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#rockbox log for 2010-09-18

00:02:13 Join toffe82_ [0] (~chatzilla@
00:03:10Acorndoes the recorder not detect clipping properly on the clip+?
00:03:39Acornthe peak meter never reachest the top even when it's completely overloaded
00:04:26 Quit toffe82 (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
00:07:09pamauryshuffle2: no, the device should send 3 packets (8+8+4)
00:09:27 Quit gevaerts (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
00:09:52shuffle2yes i've been assuming the arc driver/controller magically does this
00:09:53 Join gevaerts [0] (~fg@rockbox/developer/gevaerts)
00:09:54shuffle2it doesn't
00:10:09shuffle2^bug #2
00:10:10 Join notlistening [0] (
00:10:30pamauryis this the reason why your code fails ?
00:10:37gevaertsshuffle2: are you setting the max packet size properly?
00:10:45notlisteningRockbox on the Dell Streak - v.nice :D
00:11:18shuffle2first bug, which gevaerts found for me, was that ibss is cleared on boot, and the arc device appears to like a static buffer(?)
00:11:35pamaurythe arc driver is intelligent but however it can't make the coffee
00:12:37*pamaury doesn't see the link between "ibess is cleared on boot" and "the arc device appears to like a static buffer"
00:12:48gevaertsshuffle2: if you want 8 bytes max packet size, you need to change init_control_queue_heads()
00:13:12pamaurywe set 64 for max packet size in EP0 by default, no ?
00:13:28shuffle2pamaury well the first thing was that i was storing all my usb descriptor data ibss
00:13:38shuffle2so it would go bye bye, and i'd send all 0s
00:13:45pamauryah :)
00:14:04 Join kubiix [0] (
00:14:29gevaertsBut you're not actually allowed to use anything other than 64 for high speed
00:14:36 Join Casainho [0] (
00:14:39shuffle2gevaerts it's fullspeed
00:15:03kubiixHello, I have an simple question about Ipod USB
00:15:14gevaertsok, 8 bytes is fine then, if you tell the controller about it
00:15:56kubiixIs there any sleep or spindown timeout when Ipod connected to USB host via Rockbox (no dick mode or Ipod FW)?
00:16:32shuffle2shouldn't the values be extracted from the usb descriptors? or is this use case a little out of the ordinary? :p
00:16:59shuffle2but ya, thanks for telling me the proper place
00:17:01gevaertsshuffle2: that would mean that the lower layer driver code has to sniff for descriptors...
00:17:07 Quit BlakeJohnson86 (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
00:17:11gevaertskubiix: it will use the standard dist spindown setting
00:18:10kubiixgevaerts: the setting from rockbox ?
00:19:06kubiixok, thanks, i am using it as usb drive for Wii, and the spindown is causing me lockups in some games, when the Ipod is not accessed for a while
00:19:44pamauryyeah, the driver definitely shouldn't sniff the descriptor. At best, it could have a function to set the maximum packet size
00:19:52 Join BlakeJohnson86 [0] (
00:21:16 Quit kubiix (Quit: CGI:IRC (EOF))
00:22:21 Quit jgarvey (Quit: Leaving)
00:23:11Eldrekpixelma: now that I think of it it does seem like the issue started when I installed a new theme. do I have to remove it from the ipod entirely or will just changing themes do? Now I'm just waiting for it to try to sleep again. Is there anyway to force it to sleep manually? or shortening the sleep time even
00:26:49 Join s1gma_ [0] (~d.d.derp@
00:28:01AlexPRockbox doesn't have sleep
00:28:13AlexPIf you mean idle power off, then yeah, that is a setting
00:28:58Eldrekthat, then I guess
00:29:12 Quit edboyer93 (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
00:30:26 Quit _s1gma (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
00:31:05Eldrekok, definitely still experiencing this glitch
00:31:15Eldrekor bug, rather
00:33:24EldrekI'm fairly sure removing idle power off will sidestep the issue entirely, but I don't want to kill my battery, I just installed a new one too
00:34:17 Quit pamaury (Remote host closed the connection)
00:34:32 Join edboyer93 [0] (
00:35:01TorneEldrek: wait what's the problem? your ipod's going wrong on idle poweroff?
00:36:27 Quit fxb__ (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
00:36:28Eldrekyes, the backlight comes on and it wont turn off until I manually power it off with menu and select
00:36:46 Join fxb__ [0] (
00:36:47Torneonly on idle poweroff, not if you shut down normally?
00:36:56 Quit Judas_PhD (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
00:36:57Torneand the screen's just blank with the backlight on?
00:37:06Eldrekyep, just a blank white screen
00:37:17Tornewhat model and build?
00:37:25*Torne tries to remember which releases had which shutdown hack
00:37:39Eldrek30gb ipod video, rockbox version 3.6
00:37:45saratogatry the current build and see if it works better
00:37:59EldrekI thought 3.6 was the current one?
00:38:40Torne3.6 is the latest release
00:38:46Tornenot the current development build
00:39:04Torne3.6 uses the same shutdown method as current (clearing second half of iram then powering off via pcf)
00:39:26Torne3.5 does it differently, so that might be interesting to try as well (reboots to OF bootloader in batteryfail mode)
00:39:27 Join Judas_PhD [0] (
00:39:43Torne(3.4 does it differently again, since it has neither shutdown hack)
00:40:27Eldrekhow long has 3.6 been out? (trying to find out what version I originally installed)
00:40:35Tornecouple of months
00:40:48Tornehas this always happened, or only recently?
00:40:50Eldrekthen I probably installed it to begin with >.<
00:40:53Eldrekonly since yesterday
00:41:18Torneand it does it every time? even if you are just sitting in the menu?
00:41:55Tornethat's very odd, shutdown is not exactly complicated
00:42:12Torneit pretty much just cuts the power once it's done with everything else
00:42:28Torneand there's a timer so it cuts the power anyway if the clean shutdown doesn't complete inside of something like 40 seconds
00:42:30Eldrekyesterday I fully disassembled the ipod, but that shouldn't have done anything to it should it? it still works fine with the ipod firmware
00:42:49Torne...possibly you have shorted aux_pwr or something?
00:42:57Eldrekand it's not the first time I've taken it apart
00:43:02Torneif this only started happening since you took it apart then that's suspicious :)
00:43:35Tornethe ipod wakes up when power is applied over the dock connector, or when menu or select are pressed, or when the RTC alarm fires
00:43:45Tornebut if it was that it should just boot up..
00:43:59 Quit komputes (Quit: I haven't slept for ten days, because that would be too long.)
00:44:05Tornerealtime clock. the alarm.
00:44:12Eldrekah, okay
00:44:14Tornebut whatever causes it to power on it should just start up
00:44:28Eldrekstarting up isnt the problem, though
00:44:34Tornewell you say that ;)
00:44:44Tornebut there are some problems with startup on some people's ipods, where they ahve to reset sometimes
00:44:49Torneit doesn't normally involve the backlight being on though
00:45:11Tornethe shutdown hacks i mentioned earlier were attempts to fix the startup problem
00:45:15Tornenone of which work fully
00:46:11notlisteningamazing how some people know everything ... ;)
00:46:19Tornei'm not sure, i'm afraid..
00:46:21Eldrekindeed :D
00:46:23Torneit's not something i've heard of before
00:46:37Torneand i don't know everything, i've just spent ages working on ipod startup/shutdown and power/charging
00:46:48Tornetry the current build.
00:47:04Torneif that doesn't make any difference, try 3.5
00:47:13Tornebecause that handles shutdown differently
00:47:32Eldrekmaybe I shorted it like you said
00:47:40TorneWell, maybe, but I don't think that'd really explain it
00:47:44Eldrekbut would it still take power from the dock connector if I did?
00:47:58Tornethere's two power pins on the dock, one for usb power at 5v, one for firewire power at 12v
00:48:14Torneyou may have shorted the 12v one possibly? but i think rockbox would behave oddly while running also then
00:48:20Tornealways thinking it was charging, etc
00:48:22EldrekI thought they quit using firewire in later ipod models
00:48:27Tornethey removed the firewire data pins
00:48:33Tornebut it can still charge from the 12V firewire power
00:48:37EldrekI see
00:48:44Tornefor accessories and car kits that power it that way
00:49:21Torneanyway, it's probably not that, i was just pondering what could cause it to stay on
00:49:21Eldrekinstalled current and retrying now
00:49:36Tornethe ipod basically cannot turn off while external power on eitehr pin is applied
00:49:39Torneit just refuses
00:49:48Torneso if that's gotten stuck somehow then it might do something like what you see
00:50:14Eldrekcould I just cut the pin if that were the case?
00:50:26Tornewell, you should be able to tell if it is or not by looking in rockbox
00:50:31Tornesee what the current build does first
00:50:34notlisteningwould the OF not turn off aswell?
00:51:12Tornenotlistening: i'm not sure; the OF doesn't normally go to sleep while power is applied but I don't think the PCF actually *prevents* it
00:51:16Tornei think it's just a choice..
00:51:28Eldreksame thing on the current build
00:51:34Torneso maybe if it was a bit floaty the GPIO might read as not connected and the apple firmware would behave ok
00:51:51Tornethe PCF's poweron interrupt isn't necessarily triggered at the same level
00:52:07TorneEldrek: ok, one sec
00:52:12EldrekGPIO? so many acronyms lol
00:52:14Tornelemme grab mine so i can tellyou where in the debug menu to look
00:52:30notlisteningGeneral Purpose Input Output
00:52:46notlisteningI thhink ;)
00:52:52Eldrekso, the dock connector?
00:53:18Torneok, in rockbox go to system -> debug
00:53:21Tornethen view battery
00:53:24Tornethen scroll the wheel down once
00:53:42Torneyou should get a screen with a bunch of status messages, including "USB pwr:" and "EXT pwr:"
00:53:44 Join Evilnick_ [0] (
00:53:48Torneare those both "absent"?
00:54:00Torneright, so rockbox doesn't think there's any power
00:54:02Eldrekheadphone says connected even though it's not, though
00:54:21Torneoh? interesting
00:54:26Tornedo you use the pause on headphone unplug thing?
00:54:37Torneand does that still work? :)
00:55:15Torne(also does it fix itself if you plug in the headphones then take them out again)
00:55:31Tornei can't see any reason why the headphone detect signal being stuck would cause shutdown to fail..
00:55:40Tornebut if it *is* stuck than that suggests you did break something when you took it apart ;)
00:56:06Eldrekwell the headphone jack has been in pretty bad shape ever since I got it
00:56:18Eldrekpart of the plastic is chipped, etc
00:56:21Torneso maybe that's not new
00:56:47Eldrekafter reinstalling my settings are back to default, where again was the pause on unplug located?
00:56:51 Quit evilnick (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
00:56:57Torneyou didn't have to uninstall it
00:57:02Torneor delete the rockbox directory
00:57:03notlisteningGet a Sansa Clip+ and 32GB sd card
00:57:06notlisteningSorted :D
00:57:07Tornefor future reference. you can just overwrite it.
00:57:13Torneand then your settings will be kept :)
00:57:28Eldrekalright, I figured I would do the whole uninstall incase something I had in there was causing problems
00:57:50Torneyah, ok.
00:57:58Torneanyway i forget where it is, i'm guessing playback settings
00:58:15Eldrekno, it doesnt pause it
00:58:36TorneI think it's stuck, then :)
00:58:51Torneunfortunate but shouldn't, on its own, cause this shutdown thing
00:59:12Tornei'm reading the pcf datasheet to see whether it exposes its idea of what the wakeup signals are, bear with me
00:59:27Eldrekin the meantime I guess I'll try 3.5?
01:01:05Torneah, drat, we don't output the relevant pcf registers on the debug screen :)
01:01:34 Quit panni_ (Quit: ( :: NoNameScript 3.81 :: ))
01:02:22Torneyeah, give 3.5 a try just to see if anything is different
01:02:34EldrekI can't find it with the rockbox utility
01:02:38Tornebut i'm afraid i'm leaning towards "you broke something when you took it apart" here..
01:03:34Eldrekheh, well I was messing with the pins so it wouldn't surprise me
01:03:43***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
01:03:46Tornethere you go :)
01:04:07notlisteningEldrek, why would u want to mess with the pins....?
01:04:39Torneit's just really odd that it would only affect the idle poweroff
01:04:52Tornei'm kinda out of ideas i'm afraid
01:05:09Eldreknotlistening: I was planning to try soldering wires to it and hacking in a micro usb connector
01:05:23notlisteningbut when u mess with electronic you get stange behaviour
01:05:51notlisteningoh okay ;)
01:06:56EldrekI'm not really concerned about the thing, I just wanted to tinker, see if I couldn't do something interesting :)
01:07:09Tornenotlistening: well, you shouldn't get *inexplicable* behaviour, gneerally
01:07:32Torneyou might not know specifically what you broke but generally there should be a plausible thing you could've broken to cause the behaviour :)
01:07:53 Quit JdGordon (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
01:08:19Eldrekthe only thing I broke was part of the casing, which I just super glued in place :x
01:08:35EldrekI was carving out a space for my micro usb connector when I broke it
01:08:35notlisteningtrue but tracing it might be beyond his equipment facilities
01:08:56Torneanyway.. if you can't work out how to sort this, then turning off idle poweroff is not actually the end of the world..
01:09:12Tornethe ipod's power drain when the disk and screen are off and it's doing nothing is pretty low
01:09:26Torneit won't drain the battery for a long time
01:09:38Eldrekwont it eventually drain it completely though?
01:09:43Torneeventually, yes :)
01:09:50Tornebut you can hopefulyl remember to manually power off before then
01:10:00Eldrekand that means no more functional lithium battery heh
01:10:08Tornewell maybe
01:10:16Torneprobably not though.
01:10:20EldrekI wont remember heh :P
01:10:20notlisteninglol Torne
01:10:27TorneThe power controller shouldn't let it get to the point where any actual battery damage occurs
01:10:36Torneif the battery voltage goes super low then it *will* cut the power
01:10:42Eldrek3.5.1 worked!
01:10:42Torneeven if rockbox hasn't noticed
01:10:49TorneRight, that's plausible
01:10:53notlisteningrockbox independant
01:10:56Tornesince 3.5.1 basically reboots to the OF in order to shut down
01:11:17Torneso if the OF can shut down then that also working makes sense
01:11:20TorneI still don'tknow *why*
01:11:29Eldrekah well, it's working now
01:11:35Tornesooo. I was considering implementing the 3.5 shutdown method on the current builds, as an option
01:11:42Tornebecause the problem it's a workaround for still happens for some people
01:11:55Torneso i was gonna give users the choice of using it if they wanted, since there are downsides to both methods
01:12:03Torneso that would help you as well
01:12:05Eldrekso thanks a ton. anything major I'm missing from 3.6? I don't notice a difference tbh
01:12:12Torneunless/until you can work out the actual problem.
01:12:42Torneno problem
01:12:52Torneif you do ever find out what the actual issue is, do come tell us
01:12:58Tornebecause this is Crazy Weird still
01:13:10Eldrekthough I did notice the start up splash screen was different, and it was the one I saw originally. So I guess I just installed 3.6 when it started doing that
01:13:30Torneah, hm
01:13:35Tornethat's particularly weird.
01:13:44TorneIf you wer ereally curious to generate more data, you could try 3.4 as well
01:13:50Tornebecause that's before i started messing around with shutdown at all
01:14:06Torneif 3.4 works but 3.6 doesn't then that means there is a downside to my new workaround after all
01:14:20Tornei have been, so far, assuming the new workaround only fails to fix the startup issue for some folks
01:14:23EldrekI'll let you know if I find out, but I doubt I will. My main motivations for coming here for help was 1. potential bug fixes and 2. getting my little mod going. heh.
01:14:30Tornebut maybe this means that it does actually cause a problem for someone too
01:15:02Torneok. well, at some point i'll add a setting for the shutdown type and then you can probably use the current builds instead of 3.5
01:15:15Eldrekmany kudos if you do
01:15:43EldrekI'll give 3.4 a try while I'm at it
01:15:58Tornewell it's not particularly hard, i just need to find a little time for it :)
01:16:19 Quit ender` (Quit: Transported to a surreal landscape, a young girl kills the first woman she meets and then teams up with three complete strangers to kill again. -- The Wizard of Oz (from Marin County newspaper's TV listing))
01:16:38Eldrek..where can I find 3.4?
01:16:50Torneby guessing based on the url for 3.5.1
01:17:56Eldrekwell that was the easy way to do it
01:18:01 Quit bertrik (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
01:18:16soapWhat if you run 3.6 now that the problem has been "cured" by the 3.5 shutdown routine?
01:18:26Tornesoap: interesting
01:18:32Tornei doubt it, though
01:18:36soapActually, before that, answer this question: Since the problem started have you rebooted into the Apple original firmware?
01:18:46Eldrekyes, soap
01:18:53soapthere goes my theory.
01:19:05Eldrekthats the first thing I did, to troubleshoot whether it was rockbox or my hardware
01:19:24soapTheory being that there was still /something/ the OF is doing on shutdown which Rockbox is failing to do (and 3.5 does by nature of calling the OF).
01:19:54Tornewell that's still possible
01:19:56soapAnd that running the OF would clear that out, however it got set.
01:20:04Torneand 3.5's shutdown doesn't really call the of properly
01:20:30Torneit just starts a tiny bit of the bootrom, with memory set to the state that implies "you failed to boot last time because of insufficient power"
01:20:33soapI know, perhaps an overly simplistic description.
01:20:48Tornei wouldn't expect it to be very clever about how it shuts the thing down
01:21:24notlisteningNever assume anything
01:21:39soapcurrently the broadcom chip is just acting as passthrough?
01:21:57Torneer, ish
01:22:03Tornewe load its firmware into it now, i think
01:22:05soap(just thought about the broadcom chip as it is a screen-related issue).
01:22:07Torneso that we can shut it off
01:22:58soapOh, that's right. I forgot how the screen-power off got accomplished. Was that present in 3.5?
01:23:09Tornei think so, it' sbeen there a while
01:23:18Tornei forget he details though, the bcm video scares me
01:26:23 Part toffe82_
01:29:50Eldreksame white screen issue in 3.4
01:30:05Torneah, so it'snot the iram clearing causing it then
01:30:06Tornethat's good :)
01:30:33Eldrekwant me to try anything else?
01:32:33Tornecan't think of anything, i'm afraid
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01:34:32AcornIs the stuff in the manual about the OF being loaded when plugging the USB cable into a clip+ outdated?
01:34:51notlisteningAcorn, yes
01:35:12notlisteningLast time I updated anyways
01:35:23AcornIs there any way to switch that functionality on? Or do you just have to turn the player off and then plug in?
01:35:49notlisteningSo you want the OF with power?
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01:48:43saratogaAcorn: it was disabled recently because it caused problems for some people
01:50:54Acornhm, okay
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01:59:33AcornIf I'm not getting clipping being detected when recording, is that because I need to change some settings?
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02:40:05clone4crwIs anyone still interested in the resistor calculator plugin? I made more progress on it.
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03:03:44***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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04:07:15puetzkDarn, it looks like the vmware dev image no longer has the right compiler for clip+ - wants arm-elf-eabi-gcc, but that has arm-elf-gcc
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04:32:55soappuetzk, run to build that compiler.
04:33:05puetzkyep, working toward that
04:33:23puetzkThanks for the link though, I should have mentioned that I was just griping :-)
04:33:52puetzkI expect building it mac native could be... interesting, so I'm setting up more modern ubuntu VM first to do it in
04:33:54soapyea, I had a feeling you were and I was going to be telling you things you already knew.
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04:56:45HillshumWhat's this about the Clip+ having 80% USB support?
04:57:42saratogayou can sort of transfer files before it dies sometimes
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05:00:16HillshumInteresting. Nice to see that the AMSv1 devices have proper USB support
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05:35:47VTRaysup all
05:35:52VTRayneed help
05:36:13VTRayis it worth trying to instal rockbox on a v2 fuze
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05:37:52puetzkhow so?
05:38:07VTRayif someone could walk me through the upgrade that would be greatly appreciated as I am not very savvy with this stuff
05:38:32puetzkRButil should pretty much do it for you
05:39:13VTRayi have original firmware 2.03.33
05:39:36VTRayor i meant the sandisk updater updated my fuze to that firmwar
05:41:38VTRayok i did attempt to use that utility but the complete installtion tab and minimal installation tabs are grayed out
05:41:42VTRaywhat does that mean
05:41:57VTRayso i cant select them
05:43:38VTRayso any thoughts on that
05:44:31VTRayshould i try installing the bootloader?
05:45:46saratogadid you select a device to install? they'l l probably be grayed out if you don't tell it what to install
05:46:57VTRayyes i selected fuze v2
05:47:08puetzkand it found the mount point too?
05:47:25VTRayi had to choose the mount point
05:48:01puetzkOk. Then your next step is to patch the original firmware with the rockbox bootloader
05:48:03VTRaythe sansa is connect to the pc via a network hub
05:48:09VTRaycould that be a problem
05:48:20puetzkDunno. I probably wouldn't do it for the bootloader portion
05:48:32puetzkIt shouldn't hurt, but...
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05:48:55VTRayso how do i patch it
05:49:07saratogahit install, follow directions
05:49:25VTRayu mena install bootloader
05:49:40VTRayso which firmware do i need
05:49:48saratogadoesn't matter
05:50:07puetzkWhichever one you want it to use when you hit the "dual-boot" key to launch the original firmware instead
05:50:24saratogabluebroth3r: any chance of a new rbutil release soon? the current version is getting a bit old
05:51:10VTRayok the bootloader install went throught now what
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05:51:32VTRayinstall rockbox?
05:51:35puetzkNow your player should be rebooting and flashing itself (if the Fuzev2 works like my clip+
05:51:49puetzkThe next step is to install rockbox, yes
05:52:00CIA-81New commit by funman (r28105): Update Polish translation ...
05:52:11VTRayit didnt reboot
05:53:00VTRayit just says connected and the sansa colored logo is doing its thing
05:53:16puetzkIf install rockbox is enabled, hit that next
05:53:23funmanthen you need to use mkamsboot, see
05:53:26puetzkit won't hurt anything to do them both together
05:53:52*puetzk hasn't done the bootloader in a long time, I may be fuzzy on how rbutil sequences things
05:54:06CIA-81r28105 build result: All green
05:54:42VTRayok gotcha
05:54:53VTRaythe sansa syas reading right now
05:54:58VTRaynow writing
05:55:22funmanpixelma: Zagor: I don't get flyspray notifications either
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05:55:29VTRayok the uitility said it finished successfully
05:55:39VTRaybut my sansa is not back to just saying connected
05:55:45VTRaydo i need to unplug it?
05:56:00VTRaynot= now
05:56:12puetzkyes, unmount it and then unplug it
05:56:23puetzk(unmount == safely remove, or eject disk, or whatever - not sure what OS you're on)
05:56:44VTRayok im on xp
05:57:10VTRayit is readin firmware upgrade in progress
05:57:23VTRayupgrade completed
05:57:29VTRayand it turned off
05:57:37puetzkThat's as expected
05:57:42puetzkturn it back on and it should be rockbox now
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05:59:26VTRaylooks like it worked
05:59:38VTRayso what makes this unstable?
05:59:50puetzkUSB, mostly
06:00:04puetzkYou still have to use the OF (or the card slot) to put files on it
06:00:27puetzkOF == original firmware
06:00:45funmanif something isn't working (except Doom and what is listed on SansaAMS page of the wiki) it's a bug and should be reported
06:00:55puetzkIf you plug it into USB (instead of turning it on first), it should go to the sansa firmware
06:01:04puetzkon my Clip+, holding Home or left while turning it on does the same
06:01:41puetzkI think the Fuze uses the same buttons
06:02:15funmanyeah that's the Left button on Sansas
06:02:18VTRayso i take it this will probably eventually be patched
06:03:12saratogayeah, check out the wiki page above, USB is discussed there
06:03:25VTRayis ther an eta
06:03:31saratogawhen it works
06:03:33VTRayon a patch ot still on going
06:06:53VTRayok so i unplugged it from pc and now it is back to OF
06:07:01VTRayhow do i go back to rockbox?
06:07:06puetzkturn it off and back on
06:07:08*lestatar NP: my music player: Balanescu Quartet - Maria T - The Young Conscript And The Moon - (3:39 / 6:41).
06:07:12puetzkit goes to the OF to handle USB
06:07:22VTRayah simple enough
06:07:23lestatarooops! sorry wrong window :(
06:07:32puetzkand the OF doens't know it's supposed to reboot back into rockbox when you're done
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06:17:55VTRayrockbox is pretty nifty
06:18:22VTRayand rockbox can be removed right?
06:18:47puetzkSure, just flash the sansa firmware back on (like you did when updating it), and delete the .rockbox folder from the top
06:18:54puetzkNot that you'll want to :-)
06:19:33puetzkor use the "Uninstallation" tab in RBUtil
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06:28:00VTRayis it me or does the top part of the screen seem way up there
06:30:01funmanfuze screen is often misplaced in the case, the OF reduce height to compensate
06:34:50puetzkwrong window
06:36:15VTRayis see fuman
06:36:25VTRayintersting to kno
06:39:27VTRaydo any games have sound
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06:41:01saratogasome do
06:41:04puetzkmost let the music keep playing
06:41:06puetzksome have their own
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06:44:38VTRayso i still need to install fonts package, themes, anda gems
06:51:44funmangames are all contained with rockbox, unless you mean Doom WADs or emulator ROMs
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07:16:27VTRaywhat are those voice files
07:16:36VTRayon the install utility
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07:23:40funmancheck the manual it should explain voice
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07:57:39puetzkAnyone here familiar with the AMSv2 recording code?
07:58:09puetzkMy clip+ has always been very quiet, and very prone to clipping; I think I've solved the latter, and at least figured out what causes the former
08:00:40puetzkThe clipping is because of the way firmware/drivers/audio/as3514.c:audiohw_set_recvol is using the mic gain and the ADC gain; for some reason it's trying to keep the mic gain as low as possible, even if that means it has to use max gain (+12dB) in the ADC
08:01:09puetzkWhich, like settings things above 0dB almost always does, means it will clip
08:02:18puetzklowering the cutoffs from 36 and 32 to 28 and 24 (so that it keeps the ADC settings <= 0dB if possible) makes that much better
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08:07:38funmanpuetzk: this file was written for e200v1 and i just made minor modifications for it to work with AMS
08:08:04funmani didn't really looked at recording quality
08:09:07funmando you have the datasheets for as3514/as3543 ?
08:09:38puetzkNo; I grabbed the 3525 one off the web, but the others appear to be semi-private
08:09:54puetzkI've never hacked on rockbox before, just decided to dig into this one because it was annoying me :-)
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08:11:19funmanthey are private but AustriaMicroSystems sent them to us. if you want to work on this and promise to keep them private i can send them to you
08:11:51funmanas3514 is almost completely identical to what is described in as3525 datasheet anyway
08:12:10puetzkOr is there some more formal "promise to keep them private" involved?
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08:14:17funmanno that's enough, if you want to steal the datasheets from me all you have to do is fake interest in enhancing rockbox ;-)
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08:18:10puetzkI'll start a flyspray with what I've learned so far and the patch that fixes some of it
08:18:15funmanaccess to these docs usually require signing a NDA but after some email exchange they were kind enough to just give the docs to use without formal documents. (mail sent: ~4.5MB)
08:18:47puetzkRight now I've just changed it globally; I don't know if it should be only for AMSv2 or not, I don't have any other SansaAMS devices
08:20:27funmannow i remember this problem might already have been mentioned but i couldnt find the cause
08:20:47puetzkkudos on the toolchain setup, by the way; the VMware image was out of date, but even having to compile it it's the easest cross-toolchain I've ever set up
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08:21:29funmannot building a libc makes things easier
08:23:16n1swe know about the vmware image being out of date but noone seems interested in fixing it
08:24:39funmann1s: did you see FS #11608 ? (last comment about tremor)
08:24:59n1snope, i'll take a look
08:26:22n1si have a r278something build on my fuze and haven't had any whitenoise or crashes that i've noticed
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08:28:40n1si'll update it to current and test more later
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08:45:45funmanpuetzk: thanks
08:46:26funmani'll try on clipv1 (AMSv1), if someone can try on e200v1/c200v1 that'd be nice
08:46:55puetzkI can confirm that this used to work right (without the patch) on an e280v1
08:47:05puetzkbut I lost that player (hence bought the clip+)
08:47:11puetzkso I can't check it now
08:47:37puetzkSo I suspect the patch will mess up e200v1
08:47:47puetzk(or at least give it a change it doesn't need)
08:48:17funmanif we can use the same code on all models it's better (less #ifdef)
08:48:51puetzkIt might also be that the e200 just had an ADC that could overdrive +12dB without being awful
08:49:34puetzkBut it definitely sounded OK back when I had one
08:51:57puetzkIt's really a pretty good mic when it's not all mucked up :-)
08:52:07puetzkI'm impressed for what had to be an afterthought
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08:56:40funmanwhich gain did you use in your test?
08:57:41puetzkThe loudest one that doesn't clip with the patch
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09:03:02pixelma_funman: I wanted to ask wodz or bohoon (or however he's spelled) about the Polish translation first. I think it's better for languages for which we have native speakers as active committers
09:03:08funmanit looks ok on clipv1 without the patch
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09:03:51funmanpixelma_: ok
09:05:10n1sfunman: does fuzev1 have a regular codec buffer or is the whole thing in iram? or is that only the clip?
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09:06:55funmann1s: regular
09:07:23funmancodec buffer in iram is for clipv1, m200v4, c200v2 (amsv1 && mem <= 2) and clipv2, fuzev2, clip+ (amsv2, because iram is 1MB)
09:07:32puetzkfunman: hmm...
09:08:10*puetzk digs in the data sheets you passed along
09:08:37n1sfunman: ok
09:10:38pixelma_puetzk: btw, the channel is logged, so maybe putting your mail address here isn't such a good idea
09:10:49puetzkpixelma_: yeah, I thought of that after hitting return
09:10:59puetzkso be it, it's posted on my web page and in many list archives
09:11:08puetzkspamassassin has to earn its keep
09:12:16puetzknot much to do after sending it anyway :-)
09:13:21pixelma_maybe someone who has access to the machine that does the logging could manipulate it
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09:15:14puetzkfunman: the mic PRE_GAIN values are higher on AS3543, so the calculation would be off for v2
09:17:15funmanoh right
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09:18:21puetzkOnly 2dB though, which souldn't any different than just having set asked for 2dB more. So that shouldn't explain wildly different behavior..
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09:19:53puetzkIf anything it should help; my patch made us run the mic preamp up to 12dB hotter so the ADC's input didn't need so much gain.
09:20:45funmani have trouble comparing with and without the patch on clip+, someone with better ears than me should try :)
09:21:11puetzkSeriously? You can't hear the difference between the two recordings I posted?
09:21:15puetzkOr yours isn't doing that
09:22:12funmani can hear it on your recordings, but i think the source i use for my recording isn't loud enough / or i'm not placing the clip+ at the exact same distance from the speakers in each test
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09:29:53puetzkOK. My source wasn't crazy-loud, just an acoustic guitar. The Clip+ was sitting in my desk a maybe 2ft away
09:32:11puetzkwell, I think I'm going to turn into a pumpkin. There are definitely difference in the microphone preamps circuits between AS3525 and AS3543 in the docs you shared, so I'll investigate more tomorrow.
09:33:32puetzkand update the flyspray if I learn something.
09:33:38funmanpuetzk: keep in mind that as3543 is a preliminary datasheet and there might be typos or inaccurate stuff
09:34:31funmanok, i'll subscribe to the task
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10:08:09n1sfunman, i've now listened through an entire album in ogg on my fuze with no problems and i can not see any problem with the malloc changes in tremor that comment reffered to
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11:13:34pixelma_JdGordon: I'm not sure, I completely understand your message here:
11:13:56JdGordonwhich part?
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11:21:39pixelma_JdGordon (for later): a) isn't switching hold some sort of dynamic? At least it seems to change something, once. (b) if I replaced "Test" with current time in song, should it work? (c) I *think* I tried your code on my M5, replacing the RGB value with grey shade ones and put current time in song below - the text put behind the %Vf doesn't show up and the foreground colour doesn't change. (d) this is with r28095 which is no fun due to the backdrop
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11:54:27JdGordonpixelma: the way the engine works is that some tags are considered "dynamic" which means they are drawn every single update, that doesnt mean thouhg that when they change they cause the rest of the screen to do a full update
11:55:07JdGordonso my code (should) work because %?mh<a|b> when mh changes the conditional is redone completly causeing either a or b to be displayed
11:55:30JdGordonif you put any tag which is considered dynamic into your "test" line then it would work
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11:59:40pixelma_I tried two things which I think goes along those lines - one to just replace "Test" with a dynamic tag (at least I think %pc is - displaying the current time in a song) and then adapting your example code to greyscale and the way I understood it. I can pastebin the new test.wps if you want.
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12:01:51JdGordonyes that should do it
12:06:25pixelma_ is what I tried directly on target. Neither TTT nor GGG show up (though I don't know if they should) - plus the current playback time doesn't change colours
12:06:59pixelma_0 is black and 2 is light grey which should be quite noticable
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12:07:59JdGordonthat should work
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12:14:08pixelma_well, it doesn't ;) Am I allowed to reopen the task? It's not that important but would be nice.
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12:15:59pixelma_I still wonder why it would work with conditional viewports that define %Vf/%Vb for themselves. Where is the difference?
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12:22:41JdGordonthe difference is that viewports which are conditionally enabled to a full redraw when they become enabled
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12:23:52pixelma_couldn't %Vf/%Vb do that too if they change? Not sure if that is tracked though
12:24:31JdGordonIIRC they could only force that for the line they are on
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12:25:44JdGordonactually maybe for the rest of the current viewport
12:26:20PaulJamhi, i just wanted to compile an ipod video build with cygwin and configure tells me that the correct compiler (arm-elf-eabi-gcc) is missing. this package doesn't seem to be available at . can someone point me to the instructions how to obtain this crosscompiler?
12:27:42JdGordonyou probbaly need to build it yourself
12:28:11pixelma_you'd need to compile it yourself, running the shellscript and it may need some other packages and on cygwin: patience. I'm not sure but I thing there are some instructions in the wiki and some threads in the forum
12:28:22pixelma_I think too
12:29:39PaulJamok, thanks
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12:37:05pixelmaJdGordon: ok, reopen the task or add a new? And where can I find which tags are dynamic ones?
12:37:49JdGordonreopen it and link to that paste, libs/skin_engine/tag_table.c
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12:40:06will__how hard would it be to write a .ROCK that advances the current track by a set amount of time?
12:42:44JdGordonnot very
12:43:13pixelmawhy should it be a plugin - and did you check out the "Skip Length" settings, maybe they already do what you want?
12:43:41will__yeah, but I want a second choice
12:44:00will__i was also thinking of making the record button do it.
12:46:13will__I listen to a lot of talk radio, and during certian parts of certain shows it would be nice to have a 5-minute skip. But I use the 1-minute skip too much to go without it.
12:46:59will__I'll do some reading. There is a "how to write a rock" page IIRC.
12:50:04JdGordonIn that case you should look into making it a hotkey instead of a rock
12:50:39pixelmaI imagine starting a plugin to change that is more time consuming than changing the setting - and if you don't want to trawl the menus, you could possibly set skip length as quickscreen items or prepare two .cfgs . I don't know how you imagined the UI though
12:52:05will__Good idea. Thanks.
12:52:42will__I can make a .cfg that only changes one setting? (and there fore it will load really fast?)
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13:20:16AcornAre there known problems with clipping detection when recording on the Clip+?
13:22:02pixelmaJdGordon: out of curiousity. When seperating %Vf/%Vb from the viewport definition, I believe you said that this would make it easier to implement "white on black" modes for monochrome screens. Is that so and how complicated is it?
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13:23:37JdGordondunno, presumably it just needs a flag for the viewport to set the inverted draw mode
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13:24:14pixelmaAcorn:I think in today's logs there is talk about problems with recording gain on AMSv2 Sansas in general (which I think the Clip+ is). Someone started looking into it if I read things correctly
13:26:26Acornpixelma, ah I see
13:28:13AcornWait.. the bug ticket was opened today? Funny coincidence :D
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13:44:45pixelmaJdGordon: sounds more like a new parameter then instead foreground or background "colour", might even be useful for all targets as you could then work with the global colours, or?
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13:46:13amiconnAnother option is to make monochrome understand foreground and background colour (just 0 and 1) (needs driver work)
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13:49:14pixelmaamiconn: in this case I think (atm) that 0 and 3 would be better because then those themes could work on greyscale just the same (I'm thinking of the M:Robe100 especially). That's probably just a minor detail though
13:51:44*pixelma wonders if this "driver work" would also be motivating to get global fore- and background shades on greyscale ;)
13:52:00amiconnThat would be rather arbitrary (the 0 to 3 on 2 bpp is because with two bits you can represent 0..3)
13:52:36amiconnIt also wouldn't help themes because if the theme uses 1 or 2, what should the driver do with those?
13:54:14amiconnGlobal shades is independent of that
13:54:34pixelmaI thought about the parser and maybe checkwps (and more about the other way round). If you don't do that you have to take care if "shade" 1 is meant for greyscale or for monochrome
13:54:51pixelmaotherwise you'd get grey on black themes etc.
13:55:56pixelmaI know it's independent but also driver work I guess, hence I said "motivating"
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14:04:17PaulJami'm still having problems with the crosscompiler installation on cygwin. after having run the script to install the arm-elf-eabi compiler i still don't have the arm-elf-eabi-gcc executable under /usr/local/bin/ . in that location are other files that start with arm-elf-eabi-... but not the gcc one.
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15:22:11philipppHi. Is there anyone who knows anyting about the status of creative Zen porting?
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15:50:31sevenfourkhello people! I'm looking for scrobbler.log example/sample, how the file format looks ? Thanks. Ivan
15:52:00AlexPprobably easiest just to turn on scrobbling then look at the file it produces
15:53:49sevenfourkThe thing is my java based old nokia 6151 doesn't scrobble by itself, tired of looking some java app to do scrobbling, mobscrob failed for my cellular
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16:47:28preglowi love the fact that my phone sometimes starts calling people by random when i use the rockbox app :>
16:48:51gevaertshuh? How does that happen?
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17:01:17preglowgevaerts: wish i knew
17:02:13preglowsometimes, other tracks also start playing via the default music player activity
17:02:26preglowtotally unrelated to what i'm doing
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17:11:15*kugel has neither of that problems
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17:11:23kugeland I use the rockbox app every day
17:11:36zeefis anybody here that can help me with install ? cant get the think working
17:12:26zeefwould greatly appreciate it
17:13:23notlisteningwhich player zeef?
17:14:03zeefi know the reason
17:14:10zeefdoesnt work on ipod classic, does it ?
17:14:25notlisteningNo. not to my knowledge
17:14:27zeefany alternative for playing flac on ipod classic ?
17:14:29notlisteningothersie i'd have one :D
17:17:04notlisteningseem converting to ALAC is your best bet
17:17:12notlisteningno flac support is possible
17:18:28zeefok thanks
17:18:38zeefknow a good converter for doing that in bulk ?
17:18:51notlisteningyou using windows?
17:18:51zeefthat you dont have to do directory per directory
17:19:22notlisteningno sorry i converted to Linux about 7 years ago and do not use Windows anynire
17:19:36AlexPKeep on topic please
17:19:43AlexPRockbox stuff only in here
17:19:53zeefthanks anyway
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17:19:59notlisteningSorry AlexP
17:20:03AlexPno worries :)
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17:33:47preglowkugel: what phone?
17:33:53preglowi'm on a legend
17:33:57kugelhtc legend
17:34:24preglowbtw, any reason the rockbox amp control and the android native one aren't mirroring each other?
17:35:12kugelthe android one is global, the rockbox one is only for rockbox
17:36:00preglowthe android one decides volume for all media apps, rite?
17:36:28preglowthen why not use that? we're a media app
17:36:52kugelwe do use that, don't we?
17:37:16preglowoh we do, but i have to use both that one and the rockbox one to adjust the volume to max, for example
17:37:33preglowwould be cool if the rockbox volume control just was the android media volume control
17:37:50kugelis that a problem? you can set the rockbox one to max once and only use the global one after that (the way I do it)
17:38:04preglowrockbox consistently forgets its settings here
17:38:08preglowso i have to do that each time
17:38:23kugelyour phone seems messed up
17:38:33kugelsettings work just fine here
17:38:49preglownothing special about it, newly reset, rockbox app form your site
17:38:56preglowso unless that has been updated very recently
17:39:03kugelyou should install from source
17:39:22kugeli don't know how old the one on my site is, nor if it's even in a workable state
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17:39:52preglowit works fine enough if i never background it
17:40:13kugelI've not updated the apks on my site since ages
17:40:30preglowbut yeah, i'll have to install the android sdk shit on my linux install to roll my own, so guess i'll have to wait a while
17:40:57kugelI can upload new ones later this day if you like
17:41:06preglowwell, would certainly be nice :)
17:42:00preglowdrop me a line here when it's done and i'll update
17:45:16notlisteningthe apk runs very nicely on the Dell Streak
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17:45:23notlisteningjust so you know
17:45:29notlisteningthen ones from the wiki
17:45:30kugelnice to hear
17:46:07notlisteningGood job
17:46:30preglowkugel: btw, did you manage to work around the buggy background task stuff in 2.1 android?
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18:00:31wodzpixelma: I saw in log you wanted me to look at something
18:02:15kugelpreglow: no, I think it's impossible
18:02:37kugelit's not a 2.1 bug, it's a htc bug
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18:16:23PaulJamis someone here with knowledge of the script and cygwin?
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18:32:50noamsmlHm, this is odd
18:33:09noamsmlOn my sansa e200, when I try to copy a folder onto it, it becomes unwritable
18:33:19noamsmlBut I can write on it again when I remount it
18:33:54noamsmlWait, no
18:34:02noamsmlIt's just one specific folder
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18:35:06noamsmlThere's some sort of odd damage to the FS
18:36:16noamsmlIf I try to ls one of the foldes (Enya-The Celts), which is supposedly empty, it goes nuts
18:37:48noamsmlHuh, I managed to delete it from the player and now everything seems to work just fine
18:38:16ender`do a fsck/chkdsk just to be sure
18:38:34noamsmlOK, one sec
18:39:10ender`back in the day, the screenshot feature of rockbox could BSOD windows :)
18:39:15noamsml"There are differences between boot sector and its backup" <−− is that normal?
18:39:44ender`(it created files that had identical short names)
18:39:55ender`<noamsml> "There are differences between boot sector and its backup" <−− is that normal? <- it's not unusual
18:43:17noamsmlI think it's stuck
18:44:28noamsmlI tried playing a file and it just keeps saying "Loading"
18:47:58noamsmlender`: Do you know of any way to force-reboot it other than unscrewing the case and temoving the battery?
18:48:34ender`most players have some way to hard reset them - look in the wiki
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19:21:38gevaertsnoamsml: hold the power button long enough
19:22:28noamsmlgevaerts: Thanks, I figured it out
19:22:35noamsmlStill not sure what caused the crash
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20:15:36kugelpreglow: new built is up
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20:33:20lars_gHi rockboxers
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20:46:10bluebrotherhmm, is voice file creation not using the multithreading implementation?
20:46:17bluebrother(in Rockbox Utility that is)
20:48:16preglowkugel: same url, ye?
20:50:57preglowkugel: cheers mate, already seems to work better :)
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20:57:10skfunnyboy_anyone know how to use embios?
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21:13:35bluebrotherhmm, doesn't look like limiting the number of threads used for voice creation works as expected?
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21:22:38saratogabluebrother: did you see my message last night?
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22:02:04bluebrothersaratoga: yes. We can do a new release soon. I'd really like to get that TTS issue addressed first though.
22:02:23bluebrotherthat's why I'm looking into that multithreading thing in voice file creation right now.
22:03:44bluebrotherhowever, if I don't figure it this weekend we can make a release nevertheless. It's a known bug and it only affects voice file creation. It's not really great but shouldn't prevent a new release from happening, especially considering the updated to the patchers.
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22:21:18BagderI got a suggestion today to ask about help and volunteers for translations to Rockbox
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22:27:08b0hoonHi. Can i have admin rights on the FS?
22:29:03Bagderdon't you already?
22:30:03b0hoonouch, someone gave me already, thanks
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22:34:36wodzconsidering new release - I don't think we should release until theme engine stabilizes a bit
22:35:31skfunnyboy_hey do you think its possible to run rockbox with ibugger or embios on the nano 4g ?
22:36:10wodzskfunnyboy_: If you port rockbox to 4g than yes
22:36:41skfunnyboy_and how can i do this ? any volunteers ?
22:36:57Bagderif you do it, you are the volunteer!
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22:41:07CIA-81New commit by bluebrother (r28106): Display number of processors in System Info dialog. ...
22:43:10CIA-81r28106 build result: All green
22:50:14CIA-81New commit by bluebrother (r28107): Display number of processors in System Info dialog. ...
22:52:02CIA-81r28107 build result: All green
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23:23:19leavittxwhat happened to mktccboot?
23:23:55bluebrotherwhat should have happened to it?
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23:29:39leavittxbluebrother: it moved to rbutil :)
23:31:04bluebrotherthat's been almost a year now :)
23:32:11leavittxbluebrother: all this time i used an old bootloader and it works now too :)
23:32:33leavittxwhat is the correct way to build something from rbutil dir outside the rockbox directory?
23:32:53bluebrotheryou can build the patchers in-tree just fine.
23:33:14bluebrother(same as with the tools in tools/)
23:33:26leavittxand how to build rbutilqt?
23:33:31 Quit piotrekm (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
23:33:39bluebrotherwhich platform you're using?
23:33:52leavittxin-tree too?
23:34:00bluebrothercd rbutil/rbutilqt && qmake-qt4 && make
23:34:08bluebrotheryou don't need to build it in-tree though.
23:34:26bluebrothermkdir build; qmake-qt4 ../rbutil/rbutilqt/ && make
23:34:38leavittxcool :)
23:35:07bluebrotheror use utils/common/ -d (though that will create you a tarball out of it for releasing)
23:35:07Stummihm, on submit-form for an patch on flyspray was a foot-note which suggests to discuss the patch on irc.. so i will just do ist :)
23:35:46leavittxbluebrother: thanks!
23:36:20bluebrotherStummi: does rockboy even support audio playback while running?
23:36:50bluebrotherleavittx: you're welcome (and prepare that rbutil/ might get moved some time too :)
23:37:55Stummibluebrother, how i wrote: I only do have an sansa fuze v2. There is it not possible, because it says there is not enought memory for rockboy where i playing music... i am thinking it should be possible on a player with more memory
23:38:09leavittxalso, what is the reason why keyboard controls not work anymore in simulator (cowon d2 one)?
23:39:01bluebrotherhow much memory does the Fuzev2 have?
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23:41:02Stummihm, i don't know exactly. Where can I see this?
23:43:56bluebrotheroh, only 2 MiB according to tools/configure
23:44:13*bluebrother though the fuze had more memory but likely mixed that up with fuzev1
23:45:25kugelbluebrother: it tools/configure shows 8MB (and it's correct)
23:45:44amiconnStummi: Music playback in rockboy isn't safely possible
23:46:07*bluebrother can't read
23:46:14leavittxin case of window zoom > 1, i'm not able to control the simulator at all :(
23:46:20amiconn(1) Rockboy uses the audio buffer for loading game roms. (2) Rockboy uses pcm itself
23:46:50bluebrotherok, reading the wrong line usually results in wrong information :o
23:49:58amiconnOn targets with 8MB or less it's loaded as an overlay as well, meaning the plugin code itself also resides in the audio buffer
23:51:28Stummiok, than it would be better to leave out the playback control at all?
23:55:05amiconnThe savegame stuff is probably fine; can't really comment on it because I don't use rockboy for real
23:56:43StummiThan i have to see how to get a standalone volume control in a menu
23:58:34amiconnThe plugin api has sound_set(), sound_max() and sound_min()

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