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| 00:01:57 | * | gevaerts blocks atom270-zagor for now |
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| 00:19:15 | fs-bluebot | Build Server message: Revision 7ba50cf result: 5 errors 99 warnings |
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| 10:15:01 | Mihail | lebellium: ping |
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| 10:34:36 | Mihail | lebellium: I have test build for you: http://knk.square7.ch/rockbox-zip_volt_1.zip |
| 10:43:04 | rela | do you think there will be new players supported by rockbox in the future? |
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| 15:32:49 | [Saint] | rela: that depends - are you planning on adding support for any? |
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| 17:48:18 | lebellium | Mihail: thanks. I'll try it tonight |
| 17:50:16 | Mihail | Ok. |
| 17:50:54 | lebellium | you fixed something in the voltage scaling patch? |
| 17:54:31 | saratoga | Mihail: that build crashed for me on Clipv2 and Clip+ |
| 17:54:35 | saratoga | sorry, the committed one |
| 17:54:38 | saratoga | not the one you just linked |
| 17:54:53 | saratoga | i think we broke something over the last month |
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| 17:57:22 | saratoga | port to that new JZ player i've never heard of looks quite well done |
| 17:57:38 | saratoga | anyone familiar with mips want to look at it? almost everything looks clean to me, but i don't know the platform |
| 17:58:35 | [Saint] | wodz, perhaps gevaerts. |
| 17:58:46 | gevaerts | uh, no |
| 17:59:02 | * | gevaerts isn't familiar with *any* low-level stuff |
| 17:59:21 | [Saint] | I guess the MIPS android hosted client doesn't count huh? :) |
| 17:59:33 | gevaerts | Yes, I *can* add compiler flags |
| 17:59:50 | Mihail | saratoga: can you try remove ascodec_write_pmu(0x17, 1, 0x80 | 22); and check again clip+ and clip v2? |
| 18:00 |
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| 18:09:59 | saratoga | Mihail: yes that works |
| 18:10:03 | saratoga | i'm really confused |
| 18:10:10 | saratoga | lower voltages were fine back in january |
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| 18:11:45 | Mihail | at which conditions you have crash? |
| 18:12:16 | saratoga | a second or two after start the screen freezes |
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| 18:12:29 | saratoga | it stays showing the last thing it was doing but the player has to be hard reset |
| 18:14:07 | saratoga | dropping the voltage to 1.1v seems ok |
| 18:14:25 | Mihail | can you try bigger (100 or 200) udelay after ascodec_write_pmu(0x17, 1, 0x80 | 47); ? |
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| 18:32:26 | saratoga | Mihail: still hangs with 250 us delay |
| 18:34:43 | Mihail | can you check 3f54101858210c921e6d0039f29f649459a9a1a9 with enabled voltage scaling? |
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| 18:47:11 | saratoga | Mihail: yes that works, voltage drops to 875 mV but the player keeps running fine |
| 18:48:11 | saratoga | (watched on the debug menu) |
| 18:48:59 | Mihail | ok, try add to this build gui boost |
| 18:55:39 | saratoga | ee567d8 crashes with voltage scaling, but it seems like only when i press buttons |
| 18:59:20 | Mihail | 3f541018 + voltage scaling + gui boost also crashes? |
| 19:00 |
| 19:00:45 | saratoga | 123346b works, so yes I think it is GUI boost |
| 19:00:51 | saratoga | maybe there is a race condition there? |
| 19:03:15 | Mihail | can you check without udelay at all? |
| 19:03:16 | pamaury | I am slightly annoyed by this Xduoo X3 port, the guy never asked anything, I said I was working on the Fiio X1 which is based on the same processor and now it means I either I have to throw away my jz4760b code or rewrite his |
| 19:06:18 | | Join TheEaterOfSouls [0] (~chatzilla@66.172.117.241) |
| 19:06:41 | pamaury | a lot of code seems to be copy and paste from randomy available code for the jz4760b, mostly GPL, but he didn't keep the original credits |
| 19:07:43 | pamaury | also I will have to triple check jz4760b.h because there are plenty of different versions on the internet which are all wrong, which is why I wanted to use proper register headers from the start |
| 19:08:28 | saratoga | Mihail: freezes almost immediately without the delay |
| 19:09:23 | saratoga | i'm a little confused here, i tested boosting extensively on this device playing APE files and it was completely stable |
| 19:09:39 | saratoga | i'm not sure how boosting from the button code is somehow less stable then from the buffering code |
| 19:10:57 | [Saint] | pamaury: basically - fuck that guy. |
| 19:11:30 | [Saint] | If they can live in their own little ecosystem, fuck 'em. |
| 19:11:32 | [Saint] | let them. |
| 19:11:44 | Mihail | can you check 3f541018 + voltage scaling + gui boost? |
| 19:12:08 | pamaury | I don't know, I don't want to spend a wrong message here, but it's just quite frustrating |
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| 19:13:29 | [Saint] | pamaury: IMO the message was quite clear from the start on their part. |
| 19:15:26 | [Saint] | it might be time to have the "are you really sure you want to call that Rockbox after having actually given nothing to the community" talk. |
| 19:16:01 | [Saint] | Call me a pessimist, I guess. |
| 19:16:49 | [Saint] | Perhaps I read the situation wrong entirely but I never really got the feeling that he was interested in working /with/ Rockbox at all. More alongside. |
| 19:17:50 | [Saint] | Then that whole business with the first build seemed to cement that. I hope I'm wrong, honestly. |
| 19:22:55 | Mihail | I think we just should told to him whats wrong and ask if he can fix it. |
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| 19:42:44 | Mihail | saratoga: I use frequency and voltage scaling with g#1270 on both my zip and it seems very stable. Can you try latest git + #1270 on clip+ and clipv2? |
| 19:42:46 | fs-bluebot_ | Gerrit review #1270 at http://gerrit.rockbox.org/r/1270 : as3525: reverting I2C2 to non-interrupts version by Mihail Zenkov |
| 19:44:46 | Mihail | we use I2C2 to switch voltage so it can be related |
| 20:00 |
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| 20:02:08 | saratoga | Mihail: that does seem to fix the problem for me |
| 20:02:15 | saratoga | any idea why ? |
| 20:02:45 | saratoga | [Saint]: i think we should try to be polite, he may just not know how open projects are run |
| 20:03:24 | [Saint] | saratoga: well - as nicely as one can say "fuck this noise", I guess. |
| 20:03:54 | saratoga | we should encourage people to get involved with open source projects whenever possible |
| 20:04:23 | [Saint] | I can't see any way we could've possibly failed to do so. |
| 20:04:42 | [Saint] | To me the ommission seems deliberate, but, I want to be wrong. |
| 20:05:34 | [Saint] | Sometimes being the pessimist isn't that fun. I really do want to be wrong. I just can't fathom what anyone could've done "more right". |
| 20:05:38 | saratoga | my guess is he was concerned about looking unprofessional by pushing out code early |
| 20:05:46 | saratoga | which is not how it actually works, but people may not realize that |
| 20:07:12 | [Saint] | The unfortunate thing is how mature things are in his tree, and Rockbox's. |
| 20:07:46 | [Saint] | If they merge, there's either going to be a lot of duplication, or someone's gonna get real pissed off about having to re-invent the wheel again. |
| 20:09:55 | Mihail | saratoga: which build works "3f541018 + voltage scaling + gui boost" or latest git with g#1270? |
| 20:09:56 | fs-bluebot_ | Gerrit review #1270 at http://gerrit.rockbox.org/r/1270 : as3525: reverting I2C2 to non-interrupts version by Mihail Zenkov |
| 20:10:01 | pamaury | Maybe we can suggest an alternative: I will do the Fiio X1 port, the way I planned to do it: custom register headers and not reusing the jz47xx code (which is JZ4740 specific anyway), then I can merge his code and keep his copyright if he wants to |
| 20:10:36 | [Saint] | can we merge his shit with stripped attribution? |
| 20:10:39 | saratoga | Mihail: current git + voltage scaling + g1270 |
| 20:10:40 | fs-bluebot_ | Gerrit review #1270 at http://gerrit.rockbox.org/r/1270 : as3525: reverting I2C2 to non-interrupts version by Mihail Zenkov |
| 20:11:01 | Mihail | on both players? |
| 20:11:16 | saratoga | [Saint]: if its a problem you can ask him to put it back before commit |
| 20:11:30 | saratoga | Mihail: i only tried clip+, but that was always the one that gave the most trouble |
| 20:11:35 | saratoga | i will test zip now |
| 20:11:59 | [Saint] | saratoga: IFF he has a clear chain of attribution and didn't just squash it all. |
| 20:12:08 | [Saint] | the latter would be non-fun to talk about. |
| 20:12:09 | | Quit girafe3 (Read error: Connection timed out) |
| 20:12:15 | * | pamaury now realize that it's a real pain in the *** when you don't have the datasheet of a ddr ram and you need to reverse engineer all the timings... |
| 20:12:29 | [Saint] | uuugh. |
| 20:12:33 | saratoga | [Saint]: theres not that many files to track down |
| 20:12:47 | saratoga | these are manageable annoyances |
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| 20:13:24 | Mihail | saratoga: if you can find clip v1 we can do all test and commit g#1270 |
| 20:13:25 | fs-bluebot_ | Gerrit review #1270 at http://gerrit.rockbox.org/r/1270 : as3525: reverting I2C2 to non-interrupts version by Mihail Zenkov |
| 20:13:44 | saratoga | Mihail: sorry i forgot to search for it |
| 20:14:00 | pamaury | honestly I don't care that much about my own copyright but some of the code looks suspicously similar the GPL code released by Ingenic, for once a manufacturer releases some (albeit crappy) code, maybe erasing the copyright is not a very smart move |
| 20:14:24 | saratoga | by the way, i asked funman if he could look for my old fuzev1 and send to you if he can find it |
| 20:14:49 | [Saint] | hope it hasn't bred with any of his in the meantime. |
| 20:17:51 | saratoga | Mihail: zip seems to be working fine |
| 20:18:12 | saratoga | maybe someone here has an AMSv1 device to test the i2c changes on? |
| 20:20:00 | TheEaterOfSouls | I have a Clip v1 but I'm not very familiar with Rockbox development |
| 20:22:14 | saratoga | TheEaterOfSouls: i can make a test build if you want to try it |
| 20:22:48 | Mihail | TheEaterOfSouls: good. I provide test build for you. |
| 20:22:49 | TheEaterOfSouls | I can't test the changes by installing from git? |
| 20:23:21 | TheEaterOfSouls | As in latest development build installed with Rockbox Utility? |
| 20:23:28 | saratoga | no its not committed yet |
| 20:23:30 | TheEaterOfSouls | Sorry guys I know nothing |
| 20:23:30 | [Saint] | No. |
| 20:23:35 | saratoga | we want to make sure it works before committing |
| 20:24:39 | saratoga | by the way, it might not be a bad idea to test on fuzev1/e200v2 if possible since they'll also be affected |
| 20:30:07 | saratoga | Mihail: here is a build for the clipv1 with the i2c patch if that is what you want tested: http://web.mit.edu/mgg6/www/rockbox-clipv1_no_i2c_interrupts.7z |
| 20:30:26 | lebellium | I can test on fuze v1 but not before next sunday |
| 20:32:20 | TheEaterOfSouls | Is this the build I should test also? |
| 20:32:37 | Mihail | TheEaterOfSouls: you should check is charging work |
| 20:34:07 | Mihail | also check "system > debug > view i/o ports" is it show voltages |
| 20:34:18 | TheEaterOfSouls | Just AC charging or charging and data? |
| 20:34:34 | TheEaterOfSouls | Sorry I'm blind, I can't see anything in the debug menu |
| 20:34:40 | saratoga | Mihail: voltage scaling is disabled in that build (like in our git builds) |
| 20:35:43 | Mihail | in any case it was for AMSv2, but we should check ADC on AMSv1 |
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| 20:37:37 | Mihail | TheEaterOfSouls: you should connect and disconnect charging few times to check is charging detection work |
| 20:38:27 | saratoga | if you could also generally let us know if everything still works normally that would be nice (no crashes hopefully) |
| 20:40:12 | sansai | Ahoi. My Sansa Clip+ seems to be dying, esp. the internal flash (if it boots, I eventually get "could not write sector" panics). Is it possible to install Rockbox to a microSD card and boot from that? |
| 20:40:16 | TheEaterOfSouls | Charging behavior is normal |
| 20:40:45 | TheEaterOfSouls | Will play some FLAC and MP3 files |
| 20:40:57 | TheEaterOfSouls | Anything else specific you'd like me to test? |
| 20:42:21 | Mihail | is usb also work? |
| 20:42:41 | TheEaterOfSouls | Yes, it's showing up as usual |
| 20:42:55 | TheEaterOfSouls | Currently copying files to it |
| 20:43:02 | TheEaterOfSouls | Hasn't been used in a long time |
| 20:46:27 | Mihail | ok, thanks! |
| 20:49:53 | Mihail | saratoga: I think we can wait lebellium with fuze v1. In any case I want fix build without charging before commit. |
| 20:51:23 | lebellium | I haven't charged it for a while so I hope it's still working fine :D |
| 20:52:45 | Mihail | I hope too :) |
| 20:54:47 | lebellium | I just noticed that's my only AMSv1 device. My E200v1, C200v1 and Clipv2 are not.... |
| 21:00 |
| 21:01:53 | TheEaterOfSouls | My Clip v1 only has 2GB of storage, not very useful |
| 21:06:33 | TheEaterOfSouls | Also I get CPU noise through the earphone jack when it's connected to my computer as a disk |
| 21:06:50 | TheEaterOfSouls | Could be a problem with my specific player though |
| 21:09:56 | lebellium | CPU noise is a common issue on Clip |
| 21:11:31 | [Saint] | s/Clip/Pretty much any SanDisk player/ |
| 21:11:39 | [Saint] | (like, seriously - uuugh) |
| 21:11:45 | TheEaterOfSouls | I don't believe I've ever experienced it before on this player |
| 21:12:12 | TheEaterOfSouls | Everything else I've used is AS3525v2 |
| 21:12:15 | [Saint] | On most of mine you can hear CPU switching and NAND access. |
| 21:12:29 | [Saint] | But perhaps because I have some very sensitive IEMs? |
| 21:12:38 | [Saint] | I'm fairly willing to bet lebellium does too. |
| 21:12:47 | TheEaterOfSouls | That has to be annoying :( |
| 21:12:56 | [Saint] | Absolutely. |
| 21:13:19 | [Saint] | One of the many reasons my "daily driver" is a solid state ipod6g. |
| 21:13:31 | TheEaterOfSouls | Like I said though I only hear it when connected |
| 21:14:00 | [Saint] | Odd. |
| 21:14:27 | lebellium | yes, with my Westone UM3x (124dB - 56 Ohms) I can hear CPU noise on many Sansa players |
| 21:14:46 | lebellium | NAND access mostly |
| 21:14:52 | * | [Saint] nodsd |
| 21:14:55 | [Saint] | *nods |
| 21:16:05 | [Saint] | Mine are "fancier", his waaaaay more sensitive. Both apparenty fairly agile at hunting down hardware interference noises, though. |
| 21:16:40 | lebellium | the most recent ones got better though. There is a huge difference between E200 and Clip Zip for instance |
| 21:16:45 | [Saint] | If I plug one in to my terrible PC desk speakers I can't hear squat. |
| 21:17:04 | TheEaterOfSouls | Makes sense |
| 21:17:05 | [Saint] | So it definitely seems to be a "sensitive monitor" thing. |
| 21:17:20 | TheEaterOfSouls | I mainly only use my Zip and have never heard it |
| 21:17:40 | [Saint] | bargain basement IEMs? |
| 21:18:09 | TheEaterOfSouls | Usually over-the-ear |
| 21:18:27 | TheEaterOfSouls | Blue Microphone Mo-Fi |
| 21:18:30 | TheEaterOfSouls | So not really |
| 21:18:52 | [Saint] | Hmm. |
| 21:18:56 | [Saint] | I don't have a Zip. |
| 21:19:07 | [Saint] | Perhaps lebellium can enlighten us if it happens there also. |
| 21:19:15 | TheEaterOfSouls | It's never been an issue on my Plus either |
| 21:19:58 | [Saint] | Ah. Odd. Very odd. Sometimes it seems so bad to me on Clip+ that it sounds like my NAND is trying to tap out the lyrics in Morse. |
| 21:20:23 | lebellium | [Saint]: my Zip is currently connected over USB. I just plugged my UM3x and heard some terrible noise :) |
| 21:20:51 | [Saint] | Aha. Well, there's that, then. |
| 21:21:44 | [Saint] | I like my SanDisk players for doing stuff when having 35kg of iPod on my pocket isn't feasible. |
| 21:21:53 | [Saint] | ...but they're just soooooooooooooooooooo shit. |
| 21:22:06 | [Saint] | I literally can not get over how dirty and shitty they sound. |
| 21:22:42 | lebellium | I disagree here. Depending on the models there is more or less CPU noise and/or output hiss but the sound quality is fine I think |
| 21:22:51 | [Saint] | (note: 35kg iPod is a sliiiiiight exaggeration - they only weigh about 27.5kg) |
| 21:23:17 | [Saint] | lebellium: "CPU noise and/or output hiss but the sound quality is fine" |
| 21:23:27 | [Saint] | to me, those words in that order don't belong in any sentence. :) |
| 21:23:31 | lebellium | yes, these are different things |
| 21:23:32 | gevaerts | [Saint]: you need your *entire* ipod collection to match the sound of one sansa? :) |
| 21:23:57 | lebellium | I you get an headphone or less sensitives IEMs, the SQ is fine |
| 21:24:03 | [Saint] | lebellium: I guess I look at "sound quality" holistically, then. |
| 21:24:11 | TheEaterOfSouls | Don't the iPods use actually HDDs? |
| 21:24:17 | TheEaterOfSouls | Actual* |
| 21:24:26 | [Saint] | Mine did before I got done with 'em. |
| 21:24:28 | [Saint] | Yes. |
| 21:24:36 | TheEaterOfSouls | Yeah not for me then |
| 21:24:36 | gevaerts | Not the nanos |
| 21:24:41 | TheEaterOfSouls | Sometimes I take mine running |
| 21:24:48 | [Saint] | And? |
| 21:25:01 | TheEaterOfSouls | Shock isn't good for them |
| 21:25:19 | TheEaterOfSouls | 8GB Zip and 120 MicroSD card does it for me |
| 21:25:29 | TheEaterOfSouls | Everything in FLAC |
| 21:25:29 | [Saint] | There's a large skip buffer anyway, and you're only going to be reading from disk every ~40 minutes. |
| 21:26:06 | [Saint] | disc access doesn't happen as much as you might think when you've got ~60MB of RAm free. |
| 21:26:14 | TheEaterOfSouls | Wouldn't it take forever to load an album then? |
| 21:26:33 | [Saint] | Not at all. |
| 21:27:02 | [Saint] | I was assuming lossy in my ~40m estimate, though. |
| 21:27:12 | lebellium | [Saint]: I guess sound quality is more about soundstage, clarity and things like that than about CPU noise or hiss that most people won't experience |
| 21:27:13 | [Saint] | lossless codecs cut that down a fair bit. |
| 21:27:39 | [Saint] | lebellium: to me it is the some of all things that make the whole here. |
| 21:27:56 | [Saint] | faithful reproduction isn't worth a shit to me if the audio path is noisey as Hell. |
| 21:27:58 | lebellium | then I can understand you don't like the Sansas :) |
| 21:28:15 | [Saint] | *sum of all things |
| 21:28:21 | [Saint] | ...words are hard. |
| 21:29:24 | lebellium | but you should try the Zip |
| 21:29:31 | lebellium | it's quite cleaner than the older sansas! |
| 21:29:42 | [Saint] | TheEaterOfSouls: you likely couldn't do it yourself, due to physical impairments, but I happen to think a solid state converted ipod6g is the queen's tits. |
| 21:29:48 | TheEaterOfSouls | If you can obtain one, they're hella expensive now |
| 21:30:11 | TheEaterOfSouls | Depends on how it's assembled |
| 21:30:21 | [Saint] | Such is life. I snapped up a bunch of the players I liked when we all predicted DAPs dying here years ago. |
| 21:30:26 | [Saint] | Sadly, we were all right. |
| 21:30:37 | [Saint] | Smartphone killed the DAP star. |
| 21:30:41 | TheEaterOfSouls | I built my desktop but needed some help aligning the motherboard inside the case, front panel etc |
| 21:31:18 | [Saint] | Yeah, fiddly little flatcables that'll crack their traces if you even look at them the wrong was or say a curse word within earshot probably aren't for you. |
| 21:31:27 | [Saint] | Though you know you better than I. |
| 21:31:30 | TheEaterOfSouls | Yeah I grabbed some up too, have 3 Zips (one with a cracked screen and bad jack) and two Plus's |
| 21:31:43 | [Saint] | I really wish I was exaggerating about how fragile Apple's ribbons are. |
| 21:31:52 | [Saint] | They implode if a sparrow farts nearby. |
| 21:31:54 | TheEaterOfSouls | You're probably right |
| 21:32:28 | [Saint] | There's a bunch of people selling them pre-solid-state-ified, though. |
| 21:32:33 | [Saint] | But, at a premium. |
| 21:32:54 | TheEaterOfSouls | Yeah don't think that's for me |
| 21:33:01 | TheEaterOfSouls | I'm happy with my Zip |
| 21:33:25 | [Saint] | I could be reasonably happy with one if I used a 200GB sdcard I guess. |
| 21:33:54 | [Saint] | I like to script dumping random chunks of my collection to my DAPs. I have a lot of audio and get bored easily. |
| 21:33:57 | TheEaterOfSouls | You have to format them with FAT32 which is not possible in Windows |
| 21:34:08 | [Saint] | It is. |
| 21:34:22 | lebellium | ... and scroll over 100 000 tracks on the 1" display :D |
| 21:34:27 | [Saint] | Just not natively. For no real reason at all other than "fuck you, that's why". |
| 21:34:40 | [Saint] | But it can most certainly be done. |
| 21:34:41 | TheEaterOfSouls | If someone doesn't do it before me I hope to write an XFAT driver for Rockbox to teach me about OS fundamentals and stuff |
| 21:35:17 | [Saint] | There's a bunch of open exfat implementations to work from these days. |
| 21:35:19 | TheEaterOfSouls | Yeah I'm not a fan of third-party utilities for that sort of thing |
| 21:35:22 | TheEaterOfSouls | Just use Linux |
| 21:35:59 | [Saint] | I don't think we've talked very seriously about changing to exfat of <other_FS> other than the "we really have no reason to do this" discussion. |
| 21:36:16 | sansai | has anyone heard of success stories with heat treatment for players with hardware issues? (akin to baking graphics cards) |
| 21:36:28 | TheEaterOfSouls | Isn't Rockbox development kind of stalled? |
| 21:36:31 | TheEaterOfSouls | I mean for the most part |
| 21:36:35 | [Saint] | Not at all. |
| 21:36:40 | [Saint] | By no means. |
| 21:36:48 | [Saint] | Look at the commit list. |
| 21:37:03 | [Saint] | Look at gerrit. |
| 21:37:09 | TheEaterOfSouls | I have, seems to update with one of two every now and then |
| 21:37:17 | TheEaterOfSouls | Or* |
| 21:37:20 | [Saint] | Rockbox is still trudging alone at a glacial deathmarch pace. |
| 21:37:40 | [Saint] | I think "stalled" is a bit of a stretch though. |
| 21:37:42 | TheEaterOfSouls | Wonder for how long |
| 21:38:02 | gevaerts | At least three weeks! |
| 21:38:13 | [Saint] | I honestly think it's got another ~10 years in it potentially. |
| 21:38:18 | lebellium | Well, isn't "not at all" a bit exaggerated ? There are many commits from very few different developpers. |
| 21:38:27 | TheEaterOfSouls | Really? With no new hardware? |
| 21:38:55 | [Saint] | There's a lot of new ports happening behind the scenes you likely never see or hear of. |
| 21:39:08 | TheEaterOfSouls | I mean I've been a huge fan of DAPs but even I'm considering switching to my phone when I get one with more space |
| 21:39:14 | [Saint] | pamaury is a fucking machine in this regard. |
| 21:40:00 | TheEaterOfSouls | But not the new Clips :( |
| 21:40:15 | [Saint] | That's just plain not gonna happen. |
| 21:40:16 | TheEaterOfSouls | Not that they sound like very good players |
| 21:40:34 | pamaury | if the Fiio X1 port goes well, we could potentially have rockbox on the whole Fiio line: X1, X3, X5, that would quite nice. Sansa seems to have abandonned any interest in good players |
| 21:40:52 | [Saint] | Rockbox in its current form is in no way getting on any of the new Clips. |
| 21:41:04 | lebellium | [Saint]: yes,, but without pamaury and the few others, what would the commit list look like? Of course it's dying if you compare with 5 years or 10 years ago |
| 21:41:16 | | Quit pamaury (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 21:41:21 | [Saint] | IFF "rockbox" ever happened on these players, it would be unrecognizable. |
| 21:41:29 | [Saint] | It wouldn't be what you know and love. |
| 21:41:42 | TheEaterOfSouls | Just looked at the X5 |
| 21:41:46 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 21:41:54 | TheEaterOfSouls | That's extremely expensive for an audio player |
| 21:41:56 | | Join pamaury [0] (~pamaury@rockbox/developer/pamaury) |
| 21:42:08 | [Saint] | lebellium: That is true. But I don't think that those things are cut of the same cloth. |
| 21:42:13 | [Saint] | Yes, we're less active. |
| 21:42:15 | [Saint] | Have we stalled? |
| 21:42:18 | [Saint] | Fuck no. |
| 21:42:29 | TheEaterOfSouls | I feel terrible saying it but I think at that point if I didn't have my Zip I'd just use my phone |
| 21:42:43 | pamaury | yeah I agree the X5 is not worth its price, the X1 is a much nicer compromise |
| 21:43:07 | pamaury | There also are some Sony players, but I don't know what they are worth |
| 21:43:10 | [Saint] | The x5 is expensive because it isn't built like a happymeal toy piece of disposable electro-garbage. |
| 21:43:21 | [Saint] | Lots of their line are pricey. |
| 21:43:26 | TheEaterOfSouls | I just hate playing audio on touchscreen devices |
| 21:43:31 | [Saint] | But not so much you end up crying over your purchase. |
| 21:43:41 | TheEaterOfSouls | Personal preference I guess |
| 21:44:04 | TheEaterOfSouls | And without Rockbox voice support I can't really use other players |
| 21:44:11 | [Saint] | I dislike the feeling of any electronics that I think I could literally crush supervillain style in my bare hands. |
| 21:44:15 | pamaury | most players don't have touchscreen: the X1 to X5 line is button only, sansas too, Sony's too, only the fancy 1000€ android based players are touchscreen based |
| 21:44:33 | TheEaterOfSouls | Sorry I was referring to phones |
| 21:44:35 | [Saint] | yeah - and you really DON'T want a Dx* |
| 21:44:39 | [Saint] | like...really really. |
| 21:45:00 | [Saint] | Not for the sake of Rockbox alone, that's certain. |
| 21:45:21 | [Saint] | Nice-ish players. Not /overly/ disappointed I own them. |
| 21:45:25 | pamaury | oh sorry, yeah phones are suboptimal media players in my opinion, but I admit it's handy to only have one device |
| 21:45:25 | [Saint] | But I never use them. |
| 21:45:38 | pamaury | although I really much prefer the sound of my X1 compared to my phone |
| 21:45:41 | TheEaterOfSouls | Maybe I'll just build myself something with a Raspberry Pi running Arch and an interface written in Python |
| 21:45:54 | | Join MasterplasterPL [0] (~WIN@subscr-46-148-174-196.dhcp-docsis.net.tomkow.pl) |
| 21:45:56 | [Saint] | If you really hate yourself, go for it. |
| 21:46:01 | TheEaterOfSouls | Not to mention battery life |
| 21:46:05 | [Saint] | Raspi audio sounds like dirt on dirt. |
| 21:46:12 | TheEaterOfSouls | It does |
| 21:46:20 | [Saint] | and it'd be _huge_. |
| 21:46:24 | TheEaterOfSouls | But what else am I going to do? |
| 21:46:48 | [Saint] | pamaury just listed a bunch of newport candidates. |
| 21:46:56 | TheEaterOfSouls | I can listen to hours of audio, phone and laptop are both needed for other things so can't use the battery power |
| 21:46:57 | [Saint] | all available for purchase right now. |
| 21:47:23 | TheEaterOfSouls | Then I'll have to hope Rockbox gets running on them sometime soon |
| 21:47:34 | [Saint] | On many of them, it is. |
| 21:47:39 | TheEaterOfSouls | And I don't know much about RB development at this point so can't really help |
| 21:50:19 | TheEaterOfSouls | But these Fiio players look nice |
| 21:50:47 | TheEaterOfSouls | I'd probably get the X5 if I weren't paying for college |
| 21:51:12 | TheEaterOfSouls | Assuming Rockbox will be ready for it at some point |
| 21:52:02 | | Quit MasterplasterPL (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 22:00 |
| 22:03:14 | * | pamaury would probably not hear the difference between a X1 and X5 |
| 22:05:15 | sansai | does anyone know if the bootloader on the sansa clip+ is on the same memory chip as the other internal flash memory? |
| 22:07:14 | pamaury | sansai: iirc, the CPU has a ROM which can boot from the flash, and then the flash contains a bootloader I guess |
| 22:09:07 | bray90820 | OFF TOPIC: Anyone here have a FIIO X5 |
| 22:09:22 | sansai | thanks. so a corrupted flash might affect the bootloader |
| 22:11:57 | Mihail | sansai: yes, but we have few reports when bootloader ok but flash drive show only 30 MB |
| 22:13:08 | Mihail | IMHO we should add booting from sd card for this case |
| 22:13:59 | sansai | oh! well my player toggles between not showing up at all on usb, showing up as 4mb and showing 2gb just fine. Mihail: Yes, that would be very helpful, I asked if it was possible already earlier :) |
| 22:14:09 | | Quit ender` (Quit: Trump is basically what happens when you seed a Markov Chain out of 4chan threads and let it run for President. -- Remy Porter) |
| 22:16:06 | | Join MasterplasterPL [0] (~WIN@subscr-46-148-174-196.dhcp-docsis.net.tomkow.pl) |
| 22:18:43 | | Join ender` [0] (krneki@foo.eternallybored.org) |
| 22:18:53 | saratoga | i'm not sure if its possible to boot if the NAND is dead |
| 22:18:59 | saratoga | we patch the bootloader on NAND to execute |
| 22:19:10 | saratoga | and we can't patch the on chip ROM |
| 22:23:03 | Mihail | probably NAND not always fully dead as bootloader still work |
| 22:23:30 | pamaury | there is a bootloader in ROM (the one which shows the infamous 30MB drive in case of failure), which loads the NAND bootloader. We suspect that when you see the 30MB it's either because ROM bootloader cannot make the flash work (so flash is probably dead) |
| 22:23:44 | pamaury | at least that's my understanding |
| 22:25:02 | | Quit MasterplasterPL (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 22:25:32 | Mihail | we have few reports when user have rockbox logo and can start OF (but it freeze) and have 30 MB flash drive |
| 22:26:13 | saratoga | my understanding is that if you get the 4 MB partition the NAND is totally dead and nothing loaded from it |
| 22:26:16 | | Nick suYin is now known as suYin`OFF (mysuyin@server2.shellfire.net) |
| 22:26:38 | saratoga | if you get the 32 or 2 GB partition, the NAND loaded the firmware but then booting errored out at some later point |
| 22:26:52 | saratoga | i think it also varies a little between devices |
| 22:27:43 | saratoga | possibly in the > 4MB case we still have code execution and could try loading from SD card if one is present |
| 22:28:00 | saratoga | but i've never looked into it carefully and haven't seen a device with dead nand |
| 22:28:51 | pamaury | ah sorry I was confused between the 4MB and the 30MB |
| 22:30:18 | pamaury | yeah 4MB is dead flash (presumably), and 30MB is more like RAM disk or something like that, when the bootloader is corrupted |
| 22:38:56 | sansai | I have 2 Sansa players which sometimes show 4mb and sometimes show the full amount. At the moment both seem to lean more towards 4mb / dead it seems. |
| 22:42:34 | | Quit rela (Quit: Leaving) |
| 22:50:05 | TheEaterOfSouls | Is dead flash a common thing with Sansas? |
| 22:52:46 | Mihail | probably we have two checks: first at rom and second in bootloader. Is we have disassembled (with additional comments) sansa bootloader? |
| 22:55:53 | pamaury | probably funman did |
| 22:56:04 | pamaury | let me see if I have a copy |
| 22:57:25 | Mihail | TheEaterOfSouls: we have 5-10 reports over last year |
| 22:57:52 | pamaury | I have a dump of the clip+ rom, it has some comments but not a lot |
| 22:57:54 | TheEaterOfSouls | Well that's a little worrying... |
| 22:58:17 | pamaury | I tried to disassemble it to understand the USB code, but it's a nightmare |
| 22:58:19 | | Quit jtdesigns01 (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 22:58:24 | | Quit KD8NXH-Michigan (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 22:58:26 | pamaury | I can send it to you if you want |
| 22:58:55 | | Quit TheEaterOfSouls (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 45.0.1/20160315153207]) |
| 22:59:25 | Mihail | yes, it can be useful |
| 23:00 |
| 23:00:41 | pamaury | can you PM me your email ? |
| 23:01:39 | pamaury | or should I use the one from git ? |
| 23:02:00 | Mihail | done |
| 23:02:29 | Mihail | yes, same as in git |
| 23:03:19 | | Quit pamaury (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 23:03:49 | | Join pamaury [0] (~pamaury@rockbox/developer/pamaury) |
| 23:04:27 | pamaury | I also have the original disassembly work by funman of the clipv2, but the main firmware only, not sure that's of interest though |
| 23:05:04 | [Saint] | sansai: that's....genuinely interesting. |
| 23:05:26 | [Saint] | In my experience with recovering these devices if the 4MB partition is exposed you're pretty much fucked. |
| 23:06:00 | [Saint] | I don't think I have every guided anyone through a successful recovery when the device was exposing the 4MB partition. |
| 23:06:45 | [Saint] | Though I have seen a couple that unbricked themselves "accidentally" after exposing this 4MB partition. |
| 23:07:23 | sansai | yes, I don't know how, but that seems to have happened to the clip+ |
| 23:07:45 | [Saint] | That is genuinely interesting. |
| 23:07:47 | [Saint] | Indeed. |
| 23:08:38 | gevaerts | Sounds consistent with bad contacts somewhere |
| 23:09:07 | [Saint] | Yes. Quite possibly. |
| 23:09:35 | Mihail | pamaury: tanks! I think bootloader's dump should be enough for me :) |
| 23:09:58 | sansai | this is the dmesg protocol for the same clip+ not much time apart http://pastebin.ca/3414481 |
| 23:11:27 | sansai | And yes, I think its bad contacts / corrosion. I tried to clean it with alcohol today, but I think it made it worse. |
| 23:12:44 | Mihail | AFAIK when we have "Product: M200Plus" - bootloader not available |
| 23:12:47 | [Saint] | I always found it interesting that when these things flake out that they appear as M200Plus |
| 23:13:38 | [Saint] | That is what we know as the "recovery mode", but we don't know how to interact with, or the purpose of, this 4MB partition. |
| 23:13:52 | [Saint] | Nor the 32MB partition. |
| 23:14:10 | [Saint] | It would be really bloody nice to actually understand what it is we're doing here. |
| 23:14:50 | [Saint] | It does stand to reason that there would be a recovery/initialization mode that the manufacturer can expose. |
| 23:15:39 | [Saint] | I'm willing to bet it involves sending some magic over USB to "Do It Right (TM)". |
| 23:17:55 | pamaury | that's why I tried to disassemble the code, but it's fuc***** C++ with virtual tables all over the place, the code was clearly overengineered, I gave up eventually because I thought it was not worth it |
| 23:22:18 | Mihail | pamaury: can't open dump. I have IDA 6.1 it say "old format" and than try convert it to new, after that say "database is corrupt". Which version of IDA you use? |
| 23:22:55 | pamaury | I use IDA 6.8 but this one was made by IDA 5.5, I can convert it to a IDA 6.1 compatible format I think |
| 23:23:07 | pamaury | my IDA 6.8 refuses to open it anyway |
| 23:24:05 | pamaury | I've sent you a new one |
| 23:28:24 | Mihail | still have "database is corrupt", probably I should update IDA |
| 23:30:00 | pamaury | no, some IDA 6.1 versions have a blacklist |
| 23:30:19 | pamaury | let me try something else, I had a trick to bypass the blacklist but I need to remember how |
| 23:31:55 | | Join lebellium_ [0] (~chatzilla@ren77-h01-176-151-188-9.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) |
| 23:32:06 | Mihail | I think I can just install IDA 6.8 |
| 23:33:06 | pamaury | my IDA 6.8 cannot open this file either, I have to do my IDA 6.1 to use it |
| 23:33:09 | | Join lebellium__ [0] (~chatzilla@ren77-h01-176-151-188-9.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) |
| 23:33:21 | | Quit lebellium (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) |
| 23:33:26 | pamaury | but there is a trick to "anonymize" an ida file: http://0xebfe.net/blog/2013/01/13/how-to-create-anonymous-ida-pro-database-dot-idb/ |
| 23:33:29 | | Nick lebellium__ is now known as lebellium (~chatzilla@ren77-h01-176-151-188-9.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) |
| 23:36:32 | | Quit lebellium_ (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 23:37:26 | | Quit JanC (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 23:38:35 | | Quit lebellium (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 23:40:11 | | Join lebellium [0] (~chatzilla@ren77-h01-176-151-188-9.dsl.sta.abo.bbox.fr) |
| 23:40:58 | * | pamaury is struggling with idapython |
| 23:41:47 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 23:43:24 | Mihail | ImportError: No module named _idaapi :( |
| 23:44:04 | pamaury | I can't make idapyton work, I had this problem before, it's an issue with python on windows (I'm using wine to make things even simpler). I did manage to make it work once though |
| 23:46:00 | | Quit lebellium (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 45.0.1/20160315153207]) |
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| 23:50:52 | | Quit Mihail (Quit: Page closed) |
| 23:52:00 | pamaury | damn it, I'll try tomorrow on a Windows box |
| 23:52:06 | | Quit Guinness (Write error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 23:52:40 | | Join Guinness [0] (~Slayer@c-69-255-136-113.hsd1.va.comcast.net) |
| 23:52:49 | | Quit ender` (Quit: According to the FAA, the propeller blade didn't break off, it was just a case of "uncontained blade liberation.") |
| 23:55:02 | pamaury | haha, idapython seems to be working finally, just needed to install python 2.6 and not 2.7 |
| 23:57:23 | | Join PurlingNayuki [0] (~Thunderbi@v163-44-154-238.a00f.g.sin1.static.cnode.io) |
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