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#rockbox log for 2017-12-05

00:29:30 Quit ender` (Quit: All power corrupts, but we need electricity.)
00:44:37ParkerR[Saint], Ok cool. I was thinking V4L radio in Linux but yeah just piping audio would be cool too (I hate having ideas but not the experience to implement them :/)
00:50:04ParkerRWonder if this is related (USB audio pipe wise)
00:51:12[Saint]Without actually looking at it I would guess that's pamaury's external DAC work.
00:51:26ParkerRThe FM radio to host has been touched on before
00:52:11[Saint]The problem with it is not all of our devices support USB-HID.
00:52:18[Saint]So it's quite limited in scope.
00:52:39ParkerRClip series would be capable? (Since it can be keyboard)
00:52:45[Saint]Though there's no technical reason barring lack of implementation as to why devices with USB-HID enabled couldn't do this.
00:53:51[Saint]If I remember correctly it it requires some non-trivial changes to the core to support insynchronous transfer
00:56:32ParkerR Ahh very cool. I didn't realize where the HID stuff originated
00:58:00[Saint]ParkerR: in news unrelated to that, my current mode of selective masochism is a dynamic theme.
00:58:13[Saint]I have a proof of concept implementation presently.
00:58:34[Saint]By dynamic I mean not tied to device resolution.
00:59:29ParkerR[Saint], partially related to the touch work?
00:59:31ParkerRAlso very cool
00:59:35 Join mc2739 [0] (~mc2739@rockbox/developer/mc2739)
00:59:47[Saint]The only hardcoded value is font height.
01:00:20[Saint]It uses glyph height to determine the assets to load. The overall theme height and width is indeterminate.
01:00:50 Join alexweissman [0] (
01:01:03ParkerRAnother unrelated note: I love how simple upgrades are. Copy files, unplug, select to reload binary
01:01:07[Saint]Bit of a bitch I'll never be able to put it on the theme site because of that, but perhaps a new category could be added to the themesite.
01:01:27[Saint]This theme won't ever pass checkwps, even though it is valid.
01:01:43[Saint]There are no small number of abuses of the theme engine going on here, hahaha.
01:03:07[Saint]I've had to scrap it several times because of technical limitations I've discovered, but I believe I am past all major hurdles at this point.
01:04:05[Saint]I posited quite some years ago that this could be done without any additional changes to the skin engine/core - but I wasn't terribly interested in persuing it at that time.
01:04:41[Saint]This is somewhat of a vanity project I suppose. I'm not sure how many people will use it, but I will make a song and dance about it when if or when I finally complete it.
01:05:48[Saint]The only real limitation is that it _must_ use a specific font height.
01:06:00[Saint]Or rather, a font with a specific naming convention.
01:06:18[Saint]currently it supports 24, 32, 48, 64, and 96pt fonts.
01:06:37[Saint]I'm targeting large format displays.
01:06:58[Saint]I suppose I could add a 12pt option as well, but I'll get what I have working first.
01:07:19ParkerRSpeaking of which... I know I've asked before but is ART on Android ever going to happen?
01:08:01[Saint]There's some chinese(?) guy that forked RaaA a long while back.
01:08:42[Saint]It can happen, but Mr. Someone needs to do it. The solution used by that guy is ugly as almighty fuck, which is why it wasn't ever included.
01:11:23[Saint]Google "Rockbox-RCC" if you want to take a look.
01:11:41[Saint]They've actually added quite a few functions that would be useful to backport.
01:11:49[Saint]Well...if they were cleaned up.
01:12:10[Saint]The'r github demonstrates the "throw shit at a wall until enough of it sticks" approach.
01:13:50[Saint]I think it's PurlingNayuki that does a lot of the leg work.
01:14:04[Saint]There's a lot of good work there but some of it I am not particularly fond of at all.
01:14:12[Saint]Personal preference I suppose.
01:14:37ParkerRHmm might have to try to build. I don't see any precompiled Android (not that I'd fully trust to begin with)
01:15:18***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
01:16:00ParkerRSeems legit... (translate got me thourgh enough that I would need to register to download, noooope)
01:16:11[Saint]I have no idea what API they're targeting.
01:16:21[Saint](For Android)
01:17:03 Quit michaelni (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
01:17:29[Saint]I can't imagine Android 7+ being particularly happy with it, but I honestly don't know.
01:18:40[Saint]It looks like their github died in April.
01:20:15 Quit emptty1 (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
01:21:13[Saint]ParkerR: small glimpse so you can see what I'm going for
01:21:54[Saint]I'm shooting for a material design/flat look.
01:22:30[Saint](yes, I know the kerning on that font is terrible - lol)
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01:34:10ParkerRThats their "direct" installation apk which is 15MB. 3MB "INstallable" gets you the tiny 1080p fonts
01:36:01ParkerRHey it plays Music (Database menu is completely in Chinese
01:37:27ParkerRTheir volume key handling is so broken it wont even let me take a screenshot on the database menu with music playing
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01:38:23ParkerRAnd it worked that time...
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11:35:33copperI lost my 128 GB microsdxc card
11:35:42copperthe damn thing is too small
11:36:15copperit may have been sucked in by my vacuum cleaner
11:38:01gevaertsOr out again. It probably is small enough to go through the dust filter!
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11:42:34copperWell, I checked, it's not in there.
11:43:08copperIt's a dark piece of plastic, on dark tiles. I'll never find it.
11:44:09CtcpIgnored 2 channel CTCP requests in 1 day and 0 hours at the last flood
11:44:09*gevaerts nods
11:44:26gevaertsA screw is findable. Just remove your shoes and you *will* step on it
11:44:34gevaertsBut something flat like that is hopeless
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11:47:08DBUGEnqueued KICK [Saint]
11:47:37[Saint]fg 2
11:47:44[Saint]err, whoops.
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12:01:06[Saint]Since it's up there, does that look right for what I'm trying to do?
12:01:12[Saint]Is there a more obvious way to do that?
12:01:34[Saint]I suppose there's not many people that can answer that question.
12:02:09[Saint]basically I'm going for a "healing" metadata display panel that adjusts for missing values.
12:02:40[Saint]The first two lines are easy, because they can fall back to something that is always going to be there no matter what, filename and path.
12:03:00[Saint]I might piss some people off with preferring album artist instead of artist maybe?
12:03:13[Saint]I guess that's something that I'll need to put the feelers out for.
12:03:44[Saint]I know some (most?) people seem to prefer artist, but I have a very strong preference for album artist if present.
12:05:24[Saint]Do you have any thoughts on the matter perhaps, copper?
12:07:43[Saint]I'll have to disappoint gevaerts I'm afraid, as there's no supported IDv3 standard for which parchment or lithograph an orchestral movement is transcibed to.
12:07:59CtcpIgnored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
12:07:59*gevaerts is disappointed
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12:13:07copperoh well, lookie here
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12:16:28[Saint]what the?
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12:43:51copper[Saint]: I display the artist if found, if not I display the album artist if found
12:44:08copperalbum artist is mainly useful for browsing the database
12:46:13copperFor instance, consider Queen - Greatest Hits III
12:46:52copperit's a compilation of Queen songs with various singers other than Freddie Mercury
12:48:01copperI want to access that album from the album artist "Queen" and not "Various Artists", but I want to see weather it's Elton John or George Michael that's singing
12:49:01copperI also want to access the album "New York City" from the album artist "Norah Jones" when it's really credited to "The Peter Malick Group & Norah Jones"
12:49:23copper(but I want to display the name of the credited band while a song is playing)
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13:04:50[Saint]copper: that's a fair argument, thank you.
13:05:03[Saint]I suppose I'll just reverse the iA/ia logic then.
13:10:01[Saint]copper: are you at all opposed to artist falling back to album artist if not present?
13:11:06[Saint]Or should I perhaps display another field entirely in that case? My thinking is each is the obvious fallback for each other, my only real doubt was which should take preference but you raise a good argument there.
13:15:36***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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13:40:28copper[Saint]: that's what I meant earlier: my themes fall back to album artist if artist is missing
13:49:57[Saint]I don't want to crowd out the user with information, at present I have just:
13:49:57[Saint]track title|filename
13:49:57[Saint]artist|album artist|genre|year
13:50:47[Saint]I /may/ be inclined to swap the positions of genre and year, but I find the current layout most aesthetically pleasing.
13:52:08[Saint]I suppose I should also display disk and track numbers on the track title line if they're available.
13:57:54[Saint]It's a pity that there isn't really a way to survey end users.
13:58:24[Saint]*Real* end users, Joe Casual.
13:58:46copperI don't think that would help. Everyone has their own preference.
13:59:57[Saint]All data is sufficiently interesting in large enough sample sets.
14:00:41copperI remember doing some theme-fu to accommodate for different preferences, but the mechanism needed a manual (setting some obscure and unrelated setting in the rockbox menu in order to change what data gets displayed in my theme)
14:01:48copperI wouldn't do that again now. I just make my own theme(s) for my own use and make it available in case someone else might like it, or in case someone might feel like modifying it to their own liking.
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14:03:20[Saint]I wouldn't do it because it's almost entirely transparent to the user and has no way of resetting the value(s) used if or when the user changed themes or relied on that setting in their normal use.
14:04:30[Saint]Every setting in there is there because /someone/ uses it.
14:06:26copper"By default, the last metadata line in the Now Playing screen displays codec information; when paused, the title of the upcoming track is displayed instead. That behavior can be changed by setting the "Status Bar" theme setting to "Top" (the opposite behavior will be applied), or setting it to "Bottom" (in which case, the line will alternate between upcoming track title and codec information)."
14:07:49[Saint]Yeah, I recall when you did that.
14:07:49[Saint]The problem with that kind of thing is that there are users that piece-meal themes and mix and match WPS/SBS/FMS from different themes.
14:09:09[Saint]my understanding from talking to end users is that it is fairly common to do so.
14:09:18[Saint]At least not uncommon if not fairly so.
14:11:29[Saint]I am thinking of using some "magic values" myself, but I want to get the basic logic and localization done first.
14:12:00[Saint]I'll probably allow for a few specific viewport background colours to be set to pick the accent colour of the theme.
14:12:33[Saint]The default is and always will be "Rockbox Yellow FCC000" though.
14:13:01copperFCC? Is that a private joke?
14:13:23[Saint]With hints of "Rockbox Grey B4C3D3".
14:14:01[Saint]I use that for the line separator colour and to separate the status bar accent colour and UI/main viewports.
14:14:34[Saint]Oh, it's also the "icon not active" colour for things like Shuffle and Repeat modes.
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15:48:52_Bilgus[Saint] just comment out the other options make note of them and leave them there for the user to find and switch, if they feel that strongly they will alter it if given a way to do so
15:50:15pixelmahmm, for me and the way I lay out the directory structure a fall back to the directory name two levels above file would work for missing artist info, so "%d(2)". Not sure if this works for others too. I'd use it as a second fall back though if even album artist isn't available. And I'd present it a bit differently so that I could notice that the fall back is used (e.g. put it in brackets or so)
15:51:49_Bilgusmain issue is that you 1 have to have the manual open to parse the theme file and even then they balk at the <><>>>><<<|>>> it looks like brainfk.. so just do #Default display artist first|albumartist.....comment out if you want to switch ans ##albumartist|artist...uncomment to use
15:53:54_BilgusI'd rather see nothing if it isn't available just the song name is fine barring that the filename I put artist album artist in my filenames though and therein lies the problem everyone is different in preference
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15:56:59_Bilgusif it was 1990 it might be different but now we have decent tagging programs that allow curation of your music library :)
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23:15:51***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
23:20:55almog1006I know there are not enough ram for ruizu/agptek/sansa jam+sport players for Rockbox but is it possible to develop these players Rockbox with limited options?
23:26:57pamaurythat would be too much work for little reward
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23:31:04almog1006I know, but at the moment there are not so many players who support Rockbox that available on the market
23:33:36pamaurythere are all the Sonys, and yes but it takes a lot of work, if people don't help, nothing will happen by itself
23:34:19almog1006By the way someone from ruizu told me that its developers say there is a problem to add option of copy and paste in players who have Bluetooth
23:34:42almog1006Do you have any idea why?
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