--- Log for 26.11.102 Server: calvino.freenode.net Channel: #rockbox --- Nick: logbot Version: Dancer V4.16p1 Started: 3 days and 10 hours ago 00.03.48 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 00.19.37 Join Jet8810 [0] (~Josh@adsl-34-195-227.bct.bellsouth.net) 01.02.06 Join mecraw_ [0] (~mecraw@12-252-136-249.client.attbi.com) 01.39.36 Quit paulheu () 01.40.56 Part LinusN 01.42.53 Quit TotMacher () 02.03.50 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 02.18.58 Join datazone [0] (~datazone@207.136.36.203) 04.03.54 *** No seen item changed, no save performed. 04.28.00 Quit _seb_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 04.28.20 Quit mecraw1212 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 04.28.35 Join mecraw1212 [0] (~mecraw@12-252-136-249.client.attbi.com) 04.33.06 Join _seb_ [0] (trilluser@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net) 05.07.59 Quit _seb_ ("mir Schnuppe was meine Kritiker sag'n...") 05.08.47 Join _seb_ [0] (trilluser@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net) 05.19.28 Join paulheu [0] (paulheu@node1e8d4.a2000.nl) 05.19.32 Quit hardeep ("[BX] Tabardation - the inability to master use of the key. See: retardation; Headcase.") 05.19.38 Part paulheu 05.19.42 Join paulheu [0] (paulheu@node1e8d4.a2000.nl) 05.19.43 Quit paulheu (Remote closed the connection) 05.19.47 Join paulheu [0] (paulheu@node1e8d4.a2000.nl) 05.19.49 Part paulheu 05.27.58 Join zoof [0] (~zoof@user-0ccesee.cable.mindspring.com) 05.28.03 # hi 05.28.48 Join MrHali [0] (yomomma@HSE-Ottawa-ppp157250.sympatico.ca) 05.28.55 # hi hi 05.29.12 # I just heard about rockbox 05.29.24 # what happened to it? 05.29.33 # I got my archos jukebox recorder last wek 05.29.58 # and My friend just told me that you guys exist 05.30.07 # rockbox rocks 05.30.20 # I haven't installed it yet 05.30.31 # I could use some pointers 05.30.49 # you use pc? 05.31.01 # yes 05.31.04 # win98 05.31.13 # hook up the usb cable 05.31.16 # ok 05.31.28 # and look for a file in the root of the archos 05.31.46 # ok 05.31.48 # called ajbrec.ajz 05.31.59 # i've seen that 05.31.59 # if you see it, rename it to something like archos.ajz 05.32.15 # so, you can optionally boot it if you want the original bios 05.32.40 # then just unzip that .zip file recursively to the root of the archos 05.32.47 # and reboot 05.32.47 # that's it? 05.32.48 # that's it 05.32.52 # wow 05.33.06 # what does rockbox have better than the original 05.33.16 # if you ever want to remove rockbox, just delete the ajbrec.ajz file and the .rockbox dir 05.33.27 # and rename that archos.ajz back to ajbrec.ajz 05.33.31 # how will it boot then? 05.33.36 # oh 05.33.47 # it will boot even if that ajbrec.ajz isn't there 05.34.00 # but, it will be the firmware version, that's all 05.34.32 # I didn't know that 05.34.33 # rockbox is still in development... but.. it's hellvucool 05.34.52 # maybe when laptop HD's go down in price I will install a bigger one 05.35.01 # i just loaded it onto mine a month ago 05.35.26 # if you are willing to dare testing some of the daily builds, the newer ones support recording.. 05.35.30 # but it's highly experimental 05.35.42 # i.e. the latest one crashes my archos 05.36.04 # so what do you do then? 05.36.13 # hard boot it 05.36.29 # hard boot? 05.36.39 # press off, press on ;-) 05.37.02 # but id doesn't crash every time does it? 05.37.15 # no.. it just crashes when trying to recorder 05.37.18 # er.. record 05.37.45 # the games they added to it are cool 05.37.56 # hmmm... 05.37.57 # i'm getting alittle tired of play tetris though 05.37.58 # ;-) 05.38.03 # I need to record often 05.38.40 # yah, they are *just* working out the bugs now 05.38.53 # it's working with mine on an older build 05.39.39 # is the current download stable? 05.39.52 # rockbox1.4 05.39.59 # yah.. 1.4 is stable 05.40.04 # ok 05.40.06 # what about this thing I read about on the web site about an occational problem with the HD becomming passwrod protected? 05.40.06 # but, there's no recording support 05.40.19 # i don't know.. i didn't have that problem 05.40.27 Nick _seb_ is now known as seb-sleep (trilluser@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net) 05.40.33 # i'm just a user like you.. not a develop 05.40.36 # er 05.40.45 # no recording support? 05.40.56 # I downloaded "rockbox-1.4-recorder.zip" 05.41.16 # yes, that is stable, but it doesn't have any recording support 05.41.35 # so it can't record? 05.41.38 # they are working on recording now, if you dare to try one of the daily builds instead 05.41.47 # hmmm 05.41.52 # but, as i said, the latest one crashes my archos 05.42.05 # I think i'll wait until they get it right 05.42.12 # I record often 05.42.22 # * MrHali feels like he's talking in circles 05.42.29 # :) 05.42.46 # * MrHali gets spiral eyed ;-) 05.42.47 # I record meetings with clients 05.43.07 # then use the archos firmware until they release 2.0 stable 05.43.17 # that's a good Idea 05.43.24 # wheb is it due? 05.44.14 # i think these people are donating their time for this project... i don't think there's any timeline 05.44.29 # *coughwhenit'sdonecough* 05.44.39 # ok, makes sense 05.45.06 # thanks alot, you've been a great help 05.45.14 # no prob 05.45.17 # bye 05.45.20 # cyas 05.45.21 Part zoof 06.03.55 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 06.17.38 Part MrHali 06.26.05 Join itisi [0] (u@h0003472bdbe6.ne.client2.attbi.com) 06.27.19 # can i randomly play all the songs on a jukebox recorder, or do i need to make a playlist in matchbox? 06.43.21 Part itisi 07.03.46 Join paulheu [0] (paulheu@node1e8d4.a2000.nl) 07.04.05 Quit paulheu (Client Quit) 07.09.31 Quit datazone (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 07.09.31 NSplit calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net 07.09.31 Quit OoLio (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 07.09.31 Quit adi|sleep (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 07.09.35 NHeal calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net 07.09.35 NJoin datazone [0] (~datazone@207.136.36.203) 07.09.35 NJoin OoLio [0] (~coin@lyopc213.in2p3.fr) 07.09.35 NJoin adi|sleep [0] (~adiamas@as5300-9.216-194-23-129.nyc.ny.metconnect.net) 07.22.41 Join paulheu [0] (~Paupvdh@node1e8d4.a2000.nl) 07.25.29 Nick paulheu is now known as paulheu|sleep (~Paupvdh@node1e8d4.a2000.nl) 08.03.58 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 08.13.38 Join kargatron [0] (~Vincent@ppp-isdn-685.ath.forthnet.gr) 08.27.15 Quit dw|gone (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08.56.20 Join dw|gone [0] (dwihno@Bald067.Baldakinen.Umea.SE) 09.47.21 Quit seb-sleep (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 09.53.22 # moin 09.53.53 Nick dw|gone is now known as dwihno (dwihno@Bald067.Baldakinen.Umea.SE) 10.00.21 Join Zagor_ [242] (~bjst@labb.contactor.se) 10.04.00 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 10.17.16 Nick Zagor_ is now known as Zagort (~bjst@labb.contactor.se) 10.17.18 Nick Zagort is now known as Zagor (~bjst@labb.contactor.se) 10.18.41 Quit kargatron (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 10.19.58 Join pyvasene [0] (~pyvasene@pyvasene.net1.nerim.net) 10.29.14 Join Bagder [241] (~daniel@as3-3-2.ras.s.bonet.se) 10.38.19 Part Zagor 10.39.27 Join Zagor_ [242] (~bjst@labb.contactor.se) 10.39.49 Nick Zagor_ is now known as Zagor (~bjst@labb.contactor.se) 10.40.27 Part Zagor 10.40.41 Join Zagor_ [242] (~bjst@labb.contactor.se) 10.40.45 # wtf? 10.40.50 # bouncy day today? :-) 10.40.59 Nick Zagor_ is now known as Zagor (~bjst@labb.contactor.se) 10.41.05 # yeah 10.43.14 Join LinusN [0] (~linus@labb.contactor.se) 10.45.00 # hey, regarding the "remember settings between versions" request 10.45.36 # when playing a WPS file, we can copy it to .rockbox/.current.wps 10.45.47 # and load that one at boot 10.45.58 # indeed 10.46.08 # same with fonts and even .cfg files 10.46.49 # ugh, why copy wps files? we remember them anyway. 10.47.06 # Zagor: you don't read the mailing list, do you? 10.47.40 # i do. but apparently I missed something. 10.47.45 # it would remove the requirement for users to browse the .rockbox dir 10.48.24 # and it would allow us to remember wps files between rockbox versions 10.48.43 # even when the setting disk block is incompatible 10.49.40 # well.. frankly.. i would rather see a cfg file that pointed to the defaults of the other files 10.49.50 # ie: defaults.cfg 10.50.04 # and have: wps=../blah/mine.wps 10.50.16 # true 10.50.22 # and font=../blah/MyLargeFont.blah 10.50.23 # it may be noce, but it is easier to copy files than to edit them 10.50.27 # to me that would be cleaner 10.50.32 # and if there is no settings.cfg 10.50.37 # then we load system defaults 10.50.59 # fine then we resort to the default dir idea that .rockbox was supposed to be 10.51.17 # any .cfg or .wps in the .rockbox dir is the default loaded 10.51.27 # and if you have multiple, well its the first in the dir listing 10.51.36 # anything in subdirs is ignored 10.51.44 # no .wps or .cfg, then we load system defaults 10.51.55 # i don't like copying. adis idea to create a default.cfg is better imho. 10.52.11 # im happy either way.. but we do need a better way 10.52.18 # we could do the settings.cfg to start 10.52.25 # and if ppl don't like it, try something elese 10.52.38 # the current way is only a temporary solution, since we couldn't write files until now 10.52.43 # nods 10.52.52 # congrats to you all for that work btw ;) 10.53.13 # Zagor deserves heaps of credit for that 10.53.56 # the file write work seems to work good now 10.54.01 # code 10.54.09 # that's good 10.54.20 # my english is bad in the morning 10.55.18 # thats okay.. my swedish is non-existant ;) 10.55.22 # OoLio: you there? 10.59.25 Join kargatron [0] (~Vincent@ppp12-250.ath.forthnet.gr) 11.09.49 # LinusN: did you ever dig up the info for turning off player disks? 11.09.50 Quit pyvasene (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 11.14.20 # didn't find the time, will do later today 11.14.27 # ok 11.23.14 # PB4 11.23.18 # ok 11.23.50 # (i found it in my mailbox, didn't try it myself) 11.29.18 # is that connected to anything on the older players? 11.36.48 # "I'm very tempted to condem gcc 3.2 and 3.2.1 as unsuitable for kernel compilation." 11.37.12 # Russell King 11.37.33 # yikes 11.42.19 # Isn't 3.2 "stable"? 11.42.57 # it is 11.43.13 # So why is it unsuitable? 11.43.25 # they found another pretty serious bug 11.43.50 # off. 11.43.52 # how serious? 11.43.57 # [xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ] that serious? 11.44.16 # it saves the wrong number of registers on the stack 11.44.24 # in this specific case 11.44.38 # ouch 11.46.05 # is that a bad thing? 11.46.07 # ;-) 11.46.37 # "Kernel panic: Attempted to kill init!" 11.46.38 # ;-) 11.46.49 # ;) 11.46.54 # * dwihno got a new font 11.47.01 # Do you got nice fonts for X? 11.47.09 # I'd like some nice terminalistic fonts :) 11.47.26 # "fixed" is the only terminal font you'll ever need 11.49.50 # oh my god! they killed init! you bastards! 11.59.14 # Zagor: fixed is not a futuristic font ;) 12.01.03 # haha 12.01.20 # Such as that nexus font 12.01.20 # dwihno: look at themes.org. plenty of futuristic stuff there. 12.01.24 # or the fonts of artwiz 12.01.29 # :D 12.01.47 # Zagor - I use old stuff - 'cause it works! 12.01.48 # :-) 12.01.56 # I got dual view working with my laptop 12.02.04 # DFP+TV 12.02.52 # nice 12.04.04 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 12.07.21 # yeah 12.07.42 # But it reboots when I do something 12.07.48 # strange. 12.07.57 # I never have that problem when using DFP-only mode. 12.08.02 # I blame it on the boogie! 12.12.35 Join quelsaruk [0] (~zaknafein@faerun.ugr.es) 12.12.41 # hi 12.13.02 # hi 13.04.01 Nick quelsaruk is now known as zak|out (~zaknafein@faerun.ugr.es) 13.12.02 Part Zagor 13.12.02 Quit mecraw1212 (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 13.12.13 Join Simple`D [0] (SiMpLeZ@211.190.30.153) 13.12.40 Join Zagor_ [242] (~bjst@labb.contactor.se) 13.12.44 Join mecraw12 [0] (~mecraw@12-252-136-249.client.attbi.com) 13.17.31 Part Simple`D 13.37.01 Join seb-sleep [0] (trilluser@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net) 13.40.24 Nick seb-sleep is now known as _seb_ (trilluser@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net) 13.54.00 Quit mecraw12 (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 13.54.00 NSplit calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net 13.54.00 Quit kargatron (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 13.54.00 Quit dwihno (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 13.54.00 Quit mbr (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 13.54.00 Quit Schnueff (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 13.54.00 Quit Hes (calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 13.54.22 NHeal calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net 13.54.22 NJoin kargatron [0] (~Vincent@ppp12-250.ath.forthnet.gr) 13.55.05 NJoin mecraw12 [0] (~mecraw@12-252-136-249.client.attbi.com) 13.55.05 NJoin dwihno [0] (dwihno@Bald067.Baldakinen.Umea.SE) 13.55.05 NJoin mbr [0] (~mb@stlx01.stz-softwaretechnik.de) 13.55.05 NJoin Schnueff [0] (~mah@goedel.cs.uni-sb.de) 13.55.05 NJoin Hes [0] (~hessu@193.210.3.10) 14.03.37 Nick _seb_ is now known as seb-school (trilluser@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net) 14.03.49 Nick Zagor_ is now known as Zagor (~bjst@labb.contactor.se) 14.03.56 # i love tunnels 14.04.08 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 14.04.51 # especially quantum ones - they're the coolest. 14.31.03 Quit zak|out ("KVIrc 3.0.0-beta1 "Eve's Avatar"") 14.40.32 Join TotMacher [0] (tot@p508D91C7.dip.t-dialin.net) 14.47.39 Join pyvasene [0] (~pyvasene@62.4.7.201) 14.50.55 # any player owners here? 14.51.33 # i have one :-) 14.51.56 # you have two :-) do you have time to test my ata-power change? 14.52.03 # ok 14.52.13 # what do i have to do? 14.52.35 # i'll mail you a patch. apply it to player-old and player-new and see that it works 14.53.06 # uh, apply it to player and test on both models, i mean 14.54.38 # if you have the set-up to measure current, that would be nice too 14.54.58 # :-) 14.55.03 # :-) :-) :-) 14.57.48 # power-up takes a teeny bit more time, but the mpeg thread "lowest" value is still >128KB 15.00.38 # Zagor: I need more power! 15.00.43 # LinusN: Maximum warp! 15.00.55 # Mr Hadaka - shields up! 15.01.27 # Friday 13 december we will all get warped. 15.01.31 # Star trek NEMESIS 15.01.31 # :D 15.01.33 # YAY! 15.01.50 # :) 15.03.52 # as an ST fan, i look forward to NEMESIS, but keep my expectations sane (considering the track record of those in charge) - but the big money's on LOTR:TTT. 15.25.15 # kargatron: Klingon warship decloaking! Shields to the bridge! Modulate the pulsars! 15.42.18 # hello 15.42.30 # LinusN, do u receive the file ? 15.43.53 # yes i have, thanks a lot 15.44.54 # ok 15.45.28 # LinusN: did you try the atapower patch yet? 15.50.35 # no, not yet (busy day) 16.04.12 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 16.47.25 Nick dwihno is now known as dw|gone (dwihno@Bald067.Baldakinen.Umea.SE) 17.51.51 Join edx [0] (~edx@pD9EAA03E.dip.t-dialin.net) 18.01.26 Part Zagor 18.04.15 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 18.10.19 Quit mecraw_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 18.40.41 Join Zagor [242] (bjst@as9-5-6.k.s.bonet.se) 18.41.07 # I'm off, see ya 18.41.10 Quit Bagder ("http://daniel.haxx.se") 18.43.04 # LinusN: no go on the Neo work. he didn't want to pay. 18.47.09 # surprise! :-) 18.47.41 # not really. he seemed like "a Gerry" :-) 18.48.21 # haha 19.00.48 Join nickr_ [0] (~panphage@e-64-35-146-236.empnet.net) 19.00.49 Quit edx (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 19.02.09 Quit nickr (Killed (NickServ (Ghost: nickr_!~panphage@e-64-35-146-236.empnet.net))) 19.02.16 Nick nickr_ is now known as nickr (~panphage@e-64-35-146-236.empnet.net) 19.03.50 # Zagor: do we have ftell()? 19.04.12 # no 19.05.10 # so fseek(fd, 0, SEEK_CUR) then? 19.06.15 # yes 20.04.17 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 20.22.22 Quit pyvasene () 20.41.19 Join edx [0] (~edx@pD9EA8EB0.dip.t-dialin.net) 20.59.55 Join [keno] [0] (~kenlarzo@80.178.32.34) 21.00.14 # <[keno]> hey guys 21.00.16 # <[keno]> anyone up? 21.00.40 # yup 21.04.08 # <[keno]> I believe I found an undocumented bug (looked at the bugs list) 21.04.17 # ok? 21.04.18 # <[keno]> LinusN you alive? 21.05.17 # <[keno]> recorder was playing, paused, then I connected and used USB. When I disconnected, the paused "icon" still showed. when I hit play nothing happened 21.05.31 # <[keno]> when I hit "right", the next song played. 21.06.36 # <[keno]> I tried the exact same thing when the song was playing and not paused.. it did continue playing it when the unit "awoke" from USB, but like the previous case, the screen was blank until "right" (next song) was pressed. 21.06.37 # i think it is documented. maybe under a bad headline 21.06.48 # it's known behavior. 21.07.14 # [keno], after USB, you're stuck in browse mode - hit ON, press play, and it should play 21.07.25 # that's my experience. 21.07.35 # <[keno]> the song not continuing to play when "play" is pressed is not that much of an issue.. it's the blank screen that's an annoyance 21.07.39 # there might be a bug that the WPS doesn't show in that sich, dunno. 21.07.43 # right 21.07.55 # that's listed somewhere 21.08.08 # <[keno]> kargatron I did - screen was blank and song didn't play the first time (when it was paused) and did play the 2nd time (when it was playing before USB), but in both cases screen was blank. 21.08.09 # but it's non-fatal at least. :) 21.08.16 # <[keno]> yeah 21.08.29 # i'm alive 21.09.09 # <[keno]> good (but mainly because there's no rockbox if you suddenly get dead :) 21.09.20 # the mpeg driver gets confused and thinks it is still playing 21.09.36 # <[keno]> and the blank screen? 21.09.39 # therefore the WPS is confused as well 21.09.45 # <[keno]> oh 21.10.03 # we should do mpeg_stop() when USb is inserted 21.10.22 # [keno], not sure you are aware of the non-linus core developers - LinusN is one, but not the only. :) [i am not one, just saying....] 21.10.22 # <[keno]> I found another one on the way home, but I forgot it before the PC booted ;) 21.10.39 # haha 21.10.59 # <[keno]> kargatron I acknowledge and respect all the other developers (even in awe of some :) 21.11.16 # <[keno]> but I've had a good run with linus so I try to stick with what werks 21.11.31 # hehe, he just meant that you don't have to look for only me 21.12.23 # i also meant that perhaps rockbox wouldn't necessarily die with you. 21.12.23 # <[keno]> hehe we should publush a "where's linus?" children book 21.12.34 # not that I'm proposing a test... 21.12.56 # <[keno]> well, not die, but development would definitely be held back quite a bit 21.13.42 # <[keno]> btw, can't there be an option for displaying hidden dirs? I copied a hidden dir and got scared cause I didnt find it while browsing with the archos. 21.13.43 Nick seb-school is now known as _seb_ (trilluser@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net) 21.14.43 Nick [keno] is now known as non-linus (~kenlarzo@80.178.32.34) 21.14.46 # heh 21.15.12 # non-linus: i thought we could display hidden dirs 21.15.25 # just select "all files" in the file filter 21.16.02 # hrrm. okay. my bad 21.16.13 # was in "supported" 21.16.38 Nick non-linus is now known as [keno] (~kenlarzo@80.178.32.34) 21.16.48 # <[keno]> wish I could remember the other issue I encountered on the way homew 21.17.31 # [keno]: a skip? 21.17.39 # <[keno]> I was way to distracted by the oscillograph :) 21.18.06 # <[keno]> had only one so far and I was walking very quickly (I keep it on my uniform belt with the provided case) 21.19.00 # <[keno]> btw is there a chance of keeping the backlight on when a "demo" is showing? it's kind of annoying to keep pressing a key to keep the backlight on for the oscillograph 21.20.39 # <[keno]> a skip.. --> had only one so far and I was walking very quickly (I keep it on my uniform belt with the provided case) 21.23.27 # <[keno]> well, as for the blank screen on resume playing/paused song when returning from USB, should I submit it? 21.25.22 # <[keno]> OH. I remember the other issue now. not that much of a bug, but a MUST improvment 21.26.22 # <[keno]> not being a C programmer I can't be sure if it's possible technically, but according other implemented features it should be a breeze.. 21.26.49 # * [keno] is talking to himself 21.27.57 # <[keno]> got an mp3 here that just wont stop skipping. only happens with this one. 21.29.12 # excellent. please upload it somewhere (or dcc it to me) 21.30.07 # <[keno]> Zagor okay but lemme just make sure I defrag and try again first to make sure it's not that 21.30.14 # ok 21.32.32 # <[keno]> thing is this; when I want to move on to the next song and I hit "next", I can't hit next again to skip that song too until it starts playing. 21.33.27 # this is because disk I/O hasnt finished then? 21.33.28 # yes, this is a bit annoying 21.33.33 # k 21.33.47 # <[keno]> I figured that the next song's filename could display for say a ¼ second, and if I hit "next" again during that ¼ second the mpeg wouldnt even start decoding - it would just show the next filename instead 21.33.56 # it is due to the mpeg thread design. it will be redesigned Real Soon Now :-) 21.34.36 # [keno]: yes. currently it is not just a UI issue, however 21.34.53 # <[keno]> great.. but will it be that responsive to allow me to keep browsing forward ? 21.35.23 # hopefully 21.35.24 # <[keno]> oh. okay.. I thought that a small timeout before next mpeg starts decoding would solve this.. 21.35.43 # decoding is not the problem, reading is 21.36.40 # <[keno]> a small timeout before reading.. or is the reading of the next filename slows down processing enough by itself to prevent reading the filename after that? 21.37.26 # no, but adding a timeout will *always* slow down the start of next track, which isn't what we want either 21.37.55 # the redesign will fix so the reading is aborted immediately if you press next 21.38.24 # <[keno]> that would be better than a mandatory ¼ sec 21.38.30 # yes 21.38.40 # <[keno]> damnit wish I could help out this project 21.38.51 # why can't you? 21.39.05 # <[keno]> um.. no C experience whatsoever is a good start :) 21.39.46 # hehe 21.40.20 # <[keno]> but I gurantee that once you get the MAS to support ASP/VB - count me in!!! hehe 21.40.28 # lol 21.40.42 Join Mine78 [0] (Pozzolo@host116-22.pool80116.interbusiness.it) 21.41.17 # hai guy... any plan to a recording release ? 21.41.26 # yes 21.41.37 # is it possible to know almost when ? 21.41.42 # Mine78: no 21.41.44 # a month ? 2 ? 21.41.53 # :P 21.42.03 # I tried to search for MP3Pro info... 21.42.03 # When It's Done 21.42.05 # nothing ! 21.42.12 # the MAS can't do mp3pro 21.42.14 # <[keno]> Zagor: must one know anything about embedded processing to contribute to the rockbox project? 21.42.16 # heh 21.42.22 # [keno]: it helps 21.42.48 # [keno]: but there are lots of non-programming things to do 21.42.51 # I dont' want mp3pro to be palyed, only to be correct-display the song lenght 21.43.08 # Mine78: mp3pro is a proprietary undocumented format 21.43.10 # <[keno]> LinusN such as? maybe I can do something 21.43.15 # we will be sued if we implement it 21.43.26 # There must be a math function 21.43.34 # yes yes, I dont' want MP3pro to be played 21.43.48 # I would only that Archos read the song lenght correctly 21.43.52 # [keno]: documentation, testing, ... 21.44.16 # Mine78: find the necessary information, and I will personally add it to Rockbox 21.44.30 # I am testing 21.44.44 # <[keno]> LinusN alright. good to know. if anything is needed I'd be happy to assist 21.44.54 # I am trying to find a relation between the fake lenght and the real one 21.45.13 # Mine78: it's not that simple 21.45.13 # almost to have an "aproximate" correct lenght 21.45.25 # why zagor ? 21.45.36 # because compression is not linear 21.46.04 # <[keno]> is there a chance of an option to keep the backlight on when a "demo" is showing? it's kind of annoying to keep pressing a key to keep the backlight on for the oscillograph 21.46.04 # Yes, but if you look 3 mins files are almost 25 mins-fake-lenght 21.46.25 # <[keno]> LinusN is any testing/documentation needed at the moment? 21.46.27 # Maybe not te exact lenght... but near 21.46.35 # 3 mins insted of 25 is enough ! 21.46.36 # [keno]: backlight on when demoing is a good idea 21.46.41 # and easy to do 21.46.56 # Zagor a question: is there a way for rockbox to recognize a PRO file ? 21.47.07 # Mine78: yes it would be feasibke 21.47.10 # feasible 21.47.16 # Mine78: not until we get documentation that describes at least part of the format 21.47.29 # guessing is no fun 21.47.32 # Mine78: put an mp3pro file up so i can download it 21.47.41 # ok I will put it on my site 21.47.44 # one momente 21.47.46 # moment 21.48.04 # <[keno]> LinusN should I submit it then or is it too small of a feature to mention? 21.48.23 # [keno]: submit it, it's so easy to forget 21.49.01 # * LinusN is working on the MP3 parsing 21.49.11 # <[keno]> LinusN right. what about the blank screen on resume played/paused song when returning from USB? 21.49.31 # LinusN, will be a variable bitrate Pro good for you ? 21.49.56 # Mine78: to start with, yes 21.50.10 # but a CBR would be good too 21.52.57 # <[keno]> Zagor jeez I need a USB2 PCI adapter.. takess AGES to defrag with USB1.1 even with only 6GB/20GB in use 21.53.52 # indeed it does 21.54.07 # Linus the file is up 21.54.11 # did you received the link ? 21.54.21 # yup 21.54.51 # downloading... 21.55.04 # Encoding Quality: Highest 21.55.10 # VBR Quality: Highest 21.55.17 # these are the only info I can give you 21.55.27 # I did it with Nero MP3Pro plugin 21.55.36 # downloaded 21.56.05 # do you need others ? 21.56.22 # maybe some mp3pro done in a particular way ? 21.56.26 # for example only silence 21.56.29 # tell me 21.57.51 # Mine78: i'll get back to you 21.58.00 # in which way ? 21.58.40 # i removed it form the site... xoom doesn't like mp3, even zipped 21.58.56 # give me a minute 21.59.00 # ok 22.01.15 Quit Mine78 ("Shokowahhhhh dwahhhnowan!!") 22.04.20 Join Mine78 [0] (Pozzolo@host116-22.pool80116.interbusiness.it) 22.04.21 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 22.04.25 # here I am again 22.04.35 # sorry linus but rockbox won't connect to usb 22.04.38 # I had to reboot 22.06.53 Join slazZ [0] (~slazz@b101172.adsl.hansenet.de) 22.07.39 # Mine78: the reason that the time is incorrect in the VBR mp3pro file is probably that it has no VBR header 22.08.04 # no mp3 vbr header anyway :-) 22.08.47 # no header at all as far as i can see 22.08.52 # ok 22.09.08 # no ID3, no XING, no VBRI, nothing 22.09.54 # shoul I try to code in another way ? 22.10.31 # Mine78: di you see a song name or artist when you play that file? 22.10.41 # Winamp told me (with mp3pro plugin) it's a 5:25 minutes song 22.11.22 # no, only the mp3 name file + MP3PRO written after 22.11.28 # in the scrolling bar of winamp 22.11.37 # ok 22.12.07 # but I think even winamp show incorrect lenght...a notherone bites the dust is not 5:25 !!! 22.12.56 # This is what I see: 22.13.01 # 02 - Another One Bites The Dust.mp3 - MP3PRO (5:25) 22.13.07 # scrolling 22.16.21 # Mine78: there is probably more to it 22.16.29 # <[keno]> Zagor forget about that skipping mp3 file 22.16.35 # ok 22.16.38 # <[keno]> Zagor winamp skipped too :) 22.16.42 # haha 22.16.47 # <[keno]> Zagor must be some lame encoder 22.17.35 # I don't understand 22.18.18 # [keno]: there are lame encoders out there that doesn't set the CRC protection bit correctly 22.18.38 # or, the file may be corrupt 22.18.38 Quit edx (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 22.19.45 # <[keno]> LinusN yes.. had my fair share of bad encoders. now I use either lame or aaps (audioactive production studio), that is, if I don't encode to ogg :) 22.20.09 # someone want the winamp plugin for mp3pro ? 22.20.56 # no need 22.21.09 # ok 22.21.14 # Mine78: tell me, how long is the song, in seconds? 22.21.24 # in the reality ? 22.21.27 # yes 22.21.28 # i must check 22.22.11 # some mins 22.22.29 # wait 22.25.37 Quit slazZ () 22.26.00 # 3:38 22.26.27 # The winamp bar is still in the middle (almost) but the song end and it start with another song from the beginning 22.26.48 # (many grammatical errors, sorry !) 22.27.22 # if you want I can send you a complete album difference between what rockbox shows and what winamp says: 22.27.27 # 01 5:19 - 23:09 22.27.28 # 02 5:39 - 20:57 22.27.28 # 03 9:19 - 38:59 22.27.28 DBUG Enqueued KICK Mine78 22.27.28 # 04 5:15 - 23:28 22.27.28 # 05 6:01 - 28:26 22.27.28 *** Alert Mode level 1 22.27.28 # 06 9:00 - 35:40 22.27.30 # 07 6:39 - 38:23 22.27.31 # 08 8:16 - 37:49 22.27.34 # 09 7:23 - 35:34 22.27.36 # 10 10:17 - 40:16 22.27.38 # 11 5:44 - 26:26 22.27.40 # 12 6:43 - 30:04 22.27.41 # I don't know the REAL lenght 22.27.47 # but i will check the net 22.27.49 # one moment 22.29.21 # the album is "El Vals Del Obrero" artist "Ska-p" 22.29.30 # i cannot find the real lenght on the net 22.32.33 # 01 5:19 - 23:09 real 2:43 22.32.41 # do you need something else ? 22.34.33 # 01 5:19 - 23:09 real 2:43 22.34.33 # 02 5:39 - 20:57 real 22.34.33 # 03 9:19 - 38:59 real 4:40 22.34.33 *** Alert Mode level 2 22.34.33 # 04 5:15 - 23:28 22.34.33 *** Alert Mode level 3 22.34.33 # 05 6:01 - 28:26 22.34.33 *** Alert Mode level 4 22.34.33 # 06 9:00 - 35:40 22.34.35 # 07 6:39 - 38:23 22.34.38 # 08 8:16 - 37:49 real 4:27 22.34.40 # 09 7:23 - 35:34 22.34.41 # 10 10:17 - 40:16 real 4:47 22.34.44 # 11 5:44 - 26:26 22.34.45 # 12 6:43 - 30:04 22.35.25 # Still someone there ? 22.35.49 # yup :) 22.36.00 # Found something fun ? 22.36.50 # there is a strange thing... if i manually scroll the bar near the end the song is still there... 22.36.51 # Mine78: my mp3 parser program says it's 3:37 long 22.36.54 # maybe a bad winamp plugin 22.37.26 # I checked it with my clock, maybe I did a 1 sec error 22.37.34 # my program == rockbox 22.37.59 # one moment I upload it to rockbox 22.38.21 # Mine78: don't bother, it's not in the buld yet 22.38.22 # build 22.38.44 # So it's an improvement 22.38.46 # Mine78: just curious, why MP3pro? 22.39.19 # rockbox 1.4 says: 29:15 22.39.30 # well if it's ok it0's cool ! 22.39.43 # Mine78: let me explain 22.39.47 # Ok 22.39.58 # rockbox thinks that it's a CBR file, since there is no VBR header 22.40.15 # ok 22.40.28 # i have written a (soon to be included in rockbox) VBR header calculator 22.40.37 # AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH 22.40.50 # Will it take more time to play a song while calculating ? 22.40.54 # that program has no problem with your mp3pro file 22.41.07 # Mine78: it is supposed to add a header to the file 22.41.22 # not while playing 22.41.26 # But it phisiccally add it (writing it in the file) or only in memory ? 22.42.24 # writing to the file 22.42.30 # Automatically ? 22.42.38 # The 1st time it's played ? 22.42.47 # that function is intended for the recording function in rockbox 22.43.10 # but i will implement it so people can run it on any file they want 22.43.11 # COOL ! So I can say I had been useful to rockbox even if I am not good at programming at all ;-) 22.43.34 # But if a header is already present ? It will be overwritten ? 22.43.39 # there is a program called VBRFix that can be downloaded from the net 22.43.47 # this is the same thing 22.44.12 # Mine78: it will not add a header to a file that already has one 22.44.27 # so I have to "pass" all my mp3pro files through that VBRFix, right ? 22.44.34 # yup 22.44.35 *** Alert Mode OFF 22.44.40 # where can i find it ? 22.44.45 # just google it 22.44.50 # ok 22.44.54 # another thing: 22.44.54 # it's a Windows program 22.45.00 # i have never used it 22.45.30 # sometimes, when (i will try it for you) i press the on button to exit a song while playing, when I re-enter the song the screen is blank 22.45.34 # is it a known bug ? 22.45.39 # no it isn't 22.46.08 # It happens when I exit the song and stay out many minutes 22.46.25 # when I re-enter (a new song is playing) the screen show only the upper bar 22.46.53 # file a bug report 22.47.26 # yes but I dont' know how to exactly reproduce it... if I will find out I will 22.48.02 # Mine78: please do 22.48.21 # Now ? 22.48.34 # even if i don't know how to reproduce ? 22.48.50 # wait until you can reproduce 22.49.02 # ok I surely will ! 22.49.15 # that's how non-programmers can help 22.49.29 # Ok 22.49.33 # ah one last thing 22.50.12 # sometimes, when the recorder is off and I connect the power supply, it charges for hoyrs (6-7-8 or more) but it still says CHARGING... is it normal ? 22.50.34 # hoyrs=hours 22.50.51 # that may happen if the batteries are worn out 22.51.15 # but they are new ! 22.51.22 # ok 22.51.23 # only 2 weeks ! 22.51.47 # i think the archos firmware doesn't use negative-delta detection for the battery charging 22.52.04 # only reaching a certain voltage 22.52.10 # yeah maybe 22.52.36 # aren't they also using trickle all the time? i.e not full throttle. 22.52.42 # VBRFIX WORKS !!!! 22.52.47 # and that they have fine-tuned their charging code for those green batteries 22.53.11 # Works for rockbox but not for winamp... doesn0't matte r:) 22.53.12 # Zagor: probably 22.54.01 # Thank you all ! 22.54.12 # I will scan for bugs (if i find them) and report ! 22.54.19 # great! 22.54.45 # I hope a new release with BMP/JPG " abilities ". Someone told me it is already ready but not prefect ! 22.55.07 # The recording capability will be at 192 max ? as the original ? 22.55.22 # yes, we can't change the encoder 22.55.34 # ah it's hardcoded ok ! 22.55.41 # yup 22.55.46 # thank you again ! see you soon ! 22.56.53 # OH ! Another thing (you will say "nooooooooo stop!!") 22.57.02 # did you try to skip inside the mp3pro ? 22.57.33 # with 1.4 it will go further with seconds (bad-displayed) 22.57.40 # is it caused by that absent header ? 22.57.58 # wrongly go further 22.59.14 # Mine78: exactly 22.59.30 # without VBR header it is impossible to seek within the file 22.59.33 # So in the new version or with a good vbr it will be fixed 22.59.38 # ok great ! 22.59.56 # This time is ALL ! 22.59.59 # BYE ! 23.00.01 Quit Mine78 ("Shokowahhhhh dwahhhnowan!!") 23.00.53 # <[keno]> I can reproduce a similar bug to the one he mentioned 23.02.37 # <[keno]> GOT THIS FROM ARCHOS TECH SUPPORT JUST NOW 23.02.39 # <[keno]> 3) What are your thoughts about the independent firmwares released for archos jukeboxes? (see http://rockbox.haxx.se/ specifically) Any negative or perhaps positive critisism? Any warnings/suggestions? They did an amazing work functionality wise, and when they sort out the charging/recording issues it would be a killer firmware replacement. 23.02.39 # <[keno]> 23.02.39 # <[keno]> We don’t have comments on this, you’re free to try it with you own device. Be advice that doing so, may void the warranty. 23.02.41 # <[keno]> 23.03.12 # <[keno]> very lame of them. "no comment" crap. 23.04.42 # <[keno]> LinusN Zagor wake up 23.05.25 # <[keno]> this bit is interesting too. I don't even understand his answer 23.05.25 # <[keno]> 5) Why isn't my firmware (1.28) listed on the firmware history page? I am being told it is identical to 1.27d. If so, why the misleading labeling? 23.05.26 # <[keno]> 6) No, is not misleading. The version on your JB is newer. Though, it is the same as the version posted on our website. Only update when the posted firmware version is high in version number than what you have currently installed. 23.06.04 # <[keno]> "the version on your JB is newer" .. "it is the same as the version on our website" 23.06.11 # <[keno]> yeah. "is not misleading" alright 23.06.38 # <_seb_> heh 23.10.09 # interesting 23.10.30 # their answer on the rockbox issue isn't very surprising 23.10.42 # more or less what they have to do 23.11.02 # they can't be negative, cause customers may dosagree with them 23.11.33 # <[keno]> I expected they would declare it satan and you the antichrist. 23.11.38 # they can't be positive, because they don't want to say that their own firmware sucks 23.11.54 # so they don't comment it at all 23.12.39 # <[keno]> it's a positive thing.. they could have said "We discourage blah blah it is a risk to use 3rd party blah blah from independent developers" 23.13.04 # <[keno]> instead they chose to not comment at all. 23.13.05 # they do mention voiding warranty 23.13.22 # <[keno]> yep, but I don't think they cover israel, so I don't have warranty anyways :) 23.13.35 # [keno]: israel? 23.14.05 # <[keno]> yeah 23.14.21 # <[keno]> or was it israhell? I can't tell 23.14.31 # haha 23.15.05 # <[keno]> just too many bombs going off lately.. 23.15.10 # <[keno]> why are you surprised? 23.16.00 # <_seb_> I've never seen someone from Israel in IRC before 23.16.31 # <[keno]> hey archos should change the answer to this one to "We are consulting linus 'bout this at the moment": 11. Can I get rid of the background noise when recording with I the built-in MIC? 23.16.31 # <[keno]> Unfortunately, the background noise is caused by the hard drive spinning. The built-in MIC is more for voice messages. For best results, a pre-amped stereo MIC is recommended. 23.16.44 # <[keno]> _seb_ really? I find that hard to believe.. 23.16.54 # <[keno]> _seb_ it's not a 3rd world country you know :) 23.17.15 # [keno]: the background noise is hard to get rid of 23.17.29 # [keno]: have you used the archos recording function? 23.18.00 # <[keno]> LinusN yes but rockbox (as of 24/11) recordings sound better than archos' 1.28's 23.18.07 # <[keno]> yes (mic only so far) 23.18.33 # i wonder, does the hard drive spin down with the archos fw? 23.20.03 # <[keno]> easy enough to check.. 23.20.17 # <[keno]> LinusN you're from sweden right? (most rockbox developers are I believe..) 23.20.30 # i am 23.22.23 Join paulheu [0] (paulheu@node1e8d4.a2000.nl) 23.22.32 Quit paulheu (Client Quit) 23.23.22 # <[keno]> I'm probably visiting sweden/holland/czech republic right after I discharge from the army. any must-see places? 23.23.38 Nick paulheu|sleep is now known as paulheu (~Paupvdh@node1e8d4.a2000.nl) 23.23.40 # <[keno]> (sorry for the off-topic q) 23.23.43 # my place 23.23.47 # :-) 23.24.35 # <[keno]> heh.. the linus shrine 23.25.04 # The Amsterdam RedLicht district for sure.. ;) 23.26.09 # Not that it's a large place.. always fun when tourists are dissapointed it's such a small area.. 23.28.40 # <[keno]> I already visited amsterdam.. twice. and I just have to come back.. 23.28.56 # <[keno]> paulheu you from the netherlands? 23.29.13 # <[keno]> I miss de efteling :) 23.30.29 # yes.. Amsterdam the Netheralands.. City of Sin if you believe the Americans.. 23.31.04 # <[keno]> I don't think so at all. City of freedom and open minded government more like it 23.31.37 Ctcp Ignored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood 23.31.37 # * [keno] hasn't smoked pot in 2 years and seven months :( 23.31.44 # I go to the Efteling, one of the oldest entertainment parks in the world.., at least once a year.. always fun.. 23.31.45 # <[keno]> I miss dutch pot.. 23.31.58 # <[keno]> paulheu I loved it so much.. way better than eurodisney 23.32.07 # ;) .. we seem to have a huge menu here... 23.32.17 # <[keno]> though it may be the fact that I was friggin' stoned 23.32.40 # <[keno]> I hear it's legal now in sweden (or was it switzerland?) and the UK too, right? 23.33.07 # Well ... our governement is soemwhat less openminded nowadays.. at least on paper ;) 23.33.26 # <[keno]> paulheu my favorite coffeeshop is "barney's breakfast bar". GOD what I wouldn't give to be there right now instead of serving the damn army. 23.33.27 # It's not legal! 23.33.40 # <[keno]> paulheu less openminded? why? 23.34.11 # <[keno]> paulheu and I thought the UK government has decriminalized it.. even opened a first coffeeshop and everyhing.. was in the news 23.34.54 # Softdrugs are condoned.. you are allowed to carry a small amount for personal use (I believe 3 gammes.. not sure) dealing is officially illegal.. but hey..prostitution was illegal for a long time too.. so who knows :0 23.36.10 # Well on the openmindedness.. Our gov is currently under the influence of some heavy Americanism.. I have seen this closeby.. a bit to much to go into detail.. but the bully that is the USA is even gettig a grip here.. 23.36.11 # <[keno]> the world is beginning to get more realistic about this issue. it's all because of america (the brainwashing against cannabis) 23.37.33 # It is my opinion that the #1 threat to the world as we know it right now is still mr Bush.. the triggerhappy son of a frustrated former president 23.37.35 # <_seb_> the usa has to stop being such a bully, and also stop trying to police sovereign nations 23.37.42 # <[keno]> to an exetent that they may affect the locals' life ? 23.37.47 # Amen to that _seb_ 23.37.56 # <_seb_> (and I speak as a USian) 23.38.22 # <[keno]> good self awareness there seb 23.38.33 # <[keno]> (and please dont get me started about israel :) 23.39.19 # <_seb_> heh 23.39.35 # <_seb_> well I don't know what you think about israel, I have my own opinions there 23.40.03 # Keno: definately.. A friend of mine is currently in jail, and has been for almost a year, for something he has NOT done plain simpel because he is not clever enough to even come up with, facing extradition to the USA based on annonymous testimony by members of a US drugs gang. 23.41.36 # <[keno]> _seb_ what can one think about a country which is led by general after general? that right now is being led by a right wind fanatic (though much less than before)? 23.42.27 # <[keno]> a country that is also "beind held hostage" one too many times by religous zelouts who keep blackmailing the government? 23.42.32 # <_seb_> true 23.42.52 # <[keno]> paulheu that's very bad! what is the charge? 23.43.39 # Well the whole issue is one that will be extremely hard to resolve.. I fear that trust is hard to find nowadays and not that I approve, but when you have nothing to put against tanks and well equipped soldiers I can imagine you get 'creative' ;( 23.43.45 # <[keno]> _seb_ I believe generals should lead armies and spiritual statesmen should lead nations. generals are too war mongering and set in their ways to rule nations. 23.44.42 # <[keno]> paulheu I agree to a certain extent. Civilians should never be targeted though, no matter what. 23.45.46 # <[keno]> paulheu a "hamas" group terrorist shot 2 jewish kids in their bedroom at POINT BLANK, *THROUGH* their mother who was trying to protect them. 23.45.54 # He is charged with being the dutch leader in teir XTC ring.. could face 20 years in a US prison. And believe me when I say that this guy has to be an EXTREMLY good actor to have done this, since he NEVER had any money.. and I often payed for his drinks of a cab home .. 23.46.04 # <[keno]> paulheu this took place within israel, not in one of the illegal settlements 23.46.22 # <[keno]> jesus! 23.46.26 # <[keno]> poor guy 23.46.53 # <[keno]> his story should be made public so that pressure could be put on dutch authorities.. 23.47.17 # <_seb_> [keno]: although it does not happen as often, one must keep in mind that jewish extremists have made similar attacks 23.47.19 # Keno.. I agree with you.. and as I said I do NOT approve.. but I think the hugh problem now is that teh current generation on both sides grows up with hate built in.. and this is always a bad thing.. 23.47.31 # <_seb_> paulheu: I totally agree 23.48.36 # <[keno]> _seb_ if my military unit would have been stationed near a settlement I would have personally made sure israeli extremists never lifted a finger against arabs, any arabs 23.48.59 # <[keno]> but the thing is - israeli extremists NEVER hurt arab children - not once. 23.49.34 # <_seb_> of course, the israeli military has destroyed entire buildings, where innocent families live, in retaliation for suicide bombings 23.49.43 # <[keno]> the israely army has, but it has issued a formal apology and is paying money to the family of that child every month. 23.50.17 # <[keno]> _seb_ yes I know. It is the only intimidation that ever worked against suicide bombers. 23.50.30 # <_seb_> I know, the fear of their families suffering 23.50.32 # <[keno]> I know soldiers who have abused arabs. 23.50.49 # <[keno]> I have personally reported two soldiers who have stolen from arab homes during curfews and such 23.51.04 # keno.. We do everything we can.. As he is a regular in the Amsterdam Music scene we have held concerts, been to TV shows,, Hell even did a huge public Jamsession in fron of the house of government here.. December 3rd we hope he will be alowed to leave jail, but I fear he will be shipped of to the USA.. The most f*cked up thing is the prosecutor in the US even told his lawyer'he was willing to 'rethink the extradition' if he could name some names of ot 23.52.16 # <[keno]> many israeli soldiers ENJOY hitting arabs and it's the most disgusting thing I ever heard of. the FIRST "commandment" any israeli soldier is taught is "weapon purity" (free translation) which means a soldier should never use his weapon or body for anything other than what he's been ordered too. 23.53.05 # <[keno]> paulheu but if he's ideed innocent and there are no others to tell on?? 23.53.38 # <_seb_> [keno]: don't they understand that such actions only contribute to the Arab/Israeli hatred? 23.54.03 # <[keno]> _seb_ they are young and too blinded by hate. it's a cycle that's very hard to break. 23.54.09 # <_seb_> paulheu: I hope your friend doesn't get sent to the USA, we have really bad drug laws here 23.54.17 # <[keno]> _seb_ whenever I speak against it among other soldiers I get teased, but some hear me. 23.54.49 # <[keno]> _seb_ then join DRC / NORML - they write congress and try to change drug laws in the states 23.55.02 # _keno_ That's the issue.. he is doomed from the get go.. no way he can 'assist' the US gov. Once there he either pleads guilt and gets a deal.. or goes to trial and faces 20 years.. you tell me that sounds like a fair deal.. 23.55.25 # <_seb_> [keno]: yeah I know, but I'm young and really busy... once I am in college I'll get more involved 23.56.12 # <[keno]> paulheu but are dutch authorities one hundred precent sure that he's guilty? positive enough to extradite him??? 23.56.39 # <_seb_> even if they have no clue about his case, the USA will bully them into extraditing him 23.57.06 # <[keno]> _seb_ rightous mr. bush.. yep. 23.57.07 # Tey do not HAVE to be sure.. if the US gov can make a case or even say they have a case he might be extradited 23.57.42 # It is really f*cked up and makes me mad writing about it! 23.58.22 # <[keno]> paulheu the americans have that much power over dutch gov. ??? jesus 23.58.33 # It is my belief the US systemof law if more that you are guilty unless proven innocent to be honest.. 23.58.48 # <_seb_> paulheu: I definitely agree. especially if the trial is at all publicized 23.58.55 Part kargatron