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#rockbox log for 2011-09-05

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08:24:19 Join Zagor [242] (~bjst@rockbox/developer/Zagor)
08:25:00[Saint]What do people think about this as a mute icon for RaaA?
08:25:21[Saint](Thanks to the Tango! iconset)
08:27:38God_Eater[Saint]: can we get some context? I.e. the other icons it's going with, and the rest of the theme?
08:28:06Zagorit looks a bit complex, at first glance
08:28:56[Saint]it simply replaces the "volume empty" bar, evilnick expressed that he felt that wasn't sufficient to indicate that the audio was muted.
08:29:17JdGordon[Saint]: it looks like it would look out of place with the rest of the icons
08:29:25JdGordonjust put the red x over the volume bar?
08:30:00God_Eateryeah, if that's going in with the Cabbiev2 RaaA theme, it would look shit.
08:30:04LloreanYeah, I'd just put a simple red X over the volume area.
08:30:49[Saint]Personally, I don't see the point to it at all ;) And I thought the "empty" volume graph/image/thing was suffient to indicate audio was muted...its just my willingness to please ;)
08:31:33amiconnZagor: Do you have an idea how mingw32 sims could be added to the build system, doing proper checks to make sure prerequisites exist on the client?
08:32:08amiconnRight now, testsystem() just calls sdl-config −−version and checks whether it returns something
08:32:40God_Eater[Saint]: it would have a point if you could indicate with the icon somehow what the volume will resume to once you unmute
08:33:01God_Eaterbut I don't think Rockbox has a way to select different muted icons based on volume at unmuted levels does it?
08:33:11[Saint]It might be worth noting that I didn't intend that image to be displayed on its lonesome, but rather overlayed on top of the "empty" volume graph.
08:33:18amiconnBut in order to differentiate native and mingw32 sdl, we'd need to do two things. (1) check whether the mingw32 compiler is installed (easy), but (2) search for the correct sdl-config (like in configure)
08:34:21amiconnActually (2) is more important than (1) - (1) is very likely true when (2) is true due to the fact that you need (1) to build (2)
08:34:33[Saint]God_Eater: No, with touchscreen (as its only a touchscreen thing presently) mute will always return to the value it was prior to muting.
08:34:54[Saint]If volume is changed while muted, it resumes from min volume (which is a bit sucky)
08:36:24[Saint]the other problem is, I'm not sure that "mute" for all targets (touchscreen targets) will *actually == "no audio" due to the way its implemented.
08:36:39God_Eater[Saint]: that's my point - it would be useful to have a visual indication of what the volume was prior to muting
08:36:45[Saint]Its a "poor mans mute" that just sets min volume, which on some targets is still audible.
08:36:55God_Eater(with your red x thingy overlaying it perhaps)
08:37:14[Saint]God_Eater: there's no way I can think of to do this.
08:37:23God_Eater[Saint]: indeed - as I suspected
08:37:34God_Eaterso the "no volume at all" approach seems better
08:37:40God_Eaterand stuff evilnick's preferences ;)
08:37:53[Saint]RIght, damn my eagerness to please ;)
08:38:14[Saint]It simplifies the volume slider code *quite* a bit dropping it.
08:38:25God_Eateresp. if as you say, changing the volume whilst muted just starts adjusting from zero again, that even makes sense
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08:39:24[Saint]I would prefer, as I'm sure others would, that changing the volume whilst muted changed the volume up/down from the volume it was at prior to muting...but this is non-trivial.
08:39:50God_EaterI wouldn't prefer that
08:40:18[Saint]That's how /most/ mutes wourk AFAIK.
08:40:25[Saint]*work, even.
08:40:31God_Eaterit runs the risk of you going from zero to really bloody loud in nothing flat
08:41:02[Saint]well, only if "really bloody loud" was the value prior to muting.
08:41:04God_Eaterwhich would be fine *IF* we could solve the visual cue of what the volume is likely to be when I change it
08:41:13God_Eaterbut we can't
08:41:20God_Eaterso I'm happy with the way it works currently
08:42:11Zagoramiconn: I guess we'll have to add some detection that you're running on win32 (or a parameter or environment variable) and then it's just like all the other tools: figure out a detection, and add it.
08:42:33[Saint]My preferred way of the way mute should work doesn't sem to be common when I researched it more, but I'd prefer that whilst muted volume changes had no effect and the audio stayed muted.
08:42:56[Saint]This would solve the "visual cue" thing as we could display what the volume would be when unmuted.
08:43:58God_Eaterwe could?
08:44:04[Saint]for example, you could still continue to raise/lower the volume, and these changes would be displayed...but there would be no audio output whilst muted.
08:45:00[Saint]sure...iiuc, we could "mute" the audio, and still represent the current volume graphically.
08:46:01***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
08:46:09[Saint]This doesn't sem to be people preferred/expected mute behaviour, though.
08:46:23[Saint]in ragrd to volume changes not un-muting audio.
08:47:53amiconnZagor: Not running on win32, but crosscompiling
08:48:47amiconnI guess the check for mingw32-gcc could be added to the generic check (for (split ',', $archlist) {}) and the sdl check can be done separately after that
08:49:20Zagorbut mingw32 is not a new arch. it's a new build host.
08:50:03amiconnNo, the build hosts would be the same. We're crosscompiling the win32 sims with i586-mingw32msvc-gcc
08:50:34Zagorahhh, you mean that
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08:54:39God_Eaterstripwax: how did you do in the game dev thingy?
08:55:00God_EaterI got very curious after reading about "bee interpolation vectors" :D
08:55:30stripwaxhehe; I was about twenty mins late for the monthly roundup.
08:57:19God_Eaterseems like something which should get used in schools
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09:17:11JdGordon[Saint]: any way I can bribe you to play with the skinned lists patch?
09:17:37God_Eatersure. He accepts hookers and blow.
09:18:16[Saint]or hookers on blow
09:18:26[Saint](but, pretty sure that's a given these days)
09:18:55JdGordonpretty much I'm at the point where i need people to play with it to tell me what needs fixing
09:19:11JdGordonotherwsie I could commit it in its current start and wait for feedback that way
09:19:16[Saint]I think the guy that was fell off the radar.
09:19:25[Saint]Haven't heard from him lately.
09:19:37JdGordonyeah, dunno
09:23:20JdGordonthe only big limitation the current patch has is there is no scrolling at all in the list viewports
09:23:31JdGordonwhich is fine for tiled skins, but not for regular lists
09:24:09[Saint]I'm not sure committing it has any drawbacks...
09:24:16[Saint]it won't effect those not using it.
09:24:30God_Eaterexcept as a binsize increase
09:24:43JdGordonits a pretty small patch :)
09:24:51JdGordonbut yeah, usual nonesense there
09:25:48JdGordon[Saint]: what target can i build for you?
09:26:04[Saint]RaaA 240x320 portrait
09:26:48JdGordontime to see if i can build android here
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10:46:05***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
10:48:30CIA-14New commit by bryan (r30431): Added 'platform-tools' to the features installed by for the android build
10:49:27[Saint]It *should* "just work" now...but I still think its preferable that it be done by hand.
10:49:38[Saint](especially if needless bloat is a concern)
10:51:04CIA-14r30431 build result: All green
10:54:18[Saint]bluebroth3r: Ping?
10:54:40[Saint]You mention changing the scrollbar to 10x, right justified.
10:54:48[Saint]Is this *usable*?
10:55:12[Saint]Or merely for (*cough*) "eye-candy"?
10:56:30[Saint]The reason I have it at 24px is to make it actually usable as a scrollbar. People had trouble launching the tabs (when they were in the theme) when they were 20px wide, so I'd like to know if you can actually scroll with the bar this thin or not.
10:57:13[Saint]I'm ASSuming you're just using kinetic scrolling and the scrollbar is just visual feedbac on where you are in the lists.
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11:35:01*[Saint] finds it amusing that Rockbox is classed as "very usable" by a user on the forums.
11:35:30[Saint]...for varying definitions of "very", or "usable", Sure! :D
11:35:43Zagor[Saint]: what platform?
11:36:00[Saint]Oh...whoops, I neglected that didn't I.
11:36:03[Saint]Cowon D2
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11:37:50JdGordonfar more users think rockbox is awesome compared to those that think its shit
11:39:06[Saint]Oh, certainly. But it made me wonder how many other devices this particular user had used Rockbox on before drawing the conclusion that its "very usable" on the Cowon D2 :)
11:39:34Zagordoes it matter? he's happy with it on D2 (presumably compared to OF)
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11:56:31*gevaerts isn't very happy about this recent tendency to not want to accept a change without first discussing how it relates to all other features we might or might not have
11:57:08[Saint]gevaerts: ?
11:57:48gevaerts[Saint]: have a look at JdGordon's recent shortcut thing
11:58:20[Saint]Oh, I know about this...but, he's asked for people to look at it and point out regressions.
11:58:37gevaertsOh, sure
11:58:49[Saint]I can't think of any immediately, so I haven't mentioned any (as, i can't think of any)
11:59:16gevaertsThat means pointing out it doesn't do everything the shortcuts plugin does is fine
12:00:04[Saint]What does it not do that the shortcuts plugin does (I rarely used the shortcuts plugin, so I'm in the dark here).
12:00:11gevaertsNo idea :)
12:00:24[Saint](I'm genuinely interested, btw, not trolling you ;))
12:00:40gevaertsBut I *really* don't see why the quickscreen is involved in the discussion. I'm pretty sure that very soon someone will argue that it has to be done differently because of the way album art is rendered or something like that
12:01:29[Saint]AFAIK, the QS is in the discussion as the idea is for this to be able to be launched from the QS.
12:01:53[Saint]"this" == the menu (optional) that goes along with it.
12:02:03gevaertsThat implies that any change to any setting should trigger a QS re-evaluation
12:05:11[Saint]reading your post to the tracker....*one* of us is confused. (probably me)
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12:05:27[Saint]I thought it was to be able to be launched from the QS, not replace it.
12:06:01[Saint]and, launching from the QS I though was optional, as optional as any other QS item.
12:06:59gevaertsI don't mind it being launched from the QS, nor do I mind the reverse. What I do mind is this idea that having some functionality in common implies having to redesign the entirety of the rockbox UI
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12:10:16[Saint]<nitpicking>, fwiw, your statement about the QS being a replacement for the Settings menu wouldn't be true without this patch being committed ;) </nitpicking>
12:10:35gevaertsWhat statement?
12:10:46[Saint]the QS doesn't presently allow for all settings/config options, does it?
12:11:11[Saint]"If your argument is that the functionality overlaps the quickscreen functionality and therefore only one is needed, I could argue that the quickscreen functionality overlaps with the settings menu, so it should be removed. "
12:11:42[Saint]Or, were you implying the QS be removed? I read it as the Settings menu should be removed
12:11:52[Saint](though I know neither would actually be)
12:12:06[Saint]Right, that makes more sense to me now then.
12:12:40gevaertsIt's not just this patch though
12:12:49gevaertsThe sleep timer thing is exactly the same
12:14:06[Saint]For my two cents worth, I personally couldn't care less if this did replace the I see it as being more functional. And its something users have been asking for for a long time.
12:14:40[Saint]And JdGordon shouldn't get the blame for the Sleep timer stuff, if anyone should it should be me.
12:14:54[Saint]I never wanted that discussion to blow up like that.....certainly not.
12:15:44gevaertsAnd I'm sure that if this settings menu reorganisation gets going, someone will point out that some setting somewhere isn't needed or is implemented the wrong way, and that this should be resolved before the reorganisation can be done, so the sleep timer thing has to wait. Then it will turn out that "fixing" this setting means refactoring all audio drivers, which means every single target has to be changed and re-tested, and this is of course also
12:16:29gevaerts... to overhaul wps syntax first
12:16:50[Saint]fwiw, I have NO idea why the sleep timer stuff isn't already in. EVeryone involved had stated it needen't be held up by the menu overhaul.
12:17:09*gevaerts mispasted his correction. Not that it matters much...
12:18:12 Quit JdGordon| (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
12:18:56[Saint]I think personally, that a menu overhaul would be a very nice thing...and a long time coming. DO I think it can happen in a: a reasonable period of time, b: without generating masses of arguments, or c: in a way that will ever please all?
12:19:09[Saint]Sertainly not...hence why I've backed *right* off it.
12:19:35[Saint]Not even Llorean's (perfectly sane) plan to get it going has a high chance of success unfortunately.
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12:20:10[Saint]Ew...yuck. *Certainly
12:23:38JdGordon|ok, really what the heck?
12:24:08[Saint]Such is life when a group of very opinionated, strong minded individuals with differing opinions get together...this would be the main reason why the menu is in such a poor state presently I suppose.
12:24:33[Saint]Its easier to ignore it than it is to get agreement.
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12:27:55JdGordon1what the hell?
12:28:15 Quit JdGordon| (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
12:29:39JdGordon1gevaerts: what on earth are you complaining about?
12:31:28[Saint]For the record, and to Menu Revision, I'm not backing out of this completely. I have started to categorize the menu items as per Llorean's suggested workflow, and I'm more than willing to help when/if it gets going. I'm *not* however, going to push the idea forward any further. I think I've (IMO) caused enough grief about it. And I feel like I'm flogging a dead horse every time I talk about the menus. It only seems to encite a *very long)
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12:32:40JdGordonumm.... either I've misunderstood something, or gevaerts has, or everyone has
12:32:51*JdGordon has no idea what that was all about
12:34:31[Saint]I _think_ gevaerts believed this was to replace the QS..I said I didn't think this to be so, but then I wondered if I'd got it wrong or not.
12:34:47[Saint]Reading your last post about it on the tracker, I don't believe so.
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12:35:41JdGordonI'm wondering if is meant to be read that nothing changes unless there is a discussion first which doesnt sound right either?
12:36:12*JdGordon shall wait for gevaerts to return from lunch
12:36:20gevaerts[Saint]: you're clearly misunderstanding me :)
12:37:11[Saint]At least its not jsut me ;)
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12:38:10gevaertsJdGordon: I think I like what the patch does as-is (provided it does indeed replace the shortcuts plugin properly, but if it doesn't that's just a plain bug to be fixed, not something to be argued about). What I'm complaining about is people seein "quickscreen" somewhere in the discussion and starting an argument about the entire UI again
12:38:42JdGordonOH! ok
12:39:07[Saint]Why didn't you say so! :P
12:39:16gevaertsI did!
12:46:07***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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13:15:25*JdGordon still has on idea what the above was all about though
13:16:11gevaertsJdGordon: I basically object to fml2's latest comment on the patch
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13:31:25pamauryhum, my git svn dcommit is stuck
13:34:32pamauryah it finally works but the bot didn't print it !!
13:37:02*[Saint] kicks CIA-14
13:37:16*[Saint] kicks CIA-14 again for the fun of it
13:37:30[Saint]lazy fucker...
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13:41:01pamaurysvn is damn slow...the website shows my next commit but the command itself takes forever to run on my laptop
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13:56:08gevaertskugel: did you see JdGordon's question/comment about buflib_alloc()'s return value yesterday?
13:56:41kugelJdGordon: "<= 0" is error. the comment should indeed tell that
13:57:43JdGordonno comments i found say waht the return value is
13:58:08JdGordonalso, why is 0 a legal value? most things which return an int <0 is an error... thinking posix and specifically open
13:58:26kugel0 is not legal
13:58:41kugelI think it doesn't actually return 0, but 0 isn't a valid handle
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14:00:03JdGordongoing from memory it does return 0 for obvious errors
14:02:11kugelcould change this to -1, but that doesn't make 0 more valid
14:02:33gevaertsTrue, but -1 is clearer i think
14:04:11JdGordonis there a reason 0 is not valid?
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14:05:20gevaertsI think allowing 0 as a valid handle should be harmless. That doesn't mean the code ever has to return it of course
14:06:29kugelit goes backwards in the handle table (which is at the end)
14:06:55kugeli.e. table[-handle]. 0 is out of bounds there
14:07:23gevaertsOK, but that's an implementation detail
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14:07:44gevaerts1725218 is a valid handle, but you're not likely to ever use it
14:09:18kugelnot allowing 0 also allows to implement measure to catch invalid/unitialized handles (e.g. from bss, or invalidated by core_free)
14:09:53kugelanyway, this is how buflib always worked and not related to my work
14:10:38JdGordonok, doesnt mean it cant be discussed
14:10:42gevaertsWhat I would do is make all error conditions return <0, declare 0 to be formally valid, and always use >1 handles
14:11:23kugelwhy does 0 need to be declared valid?
14:13:24kugel0 is invalid, as expressed by buflib_free()
14:14:00gevaerts"valid" really just means "the caller shouldn't fall over if it gets it", so you're really just saying "Don't complain if we use a different allocation system next year where allowing 0 saves us two lines of code". Anyway, I don't care *too* much about it, as long as 0 isn't a valid *error* either
14:14:13kugelanyway, as the actual number totally doesn't matter it should be enough to say "returns -1 on error, a valid handle otherwise"
14:14:45kugelthen you can check for <0 or -1 easily
14:15:26*gevaerts nods
14:15:40JdGordonthats all I'm asking for
14:16:30gevaertsI'd say "<0". Documenting -1 too much means you then can't use other values later on if you want to make the thing more specific later on, even if it's always -1 now
14:16:36kugelit's the same as <= 0 if you ask me, but if you like open()-symmetry I'm fine
14:16:44*JdGordon does think that table[-handle] is insaly bad also
14:16:58kugelit isnt
14:17:44kugelgevaerts: errno :P
14:18:36kugelJdGordon asked for open()-symmetry which is documented to return -1 on error
14:18:45kugellike many other functions
14:19:13JdGordonhow is it not? I'm surprised it is actually lega;l
14:19:18*kugel really doesn't care, as long as 0 doesn't get valid
14:19:52gevaertsok, although errno and multithreaded code don't always play nice
14:20:08kugelJdGordon: it's the same as *(table - handle)
14:20:16B4gders/don't always play nice/lead to awful hacks
14:21:09JdGordonwtf? seriously?
14:21:09kugelI thought errno in multithreaded enviroments is a solved issue (except in our env)?
14:21:24kugelnote: I wasnt actually serious about errno
14:21:26B4gderkugel: it is, somewhat, on the proper operating systems and compilers
14:21:38B4gder== what I consider a hack
14:22:08JdGordon*(table- handle) does indeed work when handle is 0 and is far more understandbale than hantable[-handle]
14:22:23*JdGordon thougt it was table[end-handle] like python/perl does
14:22:44kugelthat's what it is
14:22:51kugelno wait, it isn't :)
14:23:50JdGordonI think i remember the discussion about why its backwards indexing, but table[-handle] is just scary and really shld be replaced, especially when the generated code wont change significantly
14:24:07JdGordonor am i the only one that tihnks that?
14:24:20kugelI find both equally scary
14:24:40gevaertsI think it doesn't matter much if it's *isolated* and the API doesn't depend on it
14:24:44kugelbut table[-handle] at least shows more clearly that it's indexing
14:24:46gevaertsWhich I think is OK now
14:25:26JdGordonkugel: right, but languages with support for that do different tihngs to what you're saying it is doing
14:26:01*JdGordon is thinking about the next person to touch this code
14:26:35kugelwell, it's semantally table[end-handle], except that table is pointing to the end, not the start.
14:27:30JdGordonno its not
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14:28:48kugelif you're imagining table pointed to the start it's like table[end-handle]
14:30:28*pamaury thinks tables[-handle] is ok, it's an implementation detail and easily understandable
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14:35:47jonnomy net keeps dropping out :/
14:35:49jonnokugel: you've said contradictory things
14:36:07jonno14:20kugelJdGordon: it's the same as *(table - handle)
14:36:38jonno14:28kugelif you're imagining table pointed to the start it's like table[end-handle]
14:37:33pamauryno that's consistent
14:38:57jonnothe first has the address being < table, the second is > table
14:40:02jonnoI've dropped out again havnt i?
14:40:44kugelread the second one again
14:42:04jonnoend is what?
14:43:30*jonno has been assuming end is len-1(+/-1)
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14:45:18jonnook, so how are they possibly the same?
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14:46:14kugelin the second you need imagine table pointed to the start
14:48:28jonnowhere else would table point to?
14:49:24kugelthe end
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14:50:42jonno$ ./a.out
14:50:45jonnotable: 601040, table[-3]: 601034, (table-3):601034
14:51:49jonnoguess who's insanely confused
14:52:42kugelthat program is broken :)
14:53:16*gevaerts is confused
14:53:28gevaertsWhat was that supposed to demonstrate?
14:58:43jonnoit was *supposed* to show that they are not the same
14:58:51pamauryjonno: in our code, we have a buffer of which we use, say, range [0,N[, and we table which points at the *end*, so table = buffer + N. Thus table[-1] is the last used position. Since negative offset are confusing, an equivalent way of seing it is to say that table = buffer and then table[-1] becomes table[N-1]
14:59:04pamaury*we have
15:00:46jonnomy point is still valid... in languages where negative indexing isnt a hack, -1 is 1 less than the last element
15:01:04pamauryhehe, I have bootloader usb working and now even linux is confused by the strange partition layout of the fuze+ :)
15:01:15kugelit's the last element in the languages I know
15:01:16Tornejonno: to be fair, having -1 be the last element is the trick
15:01:28Tornehaving it be the one before the zeroth element is the natural behaviour of the underlying implementation
15:01:37pamauryjonno: that's the reverse in my opinion, -1 being the last is just horrible
15:01:56gevaertspamaury: what does the partition table look like?
15:02:07TorneYou don't see it a lot in C because somearray[-1] is generally not actually valid C
15:02:16Torne(people do it anyway because they are bad bad people, but hey)
15:02:18Tornebut in this case it is
15:03:02jonnopamaury: depends if you're used to python or not
15:03:29Torneit doesn't matter if you are used to python.. having negative indexes be indexing from the back is a *trick*
15:03:33Torneit's useful and nice
15:03:44kugelwhat does "-1 is 1 less than the last element" actually mean?
15:03:48Tornebut it's not intuitive or trivial with respect to the implementation
15:03:52pamaurythe partition table itself is find, but iirc the main partition table uses a logical sector size != 512 and has one logical partitition of which the logical sector size is different from the previous one and also != 512
15:03:57kugelthe element before, or the element-1?
15:04:13pamauryeveryone will get confused in a minute ^^
15:04:49jonnowhere in the actual code is this?
15:06:31pamaurygevaerts: ah no I remember now, the partition table is *not* fine since the logical partition is of type 1 so linux thinks it's a fat partition :-/
15:06:50gevaertsDoes linux care about partition types?
15:07:12pamauryI guess so
15:07:12Tornegenerally no
15:07:20pamaurybecause it tries to mount it as fat
15:07:22Tornethe kernel does not care about them at all, other than type 0
15:07:39Torneand udisks/hal/etc afaik all just do superblock detection the same way mount does
15:07:43gevaertsDon't use automounters, and you'll have fewer problems :)
15:08:07pamauryit's actually a logical partition but the kernel doesn't report it as such
15:08:48gevaertsAh, right
15:09:19pamaurynice kernel messages:
15:09:20pamaury[57334.613630] sd 11:0:0:0: [sdb] Assuming drive cache: write through
15:09:21pamaury[57334.618675] sdb: sdb1 sdb2 sdb3 sdb4
15:09:21DBUGEnqueued KICK pamaury
15:09:21pamaury[57334.618686] sdb: p1 size 15406080 extends beyond EOD, enabling native capacity
15:09:21pamaury[57334.624644] sd 11:0:0:0: [sdb] Assuming drive cache: write through
15:09:21***Alert Mode level 1
15:09:21pamaury[57334.626642] sdb: sdb1 sdb2 sdb3 sdb4
15:09:23pamaury[57334.626652] sdb: p1 size 15406080 extends beyond EOD, truncated
15:10:06CtcpIgnored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
15:10:06*gevaerts saw errors just like that only a few days ago!
15:10:12gevaertsMy partitioning code was broken :)
15:10:38pamauryactually I don't see any problem with the partition, all partitions are *within* the disk !
15:11:01gevaertsAre you exposing the correct block size?
15:11:38pamauryI'm not doing anything in particular
15:12:54pamaurythe thing is that except in recovery mode, I don't want to use the first partitition table so I restrict the disk to the logical partition which contains the actual filesystem. But in this logical partition, the logical sector size is != 512 and apparently the kernel gets confused so perhaps I have to do something ?
15:13:58pamaurygevaerts: UMS has to report the logical sector size ?
15:14:17gevaertsIt reports the disk sector size
15:14:39gevaertsI have no idea how FAT logical sector sizes work
15:15:22pamauryif I'm no saying crap, the logical sector size stuff is just there for the partition layout, the FAT uses 512 sector size (and cluster size)
15:16:02pamauryanyway Rockbox mounts it so Linux must be the one doing bad things(TM)
15:19:22***Alert Mode OFF
15:22:47pamaurymy mistake, the fat uses 2048 bytes per sector
15:23:15pamaurybut it doesn't matter because linux doesn't find the fat since it assumes a 512 logical sector size :)
15:24:41gevaertsAre you using a partition table in that case?
15:26:06pamauryyes, there is a partition table
15:26:53gevaertsWhat sector size does the partition table assume?
15:28:47pamaurywait a minute, I will pastebin the thing, you'll see
15:34:48pamaurythe first partition uses a logical sector size of 512 and the second one 2048, but that's not written anywhere of course
15:38:44gevaertsDoes the OF do MSC?
15:39:01pamauryyes iirc
15:39:12gevaertsAny idea what it exposes?
15:39:36pamaurynope because I replaced the bootloader with mine and I'm unsure of how exactly to put it back :)
15:39:53pamaury(although I can try until I succeed)
15:40:15pamaurybut that's a nice idea, I'll try to put the OF back see what it exposes
15:40:44gevaertsWhat are you exposing now? The entire thing, or just the logical partition with its extended MBR?
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15:41:23pamauryI can choose
15:41:28pamaurynone works correctly
15:42:04gevaertsIf the latter, try setting block_size_mult to 4 in usb_storage.c
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15:43:35pamauryI just found the dmesg output in the forum:
15:43:36pamaury[ 1483.279931] sd 8:0:0:0: [sdb] 7748864 2048-byte logical blocks: (15.8 GB/14.7 GiB)
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15:44:14gevaertsI wonder how rockbox manages to mount this
15:44:28pamaurybecause we have support for unknown logical sector size
15:44:45pamauryour code tries all logical sector sizes until it mounts :)
15:45:03gevaertsYes, but based on which MBR?
15:45:13pamauryonly the logical partition
15:45:31pamaury(the extended partition)
15:47:07gevaertsWhat blocksize does storage_get_info() report? 512?
15:47:53gevaertsIf so, you should define MAX_LOG_SECTOR_SIZE to 2048 or 4096
15:48:29pamauryyes it reports 512. I already define MAX_LOG_SECTOR_SIZE
15:48:38pamauryotherwise it wouldn't mount
15:48:48pamaurythe problem is only with usb
15:48:53gevaertsOK, so then the mount code should have set disk_sector_multiplier properly
15:49:13gevaertsIn which case usb should report 2048 byte sectors to the host
15:50:17pamauryweird, disk_sector_multiplier=1 :-/
15:50:57pamauryahhhhhhhhhh, I know why
15:51:58JdGordondo we have a md5sum equiviant in firmware/?
15:52:21wodza function/plugin/or what?
15:52:37JdGordona function
15:52:40JdGordonin core
15:52:52pamauryit works \o/
15:52:57wodzdon't think so - test_codec should have one
15:53:08JdGordonwodz: have you seen fs#12251
15:53:09fs-bluebot user shortcuts in the main menu (patches, new)
15:53:19gevaertspamaury: I'm curious. What was the problem?
15:57:07pamauryI would go into usb more before trying to mount the partition, so the logical sector size was no determined yet
15:58:06gevaertsOh, right
15:59:34gevaertsFor this case I think it would be better to drop the guessing and add a "translation layer" between something that provides 2048 byte sectors starting at the right offset and the actual storage driver (which still uses 512 byte sectors)
15:59:57pamauryI'm not sure
16:00:05gevaertsThe guessing was added for the ipod video, where the same build has to be usable on both 512 byte and 2048 byte systems.
16:00:28gevaertsUsing MAX_LOG_SECTOR_SIZE is also likely to slow IO down a bit I suspect, although I'm not sure
16:00:38pamaurywhy ?
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16:01:25gevaertshm, I'm not sure how it works now... amiconn?
16:01:51pamaurythe logical sector size is really only useful when reading the mbr
16:02:30pamaurysince the storage has 512 sector size I see no reason to add a translation layer
16:02:36gevaertshm, doesn't SD (is this SD?) really work with 512 byte sectors anyway?
16:02:46gevaertsDon't they use 32 bytes natively or something?
16:03:00pamauryit has a MMC interface so it's 512 byte per sector
16:03:07pamaury(at high speed)
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16:55:16*[Saint] thinks,28788.msg184391.html#msg184391 is a damn fine idea...
16:56:06jamer123i have a question for you
16:56:10[Saint]Not that we need more settings, but a "Mount sdcard first if found" setting would be a fine idea for players where the sdcard is (potentially) much larger than the internal memory.
16:56:19[Saint]jamer123: Ask it, then ;)
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16:56:49jamer123is the rca lyra supported
16:57:20[Saint]No, only the players listed on are supported.
16:57:37amiconngevaerts: Logical sector size >512 bytes doesn't slow down anything.
16:57:48jamer123ok thank you
16:58:11amiconnWhen reading the mbr it does some guessing to find out the size being used. The value is also needed to interpet the bpb correctly
16:58:17gevaertsamiconn: ok. I think I was confusing logical sector size and the ipod 1K block workaround
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16:58:40amiconnThat's physical sector size + broken drive firmware
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16:59:28amiconnUnfortunately I don't know of a sane alternative to guessing. The mbr doesn't hold the logical sector size being used
17:00:24amiconnMAX_LOG_SECTOR_SIZE can be increased if desired; it has no negative impact apart from slightly longer guessing at boot
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17:37:13bluebroth3r[Saint]: poing
17:37:29bluebroth3rwasn't aware the scrollbar is draggable :)
17:37:39[Saint]Aha! ;)
17:37:47bluebroth3rbut it's quite usable even with 10px scrollbar. At least for me ;-)
17:38:08[Saint]Oh? That's...odd. I suspect some touchscreens are...well, shit.
17:38:24[Saint]Mine is also usable with very low res sliders, but, others not.
17:39:15[Saint]Some people could not launch the tabs on the "old style" theme for instance, when they were proportianately 3 times larger than they were on my 240x320 screen.
17:39:44bluebroth3rwell, I guess there is no easy solution for that then.
17:39:54[Saint]I addressed a few of your question onthe theme thread in the tracker.
17:40:04[Saint](in case you want to keep conversation there)
17:41:19bluebroth3rok, just read them
17:42:07bluebroth3rI'll be afk soon tonight. Will catch up on it later.
17:43:07[Saint]what would people think about the "play" button on the .wps launching thw .wps *if* playback was already commenced?
17:43:21[Saint]I _think_ this is possible, but non-trivial.
17:43:26bluebroth3rbtw, I was trying to move the plugins from to real android libs. Works for me so far but it's quite hackish right now (and I had to trick the build system to get the desired output)
17:43:50[Saint]"play button on the .sbs launching the .wps, if playback has commenced"
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17:43:54bluebroth3rhmm, not sure. Then you didn't have a button to pause, and it might be confusing that the button has different meanings depending on where you are
17:44:11[Saint]you could stil pause with it.
17:45:00[Saint]it would only (in theory) go to the .wps if playback was started. playback could still be started from the .sbs, but a second tap could kick you into the .wps
17:45:16[Saint]..just a thought I had.
17:46:48[Saint]a "long press" in the .sbs would still pause. they're seperate actions.
17:47:01bluebroth3ryeah, but it would change meanings which is usually a bad idea imo
17:48:03[Saint]Yeah...I know. I'm stuck for options really. without seriously fucking up the symmetry of the theme, or re-doing the bottom icons (which no-one wants to be any smaller than they are already)
17:48:39[Saint]I could boot "context_menu" off "long press" of the titlebar.
17:49:19[Saint]individual items in the lists would still call their context menus with long press.
17:49:47[Saint]Hmmm...yes, this seems sane.
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17:51:28bluebroth3rsorry, gtg now.
17:51:44[Saint]No problem, I'm more talking out loud anyway ;)
17:55:39[Saint]its quickscreen..not contextmenu (it was actually contextmenu in 480x800, but this was in error).
17:55:53[Saint]we *need* quickscreen.
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20:04:26TheLemonManpamaury: ping
20:06:04TheLemonManwhere should i look for a flowchart of usb init on imx23 ?
20:08:02pamaurydepends on what you call usb init :)
20:08:39TheLemonManfrom clock gating onwards
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20:11:01pamaurythe imx233 manual has a flowchart for a few trivial things. Basically you enable usb pll, enable usbphy clocks, gate on usb block and then you need to do all the controller related stuff (which is not included in the manual)
20:11:47TheLemonManhrm, yeah saw that flowchart in the manual, but im a noob when it comes to usb controllers
20:11:55pamauryyou can also have a look at our code, since it contains everything except the usbphy and pll stuff and which works if you use recovery mode to enable it
20:12:23TheLemonManoh, right, the recovery mode leaves the usb connected
20:12:44pamaurywhat do you want to do ?
20:13:21TheLemonManwrite the usb driver for my mp3 player, which is based on smtp3700
20:13:41pamaurythis is the same as in imx233 ?
20:14:04TheLemonMannot really, there are many registers silghtly changes
20:14:31CIA-14New commit by bertrik (r30435): sansa clipzip: implement default dualboot code (boots to OF unconditionally for now)
20:15:27pamaurybecause the imx233 uses the arc driver which is not fully documented in the manual and except for the imx233 specific it's probably either the same or a completely different one
20:16:31pamauryyou have the register define iirc, right ?
20:16:55TheLemonManyup, i also have the source of their linux firmware
20:17:03TheLemonManbut it's really really messy
20:17:22CIA-14r30435 build result: All green
20:18:07pamauryyou say there are a few changes, for which registers ?
20:18:31TheLemonManmany, i lost the list i had in a hard disk crash
20:19:01TheLemonManif you remember we talked a lot about this some months ago
20:19:08TheLemonManaround ~june
20:19:27pamaurynot for the usb part iirc
20:19:50TheLemonManoh, i hadnt started looking into that
20:20:34 Join mudd1 [0] (
20:21:52pamaurybasically there are two different things for usb: the phy and the controller. The phy part is stmp specific so there might be changes between imx233 and stmp3700 and you probably need to have a look at the code you have. The controller part is probably not stmp specific and you can reuse any driver for this controller (but you need to check that the register match of course)
20:22:25pamauryif you start out of recovery mode, you can skip the phy init part for now, so you're left with the controller one
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20:26:38TheLemonMangood, wheres the usb core for imx23 in rockbox tree ?
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20:29:14pamaurythe usb is split into several parts. The usb driver in firmware/target/arm/usb-drv-arc.c, the usb stack in firmware/usbstack/, there is some glue stuff in firmware/usb.c and the imx233 usb detect stuff in split in firmware/target/arm/imx233/{usb-imx233.c,power-imx233.c} which needs to irq setup
20:29:56pamauryare you writing you own system or porting rockbox ?
20:32:42CIA-14New commit by pamaury (r30436): imx233/fuze+: fix apps linker script, add comment in bootloader
20:34:52CIA-14r30436 build result: 1 errors, 1 warnings (pamaury committed)
20:35:30pamaurythe famous set but not used error :)
20:35:53bertrikyes, very annoying
20:36:14wodzwe commit to little definitely if this one still appears :-)
20:42:04gevaertswodz: feel free to fix it :)
20:42:06 Quit sideral (Remote host closed the connection)
20:42:42TheLemonManpamaury: im writing my own system atm, at least until i have nand working
20:42:47bertrikCan we enable this warning somehow on older compilers?
20:45:37n1swodz: that code is the stuff of nightmares
20:46:14***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
20:46:35n1sthe reporting is not good, there is no actual error, just a warning
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20:53:28amiconnThe build colouring script definitely needs fixing. It's been broken for quite some time now :\
20:56:43bluebrotherhmm, I had some proposed changes to that in a pastebin some time back
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20:58:25*bluebrother found it:
20:58:42bluebrotherany thoughs? Should that be sufficient?
21:02:15bertrikperhaps silly, but can't we catch stderr output (assuming warnings and errors go there)?
21:03:22bluebrotheraren't we doing that? The problem is that warning spawning multiple lines, and the regexp catches the first as error
21:03:34amiconnIs that even the correct script?
21:04:00amiconnI can't find any script that looks like it is doing the actual colouring; just counts
21:04:22 Join Buschel [0] (
21:05:32bluebrotheras far as I understand that script it puts the numbers into a database. So not writing a false positive to the db seems like a good idea to me ;-)
21:05:49amiconnYeah, but it won't fix the colouring
21:06:09amiconnThe latter already disagrees from the count - just check the latest few reds creates some html
21:06:51Buschelgevaerts: will you still hand out a beer for fixing the bmp.c warning?
21:06:58amiconnColouring doesn't mark 'Build failure', nor does it handle include chains properly (see r30424)
21:08:46*amiconn thinks those two scripts should probably share some code, but still can't find the colouring script seems to be responsible for the table
21:09:57*amiconn has the suspicion that not all scripts are in svn
21:11:47gevaertsBuschel: of course!
21:12:00*bluebrother summons Bagder
21:12:16Buschelwhat do you think of this :o) ->
21:19:16amiconndirrrty (imo)
21:20:36*Buschel is just hunting for a beer :)
21:22:57amiconnWhy not fix it the proper way, i.e. don't set it if it's not used?
21:23:01 Quit TheLemonMan (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.5)
21:24:36Buschelamiconn: you didn't take this patch seriously, hopefully...
21:27:07*bluebrother has filesystem errors on the SD card _again_?
21:29:10gevaertsBuschel: beers are only available for committed solutions that *stay* committed :)
21:29:37 Quit JesusFreak316 (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
21:29:59Buschelgevaerts: you are changing the rules!
21:30:19Buschel(or at least refining them)
21:31:34*bluebrother curses FAT
21:39:10*pamaury still needs the pcm drivers for the fuze+ and doesn't want to :)
21:39:18pamaury*to write them
21:43:57akaWolfpamaury: clip+ better)
21:45:41akaWolfor simple fuze
21:47:44pamaurywhat ?
21:50:38wodzha, I spoted the couse of prolonged delay between selecting the track and start of the playback. audiohw_postinit() needs huge 3s delay (to charge output caps?). Any Idea how to deal with this?
21:51:15wodzthis is for rk27xx of course
21:51:29bertrikeh, just don't wait 3s? :P
21:51:37saratogathat seems unreasonably long
21:52:57wodzbertrik: If I wait in audiohw_postinit() there is 3s delay between selecting track and start of the playback
21:53:18wodzI guess this is just for the first track but still rather irritating
21:53:23saratogaand thats just waiting for the dac to say its ready?
21:54:22bertrikI guess nothing really bad happens if you don't wait, maybe a pop
21:54:42wodzsaratoga: this is delay between enabling output stage and setting some gpio which is somehow related to hadphone output
21:55:00wodzbertrik: I tried - there is no sound simply
21:55:22saratogadoes the sound eventually start or just never play?
21:56:17wodzit start after few seconds
21:56:50pamauryis it faster than waiting for the 3s ?
21:57:22wodzno, 3s is experimental value :-)
21:57:42saratogacaps in stuff like this are really small, they should charge up very quickly
21:57:54saratogaperhaps some voltage regulator or charge pump isn't enabled?
21:58:17wodzOF do this tricks early and assumes no one select playback fast enough to see the oddity
21:59:19 Quit akaWolf (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
21:59:42saratogaheh, sounds like they had some errata to work around
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22:34:12bluebrother[Saint]: bluebrother/rockbox/device-2011-09-05-222915.png"> :)
22:35:52bluebrotherwould it be possible to link libcodec dynamically on Android?
22:37:27 Join lorenzo92 [0] (
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22:38:43pamaurywhat is system_memory_guard supposed to do ?
22:42:53wodzpamaury: it is SH and CF specific
22:43:15wodzthis is "poor's men mmu" thing
22:44:16wodzon cf you can setup mem bounds which are checked on every access and irq is fired if the request is not within defined bounds
22:46:16***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
22:47:22pamauryok, that's really poor :)
22:49:14wodzat least on cf this is part of debug module :-)
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23:18:50[Saint]bluebrother; 404
23:19:10[Saint]put it up on imgur (or similar) please?
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23:58:57mystica555_[Saint]: try bluebrother/device-2011-09-05-222915.png">

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