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#rockbox log for 2013-01-08

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02:33:42 Quit prof_wolfff (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
03:05:28amayerso im trying to just compile a binary for my ipod classic. when i run make and it checks for dependecies it gets addons, images, codecs and a bunch of stuff that i dont think actually goes in the binary. is there a way to "make" for just the binary
03:08:54JdGordonmake bin
03:10:13amayerso if i run "make bin; make zip" it will just output with only a bin?
03:10:26amayerthat seems way simpler then the answer i was expecting
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04:24:16amayer[Saint]: are you free to try some code?
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04:39:11amayerif i was going to change the way a slider behaved should i add a tag to enable this behavior or should i just make the change to the code?
04:39:13amayerthe thing i would like to do is make the slider stay inbounds of the progress bar backdrop without shrinking the backdrop or progress bar
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05:27:32JdGordonamayer: probably the best thing would be to deprecate the currnet bar tags and add new ones which are easier to use
05:34:57amayerJdGordon: the tag now is "slider"
05:35:12amayercould i just add something like "ibslider"
05:38:22JdGordonno, i mean completly redo the %pb() tag
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05:57:42amayercan i have my rockbox directory linked to gerrit and github so i can push/pull from both?
05:57:59amayer(not at the same time, im not into the kinky stuff)
05:58:16JdGordonwho's github?
05:58:25JdGordonthe histories will not be the same
05:58:27JdGordonso, no
05:58:37amayeri would like to make a github
05:58:45amayergithub account
05:59:25amayerhmm... so i would need to manage 2 rockbox directories in order to post changes to github to work on with other people?
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07:42:52zambonilook at this cutie
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07:51:40JdGordon /sb end
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14:29:39amayer_can someone merge this?
14:30:16Torneamayer_: presumably scorche will do it when he updates the site?
14:31:15amayer_scorche said someone else must approve. it is live on the site right now(has been for a day or two)
14:31:23Torneright, but i already approved it
14:31:38Tornedone, anyway
14:31:38amayer_soo... how do i merge it then?
14:31:58Tornethe submit button is only turned on for committers, currently
14:32:23Tornesorry this took so long to get done
14:32:35Tornebut, we really don't habe mcuh php knowledge between us all :)
14:35:33amayer_I understand that. this is a C based project(rockbox). which is why I try to help with the themesite(I know more about php then C)
14:36:13amayer_I have some great ideas i would like to implement in rockbox. but there were some things with the themesite i would like to have fixed first.
14:37:16amayer_Torne: speaking of things to fix. you commented on the private captcha key thing. what is that? should that not be public knowledge?
14:40:48Tornethe clue is in the name :)
14:40:59Torneprivate keys are not generally supposed to be public knowledge, no ;) there a way we can take it out of the GIT repo easaly?
14:41:57amayer_or how should we handle it?
14:42:07Tornein this case i think the result is that someone can take our private key and use it to access the recaptcha api under our account, which would include, say, issuing a very large number of queries so that our account gets disabled for abuse
14:42:16Torneor similar
14:43:39Tornethe right thing to do would be to get a new API key and not check it into git (just keep it in a local file on the server)
14:43:46Torneand delete the old key
14:43:52Torneit's not super important
14:44:06Torne(in this particular instance)
14:44:27Tornebut in general disclosing your keys to use other people's APIs is a very bad idea as it may let people exploit you, or destroy your data, or similar :)
14:45:28bebnahow about using gitignore to hide a file A and a post clone hook to generate file A by generating new api key?
14:45:55Tornethe API key has to be created manually
14:46:01Torneit only needs to be done once per domain
14:46:07Torneas long as you don't accidentally publish it :)
14:46:33Tornebut, yes, the normal way is to have something like or similar which is .gitignore'd
14:46:42 Join dfkt [0] (dfkt@unaffiliated/dfkt)
14:46:45Torneand then maybe a template file for it checked in as
14:46:51Tornewhich can be copied and edited by the site admin on install
14:46:54bebnaahh, i thought u generate this api keys on per user basis per script
14:47:02Torneno, there is just one key for the website
14:47:20Torneit's the key to authenticate our site to the recaptcha server
14:47:36Tornegenerally webapps have more than one secret
14:47:53Torneso, you normally end up with something like this anyway
14:48:08Tornee.g. XSRF-prevention keys, or HMAC cookie signing keys
14:48:46bebnawe use special repos for that
14:49:01bebnaand "export" the secret file on deploy
14:49:21Torneright, but we don't need to do anything so complicated
14:50:02Torneif you're using a key for encrypted storage, or for something that needs to be shared across servers, it's worth checking it in somewhere private for safety
14:50:07Tornebut this can just be regenerated if it's lost
14:50:31bebnayeah, I simply misread you and thought your hiding something like a oauth key from your web-app
14:51:32bebnalike in, oauth key from you generated
14:53:06bebnadid somone ever use from you guys have used the -S flag of git commit?
14:53:35Tornewe don't use signed-off-by, no
14:54:50bebnai thought one time about using it to sign the release tag, but it seams to be overkill anyway
14:55:05Torneoh, you mean git tag -S
14:55:10Tornecommits are not signed in git
14:55:29Tornesigned-off-by means something different (that someone approves of this commit, used by the linux kernel primarily to address copyright)
14:55:55Tornewe don't distribute any of our binaries signed either, so there's not really much point in signing the release tags
14:56:08funmanwe use -s in an inconsistent way i think
14:56:10Torneand we don't have any keyring infrastructure for anyone to have real confidence that the key used is correc
14:56:31funmanalso security is not a concern at all for rockbox code
14:56:41funmanthis is explicited somewhere on the wiki i think
14:57:01*Torne shrugs
14:57:05Torneit just hasn't come up as something anyone cares about
14:57:19Tornewe could distribute signed artifacts, but there's not a lot of reason to bother.
14:57:23funmanwell there's an 'official' statement that we don't care
14:57:41Torneand it just makes releases more complicated and fiddly
14:57:50funmanit might change since we run on android & al though
14:58:05TorneWell, we have yet to actually solve the problem of signing android builds
14:58:16Tornecurrently people sign their own with keys that their SDKs generated for them
14:58:28funmanno i meant something else
14:58:41funmannobody's gonna gain root access to my sansa clip against my will
14:58:55funmanbut if someone gains access to my phone because i run rockbox on it it's a different story
14:59:05Tornei don't think that's a real concern either
14:59:16Torneandroid's security model makes this considerably less likely
14:59:31bebna"I hacked your mp3 player!" XD
14:59:33Torneand if you are concerned about this in relation to rockbox, i'd be more concerned about it in relation to other apps you have installed hat are far bigger targets
14:59:48funmantrue but it should still be kept in mind anyway
14:59:58funmanandroid is not a permission for buffer overflows
15:00:25funmananyway i can't find that statement that we didn't care about programming securely
15:00:27bebnano, I saw last night this flag after I misspelled −−amend
15:00:40bebnaand was asking if anyone was using it
15:01:59Tornebebna: you are confusing differnet things, i think
15:02:04Tornecommits are not signed
15:02:13Tornethere is an option -s (lowercase) to git commit, which is nothing to do with signing
15:02:30Torneit just adds a textual line "Signed-Off-By: Your Name <your@email>"
15:02:34Torneto the commit message.
15:02:42Tornewhich some projects use for review or IP management purposes
15:02:44Tornebut we don't use
15:03:08Tornegit tag -s creates a signed tag, which is different :)
15:04:13Tornewe also don't use that
15:04:31wodzI wonder if anyone tried building our codebase with clang?
15:04:31Torne(our release tags are annotated tags, but not signed)
15:07:03Zagorwodz: clang still has no cross-compile support, does it?
15:07:36Zagorstill might be interesting to do an sdl build, of course
15:09:02wodzZagor: clang is cross-compiler by design. The thing is that integrated assembler is lacking.
15:09:09bebnaTorne: hmm, I swear I read yesterday something with pgp in git commit. But I can't find it on this machine. I don't think I used git tag yesterday. I probably should stop commiting that late in the night anyways....
15:09:27Zagorwodz: I know it is. but last I checked it still didn't support it...
15:09:52wodzZagor: What you mean?
15:11:00wodzclang compiles sim main binary (with tons of warrnings), building codecs fails.
15:12:22wodzclang 3.0 that is
15:17:15wodzZagor: the bug is about undocumented/weird/whatever interface to this. -ccc-host-triple, -ccc-gcc-name and so on
15:17:50wodzIt is possible to cross compile with clang but you need to guess magic set of params
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15:32:16Tornebebna: not signing commits is a deliberate choice in git's design, it's too expensive to bother to verify them
15:33:19bebnaTorne: yeah like I said, it looked like overkill
15:34:29bebnaTorne: and if really would need it, I also could sign a specific file from the repo
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19:29:32dynion[saint]... you were apple classic fanboy right?
19:32:42copper<−−- iPod Classic fanboi #2
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19:34:45dynioncopper... you might be able to help me as well, in that case...
19:35:01copperwhat's your question?
19:35:07dynionhow can you run rockbox on ipod classic, while it is not officially supported
19:35:12dynionor better
19:35:17dynioni do understand how you run it
19:35:21dynionbut is it any stable?
19:35:41dynionand is it installable with the normal installer, or do i have to do it manually
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19:36:24copperyou must install emCORE, a bootloader
19:36:36copperthen install
19:36:53copperthe installer doesn't work on the Classic
19:36:53dynionand will it run stable, after that?
19:37:19copperrockbox runs well on the Classic, save for USB transfers that can freeze or crash
19:37:30dynionand a lot of classics break down, is this because of faulty software or the hdd?
19:37:43copperI don't know that lots of Classic break
19:38:01coppersoftware would not be at fault though
19:38:05dynionand last but not least... on which versions of the classic does it run?
19:38:10copperat worst, you can reformat and restore either firmware
19:38:22dynionbecause there are a lot, and i dont know how to determine which i have to do wit
19:38:26copperthe classic is the model from 2009 and beyond
19:38:57copperformer iPods aren't called "Classic", but "Video", "Photo" and "3rd gen" etc…
19:39:51dynionwhat are the pro's of upgrading it with an ssd?
19:40:04dynionexcept for the reduced weight and power consumption off course
19:40:05copperinstant file access (no lag)
19:40:14dyniondoes it lag a lot otherwise?
19:40:25copperdepends on filesize, from what I can tell
19:40:36copperwith lossy codecs, it's acceptable IMO
19:40:45dynionand with FLAC only?
19:40:50copperslightly annoying with full-on FLAC
19:40:57copperyou can compromise with LossyFLAC
19:41:16dynioni think 7mb a song is lossy flac?
19:41:29copperfilesize alone doesn't tell me anything
19:41:38dynionwhat does?
19:42:09copperthis for instance
19:42:19copperbut you likely don't have lossyflacs
19:42:37copperit's too confidential
19:43:16coppermy lossyFLACs average at 440 kbps
19:43:25copperthey're half the size of the original flacs
19:43:38copperyet they're transparent, with no chance of any artifacts
19:43:49copperI love the concept :)
19:43:58dynioni like flac too
19:44:08dynionit's easy... and foobar runs it in a great way
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19:44:44dynionany ipod classic
19:44:49dynionsemi-easy install
19:44:55dynionmight be laggy
19:44:57copperare you sure you have a Classic?
19:45:01dynionruns great quality audio
19:45:04copperthe former iPods are supported by the installer
19:45:07dynioni still have to buy one
19:45:12copperoh, ok
19:45:27dynioni've got a sony nwz-a828 now
19:45:44dynionbut as i hear everyone, a rockbox player is way, way better
19:45:46copperI highly recommend lossyFLAC if your collection is bigger than 160 GB and if you absolutely don't want to use regular lossy codecs
19:46:13dynionit's 90 gb right now
19:46:18dynion90% mp3
19:46:22dynion10% flac
19:46:35dynionthat's ecause my mp3 player doesn't use flac
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19:47:58coppernote that you can't have both the original firmware and rockbox on the Classic, it's either one or the other
19:48:06copperbut you can revert to either whenever you want
19:48:45dyniondont worry about that
19:48:48dynioni despise apple
19:48:55dynioni would love to see apple go down
19:49:01dynionit should be a holidy
19:49:02copperdon't buy an iPod then ;)
19:49:09AlexPNot the place for it here wither
19:49:10scorche|shgetting a bit offtopic now...
19:49:36dynionwell actually i do want an ipod, just to put rockbox on it, and have a great player, while it is not an apple
19:49:40dynionand laught at everyone
19:50:04dynion2 very big pro's i would say
19:50:14copperpeople will watch your iPod in horror and shout "nooooo, what did you do to your iPod???!"
19:50:32dynionuhu, and i will say i have improved it to a very decent player
19:50:46dynionas, dont quote me in this case, their build quality is excellent
19:51:04dynionbut second hand their prices of mp3 players are quite low
19:51:11copperI dropped mine on concrete, it survived
19:51:13dynionand the build quality remains good
19:51:24 Quit dynion (Quit: CGI:IRC)
19:51:27scorche|sh#rockbox-community is over there −−−−−−->
19:51:33 Join dynion [0] (
19:51:41scorche|sh#rockbox-community is over there −−−−−−->
19:51:42dyniongod i hate this internet irc client...
19:51:59dynionwhy is it off topic... it's about the quality of a player...
19:52:04dynionanyway, i will go there then
19:52:31scorche|shdynion: this channel isnt for discussion quality of a player - it is for discussing Rockbox
19:53:35dynionah ok... i missed that... i thought about how rockbox changes players and the quality it gives the players
19:53:42dynionthank for the correction
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20:23:44TheSevenfyi, I've heard of like 10 cases of failing ipod hard drives so far
20:24:14copperthat's not very encouraging
20:24:16TheSevenit turned out that in most cases people had installed rockbox because the apple firmware had started acting up
20:24:37TheSevenso these drives apparently aren't the most reliable, but software can't really do anything to break them
20:25:16copperwell, I've had filesystem corruption after Rockbox crashed during a USB transfer
20:25:19TheSeveni have one of those buggers myself (even though that already arrived in that broken condition, I got it as a donation because of that)
20:25:41TheSeventhat can happen, but wouldn't lead to the kind of physical hdd problems that I was referring to
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21:01:59wodzTrying to build sim or sdlapp on x86 with clang it fails with this:
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21:27:57 Quit Rower85 (Quit: Hmmm...)
21:28:17n1swodz: are the other filters ok?
21:38:13n1sperhaps it's the add that's only used for the highest order that's the problem, i'm not that good at x86 asm though
21:39:35wodzn1s: thats the first it chokes on
21:48:54 Quit krabador (Read error: Operation timed out)
21:58:29n1swodz: ah i think i see it, the "Matching digit constraints" used for the inputs match v1 with res and v2 with t and res and t are ints while v1 and v2 are int16_t*
22:02:08wodzthats how I understood this error, yes
22:02:25n1sseems like a compiler bug to me but as i said i'm not too good at x86 asm
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22:03:26wodzCompiling with clang for arm hits known bug of unresolved references to __eabi_* mem functions.
22:04:19n1swhich version did you use?
22:05:52wodz3.0 but it seems it is not fixed still
22:06:00 Quit Strife89 (Quit: Heading out.)
22:06:13 Quit akaWolf (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
22:09:02wodzha, it compiled after defining missing wrappers
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23:39:35DasBubAny devs here?
23:39:36 Quit amayer_ (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
23:41:29pamauryDasBub: just ask
23:42:21DasBubIs there an existing feature to read the cid off of an sd card?
23:43:48DasBubI've read through the faqs and searched the forums, but I may be stupid
23:44:06pamauryon a rockbox'ed device ?
23:44:32pamauryyou can go in the debug menu > drive/storage info (or something like that) and iirc correctly it's shown
23:44:37DasBubya. I have a Sansa Clip, but I wondered if it was a general feature
23:45:40pamauryit's on all devices which have microsd support yes
23:47:32pamauryDebug > View disk info
23:47:35 Quit kevku (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
23:48:12DasBubohhhhhh, I saw that but I think I got tripped up. It's displaying hex and I was expecting decimal
23:48:17DasBubthanks :)
23:50:04pamauryit shows the fields of the CID already interpreted, it's doesn't show the raw hexadecimal CID
23:50:08 Quit krabador (Read error: Operation timed out)
23:50:49DasBubis there a way to display the full cid? with a plugin, perhaps?
23:52:29pamaurywhy do you want to do that ? Appart from modifying the source code I don't think so, I'm not sure plugins have access to the disk info though I can check
23:53:06pamauryno they can't apparently
23:54:50DasBubWell I'm trying to find an alternate way to may goldcards for changing roms on android phones. You need to know the sd card's cid for that, but all of my card readers are USB and don't give the actual number
23:55:21DasBubder, s/may/make
23:56:04bertrikI thought you can insert the card in an android phone and then have an android app read the csd and the cid
23:56:18DasBubindeed you can. if you have another android phone lying around :)
23:57:40 Quit SuperBrainAK (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
23:57:49pamaurythen if you can compile rockbox that's easy
23:58:07bertrikrockbox is a bit weird with reading the cid and csd as I remember, storing it as a bunch of 32-bit values instead of a simple byte array

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