok... I'm hoping I know what the problem is
16:12:15JdGordonor, either way I'm adding a bunch of error checking now
16:15:23bertrikI can save reduce size, source code lines and complexity when moving the deemphasis value in the fm_region_data struct and calculating the FM band frequency/range from the fm_region_data struct (instead of taking it from a tuner-specific region data struct)
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16:31:53[Saint]Hmmm, I fear this may be a question for the recently retired JdGordon but, is there a limit on the path lenght for images in themes perhaps?
16:32:24[Saint]bah, no...if that were the case the .wps and .fms would fail also. :/
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16:45:11*bertrik received a COMBO4E revision of the clip+ today
16:49:50kugelwe fail if bitmaps don't load, so we should as well when fonts don't load
16:50:22[Saint]kugel: It does fail, the question was *how* it shoul dfail.
16:50:44[Saint]at the moment, it fails silently.
16:50:58kugelit should show the built-in wps
16:51:21[Saint]All you get is the built-in theme, and puzzlement at why it didn't work as there is no (visible) error
16:51:21kugelwhich has always been the best indicator for "this theme is broken" :)
16:51:29[Saint]it isn't though
16:51:38[Saint]it just makes people think "wtf?!?"
16:51:48kugelit's no "puzzlement", it's been like that ever since
16:52:06[Saint]but, if you're's completely mind boggling.
16:52:39kugelthere could be a splash sure, but I don't like trying to recover in any way
16:53:02[Saint]theme X loads, but theme Y gives this black and white crap looking theme...what?!? the screenshot was WAY better! etc.
16:53:23dfktbertrik, what's a COMBO4E revision?
16:53:36[Saint]Oh, sure...I don't think it *should* recover, but "Failed to load: X" would be a marked improvemeny
16:53:42kugel[Saint]: clearly X is working, and Y is broken
16:53:56[Saint]kugel: It's not clear to some though.
16:54:00kugelI don't disagree with a splash
16:54:16bertrikThere appear to be two hardware revisions of the clip+, called "HERMON" (presumably older) and "COMBO4E" (presumably newer)
16:54:29[Saint]If we get splashes about data aborts that an average user isn't going to care less abot, then "failed to load X" seems completely sane.
16:54:46bertrikYou can see these names in the [Hw Info] diagnostic screen of the clip+
16:55:09dfktbertrik, interesting, i will check mine right away :)
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16:56:21bertrikdfkt, we've discovered that several things can be different between clip+ players: radio chip (SI4702 or RDA5802), display (132 pixels or 128 pixels wide buffer) and now also some kind of general hardware revision (HERMON vs. COMBO4E)
16:56:39dfktsandisk doesn't make it easy...
16:58:54bertrikFor the fuze v2 there is probably something similar going on, which was part of the reason why these fuzes v2 refused to flash. funman already fixed that yesterday as far as I know
16:59:01[Saint]They probably got a better deal of cheaper, compatible hardware.
17:00:13*maraz is alive again
17:00:20marazand yes, i have problems with 3.6 and nano 1g
17:00:39marazmy unit seems to be overheating which leads to read errors and very funky playback and eventually, crash
17:01:12marazif i let it crash and just reboot it -> "no .rockbox directory, installation incomplete"
17:01:39marazif i cool it e.g. by keeping the flat back against a cool metal surface for a while, it boots without a hitch and plays fine for a while
17:02:52marazit could be just the flash chip, though, since it's been quite a while since my last totally clean format. any guesses
17:06:07[Saint]Hmmm..pass. While you're here though...
17:06:22[Saint]Do you get a "hiss" when booting your Nano1G?
17:06:49[Saint]In your earphones/IEMS/whatever obviously
17:07:31[Saint]I get a (very clear) "hissing" sound, until the first sound event, be it keyclick, voice or playback.
17:08:54[Saint]I know its not my IEMs as it happens no matter what I plug it into, and it stops as soon as there is a keyclick
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17:38:35*[Saint] looks at Default_CFG_Values. Are "enter" and "hover" (values for Talk Dir Clips, apparently) target specific?
17:38:53[Saint]I certainly don't have these options on Nano1/2G
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17:44:25mitkWhat is magic combo for making screendump on fuze v1 and clip+ ?
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17:51:06pixelmamitk: usually you enable screendump in the debug menu and if you plug the USB cable the dump should be saved. Not sure if it's working with those but it should
17:51:49mitkpixelma: thanks :)
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18:13:28EvanCarrollis there any plan to impliment double-click, or scroll-wheel through song
18:13:41EvanCarrollI see a patch on FS, but no update in over two years.
18:13:46EvanCarrollthe patch apears to be well received
18:13:56EvanCarrollThis is never going to be synced again. Since double-click was rejected there really isn't any point. If you guys are really wanting to use it I have a copy of it in my set of patches for my build at You'll need to apply progressbar-slider as well as double-click to use it though since my personal version I had to modify to coexist with that patch.
18:14:02EvanCarrollis this still the policy?
18:15:02[Saint]If it was going into SVM, I'd say it would not have sat unmaintained for 2 years
18:17:23Tornethat's a statement by the author of the patch
18:17:40Torneif someone else works on it and solves any outstanding issues and interests a developer, then it can go in, sure.
18:17:51EvanCarrollI read it as, 'double-click being rejected (upstream)'
18:17:56EvanCarrollwhich sounds to me like a policy
18:18:34[Saint]it also clearly states that double click is not necessry for it to function
18:21:41Tornesomeone said, at some point, that we didnt want double click of the select button to switch to a different seek mode
18:22:00Torneso 1) this isn't an unchangeable policy, developers are human beings who can be persuaded by logical arguments
18:22:06Torneand 2) this isn't required for the functionality to work
18:22:36Tornewe have only a very very short list of fixed "this is not going to happen"s:
18:22:46Torneshorter than it was, after the last devcon discussion :)
18:23:04*[Saint] sees a hotkey being more likely than double click if it were to be implemnted.
18:23:11[Saint]which, is still a big if.
18:23:16Torneit sounds like the author of the patch had a specific idea of what UI he wanted, and got fed up when people disagreed
18:23:29Tornethe actual *feature* of being able to scrub through the song is perfectly reasonable
18:23:57[Saint]odd dependencies on other things, not so much.
18:24:27Tornerather than work with us on a different UI that was acceptable, he abandoned it and left.
18:25:00TorneEvanCarroll: So, nobody is working on it. If someone works on it, then they're welcome to prod us about whether it can go in.
18:25:01[Saint]He made it work for Nano too...if he saw my theme he'd spit balls ! :P
18:25:20TorneIt's likely that the double-click button thing will still be refused, but there are plenty of other ways to initiate it
18:25:34Tornethere is no reason why rockbox should copy the apple firmware's UI (especially since we don't just run on ipods)
18:25:40Torneis that enough of an answer? :)
18:25:58[Saint]Ironically though, didn't double click find itself in discussion earlier today?
18:26:12[Saint](read no false hope into that though EvanCarroll)
18:26:13Tornei didn't see one :)
18:26:14sinthetekjust checking: will rockbox support any size microsd or does that depend on the specific device/architecture you're using it on?
18:26:26Tornesinthetek: Should be any size
18:26:26[Saint]Torne: I'll try find it.
18:26:32TorneAll SD and SDHC cards are the same, physically
18:26:37Tornesupporting SDHC is just a driver issue
18:26:42Torneand our drivers should do it ;)
18:27:33sintheteksweet, just making sure before i spend money on a bigger one. i forgot to check last time and then when i realized my old firmware wouldn't have even supported i was like 'wow'
18:27:44sinthetek'good thing i have rockbox!' :P
18:27:49sinthetekoki, thanks
18:28:03TorneSDXC is different physically, though
18:28:11Tornebut that's really new, so you're probably ok :)
18:28:22EvanCarrollpersonally, I think the double click idea is the best implimentation/application of it I can think of. I do listen to lengthy audio-books (30min maxish), and I've never *wanted* this feature.
18:28:58TorneEvanCarroll: you can have whatever opinion you like about it, but it was rejected because developers didn't like it
18:29:40sinthetekahh no, i can't afford anything that big atm
18:29:42pixelmayes, there was a short discussion earlier today about double-clicks
18:35:15[Saint]Torne: I found it, apparently there is indeed one place, in one target where double click exists.
18:35:22[Saint]in the Ondio FM screen.
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18:41:18pixelmawith the big difference to the patch I guess, that in this screen a single click of the affected button doesn't do anything
18:42:11pixelmaand amiconn explained the downside of double clicks when there is another thing mapped to a single click quite nicely
18:42:58[Saint]Indeed, the only way I can think to add a "scrub mode" to iPod (picked a low key target) would be a setting (...yuck) or Hotkey (kinda yuck, but, not *as* bad)
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18:44:15Tornewps context menu and being available for hotkey would do fine
18:44:53S_a_i_n_tI'd hate to use a hotkey to have to *enter* scrub though...
18:45:06S_a_i_n_thotkey/context to *toggle* it would be nice
18:45:56kugelTorne: I thought SDHC => SDXC was just a filesystem change?
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18:51:10Tornekugel: sdxc cards are not required to implement the mode that sdhc readers can keep up with
18:51:13Tornefull speed sdxc is not wire compatible and supporting both is optional
18:55:18mc2739S_a_i_n_t: any progress on your theme yet?
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19:02:01S_a_i_n_tmc2739: The Apple OF one?
19:02:27mc2739yes, that one
19:02:33S_a_i_n_tHmmm...I don't seem to have you on my list of testers if you're a Nano user.
19:02:38*S_a_i_n_t adds
19:02:52S_a_i_n_tthe .sbs is still giving me grief.
19:03:13mc2739I don't have a nano, but with some minor modifications I can test on my e200
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19:03:47S_a_i_n_twhat screensize is the e200?
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19:06:26S_a_i_n_tmc2739: In a rare event, I'm *just* about to head to bed, if you PM me an address I can drop it in you mail.
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19:07:00mc2739S_a_i_n_t: I downloaded it from your llink earlier
19:07:19S_a_i_n_tAh, I see. How did it go for you?
19:07:25S_a_i_n_tdid you try it out?
19:07:45mc2739I am not having problems with the sbs, but with the fms
19:08:29S_a_i_n_tHmmm, interesting. That must be a "new parser thing"
19:08:46mc2739the rds lines (line 148 and 171) cause it to fail loading
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19:09:00mc2739actually, this is still with the old parser
19:09:07bluebrotherbieber: great to see QuaZip works fine for you.
19:09:16S_a_i_n_tActually, you may not know what to expect from the .sbs, do you see the "rockbox" "settings" "files" etc. titles in the main menu?
19:09:40S_a_i_n_tmc2739: Wow, *super* weird.
19:09:41bluebrotherI've had a (short) look in how building a Windows installer using NSIS works. Should be fairly easy to do, especially for a static binary.
19:10:00S_a_i_n_tI can't test the .fms on device, but, it works in the sim...kinda
19:10:10S_a_i_n_tis the issue an update issue?
19:10:12mc2739S_a_i_n_t: no, not the header lines
19:10:13bluebrotherthough for an installer a dynamically linked binary might be a feasible way too.
19:10:16S_a_i_n_twith scan/preset?
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19:11:12bluebrotherpixelma: I don't know of any way to handle xml from LaTeX itself. But a format as simple as in the pastebin should be fairly easy to convert with a small perl script.
19:11:21S_a_i_n_tmc2739: So, in the main screen you have the word "iPod" alternating with "time", and battery icon/playmode icon?
19:11:26mc2739My device does not have rds, so my guess is that the %?tx tag fails
19:11:29bluebrotherseems like some people really don't want to get their heads around LaTeX ;-)
19:11:30S_a_i_n_tthat's all .sbs in the main screen
19:12:01S_a_i_n_tmc2739: Does the .fms not load, at all?
19:12:04mc2739S_a_i_n_t: yes, and then the menu (no Rockbox at the top)
19:12:37 Quit webguest55 (Client Quit) fails on device on my Nanos
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19:13:02mc2739the fms does not load, commenting or modifying those two lines lets it load
19:13:18S_a_i_n_tthe .fms works fine in the sim, I havent found anyone to test it on device yet.
19:13:34S_a_i_n_tNoone I know has an iPod FM dongle
19:14:11mc2739yes, main screen has iPod/clock play, disk, lock, battery
19:14:11S_a_i_n_tmc2739: Good to know, thanks.
19:14:50S_a_i_n_tEverything else I can test on device works except the .sbs on Nano 1 and 2G
19:15:07S_a_i_n_tbesides the .fms not working properly, wht did you think?
19:15:49S_a_i_n_tyou're the first person to try it out on a non-Nano...congrats ;)
19:16:28mc2739I think it looks good. I did see one viewport alignment problem on the fms screen when switching from a station with album art to one without and back
19:17:10S_a_i_n_tHmmm...ok, another thing I havent tested.
19:17:30S_a_i_n_tIf you can screenshot it for me, it would help.
19:17:50S_a_i_n_tif you can't be bothered, I'll look into it a litle later
19:18:12mc2739no problem. I'll link here when I get them.
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19:18:31S_a_i_n_tPM me, I'll still be here...just AFK probably.
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19:24:30S_a_i_n_tHmmm, I just had an incling (which I can't test presently) about why the .sbs might be failing, but I'm now annoyed there is no "does this target have recording" tag.
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19:24:46S_a_i_n_ts/failing/failing on my device/
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19:25:41S_a_i_n_tThere's at least one target I can think of that doesn't, so, such a tag makes sense. (-ish)
19:25:55bertrikyay, playback works on the COMBO4E clip+
19:26:18S_a_i_n_tbertrik: Congrats \o/
19:26:43bertrikbasically I just enabled some parts that funman already wrote for the new fuze v2 variant
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19:27:18kugelbertrik: does the detection work the same?
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19:27:28bertrikI verified that in the OF
19:27:59Buschelmay I re-ask again: does the number of cycles needed for mac.l depend on the size of the operands (similar to ARM)?
19:28:13Buschel(question for coldfire asm experts here)
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19:28:44bertrikThis clip+ also has a rather dim display
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19:30:10amiconnBuschel: no
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19:30:29amiconnBtw, mac.l implies the operand size (32 bit), 16 bit would be mac.w
19:30:48amiconnmac is single cycle, mac with parallel load is two cycles
19:31:16Buschelmac.w uses 16 bit for both operands?
19:31:17amiconnThere is a 3 cycle latency, only relevant for accumulator readout
19:31:57amiconnYou can specify which half of the two registers to use (individually)
19:32:40Buschelso, we cannot gain performance via using 16bit precision of window coefficients
19:32:52Buschelthe ARM asm does that
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19:38:55funmanbertrik: the clip+ brightness is quite low?
19:39:17CaptainKwelHi, is there any way to debug "Undefined instruction" errors?
19:39:40bertrikfunman, yes, not sure if this is related to the LCD controller type or to the COMBO4E
19:40:18funmantry the lcd-ssd1303.c diff of and change brightness, punt2 said it was working
19:40:51funmanCaptainKwel: check in which function the undefined instruction happens (look at the .map files for rockbox and individual plugins/codecs)
19:45:27bertrikfunman, yes that works
19:46:48bertrikthe max brightness value is *very* bright though, with obvious line artifacts (full-lit lines are dimmer than others)
19:47:14amiconnThat means some voltage converter is overloaded and reduces output voltage
19:47:25amiconnI can see that on my clip+ as well
19:47:32funmantry removing the lcd_set_contrast() diff perhaps
19:48:00bertrikI think the patch is mostly OK, it just should set contrast to high I think
19:48:04amiconnPerhaps not overloaded, just not regulating very well
19:50:28bertrikfunman, could it be that all OLEDs that need an offset of 2 also need a different setting for the contrast?
19:50:32funmanbertrik: perhaps some settings in the init can be shared with clipv1/clipv2/ other clip+
19:51:10funman(btw iiuc the clip+ which have low brightness have the 2nd lcd controller type=)
19:51:21S_a_i_n_tquestion: Does the target itself have to support RDS, or is it just a "it will work if it is available" thing?
19:51:28*funman should read before typing
19:51:51funmanbertrik: yes but the difference is in lcd initialization, not just contrast setting
19:56:36funmanbertrik: did you try µSD ?
19:56:46pixelmaS_a_i_n_t: I'm quite positive that there is a "does target have recording" tag
19:56:50bertrikno, I can try that now
19:57:12S_a_i_n_tpixelma: Again, it's one the manual has missed then :/
19:57:26*S_a_i_n_t is getting *mighty* sick of missing skin tags
19:58:01 Quit funman (Quit: singing in the rain)
19:58:54mc2739S_a_i_n_t: %Rp = Does this target have recording?
19:59:19pixelmaS_a_i_n_t: yes, I believe it isn't on CustomWPS either
19:59:29bertrikfunman, yay uSD works too magically
19:59:39mc2739that was from CustomWPS
19:59:41S_a_i_n_twhere did you find that out of interest mc2739?
19:59:48S_a_i_n_tor, did you just *know* it?
19:59:53pixelmaoh, sorry then
20:00:07S_a_i_n_tAha...more discrepency between CustomWPS and the manual then.
20:00:21S_a_i_n_thow are people supposed to learn this stuff?
20:00:31*S_a_i_n_t remembers the manual being complete....once.
20:00:44*pixelma doubts that
20:01:19S_a_i_n_theh, yeah...there was probably some obscure one I didn't know of ;)
20:01:29S_a_i_n_tor, three, or five.
20:02:25S_a_i_n_tOnce this new parser is in and done, and nothing will be changing for a while I want to make it a personal missing to make DAMN sure the manual has a complete list of tags and usages.
20:03:14pixelmabluebrother: how about a simple text format: "tag & description", one line each for a parsing of such a tag list for the manual and the theme editor (we also have to keep track of target features though)
20:03:26***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
20:04:35S_a_i_n_tpixelma: If it comes down to it, I will overcome my aversion to TeteX
20:04:40pixelmaand then the manual and custom WPS also groups things based on context - all tag info tags, all bitmap tags etc.
20:04:52S_a_i_n_tI'm *that* serious about wanting a *complete* list.
20:06:10S_a_i_n_tHonestly, when I have less on my plate I'll make it a mission to learn to use TeteX, this tag stuff has bitten me in the ass too many times now.
20:06:31S_a_i_n_tIt would have been so easy to do if tags were added *when they were implemented* :/
20:08:04TorneLaTeX, you mean :)
20:08:26TorneTeTeX is a specific TeX implementation (which is not popular any more)
20:08:33pixelmatetex is just the LaTeX package cygwin uses (and it's btw. outdated)
20:08:33gevaertsHe has a lot to learn :)
20:08:47S_a_i_n_tAha, I*I* knew what I meant. :P
20:08:48gevaertsTorne: implementation or distribution? :)
20:09:04pixelma"uses" = is available from the cygwin installer
20:09:07Tornegevaerts: both, if i recall correctly
20:09:14S_a_i_n_tTeTeX is the CygWin package stuk in my brain.
20:09:23Tornedebian now uses luatex as the implementation, and the distribution is texlive, iirc ;)
20:09:25S_a_i_n_t*stuck even
20:09:31*bluebrother just managed to cross-compile the theme editor on Linux and create a NSIS installer :)
20:09:44bluebrotherthe question remains if that installer does something useful though :)
20:10:01gevaertsbluebrother: this is where wine comes in
20:11:15bluebrotherpixelma: if we need a separate script to parse that I don't see too much gain in using such a simple format. Using a simple xml format should work fine, and it could even allow to add required features
20:11:35pixelmatexlive has the nice advantage that tex4ht which is needed for HTML manuals is included (in contrast to tetex :\ )
20:12:00bluebrother(like <tag features="backlight,rtc,fm">%foo<description>This is some very weird tag</description></tag>
20:12:05S_a_i_n_tJdGordon wanted simple so he could add the tags I think, or, so others could do or the other. ;)
20:12:20pixelmabluebrother: so xml parsing is already available?
20:12:27bluebrothertetex is outdated and unmaintained anyway
20:12:48pixelmain general I mean
20:13:09bluebrotherpixelma: well, I was thinking of a simple perl script using XML::Simple
20:13:38bluebrotherin general script languages come with xml parsers. Not sure if named module is part of the standard install though.
20:13:45pixelmabluebrother: yes about tetex, but noone bothered to make an installer package for cygwin of a newer implementation so
20:14:08Tornethis is yet another reason why people shouldn't use cygwin for rockbox though :)
20:14:22*S_a_i_n_t "Bah!" 's
20:14:26bluebrothernewer implementation as in TeXlive?
20:14:51*bluebrother wonders if it would be feasible to use MinGW + msys + MikTeX to build the manual :)
20:15:06 Quit Jaykay (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
20:15:11Tornemsys is cygwin
20:15:14Tornejust for reference, btw
20:15:22Tornei've explained this one before
20:15:36bluebrothernot really.
20:15:51bluebrotherfor example, there is no dependency on cygwin-1.dll
20:15:56*S_a_i_n_t dubs Torne "Sir. Hatescygwinalot"
20:15:56Torneyes there is
20:16:03pixelmagetting a bit offtopic here
20:16:08Tornethe actual mingw toolchain doesn't depend on cygwin. the msys environment does.
20:16:15Tornethe tools in msys do not compile natively for win32.
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20:24:10bluebrotherTorne: well, my msys installation doesn't depend on any Cygwin libraries so I don't consider that being Cygwin. Sure, it uses code from cygwin but that doesn't make it cygwin.
20:24:21Torneit all links to msys-1.dll
20:24:29Tornewhich, as you can see from the suspicious naming convention
20:24:35Torneis, er, cygwin, configured slightly differently ;)
20:24:40Torneand renamed
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20:24:48bluebrotherwith that reasoning I could also say that Rockbox is Linux because it requires Linux for building. Plus, it also uses some code imported form
20:24:55bluebrother*from Linux programs
20:25:02Torneno, it's not the same at all
20:25:33*S_a_i_n_t coughs loudly
20:26:13bluebrothermsys might be a fork of cygwin (and AFAIK it's been forked from the cygwin codebase years ago), but it's still something different. msys is msys, not cygwin.
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20:40:18bluebrotherbieber: just tried checked the Rendering settings in the Theme Editor. IMO it would be better to put the target db file in the usual settings location instead of creating yet-another-dotfile in $HOME.
20:41:12bluebrotheralso, the font path gets initialized to /, and I'm rather sure users aren't allowed to write there (at least on Linux :)
20:41:49bluebrotheralso, as I was thinking about an installer for Windows it might make sense to default that path to the path where the editor binary is located
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20:54:27bluebrothernice. Installer completely broken :/
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20:57:25kifohooray my first wps is almost done
21:03:39bieberbluebrother: Do you know if there could possibly be any performance issues from storing really large keys in the config file?
21:04:10 Quit kifo (Quit: life)
21:06:04bluebrotherbieber: I don't know of any. What do you want to store? The complete targetdb? ;-)
21:06:53S_a_i_n_tcan't it locate that somewhere online also?
21:06:56bluebrotherhmm. Wouldn't that complicate updating it?
21:07:10*S_a_i_n_t assumes someone needs web acces to get it in the first place
21:07:13bluebrother(for the user that is)
21:07:34S_a_i_n_tIt was decided (I thought) it should auto-update
21:08:12bieberJdGordon1: I think I did put lower-case "wps" in all the constants :/ I'll go ahead and fix that
21:08:21bluebrotherbtw, if we provide a Windows installer it would make sense to have that also include (or download) the fonts package. Another reason why I'd default that to the path of the executable (maybe a subfolder fonts/ or so?)
21:08:51S_a_i_n_tbieber: It needs to be able to accept .wps and .WPS, .sbs and .SBS etc
21:08:56S_a_i_n_tAs, the device does.
21:09:09kugelbluebrother: why ~/.config/
21:09:14bieberS_a_i_n_t: It has a download button, but I don't want it to _alwas_ fetch the file from the Internet, since it obviously won't change very much
21:09:18kugeli.e. not just rockbox
21:09:29kugelthe font folder should probably be shared with RaaA
21:09:55bieberkugel: That's just the way Qt likes to store settings on *nix
21:10:32kugelbieber: I mean the ".org" specifically
21:11:16bluebrotherbecause Rockbox Utility uses that since years?
21:11:45bieberHeh, I guess that's as good a reason as any :P
21:11:48kugelbluebrother: that doesn't answer my question
21:12:10bluebrotherwell, then your question was unclear.
21:12:15bluebrotherat least to me.
21:12:19bieberI do see that it has a separate field for organization domain, and we're putting it in organization name. Perhaps we should transition them over to just rockbox?
21:12:20kugelwhy does it use the .org
21:12:42bluebrotherbecause someone (presumably me) put it to the "organization" part of the QSettings calls.
21:12:55kugelah, so it's a Qt thing
21:13:39bieberbluebrother: I thought you were recommending putting the targetdb in the config file? If not there and not in a hidden file in ~, where else to put it?
21:13:55bluebrotherbieber: no, I means to just put it in the same folder.
21:14:02kugelI think it would make sense if all our desktop apps use the same folder in ~/.config, but I find strange because our project isn't called
21:14:35bieberAh, okay
21:15:09S_a_i_n_tThe project isn't called that, but, everything is linked from there.
21:15:12kugelRaaA will have fonts in ~/.config/rockbox[.org]/fonts
21:15:18S_a_i_n_tI think the .org fits, personally
21:15:27bluebrotherwell, that's handled quite differently between applications. I have in my ~/.config for example, but the application isn't called I also have Nokia, but the application isn't called Nokia.
21:15:49kugelS_a_i_n_t: yea, but the scheme is .config/<project> and not .config/<website of the project>
21:15:51*gevaerts isn't at all convinced that RaaA and the theme editor should share fonts
21:16:48bieberWell, the way QSettings initializes it is .config/organization/application.conf, we've just been putting our domain name in where we're supposed to put our organization name
21:16:54 Quit milz (Remote host closed the connection)
21:17:16kugelis our organisation name
21:17:42kugelgevaerts: do you see a problem with that?
21:18:29bluebrotherwell, what _is_ our organization name? In the Google sense the organization is Rockbox, but in the general sense Rockbox is not an organization. In which case it makes sense to use the url instead.
21:19:07*kugel doesn't agree with that
21:19:13gevaertsBut you're not using the URL!
21:19:35gevaertskugel: I'm not sure actually
21:20:13S_a_i_n_treal browsers care not for www's etc. ;)
21:20:22bluebrotherwith what? That in the general sense Rockbox is not an organization?
21:20:42kugelwe are an organization in a way, just no legal entity. and we do have a name
21:20:55bieberJdGordon1: What do you mean by error checking? The parser just errors out if it finds a syntax error, and leaves it up to the caller to print an error message
21:20:56gevaertsPersonally I find this usage of domain names to specify organisations to be silly
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21:22:09S_a_i_n_tbieber: That should be good enough, the idea is to spit a splash/message/something on device when a theme fails to load, with the file it failed to load.
21:22:26S_a_i_n_tit the moment, it just silently fails
21:22:58 Quit milz (Remote host closed the connection)
21:23:00bieberThat makes sense, I just don't do it in my parser code because I didn't want it throwing crap on the terminal every time a parse failed, so whatever code calls it has to make sure to check for error after calling it
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21:24:03kugelgevaerts: do you want a couple copies of the same instead? :)
21:24:47bluebrotherdoes RaaA even run on the same platforms as the theme editor? IIRC RaaA was ment to get ported to Android as first target
21:25:08S_a_i_n_twill it *be* the same fonts?
21:25:24 Quit milz (Remote host closed the connection)
21:25:27kugelbluebrother: the first port is the sdl app
21:25:32S_a_i_n_tIf you *could* use aliased fonts, wouldn;t you?
21:25:51bluebrotherhow about using TTF fonts? ;-)
21:25:51kugelS_a_i_n_t: I'd think it should look the same as on target
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21:26:07kugelmore eye candy isn't necessarily helpful
21:26:16*S_a_i_n_t isn't so sure abou that
21:26:23S_a_i_n_tif it can look better, it should
21:26:35S_a_i_n_t(within reason)
21:26:44gevaertsS_a_i_n_t: sure, which is why we don't do anti-aliased fonts :)
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21:27:31kugelS_a_i_n_t: it's meant to make themes for use with rockbox, it has no purpose on its own. so why should it look differently than the actual result?
21:28:27S_a_i_n_tOh, I was talking about RaaA
21:28:28kifoHi. I was trying to make in my little practice theme a 24 hour clock with HH:MM where the : blinked on and off each second, I have it set to %t(1)%al%cH:%cM;%al%cH %cM
21:28:31kifocurrently but
21:28:36kifothe : isnt blinking at the right rate
21:28:38kifois that a uhm
21:28:41kiforesource issue
21:28:46kifoor am i missing something
21:29:21bertrikDoes the fuze v2 have some kind of diagnostics menu in the original firmware?
21:29:26S_a_i_n_tyes, indeed.
21:29:30kugelS_a_i_n_t: oh, I see, then I agree with you :)
21:29:41S_a_i_n_teach subline needs the %t(X)
21:29:53S_a_i_n_tkugel: Awesome ;)
21:29:54kifookay cool
21:30:13bieberkugel: As an aside, if you want RaaA to be cross-platform, putting fonts in .config/rockbox[.org] is probably not a good idea, because on different platforms settings will be stored elsewhere (i.e. in the registry on Windows)
21:30:24kifothat makes it a lot easier for me because now I can but non-timed elements on the same line :D
21:30:25S_a_i_n_tkifo: %t(1)%al%cH:%cM; %t(1)%al%cH %cM
21:30:25bieberPerhaps just the application path and /fonts
21:30:29kifoi couldnt figure out what I was missing before
21:30:35kifo"; " L
21:30:42kifoer i mean
21:30:46kifowhy the space after ;
21:31:03simonrvnclarity, presumably
21:31:21kugelbieber: the fonts in the registry?
21:31:42kugelthe config path can sure be different on other platforms
21:31:44S_a_i_n_tkifo: come again?
21:31:45bieberNo no, I just mean that the .config/rockbox directory won't be there to store them in on Windows
21:32:02S_a_i_n_tone line this time, please...easier to follow if you don't press enter a million times ;)
21:32:04bieberSo we'd best keep them somewhere we know will always be there, like the application's directory
21:32:26gevaertsbieber: that's not possible
21:32:31kugelbieber: which is not always writable
21:32:32kifoS_a_i_n_t: bad habit, I get yelled at a lot. go write in PM to yourself 500 times "Enter is not punctuation!"
21:32:34gevaertsThis must be a user-accessible path
21:32:58kugeleven on windows the application dir is not really writable (since the introduction of UAC)
21:33:03bluebrotheryou could use an application folder _plus_ a user-writeable folder for additional / replacement fonts
21:33:06bieberOh yeah, that would cause a pretty big problem when it gets installed in /usr
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21:33:12kifowith the %t(1) after the ;, in the second subline, why do you have a space between the %t(2) and the ;?
21:33:20CIA-6New commit by alle (r27510): More explanation to the convbdf options
21:33:34kugelbluebrother: that's what RaaA does
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21:33:44bluebrotheri.e. ship some defaults but allow overriding them without the need to copy them in the user folder in the first place
21:33:51gevaertsbieber: anyway, the idea is not to write a crossplatform application, it's to write a portable application :)
21:33:55bluebrothermight be sensible for distro packages f.e.
21:34:06 Join milz [0] (
21:34:24*kifo loves the battery behavior in the simulator
21:34:26bluebrotherhaving an application work portable is always a good thing :)
21:34:39 Quit milz (Remote host closed the connection)
21:34:43biebergevaerts: I guess I'm missing a subtle distinction?
21:34:51CIA-6r27510 build result: All green
21:35:01S_a_i_n_tkifo: I didn't realise I *did* include a space, sorry.
21:35:04gevaertsbieber: indeed :) Think java versus Qt
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21:35:08S_a_i_n_tit's not needed.
21:35:18CIA-6New commit by bluebrother (r27511): Don't overwrite AR if it's been set from outside.
21:35:23CIA-6New commit by bluebrother (r27512): Support cross-compiling Theme Editor. ...
21:35:24bieberOkay, so cross platform means a single binary
21:36:03kifoS_a_i_n_t: okay cool. I have my first practice wps perfect how I wanted it, now I get to try to figure out how to have a graphical battery indicator, sounds fun huh?
21:36:17*kifo could probably look it up but wants to figure it out
21:36:32*bluebrother was thinking about something like when speaking about portable :o
21:36:32CIA-6New commit by bieber (r27513): Theme Editor: Added support for upper-case wps file extensions
21:36:43S_a_i_n_tkif *should* look it up ;)
21:36:53CIA-6r27511 build result: All green
21:36:56S_a_i_n_tkifo: even.
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21:37:16bieberbluebrother: What platforms do you have it cross-compiling from/to?
21:37:21gevaertsbieber: the way I see it, a cross-platform application has to handle all sorts of platform, while a portable one only has to be easy ti adapt to various platforms
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21:37:33bluebrotherbieber: w32 binary from my F13 box
21:37:54S_a_i_n_tkifo: It really depends on the result you want, but, you can do it a not so easy way sing bitmap-strips, or an easier way using a progressbar.
21:37:54*kugel wonders if he should stick to .config/ or use .config/rockbox (meaning there's two rockbox folders in .config)
21:37:57bluebrotherhowever, I don't have a static build of Qt around so the resulting binary will need Qt*.dll
21:38:09bluebrother(plus a few others)
21:38:23CIA-6r27513 build result: All green
21:38:32bluebrotherFedora 13
21:38:52bieberOh, okay
21:39:03bieberlol, I was thinking it was some obscure architecture :P
21:39:26bluebrotherthey provide mingw packages and also a Qt package for mingw. Quite nice, but it has a few quirks.
21:39:44kugelalternatively rbutil could change to .config/rockbox of course (which I would prefer)
21:39:47gevaertsbieber: it is!
21:40:04bluebrotherbuilding Rockbox Utility doesn't work at all (at least right now), because various OS specific stuff doesn't get selected correctly right now.
21:40:23bieberDoes it not define the right flags or something?
21:40:25 Quit Jerom (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
21:40:30*bluebrother really doesn't understand why for 3 years _nobody_ did care about ~/.config/ and now people are coming up with that.
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21:40:57gevaertsbluebrother: that's easy, because now people need directories for other things :)
21:40:59bluebrotherbieber: basically, yes. All those "win32 { foo }" stuff in the pro file doesn't work.
21:41:19bluebrothergevaerts: well, they can pick other directories at their choice ...
21:41:31kugelbluebrother: because rbtuil isn't the only rockbox desktop app anymore
21:41:38*S_a_i_n_t is of the "if its been there for 3 years, let it be" mentality for most things...except bugs ;)
21:41:49bluebrotherbieber: fortunately the theme editor doesn't use any platform specific code. That makes it much easier to cross compile it :)
21:42:13bluebrotherkugel: well, if people don't like using now I assume they also didn't like it 3 years in the past.
21:42:15bieberHehe, I try to keep it that way :) I really hate platform-specific ifdefs
21:42:43bluebrotherbieber: yeah, but for Rockbox Utility we can't live without them. Unfortunately, but well ...
21:42:48kugelbluebrother: possible, I for one never cared about it, but I now do
21:43:04kifoS_a_i_n_t: battery progress bar, eh?
21:44:08S_a_i_n_tsure, all (well, most) in the manual.
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21:47:50kifoS_a_i_n_t: the manual only mentions progress bars for time in track?
21:52:16bieberkifo: You can use %bp with the same arguments as %pb to turn it into a progress bar
21:52:49kifoI thought bp was the charging status
21:52:57kifohmm lemme play around with that
21:53:18pixelma%bl probably but I lost track too
21:53:30S_a_i_n_t%bp is "charger connected"
21:53:31kifo%bl is just the battery in percent
21:53:41S_a_i_n_t%bl is "battery status"
21:54:03pixelma"battery level" ;)
21:54:18kifoyea i dont get this battery progress bar thing
21:54:23S_a_i_n_tbah...same difference :P
21:54:44S_a_i_n_tkifo: did you read the manual?
21:54:54S_a_i_n_tsorry to ask but, it's right there.
21:55:42kifoyea thats the bitmap thing
21:55:50kifoI must have misread what you said
21:55:57bieberOh, yeah %bl
21:56:08kifoi thought you said there was some sort of %bp thing like %pb that had a progress bar for the battery
21:56:09bieberWhenever I name a tag, just assume that I've got at least one of the letters wrong :P
21:56:31S_a_i_n_tkifo: I did.
21:56:32bieber%bl(x,y,w,h,image), like S_a_i_n_t said
21:56:35S_a_i_n_tand, that is it.
21:56:50kifoI thought you meant there were two different ways to do it :p
21:56:57S_a_i_n_tthere are.
21:57:29S_a_i_n_ttwo progressbar ways, one bitmp strip.
21:57:57kifoerm I thought you meant there was some way to do it without specifying a bmp
21:58:14kifobut yea that makes sense
21:58:16kifoill play with the bmp thing
21:58:19S_a_i_n_tthere is, just use - instead of bitmap.bmp
21:58:50S_a_i_n_tand, it will draw the "built in" progressbar.
21:59:29S_a_i_n_tspecifying a bitmap image just tells it to use that image as the progressbar, instead of drawing one using the foreground color
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22:03:28***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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22:08:53CIA-6New commit by bieber (r27514): Theme Editor: Added file filters with capitalized extensions for WPS, SBS, etc. files
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22:10:24CIA-6r27514 build result: All green
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22:13:44kifohmm, having a problem with my status bar not updating on my wps
22:14:24kifoworks fine in the simulator, maybe a theme conflict
22:14:30S_a_i_n_tpastebin the .wps
22:15:35S_a_i_n_tAs much as they try to, and as much as they should...sim and device work a little differently with some things sometimes.
22:16:18kifoI know its probably a real stinker of a wps to your eyes but I'm proud of it :D
22:17:42 Quit bunnyboi (Quit: Nice Scotty, now beam my clothes up too!)
22:18:41S_a_i_n_tkifo: What do you mean by "status bar" exactly?
22:18:54kifouhm, at the bottom
22:18:57kifothe track time status bar
22:19:06kifoand the volume, remaining time, and elapsed time
22:19:09kifoall fail to update
22:19:14kifosort of freeze after a few seconds
22:19:26kifoand dont reload unless I got to menu, then come back to now playing
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22:21:51S_a_i_n_tkifo: try
22:22:02S_a_i_n_tLines with dynamic content cannot scroll.
22:22:11S_a_i_n_tthe %s was blocking the update
22:22:42kifooh geez i didnt even notice that
22:23:54S_a_i_n_tIt says it right down the *very* bottom of the tags section in the manual, so, I don't blame you.
22:25:56kifooh yea I should have spotted that
22:26:00kifoi dunno why the %s was there
22:26:19kifomy eyesight only works when im reading the manual not for my own wps
22:26:24kifocall it a personality flaw
22:31:10bertrikI guess the DC_DC on/off register influences the clip+ display brightness, I'll try that out now
22:33:33kifoi have to go to dinner
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22:40:13bertrikYup, it's the DC_DC on/off register that makes the difference for the display brightness/contrast on the clip :)
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22:43:30danrHi, I was wondering how to get a plugin I wrote added to Rockbox. It's a shopping list app called Shopper, which I added as a patch a while back. Could any of the developers take a look please?
22:43:50bertrikToo bad, using the setting of the "new" clip+ looks very bad on the "old" clip+
22:45:35S_a_i_n_tdanr: Is it on the tracker?
22:47:24danrIt is, yes, with ID 10820. I wrote the patch against version 3.4 so I could always update it for 3.6, but it's quite basic anyway.
22:48:09S_a_i_n_tIf it has been there since 3.4, it's pretty safe to say a dev has reviewed it...but, I may be wrong.
22:50:15danrHopefully a dev has picked it up, but since there's no feedback attached to the task, I wouldn't know if that's the case.
22:50:38kugelS_a_i_n_t: you're most probably wrong :)
22:51:40S_a_i_n_tkugel: If a patch from 2 revisions ago has not been reviewed by at least 1 dev something is seriously wrong...
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22:58:06danrOK, let me know if there's anything more I can do to get the patch reviewed. Thanks :-)
22:58:51S_a_i_n_tThis channel is logged, so, if it's going to will ;)
23:00:25danrCool ;-)
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23:15:32kugelS_a_i_n_t: no shit!
23:18:19CIA-6New commit by bieber (r27515): Theme Editor: Changed default directories for fonts and targetdb, font downloader will now make download directory if it doesn't exist
23:18:38 Join krazykit [0] (~kkit@
23:19:52CIA-6r27515 build result: All green
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23:27:33cfpHi there! Just wanted to drop in and say how great the rockbox project is :)
23:27:42cfpWell, good night everyone =)
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23:34:21Buschelhi, can anyone of you coldfire guys give this a short try ->
23:36:18Buschelthis change does a little refactoring of inline asm (also uses identical macros for 2 calls). this will help to be able to go back to a single synth_full()-function...
23:36:56 Quit togetic (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
23:37:04Buscheland imho it enhances readability
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