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#rockbox log for 2013-07-04

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03:49:41***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
04:04:16[Saint]What is the reasoning behind the extremely high preference for embedded album art in Rockbox?
04:07:44[Saint]I kinda assumed it would have a much lower preference, to cater for those that have high quality art embedded and generate smaller file based art for DAPs to remove the need for resizing (or much resizing).
04:08:54[Saint]Sorry, if it wasn't clear, I meant the preferential order from which album art is loaded.
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04:38:23JdGordonI doubt there was much of a discussion about ordering
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05:10:22[Saint]Seems to me that if you've gone to the effor of creating file based art, that you'd want it to work.
05:10:48[Saint]And if you hadn't, and had embedded art, even if it did have a lower preference, nothing would change for you.
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10:04:36copper[Saint]: if there is a cover art file in the directory, it is likely on purpose; the same can't be said about embedded artwork. So I guess file based cover art should take precedence over embedded artwork.
10:05:11copperby that I mean, someone else might have put the embedded artwork in there
10:05:11[Saint]coincidentally, that is exactly how I discovered this.
10:05:14coppersoftware, or people
10:05:53[Saint]I somehow accidentally ended up embedding art in several thousand tags, and while I was out-and-about, I couldn't work out why my file based art was messed up.
10:06:59[Saint]As I said earlier, and you sumeed it up as well, file based art almost certainly is there on purpose, and should take a higher preference. Embedded art, if there on purpose, would make no use of file based art, so it makes sense to be a lower preference.
10:07:20[Saint]Neither party would notice any negative effect, and the file based art guys get a clear bonus.
10:08:24[Saint]I thought about the case earlier of people possibly wanted high quality embedded art, and much smaller file based art specifically for the DAP, also.
10:08:27copperone example of systematic embedded artwork that the user didn't ask for, is iTunes music
10:08:58copperand I don't think you can turn it off in iTunes
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10:13:22copperdoes embedded artwork increase memory usage when Rockbox parses metadata from the file?
10:15:17[Saint]Well, you have the copy of the art embedded in the file in the buffer, and the art itself in the buffer.
10:16:16[Saint]How extreme that wastage is depends on the quality of the embedded art, I guess.
10:16:26[Saint]Some of which can be several MB
10:17:02[Saint](one of the reasons I use file based art no larger than the smallest dimension of the device resolution)
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10:20:32H140RBox v3.13 hangs in the start screen on boot up, this only occurs after flashing to RAM and ROM with RBox. RBox v3.8 boots normally from disk and ram/rom after flashing. All Rockbox versions after v3.8 hang during boot after flashing.
10:29:41wodz[Saint]: I would say put patch on gerrit which changes precedence of artwork loading.
10:30:23[Saint]Yes, I plan to do so - I was just checking the opinions of others before doing so.
10:31:00wodz[Saint]: Personally I agree that dir file should take over embedded one
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10:31:36[Saint]Glad to know it isn't just me.
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10:56:52copper[Saint]: the only case where I think a user wouldn't be happy about that, is if they use the cover art file as a fallback
10:57:28copperi.e. they would want to display embedded artwork if it's there (custom cover for the track), or the cover file if there's no embedded (custom) artwork
10:57:31pixelmathe fallback would still work
10:57:49copperlike, displaying the cover art of a single, and the album cover art for the rest of the tracks
10:58:24copperpixelma: will [Saint]'s change, the embedded artwork would never get displayed
10:58:51pixelmahuh, I thought he only spoke about the preferences
10:59:23copperthere's a preference entry for that?
10:59:47pixelmaas the manual tells you ;)
11:00:30copperI'm actually looking at the manual right now
11:00:40copperI don't see anything about artwork
11:01:52copperI don't see anything about an artwork preference entry*
11:05:48pixelma"The order Rockbox uses when looking for a picture is as follows (a list in braces means that those file extensions are tried in that order): "
11:06:19pixelmain the appendix part C
11:10:33copperthat's not a preference entry, and what I said stands
11:11:13copperif [Saint] gives cover files priority over embedded artwork, and a cover file is present, the embedded artwork will never get displayed
11:11:49pixelmathe list that follows tells you which will be tried first then next, and the only thing in question is why embedded album art is first there
11:12:21copperam I not being clear?
11:14:37pixelmaI understood "fallback" as "what happens if something is not there
11:16:12copperif the cover file takes precedence, it can no longer serve as a fallback for missing embedded artwork, because the embedded artwork will NEVER get displayed even if it's there
11:17:14copperand actually I was about to go on, to say that it would be nice to have a preference entry for that
11:17:29copper"artwork priority" -> embedded / file
11:17:42wodzThe whole idea of embedded art is brain damaged
11:18:00copperwodz: not if it's unique for each file
11:18:08copperbut that almost never happens
11:18:17copperthe only case that I can think of, is singles
11:18:45copperi.e. display cover art for "Get Lucky" for that song, and cover art for "Random Access Memories" of the rest of the Daft Punk album
11:22:50pixelmayou could still achieve this if you have a "filename.{jpeg,jpg,bmp}" which comes second currently for the "single" music file but it'll clutter up your folder more
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18:59:27flugfafendoes rockbox add inline remote support to sansa clips+?
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19:48:30copperflugfafen: no
19:48:37copperthat won't work
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