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#rockbox log for 2020-03-05

00:08:39***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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00:28:27__builtinWe really should start planning out this transition away from Haxx soon
00:28:49Lonoxmont?
00:29:21 Quit kugel (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
00:29:38__builtinThe original founders of the project have announced that they plan to stop hosting rockbox services next year
00:29:51Lonoxmontthat sucks
00:30:21__builtinWe should really be grateful for the last ~20 years though
00:30:33Lonoxmontwow rockbox is that old?
00:31:10__builtinYeah. 2001 or thereabouts
00:31:51Lonoxmonthah, so oyu guys didnt waste any time once ipods came out
00:32:09__builtinAnyway, I think speachy has volunteered to host (most) things
00:33:56__builtinWhat's left is figuring out how we move all our stuff over
00:34:15__builtinAnd we have a lot of it
00:34:31Lonoxmontin tarballs, probably :P
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01:10:53BilgusSo from what I read of the game plan I gather its just going to be a straight transfer then work on changing things?
01:11:16__builtinI'm in favor of that
01:11:27__builtinAnd I think speachy is too
01:13:01Bilgusso is speachy going to be point on this then?
01:13:09__builtinI believe so
01:13:43BilgusWe need a migration manager because I honestly don't know where efforts are best placed
01:15:42BilgusNot that I've had a lot of time lately but I'd like to use it wisely when I do ditto from everyone else clearly
01:18:14__builtinRight. I'm not in a position to take that on, unfortunately.
01:18:36__builtingetting 3.15 was enough for me
01:18:43Bilgusnow does this include the forums as well? I was under the impression scorche had them hosted on his server
01:18:50__builtinit does, actually
01:19:08__builtinyou're correct in that scorche hosts them, but he would like to step away as well
01:20:24Bilguswell thank goodness for speachy then :/
01:20:38__builtinhttps://github.com/Rockbox/rockbox/wiki/Transition lists only mailing lists and DNS as continuing services
01:21:01*__builtin will be around to help where he can, but that's limited by IRL things
01:22:47Bilgusdownload.rockbox.org: 32 GB disk, 500 GB traffic/month
01:22:49Bilgusphew
01:24:41__builtinour problem is not so much bandwidth or disk space, thankfully
01:24:49__builtinmore just having people willing to host :)
01:25:16__builtinI think we would do well to nominate speachy as migration manager, though
01:25:25__builtinassuming he's still willing, of course
01:25:42Bilgusyet they don't want to see it use github as the primary interface?
01:26:40__builtinI'm against migrating to github on primarily technical grounds
01:27:12__builtingerrit is a much nicer code review system imo, and we already have significant time invested into custom infrastructure that suits our needs
01:27:30__builtinof course there's also the philosophical element, too
01:30:09BilgusIdk i'm of the thought of our custom stuff is great but we don't have the staff to maintain it so rather than letting it go down the drain maybe its time to use tools readily available
01:32:25__builtinthing is, it'll take far more effort to recreate the same level of functionality we already have with a new tool
01:33:57Bilgusbut with a (more?) robust backend to support it
01:35:05__builtinexplain?
01:35:59Bilgusgit hub is more widely used there are already tools to migrate it tools built to work with it and the hosting is taken care of
01:36:46BilgusRb is after all FOSS and clearly there are no donations coming into the coffers despite 500GB of downloads a month
01:39:04Bilgusdo we need all that functionality for what ~5 devs??
01:39:33__builtinhmm...
01:40:21__builtinspeachy has already volunteered to host a migrated version of our existing infrastructure, though
01:40:29Bilgusfor now sure
01:41:24Bilgusits just a finger in the dike though and I don't feel he should have to take that burden forever
01:42:14__builtinif he decides it's not for him, then yes, we can look for other options
01:42:52__builtinbut I feel that self-hosting gives us more freedom and independence than available through github
01:43:06Bilgusfreedom from what though
01:43:34__builtinfreedom to customize our infrastructure as we please
01:43:43__builtin(and freedom as in FOSS, of course)
01:44:37Bilgushmm I'm not sure we are plubishing anything thatd be censored except maybe the themes
01:45:09__builtinthe rockblox incident comes to mind
01:45:21__builtinand jewels/Pop Cap
01:45:40Bilgusthe DCMA process with github does leave something to be desired
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01:45:51__builtinhttps://lwn.net/Articles/200179/
01:45:54Bilgusso perhaps you are right
01:46:26__builtinand https://lwn.net/Articles/180172/
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02:00
02:01:58mendel_munkis__builtin: rockblox incident?
02:02:24__builtinsee above
02:02:37mendel_munkisyeah just started looking at the links
02:03:52__builtinin short, I feel like self-hosting shields us from arbitrary takedowns over things like that
02:04:13Timetravelerruh oh
02:05:50TimetravelerrCopyright really affected everyone's right to own anything huh..
02:08:27mendel_munkisTimetravelerr: some of that stuff was pretty reasonable.
02:08:42***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:09:14Timetravelerroh shoot..
02:09:43Timetravelerrbut thats a really old post?..
02:12:54BilgusI'd agree on the arbitrary takedown part VALID point
02:13:12mendel_munkis It's also nice to see that rockbox had enough attention to get C&Ds
02:13:52Timetravelerrso does this mean no more Rockbox?
02:14:02mendel_munkisnot at all.
02:14:54mendel_munkissome time ago certain componies had issues with certain pieces of rockbox. thos issues where delt with.
02:16:00Timetravelerroh
02:16:13Lonoxmontus copyright/trademark law is bonkers
02:16:29Lonoxmontbasically unless you defend what you own like a rabid dog you risk losing control of it
02:17:02Timetravelerrwow
02:17:41mendel_munkiswhat was originally intended to avoid IP owners from having too much power now has the oppisite effect.
02:17:52Timetravelerrsmh
02:18:10Lonoxmontgotta love the mickey mouse protection acts they keep passing...
02:18:35Lonoxmontsurprised disney doesnt just buy a law making copyright eternal unless released or w/e
02:18:46mendel_munkisthe length of copyright is directly proportional to the size of mickey ears
02:19:16Timetravelerrloll
02:19:28Timetravelerrdamn disney
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