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| 03:37:49 | braewoods | speachy1: i just realized that bitwise XOR with -1 (all bits on) produces the same logical output as bitwise NOT. so why do people prefer XOR over NOT for this effect? i see that in some crc algorithms as the final step. |
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| 05:41:08 | braewoods | _bilgus: g#3491 |
| 05:41:10 | rb-bluebot | Gerrit review #3491 at https://gerrit.rockbox.org/r/c/rockbox/+/3491 : mi4: replace chksum_crc32 with crc_32r by James Buren |
| 05:41:31 | braewoods | i'll test it on my iriver h10 but that's my only PP unit right now i can easily get to |
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| 06:04:00 | braewoods | _bilgus: ... it's back. the h10 is freezing again on latest dev stuff. unrelated to my changes too. |
| 06:06:21 | braewoods | testing the 5gb model |
| 06:09:03 | braewoods | rofl the 5gb model is immune? |
| 06:28:01 | braewoods | weird. the 5gb bootloader made from git doesn't even boot. the OF boot rom thinks its corrupted or so. |
| 06:28:18 | braewoods | unrelated since latest master w/o my commits is same end result |
| 06:55:09 | braewoods | ok found the problem |
| 06:55:25 | braewoods | turns out I need the MTP mi4 container which isn't mentioned any where |
| 06:55:30 | braewoods | :p |
| 06:55:43 | braewoods | so the crc32 change appears to be working correctly |
| 06:55:48 | braewoods | as my preliminary tests showed |
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| 07:02:43 | Mode | "#rockbox +v speachy" by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.libera.chat) |
| 07:07:12 | braewoods | speachy: wb |
| 07:07:21 | speachy | UPS died. :/ |
| 07:07:35 | braewoods | speachy: care to review my changes? |
| 07:07:36 | speachy | refuses to power up, batteries are good. |
| 07:07:42 | speachy | can't for a few hours |
| 07:07:44 | braewoods | ok |
| 07:07:58 | braewoods | sounds like it could be a hardware failure then |
| 07:08:46 | braewoods | tldr; i staged 2 commits for implementing a space optimized version of the mi4 checksum algorithm |
| 07:10:07 | braewoods | already tested it on the h10 5gb |
| 07:10:22 | braewoods | works with both the new/old bootloader and new/old main; only used during booting anyway |
| 07:10:46 | braewoods | it's a bit slower but it's only used when booting so probably not that big of a deal |
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| 07:29:22 | speachy | Li-Ion UPSes command a 7x price premium still. sigh. |
| 07:31:48 | braewoods | speachy: what kind of UPS broke? |
| 07:33:25 | speachy | tripp-lite smart1500lcd to be precise |
| 07:33:54 | speachy | 4 yr old or so. been through one battery replacement already. |
| 07:34:01 | braewoods | $227 on amazon |
| 07:34:07 | speachy | yep. |
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| 07:34:28 | braewoods | you were looking for something not based on SLA? |
| 07:35:02 | speachy | curious about pricing alternatives |
| 07:35:07 | speachy | but yeah |
| 07:35:32 | braewoods | i've heard some people modded their SLA UPS to take a lifepo4 pack |
| 07:35:59 | braewoods | only problem is lifepo4 packs usually have low discharge amps compared to SLA |
| 07:36:18 | braewoods | at least at the sizes UPS often use |
| 07:36:20 | speachy | after two different battery explosions due to not using stock battery chemistries I'm leery of doing such things. |
| 07:36:35 | braewoods | true. |
| 07:36:57 | braewoods | it is an option. some people have managed to use lifepo4 for a drop in replacement. |
| 07:37:19 | braewoods | but i'd not do that unless i knew everything about the design of the battery it expects to have |
| 07:37:33 | braewoods | but if it does CC/CV only then it may be compatible |
| 07:37:36 | braewoods | for charging |
| 07:37:45 | braewoods | as for discharge... |
| 07:37:48 | braewoods | oui |
| 07:37:59 | braewoods | 12V needs a lot of amps to work |
| 07:38:03 | speachy | the limiting factor is most likely the UPS's inverter anyway. |
| 07:38:07 | braewoods | i expect high end UPS would use higher voltage |
| 07:38:24 | braewoods | 12V DC would need a shit ton of amps to support 500+ W |
| 07:38:55 | speachy | 37.5A max (@24V) on this thing, for example (assuming 100% efficiency) |
| 07:39:24 | braewoods | 4S lifepo4 is fairl compatible with SLA voltage range |
| 07:39:27 | braewoods | at 12V |
| 07:39:39 | braewoods | but you're dealing with 24V... |
| 07:39:50 | braewoods | my 7S lithium pack is 29.4V peak |
| 07:40:00 | braewoods | around 21V at the low end |
| 07:40:44 | braewoods | i suspect loads don't care about the battery chemistry as long as it's within its voltage range tolerances and can handle the discharge rate of the load |
| 07:41:05 | braewoods | the main problem is probably charging which does have to care about the chemistry |
| 07:41:19 | speachy | yep, charging is the real key. |
| 07:41:54 | braewoods | i'm working on installing a DC online UPS for my networking gear |
| 07:41:58 | speachy | well, figuring out the remaining capacity too −− LiFePO4 has a _very_ flat curve. looks great until it's nearly completely dead |
| 07:42:10 | braewoods | oh, right. it won't know the load. |
| 07:42:19 | braewoods | so it'll throw off any instruments and anything relying on that data. |
| 07:42:56 | braewoods | i imported a proline modular UPS that lets you connect most any SLA battery to it |
| 07:43:01 | braewoods | it only does CC/CV type charging |
| 07:43:04 | speachy | the UPS I had explode on me (twice) was set up with some deep cycle marine wet cell batteries; I spec'd it for ~5 hours of runtime. |
| 07:43:22 | speachy | but the charging characteristics ended up cooking the cells after about 2 years. |
| 07:43:38 | braewoods | i see. |
| 07:43:47 | speachy | after the second such bang I decided it wasn't worth the risk again. |
| 07:43:50 | braewoods | don't UPS normally take regular SLA batteries? |
| 07:43:57 | speachy | yep |
| 07:44:01 | braewoods | not those special purpose built ones |
| 07:44:39 | speachy | If I really wanted to go nuts I could use some 4-cell golf cart batteries. :D |
| 07:44:47 | speachy | those things are built for abuse |
| 07:44:51 | speachy | but $$$ |
| 07:45:22 | braewoods | i'm not sure if it's wise but i was considering using my DC UPS on a 4S lifepo4 battery pack |
| 07:45:23 | speachy | anyway. this is way OT, and not even high on the priority list for the day. |
| 07:45:49 | braewoods | hm |
| 08:00 |
| 08:42:47 | rb-bluebot | Build Server message: New build round started. Revision 581081a3df, 297 builds, 8 clients. |
| 08:44:21 | braewoods | _bilgus: thanks |
| 08:44:42 | braewoods | _bilgus: care to test how much free space you now have on the c200 and e200? |
| 08:44:46 | _bilgus | np ill stay long enough to make sure it sticks |
| 08:45:05 | braewoods | or i can calculate it if you know the space limit |
| 08:45:17 | _bilgus | not at my dev machine |
| 08:45:19 | braewoods | ok |
| 08:45:47 | braewoods | which reminds me, i'm replacing my old dev machine with a newer system... first upgrade of it in 5 years |
| 08:46:04 | braewoods | double the core count and quadruple the RAM |
| 08:46:14 | _bilgus | I went to the micro pcs really liking it |
| 08:46:29 | braewoods | ah, my dev machine is also my server NAS and desktop |
| 08:46:43 | braewoods | why i still use a full size tower |
| 08:47:21 | _bilgus | new micro pc is specd like my giant one just in 10% of the space |
| 08:47:46 | braewoods | yea that works too but i really enjoy the power I got in this one |
| 08:48:13 | braewoods | it will be interesting to see how well this new ATX12VO psu standard works out |
| 08:48:26 | braewoods | it'll be a drastic departure from the old ATX systems |
| 08:48:27 | _bilgus | yeah I guess as I get older the clutter becomes annoying |
| 08:49:01 | braewoods | it gets rid of the 3.3V and 5V rails and replaces it all with 12V |
| 08:49:04 | _bilgus | the hp biz machines already do as a general rule |
| 08:49:42 | _bilgus | I spun up boards to convert so I could use real power supplies |
| 08:50:04 | braewoods | _bilgus: how much barrel jack power does the mini pc use? |
| 08:50:07 | braewoods | 19V i assume? |
| 08:50:29 | _bilgus | its lenova so same as the laptop bricks |
| 08:50:35 | braewoods | so 19V. |
| 08:50:51 | _bilgus | sounds right |
| 08:50:54 | braewoods | so they basically took the laptop model and applied it to a mini pc |
| 08:51:27 | _bilgus | yeah infact the mini pcs are like laptop boards w/ no monitor |
| 08:51:45 | braewoods | if you need a UPS for it there's a few options for DC only power; they have no inverters |
| 08:52:10 | braewoods | just kinda interesting if nothing else |
| 08:52:43 | braewoods | i saw one on alibaba or so that provides 19V regulated output; uses lifepo4 cells |
| 08:52:51 | braewoods | not much runtime but interesting in any case |
| 08:53:00 | _bilgus | my power has gone out here 1x in 10 yrs |
| 08:53:08 | braewoods | ah i see |
| 08:53:15 | _bilgus | the ups's die before they get an event |
| 08:53:42 | _bilgus | I wanna say that 1x was a brown out |
| 08:53:53 | braewoods | the desktop PC is evolving |
| 08:54:07 | braewoods | most new cases have no front side drive bays |
| 08:54:38 | braewoods | 3.5" internal is being phased out in favor of other stuff |
| 08:54:44 | _bilgus | I thought I'd miss cd drives or dvd but no |
| 08:55:04 | braewoods | well i still miss the front side drive bays; i did manage to find a case finally |
| 08:55:39 | braewoods | but i'm not using mine for optical drives |
| 08:55:55 | braewoods | one is a status LCD connected over USB |
| 08:56:08 | braewoods | the other is a front panel USB hub |
| 08:56:17 | _bilgus | my old dev machine has like 5 disks it makes 5tb of storage far more feasible than the mini pc 2 drive bays + m2 |
| 08:58:44 | _bilgus | 2.5" drive bays I think I found 3tb drives but they are $$ and likely less reliable |
| 09:00 |
| 09:02:49 | braewoods | do these build rounds normally take this long? |
| 09:03:19 | _bilgus | depends whos on |
| 09:03:42 | braewoods | i see |
| 09:04:33 | braewoods | _bilgus: do you have any recommendations for converting car voltage range to a regulated 12V? |
| 09:04:45 | braewoods | 10.8 to 13.8 volts here |
| 09:04:55 | braewoods | though it'll be at 13.8V most of the time |
| 09:05:12 | _bilgus | the under voltage is the one that makes it harder |
| 09:05:21 | _bilgus | so you need buck and boost |
| 09:05:31 | braewoods | indeed since the voltage i need is in the middle |
| 09:05:54 | _bilgus | those ebay modules are fine depending on the amps |
| 09:06:01 | rb-bluebot | Build Server message: Build round completed after 1394 seconds. |
| 09:06:04 | rb-bluebot | Build Server message: Revision 581081a3df result: All green |
| 09:06:07 | _bilgus | consider it half the listing |
| 09:06:23 | _bilgus | yay! |
| 09:06:59 | braewoods | yea, the proline i bought can handle uh.. |
| 09:07:17 | braewoods | it provides 10.8V to 13.8V but is always at 13.8V when AC is connected |
| 09:07:22 | braewoods | the range is when the battery kicks in |
| 09:07:49 | _bilgus | well tbh the most regulated dc you will ever have is another battery |
| 09:08:09 | _bilgus | if you need big amps you be better off that way |
| 09:08:29 | braewoods | well the max load amps is 6.5Aish at 13.8V |
| 09:08:33 | _bilgus | but 10A or < then buck boost |
| 09:09:02 | braewoods | more than enough |
| 09:09:41 | braewoods | given the problems with barrel jack connectors i'm planning to distribute my heaviest load to one regulator and the lighter 2 to a different one |
| 09:09:58 | braewoods | the proline i have provides 2 DC barrel jacks |
| 09:10:13 | _bilgus | or switch to the connectors made for rc cars |
| 09:10:23 | _bilgus | oh |
| 09:10:42 | braewoods | well it's more the fact that barrel jacks don't really advertise their amp loads well |
| 09:11:01 | braewoods | if i could find a buck boost inline converter i'd use that but |
| 09:11:06 | braewoods | they're usually buck or boost only |
| 09:11:23 | braewoods | instead i have to buy one and wire it up for my purposes myself |
| 09:11:59 | braewoods | in any case this ended up being more cost effective for me to replace my crappy UPS for my networking gear |
| 09:12:06 | _bilgus | Its not a complicated circuit but there are ready made ones |
| 09:12:50 | _bilgus | have run into one that was buck only even though they claimed both |
| 09:13:09 | _bilgus | well 5 of them but they eventually got used |
| 09:19:15 | _bilgus | braewoods, it was double because of the stacked commits, duh |
| 09:19:33 | braewoods | _bilgus: lol |
| 09:19:36 | _bilgus | in hindsight |
| 09:19:50 | braewoods | _bilgus: well, i'd already tested it to minimize the chance of random failure |
| 09:20:06 | braewoods | side note, i discovered the H10 is freezing again during boot |
| 09:20:08 | braewoods | not sure why this time |
| 09:20:42 | _bilgus | Idk whats changed since then but ugh. |
| 09:20:46 | braewoods | the H10 20GB has got to be the most fickle rockbox port i've ever used |
| 09:21:07 | braewoods | you want to take another look at it? |
| 09:21:19 | _bilgus | no time atm |
| 09:21:21 | braewoods | ok |
| 09:21:31 | braewoods | i'll let speachy know it's not booting for now |
| 09:21:47 | braewoods | oddly the 5GB model works just fine |
| 09:21:59 | _bilgus | I assume you updated the fw? |
| 09:22:06 | braewoods | the OF firmware? |
| 09:22:16 | _bilgus | no rb |
| 09:22:28 | braewoods | yes, i tested the latest dev build and it froze during boot |
| 09:22:45 | braewoods | i'll look into it more later |
| 09:22:58 | _bilgus | ah ok so some commit broke it |
| 09:22:58 | braewoods | i ended up using the 5GB model to test my crc changes |
| 09:23:35 | braewoods | thanks for your help merging it; i can now return to working on my rockzip module |
| 09:23:43 | _bilgus | there can't be many that actually touched h20 specific code |
| 09:24:07 | braewoods | i just needed a viable crc32 algorithm and this solves that problem |
| 09:24:33 | braewoods | i'm trying to make rockzip as lightweight as possible so we can use it on even low ram targets (in theory) |
| 09:24:39 | _bilgus | np I can still read code without my dev machine |
| 09:24:54 | braewoods | main problem is i need at least 128KB of memory for buffer space |
| 09:25:00 | braewoods | due to how ZIP is designed |
| 09:25:26 | braewoods | but that is best dynamically allocated so it doesn't need to be permanently reserved |
| 09:25:29 | _bilgus | kill the playback buffer |
| 09:25:51 | braewoods | yea, i decided to make allocating the buffer up to the user of the library |
| 09:26:00 | braewoods | so i don't need to care how it is allocated in my code |
| 09:26:18 | braewoods | that way i can use a static allocation in the bootloader and dynamic in rockbox itself |
| 09:26:32 | _bilgus | in the case of a plugin itd also depend on bin size |
| 09:26:55 | braewoods | indeed |
| 09:27:09 | braewoods | i'm just optimizing for size since i expect rockzip to become part of the firmware |
| 09:27:16 | _bilgus | you might be able to satisify both with only the plugin buffer |
| 09:27:48 | _bilgus | itd be nice to enable theme files to be loaded as zip |
| 09:28:04 | braewoods | well for now i'm just implementing basic zip file support |
| 09:28:12 | braewoods | how it gets used is a matter of creativity |
| 09:28:36 | braewoods | my library will handle everything except what to do with the files and data payload |
| 09:28:56 | braewoods | i plan to support only the basic 2 storage methods; STORE and DEFLATE |
| 09:29:08 | _bilgus | is pass protect part of that spec? |
| 09:29:23 | braewoods | maybe but i don't plan to add support for it because it's not really necessary for what we do |
| 09:29:56 | braewoods | why would we need support for encrypted ZIP files? |
| 09:30:32 | braewoods | the only two parts that seem necessary to use a third party library for is the crc32 algorith and DEFLATE |
| 09:30:37 | _bilgus | nothing in particular just curious |
| 09:30:44 | braewoods | ah |
| 09:30:46 | braewoods | ok |
| 09:31:05 | braewoods | if you want to look into other uses for rockzip, be my guest. i'm desinging it for a port specific problem. |
| 09:31:19 | braewoods | but i conceived of using it to extract rockbox archive payloads and such sent over MTP or UMS |
| 09:31:42 | _bilgus | well assuming it can unzip the themefiles.zip then it'd make user stuff easier |
| 09:32:02 | _bilgus | and builds could be installed like that too |
| 09:32:04 | braewoods | it'll be able to extract them to the internal storage |
| 09:32:09 | braewoods | or w/e you decide to do with it |
| 09:32:21 | braewoods | maybe you can just load them into RAM from the archive |
| 09:32:36 | braewoods | initially i'm only going to have a basic function that extracts to internal storage |
| 09:32:50 | _bilgus | with ROLO for sure to internal but the themes I hope can just load from ram |
| 09:33:09 | braewoods | plus the option of processing the ZIP file from a RAM buffer or from a file descriptor |
| 09:33:20 | _bilgus | we already cache theme files |
| 09:34:03 | braewoods | the advantage of using ZIP is we'll be able to leverage the compressed data to reduce RAM requirements for loading the archive into RAM |
| 09:34:21 | *** | No seen item changed, no save performed. |
| 09:35:20 | _bilgus | it still has to expand though to use it so how is that an advantage |
| 09:35:47 | braewoods | _bilgus: it is if you're planning to write it to disk |
| 09:35:59 | braewoods | but in either case |
| 09:36:08 | _bilgus | oh you mean while creating an archive? |
| 09:36:25 | braewoods | well i'm only planning to support read-only access |
| 09:36:32 | braewoods | at least initially |
| 09:36:50 | braewoods | i'm stripping it down to a minimal subset so the requirements won't overwhelm rockbox |
| 09:37:02 | _bilgus | I'm not understanding how the zip file gets in ram then? |
| 09:37:25 | braewoods | _bilgus: someone reads the archive into RAM. they process the file contents in RAM before writing to disk. |
| 09:37:34 | braewoods | by reading the archive into RAM they avoid the double-io penalty |
| 09:37:45 | braewoods | from trying to read/write at the same time |
| 09:38:00 | _bilgus | ah ok |
| 09:40:24 | _bilgus | I suppose with flash storage at least you would really want nice long blocks too |
| 09:40:53 | braewoods | _bilgus: and zip files also don't really lend themselves well to sequential access all the time |
| 09:41:13 | braewoods | to parse them fully you end up jumping around a lot. |
| 09:41:29 | _bilgus | yeah i'm not not overly familar clearly |
| 09:41:32 | braewoods | the data payload is stored in a different region from the basic directory payload |
| 09:42:01 | braewoods | you first look for the end of directory record at the end of the file |
| 09:42:19 | braewoods | once you find it you find the offset of the first regular file entry |
| 09:42:36 | braewoods | it also details how many exist in this contiguous region |
| 09:42:50 | braewoods | this is enough if you just want to iterate over the metadata |
| 09:43:09 | braewoods | but if you want to process the file data, you need to jump to wherever it stored it as indicated by each entry's LF offset field |
| 09:43:22 | braewoods | it's usually stored at the start of the archive |
| 09:43:31 | _bilgus | are you planning to add that to the file browser? |
| 09:43:42 | braewoods | maybe, but not right now. |
| 09:43:50 | braewoods | VFS support seems a bit further along. |
| 09:44:12 | braewoods | but it's not impossible to add |
| 09:44:26 | braewoods | hm |
| 09:44:35 | _bilgus | wouldn't need to do that just make a file/dir list |
| 09:44:44 | braewoods | oh |
| 09:44:46 | braewoods | i see |
| 09:44:47 | _bilgus | then you unzip |
| 09:44:57 | braewoods | so support for extraction from the UI or so |
| 09:45:36 | braewoods | well i'll finish my first use case and we'll see where that leaves us |
| 09:45:39 | braewoods | one thing at a time and all |
| 09:46:25 | braewoods | we can also experiment with faster crc32 if zip support is too slow or so |
| 09:46:32 | braewoods | or even disabling crc checks |
| 09:47:03 | braewoods | but for now i'm just going to turn on all my validation checks |
| 09:47:24 | _bilgus | yeah make it right first :) |
| 10:00 |
| 10:03:03 | braewoods | _bilgus: which also reminds me, by having a single source for crc32 we could also swap in a faster version if we don't mind the waste |
| 10:03:13 | braewoods | make the choice at compile time or something |
| 10:03:44 | braewoods | but that's for later if we deem it useful |
| 10:03:58 | braewoods | we don't use these much as it is so a faster version won't do us much good |
| 10:04:42 | braewoods | in theory we could also use these to replace code in some of the apps too |
| 10:05:24 | braewoods | _bilgus: i'll give you more stuff as i work on this rockzip code. |
| 10:05:36 | braewoods | for now i'm developing it for my desktop target so i can easily test my code |
| 10:05:47 | braewoods | just using designs that will easily translate to rockbox |
| 10:06:46 | _bilgus | well with plugins just have them carry it |
| 10:07:33 | braewoods | i guess if they need a speed optimized version that would probably be best |
| 10:07:38 | braewoods | rockbox core doesn't need one |
| 10:07:55 | _bilgus | and its a mp3 player lol |
| 10:08:14 | _bilgus | just zip support is amazing |
| 10:08:46 | braewoods | i'm working on this because i need at least some ZIP support to make delivery of the first installation of rockbox on gigabeat S smoother |
| 10:09:03 | braewoods | so i thought i should make it something reusable while i'm at it |
| 10:09:40 | braewoods | being able to upload the rockbox files right before the bootloader payloader would make it much easier |
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| 10:11:11 | _bilgus | bbl |
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| 14:28:20 | _bilgus | braewoods, I assume you tested g#3316 on the H20 can we assume thats a known good point? |
| 14:28:22 | rb-bluebot | Gerrit review #3316 at https://gerrit.rockbox.org/r/c/rockbox/+/3316 : pp: fix adc mistake where base 10 was used instead of base 16 by James Buren |
| 14:54:51 | braewoods | _bilgus: probably. |
| 14:55:07 | braewoods | only one way to know; it's been awhile |
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| 23:37:24 | __builtin | so I've had commit access on this project for ~5 years at this point... and I *just* found out what we have working USB serial support :/ |
| 23:56:23 | __builtin | anyway, I need some ideas: I've got a heisenbug that's manifesting as a mysterious yet consistent memory corruption of a particular variable |
| 23:56:37 | __builtin | (only on hardware, of course...) |
| 23:57:18 | __builtin | can you all think of any tricks for quickly tracking this down? |
icon identifies that the person is a core developer (has commit access).