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#rockbox log for 2011-06-12

00:06:53sideralIs the rockbox-dev mailing list moderated? My postings don't seem to get through since I switched to my email address
00:07:16gevaertsIt's subscriber-only, yes
00:07:32gevaertsYou can have a non-delivery subscribtion though
00:07:33sideralBut posting via gmane used to work with my old address
00:07:47 Join ChickeNES [0] (
00:07:48sideralI don't remember subscribing to -dev to be able to post
00:10:52gevaertsYou need to check with the Swedes then I guess
00:10:52 Quit evilnick (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
00:12:39sideralthanks gevaerts. I'll verify first that I really didn't subscribe and just don't remember :)
00:14:03Bagderthere is a subscriber-only rule enabled
00:14:27Bagderwhile we can in theory allow non-subscrbers at will, that list only has the rsb email address
00:15:08sideralJust had it send me a passwd reminder −− and it looks like I indeed subscribed to it :)
00:15:33sideralAlright, I'll subscribe the new address then and repost.
00:15:44Bagderand btw, 495 members are on the rockbox-dev list!
00:16:07Bagder1114 on the "regular" rockbox list
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00:24:38sideralBagder: Thanks, the posting made it now. You can delete the other attempts from the list's filter :)
00:25:02Bagdernon-subscribers' posts are just discarded without telling anyone...
00:25:49sideralah, very convenient ;)
00:25:50Bagdermostly because we used to get so many spam posts it got unbearable
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00:29:12sideralBTW, I'm quite sad that there's so little traffic on the user's mailing list. I have to follow multiple web forums to "know what the users think", and I believe that most of these discussions would belong to the mailing list. Those were the times, I guess
00:29:56saratogamailing lists are annoying, so i think most users just stick to forums
00:30:42sideralsaratoga: Huh? If there's something that's annoying, it's forums
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00:32:58saratogagiven the ratio of forums to mailing list users, i think most people would disagree
00:34:05 Quit ender` (Quit: If you assign N persons to write a compiler you'll get a N-1 pass compiler.)
00:35:35sideralThat's because they don't know the powers a good mail or news reader can unfold. But sadly true, nonetheless
00:39:12bluebrotherwell, I did unsubscribe from the users ML because of the amount of crap (and users not willing to follow our etiquette and such). The forums are strangely much more sane in that aspect
00:39:30bluebrotherpersonally I'd prefer that stuff to go via mailing lists instead of forums but well ...
00:49:45sideralAt least I can already read our forums with my news reader. If only I could also post to them with an email or NNTP interface...
00:50:56sideralFor other forums such as anythingbutipod, it's completely hopeless. vBulletin doesn't offer useful RSS feeds, so reading them offline is painful
01:08:38 Quit HaimN (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
01:12:15AlexPThe user list drove me away
01:12:31AlexPToo much rubbish, too many people ignoring etiquette etc.
01:12:37AlexPIn the forums I can fix things :)
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01:18:30bug2000sideral: I hate this database bug :\
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01:59:42***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
01:59:50saratogagoing to do a round of battery benches on my clip+ comparing SD card with no SD card inserted
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07:52:34saratogascorche: ban governer45
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08:30:08wodzTorne: mail provided by 'hcl' in spreadsheet is a fake for sure
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08:37:43saratogawodz: hcl passed away a few years ago, so we won't need to email him
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09:54:11bug2000What is the best way to read the database files?
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09:59:53***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
10:01:30[Saint]aren't they just plain text?
10:02:09n1sread them for what?
10:03:41Slasheribug2000: use the tagcache api, a demonstration can be found from tools/database/database.c
10:03:50Slasheri[Saint]: no, we use a custom binary format
10:04:08bug2000Slasheri: Nothing that I can quickly compile?
10:04:24Slasheriwhat are you going to do?
10:04:35n1sSlasheri: is there pathname compression or something like that in the db?
10:04:56Slasherin1s: no, full pathname is always included, without compression
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10:05:19bug2000Slasheri: Just want to read 'em on the PC.
10:05:34Slasheribug2000: then export db changes to a changelog
10:05:38Slasherithat is a plain text file
10:05:50n17ikhthe database stuff on android doesn't work yet, does it?
10:07:22n1si think it does
10:09:42bug2000Wee crash; Undefined instrucation at 20248CFC.
10:10:36bug2000Data about at 30212598 FST 0x8 (domain 0, fault 8) address 0xE082FD5C
10:11:16bug2000Data abort at 302158A for 0x8 (domain 0, fault 8) address 0xE82FD60
10:11:33bug2000Is this crash data any worthy?
10:11:52n1sbug2000: maybe, if you have a way to trigger it
10:12:09bug2000n1s: Nah, pretty just happened out of the blue on me >.> 3 multiple crashes.
10:12:15bug2000in a row*
10:14:06[Saint]n17ikh: Sure it does.
10:14:18[Saint]n1s: jsyk, also ^
10:14:24n17ikhdoesn't work for me, tells me "reboot to enable"
10:14:37[Saint]n17ikh: So....reboot? ;)
10:14:51n1sbug2000: then it's of limited use i think, the data aborts are kind of interesting though
10:15:11n17ikhwell, killing the application didn't help it
10:15:24bug2000n1s: I was trying to duplicate the duplication bug of the database. and got those stuff in the process.
10:15:26[Saint]It certainly should do.
10:15:29n1sthose addresses are word aligned so something else is probably wrong
10:15:41[Saint]turn the phone off and on again.
10:15:52[Saint]or, use a build with Shut Down" enabled.
10:16:11[Saint]killing the task certainly should "just work" though.
10:16:13n17ikhseriously, reboot the phone? what is this, windows 95?
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10:16:24[Saint]I did it myself for about a month before I bothered adding shutdown to the main menu.
10:16:42[Saint]as I said above, killing the task works for me.
10:18:27[Saint]If rebooting the actual handset doesn't work...then there's something else wrong.
10:20:42 Quit Keripo (Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
10:22:53bug2000Finally. This bug is ANNOYING.
10:26:47 Quit user890104 (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
10:27:25bug2000Finally managed to generate bad database.
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10:28:54[Saint]Oh? Please share.
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10:29:18bug2000Yeah, uha which files are the database one that I have to upload?
10:29:54[Saint].tcd and .idx pertain to the database.
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10:30:55bug2000[Saint]: Can I send it only to you or I have to upload the database for the entire world to see?
10:31:35n1sbug2000: it's probably most useful fro us if you can file a bug report and attach it there
10:31:46bug2000n1s: Fine :(
10:32:18bug2000tar.lzo is ok?
10:33:28n1sno idea :)
10:33:51bug2000Gerat, then you'll enjoy this format :P
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10:34:04[Saint]Hmmm, yep. to banish myself to the hole for thinking the database index had it's own extension.
10:35:00[Saint]bug2000: people are probably less likely to look at it if you put it in a truly obscure compression format, though ;)
10:35:37[Saint]Also...what do you possibly listen to that you might not want others to see?
10:35:45[Saint]porn soundtracks? ;)
10:35:46bug2000[Saint]: So .lzo isn't obsecure enough... Gimme a format? :P
10:36:10bug2000[Saint]: Nah. But if I don't want people to know, why would I say it on IRC? :P
10:36:26[Saint]it's ok, I can just go check the tracker :P
10:36:48bug2000Ok, so what obsecure format should I use?
10:37:17 Quit n1s (Remote host closed the connection)
10:37:33bug2000Nah, zip isn't obsecure at all.
10:37:39[Saint]perhaps I worded that oddly. I was basically saying "It has a better chance of being looked at if it's easily accessible"
10:38:09[Saint]and by "looked at" I mean "fixed".
10:38:11bug2000Well, anything is easily accessable :P
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13:40:22CIA-58New commit by bluebrother (r29994): Remove Manual option from configure script. ...
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13:43:53CIA-58r29994 build result: All green
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14:12:20CIA-58New commit by thomasjfox (r29995): Work around missing EOVERFLOW define on cygwin/mingw. ...
14:14:57CIA-58r29995 build result: 4 errors, 0 warnings (thomasjfox committed)
14:15:16thomasjfoxah, spoil my lunch time...
14:15:44n1slooks like a server problem with kugel's android builder
14:15:59n1s/bin/sh: /home/kugel/android-ndk-r5b//toolchains/arm-linux-androideabi-4.4.3/prebuilt/linux-x86/bin/arm-linux-androideabi-ar: No such file or directory
14:16:08n1skugel: ping
14:16:50thomasjfoxwho needs a compiler anyway :)
14:16:55n1sit can't find the toolchain at all
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14:20:20n1spossibly caused by r29993 in some way
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15:56:13mshathlonxpbertrik are you here?
15:58:18TheLemonManpamaury, hello
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16:07:13cpu98hey guys some1 using ipod video?
16:08:09[Saint]It's likely your problem isn't specific to the Video, try asking your question anyway.
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16:08:58bluebrotherwow, cross compiling the sim with mingw-cross-env throws a lot of warnings
16:09:40bluebrotherlooks like it's only that -fPIC thing
16:09:51cpu98oh I just wanted to ask about my patch
16:10:09Tornebluebrother: we don't want -fPIC when compiling for windows
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16:10:18Torneit should only be for linux/mac sims
16:10:28cpu98expect better-than-OF Sound Quality
16:11:10bluebrotherI'm wondering if it makes sense to have the cross compiler prefix hard coded into configure. mingw-cross-env uses a different one so I have to adjust it before I can compile
16:13:04bluebrotherhmm, errors out at some point. Need to investigate that some time later
16:13:09cpu98what do you think?
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16:15:02[Saint]well, it's not Video specific, for one.
16:15:26[Saint]but, the patch itself doesn't claim to, that's cool. Just a side-note.
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16:22:03[Saint]whoops, the Nano1G has the 8975
16:22:07*[Saint] is in dreamland.
16:24:01[Saint]damn, I was really hoping I *didn't* mess that up ;)
16:24:20[Saint]It'd work for the Color and the Nano1G then too (both of which I own) ;)
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16:26:16[Saint]Oh, Nano2G also.
16:26:25[Saint]You worked on the wrong one! :P
16:31:59cpu98nano2 has 8975?
16:33:22[Saint]according to ipodnano2g.h yes
16:34:40cpu98aah damn no datasheet for 8975... i had nano 1g it was great player
16:34:50cpu98i mailed wolfson about 8758 datasheet
16:34:56cpu98no response for months
16:35:00cpu98and after that they release it
16:36:41[Saint]I *love* the sound of my Nano1G(s) and Color(s)...the Nano2G sounds...different to me, maybe something diferent in the HW setup that RB does, no idea.
16:37:04[Saint]I've never listened to the Nano2G with the OF personally, the GF does occasionally in the car though.
16:38:28[Saint]perhaps if you posted to the developers mailing list *someone* has the datasheet for the 8975 floating around.
16:41:08cpu98current driver seems pretty vanila there might be room to improve
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16:42:48*mshathlonxp doesn't like sound of his 1G nano
16:43:12mshathlonxpwhen listening the same stuff I usually do with my video, it feels that nano is lacking some high frequency response
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16:44:11mshathlonxpcpu98 what does your patch do - improves sound quality?
16:44:19cpu98actually it does
16:45:04mshathlonxpwhich ipod video are you using?
16:46:13cpu98should work for all videos
16:47:25*mshathlonxp is too lazy to compile rockbox
16:47:44mshathlonxpdo you have 80GB or 30GB?
16:49:44[Saint]the only possible differences between ZVideos is RAM and HDD iiuc.
16:50:38mshathlonxpwell, is rockbox compiled with RAM size specified?
16:51:24Tornewell yes, but it figures it out :)
16:51:44Tornethere is only one ipodvideo build now, anyway.
16:52:08mshathlonxpsounds nice
16:52:24mshathlonxpcpu98 can you share your compiled rockbox for ipod video?
16:52:35mshathlonxpI think I won't hear any difference, but anyway :>
16:52:47cpu98sure but it isn't quite vanilla though
16:52:58[Saint]*way* nicer for Torne regarding "my <big_disk> doesn't work with my Video" forum posts, anyway ;)
16:53:08Torne[Saint]: that was seperate :)
16:55:24cpu98msathlonxp I'm scared of my patch exploding your ipod
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17:01:43kugelstrange issue on my build client
17:01:55kugelit can't find the compiler, even though it's there
17:02:21cpu98mshathlonxp you need one?
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17:05:02mshathlonxpI could use one ;>
17:07:07kugelI think I know what's wrong
17:07:18kugelthat server possibly cannot execute 32bit binaries
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17:10:18kugelis there a kernel module for this?
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17:14:11gevaertskugel: as far as I know, the kernel should be able to handle both, but you might not have the required userspace bits
17:14:59*AlexP clangs the freezy bell - 1 day to go!
17:15:54kugelI perhaps lack the libraries
17:16:16kugelit sucks that I forgot the root password for this machine :)
17:18:35gevaertsWhy are you trying to run 32 bit compilers on it anyway?
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17:20:53cpu98mshathlonxp where to upload?
17:21:08mshathlonxpI dunno, you choose ;>
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17:21:14[Saint] (painless)
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17:26:51kugelgevaerts: the ndk has only 32bit binaries
17:27:09gevaertsTime to drop android support then ;)
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17:27:24cpu98gevaerts : what@!!!!
17:27:44cpu98 ipod build came
17:31:02sideralbug2000: congrats on reproducing the bug. I'll have a look ASAP.
17:31:39sideralIf you want to take a quick look at the DB contents yourself, you can use the Python scripts posted at the end of this page:
17:32:08sideralI maintain a copy at sideral-rockbox/rbdb">
17:32:27sideralYou can easily change these scripts to dump whatever you like
17:35:58*mshathlonxp reboots ipod video
17:36:16mshathlonxpearphones emits sound, no errors and no smoke coming from ipod ;>
17:36:37cpu98it's a trick!
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17:40:03ender`<mshathlonxp> earphones emits sound, no errors and no smoke coming from ipod ;> <- you just don't see the smoke, because it's trapped in the hermetically sealed body :)
17:40:45mshathlonxpyou're wrong
17:40:47mshathlonxpit's not hermetical
17:41:01[Saint]then, how does Apple emit the iNeural-Toxins?
17:41:23mshathlonxpgod only knows
17:41:26mshathlonxpsteve jobs*
17:41:47mshathlonxpcan anyone explain where is that new "Histogram interval" string?
17:42:01mshathlonxpdescription says "in record settings menu" but I can't find it
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17:45:08mshathlonxpah and one more question - is firmware that is running on iPod able to regulate voltage received by connected accesory?
17:45:58*mshathlonxp has noticed that when apples firmware is running, FM transmitter is receiving noticeably less voltage
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17:51:24[Saint]Hmmm....why is the peak meter settings in recording options and playback options?
17:55:49 Quit robin0800_ (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
17:56:04[Saint]also, I have *no* idea what r29969 changes.
17:56:30[Saint]I can't seem to find anything on my devices regarding histogram in playback.
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17:57:34[Saint]I guess, it does say "makes it usable by"...not "make it usable *in*".
17:59:48[Saint]If I'm not just talking to myself here (;)), is there perhaps a case for moving the peak meter settings to somewhere it won't be doubled up needlessly?
18:00:03***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
18:00:11cpu98'm watching
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18:02:41[Saint]It's not specific to recording, so...moving it out of recording settings "fixes" it.
18:04:15cpu98maybe that's todo
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18:12:47[Saint]Hmmm...AVG seems to be giving a false positive for RBUtil now also.
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18:21:30ruskielo, is there an easy way to clean current playlist(Sansa Clip) ?
18:23:05ruskieremove all entries in the current playlist
18:23:37n1sstop playback
18:23:45[Saint]stop playback
18:23:52n1s[Saint]: histogram is only available on iriver h10 and h300
18:24:01n1seh h100, not h10
18:25:02[Saint]Aha, that gibes me a very good reason as to why I couldn't find it then.
18:25:05[Saint]*gives too
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19:05:58TorneDid we come to a conclusion at devcon about whether we want to try and enforce a linear history going forward in git?
19:06:10Tornegerrit can totally do it (you can reject pushing merge commits)
19:07:00gevaertsDid we discuss it?
19:07:17Torneer, not with everyone :)
19:07:21Tornei talked to some people ;)
19:08:02gevaertsRight. Did those who understand the question properly (I know what you *mean*, but I've never thought about the implications) seem to have similar opinions? :)
19:08:13Torneer, kinda
19:08:37Tornethe main implication is you have to rebase before you can push, if anyone else has made a commit
19:08:45Tornelike having to do svn up before you can svn commit
19:09:14Torneif you are actually using gerrit to submit via code reviews, though, this is much less of a problem beause gerrit can do it "for you" on the server side by cherrypicking
19:12:02gevaertsAllowing merge commits means that you're blindly trusting git to do the right thing, while rejecting those means the committer (at least in theory) checks if things make sense?
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19:12:42TorneWell, there is a *seperate* option for allowing merges that require conflict resolution
19:13:00Torneso unless that's also enabled then allowing merge commits should generally be fine
19:13:31Tornethe "problem" with merge commits is just that the history becomes a graph
19:13:39[Saint]it's not very often I discover an actual bug ;)
19:13:49*gevaerts nods
19:13:58[Saint]seems that rockboxinfo has been stuck on 29969 for some time now ;)
19:14:00Torneusually quite a complicated graph quite quickly, if few/no people rebase their changes ;)
19:14:36[Saint]Install a new build from the current builds section, it states the revision as 29969
19:15:03gevaerts[Saint]: hm, I believe someone said something like that a few days ago...
19:15:09Tornethat's actually the bot being stuck i think
19:15:16[Saint]*I* wanted to find it!
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19:15:26Tornethe builds after 29969 don't appear tobe being uploaded
19:15:42gevaertsTorne: so what you'd *really* want would be something like "only allow merge commits if they're actually more than just people not having rebased"? :)
19:15:49Tornegevaerts: heh
19:16:11Tornegevaerts: Well yes, the time you *want* to commit a merge is when someone has worked on something in a parallel branch for a while and you want to keep all that history
19:16:28Tornerebasing that kind of thing is generally crazy hard
19:16:35gevaertsYes, and not being able to keep it then is a bit annoying
19:16:46TorneWell it's not an irrevocable choice
19:17:02Tornein fact it's a permission that can be different for different people :)
19:17:12gevaertsI at least understand why it's an actual question :)
19:17:33Tornethere's two related things here: whether gerrit allows you to push a merge commit, and how gerrit actually submits patches itself when it's told to
19:18:32Torneit can refuse if they need rebasing, or merge it for you, or cherrypick it (which is functionally equivalent to you rebasing it and reuploading it)
19:18:40*[Saint] wonders what's the builds are being...errr, built.
19:19:37TorneI guess the thing to do is bring up the demo/sandbox with it enforcing linear history and see what people think
19:19:41Tornerelaxing it is easy
19:19:51Torneturning it linear again after allowing people to sbumit merges is basically impossible ;)
19:21:29AlexP[Saint]: Yeah, sorry - that is known :)
19:21:38AlexPAnd it the builds, not just rockboxinfo
19:22:13AlexPThey aren't being copied to the download directory I would guess
19:22:16pamauryTheLemonMan: hi
19:25:10TheLemonMan i did some more reversing on the rom and found some slightly differences between the dasm and your code
19:26:45pamauryfor the usb part ?
19:27:25TheLemonManyou said the problem was the pll, right ?
19:27:40pamaurythat's to be expected since usb; it could be I said but that was just an idea
19:27:52pamaury*usb is rather complicated
19:28:26pamauryBut on my device it works and don't forget that's my rom ! :)
19:28:55TheLemonManheh, that's the strange part
19:29:25pamaurydid you find something interesting ?
19:29:54amiconnBagder/ Zagor: ping
19:30:02pamauryI had a look at the ROM but the code is definitely hard to disassemble, I was interested in the sb handling part but did go far enough
19:30:46TheLemonMannothing much, the usb part kinda matches your code even if i havent finished disassembling it
19:31:43TheLemonManthe interesting part was the bootup sequence and how they hide stuff into reserved bits of otp :D
19:31:54pamauryyes, I saw that too :)
19:32:22pamauryI only find some read/write to reserved regions of the memory, there is probably something here :)
19:32:45TheLemonManyeah, low memory around 0x5000/0x6000
19:33:03pamauryhum, no that ocram
19:33:22pamaurythe code copies some data from the rom to the ram
19:33:38pamaurythe 0x5000 region is a used as "scratch pad" since the rom needs some ram !
19:33:56pamaurybut really I'm confident that the usb controller part is correct, the problem is probably elsewhere
19:34:11pamauryI have writes to some 0x8003C... iirc
19:34:29TheLemonMani wonder why they waste so much space with useless data between functions
19:35:08kugelTorne: IMO merge commits are fine
19:35:35pamauryI didn't find useless data, there is a LOT of code in this rom
19:35:56pamaurythere a kind of master table which points to several function tables
19:36:03TheLemonManhuh, there is some meaningless data between some functions
19:36:09 Quit bluebrother-bot (Quit: So long, and thanks for all the fish.)
19:36:35pamauryare you sure it's not code ?
19:37:25TheLemonManyup, or at least i assumed that because it's after the function return and before the literal pool
19:38:06pamaurythe literal pool does not need to be close to the code
19:38:37pamauryso it might be code, or some data related to some code you haven't yet disassemble
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19:39:23TheLemonMangcc usually puts the literal pool right after the function
19:39:30kugelTorne: I'm not sure I understand the problem with non-linear history?
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19:41:12pamauryTheLemonMan: but it's might not be gcc which compiled the code
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19:41:27pamauryanyway, I'm pretty sure there is nothing useless in this rom
19:42:04TheLemonManso that 0xBE streak in the middle of it has a purpose ?
19:42:04pamaurybut it uses a lot of pointers to function which is a pain
19:42:38pamaurynot the part filled with 0xBE but apart from this, I can't see what you are talking about
19:42:49bertrikbah, I don't even know what the issue with git linear or non-linear history, let alone have an opinion about it
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19:43:29Bagderamiconn: yes?
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19:44:04kugelBuschel: did you see my answer about gui boost?
19:44:24TheLemonManpamaury, take a look @ FFFF97F6
19:44:28TheLemonManfor example
19:44:45Buschelyes, I understood the automated mail wrong and assumed you already closed it. sorry for that
19:47:13pamauryTheLemonMan: that's a constant pool
19:47:58kugelBuschel: I still think it should be closed if nobody works on making it committable
19:47:59TheLemonManthe functions ends at E0 and the constant pool is at E4
19:48:36pamauryI have a function ending at F6 and the pool starting at F8
19:49:34pamaury(and the function starts at FFFF97DC)
19:50:18TheLemonManhuh, the start matches but for me ends at F4
19:50:44pamaurynot, at F4 there is BX LR
19:50:45kugeljhMikeS: the audio mixer patch doesn't work on android
19:51:10[Saint]kugel: I don't think he expected it to.
19:51:17pamauryso that leaves only two useless bytes for alignment
19:51:35kugel[Saint]: perhaps, but he wanted testing on RaaA
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19:51:58TheLemonManaha, didnt take in account it was thumb
19:53:04[Saint]kugel: there's a comment in there that made me think he knew it wouldn't...but, testing and knowing is good.
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19:55:04[Saint]it's actually kinda flamey, and I don't want to repeat/repost it. but yeah...pretty sure he knew it wouldn't work.
19:57:40kugelhm, make apk calls make zip again for some reason
19:58:02pamauryperhaps an apk is a zip ?
19:58:28[Saint]'s an *archive*, if "archive" == .zip
19:58:44kugelpamaury: it is but it doesn't matter
19:58:55*pamaury denies any knowledge
20:00:05***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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20:04:08Buschelkugel: in general I would say you're right. in this particular case I think we should keep it as it is quite helpful even though it is not in svn (and not in a state to be submitted)
20:04:29kugelit should be hosted somewhere else then
20:05:40[Saint]I think this needs a clear "if it hasn't been touched in <X>" timeline.
20:06:20[Saint]as all he really needs to do is say that he's getting around to maintaining it, but <foo> gets in the way.
20:06:48kugelr29977 is causing the make apk problem
20:06:58[Saint]real life...impending doom, other? I dunno.
20:07:24 Quit ukleinek (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
20:07:35kugelZagor (logs): make apk now causes to be copied to which is annoying
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20:12:48[Saint]anyway, yeah...I think a "if a patch hasn't been touched in <some_period_of_time>, consider it dead" rule to help clean up Flyspray.
20:12:59[Saint]Something that can be agreed upon.
20:13:32[Saint]*s/I think a/I think there should be a/
20:14:08gevaerts[Saint]: won't happen.
20:14:17gevaertsWe'll close the patch part of flyspray instead :)
20:14:54[Saint]well, that certainly fixes the issue ;)
20:14:59 Quit merbanan (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
20:15:22gevaertsThat's actually part of what this gerrit stuff is about
20:19:09[Saint]without *truly* understanding gerrit...doesn't that kinda remove the ability for "John Everyman" to post patches for review by limiting the way he can do so?
20:19:25[Saint]I mean, to even push for review you need an ssh account/git no?
20:19:52gevaertsNo, if I understood things correctly
20:20:19Tornebut you can just create one yourself
20:20:26[Saint]Hmmm. :-S
20:20:42Tornealso nothing stops you sending a regular patch to rockbox-dev
20:20:42[Saint]Oh, anti=Hmmmm :-S
20:20:44gevaertsTorne: can we ban [Saint] from it at least? ;)
20:21:13Torne[Saint]: the argument against flyspray in general is it's a crap way to read/compare/comment on patches
20:21:33Torneyou have neither any clear separation of versions of the patch, nor any threading that might help :)
20:21:57[Saint]it's one saving grace is the ease of use.
20:22:06Torneit's not particularly easy to use
20:22:15Torneand you have to create an account
20:22:19Torneincluding password and email verification and stuff
20:22:52[Saint]and...gerrit *doesn't* have those things?
20:22:57Tornenope :)
20:23:02bluebroth3ris that gerrit thingy already up for playing around with it?
20:23:08Tornebluebroth3r: er, yes, just about
20:23:14[Saint]so, technically bots could spam bs to it for review?
20:23:15TorneI was about to start writing a little trial guide for it
20:23:22Tornebluebroth3r: give me a bit :)
20:23:26bluebroth3rok, nice :)
20:23:34Torneit doesn't have the rockbox history in it though
20:23:44Tornei will do that soon, but am still waiting for more emails before i give up, for now ;)
20:23:49bluebroth3rfor playing around with it that shouldn't hurt
20:23:53Tornei made a sandbox repo instead and committed some random crap
20:24:05Torne[Saint]: not particularly easily, no
20:24:08bluebroth3ryou crap committer! :P
20:24:13Torne[Saint]: it authenticates with OpenID
20:24:29[Saint]Ah, there's *some* authentication.
20:24:38Torneyes, but it's for an account that virtually everyone already has ;)
20:25:13[Saint]no "blatant asshole protection" bother me a little, but, you never know if you don't try right?
20:25:24Torne[Saint]: you can opt to only allow/trust certain openid providers
20:25:36Tornepeople you know have decent bot protection etc
20:25:43Tornee.g. google, yahoo
20:25:53bluebroth3roh, the irc reader doesn't recognize my secondary nick as Rockbox nick?
20:26:38Torne[Saint]: the chance of anyone inventing a system to spam gerrit repositories by running a fake openid provider and logging in to them, adding ssh keys, and then connecting to them over ssh to push proposed changes over git, is pretty minimal
20:28:10Torneif they were motivated to do that they would probably also be signing up to rockbox-{dev,users} and spamming that
20:28:13Tornewhich would be easier ;)
20:28:32*[Saint] has a LOT of gerrit-related crap to read up on.
20:28:45Tornethe process is not significantly more difficult, i don't think
20:29:12 Quit HaimN (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
20:29:26Torneinstead of svn checkout, edit files, svn diff, manually upload to flyspray with browser, you git clone, edit files, git commit, git push origin HEAD:refs/for/master
20:29:38 Join HaimN [0] (~quassel@
20:29:57Tornegetting set up is marginally more complicated because you are expected to provide an ssh key
20:30:16Tornebut if you don't know how that works you can ask gerrit to make you a password and use that
20:30:17 Nick bluebroth3r is now known as bluebrother (~dom@rockbox/developer/bluebrother)
20:30:48[Saint]I'm not worried for myself..I mean, I'll figure it out when I need to. It's the odd gem that shows up on Flyspray out-of-the-blue from a user that comes and goes just as easily I worry about. Someone that might decide it's not worth the effort to go through this becuase they don't plan to be around in the future/whatever.
20:31:26Tornefew patches are okay when that happens the first time
20:31:45Tornethe ones you were suggesting closing with no activity for a long time would be mostly those ones ;)
20:31:50gevaerts[Saint]: those patches are welcome on the mailing list then I'd say
20:31:54Torneor ones where people haven't bothered to give their real name
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20:32:46Torne[Saint]: you have to be able to at least use the most basic git commands to produce a patch at all, because we don't provide source tarballs ;)
20:33:14Torneso getting a clone and updating it requires that you have a vague idea
20:33:23dan_aTorne: Why no source tarballs?
20:33:34[Saint]Yeah, sure. In truth I'm neither for or against it. I just wanted to hash it out from the viewpoint of making it as easy as possible for new contributers.
20:33:43bluebrotherwhat's the point of source tarballs (except for releases)?
20:33:47Torne[Saint]: well when i post the instructions you are welcome to try it
20:34:00Tornesource tarballs are a waste of bandwidth/time for both parties
20:34:15 Join merbanan [0] (
20:34:19Tornevirtually nobody who has any use for the source will only ever have *one version* of it
20:34:32Tornethe version control system gives you every version, much quicker and more cheaply :)
20:35:12gevaertsdan_a: we stopped those a while ago. I can't remember the exact reasons
20:36:28dan_agevaerts, Torne: Ah, thank you.
20:39:15AlexP[Saint]: While being easy for new people is important, being easy for committers is important too - otherwise nobody will comment/review
20:39:33AlexPI think the combination of this + accepting patches on the mailing list should cater for most
20:40:09AlexPTorne: Are we going to try to synchronise the switch with the release?
20:40:18TorneAlexP: i don't see any reason to bother
20:40:19AlexPAs in when we branch for release shut svn trunk
20:40:28TorneNaw, that doesn't help
20:40:33[Saint]Yeah, truth be told I was sold as soon as I saw that the odd "one-off" would be accepted on the ml...just wanted to hash it ot in case there was yet another side I wasn't seeing.
20:40:39Tornethe git repo will contain all branches, not just trunk
20:40:41AlexPI don't care myself :)
20:40:46Tornebecause it's easy, so it might as well
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20:41:07Tornewe'll just do it some time after the release when all the open questions are resolved :)
20:41:12AlexP[Saint]: More than one offs, I think people can do it as the prefer
20:41:17AlexPSounds good
20:41:49Tornewell, and once it's hosted somewhere on
20:41:54Tornethe machine i'm using atm is temporary
20:43:38Torne[Saint]: the big thing personally i like is that if some random person who isn't a committer posts something on gerrit I can merge it into trunk in ten seconds if it's good, without needing to touch my local copy of the code ;)
20:43:54Torne[Saint]: and if it needs changes i can place comments on individual lines of the diff, and see the full context of the entire file at will
20:44:23AlexPFrom the brief look I had at gerrit at devcon it looked useful
20:44:36AlexPI'm looking forward to the cheat sheet :)
20:44:43Torneright :)
20:44:44*[Saint] too
20:45:00*[Saint] finds a pointier stick for Torne-poking ;D
20:45:30AlexPTorne: It is like all the git stuff - when you explained it I followed and it seemed sensible, but I'll be buggered if I can remember it now :)
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21:29:51kugelTorne: will we see the gerrit demo today?
21:30:11Tornekugel: i'm writing the guide for it now
21:30:26bluebrother"today" in which timezone? ;-)
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21:35:24bertrikbluebrother, what needs to be done to release a new AMSv2 bootloader?
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21:42:32bluebrotherbertrik: no idea, I was never involved with those. For Rockbox Utility it should be sufficient to push new files to the download server (unless mkamsboot needs changes)
21:43:12bluebrotherwhat's the difference between h300 LCD remote and h100 LCD remote? Only the case or does it also differ in number / naming of buttons?
21:44:17bertrikbluebrother, I can compile a clean SVN bootloader, but I don't know how to push this to the download server. Who would know the procedure?
21:44:45bluebrotherbertrik: I think funman did the previous releases. As for pushing files just ping Bagder
21:45:02bluebrotherand since I don't have any AMSv2 device I can't test anything
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21:47:10bertrikhm, I can only test clip+, not clipv2 or fuzev2
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21:51:07amiconnBagder: Is there an ETA for fixing the downloads and the delta table?
21:52:56*amiconn is kinda annoyed that the delta table seems to like breaking when there are potentially interesting deltas
21:52:59 Quit mshathlonxp (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
21:53:24amiconnThis time: removal of track number guessing
21:57:24AlexPAnybody around with an archos who can test a build for me? I had to cludge binutils a bit to get it to build, and I'd like to check the builds I'm producing work
22:00:08***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
22:01:18bluebrotherAlexP: what archos? I have an Ondio SP
22:01:37AlexPbluebrother: any, it was the sh toolchain I had problems with
22:01:48AlexPI'll do an SP build if you wouldn't mind :)
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22:03:10bluebrotheranyone with a h300 LCD remote around? I'd like to get FS #8569 some testers (and hopefully closed again soon)
22:03:11fs-bluebot Iriver remote keymap changes (patches, new)
22:03:37bluebrothernot that I'm too interested in that change but we really should try to get the number of open patches down.
22:06:30bluebrotherhow about some "patches of the week"? Post some (older) patches to the ML and ask people to test / comment on them?
22:06:50AlexPWorth a go
22:06:58AlexPSomeone would have to check they build etc. fist though
22:07:27bluebrotherI wasn't thinking about users, rather point developers to it to hopefully get more attention
22:07:36bluebrotherfor maybe 10 patches out of different areas?
22:07:45AlexPyeah, but even then :)
22:09:39bluebrotherthat build is r29993,right?
22:09:56bluebrotherplayback works, voice too. So I guess everything is fine.
22:13:48AlexPgreat, thanks
22:14:31AlexPthis is good to know
22:16:22gevaertsAlexP: I just checked your build against one I made here for the same revision
22:17:07AlexPgevaerts: anything interesting?
22:17:25gevaertsThree files differ: rockbox-info.txt (it has the host gcc version), ajbrec.ajz and rockbox.ucl
22:17:48AlexPwould the latter two be expected to?
22:17:57gevaertsNot sure actually
22:18:10gevaertsWhat does md5sum rockbox.bin give you?
22:18:42gevaertsI believe those two are compressed
22:18:50gevaertshm, different from mine
22:19:05gevaertsSo obviously compressed/repacked versions are also different
22:19:26AlexPmaybe compare against a version from the server?
22:19:49AlexPI can't as it wouldn't tell us anything :)
22:20:46 Quit Strife89 (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
22:20:54gevaertsI wouldn't trust server binaries right now
22:21:05gevaertsCan you upload your rockbox.bin and rockbox.elf?
22:21:12AlexPsure, one mo
22:22:42 Quit HaimN (Remote host closed the connection)
22:22:59AlexPgevaerts: and
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22:25:53TorneOK, I've done some of the Gerrit demo guide
22:26:08TornePlease let me know if anything is really unclear or doesn't work
22:26:24TorneThe instructions are not yet complete (i haven't covered all topics) but it should be enought o get started and have a fiddle with it
22:27:34AlexPTorne: wow, good work :)
22:27:39*AlexP will have a peruse
22:28:04Tornei'm going for now, which is why i'm posting it as-is ;)
22:29:33gevaertsAlexP: after correcting for some differences caused by you using git, they match
22:29:45AlexPhehe, good work :)
22:29:55AlexPThanks very much for taking the time
22:30:08gevaertsThe scrobbler output has the svn revision, which is empty for you apparently
22:30:58gevaertsSo I had to patch that out, after which it was different again due to me now having 29993M instead of 29993. After fixing that, ajbrec.ajz is exactly the same
22:32:01AlexPI admire the dedication :)
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22:32:42gevaertsIt's not *that* much work!
22:32:54gevaertsAnd all plugins were the same, so it had to be something like this
22:33:09AlexPwell, I'm glad it works anyway
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22:34:05bluebrotherhmm, registering with gerrit seems to have ignored my real name, needed to set that in the settings afterwards
22:35:48kugelTorne: I can't seem to use my google account
22:36:13kugelnvm, works now
22:36:24saratogaif i understand this correctly, with garret you can push a patch for review without actually having commit access?
22:36:36AlexPsaratoga: yes
22:36:50AlexPsaratoga: And then if all is immediately good, a committer can just click merge
22:36:52saratogawho do you register with ?
22:36:53AlexPand it does it
22:37:08AlexPOr you can have multiple reviews there, then he can finally press merge
22:37:16saratogaoh i guess you register with the web app
22:37:18AlexPOr download it to local tree or whatever etc. etc.
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22:51:13 Nick kramer3d is now known as d3remark (~kramer@unaffiliated/kramer3d)
22:52:22kugelI might note that git-config has to have the email registered with gerrit, but you can override the global config per repo (in .git/config)
22:52:51gevaertsTorne: how do patches go to "Abandoned"
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22:55:17bluebrotherhmm, how can I do a review? Do I need to add myself as reviewer first?
22:55:56gevaertsI don't think so
22:56:18*bluebrother tries
22:56:22gevaertsJust pick a patch and click review
22:56:41bluebrotherah, found the review button :)
22:57:14gevaertsOr look at the diff and click on it in random places
22:57:34gevaertsIf you double-click on a lone you'll get a text box
22:59:00*gevaerts likes the thing in general, but he obviously can't say yet that nothing in it will annoy him :)
22:59:28kugeloh my patch set conflicts, lets see how to resolve
22:59:45bluebrotherhmm, got and application error but it still shows the comment
23:01:59kugelTorne: where should I push the resolved change to?
23:02:26gevaertskugel: commit −−amend?
23:02:55kugelgevaerts: I have fixed it locally, but I need to push another patch set, I think
23:07:18kugelFWIW, git push origin HEAD:refs/changes/X to update tracker items
23:07:39kugelwhere X the number found in the URL
23:09:10*bluebrother just managed to push a review :)
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23:13:38kugelbluebrother: "diff all unified" for your task crashes my browser
23:14:56gevaertsOh, it tries to open seven thousand tabs apparently
23:16:06bluebrotherkugel: maybe that task is a bit large then :)
23:16:15gevaertsWhich is a bit annoying. I like a patch to be in one file sometimes
23:16:37bluebrother542 files changed is a bit :)
23:17:32kugelgevaerts: indeed, in fact I expected to get 1 file by clicking that
23:18:21kugelbut looking at patches is a lot nicer than on flyspray
23:18:39*gevaerts agrees
23:18:41bluebrotherurgh, diff all unified is really not really a good idea on that change
23:18:55gevaertsIt doesn't crash *my* browser :)
23:19:34bluebrotherI killed the browser before that could happen :)
23:19:40kugelside-by-side diff is what viewvc had for reviewing post-commit :)
23:21:12sideralI have trouble unpacking bug2000's .lzo file attached to FS #12129 <>. My distro seems to provide a shared library, but no binary for accessing this file type. Which program should I use?
23:21:12fs-bluebot Duplicate database entries (bugs, unconfirmed)
23:21:33 Quit xeniter (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
23:23:10*bluebrother tries inviting some random people to review the patch
23:23:37gevaertssideral: lzop should do it, although I'd shout and ask for standard files
23:24:04bluebrotherah, it sends out mails on reviews. Nice
23:24:51n1sgevaerts: sideral: for some reason he chose an obscure format deliberately
23:24:58n1si told hin to use zip
23:25:15kugelbluebrother: heh, you asked me to review?
23:25:26bluebrotherdidn't someone earlier say something among "any format will do"?
23:25:28bluebrotherkugel: why not?
23:25:50bluebrotherjust picked some random people I figured having an account already :)
23:26:07kugelnice that this is possible
23:26:22sideraln1s: Maybe bug2000's "zip" binary generates this crap format. you never know what's en vogue in the Windows lands these days
23:26:54 Join xeniter [0] (
23:27:17*sideral is willing to assume innocent ignorance
23:27:17n1ssideral: no i'm pretty sure it was done on purpose, you can find the discussion in the logs from this morning if you want to read for yourself
23:28:08bluebrotheroh, seems I committed a change :o
23:28:32*bluebrother starts to like this
23:28:48gevaertsbluebrother: I "submitted" your patch
23:29:21gevaertsI'd like an easy way to see who pushed the button though
23:30:00bluebrotheryou see that in the git log
23:30:17bluebrotherthough I was a bit confused what "submit" actually does.
23:32:11bluebrothergevaerts: git log −−format=full
23:33:26gevaertsAh, ok
23:33:38bluebrotheror use gitk
23:34:03gevaertsright, that's the other option
23:34:18 Quit xeniter (Read error: Operation timed out)
23:35:07gevaertsThis is just me not knowing git properly yet of course
23:35:36kugelwith −−format=full it doesn't show the date anymore"
23:35:37bluebrotherhmm, is there a way to finally reject a patch?
23:35:40Bagdertips: add custom aliases in ~/.gitconfig to get handy shortcut commands for your favourites
23:35:42 Join [Saint] [0] (
23:35:48kugelbluebrother: clock "Abandon Change"
23:36:01bluebrotherkugel: oh, right. −−format=fuller does
23:36:12kugelfuller than full?
23:36:25bluebrothersure :)
23:36:31gevaertsBagder: and spread confusion by then forgetting that they're your own aliases and using them in instructions :)
23:37:23*Bagder uses "git up" all the time =)
23:37:31*kugel too :)
23:38:01Tornekugel: You shouldn't have to push to refs/changes to update the review
23:38:10kugelhow else?
23:38:29 Quit petur (Quit: Leaving)
23:38:49Tornethe commit message hook that the instructions told you to instal takes care of it
23:39:00Torneyou just amend your existing commit and push to refs/for/master again
23:39:11TorneIt notices the Change-Id: line is the same and puts it on the right one
23:39:28bluebrother"you are not allowed to upload merges"?
23:39:56kugelTorne: the way I did also worked apparently
23:40:02Tornekugel: yes, that does work
23:40:15Tornebut you don't need to know the change number this way
23:40:37Tornebluebrother: currently gerrit is set up to refuse merge commits in order to keep history linear
23:40:41Tornebluebrother: rebase instead of merging.
23:41:00Tornewhen you submit in gerrit, instead of pushing directly, it cherrypicks the change so you don't have to rebase as long as there are no conflicts.
23:42:41kugelTorne: nope, it opens a new task always
23:42:55Tornekugel: Then you haven't installed the hook properly
23:43:05Torneyour changes don't have a Change-Id line
23:43:09Torneso, obviously not ;)
23:43:47Tornesee,3 for what it should look like ;)
23:44:05gevaertsTorne: the Change-Id does force using one branch per feature a bit I think
23:44:19Tornethat is generally the intended way to use it
23:44:23gevaertsYes, I know
23:44:28Torneit doesn't really force it though
23:44:39Torneit's just generated the first time you commit something
23:45:12gevaertsWell, it really only "advises" it for changes that have to go through the review system anyway
23:45:39kugelTorne: still not doing it right..
23:46:05gevaertsCan you do the amend thing on something that's not the latest commit in your current branch?
23:46:14Tornegevaerts: no
23:46:14bluebrotherhmm. I've rebased master but still cannot commit −− "change 5 closed"
23:46:32Tornegevaerts: you can do it with rebase
23:46:49Tornekugel: you did run the scp to get the hook? :)
23:46:56Tornelook at .git/hooks/commit-msg
23:47:01Tornemust be executable
23:47:14kugelit is
23:47:26Tornewait, are you still amending an existing commit?
23:47:32Torneit only inserts it on new commits
23:48:10Torneif you want to match it up to something already in the DB that didn't have one you need to copypaste the commit id from the gerrit page
23:48:41gevaertskugel: you're not going to be able to change a patch that's past the review stage
23:49:02gevaertsChange 5 has been committed to master
23:49:18kugelI'm not trying on 5 :)
23:49:20 Join xeniter [0] (
23:49:28kugelsee tasks 8+
23:49:48Tornekugel: does the commit have a change id line on your local branch?
23:50:09 Quit benedikt93 (Quit: The quality of my life is going straight up now that i have a shotgun.)
23:50:16Torneand you installe hte hook first before any commits?
23:50:28kugelpretty sure I did, yes
23:50:31bluebrotherhmm, I still can't get it to push. Still change 5 that breaks
23:50:39Tornekugel: well other people's work
23:50:44Tornebluebrother: what're you trying to do?
23:51:04gevaertsbluebrother: are you pushing something you reviewed earlier?
23:51:48bluebrothergevaerts: not sure.
23:51:56gevaertsTorne: I suspect we may want to keep the sandbox around :)
23:52:02bluebrotherI've resetted my repo to some time earlier and pulled, now it works
23:52:03Tornegevaerts: i was intendin gto :)
23:52:07kugelwhy doesn't it work for me? :(
23:52:40Tornekugel: don't know i'm afraid
23:52:44Torneit appears to be working for everyone else :)
23:52:53*kugel has an idea
23:53:03kugelI have the clone on /tmp which is mounted noexec :)
23:53:20TorneThat's probably a problem, yes ;)
23:53:44kugelahh now it works
23:53:59kugeland it does add change id on −−amend
23:54:14TorneOh, maybe it just adds it if it doesn't have one
23:54:20Tornefair enough
23:54:23kugelso, all commits get this change-id whether they're put to gerrit or not?
23:54:44Tornemy general thought: who cares
23:54:45gevaertsWell, they're supposed to all go through gerrit at some point
23:55:01kugelwhat? no
23:55:11Tornelots of people use git in ways that adds lots of trailing lines (signed-off-by, etc)
23:55:19gevaertshm, right
23:55:42Torneanyway. the hook *is* optional
23:55:46gevaertskugel: you can use a different checkout to work in your in-progress branches if you like :)
23:55:50kugelhm, I'd rather not have change-id for direct pushes
23:56:00Tornekugel: that seems weird/arbitrary
23:56:13kugelwell, I don't feel strong anyway, but it's ugly :)
23:56:15TorneIf some changes are going to have it, why not all?
23:57:07TorneThe header-line-at-the-bottom format is kinda standard in git at this point
23:57:29*Torne shrugs.
23:57:33TorneYou don't have to include it :)
23:57:43Torneyou can push to refs/changes to update a change
23:57:56Torneit's just less mistake-prone to have the hook do it

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