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#rockbox log for 2014-02-17

00:06:19***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:08:23[Saint]many targets don't need to boost at all in most scenarios now.
00:08:48[Saint]not too sure that should default on for all targets globally.
00:09:49*[Saint] is reminded that the boost on UI thing we do with the iPods is totally unnecessary on the Classic and Nano2G
00:10:16[Saint]...I should like, fix, that. And stuff.
00:11:03 Quit akaWolf (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
00:11:19[Saint]And carve out USB on N2G or jiggle with stacks again. I want that stable for releases again.
00:11:40 Quit bertrik (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
00:11:57[Saint]No USB wouldn't be heartbreaking, even if we cant force boot to EDM.
00:12:21[Saint]Not a showstopper, at least.
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01:49:30 Nick DormantBrain is now known as SuperBrainAK (~andy@2001:470:8:a61::5f92:59a1)
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01:58:29cmhobbswell, my dad just called me
01:58:36cmhobbsi put rockbox on his sansa device months ago
01:58:48cmhobbsand he called for the express purpose of saying thanks for setting that up
01:58:56cmhobbsbecause "it's so much better than whatever crap came on it before"
01:59:12cmhobbsso there you have it, rockbox devs
01:59:26cmhobbsthanks for making something my luddite father digs
02:00:24ZincAlloyhe can't be such a luddite if he likes rockbox better than the original firmware :D
02:00:40[Saint]That's great to hear, really.
02:00:56[Saint]Thankyou, cmhobbs.
02:01:50[Saint]Thank you indeed. You can tell your father the praise is appreciated when you next speak to him, and wish him well on my behalf.
02:02:31[Saint]One little story like that puts aside the many thankless complainers.
02:03:15cmhobbsha, great!
02:03:32cmhobbshe swears it improved the radio performance and the battery life
02:03:56[Saint]Depending on the device I can very well imagine that to be true.
02:04:14[Saint]We outshine the OF in battery life by a resonable mark on some AMS devices.
02:04:53ZincAlloyand the imx device..
02:05:43[Saint]Generally speaking, its reasonably rare that we don't at least match the OF runtime.
02:05:58[Saint](and usually seem to do so on markedly aged batteries)
02:06:22***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:06:23cmhobbshe said he got nearly 19 hours out of it
02:06:30cmhobbs"listening to the news"
02:06:35cmhobbsi assume that means the radio
02:06:40cmhobbsbecause i don't think he does podcasts
02:06:43cmhobbshe does have some mp3s though
02:07:01ZincAlloywhich player does he have?
02:07:16[Saint]On iPod Classic, with all the refinements I make to my setup (disabling literally everything I don't need, and tuning to meet me exact requirements), I get 90+ hours.
02:07:33cmhobbsi'd have to look at the pictures
02:07:34cmhobbsjust a sec
02:07:47ZincAlloythat's really impressive
02:07:59cmhobbssansa clip
02:08:05[Saint] Its mostly down to RAM utilization, I believe.
02:08:18[Saint]I turn off *everrything* I don't use.
02:08:25cmhobbsi was worried about font size being an issue, but he has mr. magoo glasses
02:08:39cmhobbsi have a clip zip and i get about 10 hours, sometimes more
02:08:39[Saint]I end up with about 59MB of playback buffer.
02:08:47[Saint]Meaning I pretty much never hit the disk.
02:08:48cmhobbsi only use mine for podcasts
02:08:56cmhobbsand freedoom...
02:09:15ZincAlloyI benchmarked my clip zip at around 14 and a half hours
02:09:33[Saint]I made some other changes to my build, too.
02:09:48[Saint]I doubt it would be possible to get that kind of runtime out of a vanilla binary.
02:10:16[Saint]The Classic wastes quite a bit boosting unnecessarily in the UI.
02:10:56[Saint]The older PP iPods needed this, and the Nano2G and Classic just absorbed the change, despite not really neededg it at all.
02:11:37[Saint]They are both powerful enough to handle the UI without lagging on the lowest clock.
02:12:08cmhobbswhen i learned about rockbox, i went out and bought a clip zip as soon as i could
02:12:22cmhobbsloved it so much, i put it on dad's clip. we're both happy as clams
02:12:31cmhobbsthe clip zip is an intriguing little piece of hardware
02:12:51[Saint]I can see why people think that. But I can't shake the Happy MEal toy image.
02:12:57ZincAlloyI wouldn't even consider giving my parents rockboxed players :D I don't think they'd get it
02:13:20cmhobbsmy dad ran ubuntu forever, but he didn't really know what it was. he's on windows 7 now, but that's a long story
02:13:24cmhobbsubuntu will be back soon enough
02:13:50ZincAlloymy mom can handle linux. she doesn't know what she's doing and stuff.. but she gets along with it
02:13:55cmhobbswhen i was a kid, i cut my teeth on minix/linux and ended up putting linux on the family computer when we finally got one
02:14:02cmhobbsthen i went on foreign exchange for a year
02:14:07ZincAlloyI don't trust her with windows. she keeps attracting viruses
02:14:12cmhobbswhen i came back, they got a new computer and were pretty upset at windows
02:14:15cmhobbsbut didn't know why
02:14:19cmhobbsthey thought it was the same os
02:14:24cmhobbsso i put another distro on it
02:14:30cmhobbswith that kind of background, he responded well to rockbox
02:14:47cmhobbshe was already used to me replacing his proprietary stuff with free alternatives and shopping for hardware that way
02:15:39cmhobbshow long has rockbox been in development?
02:15:41[Saint]cmhobbs: let me let you in on a power-user pro tip.
02:15:53[Saint]cmhobbs: about 13 years.
02:16:31cmhobbsalso, sorry about spamming up the dev channel. i just noticed the topic
02:16:39[Saint]Next time you see your father, get the device into a state with preferred settings a "safe default" if you will. Then save this as "/.rockbox/fixed.cfg"
02:16:52[Saint]The player will read this config after config.cfg and apply the settings.
02:17:07cmhobbsthat'll be useful as he likes to mash buttons
02:17:08[Saint]Meaning you can always just reboot the device to reset to a known config.
02:17:11[Saint]Great for oldies.
02:17:29[Saint]...Hell, even I use it to reset volume, etc. to safe limits.
02:17:40ZincAlloybut annoying when he does need to change something permanently
02:17:46ZincAlloythat's a good idea...
02:18:05[Saint]I don't hardcode themes, etc.
02:18:17[Saint]But I will hard code volume, shuffle, repeat settings, etc.
02:18:32[Saint]Every boot I know exactly how it'll behave.
02:18:33ZincAlloyI don't use shuffle and repeat settings
02:18:49ZincAlloyI may change replay gain mode and channel configuration once in while
02:18:59[Saint]I have blasted myself far too many times taking my player from the amp and forgetting volume was at 0db.
02:19:01[Saint]Not fun. :)
02:19:29ZincAlloybeen there, done that
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02:51:52[Saint]Gah. Yeah...kinda thought that would happen.
02:52:33[Saint]Musicbrainz Picard fell over spectacularly trying to import 170,000 tracks into it to update the tags.
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02:58:40*[Saint] removes a zero
02:59:08[Saint]Ata rough guess, that would work out to ~14TB, and I'm not quite there yet. ;)
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04:06:23***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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05:23:24SuperBrainAKim starting to notice my sansa clip zip's battery diminishing away :(
05:24:25SuperBrainAKdoes the sansa hardware have any type of battery charge/discharge current monitoring?
05:33:31saratogano, just voltage
05:43:26[Saint]Eeek. Caps. Sorry.
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06:06:27***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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07:00:21fs-bluebotBuild Server message: New build round started. Revision 7f0b7b7, 253 builds, 33 clients.
07:03:56SuperBrainAKdarnit i wish it did :( if i made an portable device i would have it log battery capacity :)
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07:13:51fs-bluebotBuild Server message: Build round completed after 811 seconds.
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07:56:53[Saint]DormantBrain: realistically its not important information.
07:57:19[Saint]Its "good enough" to know the voltage and safe operating ranges.
07:57:37[Saint]Let the battery handle itself.
07:59:56Mirhmm... seems my E260 doesnt like the new Black Sabbith album
08:00:13Mirit keeps dividing by zero when i play "GOD IS DEAD"
08:00:47Mirliteraly it get a white screen that said dividing my zero at (some hexidecimal adress)
08:03:44[Saint]sounds like a bad encode.
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08:05:25[Saint]If you have an original lossless source I'd try whipping up a fresh version.
08:06:01Mirthe exact message is ,00Divide by zero at 01E812E4 (0pc:01E812E4 sp:40002AF8 bt end
08:06:29***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
08:07:00Mirits flac
08:07:01[Saint]that's not too interesting without the binary revision and a map file.
08:07:54Mirbinary version?
08:08:37[Saint]the release version or git hash.
08:09:00Mirits 3.13
08:10:33[Saint]I'm not sure if we keep the map file for the shipped builds or not. But if you were to have said map file, or rebuild the same version to get said map file, the address in the error can (help to) pinpoint where in the code it fell over.
08:11:18Mirwhere would i find the map file?
08:12:29[Saint]I doubt we pack it in the zip. But we may keep it around somewhere server side. I'm not sure.
08:13:06[Saint]Otherwise the only way I know of is to get it from the build folder at compile time.
08:13:34Miryea i used the rockbox installation app
08:14:09[Saint]However, the first step is to see if you can reproduce this on a current build.
08:14:49[Saint]If you can't. Yay. If you can. Yay.
08:14:59Mirthat i can do tomorrow as i have the same player
08:15:10Mirwith rockbox installed
08:15:23Mirso i would just install the unstable nightly
08:16:13Mirthanks [Saint] and good night
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10:06:33***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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12:13:22PurlingNayuki I've started a wiki to help chinese-speakers to get to know how to use Rockbox. Bless me!
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12:14:10gevaertsGood luck! :)
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12:23:38[Saint]PurlingNayuki: Be careful, Rockbox is a bit too free for the likes of China. ;)
12:23:38 Quit JdGordon (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
12:23:52ikeboyMy last commit slows the textviewer down after the boost up and down, don't commit it yet
12:24:25[Saint]I would only want to see this committed on devices we *know* need it.
12:24:43[Saint]Applying this globally seems silly.
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12:30:34PurlingNayukiThat why exactly I started this wiki
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12:32:00PurlingNayukiIn case that someone ask for a tutorial, we'll have abundant reasons to tell them 'See the wiki'
12:32:58[Saint]Just be careful you don't end up getting assassinated.
12:36:26PurlingNayuki:( That sounds terrible, horrible
12:36:56PurlingNayukiOr simply say that terribly horrible?
12:37:13*[Saint] is making a generalized "joke" about China not being particularly fond of freedom.
12:37:30[Saint]...I guess it didn't go down too well. SOrry.
12:38:56PurlingNayukiNever mind. I do agree with you actually
12:39:32PurlingNayukiThat most of the people is fond of freedom, except when they have all the right to customize :P
12:41:01[Saint]I suspect the people are. The government, not so much. :)
12:41:38[Saint]Rockbox could enable you to become a political dissident.
12:42:01[Saint]Too. Much. Freedoms.
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12:50:02ikeboyHow about boosting for files over 500Kb only on fuze+, but throughout all of textviewer?
12:51:08[Saint]I dunno. Specific target hacks like this are usually frowned upon.
13:04:00pamauryyeah, that's ugly
13:07:38ikeboyWell you don't want it for other targets, right?
13:08:08pamauryit's either all targets or none
13:08:34ikeboyDo you know why it might slow it down? Does the cancel boost do more than the boost or something?
13:08:58ikeboyAnd how do I get filesize?
13:11:32ikeboyAh rb->filesize()?
13:12:26pamauryto be honest I don't really like the idea to depend on the file size either
13:15:02ikeboyAnd what units is the filesize in?
13:16:02pamaurybecause 500Kb seems arbitrary
13:16:24pamauryI would rather depend on file size w.r.t current processor speed
13:17:13ikeboyW.r.t.? (What's that?)
13:17:19pamaurywith respect to
13:18:06pamauryor maybe something like: begin job and after a specified amount of time, if not enough work was done, boost until end of the job
13:19:14ikeboyThe problem is that with my patch, it loads faster but then slows down on regular scrolling.
13:19:36ikeboySo I need to boost throught unless I can figure out why
13:22:16pamaurythere two sets of boosting functions, maybe the other one should be used
13:22:23pamauryI think one is reference counted and the other not
13:28:28ikeboyWhat's the other one?
13:29:10ikeboyAnd how to cancel it?
13:29:18pamauryit's on/off
13:29:28pamauryby the way, not all targets can boost
13:29:34ikeboyOh, so you just call it twice?
13:30:15pamaurythere is a on/off parameter
13:30:28ikeboyOh I see
13:30:53pamauryok so cpu_boost is ref counted whereas trigger_cpu_boost seems not and only applies to the current thread
13:31:15ikeboySo the debug menu one uses which?
13:32:11pamauryprobably cpu_boost()
13:32:54ikeboyI'll try it later today and see if it still has a slowdown problem and if not I'll amend commit
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13:54:21cramlerpamaury: I pulled a fresh source and retried. It seems you cleaned it up quite a bit, but sadly, the same behaviour remains...
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14:01:38pamaurycramler: ok, I will try later
14:01:40MarcAndersenHi. I just installed the latest build of rockbox on my zen x-fi, and now it just boots up for a few seconds, then shuts down again. what can be wrong here?
14:02:36pamauryMarcAndersen: problem with the LCD driver, apparently my fix made is more stable on the ZEN and less stable on the ZEN X-Fi
14:02:43pamaury*made it
14:03:23MarcAndersencan i get it working somehow?
14:04:22pamauryhum, best would be to get an older build I think
14:04:43MarcAndersenwhere can i find that?
14:05:23pamauryyou can't because we don't provide one :-/ Wait a minute, I will upload one with a month old commit, should be ok
14:05:49MarcAndersendo i need to reinstall the bootloader?
14:06:09[Saint]Not unless you're told to, no.
14:06:18pamaurycramler: you are right, the current build is broken, this is extremely weird
14:06:19MarcAndersenall right
14:06:22[Saint]In general, you rarely ever do need to.
14:06:37***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
14:06:50MarcAndersenoh but it is an unstable build so I was not sure
14:07:20[Saint]The build classifications are really quite meaningless.
14:07:28[Saint]To an end user, that is.
14:07:46[Saint]Stable and Unstable are hilariously misleading.
14:08:07[Saint]In most cases the current development build will be more "stable" than the last release.
14:08:14[Saint]If it wasn't, we'd be doing it wrong.
14:08:19pamaury[Saint]: I disagree but that's not the point, bootloader rarely change, period
14:08:34MarcAndersenI also use dev builds on my sansa clips
14:09:10[Saint]"Unusable" is even more misleading.
14:10:08pamaurymaybe they should be named "possibly unstable" and "possibly unusable"
14:10:32[Saint]That would in theory be every build. :)
14:10:54pamauryMarcAndersen: try this one:
14:12:05MarcAndersengot it
14:12:50pamaurycramler: are you familiar with bisection ?
14:13:20pamaurycramler: if you have time and want to help, you can try to find which commit caused this "No .rockbox" error
14:13:47MarcAndersenpamaury: did you just compile it now?
14:14:36pamauryMarcAndersen: yes
14:14:48pamauryI used a commit which is 2 weeks old approx
14:15:07MarcAndersenok, thank you
14:15:41MarcAndersenand i can confirm that it works
14:16:20pamauryyeah I'm sorry for the breakage but I don't know how to properly fix both ZEN and ZEN X-Fi LCD drivers for now
14:17:03MarcAnderseni am still looking forward for the speaker though
14:17:44pamauryyeah I implemented speaker support on some imx233 targetes yesterday
14:17:59MarcAndersenbut not the x-fi?
14:18:11pamaurynot yet, it's stmp3700, slightly different
14:18:52MarcAndersenok, but I thought that the device would do that automatically but that is not the case
14:23:43MarcAndersenI wish I could help to contribute some code to rockbox, but it seams very hard to learn. I can only do autoit and angelscript.
14:24:09cramlerpamaury: I will try that. Bisection boils down to a special "divide and attack", right?
14:24:24[Saint]If you use git, most of it is done for you.
14:24:34pamaurycramler: wait, I'm doing the bisect myself, will be faster
14:25:27 Part gammy_
14:27:52cramlerpamaury: Sorry... Hm, I only got two bases so far, and both had the problem.
14:28:03cramlerBut I am eager to learn
14:29:33pamauryok, I found the culprit
14:29:38pamauryit's what I expected
14:30:58fs-bluebotBuild Server message: New build round started. Revision dd6f5cf, 253 builds, 32 clients.
14:33:38cramlerNow I'm bursting with curiosity.
14:34:19fs-bluebotBuild Server message: Build round completed after 200 seconds.
14:37:35pamauryI'm pretty I tested it though, apparently I made a mistake, I'll need to investigate this
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15:25:46 Join [Saint] [0] (~saint@rockbox/staff/saint) it ok to work on this snapshot (with amaurys revert), or will I invoke the wrath of the devs?
15:46:34pamaurycramler: it should work now
15:47:00[Saint]If you're asking "is it ok to use the current development build", yes. It always should be the case.
15:51:14cramlerpamaury: Thank you
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15:54:51cramlerSaint: I am still a bit confused by git, so I did not know whether auto snapshot is the actual dev-build...
15:55:16[Saint]the dev-build is always the very tip of master
15:56:38pamaury[Saint]: it's always ok except when it's broken ;)
15:57:53[Saint]I said its OK to use it...I didn't say it would /work/. ;)
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16:00:19cramlerIt was because at first it said "unknown-140217"
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19:05:48fs-bluebotBuild Server message: New build round started. Revision 8927df4, 253 builds, 33 clients.
19:06:06pamauryThis time, I got it right, I hope
19:07:38pamaurygevaerts: why does the build page shows two "X-Fi Style - Boot" ?
19:08:28pamaurythis is even more confusing because of the them is the normal build with the "Normal" tooltip :-/
19:08:34pamaury*one of them
19:08:51fs-bluebotBuild Server message: Build round completed after 183 seconds.
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19:15:18gevaertspamaury: maybe a consequence of the earlier duplicate ids?
19:15:34gevaertsIn that case, I suspect Zagor needs to do some cleaning
19:18:32pamauryyeah maybe, all my fault :-/
19:24:05cramlerSo, this is for the x-fi3 and fuze+, right?
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19:25:29pamaurycramler: what do you mean ?
19:26:01cramlerThe last changes on the build
19:26:20pamauryall imx233 builds, that's far more than zenxfi3 and fuze+
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20:03:48teythoonhi :)
20:04:20teythooni stumbled across bug FS #12774 and tried to grep around in the source a little
20:04:22fs-bluebot Files are not correctly sorted if the track number is 100 or more. (bugs, unconfirmed)
20:04:54*teythoon . o O (sweet)
20:05:10teythoonany pointers where i should start reading the source ?
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20:22:48bluebrotherteythoon: is that using the database or file browser?
20:23:02bluebrotherah, database. Missed that in the task :)
20:23:18bluebrotherthis doesn't sound like a bug to me though. It's more a database configuration thing
20:23:53teythoonbluebrother: oh ? so how would i fix my config ?
20:24:17bluebrotherlook after tagnavi.config
20:24:27bluebrotherit has a couple of lines like this:
20:24:28bluebrother%format "fmt_title" "%02d. %s - %02d:%02d" tracknum title Lm Ls ? tracknum > "0"
20:24:58bluebrotherwhich tells me that (for that format) it uses the track number formatted with 2 digits, followed by the title
20:25:23bluebrotherso obviously if the track number if formatted as 2 digits I expect it to only respect those when sorting
20:25:30teythoonok, great
20:25:47teythooncan i change this at runtime ?
20:25:49bluebrotherat least I'd check that first. There still might be a bug ;-)
20:26:19bluebrotherit's a text file. Use any text editor you like. Not sure if Rockbox reloads the file after USB disconnect, but rebooting the player isn't that much of a big thing :)
20:27:35teythoonok cool :)
20:28:49bluebrotheralso, I'm not too familiar with the database. But given that it has a format string for the track number (and I'm aware of that) FS #12774 doesn't sound like a bug to me
20:28:49fs-bluebot Files are not correctly sorted if the track number is 100 or more. (bugs, unconfirmed)
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20:33:12teythoonbluebrother: cool, that fixed it. thanks for the help :)
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20:35:00bluebrotheryou're welcome
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20:36:34saratogaisn't the database sort thing already fixed int he current build?
20:36:57*bluebrother doesn't know
20:37:09saratogaFS #12888
20:37:10fs-bluebot Discnumber tag is not honoured for large numbers (bugs, closed)
20:37:53saratogaalthough fixing that tagnavi file seems like a good idea anyway since i think users can turn that setting off
20:38:40saratogaif someone wants to put that on gerrit i can push it
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21:16:11dfkt_speaking of... reminds me of a discnumber question i had. %ik always shows both, current disc number and total disc number - is there a way to truncate the tag, so it only shows the current disc number?
21:16:29dfkt_or is there another new tag for that which i'm not aware of? :)
21:18:12copperdfkt_: %ss()
21:18:39dfkt_hmm, that needs to know how many digits there are
21:18:56copperyup, but you can test the string for '/'
21:19:16gevaertsSounds ugly. I'd go for it :)
21:19:17copperif char 3 is '/', then get the first two digits
21:19:25copperif char 2 is '/', then get the first digit only
21:20:38copper%?if(%ss(1, 1, %ik), =, /)<%ss(0, 1, %ik)|%ss(0, 2, %ik)>
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21:21:36copper^ that works if there is no slash
21:21:49copperthe other way wouldn't work properly
21:23:28coppergevaerts: gotta make do with what's available :)
21:24:27copperbtw, %ik only displays DISCNUMBER for me, not DISCNUMBER/DISCTOTAL
21:24:59dfkt_guess it depends how the files are tagged
21:25:02gevaertsIt probably depends on what whoever tagged it thought was right
21:25:45dfkt_thanks for the line, sounds.. sound (despite gevaerts' Seal Of ApprovalĀ®) ;)
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22:51:07pamaurywodz (logs): your rockchip desc file makes headergen crash
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