--- Log for 29.12.103 Server: orwell.freenode.net Channel: #rockbox --- Nick: logbot Version: Dancer V4.16p1 Started: 15 days and 10 hours ago 00.00.03 # (or atleast one needle!) 00.00.06 # lol 00.00.08 # cool 00.00.17 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 00.00.25 # i just set up a table of values 00.00.28 # but the must would be to have real NFO viewer (http://www.damn.to/software/nfoviewer.html) and reak cue file viewer (http://brianvictor.tripod.com/mp3cue.htm) :) 00.00.35 # but i am dreaming then ;) 00.01.05 # let your dreams become a reality :) 00.02.15 # It is the dreamers who create the future 00.02.58 # the logarithmic scale dosent look as good for realt loud music 00.03.12 # i guess i set a button to switch betwene linear and log 00.03.22 # I hope so 00.03.52 # I wanna BPM counter from you next :) 00.03.54 # i need to figure out a way to make it delay, it jumps to much 00.04.05 # :) 00.04.08 # sample less often? 00.04.20 # well then its not so smooth 00.04.27 # hmm 00.04.34 # i an go from pixle 0 to 30 in an instant 00.04.42 # and thats not smooth 00.05.15 # take a sample once every second (second is just and easy example) 00.05.35 # then remember THIS sample and LAST sample values 00.05.59 # then 10 times during the second ...move from one to the other 00.06.02 # im not 100% sure it was the best forula to get the value for log, by my formula was log(x)*30.09, where x would be the original x position 00.06.23 # not got a log button on your calculator? 00.06.30 # i do 00.06.38 # i have ti 83+ :) 00.06.41 # cool 00.07.05 # i've got a casio fx-451 ...and original with the giant solar panel 00.07.06 # i acctually wrote a program on it to figure up all 56 calculations so it was easy to do 00.07.18 # best choice 00.07.30 # program on the ti83 of course :) 00.07.33 # i dont know anything about the casio calcs 00.07.38 # of cource 00.07.56 # that basic built in language is very usefull 00.08.21 # still hunting for the ultimate programmers calculator 00.08.31 # so what about my decay idea? 00.08.40 # i found a program someone write on ticalc.org that solves quadratics, you just write down what it says, it shows all the work, it made my homework very easy :) 00.08.48 # the decay idea may work 00.08.59 # ill try it when i get the log scale all nice 00.09.14 # all in a big array? 00.09.23 # yes 00.09.26 # :) 00.09.55 # just enter in the AB and C and write down what it says 00.10.06 # cant get much easier than that 00.10.24 # you can take that into an exam? 00.10.26 # cool 00.10.39 # i used it on the state tests 00.10.54 # LMAO 00.11.17 # well see ya BC|code 00.11.20 # takl to you later 00.11.26 # byeeee 00.11.33 Quit diddystar5 ("Leaving") 00.18.21 Join Electronic [0] (jirc@ACBACA44.ipt.aol.com) 00.36.04 Quit Electronic ("Leaving") 00.48.53 Join LinusN [200] (~linus@labb.contactor.se) 00.52.55 Join c0utta [0] (noemail@dialup-113.96.220.203.acc01-waym-adl.comindico.com.au) 00.53.22 # u there linus ? 00.54.20 Nick edx{visited} is now known as edx{code} (edx@pD9EA9ADC.dip.t-dialin.net) 00.55.59 # c0utta: he signed on 4mins before you ...so he is likely to be around soon :) 00.56.10 # i'm here 00.56.25 # no worries. i've isolated the source of rockbox hanging. 00.56.32 # nice 00.56.48 Quit Dr_Slump () 00.57.13 # they are a specific set of files that have worked previously on Rockbox 00.57.20 # ok 00.57.36 # 192kbps - nothing special about them. You try to play them and they hang. Work OK on WinAmp 00.58.13 # how big are the files? (i have only a v.90 modem right now) 00.59.35 # 4440kb 00.59.48 # ouch 01.00.09 # can you put it up for download somewhere? 01.00.48 # i'll try. i think i have some webspace somewhere. leave it with me 01.00.50 # does the file still exhibit the same behaviour if you cut some of it out of the middle? 01.01.27 # if it is the id3 tag, i would only need the beginning of the file 01.01.43 # what's the best way to cut it ? 01.02.00 # dd 01.02.09 # (linux program) 01.02.21 # using xp 01.04.02 # download a dos compile of dd? 01.06.28 # http://members.cox.net/dos/unix.htm 01.07.44 # http://unxutils.sourceforge.net 01.08.00 # bookmarked :) 01.09.33 # wonder why he didn't use DJ to compile - then he would have NO file dependancies !? 01.13.36 # which of the unxutils does the cutting ? 01.13.42 # dd 01.14.54 # dd if=original.mp3 of=newfile.mp3 bs=1024 count=128 01.15.15 # will copy the first 128kbytes from the file to newfile.mp3 01.20.17 # bc: FYI - http://members.cox.net/dos/unix.htm doesn't work 01.20.40 # c0utta: okay - cheers, sorry for the misdirection 01.20.58 # no problem. 01.22.35 # i'm on 56K so i'll be about 4 hours downloading the unix utils 01.23.15 # hang on dude - i'll get it on cable and send over the one you need. 01.24.28 # can't see the d/l link... 01.24.57 # got it 01.27.03 Quit AciD (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 01.28.32 # c0utta ...comin at ya' 01.32.09 Join AciD [0] (~acid@longchamp44-1-82-67-133-87.fbx.proxad.net) 01.33.25 # sorry BC - i was parenting 01.33.37 # what type of file are you sending ? dcc ignored the type 01.33.49 # understood ...we stumbled over the term NMI the other night ;) 01.33.52 # .exe i guess 01.33.57 # sending dd to save you time 01.35.06 # ok BC - try again 01.35.41 # that's from the zip from the sourceforge link from linus 01.36.17 # got it. i'll still download the unix utils tho.. :) 01.36.28 # fer sure 01.36.40 # LinusN: i also understand your issue about recursive keypresses 01.37.33 # i made a change to the F3 screen last night to load the playlist viewer 01.37.47 # caused all sorts of problems - had to turn off and on again. 01.38.27 # hehe 01.39.42 # i have worked out the problem too..i think 01.39.57 Join Electronic [0] (jirc@ACBF68D0.ipt.aol.com) 01.40.17 Quit Electronic (Client Quit) 01.40.21 # rockbox is designed to be very modular in that you can press almost any key at any time and it will perform that function 01.43.20 # ok linus - i've dd'd 01.43.53 # c0utta: nice 01.44.06 # where can i get the file? 01.48.17 # Linus, do you know a way to make diff "ignore TRAILING spaces"? 01.48.51 # "trailing spaces"? 01.49.25 # my editor strips trailing spaces and there are load of lines of code in Rockbox which flag up as "changed" 01.49.51 # I hav a number of fiddly work arounds 01.50.25 # regular gnu diff has a -b flag 01.50.39 # -b means "ignore whitespace changes" 01.50.45 # I need "trailling" spaces only 01.51.08 # ignore "start" spaces means you cannot correct indenting 01.51.58 # LinusN: i can't dcc it to you ? 01.52.16 # try 01.54.41 Quit AciD (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 01.55.48 Quit methangas (" Try HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <-") 01.57.35 # LinusN: incoming... 02.00.19 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 02.02.05 # Linus, is there a font editor/creator fro windows? 02.02.49 # there are lots, but most of them are expensive 02.03.00 # i want to generate a font for rockbox 02.04.06 # c0utta: got it, analyzing 02.04.07 # LinusN: did you get the file ? 02.05.45 # c0utta: got it, analyzing 02.11.18 Quit uski ("Fermeture du client") 02.13.24 Join midknight2k3 [0] (zakk@AC877D10.ipt.aol.com) 02.13.49 # hi all 02.14.24 # hi 02.14.30 # hi linus 02.20.35 Join kurzhaarrocker [0] (~Philipp@Be169.b.pppool.de) 02.21.01 # LinusN: you seem to be an owl. 02.23.14 # or vampire 02.23.20 # shriek! 02.23.35 # no Shrek, moves by day ;) 02.23.48 # :) 02.24.49 # Kurz - do you have any idea how to make a rockbox font using windows? 02.25.03 # I never bothered with that 02.25.12 # else I gotta dupe a whole big fat bunch of code to deal with my own format 02.25.31 Join Gazel [0] (~jirc@vaugirard-1-81-57-77-26.fbx.proxad.net) 02.25.35 # ok thanx 02.30.53 # Just for my interest: Is it right that the mas can provide timing information - but only while recording? 02.31.10 # yes 02.31.30 # it can include a time stamp in the frames 02.32.00 # So - theoretically they could be kept persistent? 02.32.10 # persistent? 02.32.27 # stored in the file and read back while playing. 02.32.51 # yes 02.33.17 # not very useful if you edit the file, though 02.33.41 # hm. And it would only concern files recorded with the mas I assume. 02.34.02 # -> pretty much effort for little effect to use these infos 02.34.14 # agreed 02.34.22 # pretty useless, if you ask me 02.40.26 # Linus, is it a simple task to retarget the .rocks to ./$DEVICE/.rockbox/rocks 02.40.41 # ...for sim 02.41.18 # don't know for windows, but it should be fairly simple 02.41.52 # its more of a makefile problem than a windows problem 02.43.02 # if I do everythng else for the sim, would you help with that bit? 02.44.37 # i'll try 02.44.49 # c0utta: i have found the cause of the hang 02.44.57 # ok thanks, i'll let you know when I get there 02.47.20 # * kurzhaarrocker is reading tech info 02.47.44 # who's dma controller is it that transfers the data? Of the MAS or the cpu? 02.48.42 # none 02.48.50 # there is no dma 02.49.00 # when recording 02.49.19 # I was still reading about playback 02.49.36 # the cpu sends serial data to the mas 02.50.01 # the serial controller on the cpu can fetch the data to send with dma 02.50.03 Quit k4waii (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 02.50.11 # ah 02.50.24 # rockbox uses the dma capability for this 02.51.06 # for playback and recording? 02.52.55 # recording uses the 8-bit parallel connection to the MAS 02.53.23 # ok 02.53.39 # however, we can't use DMA for this, so the CPU has to handle it "manually" 02.54.07 # pretty tricky 02.55.11 # And I still have no clue where I could start to understand the beast. There are so many interrupts I have no clue about, what they might be for. 02.55.27 # kurzhaarrocker: what are you trying to do? 02.56.13 # First I'd like to understand a _little_ of what happens. Long time goal is mp3 frame precise looping. 02.56.47 # for playback: 02.57.05 # the MAS has a DEMAND signal that is active high 02.57.07 # looping recordings is a job for musicians 02.58.14 # Is that what feeds (on negative edges) the DEI3? 02.58.24 # the DEMAND signal is connected to two pins, PA15 and PB14, PA15 is inverted 02.58.41 # ah 02.59.27 # so, PA15 can be configured as IRQ3 02.59.33 # i have (a=b=c=d=0xff) and I get "warning operation on rr may be undefined" ...any ideas? 02.59.40 # and PB14 as IRQ6 03.00.02 # 01 "warning operation on d may be undefined" 03.00.08 # So we have irqs for both: mas needs data and mas is fed up? 03.00.08 # BC|code: show me the entire expression 03.00.24 # yes (on recorder only) 03.00.24 # ll = rr = rl = rr = 0xC000; 03.00.39 # BC|code: you have rr twice 03.00.46 # thanks 03.00.49 # d'oh! 03.01.27 # so, IRQ3 enables the serial DMA and IRQ6 disables it 03.02.09 # LinusN: parenting. what's the cause of the hang ? 03.02.30 # the id3 tag is bad, basically 03.02.56 # older versions of rockbox handled that more or less by mistake 03.03.35 # Do those dma chunks _have_ to be 64 kb or may they be smaller? 03.03.37 # kurzhaarrocker: the DEI3 interrupt is triggered by the DMA controller when the DMA block has been sent 03.03.46 # kurzhaarrocker: they are 8k iirc 03.04.05 # you were correct then - id3 tag was the issue 03.04.13 # yup 03.04.29 # i don't know how to fix it yet 03.04.50 # and no-one else reported it ? 03.04.56 # nope 03.05.46 # Hi all geniuses ! I just got my FMR back from repair (warranty), all fine, and so i come back to rockbox to see what's new :) Can u briefly tell me what is currently incorporated in the daily builds that is not present in 2.1 ? i know about playlist viewer and video player... anything else ? 03.05.49 # c0utta: the frame size field of the TYER tag is wrong 03.05.51 # So there's a short period of undefined length between DMA is complete (DEI) and Mas wants food (irq3)? 03.06.22 # Gazel: LCD upside down flip, bug fixes, new rocks 03.06.35 # don't forget the new clock plugin :) 03.06.37 # kurzhaarrocker: yes 03.06.41 # (sorry to appear at that moment :o) thanx ! 03.06.44 # kurzhaarrocker: "new rocks" 03.06.55 # erm. yes. 03.07.04 # the clock is cool 03.07.22 # what does it do ? show time ? 03.07.23 # (especially the digital one :-) 03.07.29 # Gazel: yes 03.07.32 # ok 03.07.37 # But you can have the help (f1) only once. And I don't know how to change the date format... 03.07.55 # the date format is fixed, methinks 03.08.01 # me too 03.08.47 # the dma block size was lowered to 8k some time ago, to increase the resolution of the resume info 03.08.58 # oh my clock? 03.09.03 # yes 03.09.06 # yay 03.09.23 # Was my assumption right that the dma chunk always has to be the complete size - be it 8 or 64 kb? 03.09.35 # no 03.09.40 Quit Gazel ("Leaving") 03.09.40 # Gazel: my clock 03.09.43 # lol 03.09.44 # too late. 03.09.45 # grr 03.09.53 # it will be shorter in two cases: 03.10.03 # i should make IRC beep everytime someone says "clock" 03.10.05 # :) 03.10.10 # three cases: 03.10.17 # 1) end-of-song 03.10.22 # 2) track change 03.10.28 # 3) buffer wrap 03.10.55 Quit edx{code} (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 03.11.18 # ? buffer wrap? Sounds delicious. New kebab. What's that? 03.11.34 # the mp3 ram buffer is circular 03.11.41 # ok 03.17.43 # In the source comments I repeatedly read interrupt on level 5. Does the sh1 have priority handling for interrupts? 03.17.53 # yes 03.17.56 # 15 levels 03.18.15 # Have there been problems with them? 03.18.26 # i believe so, yes 03.18.42 # we had to adjust a few levels once, iirc 03.19.04 # Sounds like a hell to debug. 03.19.12 # indeed 03.25.28 # gotta sleep 03.25.36 # kurzhaarrocker: read docs/TECH 03.27.29 # nite all 03.27.31 Part LinusN 03.28.05 # * kurzhaarrocker is reading exactly that :) 03.34.20 Join earHurts [0] (~zic@c-65-97-29-164.va.client2.attbi.com) 03.34.48 Part scott666 03.46.46 Join AciD [0] (~acid@longchamp44-1-82-67-133-87.fbx.proxad.net) 03.52.33 Quit kurzhaarrocker (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 03.56.15 Join Nomad [0] (nomad@ipv6.rdlg.net) 03.56.18 # 'lo all 03.56.21 # hey, any chance of getting ext3 support into rockbox? 03.57.25 # 01I) 03.57.25 # can you code in C? 03.58.26 # I wish 03.58.33 # thats why I "ask" instead of tell :> 03.58.49 # also why I ask if it's possible 03.59.03 # :( in which case I can only suggest that you put in a feature request and see if it gets any interest 03.59.30 # it'd would be great if we could use ext3 so I could rsync from my linux filesyerver instead of having to copy the whole frigging archive every time 03.59.39 # figured I'd ask if it's possible before bothering anyone 03.59.52 # that's fair :) 04.00.21 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 04.01.20 # feature request is down it seems 04.01.32 # I'll try again in a bit 04.01.38 # MIGHT GET SOME INTEREST ON THE MAILING LIST 04.01.43 # sorry - coding in hex 04.01.54 # np 04.02.48 Quit Nomad (Remote closed the connection) 04.03.21 Join Nomad [0] (nomad@ipv6.rdlg.net) 04.03.33 # that was neat, irc client hung up 04.09.05 # bounced it to the mailing list 04.25.17 # tu 04.44.38 # Nomad: just to advise, your email was posted as an attachment and will likely be ignored by many 04.57.09 Quit earHurts (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 05.19.47 Join SirZoltan [0] (CIV@ACC7F5F3.ipt.aol.com) 05.19.53 # hello :) 05.21.20 Part SirZoltan 05.26.45 # lmao 05.26.57 # how are you gonna use the toilet now? 05.27.06 # er 05.27.14 # lmlo 05.27.22 # i dread to think - LOL 05.27.38 # rofl 05.28.03 # I have "rtoflmfao" reservered for VERY special occasions :) 05.28.10 # "rotflmao" 05.28.17 # argh!!!!!!!! 05.28.23 # ? 05.28.24 # "rotflmfao" 05.28.28 # gotit 05.28.29 # no 05.28.29 # its 05.28.35 # roflmmfaoacs 05.29.28 # my code looks like that at the moment 05.29.35 # dsf 05.32.37 Join rhak [0] (~rhak@phobos.ramapo.edu) 05.38.00 # as5300-10.216-194-24-87.nyc.ny.metconnect.net/ 05.38.02 Quit rhak ("[BX] Beavis & Butthead use BitchX. Huh-huh huh-huh huh-huh he said "Bitch".") 05.40.23 Join midk2k3 [0] (zakk@ACC6C8D4.ipt.aol.com) 05.42.27 Join earHurts [0] (~zic@c-65-97-29-164.va.client2.attbi.com) 05.43.06 # hello 05.43.42 # hi 05.43.43 # hear 05.43.45 # ear* 05.44.06 # what's up? 05.44.16 # not much 05.44.19 # coverting vids 05.44.27 # (btw I'm typing on my pda) 05.45.34 # cool 05.46.35 # and playing gnuz 05.46.48 # sd 05.47.06 Join arspy87 [0] (~arspy87@h00062598fa3b.ne.client2.attbi.com) 05.47.39 # hey all, i actually have to go in 5 minutes or so, then i'll be back in 30 05.47.57 # ars dude -yo :) 05.48.12 # what's shakin' bc? :) 05.48.25 # lol 05.48.40 # rattling some audio code - but the user interface is giving me a headache 05.48.48 # midk... midknight... interesting, we have a clone here 05.48.54 # yes 05.48.55 # we do 05.49.13 # so skip the ui and make an sdk 05.49.35 # or an api 05.49.43 # i get headaches and i dont even have to be coding - trying to rip with RealOne player is enough 05.49.56 # realone sucks 05.50.02 # get a real ripper 05.50.21 # i know :) i moved on to musicmatch! lol 05.50.33 # WMP was a very long time ago 05.50.46 # musicmatch is ugly as a 50 year old hooker,s ass 05.50.51 # lmao 05.50.57 # get cdex or eac 05.52.00 # yeah, probably going to get EAC 05.52.20 # EAC is arsey to configure, but worth the effort 05.52.46 # why must we pay for winamp5 to rip *rolls eyes* 05.53.03 # sd 05.53.14 # think I'll stick with 2.8 05.53.37 # dont see the point in 5 - with the classic skin - it is IDENTICAL to 2.8 05.53.51 # is not 05.53.59 # every winamp after 2.8 is bloated and leaves a big memory footprint 05.54.07 # sure. sure. 05.55.18 # well i'm out for 30, back soon 05.55.18 Quit AciD ("ac1d.free.fr") 05.55.22 # bye as! come back soon! 05.55.29 # will do :) 05.55.34 Join scott666 [0] (scott666@c-24-245-58-245.mn.client2.attbi.com) 05.55.36 # you already told me that 05.55.38 # hi scott 05.55.40 Part scott666 05.55.43 # aww 05.56.09 # BC - try not to bang your head on the table too much with that audio coding, it will only make your headache worse :) 05.56.23 # lol 05.56.35 # ttys 05.56.37 Part arspy87 05.56.55 # winamp 5 is free; the ripper part is the only part charged for 05.57.07 # hi earHurts 05.57.13 # er, the burne 05.57.29 # you can get free burners that are better 05.57.35 # nero 05.57.55 # whatever. I don't have a cd-w 05.58.09 # fine then 05.58.10 # ignore me 05.58.12 Quit midknight2k3 (Connection timed out) 05.58.23 # yeay 05.58.27 Nick midk2k3 is now known as midknight2k3 (zakk@ACC6C8D4.ipt.aol.com) 05.59.19 # midk2k3 is often known as sdd 05.59.33 Nick midknight2k3 is now known as sdd (zakk@ACC6C8D4.ipt.aol.com) 05.59.34 # good idea 05.59.40 # ;) 05.59.41 # hey 05.59.43 # thats a great idea 05.59.47 # that oughta be my new nick! 06.00.24 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 06.14.48 Join Stevenm [0] (~StevenM@pcp04424903pcs.nrockv01.md.comcast.net) 06.17.37 Join arspy87 [0] (~arspy87@h00062598fa3b.ne.client2.attbi.com) 06.17.45 # back in the house 06.17.53 # i mean, the 'box 06.18.03 # hey 06.18.17 # box is a british euphemism, I'd stick with house if I were you 06.18.46 # ah ok, what's it for? 06.19.10 # aeroplane blonde ...blonde on top ...black box below 06.19.13 # lmao 06.19.27 # ah, got it ;) 06.19.33 # *writes note to self* 06.20.11 # we all know midk = ssd right? :) 06.21.34 # just casue you didnt see me change nick doesnt mean noone else did 06.21.36 # ;D 06.23.20 Quit earHurts (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 06.24.42 Nick sdd is now known as MidK|GTA3 (zakk@ACC6C8D4.ipt.aol.com) 06.25.48 # grand theft auto 3, midk? 06.30.52 # indeed 06.35.22 # got it? 06.35.27 # sorry iw as making a playlist 06.36.17 # I WIN ALMOST 06.36.43 # nice 06.36.59 # i beat the hard part 06.38.14 # cool 06.38.24 # isnt cheating great 06.39.22 # we need a few more video player controls 06.39.31 # mk, you missed an entry off that list earlier - do you want to add it, or shall I delete your vote? 06.39.40 # what? 06.39.55 # mono l, mono r, custom, karaoke, stereo wide, stereo, stereo narrow, 06.40.06 # what was missing? 06.40.09 # mono 06.40.10 # it was different than that too 06.40.31 # i rotated it so mono-l was first ...it is a circle anyway 06.40.52 # i said: mono, mono-l, mono-r, custom, karaoke, stereo wide, stereo, stereo narrow 06.40.56 # or i think i did 06.41.00 # if not just add that 06.41.52 # do you want in 007? 06.42.17 # (007 being a famous spy an all) 06.42.54 # er 06.42.57 # wha 06.43.01 # clearly not! 06.43.08 # do i want "in" 007? 06.43.19 # hey ars pie 06.43.25 # arse pie 06.43.41 # hey 06.43.49 # how's that coding going? 06.43.56 # I'm looking for opinons on the sequence 06.44.02 # ah, cool 06.44.08 # wanna vote? 06.47.12 # i'll consider that a no 06.48.44 # sorry about that BC, what am i voting for? 06.49.02 # compiling - bbs 06.49.20 # bbs = ? lol sorry 06.49.29 # be back soon 06.49.34 # ah got it 06.49.39 Quit Stevenm ("Client exiting") 06.49.45 # what's the voting for midk? 06.50.00 # sequence of channel options 06.51.40 # elaborate 06.52.21 # er 06.57.52 Nick MidK|GTA3 is now known as midknight2k3 (zakk@ACC6C8D4.ipt.aol.com) 06.58.51 # woo hoo 07.09.23 # ? 07.09.36 # nothng 07.10.22 # need to write a sprite designer! 07.10.36 # OOH 07.10.40 # then make icy tower 07.10.46 # or boxy jumper 07.11.50 # ?? 07.11.59 # nm seeya all later 07.12.07 # byee 07.12.26 # bye BC|code, bye mbr, bye logbot 07.13.25 # bye logbot, lol 07.13.33 # oh, and of course 07.13.43 # bye adi|home 07.13.56 # g'nite johhn boy 07.14.01 # ok bye all anyways lol 07.14.03 Part midknight2k3 07.32.02 # nite all 07.32.13 Part BC|code 07.37.25 Part arspy87 07.55.10 Join edx{visited} [0] (edx@pD9EA9ADC.dip.t-dialin.net) 07.55.35 Nick edx{visited} is now known as edx (edx@pD9EA9ADC.dip.t-dialin.net) 08.00.27 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 08.32.21 Join Kevin [0] (~jirc@client202.imon1.hawkcommunications.com) 08.33.44 # hi 08.35.59 Quit Kevin (Client Quit) 08.49.24 Join matsl [0] (~matsl@dhcp101.contactor.se) 09.06.43 Quit webmind (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 10.00.28 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 10.47.44 Join theTof [0] (~chatzilla@strasbourg-2-62-147-12-62.dial.proxad.net) 10.51.31 Quit theTof ("ChatZilla 0.8.31 [Mozilla rv:1.4/7]") 12.00.30 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 12.16.40 Join methangas [0] (methangas@0x50c61de4.virnxx10.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk) 12.19.42 Quit c0utta (" We ARE the pride of South Australia We are the MIGHTY AD") 12.25.03 Join c0utta [0] (noemail@dialup-113.96.220.203.acc01-waym-adl.comindico.com.au) 12.47.11 Join Laurent_ [0] (~laurent@dyn-81-167-124-14.ppp.tiscali.fr) 12.47.25 # hi 13.00.11 Quit mbr (Remote closed the connection) 13.00.44 Join mbr [0] (~mb@stz-softwaretechnik.com) 13.07.25 Quit c0utta (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 13.09.36 Join c0utta [0] (noemail@dialup-86.53.221.203.acc04-waym-adl.comindico.com.au) 13.11.34 Quit c0utta (Client Quit) 13.15.21 Join kurzhaarrocker [0] (~Philipp@Be15d.b.pppool.de) 13.19.59 Join c0utta [0] (noemail@dialup-86.53.221.203.acc04-waym-adl.comindico.com.au) 13.21.07 Quit c0utta (Client Quit) 13.21.55 Join c0utta [0] (noemail@dialup-86.53.221.203.acc04-waym-adl.comindico.com.au) 13.22.58 Quit c0utta (Client Quit) 13.23.19 Join c0utta [0] (noemail@dialup-86.53.221.203.acc04-waym-adl.comindico.com.au) 13.23.34 # c0utta: you're blinkin... 13.23.51 # yeah, just changing irc clients 13.24.22 # trying to get my profile correct 13.24.43 # one more time.... 13.24.46 Quit c0utta (Client Quit) 13.24.57 Join c0utta [0] (noemail@dialup-86.53.221.203.acc04-waym-adl.comindico.com.au) 13.25.42 # hey, kurz 13.25.53 # i heard that you had looked at keyboard mapping 13.26.31 # oh, yes. 13.26.53 # I was as far as a working prototype -with some bugs 13.27.08 # hey kurz 13.27.11 # i had a long discussion with linus and bluechip about this topic 13.27.19 # ah 13.27.22 # so what did you guys find out? 13.27.33 # c0utta I've read about that 13.27.46 # hey Laurent_ :) 13.28.54 # The main issue (stack problems) that Linus had are true but can be overcome as long as you impose some restrictions 13.29.05 # yeah, i've got very simple requirements. i currently modify f2_screen & f3_screen myself 13.29.43 # I had that as a by product, too... 13.30.22 # it seems that the philosophy with rockbox is that you should be able to use any key at any time 13.30.43 # this causes the stack problems that linus was referring to 13.32.23 # Well for that you need to 'walkback' the callstack before entering another branch of the user interface. 13.33.04 # do keys generate interruptions ? 13.33.10 # No 13.33.33 # looks like keys are polled to me 13.34.36 # A separate key thread? 13.34.48 # -> To implement user bindable keys we'd have to rewrite every single switch(button) thingie within all rockbox. That's owfully much. 13.35.17 # If we want bindable keys, that has to be done. 13.36.10 # it depends, you might just replace switch( button ) by switch ( get_user_button( button ) ) if it's done properly 13.36.54 # Laurent_: no that doesn't work. It's not just button substitution. 13.37.35 # sorry, I tried ;) 13.37.38 # my simple requirements only involve f2 & f3 so easier to implement. i would not be interested in fully bindable keys personally 13.37.43 # buttons behave totally different in different contextes 13.38.03 # true 13.38.26 # But within f2, f3 screens you use other keys, too 13.38.49 # * kurzhaarrocker digs to find his old fn screen patch. 13.39.45 # I think the key bindings are pretty OK 13.40.05 # Perhaps customizable F2/F3 screens might be useful. 13.40.12 # That's a matter of taste / use 13.40.18 # dwihno: i agree. f2/f3 is very underused 13.40.45 # They are just the peak of the mountain 13.41.02 # that's why they're relatively easy :) 13.41.14 # kurzhaarrocker: tell me how you would like to change the key bindings... 13.42.27 # I haven't made up my mind completely and its been a while. But eg I'd prefer skipt to next / previous song to be a button combo. And I'm very lonly with this wish. User assignable keys could solve that. 13.43.06 # ah 13.43.10 # i'm sooo vanilla 13.43.33 # Let's make some cake from c0utta 13.43.39 # :) 13.43.41 # lol 13.43.44 # kurzhaarrocker: you apply your own patches to make those changes right now? 13.43.46 # * Laurent_ is going to be sick from eating too much chocolate 13.44.13 # guys, i have some general development questions.. 13.44.29 # if i decide to do a patch for f2/f3 how do i keep synced with the source 13.45.34 # dwihno: no I've been working key schemes since more than half a year because my unit broke. Now I'm more concerned about split editors and a 'rehearsal plugin' which would suit the need of a musician in a band. 13.45.59 # c0utta cvs is the only way 13.46.43 # i'm concerned i'll trample over someone else's work 13.46.45 # What I did was #ifdef 0 the original code. So not every commit resulted in a conflict. 13.46.56 # kurzhaarrocker: split editor? 13.47.44 # c0utta: Just try to update regularily. I think sometimes there has a price to be paid. 13.48.12 # but if i update incomplete/buggy code does this stuff everyone else ? 13.48.22 # do the daily builds get mashed ? 13.48.49 # c0utta: Well, key bindings at some places are things that does not change too often. I don't think you will get much of a problem when checking out new revisions. 13.49.36 Quit kurzhaarrocker (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 13.49.45 # i've never worked in a cvs environment before. i have many, many questions 13.50.07 Join kurzhaarrocker [0] (~Philipp@Be15d.b.pppool.de) 13.50.10 # what if someone else is updating the same code as me ? 13.50.35 # You'd know as cvs tries to merge the code 13.50.55 Join orby [0] (~orby@c-67-164-138-36.client.comcast.net) 13.51.03 # hey guys 13.51.07 # c0utta: Are you used to cvs? 13.51.19 # c0utta: cvs does not replace old code with yours, it integrates the differences between your code and the "old" one 13.51.23 # old->current 13.52.00 # can anybody here tell me if the FM recorder 20 is worth $80 more than the recorder 20? :) 13.52.06 # never used cvs. come from a vb programming background. the last c programming i did was talking to manufacturing equipment 13.52.19 # (aside from the fact it'll tune FM stuff) 13.53.10 # orby: it isn't, if you ask me. I think the FM has one major downside that prevents me from ever purchasing one. Custom batteries. 13.53.10 # Laurent_: what if: c0utta->current<-laurent_ 13.53.28 # c0utta: this can't happen 13.53.42 # why ? 13.53.42 # the cvs server merges one first, then the other 13.54.15 # they knew some guy name c0utta would try to mess things :) 13.54.21 # c0utta: Then I'd recommend to play around with cvs for half a day. Put up a simple demo cvs root on your own machine. After you'll feel better. At least it helped me 13.54.21 # name=named 13.55.07 # i'll second kurz recommendation 13.55.33 # it makes me realise how much i don't know.. 14.00.33 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 14.01.31 # this will be always true throughout you whole life ;) 14.01.34 # living is learning 14.02.03 # (amen) ;) 14.08.21 Part orby 14.10.09 # meaning : there's always more that we don't know than that we know 14.10.33 # I don't know 14.12.40 # ;) 14.20.39 Nick edx is now known as e{eating}dx (edx@pD9EA9ADC.dip.t-dialin.net) 14.21.51 Nick e{eating}dx is now known as e{ating}dx (edx@pD9EA9ADC.dip.t-dialin.net) 14.47.50 Join Pierrot [0] (Pere-Now-H@Mix-Reims-109-4-6.w193-250.abo.wanadoo.fr) 14.48.18 DBUG Enqueued KICK Pierrot 14.48.18 # 12Hi everybody 14.48.47 # hi 14.49.08 # I'm a beginner, and I need pieces of advice 14.49.44 # kurzhaarrocker => do you know how compil a .c file into a .rock file ? 14.50.06 # yes. You'll need a complete toolchain for that 14.50.29 # h 14.50.31 # hi 14.50.37 # Look at http://rockbox.haxx.se/docs/, there it is explained quite well 14.51.15 # hum 14.52.01 # for .rock files as "snow.rock" or simply "helloworld.rock" , I have to compil all the rockbox ? 14.52.33 # You don't have to, but its easier that compiling it separately :) 14.52.43 # that = than 14.53.16 # and If I want to compil it separately, how can I do ? 14.53.17 # Actually you need parts of the rest of rockbox for your rock 14.53.24 # ok 14.53.40 # have you time to explain me how to compil that ? 14.53.42 # please* 14.53.56 # Pierrot: don't try. It would really be the hard way to compile it separately 14.54.03 # ok. 14.54.19 # is it long to compil rockbox ? 14.54.37 # It takes less than a minute once the tool chain is set up 14.54.45 # what is this tool chain ? 14.55.02 # Are you working on linux or win32? 14.55.07 # win32 14.55.19 # That would be the cygwin way :) 14.55.24 # ok :) 14.55.50 # and what do I exactly need ? 14.56.33 # as said before in http://rockbox.haxx.se/docs/ you can find all the info including a link to the development environment found at http://rockbox.my-vserver.de/win32-sdk.html 14.56.57 # thx :):) 14.57.35 # The tool chain mainly consists of cygwin - which is something like a little bit linux on windows and the compiler for the sh1 processor 14.58.32 # cygwin is needed for all the tools like make, shells to execute the shell scripts and so on. 14.59.19 # (I've just begun to Download tar.exe and bzip2.exe) 14.59.27 Join AciD [0] (~acid@longchamp44-1-82-67-133-87.fbx.proxad.net) 14.59.52 # Pierrot: do you know cvs? 15.00.27 # just the name ... but I don't really know how it works 15.01.05 # Pierrot: why do you want to compile only some files ? 15.02.10 # In the long run you'll want to find out. But for the first try it would be nothing but an additional hazzle. Thus I'd recommend to use a tarball of the daily builds on http://rockbox.haxx.se/daily.shtml. 15.02.13 # Because I want to add only .rock files .. 15.02.47 # ok. thx :) 15.04.05 # Actually the rocks are based on an api defined by the rockbox. So you'll need something to link your rock against. These things are byproducts of the compile process. They aren't downloadable anywhere so you have to build them yourself. You can't get around building rockbox completely at least once. 15.04.32 Ctcp Ignored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood 15.04.32 # * Laurent_ doesn't even know what a .rock is ;) this seems to be an object file of some sort ? 15.04.56 # Afterward the makefiles take care that only the source that has changed (your rock) is compiled. 15.05.03 # Laurent_: rocks == plugins 15.05.33 # kurzhaarrocker: oh, thanks 15.06.03 # while I am at it : another dumb question -> what's a .ucl ? 15.06.24 # That's the file that is used for flashing 15.07.03 # I think it's a specially compressed .ajz / .mod thingie 15.07.39 Quit c0utta (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 15.09.36 # oki 15.11.30 # another dumb question => how does work a patch ? 15.12.17 # a patch is a file that contains _changes_ to the current source. When you apply a patch these changes are inserted into your source. 15.12.45 # and after, I have to compil the source, haven't I ? 15.12.54 # that's the contrary 15.12.57 # yes. 15.13.02 # huh ? 15.13.09 # looooooool Laurent_ 15.13.16 # erm the yes was for Pierrot 15.13.21 # first changes, then compile, then patch then submit patch ? 15.13.38 # ok 15.14.15 # Laurent_ => I think it's not a patch as U have the habit to download 15.14.34 # it's not the kind of patch U use for a game or smthng like that 15.14.54 # no, it's a source patch, made with diff 15.15.52 # so there are two sides of a patch. 15.15.52 # 1.) the programmer who has changed the source creates a patch with his changes. 15.15.52 # 2.) another programmer who wants to try the changes applies the patch from programmer1 to his own source 15.16.27 # So there are two processes: creating a patch and applying a patch. 15.16.41 # I described applying a patch. 15.17.14 # ok, that's why I was wrong 15.17.20 # my apologies ;) 15.17.24 # you weren't 15.17.43 # I was wrong in thinking the process was creating a patch ;) 15.18.34 # oops, I must go, if I don't go shopping now, I'll never do it ;) 15.18.51 # back in a few hours 15.18.53 # C ya 15.18.55 # bye ! 15.18.57 # bring some beer, please :) 15.19.04 # good idea ! I will ! 15.19.06 # ;) 15.19.09 # (lol Laurent_ ... comment ch'cause ... un vrai americain :p;)) 15.19.21 # lool yeah good idea :p 15.19.27 Quit Laurent_ ("shopping") 15.22.54 # * kurzhaarrocker is hungy 15.22.57 # see you later 15.23.11 # C you :) 15.23.26 Quit Pierrot () 15.38.07 Join webmind [0] (~cme2@217-195-236-172.dsl.esined.net) 15.42.38 Quit kurzhaarrocker (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 15.51.42 Join jameson [0] (~reichenb@128.138.193.136) 15.54.26 # Hi! I noticed that you guys have a list of fonts available at http://rockbox.haxx.se/fonts/; are these in the public domain or licensed under some public license? 16.00.30 # dunno 16.00.36 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 16.09.25 Nick e{ating}dx is now known as edx (edx@pD9EA9ADC.dip.t-dialin.net) 17.07.09 Join OrbyX [0] (total2@64.246.54.8) 17.08.02 # hey peeps 17.08.09 # anybody here with the FM Recorder? 17.09.00 # better yet, anybody here? :) 17.10.24 # im here.. but i odn't have the recorder:) 17.10.38 # cool 17.11.00 # I'm just trying to figger out if I should upgrade to the FM Recorder to stick with the regular recorder 17.11.11 # I think the FM Recorder has a different design and maybe different battery?! 17.11.22 # which has been my big complaint so far withmy recorder :( 17.11.31 # battery life sux! 17.19.52 # regular recorder rules! 17.19.59 # well, buy a new set of batteries 17.20.05 # powerex 2200! :D 17.21.18 # They should stop billing the batteries as "10hrs" life if they only provide 1.5 hour 17.21.34 # Doesn't the FM Recorder come with Li-Ion ones though? 17.24.51 # think so 17.25.10 # I wonder what the life of those are per charge? 17.31.41 # how long do your powerex 2200's last ya? 17.32.46 # I don't have a couple of those yet. 17.33.01 # I'm using a pair of GP 1800 17.33.07 # Works like a charm 17.33.52 # what are thosE? 17.34.01 # I wonder if anybody makes Li-Ion AA batteries? 17.35.13 # Hmm.. 17.36.24 Join mecraw__ [0] (~mecraw@69.2.235.2) 17.37.13 # haven't heard of it 17.53.06 Part OrbyX 17.59.07 Join diddystar5 [0] (Lee@ACC54580.ipt.aol.com) 18.00.40 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 18.01.02 Quit matsl (Remote closed the connection) 18.06.35 Join BC|code [0] (~bluechip@cpc3-colc1-3-0-cust61.colc.cable.ntl.com) 18.06.44 # hi BC|code 18.06.49 # hey diddy 18.07.02 # wrote that code you wanted to see 18.07.10 # send it on 18.26.09 # got thelog scale done for both needles! 18.26.15 # yeah 18.26.23 # not to clean all the code up 18.26.26 # cool 18.26.30 # lol 18.26.33 # you do that too huh? 18.26.50 # 8 i mean TO clean the code up :) 18.26.54 # lol 18.27.12 # did the decay ocde too? 18.27.22 # i need to set a button to switch betwene the scales also... 18.27.28 # not the decay yet 18.27.43 # ill work on that when i finish all the log stuff up 18.34.09 # I've got all the basic audio controls running at full steam now :) 18.34.21 # working on user-definable stereo seperation now 18.34.53 # ...the worst bit is designing all the graphics and fonts to make it look good 18.40.41 # cool 18.47.00 # think i have the button scale switch done 18.47.03 # now to test 18.48.06 # no joke, I am looking forward to trying it ...LOVE the analogue VU meters :) 18.51.18 # lol - clearline is the opposite of drawline, but clearrect is NOT the opposite of drawrect !! 18.51.32 # lol 18.51.54 Join scott666 [0] (scott666@c-24-245-58-245.mn.client2.attbi.com) 18.52.05 # humm the linear scale works, but the log scale well.... the needles are all over the place. sometihng is wrong 18.52.22 # do you want me to take a look and make suggestions? 18.52.29 # no promises 18.52.38 # well the left needle on log scael works, just the right needle 18.52.43 # sure one sec 18.52.46 # dcc? 18.52.54 # go4it 19.12.04 Quit edx (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 19.13.32 Join edx [0] (edx@pD9EABA70.dip.t-dialin.net) 19.22.05 Join kurzhaarrocker [0] (~Philipp@Be14e.b.pppool.de) 19.30.46 Join gsn [0] (~guest@p508B5A56.dip.t-dialin.net) 19.33.57 Join Dogger [0] (~jimmy@cpc1-colc1-5-0-cust124.colc.cable.ntl.com) 19.34.12 Quit scott666 ("i'll be back...eventually...") 19.36.26 Join Laurent_ [0] (~laurent@dyn-213-36-188-207.ppp.tiscali.fr) 19.36.36 # hi 19.36.40 # ho 19.36.46 # hoho 19.37.00 # where's santa when you need him? 19.37.57 # north pole 19.38.04 # lol 19.38.42 # probably drunk amongst his reindeer ;) 19.38.48 # reindeers 19.39.57 Join scott666 [0] (scott666@c-24-245-58-245.mn.client2.attbi.com) 19.40.03 # hear about Blitzen the Brown nosed reindeer ...second in line to Rudolf ...just as fast ...but lousy brakes 19.40.20 # heh 19.40.39 # scott666: BC|code wasn't talking about you 19.40.53 # i know, its still funny 19.43.38 # inspired by c0utta I just had a glance at my ancient key schemes code. I have hardly any clue what I did there. 19.45.02 Quit gsn () 19.45.26 Quit kurzhaarrocker ("Trillian (http://www.ceruleanstudios.com)") 19.45.34 Join track [0] (jirc@ACB91D9F.ipt.aol.com) 19.45.55 # track!!!!! 19.45.56 Quit track (Client Quit) 19.46.00 # lol 19.47.50 Quit Dogger ("Client Exiting") 19.51.21 # bye BC|code, and scott666 19.51.27 Quit diddystar5 ("Leaving") 19.56.24 Part Laurent_ 19.56.30 Join Laurent_ [0] (~laurent@dyn-213-36-188-207.ppp.tiscali.fr) 19.57.25 # was dogger present this afternoon ? 19.58.12 # no idea, sorry 19.58.21 # it's ok ;) 20.00.44 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 20.08.38 Quit scott666 ("i'll be back...eventually...") 20.31.47 Join hardeep [0] (1098@208.247.65.237) 20.49.40 Join Lowfiler [0] (~dIRC@p5085FF5C.dip.t-dialin.net) 20.49.53 # hi 20.50.14 # hi 20.55.36 # was jörg here? 20.58.42 # Lowfiler: his nick is [IDC]Dragon and he's online quite frequently. 21.00.02 # thx hardeep 21.33.43 Join [IDC]Dragon [0] (~idc-drago@pD9512B7F.dip.t-dialin.net) 21.37.21 Join DJBaz [0] (~baz@modem-3415.leopard.dialup.pol.co.uk) 21.38.36 Quit [IDC]Dragon () 21.45.33 # does anyone here have any info on the stereo seperation parameters? 21.45.36 Join electronic [0] (jirc@ACB91D9F.ipt.aol.com) 21.49.53 # I am wondering what the range is for each parameter and whether it is signed or not 22.00.45 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 22.01.37 # Hi 22.02.18 # evenin 22.02.22 # Hi 22.02.51 # BC|code: are those params those of the hardware or of rockbox ? 22.03.20 # hardware 22.03.25 Join Asmotaku-neko [0] (WinXP@ACB7B126.ipt.aol.com) 22.03.32 # Hi there ! 22.03.56 # hi 22.04.32 # I'm in seach for infos about RockBox history. 22.04.43 # BC|code: isn't this information in the MAS data sheet ? 22.05.06 # no, it just says 4 registers default values are <...> 22.05.20 # u mean, like : "how we figured how to program the jukebox" ? 22.05.23 # 22.05.25 Quit DJBaz ("Leaving") 22.05.34 # I wonder how. 22.05.58 # Asmotaku-neko: a good start is the mailing list archive 22.06.12 # Asmotaku-neko: i guess at least that it might be so ;) 22.06.25 # k, I'm off to it. 22.06.44 # * Asmotaku-neko is reading RockBox mailing list. 22.06.57 # -archive, that is- 22.09.09 # k, I get it, it's pure reverse eng. 22.10.23 # u guy should have put a hit counter on rockbox.haxx.se, that could have been a clue to praise Archos for an SDK release. 22.10.35 # don't u think ? 22.10.47 # °_° 22.11.18 # archos SDK - I wish 22.11.50 # Mind you, what we've got is sooooo much better it would be irrelevant now 22.12.21 # well, first of all is to build a marker study chart, as a proof. 22.12.38 # third-party firmware could attact more customers. 22.12.47 # attact = attract. 22.12.54 # they are stamping on it big time 22.13.07 # huh ? how that ? 22.13.11 # they want ZERO support and are prepared to sue to make it happen 22.14.13 # you mean their are ready to start legal 22.14.21 # you mean their are ready to start legal proceedings ? 22.14.28 # -_- 22.14.34 # yep, not with us ...with their new kit 22.14.46 # avos.sourceforge 22.14.49 # I think it would be a good idea to measure rockbox' popularity 22.15.37 DBUG Enqueued KICK Asmotaku-neko 22.15.37 # 07(Laurent_07): that should be a good mark for alternative firmware dev. 22.15.45 # that might indeed force them to think again 22.15.45 # we already know how many downloads per day 22.16.07 # I'm sure Rockbox had taken more than 100K hit, 22.16.15 # gotta start thinking like a marketting capitalist ...not a techie ;) 22.18.39 Join [IDC]Dragon [0] (~idc-drago@pD9512B7F.dip.t-dialin.net) 22.22.13 # ;) 22.22.19 # well, u're right BC|Code... only BIG MONEY will make them move. damn them. 22.22.57 # Time to get out the Rodger Dawson tapes and set up a meeting with their marketting boys 22.23.06 # stupid dd question : i'd like to copy 10Mb of zeros into a file, I'm doing "dd bs=10M if=/dev/zero of=block" but it never stops :( 22.23.29 # there's something in dd that i don't understand correctly 22.23.58 # ok I got it 22.24.02 # dd writes blocks not bytes 22.24.09 # don't bother answering 22.24.12 # lol 22.24.53 # yop, that was it 22.25.00 # :) 22.26.20 # ^w^ 22.27.37 # neko: you truly are the master of the smiley :) 22.27.54 # °w^ thanx 22.27.58 # lol 22.28.17 # ...are you a dan grade? 22.29.07 # Am i a ... what ? 22.29.31 # sorry, just being silly and distracting myself ..."dan grade" is a martial arts term 22.29.36 # r u talkin'bout martial arts ? 22.29.51 # oops... sluggish answer. 22.31.02 # well, no answer from telechips... but got an answer from the samsung guy 22.31.49 # he basically says : "did you ask telechips first ? if they wont help you, tell me i'll get you in touch with a guy here who can" 22.32.05 # cool 22.32.08 # kind of encouraging 22.39.45 # <[IDC]Dragon> Lowfiler: you were looking for me? 22.42.45 Quit electronic ("Leaving") 22.44.04 Join kurzhaarrocker [0] (~Philipp@Be178.b.pppool.de) 22.44.23 # <[IDC]Dragon> Hi Phil! 22.44.44 # Hi Dragon! Startet rewriting mpeg already? 22.44.51 # <[IDC]Dragon> ;) 22.45.22 # <[IDC]Dragon> Linus wasn't exactly jumping on it 22.45.32 # what are you doing inside mpeg.c ?? 22.45.54 # It' s just that I am working on some new audio prams code ...which will be affected 22.46.04 # will/may 22.46.09 # I want to avoid fiddling there 22.46.14 # ...or maybe even save you some work 22.46.21 # ah okay 22.46.39 # <[IDC]Dragon> see my post about splitting it up 22.46.50 # ok 22.47.23 # What I _have_ done is to encapsulate some code for calculating the fileposition from time in a function. But that really was a minor change. 22.48.09 Join LinusN [200] (~linus@labb.contactor.se) 22.48.18 # hello linus 22.48.23 # <[IDC]Dragon> Ah, there's the man 22.48.32 # <[IDC]Dragon> So early today? 22.48.33 # where? :-) 22.48.37 # [IDC]Dragon: now lets see LinusN jump :) 22.48.47 Ctcp Ignored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood 22.48.47 # * LinusN jumps 22.48.55 # <[IDC]Dragon> I was afraid Linus and I have no overlap in IRC 22.49.17 # <[IDC]Dragon> jumping on the subject of slitting mpeg.c 22.49.32 # <[IDC]Dragon> (that's what we were talking about) 22.49.45 # slitting is too much, just split it :) 22.50.07 # <[IDC]Dragon> splatting 22.50.38 # I encourage the idea of going stream oriented, but I will not be able to help with code, just with encouragement ... :) 22.51.26 # Moral Officer Kurz 22.51.30 # :) 22.51.34 # <[IDC]Dragon> (looks like Linus jumped away) 22.51.47 # i think stream oriented mpeg handling will complicate things even more 22.52.08 # <[IDC]Dragon> please explain... 22.52.14 # K.I.S.S 22.52.17 # Do you mean things like keeping time? 22.52.33 # keeping time, buffer handling, rw/ff 22.52.36 # <[IDC]Dragon> it's not simple the way it is... 22.52.37 # dma 22.52.42 # no it isn't 22.53.11 # but the file i/o is the smallest part of it 22.53.26 # <[IDC]Dragon> I wouln't call it streaming, but seperating source and sink just has to be easier (gut feeling) 22.53.56 # when playing mpeg data, what would be the sink other than the MAS? 22.54.11 # A file while recording 22.54.22 # "when playing" 22.54.23 # <[IDC]Dragon> true for sink, but the source may differ 22.54.33 # yes it could 22.54.44 # i agree that playing from RAM would be nice 22.55.10 # <[IDC]Dragon> :) 22.55.24 # i'm just allergic to unnecessary abstractions 22.55.49 # but maybe a source/sink approach would be nice 22.56.24 # <[IDC]Dragon> I find them (abstractions) helpful to have a mental modularization 22.56.25 # nice way forward to new platforms too 22.56.34 # on a side note, ive emailed multichannel asking for possible information sharing about the xclef 22.56.44 # BC|code: which platform doesn't have read()? 22.57.13 # <[IDC]Dragon> it's more the MAS side to worry about... 22.57.19 # LinusN: My consideration was more to the sink 22.57.21 # i also agree that mpeg.c is a mess 22.57.27 # fingers crossed, they may supply some information about their flash procedure 22.57.51 # But when we have a source/sink approach - why stop there? Imagine we have different sources - they all could be encapsulted by the same buffer mechanism which is between the source and the real sink 22.57.54 # LinusN: but intuitively if you isolate the sink, then the source becomes isolated by default 22.58.19 # kurzhaarrocker: you said the forbidden word - encapsulate!!!! 22.58.38 Join c0utta [0] (noemail@dialup-180.55.221.203.acc05-waym-adl.comindico.com.au) 22.58.40 # I love encapsulating - but I'm a java programmer. 22.58.40 # <[IDC]Dragon> why forbidden? 22.58.48 # K.I.S.S 22.58.56 # <[IDC]Dragon> not that again 22.58.59 # otherwise it will get quite messy, bad code = the machine stops working :/ 22.59.28 # (quick change your teminology) 22.59.30 # (what does Lins mean by K.I.S.S?) 22.59.30 # <[IDC]Dragon> I've learned (in practice) that clear interfaces make stuff a lot more maintainable 22.59.36 # im v much looking forward to this machine arriving, 120 MHz is a lot of oomph to play with :) 22.59.40 # Keep It Simple, Stupid 22.59.41 # Keep It Simple Stupid 22.59.42 # Keep It Simple Stupid 22.59.46 # LOL 22.59.49 # ok 22.59.59 # <[IDC]Dragon> repeat, everyone 23.00.03 # Keep It Simple Stupid 23.00.08 # Keep It Simple, Stupid 23.00.10 # Keep It Simple Stupid 23.00.11 # also, abstractions leak 23.00.18 # <[IDC]Dragon> fine! 23.00.18 # Is that mantra? 23.00.21 # hmm, me too.. brb 23.00.26 # Laurent_: Joel Spoilsky? 23.00.46 # http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/LeakyAbstractions.html (yup) 23.00.51 # *sob* *sob* I wish I could find an alternate firmware for my AV140 ! *sob* 23.00.55 # K.I.S.S is a Rockbox mantra 23.01.21 # Asmotaku-neko: you wanted the history of Rockbox? 23.02.05 # I also think that it would be a nice thing to have on the web site 23.02.19 # the history? 23.02.21 # yes 23.02.28 # Well, yes, but I wondered how your community managed to dev some firmware on JBM 23.02.29 # Daniel is writing it 23.02.52 # Asmotaku-neko: that is a completely different beast 23.03.01 # when I discovered Rockbox it has been the first thing I have searched 23.03.05 # Daniel is writing some firmware for AV1XX series ? is that it ? 23.03.15 # no, the history 23.03.27 # Or did I misunderstood ? 23.03.55 # duh ! painful answer ! 23.04.02 # *sob* *whine* 23.04.11 # T_T 23.04.18 # Asmotaku-neko: work is being done 23.04.24 # bak 23.04.40 # but none of the core rockbox developers have a MM device 23.04.54 Join Pierrot [0] (Pere-Now-H@Mix-Reims-109-4-225.w193-250.abo.wanadoo.fr) 23.04.59 # but if you're offering to buy a bunch of them... 23.05.15 # Hi everybody 23.05.19 # Pierrot: hi 23.05.21 # hi 23.05.23 # <[IDC]Dragon> AV3xx, please 23.05.30 # at least, I've posted a topic about the petition, on the biggest french DivX forum. They reprensent the second community, in terms of population. 23.05.51 # reprensent = represent 23.06.04 Join scott666 [0] (scott666@c-24-245-58-245.mn.client2.attbi.com) 23.06.23 # so the "we wont touch mm devices" motto, is more due to lack of resources than to some other reason ? 23.06.35 # also lack of interest 23.06.47 # I thought it was because there were too much differences on the hardware side 23.06.55 # I guess the interest would grow if we all owned them 23.07.00 # if i felt i needed a mm decice i would have bought one already 23.07.03 # Asmotaku-neko: it was a bit like this with the FM Recorder - people were getting there, but quite slowly. Then one kind man bought Linus an FM Recorder, he disected it and within a month the port was stable and complete 23.07.07 # although it is VASTLY different hardware 23.07.07 # the MM devices would be interesting PDAs 23.07.25 # I have a problem. my girlfriend had plugged her jukebox on an USB port, but she unplugged it without removing it by the icon in the taskbar. Now when she plug the JB on the computer, she get a blue screen ... Have U got an idea of what she could do ?? 23.07.34 # 1 month!? Respect dude ! 23.07.46 # lol...reboot 23.07.50 # she did 23.07.56 # it's still the same probleem 23.08.00 # problem* 23.08.22 # win9x i bet? 23.08.22 # Pierrot: reboot safe mode - system - device mangler - remove ALL occurences of Jukbox drivers - reboot 23.08.28 # Pierrot: does the jukebox work without usb? 23.08.36 # I don't know 23.08.41 # what if it works .. ? 23.08.48 # ahhh, check Linus advice first 23.08.52 # lol ok 23.08.55 # [IDC]Dragon: about the source/sink idea, what did you have in mind? 23.09.18 # so, I don't know if it works or not ... tell me what to do in both cases please LinusN 23.09.18 # <[IDC]Dragon> you mean, in addition to what I posted? 23.09.40 # Pierrot: i want to know if you can playt music with it? 23.10.06 # <[IDC]Dragon> I've worked with DirectShow in the past, and we developed an architecture for mobile phones recently. 23.10.39 # I don't know ... I don't have my girlfriend's JB here 23.10.40 # <[IDC]Dragon> Both are too big for what we need here, but stripping down is the easier part. 23.10.45 # * c0utta is AWAY: -[ auto-away ]- away for about 10 minutes 23.10.50 # but I guess it can play music 23.10.57 # Pierrot: i can imagine two things: 23.11.31 # either the windows drivers are corrupt (doubt it), or the file system on the JB is corrupt (more likely) 23.11.59 # What can I do if the file system on the JB is corrupt ? 23.12.02 # i suggest you connect it to another computer and scandisk (or reformat) the drive 23.12.45 # ok 23.12.52 # [IDC]Dragon: i can imagine a simple abstraction of the I/O parts 23.13.11 # <[IDC]Dragon> something like that 23.13.13 # so you can read/seek/write to a RAM buffer 23.13.32 # <[IDC]Dragon> who's RAM buffer? 23.13.38 # does one say zeroes or zeros ? 23.13.43 # my RAm buffer 23.14.00 # <[IDC]Dragon> who is "me"? 23.14.23 # Laurent_: i guess it's zeros in USA and zeroes in England 23.14.25 # <[IDC]Dragon> I suggest the source owns the buffer 23.14.42 # yes 23.14.52 # <[IDC]Dragon> the sink consumes it and notifies before it needs more 23.15.17 # how long before? 23.15.42 # and how does it notify? 23.15.45 # and why? 23.15.49 # That's why I'd prefer streaming then the sink can just fetch from the input "queue" 23.15.49 # <[IDC]Dragon> dragging me onthe ice? ;) 23.16.07 # this is why i prefer a simple read() 23.16.26 # no abstract mumbojumbo 23.16.35 # <[IDC]Dragon> let's put it the other way: the source tries to stuff the buffer until it stalls 23.17.11 # ::: should we code with the intention of our code running on machines which may be supported in the future? 23.17.14 # It could stuff its own buffer which the sink reads 23.17.37 # BC|code: not if you ask me 23.17.40 # <[IDC]Dragon> kurzhaarrocker: that's what I mean 23.17.54 # that makes perfect sense of the opposed views 23.18.21 # But that means that all the high / lowwater mechanisms have to be handled by the source. 23.18.30 # <[IDC]Dragon> I'd like to do the bitswapping late, like just in time, to keep the data intact for seeking 23.18.32 # By every source 23.18.39 # i see no reason to go lengths to make code portable when you don't even know if it will ever be ported 23.19.12 # I understand your thought, but to many (myself included) it is habitual ...not sure if that is good or bad 23.19.38 # <[IDC]Dragon> kurzhaarrocker: the watermarking is because of the source, so should be its business. 23.19.57 # well, i said "go lengths" because there are of course reasons why we stick to the POSIX API for instance 23.20.00 # <[IDC]Dragon> the powered down disk has other latency than a RAM buffer 23.20.21 # so some effort is always good 23.20.23 # oops, does anyone know what to type to reset a terminal that switched to some obscure mode ? (off topic I know) 23.20.32 # stty sane 23.20.33 # But why not put that low highwater mechanism into a pipe that connects source and drain 23.20.57 # <[IDC]Dragon> my vote 23.20.59 # LinusN: hum... not enough unfortunately ;) 23.21.02 # thx for your advices LinusN :) 23.21.09 # Pierrot: you're welcome 23.21.13 # good bye everybody 23.21.17 # bye 23.21.19 # cu Pierrot 23.21.39 Quit Pierrot () 23.21.46 # kurzhaarrocker, [IDC]Dragon: hold it for a second 23.21.55 # * kurzhaarrocker holds it 23.22.01 # * [IDC]Dragon holds "it" 23.22.14 # go back and think of the reasons why you wanted to do this source/sink stuff 23.22.24 # <[IDC]Dragon> OK 23.22.48 # was it to create a nice "architecture" that was really neat and cool, or was it because you wanted to play mpeg data from different sources? 23.23.16 # <[IDC]Dragon> the latter, but I was thinking about the way to there 23.23.40 # <[IDC]Dragon> and other things: 23.23.52 # finer control over what is played when 23.24.12 # <[IDC]Dragon> I'd like the buffer data to stay unswapped for as long as possible, to allow seeking around 23.24.31 # [IDC]Dragon: explain 23.24.59 # <[IDC]Dragon> We can parse the headers way better when it's plain 23.25.14 # ah 23.25.21 # <[IDC]Dragon> an old feature whish of mine: have audible FF/FR 23.25.26 # (apropos swapping: I heared rumors there was someone with access to the MAS specs -> could swapping be delegated to the mas?) 23.25.45 # kurzhaarrocker: yes and no 23.25.53 # <[IDC]Dragon> I was discussing that wit BC yesterday 23.26.06 # I'll read that later 23.26.14 # <[IDC]Dragon> the avail info is by far not enough 23.26.15 # it would probably require quite a lot of code rewriting 23.26.21 # in the MAS 23.26.32 # <[IDC]Dragon> for which we have no tools 23.26.42 # nor knowledge 23.26.45 # <[IDC]Dragon> nor even an instruction set 23.26.54 # Linus ...have you managed to speak to "my contact" yet? 23.26.59 # * kurzhaarrocker 's dream burst like a soap bubble 23.27.18 # yes, we have contacted Micronas once again 23.27.23 # great 23.27.24 # are the recorder/player's archos firmwares compressed ? 23.27.37 # no 23.27.45 # just scrambled 23.27.47 # the gmini's is 23.27.51 # BC|code: however, the nice guy at Micronas has quit his job, so another person is taking his place 23.27.55 # he can take his time to reply sometimes, (although not as bad as mas) but his replies are always worth waiting for :) 23.28.03 # BALLS! 23.28.17 # we contacted him, waiting for an answer 23.29.04 # LinusN: if you vote for a simple read: would there still any buffering on the side of the mpeg engine? 23.29.11 # Linus: there are more under-handed ways of contacting techies ...if you get stuck, PLEASE ask 23.29.22 # BC|code: i'll do that 23.29.40 # eg the dma chunks.. 23.29.57 # kurzhaarrocker: the mpeg.c code (today) needs a large consecutive RAM buffer 23.30.35 # that can of course change 23.30.56 # 255464 Oct 22 13:42 FirmwareGmini100_v120.aos 23.30.56 # 253817 Dec 29 23:19 FirmwareGmini100_v120.aos.gz 23.31.48 # the mpeg playing today uses very little CPU (except for the bitswapping) 23.32.13 # thanks to the DMA and the large buffer 23.32.17 # Linus: do you know the valid range for the Stereo seperation registers? 23.32.38 # <[IDC]Dragon> do you set the DMA for the whole lot, or piecewise? 23.32.44 Join Guest [0] (jirc@56.238.62.62.9nanterr1-0-ro-bas-1.9tel.net) 23.32.50 # 8k at a time 23.32.53 # hi 23.33.08 # <[IDC]Dragon> so there is a granularity, good. 23.33.12 # I read on the mailing list that the hd's cache is invalidated when it stops spinning, is that true ? 23.33.25 # hi 23.33.28 Quit Guest (Client Quit) 23.33.48 # linus: 8k !? so where does 7ffff or 80001 come from then? 23.33.48 # BC|code: i assume it's -1 to 0 23.33.49 # <[IDC]Dragon> that was short... 23.33.52 # strange Guest 23.34.07 # probably very shy 23.34.07 # BC|code: where does what? 23.34.26 # Laurent_: yes, the cache is invalidated 23.34.39 # LinusN: D0:7F? Stereo/narrow/wide/mono/etc 23.34.56 # LinusN: isn't there any way to prevent this from happening ? that would help buffering a lot 23.35.45 Join chris [0] (jirc@56.238.62.62.9nanterr1-0-ro-bas-1.9tel.net) 23.35.49 # Laurent_: yes, we can use another powersaving mode, which draws a lot more power 23.35.52 # But it would need power to keep the hd on 23.36.15 # hi 23.36.29 # LinusN: I see, more buffer but less batteries so it's probably better not to do it ? 23.36.33 # Hi! 23.36.45 # hi Chris 23.36.49 # hi 23.36.51 # Laurent_: true, and don't overestimate the importance of the disk cache 23.37.02 # panic 23.37.06 # ata -61 23.37.23 # ??????? 23.37.45 # how many bytes is the memory buffer ? 23.38.01 # where can Isee it? 23.38.46 # chui français 23.38.51 # chris: when do you get it? 23.39.11 # Info in the main menu 23.39.13 # Laurent_: 1.7Mbytes or so 23.39.38 # I got it when i push on 23.40.01 # BC|code: i think the range is -1 to +1 23.40.17 # chris: flashed? 23.40.31 # not flashed 23.40.45 # Im formating the drive 23.40.49 # Linus: how does 0x7FFFF fit that rrange? 23.41.11 # lol! virtual memory! 23.41.18 # Linus: maybe a better example would be 0xC0000 23.41.32 # BC|code: page 23 in the 3587F data sheet 23.42.06 # ahhaa, maybe I have the wrong PDF open 23.43.29 # I d formatted the drive but the register hd drive error came back 23.43.55 # chris: that is very often a battery problem 23.44.16 # I hope so 23.44.44 # Didn't these problems rise somtimes when the battery connecter solder points break? 23.45.05 # yeah 23.45.36 # my problems came when i deleted some files 23.45.59 # could still be a battery problem 23.46.41 # Linus: cheers - wrong data sheet! 23.47.38 # got an idea : let's assume hd's cache is 0.5Mb, proceed so -> read 1.7 Mb into memory in a single run, then read the next 0.5Mb consecutively chunk by chunk into a small buffer (ie don't store it), then power down while keeping the cache valid, as soon as 0.5Mb are played, read them from the cache into memory, then power down completely for 1.7Mb of playing data 23.47.43 # mpeg engine: Would it be reasonable to keep a little queue of maybe 3 or 4 8kb dma chunks in the mpeg engine and the rest of the bufferin has to be done by the source? 23.48.40 # <[IDC]Dragon> I'd say: the source hands buffers to it, period. 23.48.54 # <[IDC]Dragon> The sink eats it up as availabe 23.48.55 # Laurent_: I have no idea wether there is sucha fine control over the cache of the disk 23.48.59 # so, the hd stays in low power mode during 0.5Mb worth of playing data and is off during 1.7Mb worth of playing data, so general consumption is down by a good factor 23.49.03 # <[IDC]Dragon> and passes them back 23.49.09 # Laurent_: that may work, but you don't know how and when and what the HD stores in the cache, and i see lots of complications, like if the user pauses the music when the hd is not powered down 23.49.25 Quit chris ("Leaving") 23.50.28 # and what if it its an 8mb cache? 23.50.41 # [IDC]Dragon: that means that the buffer handling would be done at interrupt time? 23.50.43 # [IDC]Dragon: And the buffer has to be aproppriately granular ? 23.50.48 # I don't know who that user guy is but in every design I ever saw, he's always putting us in trouble ;) 23.50.55 # youd keep the disk up for 6.3mb of time 23.51.19 # <[IDC]Dragon> LinusN: not necessarily, it can be a task 23.51.25 # Laurent_: "Who is General Failure, and why is he reading my drive?" 23.51.45 # lol 23.53.03 # Laurent_: i had that as my email signature for a while, and I later received an answer to that: 23.53.37 # ...He is there to keep Major Problem under control 23.53.38 # "He is the commanding officer of Major Disk Crash, who is the commanding officer of Private Files" 23.53.44 # LOL 23.53.53 # <[IDC]Dragon> the memory doesn't have to be chunked, it could stay one circular buffer as it is today. 23.54.15 # nice one ;) 23.54.16 # <[IDC]Dragon> the sink maintained the read pointer, the source does the write pointer 23.55.44 # hm. ok. I want functions to control the read pointer, too. 23.56.16 # <[IDC]Dragon> depends on if you're a source or sink 23.56.28 # <[IDC]Dragon> kurzhaarrocker: for which use case? 23.56.36 # looping 23.57.08 # I want to be able to tell it: when you arrived here, then jump there 23.57.33 # <[IDC]Dragon> hmm, then you may better work whith chunks 23.57.44 # <[IDC]Dragon> so they can form a linked list 23.58.19 # If we want to beep we could tell the read pointer jumpt to the beep and then continue