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#rockbox log for 2021-09-13

00:06:03 Quit Piece_Maker (*.net *.split)
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11:51:20 Join dconrad [0] (~dconrad@208.38.228.17)
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12:19:01dconradspeachy: are there any old devices we support that have charge-only usb? If not, perhaps we could get rid of the "Force" option of "Charge During USB Connection"?
12:19:54dconradit causes an issue with g#3780, and I'm not sure if we could just remove it or should go through the runaround of making both work
12:20:28dconrador, rather devices where that option makes sense
12:20:30speachyI know we have devices that don't charge over USB.
12:20:48speachyand some devices where the only thing that does work over USB is charging
12:21:03dconradah, so we do
12:21:26speachy(ie due to incomplete ports rather than inherent hardware limitations)
12:29:54dconradI think I understand that option better now, I'll make it "(FORCE && usb_no_host) || (usb_no_host)", I think that'll allow both to work without locking up
12:30:36dconradwell, though maybe that comes back around to FORCE not mattering
12:50:16speachyyeah, that's effectively makes FORCE into a dontcare
13:00
13:17:23dconradmaybe this is too specific a question, but on a device without usb data capabilities, will the usb_state ever be CONFIGURED? or will it always be DEFAULT?
13:18:59speachy... what do the iriver 1xx/3xx do?
13:20:45dconradthose don't have usb data?
13:21:08speachynope, they charge via a separate port and the USB port is attached to a USB-ATA bridge
13:21:28dconradhuh, weird, ok
13:24:18dconradthe charging is still "usb" though? As far as rockbox knows
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16:05:34dconradit looks like I'm not able to push to gerrit today, I'm getting Connection Refused, has anything changed in the setup with the move?
16:05:53speachyohhhhyeah,... hang on.
16:07:51speachytry again please
16:08:42dconradyep, that works
16:09:11speachycool. I didn't make the gerrit ssh port part of the permanent firewall rules so it got lost when I rebooted the VPS with the new network config.
16:09:33speachy(bad speachy)
16:09:36dconradso it should be stable across reboots now?
16:09:40speachyyeah
16:09:42dconradsweet
16:11:18dconradre: iriver, it looks like it has USB charging without having the usb stack, or something like that... I can't say I can understand what something like that would want in regards to charging current set
16:12:20dconradturns out I was just looking for the "FORCE" option, but in this day and age it never occurred to me charging with high current from an AC adapter wouldn't be default
16:12:53speachysomething like that wont' care at all about charging current; it's presumably handled by external hardware...
16:14:20dconradso my thought is to, in some shape or form, make higher current from an AC adapter the default option
16:14:47dconradeither make Force default or make Enable do what Force currently does
16:17:17dconradI've tested both options on my eros, but I don't know if there's weird implications for esoteric old devices for the latter
17:00
17:24:50braewoodsdconrad: only the h300 can charge over usb
17:25:00braewoodsthe h1xx is barrel jack only
17:25:32dconradah, good to know, the h300 was the one I looked at for an example
17:26:45braewoodseven then it's not all that comparable since the h3xx is still hw usb only for the most part
17:27:04braewoodsit does have a otg port but rockbox has never supported both in one target
17:27:30braewoodseven if you did the OTG port is limited to 1.1 speeds so not much use.
17:30:06braewoodsbasic problem is they can't co-exist afaik because it was assumed only one of them would be active at a time
17:30:50 Join Moriar [0] (~moriar@107-200-193-159.lightspeed.stlsmo.sbcglobal.net)
17:32:57dconradI mostly just wonder if making "USB Charge Enable" do what "USB Charge Force" currently does is going to cause problems
17:33:10dconradi.e. ask for 500mA from an AC adapter
17:35:09braewoodsit can't ask for 0.5mah from an ac adapter unless it has the data pins connected and it actually understands usb protocol
17:36:44dconradthe way we do it is we just decide if we haven't talked to a host for 10 seconds, do 500mA
17:37:10dconradsee firmware/usbstack/usb_core.c
17:37:14braewoods0.5mah is still pretty conservative and is the maximum you can ask from for usb
17:37:18braewoods2.0
17:37:25braewoodserr
17:37:27braewoods0.5ah
17:37:29braewoodsamps
17:37:43speachythe danger is if the adapter _can't_ supply 500ma; what happens?
17:37:52braewoodsNo idea.
17:37:54dconradit's a wimpy adapter?
17:38:03braewoodsBut most adapters should be able to provie 0.5 amps.
17:38:13braewoodsthat's a pretty small amount to begin with.
17:38:38speachythe smarter ones are less likely, actually −− absent a negotiation, they're not supposed to allow more than 100ma.
17:38:42braewoodsit's so low the only way i can think to test this is to use a low CC limit on a power supply
17:38:47dconradmaybe that's a good argument for keeping "Enable" and "Force" separate
17:39:10braewoodsand see what happens
17:39:32speachyie just plug it into a usb hub that's not connected to a PC; it should still supply power.
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17:43:28TorCI believe some cheap USB hubs don't have any current limiters, and will just wire a 2A source to four ports.
17:43:52braewoodsi'd rather test it on a CC power supply myself
17:44:21braewoodsthose are usually designed with plenty of safeties in the event of shorts or over current
17:44:31speachyI'd make this something that's configurable; at least on a per-target basis, and we can whitelist targets as they get tested.
17:45:21dconradis there a way to do a per-target setting default?
17:45:50dconradlike, a different default value depending on the target
17:45:50speachy#define something in the firmware/export/config/target.h ?
17:46:41dconradhmm, yeah I suppose
17:47:03speachyyeah, there is −− in the appropriat place in setting_list (or whtever) chagne the fixed default to a value #defined somewhere, with a default #ifndef whatever, #define whatever
17:47:23 Quit ZincAlloy (Quit: Leaving.)
17:47:24dconradoh, sure that makes sense
17:48:15speachy#ifndef TARGET_USB_CHARGE_DEFAULT #define TARGET_USB_CHARGE_DEFAULT MODE_FORCE
17:48:34speachyeg
18:00
18:11:48dconradso something along the lines of g#3805?
18:31:26speachyyep, exactly like that
18:37:02dconradappears to work without issue on both eros q and m3k, with fresh installations onto the card (to ensure I'm getting the real default)
18:40:07dconradnot related to that patch, the m3k doesn't have current values hooked up in the debug pages though, can't see the real charge current
18:40:41dconradbut the requested current changes appropriately
19:00
19:16:30speachyhow are you measuring the actual current?
19:20:04dconradjust the built-in measurement on the debug page
19:20:35dconradit seems to be accurate enough
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