--- Log for 29.05.107 Server: pratchett.freenode.net Channel: #rockbox --- Nick: logbot_ Version: Dancer V4.16 Started: 9 days and 18 hours ago 00.00.34 # somebody should buy preglow a gigabeat S :-) 00.00.50 # bah 00.01.03 # even more overkill hardware than the gigabeat f and x 00.01.09 # haha 00.01.13 # boooring 00.01.16 # was just going to ask what you thought of this thing 00.01.37 # still, its pretty cheap 00.01.45 Join Pyromancer [0] (n=Pyromanc@c-24-63-23-50.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) 00.01.54 # Does it have a decent lcd? The f and x don't 00.02.34 Quit stripwax ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") 00.02.35 # they're going around the 100-120 mark on ebay 00.02.56 # * amiconn rather pays more for a decent thing, like the h1x0. 00.03.07 Join sejanis [0] (n=sejanis@209-252-79-236.ip.mcleodusa.net) 00.03.41 Quit linuxstb_ ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") 00.03.45 # http://www.anythingbutipod.com/archives/2006/06/toshiba-gigabeat-s30-s60-review.php 00.03.56 # http://www.anythingbutipod.com/archives/2006/06/toshiba-gigabeat-s30-s60-review.php 00.04.17 # "The screen is a 2.4” QVGA 320 x 240 pixel screen. I would compare the screen to something you would find on the latest Windows Mobile Pocket PC." 00.04.31 # amiconn: sure, me too, but it's also fun with something new 00.04.51 # bluebrother, you still there?? 00.04.56 # still, i hope other players go this way in the future, instead of using proprietrary DSP cores 00.04.58 # saratoga: As far as I'm concerned, most WIndows Mobile devices I've seen have worse screens than the daps I own 00.05.02 # Joely, yup 00.05.10 # http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/RockIR 00.05.12 # saratoga: I'm not interested in high resolution, or colour, or sth like that 00.05.30 # so why not port Rockbox to Windows Mobile and run that on the S? ;-) 00.05.30 # The most important thing is a screen that is readable w/o backlight 00.05.42 # Iriver H10 shows in windows my computer as an "audio device" with no drive letter to load the bootloader and firmware for rockbox, does anyone know a workaround? 00.05.44 # ah, was going to ask what you looked for 00.05.45 # bluebrother, i still have to edit that part of the wiki for a while... 00.05.57 # The only rockbox targets which fulfill that are the non-colour ones, and as I recently learned, ipod video and nano 00.06.14 # sejanis: Don't use MTP mode, you have to be in UMS mode 00.06.30 # I even prefer the archos player screen over any of the other colour screens 00.06.31 # i mostly just keep the player in my pocket anyway, so screens aren't a big deal to me 00.06.32 # Joely, looks like a nice start to read at least. 00.06.58 # there are color screens around which you can read without backlight? 00.07.04 # yes 00.07.05 # my old gameboy had one 00.07.09 # my nano isn't half bad 00.07.09 # wow 00.07.14 # not as good as the h120,but not bad either 00.07.57 # bluebrother: I already knew that there is this kind of colur lcds... and now know that the ipod video and nano fall into this category 00.08.09 # * amiconn has to check the video's display in direct sunlight 00.08.32 # that reminds me, I still think the Nintendo DS would be a fun target, since theres CF and SD card adapters for it, and the dev kit already has GPLed drivers 00.08.33 Quit My_Sic (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 00.08.37 # pointless, but kind of fun 00.08.45 # saratoga: i've been thinking about it too... 00.08.48 # ...a situation where all of H3x0, X5 and my mobile phone become totally unreadable, unlike all my archoses and the H1x0 and ipod mini 00.08.54 Quit sejanis () 00.09.07 # preglow: you pick up a flash cart for one yet? 00.09.28 # saratoga: don't even have one, but it'd be one of the first things i did pick up 00.09.36 # ah 00.09.45 # i jsut got a DS, lovely piece of hardware 00.09.52 # can't believe how much fun they are 00.10.02 # i can, which is why i don't have one 00.10.02 # heh 00.10.14 Part maffe 00.10.23 # gonna try one next weekend 00.10.46 Quit kokeradio () 00.11.05 # yeah there is a very real danger of your life being consumed by the DS 00.11.16 # it really is that much fun, and you can bring it anyway and just play 00.11.20 # really? Hasn't applied to me 00.11.29 Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.) 00.11.34 Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS) 00.11.40 # but maybe that is also caused because I only have this brain jogging cartridge ;-) 00.12.01 Join My_Sic [0] (n=MySic@m180.net81-67-5.noos.fr) 00.12.20 Join maffe [0] (n=maffe@195.159.148.248) 00.12.35 Quit maffe (Remote closed the connection) 00.13.01 Join maffe [0] (n=maffe@195.159.148.248) 00.14.12 Quit jhulst (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 00.14.35 # saratoga: definitely looks like stock ffmpeg has a very decent chance of running on this thing, yes 00.15.20 # what about lame as an encoder :-) 00.15.56 # it has an on-chip mpeg4 encoder 00.15.59 # haha 00.16.08 # guess who has silicon to burn 00.16.33 # brrrr 00.17.09 # i PMed toffe asking if hes had a look at the exploit 00.17.23 # where there any other people with S models who were programmers? 00.17.38 # dunno 00.18.18 # ptw is the main guy 00.18.40 # "main"=the only one for now here :) 00.19.08 # night all 00.19.12 Quit moos ("Glory to Rockbox") 00.19.30 Join Thundercloud [0] (n=thunderc@82.153.38.228) 00.22.29 Quit Daishi ("Client exiting...") 00.23.11 Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC") 00.23.43 # what does 'PANIC Stkov sd' mean? 00.23.49 # stack overflow 00.23.59 # so stack overflow on sd? 00.23.59 # sd? don't know. sansa? 00.24.04 # yeah 00.24.10 # using sd patch? 00.24.23 # yeah, but i don't have an sd card 00.24.37 # That's odd then 00.24.46 Quit BHSPitLappy (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 00.25.09 # The only situation where the sd thread needs signifiant amounts of stack should be a (re)mount of an sd card 00.25.28 # Unless the sd thread does something weird that the mmc thread on ondio doesn't 00.25.34 # amiconn: The internal flash is "sd" too, I think 00.25.41 # At least, I have an sd stack without the sd patch 00.25.46 # well, it didn't exactly happen to me (i don't have a Sansa with me because Sandisk is taking forever...) but it was a problem someone mentioned on ABi (they don't have a microsd card though) 00.25.47 # ah 00.25.49 # Llorean: That doesn't matter, since that can't be hotswapped 00.26.08 # ( http://www.anythingbutipod.com/forum/showthread.php?p=127035#post127089 ) 00.26.25 # chrisjs169: The ABi people should learn to properly interact with the developers of the software, ie coming here and actually reporting bugs properly, I think. 00.26.50 # amiconn: Yes, but could other activities mean a lot of use of the 'disk' stack? 00.26.54 # Llorean: yeah 00.27.13 # The sd thread doesn't do much when no swapping is involved 00.27.27 # Without hotswap, this thread doesn't even exist 00.27.40 # amiconn: I don't have the sd patch installed, I have an sd thread on my sansa at 75% 00.27.51 # oh? 00.27.51 Join Rob222241 [0] (n=Miranda@p54B146DB.dip.t-dialin.net) 00.27.55 Quit lee-qid (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 00.27.59 # * amiconn wonders what it does, then 00.28.06 Join lee-qid_ [0] (n=liqid@p549649CA.dip.t-dialin.net) 00.28.07 Nick lee-qid_ is now known as lee-qid (n=liqid@p549649CA.dip.t-dialin.net) 00.28.11 Quit Pyromancer ("Leaving") 00.28.18 # if Llorean is right about the internal memory being sd based (I believe it is too) then is it possible that could be the cause? 00.28.48 # The ondio internal flash is also mmc based, yet the thread is only necessary to handle hotswap 00.28.59 # It could just be poor naming of a thread. 00.29.21 # hmmmmm 00.29.54 # * amiconn must be cautious with slapping forehead, in case he watches the channel ;) 00.30.00 # chrisjs169: Though as far as I know, the stkov you're talking about doesn't happen to anyone using the official builds 00.30.22 # I know it's certainly never happened on my Sansa 00.30.23 Join pixelma_ [0] (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) 00.30.24 # The thread also handles ata notification... 00.30.46 Quit pixelma (Nick collision from services.) 00.30.47 Nick pixelma_ is now known as pixelma (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) 00.31.20 # * Initializes the plugin. This is called from the main application 00.31.20 # * when the plugin is first loaded. 00.31.21 # Llorean: it's never happened on mine, but being an 'odd' error that someone mentioned, I figured I'd ask and see what it is (I use a custom build with the SD patch, but never have seen it) 00.31.29 Quit My_Sic (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 00.31.44 # petur: on my Ondio's recording screen there is one empty line left now ("worst case line-in recording") 00.32.10 # chrisjs169: Until it happens in SVN builds, it's very likely just a symptom of one of the patches. 00.32.24 # chrisjs169: Meaning it's not a bug anyone here necessarily can fix. 00.32.29 # Llorean: ok 00.32.42 # Especially if you have the SD patch installed. 00.33.03 # pixelma: well it's some time ago since I ran one in the sim, I thought I remembered the display being full 00.33.29 Part landan 00.33.51 # well a bit of info was moved to the status bar some time ago 00.34.22 # (like quality and bitrate) 00.34.50 # s/bitrate/frequency) 00.35.23 Quit Rob2222 (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 00.36.59 Quit austriancoder ("Kopete 0.12.4 : http://kopete.kde.org") 00.39.00 # Llorean: It seems to have happened to another user on ABi as well... 00.39.29 # chrisjs169: Using an unmodified SVN build? 00.39.41 # I'm getting the impression, but they didn't say 00.40.08 # Well, feel free to ask them. 00.40.17 # I did 00.40.19 # But I'm not sure why they're reporting bugs there if they're using official builds. 00.40.32 # * petur gets warned by his h300 that he removed an unenumerated usb device :) 00.41.02 # petur: So, progress? 00.41.04 # Yeah, but I guess they figure it'd be more active there then on Flyspray 00.41.31 # Llorean: yes, the usb stick now flashes twice :) 00.41.53 # chrisjs169: That doesn't make any sense. How's a bug in the official version supposed to get fixed if people don't report it? 00.41.55 # but I only see something happening when I remove it :/ 00.42.11 # petur: Still, somewhat exciting news. :-P 00.42.40 # well I found some time to work on it again :) 00.42.50 # Llorean: I know it doesn't really make sense, but maybe they figure it's common, even though Google shows nothing 00.43.31 # chrisjs169: In the thread you're talking about though, he did say "it was working with sd earlier" (paraphrased) which suggests to me at least that he was using the patch. 00.43.55 Quit ender` (" To get as fewest unhappy people as possible, always bully the same ones.") 00.44.19 Quit Thundercloud_ (Connection timed out) 00.44.26 # Llorean: you're right, must have missed that part *now feels it may indeed be the SD patch* 00.45.44 Join BHSPitLappy [0] (n=steve-o@pool-71-96-209-91.dfw.dsl-w.verizon.net) 00.47.28 Quit z35 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 00.48.24 # chrisjs169: A very quick look at the sd patch tells me why it crashes... and reveals other strangenesses which need to be fixed before it can go into svn 00.50.10 Part krush1704 00.50.19 # (quick == in the range of seconds) 00.50.25 # amiconn: n1s asked me to use the list widget in a patch I made. Everything's done now, but I don't seem to understand the "actions" part. I tried "case ACTION_STD_OK" hoping for the SELECT_BUTTON to trigger that action, but it didn't. can you give me a clue? 00.50.30 Join krush1704 [0] (n=andikrus@p57bb24d8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) 00.51.03 # amiconn: I ask you because apparently, you commited the action.c file :p 00.51.13 # mpeccorini, the button is dependent on the context you are in 00.51.19 # JdGordon is Mr. action 00.51.53 # amiconn: is he around? 00.52.06 # bluebrother: I don't even know what a context is in this case :( 00.52.11 # And btw, select button doesn't tell much w/o mentioning the target 00.52.24 # LOL, you're right, it's an iPod nano 00.52.35 Join jac0b [0] (n=jac0b@user-1120dm5.dsl.mindspring.com) 00.52.43 # so if quick == a few seconds, very quick == ?? I've been away from rockbox for a while, so I can't see why it crashes... 00.53.01 # Joely: ping 00.53.11 # bluebrother: I don't know what a context is but I'm using CONTEXT_LIST ;) 00.53.26 Part jac0b 00.53.27 # mpeccorini, that page might be helpful: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/ButtonActionIdea 00.53.43 # might be outdated, but at least it has some text about it ;-) 00.53.45 Join jac0b [0] (n=jac0b@user-1120dm5.dsl.mindspring.com) 00.53.53 # chrisjs169: Stack is too small as the sd stack has to handle remounts with hotswap 00.54.10 # Compare ata-e200.c with ata-mmc.c ... 00.54.16 # amiconn: ok 00.54.17 # bluebrother: thanks 00.54.18 Join Thundercloud_ [0] (n=thunderc@82.152.175.70) 00.54.24 # The sd patch doesn't change this 00.55.22 # disk_mount needs quite a bit of stack 00.55.55 # The other strangeness is that the sd patch replicates the 'remove card...' behaviour of the Ondio 00.56.31 # That's not desired behaviour, it's a technical shortcoming on the Ondio that doesn't apply to the Sansa afaik 00.56.32 # hey scorche 00.57.56 # Joely: see PM 00.58.15 # does anyone in here know this debugger? http://www.amontec.com/jtagkey-tiny.shtml 00.58.26 # I am getting an error when I "make" my build with the hotswap patch 00.58.33 # make[1]: *** No rule to make target `export/hotswap.h', needed by `/home/jacob/r 00.58.33 # ockbox/build/firmware/common/disk.o'. Stop. 00.58.33 # make: *** [build] Error 2 01.00.01 # Bagder: ping 01.00.11 # can someone help? 01.01.45 # jac0b, export/hotswap.h is probably included in another file and is not in the -I path in the makefile for that file 01.02.30 # so do I need to change the make file 01.02.30 # jac0b so make tries to compile it by itself and obviously doesn't find a rule to "create" a .h 01.02.55 # yes, you need to add a new -I including the folder where "export" is 01.03.12 # or change the #include to point to the file 01.03.47 # * amiconn thinks that just a full rebuild might help, that regenerates the dep- files 01.03.53 # * dep-* 01.06.57 Part Domonoky_ 01.09.01 Join Llorea1 [0] (n=Llorean@cpe-70-113-91-140.austin.res.rr.com) 01.09.14 Quit Llorean (Nick collision from services.) 01.09.16 Nick Llorea1 is now known as Llorean (n=Llorean@cpe-70-113-91-140.austin.res.rr.com) 01.11.53 Quit Thundercloud (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 01.12.35 # mpeccorini: I can't find a hotswap.h only a hotswap.o 01.13.36 Join major_works [0] (n=a08e9562@gw01.penton.com) 01.13.52 # jac0b: I ran into the same problem earlier today. 01.14.09 # When the patch was reposted a couple of days ago, a bunch of stuff was omitted from it. 01.14.40 # You need to compare the latest version to the version before and paste back in the stuff that's missing in the new version. 01.14.45 # major_works: the one posted from today 01.14.55 # Yes. 01.15.22 # okay so I need to merge the 2 files togther 01.15.30 # Basically, that's right. 01.15.46 # how is that done? 01.15.54 # It patched and compiled fine for me after I did so. 01.16.52 # Open both versions of the patch in separate Wordpad windows and compare them section by section. 01.17.22 # Use the new one as your final version and paste in the stuff from the older one that's missing. 01.17.29 # Then patch with that file. 01.18.15 # * petur updated his usbotg page. No big breakthrough yet :( 01.18.29 Quit petur ("Zzzzz") 01.18.46 # jac0b: OK? Capische? 01.19.52 Join isaac_w [0] (n=isaac@bzq-82-81-16-49.red.bezeqint.net) 01.20.31 Join donutman25 [0] (n=chatzill@24.244.160.233) 01.20.48 # * Nico_P is hoping for a (small) green delta 01.21.40 Join My_Sic [0] (n=MySic@m180.net81-67-5.noos.fr) 01.21.52 Quit My_Sic (Client Quit) 01.22.49 # Nico_P: what, but that _was_ worth implementing? :P 01.23.25 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 01.23.29 Quit major_works ("major_works has left the building...") 01.23.32 # moving cuesheets into a different folder removes clutter? 01.23.49 # bluebrother: from the file browser, yes 01.24.04 # Why not just make cuesheets not a supported filetype? 01.24.09 # I know I could just have display set to music instead of all 01.24.10 # I tend to disagree ... 01.24.22 # linuxstb was faster -- just wanted to say the same 01.24.26 # linuxstb: because there are supported 01.24.34 # s/there/they 01.24.42 # I know there's a cuesheet viewers, but I can't see the point in that either... 01.24.53 # ^viewer 01.25.18 # There are other filetypes in rockbox which are supported in a way but not included in the 'supported' view 01.25.25 # ...e.g. the .talk files 01.25.37 # There's somewhat of a history of providing a folder for storing "supplemental" files in Rockbox already 01.25.43 # Specifically the playlist folder for the catalog 01.25.49 # well at least part of my commit is useful : the duplicate code removal 01.26.17 # if really everyone is against the other part I'll remove it 01.26.24 # but I don't see how it hurts anyone 01.26.35 # i can tell you of one cuesheet feature you can replace it with :> 01.27.18 # Nico_P: well first - some yellow 01.27.26 # silly me 01.27.27 # cuesheets are overrated anyway :-p 01.27.31 # i'd rather keep the cuesheet handling simple myself, though, if you ask me it isn't really logical to look for cuesheets any other place than in the dir where the audio track is 01.27.57 # It's not logical to look for cuesheets at all :P 01.28.22 # heh 01.28.27 # * Llorean finds the FmPresets pages have become ridiculously complex. 01.28.43 # haha I see cuesheet support is probably rockbox's most mocked feature :) 01.29.02 # * amiconn rather uses --nogap on hwcodec than using cuesheets 01.29.05 # I never understood what cuesheets are good for on a dap 01.29.17 # Nico_P: Yes, but I've also forum posts where people say how much they like cuesheet support... 01.29.23 # Llorean: any idea to make them better? 01.29.34 # bluebrother: Simply so people can play the same files everywhere. 01.29.35 # Llorean, maybe something similar to rockbox-themes for fm presets? 01.29.41 # pixelma: Well, it's all the individual .zip files, mainly 01.30.01 # Someone adding a .fmr file is required to update many files, rather than just adding his text update to the page, then updating the one "total" .zip. 01.30.10 # bluebrother: now I can listen to chaptered podcasts in a nice way 01.30.13 # It really doesn't need all the divisions it's given, I think. 01.30.13 # and a script could generate the zip file on the fly 01.30.15 # (especially now that I have a nice automating transcoding script) :) 01.30.18 # i think cuesheet support is great 01.30.21 # bluebrother: A script would make it even easier, yes. 01.30.29 # it even turned out better than i expected 01.30.38 Quit lee-qid (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 01.30.39 # Llorean: s/he he can start by just uploading the .fmr 01.30.43 # Yeah 01.30.47 # I might even be interested in looking into it. When I manage to finish this uni stuff :o 01.30.48 # preglow: how's that ? 01.31.26 # pixelma: I just think the process should be simple: 1) Download the complete .zip. 2) Add your FMR to the appropriate place. 3) Go to the corresponding wiki page for the .fmr and upload it, then overwrite the complete .zip 01.31.41 # Instead we may often have a "USA" zip that contains presets the complete one doesn't, or vice versa. 01.31.45 # There's even a Texas zip. 01.31.48 # major_works: sorry its my g/f's b-day had to cut the cake, but thanks for the help 01.31.56 # Llorean: I just wanted them to state when it was uploaded so someone knows that this specific fmr might not be included in the zip 01.32.07 # Llorean, I would prefer to be able downloading individual files 01.32.09 # having nothing else to do, I was looking at the sd stack overflow problem, and noticed that there's also a mmc_stack in addition to sd_stack. what's the difference? 01.32.18 # bluebrother: Downloading individual .fmr files should be fine. 01.32.22 # bluebrother: But I don't like regional compilations. 01.32.32 # Unless they're automatically updated on .fmr upload 01.32.39 # so, I think it would be best to automate that. 01.32.51 # Nico_P: seeking performed better than i would have thought 01.33.09 # preglow: in speed or precision ? 01.33.18 # bluebrother: Automation would make me just as happy. 01.33.18 # either update compilations on file upload, or (that is a bit more what I'm thinking of) give the user a list with all files and let him tick those he wants. 01.33.24 # Llorean: the main concern was just that the list(s) got very long 01.33.26 # and then generate a zip file with all those files on the fly 01.33.36 # pixelma: I'm all for dividing the pages up so it's readable. 01.33.41 Quit PaulJam (".") 01.34.04 # pixelma: As I said, the only thing that makes me unhappy is that there are multiple .zip files that may or may not be in sync. 01.34.05 Quit Thundercloud_ (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 01.34.23 # * bluebrother puts a note to his todo list 01.34.27 # One .zip file was already iffy enough, I thought, because an upload date just tells you when the last person added to it, not whether it's actually complete relative to the full list. 01.34.40 # * linuxstb wonders why people seem to be abbreviating place names to 8 characters in the FM presets 01.34.57 # man, will I ever get able cutting down that list before I'm really old? 01.34.59 # surely I can understand that 01.34.59 # Nico_P: precision 01.35.16 # :) 01.35.25 # well that's not my code anyway... it's all in the codecs 01.35.43 # Nico_P: I still get annoyed by the cue-sheet specific seeking behaviour though - i.e. not seeking back to the start of the current track when pressing PREV. 01.35.49 # but I'm pleased you like it... funny how some people love it and other hate it 01.35.58 # Nico_P: how is it possible to hate it? 01.36.03 # it's not even intrusive 01.36.08 # linuxstb: guess most of it was my fault (still working from the assumption that they aren't allowed to be longer) :/ 01.36.12 # preglow: ask amiconn:) 01.36.26 # linuxstb: I am too but I really didn't find how to do it the right way 01.36.27 # Nico_P: he hates cuesheets, not the cuesheet support 01.36.45 # pixelma: Perhaps the whole problem is more related to the fact that it's not manageable at all, anyway. =/ 01.36.48 # if you don't like cuesheets, i assume you keep the feature switched off 01.37.03 # linuxstb: the problem is mainly with VBR MP3 I think 01.37.12 # i'd just like it to be always on and remove the setting 01.37.14 # preglow: 100% agreed 01.37.42 # 100% disagreed 01.37.47 # linuxstb: The wiki page actually says "(the name must be less than 8 characters long)" 01.38.01 # A waste of ram for no good... cuesheets are flawed by design 01.38.08 # sure 01.38.16 # Llorean: that's outdated 01.38.17 # amiconn: I agreed on the "if you don't like cuesheets, i assume you keep the feature switched off" 01.38.18 # still doesn't prevent the fact that a lot of them exists 01.38.34 # mp3 is also quite old and crummy, better codecs exist now 01.38.40 # so we should remove support, right? 01.38.42 # Of course 01.38.43 # waste of good ram 01.38.58 # Remove support for "until the patent climate becomes less hostile to those using MP3 technology" 01.39.44 # preglow: I don't say the feature should be removed... but the option to disable it has to stay 01.40.02 # pft, what is an extra disk access these days anyway ;) 01.40.32 # Still, I haven't seen any cuesheets in the wild, only temporary ones (for ripping cds), and the one I created deliberately for testing the feature on archos 01.40.49 # i've seen plenty, lots of people still don't know better 01.41.12 # I've often seen CDs distributed as a single FLAC/wavpack/whatever file with a cuesheet 01.41.35 Quit bluebrother ("Leaving") 01.41.40 # rather annoying, the first thing I usually do with it is to cut it up 01.41.40 # yeap 01.41.43 # amiconn: I have now found a way to extract a cuesheet from a chaptered MP4 podcast... that's at least one major use I will have until real chapter support arrives (if it does one day) 01.41.48 # amiconn: why are cuesheets flawed by design, btw? 01.42.00 Quit robin0800 (" HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Nine out of ten l33t h4x0rz prefer it") 01.42.01 # I would never dream of cutting a podcast 01.42.05 # what's the difference between sd_stack and mcc_stack? 01.42.05 # too much of a hassle 01.42.19 # ah, yeah, something like a podcast is different, I guess 01.42.29 # Nico_P: Do you have any links to chaptered mp4 files I could download? 01.42.39 # i don't want to cut anything, i want rockbox to be able to listen to my music as it is 01.42.49 # if i have to pre-process anything, rockbox is wasting my time 01.43.02 # preglow: Why shoudl I concatenate separate tracks and the have a list where the split points should be, rather than having the tracks separate as they should be 01.43.05 # linuxstb: sure. http://nicolas.pennequin.free.fr/rockbox/dancin-2007-01-06_51.53.m4b 01.43.18 # you might not like the music though :) 01.43.18 # Also, a bunch of smaller files is easier to handle than a single giant one 01.43.38 # amiconn: that's a matter of preference, some people would say they prefer fewer files to many 01.43.49 # Nico_P: It's OK, I don't plan on listening to it... ;) 01.43.52 # amiconn: in the case of a podcast, the tracks are concatenated to begin with 01.43.53 # Something like chapter marks _in_ the file make some sense... though not with music either 01.44.27 # linuxstb: today I wrote a program to extract the chapters as a cuesheet 01.45.01 # Why extract them, why not just read them in Rockbox? 01.45.03 # Nico_P: Could that just be incorporated into an interaction between the metadata parser and cuesheet handling without an intermediary file? 01.45.19 # amiconn: it depends, some might say one cd "belongs" in one file 01.45.40 # amiconn: and stuff like dj sets also fit logically in one file 01.45.41 # Llorean: I'd love that but my program actually uses an other one that outputs an SRT file and then parses the SRT to a CUE 01.45.50 # while track info might still be nice 01.45.56 # preglow: Then the metadata would belong there as well, and not in a separate file 01.46.01 # Nico_P: I'm guessing the SRT one isn't GPL then. 01.46.21 # amiconn: agreed, but i believe that qualifies more as "impractical" than "flawed by design" 01.46.24 # Llorean: not sure... it's open source though : MP4Box from GPAC 01.46.45 # I'll have a look at it 01.47.41 # Nico_P: LGPL 01.47.56 # At least, GPAC is described as that at their official site. 01.48.52 # Llorean: then MP4Box is too 01.49.41 Join TrueJournals [0] (n=aimjourn@c-24-12-147-61.hsd1.il.comcast.net) 01.53.16 Quit grndslm ("Leaving") 01.55.24 Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@c-71-205-0-132.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) 01.56.11 # bedtime 01.57.13 Part isaac_w 01.59.54 # Nico_P: Does that example m4b file do chapters the Apple way or the Standard way? 02.00.06 # linuxstb: the Apple way 02.00.13 Quit amigan (Connection timed out) 02.00.34 # Nico_P: So you think mp4box can read Apple chapters, but not write them? 02.00.43 # that's it 02.01.16 # but I don't have an iPod or iTunes to check that 02.02.10 # and actually I think there's no real standard way of doing chapters in MP4 02.02.31 # If we're going to add support for chaptered MP4, perhaps we should fix the long standing "MP4s over a certain size don't play" issue 02.02.48 # If it's even fixable. 02.03.08 # * Llorean doesn't remember ever quite being told what caused it. 02.04.26 Part TrueJournals 02.07.16 # that would be a good question for Lear 02.08.07 # Right now if I stumble across a long AAC format file, it's always spoken word anyway, so I convert it to speex first, and just be done with it. 02.08.16 # Nico_P: Are you sure they're chapters? They just look like subtitles - SRT is a subtitle format... 02.08.41 # Llorean: mine are music 02.08.59 # linuxstb: you're right. they seem to be only subtitles 02.09.05 # but there are also pictures 02.09.25 # maybe adding an SRT track would be enough 02.10.00 Part pixelma 02.12.38 # Nico_P: Have you tried playing that file in Rockbox? 02.12.49 # it plays nicely 02.15.31 Quit BHSPitLappy ("Leaving") 02.15.56 # the cuesheet I got from it seems to be screwed up though 02.16.05 # og I know why 02.16.21 Join Shak- [0] (n=shak@adsl-18-110-188.sdf.bellsouth.net) 02.16.43 # rockbox thinks it's half as long as it actually is, because of the frequency 02.17.05 # I thought Lear fixed that recently? 02.17.33 # he fixed the playback speed but apparently there are still a few issues left 02.18.15 # how come theres no feature chart for the sansa e200 series on the rockbox site? 02.18.19 # linuxstb: if you want I can give you links to files that don't have that problem 02.18.27 Part krush1704 02.18.58 # Nico_P: No, that's OK. 02.19.29 # Shak-: Because nobody's updated the page, and not all hardware features are implemented yet (no FM Radio, no SD slot, etc) 02.19.44 # Shak-: Assuming you're talking about the feature comparison table, it's not updated often these days 02.20.09 # ah 02.20.40 # Basically, it existed because there was a good deal of difference between what the H100 and the Archos could do under Rockbox, I believe. 02.21.02 # Nowadays, most software codec players are pretty much the same other than a few general rules like "If it doesn't have a radio chip, it can't do radio" 02.21.03 # It compares rockbox vs. of 02.23.06 # Not many people can update that, as it requires knowledge about what the of can do 02.23.25 # * amiconn couldn't even update the comparison table for some of the targets he has 02.24.09 Join jchord [0] (n=jchord@d39-86-63.home1.cgocable.net) 02.24.37 # Nico_P: Looking at that m4b file in hex editor, it seems full of all kinds of rubbish - xml files, pngs, jpegs, ... But it seems that the chapter information (at least the track titles) is multiplexed within the file, not neatly at the start. So reading it in Rockbox may not be very efficient. 02.24.41 # I think dropping the OF comparison aspect of it from the list entirely may be useful. Instead just a comparison of what various players can do under Rockbox 02.24.54 # is rockbox the only effort for new firmware on media players (besides ipodlinux for the ipods) 02.25.44 # Llorean: I don't agree. That would remove the main point of the chart, and would just convert it into a rockbox feature list 02.25.57 # linuxstb: yes, I read that somewhere about AtomicParsley: it would require a muxer/demuxer to be able to read/write this kind of chapter info 02.25.58 # Shak-: There's the archopen project for the newer Archos devices. 02.26.48 # Nico_P: If Rockbox can play the file, then it must contain demuxing code. 02.27.12 # linuxstb: yes, so maybe it would be possible to demux the SRT with not too much code 02.27.16 # So that would be a start - you would then need to change it to demux the subtitle stream instead of the audio stream. 02.27.38 # Although the demux code will be in the codec, not in the core (get_metadata) where it's needed for chapter parsing. 02.28.43 # is the iriver clix on the to-do list at all for iriver devices? 02.29.37 # There is no to-do list for targets 02.30.29 Join hanaurimasume [0] (n=karma@c-67-170-136-42.hsd1.or.comcast.net) 02.30.31 # do you have it in mind, rather 02.30.44 # Shak-: no rockbox developer owns it 02.31.02 # and no owner has manifested the desire to port rockbox on it 02.31.03 # ah 02.31.17 # not that I know of at least 02.31.37 # do the rockbox developers get media player donations? 02.33.01 # A lot of the money donated to Rockbox is used to buy hardware. 02.34.04 # I think some people/companies have donated hardware - e.g. Sandisk donated a couple of Sansas. 02.35.00 # now I am getting a different error on the sd-card patch 02.35.03 # patch: **** malformed patch at line 111: @@ -1208,6 +1208,9 @@ 02.35.21 # should I change the 1208,9 to 1208,6 02.35.47 # jac0b which patch is it? 02.36.20 # the sd-card patch 02.36.31 Quit jchord () 02.36.31 # linuxstb: maybe a wiki page about MP4 chapters could be nice 02.36.50 # jac0b, url? i meant 02.36.51 # major_works said to compare the old and new diff files and paste the changes to the new one 02.37.10 # joely: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7134 02.37.10 # Nico_P: Yes, although I don't use mp4 for anything... 02.38.06 # maybe I'll have a go at it tomorrow and upload my tools to it 02.38.16 # with the information I found today 02.39.41 Join krush1704 [0] (n=andikrus@p57BB24D8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) 02.39.45 Part krush1704 02.39.47 # Nico_P: And some links to freely downloadable podcasts using such chapters could be useful as well. 02.40.02 # good idea 02.40.13 # I think atomicparsley has some example files 02.40.29 # who/what/where is atomicparsley? 02.40.52 # * linuxstb got an answer from google 02.41.06 # http://atomicparsley.sourceforge.net/ 02.41.09 # ok :) 02.41.23 # it's dedicated to iTunes tags 02.42.10 # and it has example files : http://atomicparsley.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/atomicparsley/trunk/samples/ 02.42.36 # what does "(Stripping trailing CRs from patch.)" mean? 02.42.57 # jac0b: that means your patch had windows-style line endings 02.42.59 Quit kennethd (Remote closed the connection) 02.43.03 # and patch likes linux-style line endings 02.43.11 # its no problem right 02.43.36 # apparently not, but it's better to have your patch files linux-style 02.43.50 # oh okay 02.43.51 # actually it's "unix-style" 02.44.37 # joely: did you check out the diff's 02.45.17 # yes....i still don't see what's the problem... 02.45.22 # what are you trying to do? 02.45.24 Quit Nico_P ("bed time") 02.45.35 Join webguest43 [0] (i=18976e30@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-1a16a9604fc2555d) 02.45.36 # patch the current build with the sd-card patch 02.45.43 # look at line 103 02.45.46 # ok 02.46.00 # opps 111 02.46.08 # that is where the problem is 02.46.19 # it went perfectly 02.46.30 # wait 02.46.36 # sd? or hotswap? 02.46.56 # hotswap includes sd i think 02.47.12 # yeah I think so 02.47.13 Join rushfan [0] (n=rushfan@adsl-65-43-145-147.dsl.bcvloh.ameritech.net) 02.47.20 # How do I completely erase my database and rebuild it? 02.47.25 # http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7134?getfile=13997 02.48.15 # jac0b are you on windows? 02.48.24 Quit webguest43 (Client Quit) 02.48.24 # yep 02.48.36 # using cygwin or native utils to patch? 02.48.41 # supposing selecting initialize now should do that but it didnt work for me 02.49.09 # rushfan: What do you mean by "it didn't work" exactly? 02.49.10 # that is what I am using is cygwin 02.50.08 # use wget to download http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7134?getfile=13997 then from cygwin 02.50.11 # Llorean: It added the new songs. But didnt erase the ones I deleted 02.50.32 # rushfan: And what happens when you try to play one of the deleted songs, exactly? 02.50.39 # It says No File! 02.51.11 # Usually when you "Initialize Now" if old songs show back up after the reboot, and the commit, that means they're in the recycle bin. 02.51.21 # recycle bin? 02.51.25 # After "Initialize Now", did you shut down the device, turn it back on, and see "Committing" 02.51.32 # no 02.51.34 # Recycle Bin, Trash Can, or some form of undelete hidden folder. 02.51.35 # should I shut it down after? 02.51.41 # Yes. 02.51.56 # Initializing requires you restart to commit the first time, and re-initializing has the same requirements 02.52.07 # You're probably looking at the old database, still loaded to RAM if you enabled that. 02.52.36 # thank you. Now its rebuilding the database :D 02.52.40 # Ill remember that next time around 02.53.41 Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.) 02.53.44 Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS) 02.54.22 Part rushfan 02.56.20 # joely: didn't work either 02.56.35 # how are you patching? 02.56.51 # patch -p0 < hotswap.patch 02.57.01 # yep 02.57.05 # hotswap.diff 02.57.16 # yeah, i just renamed it 02.57.17 # haha 02.57.27 # it fails on "make" 02.57.47 # did you _just_ sync with svn? 02.57.51 # check your revision 02.58.01 # i'm at 13509 02.58.08 # 13509 02.59.03 # hmm do you think it's a thing with cygwin? 03.01.49 # how do I rename in linux/cygwin again 03.02.01 # you could use mv 03.02.18 # or rename 03.02.59 # I am trying it with just cygwin 03.03.39 # b/c before I used wget but renamed the file with windows 03.03.44 # if you want i can build you a rockbox build...if you want to trust me. otherwise i guess i can just set up a native windows compiling env with patch and all the standard utils... 03.03.54 # nope still get the error 03.04.07 # make[1]: *** No rule to make target `export/hotswap.h', needed by `/home/jacob/r 03.04.07 # ockbox/build/firmware/common/disk.o'. Stop. 03.04.07 # make: *** [build] Error 2 03.05.53 # that is the same one I got before and major_works said I need to merge http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7134?getfile=13997 & http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7134?getfile=13990 03.06.05 # to get it to work 03.06.24 # why do you need both? 03.06.55 Join major_works [0] (n=a08e9562@gw01.penton.com) 03.07.17 # jac0b: Are you sure you got all the missing bits from the older version into the newer one? 03.07.43 # One of the missing bits, IIRC, was hotswap.h in total. 03.08.33 # Make sure there's a hunk in your combined hotswap.diff file labeled hotswap.h. 03.09.30 Join Daishi [0] (n=daishi@ool-18be2884.dyn.optonline.net) 03.10.30 # http://www.divshare.com/download/767239-9fe there is the merged hotswap.diff file 03.10.40 # I am pretty sure I got everything 03.11.25 # sorry but I have to go (get ready for dreded work) 03.12.09 # I will have to pick up on this tomorrow, but thanks everyone for the help 03.13.03 # PM me on ABi tomorrow and tell me where I can send you my version of the patch. 03.13.51 # jacbrooksATgmailDOTcom 03.13.58 # thanks major_works 03.14.00 Join entheh [0] (n=purr@88-106-131-125.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) 03.14.19 # OK, I'll send it now. Don't know if it'll help but you may as well try it. 03.14.27 # It worked for me twice now. 03.15.12 Quit major_works ("major_works has left the building...") 03.19.22 Join aliask [0] (n=chatzill@c210-49-190-113.eburwd8.vic.optusnet.com.au) 03.23.29 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 03.31.33 # also was hotswap-target.h and hotswap.c.... 03.31.39 # oh wait, he left, d'oh 03.33.06 Quit jac0b () 03.34.23 # does the 8 character-long limitation exist on settings that require a path for files? (e.g fm presets, setting files etc.) 03.35.24 # because the part on that says not longer than 8 characters name on the FmPresets wiki page was written by me. At the time all those files should be less than 8 characters in order for rockbox to remember them on the next boot 03.36.04 # but at that time the default settings file was written on a special disk sector instead of a simple file 03.36.59 # so for sector capacity reasons the path to those files was not stored on te settings file (.cfg) 03.37.22 # I should probably test it my self 03.37.51 Join z35 [0] (n=z@adsl-1-20-4.dab.bellsouth.net) 03.38.39 Quit element_g (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 03.42.48 # well at least on radio level the limitation still applies, if you want the preset to be remembered after boot, it must be saved on the /.rockbox/fmpresets directory 03.43.01 # I am not sure though if that limitation exists anymore on the saving of the configuration file 03.43.27 Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.) 03.43.33 Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS) 03.43.40 Join kubiix [0] (n=Miranda@mos-81-27-201-28.karneval.cz) 03.48.47 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection) 03.52.12 Join JdGordon [0] (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 03.53.28 Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.) 03.53.34 Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS) 03.53.57 # http://phpfi.com/237769?download <-- is that what major_works and jac0b were looking for? 03.54.15 # that patches fine for me 03.54.32 # has all the needed files.. 03.55.25 Join Soap2 [0] (i=41bd808d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-2ae57366f76f7412) 03.55.50 # scorche - thanks for the added !s to the wiki 03.57.26 # ah oops, i'm still working on what i added...sorry about that :-/ 04.03.54 Quit Soap2 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 04.06.29 Join amigan [0] (i=dcp1990@unaffiliated/amigan) 04.09.27 Quit gtkspert (Remote closed the connection) 04.10.26 Join gtkspert [0] (n=gtkspert@gateless.info) 04.19.39 Quit maffe (Remote closed the connection) 04.21.10 Join sando [0] (i=lolsteam@124-254-76-41-static-dsl.ispone.net.au) 04.25.01 Part Joely 04.28.04 Join lucaslucas [0] (n=lucasgeo@189.146.51.134) 04.28.54 Quit lucaslucas (Client Quit) 04.29.48 Join j1mc [0] (n=j1mc@adsl-75-21-84-11.dsl.chcgil.sbcglobal.net) 04.39.05 Quit entheh ("^~") 04.44.00 Quit donutman25 ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.3/2007030919]") 04.52.37 Join Joely [0] (n=joel@adsl-71-147-42-12.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) 04.56.57 # any recording addits here? 04.57.00 # addicts* 04.57.22 # and of course, by addict, I mean anyone who actually uses the recording stuff.... 05.17.31 # JdGordon, just ask your question... ;) 05.17.33 # heh 05.23.32 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 05.25.45 Quit amigan (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 05.26.29 Quit jurrie ("Leaving") 05.29.07 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 05.29.22 Quit Bawitdaba (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 05.29.31 Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (n=hihi@p54BF70CC.dip.t-dialin.net) 05.31.04 Quit Daishi (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 05.37.05 Quit gtkspert (Remote closed the connection) 05.37.20 Join chainlynx [0] (n=dannyc@c-24-23-194-98.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) 05.38.02 Join gtkspert [0] (n=gtkspert@gateless.info) 05.44.51 Quit relaxed (Remote closed the connection) 05.52.20 Quit sando ("Apply directly to the forehead") 05.59.41 Quit j1mc ("Leaving") 06.05.37 Quit alienbiker99 ("( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: www.XLhost.de )") 06.27.13 # BHSPitMonkey: :p 06.27.23 # anyone wanna test a patch for the rec code? 06.28.57 Join alienbiker99 [0] (n=alienbik@ool-44c126d4.dyn.optonline.net) 06.30.11 Quit Shak- () 06.33.47 Join corevette [0] (n=corevett@adsl-75-35-79-86.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) 06.34.51 # me me!!! 06.34.57 # sansa right? 06.35.12 # hehe no, not enablin recordin on the sansa 06.35.32 # aww 06.36.03 # what's it for then? 06.36.12 # surprise :) 06.36.26 # commitintg it anyway seen as its so small and works :p 06.38.00 Quit jhulst (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 06.54.37 Join RMenes379 [0] (n=viewtifu@ool-4351bd58.dyn.optonline.net) 06.55.18 # Hello there! 06.56.38 # Someone around? 06.56.59 # yeps 06.57.48 # I just registered on the Rockbox Wiki to do some editing and contribution. 06.58.06 # I've been planning to do that too 06.58.07 # hey RMenes379 06.58.16 # for a couple of days at least ;) 06.59.05 # Mine's longer term than that. 06.59.17 # Mine's for as long as I'm using Rockbox. 06.59.24 # Which will be for a good long time. 06.59.36 # I don't have a supported player, so.. :) 06.59.48 # What are you using? 06.59.56 # iriver S10 07.00.28 # Have you tried to look for any technical information about the player? 07.00.39 # Perhaps you can help jump start a new port for it. 07.00.43 # I've found pictures of the interior 07.00.53 # that's what I was planning on posting 07.02.02 # Wait... the iriver S10... which one is that one? 07.02.07 # I haven't seen that model. 07.02.09 # tiny 2GB player 07.02.13 # quite new 07.02.27 # oh that one, thats really small 07.02.32 # http://images.enet.com.cn/cimg/2006/1221/c_1166694960_2.jpg 07.02.34 # yeah 07.02.51 # The only irivers that I've seen up close are the H120 and H320. 07.02.57 # But that's what I want to post. 07.03.12 # i miss my H120 07.03.14 # My girlfriend gave me her FM presets from her iriver H320 for the New York City region. 07.03.44 # And I want to post it to the wiki, seeing that the only two regions posted for New York are both upstate. 07.04.28 # ahh I found the pics again :) 07.04.43 # RMenes379 what stations? 07.04.59 # I dunno how to start anything at the wiki tho 07.05.11 # I suck at formulating stuff like that 07.05.13 # All of the major stations from New York City and surrounding regions. 07.05.37 # i listen to some NYC stations, less now, i live in central jersey so i get a lot of stations 07.06.21 # But isn't that a pain? I mean, whenever I travel across Jersey, right around halfway through the state I lose the NYC stations and start receiving the Philadelphia stations. 07.06.40 # A pain, it is! 07.07.16 # it depends, it gets annoying but i dont travel to south jersey a lot but when i do usually just play stuff from my mp3 player 07.07.44 Join XbooX [0] (n=xboox04@206.186.45.240) 07.08.16 # i didnt even know there was a fm preset page on the wiki 07.08.38 # You can reach it via the Extras menu. 07.08.50 # At the bottom. 07.09.54 # on the wiki or in rockbox? 07.10.28 # From the main Rockbox page, pick the "Extras" on the sidebar, then scroll to the bottom of the page, and you'll see the link to the FM Presets. 07.10.50 # oh ah isee 07.11.04 # i killed my H120 =( and my H320 battery is dead 07.11.14 # ballooned on me 07.12.08 # A shame, that is. The irivers are some great little devices. 07.12.09 # ballooned? 07.12.25 # Did he blow it up like a beautiful balloon? :) 07.12.29 # there's two things I don't like with this S10 07.12.34 # small things tho 07.12.37 # hahah its like internally explodes sorta 07.13.01 # What's bad about the S10? 07.13.13 # hey all, I have a fourth-generation (grayscale) ipod and I'm installing rockbox for the first time... I've downloaded and installed the current build for my platform, but I don't (think) I have the fonts package installed yet... I've downloaded the fonts zip file but the docs don't say where to put it on the iPod... does anyone know where I'm supposed to stick the fonts files? 07.13.18 # they use some weirdo playlist format, and not m3u/pls.. and they don't turn off completely, they just go down in "powesave mode" 07.13.18 # its a replacement battery and most of them balloon, but im in the process of tryingto find a working motherboard for the H120 07.13.30 # Zider pls or plp? 07.13.35 # .pla 07.13.54 # ah thats what i meant, yeah its what they use on MTP devices 07.14.00 # chainlynx: Open the fonts zip file, and just extract that folder to the root of your device. 07.14.10 # and it's a really dumb format too 07.14.19 # I hacked up a script to create playlists 07.14.38 # and it really only started going to sleep mode with the H10 ...trying to be ipod like 07.15.03 # it CAN be turned off completely.. but you need to access the reset button for that :P 07.15.11 # Zider, ive been looking for a script for my gigabeat, but trying to find one that doesnt copy the song a second time 07.15.15 # I'm nagging them for a setting for ut ;) 07.15.22 # it 07.15.55 # I never liked that sleep mode with the iPod. 07.15.59 # RMenes379: ah, ok, as simple as that... thanks 07.16.09 # I never liked iPods ;) 07.16.21 # But Rockbox makes them all the better. 07.16.34 # they're still ugly 07.16.45 # and all Appley 07.16.53 # and HUGE ;) 07.17.02 # Would you rather... a ZUNE?? *BUM BUM BUUUUUUM* 07.17.07 # a what? 07.17.15 # My thoughts exactly. 07.17.19 # they just passed a million sold, didn't they? 07.17.32 # eww, a microsoft thing :P 07.17.34 # this is a bit offtopic.. 07.17.39 # and even huger 07.17.55 # they really arent bad 07.18.01 # At least Apple's less evil. 07.18.13 # * scorche coughs 07.18.23 # oh if somebody has a wiki account can they please change the note on the buyersguide about the 80gb not being compatible with rockbox 07.18.37 # scorche: we're not supposed to talk about mp3 players..? 07.18.43 # I need permission to write to the wiki. 07.18.53 # That's what I came for in the first place. 07.18.57 # Zider: you are supposed to talk about rockbox 07.19.03 # this isnt a social channel 07.19.16 # scorche: sorry then :P 07.20.38 # alienbiker99: done, but someone else will have to put it on the table 07.22.02 # RMenes379: what were you planning on editing? 07.22.18 # My girlfriend gave me her FM presets from her iriver H320. 07.22.37 # and what is your wikiname? 07.22.44 # She and I live in the New York City area, so the presets are for this region and surrounding areas. 07.22.46 # RobertMenes 07.22.53 # ok i would but no ipod for me =D 07.23.34 # RMenes379: done 07.23.35 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 07.24.06 # Okay, so how to I upload the .fmr? 07.24.47 # Wait... found it. 07.24.58 # I'll be right back. 07.26.32 # I attached the .fmr to the wiki, but I think something's off. 07.27.46 # scorche: Can you see if it looks correct? 07.30.10 # Actually, before I leave, I wanted to ask one question to any Rockboxers in New York City with FM radio targets. 07.31.16 # Can any of you receive 100.3 Mhz (Z100) clearly on your players? 07.33.20 Quit corevette (Remote closed the connection) 07.36.43 Quit RMenes379 () 07.37.30 Join SolidSnake [0] (i=SolidSna@dialup-4.227.124.138.Dial1.Dallas1.Level3.net) 07.38.53 Join kaaloo [0] (n=luis@rue92-3-82-232-48-241.fbx.proxad.net) 07.38.57 Part kaaloo 07.40.19 Quit SolidSnake (Client Quit) 07.47.48 Join My_Sic [0] (n=MySic@m180.net81-67-5.noos.fr) 07.54.01 # about rockbox's dual-booting: I can get the ipod to switch over to the original apple firmware from rockbox... how do I switch it back to rockbox? Powering down does no good... do I just have to wait until it goes into a deep sleep (wait a few hours w/o power to it)? 07.54.25 # Hold Menu+Select to reboot 07.54.33 # The Apple firmware doesn't power down naturally, it only 'sleeps' 07.55.51 # Llorean: works beautifully, thanks 08.06.10 Join pearldiver [0] (n=say@cpe-72-225-231-80.nyc.res.rr.com) 08.06.22 # Can someone give me write access to the wiki, please? 08.17.14 # chainlynx: sure.. your username? 08.18.24 # chainlynx: done.. :) 08.21.08 Quit My_Sic (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 08.23.10 # midkay: thanks 08.26.17 # no prob 08.26.36 Join GodEater [0] (i=c2cbc95c@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-445722397ee00611) 08.28.42 Part toffe82 08.32.11 Join LinusN [0] (i=linus@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-745cf8b6f7dac3c6) 08.34.11 Quit gtkspert (Remote closed the connection) 08.35.08 Join gtkspert [0] (n=gtkspert@gateless.info) 08.41.45 # Slasheri: hey, do you tihnk it would take up reworking to add a tag in he tagnavi_custom.config file which would allow you to add a submenu into an exsisting menu? 08.43.42 Join Rob2222 [0] (n=Miranda@p54B17652.dip.t-dialin.net) 08.45.44 Join Clapa [0] (i=andrw@89.34.6.212) 08.53.09 Join ender` [0] (i=krneki@84-255-206-8.static.dsl.t-2.net) 08.53.17 Join B4gder [0] (n=daniel@static-213-115-255-230.sme.bredbandsbolaget.se) 08.57.42 Join petur [0] (i=d4efd6a6@rockbox/developer/petur) 08.59.19 # JdGordon: hmm, that should be possible to do 09.00.28 # Slasheri: I tinhk that is better than just having the option of adding more menus, seen as the layout of the default menu is ussualy great, just needs some minor additions 09.00.40 Quit chainlynx ("Leaving.") 09.02.04 Quit Rob222241 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 09.02.48 # JdGordon: iirc sub menu entries are just pointer references so it should be able to allocate more of them afterwards 09.02.57 # *possible 09.03.25 # coolies :) I'll have a play after I get some uni work done :p 09.03.28 # and the pointer reference table is fixed in size, so menu entries could be even moved 09.03.34 # nice :) 09.05.33 # question.. so tagnavi_custom.config is appended to tagnavi.config if it exists? or does it entirely replace it? 09.07.21 Quit aliask ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.3/2007040314]") 09.07.39 # my understanding is it replaces, unless you dont specify a new root, in which case it adds to it.. 09.08.13 # * JdGordon thinks it shuold be read just before the end of tagnavi.config instead of at the begining so less menus need defining in the custom file 09.08.44 # oh, i see.. 09.09.55 # GodEater: I once had to have someone redirect the output of a directory listing on their player to a text file to finally get a straight answer as to what files were where. 09.10.23 # I though the custom one was just inserted, if you did it right. 09.10.39 # ^--- Speaking of Tagnavi 09.11.30 # Llorean: I'll ask him later if he still has problems :) 09.12.50 # midkay: it's appended 09.13.08 # midkay: or included just there where the include clause is 09.13.09 # it replaces if you specify a new rot though doesnt it? 09.13.21 # yes, then it replaces the default menu structure 09.13.43 # but everything defined in tagnavi.config (if any) is available also from tagnavi_custom.config 09.14.04 Join Thundercloud [0] (n=thunderc@82.153.142.173) 09.15.43 # Slasheri: everything? or only the stuff that was efined before the %include line? 09.15.49 # Slasheri: so there *is* a way to make it totally replace tagnavi.config if you so desire. 09.16.03 # * JdGordon vagualy remembers seeing a patch so even stuff after the %include could be used 09.16.26 # JdGordon: only the stuff before %include 09.16.51 # midkay: yes, if you mean replacing the default root menu 09.16.57 # just use the %root_menu caluse 09.17.00 # *clause 09.17.06 # Slasheri: got it, was just curious. thanks. 09.17.14 # then the default root menu will be hidden and inaccessible (but it's still there) 09.17.20 # Slasheri: ok, then shohuoldnt the include be the last line of tagnavi.config? or that patch be commiteD? 09.17.21 # ah.. 09.17.58 # JdGordon: it can't be the last line because the default root menu has the custom menu reference 09.18.07 # so it needs to be included before that 09.19.30 # Slasheri: then maybe 7003 could be commited? (goin just by the description though...) 09.20.33 # hmm.. that actually sounds like it will do what I wanted t do and append to exsisting menus also :) 09.20.35 Quit GodEater ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") 09.21.04 # JdGordon: possible, there are few tagcache/browser patches on the tracker that are almost commitable 09.21.10 Join purplegreendave [0] (n=chatzill@212.2.174.90) 09.21.24 Join davina [0] (n=dave@cpc1-sout6-0-0-cust616.sotn.cable.ntl.com) 09.21.33 Quit Clapa ("643") 09.21.37 # can't remember now which ones.. but the code of those needs little fixing, the use of buffers etc. isn't all correct 09.23.04 # Can anyone help me please? I have rockbox on my iPod nano, and I can put an mpeg on and it plays fine, but it only displays a quarter of the video (the top left corner). I have tried using media coder to resize it but I cant seem to get it to work/ 09.23.37 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 09.23.49 # JdGordon: yes, i think #7003 is ok. but the code needs minor adjustments 09.24.02 # whats the use of havin a title and a in string i the struct root_menu? couldnt just the title be used for the id? 09.24.04 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 09.25.54 # actually... ignore that, I guess you could have multiple menus with the same name but unrelated 09.26.00 # * JdGordon bbs 09.26.05 # indeed 09.26.23 # purplegreendave: You should probably ask somewhere that specialized in mediacoder for help with using it. 09.26.33 # it could be used but might not be so clean way to implement it 09.26.56 # ok thanks & will do, but is there a way to zoom out on the iPod? 09.27.32 # No 09.27.44 # That would take more cpu power for scaling, and we're already tight in that area. 09.27.48 # You should resize your videos in advance. 09.29.48 # mmkay thanks 09.29.52 Quit purplegreendave ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.3/2007030919]") 09.30.03 Join linuxstb_ [0] (i=5343d4aa@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-b02823207edb4391) 09.30.13 Join ompaul [0] (n=ompaul@freenode/staff/gnewsense.ompaul) 09.33.58 Join GodEater [0] (i=c2cbc95c@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-ad8d0b358c30f8fd) 09.35.00 # is rbutil included in the source archive? Or only available through svn ? 09.37.49 Join maffe [0] (n=maffe@195.159.148.248) 09.38.02 # Just SVN I think. 09.38.15 # bugger 09.38.35 # with my current lack of home internet I can't do my usual network hoop jumping to make svn work here :( 09.38.37 # I could host a copy if you wanted it. 09.38.58 # cool - I'm going to have another stab at making a statically linked version 09.40.10 # http://www.davechapman.f2s.com/rockbox/rbutil.tgz 09.40.22 # thank you very much 09.41.28 Join Zagor [0] (n=bjorn@rockbox/developer/Zagor) 09.44.24 # * linuxstb_ wonders why the distros are so slow to include wx-2.8 09.44.57 # distros are generally slow at including new packages 09.45.22 # ... and they often have valid reasons 09.45.52 Quit GodEater ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") 09.47.26 # * linuxstb_ finds the valid reasons here - http://people.debian.org/~terpstra/message/20070525.181456.d8d237e8.en.html 09.48.07 # haha 09.48.16 # "Let me clarify: NEVER has 09.48.16 # the first "stable" release of some new wx branch gone out the door 09.48.16 # without some critical flaw" 09.49.48 # I see the 2.8 branch is now up to 2.8.4... 09.51.54 Join crop [0] (i=c27f0812@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-4a1e9c8b210d8a9a) 09.51.55 Join GodEater [0] (i=c2cbc95c@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-f4594e9f8b55505f) 09.53.17 # gentoo has 2.8.2.0 available now 09.53.48 # Hello. I find the new string "list acceleration speed" a little bit weird. IMHO just "list acceleration" or "list scroll acceleration" would be better. "acceleration speed" is a wrong term IMHO. 09.53.51 # Do they also have older versions available? I think that's what Debian is refusing to do. 09.54.18 Join Gibbed [0] (i=rick@pool-71-108-0-77.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net) 09.54.22 Quit Rick (Nick collision from services.) 09.54.45 # amiconn: here? 09.54.53 # crop: Wrong how? 09.54.54 # yes it does 09.55.21 # 2.4.2, 2.6.3.3 are available too 09.55.41 # "Acceleration speed" is double. "Acceleration" already means speed change per time unit. 09.56.18 # crop: Yes, but acceleration has other attributes than just speed. 09.56.21 # "Acceleration start delay" is OK 09.56.21 # Acceleration speed means rate of change of acceleration. 09.56.31 # As you mentioned, it has a time element and a speed element. 09.56.59 # Honestly there should be two settings, one that changes the time between increases, and one that changes the increase size (speed) 09.57.06 Quit linuxstb_ ("CGI:IRC") 09.57.14 # If acceleration had speed it would change in value. But it doesn't change. So it has a value but not speed. 09.57.27 # What do you mean by "value" 09.58.02 # Acceleration has a constant value, e.g. 2x/3s. But its *speed* is zero since the acceleration doesn't change 09.58.22 # The rate at which it accelerates changes. 09.58.31 Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.) 09.58.32 # In the dP/dT formulat, the ratio of dP to dT is changed. 09.58.37 Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS) 10.00.05 # Llorean: well, we use 'logarithmic' acceleration but still it's constant (set by the option) What does change is the scrolling speed. 10.00.24 Quit Thundercloud (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 10.00.33 # What changes is "how fast it accelerates" in lay terms. 10.00.34 # crop: I think I agree. The seeking acceleration setting is just called "FF/RW Accel" 10.00.38 Join Thundercloud [0] (n=thunderc@82.153.142.173) 10.00.49 # "How fast" often translates to the word "speed" 10.00.55 # Perhaps "Acceleration Rate" might make more sense? 10.01.20 # Llorean: no, the acceleration remains const (if seen in the logarithmic way). The speed changes 10.01.43 # Yes, you're picking that constant. 10.01.53 # You're picking the rate of acceleration. You aren't picking the speed. 10.02.02 # Slasheri: back to the id/title thing to save ram, would it be better to use a number instead of a string for the id? or not too worried about the ram usage? 10.02.22 # If the acceleration changed it would be "Acceleration acceleration" 10.02.26 # "Acceleration rate" is better IMHO. It's correct and it does distinguish the option from the "start delay" option 10.03.10 # Llorean: yes. But since it doesn't change its speed is always zero, so the option doesn't make any sense 10.03.12 # Slasheri: and lastly, could you put a comment on 7003 saying what would need to be fixed before it could be accepted please? 10.03.32 # crop: That statement makes no sense. 10.03.40 # crop: The acceleration changes when you pick it. 10.03.52 # The acceleration has no acceleration, it's constant. You are picking that constant. 10.04.02 # That constant is the "rate of increase of speed" 10.04.27 # Llorean: yes, but not "Acceleration speed". 10.04.29 # rate means "a ratio between two different measurements", in this case, the change in amount scrolled per period of time, a rate of distance over time is also known as "speed" in the english language. 10.04.36 # linuxstb: how can I better explain it? 10.04.55 # JdGordon: Looking at your patch to tools/configure - does that create the recpresets directory for targets without recording? 10.05.19 # s/patch/commit/ 10.05.29 # s/configure/buildzip.pl 10.05.34 # The best would be just "acceleration" or "scroll acceleration". But the former doesn't explicitly distinguish from the other setting 10.05.35 # * linuxstb goes to kitchen for coffee 10.06.49 # Llorean: so if I've chosen the option e.g. 3x/2s then the logarithmic accel is const and is 3/2 (in some appropriate unit). But it remains const, so its speed is zero. 10.07.21 Part odb|fidel_ 10.07.27 # Out of curiosity, 3 units of measurement over 2 seconds = 1.5 units per second 10.07.30 # This is a measurement of? 10.08.01 Quit ender` (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 10.08.13 # Since our units are distance, the right answer is "speed" 10.08.14 # linuxstb: yeah, I could change it to check, but is it realy a big deal if the exra folder is there? 10.08.52 Join barrywardell [0] (n=barry@wardell.ucd.ie) 10.09.03 # Nevermind 10.09.07 # Forget I said anything 10.09.13 # crop: the x/2s is really only because it was the closest to the usage... without adding exra code tha was the closes to making sense.. it shhuoldnt be taken literally.. 10.09.26 # just that the general idea is tha if that number goes up you go faster 10.09.27 # Llorean: with "distance" do you mean how far the cursor advances? 10.09.32 # JdGordon: yes, people get annoyed by empty dirs in release packages 10.09.35 # crop: I said forget I said anything. 10.09.45 # B4gder: ok, ill fix that now then 10.10.47 # JdGordon: the way it works is OK, I only complain about how it's names 10.10.50 # *named 10.11.05 # yeah, I didnt like the name either, but meh, close enough 10.12.13 # * Llorean thinks the problem is just a case of the physics definition of speed, which isn't appropriate here, vs the colloquial definition of speed, which is acceptable 10.14.46 # JdGordon: if you find some alternate way for the id, just please do it :) however, numbers in configuration file instead of strings could be confusing 10.15.29 # :) if we arnt worried about the mem usage then im happy if you're happy :) 10.15.34 # JdGordon: the fix should be fairly simple and i have intended of doing it while committing it.. but it just has been delayed, i will try to do it soon 10.15.42 # :) 10.16.09 # cool 10.17.03 # Llorean: maybe. But since I've dealt a bit with the terms the difference is very clear to me :-) 10.17.53 # crop: In my defense, I confused what the 2x referred to in the ratio, you were right that the unit isn't a measure of speed. 10.18.23 # But I still don't think the phrase is inappropriate for how it's used considering it'll make sense to users more this way, I think. Though I think "rate" would be better. 10.19.54 # Llorean: "rate" in the sense of "value". And the accel unit is logarithmic :-) 10.21.02 # "Rate" in the sense of "how often the speed is changed" 10.21.36 # In the end, it's apparently "double the speed ever X seconds", so it's just a frequency. 10.21.39 # every 10.21.57 # At least, according to that menu 10.22.23 Quit Gibbed (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 10.22.34 # Eh 10.22.38 # I'm not explaining clearly now 10.22.41 # It is much too late. 10.22.48 # Llorean: yes. So the linear acceleration isn't const but the logarithmic one is 10.22.56 # Yeah 10.23.37 # But if the accleration (the log one) is const then its speed is zero 10.24.11 # See, I see "60 cycles per second" as a speed. Or "1 trigger every two seconds". It's how fast an even occurs. 10.24.35 # That's why I think just "acceleration" would be the best, without specifying that it's really a logarithmic one. 10.24.38 # Since you can't change both the 2x and the / X seconds aspects, you can only change the speed of events, rather than the whole acceleration 10.25.04 # JdGordon: Did you spot my remarks regarding the sd patch in the log? 10.25.14 # no 10.25.22 # Llorean: ah, then you mean acceleration frequency 10.25.25 # Yes 10.25.27 # i must have mised them, i did read the log though :p 10.25.36 # amiconn: roughly what time? 10.25.37 # I meant acceleration as applied to the cursor movement 10.25.40 # But frequency is velocity within an oscillatory path anyway. 10.26.03 # It's still distance over time, it's just a case of distance to reach the zero point again. 10.26.10 # Well... sorta 10.26.11 # Anyway 10.26.23 # * JdGordon thinks he will just change the setting to a regular int to shut everyone up 10.26.26 Quit barrywardell (Remote closed the connection) 10.26.26 # It's frequency, i.e. how many times an event occurs within a time unit 10.26.34 # "scan accell speed" 1...10 10.26.49 # JdGordon: 00:48..00:56 cest today 10.26.55 # * linuxstb wishes English had two different words for scroll 10.27.03 # crop: Yeah, but in computers it's a speed: How fast you go through a specific series of instructions 10.27.08 # Or repeat a specific series. 10.27.13 # mmm... chocolate scroll :p 10.27.22 # linuxstb: English could use separate words for a _lot_ of things 10.27.25 # Like "free" 10.27.34 # * Llorean doesn't need to hear that speech a million more times. 10.27.35 # beer? 10.28.00 # crop: Anyway, I think "Acceleration" is valid, just a bit less clear for the users. 10.28.03 # yes, english needs many more words for beer! ;*P 10.28.31 # english *has* lots of words for beer :) 10.28.35 # scorche: Actually, at this thing I was at, the CEO of Red Hat said "Proprietary software companies give away of lot of demos, the 'free beer' approach as you might say. Open Source tends to take a more sober approach." 10.28.41 # I swear, I was the only person at the even who laughed. 10.28.45 # amiconn: the sd thread without hotswap is the ata thread... so it does the idle notify code 10.28.55 # haha 10.28.59 # event 10.29.27 # ... /me shold have continued reading... 10.29.46 Join barrywardell [0] (n=barry@wardell.ucd.ie) 10.30.19 # crop: Anyway, sorry for all the arguing 10.30.29 # How does "scroll" translate into other languages? Can you use different words for scrolling up/down lists and the horizontal scrolling of text? 10.30.38 # Llorean: you don't have to be sorry, it was a pleasure! 10.30.56 # crop: You just came here for an argument? ;) 10.30.58 # linuxstb: cursor movement? 10.31.04 # we could say "panning" for horizontal movement 10.31.09 # I think that's valid 10.31.12 # * petur gets a late trigger and blames work for it 10.31.18 # Panning might work. 10.31.22 # linuxstb: in Swedish we prety much use the english word "scroll" in daily speak actually 10.31.22 Join spiorf [0] (n=spiorf@host36-220-dynamic.4-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) 10.31.37 # panning is also 1 less byte! 10.31.44 # woohoo 10.31.53 # amiconn: if "input source" is the "most important" setting why not put it to the top? 10.32.00 # panning also means to heavily criticise.. 10.32.15 # But I guess people won't confuse the meaning :) 10.32.25 # That's a rather uncommon use of the word over hear at least. 10.32.33 # not here it isn't 10.32.44 # but I don't see how you could possibly confuse it as a setting :) 10.32.47 # Rockbox gave that text a good panning... 10.33.08 # that's a bit of a stretch 10.33.15 # hahaha 10.33.41 # Or as Crop suggested we could just call the list-version the "cursor acceleration" or whatnot, rather than scrolling. 10.33.59 # that's far too many bytes :) 10.34.01 # Since there's a lot of code and discussion referring to "text scrolling" as "scrolling" anyway. 10.36.10 Join pixelma [0] (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) 10.38.29 Part Llorean 10.40.46 # GodEater: Regarding your last forum post - does party mode make the lock icon appear? 10.41.05 # ugh @ http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=10753.0 10.41.25 # linuxstb: aye....i didnt think it did either 10.42.59 # linuxstb: I don't know actually - I've never used it 10.43.09 # let me check... 10.43.38 # it sounded like his switch was actually broken, or Rockbox froze, if he was moving it and it didnt do anything 10.43.38 # I think I remember someone else mentioning that problem on a video ipod (lock icon appearing when the hold switch wasn't on) 10.44.20 # No it doesn't 10.44.25 # my bad 10.44.34 # it's not a bad idea though :) 10.44.44 # We need a party-hat icon... 10.45.01 # Or a beer icon... 10.45.07 # hahah - yeah 10.45.22 # * JdGordon likes the idea of the lock icon showing if in party mode 10.45.43 # i dont think petur/preglow would be able to have Rockbox run without party mode then... 10.45.59 Quit atsea- (Remote closed the connection) 10.46.11 # hahaha 10.46.26 # they don't have some sort of beer based theme already ? 10.47.20 # what happened to the patch to make rockbox read themes straight from a tarball ? 10.47.53 # Nico_P updated it recently, but it didn't seem to give any noticable speedup. It's in the patch tracker, and could do with more testing. 10.48.19 # * amiconn wonders what crop is talking about 10.48.20 # I'm not sure if it's worth committing if it doesn't speed up theme loading. 10.48.39 Join atsea- [0] (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-281cecb780ac8bc3) 10.48.42 # It might not speed it up 10.48.52 # but it might make *some* of our users lives easier 10.49.07 # It wasn't the whole theme in a tar, just the WPS bitmaps. 10.49.12 # ah 10.49.56 # I wonder if Rockbox will be mentioned in this thread: http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/05/29/028259 10.49.56 Quit Maz (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 10.50.01 # I was thinking it might be nice if the theme could be loaded all from one file - it might encourage more theme authors to package them up nicely 10.50.13 # amiconn: hey! What are you wondering about? I meant the recent change in the wavrec menu 10.50.34 Join The-Compiler [0] (n=florian@234.37.77.83.cust.bluewin.ch) 10.51.49 Join bluebrother [0] (i=aJD0HkfO@rockbox/staff/bluebrother) 10.52.42 # markun: I doubt it 10.54.51 # Slasheri: why can't the tagnavi 10.54.59 Join thegeek [0] (n=thegeek@s189a.studby.ntnu.no) 10.55.22 # Slasheri: why can't the tagnavi_custom.config not use UTF-8 but uses ANSI instead? 10.55.41 # (at least according to http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/DataBase) 11.04.06 # crop: The most important item is 'start recording', but the items are sorted in logical order. First you set parameters, then you start recording 11.09.15 Join Entasis [0] (n=Jarred@ppp7-94.lns10.adl2.internode.on.net) 11.22.18 Join Nico_P [0] (n=nicolas@jau31-3-82-239-20-145.fbx.proxad.net) 11.23.40 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 11.29.10 Quit linuxstb ("Leaving") 11.33.51 # amiconn: ah, right, the item number is zero based! My fault. This will probably change once we have a dedicated record button, right? 11.36.33 # markun: hmm, that needs to be fixed 11.37.04 Quit Nibbier (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 11.39.02 # Slasheri: I think so too, so people can have a korean tagnavi file for example 11.39.30 Join Nibbier [0] (n=sven@port-212-202-177-141.dynamic.qsc.de) 11.39.41 Quit petur ("worrrk stkov") 11.40.06 Join lee-qid [0] (n=liqid@p54966A20.dip.t-dialin.net) 11.40.10 Quit lee-qid (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 11.40.25 Join lee-qid [0] (n=liqid@p54966A20.dip.t-dialin.net) 11.44.33 Join Llorean [0] (n=Llorean@rockbox/administrator/Llorean) 11.48.58 # In regards to a discussion while I was out: even if part of it was in jest, I do think some sort of visual display that party mode is active would be helpful. 11.51.00 # Slasheri: (soz keep bugging you), just tried out 7003 and it works great. my custom config is tiny compared to before now :) 11.55.13 # amiconn: why is the entry to start recording in the sttings at all? Shouldn't it be "factored out", i.e. be not in every recording settings? 11.56.36 # wavrecord only has one menu 11.56.47 # This is tech preview stuff anyway 11.56.52 Join DataGhost [0] (i=dataghos@ip3e832ea5.speed.planet.nl) 11.56.54 # Does anyone have any special love for the current Sansa keymap? 12.00.41 Part maffe 12.01.00 Join maffe [0] (n=maffe@195.159.148.248) 12.03.45 # Question about the button things, what's the difference between a button | BUTTON_REPEAT with a prereq of the same button vs one without a prereq of the same button? 12.07.11 # Slasheri: it looks like the tagnavi file works fine with UTF-8 12.09.52 Join amigan [0] (i=dcp1990@unaffiliated/amigan) 12.12.41 Join kubiixaka [0] (n=Miranda@mos-81-27-201-28.karneval.cz) 12.15.50 Join linuxstb [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 12.16.55 # Anyone with an e200 want to let me know what they think of this? http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7232 (and if they think I did something wrong with setting the keymappings, I've not tinkered with those before) 12.19.44 # Llorean: there is a sublte difference which i cant remember right now :p 12.20.27 # JdGordon: I couldn't determine the difference just from reading the buttons and thinking "how do I uses these buttons" 12.20.46 # So I pretty much went with "if there's a |BUTTON_REPEAT or |BUTTON_REL, use a prerequisite of the button being pressed" 12.21.04 # Anyway, I want to remap the keys so that the buttons make a wee bit more sense. 12.21.11 # repeat isnt always needed, I cant really remember why though 12.21.25 Quit kubiix (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 12.21.32 # I disagreee with moving stop to power and menu to the down button 12.21.37 # Why? 12.21.46 # * JdGordon finds menu much more uefull tha a stop button 12.22.15 # My goal is to bring it more into line with our other targets. 12.22.18 # also, I like the fact that I dont have t hold the buton to get the contxt menus 12.22.32 Quit Soap () 12.23.03 # To me, holding down the select button makes a kind of sense anyway, it's almost like right clicking. 12.23.30 # Meanwhile, on many of our targets the power and stop buttons are the same button. 12.23.46 # The only target I know of that uses a long press of Play/Pause is the iPod because there isn't a button we can use on its own. 12.24.23 # I really dont see the need for a stop button... pause is good enough, and if you want t clear the playlist, then a long pause is just as simple 12.25.05 # Long pause doesn't make much sense though, people frequently enough ask how to stop playback on iPods already 12.25.23 # Also, why is "I like it better" a good reason to make it more confusing for people moving from other Rockbox targets? 12.25.36 # looking at the keymap... the |button_rel is only needed if its likly that the button is used in another context but it is still needed in this one.. e.g the power button in context_standard 12.25.46 # I'm just looking at a picture of an e200 - what's the icon on the "down" button meant to be? 12.25.54 # a drop menu 12.26.03 # its used for the context menus in the OF 12.26.05 # Llorean: The difference of a button|BUTTON_REPEAT with and without prereq is very simple: 12.26.18 # With prereq, it triggers only once, i.e. action on long press 12.26.35 # amiconn: Ah, forces only one trigger? 12.27.14 # linuxstb: My patch basically makes that the "Menu" button as it is on most of the other players. 12.27.19 # Without prereq, it triggers continuously times until the button is released. This is used for actions that should repeat (like increasing/decreasing volume, seeking in wps etc 12.27.29 # s/times// 12.27.36 # amiconn: Then for my changes, adding the prereq was appropriate it seems. Thank you. 12.27.36 # * JdGordon thought there was a geater argument for using the buttons as they are labbeled, than using them to get consistancy between targets 12.27.57 # JdGordon: The only label I contradict is the small word "Menu" above the power button. 12.28.09 # Errr, below 12.28.23 # I know :) I really think hat should be used as it is no 12.28.24 # I think there's an advantage to keeping the "power" button as menu - it means that in plugins where you need four directions, you still have a button free for the menu (or exit). 12.28.25 # w 12.28.38 # linuxstb: My patch doesn't change the plugins at all 12.28.47 # (that's a pain on the ipods) 12.28.54 # It just aligns the keymappings in the WPS and tree/menus 12.29.10 # So that long-menu gets you the quick menu, long-select gets you the context menu, and the power button serves as stop 12.29.44 # * JdGordon back in an hourish 12.30.10 # Llorean: Consistency between core and plugins is a nice thing to have... 12.31.07 # linuxstb: I agree, but I think having the quick menu be an different button from the main menu, and the context menu be a different button from select causes a lot of confusion for those who come from other targets. 12.31.52 # To me, these are part of the fundamental controls of Rockbox, and they're mostly the same on other players. 12.31.55 # Is there a button on the side (top-left) of the sansa? 12.31.59 # Record 12.34.15 # It just seems to me there should attempt to be some fundamental consistencies about how Rockbox works on the players. A sort of input paradigm, where possible, rather than somewhat drastically different controls per target. 12.36.38 # using the power button for menu makes it somewhat risky, since you could hold it for too long to get to the context menu, and turn it off instead 12.36.52 # LinusN: Context menu was a short press of a different button 12.36.57 # It was not mapped to the same button as the main menu 12.37.07 # aha 12.37.12 # Err, quick menu, rather 12.37.13 # What's record used for? 12.37.18 # Record isn't used at the moment 12.37.20 # Mostly 12.37.29 # It's sorta in the same state as the H1xx 12.38.35 Quit Rob2222 () 12.39.16 # To me, if you're going to present users with the same screens, there's a value in having the same button relations. 12.39.43 # Where the number of buttons permits 12.40.27 # The "Menu / Quick menu" pairing and the "Select / Context menu" pairing are, to me, at the core of this. 12.40.39 # Which is kinda a point I argued regarding the Gigabeat too 12.45.46 Join PaulJam [0] (i=Paul@vpn-3158.gwdg.de) 12.46.38 Join jurrie [0] (n=jurrie@adsl-068-209-041-021.sip.asm.bellsouth.net) 12.47.26 Join Rob2222 [0] (n=Miranda@p54B17652.dip.t-dialin.net) 12.47.32 Quit HEx (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 12.47.35 # hi, i noticed, that now when paged scrolling is enabled, at the end of a list, the last item now isn't always aligned with the bottom of the screen. is this intended? 12.50.12 # and when you then mark the second to last idem and hold DOWN, then the list jumps down so that the last item is at the bottom of the screen. 12.54.01 Join david11 [0] (n=david52@84.72.254.113) 12.55.51 # * david11 greets everyone 12.57.43 Quit z35 (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 13.06.06 # PaulJam: Is that something that changed with the recent list acceleration commit? 13.08.15 Join HEx [0] (i=HEx@213-228-241-143.dsl.prodigynet.co.uk) 13.20.44 Join Domonoky [0] (n=Domonoky@p549AEF50.dip.t-dialin.net) 13.22.44 # linuxstb: i haven't noticed it before, should i try it with an older build before the list acceleration? 13.23.43 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 13.28.39 # PaulJam: It would be nice to know if it's an old or new problem. 13.29.23 # linuxstb: with the 2007-05-27 dayly build it does not happen. 13.29.52 # * amiconn thinks that the list acceleration is the culprit 13.29.59 # It has more problems than just that 13.30.28 # I've only used it briefly (in a sim), and got some strange jumping between items. 13.34.41 # * JdGordon back 13.35.05 # the strange jumping isnt selecting the wrong item... just moving the wrong one to the top.. needs some fixing 13.35.42 # JdGordon: Can you explain briefly how the acceleration works? 13.36.04 # (neither your flyspray comments or commit message described the details) 13.36.59 Join Jon-Kha [0] (n=Jon-Kha@a91-152-87-243.elisa-laajakaista.fi) 13.37.26 # after a wait time (where the direction is held down) the number of items skips each buton press increases 13.37.44 # good 13.39.26 Join petur [0] (i=d4efd6a6@rockbox/developer/petur) 13.40.00 # JdGordon: So the number of items skipped doubles every X seconds (specified in the acceleration setting) ? 13.41.16 # not really... I jus used that formatting string in the setting list because its close enough and saves writing extra code... 13.42.01 # So what does happen, and what does the setting mean? 13.42.24 # every *HZ/2 the skip value is incremented 13.42.36 Quit elinenbe (" Like VS.net's GUI? Then try HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <-") 13.42.45 # wait a sec.. that doesnt sound right 13.42.50 Quit idnar (Nick collision from services.) 13.42.53 Join Rob222241 [0] (n=Miranda@p54B1548C.dip.t-dialin.net) 13.42.53 Join idnar_ [0] (i=mithrand@unaffiliated/idnar) 13.43.12 # no, yeah, thats right 13.43.24 Part Llorean 13.44.28 # OK, so the "2x/2s" setting means that the items_to_skip value is incremented once a second? 13.44.49 # could this also cause FS#7230? 13.44.59 # there is another fummy behaviour: if paged scrollung is disabled and you scroll down item by item near the end of a list, the view jumps too early to the start of the list (with the cursor still being at the end of the list). 13.45.30 # bluebrother: yeah, saw that in the thread... it does cause it... 13.45.46 # that shold be a simpe fix.. just have to find 5 min to d it 13.46.39 # JdGordon: Did you try any other algorithms? e.g. doubling the skip items at each interval? 13.47.01 # each which interval? the start delay interval? 13.47.29 # The interval at which you change the skip value. 13.48.01 # the code to decide how much we skip is gui/list.c:814-835... 13.48.16 # linuxstb: that would be enourmous acceleration, wouldn't it ? 13.48.43 # Nico_P: It depends on the value of the skip interval - it would obviously need to be longer than the current method. 13.48.49 # like I said, I cheated with the 2nd setting formatter to save bin space... the actual string the uer sees is mostly irrelvant, I could have used numbers instead... 13.49.03 # it only increments.. never doubles... 13.49.18 # if it did double it would be way to fast, as Nico_P said 13.49.18 # linuxstb: I think it would feel jumpy at one point, but probably still worht testing 13.49.30 # JdGordon: That's what you've just told me - I'm asking if you've experimented with other algorithms, or just went with the first. 13.49.47 # cant really remember, probably just went with the first 13.50.17 # The cause of the bugs is in the function which replaced the old select_previous and select_next functions 13.50.37 # gui_list_select_at_offset() 13.51.56 # * Nico_P is off ot class (and going to get $500 from google too :) ) 13.52.04 # lucky bugger... 13.52.08 # not to the first part though ;p 13.54.25 # linuxstb: do you ask bcause the acceleration isnt smooth enough? or not fast enough? or? 13.55.56 # just to add my 2 cents - it doesn't appear to kick in in an untuitive way either 13.56.01 # JdGordon: My original question was just so that I understood the algorithm you've chosen to use - there are lots of possible ways to implement this acceleration. 13.56.02 Quit crop ("CGI:IRC") 13.56.05 # s/untuitive/intuitive 13.56.37 # looking at the menu options only, it appears we start accelerating after a given amount of time yes ? 13.56.45 # yes 13.56.48 # JdGordon: Does it work on the Sansa's wheel ? 13.56.54 # yeah, works great 13.57.01 # _if_ you can keep your thumb going :p 13.57.03 # I'd find it more intuitive if it were kicked in when you really go for it with the wheel 13.57.22 # i.e. a great deal of movement in a short space of time 13.57.36 # rather than just, has the wheel been moving for >500ms 13.57.46 # the button driver speeds up the rate it sends repeat events anyway 13.59.40 # * GodEater wonders if that's the best approach 14.00.07 # JdGordon: I think the setting needs to change to more accurately describe what it does. e.g. give a time in 500ms increments. 14.00.33 Quit Rob2222 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 14.01.18 # linuxstb: ok, but then what shuold the setting be called? 14.01.49 # Maybe "list acceleration interval" ? 14.02.20 # * linuxstb waits for crop to complain 14.04.32 # How do the repeat events work for the Sansa's wheel? IIUC, it's a mechanical wheel that you turn, so you can't detect a user touching it? 14.04.48 # jhMikeS got repeat events working 14.05.10 # i assume goign by the time difference on the interupts 14.05.14 Quit GodEater ("CGI:IRC") 14.05.27 Join GodEater [0] (i=c2cbc95c@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-21da840bb55cdd02) 14.05.50 # I tihnk I fixed 7230, but no multiline lists long enough, still other wierd bugs though 14.06.20 # Yes, looks that way. Something similar should probably be done in the ipod wheel driver, so a user momentarily untouching the wheel doesn't stop repeat events being sent. 14.07.32 # JdGordon: tried the id3 info screen with a large font? it uses double lines. 14.08.18 # I forced the tree view to use 2 lines, and now always have the first line selected first, so seems t work 14.08.54 # page scrolling is funny :) 14.09.16 Join sando [0] (i=lolsteam@124-254-76-41-static-dsl.ispone.net.au) 14.17.00 Join Llorean [0] (n=Llorean@cpe-70-113-91-140.austin.res.rr.com) 14.17.13 # JdGordon: Y'know, I'm still having problems using Icons reliably. 14.17.32 # Is it still "not done" or is it expected to be working at this point? 14.17.50 # whats wrong wth them? 14.17.56 # * JdGordon thought all bugs were fixed 14.18.02 # Without a .icons file, they don't quite work right 14.18.08 # I'm using the white "default" icons 14.18.20 # And the viewers ones for .txt files and .mpeg files are showing up as question marks 14.18.48 # It's a duplicate of the normal icons, only white, and they're in the same order. 14.19.08 # ok, 1 thing at a time... :) 14.19.13 # It is one thing 14.19.21 # :) 14.19.24 # lists first :) 14.19.49 # Just wanted to know if it was "known" or if I should remember to bug you about it later. :-P 14.20.00 # I was testing out this "Ultima" theme, Denny's default entry 14.20.14 Quit slarti ("leaving") 14.20.25 Join slarti [0] (i=tom@gentoo/developer/slarti) 14.21.33 # I assume I'm not the only person getting "Internal Server Error" when trying to use viewvc? e.g. http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi/trunk/apps/ 14.21.56 # same here 14.22.05 # I dont remember anyone else reporting icon bugs... Llorean if you want t put it on FS and assign to me that shuold be enough to remind me ;p 14.22.15 # 500 error here also 14.22.21 # * JdGordon 's commit broke svn :D 14.22.41 # * linuxstb pings LinusN, B4gder and Zagor 14.22.42 # JdGordon: This is with an absolutely current build, so it's possible they've resurfaced recently, or it's possible nobody noticed since I think this is the only iconset without a .icons file 14.22.46 # * Zagor is looking at it 14.22.52 # JdGordon: I'll post a flyspray entry 14.23.28 # Zagor: hey, are emails in FS viewable to all users or just the developers group? 14.23.57 # viewable? they are all sent out to the mailing list, so anyone who subscribes can see them 14.24.27 # were they always? 14.24.39 # yes 14.24.47 # JdGordon: Are you talking about emails or email addresses? 14.24.47 # hmm, ok then 14.24.53 # addresses 14.25.08 # JdGordon: Okay, task 7233 14.25.13 # oh, they shouldn't be visible. are they? 14.25.37 # I dont know... 14.25.57 # I was wondering why I got an email from someone who must have got it from FS 14.26.42 # I know the email addresses used to be visible in flyspray emails, but I think that's been fixed at some point. 14.27.30 # I think the new version fixed that 14.27.51 # if you are logged in and click on a name in flyspray the emails are visible 14.27.52 # Yes, checking my archives, the 19 May 2007 was the last email with the addresses listed. 14.28.13 # One I received on 20 May was just addressed to me. 14.28.18 Nick idnar_ is now known as idnar (i=mithrand@unaffiliated/idnar) 14.29.01 # PaulJam: I think that's new though... 14.29.23 # is there any way to hide the email adress from others? 14.30.15 Quit pearldiver ("some games are better left unplayed") 14.31.26 # I'm not sure if we would want to - I don't mind my address being there, and think it's useful to be able to directly contact people who have opened tasks or commented on flyspray. 14.31.48 # (it's no different to using one of the mailing lists) 14.32.10 # where is the difference between single platter and dual platter, exept of the size and weight? 14.32.16 # PaulJam: I'll fix that 14.32.35 # david11: Um, other than the fact that there's two platters, size, and weight, what are you looking for? 14.32.59 # maybe it needs more energy 14.33.16 # or is faster at reading 14.33.42 # Energy use and read speed varies from drive to drive even among those with the same number of platters. 14.33.45 # B4gder: ping 14.33.59 # * B4gder schpongs 14.34.02 # Zagor, how much work would adding a cookie the the reader.pl be so it can remember things like autoscroll, and show/hide joins ? 14.34.15 # how about the price 14.34.32 # B4gder: linuxstb has checked my server yesterday, and everythink worked! 14.34.36 # Drives with more capacity always cost more. 14.34.56 # Single platter drives with the same capacity as dual platter drives tend to cost more because they tend to use more advanced technology. 14.35.00 # otih: yes, but how does that help us? 14.35.01 # GodEater: not much. I figured you might want to explicitly enable autoscroll, though, since it can be somewhat annoying to turn off again... 14.35.09 # ok, thanks# 14.36.00 # Zagor, true - but when I hit refresh currently to renew my timed-out connection, the autoscroll box remains ticked, but doesn't actually do anything until I click it again. At which point autoscrolling is now working, but the setting is indicating it isn't. 14.36.12 # ahh 14.36.21 # no idea, but failure is not on my servers side ... i´m now reading the scripts, perhaps i could find something ... would you check my server too? or test it again in the build process? 14.36.23 # Zagor: you could always get the text being drawn into a frame and keep the settings at the top ? 14.36.53 # otih: we have like 20 servers and your server showed this error, the others don't 14.36.56 # yeah, but I don't like frames 14.37.03 # and no I have not tracked anything since we talked yday 14.37.05 # Zagor: fair enough 14.37.19 # B4gder: but why? 14.37.24 # why what? 14.37.33 # * Zagor curses python for changing everything every release 14.37.51 # why there is a failure? linuxstb didn´t find something 14.37.57 # "and no I have not tracked anything since we talked yday" 14.38.04 # btw, would it be possible in the reader.pl to always open a new window/tab for links? 14.38.16 # * preglow curses python 14.38.47 # * GodEater thinks perhaps we should open a feature request for reader.pl in flyspray ;) 14.40.07 Part maffe 14.40.20 # B4gder: perhaps there is a failure in my sshd config, could you parse me yours? perhaps i find something?! 14.42.47 Part david11 14.45.28 # PaulJam: flyspray email address is now hidden for non-admins 14.45.57 # Zagor: ok the i can change it back, thank you. 14.46.17 Join david11 [0] (n=david52@84.72.254.113) 14.46.48 # hmm, would it be ok if developers can see all email addresses? sometimes you want to mail someone questions. 14.47.31 # I think it's somewhat important that at least developers can get in direct contact with patch posters. 14.47.33 # I can't see a problem with always showing email addresses - treat flyspray the same as the mailing lists. 14.47.36 # And/or bug posters. 14.47.57 # I don't see a problem with having normal users able to see them either, honestly, as linuxstb says 14.48.10 # Zagor: now i have a problem. the email entry on the "edit my details"-Page is now removed too. so i can't enter my email adress now. 14.48.16 # People who try to fix bugs aren't always in the Developer group 14.48.24 # PaulJam: haha oops :) 14.49.43 # linuxstb: yeah but flyspray doesn't even try to obfuscate the address. personally I don't care, but I know we're going to get complaints from people. 14.49.44 # Llorean: i don't like it if everyone can see my emailadress. 14.50.08 # trying to hide email addresses is futile and will fail no matter what we do 14.50.23 Join aliask [0] (n=chatzill@c210-49-190-113.eburwd8.vic.optusnet.com.au) 14.50.24 # Zagor: But the difference is that you need to be registered and logged into flyspray to see the addresses. 14.50.35 # true 14.50.36 # PaulJam: Have you ever investigate TMDA ? 14.50.44 # PaulJam: And I don't like it when someone reports a bug, then never checks their flyspray task, and doesn't have it set to email them when someone posts a comment on it. 14.50.49 # GodEater: don't recommend tmda please. it's broken by design. 14.51.04 # PaulJam: You still have to be registered for Flyspray to see the addresses. 14.51.10 # it wasn't a recommendation, just a suggestion. I don't use it any more myself. 14.51.25 # there are people more paranoid than me out there 14.51.41 # * Zagor goes back to bashing on python 14.52.08 # PaulJam: So you've never used the Rockbox mailing lists for that reason? 14.52.48 # * preglow joins in on the python bashing 14.52.56 # * B4gder lines up 14.53.37 # Llorean: but everyone can register at flyspray. and the emil notification on comments is enabled by default. if i knew that my email is visible for everyone i wouldn't have made a flyspray account. 14.53.41 # if anyone knows a svn browser that doesn't use python, please speak up now 14.53.59 # I believe there are 14.54.14 Quit aliask (Client Quit) 14.54.23 Quit kubiixaka (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 14.54.43 # PaulJam: If your email has been harvested once, ever, your spam amount will continue to increase with time, ad infinitum anyway. 14.55.15 # and even if not, any friend who get virus infected will spread it 14.55.21 # etc etc 14.55.39 Join z35 [0] (n=z@adsl-35-180-21.dab.bellsouth.net) 14.55.42 # Was there a deliberate decision to make flyspray excempt from the real-name policy? 14.56.00 # PaulJam: Give me good reasons it shouldn't be available, other than you don't want yours available. I'm not sure keeping your account there is a good reason for us to make it hard for those who need more details to contact those who have the details. 14.56.09 # linuxstb: not really, we just never bothered there 14.56.17 Join jac0b [0] (n=jac0b@gifn3.fpl.com) 14.56.21 # linuxstb: it's for users too, not contributers only 14.56.32 # just like the forum 14.56.40 # and any friend who is nice enough to add you to their myspace/freindster/etc list... 14.56.41 # petur: But users turn into contributors... 14.56.55 # and then we ask their real name 14.57.03 # that we do 14.57.19 # But then we get awkward cases of patches posted anonymously... 14.57.40 # maybe we could encourage them to use real names if they plan to contribute 14.58.00 # linuxstb: yes we do, but we ask for real name before accepting them 14.59.02 # The problem lies in the fact that people post a patch, not realizing we'll ask for a real name. 14.59.22 # i don't see it as a big problem 14.59.29 # otoh I certainly have nothing agains adding a little text about our real-name policy on the sign-up page 14.59.39 # Zagor: That's about what I feel should happen. 14.59.52 # ditto 15.00.24 # anyone know if Rockbox has better battery life on a 5.5G 80GB iPod? 15.00.26 # * linuxstb doesn't feel strongly one way or the other 15.00.30 # XbooX: No, it doesn't. 15.00.43 Quit jac0b (Client Quit) 15.00.46 # XbooX: We're quite clear on the fact that on iPods Rockbox has worse battery life than the original firmware 15.01.35 # Llorean: do you have a ratio? 15.01.48 # XbooX: See the IpodRuntime wiki page. 15.01.57 # k 15.03.21 # thanks Llorean, now i know what to use if i cant charge for a while 15.05.52 Join webguest07 [0] (i=d061b707@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-32288d5927e7c8ba) 15.06.48 Join ducbian [0] (n=ducbian@62.254.222.241) 15.07.47 Join pondlife [0] (n=Miranda@cpc1-rdng11-0-0-cust362.winn.cable.ntl.com) 15.07.47 Quit webguest07 (Client Quit) 15.07.50 Quit The-Compiler (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 15.07.57 # ok, now the selection bugs have been fixed.. whats the final decision on the acceleratio settings language? 15.08.04 Join The-Compiler [0] (n=florian@156.14.77.83.cust.bluewin.ch) 15.08.47 # Hmm, did anyone note that the SVN diffs aren't working? 15.09.03 # You mean viewvc ? 15.09.09 # Yes 15.09.11 # Yes 15.09.17 # Llorean: ah, your icons problem is by design... without the .icons file there is no way to know that the icons are actually the corect height, and order 15.09.27 # linuxstb: "SubversionException: ("Can't open file '/sites/svn/rockbox/format': Permission denied", 13" 15.09.37 # JdGordon: I thought it assumed they were the correct order, and the same height as the main icons? 15.10.06 # pondlife: Zagor said he was investigating. 15.10.11 # ill double check, but I dont think so 15.10.39 # No problem, just thought I'd pop in and mention it as I couldn't see the error in the IRC logs. Bye for now. 15.10.46 Quit pondlife (Client Quit) 15.12.21 Join webguest06 [0] (i=d0438e04@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-ecb68c1020673e79) 15.13.29 # JdGordon: I thought that the viewer icons were supposed to work _if_ they were in the same order, and the right size. That's at least what you said originally 15.14.03 # I said that? ok, ill modify the code.. 15.14.07 # Is there a reason why it's a waste of my time to attempt to get a build running on my g2 ipod or is it simply because no current developer has hardware to develop for? 15.14.08 Quit webguest06 (Client Quit) 15.14.34 # ducbian: You mean the 2nd gen Nano? 15.14.59 # No, I mean a 2002 gen2 touchwheel, kind of old but apparently has the same processor as the g3 15.15.10 # Then no, it's not a waste of time at all. 15.15.11 # JdGordon: I _thought_ you did. I could be wrong. 15.15.23 # Llorean: no, it doesnt make sense.. 15.15.42 # umm... hmm 15.15.59 # Alright 15.16.05 # Well then, everything's working fine 15.16.19 Join BlueChip [0] (n=BlueChip@cpc2-colc4-0-0-cust919.colc.cable.ntl.com) 15.16.19 # ducbian: What you will need to do is to look at the source code to ipodlinux (mainly the kernel, but the original podzilla source code could also help), see where different codepaths/functions are used on the g2 compared to g3, and port those changes to Rockbox. 15.16.27 # linuxstb: will ipodpatcher work on a 2nd gen ? 15.16.41 # Llorean: yeah, it wont play nice if we allow it without the .icons file 15.17.12 # I tihk, if you create the empty .icons file it will work as expected though 15.17.15 # GodEater: Not sure. If it does, it will install the 3rd Gen bootloader, which may or may not work on the 2nd gen... 15.17.35 # that'll be interesting =/ 15.17.41 # Hi. A very quick visit. I threw a guy on the m-list a link for SVN ...it seems svn is dead - or maybe just viewvc? Thought it would be helpful to mention it here 15.17.48 # is there a hardware based disk mode in the early ipods ? 15.18.04 # BlueChip: we're aware of the issue ;) 15.18.11 # OK dude ;) 15.18.15 # byeee 15.18.25 # The firewire chip is documented (I think), so I think a firewire driver could potentially be written. 15.18.28 Part BlueChip 15.18.35 # ducbian: Did the 2nd gen have USB, or just firewire? 15.18.41 # Just firewire 15.18.47 # documentation, on an iPod component? Whatever next! 15.18.49 # Llorean: definatly, if you create the .icons file with the only entry bei he highest value in the viewers.config file it will work 15.19.05 # GodEater: It's external to the portalplayer chip IIRC. 15.19.25 # JdGordon: Highest value? 15.19.38 # JdGordon: As in, the largest number so it knows how many icons there are? 15.19.45 # ducbian: Have you tried installing the 3rd gen version of Rockbox on your ipod? 15.20.09 # Llorean: yes 15.20.13 # Alright 15.20.14 # Llorean: your a lefty? 15.20.17 # Yup 15.20.26 # Actually, ambidextrous, but with a preference to my left. 15.20.40 # ok, startin to make thing clearer now... 15.20.42 # I'll catch a ball with my right if it's coming from that way, and that's a common test. 15.21.05 # I ca see how tring to get thepower button with the left hand is a pita 15.21.18 # Not yet, I'm currently at work and our linux guy was bullying me about my moaning rather than using some of our resources to attempt to get rockbox working for my hardware. 15.22.16 # ducbian: That's probably the first thing to try, and take it from there... The pp5002 ipods are in need of love and attention - no-one is maintaining/developing them currently. 15.23.44 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 15.24.58 # Llorean: at the expense of a few bytes, I could add an optoin so if there is a line in the .icons file to the effect of "use viewers.config" it would stop reading and assume its all correct, wold tha be ieal? 15.26.03 # JdGordon: What if the .icons file existed but was empty? 15.26.09 # Instead of looking for a line 15.26.39 Join Faemir [0] (n=Faemir@85-211-222-38.dyn.gotadsl.co.uk) 15.27.13 # that could work also 15.27.26 # I'm not sure though 15.27.35 # I mean, it's fairly easy for authors to just create the file. Heh. 15.27.48 Join pearldiver [0] (n=say@cpe-72-225-231-80.nyc.res.rr.com) 15.28.02 # I don't think we're going to be getting _too_ many more iconsets anyway, interest in it seemed to be somewhat shortlived 15.28.18 Part david11 15.28.23 # Ok thanks for the information linuxstb, I'll be back outside of business hours as I've probably used up my lunch break poking around the docs and chatting here. My other question was if there is a copy of the docs/contributing.html page because the linked one seems to be awol. 15.29.17 Join Arathis [0] (n=doerk@p5484ba09.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) 15.30.18 Part Domonoky 15.30.45 Quit Thundercloud (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 15.30.49 # ducbian: That's just a temporay problem with the SVN viewvc script. Apart from coding guidelines (tabs, line lengths etc), the main contributing rules are: 1) Write a patch and submit it to the patch tracker; 2) No anonymous contributions are allowed, so you need to use your real name when contributing patches. 15.30.56 # * JdGordon cant remember how the .icons file worked :p 15.35.27 # Fair enough. 15.39.31 Part LinusN 15.40.08 Part Llorean 15.40.14 # linuxstb: Calling emergency diskmode when detecting firewire should be straightforward. 15.40.23 # * amiconn still wants to do that for the mini 15.40.41 Join kubiix [0] (n=Miranda@mos-81-27-201-28.karneval.cz) 15.46.34 Quit pixelma (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 15.52.43 Join Psilonaut [0] (i=DaPhunka@88.191-246-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) 15.54.34 # btw, I've been offered a sansa e200 R model 15.54.42 Join EspeonEfi [0] (n=espeonee@c-75-66-59-124.hsd1.tn.comcast.net) 15.55.06 # and if I get it I'll offer it to anyone who feels like poking it 15.55.47 Quit EspeonEefi (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 15.59.03 # Did MrH have some success with it? 15.59.18 # he doesn't have one 15.59.34 # we have not been able to put our own bootloader on it 16.01.32 # viewvc running aain 16.01.33 # again 16.01.57 Quit mpeccorini ("User pushed the X - because it's Xtra, baby") 16.02.00 # great 16.02.44 # * linuxstb is drowning under new devices to work on, so should pass 16.03.04 # gotta go 16.03.06 Quit Zagor ("Client exiting") 16.03.15 # i'm almost tempted 16.03.22 # but can't really guarantee poking time, hrm 16.03.57 # what's the status on the thing anyway? didn't someone manage to flash it with ordinary e200 firmware? 16.04.20 # nope 16.04.20 # I thought dan_a managed to put a regular firmware on it? 16.04.31 # we can make a vanilla e200 into an R and back 16.04.42 # but we can't modify an R at all 16.04.55 # Do the DRM features work on a vanilla e200 turned into an R? 16.05.07 # I don't think anyone tried 16.05.37 # the R models can't upgrade the bootloader from recovery mode 16.05.47 # and they don't have it in a second partition 16.06.19 # and they fixed the dummy signature flaw 16.06.23 # where does that leave us? :-) 16.06.35 # Do we have an unencrypted R bootloader? 16.06.43 # yes 16.06.46 # and just to be annoying, I think the new OF for the e200 doesnt use a byte for the usb rebuild... 16.06.58 # using e200tool we could rip the bootloader from memory 16.07.29 # and we even have a binary-patched version with supposedly removed signature checks 16.07.30 # e200tool allows us to upload and run code on the device, commicating via USB? 16.07.35 # yes 16.07.45 Join mpeccorini [0] (n=mpeccori@mail1.theargusgroup.us) 16.08.02 # So the problem is installing that bootloader? 16.08.07 # exactly 16.08.56 # Has anyone compared them physically? 16.09.13 # you mean the hardwares? no I don't think so 16.09.21 # what size are the e200 rs? 16.09.32 Join jgarvey [0] (n=jgarvey@cpe-075-177-187-106.nc.res.rr.com) 16.09.37 # as in flash capacity 16.09.45 # preglow: they look identical on the outside from the photos I've seen and they have the same flash sizes 16.10.15 # and they have radio 16.10.57 # but no, i can't really promise time for hacking 16.11.07 # so i'll skip this one 16.12.03 Join JETC- [0] (n=jetc@pool-71-125-73-46.nwrknj.east.verizon.net) 16.14.08 Join VPN-User [0] (n=Miranda@82.140.49.17) 16.14.18 # Hello there 16.15.17 # I still experience charging problems with rockbox an my recorder v1 :( 16.15.39 # It only charges for about half an our from 5% to 100% 16.15.50 # hour 16.16.03 # * preglow pats hardware controlled charging 16.16.21 # VPN-User: batteries in mint condition? 16.16.53 Join PaulJam_ [0] (i=Paul@vpn-3158.gwdg.de) 16.17.03 # There are relatively new 16.17.18 # When I charge them in a dedicated charger, I get 15h playtime 16.17.32 # But when charged with rockbox, only about one hour :( 16.17.48 # VPN-User: Which version of Rockbox are you using? 16.18.01 # its a recent daily build 16.18.06 # 3 days old 16.18.20 # * B4gder haven't used his recorder in ages 16.18.25 # i also flashed it 16.18.32 # anyone with a sansa and not the latest OF and 3min spare time? can you connect the sansa to the comp but not mount it, then reboot back into the of? does it rebuild the db? 16.19.03 # no sansa here 16.19.34 # B4gder: Have you given them all away, or do you just not have one with you? 16.19.45 # I still have one at home 16.20.52 Quit mpeccorini (" HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Go on, try it!") 16.21.15 # I really love my v1 :) 16.21.21 Join mpeccorini [0] (n=mpeccori@mail1.theargusgroup.us) 16.21.27 # But with rockbox - currently unusable 16.21.43 # Has anyone a flashable stock firmware for me? 16.21.46 # What if you charge with the original firmware? 16.21.55 # What rockbox version are you using? 16.22.01 # Because when I ROLO into stock firmware, charging works fine 16.22.05 # If it's 2.5, consider upgrading 16.22.14 # its a 3 days old nightly 16.22.22 # tried several 16.22.23 # hmmm 16.22.47 # What batteries are you using? Very high capacity ones? 16.22.53 # first i thought i have the solder-problem 16.23.00 # 2400mAh 16.23.23 # but then it also wouldnt charge with stock firmware, nor? 16.23.33 Join Febs [0] (n=chatzill@38.98.196.75) 16.23.55 # Not necessarily. The stock firmware brute-force charges afaik 16.24.09 # ...at least for a certain amount of time 16.24.56 # It looks like rockbox thinks the batteries are full when they actually aren't, or even stopping completely because of some odd behaaviour 16.25.38 # If it would just detect full, it should at least peform the 2 hour top-off charging... 16.28.08 # does anyone know what battery mAh a ipod video 5.5g is? or how to find out? 16.33.22 Quit PaulJam (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 16.34.09 # Faemir: Have you read the section in the manual about that setting? 16.36.20 Join haemmy [0] (i=stefan@194.208.162.140) 16.37.11 # no 16.38.27 # The voltage increases very fast with these batteries while charging 16.38.32 # hmm... viewcvs is still fubar 16.38.32 # maybe thats the problem? 16.38.51 Join printfXh4 [0] (n=pseudo@ppp217-33.lns2.bne1.internode.on.net) 16.39.46 # These are batteries specially for MP3 players 16.40.02 # or electronic devices that need a constant high voltage 16.40.08 # JdGordon: where how? 16.40.50 # viewing a diff 16.40.58 # http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi/trunk/apps/gui/list.c?r1=13513&r2=13514 16.41.03 # indeed 16.41.20 # Permission denied: '/dev/null' 16.41.21 # ;-) 16.41.49 Quit printfXh4 (Remote closed the connection) 16.42.03 # ah. 16.42.07 # linuxstb, i see. 16.44.53 Quit VPN-User ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") 16.45.54 Join printfXh4 [0] (n=pseudo@ppp217-33.lns2.bne1.internode.on.net) 16.54.50 Join My_Sic [0] (n=MySic@m180.net81-67-5.noos.fr) 16.56.49 Join toffe82 [0] (n=chatzill@h-74-0-180-178.snvacaid.covad.net) 16.57.01 Quit printfXh4 (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 17.02.16 Join ender` [0] (i=krneki@84-255-206-8.static.dsl.t-2.net) 17.03.38 Quit B4gder ("It is time to say MOOO") 17.05.18 Join pixelma [0] (i=pixelma@212.204.47.129) 17.06.29 Join desowin [0] (n=desowin@avc146.internetdsl.tpnet.pl) 17.11.25 Join dimmok [0] (n=dimmok@66.43.74.178) 17.15.24 Quit Entasis (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 17.16.03 Quit JdGordon (Remote closed the connection) 17.16.25 Join Llorea1 [0] (n=Llorean@cpe-70-113-91-140.austin.res.rr.com) 17.16.28 Join crop [0] (i=c27f0812@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-1bb247ede31ea7b6) 17.16.34 # linuxstb: ping 17.19.15 Join rift [0] (n=rift@33.56.70-86.rev.gaoland.net) 17.20.46 # crop: hi 17.23.46 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 17.26.11 Quit lee-qid (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 17.27.02 Join david11 [0] (n=david52@84.72.254.113) 17.28.16 # linuxstb: I wanna complain :-) About "interval." 17.29.28 # Do you have a better name, given jdgordon's description of how it works? 17.32.31 Quit dimmok () 17.32.33 Quit Seed (Nick collision from services.) 17.32.40 Join Seed [0] (i=ben@bzq-84-108-237-178.cablep.bezeqint.net) 17.32.41 Join Rick [0] (i=rick@pool-71-108-0-13.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net) 17.32.51 # i have a question concerning album art: which are the requirements to see album art (i know that i need an build with albumart patch(i got senabs one), and a theme supporting it(black glass aa) 17.33.12 # haemmy: Have you seen this page? http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/AlbumArt 17.33.18 # i have tagged mp3s 17.33.39 # i'll have a look at it ;) 17.34.49 # linuxstb: is there a way to list all the documents in the wiki? 17.35.15 # linuxstb: I'm planning to write a comprehensive guide to use the list widget, but I wonder if one already exists :p 17.35.58 # I doubt there is such a document. You can search the wiki, or view the very long index (see that links at the top of every wiki page) 17.36.19 Quit shnee (Connection timed out) 17.36.45 # Ahhh, that's exactly what I was looking for, thanks 17.39.25 # Ok, there's no guide about how to use the list widget. It's confirmed. Do you guys think it's worth writting it? 17.40.01 # I would have used one yesterday, it would have taken me 1 hour to do what I did in 3 LOL 17.40.33 # @ linuxstb: the link helped me thx 17.40.56 Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (n=hihi@p54BF63E9.dip.t-dialin.net) 17.41.03 Join lee-qid [0] (n=liqid@p54966A20.dip.t-dialin.net) 17.42.06 Quit Febs ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.3/2007030919]") 17.42.45 Quit amigan (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 17.44.13 Quit petur ("later") 17.45.12 Join shnee [0] (n=CurtyD13@d149-67-40-157.col.wideopenwest.com) 17.46.13 # another nooby question on ipod rockbox: is there a plan to use artwork providet by the itunes artwork db? 17.46.31 # *provided 17.46.35 # album art is going to be supported soon 17.46.53 # rockbox is not going to care how you get that artwork 17.47.10 # it won't be loaded from the itunesdb directly however 17.47.14 # not all formats will be supported, though 17.47.20 Join jaczehack [0] (i=d572f7b7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-02b69ede1c45e17a) 17.47.36 # i thougt that to... 17.47.37 # preglow: IIUC itunes creates a database on the ipod which stores (as uncompressed bitmaps I think) the album art used by the Apple firmware. 17.47.38 # too 17.47.39 # linuxstb: ehmm... sorry, was a bit off. Where is the description of how it works? 17.47.55 # linuxstb: not the worst arrangement ever 17.47.59 # crop: The IRC logs just before I invited you to complain :) 17.48.08 # linuxstb: it's probably going to be keyed by something we can't use, though 17.48.52 # preglow: Possibly. But the principle is very close to Rockbox's proposed album art support - just that Apple use a database instead of the filesystem. 17.50.32 # haemmy: I think it's unlikely that Rockbox will read album art directly from the itunes db - but it would be nice if someone wrote a program (or maybe even a plugin) to extract it to files Rockbox could use. 17.50.59 # would be very nice *g* 17.51.45 # linuxstb: just read the explanation. It doesn't tell much since it's not specified _how_ the items_to_skip is incremented. 17.52.43 Join nls [0] (n=nils@nl104-202-175.student.uu.se) 17.52.44 # linuxstb: since retailos uses itunesdb, i kind of doubt how much use we can find in the artwork db. we'll be unable to figure out what bitmap goes with what files anyway 17.52.46 # Sorry, I must leave. Will read the log. And hope to continue the talk tomorrow :-) Bye 17.52.49 Quit crop ("CGI:IRC 0.5.7 (2005/06/19)") 17.53.12 # linuxstb: that is, of course, unless people just use the database 17.53.18 # i never do that, so kind of forgot about it, heh 17.53.27 # if rockbox could use the itunes album art db, then it would not be far away to completely integrate itunes 17.53.51 # the itunes data on ipod 17.53.57 # I'm not sure we'd be too keen to do that - not a lot of point 17.54.10 # it's only one of our targets that uses iTunes 17.54.19 # well, if the integration is by the way of using the database and external tools: sure 17.55.07 Join Rondom [0] (n=Rondom@p57a97d04.dip.t-dialin.net) 17.56.16 # so i'll transfer my songs + artwork to iPod with Anapod and then listen to them with Rockbox +g+ 17.56.24 Join helixxo [0] (n=helixxo@h-67-103-203-168.miatflad.dynamic.covad.net) 17.56.47 Join Thundercloud [0] (n=thunderc@82.152.249.137) 17.56.52 # it's not a pity for me dont having album art everywhere 17.57.17 # if i want album art, i can start with original firmware +g+ 17.57.45 # another question: what about the battery? 17.57.51 # hmm is it known that the diff links on th efrontpage don't work? 17.58.23 # nls: Yes. At least, B4gder knows. 17.58.40 # how long can i listen non stop with an ipod video 30gb? would be interesting 17.59.11 # linuxstb: ah, good, I guess he'll fix it when he has time to do so 17.59.31 # is there a significant loss of playing time? 18.00.10 # haemmy: Yes, Rockbox has bad power consumption on ipods. Around 7 hours I think is usual for the 30GB video according to this page - http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IpodRuntime 18.01.42 # ah.. turing down the display light will help a bit i think? 18.01.45 # just loaded rockbox onto my gigabeat, when i browse the files my directories are still there, but when i open them i just get a blank screen, no songs to select. is there a troubleshooting page that could help me here? 18.02.30 Join PaulJam__ [0] (i=Paul@vpn-3113.gwdg.de) 18.02.33 # oh i see rockbox cant read sat 18.02.35 # sorry 18.02.36 Nick PaulJam__ is now known as PaulJam (i=Paul@vpn-3113.gwdg.de) 18.05.59 # haemmy: possibly, but the biggest cause of power drain is unknown as of yet 18.06.33 Part david11 18.07.51 # unknown? -.- sounds mysterious 18.09.23 Quit shnee (Connection timed out) 18.09.27 # Has Apple contributed any code recently? :) 18.10.04 # s/recently/ever/ 18.11.15 # intgr : is apple supporting rockbox project? 18.11.25 # nope 18.11.32 # Of course not, I was joking. 18.11.54 # ^ 18.11.57 # ^^ 18.16.32 # AustraiMicrosystems is only one supporter (from player makers) 18.17.00 # http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/AustriaMicrosystems 18.20.37 # I wouldn't really call them a supporter - companies that freely publish datasheets for their chips have contributed a lot more to Rockbox. 18.21.12 Quit PaulJam_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 18.21.14 # well, they are supporters in the sense that we've had an active dialogue with them 18.21.25 # even though we'd prefer it if the datasheets were freely available or not 18.23.04 # austria :) 18.23.14 # I agree, it's nice they made us send people to go and collect datasheets from their offices... ;) 18.23.33 # Why do they keep them a secret, are they scared of Chinese knockoffs that are protocol / pin compatible or is it just reflex? 18.23.34 # i'm from austria too ;) 18.23.43 # desowin: SanDisk gave the project 2 or 3 sansas actually, we didn't get any docs on them though... 18.24.16 # ducbian: i think they're afraid users would fry their players writing illegal combinations of values to their chips 18.24.18 # you got developer boards didn't you ? 18.24.25 # ducbian: but that's rather silly, since that risk is even greater when you have no info 18.24.36 # ducbian: The cynic in me thinks that companies with strict NDAs regarding their documentation have something to hide. 18.25.01 Join shnee [0] (n=CurtyD13@d149-67-40-157.col.wideopenwest.com) 18.25.05 # i just think they have retarded management 18.25.14 # desowin: I think bagder got one with a jtag connector soldered on 18.25.34 # linuxstb, I suspect it's actually more than many of these companies adopt a default position similar to everyone elses because it is easier than exploring the ramifications of making such documents publicly available. 18.27.19 Quit ducbian ("boom") 18.27.23 Join jac0b [0] (n=jac0b@gifn3.fpl.com) 18.28.48 # * amiconn tends to agree with linuxstb (cynic part) 18.28.50 Join JerryLange [0] (n=JerryLan@ppp422.hk.centurytel.net) 18.29.17 Quit jac0b (Client Quit) 18.29.23 # hello. is there anybody in here? i have a very important problem 18.29.35 # ask 18.29.51 # my ipod wont turn on at all 18.30.28 # is the battery charged? 18.30.52 # it was last night when i turned it off. 18.30.57 # have you already tried to reset it? 18.31.26 # with menu+select? 18.31.49 # yes 18.32.13 # ok that worked. 18.32.28 Quit lee-qid (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 18.32.42 # somebody know if Duke Nukem 3D will work on Rockbox - H320 ? 18.32.57 # why did it work like that? 18.33.03 # if someone ports it, them maybe 18.34.13 # JerryLange: i could imagine that the wasn't rally off, but that it hung with backlight being off. 18.34.14 # may i ask my my ipod would only turn on that way the first time today? 18.34.27 # ok. 18.34.56 # the safest and cheapest way is to require ndas, so i understand them well 18.36.52 # sweet i got it working :D 18.37.03 # thanks for the neast program, guys 18.38.08 # AtG: if it already works? 18.38.12 Quit shnee (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 18.38.14 # or if it's possible to port it? 18.40.29 Quit JerryLange ("Leaving") 18.40.42 Join shnee [0] (n=CurtyD13@cpe-24-210-44-101.columbus.res.rr.com) 18.45.33 Join dan_a [0] (n=dan_a@217.23.173.156) 18.45.35 Quit dan_a (Remote closed the connection) 18.46.38 Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.) 18.46.44 Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS) 18.46.46 Join barrywardell_ [0] (n=barrywar@host-194-46-234-24.dsl-ie.utvinternet.net) 18.48.54 # * nls wonders if he made the top 10 highscore? 18.51.44 # n1s: hi buddy, thanks a lot for suggesting the List Widget. I did look a lot better. Did you test it? 18.52.02 # mpeccorini: yep, looked good so I comitted it :-) 18.52.46 # n1s: gr8, I've got plenty other features to add ;-) 18.53.13 # more chessfeatures? 18.54.58 Quit GodEater ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") 18.56.38 # n1s: yes, storing games you play against GnuChess, switching between viewer and game modes, a configuration screen with several options like autosave ... 18.57.35 Join pepie34 [0] (n=pepie34@cop60-1-82-240-26-92.fbx.proxad.net) 18.57.38 # mpeccorini: ah ok, sounds nice I guess you play a lot of chess on the go :-) 18.58.16 # n1s: yep, I'm a lousy player, I hope my iPod can help me LOL 18.58.45 # these are not my ideas though, they're documented here http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/PluginChessbox 19.00.04 # Yeah I remember the guy that made the initial port of chessbox, he had a lot of ideas, but he vanished 19.00.35 Part shnee ("Konversation terminated!") 19.01.57 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye") 19.02.13 Quit helixxo () 19.02.34 Join n17ikh|Lappy [0] (n=n17ikh@cu-nat-2.clemson.edu) 19.02.52 # n1s: with some time, they'll get done by someone 19.03.29 # n1s: he does have some very bold ideas though 19.05.17 # yeah, people who are not regulars tend to do a couple of drive-by patches for the plugins so maybe one day they'll all get implemented :-) 19.08.21 Quit pepie34 ("Ex-Chat") 19.10.18 # I have a question for people with the iriver H10 20gb. I have problems playing wavpack and high-bitrate (320kbit) mp3s 19.10.33 # seems like every once in a while the thing just gets overwhelmed and pauses for a few seconds and resumes 19.11.00 # only happens in the WPS regularly, not in the file browser, although it does happen in the file browser occasionally 19.11.08 # not that I have a very complicated WPS 19.11.19 # n17ikh|Lappy: are you using eq, crossfeed or dithering? 19.11.47 # not sure about EQ, but no crossfeed or dithering 19.11.59 # let me check 19.12.50 # nope 19.13.00 # not using the EQ, but I am using the coarse bass/treble adjustment 19.13.45 # but then again, mine isn't the very latest build, it's a week or two old 19.14.08 # n17ikh|Lappy: I don't think the bass/treble controls should affect it, the problem is that eq and the other dsp options use a fair bit of cpu power 19.14.20 # yeah, I realize that 19.14.24 # but I'm not using any :/ 19.14.44 # and as the codec also wants a fair bit of cpu power, especially with higher bitrates there is not enough 19.14.48 # Does the H10 have hardware tone control? 19.14.50 # I thought the portalplayer CPUs were more powerful than that though 19.14.57 # no clue, amiconn 19.16.02 # hmm, seems they are software tone controls 19.16.16 # so turning those to zero would probably help 19.16.19 # try torning bass/treble off (set them to 0) 19.16.26 # yeah, I'll give it a shot 19.16.32 # n17ikh|Lappy: Do you have peakmeters on your wps? 19.16.37 # nope 19.16.39 # it's the uh 19.16.39 # n17ikh|Lappy: yeah it should help a little bit at least 19.16.40 # one sec 19.18.14 # "boxes" WPS that comes with rockbox 19.19.10 # no peak meters, it does have some graphical stuff that I could get rid of if I wasn't too lazy to look for/write a good wps 19.19.39 # n17ikh|Lappy: the graphics shouldn't make a big difference 19.20.12 # how much of the screen does it redraw every refresh? 19.20.22 # (I don't know how rockbox does screen updates) 19.20.27 # It's dynamic 19.20.37 # so just what's changed then 19.20.43 # It only refreshes what's changes, approx. twice per second 19.20.54 # Only peakmeters are drawn more often 19.21.29 # ah 19.21.48 # well, I guess it's just a limitation of the portalplayer CPU :/ 19.22.04 # wonder if it's possible to get it to clock up when plugged in 19.22.20 Join a1titude [0] (n=Compaq_A@206-163-245-140.swcr.hsdb.sasknet.sk.ca) 19.22.21 # perversely, I don't have the problem when on battery because I have the screen set up to time out 19.22.28 # n17ikh|Lappy: also rockbox does not make full use of the second core in the processor yet 19.22.32 # ah 19.22.39 # so, eventually it might do better 19.22.41 # The problem is that we can't use the pp like we'd want to atm 19.23.20 # I see. 19.23.50 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 19.24.23 # that's part of the summer of code project, right? 19.25.48 # I was actually going to ask a question about battery life, I was wondering how long do you immagin that it will take for you (the rockbox developers) to find the drainage problem and solve the short batterylife for the portalplayer chip based targets? - I'm reluctent to use rockbox for audio playback until it gives bettter battery life. :( 19.26.23 # a1titude: we don't make ETAs 19.26.32 # make/set 19.26.46 # because we don't know 19.27.15 # ahh, well thanks 19.28.40 # a1titude: although one problem that is known is that nobody knows how to power down the harddrives in the ipods (does not affect h10 where that works or flash based players) 19.29.50 # apple should make it easyer for rockbox developers when making the hardware! haha jk lol 19.33.28 Quit toer (Remote closed the connection) 19.35.05 Part a1titude 19.45.45 Join f00f [0] (n=obo@CPE002078c67dd3-CM0011ae015168.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) 19.45.56 Nick f00f is now known as zobo (n=obo@CPE002078c67dd3-CM0011ae015168.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) 19.47.57 # guys, is Kevin Ferrare still contributing to Rockbox? 19.49.18 Join maffe [0] (n=maffe@195.159.148.248) 19.49.44 # mpeccorini: why not ask him directly ? 19.49.58 # * amiconn hasn't seen him for ages 19.50.26 # his last commit was on Jul 2nd 2006 19.50.42 Join PaulJam_ [0] (i=Paul@vpn-3113.gwdg.de) 19.50.49 # hm is there a build, where ipod could shut down the display during playing audio until a button is pressed? 19.51.07 # I just wrote http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/ListWidget and I was hoping he could take a loot at it 19.51.25 # but I should probably just go get a life :p 19.51.54 # haemmy: atleast on mini it didn't gave me any change, if you have grayscale iPod I could check if my old patch still applies 19.52.10 # (change in battery life) 19.52.35 # Switching off the lcd doesn't make sense wrt battery life 19.52.47 # What sucks power is the backlight, not the lcd itself 19.53.22 # And if the lcd stays readable w/o backlight, it doesn't make sense to switch it off. That applies to all ipods except the color/photo 19.53.25 # desowin : no i got a ipod video 30gb 19.54.29 # haemmy: sorry, I can't help then 19.56.10 # * desowin was one who thought he know it better, but it just paid me many hours on trying to make patch and then notice that there's no difference, but it's good, I no longer argue with you guys 19.57.21 # sry, didn't know that 19.58.44 Quit EspeonEfi ("Leaving") 20.00.30 Quit Nibbier (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 20.01.19 Join ducbian [0] (n=Nick@cpc2-cmbg3-0-0-cust33.cmbg.cable.ntl.com) 20.02.58 Join Nibbier [0] (n=sven@port-212-202-177-141.dynamic.qsc.de) 20.03.46 Quit n17ikh|Lappy () 20.04.12 # does anyone know if rockbox implements some sort of buzzer? 20.05.02 # there is a ptch on the tracker for the piezo, if that is what you mean 20.05.03 Quit haemmy () 20.08.09 Join midkay_ [0] (n=midkay@63-226-219-199.tukw.qwest.net) 20.09.56 # scorche, the piezo patches deal with button presses, correct? 20.10.48 # those are old from what I know, probablt won't apply to svn now, someone would have to sync them 20.10.59 Quit PaulJam (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 20.11.14 # (and correct) 20.12.15 # hum 20.12.35 # for doom, i put the .wad on .rockbox/games/doom or in .rockbox/doom ? 20.13.00 # Whatever the manual says... 20.13.48 # but say I want to generate beeps at specific time intervals as opposed to buttons being pressed. 20.14.31 # Are you talking about beeps in your headphones, or the ipod's piezo? 20.14.53 Quit barrywardell_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 20.15.24 # linuxstb, I just need an audiable beep to be created at certain time intervals. 20.15.57 Join david11 [0] (n=david52@84.72.254.113) 20.17.12 # For example, I often do High-intensity Cardio w/ my Sansa. I run for a minute, then walk for a minute, then run for a minute again... etc. 20.17.27 # So you want it whilst listening to music? 20.17.48 # It would be much more prctical to hear when the interval has elapsed than having to glance at my stopwatch every couple of seconds 20.18.00 # linuxstb, ideally, yes. 20.18.22 # fade music, hear beep. 20.18.36 # is there a plugin for something like this already? 20.19.03 Quit sando ("Apply directly to the forehead") 20.19.26 # I don't think such a plugin exists already, but there's the pcmbuf_beep() function available to plugins, so a plugin could be written to use that. (although I'm not sure how well that function works) 20.20.00 # thanks 20.26.03 Quit midkay (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 20.26.14 Join toer [0] (i=tore@skjeldal.com) 20.27.46 # looks like I' not getting any Flysspray notifications anymore... 20.28.42 Quit atsea- (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.29.51 # Nico_P: You mean personal emails or the mailing list? 20.30.01 # oh actually it's ok I got one today :) 20.30.02 Join Lear [0] (i=chatzill@rockbox/developer/lear) 20.30.20 # it seems the notifications were disabled with the new version of FS 20.30.37 # linuxstb: I was talking about personal emails for watched tasks 20.31.22 # linuxstb: btw, what do you want to do with your checkwps tool ? 20.32.04 # I'm happy to commit it, but want someone (you?) who knows the WPS code to help improve it - it's just a proof-of-concept really at the moment, rather than a useful tool. 20.32.53 # linuxstb: what kinf of improvements do you have in mind ? 20.32.53 Quit ducbian ("Leaving") 20.32.53 # Mainly two things: 1) Check that the changes to core rockbox code are OK, and that they can't be done any less intrusively; 2) Change the application itself to provide more useful output. 20.33.18 # what sort of output ? 20.33.46 # You think it's fine as it is? I don't write WPSs, so don't know what WPS authors will want to be told. 20.34.38 # * linuxstb can't remember exactly what the output looks like, apart from the fact that it seemed very verbose 20.35.01 # it is very verbose... maybe that can be changed with command line arguments 20.35.32 # WPS creators seemed to be quite happy with the output 20.36.03 # Fair enough then. 20.36.27 # I'll check the core parts 20.37.07 Join webguest01 [0] (i=43ad8a99@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-239b128d11fb2751) 20.37.38 # hi can anybody give me a link to the current build for my ipod video plz? 20.38.33 Join aa234238 [0] (n=a@cpc2-leed6-0-0-cust691.leed.cable.ntl.com) 20.39.13 # Good evening all, I was hoping someone could advise me - in its current state, is Rockbox on a 5G video iPod capable of decoding and mixing two streams of audio for >30 secs? 20.39.13 Quit zobo (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.39.27 Join zobo [0] (n=obo@CPE002078c67dd3-CM0011ae015168.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) 20.40.08 # webguest01: Click on "Current Build" in the menu on the left of the Rockbox website, and scroll down until you see a photo of your iPod. Then click on it. 20.40.57 # thank u 20.41.33 Quit webguest01 (Client Quit) 20.41.41 # aa234238: There's no feature to do that currently. Are you asking if the ipod hardware would be up to it if it was implemented? 20.41.43 Join webguest75 [0] (i=43ad8a99@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-fefd508115a3d60b) 20.42.58 # yeah basically.. well my idea (/dream, it would take a long time for me to get anywhere near implementing but i love a good challenge..) is to have precalculated info on bpm/beat timings of songs and for the ipod to resample the next song to match the tempo and x-fade the two 20.43.00 # dj style 20.43.04 # just for fun really ;) 20.43.47 # see, x-fade obviously exists, but i'm unsure if it actually decodes two streams at once or whether it uses the last few seconds when the other track has been decoded to start decoding the next one 20.43.58 # i did have a look at the sources a while ago but it was a bit confusing, thought i'd see if anyone knew the answer 20.44.02 Quit Rob222241 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 20.44.20 # my guess is that mp3 decoding would have to be happening at well over 200% realtime for this to even be feasible 20.44.25 # Yes, crossfade starts to decode the second track after it's finished decoding the first. Only one codec is running at a time. 20.44.35 Join lee-qid [0] (n=liqid@p549648AA.dip.t-dialin.net) 20.44.49 # aa234238: This page shows some decoding speeds (on the iriver H10, but it has the same CPU as the ipod video) - http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/CodecTesting 20.45.25 # ah excellent, thanks for that 20.46.19 # Note that the MP3 figures are for a version of the decoder with some as yet uncommitted optimisations. Current SVN is slower. 20.46.20 Quit zobo (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.46.40 # * linuxstb just notices the page has two sets of MP3 figures.... 20.46.46 Quit Faemir (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.46.55 # 180%.. hmm, that would allow ~3 mins to decode the next song on a six min song... but then there's the memory overheads to consider 20.46.55 Join zobo [0] (n=obo@CPE002078c67dd3-CM0011ae015168.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) 20.46.55 Join Faemir [0] (n=Faemir@85-211-222-38.dyn.gotadsl.co.uk) 20.47.21 # and woudl i be right in thinking that resampling works by changing something in the hardware, i.e. its a global thing rather than a "per-stream" thing? 20.47.41 # No, the DAC is fixed at 44.1KHz - all resampling is in software. 20.48.02 # ahh, interesting 20.48.21 # so what i'm suggesting might not be impossible, as long as memory isnt the limiting factor 20.48.30 # i might look in to it a bit more 20.48.39 # as i say, it'll be a fun challenge if nothing else ;) 20.48.41 Quit pearldiver (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 20.49.03 # - is the overhead of resampling in s/w high do you know btw? 20.49.14 # I'm not sure why you need to decode the whole song in advance though - you can resample the second song as it's playing. 20.49.44 Join pearldiver [0] (n=say@cpe-72-225-231-80.nyc.res.rr.com) 20.49.49 # linuxstb: I don't see a problem with the core parts of the patch... But I get weird warnings about printf when I build the tool 20.49.49 # yea, you're absolutely right. i was more thinking in terms of i'd like there to be a ~45sec period of time where both songs are playing 20.49.54 # which looks like it might not be impossible 20.50.19 # You could just increase the current crossfade buffer. 20.50.41 # Nico_P: Yes, I get those too. 20.50.59 # indeed, then write software on the pc side to analyse the tracks, and routines on the ipod/rockbox side to use this info to synchronise the tracks (assuming they are perfectly in sync) 20.51.01 Join atsea- [0] (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-3a1e6f8a6f60ee95) 20.51.01 Quit webguest75 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 20.51.08 # i think it'd be a quite cool feature, i'll look in to it more 20.51.10 # thanks for you advice mate 20.51.16 # linuxstb: no idea how to fix them, or even where they come from ? 20.51.18 # Nico_P: I think it's a problem with the system printf getting in the way of the Rockbox printf. 20.51.18 # if i carry on with it i guess you'll see more of me here ;) 20.51.31 # shouldn't we be using the system printf ? 20.52.02 # Nico_P: Yes, we should - and I think we are... I probably meant to say the Rockbox printf is getting in the way of the system one. 20.52.11 # ok :) 20.52.20 Quit zobo (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.52.27 # linuxstb: by the way, ignoring obvious preferences like UI etc, will i have a harder time getting a build environment going under linux or under windows? 20.52.38 Join zobo [0] (n=obo@CPE002078c67dd3-CM0011ae015168.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) 20.52.54 # aa234238: the build env is meant for linux 20.52.58 # ahh 20.53.00 Quit zobo (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.53.27 Join zobo [0] (n=obo@CPE002078c67dd3-CM0011ae015168.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) 20.53.35 # aa234238: Linux is easier (and compiles faster). On Windows, your options are cygwin or Linux running in vmware. 20.54.13 # yeah, i was thinking i could use colinux under windows (not checked if that project is still alive tho..) - however been looking for an excuse to use XGL more so linux it is :) 20.54.24 # Ah yes, colinux works as well. 20.54.51 # I think you'll find info on using colinux for compiling Rockbox on the Rockbox website. 20.55.07 # cool, i'll have a good read of the wiki and look through the sources 20.55.09 # thanks for the help 20.55.31 # you're welcome. 20.55.54 # Nico_P: I'll commit checkwps-v3.diff then? 20.56.10 Quit zobo (Client Quit) 20.56.43 # linuxstb: I'm fine with it. maybe someone will come up with a solution for the warnings 20.56.53 Quit aa234238 () 20.57.02 Quit secleinteer (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 20.57.14 # and the functions you moved feel more at home in wps_parser.c 20.57.38 # Good. 20.59.06 Join chainlynx [0] (n=dannyc@c-24-23-194-98.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) 20.59.41 Quit XbooX (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 21.00.53 # Nico_P: OK, committed... 21.01.01 # cool :) 21.01.49 # is gigbeat s still sold? 21.02.27 # http://www.thebulletin.org/minutes-to-midnight/ 21.02.38 # oh sorry 21.03.00 Join krush1704 [0] (n=andikrus@p57BB249D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) 21.04.51 # preglow: google seems to be telling me no. 21.05.00 # damn, shelflife is getting short 21.05.08 # preglow: there are some on ebay 21.05.19 # I think the S is still sold in some places 21.05.30 # hmm, anyone know if the gigabeat s code injection tool works with zune? :/ 21.05.49 # preglow: it doesn't 21.05.51 # It doesn't. I think the exploit on the S doesn't exist on the Zune. 21.05.59 # I was going to add that :) 21.06.09 # would be seriously cool with an fpu target for rockbox... 21.06.09 # is someone tempted by the 500MHz arm + vector fpu? ;-) 21.06.29 # preglow: get startedon the port then :) 21.06.37 # That's what the Zune has? 21.06.41 # Lear: aye 21.06.52 # Nico_P: i'd need a unit first 21.06.53 # also time 21.07.04 # hrmr 21.07.04 # Lear: And the Gigabeat S. 21.07.23 Part The-Compiler ("Connection reseted by god") 21.07.36 # * linuxstb is starting to see his Gigabeat F as slow... 21.07.40 # preglow: toffe82 might be able to get you one 21.08.41 # :) 21.09.13 Join Tachikoma [0] (n=Tachikom@fl-71-53-133-205.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) 21.09.28 # why a zune ? the only difference with the S is the wifi if I remember 21.09.45 # It's a currently available device? 21.09.46 # does the 4th gen ipod have a colour screen? 21.10.03 # linuxstb: not on this side of the pond 21.10.23 # Tachikoma: some do, they are called ipod photo/color 21.10.26 # Tachikoma: The one with the colour screen does... There are two 4th gen - one is an greyscale LCD (normally just called "4th gen") and one with a colour LCD - called the Photo or Color. 21.10.28 # He, found a page claiming that the Broadcom chip is a 300 MHz ARM11 and a 150 MHz "video core"... 21.10.43 # i'm pretty sure it's arc based 21.10.45 # i ordered one off ebay 21.10.59 # and can tell if its the grayscale or the photo 21.11.02 # but that might be bs 21.11.13 # Tachikoma: If it's just advertised as "4th gen" then it will most likely be the greyscale version. 21.11.52 # well i was looking on youtube and this guy had a video of a 4th gen with colour 21.13.07 # The 4th gen with colour is more often called "ipod Color" or "ipod Photo". 21.13.34 # i know about the ipod photo 21.14.21 # If the ebay advert didn't advertise colour, then I would be very surprised if it was. 21.14.49 # alot of them don't 21.14.58 # it looks like it has colour 21.15.00 Join otih_ [0] (n=otih@p54A4FF54.dip.t-dialin.net) 21.15.34 # only reason i am getting it it to install linux on it 21.16.09 # You mean Rockbox? ;) 21.16.10 # i am a huge linux nut 21.16.20 # podzilla or rockbox 21.16.52 # podzilla is an application that runs on the ipodlinux kernel. Rockbox is a complete standalone firmware replacement - nothing to do with Linux. 21.17.11 # ohh 21.17.14 # i want 21.17.16 # lol 21.17.53 Quit Jon-Kha (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 21.18.11 # i just download the installer from the rockbox site? 21.18.57 Join robin0800 [0] (n=robin080@cpc5-brig8-0-0-cust142.brig.cable.ntl.com) 21.19.38 # wow, the gigabeat S is almost 9mm thinner than my h320 and slightly smaller in the other dimensions too /me wants one 21.19.50 Join Buschel [0] (n=AndreeBu@p54A3D53E.dip.t-dialin.net) 21.21.58 # * slarti likes his iaudio x5l... the battery life is incredible 21.23.35 Join shiftplusone [0] (n=shiftplu@c211-28-48-3.frank1.vic.optusnet.com.au) 21.23.51 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 21.25.11 Quit thegeek (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 21.25.34 Quit Tachikoma ("KVIrc 3.2.0 'Realia'") 21.25.55 Join perldiver [0] (n=say@cpe-72-225-231-80.nyc.res.rr.com) 21.26.29 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 21.26.55 Quit linuxstb (Nick collision from services.) 21.26.58 Nick linuxstb_ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 21.28.55 Quit otih (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 21.30.20 # mpeccorini: Have you thought about updating the manual for chessbox? 21.34.18 Part david11 21.36.10 Join netmasta10bt [0] (n=torment@pool-72-64-226-231.tampfl.fios.verizon.net) 21.37.45 # is FM working on sansa? 21.38.21 # netmasta10bt: not in the official builds, there's a patch for it though 21.38.33 # nls: great thx much 21.39.41 Join secleinteer [0] (n=secleint@adsl-70-237-245-39.dsl.stlsmo.sbcglobal.net) 21.39.49 Join thegeek [0] (n=thegeek@s189a.studby.ntnu.no) 21.41.33 Quit thegeek (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 21.42.22 Quit pearldiver (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 21.42.55 # linuxstb: no I had not thought about that, but now that you mention it, I definitely will 21.43.20 Join thegeek [0] (n=thegeek@s189a.studby.ntnu.no) 21.43.31 # prelow: you are there? 21.43.37 # preglow* 21.44.47 # linuxstb: however, I think I'd rather spend some more time adding the features listed in the wiki and take care of the manual when they're done 21.44.59 # linuxstb: what do you think? 21.46.01 # mpeccorini: It's up to you what you want to work on - I just thought I would mention it as I see you had a desire to document things.... 21.48.20 Quit jaczehack ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") 21.48.25 # linuxstb: hehe, if you mention that because of the ListWidget in the wiki, that was because I would have been VERY greatful if that had already existed ;-) 21.48.58 # but yes, I will update the manual, there's no point in adding features if no one can use them 21.49.10 # Or if no-one knows about them... 21.49.34 # right 21.50.03 # If you want to become an A-list patch submitter, you could even include manual patches with your code patches... 21.50.44 # sounds good, I didn't know the manual was in the SVN repository ... 21.50.57 # what format is it written in? 21.51.01 # plain text? 21.51.02 # Tex 21.51.04 # It's LaTeX. 21.51.45 # mpeccorini: it's quie easy to add stuff to it, just look at what's already there 21.51.59 # I will 21.52.25 # and if adding them to the patches is better, I'll do it that way 21.52.39 # them = the changes to the manual :p 21.53.23 # mpeccorini: yeah sure, although I would like to have the manual changes in a seperate patch which of course can be posted in the same task 21.53.43 # but either way is absolutley fine :-) 21.54.16 # if it works better for you, I'll have it in a separate patch 21.54.43 # but in that case, I'll have a patch just for the manual so it's updated with the features already added 21.55.44 # * mpeccorini thinks LaTeX is a little cryptic, even more than the C language 21.56.26 # * linuxstb suspects mpeccorini hasn't done much Perl 21.56.45 # * mpeccorini hasn't done any Perl at all 21.56.53 # * preglow doesn't get why people think perl looks cryptic 21.57.02 Join Jon-Kha [0] (n=Jon-Kha@a91-152-87-243.elisa-laajakaista.fi) 21.57.14 # Buschel: i'm here now, but i've got to go pretty soon and haven't got time for too much 21.57.24 # * mpeccorini thinks it's probably because they don't know it 21.57.36 # also, it uses $ and @ characters 21.57.37 # heh 21.57.54 # preglow: that's ok. you've made up your mind reagrding the decoder optimizations? 21.57.56 # but they really do clarify instead of obfuscate 21.58.28 # Buschel: haven't had time for rockbox stuff at all, sorry 21.58.39 # preglow: I don't think it looks cryptic, I think it is cryptic - i.e. I have no idea what's going on.... But that's obviously because I don't know it well enough. 21.59.02 # Buschel: probably won't have time until after the weekend either 21.59.04 # preglow: :o) same to me, our customer is pushing a lot 22.00.19 # preglow: just to let you know -> even if still using full precision (all 32bit-defines unused) the performance is +10% on ipod and about +3-4% on coldfire 22.01.19 # linuxstb: how can I preview the changes to Tex files, can you recommend a good/light/free/easy-to-use viewer? 22.01.40 # ... for windows 22.03.54 # Buschel: yeah, aware of it 22.07.54 # This is musepack, correct? 22.08.14 # mpeccorini: You "compile" it to either PDF or html. 22.08.41 Quit rift ("Lost terminal") 22.09.09 # mpeccorini: Create a build directory (e.g. build-manual), run ../tools/configure, and select "M" for manual. Then type "make" (for PDF) or "make html". 22.09.32 # I mean, the various mp3 decoders don't produce bit identical output, there are those various levels of compliance 22.10.00 # linuxstb: ok, thanks 22.10.28 Part maffe 22.10.45 Join maffe [0] (n=maffe@195.159.148.248) 22.11.27 # amiconn: yes, i was talking of musepack 22.11.58 # Buschel: (you may already have done this) but regardless of what gets enabled when your changes are committed, it would be nice to have a #define to control the accuracy, so both options are still available in the code. 22.12.29 # How would the amount of deviation caused by the additional optimisations relate to what the mp3 compliance levels allow? 22.12.34 # linuxstb: that's exactly the way the patch is done 22.12.44 # Buschel: I'll stop stating the obvious then ;) 22.12.47 # Do all mpc decoders up to now produce bit identical output? 22.13.40 Join saratoga [0] (i=9803c6dd@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-043835abdab85380) 22.13.52 # amiconn: no, normally the difference is +/-1 over 16bit range 22.14.22 # how many MPC decoders are there? The official one and peters right? 22.14.44 Join TrueJournals [0] (n=aimjourn@c-24-12-147-61.hsd1.il.comcast.net) 22.15.19 # preglow: I saw a used gigabeat S go on ebay for < 100 shipped the other day 22.15.26 Join PaulJam__ [0] (i=Paul@vpn-3113.gwdg.de) 22.15.29 # saratoga: Do you have a stripped-down wma2wav based on the current ffmpeg? 22.15.35 # there is a long history of official ones -- there was lots of optimizing in the past (especiall around 2000-2002) 22.15.45 Join pepie34 [0] (n=pepie34@cop60-1-82-240-26-92.fbx.proxad.net) 22.15.52 # if you're interested in the port, I'd be willing to kick in 30 USD for one, maybe others would 22.16.15 # linuxstb: yes I do, as well as an updated patch from the old code 22.16.20 # do you want either? 22.16.35 # I would be interested in the version based on current ffmpeg. 22.16.38 # Buschel: I just want to get an idea what enabling these additional optimisations means regarding sound quality 22.16.45 # (i'm afraid the rockbox decoder still has issues with the huffman coding though) 22.17.01 # ok, i'll upload it 22.17.02 # It might not be bad; lossy audio compression is always about making compromises 22.17.16 # saratoga: it was a working S ? 22.17.25 # saratoga: Is it just a program that you link with ffmpeg, or is it using the ffmpeg .c files directly, with your own makefile. 22.17.28 # If one doesn't want to make compromises, he'd go lossless 22.17.30 Quit saratoga (Client Quit) 22.17.35 Join saratoga [0] (i=9803c6dd@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-ec57ca020c3e204d) 22.17.41 Quit Psilonaut (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 22.17.56 # sorry 22.17.59 # my own makefile 22.18.04 # Good. 22.18.07 # i do not build ffmpeg 22.18.32 # amicon: if you take a look at the images i submitted in the patch-description, you will see the amount of additional noise which is committed by the 32bit-optimization 22.18.34 # amiconn: the differences seem to be unnoticable 22.18.36 Join Alldogship [0] (n=Alldogsh@bas3-montreal02-1096680967.dsl.bell.ca) 22.18.51 # amicon: noise is below masking... 22.19.17 # Hmm. 22.19.34 # saratoga: Have you spent much effort in stripping it down, or is it just at "first-attempt" stage? 22.19.45 # * amiconn didn't use mpc so far 22.19.45 # amicon: or better -> additional noise is below noise which is added through encoding 22.19.56 # a fair amount of effort, but it still needs a lot more 22.20.18 # theres a lot of crap left in the various structs, and some of the ffmpeg abstraction stuff is still there for the decoder initialization 22.20.40 # but its more stripped down then marsdaddy's 22.21.11 Quit PaulJam__ (".") 22.21.31 # i'm actually very impressed with John Paul's decoder 22.21.51 # i think it should be very fast if he'd bothered to do the fixed point stuff in asm and to use iram 22.22.17 # given the issues he had with c fixed point and running his look ups in DRAM, i'm not surprised it was slow 22.23.04 # but even in 32 bit precision, he has no overflows at all in my test files, and only occasional problems with some as yet unidentified bug in the huffman coding I think 22.24.35 # here you go http://www.duke.edu/~mgg6/rockbox/wmaplay.zip 22.25.21 # yeah, he mentioned one bug, i remember 22.25.27 # but why would huffman decoding bug out? 22.25.40 # no idea 22.25.44 # but it appears to 22.25.54 # rarely, it'll return garbage for a couple hundred frames 22.26.05 # at least i think its huffman, or unpacking the exponents or something 22.26.13 # its not in the MDCT or windowing at least 22.26.28 # i spent all night going through those and they appear to work correctly 22.26.34 # nice 22.26.34 # Are you able to create a very small WMA file that exhibits the problem? 22.26.39 # i think he just added a bug somewhere 22.26.41 # sure 22.27.08 # updated the wmaplay zip 22.27.16 # so redownload it 22.27.26 # the one i put up was seeked to a problem spot in a test sample 22.27.43 # test sample: http://www.duke.edu/~mgg6/rockbox/g_128k.wma 22.27.58 # saratoga: That looks a managable number of files... 22.28.33 # a lot of them are half #if 0 and not much else too! 22.28.36 Join amiconn_ [0] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 22.28.46 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.) 22.28.47 Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 22.29.00 Quit schula (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 22.29.11 # wmatest2.c is the loader, its pretty simple once the ffmpeg stuff is out of the way 22.30.09 # basically, theres an open on the input file and codec which call the init functions in the asf and wma c files respectively 22.30.11 # Hmm, I get a segmentation fault running "./wmaplay g_128k.wma" 22.30.17 # sorry 22.30.27 # ./wmaplay g_128k.wma out.wav 22.30.32 # Ah, OK 22.31.08 # Still a segmentation fault... 22.32.19 # oh me too 22.32.22 # let me see 22.32.46 # ./wmaplay g_128k.wma out.wav b 22.32.53 # sorry, dumb debug code i was just trying 22.33.10 # i made it look for a third input that triggers different debug screens 22.33.13 # i should comment that out 22.33.26 # Not to worry. 22.34.33 # as you can see i was just trouble shooting the MDCT and window length code in that build, so you get a lot of crap 22.35.00 # been dumping the coefficinets in both versions to see whats wrong with the integer one 22.35.31 # what were you looking for anyway? 22.35.35 # saratoga: you checked out if the bugging happens both on target and computer? 22.35.49 # i can't build for the target yet 22.35.52 # for lack of a target 22.35.57 Quit PaulJam_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 22.36.08 # i ordered a sansa and a gigabeat, but the holidays in the US mean the mail is very slow 22.37.13 # you have no rockbox targets? : 22.37.15 # ) 22.37.22 # saratoga: what gigabeat ? S30 or S60 22.38.03 Join jac0b [0] (n=jac0b@user-11209e0.dsl.mindspring.com) 22.38.44 Quit jac0b (Client Quit) 22.39.15 Quit shiftplusone ("Leaving") 22.39.24 # saratoga: The reason I asked was that I'm thinking (but not really that seriously) about porting the realaudio Cook decoder. So thought your stripped down ffmpeg could help... 22.39.48 # toffe82: sorry, just an F20 22.40.28 # linuxstb: sure, could help you too 22.40.30 # I thought you were interested in a S ;) 22.40.34 Quit Rondom (No route to host) 22.40.40 # I am, but no time to port that now 22.40.47 # got to get this WMA thing working 22.40.56 # one project at a time 22.41.00 # * bluebrother returns and notices that some LaTeX talk has happened ... 22.41.17 Quit Alldogship ("Leaving") 22.41.37 Join Rondom [0] (n=Rondom@p57A97D04.dip.t-dialin.net) 22.41.37 # basically, my stripped down version would work great, just got to change it to register the RA demux and decoder instead of ASF or WMA 22.42.16 # saratoga: That's what I thought... 22.42.20 Quit desowin ("use linux") 22.42.31 # what is cook anyway? 22.42.35 # i thought real used AAC now 22.42.40 # used 22.42.43 # cook is an older format, afaik 22.42.55 # its already fixed point? 22.43.19 # aye 22.43.24 # I thought it was, but just checking the code now, it doesn't seem to be... Maybe the patch wasn't committed. 22.43.35 # by the same dude that said he'd tackle wma 22.43.38 # linuxstb: oh? 22.45.02 # the GSOC projects have now started right? has austriancoder said anything about his USB project? 22.45.52 Join webguest51 [0] (i=18976e30@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-1a1ba4614a216999) 22.46.16 # saratoga: they started as of yesterday, afaik 22.46.46 # nico_p is around, so i assume he's started his. the speec synth guy was busy until june 10th, and ac i haven't heard from 22.47.43 Part TrueJournals 22.47.49 # i created a wikipage for my project in order to save people digging through IRC 22.48.04 # if anyone sees AC, bug him to do the same, so i can stop asking about it 22.48.44 # preglow: Unless I'm missing something, it seems the patch was never committed in the end... 22.49.03 # ironically, id rather his project work then mine 22.49.24 # heh 22.49.32 # outside of some sansa users, who cares about wma 22.49.36 # i'm really quite excited about all four projects 22.49.49 # its just mp3 with no subbands and variable MDCT window sizes 22.49.56 # saratoga: hell, i do, i have a wma file i'd like to be able to play :) 22.50.01 # saratoga: wma is popular amongst iriver users as well... 22.50.17 # who needs users anyway? ;-) 22.50.19 # * linuxstb hopes he can still find his wma file 22.50.33 # preglow: I haven't realy started mine 22.50.35 # saratoga: that pretty much sums up aac too... 22.50.35 # i linked my one WMA file if anyone needs it 22.50.48 # true 22.50.54 # So the three people showing interest in WMA have one file each? ;) 22.51.08 # its amusing how no one has really come up with a way to really beat MP3 22.51.12 # Nico_P: get going!"¤!"¤!" 22.51.17 # just fix the stupid bugs in the format 22.51.27 # but still leave the idea intact 22.51.41 # saratoga: turns out mp3 was pretty flexible after all, yeah 22.51.52 # preglow: :) I need to figure some things out 22.52.12 # if you know the playback engine I'll appreciate your help 22.52.15 # the one cool thing about WMA is the many block sizes you can use, I haven't heard of that before 22.52.22 # Nico_P: i happen to know absolutely nothing about it 22.52.32 # Nico_P: try getting hold of jhMikeS, he knows a hing or two 22.52.34 # thing, yes 22.52.34 Quit webguest51 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 22.52.48 Join jimh_jimh [0] (i=18976e30@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-da41dcd2387ac121) 22.52.48 # will do 22.53.04 # saratoga: as in it uses more than two in one file? 22.53.16 # yeah 22.53.27 # cool 22.53.29 # they're variable in powers of two from 128 to 4096 IIRC 22.53.38 # vorbis also has tons of window sizes, but only two can be used in one file 22.54.14 Join XbooX [0] (n=xboox04@206.186.45.240) 22.54.14 Quit XbooX (Remote closed the connection) 22.54.19 # Nico_P: lostlogic also knows a fair bit about the playback engine, although he's not around much nowadays 22.54.33 # should give wma very good transient handling I guess, but i have to wonder how they deal with the MDCT reconstructon, since they'd need a ton of different windows 22.54.40 # yeah, I'll try to ask him for advice if he shows up 22.54.57 Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@i-83-67-214-206.freedom2surf.net) 22.55.04 # what I'd like to do is set up a branch for my work so that people who know the code can review it and maybe help out a bit 22.55.33 # saratoga: well, from what i hear, wma has nasty pre-echo tendencies which point to anything but a good transient handling 22.55.44 Join XbooX [0] (n=xboox04@206.186.45.240) 22.55.53 # saratoga: different window sizes is no problem for mdct as long as you overlap them nicely 22.56.15 # yeah, but you'll need a window for each possible window transistion right? 22.56.31 # i guess they have some formula to convert between them 22.56.35 Join hannesd [0] (n=light@gate-hannes-tdsl.imos.net) 22.56.47 # well, kind of, but the new windows can still be constructed from existing ones 22.56.53 # so it's not like you need to generate new coefs or anything 22.56.53 # the code says something about resampling them, but i don't know how that wokrs 22.57.20 # maybe it is just as easy as zero padding/stuff to step between sizes 22.57.22 # i don't really know, all my playing about with mdct has been done with fixed-size blocks 22.57.49 # been meaning to ask: is there some way to get gcc to spit the output from the preprocessor out? 22.57.56 # as in preprocessed .c files 22.58.47 # -E 23.00.18 Quit Lear ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.3/2007030919]") 23.00.33 # saratoga: Is some of that zip file you sent me from an old ffmpeg? 23.01.41 Join TrueJournals [0] (n=aimjourn@c-24-12-147-61.hsd1.il.comcast.net) 23.02.05 # guys - I've been working on enhancing the mpegplayer plugin - is anyone here familiar with this code? 23.02.35 # linuxstb: yes, the asf stuff is parly from it 23.03.00 # since the newer stuff mainly added more abstractions I didn't want or need 23.03.06 # saratoga: OK, that explains why the cook decoder doesn't work... 23.03.24 # the codec interfaces haven't changed though 23.03.37 # they still only expose themselves through a function pointer table 23.03.48 Join p3tur [0] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) 23.03.49 # I'm sure it's fixable. Just wanted to make sure I was understanding what I was looking at. 23.04.03 # though the function names in futils and utils.c will be different, moved around and changed some 23.04.17 # Yes, that's what I was hoping you had reconciled... 23.04.24 # actually, i never got the current SVN ffmpeg to work 23.04.42 # so i took the WMA code from it and went with that 23.05.08 # they changed something in utils.c that broke all the example code i could find, eventually i gave up in fustration 23.05.55 # I can understand that... 23.06.03 # jimh_jimh: What's your question? 23.06.23 # probably the code you have will have a mountain of crap in utils and cook.c related to "probing" which is how they figure out what a container actually contains 23.06.43 # if you strip that out and just hard code Cook to .RA, then most of the changes since then don't really matter 23.07.01 # the codec and container init stuff is relateively simple and not changed very much 23.07.48 # linuxstb: I'm trying to get ff/rew to work - I've managed to get the sound thread to jump around to the new playing point, but the video won't jump ahead/back in the buffer - any suggestions? 23.07.56 # saratoga: OK, but I think I need to leave it now. 23.08.15 Part Llorea1 23.08.41 # jimh_jimh: I know jhmikes has done a lot of work on the buffering code in mpegplayer (and was also planning to implement seeking at some point). He's probably the best person to talk to. 23.09.51 Quit davina (Remote closed the connection) 23.10.00 # linuxstb: thanks - I've also written some code that allows for resuming - I'll try to get in touch with him in case he wants to incorporate it with his work 23.12.41 Quit pepie34 ("Ex-Chat") 23.12.51 # jimh_jimh: You should post your code on flyspray... maybe some people could help there 23.13.33 Join Llorean [0] (n=Llorean@cpe-70-113-91-140.austin.res.rr.com) 23.13.52 Nick p3tur is now known as petur (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) 23.16.41 # ugh my Sansa is in a building less then 55 minutes from my door, yet the post office is predicting another week to get it to me 23.16.49 # i don't understand how this is possible 23.18.40 Join ducbian [0] (n=Nick@cpc2-cmbg3-0-0-cust33.cmbg.cable.ntl.com) 23.19.25 Join ivan` [0] (i=ivan@unaffiliated/ivan/x-000001) 23.19.49 # hi - is there any easy way to take something like http://tinyurl.com/2fcfk2 and create an 'flatter' equalization for the DT990 on rockbox? 23.19.56 # without manually playing with Q values and listening all day 23.22.17 Join Wiwie [0] (n=goddi@p5B09C34D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) 23.22.18 Quit Wiwie (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 23.22.30 Join Wiwie [0] (n=goddi@p5B09C34D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) 23.23.03 Part TrueJournals 23.23.55 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 23.24.37 Quit Wiwie (Client Quit) 23.26.01 Join ShedAdatiCheapSl [0] (i=ritz@bzq-88-154-49-125.red.bezeqint.net) 23.26.47 Nick ShedAdatiCheapSl is now known as use1ess (i=ritz@bzq-88-154-49-125.red.bezeqint.net) 23.26.55 Quit Thundercloud (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 23.27.55 Join Thundercloud [0] (n=thunderc@82.153.10.15) 23.29.40 Quit jimh_jimh ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 23.32.34 # Llorean: Around? 23.36.44 # linuxstb: Yes 23.37.00 Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@c-71-205-0-132.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) 23.37.15 Join alexsaway [0] (n=alex@static220-21.adsl.no) 23.37.17 # heya 23.37.39 # anyone here? 23.37.44 # yes 23.39.08 # Llorean: I was trying to modify a forum post containing a DOS directory listing so it was readable, but got some odd behaviour I thought you might understand. The part of the message was being interpreted as markup - but only in the real post, not the preview. i.e. the preview was different to the final post... 23.39.11 # ivan` - I can't think of any easy way.. 23.39.27 # that's ok, i mostly got it with the peaks 23.39.42 Quit thegeek (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 23.39.51 # my ears are way too sensitive to highs 23.39.57 # linuxstb: Yeah, Anything wrapped in a <> is considered markup, but for some reason not in the preview, and I haven't really gotten to look into it. 23.40.08 # I sortof feel there should be a way to plot the frequency response of the sw filter though .. preglow? 23.40.10 # linuxstb: The easiest solution, as a workaround, is to add spaces < DIR > 23.40.24 # Llorean: That's what I did in the end. 23.40.51 # uhm i think im abit screwed.. i cant boot in to normal boot , i cant get it connected to pc becuse rockbox doesnt support that yet on sansa 23.40.53 # any ideas? 23.40.53 # .. 23.41.12 # linuxstb: TBH, I'm kinda hoping that it'll just be 'fixed' with an update. 23.41.41 # alexsaway: Why can't you boot into the official firmware? What does it say when you try? 23.41.46 Quit atsea- (Remote closed the connection) 23.42.02 # well , i installed that thing that auto boots in to orginal 23.42.31 # now suddenly it just boots into rockbox 23.42.36 # cant press < button either 23.42.52 # Llorean: I think the problem is that the forum software isn't quoting <> - so "" is being sent to the browser as-is, and is processed as a tag. 23.42.56 # alexsaway: you can use recovery mode to restore the original 23.43.10 # how? 23.43.16 # alexsaway: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaE200TroubleShooting 23.43.24 # thanks <33 23.43.45 # linuxstb: It just seems odd to me that the preview mode handles it differently than the actual post mode. 23.45.14 # Llorean: So people can use HTML in messages? 23.46.22 Join scorche` [0] (i=scorche@rockbox/administrator/scorche) 23.46.39 Join Thundercloud_ [0] (n=thunderc@81.5.171.82) 23.47.42 Join donutman25 [0] (n=chatzill@24.244.160.233) 23.47.42 # linuxstb: I mean, though, the whole point of preview is to show you what the message will look like when posted, right? So any time the preview and message don't look the same, it's a bug? 23.48.39 # Llorean: Sorry, my question wasn't an answer to your message... I agree preview should do what the name says. 23.49.15 # But my question was whether people can use html in messages - I at least seem to be able to, without the [html] markup. 23.49.54 # stripwax: you there? 23.50.14 # linuxstb: People aren't supposed to be able to, the option is unchecked. 23.50.20 # linuxstb - what is the status of the MPA patch in http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/6705?pagenum=4 ? Other than the profiling, (and the potential small diffs due to the new dct), is it committable? 23.50.21 # Buschel - ay 23.51.14 # Llorean: Am I (I'm not sure what group I'm in) supposed to be able to? 23.51.20 # stripwax: just saw your post regarding the battery type patch. is there any way to differ 60/80GB iPODs from 30GB ones? 23.51.27 # linuxstb: As far as I know, it's not group specific 23.51.37 # stripwax: at compiletime? 23.51.39 # It's supposed to be disabled across the board. 23.51.42 # * Llorean checks his dummy account 23.52.02 # Buschel - when you configure, you get the option of specifying memory size. 60GB and 80GB have 64MB. Could use that? 23.52.15 # (i.e. ../tools/configure asks for ipod video memory size) 23.52.42 # Someone should really check how much RAM the G5.5 30GB has 23.52.49 # was just about to say same 23.52.56 # battery too. 23.53.17 # linuxstb: It seems any account can do it. 23.53.19 # Should be simple - just install a 64MB build. If it runs, it has 64MB, if it crashes, it has only 32 23.53.40 Join atsea- [0] (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-f928e5e1df681f0c) 23.53.43 # batteries are 400mAh for 30GB and 600mAh for 60/80GB (Li-Ion) 23.53.54 # Buschel - 5.5G too? 23.54.11 # yep, that's what apple sites sais 23.54.31 Quit Thundercloud (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 23.55.28 Quit alexsaway ("( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: www.XLhost.de )") 23.56.10 # stripwax: been wondering about that patch too 23.56.16 # seems like a good thing to have 23.58.07 # hmmmm 23.58.25 # * amiconn would like to see mpegplayer support sample rates != 44100 Hz