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#rockbox log for 2016-12-19

00:04:03*chrisjj wonders if the audience for his question is now zero.
00:17:32 Quit petur (Quit: Leaving)
00:24:54 Quit TheLemonMan (Quit: "It's now safe to turn off your computer.")
00:33:17***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:36:11__builtinjust ask
00:53:25 Quit Senji (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
00:55:44chrisjjI think I found the answer. It was about reverse button mapping. To let the code refer to a logical button by its physical button name.
00:57:35chrisjjISTM there's none in the code. Yet there is (manually) in the Manual. In which case, got to wonder why the manual goes to the trouble. AFAIC this just created confusion for new users −− the UI and the manual using different names for the same button.
01:01:49 Quit ender` (Quit: The other day Windows told me I might be a victim of software counterfeiting. Funny, I always thought I was a beneficiary.)
01:08:53__builtinIf you think there are so many problems with the manual, why don't you try and improve it?
01:10:36 Quit chrisjj (Quit: Page closed)
01:10:57 Join chrisjj [0] (5001d87b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.
01:11:03chrisjjI think I mentioned just one problem :-)
01:11:43chrisjjBut I would not attempt to fix this until I understood the cause. Because the cause is more likely to be the best place for a fix, I think.
01:12:22__builtinOur conversation from a while back and your complaints about the wiki suggest otherwise. ;)
01:13:37chrisjjUm, a fix to the manual is not going to improve the wiki! I mentioned one problem with the /manual/.
01:15:04__builtinThe sad truth about documentation is that devs hate writing it, if you see a problem you're probably going to need to fix it yourself; no-one will do it for you.
01:15:50chrisjjIt seems to me the manual policy is to use native button names. E.g. it names the centre button on the Iriver "Navi".
01:20:08chrisjjI accept Devs hate writing documentation. And I can see why RB manual writing is more hateful that most. E.g. because AFAICS the code isn't helping at all on structuring the UI metadata.
01:29:45chrisjjOn a completely different subject, is there any way to set the default action for a given file type?
01:30:20__builtinwell, "kind of"
01:30:47chrisjjAh, that probably explains why I couldn't find it :-)
01:30:52chrisjjPray do tell.
01:30:54__builtinyou can change the viewer plugin for a flie extension
01:30:59__builtinedit viewers.config
01:33:40 Quit cc___ (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
01:34:43chrisjjI find no entry for e.g. WMA. Yet WMA has a default action of Play.
01:40:00__builtinwell, in that case it's hardcoded somewhere else
01:42:01chrisjjOn e.g. "mp3,viewers/vbrfix,5" what's the number mean?
01:42:24__builtinlooks like the file you want to edit is apps/filetree.c
01:42:50__builtinspecifically ft_enter()
01:47:16 Quit ZincAlloy (Quit: Leaving.)
01:47:26chrisjjThanks. I don't see any file-extension-specific actioning there.
01:47:56chrisjjIn particular, all FILE_ATTR_AUDIO goes to e.g. paylist_insert_track(NULL, buf, PLAYLIST_INSERT_LAST, true, true);
01:48:39__builtinwhy are you treating treating wma as special?
01:52:34chrisjjIt is RB treating WMA as special. It viewers.config has entries for MP3, WAV. Not WMA. Yet all have a default action of Play.
01:53:34__builtinviewers.config is not the default action for a file type, it simply lists plugins which are capable of opening a certain file extension
01:54:13__builtinthe viewers listed are utilities that perform actions specific to the file type, i.e. encoding
01:54:31chrisjjOK, so re Q: "is there any way to set the default action for a given file type?", where is the "kind of" to be found?
01:55:21__builtinwell, the "kind of" was assuming you wanted a plugin to do something
01:57:08chrisjjIf a plug-on can do what I want, that will be great :-)
01:57:30__builtinwhat do you want?
02:00:46__builtinby the way, it would be possible for you do define a new category and make WMA part of it under apps/filetypes.c
02:01:52chrisjjE.g. change WMA (or all audio file) default action (in File Browser) from Play to Enqueue.
02:02:26__builtinoh, that should be easy
02:03:29__builtinI believe there's a setting called "party mode" somewhere, from looking at the code
02:05:19chrisjjYeah, there is, but it prevent skipping, bars plugins etc.
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02:13:14chrisjjHow can I find the filename of the currently playing track?
02:13:34__builtinfrom what context?
02:13:39 Join Bilgus_ph [0] (4cf32773@gateway/web/freenode/ip.
02:14:10Bilgus_phchrisjj: do you mean find out which button say Select is mapped to?
02:15:10chrisjjI find that in firmware\target\arm\imx233\creative-zen\button-zen.c
02:15:41chrisjjOh, I realise I didn't know which of my comments you were addressing.
02:17:02Bilgus_phI think I found the answer. It was about reverse button mapping. To let the code refer to a logical button by its physical button name.
02:17:13Bilgus_ph\Chrisjj ""
02:17:52chrisjjAh, ages back! :-)
02:19:06chrisjjThen yes. Say I wrote a plugin, using BUTTON_SELECT.
02:20:00chrisjjHow do I print on screen "Please press the {physical_button_name_of(BUTTON_SELECT)} button." ?
02:20:24__builtinrb->splash(0, "BLAH");
02:20:32Bilgus_phI went through this a while back
02:20:48chrisjjI want a little more than BLAH!
02:21:12chrisjjI want a function "physical_button_name_of(BUTTON_SELECT)".
02:21:44__builtinwell, there's printf-style formatting available through rb->splashf()
02:21:45 Quit skapazzo (Quit: Lost terminal)
02:21:58__builtinyou'll have to write something based on that
02:24:18Bilgus_phall the buttons while in physically named form during programming are merely masks of bits while compiled an c has no decent way of getting a literal at runtime
02:24:32Bilgus_phwell no safe way
02:24:51 Quit krnlyng (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
02:26:00chrisjjSo, for my one plugin, I have to write something covering all targets?? E.g. { BUTTON_SELECT, "Navi" }, of iRiver?
02:26:36Bilgus_phif you want to have device specific names like that then yes
02:27:59Bilgus_photherwise what I posted should cover quite a few devices but when pamaury went through and searched all the button names there are literally 1000's
02:28:09Bilgus_phsorry 100's
02:30:11chrisjjOK, thanks. See why this doesn't make sense to me. The device-specific button names are used in the manual. The info exists. But the info is not accessible ISTM to the UI code. So the UI uses different button names.
02:31:25Bilgus_phlook at the post by pamaury at 17:07
02:32:06chrisjjThanks (BTW, you can link to a line )
02:32:59Bilgus_phdoesan't matter anyway its already 404'd thx tho i'll try and rem that
02:33:21***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:36:04chrisjjNo 404's .. once you workaround the archive's link messup e.g. pamaury/2ff88a35c5866d2cd62e8a796f297447">
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02:37:39Bilgus_phah ok forgot
02:41:51Bilgus_phmy excuse is i'm on my dumb phone the link you want is this one: pamaury/385b38342a1562e854e478ba62390212">
02:43:53chrisjjI saw it from your first link. Thanks. But it doesn't do the job.
02:44:14chrisjjphysical_button_name_of(BUTTON_SELECT) would return "Navi" on iRiver.
02:44:19Bilgus_phno its not to do the job its to show you many of the button maps
02:45:35Bilgus_phthe link i first posted is the only way you can that I know of and go through and group the players that are similar
02:47:41chrisjjThe link you first posted doesn't do the job.
02:48:29Bilgus_phnope but it is the way you would achieve that job
02:49:34chrisjjI think the better way would be to take the complete info from the manual than the incomplete info from the .c.
02:49:44Bilgus_phaka an {index, name} list
02:53:11chrisjja.k.a. a Physical name <=> Logical name list.
02:55:24Bilgus_ph^ there is the PLA map for plugins, thats the thing thgough chrisjj you don't have access to any names
02:55:52chrisjjWell quite. So no "Please press the {physical_button_name_of(BUTTON_SELECT)} button."
02:56:36Bilgus_phthe buttons all are bits in a mask as in Btn_blah =1 btn_bleh =2 btn_bleg =4 btn_beah = 8 btn_breat = 16 etc..
02:59:21Bilgus_phthe names are only to make it easy to identify during programming the text is all stripped at compile
03:01:23chrisjjWhat I don't understand is how anyone thought this was going to work properly. Unless they thought a game plugin was never going to tell the user what buttons to press.
03:02:12Bilgus_phthere is just only so much you can do when 100 different targets exist
03:03:11Bilgus_phnot to mention it takes a lot of space, you could make a plugin that uses a pic of all the sims and highlights a button
03:03:43Bilgus_phthat might come in handy for tons of stuff
03:04:09__builtinchrisjj: usually the user figures it out by themselves
03:04:12 Quit Moarc (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
03:04:15__builtinideally, at least
03:04:17Bilgus_phlike press select and highlight the middle button
03:04:32chrisjj"there is just only so much you can do when 100 different targets exist" You've lost me there. The current solution means a ton of work for coders and the work gets bigger with each new target!
03:04:36 Join Moarc [0] (
03:04:40__builtinBilgus: that actually -kind of- exists already
03:04:48__builtinBilgus_ph: ^
03:04:57Bilgus_phoh yeah?
03:05:16__builtintry the .rockbox/rocks/viewers/pdbox.rock
03:05:16chrisjj"not to mention it takes a lot of space" How so? It could be C macros. No additional space cost in binary.
03:05:40__builtinwho's going to write it?
03:05:57Bilgus_phC macros are not free
03:06:03chrisjjhow so?
03:06:21Bilgus_phbecause you still want to map to a string
03:07:01Bilgus_phbecause you still want to map to a string/
03:07:07Bilgus_phor are you saying to make the names mean something else in the sources**
03:07:36__builtinBilgus_ph: I think he wants physical button names from button masks
03:07:49chrisjjYes I do.
03:07:49Bilgus_phand in that case wow the complexity would be scary the method in use currently is the best way
03:08:17chrisjjWhat complexity?
03:08:26Bilgus_phand therefore a macro wouldn't be free because of the strings
03:08:36TorCI was under the impression he wanted the names used in the manual added to the compiled version in some way that could be accessed from a plugin.
03:08:37Bilgus_phnot to mention interlanguage
03:09:42__builtinyou're going to need a list of every single button code −−> button name mapping for every single target rockbox supports
03:10:11chrisjjA target doing "#define BUTTON_SELECT PhysNavi" does also "#define BUTTON_SELECT_NAME "Navi" "
03:10:21Bilgus_phit would be doable for 1 or maybe 10 targets but 100 would be complex at best
03:10:53chrisjj__builtin: You already need/have it for the manual, no?
03:11:18Bilgus_phand then 80 more times
03:12:01chrisjjBilgus_ph: quantity does not mean complexity.
03:12:37chrisjjCompletity is having to do it manually in every plugin for every target. That's mad.
03:12:44Bilgus_phk, i'd love to check it out when you finish
03:12:46__builtinno plugin needs that
03:13:27chrisjjNo plugin runs on every target??
03:14:00__builtinwell, minus blackjack
03:14:04Bilgus_ph__builtin: ill have to check it out when i get to my other player
03:15:01__builtinthe thing with this is that its usage will be very limited in relation to the massive amounts of time needed to make it happen
03:15:25 Quit Bilgus_ph (Quit: Page closed)
03:16:06chrisjjBlackjack could tell you the button to place a bet. Currently it doesn't.
03:16:13__builtinit does.
03:16:40__builtinwell, maybe not exactly
03:16:40chrisjj__builtin: I think the usage of physicial button names is already widespread.
03:18:06__builtinwhy do you even need this functionality?
03:19:07chrisjjE.g. RB ZEN on adding a playlist tells me "OFF to abort". That's wrong. OFF does not abort
03:19:22chrisjjI guess OFF does abort in some older player.
03:21:21chrisjjI find that phrase in each lang file, with variants for some targets.
03:23:02chrisjjSeems to me that this port completion is going to need 44 lang files adjusted for ZEN to "BACK to abort".
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03:46:09Bilgusyou just put it in in english.lng apparently gets translated automagically by multilingual elves
03:56:36__builtinproblem is, translate site is on the same server as the forums :(
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04:18:51chrisjj:-) Who is it that kicks the forums back to life?
04:20:04Bilgusas I got it, it is a random DOS so I suppose the internet gods
04:27:44Bilgus__builtin: If you get a chance could you test this on your ipod to be sure it still works?
04:27:53chrisjjOK. But evidently not random enough to hit .
04:28:48[Saint]different hosting.
04:29:38[Saint]forums and themesite are at one site, wiki and other related www assets at another.
04:30:04Bilguswhich is smart imo
04:30:27chrisjjSmart to put the forums on the DDoSable one? :)
04:30:53[Saint]Any server is DOSable.
04:31:28[Saint](and its not distributed in this instance)
04:32:40Bilgusdistributed implies lots of traffic directed from many sources by a central source
04:33:23***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
04:33:52Bilguslike that whole thing about a bunch of IOT devices with east root passwords being turned into a bot net, toasters and lightbulbs and such
04:35:37Bilgusbasically the site is unable to serve any requests because it is tied up with a shit ton of other requests .. in both cases
04:40:30[Saint]right, the only practical difference is the starting point(s) of the overwhelming packets.
04:40:49chrisjjIf it is not distributed, then I wonder why it is not already blocked by a simple IP blacklist entry.
04:40:51[Saint]and that ddos general implies malicious intent.
04:41:27chrisjjWhat's the non-malicious intent of the non-D DOS attack?
04:46:09chrisjj__builtin: "why do you even need this functionality?" It lets new code write e.g. "Press {BUTTON_RIGHT__NAME} to go forward" to serve every target automatically.
04:46:20chrisjjOff to bed.
05:20:32scorche`sorry folks - 'tis back up
05:21:38scorche`and a DoS does not necessarily mean that it just has a shit ton of requests - this is triggering an Apache bug
05:25:12Bilgusso what some malformed packet?
05:25:20scorche`anyway, it isnt worth discussing the real reasons or anything. The core issue is that I have just been too busy to re-do the server. I anticipate getting the necessary time to do a proper fix sometime soon-ish - next month or so. Maybe sooner if we are lucky.
05:28:35scorche`it is something that shouldn't happen and i am embarrassed that it is, but i just dont have the time to properly fix it at the moment
05:32:53Bilgusif you don't have the time to do it right then why do it at all no need to explain :)
05:35:53BilgusJohnb2: here is the latest firmware for selective backlight and softlock
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08:46:55johnb2Bilgus: I grabbed just the version for clip+ for testing on the train.
08:47:37johnb2THe previous problems seems to be solved according to the quick tests I have done so far, but I found different one:
08:48:33johnb2Play unselected for BL, but selected for SL: still Play turns on the screen while locked.
08:49:27johnb2I am not sure if I had tested this before ( I rarely use the lock screen in daily use).
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11:05:01pamaurychrisjj: re button names
11:06:18pamauryif you want a realiable way of getting butto names accross all rockbox, then the only real fix imo is to introduce a button_name() function that looks a up a target-specific table, which means that you need to create a small table for all targets, in the button-*.c files
11:06:58pamaurythen you can go and remove all the defines from the plugins to use button_name() instead of #define BUTON_SELECT_NAME and friends
11:09:50pamaurymessages like "OFF to cancel" are harder to fix because there is no easy way to get a key name (in general in can be any action of the keymap). To me to right approach for those strings is to not create a default (*) string, and have a string for each target. This way when you create a new port, you get an error until you create te appropriate string (otherwise you simply don't noticed, they are hundreds of strings)
11:10:25pamauryIf you are willing to this, I can help you with the first part (creating the table)
11:13:38TorCjohnb2: Bilgus: I suspect the issue with the BL turning on with selSL relates to the button being trapped by SL. Thus, the action it would normally call doesn't occur due to SL, the lack of action prevents selBL from trapping it, and so the BL turns on to display the "buttons locked" message.
11:16:50TorCI've grabbed the zip version, but I won't get a chance to play with it until tomorrow at best. Usually when I'm using my player I'm either working or driving. Neither is especially conducive to careful testing.
11:29:35pamaury__builtin: about puzzles, I read your commit and something is not entirely clear to me. Would it be possible/wanted to build each one as an overlay? Pretty much like imageviewer
11:30:04pamaurythis way you share the common code in the plugin and each overlay contains the puzzle specific part
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11:42:42wodzpamaury: __builtin: I was about to ask the same question. This sounds natural.
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13:58:50Bilgusjohnb2: that is by design if you don't want blocked keys turning on screen do 'disable notify';
13:59:47BilgusTorC that is exactly right, as it goes through softlock it gets blocked and changed to Action_redraw
14:03:10Bilgusjohn I understand the confusion since you don't see the buttons locked message if you hit play again it will then pop up the message
14:05:27Bilgusalso power button will always turn on backlight and notify
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17:14:03asymsuconHi, I'm having problems accessing forums and themes part of rockbox website.
17:14:43asymsuconIs it just me, or they appear down for everyone else?
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17:25:07pamauryasymsucon: forums are down if that's the question
17:25:26asymsuconsuddenly, they're back up again
17:27:38pamauryyeah we have a problem with the forum server
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18:49:49fs-bluebotBuild Server message: New build round started. Revision 622088c, 255 builds, 17 clients.
18:50:45pamaurybluebrother: ping
18:53:10 Quit Slasheri (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
18:54:08bluebrotherpamaury: pong
18:56:43pamaurybluebrother: I'm trying to resurrect work on imxtools I did a year ago when I lost data when my computer was stolen. Among it is an scsi library without any dependency on linux and windows. I think this could be useful to share between several tools and useful in rbutil
18:57:47pamaury g#1434 if you are interested
18:57:48fs-bluebotGerrit review #1434 at : Add scsi library and use it by Amaury Pouly
18:58:01bluebrothersure, great :)
18:58:02pamaurycurrently only the linux part is implement (I lost the windows part)
18:58:23pamauryI'm looking to a soul to help me implement/test the windows part ;)
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18:59:55bluebrotherwe do have some code in ipodpatcher that does SCSI on Windows
19:00:28bluebrotherif I find some time I can give it a look ... though time has this weird "feature" that it seems to run away from me :)
19:01:42pamauryah great, I will look into ipodpatcher code then. I think the api should be generic enough, even though I recall windows scsi has some annoying feature like behing super slow and only supporting small payloads
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19:01:53pamaurydoes mxe comes with its toolchain ?
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19:19:52bluebrothermxe includes MinGW, so you can build that code with it
19:20:07bluebrotherso it should be good enough
19:20:22bluebrotherif necessary I can also look into it on Windows
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19:28:16pamaurybluebrother: apparently debian have a mingw toolchain in the repository, I will use it
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21:16:29johnb2Bilgus: I am testing the fuzev2 now. Can you please elaborate once more what "Disable unknonw actions" is supposed to do?
21:20:03johnb2I feel I sometimes manage to leave the menu hierarchy e.g. the Settings menu without the setting taking effect, but when I re-enter later my previous selection was set to on. I still need to find a deterministic way to reproduce :-(
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21:33:42johnb2For the "unknown actions" I believe this earlier had disabled the menu button (= south key) and the Home button. This is not true today.
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22:02:04Bilgus_phJohnb2 disable unknown actions will prevent any button not mapped to an action within the wps or fms from turning on the backlight. i haven't touched that code in several releases although on some players it doesn't work depending how the keymaps are laid out and how the undrlying button system works
22:03:32Bilgus_phthat being said it does not affect softlock as they are seperate entities
22:06:34Bilgus_phI just tested it on my clip+ and fuze+ and it does as expected on clip+ the down button doesn't turn on the bl unless i long press and the fuze+ doesn't with left and right held at the same time
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22:14:43Bilgus_phAS far as the selection screen goes anytime you exit the settings are saved although they are not applied till you exit the whole menu so there could be something weird going on with the way you are exiting the menu although I DOUBT it since i have it apply on cancel. Main menu. And menu exit if you want to be extra sure power cycle the player and see if it works then as it will apply it from the saved settings on power up
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23:17:51__builtinpamaury: I wanted to avoid having to use overlays at all because they stop playback
23:18:06__builtinwhich is undesirable for a games like these
23:19:03gevaertsI imagine you could still do an overlay for some of the shared code while staying inside the plugin buffer, which would save some disk space
23:19:37gevaertsI'm a bit doubtful that that's really worth the effort though
23:20:08__builtinyeah, that'd be awfully complicated for not much of a difference
23:20:20__builtindisk is real cheap nowadays
23:20:44gevaertsYes, but replacement SSDs tend to be flaky :)
23:21:47__builtinit's less than a 3MB difference
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