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#rockbox log for 2010-07-31

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00:54:17*Dreamxtreme hacks his Classic 1G with ibugger
00:54:36*TheSeven wonders who Dreamxtreme is
00:55:14Dreamxtremejust read a manual for rockbox now cant wait hehehe
00:55:25Dreamxtremesome good stuff in there
00:55:52DarkMallocoOo, TheSeven
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01:35:10seaniCould someone tell me what the revision number is for the 3.6 release? I want to do an identical rebuild. And what the standard way of getting this info is when I don't have a player to hand to test install and look at the Rockbox info screen? Ta!
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01:38:59AlexPseani: It is tagged in svn
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01:39:09AlexPbranched even
01:39:15AlexPjust checkout the branch
01:39:42AlexPThe mail on the dev list announcing the branch has the command IIRC
01:41:44seaniAlexP: Thanks, maybe time I became familiar with more than "svn co" - I'll go and look
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01:46:18AlexPseani: Still the same command :)
01:46:21AlexPsvn co svn:// rockbox-3.6
01:47:51CIA-6New commit by bertrik (r27631): Make some global function/variables local (by making them static)
01:49:10seaniAlexP: Thanks. A quick install of rapidsvn seems to indicate it's 26776 in old money. But I'll stick to your method.
01:49:46CIA-6r27631 build result: All green
01:51:05bertrikooh, even a green delta :)
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01:56:51S_a_i_n_tpixelma: I *could* be remembering it wrongly, but, from what I recall %pE (and friend) works fine up to 10, as in %pE(1) == 1second, %pE(2) == 2seconds etc up to 10 (which is also the default) then it seems broken from there.
01:57:12S_a_i_n_tI could be remembering it wrongly, but I'm pretty sure that values lower than 10 work as intended.
01:57:42S_a_i_n_ts/lower than 10/lower than, and inclusive of, 10/
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02:19:11seaniDo I need a different make config. when I generate voice clips depending on whether it's for the physical target or the simulator?
02:19:56seaniMy sim builds always seem to be out of synch. with freshly built voice files, but the same voice file seems fine on the actual player
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05:01:52meesebyteThis is what I want to do: Install Win7 on MacBook pro, and then install ubuntu. Is there a way yo /just/ use GRUB as the boot menu instead of boot camp?
05:02:36krazykitmeesebyte, well, rockbox can't help you do any of those things.
05:03:27krazykitthis is the rockbox channel. discussion is limited to rockbox
05:04:21meesebyteSomehow my irc client thought "/join #ubuntu" meant something else
05:04:31meesebytelol thanks anyways
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05:58:08old45I am atempting to upgrade my Rockbox version to 3.6 and I get a message that there is a problem; it reads that it is looking for the target H120 but is finding h120. Should I proced with the update or fix the h to H
06:03:08old45I am using the utility for the upgrade
06:03:37mc2739just proceed
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10:25:04deltquick question.... so its 4:25 here. how do i set my (rockboxitated) sandisk e260 to start playing at 8:45 am?
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10:28:11deltlooking at system -> time & date -> sleep timer ...?
10:28:47delt(set to off by default)
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10:37:45deltalso, somefile.txt -> "viewer menu" -> (fonts etc. set to decent defaults) -> now wtf is up with the line feed??!?
10:37:57delt(scrolls kind of slow too)
10:39:49deltanyway, gonna get more familiar with 3.6 (before annoying you with more questions)
10:40:10deltseems to... well, rock tha box :D
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10:58:36CIA-6New commit by jdgordon (r27632): remove an unused variable
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11:00:33CIA-6r27632 build result: All green
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11:18:48n1sJdGordon: speaking of unused vars, could you look at FS #11396, it's still there and still not set, just read...
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11:32:09*TheSeven just noticed an interesting corner case: if a rockbox wakeup is waited on before it is signalled, it will wake the *first* thread waiting for it. so if multiple threads wait for it, they will take one signal each. however, if the wakeup is signalled *before* a thread waits for it, *one* thread will be woken immediately when waiting for it, even if it was signalled multiple times. is this intentional?
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11:33:11TheSevenor is multiple threads waiting on a single wakeup not supported at all?
11:33:15n1sTheSeven: i'd guess jhMikeS is the one to ask
11:33:57biohazardmight i ask a question?
11:34:04n1sbiohazard: sure
11:34:34biohazardanyone here using the current build for the ipod 2g experiencing the panic stkov nand error?
11:34:35TheSevendepends on the question :P
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11:34:54TheSevenbiohazard: i assume you mean *nano* 2g?
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11:35:05biohazardforgot that
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11:35:25TheSevenwhen does it happen?
11:35:37TheSevenand current build as of when? (if not within the last few days)
11:36:02JdGordon1n1s: hmm, yeah probably good to remove
11:36:48JdGordon1bertrik: I was pinged a few days ago about release?
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11:37:12n1sJdGordon1: i'm not sure what it was/is intended to do so i didn't want to just remove it but you think that is fine?
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11:37:33JdGordon1it looks like its in really old code
11:37:45bertrikJdGordon, I don't know
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11:38:21JdGordonanyway, my answer would be no need to postpone unless lots of bugs come in before we are due
11:38:27JdGordonwhen is 3.7 due?
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11:39:26biohazard1sry my computer went out
11:39:32TheSeven[11:35] <TheSeven> when does it happen?
11:39:32TheSeven[11:35] <TheSeven> and current build as of when? (if not within the last few days)
11:39:55biohazard1the most current build
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11:40:16JdGordonlooks like another month still, which means freeze soon
11:41:03TheSevenbiohazard1: does it crash immediately on boot or how do you trigger it?
11:41:06stripwax(for the logs-)
11:41:14bertrikJdGordon, if we follow the 3-month-scheme, I think we'll release around end of august, so we're quite well on track to have 4 weeks to shake out any remaining issues because of with big changes (like eabi and skin breaking change)
11:41:15stripwax(Seani - yes, different targets have different strings)
11:41:27TheSevenbertrik: wasn't it 4 months?
11:41:36biohazard1it crashes at random
11:41:37stripwax(delt - try the Alarm settings. the sleep timer tells it to turn Off, not turn On)
11:41:51bertrikTheSeven, I don't know, wasn't it 3 months?
11:42:11JdGordon3 months
11:42:14biohazard1i think the ipod itself is going bad
11:42:15*TheSeven suggests to look at actual release dates... wikipedia says 4 months at least :)
11:42:18JdGordon3.5 was late apparnetly
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11:42:26TheSevenbiohazard1: i doubt that.
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11:42:33JdGordon :)
11:42:35biohazard1its pretty old
11:42:42TheSevendid anybody change anything regarding storage idle callbacks recently?
11:42:59biohazard1screen is damaged and the hold button is missing and i cant uninstall the bootloader
11:43:01TheSeventhis would be the most likely reason for the (tiny) nand stack to overflow
11:43:26JdGordon3.5 might have been late due to noone being around in january?
11:43:32TheSevenbiohazard1: which bootloader?
11:43:40biohazard1the current one in the ipod
11:43:50TheSeventhe rockbox bootloader or iloader?
11:44:09TheSeventhat one can always be uninstalled as long as usb works
11:44:16 Nick mt2 is now known as mt (~chatzilla@
11:44:25biohazard1might be my usb my laptop is pretty iffy
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11:44:50TheSevendid you try just restoring using itunes?
11:45:11stripwaxn1s (and Buschel) - so, if the coldfire asm truncates then we might as well have the arm asm truncate too and save a few instructions. (libwmapro). And also use XNPROD instead of fixmul31-fixmul31 ?
11:45:20biohazard1pff itunes? lol sadly i dont have that installed. good idea though. i got the ipod from a friend about a year ago
11:45:49TheSevenactually ipodpatcher should also be able to remove it
11:45:51stripwaxn1s - checked logs but didn't see any follow up, other than your comment to Buschel (and your commiit to state that in the comments)
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11:46:22biohazard1does the website keep the builds for the 2g? or only the most recent?
11:46:35n1sstripwax: yes, i think that's fine as long as noone can hear the difference, i can not
11:47:16n1salthough i have become uncertain what actually is in the lsb in the 32 bit acc on coldfire
11:47:53n1sthere's also a rounding mode for the emac that we might want to use
11:48:37stripwaxoh.. :) I think the "half-a-bit" loss in windowing is unavoidable since that's the best possible precision we can have with fixed point; but was thinking maybe we could have a 'precision' #define to make e.g. MULT and fixmul do the extra instructions on arm, but only if you compile it with that flag set.
11:49:39 Quit JdGordon (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
11:49:47stripwax(same for coldfire but only useful if it saves instructions)
11:50:05biohazard1im trying ipodpatcher now
11:50:06n1syeah, we could make that define affect cf too, getting the additional bit cost 3 instrs
11:50:24n1sno, more than 3
11:50:51stripwaxI wonder if anyone has compared decoded output across multiple devices. are some rockbox platforms 'more precise' than others?
11:51:05n1s4 instrs
11:51:06stripwaxanswer currently seems to be 'not really sure' :-)
11:51:17biohazard1ipodpatcher worked
11:52:01n1sstripwax: i think were losing this last bit of precision in almost all fixed point stuff done with the emac
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11:52:52n1sstripwax: the arm v6 (gigabeast) also has instructions for multiply and multiply accumulate for 32*32=32hi
11:53:32n1swhich also truncate the result so the accumulated result will differ slightly from the regular 64 bit accumulation
11:56:49biohazard1i dont want to sound stupid but are you guys talking about a new type of arm cpu?
11:57:00stripwaxwe might as well use the simpler instructions for arm too then. i think only wmapro is going out of its way to keep that 1 bit.
11:57:32stripwaxbiohazard1 - specifically discussing some of the codec assembly code. but talking about the different implementation we have for different cpus (coldfire, ipod arm, and gigabeat S arm)
11:58:56n1syeah, i already wrote armv6 windowing loops for tremor with those instructions
12:04:03stripwaxwe should also migrate wmapro to codeclib mdct :)
12:04:49n1syeah, i thought mt was working on that
12:07:27stripwaxi wonder if/how much faster codeclib fft would be if we didn't need to do that revtab stuff - that massive table that doesn't fit in iram.
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12:09:57CIA-6New commit by bertrik (r27633): Let format.c #include its own format.h header file
12:11:37CIA-6r27633 build result: All green
12:11:44*stripwax wonders about an EvenFasterFFt ..
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12:16:35mtI was looking into using the codeclib's mdct in wma pro
12:17:38mtI was thinking of trying to use our trig tables first in wma pro and then see what I have to do with the input...
12:17:55stripwaxis it clear why the trig tables are different?
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12:18:13stripwaxis one just a rescaled version of the other? (it kinda looked like it but i didn't dig in)
12:18:31stripwaxe.g. maybe some wmapro blocksizes have a scaling factor built in, and some don't
12:19:10stripwaxShould be easy to figure out, since the ffmpeg code didn't have tables but instead had an initialisation calculation to build the tables at runtime, I think?
12:19:32mtstripwax: no, all are scaled, but with different scaling per block size
12:19:35mtyes you're right
12:19:52seanistripwax: Yes, I get that bit ta, but how do configure for voice for, say, C240 sim as opposed to C240 physical target. I tried "S V" as options under (A)dvanced in tools/configure - no joy. What am I misunderstanding?
12:19:53mtalso, I tried scaling the input according to block size before the mdct, but it didn't work
12:19:54stripwaxis the scaling factor something like 1/N or more complex
12:20:49stripwaxseani - hrm, I'm not sure to be honest; I'm not using voice files personally. Anyone else know?
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12:23:53mtstripwax : scale is sqrt(fabs(1.0 / (1 << (BLOCK_MIN_BITS + i - 1)) / (1 << (s->bits_per_sample - 1)) ) )
12:24:06mtlooks very simple .. :-\
12:24:31stripwaxis BLOCK_MIN_BITS a constant? what is ' i ' in the above? or s->bits per sample for that matter
12:25:26stripwaxassuming i is log(2)N , then we could just build a single lookup table for all i, I think
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12:26:45mtstripwax: i is an index for the block sizes in wma pro
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12:28:04mtstripwax: a lookup table of the scale is not a problem, I even had a for choosing the scale accordgin to the block size
12:28:21mtand used that scale to scale down the input before the mdct
12:28:26stripwaxah no....
12:28:45stripwaxif you divide your Trig table by two, it's equivalent to dividing your input by 2^N
12:28:59stripwaxsince you compound the scale factor at each step
12:29:06stripwaxI think
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12:29:46stripwaxI mean 2^i (where i = log(2)N)
12:31:11stripwaxer, which is N. haha.
12:32:25mtare you saying that the input should then be scaled by (scale*2/N) ?
12:32:42stripwaxnot sure, gimme a sec :)
12:34:22stripwaxyour formula for scale above; do we multiple the trig table by that amount, or divide it?
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12:36:19stripwaxi think we scale the input by scale ^ (log(2)N)
12:37:20mtwe multiply trig val by scale
12:37:30stripwaxI have a suspicion that a nice number falls out of the equation at the end of it all... like maybe "4" or something :)
12:38:23stripwaxmt - ok so for each pass of the FFT we would be multiplying everything by scale, so for four passes, we would mulitply by scale * scale * scale * scale by the end of it all. hence scale^(log(2)N)
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12:40:20mtstripwax: N here is mdct_size / 2 ?
12:40:52 Quit bieber (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
12:41:02stripwaxN here is fft size. So i *think* mdct_size / 4 ... try it and see what happens?
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12:41:51stripwaxmaybe try using the floating point mdct implementation, and use that to understand the relationship between scaling trig and scaling input without running into fixedpoint overflows
12:45:50*mt reverts to an old rev
12:47:50***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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12:59:25CIA-6New commit by bertrik (r27634): Add #include to power-ipod.c, make some variables static in storage.c
13:01:36CIA-6r27634 build result: All green
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13:03:33mtin case someone wants to fiddle, here are the scales used in the mdct in wma pro :
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13:07:29stripwaxmt - hm, those numbers are *tiny*. that's just the evaluation of the scale formula above for each 'i' ? scaling the result of *each step* of the FFT by 0.000043 almost means there'd be nothing left at the end. is there a shift missing somewhere?
13:09:41stripwaxi'm assuming at this point that your input is already normalised to -1=<x<1 .. . if that's not true then the scale factor must be doing some of that normalising too?
13:09:57mtstripwax: they are tiny yes, that's why the trig table is almost 16 bits ... anyway I got those by printing the scales from mdct_init directly before populating the trig tables..
13:11:12mtand it's applied to trig tables so yes values would be in the range [-1,1]
13:11:30stripwaxno i mean the range of the input values at that point
13:11:56stripwaxe.g. if the input is in range -12345 <= x < 12345 then I can see an argument for the scale being so small
13:12:57mtah yes, the inputs at that point aren't normalised
13:13:14mt(the inputs to imdct_half)
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13:20:26stripwaxwhat scale factor are you using in the fixed-point fft to get these input values into s.31 format?
13:20:35 Quit Topy (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
13:23:31stripwaxor whatever fixed point format we're using
13:28:35mthm .. sorry, a bit confused by that last question. Which inputs ? wmapro's ?
13:28:39CIA-6New commit by nls (r27635): skinparser lib: some const correctness and marking of local vars as 'static'
13:28:41stripwaxi think if we rescale the inputs so that they are in -1<=x<1 in s.31 format, before executing the imdct, then we're "done". i'm now beginning to wonder though if that rescaling is going to be significantly nontrivial.
13:28:57stripwaxso at some point in wmapro we have floating point data, that we pass to the imdct.
13:29:22stripwaxand in the fixed-point version we take some data, and then presumably shift/normalise it into s.31 format before executing the imdct?
13:29:31stripwaxwhat is the shift we use? something like x<<16 ?
13:30:19CIA-6r27635 build result: All green
13:31:09mthm, iirc we don't assume a representation for the input, just s.31 trig vals. (we just assume the product won't overflow)
13:32:30bertrikn1s, nice savings on ZVM and mrobe-500 :)
13:34:39n1sbertrik: wow, didn't expect that
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13:37:46n1sthose are the same targets that got *huge* savings form the new parser. I can't help but think something's fishy
13:40:00bertrikit's mostly a RAM size reduction and I don't know how that is determined, bloat-o-meter gives me 22 bytes binsize reduction for ZVM30
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13:42:08n1si guess a map comparison between 2 revs could help here since not much changed
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13:46:52mtstripwax: still around ?
13:47:24n1sbertrik: hmm, map files aren't very friendly to diff
13:47:37*n1s looks at that bloat-o-meter
13:48:01mtanyway, something totally imperical, I tried scaling the inputs down by (nbits - 3) and before ff_imdct_half
13:48:15mtand it seems to produce correct output :)
13:48:25mtbut I need to check
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13:48:47stripwaxmt - ok. Awesome! I was just writing a big long explanation of what I thought might be the correct scale factor to apply but I did not end up with (nbits-3) :)
13:49:07stripwaxcorrect == same amplitude as reference decoder?
13:49:22mtSomething close to that yes :)
13:49:33mtI'll check now against svn
13:49:54stripwaxi'm not surprised; I thought something simple would fall out the other end :)
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13:53:21mtstripwax: the waveform looks the same to me on audacity but with a flipped phase
13:54:05AlexPJdGord: You about?
13:54:39mter .. there's an audible low freq noise. :(
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13:59:35n1sbertrik: the change that lowered the ram usage was consting of the tag table, i wonder if that was included in 2 copies that are now merged or something like that
14:03:28JdGordAlex; sup?
14:04:09AlexPJdGord: Sorry, stupid font issue - on the CustomWPS page l and I look identical, so I wanted to ask why %Vl was used twice :)
14:04:48JdGordFl is font
14:05:05AlexPno, VI and Vl look the same in the font on the webpage
14:05:11AlexPso I thought it was duplicated
14:05:14AlexPbut it isn't
14:05:20AlexPSo there isn't a problem :)
14:07:03AlexPJdGord: While you are here however, do you know which %f tags don't work with the playlist viewer?
14:07:08n1shumm, according to the map files before the change tag_table.o has a 0x9cc data section and after it has a 0x9cc rodata section so those should take the same space, no?
14:08:53n1smaybe there's some magic going on
14:10:33mtstddev: 12.38 PSNR: 74.47 MAXDIFF: 662 bytes: 17977300/ 17977300 −−−− this is what I get from comparing svn against what I have now (using codeclib's mdct).
14:10:56mtstripwax: ^
14:14:54JdGordAlexp: most I think. That's on my tidings list
14:15:04JdGordTodo *
14:15:15AlexPOK, I'm just adding it to the manual
14:15:35mtJdGord: you're the one to ask about %fc right ? :)
14:16:02JdGordI guess....
14:16:10n1shmm, the tms320dm320/ doesn't define some of the rodata secions that the other files do
14:16:16JdGordAlthough I'm tipsy atm so maybe not.
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14:16:59mtalright later then
14:18:04stripwax__mt - unfrotunately I don't know what those numbers mean
14:18:25JdGord Na. Sup? I'll answer later if I can't now
14:18:47stripwax__MAXDIFF - 662 bytes means what exactly? and the stddev/psnr are in what units ; samples i.e. bits?
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14:19:19mtstripwax__ : no MAXDIFF : 662 .... bytes : x/x
14:19:37mtit just means that the output is not exact to that in svn
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14:20:10stripwax__right but 'how far off' is it? what does '662 bytes' mean? that of the entire output file, only 662 bytes of the output differ?
14:20:18AlexPJdGord: One last one - %?Sr - RTL then LTR or vice versa?
14:20:26mtstripwax: Although I believe the difference between the waveforms in matlab for example will be quite small (int the order of ~1e-3 or 1e-2)
14:21:01stripwax__or that the biggest sample difference is a value change of 662 (on a 16-bit scale)? (or a 32-bit scale?)
14:21:35JdGordNeed to check the code to be sure
14:21:37stripwax__wait. compared to svn? or compared to reference floating-point decoder?
14:21:53stripwax__i don't think the former is as useful as the latter
14:21:55AlexPJdGord: That's what is in the bug report, so I guess is fine :)
14:22:01mtJdGord: I just wanted to make sure I didn't break the order for %fc .... just noticed the note before AFMT_* a few days ago.
14:22:19stripwax__gotta head out...
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14:24:55JdGordMt. Have a look in GUI/skin _engine/skin_tokens.C if you changed that enum then yeah you prob broke it
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14:43:40CIA-6New commit by bertrik (r27636): Various minor clean-ups for Zen Vision
14:45:21CIA-6r27636 build result: 4 errors, 0 warnings (bertrik committed)
14:45:28bertrikhm, oops
14:47:14CIA-6New commit by alex (r27637): Manual: add some missing theme tags, and close FS #11472.
14:47:53***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
14:48:53CIA-6r27637 build result: 4 errors, 0 warnings (alex committed)
14:49:02AlexPNot my fault!
14:50:07*mt likes his new task number (FS #11511)
14:51:54bertrikfunction prototype audiohw_set_monitor is only defined in audiohw.h for #if defined(HAVE_RECORDING) || defined(HAVE_FMRADIO_IN), but it's used in audio-iaudio.c outside of #ifdef HAVE_FMRADIO_IN
14:54:07bertrikso either the declaration of the function is wrong, or the use of the function
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15:01:53CIA-6New commit by bertrik (r27638): Fix condition for compiling audiohw_set_monitor (should fix red)
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15:03:59CIA-6r27638 build result: All green
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15:41:08CIA-6New commit by bertrik (r27639): Various minor clean-ups for mrobe
15:43:04CIA-6r27639 build result: All green
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15:46:43dfktjust wanted to say that clipv1 USB HID works better than the multimedia buttons on my keyboard - thanks :)
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16:29:40n1shah, fun configure fails silently if you specify invalid advanced options and pretends to work fine while just configuring a regular target build :)
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16:42:30n1sin fact a lot of this complication in configure makes no sense
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16:44:34xvellojust installed rockbox on my sansa clip+, it works great ; thanks folks !
16:47:54***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
16:48:11kugeln1s: configure evolved to a little beast over time :)
16:48:31n1skugel: i think i figured out an easy fix
16:49:28n1smake reconf doesn't remember voice selections it seems, it asks the questions again
16:50:03kugeln1s: I think make reconf only remembers advanced options if you passed them via command line option
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16:50:33n1sthat's not very nice
16:52:57CIA-6New commit by nls (r27640): configure: print error when user selects invalid advanced options.
16:54:42CIA-6r27640 build result: All green
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17:10:58bertrikxvello, nice to hear :)
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18:25:43CIA-6New commit by nls (r27641): skinparser lib: more const correctness
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18:27:50CIA-6r27641 build result: 455 errors, 481 warnings (nls committed)
18:28:07n1seh, wtf
18:30:24CIA-6New commit by nls (r27642): skinparser lib: even more const correctness, should fix checkwps
18:31:42n1shmm, the error detection of the buildsystem is buggy, those 455 "errors" are actually notes
18:32:10CIA-6r27642 build result: 0 errors, 37 warnings (nls committed)
18:33:36CIA-6New commit by nls (r27643): skinparser lib: even more const correctness, should fix checkwps, again
18:35:16CIA-6r27643 build result: All green
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21:09:10old45bluebrother, I think you are the person that was working with me yeasterday on an upgrade of my rockbox on an H120. I did get the upgrade installed and all is well
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22:10:03*S_a_i_n_t wonders about licensing of
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22:10:16S_a_i_n_tI can convert it *easily*, but..*should* I?
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23:07:19CIA-6New commit by Buschel (r27644): Housekeeping for libwmapro. Define some multiple used constants, use more precise value for cos(pi/4).
23:08:49kugelthere seems to be no way to pack the .codec files into the .apk file
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23:09:08CIA-6r27644 build result: All green
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23:16:58kugelthat's going to need a lot of trickery
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