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#rockbox log for 2013-04-08

00:07:24 Quit deeper-blue (Quit: deeper-blue)
00:30:25 Quit Wardo (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
00:33:33 Join pokey [0] (
00:44:32pokeyI think I borked my new Sansa Clip+. It just says "Loading firmware" "File not found" when I try to power it up. Then it says something like "Connect USB" and "Bootloader USB Mode." It happened while I was trying to instal rockbox, using the latest stable installer. It (the installer) seemed to hang up for quite a while, so I thought I should re-start the install. I might have quit the installer, or I might have unplugged the cable, I forget no
00:45:12pokeyTomorrow I'll try using the disk that came with it when I have access to a windoze computer.
00:46:40gevaertspokey: sounds like the bootloadet installation worked, but the main rockbox build isn't there
00:47:09gevaertsHold the left button when booting to go to the original firmware, and continue from there
00:57:20 Quit ender` (Quit: The reason people use a crucifix against vampires is that vampires are allergic to bullshit. -- Richard Pryor)
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01:16:10pokeygevaerts: Oh! Great thinking! That's working.
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01:48:32pokeygevaerts: Thank you. I think this is working. The original firmware is working at least.
01:52:30[Saint]Well, one should boot Rockbox before they commit to saying it is indeed working.
01:59:41***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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02:13:15pokey[Saint]: yes, true. It isn't booting to rockbox yet (which is like saying 5 out of my 6 senses work just fine).
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03:47:19telliottAnyone know how to get DFU mode on an iPod Classic in Windows 8?
03:48:28[Saint]The same as you do in any other OS.
03:48:38[Saint]The OS is irrelevant to DFU mode.
03:49:40[Saint]Try the video clearly linked in the freemyipod emCORE installation instructions
03:50:35telliottI get the connect cound but nothing shows up
03:50:43[Saint]Technically speaking the emCORE (while closely related to the Rockbox project) is off-topic here also
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03:59:42***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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05:00:28[Saint]...does anyone actually care about IPL anymore?
05:00:45[Saint]I'm fairly confident that project is long dead, yes?
05:01:04*[Saint] is poking at the iPod bootloaders.
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05:19:52[Saint]The Classic can get itself into a weird situation where if the device is powered down with the hold switch off, and you switch the hold switch on, it'll boot and nuke your settings.
05:20:22[Saint]I _think_ the CLassic is the only iPod that boots from the hold switch from powered down, so it isn't at all surprising this flaw exists.
05:21:05[Saint]...anyway, tl;dr: I want to move the "nuke your settings" off the hold switch for the iPods. Its kinda silly.
05:21:49[Saint]I'm also looking for feedback on whether anyone actually cares if the bootloader can boot IPL or not.
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05:59:44***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
06:00:23JdGordon[Saint]: what's your suggested keymapping?
06:01:35[Saint]I would rather go with Menu or Play
06:01:50[Saint]...but, I wonder why we need to be able to clear the .cfg from the bootloader anyway?
06:02:24[Saint]If the device boots, this can be done from the settings menu - and if it doesn't, this probably won't help much anyway.
06:03:24[Saint]I want to get rid of the option to boot IPL entirely, as I suspect that the resultant splash a user gets if they accidentally boot with that key combo just serves to confuse users more than anything else these days.
06:05:06[Saint]If we freed up these keys, we could just do "Hold *any* key {except hold, as thjat's silly}) to boot the OF in the bootloader.
06:06:56[Saint]The only thing I worry about is that moving the clear settings key to the scrollwheel might make it easier to accidentally nuke your settings for the other (non-Classic) iPods.
06:07:17[Saint]Which is why I wondered if it was needed at all.
06:08:45[Saint]Bootloader USB and/or Diskmode and/or the Manage Settings menu make it surpluss to requirement IMO.
06:09:09[Saint]If there is a case that requires this, I'm missing it, and I will be happy to be educated on what it is.
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07:59:48***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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09:59:52***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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11:59:56***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
12:06:38 Join redhot [0] (~kvirc@
12:10:40[Saint]redhot: If you have a specific query - or there's something we can help you with - just ask.
12:10:42 Quit gshrikant (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
12:10:56[Saint]If you're just being social - that's great too - just clarifying.
12:11:10redhot[Saint]: I am here just to say "Hello" to community ;)
12:11:24[Saint]Fair enough. :)
12:11:45redhotAt the moment all my questions are answered)
12:12:06redhotProbably you guys need some tests/FAQS with SanDisk Sansa Clip+?
12:12:11redhotI could do it
12:12:32redhotI mean "update FAQ"
12:13:22[Saint]Ummmmm...not realy, no. We don;t have any device specific FAQs, and the Clip+ is a stable target, so nothing needs testing.
12:14:15redhotOk, then it's up to me what to do ;)
12:14:33lebelliumthe Clip+ needs working RDS :D
12:15:12[Saint]If you don't have any questions regarding Rockbox operation - you're not looking hard enough ;)
12:15:51redhotRDS would be amazing, but not sure if I as non-developer can help you this way :)
12:16:43[Saint]I know little about FM tuner chips, but "poll the tuner every tick for a new RDS packet." seems excessive to me.
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12:17:19redhotOk, I will contact SanDisk clarifyin this question
12:17:19[Saint]I suspect bertrik, wodz or pamaury will have a looksee at that.
12:17:31wodzwhy me :P
12:17:35 Join evilnick_ [0] (538a2493@gateway/web/freenode/ip.
12:17:45[Saint]redhot: Sorry - what question?
12:18:05redhot[Saint]: if Clip+ FM chip can support RDS
12:18:25[Saint]redhot: Oh, it can. There's no need.
12:18:35redhotSo vendor's FW support it?
12:18:53lebelliumno RDS in Sansa's firmware
12:18:55[Saint]wodz: you've been poking at FM tuners lately - you seemed like a fitting candidate. :)
12:19:29lebelliumBut just a stupid question: if the FM chip is the same in Clip+ and Clip Zip, why don't we reuse the RDS code for Clip Zip on the Clip+?
12:20:03wodz[Saint]: I am poking mysteriously broken i2c transfers on rk27xx which happen to appear when reading off fm chip
12:20:53[Saint]lebellium: FM is usually one of the last things to get attention, with a similar priority to recording. As to why the driver isn't re-used, I suspect that whoever posted that patch is unaware the same (or similar) chipset is used in other targets.
12:21:07[Saint]wodz: close enough ;)
12:21:17[Saint]That makes you an expert.
12:21:46redhotlebellium: make it happen :)
12:22:50lebelliumredhot: heh! I'm not a dev :P I'm just the guy who like complaining here with bug reports and improvement suggestions.
12:23:09[Saint]...and making themes that break USB.
12:23:19redhotlebellium: just like me, just like me!
12:24:06lebelliumWho has both a clip+ and clip zip? Bertrik maybe?
12:24:21[Saint]pamaury I suspect
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12:24:51[Saint]now funman is less active, pamaury seems to have taken over as Cpt. SanDisk
12:26:27lebelliumPamaury works on too many ports at the same time, I don't think he has time to look at RDS for Clip+. But I can ask him anyway :)
12:29:11*funman does
12:29:32funmanbut yes i gave up my Sansa hat :)
12:29:40[Saint] you've gone and done it :)
12:30:12[Saint]lebellium: get 'em! <points at funman>
12:30:54funmanRDS is enabled on Zip ?
12:31:05lebelliumwith the same SI470
12:31:16funmani can try to add the define for clip plus
12:32:19[Saint]Yeah - I suspect the author of that patch was unaware they were re-inventing the wheel.
12:32:30 Join AlexP_ [0] (~alex@rockbox/staff/AlexP)
12:32:56funmanwhich patch?
12:32:58redhotfunman: I am ready to check test build on clip+
12:33:21[Saint] g#371
12:33:25fs-bluebotGerrit review #371 at : sansa clip+: add RDS capability for SI4702 tuners by Ryan Hitchman (changes/71/371/1)
12:33:47lebelliumoh, that's how it works for patchs [Saint], I did not know how to call it :D
12:34:16redhotwe're not devs, dude!
12:36:11lebelliumin general RDS is still buggy on my Clip Zip and YP-R0 as I reported it some time ago: FS #12759 but it's working well enough to be worth it on Clip+ :)
12:36:12fs-bluebot Various RDS issues (Clip Zip, YP-R0) (bugs, unconfirmed)
12:36:35wodzhell, with generic-i2c I have reliable readings from FM chip
12:37:24funmanhm i don't remember how to display RDS info
12:37:33funmani'd need a theme tailored for the clip+ i guess
12:38:05lebelliumI can enable RDS on mine
12:38:12lebelliumif you need
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12:39:31funmani'm looking at the debug screen right now
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12:49:29funmanwell the clip zip code as is doesn't work so i guess that patch is needed
12:51:28lebelliumthe clip zip code doesn't work?
12:52:27funmani just added the defines to clip plus config
12:56:20lebelliumI tried this patch some time ago and I not get any RDS data while the patch author says in the comments: "I tested this on my sansa clip+ and it works well."
12:56:34lebelliumI did not get*
13:08:06 Quit petur (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
13:13:56lebelliumBTW, if someone needs a RDS-compatible theme for testing on Clip+, here it is
13:14:13lebelliumcan display RDS name and RDS text on 2 lines
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13:38:58funmanso the patch doesn't work on my clip+
13:39:58lebelliumare you sure you have the SI4702 tuner?
13:44:53funmanafaik the + only has one type of tuner
13:45:08funmanwhich explains the warnings seen in the task comments
13:45:08lebelliumthat's why I ask
13:45:32funmanah the zip has 1 tuner and the + has 2
13:45:42lebelliumsome clip+ have a RDA5802
13:45:51funmandebug screen shows me 'si4700 regs'
13:46:27lebelliumok me too and the OF diagnostic mode says SI4702
13:47:32lebelliumHum I just read
13:47:36lebellium"Clip Zip: The tuner chip is the SiLabs Si4703, which is the RDS capable brother of the SiLabs Si4702 (used in several other Sansa players). "
13:47:58lebelliumIf that's true, that could explain our issue
13:52:21JdGordonlebellium: just updated the random value tag, it *might* work, untested, and don't know if there are brokeness because of the change
13:52:26JdGordonlet me know how it goes
13:54:40lebelliumok thanks
13:59:57***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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14:08:42lebellium"/home/ubuntu/rockbox/apps/gui/skin_engine/skin_render.c: In function 'skin_render_line':
14:08:43lebellium/home/ubuntu/rockbox/apps/gui/skin_engine/skin_render.c:520: error: invalid type argument of '->' (have 'skinoffset_t')
14:08:45lebelliummake: *** [/home/ubuntu/rockbox/R0Random/apps/gui/skin_engine/skin_render.o] Error 1"
14:09:03JdGordonhang on
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15:59:59***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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19:56:40bertrikRegarding the RDS on Clip+: I think it's very well possible, but (IMO) RDS works best when used with tuner interrupts (about 11 per second for RDS) and some clip+ seem to not support these interrupts because of a clip+ PCB redesign
19:57:10bertrikSo, I'd like to be really sure that the interrupt is not present on the redesigned PCB before implementing a work-around by using polling
19:58:38bertrik(also, I'd like to try the interrupts for tuning too, I expect things like the auto-scan to work a lot faster that way)
19:59:22bertrikwodz, fixed the RKxxxx tuner problem?
20:00:03***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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20:19:38wodzbertrik: not really. hw i2c driver has some bug in reading routine I can't track down. After switching to sw implementation on this lines I can reliably communicate with tuner but this is rather ugly workaround.
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20:23:26bertrikoh, but I saw some talk earlier that it was related to power-down mode of the fm tuner
20:23:44bertrikperhaps not so nice of the chip to behave this way, but possible to work around it
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20:26:32bertrikthe bitbang sw driver does not support all i2c options, like clock stretching, or checking for stuck SDA/SCL lines
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20:50:44scorche|shkugel: gevaerts: anyone else: we were not accepted for GSoC
20:50:52*gevaerts saw
20:50:58gevaertsOh well
20:51:55gshrikantAre the results out yet?
20:52:12gevaertsThey've been mailed to org admins though
20:52:34gshrikantoh! I see. Anyways, I am in :-)
20:52:50gevaertsWell, good luck, wherever you end up :)
20:54:12gshrikantthanks. I'll try to be active here though. Might end up being my first FOSS contribution.
20:54:25gevaertsYou're certainly welcome!
21:01:46bertrikgshrikant: what do you plan to work on?
21:03:08gshrikantopus codecs for ARM7 as suggested by gevaerts
21:03:21*gevaerts will take all the credit
21:04:01gshrikanthaha! I am still a long way though. Have to go through the docs. Interrupted by exams.
21:04:18evilnickgevaerts will take the credit for the exams too
21:04:32bertrikgshrikant: nice
21:05:03gshrikantnah! exams are bad enough as they are ;)
21:05:18bertrikgshrikant: our current opus code is a snapshot from just before the first opus release, with some optimisations done by rockbox people (n1s and saratoga IIRC)
21:05:24saratogai don't have time to work on opus now but i can certainly tell you about it
21:05:40saratogai barely did any optimization though (~1MHz of speed up!)
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21:06:54gshrikantthanks. that would go indeed go a long way to get me set up.
21:08:52bertriklib/rbcodec/codecs/libopus/README.rockbox has some info on what was done for the port
21:11:43 Join stoffel [0] (
21:12:20saratogathe FFT is the main thing slowing the port down
21:12:31saratogaIIRC its something like half as fast as the other codec FFTs
21:18:12bertrikI got a review request for g#430 but I don't have the player (h100) , perhaps someone else can review it?
21:18:15fs-bluebotGerrit review #430 at : some optimizations for iriver h100 series by Dmitry Gamza (changes/30/430/1)
21:18:35gevaertsbertrik: I have a review comment for that one. You can borrow it if you like :)
21:18:51gevaerts"Please don't put several unrelated changes in one commit"
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21:20:05bertrikthere, fixed it for ya
21:21:28n1shis commits seem to depend on each other for no reason
21:22:28gevaertsThat too
21:24:13saratogafuck the gerrit interface makes looking at changes hard
21:24:50saratogaam i blind or is there no way to see the commit history for a file from gerrit?
21:28:02 Part LinusN
21:30:30lebelliumBertrik: if both SI4702 and SI4703 are RDS capable, what's the difference?
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21:31:16bertriksi4701 and si4703 are RDS capable, don't know about the higher numbers
21:31:24bertrikI don't know exactly the difference
21:31:46bertrikmight just be internal firmware of the tuner
21:32:48lebelliumSo the person who wrote this sentence "Clip Zip: The tuner chip is the SiLabs Si4703, which is the RDS capable brother of the SiLabs Si4702 (used in several other Sansa players). " probably thought the SI4702 is not RDS capable because of the OF not using this feature
21:33:05 Quit pretty_function (Remote host closed the connection)
21:36:44bertriksi4702 is indeed not RDS capable
21:37:20lebelliumbut the Clip+ uses Si4702
21:38:43bertrikI think there was a report of a clip+ with a si4701 or si4703
21:39:15pamauryI only have a clip+, not a clip zip
21:39:26pamauryI don't know much about amsv2
21:39:50saratogaclip+ is AMSv2 :)
21:40:24 Join lebellium_ [0] (
21:41:12lebellium_the wiki says Si4702, OF diagnostic mode says Si4702 for my Clip+, the RDS patch we were talking about is for Si4702. I never heard of Si4701 on Clip+
21:41:18pamauryyes but I only "worked" on usb, and we know the result
21:41:46 Quit lebellium (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
21:41:50 Nick lebellium_ is now known as lebellium (
21:43:42lebelliumIf the Si4702 is really not RDS capable, g#371 cannot work, right?
21:43:44fs-bluebotGerrit review #371 at : sansa clip+: add RDS capability for SI4702 tuners by Ryan Hitchman (changes/71/371/1)
21:46:32bertrikMy interpretation is that it's really an si4703, but that the OF can only recognise it as a si4702
21:47:01bertrikMaybe sandisk put the si4703 in because they were out of si4702s
21:47:55bertrikgevaerts, saratoga: but the patches look interesting, right?
21:49:18saratogathe ipod video one is something buschel tested extensively years ago, so probably not
21:49:21saratogano idea about the rest
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22:00:04***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
22:05:44*bertrik wonders how to close a gerrit patch
22:07:35gevaertsbertrik: the submitter has to click on "abandon change"
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