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| 09:55:22 | speachy | Nyaa: No in herent reason why not; if I'm reading the specs on that thing properly there are _Three_ separate cores; the highest power one is a 64-bit native one that's probably going to be a bit of a headache, but the middle one looks about perfect. The tiny one should still be useful too. |
| 09:57:09 | speachy | not immediately obvious if there's an onboard audio codec and what board pinout supports (eg we'd want 4-bit MMC/SD, 3-bit I2S, external SPI flash and some sort of display hookup, etc..) |
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| 11:51:26 | Nyaa | speachy, there is onboard audio and display |
| 11:51:36 | Nyaa | though accessible in somewhat odd ways |
| 11:52:13 | Nyaa | maybe the reference manual would be a better resource one sec |
| 11:52:19 | speachy | probably don't need external flash, as long as there's enough onboard for a bootloader capable of hitting the SD card. |
| 11:52:46 | Nyaa | here's the reference manual https://github.com/bouffalolab/bl_docs/raw/main/BL808_RM/en/BL808_RM_en_1.2.pdf |
| 11:54:16 | Nyaa | speachy, additionally i'm pretty sure the middle core is the core that boots the device, the other two you have to set up yourself after |
| 11:57:51 | Nyaa | the flash is "external" flash already, though the ox64 boards come in two variants, one with 2MiB of external [soldered winbond chip] and without an sdcard slot, and one with 16MiB [also asoldered winbond chip] and with an sdcard slot |
| 11:58:07 | Nyaa | iirc it's also possible to solder a 32MiB SPI chip too |
| 12:00 |
| 12:02:43 | Nyaa | oh, also due to a bootrom bug, it'd be semi-necessary to include a USB programming mode in anything you flash to the SPI memory, since programming it otherwise is pretty annoying, i've been stuck trying to figure that one out lol |
| 12:06:41 | Nyaa | the datasheet has more info about the hardware specifications too, https://raw.githubusercontent.com/bouffalolab/bl_docs/main/BL808_DS/en/BL808_DS_1.2_en.pdf |
| 12:07:29 | Nyaa | the on-board audio only does one channel, so supporting an external audio codec might be a good idea if someone did want to port it lol |
| 12:12:32 | jssfr | • Integrated with two 20-bit DACs that support two analog LINEOUT differential outputs with ramp power-on function |
| 12:12:35 | jssfr | that sounds like two-channel? |
| 12:12:46 | jssfr | or is that one channel with differential output? |
| 12:13:16 | Nyaa | oh i was looking at the audio codec |
| 12:13:29 | Nyaa | it also has a general purpose dac [or maybe two?] |
| 12:13:39 | jssfr | I was looking at the AUDIO thing, too |
| 12:13:49 | Nyaa | datasheet says "DAC*1" |
| 12:13:52 | jssfr | (page 527 in the reference manual) |
| 12:15:48 | jssfr | > AUDIO has two DACs. |
| 12:15:52 | jssfr | this is explicit, seems sensible |
| 12:16:10 | jssfr | for a reference manual, that document has shockingly little information on how to access the DAC |
| 12:16:15 | Nyaa | yeah hold on i'm asking the pine64 dev team which one is correct |
| 12:16:35 | Nyaa | initial response is that they don't know either and to check the SDK |
| 12:16:54 | Nyaa | here's the SDK https://github.com/bouffalolab/bouffalo_sdk |
| 12:18:59 | Nyaa | ok i see two channels init'd in the SDK demo |
| 12:19:10 | jssfr | was just looking at https://github.com/bouffalolab/bouffalo_sdk/blob/10cea536539c5c97e64b40d55725ed5b614d2aa2/examples/peripherals/audio/audac_play_from_mem/main.c, too |
| 12:19:31 | jssfr | with a SoC-DAC, I'd really like to hear how it sounds before investing any effort in porting to it though. |
| 12:20:03 | Nyaa | lol yeah idk how good it'll be since the onboard audio is mostly an afterthought afaict |
| 12:20:17 | Nyaa | but there's plenty of gpio to support an external codec |
| 12:20:45 | jssfr | right |
| 12:20:56 | jssfr | (including I2S) |
| 12:21:18 | jssfr | though the question is if I2S is exposed on the Ox64 pinout. |
| 12:22:10 | jssfr | whenever I look at processor/microcontroller vendors which are not STM or Atmel, I'm massively disappointed by documentatio.n |
| 12:22:11 | Nyaa | it does |
| 12:22:14 | Nyaa | https://wiki.pine64.org/images/2/24/Ox64_pinout.png |
| 12:22:26 | jssfr | ahhh, up there |
| 12:23:15 | Nyaa | they also said a lot of stuff goes through pinmux so most of the pins are re-assignable |
| 12:32:47 | Nyaa | guess first question would be, can the rockbox bootloader be compiled to RV32IMAFCP or a subset of it |
| 12:33:16 | Nyaa | gonna have a hard time going anywhere if it won't even compile to the architecture lol |
| 12:33:19 | jssfr | I would be surprised if not, possibly with minor modifications |
| 12:33:30 | jssfr | if GCC has support for that, at least :-) |
| 12:33:38 | Nyaa | it does |
| 12:33:53 | Nyaa | uhh, what version of gcc gets used |
| 12:34:00 | Nyaa | if it's an ancient version like 4.3 than no lol |
| 12:34:09 | * | jssfr is still disappointed that his toy FPGA is too weak to synthesize any 32-bit RISC-V he found in :< |
| 12:34:23 | gevaerts | 4.3 is *new*! |
| 12:34:25 | Nyaa | jssfr, well you could grab one of these ox64 boards, they're pretty cheap lol |
| 12:34:28 | jssfr | I do seem to recall rockbox being rather opinionated about gcc versions, but I don't recall whether that was specific to a target ... :-) |
| 12:34:42 | * | gevaerts still feels that gcc 2.7 is normal :) |
| 12:34:49 | jssfr | Nyaa, thanks, I've got a bunch of ESP32-C3 on my desk :-). |
| 12:34:55 | Nyaa | ah i have one of those too |
| 12:35:22 | speachy | my "new" vs "old" is the EGCS fork. :D |
| 12:35:56 | gevaerts | Ah yes! |
| 12:36:59 | Nyaa | looks like the oldest version of gcc recommended for compiling code for the 64 bit core is gcc-git lol |
| 12:37:09 | Nyaa | because they're still not done fully adding support in |
| 12:37:31 | Nyaa | [mostly the vector extensions] |
| 12:38:59 | Nyaa | looks like the official risc-v toolchain uses gcc-12.2 though |
| 12:39:12 | Nyaa | https://github.com/riscv-collab/riscv-gnu-toolchain |
| 12:39:55 | speachy | jssfr: Rockbox doesn't actually care about which gcc version you use (in a general sense) but as we do a ton of low-level stuff newer versions of the compiler (and linker, etc) might trip over latent bugs or grey areas in our codebase. |
| 12:40:19 | Nyaa | time to just rewrite all of rockbox /s |
| 12:40:21 | Nyaa | lol |
| 12:41:02 | speachy | for example, a lot of the build farm runs gcc 12 or 13 for the sim builds. |
| 12:41:36 | Nyaa | ah, if the gcc-12 series works at least for part of it than it should hopefully not be too hard lol |
| 12:41:57 | speachy | but for the targets, we're currently on 4.9.4 across the board. I have a bump to 8.5 sitting in gerrit but I haven't found enough volunteers to try builds on platforms I don't have. |
| 12:41:58 | gevaerts | If you're doing the first port for a new CPU architecture, you pick the version you want |
| 12:42:10 | speachy | exactly ^^^ |
| 12:42:22 | gevaerts | If it's another arm, things are a bit more subtle |
| 12:42:44 | Nyaa | unless it's arm64 since it looks like no 64 bit targets are supported currently |
| 12:43:07 | speachy | yeah, we might need to rebuild our arm toolchains so they have native v6m/v7m libc stuff. |
| 12:43:40 | speachy | Hmm, I should add that into the gcc8.5 patchset. |
| 12:44:11 | gevaerts | I shoud consider sending some of my players to people who actually still do stuff... |
| 12:44:20 | speachy | I'd strongly caution against native 64-bit rockbox builds. |
| 12:44:28 | Nyaa | to be fair it does look like there is a fork/patchset for gcc 4.9.x to add risc-v but idk how much of a good idea that is given risc-v is still an emerging architecture |
| 12:45:06 | gevaerts | If you're doing a risc-v port, I see no reason to go for older compilers. You have no regressions to worry about |
| 12:45:39 | Nyaa | ah, makes sense |
| 12:46:31 | * | Nyaa wonders if rockbox is compilable with LLVM/Clang |
| 12:47:28 | gevaerts | For the existing ones the worry is that suddenly it crashes on boot for regular users after a regular upgrade and similar things. For new ports, that's just not an actual scenario |
| 12:48:08 | speachy | Nyaa: it's probably safer to say that rockbox requirs GNU LD, rather than GCC per se. |
| 12:48:55 | Nyaa | does rockbox have like, a generic target, for doing toolchain related stuff |
| 12:50:59 | Nyaa | i want to see how badly it explodes if i do try to use clang lol |
| 12:52:22 | speachy | a good start would be to build a hosted or simulator target using clang |
| 12:52:34 | speachy | or the generic SDL target |
| 12:52:54 | Nyaa | makes sense |
| 12:53:15 | Nyaa | how much storage space do i need for a rockbox dev environment lol |
| 12:53:42 | * | Nyaa is moving stuff off her SSD and onto her HDD to free up space since she only has like 10GB left |
| 12:53:46 | jssfr | my ~/Builds/rockbox, i.e. including a build and all kinds of stuff in there, is less than a GB |
| 12:53:51 | Nyaa | oh |
| 12:53:57 | Nyaa | ok i should be fine then lol |
| 12:54:05 | Nyaa | i'm used to projects that require a lot more space |
| 12:54:07 | jssfr | it's a media player firmware, not chromium. |
| 12:54:21 | * | Nyaa ports chromium to it |
| 12:54:22 | Nyaa | jk lol |
| 12:55:08 | speachy | toolchains for all targets (other than android) take about 1.7GB. |
| 12:55:26 | speachy | all combined, that is |
| 12:55:37 | gevaerts | Similar numbers here |
| 12:55:49 | gevaerts | android doesn't really count I'd say |
| 12:55:56 | Nyaa | android is android lol |
| 12:55:59 | speachy | about .5GB for a git checkout and a single target build. |
| 12:56:08 | gevaerts | I mean, the android port is basically dead |
| 12:56:20 | speachy | the android ndk+sdk take over 5GB. :D |
| 12:56:44 | Nyaa | i wonder if it would be possible to port to the iphone 1/2 or ipod touch 1, bare metal lol |
| 12:57:07 | Nyaa | [they have practically no bootloader locking and are easy to get bare metal stuff to boot untethered on] |
| 12:57:25 | gevaerts | Feel free to have a go :) |
| 12:57:27 | speachy | the first couple of generations are an arm1100ejs IIRC |
| 12:57:53 | speachy | we have the core support and toolchains for that already, so all that's left is the port to the actual hardware. |
| 12:58:27 | speachy | no silver bullets here, just a lot of lead. |
| 12:58:58 | Nyaa | might try once i'm not using the iphone 2 as my main phone lol |
| 12:59:10 | Nyaa | that'll either happen when i fix my usual main device or 2g gets shut down |
| 12:59:13 | Nyaa | whatever happens first |
| 13:00 |
| 13:00:15 | gevaerts | Is there any hardware documentation available for those? As in, has anyone reverse engineered things? |
| 13:00:19 | Nyaa | the iphone 1, 2, and ipod 1g all have near identical hardware |
| 13:00:37 | Nyaa | yeah, the openiboot team did a while back, they got linux booting on it iirc |
| 13:00:53 | speachy | ipod touch 1g, that is |
| 13:01:05 | Nyaa | the iphone 1, 2, and ipod touch 1 are all identical hardware-wise iirc |
| 13:01:13 | Nyaa | differences being cellular/gps modems |
| 13:01:33 | Nyaa | yeah |
| 13:02:29 | Nyaa | also, https://github.com/iDroid-Project/openiBoot |
| 13:03:38 | gevaerts | Then with sufficient motivation it should be possible |
| 13:04:17 | Nyaa | the ipod touch 2g introduced new hardware though |
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| 13:05:04 | Nyaa | i think the ipod touch 2g and iphone 3gs [third gen iphone] are identical though, minus the modem... including the "MC" hardware revision where they actually locked the bootloader |
| 13:06:30 | Nyaa | the non-MC models should be supportable but after that it's much harder |
| 13:07:53 | Nyaa | iirc, everything from the ipt2g/ip3gs mc model through the iphone x / ipod touch 7g all require a tethered bootloader exploit to boot into unsigned code |
| 13:08:07 | Nyaa | newer iphones have no such exploit and apple hasn't made a newer ipod touch |
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| 13:27:09 | Nyaa | jssfr, oh also the ox64 has zigbee and full bluetooth while iirc the esp32-c3 only has ble, no regular bluetooth [and no zigbee either] |
| 13:27:44 | Nyaa | i remember wanting to make a bluetooth audio thing for the esp32 i had only to learn it has no bluetooth classic support |
| 13:28:28 | Nyaa | now it runs the lighting in my room lol |
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| 13:34:01 | jssfr | I certainly don't want bluetooth anywhere near my audio |
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| 15:07:09 | Nyaa | does rockbox not factor in a generic lithium-ion discharge curve when calculating battery percentage, at least not on cowon d2? |
| 15:07:24 | Nyaa | the discharge curve looks near identical to how my pinetime acted before infinitime factored that in |
| 15:07:42 | Nyaa | quickly dropping from 95-100% down to 78-85%, then much slower down to ~50-60%, then way faster again |
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| 15:10:11 | jssfr | I thought there was calibration stuff per target? |
| 15:10:30 | Nyaa | i mean, there probably is, but all lithium-ion batteries follow a pretty similar pattern |
| 15:10:48 | Nyaa | a generic default could be included for stuff that hasn't had a calibration created yet |
| 15:14:05 | Nyaa | plus, given a lot of rockbox devices are aging now and many people would have replaced the included batteries, a generic discharge curve might be more accurate than the included one |
| 15:14:26 | Nyaa | [provided the device gives an accurate voltage readout, anyway] |
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| 15:23:54 | Nyaa | nickel-metal hydride and nickel-cadmium batteries have a similar discharge curves to li-ion too, although vastly different peak/cutoff voltages |
| 15:24:18 | Nyaa | they should all be interpolatable with bézier curves, though there's probably simpler maths for doing the same thing too |
| 15:25:14 | Nyaa | you basically need: peak voltage, first inflection, second inflection, cutoff voltage |
| 15:25:29 | Nyaa | and the whole curve is interpolatable from that |
| 15:26:37 | Nyaa | [oh, first/second inflection would be a percentage/voltage pair, not one value] |
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| 17:45:55 | speachy | okargh. make 4.4 triggers a build failure in our hosted toolchains. |
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| 18:03:24 | ats | Does 4.4.1 work OK? 4.4 had a nasty bug where it spawned child processes with SIGPIPE blocked... |
| 18:05:55 | speachy | it's a bug in the glibc makefiles, I just backported the fix and I'm seeing if that solves things. |
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| 21:03:54 | Nyaa | is there a list of which fonts have multilingual [particularly CJK] support anywhere? |
| 21:05:41 | Nyaa | I can read cryllic, kana, a bit of hangul, and a bit of hanzi; so i often leave my music filenames as-is... but most of the rockbox fonts can't render them |
| 21:08:02 | Nyaa | currently using 12pt sazanami mincho but that's missing accented latin characters |
| 21:13:18 | Nyaa | 14pt rockbox mix appears to have everything, as does 16pt unifont, but those are too big |
| 21:15:45 | Nyaa | ah, 11pt sazanami mincho appears to have everything but it's slightly too small lol |
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icon identifies that the person is a core developer (has commit access).