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#rockbox log for 2011-04-03

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03:17:47kendelldoes anyone know why the voice generation keeps failing? it only seems to work when complexity is set to 7 and quality is set to 7. any other values fail and abort. the reason I keep changing it is because there is some clipping I'm guessing due to the quality. but not sure.
03:21:08[Saint]What OS?
03:22:33kendelloh, sorry. windows 7 64 bit. sandisk sansa fuze v1 if that helps at all
03:38:33[Saint]I believe it's a known issue that voice generation is broken on Windows OS, though I couldn't say why.
03:38:58[Saint]RbUtil's maintainer has been looking into the issue iiuc.
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03:39:49kendellcrap. wish there were some documentation? I looked on the wiki but haven't found any. sometimes I can generate voice files but only at very very low quality levels. is there an alternate way to create them? i'd like to use eloquence but so far haven't been able to figure out how
03:47:01kendelltried espeak too, but can't seem to load it. tried selecting the dll, but no dice so far
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04:19:04kendellhmmm, still fails. I thought that would work, oh well, back to wiki
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05:48:46kendellhi all. if a player supports audible files, sueh as my sandisk fuze, can rockbox play them? i didn't see it in the list of coedcs so was just wondering. if I have to use the original firmware I can't, can't see the screen.
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05:59:56wtachikendell: it's irrelevant whether the original firmware supports it
06:00:46wtachiRockbox doesn't support Audible because it's DRMed
06:00:55wtachiyou may be able to find a converter somewhere
06:01:04kendellthat's what I thought.
06:01:31kendelloh well. now if only I could figure out how to generate talk voice files. sorry to be a pest, but I'm really stumped.
06:01:45kendellvoice files, sorry, not talk clips. I got that one
06:02:03wtachikendell: no idea, I haven't used them
06:02:33kendellI wish they weren't necessary, but i can't see the screen so it has to talk to me. I can't easily understand the default voice that comes with rockbox
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06:14:17[Saint]why not just download the voice files?seems to me you're going to a lot of effort for little gain.
06:14:33[Saint]kendell: ^
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06:29:19kendellI will do that from now on. the latest revision has a better voice file then the stable release
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06:30:48kendellbtw, I'm thinking about getting a replacement mp3 player, the battery in my fuze does not hold a charge and it is non replaceable. should I get another fuze or something else? I relize this is off topic but I don't know which of the players rockbox runs on can still be purchased at walmart. some of them are long out of sail.
06:32:06kendellI know most of the archos line no longer is produced, but the others I'm not sure about
06:33:45kendellmmm, tea's done
06:40:45[Saint]what makes you think the battery is non-replaceable?
06:42:38[Saint]Sansa doesn't offer replacement parts to the general public...but that doesn't make it "non-replaceable"
06:42:41kendellsays so in the manual. and on sandisk website
06:43:00[Saint]Right, but that doesn't make it true.
06:43:08kendellah. so they're lying to make more money.
06:43:14[Saint]you're onto it.
06:43:38kendellI should've caught on to it. so, is tehre some sort of tutorial for replacing the battery? I don't know how to open up the player
06:43:53kendellcan't find any screws or bolts
06:44:56[Saint]google "<yourplayername>+teardown"
06:45:09kendellwow. thanks
06:45:16kendellit's that easy? first hit
06:45:39kendellis the plastic cover overt eh display screen replaceable? mine is all beat up, but I think the lcd is fine
06:45:58kendellcan't pry it up without popping off the scroll wheel and botton covers
06:46:46[Saint]There shouldn't be any "prying" needed.
06:47:12[Saint]There's a series of small clips around the edge of the case to be released, and a very tricky ZIF ribon cable.
06:47:36[Saint]it's *very* important to release the ZIF connector, not just rip it out.
06:47:57kendellwow. it's that easy? so where do I get a new plastic cover? sorry, but I can't find one at walmart smiles. they thought I was nuts. uh, nope, we only sell the player.
06:48:51[Saint]Do you specifically need one? Opening the player shouldn't render it harmed.
06:49:18[Saint]I'd suggest buying a broken one of ebay (etc.) for the case.
06:49:24[Saint]but this is sliding offtopic ;)
06:50:34kendelloh. I'l try to keep it on topic. the main question I had is why does rockbox eat up so much battery? mine has dropped thirty percent in less than an hour and it was fully charged? there was a couple of bugs relating to ams 3525 battery performance, but not sure if they can be fixed or if it's my player
06:51:43[Saint]That's a bad battery.
06:52:06[Saint]There's no way Rockbox could use that much power if the battery was in good condition.
06:52:10[Saint]It wouldn't be possible.
06:53:04kendellwell, it was kind of in my closet for a couple months dead. could the battery have gotten old? I've had it since october of 2009
06:53:18[Saint]Hmmm....*perhaps* mpeg video could do it.
06:53:57[Saint]but just listening to audio and browsing menus should make a drop like that.
06:54:09[Saint]*shouldn't, rather
06:54:19kendelli only play mp3's, listen to radio and use the alarm. speaking of which, why is there no voice in the plugins menu? I can go to aps, demos, etc but there are no voice items afterwards? I can't generate talk clips for that section of the UI, I tried
06:54:56kendelljust curious, not complaining, as I can't use that section of the player due to no voice prompts
06:55:45[Saint]I'm not certain about that. There's a few places that aren't voiced. Debug menu. playlist viewer, plugins...nio idea why exactly.
06:56:18kendellI think the debug menu is deliberately not voiced to keep blind people out of it? smiles
06:57:46saratogadebug is probably just because people are lazy, and also because theres a lot of random menus in there that are only on a few devices
06:57:50kendellarg, I can't find those clips. hmmm
06:58:26*wtachi imagines his player saying "gee pee eye oh ay colon zero one..."
06:58:46kendellmost of the stuff in there is so technical I can't even comprehend it. I wish manufacturer's were up front about there specks rather than listing proprietary on there data sheets. stupid
06:59:48[Saint]wtachi: The voice is actually pretty good considering ;)
07:00:05[Saint]the fact we even have voiced menus is amazing.
07:00:27kendellit's alright. just wish I could use eloquence but as long as I can understand it. and btw your system for installing and updating is about the most straightforward I've seen
07:00:47[Saint]The big brands for a while were under the impression that only sighted people use these players, some still are.
07:00:56kendellI love the voiced menus. it's awesome. and my player never crashes
07:01:13kendell*cough* sony, anyone?
07:01:44*kendell doesn't like sony. proprietary everything, and no rock box.
07:03:30kendelljust the other day I went into walmart to get a new mp3 player, and I told the girl I cannot use touchscreen unless it's a sandisk. what'd she do? sell me an RCA that had a touchscreen. hahaha
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08:04:29[Saint]wannabenoh46 wants banning
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08:49:54FlynDiceso are the irc logs on the front page borked or am I just special?.....
08:56:18bluebroth3rFlynDice: the irc page is broken for me too, but on the front page?
08:57:26FlynDicewell, the link from the front page is what I was getting at...
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09:45:57bertrikAnyone here with a clipv2 suffering from background noise?
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10:06:50bluebroth3rhmm, looks like the "Rb" logo icon doesn't have its svg file in svn. Might be a good idea to commit that, wouldn't it?
10:07:02CIA-48New commit by bluebrother (r29672): Add capability to speak directly from the TTS engine. ...
10:11:07CIA-48r29672 build result: All green
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11:23:26CIA-48New commit by bluebrother (r29673): OS X TTS: add pitch setting. ...
11:26:35CIA-48r29673 build result: All green
11:27:35[Saint]bluebroth3r: Yes please.
11:27:41[Saint]I've been looking for it.
11:28:04[Saint]iiuc there's only a ~40ish px .png available of it.
11:30:53bluebroth3r[Saint]: it's been available since I worked on it but simply not in svn :) See
11:31:41bluebroth3rbut since that is created from the manual svg it's slightly different to the bitmap version. Don't think that matters much though
11:32:54bluebroth3rsince the logo is used in several places (and converted to different formats) it might be a good idea to have some folder holding the original svg graphics?
11:35:17[Saint]yes, indeed.
11:35:40[Saint]cabbie has suffered this fate, although the original images are *around*...they're not in SVN.
11:35:52[Saint]so, authors improvised..and "watered it down".
11:36:19bluebroth3rthe cabbie original files are psd though, aren't they?
11:36:26[Saint]yeah :/
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11:43:32bluebroth3rRockbox Utiltiy svn binaries updates, if anyone is interested in trying it
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11:58:47kugelFlynDice, bluebroth3r: opening still works
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13:16:51bertrik_train_AlexP: I've prepared a build at home with all of the little AMSv2 fixes in it. I can commit it tonight and make it part of the 3.8.1 branch.
13:17:12bertrik_train_*AMSv2 sd card fixes I mean
13:17:17AlexPbertrik_train_: brilliant, thanks
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15:10:42***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
15:28:28gevaertsJdGordon|: could you have a look at FS #12041? I believe you're more or less familiar with all bits involved
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15:30:04JdGordon|looks fine
15:31:31gevaertsAny opinion on which one is the best?
15:31:45gevaertsOr if we really want the exact old behaviour back?
15:33:15kugelgevaerts: perhaps you can silently slip in scale-on-load as well? :)
15:33:40gevaertskugel: you can, maybe. I can't :)
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15:39:16JdGordon|gevaerts: i didnt look at the first patch... i guess we want the old system back and we could make it so bmp's outside of /.rockbox/backdrops are not persisted pretty easily
15:39:28JdGordon|just copy the filename to some non-permenant buffer
15:39:39*JdGordon| needs to make that work with .wps/sbs/etc
15:39:53JdGordon|and jpg+scaled loading bmps should be pretty simple to implement
15:41:01gevaertsJdGordon|: but why?
15:41:15JdGordon|why what?
15:41:20gevaertsWhat are the advantages of the old system, apart from confusing users?
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15:41:47JdGordon|I dont know, which is why i didnt really have a problem breaking it
15:41:59JdGordon|and apparntly noone else did either (though there is a bug for it open)
15:42:47gevaertsI suspect this is one of those "historical reasons" things
15:43:38AlexPEither it should persist from everywhere, or should only be settable from the specific directory IMO
15:44:18gevaertsIt looks (note: newbie alert!) as if there once was a backdrop setting menu item in the settings menu that worked like all of those other similar settings: pick one from a directory. In that context, the setting stored just the filename, not the full path. As far as I can see, that menu item is gone
15:44:19AlexPI don't care which :)
15:44:49gevaertsAnd the way things were implemented, adding the context menu item made it work the way it did by accident
15:45:13gevaertsSo I suspect there was no particular reasoning behind the old behaviour
15:45:14JdGordon|thats pretty much it... when the config was stored in a hard disk sector we needed to be more carfeul about what we store
15:45:34JdGordon|iirc it was something like 250 bytes total
15:45:51JdGordon|or 500 or so... not enough to waste of full paths
15:46:11*gevaerts nods
15:46:34JdGordon|hmm, you werent around back then were you?
15:46:43*JdGordon| feels like he's been here too long :p
15:47:35gevaertsSo I don't really see a good reason to spend effort to reproduce a behaviour that was dictated by a combination of different constraints and luck, and that wasn't actually backed by usability concerns
15:47:44AlexPand is confusing
15:49:34AlexPJdGordon|: We all feel like that too :P
15:49:45JdGordon|gevaerts: the two changes to apps/gui/skin_engine/skin_backdrops.c can be simplified to just sprintf("%s.bmp") because the whole poath will get stored
15:50:06gevaertsJdGordon|: not really, I think
15:50:21JdGordon|actually, you can use global_settings.backdrop_file directly
15:50:24gevaertsI think we want the full path for user-set backdrops, but not for theme-set backdrops
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15:51:40JdGordon|ok, well your settings_list.c change makes it store the full filename (including folder and .bmp) so make sure it works with that :)
15:51:57gevaertsYes, on setting it
15:52:11gevaertsBut as far as I can make out, not on reading
15:52:34gevaertsWell, I mean, on reading it just gives back what's in there
15:52:50gevaertsSo hand-crafted theme cfgs still work the old way
15:53:56JdGordon|it should be "backdrop: /.rockbox/backdrops/foo.bmp" in the config
15:54:30JdGordon|indeed it is
15:54:44JdGordon|anywho... i must goto bed
15:55:03gevaertsYes, after saving from the context menu
15:57:30gevaertshm, right
15:57:49gevaertsThat does indeed simplify things a bit
15:58:19gevaertsAlthough I don't understand how this works now then
15:58:58gevaertsIt reads the full path from the file, strips bits off, stores just the basename of the file, and then re-adds things when loading?
16:00:41kugelmy plan for buflib currently: a) get rid of all direct audiobuf accesses (e.g. the tempbuf in tagcache), b) implement some callback mechanism for buflib, c) replace buffer_alloc() with buflib_alloc() in all places without compaction, d) enable compaction. I think d) will cause some pretty interesting problems
16:01:02 Quit antil33t (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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16:01:22kugelalso I think I should write some test cases for buflib
16:01:52gevaertsd) is the most interesting one, yes. The rest is mainly tedious search and replace I think
16:01:54JdGordon|gevaerts: curently it strips off because "we" want to save ram usage in global_settings
16:02:30*JdGordon| has a patch somewhere to stick a lock on the audiobuffer pointer
16:03:24gevaertsJdGordon|: right. But it's replaced by at least the same in code, which on most players doesn't make it a gain :)
16:04:29CIA-48New commit by bluebrother (r29674): Properly remove the configuration dialog. ...
16:04:56kugele) could be to make buffering maximize it's buffer on rebuffering (in case something was buflib_free()d in the meantime)
16:05:28JdGordon|gevaerts: yes, artifact of ancient handling...
16:05:37JdGordon|really going to bed now
16:05:54kugelor generally delay compaction until the next rebuffer
16:05:55*gevaerts will test the new patch before he uploads it
16:06:28gevaertskugel: I'm not entirely convinced that the audio buffer has to know about compaction
16:07:33kugelbut you need stop playback before compaction if the audio buffer moves
16:07:42gevaertsThen don't move it! :)
16:08:03CIA-48r29674 build result: All green
16:08:12*gevaerts will try to get his thoughts clear enough to explain...
16:09:11gevaertsWhat you basically *can't* do is give away the bit of audio buffer that's in use, or nearly in use. I'll call that the working set from here on
16:09:26kugelwell, since it's a ring buffer, we could possible benefit from new space in the front without moving data
16:11:21kugelgevaerts: but we want to reclaim unused space, no?
16:11:31gevaertsbah, this really needs pictures!
16:12:25gevaertsI suspect that "reclaim on next rebuffer" is good enough
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16:12:56gevaertsAt least if things aren't constantly allocating and deallocating
16:13:54gevaertsWell, that's the case in my views on the thing anyway, which also includes how you allocate
16:17:10gevaertsA simplified view of what I would do (it has some obvious flaws...) is to allocate from the right (imagine a whiteboard here) and keep the audio buffer aligned to the left. Assume for the moment that the working set will always be somewhere to the left (flawed idea, but that's for later)
16:17:17 Quit silbo (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
16:17:42gevaertsThis means that when you allocate a buffer, the end of the audio buffer just gets adjusted, nothing more has to happen
16:18:32gevaertsAnd when you deallocate, you may have to run your compaction routine, but again, it doesn't touch the audio buffer apart from moving the end
16:18:37kugelbuflib uses the end of the buffer for a lookup table, for fast handle->pointer conversion
16:19:36kugelplus, since audio buffer is a ring buffer, its start and end move over time so allocating from the end isn't as easy as it looks like
16:19:49gevaertsThat's why I said that was flawed :)
16:20:07gevaertsI'd say that at first a fixed lookup table may well be fine
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16:21:43kugelI suspect a-c) can be done pretty easily in a few weeks, but getting compaction right will be troublesome and take a lot of time
16:22:24gevaertsThe way I though of to fix the "what if the working set overlaps?" issue is to just allocate from both sides, and pick the one side that *doesn't* overlap
16:22:47gevaertsThat only breaks if the working set gets too big, and I don't know if that can happen
16:24:13kugelthe working set can be in the middle of the audio buffer, with valid allocations at the start and end
16:25:30gevaertsIs that a problem, apart from limiting the amount you can allocate in total?
16:25:54kugelyou mean to allocate from the middle in such a case?
16:26:26gevaertsThat would split the audio buffer, which would be awkward
16:27:22gevaertsWhat I'm saying is that if the working set is in a position that prevents allocating from both the left and the right, you can't allocate. I haven't worked out the numbers, but I'd say that this shouldn't happen anyway
16:29:51gevaertsThe biggest working set that can happen is probably wav on a slow disk, let's say 5 seconds at 176K/second, or about 800K
16:31:16gevaertsI suspect that this means that as soon as you have only twice that, you may not be able to allocate, so say 1.6MB
16:31:45gevaertsNow disk targets (apart from the Archoses, but those don't do wav) all have 16MB or more IIRC. If you only have 1.6MB audio buffer left, you have to wonder what you've been doing...
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16:32:46gevaertsFor mp3 (i.e. archoses) the maximum would be 320kbps * 5 seconds, or 200kb, again *2 to handle both sides, so 400kb
16:33:07gevaertsAnd again, I'd say that going that low isn't realistic anyway
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16:33:23gevaertsAnd on flash, you don't need anywhere near those 5s
16:34:06gevaertsWell, there's the antiskip buffer too of course
16:34:21gevaertsBut again, it's a tradeoff
16:34:34gevaertsAnd you'll need to refuse new allocations at some point anyway
16:35:14gevaertsNow it's of course entirely possible that there are some flaws in there that I haven't thought of...
16:35:17kugelI thought allocations should always succeed, by stopping playback
16:35:34gevaertsThat's the other option
16:35:44gevaertsAnd you can still do that
16:36:02gevaertsBut avoiding that when it's not needed is good :)
16:36:43gevaertsBut seriously, I suspect that those numbers are really near the minimum needed to have working playback *anyway&
16:39:53AlexPgevaerts: Maybe you should implement it to see if it works? :)
16:40:02kugelI think optimizing allocations to not need playback stopping is something for the end of the project :)
16:40:16gevaertskugel: I don't really agree
16:40:24gevaertsSure, if you can get away with it
16:40:38kugelgenerally we don't do new allocations after boot, so they are really rare
16:40:39gevaertsBut if you have to rewrite the entire allocation thing, that's not ideal
16:41:00gevaertsWe don't, because we're rather generous with the initial allocations
16:42:31kugelbuflib can't do most of the things you propose too
16:42:50gevaertsBut if you look at e.g. language files, German is half the size of the allocated buffer
16:43:10gevaertsBut I don't see that as a good reason not to want it
16:43:42kugelthen buflib needs to know of the internals of playback&buffering
16:44:43gevaertsDoes it? It needs to know which bits have to be left alone if at all possible
16:44:51gevaertsI don't see it needing much more
16:45:33kugelI'm unsure if I fully understand your proposal
16:45:47 Quit sirrozha (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
16:45:54gevaertsWell, I'm not sure if I fully understand it myself :) I think it works, but...
16:47:46kugelI think it's the average case that buffering has valid allocations on both start and end of the audio buffer
16:47:57gevaertsvalid, or needed?
16:48:48gevaertsYes, you also need to tell playback about what you ended up doing
16:49:29kugelso you propose to make playback/buffering discard all allocations which are X seconds of audio away?
16:50:53gevaertsWell, not entirely.
16:52:13gevaertsWe're going to steal valid data, and tell playback/buffering about that. This valid data may be at the end of the logical buffer, in which case not much will get dropped at all
16:53:09gevaertsAnd yes, we may want to try to optimise for that, which would mean asking more data from buffering :)
16:53:49gevaertsThere's one more issue in the long term
16:53:57kugelI thought buflib would be in firmware/, in which case we can't just ask buffering for data
16:54:27gevaertsbuffering would register callbacks in that case
16:55:10gevaertsIf we end up also having relocatable plugins, there's a problem. While relocatable code can be loaded anywhere, it's not really feasible to move it after loading
16:56:32wtachithis could easily turn into a research project on new kinds of malloc()...
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16:56:50kugelyes, we are going to need to mark some allocations as unmoveble, and delay compaction until it's freed
16:59:21*gevaerts nods
16:59:53gevaertsI'd like to see some simulations of what this would mean though, before the actual implementation starts
17:00:28kugelthat actually doesn't mean compaction need to be delayed; just that these blocks must not be moved. and new allocations can go into possible wholes in the meantime
17:00:36gevaertsI mean, delaying compaction is all very nice, but if it means the system will lock up in some common cases, it's not good enough :)
17:01:24gevaertsOh, there's one more case that should be taken into account I think, especially in the "don't stop playback" case
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17:02:39gevaertsCurrently the codec buffer is rather large, wasting a huge amount of space for some codecs (WAV doesn't need 1MB to decode), while still not being quite enough for some files (there was a report of some vorbis files not playing due to this last month)
17:03:08kugeland you want to optimize for "don't stop playback" from the beginning? I'd rather do it at the end, when all other compaction induced problems are fixed
17:03:11gevaertsHaving codec data allocated on the buffer would provide a nice way to help here, *but* codecs do have real-time needs
17:03:30kugelaudio buffer is probably not the only area where compaction is going to be tricky
17:04:08gevaertsNot "optimise for", no. I do think that you need to think about it from the start though, or you risk getting a system that can't do non-stop at all
17:04:41n1sgevaerts: ogg vorbis files can basically use limitless amounts of memory (although limited to 32 bit addressing iirc) the format sucks that way
17:05:54gevaertsn1s: yes, that's how I understood it
17:07:26 Quit Bagder (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
17:07:43gevaertsIf you can make the buffering code handle a fragmented buffer, that would help a lot I guess
17:08:34*gevaerts looks forward to reading kugel's detailed proposal :)
17:10:47***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
17:14:05 Join num1 [0] (~num1@unaffiliated/num1)
17:15:53gevaertskugel: I'm not saying the proposal should solve all issues, but I think it should at least try to list the various problems and have a general idea on how to solve them (or which ones will not be solved, and why that's not a blocker) links to , a website that returns an "Internal Server Error," instead of linking to, a website which works. is an experiment which isn't intended to work
17:17:47AlexPHow did you get there?
17:18:55AlexPwhat is that, a search engine?
17:18:59num1I tried to use and it timed out on me (it's working now) so I tried the link to next.
17:19:03num1yeah it's a search engine
17:19:14AlexPwell, not much we can do about it then
17:19:27num1that would make sense then that it's not supposed to work. thaks
17:19:35AlexPno worries
17:19:55AlexPIt is slightly unfortunate that people can get pointed there, but never mind
17:22:14*pixelma seems to be too stupid to find out which URL is needed to actually checkout the connectbot source
17:22:45pixelmaoops, sorry. Wrong channel
17:23:42num1oo I just noticed uses ipv6, thank you for doing "the right thing" !
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18:21:48LeifIs Austin Appel in the room?
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18:23:34AlexPLeif: That is scorche
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18:24:26LeifAlexP, Thanks
18:25:08AlexPLeif: Is it about your proposal?
18:25:15LeifAlexP, Yes
18:25:34LeifAlexP, Okay
18:25:40Leif(You as well?)
18:25:52AlexPI meant I'm going to PM you :)
18:25:56LeifOh, okay
18:28:56AlexPbagder or zagor - a news item that we have been accepted for GSoC might be a good idea :)
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18:35:52wodzI have problems accessing irc logs - is it known issue?
18:36:16wodztoo bad
18:36:32kugelwodz: works
18:36:34n1sthe webpage is gone but the actual logfiles are still available
18:37:48n1s for example
18:38:06wodzI am reading about how irqs are serviced on arm and I don't understand if I have to do something special on returning from ISR or not
18:39:30Torneon which ARM version?
18:40:13Tornetraditionally you return with subs pc, lr, #4
18:40:52wodzTorne: and this reenables irqs right?
18:41:18Torneit drops the value in spsr_irq back into cpsr
18:41:50Torneit doesn't explicitly reenable irqs, but presumably if it took one the saved value has them enabled :)
18:42:16wodzI see, that's what I was missing
18:42:29Torneany ALU op with target PC and the set bit set also restores cpsr from spsr
18:42:54Torneand on entry to irq the link register value is off by four
18:43:36wodzyes this shift is explicitly stated
18:43:49Torneso you need to fix it by four at some point, and put it back into pc with the S bit enabled. you can do it all at once with subs pc, lr, #4, or if you had a more complicated interrupt handler that switches mode, or whatever, you can do them independantly
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18:47:41Aylaand how can you switch modes? AFAIK when you are on IRQ mode you can't set the bits on the cpsr to change the mode... Is there a trick for that?
18:49:07Torneyou can change mode any time
18:49:26Torneno trick
18:50:07Aylaso you can change the mode from IRQ to supervisor just by writing the cpsr? I remember there was some protected bits it's impossible to write unless you're on the supervisor mode
18:50:13 Quit TheLemonMan (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
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18:50:32Torneall modes otehr than user are privileged modes
18:51:04Tornethere is nothing special about supervisor mode except that it uses the "svc" banked registers for r13, r14 and spsr
18:51:15Torneall the other modes have the same abilities.
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19:41:23jvoisinhi, I'm a fench student, and i'm intrested in the GSoc
19:42:12AlexPcool, which project?
19:42:22jvoisin"Clean up the radio code"
19:43:14AlexPOK, do you have any experience with Rockbox?
19:44:27jvoisinI'm using it since 4-5 years
19:44:39jvoisinI have read some code
19:44:47AlexP*a good start :)
19:44:58jvoisinBut I never contributed :/
19:45:17AlexPThat's OK, new blood is always welcome :)
19:46:31AlexPI think bertrik might be good to discuss this with, he has done some radio work IIRC
19:46:44 Quit BHSPitMonkey (Quit: Ex-Chat)
19:46:50jvoisinI don't have any exeperience in embedded devices : will it be a problem ?
19:47:22gevaertsDo you have some experience with C?
19:47:54gevaertsThat should be fine then
19:47:57jvoisinI'm not a master, but I can produce code
19:48:50gevaertsRockbox isn't the sort if embedded where everything has to fit in 512 bytes or so. We do care about code size and efficiency, but I think it's merely a matter of getting used to it
19:49:10AlexPBagder: Could you pop up a we are in GSoC news item on the front page when you get a minute?
19:49:38AlexPOh, and is broken :)
19:50:15 Join Zagor [0] (~bjst@rockbox/developer/Zagor)
19:50:26Aylais there a way to specify the toolchain to use when building the SDL application? Or should I manually edit the makefile generated from tools/configure?
19:51:46n1sAyla: what do you want to do?
19:53:16Aylan1s, I'd like to compile rockbox as a SDL application for a mipsel-linux system
19:54:37n1sconfigure for the sdl application is only set up for native compiles afaik so you will probably need to hack up the makefiles a bit, yes, i think we have a crosscompiled RaaA target that uses sdl but don't remember which
19:55:12BagderZagor: is broken apparently
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20:06:43 Quit slooopy (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
20:12:15hex__wait, does rockbox work on sansa fuze v2?
20:13:45jvoisinhex__: by fuzev2, you mean fuze+ ?
20:14:14hex__no, version 2
20:14:42gevaertshex__: yes
20:14:56AlexPjvoisin: There is a fuzev1, fuzev2 and fuze+
20:15:38 Quit TheSeven (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
20:16:25hex__what is the chance of ruining your sansa (failure rate)
20:16:33gevaertsAnd probably soon the fuze+v2 :)
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21:09:49hex__can rockbox play video files?
21:10:20LambdaCalculus37Yes, Rockbox can play MPEG1 and MPEG2 video files with MP3 audio.
21:10:51***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
21:13:30Aylaallright, I have the welcome image of rockbox on my dingoo A320 screen :)
21:13:52 Join cooper29 [0] (
21:14:11hex__why can't I see any video or music files in the file browser?
21:14:11LambdaCalculus37Ayla: Picture, please!
21:14:34LambdaCalculus37hex__: Is your Show Files setting set to "All" or "Supported"?
21:14:37gevaertshex__: maybe you accidentally changed the "Show files" option
21:14:41AylaI can take a screenshot
21:15:02AylaI didn't configure controls right now, so I can't do anything
21:15:11Aylaplus, some plugins failed to build
21:15:15Aylabut I guess that's a good start
21:16:12hex__I have it set to all files, but it still shows nothing
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21:16:34gevaertsAyla: don't worry too much about the plugins at first
21:16:48AlexPhex__: How did you copy them over?
21:18:14*bluebroth3r slaps forehead
21:19:10hex__oh I see, it is in a folder called ##music##
21:19:26hex__and how do i see .avi files?
21:19:31AlexPYou don't
21:19:43bluebroth3ryou convert them
21:19:45AlexPLambdaCalculus37 just said that Rockbox supports mpeg1 and mpeg2 video only
21:19:58AlexPhex__: And you can copy the music to wherever you want
21:21:07Aylaand here is the screenshot:
21:21:36hex__yes alexp, i can
21:21:49AlexPyou can what?
21:22:14hex__i can copy music where ever i want
21:22:36AlexPRight, so you therefore know where to find them
21:23:00AlexPIf they are in the ##msuic## folder it is only because you or the OF put them there, nothing to do with Rockbox
21:23:23gevaertsAyla: does it go any further than that screen yet? If not, you probably have thread issues
21:23:28 Quit Stummi (Quit: Bye!)
21:23:51hex__besides that, does anyone have a good converting tool?
21:24:05AlexPfor converting...?
21:24:13AlexPTry winff
21:24:15Aylagevaerts, it should update to a new screen?
21:24:37hex__ok, i'll just go to my virtual windows machine...
21:24:40gevaertsAyla: yes, you should get to the menu screen after a few seconds at most
21:24:48AlexPhex__: why?
21:24:57gevaertsAyla: try running configure with −−sdl-threads
21:25:45hex__AlexP: I'm using linux and I don't want to be bothered by putting programs on it
21:25:55AlexPer, OK...
21:26:23*bluebroth3r has expandable inline settings for TTS and encoder working :)
21:26:57bluebroth3rwhat do people think about that? Instead of having a separate window for that configuration?
21:28:03hex__is rockbox based on linux by any chance?
21:28:23AlexPIt isn't based on anything
21:28:31AlexPIt is built from scratch
21:28:41hex__I know...
21:28:48AlexPSo why ask then?
21:28:54bluebroth3rit is based on recycled bits :P
21:28:58AlexPbuilt from scratch != based on linux
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21:29:27AlexPIf it is built from scratch then it can't be based on linux by definition
21:29:28hex__=! =>:O
21:29:42AlexPSo if you know it is built from scratch then why ask if it is based on linux?
21:29:47LeifI thought rockbox used a few bits from uclinix, which also used little bits of linux in it...
21:30:24gevaertsI think we got our original strcpy from linux, but that got replaced
21:30:36LeifOh, okay
21:30:44Aylagevaerts, there's no such thing on the configure, there's a −−no-sdl-threads instead
21:30:58Aylaah crap. forget about it
21:31:02gevaertsAyla: weird. configure −−help says there is
21:31:03AylaIt's right above
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21:32:35gevaertsAyla: anyway, −−sdl-threads will use SDL threads, which wrap pthreads, so that should work anywhere. The −−no-sdl-threads one (which is default) uses our own context switching mechanism, which I suspect nobody ever tested on MIPS for the application code
21:32:36hex__wouldn't it be horrendous if microsoft somehow gained control of rockbox?
21:32:57*Leif doesn't think they would ever really care.
21:33:33gevaertshex__: you mean, like if they buy out all of us?
21:33:50*gevaerts considers the likelyhood of this to be quite remote
21:34:00AlexPhex__: It'd also be terrible if the planet exploded
21:34:07AlexPBut why worry about either?
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21:34:51bluebroth3rdomonoky: thoughts?
21:35:31domonokybluebroth3r: good idea
21:36:25bluebroth3rok, then I need to fix the missing functionality and clean up the code. Currently it's somewhat hacked in to only show the UI part
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21:37:53Aylagevaerts: allright, it works with −−sdl-threads
21:38:06gevaertsAyla: excellent!
21:38:07AylaI now have a menu with "Files", "Database" ...
21:38:46 Part num1 ("Ex-Chat")
21:38:48gevaertsYou lose some performance compared to our own threading, but performance doesn't buy you much if it doesn't work :)
21:38:56Aylalooks like there are some tiny rendering issues, it's flickering a bit
21:38:59Aylayes, indeed :)
21:42:30Aylahmm, it segfaults after a Ctrl-C
21:53:43Aylawhere can I configure the controls?
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21:56:26gevaertsAyla: maybe have a look at FS #12027 for another recent application port-in-progress that uses sdl. That should provide some hints on what to change
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21:58:52Aylaok, thank you
21:59:11hex__does anybody have a driver for the sansa fuze for windows xp?
21:59:31Aylazipit z2, nice :)
21:59:56gevaertshex__: set the fuze to use msc
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22:21:33hex__my windows xp virtual machine will only accept mtp
22:22:45hex__I NEED A DRIVER FOR SANSA FUZE (yelling)
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22:24:04AlexPhex__: Then your VM is broken
22:25:28Aylahmm, it looks like rockbox expects the key codes reserved for touchscreens (like BUTTON_TOPLEFT...) even if it has been compiled without HAVE_TOUCHSCREEN, is that its normal behaviour?
22:25:50hex__my vm is NOT broken
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22:27:31AlexPOK, sure
22:27:41AlexPEither way we don't have the driver, go and ask Sandisk
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23:10:53***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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23:54:22CIA-48New commit by bagder (r29675): push for gsoc2011
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23:57:50Bagderfront page update
23:58:28AlexPnice, cheers
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