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#rockbox log for 2017-03-04

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01:48:20shrizza_:split
01:48:58shrizza_Not here!
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11:37:45dysreassembling the resurrected TEAC, I noticed that there is a whopping 3mm of air between the lipo bag and the case
11:38:02dyssomeone needs to tell the engineers that the energy density of air is not that good
11:41:34dysOTOH, the air might be crucial for the sound of the unit
11:41:40*dys hides
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12:00:41AmboynaI'm making a stab at trying to convert a program to generate audio files to an RB plugin. Does RB insist on being fed 44.1kHz or 48kHz samples, dependent on current settings? The original seems to use a default of 11205, which is plenty.
12:04:41AmboynaAs I understand from brief discussion of this before, the basic object will be to strip the encoders, add controls to maintain an appropriate audio buffer fill, and drop the PCM samples generated by the program into the audio buffer.
12:05:36AmboynaThen wrap the beast in some pretty user-facing plugin controls.
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12:13:24AmboynaI made a first attempt at stripping out the output file handling and encoding, and got that to compile native for my computer.
12:17:40Bilgusdys lipos expand when they get old/overcharged perhaps it was to allow for some expansion without destruction?
12:18:13Bilgusfigure cellphones have a removable back that pops off
12:22:48dysBilgus: granted, the graphite electrode expands a couple µm when absorbing li ions, but 3mm definnitely sounds like management opted to shave off $3 using a smaller lipo bag
12:24:38Bilgusoh probably, I've seen a lot more than a micrometer on a failing lipo though
12:25:01Bilgusis the case like screwed together?
12:25:15dysit's a heavy hunk of extruded aluminum
12:25:51Bilgusyeah thats expansion room so you don't have a hand grenade go off in your pocket
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12:28:27Bilgusnow how much room is actually needed idk but theres probably a safety factor of 2:1 or something in that extra room as well
12:29:03AmboynaWhen I read something on the Samsung fiasco, I recall 10% being a recommended margin.
12:29:40AmboynaOf battery thickness, that is.
12:29:55dysthat'd be 0.4 mm then. but I concur, better safe than sorry.
12:30:24Bilgusso add in a battery 2cm thicker
12:31:27BilgusThat is probably in devices that expand though (plastic)
12:31:40AmboynaThough I could believe there would be a larger recommended margin if dealing with solid aluminium on both sides.
12:31:50AmboynaAnd Bilgus beat me to it.
12:32:31dysso much for the idea of rockboxing it by sneaking an iRiver PCB into that 3mm :-)
12:32:42Bilguslol
12:33:48AmboynaYeah. The visual of a lipo expanding into a populated PCB isn't exactly pretty.
12:34:27Bilgusdepends who's pocket it is?
12:35:46AmboynaTrue. The pocket of a murderer in the middle of nowhere might be, shall we say... less undesirable?
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13:33:30duo8my dap has a ton of free space inside too
13:33:40duo8do wish they made it a bit more efficient
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13:51:15pixelmacramming everything together may not always be the best choice... there is a chance you'll get electrical noise that's audible through the headphones
13:51:52pixelmathinking of the c200s and some cheap front USB and audio ports on computers
13:56:22duo8shield it lol
13:56:40duo8not like my dap doesn't hiss anyway
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14:03:21dysalso, the soundstage becomes more airy
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17:22:41SaratogaAmboyna: I believe plugins can specify any sampling rate
17:23:44SaratogaPamaury: was the mkimxboot binary removed from the server intentionally? The manual still refers to it
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17:26:45pamaurySaratoga: no idea, I never uploaded any mkimxboot binary so I don't know anything about this
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17:29:53saratoga_the manual still refers to one, do you want to upload one or should I edit the manual?
17:31:15pamaurywe can upload one, that sounds like a good idea
17:32:03saratoga_ok, i don't know how to compile them for anything but linux, can anyone do mac?
17:32:55pamauryI can do windows with a cross compiler, but not mac
17:34:40pamaurybluebrother can do mac I think
17:37:24dyspamaury: just pushed a scramble tool. Flashing a modified image worked.
17:38:18pamaurydys: good job :)
17:40:01pamaurydys: did you modify the image by hand ?
17:40:24dysja, just changed some strings to "ROCKBOXED" for a test and they show up
17:41:06dystrying to make a boot block to inject for the next iteration
17:46:38dysmaybe code to broadcasting something to the uarts in a hope to find some testpoints for them
17:47:19dysif that fails, initializing the USB peripheral with a CDC descriptor and trying communicating that way
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17:51:26dysanother option would be to inject a redirect boot block to the sdcard
17:52:21pamaurydys: if you can get the rom to change boot device to sdcard I think that's the simplest option. That way you can put the original firmware on the sdcard to recover and you can easily experiment
17:52:56pamauryfor rockbox, I developed a tool call hwstub (might have mentioned it before) to poke registers and execute code over usb, it's also scriptable in lua from pc
17:53:24pamaury"all" you have to do is port the code to this cpu (should be easy) and implement a usb driver (less easy)
17:53:43dysja, I have options for that as well. the problem is finding a reliable communication channel
17:53:55dysserial-over spdif-in/-out :-)
17:55:15pamaurywell my experience is that unless you can find uart (which I never found in any of my devices ;)), usb is quite a good one if you know usb well enough to implement and debug the driver without any feedback
17:55:48dysbit banging via the control endpoint should be easier then making a CDC
17:56:17dysaccording to the docs, control endpoints are ready for use immediately when activating the peripherial in device mode
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17:58:16dysi think loading the OFW original boot stream won't work, as sdcard appears to imply 512byte-sized boot blocks
17:58:38dysbut custom boot-stream on the card and a redirect block to flash for booting OFW might work
18:00
18:00:45pamaurydys: as a matter of fact, the usb core in this soc looks awfully similar to the one of JZ4760B to which I ported hwstub
18:00:57dysinteresting
18:01:30pamauryhttps://git.rockbox.org/?p=rockbox.git;a=blob;f=utils/hwstub/stub/jz4760b/usb_drv_jz4760b.c;h=92880c5303d3383d98a24d019e1d938eb77118b5;hb=1ba5ef7
18:06:56duo8ooh what did i miss
18:09:18pamaurydys: in my experience, the first thing you want to find on the device is backlight
18:09:29dys(oled)
18:10:05pamauryis the lcd code complicated ?
18:10:16pamauryis there some LED you could flash ?
18:11:06dystracing messagebox() & co was always obscured by vtables before getting to the hardware
18:11:50dysthe oled is wired to the SPI port, so sniffing would be an option
18:12:56dysthere is a single led, but I have no idea to which of the GPIO outputs it is wired
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18:27:49duo8try all lol
18:27:54duo8what is this btw?
18:29:33dysduo8: https://www.rockbox.org/wiki/TEACHAP90SDPort
18:30:27duo8looks fancy
18:31:22bluebrotherpamaury, saratoga_: I can build on Mac.
18:31:58saratoga_bluebrother: assuming current git source is ok, I guess build mkimxboot in the rbutil folder and then forward to the swedes
18:32:21duo8hey the onkyo uses the same opamp as my dap
18:32:48dys^^
18:32:49dysduo8: used ones are somewhat affordable due to the abysmal OFW
18:32:56duo8?
18:33:12duo8oh i go it
18:33:24duo8how much?
18:33:35dysI got one for 199€
18:34:16duo8huh, bout the price of my dap new
18:34:46dysnot sure if the porting effort has a future though, Onkyo and TEAC now seems to focus on Android-DAPs
18:35:14duo8anything else using analog devices soc?
18:35:36duo8wait what dual core DSP
18:35:37dyslots of professional equipment by TEAC does (tacsam brand)
18:35:43duo8for a processor?
18:37:35dysja. gcc-toolchain is available, so no the DSP is no drama I guess
18:39:25duo8what is that "PSoC3"
18:40:00bluebrotherok, doesn't build due to cryptopp dependency. Let's see if it works with the one homebrew provides.
18:40:35dysduo8: it's a 8051µC with a small FPGA
18:40:36pamaurybluebrother: yeah I switch from custom code to cryptopp
18:40:51duo8huh
18:40:57dysduo8: the parallel DAC and digital in/out is wired to it
18:41:26dysprobably they communicate via i2s with from the blackfin, and use the programmable logic to talk to the other chips and DAC
18:41:36dyss/with/with it/
18:41:54duo8made me think of the mysterious chip on FiiO players
18:42:22dysyeah, I remember seeing some chinese-made FPGA on there as well
18:42:40duo8i found literally no info on that chip though
18:51:39bluebrotherok, so it's cryptopp using homebrew. And then something breaks with libstdc++ vc. libc++. And then it links dynamically against homebrew ...
18:56:17bluebrothergreat. The cryptopp distribution is a zip that's a zipbomb :(
18:56:44pamaurywhat is a zipbomb ?
18:57:01dysbombs your working directory
18:57:49bluebrothersame as tarbomb, but with zip :)
18:58:00pamauryshouldn't you always unpack in a fresh directory anyway ?
18:58:06bluebrotherextracts all files to the current folder, not a subfolder. Quite a bad idea for source code
18:58:39bluebrotheranyway, let's see if building libcryptopp helps
18:58:39pamaurybluebrother: where did you get the zip ?
18:59:01bluebrotherfrom the official website. The first download link. But they also link to github, which also has a tar.gz
18:59:38bluebrotheranyway, since mkimxboot is a dependency for Rockbox Utility this means that we cannot build Rockbox Utiltiy right now either
18:59:50pamauryon mac you mean ?
18:59:53bluebrotheryeps
18:59:59bluebrotherand on Windows too I gues
19:00
19:00:04bluebrother*guess
19:00:36bluebrotherI was thinking that the Makefile could look if there's a libcryptopp folder in mkimxboot and if so build that and use it
19:01:04bluebrotheror we could import the parts of libcryptopp we use. It's not that much right now, is it?
19:01:22pamaurycross compiling cryptopp should be trivial in general, we can embed the code if it simplifies the build system
19:02:51bluebrothercross compiling? I'm building natively right now :)
19:03:22bluebrotherbut yeah, embedding the used parts might help. Still doesn't work with the libcryptopp I built myself. Need to give that a closer look ...
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21:14:13 Join wodz [0] (~wodz@89-74-169-198.dynamic.chello.pl)
21:15:06wodzDo we have a target with 4 direction buttons, select/play, vol+, vol- and power? I am looking for keymap to adapt.
21:16:09pamaurywodz: sony nwz
21:16:27wodzpamaury: sony has back additionally
21:16:37pamaurywodz: take the fuze+ then
21:16:56pamauryit has two more buttons but they are never mapped to essential stuff
21:17:13pamauryalso it is quite tested
21:17:54wodzwill look
21:19:39*pamaury is thinking about other targets
21:19:48wodzpamaury: basically only menu is a problem as it is mapped to back on f+
21:20:10pamauryah I forgot menu
21:20:33pamaurybut that should be a good start anyway
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21:21:13wodzI thought we have target with such layout as it looks pretty intuitive
21:23:29wodzand the answer is sansa e200 :-) (with the twist that it has scroll wheel instead of vol+ and vol-)
21:23:44wodzah damn, it has also rec
21:25:39pamaurysurprisingly, no target seems to be an exact match, they all have one more button
21:26:03pamaurybut to be honest, for most of them, you can simply remove it, like the rec butto
21:27:39wodzpamaury: sure, but this is just another thing I have to do (plus keymaps for plugins is a pain)
21:29:48wodzstupid question but what is WPS hotkey actually?
21:30:05pamauryyeah plugin keymap is a pain
21:30:43pamauryno idea ;) maybe it's the key that opens the menu of your favorite shortcuts ? something like that
21:36:01dysmeh, building the bfin toolchain on a modern system is a PITA
21:37:03wodzdys: building crosscompilers is a pita in general
21:37:10pamaurydys: building any gcc toolchain <4.9 is getting harder veryday
21:37:13pamaury*everyday
21:37:35*dys probably should set up a Debian potato VM or something
21:37:35pamaurythos projects are very conservative when it comes to coding in actual C
21:37:55pamauryand not pre-standard C with extensions and stuff
21:45:46wodzWPS_BROWSE is jump directly to folder, what is WPS_MENU and WPS_CONTEXT, WPS_QUICKSCREEN and WPS_ID3SCREEN?
21:47:01pamauryid3screen is tag info I think, one of {context,menu,quickscreen} give access to quick controls like pitch and others
21:47:06pamaurythe others I am not sure
21:48:01pamaurybased on fuze+, I think wps_menu returns to main menu
21:48:27wodzthanks
21:49:11pamaurycontext is context menu: you can access everything from it: playlist, sound setting, etc
21:49:26pamauryit's basically the context menu in the case of wps
21:49:58pamauryso quickscreen must be the one with pitch and others
21:50:19wodzbut there is pitchscreen separately
21:50:45pamauryah, maybe it's the one with repeat and shuffle options then
21:51:45wodzpamaury: one more question. What is the third column in keymap actually? previous event or what?
21:52:03pamaurypre condition
21:52:13pamauryso you can have combos and repeat
21:53:59wodzso { ACTION_WPS_PLAY, BUTTON_SELECT|BUTTON_REL, BUTTON_SELECT } means it triggers on release when previously button was pressed?
21:54:45pamauryyes
21:55:06pamauryit's mostly useful to distinguish long press and short press
21:55:52wodzlong press will be BUTTON_SELECT|BUTTON_REPEAT, BUTTON_SELECT} in this context?
21:56:10pamauryexactly
21:57:37Amboyna__builtin: Any chance you could look at my questions from 10hrs ago, since you've got quite a bit of experience with plugins?
21:59:08wodzpamaury: what does it mean then BUTTON_LEFT|BUTTON_REPEAT, BUTTON_NONE } ? how button left repeat event can be without button left previously?
21:59:30AmboynaThanks, pamaury. I'll keep working on it bit by bit. I'm looking at the metronome for some guidance, as it does play sound. Not quite complete, as it seems to submit a sample when it wants it to play, rather than feeding a buffer and keeping it above a fill threshold.
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22:02:19wodzAmboyna: mpegplayer does what you want (ie feeds buffer with decoded samples and keeps it above threshold). Might be inspiration for you.
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22:11:36pamaurywodz: I *think* BUTTON_NONE means "no constraint"
22:12:31pamauryso I might be wrong but for example if you have BUTTON_LEFT|BUTTON_REPEAT, BUTTON_NONE then the action trigger on every repeat
22:12:38pamaurybut not if you have BUTTON_LEFT|BUTTON_REPEAT, BUTTON_LEFT
22:12:44wodzI really don't like to go outside /firmware in our source tree
22:12:54pamauryjust my interpretation, I don't mess with keymaps very often
22:13:11pamauryfor example:
22:13:11pamaury{ ACTION_WPS_VOLDOWN, BUTTON_VOL_DOWN|BUTTON_REPEAT, BUTTON_NONE },
22:13:17pamauryvolume decreases on every repeat
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22:13:42wodzpamaury: so, when the second one will trigger? only on first repeat?
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22:14:57pamauryI think, but I'm not 100% sure
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22:19:40pixelma*IIRC* the pre conditions are mostly important in situations where you have to distinguish between a short press (with | BUTTON_REL) and a long press (with | BUTTON_REPEAT )
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22:33:09Amboynawodz: Thanks. I'll take a look at that one too. The source I'm working from has the PCM generation, so finding that loop to watch the buffer should get me a step along the way.
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22:48:17__builtinAmboyna: you should be able to set the frequency from a plugin
22:48:24__builtinuse pcm_set_frequency()
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23:11:23Amboyna__builtin: Thanks. I've made a note of that function.
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