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| 00:28:13 | * | [Saint] wonders what is vague about "MPEG-1/MPEG-2, resolution can't be greater than target resolution and must be a factor of two" |
| 00:28:20 | [Saint] | (paraphrasing) |
| 00:29:00 | [Saint] | Reddit'll be a whole barrel of laughs. |
| 00:29:13 | [Saint] | "Hey, Reddit, how do I Rockbox?" |
| 00:29:20 | [Saint] | >Shut up, fag. |
| 00:32:43 | [Saint] | Seems like that place would be a barren wilderness if not for saratoga. |
| 00:32:59 | [Saint] | So there's at least one person there who actually knows something. WHich is pleasing. |
| 00:33:44 | [Saint] | Pity that his comments seem to get downvoted a lot in favor of outright misinformation or guesses. |
| 00:35:32 | [Saint] | well, one presumes saratoga3 is saratoga. |
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| 03:53:06 | __builtin | why are mutexes SWCODEC only? |
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| 05:16:25 | musickflgj | Hello! |
| 05:17:10 | musickflgj | ?? |
| 05:22:27 | [Saint] | Ask your question. |
| 05:22:56 | [Saint] | (and/or glance at the topic next time :)) |
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| 05:25:31 | musickflgj | The question is, where is the about page for the rockbox? I can't find it, and I don't really understand what it is. |
| 05:27:09 | [Saint] | http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/WhyRockbox |
| 05:27:18 | [Saint] | hiding in plain sight. |
| 05:27:55 | [Saint] | That page is hilariously out of date, though. |
| 05:28:50 | [Saint] | It can basically be summarized with "Why Rockbox? Your DAP firmware is a piece of shit, you know it, I know it, we all know it - that's why you went looking for a third party firmware for it - We are that firmware" |
| 05:30:03 | musickflgj | Ah, I see. Thank you. Is the quality of the music the same or is it worse/better? |
| 05:31:15 | [Saint] | Better and worse is very subjective. |
| 05:31:26 | [Saint] | It is infinitely more flexible, I can say that. |
| 05:32:09 | [Saint] | Some people like the artificially coloured audio from their DAPs and think that audio when faithfully reproduced sounds "bad" or "wrong". |
| 05:32:23 | [Saint] | WHen in fact they're just actually hearing it reproduced as intended. |
| 05:33:03 | musickflgj | Understood. So it would get the exact audio, rather then filtered audio, for better or worse? |
| 05:34:30 | [Saint] | As close to it as possible, yes. |
| 05:35:08 | [Saint] | If it turns out you do prefer artificial colouring/shaping, we have a full parametric EQ and bass/treble high/low pass shelf filters. |
| 05:35:43 | musickflgj | I see. I am debating buying a DAP, and am factoring these into my considerations. Thank you very much for your time. |
| 05:36:44 | [Saint] | These days I really don't think there is much of a market for a dedicated audio player. |
| 05:36:45 | [Saint] | Most people carry around a smartphone with enough computational power that inefficient routines really don't matter too much. |
| 05:37:03 | [Saint] | And Joe Average has very firmly adopted MP3 as the defacto codec. |
| 05:37:54 | [Saint] | If you're looking at it as an audio enthusiast, then, absolutely - dedicated DAP wins. |
| 05:38:12 | [Saint] | If you just want to play some music occasionally, you probably already own that device. |
| 05:39:01 | [Saint] | Oh - one other use case I guess: |
| 05:39:19 | [Saint] | "Essentially disposable device you don't mind getting soaked in body fluids at the gym" |
| 05:39:33 | [Saint] | That's a definite use case for a dedicated DAP. |
| 05:40:25 | [Saint] | Powerful mobile phones and the advent of fast unlimited mobile data pretty much killed the DAP scene. |
| 05:40:38 | musickflgj | I would like to play high quality classical FLAC's on a device. I do not have a fantastic budget, so I was looking towards the Sansa models. My phone, I believe, doesn't have the same quality as my computer, and so I'd like something that can play them right. The rockbox, then, fits well, because I don't want filtered music. I want to hear it all. |
| 05:41:08 | | Part Galois |
| 05:41:09 | | Join Galois [0] (djao@efnet.math.uwaterloo.ca) |
| 05:41:34 | musickflgj | The gym thing, maybe, but I'm not going to listen to classical anyways while working out. Haha, no data, maybe I'm wrong, would particularly like flac. |
| 05:41:51 | [Saint] | flac is a really really really low overhead codec. It is likely that your soundcard is the part providing the terrible experience. |
| 05:42:09 | [Saint] | an external USB DAC would probably solve that. |
| 05:42:43 | Galois | one problem I have with classical (notably opera) is that smartphones even today mess up gapless playback |
| 05:42:46 | [Saint] | and perhaps even the speakers themselves. |
| 05:43:08 | [Saint] | PC speakers are hardly precision monitors. |
| 05:43:26 | [Saint] | (and many of them do their own high/low shelf filtering in hardware - annoyingly) |
| 05:45:02 | [Saint] | Galois: hate to be a pedant (ha! right...), but, wouldn't that be a problem with all media equally, regardless of genre? |
| 05:45:43 | Galois | I think most of my pop music consists of individual songs amalgamated into albums where a gap isn't really noticeable |
| 05:45:55 | musickflgj | It would be excusable to most people. They dont really care much about sound quality. |
| 05:46:43 | | Quit krabador (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 05:47:14 | [Saint] | honestly, unless the source material has VERY high dynamic range - with modern LAME, a vast vast vast percentage of the population can't pick from flac8 or LAME 320CBR |
| 05:47:47 | [Saint] | Even someone trained has a pretty difficult time with this unless there is veru high dynamic range and with it, expected artifacts. |
| 05:47:55 | [Saint] | *very |
| 05:48:03 | Galois | for me a good pair of in-ear headphones does more for sound quality than whatever device I use, except for REALLY low-end devices |
| 05:48:38 | [Saint] | Right. Most people are frankly just kidding themselves with lossless vs. lossy. |
| 05:49:00 | [Saint] | We have more than enough data to prove rather categorically that "golden ear" audiophiles don't exist. |
| 05:49:23 | [Saint] | They'll claim they do, though, very loudly. |
| 05:49:25 | [Saint] | And often. |
| 05:49:32 | [Saint] | To anyone even remotely interested. |
| 05:49:53 | musickflgj | I just like music. I also like having the best for as little as possible. But, I have no claims on anything fortunately. |
| 05:50:43 | [Saint] | I can discern between mp3 and lossless in some very specific cases, most obviously the case of tracks with extremely high dynamic range. |
| 05:51:05 | [Saint] | But I know what I'm listening for, and I need to have specific samples to do it from. |
| 05:51:25 | [Saint] | I fail ABX on unknown lossless/lossy content reliably. |
| 05:51:27 | musickflgj | But I like the idea of FLAC itself. Perhaps I can hear nothing different. I do not know. I just know that it's harder to hear someone breathing in on an MP3 then in a FLAC. |
| 05:51:52 | musickflgj | But perhaps that is a placebo? |
| 05:52:00 | [Saint] | almost certainly. |
| 05:52:48 | Galois | everyone can abx the hard stuff like fatboy with experience. Normal music is much harder. |
| 05:52:54 | [Saint] | Though there's certainly a chance as you specified classical genre, which often has a very wide sweep for dynamic range. |
| 05:53:04 | | Quit michaelni (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 05:54:13 | [Saint] | Modern music where everything has been condensed and packed suitably for the "loudness wars" contest popular music has going on, and...yeah, I would think reliably picking out encoding artifacts to be much much harder. |
| 05:54:54 | [Saint] | Though the current joke isn't lossy or lossless in the deluded audipphile world. |
| 05:55:02 | [Saint] | The current joke is "HD" audio. |
| 05:55:07 | musickflgj | Oh? |
| 05:55:24 | [Saint] | 96bit/192KHz "HD" audio. |
| 05:55:37 | [Saint] | Because apparently we're bats and here at sub and supersonic frequencies... |
| 05:55:54 | [Saint] | (hint: we don't) |
| 05:56:35 | [Saint] | 16/48 is plenty to faithfully reproduce the entire human audible range. |
| 05:56:46 | [Saint] | we can actually do it in a tiny bit over 15 bits. |
| 05:57:08 | [Saint] | stacking on more numbers there does absolutely nothing in consumer audio. |
| 05:57:27 | [Saint] | it is useful in recording and mastering, but not at the consumer level. |
| 05:57:45 | Galois | well, it lets the consumer do recording and mastering ... that's not nothing |
| 05:58:01 | Galois | re-recording, re-mastering, whatever |
| 05:58:10 | [Saint] | Yes but it isn't marketed as such. |
| 05:58:30 | [Saint] | They very clearly market it in most circumstances as an improvement in SQ. |
| 05:58:42 | [Saint] | Which is just batshit. |
| 05:59:09 | [Saint] | There's no more audio in there. Lossless is lossless. |
| 05:59:17 | [Saint] | There's just a bunch of empty space. |
| 05:59:34 | musickflgj | How is it useful in recording and mastering though? |
| 05:59:43 | musickflgj | If it's just empty space I mean. |
| 06:00 |
| 06:00:04 | Galois | think of it as a photograph with too many megapixels for you to see at normal size |
| 06:00:14 | Galois | the extra pixels are still useful if you zoom in |
| 06:01:20 | [Saint] | well done, good analogy. |
| 06:01:23 | Galois | so you know maybe you want to re-sample something at quarter speed. Suddenly your 192khz becomes 48khz. That's zooming in. |
| 06:01:43 | [Saint] | That's a damn good analogy, actually. |
| 06:02:00 | [Saint] | Couldn't have said it better myself. |
| 06:02:11 | [Saint] | I'll steal that for future arguments. |
| 06:02:17 | Galois | yer welcome |
| 06:04:20 | [Saint] | There's actually a very good argument in favor of not using 48KHz samplerate, but honestly I don't think anyone really notices the largely imperceptible pitch shift between 44.1 and 48KHz. |
| 06:04:48 | [Saint] | People find it very difficult to detect very minor pitch shiting. |
| 06:04:52 | [Saint] | Arrr, shifting. |
| 06:05:37 | [Saint] | You can speed up content as much as ~8% and have people just totally not notice it unless they have a frame of reference. |
| 06:05:56 | [Saint] | So a .0* difference isn't going to ruffle any feathers. |
| 06:06:34 | [Saint] | (Television speeds up or slows down shows to make up for overtime/undertime _all the time_) |
| 06:07:04 | [Saint] | If they're running a minute or so early, or late, they'll just increment the playback speed by a largely imperceptible amount. |
| 06:08:07 | musickflgj | I see. Good analogy btw @Galois |
| 06:08:11 | [Saint] | Speed up a 40 minute show for a 60 minute time slot by ~8%, and bam, that's three more minutes of commercials. |
| 06:08:21 | [Saint] | And no one notices. |
| 06:08:59 | musickflgj | ?? |
| 06:09:08 | musickflgj | Im not understanding that one. |
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| 06:09:31 | musickflgj | Do you mean that it can be played faster then the original recording and no one notices? |
| 06:09:39 | [Saint] | Yes. Absolutely. |
| 06:10:07 | [Saint] | Humans are only really good at picking up differences in pitch or tone when they have a direct comparison. |
| 06:10:30 | Galois | in specialized contexts, people will notice. I used to do fansubs. I noticed even the slightest deviations from standard timing. |
| 06:10:39 | Galois | normally, people won't notice. |
| 06:10:55 | [Saint] | Yeah, granted. |
| 06:11:25 | musickflgj | I see. Kind of like how cartoon characters can move their lips and no one notices unless they look at it and try to match it with the word? |
| 06:11:43 | [Saint] | I kinda went on a tangent there, sorry - I went off the deep end as to why there's a reason some people won't use 48KHz samplerate, but how that reason is largely inconsequential for the masses. |
| 06:12:21 | [Saint] | musickflgj: that's usually a result of the original audio stream, being replaced with a translation. |
| 06:12:32 | [Saint] | But I guess you could say it was similar. |
| 06:12:37 | musickflgj | It's fine. It's better then the place was before I started asking questions, "dead". |
| 06:12:52 | musickflgj | I see. |
| 06:15:04 | Galois | like you record something off the air. Then you time it. Then you get the DVD release, and you think your timings from before will work, but no, it's off. And sometimes it's off by different amounts because they varied the amount and locations of nonstandard timing. |
| 06:15:53 | Galois | in that context it was very easy for me to see even a one-frame difference, which isn't that hard (0.03 seconds), but still, I would never notice it if I weren't doing subtitling |
| 06:18:28 | * | [Saint] nods |
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| 06:58:45 | musickflgj | Agreed. Thank you fine people for the discussion, I will be on my way now. |
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| 13:02:15 | pamaury | __builtin: re mutex and SWCODEC. Probably a relic from the past to reduce code size because mutexes were only used on SWCODEC platform |
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| 13:19:28 | robertd | hi, im trying to make a uboot image and receive this error http://pastebin.com/gngUkuA6 |
| 13:22:34 | pamaury | robertd: why do you want to make a uboot image ? |
| 13:23:27 | pamaury | I am not sure I would attempt to reflash uboot on the sony players, if you fail, you will brick the device |
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| 13:25:22 | robertd | <pamaury> I was trying to draft from the sony sources. I wrote an update script and working on the kernel |
| 13:25:40 | | Quit ender` (Quit: Sufficiently advanced stupidity is indistinguishable from malice.) |
| 13:27:10 | | Join ender` [0] (krneki@foo.eternallybored.org) |
| 13:27:17 | robertd | <pamaury> I also found an obscure device the PanasonicMV100 which uses the emma mobile. The update is strange it comes as a zip file |
| 13:27:45 | pamaury | the thing you have to be aware of is that (assuming it works like on mine), if you break any of uboot or the kernel, you will brick the device, just saying ;) Because when the device boots, if loads uboot. Then uboot looks at the NVP, if it see the update flags, it loads the kernel with the initrd that runs the update script. Otherwise it runs the kernel normally |
| 13:28:16 | pamaury | robertd: the upgrade method on the sony players is very specific to sony |
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| 13:29:36 | robertd | <pamaury> Yes, i wanted to know how the update process works http://pastebin.com/2UPEYU3i |
| 13:32:15 | pamaury | it's very easy to brick a Sony player: if the regular kernel does not boot or usb does not work, you cannot change the NVP update flag and thus cannot upgrade => bricked. If you upgrade does not clear the NVP flag, the device will be stuck in an upgrade loop => brick. If uboot fails boot, there is no usb recovery mode => brick :( |
| 13:32:49 | pamaury | (unless you are willing to remove the emmc from the board, which is huge pain) |
| 13:33:57 | pamaury | ideally you would want to flash a different uboot that has a recovery mode, but unless you are ready to unbrick, there is 0% chance you will get it right the first time I would say |
| 13:34:22 | robertd | <pamaury> I need to add the entry in the upgrade file. the kernel 2.6.23 is the source for a several devices |
| 13:34:41 | pamaury | robertd: what do you mean "add the entry" |
| 13:36:58 | pamaury | ? |
| 13:37:25 | robertd | <pamaury> To give the instructions to the kernel to remove the upgrade flag |
| 13:38:01 | pamaury | robertd: yes, like this: https://gist.github.com/pamaury/1bd21f04388132ce2c13e6092f508b35 |
| 13:38:28 | pamaury | if I were you that you be the first instruction I run. Also check before-hand that you file passes syntax check |
| 13:42:36 | robertd | <pamaury> thank you. I am having a lot of trouble trying to dump the memory. So far I am obtaining info from the firmware extraction |
| 13:43:51 | pamaury | robertd: what are you trying to dump ? |
| 13:45:13 | robertd | <pamaury> a part of the roofts |
| 13:46:06 | pamaury | you need to execute code on the device for this |
| 13:48:57 | pamaury | or remove the emmc from the board |
| 13:49:23 | robertd | <pamaury> Exactly, i am trying to draft with that purpouse. For me removing the emmc from the board is beyond my capabilities |
| 13:50:31 | pamaury | on my device, the emmc is on a separate board that can be easily removed. Accessing it is a not exactly easy but I managed to unbrick (twice), so if you are afraid of bricking, I can run it on mine before. In the worst case, I can unbrick |
| 13:51:28 | robertd | <pamaury> which device do you own ? |
| 13:53:10 | pamaury | nwz-e460 |
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| 13:57:36 | robertd | <pamaury> The e460 is from the same generation of the nwz a60 and the S760 |
| 13:58:38 | pamaury | what is your device again ? |
| 13:59:06 | pamaury | all those devices are very similar anyway, the cpu is the same, one would need to check but even the kernel and uboot are all incredibly similar |
| 13:59:07 | robertd | <pamaury> the nwza867 |
| 14:00 |
| 14:00:39 | | Quit paulk-collins (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
| 14:03:12 | pamaury | robertd: also my "quick" analysis of uboot suggest that it has a recovery console of some kind, but I never understood how to activate it, maybe there are pins on the board |
| 14:04:21 | robertd | <pamaury> I have been searching and reading a lot of info about those devices . Let me see if i can find something about the recovery console |
| 14:04:36 | | Join paulk-collins [0] (~paulk@liv47-1-78-221-56-46.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 14:05:38 | pamaury | well technically it is a uboot console, but I just don't understand from the uboot code how it's activated. I have to admit that was some time ago that I looked at it, I don't remember the details |
| 14:07:40 | robertd | <pamaury> there is an old post from japan in which they ported android to the em1 |
| 14:09:28 | pamaury | what kind of port are you aiming at ? native port or hosted port ? |
| 14:12:00 | robertd | <pamaury> I believe that the hosted port would be easier |
| 14:12:28 | pamaury | yes, then you don't need to touch either uboot or the kernel |
| 14:14:40 | robertd | <pamaury> Now I see why porting rockbox to new devices it is so difficult and takes a lot of effort. |
| 14:19:15 | pamaury | yes.... and at on hosted port you are not starting from scratch, but you have to play nice with the manufacturer's kernel/code. If I remember correcty, on the sony, all the UI and all is just a single executable that is run after the device boots. You could simply rename it, and replace it with another one that would be rockbox (and have the possibility to run the OF by pushing a button on boot) |
| 14:22:49 | robertd | <pamaury> That is just what I am aiming for. |
| 14:23:57 | robertd | <pamaury> There is another method that was used with the ereaders from sony. Crafting an upgrade as if it where an android device |
| 14:25:40 | pamaury | I am not sure that's a good idea in this case |
| 14:26:18 | pamaury | I doubt it would be able to run android, not enough RAM and also you would an android port for this specific device, which you don't have |
| 14:27:48 | robertd | <pamaury> I agree. In this case it is an old device |
| 14:40:29 | | Quit athidhep (Quit: athidhep) |
| 14:40:45 | pamaury | robertd: I have another suggestion to help bootstrap the whole thing. I would pack an upgrade with two file: first the shell script, second a liux executable that would want to test-run. The script would clear the upgrade flag, load a few modules, mount file systems if necessary and then run the second file |
| 14:41:02 | pamaury | this way you can test an executable without risking (too much) to brick |
| 14:41:42 | pamaury | the executable would run with the upgrade kernel/initrd so it's not exactly the same environement as the real thing but it let's you test and debug a few helpful thing |
| 14:42:16 | pamaury | most notably, you can understand how keys work (there is a special icx_keys module on my device) and then design a bootloader that either exec the OF or RB based on keys |
| 14:42:38 | pamaury | I can try it on mine, see if I can go anywhere with this |
| 14:42:48 | pamaury | the "hardest" part is to manage to compile the sony cross compiler :-p |
| 14:42:57 | pamaury | (which I haven't tried yet) |
| 14:44:50 | pamaury | ideally I would like not to really on this cross compiler but rather have an equivalent crosstool config file that works, because otherwise toolchain rot and you end up with the yp-r0 situation |
| 14:45:42 | robertd | <pamaury> That is a great suggestion. I will use that aproach. Yes, the sony tool triplet is a nightmare they give you the gcc but not the croos binutils |
| 14:46:14 | pamaury | yeah, but I except their toolchain has nothing special |
| 14:46:30 | pamaury | also it would be a good idea to document all of this on the wiki, unlike what I did :-/ |
| 14:48:31 | robertd | <pamaury> Indeed, even the kernel requests for the arm-sony-linux cross compiler |
| 14:49:14 | pamaury | maybe we should start working on the cross compiler, get it to work or get an equivalent cross tool config |
| 14:51:29 | pamaury | on the nwz-e463, sony provides a package named "sony-cross-gcc-for-dev-4.1.2-05000204.src" |
| 14:51:53 | robertd | <pamaury> I managed to find the sony cross binutils 2.23 but the poison patch included is giving me a hard time |
| 14:53:16 | robertd | <pamaury> it is the same for the A-series the cross gcc 4.1.2 |
| 14:56:06 | pamaury | where did you find the binutils ? |
| 14:56:15 | pamaury | it's also annoying that they provide rpm package |
| 14:56:48 | pamaury | I had a look at the patches in the RPM for gcc 4.1.2, most (if not almost all) are simply backports of bugs |
| 14:57:06 | pamaury | we can simply use a more recent gcc (like 4.9) to get rid of all of them I think |
| 14:57:15 | robertd | <pamaury> In the sony global distribution. It is under linux audio not the devices source code page |
| 14:58:00 | pamaury | hum, I can't see it, am I here: http://oss.sony.net/Products/Linux/Audio/ |
| 14:59:30 | robertd | <pamaury> my mistake sorry, http://oss.sony.net/Products/Linux/Projector/VPL-SW635C.html |
| 14:59:52 | pamaury | thanks |
| 15:00 |
| 15:01:57 | robertd | <pamaury> you are most welcome it is the only binutils available from the global source page |
| 15:02:05 | pamaury | robertd: I am not familar with RPM, what "%{sony_vendor}" means ? |
| 15:02:10 | pamaury | oh wow |
| 15:02:22 | pamaury | is it an environment variable ? |
| 15:03:42 | pamaury | robertd: the binutils patches also look like bugfixes, except maybe for the poison patch, which might be a sony thing, but I would need to check this |
| 15:04:14 | pamaury | also they use things like %sony_cross_dev_setup |
| 15:04:57 | robertd | <pamaury> Yes The packages had to be converted |
| 15:05:01 | robertd | one sec |
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| 15:07:11 | pamaury | I might be wrong but my feeling is that any reasonable arm linux cross binutils and gcc will do, AS LONG AS we have the properly glibc/whatever-libc-they-use includes and linker file right |
| 15:07:21 | pamaury | that means matching exactly the one on the device |
| 15:13:02 | pamaury | honestly the whole thing look at a f**** nightmare ^^ |
| 15:13:33 | | Quit NathanV (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
| 15:13:45 | robertd | <pamaury> I had to use the alien package to convert the rpm files. Yes it is a mess of a process to do the crosscompiler |
| 15:13:56 | pamaury | what is "alien" ? |
| 15:15:24 | robertd | it is a program that converts rpm files to .deb |
| 15:16:05 | pamaury | oh, so you are trying to install it this way, that's not a bad idea actually, to start |
| 15:16:59 | robertd | <pamaury> thanks, they include the glibc 2.7 for the device |
| 15:17:41 | pamaury | yes, but glibc 2.7 seems to depend on another one, libopt |
| 15:19:30 | robertd | <pamaury> it is inside the same package sony-devel-libopt-build-libc |
| 15:23:47 | robertd | <pamaury> I changed the line for the em1-config which refers to arm-sony-linux-gcc for the cross compiler that I use. Some programs run but u-boot fails |
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| 15:25:40 | timemob | <robertd> do you realize how freaking annoying your way of quoting the nickname is. it's absolutely infuriating because normally you do "pamaury: text here". FYI. |
| 15:26:00 | timemob | your shit looks like you're pasting what pamaury says. |
| 15:26:36 | robertd | Sorry I did not mean to be annoying. Wont happen again. |
| 15:27:14 | pamaury | timemob: no need to be rude |
| 15:27:16 | robertd | pamaury the problem with the kernel from the souce code is that I am getting mixed implicit and normal rules: deprecated syntax warning |
| 15:27:42 | timemob | pamaury, I know. just watched it for the last few hours and it's super buggy :) |
| 15:28:41 | pamaury | robertd: what is the build dependency order ? do you really need to build the kernel ? |
| 15:28:53 | | Quit timemob (Client Quit) |
| 15:31:02 | robertd | pamaury Indeed, I was trying to compare which modules are included with the one I manage to extract from the update |
| 15:31:24 | pamaury | robertd: the sony source contains almost nothing iirc |
| 15:32:30 | pamaury | all the interesting modules are out of tree I am afraid |
| 15:33:47 | robertd | pamaury then all comes to the using the suggested procedure. Thank you, you saved me from a lot of work |
| 15:36:29 | pamaury | robertd: could you do something for me ? dump all the gcc and binutils config ? |
| 15:36:47 | pamaury | something like sony-arm-gcc -v |
| 15:37:02 | pamaury | and put on pastebin |
| 15:37:24 | pamaury | hum, I think there is more to dump, let me find the exact command |
| 15:39:17 | pamaury | also gcc -dumpspecs |
| 15:39:56 | pamaury | there must be an equivalent for the binutils but I can't find it |
| 15:40:53 | robertd | pamaury ok I am into it. let me give it a try |
| 15:43:19 | pamaury | basically I'd like to come up with a crosstool config that gives the same result, I only want what is necessary to build an executable for linux, so probably gcc, binutils and maybe glibc (I don't know how it works w.r.t includes and linker files for cross compilers) |
| 15:59:17 | robertd | pamaury do I need to extract from this ? http://pastebin.com/J6PtHp8y Sorry for the delay I am really slow with this |
| 15:59:49 | pamaury | not sure what you mean |
| 16:00 |
| 16:00:01 | pamaury | are you trying to do the cross tool config ? |
| 16:01:11 | robertd | pamaury, yes It will take me a while... sorry |
| 16:03:52 | pamaury | no that's fine, take your time, but please do pastebin the gcc -v output, just so that it's somewhere and can serve as a reference |
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| 16:21:00 | __builtin | pamaury: thanks! |
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| 17:00 |
| 17:09:35 | pamaury | wodz (logs): apparently I made a mistake, I can access TCSM0 by its virtual "physical address": 0x932b000c and 0xb32b000c, I don't know why it didn't work last time I tried |
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| 17:39:22 | pamaury | that means that I can use EBASE, also it means that I can keep the RAM at 0x80000000 and have a single wired entry to map for example 0x88000000-0x8fffffff uncached to 0xb0000000-0xb7ffffff which includes TCSM0, TCSM1 and SRAM :) |
| 17:39:58 | pamaury | maybe not such a big range, a single entry 16MB is enough to cover all TCSM and SRAM |
| 17:40:27 | pamaury | actually we several entries I could map them so that they look like they are adjacent but I am not sure it's really worth it |
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| 21:42:10 | | Join Jason__ [0] (4d638c8d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.77.99.140.141) |
| 21:42:25 | Jason__ | Hi |
| 21:42:41 | Jason__ | I wonder if there is still a market for Rockbox with Android and iPhones and Spotify etc |
| 21:43:48 | Jason__ | amyone home |
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| 21:44:51 | Jason__ | hi Wodz |
| 21:45:03 | wodz | Jason__: hi |
| 21:45:17 | Jason__ | Is there still a market for Rockbox? |
| 21:45:26 | Jason__ | with the advent of music streaming from Spotify or Deezer? |
| 21:45:37 | Jason__ | and everyone using their phones for music playback? |
| 21:45:50 | wodz | pamaury: It is really great gift from ingenic that they decided to support EBASE |
| 21:46:17 | wodz | Jason__: Technically speaking there were never market for rockbox. It is not commercial product |
| 21:46:29 | Jason__ | yea but you know what I am getting at |
| 21:46:34 | Jason__ | Do people still use it? |
| 21:47:19 | wodz | Jason__: I am not the right person to ask. For me rockbox is hobby. I like to tinker with hardware/software. Reverse engineering is pure fun for me :p-) |
| 21:47:26 | Jason__ | Ok |
| 21:47:34 | Jason__ | I used to use Rockbox many years ago |
| 21:47:59 | Jason__ | on an Archos Jukebox recorder, then an iRiver device, then an iPod |
| 21:48:14 | Jason__ | but I now have an iPhone which does everything |
| 21:48:46 | wodz | Jason__: If that service your needs, good for you |
| 21:49:18 | Jason__ | It does |
| 21:49:21 | gevaerts | But does it do anything *well*? :) |
| 21:49:32 | Jason__ | Yes |
| 21:49:43 | Jason__ | I think Rockbox plugins spawned the ideas for 'apps' |
| 21:50:44 | wodz | actually plugins are probably the weakest part of rockbox. At least from the maintainer/dev point of view |
| 21:51:06 | Jason__ | But they do provide stuff like games and whatnot |
| 21:51:36 | gevaerts | Given that java applets on phones predate rockbox, I'd doubt that |
| 21:52:02 | Jason__ | Ok |
| 21:52:11 | Jason__ | I do miss my Archos Recorder 10 |
| 21:52:15 | Jason__ | my first ever MP3 player |
| 21:54:27 | Jason__ | It was built like a tank with its metal body and rubber corners |
| 21:55:44 | gevaerts | To be fair, it had to be, otherwise it'd have collapsed under its own weight :) |
| 21:56:43 | Jason__ | Lol |
| 21:56:51 | Jason__ | I think the standalone MP3 player is dying |
| 21:56:56 | Jason__ | as everybody now uses phones |
| 21:58:19 | gevaerts | That's definitely true |
| 21:58:43 | Jason__ | Yea |
| 21:58:53 | gevaerts | Although there seems to be a remaining niche for small, light and cheap players, which people seem to like to use while exercising |
| 21:58:59 | Jason__ | Its extremely rare to find a device that supports line-in recording (whether recording to WAV or MP3) |
| 21:59:04 | gevaerts | But that "cheap" bit usually means "no rockbox" |
| 21:59:10 | Jason__ | Yea |
| 21:59:23 | Jason__ | I haven't bought a CD for the last few years as I have a Spotify account |
| 22:00 |
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| 22:37:16 | * | pamaury has a weird bug with usb on jz4760B, again |
| 22:38:39 | wodz | pamaury: which one this time? |
| 22:39:00 | pamaury | I wanted to upload by test rockbox bootloader using hwstub_load |
| 22:39:07 | pamaury | and it fails with "unspecified usb error |
| 22:39:41 | pamaury | I pinned this down the size of transfers right now. If I transfer ~3900 bytes per request it works, but ~4000 fails |
| 22:40:14 | pamaury | I have no idea of what's going one currently, maybe it's hitting the time limit for control transfers, I need to fire the usb analyzer again |
| 22:51:15 | pamaury | wodz: I saw your comment on gerrit how coprocessor hazard |
| 22:52:13 | pamaury | I am award of the potential problem but on mips32r1 I don't what else I can do, the jump+nop gives two cycle, is there any other option ? |
| 22:53:42 | pamaury | also the jz4760 manual says that mfc0 has a 3 interlock cycle dependency, so if you try to use v0, the hazard will be cleared by stalling |
| 22:53:52 | pamaury | (at least that's my understanding of interlock) |
| 22:54:58 | pamaury | but yeah I see your point that some cores might have a different behaviour |
| 22:57:20 | wodz | pamaury: if jz is interlocked we are safe |
| 22:58:12 | wodz | pamaury: barrier instructions in r2 where invented just because of implementation differences. There is no standard way on mips to know how many nops/snops are safe |
| 23:00 |
| 23:02:56 | wodz | btw. 4k core in atj is not interlocked |
| 23:07:43 | | Quit pamaury (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) |
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| 23:08:30 | pamaury | oh ok, I thought most recent mips were interlocked |
| 23:08:58 | pamaury | well then I guess the code might need some fixing, perhaps we need a define in target-config.h that gives the mips revision, or the existence of barrier |
| 23:12:09 | wodz | pamaury: apparently I remembered wrong m4k IS interlocked by introducing 'slips' instead of stalls |
| 23:12:23 | pamaury | slips ? |
| 23:13:37 | wodz | https://imagination-technologies-cloudfront-assets.s3.amazonaws.com/documentation/MD00016-2B-4K-SUM-01.18.pdf see page 25 and later |
| 23:16:04 | pamaury | ah, a slip is a bubble :) |
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| 23:48:52 | [Saint] | Bloody hell cron. |
| 23:49:21 | [Saint] | Y u no export user PATH explicitly when the user crontab is built? |
| 23:49:28 | [Saint] | I swear it used to... |
| 23:50:17 | [Saint] | I wondered what the hell was going on there for a second. Couldn't execute from crontab to ~/bin* without exporting the path specifically. |
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