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#rockbox log for 2016-01-15

00:04:24 Quit xorly (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
00:05:54Link8got it
00:06:01Link8doing the development version
00:10:42Link8shit could not open
00:10:44Link8permission denied
00:14:02 Quit ender` (Quit: It always takes longer than you expect, even when you take Hofstadter's Law into account.-- Hofstadter's Law)
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11:07:56edhelashello everyone o/
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13:19:44[Saint]TheSeven: do you know anything about this perhaps?
13:19:44[Saint]TheSeven - I can get a reliable panic relating to reading the BBT when attampting to ROLO builds on ipod6g
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15:03:48TheSeven[Saint]: with what kind of storage device? HDD/SSD/CF/SD?
15:05:40TheSevenI guess that ROLO is a case where we have a very brief power down time of the HDD, shorter than anywhere else
15:06:20TheSevenso I guess something in rockbox's HDD shutdown code leaves things in a bad state
15:06:59TheSevenit might be the very brief powerdown that confuses the drive, or it might be short enough to not actually reset the drive after it gets a sleep command, or something like that
15:07:32TheSevenmight be worth a try to check if adding a delay right before jumping into the new firmware helps
15:10:34gevaertsI know that on gigabeat F we used to have a bug where after USB disconnect (remember, USB is a hardware ATA-USB bridge!) we tried accessing the HDD too fast on some devices
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19:09:12 Quit einhirn (Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.
19:16:11 Join edhelas [0] (
19:17:23edhelashi everyone :) I just bought a iPod 3gr and a couple of accessories for it, Rockbox is running fine on it and I'd like to know if anyone here already played with the iPod connector that is just next to the jack one
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20:15:27[Saint]TheSeven: the stock HDD in this case, can't get it to do it on SSD/CF - so you might be onto something.
20:15:55[Saint]I'll see if I can slow it down a tad and give it time for the disk to come up.
20:34:55gevaerts[Saint]: by the way, replying to something you said a while ago, I don't think there's a problem with requiring one fairly new android toolchain, as long as you make sure you document which one in the usual places (probably mostly the error message if it's wrong, and maybe the build client wiki page) and you notify the build client ML
20:38:00***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
20:39:14gevaertsOh, and you're going to annoy people if you change it *too* often
20:40:26[Saint]we changed to 19 for the main android builds yonks ago.
20:40:36[Saint]this is just bringing everything /else/ up to 19.
20:40:55gevaertsAh, to 19? That's *old*! :)
20:54:15vlcnstill easy to obtain, though :)
20:57:13[Saint]I don't technically have to use the android platform-tools 19.* version, I can target whatever version greater than 19.*, and I guess that would make it easier in the long run.
20:57:51[Saint]as long as they don't make any more drastic changes in the layout of the expected tools, but they haven't done that with anything we use since 19's platform-tools.
20:57:55[Saint]so I think we're good.
20:58:53[Saint]we can easily target platform 19, but use whatever the current supported platform's (25 now?) platform-tools version is.
21:01:43*gevaerts nods
21:05:04TheSeventhat reminds me... my build machine had a hdd crash recently
21:05:19TheSevenI think everything should be up and running again, but if not, please let me know
21:07:11 Join saratoga [0] (123e11e0@gateway/web/freenode/ip.
21:07:23vlcnwell that was a discouraging reply on the mailing list... lol
21:07:31saratogahow long is dangerously long to have IRQs disabled on a device like AMS?
21:12:23gevaertsvlcn: the sad truth is that the number of active committers is not very far from negative these days. That means patch review is probably close to non-existent
21:13:08gevaertsI don't think there's more to it than that
21:14:37vlcnI guess, just disappointing.
21:15:01vlcnI don't feel like I'm alone in *not* wanting to use my phone to listen to music.
21:15:24saratogadidn't we merge all the DX tasks anyway? not even sure what that guy is talking about
21:15:25vlcnif that wasn't the case then people wouldn't be buying $200+ stand alone DAPs these days.
21:15:35*vlcn shrugs
21:15:39vlcnI really have no idea.
21:18:30vlcnI just want to be able to listen to music on a device that can hold most of my music, sounds really good and still be able to scrobble all my listens to
21:19:02saratogai think these days thats a smartphone
21:19:28saratogathe main thing that dedicated mp3 players seem to be better at is just being small/cheap like a clip IMO
21:19:38vlcnmaybe, but I'm not really happy with the output from any smartphone I've had recently and sd card slots are no longer a thing, either with most phones.
21:20:08saratogaSD cards are pretty easy to get on a smartphone, and most smartphones these days have better audio quality than mp3 players
21:20:17gevaertssaratoga: shows a few patches
21:20:41vlcnsaratoga, there really are very very few top tier phones than had a micro sd card slot anymore.
21:20:44saratogathe baseline qualcomm part is better than most of the junk you see in a lot of those weird brick mp3 players people come here asking about
21:21:13vlcnAnd I've been very disappointed with how my last few phones have sounded, in general.
21:21:16 Quit krabador (Quit: Take The Time)
21:21:25vlcnworse than my Clip, easily.
21:21:50saratogaUdo actually has commit access, so he can put those in when he thinks there ready
21:22:08*gevaerts nods
21:22:20saratogai think its tough to find a phone worse than a clip these days
21:22:36saratoganothing with qualcomm, samsung chipsets
21:23:04saratogamaybe rockchip or mediatek (never tried one)
21:23:39saratogaclip was good for its time because it was one of the first devices with a modern SOC-integrated dac
21:23:41vlcnMy current phone is a Nexus 6, before that I had a Galaxy S6. Very disapointed with both of them as far as the headphone output goes.
21:23:42saratoganow everything has that
21:23:56saratogaboth are actually better than the clip though
21:24:03vlcnMy LG G3 wasn't bad, though.
21:24:26 Quit [Saint] (Remote host closed the connection)
21:24:50vlcnbut really, it's more than that. I want a dedicated music device so I can focus on actually listening to music. It forces me to be more thoughtful about what I am listening to when I don't have all the worlds music three taps away.
21:25:00vlcnI know that sounds counterintuitive, but it makes sense to me in a way.
21:25:04saratogaFWIW G3 and Nexus 6 are both qualcomm, so they're basically identical
21:25:23saratogaif they sound different its probably not the hardware you're hearing
21:25:31vlcnI mean maybe as a line out, but in practice that's not my experience.
21:27:45saratogaNexus 6 is the same as essentially everything else out there, headphones included
21:28:10vlcnI really don't think you can fully quantify how something sounds in a test like that
21:28:24saratogathats ridiculous
21:28:36saratogayou check the output and see if its correct
21:28:53saratogaif its correct, thats pretty much the end of the story
21:29:22saratogawhats actually almost impossible is to listen to two devices and decide if they're the same, particularly devices like phones that are tough to time and volume match
21:29:45*vlcn shrugs
21:29:49vlcnnot here to argue about it
21:30:18saratogai'm not here to argue, i'm just telling you how audio players work
21:30:43vlcnI don't think what I'm saying is crazy. A set of 6 numbers just can't fully describe what a source sounds like anymore than a frequency response graph can tell me what a pair of headphones (or even less so, a speaker) is going to sound like.
21:31:07saratogaits not crazy, just wrong
21:31:35saratogayou can directly characterize the output of a digital device from its transfer function and its linearity
21:31:38saratogathis is simple DSP
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22:38:04***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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23:03:45edhelashi back
23:16:11edhelasI found some implementation in the iPodLinux sourcecode for the iPod Remote
23:16:26edhelasI'll try to see if there's some chance to port it to Rockbox
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23:28:50gevaertsedhelas: ipod remotes should work just fine
23:30:24gevaertsAlthough you may have to set the accessory power setting to on
23:30:47edhelasgevaerts, well the "Radio Remote" should works fine but mine is using the little connector on top, just next to the jack
23:31:08edhelasI'll double check
23:32:19edhelasno it's not the case with this remote
23:32:29gevaertsWith the accessory power supply set to on?
23:33:19edhelasI'm talking about this device :)
23:35:23 Quit elgis (Remote host closed the connection)
23:35:37gevaertsAll I know about ipod remotes is what's on the wiki, really. I've never had one myself
23:36:28edhelasyes I'll try to complete the wiki and see if I can do something to make this device supported
23:37:10edhelas(I'm not a C developer, I'm mostly doing PHP for now)
23:37:24[Saint]I'm fairly confident it used to work.
23:38:02[Saint]it's entirely passive afaik, I don't believe accessory power supply governs the top remote port.
23:39:03edhelasI've tried on a Mini 2G a 3rd and 4rd
23:41:48[Saint]well, if it's broken on one of the ipods that have this, there's a very high chance it's broken on all of them - so that wouldn;t surprise me at all.
23:42:05[Saint]it would be more surprising if it worked on one but not any of the others.
23:42:13edhelasyup :)
23:42:45edhelasbut for now I didn't found any related code in the rockbox trunk, I'll try to have a second look
23:51:56edhelasit's hard to find something in this huge history of more than a decade :)
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