--- Log for 27.11.107 Server: kubrick.freenode.net Channel: #rockbox --- Nick: logbot Version: Dancer V4.16 Started: 20 days and 2 hours ago 00.00.00 # Congratulations Bagder \o/ 00.00.16 Join zajacattack [0] (i=42617b7b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-0b1a116e5b394cab) 00.00.23 # http://daniel.haxx.se/blog/2007/11/27/scandinavian-free-software-award-nominee/ 00.00.29 # rasher: ah, in German it's only seperate up to 12 as in quite a few other languages 00.00.54 # so, how is the work on the USB stack going? 00.02.06 # Bagder: congrats! 00.02.39 # * scorche|w cheers for Bagder 00.03.30 # * rasher adds yet another half-baked patch to the tracker 00.03.38 # yes, congrats Bagder 00.03.44 # With any luck, someone will take one and run with it some day 00.06.32 Join Traveler2 [0] (n=traveler@CPE-69-23-137-242.wi.res.rr.com) 00.06.34 # w00t 00.06.44 # yay, got my first plugin working 00.07.11 # all it does is draw a rectangle and wait till you press the quit button, but its a start 00.07.13 # what's the price? free software? :P 00.07.29 # haha, who knows 00.11.36 # Bagder: Wear a rockbox shirt at the ceremony ;) 00.11.42 Join J3TC- [0] (n=jetc123@pool-71-125-77-210.nwrknj.east.verizon.net) 00.12.41 # Nico_P: I won't even make it to the ceremony! :-/ I'm doing a speech at that conference, but the day after the ceremony as I'm going there and back again on the same day (~3 hours train trip each way) 00.13.52 # Bagder: ooh, shame... what if you get the award? 00.14.10 Join axion [0] (n=axion@cpe-74-70-239-192.nycap.res.rr.com) 00.14.20 # I don't think that'll happen, but I won't be there anyway 00.15.18 # Bagder: well, good luck on your speech 00.16.22 # I might wear my rockbox shirt then ;-) 00.17.09 # the white one? 00.17.27 # might be as fun as to see the rockbox shirt in China, markun found the pic I believe :) 00.17.33 # do you also have curl t-shirts? 00.17.42 # hehe 00.17.49 # markun: nope, we don't 00.18.10 # * linuxstb notices the Gigabeat S has 64MB of RAM, not 32MB as configure says... 00.18.18 # nice :) 00.19.24 # amiconn: you should have removed those extreme fade out times too, heh 00.19.42 # s 00.19.57 # oops 00.20.03 Quit axion ("leaving") 00.20.13 # Overlooked one get_talk_id function that needs adjustment 00.20.16 # amiconn: player warnings, of all things 00.20.16 Join axion [0] (n=axion@cpe-74-70-239-192.nycap.res.rr.com) 00.20.44 Nick axion is now known as axionix (n=axion@cpe-74-70-239-192.nycap.res.rr.com) 00.20.51 # * preglow finally sets fade in time to 200 ms 00.20.59 # Yeah jumpscroll_getlang(). Don't even need to look at the log 00.21.04 Quit axionix (Client Quit) 00.21.16 Join axion [0] (n=axion@cpe-74-70-239-192.nycap.res.rr.com) 00.21.21 # and a cute little green delta too 00.21.56 Quit axion (Client Quit) 00.22.09 Join axionix [0] (n=axion@cpe-74-70-239-192.nycap.res.rr.com) 00.22.10 # yup 00.22.18 # I hoped for that green delta :) 00.22.53 Quit axionix (Client Quit) 00.22.54 Quit Billenium ("Ex-Chat") 00.23.05 Join axionix [0] (n=axion@cpe-74-70-239-192.nycap.res.rr.com) 00.23.44 # Hrrm, that reminds me. This jump scroll thingy needs to be either repaired+extended, or removed 00.23.54 # * amiconn would prefer the former 00.23.55 Join donutman25 [0] (n=chatzill@65.75.87.48) 00.24.21 # amiconn: btw, buschell stripped everything but the vuv change from his patch, commit now? 00.24.34 # * preglow doesn't like having obvious commital candidates hanging around in the tracker 00.24.43 # Yeah I know. Was busy with that backlight fading stuff 00.25.01 Quit Zagor ("Client exiting") 00.26.54 # Any objections to committing the matrix demo? Someone fixed my awful coding. 00.28.11 # go ahead 00.28.15 # how many targets does it support? 00.28.28 # * amiconn builds for G5 00.28.57 # I think it works on all colour targets, except for those lacking keymaps 00.29.10 # What keys are needed? 00.29.21 # just speed up/down and exit 00.29.34 # So it's not like that's a huge problem 00.29.37 # linuxstb: dual boot works fine :) 00.29.50 # The thing's here by the way: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7920 00.30.04 # He also created one that asks for a password when exiting, but I'm not sure about committing that 00.30.16 # Did anyone get a chance to try http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8226 on nano? 00.30.26 # Nico_P: Nice... I think I would still like to get it working better before committing though - i.e. having the dual-boot code in the Rockbox bootloader, rather than hard-coded in mknkboot. 00.30.48 # rasher: drop the password stuff, none of the other "screensavers" do it 00.31.01 # rasher: and if we ever do anything like that, it should be just one plugin or one core feature 00.31.11 # * stripwax hmms 00.31.23 # preglow: Agreed. 00.31.25 # whats this about a dual boot code? 00.31.27 # Sliding Puzzle shows up under "Applications". Should that be Games? 00.31.29 Nick midkay_ is now known as midkay (n=midkay@63-226-229-228.tukw.qwest.net) 00.31.33 # stripwax: deed 00.31.56 # preglow - ok, will add that to my patch too 00.32.08 # stripwax: what patch? 00.32.13 # amiconn: is your next step to move the sound units out of firmware? I was most of the way through that last night, but the recording string held me up. 00.32.21 # preglow - I'm updating the sliding_puzzle bitmap patch 00.32.45 # preglow - that is to say, I'm working on it at the moment, I haven't updated the tracker yet 00.32.49 # safetydan: I am planning to do some greyscale work next 00.33.18 # Too much high-level work in succession isn't good for my motivation ;) 00.33.36 # hehehe 00.33.41 # you sound like preglow complaining about doing ui code :) 00.33.58 # rasher: Do you have an ipod? 00.34.00 # stripwax: ahh, ok 00.34.01 # Yeah, low-level code is definitely more fun 00.34.04 # linuxstb: nope - sansa 00.34.27 # I got an ipod, planning to upgrade to sansa e200 00.34.37 Quit lee-qid (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 00.34.43 Join lucas42 [0] (n=s0681043@dwarmo.inf.ed.ac.uk) 00.34.44 # safetydan: about ui code, did you ever flesh out that new eq screen any more? 00.34.47 # rasher: I've looked briefly at matrix, and it doesn't look like it will increase/decrease speed on repeat events - which is annoying with the wheel. Also, it seems odd to use the wheel on the ipod, but not on the Sansa. 00.35.14 # linuxstb: isn't that basically a case of adding |BUTTON_REPEAT somewhere appropriate? 00.35.44 # hey, has anyone here been working on the new USB stack? 00.35.48 # Is there any reason why matrix wouldn't work on greyscale/mono? 00.36.07 # amiconn: not really. It'll look silly on mono though, I predict 00.36.11 # zajacattack: zagor's done most of it and he left a short while ago 00.36.37 # rasher: I think so... 00.36.50 Join Inkey5 [0] (n=james@209.235.162.29) 00.36.59 # rasher: How many speed settings are there? IMO the wheel only makes sense with a large range of values. 00.37.11 # how do I transfer files to my sansa e250 w/ rockbox on it? 00.37.23 # windows does not recognize a storage device 00.37.26 # * linuxstb reads the code and it seems there is no upper limit to how slow it gets... 00.37.29 # osx doesnt either 00.37.36 # linuxstb: iirc, it just adjusts a sleep, so in theory limitless 00.37.47 # Inkey5, that'd be because you need to boot to the OF for usb transfer right now 00.38.16 # so, why can some older devices do USB but not the new ones? 00.38.25 Join advcomp2019_ [0] (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 00.38.30 # Inkey5 - the usb code is under development and won't do the right thing if you connect your device to your PC while rockbox is running on your device 00.38.45 # zajacattack: the old models use a hardware usb bridge 00.38.51 # ah 00.38.57 # and what do the new use? 00.39.01 # software 00.39.02 # reboot and hold left? 00.39.07 # rasher: At the very least, I think the missing kemaps need to be added for all color targets. Looking at it, I think that's just the H10 and C200? 00.39.13 # Inkey5, yep 00.39.14 # o, i see 00.39.43 # linuxstb: I'll fix that and the wheel thing and commit? 00.39.46 Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection) 00.40.08 # is there an etr on the usb thing? 00.40.21 # can we expect a fix soon? 00.40.26 Join Thundercloud [0] (n=thunderc@resnet05.nat.lancs.ac.uk) 00.40.47 # Inkey5: it's not a fix. More along the lines of "writing a complete driver and usb stack" 00.40.50 # Inkey5: we don't estimate dates ot times for anything 00.40.52 # well, right 00.41.01 # thats cool 00.41.11 # I appreciate what you guys have done, nonetheless 00.41.16 # Some work has been done, and the rest could take days, or months. Or never work at all. 00.41.24 # rasher: It looks to me as if it will work on greyscale targets - have you tried compiling it? Also, does it make sense for all LCDs to use the same sized bitmaps? (sorry for being fussy....) 00.43.17 # * jhMikeS notices the sansa bootloader now boots rockbox by default even when plugged 00.43.38 # rasher: You could simply use the actions system for the keymaps. 00.44.10 # Llorean: I can never remember if the wheel will do the right thing.. I'm guessing not. 00.44.32 # Yeah, it wouldn't likely use the wheel 00.44.50 # Doesn't bubbles use the action code? That's using the wheel. 00.44.58 # Or rather, it'd invert the wheel 00.45.30 # Well, maybe. 00.45.34 # linuxstb: the e200 has an exception in bubbles... 00.46.05 # Actually, looks like the ACTION_STD context would work well 00.46.11 # pixelma: Why? Isn't it comparable to the ipod? 00.46.19 # Scroll down, and "Down with the stick" for h120 are equivalent 00.46.32 # * linuxstb regrets asking pixelma about plugin actions ;) 00.46.52 # linuxstb: probably because someone was afraid to break other plugins 00.47.21 # (JdGordon did that commit himself...) 00.47.44 # Shouldn't matrix be the same as the settings? i.e. SETTINGS_INC, SETTINGS_DEC ? 00.47.45 # Llorean: plugin use their own system of button actions 00.48.00 # I think the plugin action suffers from: a) being implemented on bubbles first b) trying to d too much c) poor documentation 00.48.01 # * JdGordon did what? 00.48.02 # pixelma: I thought at least one plugin used the ACTION_STD mappings? 00.48.21 # text editor? 00.48.38 # yeah because it uses the core virtual keyboard 00.48.54 # But couldn't another plugin use ACTION_STD mappings too? 00.49.00 # JdGordon: the e200 keymap change in bubbles 00.49.03 # If it just needs generic "Next, Prev, and Cancel" keys? 00.49.36 # yes, plugins can use the core mappings also 00.50.30 Quit linuxstb ("ChatZilla 0.9.79 [Firefox 2.0.0.9/2007102514]") 00.51.01 Quit MethoS- (Remote closed the connection) 00.51.54 Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@unaffiliated/jhulst) 00.52.20 # * stripwax hmms again 00.52.43 # I see from apps/plugins/CATEGORIES that sliding_puzzle is indeed flagged as Games. But when I make install it ends up in apps. Any ideas why that is? 00.52.47 Join linuxstb [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 00.52.51 # preglow: Tested and committed. 00.52.58 Quit ender` (" But there, everything has its drawbacks, as the man said when his mother-in-law died, and they came down upon him for the f") 00.53.42 # amiconn: excellent 00.53.45 # stripwax: viewers.config can move it also 00.54.12 # JdGordon - ah. right. That's good to know.. 00.54.31 # yep, that's it. thanks! 00.54.48 # Hrm, (button & (~BUTTON_REPEAT)) will just unset the button_repeat bit, right? 00.54.59 # should do 00.55.19 Quit petur ("Zzzzz") 00.55.28 Quit advcomp2019 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 00.55.47 Nick advcomp2019_ is now known as advcomp2019 (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 00.56.50 # linuxstb: the dual boot is really a plus... and I can update while in the OF without a problem and it doesn't erase my files 00.57.12 Join Lars_G [0] (n=Lars@unaffiliated/lars-g/x-000001) 00.57.19 # maybe we can think of loading a file now 00.57.26 # apps/settings_list.c has unresolved merge at the end 00.57.30 Join aliask [0] (n=chatzill@c58-109-97-210.eburwd4.vic.optusnet.com.au) 00.57.35 # dah it's MY merge 00.57.36 # nvm 00.59.24 # Nico_P: Glad it's useful. I'm experimenting a little now, and it seems that RAM is 64MB starting at 0x88000000 - so up to 0x8bffffff 01.00.10 # linuxstb: you've got a gigabeat s now? 01.00.12 # IIUC, eboot.bin is being loaded to 0x88000000, and then nk.bin is being loaded at the addresses specified in the nk.bin chunk headers, which start at 0x88200000 01.00.17 # * amiconn will try to find out where this excessive 2KB alignment on PP502x comes from 01.00.18 # Hmmm is it me or the usb stack was dropped? 01.00.26 # preglow: I've had one for a while, but have been resisting the urge to hack... 01.00.36 # linuxstb: more than i would have been able to 01.00.56 # amiconn: why would pp need to align by 2kb? 01.01.14 # linuxstb: how does one put rockbox on it, btw? 01.01.15 # gcc won't even accept alignments that large I thought 01.01.25 # That's what I don't know... but the build table shows that it does 01.01.26 # linuxstb: Did you get dual booting working? 01.01.29 # though the theres 16384 bytes array for usb 01.02.00 Quit scorche|w ("CGI:IRC") 01.02.01 # aliask: Yes, but I'm still not completely understanding what is going on. I got it working by injecting 28 bytes of code (the hold-switch check and branches) to 0x88200000 01.02.42 # aliask: Also, are you aware the S has 64MB of RAM? tools/configure states 32MB. 01.03.14 # linuxstb: Yes, I did. But in the configure script I noticed a comment that said "always 32" so I didn't change it. 01.03.44 Join hcs [0] (n=agashlin@rockbox/contributor/hcs) 01.04.34 # yay, reboot on usb works on sansa 01.04.53 Part LinusN 01.05.43 # linuxstb: is it now possible to rockbox a gigabeat s with no other tools than our own? 01.05.55 # heh, after SVN up, 3g myteriously boots again :p ... to heck with it, I'm committing the DC for 5002 since the problems are obviously unrelated. 01.06.09 Part Lars_G 01.06.36 # jhMikeS: are these the same bugs amiconn are having on his 2g? 01.07.10 # I think so 01.07.52 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 01.08.01 Quit linuxstb (Nick collision from services.) 01.08.06 Nick linuxstb_ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 01.08.10 # 3g is happily playing SPCs again...just from SVN up 01.08.23 # nice 01.08.37 # I wonder how this compares to IPL's SPC player 01.08.53 # well, then i guess a binary search for an offending commit is coming up, though i can see how such a search might be difficult to do accurately... 01.08.55 # preglow: Yes. Although you need a copy of the original firmware to patch, and I think the update tool will only work on Linux. 01.09.03 # hcs: probably favourably, it is top quality 01.09.22 # aliask: Have you tried creating an nk.bin with just Rockbox in it? 01.09.22 # jhMikeS: is kickin' ass 01.09.29 # aliask: that "always 32" comment is because you can chose the RAM size of some of the targets... 01.09.29 # linuxstb: well, sure, i hardly expected to not need the original firmware yet, heh 01.09.33 Quit gromit`` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 01.10.01 # grah 01.10.06 # the lust for gigabeat s strikes again 01.10.13 Join gromit` [0] (n=gromit@ras75-5-82-234-244-69.fbx.proxad.net) 01.10.18 # linuxstb: Can we extract that copy of the original fw from the device? 01.10.27 # preglow: You _really_ don't want to see the original firmware though... 01.10.37 # linuxstb: As in, without the OF? 01.10.41 # aliask: Yes. 01.10.49 # preglow: Yes, I have to agree with that. Don't boot the OF, and absolutely don't try to actually *use* it or navigate in it 01.10.49 # linuxstb: i really don't plan on it 01.10.58 # Llorean: I don't think so. 01.10.59 # linuxstb: cant be worse than the irivers...? can it? 01.11.15 # i thought iriverfw was ok 01.11.22 # I've forgotton what the iriver firmware is like, thanks to Slasheri it no longer exists. 01.11.31 # linuxstb: I tried, but it was difficult to get an nk.bin which would be allowed to be sent by the gigabeat v updater - the nk.bin format isn't well documented 01.11.42 # bootloaders seem ok after rearranging crt0-pp-bl.S too 01.11.46 # linuxstb: so, what shape is the port in? 01.12.07 # jhMikeS: gcc won't accept it?? Look at usb-drv-pp502x.c, line 310... 01.12.17 # __attribute((aligned (2048))); 01.12.32 # preglow: I'm not sure really - I've just been working on getting dual-boot to work, to make installing test code easier. I haven't actually tried any code, apart from the "hello world" bootloader which is in svn. 01.12.34 # * amiconn wonders why the heck such an alignmend would be needed 01.12.40 # Soooo... Who to credit for the matrix plugin? It was originally cmatrix for linux, ported to ipl/podzilla, ported to rockbox... 01.12.40 # *alignment 01.13.10 # linuxstb: so, rockbox isn't working yet? 01.13.31 # * Nico_P doesn't fine the gigabeat S OF *that* bad 01.13.32 # linuxstb: However, you can see my efforts in /tools/gigabeats.c (for scramble.c) 01.13.37 # preglow: far from it 01.13.40 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 01.13.51 # any major difficulties left? 01.13.59 # amiconn: hmmm....maybe the assembler was whining then 01.14.12 # There is a limit though 01.14.31 # .align in gas means actually 2^n for most targets 01.15.11 # sliding puzzle bmp / albumart patch updated http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7218 01.15.35 # ok, now, the e200 v2 have completly different HW, so there's no way to update a v1 to a v2, right? 01.16.00 # zajacattack: Yes, change the hardware... 01.16.05 # zajacattack: Not unless you get out your soldering iron.. 01.16.13 # .balign is just a byte align though and has a small limit 01.16.19 # ok 01.16.39 Join alienbiker99 [0] (n=alienbik@ool-44c126d4.dyn.optonline.net) 01.17.00 Quit advcomp2019 ("Nice Scotty, now beam my clothes up too!") 01.17.06 # aliask: I posted my dualboot patch here - http://www.davechapman.f2s.com/rockbox/dualboot.diff 01.18.03 # linuxstb: Will test 01.18.51 # so wait, rockbox will install on new sansa e200's, right? 01.19.02 # stripwax: your change to viewers.config looks wrong? doesnt that put it in .rockbox/rocks instead of /rocks/games ? 01.19.02 # not the v2 models 01.19.13 # Is the Gigabeat S the i.MX31 or i.MX31L? 01.19.18 # L 01.19.28 # What's the difference? 01.19.32 # No 3D graphics. 01.19.33 # no graphics accelerator 01.19.37 # JdGordon hm - possibly, if I didn't upload the correct patch.. 01.19.42 # Damn, I want a refund... 01.20.09 # though it's quite overkill for an mp3 player even without accelerated open gl... 01.20.13 # Llorean: I thought you were joking, but then again, it's the Gigabeat S.. 01.20.16 # So "L" is the "lite" version? ;) 01.20.26 # JdGordon: Did you check out my formatter/getlang unification? 01.20.29 # rasher: Considering how much overkill this chip already has... 01.20.32 # JAVA acceleration? 01.20.41 # What, seriously? 01.20.42 # amiconn: yeah, had a quick glance.. looks fine 01.20.46 # ok 01.20.54 # rasher: "Jazelle Java acceleration" 01.21.13 # so how do I know if a sansa e200 is v2 or not? 01.21.14 # * JdGordon wants openGL accelerated lists in rockbox! 01.21.14 # Llorean: Well, java definitely needs acceleration even on multi-GHz PCs to be bearable... 01.21.17 # And it still takes 15 seconds to boot... 01.21.19 # Llorean: that's just bizarre. I guess someone should hurry up and port j2me before the S port gets going anyway. 01.21.26 # JdGordon - hm, that is strange indeed. Let me recreate the patch, that is not the version I actually have.. 01.21.30 # Traveler2: It says v2 on the back of it, and "audible support" on the box 01.21.42 # linuxstb: 15s from a hard disk player? thats not bad at all... 01.21.53 # JdGordon: That's sloow 01.21.55 # rasher: sure, it does java natively. why not, it bloody has a simd fpu too 01.21.56 # rasher: It claims to rival the effective throughput of a 3ghz system with its "Smart Speed Switch" technology. They seem to think this thing will solve all the world's problems too. 01.22.07 # Archos recorder boot within 5 seconds (with rockbox in flash) 01.22.16 # And that chip only has 11MHz 01.22.25 # ok, so maybe its only the h300 which is slow? 01.22.27 # * JdGordon shuts up 01.22.45 # The H300 boot time is annoying to say the least 01.22.50 # h300 OF takes between 30-60 seconds iirc :/ 01.23.00 # okay, so if amazon.com has a sansa e200 and one of its images shows it running rockbox its a v1? 01.23.02 # The S's OF is almost 13MB though... 01.23.07 # h120 OF takes longer, because of it's appalling tag database 01.23.10 # its 01.23.14 # that was the major selling point for rockbox when I first got it :) 01.23.15 # is there any work being done on an actual Rockbox player? 01.23.23 # Traveler2: As long as it's not the model that supports Audible. 01.23.42 # h300 OF is only slow when the iriver db is enabled, for me it booted in ~12 seconds. 01.23.43 # stripwax: the h300 takes about 30 with the db disabled... 01.23.47 # Seriously though, who do I put in CREDITS for the matrix plugin? The guy who wrote the original cmatrix (at the bottom, perhaps)? The guy who ported it to ipl? The guy who fixed my mistakes (yes) 01.23.54 # JdGordon: _maybe_ an svn bootloader would speed things up a bit on H300. But I won't test one without a bdm wiggler around... 01.24.06 # rasher: "Yes to all" I think? 01.24.06 # rasher: "The Matrix team" ? (half-serious...) 01.24.06 # rasher: well, was porting it to ipl major bother? 01.24.29 # PaulJam: Imo boot time on H300 *into rockbox* leaves a lot to be desired 01.24.30 # preglow: I've never looked at the original code, so I've no idea to be honest. 01.24.42 # amiconn: I tihnk i have a testing bootloader on it... it doesnt really worry me seen as i dont use it anymore (its my brothers dap now) 01.24.44 # rasher: if any part seems like a decent amount of work, credit the person who did it 01.24.47 # linuxstb: I'm leaning towards that, with a regular credit to the guy who fixed my code 01.24.49 Join Febs [0] (n=chatzill@207-172-204-33.c3-0.rdl-ubr4.trpr-rdl.pa.cable.rcn.com) 01.25.04 # there is not "matrix team", so that would be silly 01.25.04 # preglow: He's not named by full name though :| 01.25.21 # Only "Alastair S" - maybe his name is known? 01.25.22 # amiconn: well, the h300 is my only rockbox target, so i can only compare to the OF and tehre is see an improvement. 01.25.22 # just call him Bob 01.25.39 # I'll just add everyone to CREDITS individually then 01.25.48 # rasher: did he copyright the ipl source? 01.26.06 # preglow: There's a copyright notice with his name in it, below the original author's 01.26.13 # ok, then skipping his name is a bit too much 01.26.39 # JdGordon - I'm an idiot, I reuploaded the old patch rather than the new one. Thanks! 01.26.49 Quit n1s () 01.26.55 # :) 01.27.10 # preglow: I guess I'll just put Alastair S. It's not like he's a direct contributor, and I'll bet there are semi-anonymous contributors to some of our codecs as well 01.27.12 # ill commit it unless anyone has objections? (the real new version that is) 01.27.46 # 2 builds in a row crashed? 01.27.50 # okay, amazon.com has a sansa e280, any idea which version it would be? 01.28.02 Part toffe82 01.28.25 # what, no one cared to mention the /var problem to the swedes? 01.29.08 # bah bum! 01.29.11 # /var has 150 megs of space left, i dunno if that's enough 01.29.16 # at least it compiled... 01.29.41 # amiconn: boot time could be made quite fast on H300 by flashing the rockbox bootloader just like on H120/140, the thing is that we need a "Slahseri" (or should I say "Flasheri") with an H300 :P 01.29.52 # Nico_P: yay. 01.30.03 # :) 01.30.21 # Bagder: /var seems to be really tight on the build server 01.30.21 # Nico_P: you want to look into fixing gapless or want me to? 01.30.35 # lostlogic: I won't do it now, that's for sure 01.30.46 # lostlogic: do you have ideas? 01.31.41 # stripwax: search_files() hits the hard disk right? wouldnt it be better to have albumart_get_filename() or something which returns the known filename instead of doinf the search again? 01.31.48 # or wont it really make a difference for viewer? 01.31.57 # s/viewer/slider 01.33.12 # JdGordon - it should only get called when you change the picture (e.g. select+right on ipod), it doesn't hit the disk more than necessary. also the "known filename" isn't quite right, I'm adding a note to the tracker to explain 01.33.17 # stripwax: and last thing... you added functions into the middle of the plugin API which is bad! 01.33.31 # linuxstb: Did you ever get any of those random freezes that Nico_P had? 01.33.43 # add them to the end... or bump the plugin api version 01.33.59 # aliask: No, I haven't got as far as trying to make the bootloader do anything interesting. 01.34.00 # JdGordon- ah, crap. Thanks, yes, I'll add to the end. 01.34.04 # aliask: I haven't seen them yet with linuxstb's patch 01.35.17 # linuxstb: Well, it seems they stemmed from the original nk.bin file that was being used. The ones on the wiki seem to cause that problem, but the one I've been using doesn't have the same issues 01.36.23 Join gromit`` [0] (i=gromit@ras75-5-82-234-244-69.fbx.proxad.net) 01.36.50 Quit gromit` (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 01.38.14 # aliask: I've used the one from the wiki for dual boot, and linuxstb uses the same 01.38.23 # aliask: BTW, is there a nicer place to get the OF nk.bin from? We probably shouldn't host them on the wiki.... 01.38.54 # does anyone else think adding a new hour tag for the WPS to copy the config setting is a good idea? I hate to manually edit themes to fix it 01.38.59 # s/it/them 01.39.08 # Not that I really know of. I would host them, but my IP changes way too often to be of any use 01.39.21 # aliask: dyndns.org 01.39.38 # JdGordon - actually, why is adding a new fn into the middle of the api struct still a bad thing (do people really not just unzip the whole new build over the top, new plugins 'n all?) 01.39.39 # Router doesn't support auto update 01.39.52 # Also the DNS caching doesn't help 01.40.04 # stripwax: yes 01.40.14 # :) ok then 01.40.19 # Nico_P: yeah, I think I can add a callback that's called whenever a handle is finished and a function that reclaims X bytes on the end of a handle 01.40.31 Join atsea-104 [0] (i=atsea-@gateway/tor/x-f3d05044e08097fa) 01.40.38 # JdGordon - given that rbutilqt doesn't give you any other option, I assumed that was now ok 01.40.57 # stripwax: what's the fs number again? 01.40.58 # not everyone uses rbutil 01.41.04 # lostlogic: I was vaguely thinking the same 01.41.21 # linuxstb: With my nk.bin the dual boot patch doesn't load anything, just sits at the first splash screen (before the windows mobile one) 01.41.25 # JdGordon - true 01.41.31 # pixelma - http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7218 01.41.32 Quit lucas42 (Remote closed the connection) 01.41.38 # for sliding puzzle that is (not pacbox) 01.41.40 # stripwax: if you bump the api then its less bad, because at least then we wont have crashes when people use old .rocks witth a new binary 01.41.41 # so, is there any way to run more than one rockbox build? 01.41.54 # JdGordon - happy to move to end of api anyway 01.41.58 # * amiconn 's build server is on a dynamic IP as well, which changes at least once per day 01.42.02 # stripwax: thanks, does it always use the albumart? 01.42.43 # aliask: Where did you get your nk.bin from? 01.42.55 # pixelma - no. by default it uses a crafty Rockbox puzzle. Unless launched as a viewer, in which case it uses the file you select. You can cycle picture mode (default picture -> albumart -> numerals) 01.43.00 # aliask: Or put another way, where can I get it from? 01.43.02 # linuxstb: I can't remember to be honest. I thought it was from the wiki, but obviously not... 01.43.22 # stripwax: ah, ok. Sounds neat. 01.43.24 # linuxstb: http://58.109.97.210:70/temp/nk_orig.bin.7z 01.43.31 # goovy 01.43.40 # er, groovy 01.43.40 # stripwax: Just take care that it'll still work on targets which don't have album art 01.43.52 # Nico_P: might need an additional read command "char *buf_get_location(int handle, ssize_t where, size_t bytes)" or some such where "where" can be positive for an offset from the beginning and negative for an offset from the end of a file 01.43.53 # amiconn - it ought to 01.43.57 # Nico_P: or something like that 01.44.47 # Nico_P: is it possible to change the token which is used for a token string on load? 01.45.11 # lostlogic: why not calculate that from the pointer you get with bufgetdata? 01.45.19 # amiconn - although I am making the gross assumption that LCD_DEPTH==1 implies no albumart support in the build. I don't know if that assumption has changed now that albumart is in svn... 01.45.29 # JdGordon: I don't see what you mean 01.45.40 # I did try an archos build and an H120 build previously, but not recently.. 01.45.42 # Nico_P: because bufgetdata may be operating at whoknowswhatoffset if the handle is currently being played by another client -- this is an out-of-band operation 01.45.43 # stripwax: I just don't want it to use my 40x40 album art I prepared as an experiment for my c200 :) 01.45.59 Join advcomp2019 [0] (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 01.46.11 # stripwax: I'm not sure but there may be a HAVE_ALBUM_ART define 01.46.15 # pixelma - not sure I follow. I don't know the c200 01.46.29 # Nico_P: I want to use a different token value for the string depending on a global_setting value? 01.46.33 # linuxstb - hm. 01.46.55 # what's this gapless problem? I haven't had any trouble with it. 01.47.01 # linuxstb might want album art on his logikdax 01.47.06 # * linuxstb checks and finds HAVE_ALBUMART 01.47.09 # linuxstb - is there anything intrinsic in albumart that would make you want to disable it in the build for color lcd devices? 01.47.17 # ta 01.47.19 # lostlogic: good point 01.47.38 Quit Skail ("Concoction recent by Pier.") 01.47.43 # Nico_P: I want to get the wps to show 12/24 hour time depending on the config 01.47.46 # stripwax: I don't think so. 01.47.52 # linuxstb: you know if that thing has a hardware mpeg decoder, btw? 01.47.55 # ...with the greyscale lib built into the core ;) 01.48.04 # and i thought the best way was to instert the right token when the .wps is being parsed 01.48.10 # linuxstb - should I predicate the calls to albumart_search_files on HAVE_ALBUMART? 01.48.11 # stripwax: just saying that it would be even smaller than what's currently used (c200's screen is only 132x80 pixels) 01.48.16 # amiconn: I don't think the 128x64 screen could take it... ;) 01.48.22 # .. but that wont change at runtime if the setting changes, so i tinhk ill do it a diferent way 01.48.28 Quit Febs (Remote closed the connection) 01.48.54 # JdGordon: it's not a string setting 01.49.00 # s/setting/token/ 01.49.08 # ? 01.49.10 # pixelma - the plugin takes the bitmap and resizes it to fill the screen - it wouldn't use the "wrong" resolution in any way, if that's what you mean. But if your only albumart is 40x40 then, yes, it will use your 40x40 bmp and resize it (not clear what else it could do in that situation..) 01.49.11 # stripwax: and so I experimented with really small bmps 01.49.29 # JdGordon: unless I didn't understand correctly (it's late), I think you want a new token 01.49.45 # pixelma - my note at the bottom of the tracker page should be useful? 01.49.45 # yeah, but i dont want to add a new token 01.49.47 # sh*t! power outage!! 01.49.48 # preglow: Which thing? 01.49.50 # but i tinhk ill have to 01.49.53 Quit XavierGr ("One firmware to rule them all!") 01.50.12 # buffering need serious simplification 01.50.18 # preglow: It claims a hardware encoder, at least 01.50.19 # JdGordon: do you want to use the same tags/tokens as the existing RTC ones? 01.50.30 # linuxstb: that logik dab thing 01.50.34 # jhMikeS: how? 01.50.57 # Nico_P: dont worry.. its not as bad a hack as i was scared of 01.50.58 Join webguest57 [0] (i=63e88a81@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-356018fbcc8ddb3d) 01.51.28 # Nico_P: do you allow memory reservation of greater than ram size? 01.51.41 # Is there an easy way to search a data file for a string in rockbox? 01.51.41 # preglow: "MPEG4 Encoder", I'm assuming it means video. 01.51.41 Quit PaulJam (".") 01.51.49 # stripwax: I'm fine if I can just let it not use those bmps (so either using the "built-in" one or another bmp) 01.52.08 # * jhMikeS finds the code a bit difficult to follow in any case 01.52.10 # preglow: No, just the Telechips SoC. Although I'm not 100% sure what's inside the DAB module, although I wouldn't expect a hardware decoder. 01.52.35 # linuxstb: no, me neither 01.52.48 # aliask: Any idea how to power-off the S in software? 01.53.13 # linuxstb: docs on the dab module? 01.53.43 Quit Traveler2 ("Java user signed off") 01.54.12 # pixelma- yep, and that's the default behaviour. but having said that I haven't tried building for c200, it might just look plain ugly. 01.54.56 # jhMikeS: a file that is bigger than the buffer will prevent another one from loading, so I'd say yes 01.56.00 # what I meant was reserving 200MB or something for a track explicitly making buffer space logically infinite 01.56.29 # I'm not folowing 01.56.37 # rasher: loadsa red... 01.56.43 Quit webguest57 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 01.57.02 # lessee 01.57.11 # Nico_P: Llorean: others: any objections to http://rafb.net/p/VVwGei48.html ? 01.57.58 # aliask: I've just tried with your nk_orig.bin, and the dual-boot worked fine. 01.58.11 # to simply reserve x number of bytes in advance on the buffer as a placeholder for data and in no way limiting this allocation to RAM size. 01.58.21 # linuxstb: Power off can't really be done - but you can put it to sleep. IIUC both the battery, and the power cable are tied to interrupts which will turn the unit on, so as long as the battery switch is on, it can't turn off 01.58.33 # aliask: How annoying... 01.58.33 # linuxstb: Odd. Maybe I did something wrong... 01.59.47 # linuxstb: I patched mknkboot.c and boot.lds, rebuilt the bootloader.bin, rebuilt mknkboot, used mknkboot on my nk_orig.bin, then sent the resulting nk.bin to the player. Did I miss anything? 01.59.49 # aliask: does it display the progressbar? 01.59.57 # Nico_P: Nope 02.00.00 Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@ppp92-125.adsl.forthnet.gr) 02.00.24 # another is using data attributes instead of types...say DATA_HAS_POINTERS, DATA_ATOMIC, etc. in order to not special-case for types 02.00.25 # aliask: that would happen to me with a totally bogus nk.bin 02.00.46 # JdGordon: Honestly, I'd be in favour of getting rid of the old hour tags too. But that's me, and we probably shouldn't break WPSes yet again. :) 02.00.52 # But yeah, no objection 02.01.03 # great 02.01.08 # just checking the code actually works :p 02.01.25 # Good plan 02.01.55 # aliask: Maybe I've changed something in my dual-boot patch, let me upload another. 02.02.51 # jhMikeS: there is no real reservation. when trying to add something to the buffer (bufopen of bufalloc), we simply check if there is enough space left to finish buffering the current file. I'm not sure what you're saying, are you suggesting adding a reservation mechanism? 02.02.56 # crap.. stupid sim is crashing 02.03.12 # linuxstb: Got it working. I think I gave mknkboot the arguments in the wrong order before 02.03.16 Quit scorche (Nick collision from services.) 02.03.32 # aliask: Ah, that would do it... 02.03.45 Join scorche [0] (n=scorche@rockbox/administrator/scorche) 02.04.00 # JdGordon - ok, patch updated, but I haven't had a chance to try building for all possible targets.. 02.04.32 # you done a target with no AA? 02.05.07 # Nico_P: sort of I guess. meaning space for the whole file would be reserved in advance. 02.05.25 # lame.... you cant change the clock in the sim... 02.05.35 # JdGordon - not yet, but it's pretty late here. If nobody else will have a chance to test, I can take a look in the next day or so 02.05.36 # 12pm is a really sucky time to be testing this patch! 02.05.45 # 1am is worse :) 02.05.47 # ok 02.05.54 # no... 1am is 13 in 24 hour time 02.05.55 # * preglow blinks at his 2am 02.06.00 # 12 is always 12 02.06.17 # JdGordon: around -2pm or so ? 02.06.36 # JdGordon: 1am is 1 in 24-hour... it's 1pm that's 13... 02.06.50 # bah 02.06.51 # preglow: no, haven't got further than the initial discussion. Now that the hardware eq is out though, I might start looking at it again. 02.06.55 # 12 is sometimes 0 02.06.57 # * JdGordon needs more sleep 02.07.02 # * stripwax does too 02.07.04 # night all 02.07.09 # cya 02.08.07 # aliask: I've just had a look at the tools/gigabeats.c code - I assume that simply creating two records (the eboot patch, plus the bootloader) doesn't work? 02.08.08 # 0 = 12 midnight, 1 to 11 = 1 to 11 am, 12 = 12 noon, 13 to 23 = 1 to 11 pm :P 02.08.36 # * preglow implodes 02.08.54 # linuxstb: Well, it may now that we send the nk.bin file directly rather than using the gigabeat v updater 02.09.04 # But before it was rejecting it before it even got to the player 02.09.41 # Which is why that gigabeats.c file has so many strange entries, I was trying to get it to work by copying chunks from the OF nk.bin 02.10.04 # rasher: lazy, eh? ;) 02.10.25 # amiconn: absolutely. How did I get caught? 02.10.33 # Nico_P: What's the status of your experiments with identifying files transferred via libmtp? 02.10.34 Join iamben_ [0] (n=ben@adsl-75-34-64-88.dsl.spfdmo.sbcglobal.net) 02.10.41 # amiconn: Oh, not converting to grayscale? 02.10.48 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) 02.11.01 # I wasn't planning on doing that, really. 02.11.19 # I doubt it should be hard. There's really only a single drawing call 02.11.27 # rasher: Is any conversion needed? 02.11.39 # * jhMikeS is about to inflict real damage on things ;) 02.11.55 # linuxstb: I've found them, but the names are seq numbers 02.12.22 # That's to be expected... 02.12.25 # linuxstb: no idea. I really don't know how the bitmaps system works to be honest. 02.12.40 Join ChanServ [0] (ChanServ@services.) 02.12.40 Mode "#rockbox +o ChanServ " by irc.freenode.net 02.12.51 # rasher: Looks like that for greyscale, all that's missing is a suitable bitmap. Plus keypad definitions for H1x0 and ipod G1..G3 02.13.17 # linuxstb: but I think we can reasonably assume that the first file we send will be 02 02.13.56 # Is Rockbox itself building for the S? 02.13.59 # amiconn: ah, the bitmap isn't converted to greyscale if used on a greyscale target? 02.14.05 # haven't tried :p 02.14.20 # * linuxstb sets a build going now... 02.14.21 # rasher: The bitmap isn't compiled atm, that's why liniking fails 02.14.49 # * aliask races linuxstb 02.14.58 # jhMikeS: I'd be interested in discussing your idea, but tomorrow... I really need to go to bed now 02.15.19 # aliask: It almost builds - some functions in the debug menu don't exist... 02.15.21 # linuxstb, aliask: I can give you my recursive dir listing if you want 02.15.21 # amiconn: ah, yes. And the button problem. 02.15.21 # committing this kernel stuff always feels like skydiving :\ 02.15.38 # do you skydive? :p 02.15.39 # Nico_P: gnight 02.15.47 # The button "problem" is dead simple to solve 02.15.49 # aliask: But the linking address (0x80000000) in firmware/apps.lds is wrong - IIUC DRAM starts at 0x88000000 02.15.56 # I should...less stressful :) 02.15.56 Mode "#rockbox +o scorche " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) 02.16.14 # 0x8000000 is ROM I think 02.16.28 Quit hcs ("Leaving.") 02.16.57 # I must have just copied the datasheet when I was writing that. 02.17.24 # Just use the IPOD_4G_PAD definitions for IPOD_1G2G_PAD and IPOD_3G_PAD, and the IRIVER_H300_PAD definitions for IRIVER_H100_PAD 02.17.29 # aliask: My dualboot patch now loads the bootloader to 0x8a000000, so plenty of room to load Rockbox at 0x88000000 02.17.38 Mode "#rockbox +eeee *!*@rockbox/administrator/scorche *!*@rockbox/developer/amiconn *!*@rockbox/developer/lostlogic *!*@rockbox/developer/preglow " by scorche (n=scorche@rockbox/administrator/scorche) 02.18.22 # We distinguish these keypads because of the different physical button arrangements, but apart from one single plugin, there are no actually different assigments so far 02.18.26 # scorche: point being? 02.18.42 Join Febs [0] (n=chatzill@207-172-204-33.c3-0.rdl-ubr4.trpr-rdl.pa.cable.rcn.com) 02.18.43 # exceptions in case of attack...handy to have at times 02.18.50 # amiconn: already done that, in fact 02.18.54 # Testing now. 02.19.00 # scorche: why not except all rockbox/developer/* ? 02.19.20 # (the single plugin is the jpeg viewer, where the buttons for flipping through the folder are swapped between H300 and H1x0) 02.19.20 # JdGordon: I might be late but I have no objection for your patch 02.19.28 # exceptions only really make sense when the people being excepted can do something about said attack 02.19.39 # Nico_P: great :), just commited 02.19.40 # scorche: if we're ever attacked, that'll be pretty easy for any attacker to reverse, no? 02.20.30 # * jhMikeS pushed the big red button 02.20.32 # * preglow doesn't know all the freenode bells and whistles 02.20.33 # most people dont know about it, and it isnt scripted commonly like kb is...either way, it gives time to respond...there really is no downside to it, and after they are set, you wont notice anything 02.20.42 # sure 02.20.47 # linuxstb, aliask: http://pastebin.ca/798826 02.20.59 # it includes the dual boot patch 02.21.03 Mode "#rockbox +eeee *!*@rockbox/developer/T0mas *!*@rockbox/developer/Bagder *!*@rockbox/developer/Zagor *!*@rockbox/developer/LinusN " by scorche (n=scorche@rockbox/administrator/scorche) 02.21.24 # Nico_P: Nice 02.21.28 Mode "#rockbox +e *!*@rockbox/administrator/Febs " by scorche (n=scorche@rockbox/administrator/scorche) 02.21.37 Mode "#rockbox -o scorche " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) 02.21.57 # aliask, Nico_P: Have either of you tried writing to the disk? 02.22.05 # * Nico_P hasn't 02.22.11 # linuxstb: I did once, and it didn't work 02.23.27 # aliask, Nico_P: Should I commit this dual-boot stuff? 02.23.45 Quit iamben (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 02.23.52 # linuxstb: I say yes 02.23.56 # linuxstb: call it "dual-day" 02.24.09 # Nico_P: Can you apply that git patch using regular patch? 02.25.25 # amiconn: well that works just dandy. Can't check it on target though. Sold my h120 02.25.30 # * linuxstb commits and goes to sleep 02.25.34 # * jhMikeS has to wait through a build blocking him :\ 02.25.43 # * JdGordon appologises... 02.25.43 # linuxstb: dangerous practice :P 02.26.08 # scorche: but this commit's bugfree. 02.26.18 # aliask: I think so 02.26.19 # they all start out that way :) 02.26.20 # arnt they all? 02.26.39 # aliask: use -p1 02.26.50 # Ah, of course... 02.28.58 # JdGordon: I guess I'm too slow, but how about a WPS tag that says what the 12h/24h setting currently is? So the WPS could display "22:00" or "10.00pm" depending on that setting. 02.29.45 # have we got an am/pm tag already? 02.29.52 # * jhMikeS sees the motley combinations of commits in the current build :p 02.29.53 # yes.. 02.29.58 # yeah, thats a good idea 02.30.01 # ouch 02.30.14 # * preglow watches free space on /var grow smaller and smaller :/ 02.30.31 # /var ? 02.30.41 # At least we squeezed 3 commits into a single build. 02.30.42 # the build server /var partition is almost full 02.30.54 # who's 02.30.57 # it currently has 130 meg left 02.31.00 # jhMikeS: the main one 02.31.12 # she'll be right... 02.31.12 # JdGordon: And then you wouldn't need %cf or %cg... 02.31.14 # out of what? 02.31.29 # * Nico_P is really off to bed now 02.31.29 # jhMikeS: 19 gigs 02.31.32 Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection) 02.31.38 # * linuxstb is really off to sleep too 02.31.39 # linuxstb: but haveing the one tag instead of the conditional is easier to write up 02.31.40 # only 19 gigs? 02.31.55 # jhMikeS: looks like it 02.32.10 # jhMikeS: Is there a special reason for the moved .stack in the .lds? 02.32.15 # and there it crashed into 0kb 02.32.59 # amiconn: put it at the end? any reason the smaller stacks should go after the main one? 02.33.25 # No. Just asking as that seems to be not really necessary 02.34.50 # out of curiosity, why is this project compiled with linux and yet designed for FAT32? 02.35.26 # zajacattack, because fat32 is supported on nearly every platform out there 02.35.46 # There's tons of additional reasons too 02.36.00 # not only that, for players that dual-boot, you can't format it something that the OF can't read: this is especially true on iPods and Sansas, where you need the OF to transfer files 02.36.27 # And btw, rockbox can be compiled on a variety of OS 02.38.36 # amiconn: It's partially that I'd rather have those stacks not be subject to damage from overflows on the main one if that occurs. 02.38.57 # Several targets couldn't even boot if the disk wouldn't be fat formatted 02.38.58 # actually, that's is the reason 02.39.44 # looks like that went well 02.39.52 # apart from the no space left builds 02.39.58 # (from head: all archoses when not flashed, the iaudios, and the .mi4 targets at least) 02.40.32 # rasher: red again... 02.40.50 # mono != greyscale 02.40.59 # hm, why is the 1-3g binaries so much smaller than the rest of the ipods? bitmaps? 02.41.17 # amiconn: I know. I even put that in the bitmaps SOURCES... I'm just on crack, it seems. 02.41.29 # amiconn: Put LCD_DEPTH > 1, that is 02.42.03 # does the new gigabeat s bootloader make you erase your hd? 02.42.28 # actally, I did exactly the opposite of what I wanted to do. :\ 02.43.05 # preglow: Bitmaps and features. The G3 and G4 should be equal bitmap wise. But G4 has usb stack and recording. G3 has neither of those 02.44.25 # ok 02.44.29 # but bedtime for me 02.44.31 # gnight 02.45.08 # jhMikeS: You mean the stack? 02.45.39 # yeah, I'm thinking backwards here. 02.46.23 # Does dualcore work nicely now? I guess you tried spc? 02.46.35 Join DM| [0] (n=dm@cpe-65-24-163-189.columbus.res.rr.com) 02.46.41 Join LycoLoco [0] (n=Lyco@cpe-075-181-041-203.carolina.res.rr.com) 02.46.43 # yes, listened to it for hours 02.47.12 # mpegplayer should also use the second core? 02.47.17 # it does 02.47.41 # Ok, will try that out when my new greyscale stuff is taking shape :) 02.47.42 # the graylib interrupt can still cause some audio skipping (short though) 02.48.08 Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection) 02.48.14 # But now, sleep 02.48.23 # I guess if graylib runs faster it won't though 02.48.29 # nighty 02.50.55 Quit stripwax ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") 02.51.36 # What, more red? 02.51.51 # Ah, not my commit. More waiting, then. 02.57.29 # all matrix stuff 02.57.40 Join lucas42 [0] (n=s0681043@myaree.inf.ed.ac.uk) 02.59.43 # preglow: ipl has an SPC emulator? not as up to snuff as ours you said? 03.04.37 # wasn't it hcs who mentioned it /me thinks in half asleep state 03.05.25 Part pixelma 03.05.40 Quit TTThomas ("Lost terminal") 03.09.33 Part zajacattack 03.10.56 Join darkapostrophe [0] (n=darkapos@217-50-177.231210.adsl.tele2.no) 03.13.44 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 03.23.07 Join psycho_maniac [0] (i=psycho_m@ppp420.hk.centurytel.net) 03.23.30 Join Phoul [0] (i=AOS@sourcemage/guru/Phoul) 03.23.49 # Has anyone successfully installed rockbox onto a 3rd gen ipod nano video 03.24.01 Join dvdv [0] (n=ut@41.234.199.91) 03.24.21 # if you look on the main page Phoul you will see if your player is supported by rockbox. 03.24.32 # I know its -not- supported lol 03.24.47 # But just because something isnt "supported" doesnt mean theres no way of getting it to work ;) 03.24.58 # then the answer to your question is probably "no" 03.25.04 # check the wiki and the new port topics 03.25.22 Part Phoul 03.26.36 # Actually, it lists targets on which Rockbox runs. You would think that's specific enough. 03.27.43 Quit Dark_Apostrophe (Connection timed out) 03.27.44 Nick darkapostrophe is now known as Dark_Apostrophe (n=darkapos@217-50-177.231210.adsl.tele2.no) 03.27.45 # rasher: People seem to think it's a case of simply "try and see if it works" 03.27.50 # ok this is strange. on my ipod 5.5g the backlight will not turn on 03.28.01 # rasher: Like the people who ask what file from their favorite N64 emulator they should rename to .rock to get it to run. 03.28.17 # psycho_maniac: What do you have the brightness set at? 03.28.26 # Llorean: Oh dear. Are you serious? 03.28.41 # 16 03.28.43 # rasher: 100%. 03.29.05 # * jhMikeS shakes head 03.29.05 # psycho_maniac: I don't know if that's bright or dark, but I just meant 'maybe it's dim enough that it looks off' 03.29.20 # updated both my gigabeat and ipod 5.5g at the same time and this only happens on the ipod 03.29.24 # 16 is the default 03.29.31 # on the ipod 03.29.36 # reset settings? 03.30.36 # that worked. now i just have to find out what makes it do that. 03.34.06 # ahh who cares. i dont like the ipod anyways. 03.38.42 Part dvdv 03.46.04 Quit japc (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 04.07.44 Quit donutman25 ("ChatZilla 0.9.79 [Firefox 2.0.0.9/2007102514]") 04.13.09 Join sdoyon [0] (n=steph@modemcable193.152-83-70.mc.videotron.ca) 04.15.37 Quit advcomp2019 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 04.17.54 # voice.pl question: when make voice is run a second time, why not overwrite english.voice? Why are we creating an english-1.voice? Took me a while to notice and figure out why my voice file was wrong :-). 04.21.30 Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) 04.24.01 Join advcomp2019 [0] (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 04.25.04 Join advcomp2019_ [0] (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 04.26.23 Quit advcomp2019 (Nick collision from services.) 04.26.33 Nick advcomp2019_ is now known as advcomp2019 (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 04.30.49 # I get an SQL error with the tracker! 04.31.20 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 04.32.01 Join linuxstb__ [0] (n=linuxstb@i-83-67-212-170.freedom2surf.net) 04.32.21 # sdoyon: The tracker is working for me, what page are you trying to access? 04.32.38 # http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/index.php 04.33.07 # Oh wow! Yes, that's certainly broken. 04.33.16 # Failed! (Incorrect key file for table '#sql_3edd_0.MYI'; try to repair it) 04.33.56 # Bagder: Ping 04.34.07 # Well thanks for letting me know I'm not crazy :-) 04.35.14 Join Simon14 [0] (n=chatzill@S0106000c41aa7bd5.pk.shawcable.net) 04.35.16 # Would you happen to know the URL to add a new task? 04.35.59 # http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/newtask/proj1 04.36.27 Join iamben [0] (n=ben@ppp-70-250-214-76.dsl.spfdmo.swbell.net) 04.36.51 Join TTThomas [0] (n=tblackwe@c-68-38-172-205.hsd1.de.comcast.net) 04.38.08 # aliask: hmm thx, but that's not working either for me. Thought I just saw a notification for a new open bug go by the mailing list. Oh well no matter. 04.38.39 # sdoyon: That link works for me, but I had to log in first 04.40.28 # aliask: strange.. Hmm OK, at what URL could I try to login? 04.40.50 # * jhMikeS questions whether that error info should even be displayed publicly :\ 04.41.41 # sdoyon: All tasks should have a login box at the top. For example you could use http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7967 04.41.59 # jhMikeS: I don't see what's sensitive about it... 04.42.03 # it dumps the whole query? ouch. 04.42.20 Join billenium [0] (n=billeniu@c-69-249-243-110.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) 04.42.29 # I don't know either atm. 04.42.38 # Well, it's not elegant, but it's not going to compromise security. 04.43.28 # aliask: That task works, another one I was trying did not for some reaspon... Perhas I had an invalid id... 04.43.39 Quit linuxstb (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 04.43.41 # better to never show it imo 04.44.07 Quit stripwax (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 04.45.21 # aliask: Thanks, appears to work. 04.49.19 Quit linuxstb_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 04.50.20 Quit iamben_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 04.50.33 Quit DM| ("*bashes head against keyboard*") 04.57.29 Join keanu [0] (n=keanu@unaffiliated/keanu) 04.58.05 # I appreciate being able to see the entire mysql query on the tracker, but really, I don't need to see it ;) 04.59.02 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 04.59.13 Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (n=hihi@p54BF6195.dip.t-dialin.net) 04.59.59 Join Norrin [0] (i=4bce7617@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-d8715fb716d67367) 05.01.00 # Good evening all. 05.01.41 # Evening 05.01.56 Join karashata [0] (n=karashat@207.61.208.83) 05.02.41 Quit Llorean ("Leaving.") 05.03.31 # Anyone have access to fix mysql? 05.03.53 # I'm asking for some help concerning my Archos FM recorder I recently upgraded to the newest build. 05.04.54 # When I boot it straight up, it gives me an ATA error: -11. I can plug it in to my USB and it works fine as an external HD. I can then remove it and it boots normally. It just seem to have a problem with the cold boot and shutdown. 05.05.06 # Any help is greatly appreciated. 05.06.35 Quit J3TC- (".•«UPP»•.") 05.07.02 # Norrin, hold on, i'm trying to figure out what error -11 is 05.07.45 # Norrin, this might help until I find an answer: http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=13851.msg103913 05.09.29 # Norrin, according to the mail archive, it means it's because the hard drive isn't accessible or doesn't spin up. http://www.rockbox.org/mail/archive/rockbox-archive-2004-11/0238.shtml 05.09.47 Quit karashata ("I will *SO* make you regret that... Later... *is a lazy dragon*") 05.10.32 Quit Norrin ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") 05.11.17 Join Norrin [0] (i=4bce7617@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-913d66c2817c5ab6) 05.11.25 # "Norrin, this might help until I find an answer: http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=13851.msg103913" 05.11.27 # "Norrin, according to the mail archive, it means it's because the hard drive isn't accessible or doesn't spin up. http://www.rockbox.org/mail/archive/rockbox-archive-2004-11/0238.shtml" 05.11.30 Join homielowe_ [0] (n=chatzill@d207-81-67-190.bchsia.telus.net) 05.11.43 # in case cgi:irc timed out before those two messages ;) 05.11.48 # Sorry, got booted off for some reason. 05.11.57 Nick homielowe_ is now known as homielowe (n=chatzill@d207-81-67-190.bchsia.telus.net) 05.12.16 # not a problem 05.13.24 # is there any talk about removing the first screen that comes up when you turn on the gigabeat Fxx series? 05.13.47 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 05.15.29 # It worked fine earlier today with a previous build. Any clue why it would suddenly develop a problem immediately after upgrading? 05.16.12 # it could have been a failing drive I assume, though I believe you did say you can still access it as an external HD, right? 05.16.36 # If I plug in to the USB first, let it boot in USB mode, then remove the USB, it works as advertised. 05.17.00 # if you believe it is because of the build you are using i would try a older build. then if it still does it it would be for sure a hd failure like keanu said. 05.17.06 Quit jurrie ("Leaving") 05.17.33 # *it *could* be for sure a hd failure 05.17.39 # I also can run the Archos 1.30j file without any errors. 05.18.18 # In that case, try an older rockbox build and see if it works, and maybe try reseating the battery. 05.18.24 # try an older build to see if you get this error 05.19.09 # I don't have the FM recorder (or a HDD-based player - I have a Sansa) so I'm just going off of what I'm seeing in the mail archive and forums 05.19.18 Quit Simon14 ("ChatZilla 0.9.79 [Firefox 2.0.0.9/2007102514]") 05.19.34 # * keanu rants for a minute about flyspray still being down 05.19.36 # I'll try the 2.5 build and see what happens. 05.19.57 # ok 05.20.14 Join jurrie [0] (n=jurrie@adsl-068-209-041-021.sip.asm.bellsouth.net) 05.22.33 # Thanks. Loaded the 2.5 and it worked fine. Need to find which build causes problems. Like the newer capabilities (except for the ATA error.) 05.22.48 # Thanks for your time. 05.23.17 # Glad I could help. Once you find which build it is, you may want to report it as a bug 05.27.54 Quit Norrin ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") 05.32.00 Join advcomp2019_ [0] (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 05.32.14 Quit advcomp2019 (Nick collision from services.) 05.32.20 Nick advcomp2019_ is now known as advcomp2019 (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 05.35.16 Quit sdoyon ("ircII EPIC4-2.4 -- Are we there yet?") 05.35.50 Join Norrin [0] (i=4bce7617@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-a013c5f40744bb6b) 05.38.03 # 20071102 works, 20071109-06 have not. Trying 1104 now. 05.43.20 Quit Norrin ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") 05.46.53 Join Norrin [0] (i=4bce7617@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-ae97170fc6d08759) 05.52.19 Quit Norrin ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") 05.56.02 Join Ebert [0] (n=EbErT@adsl-156-29-3.asm.bellsouth.net) 06.07.30 Quit DaCapn (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 06.13.12 Join DaCapn [0] (n=dacapn@c-76-105-220-239.hsd1.or.comcast.net) 06.15.34 Join JdGordon_ [0] (n=jonno@c210-49-113-143.smelb1.vic.optusnet.com.au) 06.16.21 Quit JdGordon (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 06.18.22 Quit DaCapn () 06.28.59 Nick JdGordon_ is now known as JdGordon (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 06.43.55 Join l7 [0] (n=l7@evil-wire.org) 06.44.16 # hello 06.44.32 # anyone have an opinion on which mp3 player is the best rockbox platform? 06.44.56 # l7: have you checked the buyers guid? 06.44.57 # i'm trying to decide between sansa e200 or c200 series 06.45.01 # guide 06.45.07 # which buyer's guide? 06.45.18 # is it on rockbox.org? 06.45.33 # http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/BuyersGuide 06.45.41 # I just got the e200 today 06.45.42 # cnet seems to claim that the c200 series has poorer sound quality 06.45.48 # Im pretty happy with it 06.46.00 # ah thanks for that link 06.46.15 # i also heard that more of the dev team has e200s 06.46.37 # it being a bit newer and alot more popular, I'd expect that to be the case 06.46.48 # hrm yeah 06.47.06 # the bigger screen on the e200s seem to be a nice bonus 06.47.34 # there a pretty good price too arent they? 06.47.37 # sandisk advertises it's 1.8 inch screen but is mysterious about the c200's exact size 06.47.38 # yes 06.47.43 # be aware that there's a version 2 of the e200 and c200 that Rockbox currently doesn't work. 06.47.45 # I got mine off woot for $30 06.47.45 # yeah, they're both pretty cheap 06.47.49 # the c200 is a bit cheaper 06.47.51 # work on even 06.47.54 # nice 06.48.05 # i missed out on that woot 06.48.12 # only gotcha is no usb yet in rockbox 06.48.13 # Inkey5: how much space does it have when you bought it. 06.48.22 # gotta boot into OF to load stuff 06.48.24 # 2gb 06.48.29 # plus micro-sd slot 06.48.37 # USB support is coming eventually right? 06.48.42 # which can hold up to 5gb? for how much? 06.48.48 # 6gb* 06.48.54 # "probably" is the answer I got 06.48.59 # i'm not sure if i read the c200 faq properly, but is there USB for the c200? 06.49.08 # psycho_maniac: I suppose so; it was $30 06.49.17 # I think so 06.49.26 # I think the c's had a built in usb bridge 06.49.32 # i take it you didnt get a msd card? 06.49.46 # maybe you could just transfer files from the microsd card if you wanted to avoid using USB someimes 06.49.49 # sometimes 06.50.19 # ooooh, according to the faq the e200 supports micro-sd up to 32gb 06.50.43 # wow, the e200 has 15h of batter life compared to 5-6h for the c200 06.50.46 # battery 06.50.53 # yeah 06.50.57 # 22 if you stick with stock firmware 06.51.18 # wow 06.51.33 # only thing about the e200 is the lack of a charger 06.51.53 # psycho_maniac: I have a 1gb from my phone, but havent bought a bigger one yet 06.51.59 # yeah...you can buy those, though 06.52.04 # I have a 2 gig in mine 06.52.17 # and how often are you going to go 16 hours without being by your computer? 06.52.41 # I've seen car chargers for them too 06.52.44 # and even so, they have batteries you can swap in the field with only an eyeglass screwdriver 06.52.54 # or a swiss army knife 06.53.10 # can you put sdhc cards in either sansa? 06.53.18 # yes 06.53.43 # but the OF will not read them 06.53.52 # it read mine ok 06.54.01 # Inkey5: which one do you have? 06.54.05 # even with my wierd motorola filesystem from my phone on it 06.54.07 # e250 06.54.21 # also,I cant speak for the c200's, but the screen on the e250 looks really nice 06.54.32 # advcomp2019: living w/o OF support for SDHC shouldn't be much of a problem right? 06.55.02 # the only nit is i guess it means you will need to use a card reader until rockbox has usb support 06.55.09 # what would be nice would be a plugin for RB to copy all media from the sd to the flash 06.55.22 # my friend has c200 and it's screen is just awful when compared to my e280 06.55.24 # l7: dual-boot into the OF and do your transfering 06.55.51 # Inkey5: you have a e250, not an e250R right? 06.55.56 # correct 06.55.59 # cool 06.56.03 # l7, you just need figure out a way to transfer stuff to microsdhc card 06.56.10 # i guess i should just go and get one 06.56.17 # its a good player, though 06.56.25 # the picture viewer in RB is pretty sweet, too 06.56.29 # advcomp2019: it should be okay, as long as an exotic filesystem isn't needed 06.56.37 # it shows my 1600x1200 pictures from my camera 06.56.43 # wow 06.57.02 # scaled down, but you can zoom in all the way and pan around 06.57.07 # its pretty nice 06.57.17 # just wait until the larger sdhc cards come out... 06.57.22 # so much for ipod 06.57.42 # clearly youve not played with an ipod touch 06.58.10 # its pretty bad ass 06.58.10 # actually i have 06.58.23 # i'm about to get a nokia n800 though :) 06.58.24 # it could conceivably replace my laptop for a lot of things 06.58.53 # i think the n800 would be more useful than the touch for most things, and the e250 would be better for working out or whatever 06.59.11 # Inkey5: the ipod touch has no bluetooth though... 06.59.24 # true 06.59.25 # well it might have a disabled bluetooth chip inside 06.59.26 # but 06.59.34 # this is getting offtopic... 07.00.06 # but you can jailbreak them and add any number of apps 07.00.07 # like mail 07.00.11 # or office 07.00.13 # etc 07.00.20 # way off topic 07.00.21 # this is offtopic... 07.00.33 # is that bad? 07.00.43 # * scorche points to the guidelines in the topic 07.00.51 # well i guess we could yack in #rockbox-community 07.01.15 # * psycho_maniac was wondering when somebody was going to say something 07.01.20 # ah 07.01.24 # sorry then, chaps 07.01.31 # well in short, get an e200 07.02.14 Quit BHSPitMonkey ("Leaving") 07.03.07 # heh 07.06.36 Join BHSPitMonkey [0] (n=stephen@unaffiliated/bhspitmonkey) 07.08.26 Join ddalton [0] (n=daniel@124-168-107-225.dyn.iinet.net.au) 07.08.55 Quit ddalton (Client Quit) 07.09.30 Join ddalton [0] (n=daniel@124-168-107-225.dyn.iinet.net.au) 07.13.51 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 07.13.58 Join perrikwp [0] (i=98216687@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-d330b46863e1b434) 07.19.26 Quit perrikwp ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") 07.23.47 Quit linuxstb__ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 07.23.54 Join linuxstb__ [0] (n=linuxstb@i-83-67-212-170.freedom2surf.net) 07.28.22 # does anyone know if the microsd card for e200s causes a loading delay in rockbox? 07.28.47 # i have an older sansa and the loading delay is very annoying 07.29.12 # only one time as it refreshes the database 07.30.25 # l7, i tried a a friends card in my e280r with rockbox and i had no delay, but i am getting my own card to play around with 07.31.50 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 07.31.53 # it doesnt slow it down just being in there, though, if thats what you mean 07.32.17 Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (n=hihi@p54BF6195.dip.t-dialin.net) 07.33.54 # Inkey5: the annoying thing about the older sandisks is that if you used them with a SD card, it would take about 2 minutes to load songs from the SD every time you booted it up 07.34.28 # the longest it could standby for was about an 1/2 hour, which was troublesome 07.34.31 # is this with the OF or with rockbox? 07.34.40 # psycho_maniac: with the OF 07.34.52 # this is a sansa e130, really old :) 07.35.05 # nah, not a problem 07.35.11 # it only refreshes the database on changes 07.35.16 # how long does the e200 series take to boot up from being off? 07.35.18 # that is smart 07.35.21 # 10 sec even 07.35.29 # to OF 07.35.31 Quit aliask ("ChatZilla 0.9.79 [Firefox 2.0.0.8/2007102213]") 07.35.34 # rockbox is a bit faster 07.36.00 # hrm 07.36.07 Quit ddalton ("leaving") 07.36.13 # yeah my creative zen takes about 10 seconds as well 07.36.31 # how long can the e200 stay in standby mode before it powers off? 07.36.34 # in rockbox 07.36.40 # I think thats a configurable setting 07.36.56 # how is the sound in the h120 compared to the gigabeat Fxx? 07.37.02 # up to 60min 07.37.05 # i wonder how much battery life it would have idling and not playing songs 07.37.15 # ah 07.37.57 # one of the things i really liked about my ipod before it died was that it would start up really fast from sleep mode 07.38.02 # i always hear about people having problems with there ipods when the battery power gets really low. would i risk this happening if i ran a the battery bench plugin? 07.39.15 # of course 07.39.56 # psycho_maniac: just charge it afterwards 07.41.42 # hrm, according to http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaE200Port#Rockbox_Status, "Not all plugins have been adapted to the Sansa's screen layout yet." 07.41.55 # any idea what plugins these are? 07.42.19 # i could probably live w/o doom at optimal res :) 07.43.10 # if nobody gives you an answer the easiest way is to go to the plugins wiki page and see what plugins are missing on your player compared to that wiki page. 07.43.56 # actually doom works great 07.45.03 Quit Inkey5 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 07.45.40 # i guess i can live with whatever the e200 is missing 07.45.42 Join hcs [0] (n=agashlin@rockbox/contributor/hcs) 07.46.17 # the wiki also mentions that you could flash the e200 with e200r firmware... has anyone tried this one? 07.47.09 # yes 07.47.20 # why would you want to? 07.47.24 # how does it work? 07.47.46 # i thought it might be neat to be able to use rhapsody on the go 07.47.54 Join LinusN [0] (i=linus@rockbox/developer/LinusN) 07.48.12 # i would probably get bored of it and go back to rockbox though, but it would be a nice option 07.54.29 Join OlivierBorowski_ [0] (n=OlivierB@ANancy-157-1-81-109.w86-218.abo.wanadoo.fr) 07.58.03 # LinusN: want to nuke this person's avatar? http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?action=profile;u=13125 07.58.55 # because it's a screenshot? 07.59.11 # "nigga stole my yoshi" 07.59.26 # ah, now i see it 07.59.33 # heh 08.00.02 # hmmm, tough call 08.01.01 # if we discourage and censor the use of "spaz" which is offensive in the UK, but not the US, i dont see how "nigga" is any better 08.01.22 # although, others are free to input.. 08.01.26 # we do? 08.01.48 # let's pm him and ask him to change it 08.01.49 # does anyone consider "nigga" offensive? 08.02.06 # i dunno, you tell me 08.02.23 # hcs: well, considering its direct root.. 08.02.24 # they tell me I can't have an opinion if I'm not a minority 08.02.41 # it is in very common usage in an inoffensive sense, though 08.02.58 # though here we have it specifically applied to a black man 08.03.03 # by a white man 08.03.05 # so... 08.03.13 # (well, sprites) 08.03.42 # LinusN: http://www.rockbox.org/irc/reader.pl?date=20070915#19:26:41 08.04.08 # although i suppose we can always wait for Llorean's word on it.. 08.04.29 # i would just think it would be something considered offensive 08.06.05 # i take it that topic had the word "spaz" in it? 08.06.11 Quit jepler (Remote closed the connection) 08.06.14 # yup 08.06.16 Join jepler [0] (n=jepler@emc/developer/jepler) 08.06.16 # my guess too 08.06.26 Join iamben_ [0] (n=ben@adsl-71-144-122-39.dsl.spfdmo.sbcglobal.net) 08.08.26 # mo0ning 08.08.53 # * amiconn wonders why there is an actual op named 'Chanserv' here now 08.10.22 # it is a set option for freenode...the upside of which, means that we will not lose modes, banlists, exception lists, etc in event of service failure...this has happened twice before in recent memory in times of freenode chaos 08.12.26 Quit OlivierBorowski (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08.13.40 Join CaptainSquid [0] (n=Miranda@proxy15.netz.sbs.de) 08.18.18 Quit Mouser_X ("Java user signed off") 08.19.52 # hmrrr 08.21.03 # jhMikeS: The current 1st/2nd Gen build has that crash problem again. First the cop crashes (showing the UIE screen), but rockbox continues too boot. A few seconds later the cpu crashes too... 08.21.33 Quit iamben (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08.25.14 Join Buschel [0] (n=AndreeBu@p54A3C758.dip.t-dialin.net) 08.25.33 Part safetydan 08.28.56 # if I play videos via mpegplayer without frame-dropping and frame-limitation (test configuration) I see much higher fps than in real life (frame-dropping and fps-limitation). e.g. my full screen videos play @16fps in test configuration and @12ps with audio/video synced. 08.29.30 # is this normal behaviour / technical limitation? 08.30.52 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08.31.47 # I think that even the skipped frames need to be decoded to some degree 08.33.41 Join Mouser_X [0] (n=mouser_x@207.155.176.3) 08.36.21 # yes, but i _all_ frames are decoded i get 20fps, with skipping only 16fps. 08.36.22 # * LinusN writes another post on the motorola forum 08.36.38 # *if 08.37.13 Join Rob222241 [0] (n=Miranda@p54B14FB0.dip.t-dialin.net) 08.37.29 # *ahem all->16fps, skip->12fps 08.37.39 # i should drink another coffee... 08.39.10 # Yes, because the 12 fps with skipping are only the frames shown; the number of source frames is > 16 per second then (probably 24) 08.41.36 # hmm, i'm wondering how the sync-mechanism audio<->video is working. maybe i'll take a look at it. but for now i better go working now :) 08.41.40 Quit Buschel () 08.55.08 Quit Rob2222 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08.55.27 Quit l7 ("Lost terminal") 08.56.49 Quit lucas42 ("Leaving.") 09.01.35 Quit _pill ("changing servers") 09.02.02 Join reppy [0] (i=reptile@c-24-20-102-96.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) 09.02.35 Join pill [0] (i=pill@sloth.shellfx.net) 09.03.35 Join petur [0] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) 09.04.59 Quit hannesd (kubrick.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 09.04.59 NSplit kubrick.freenode.net irc.freenode.net 09.05.22 # * amiconn just had an idea 09.05.25 # jhMikeS: ping 09.07.12 Join Zagor [0] (n=bjst@46.35.227.87.static.tab.siw.siwnet.net) 09.07.23 Join lee-qid [0] (n=liqid@p54964681.dip.t-dialin.net) 09.08.12 # yeah? 09.08.43 # * jhMikeS goes and has a smoke 09.09.20 # You said those weird crashes on PP5002 look like a cache issue 09.09.35 # Did you test things in the bootloader? 09.10.13 # Iirc there is a comment in the bootloader saying that we can't enable the cache or else rockbox won't boot - but what if the cache is already enabled by the apple loader on 1st..3rd Gen? 09.12.48 Join spiorf [0] (n=spiorf@host22-211-dynamic.20-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) 09.13.23 # I'm using a bootloader built from the committed code 09.13.53 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 09.14.38 # Does that bootloader handle the cache? 09.14.42 # If does the flush/invalidate sequence. Nothing should need saving from the COP cache so it simply invalidates. 09.14.51 # ah 09.14.53 Join hannesd_ [0] (n=light@gate-hannes-tdsl.imos.net) 09.14.57 # Maybe I should try that too 09.15.18 # An svn build crashes spectacularly on my 1st and 2nd Gen :( 09.15.51 # I'm not sure it's a cache issue. I notice the dump comes before the rockbox logo and the screen is offset to the left. 09.15.51 Quit scorche (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 09.16.20 Join ender` [0] (i=krneki@84-255-206-8.static.t-2.net) 09.16.45 Join scorche [0] (n=scorche@rockbox/administrator/scorche) 09.17.13 # When it runs, it runs fine. What struck me is that an SVN build was running, then proceeded to stop running at a later time. 09.18.14 # Yes, when it runs, it runs fine, but now with dualcore, if it crashes, both cores crash... 09.18.22 # (cop first) 09.18.59 # makes sense since COP will proceed out of kernel init first after waking the CPU. 09.19.33 # it just stays asleep inside switch_thread 09.21.13 Quit psycho_maniac (" HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Would you like to know more?") 09.21.37 # one test revealed no change if memset was used to zero thread and core structures 09.22.47 # I think something is just trashing the scheduler data 09.24.11 # or some object somewhere 09.25.49 Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) 09.27.33 Quit reppy () 09.33.51 Quit stripwax ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") 09.41.34 Join hasmind [0] (n=hasmind@121.127.192.229) 09.41.36 Quit lee-qid (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 09.43.32 Join safetydan [0] (n=safetyda@rockbox/developer/safetydan) 09.44.41 NHeal (timeout) kubrick.freenode.net irc.freenode.net 09.45.14 Nick linuxstb__ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@i-83-67-212-170.freedom2surf.net) 09.50.36 Join davina [0] (n=davina@cpc1-sout6-0-0-cust616.sotn.cable.ntl.com) 09.52.41 Join pondlife [0] (n=Steve@rockbox/developer/pondlife) 09.59.26 Join _quester [0] (i=c27f0814@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-735a5ed224c93437) 09.59.52 Quit Ebert () 10.00.36 Quit TMM ("Ex-Chat") 10.00.46 # <_quester> LinusN: hello LinusN. Could you please answer the questions of yesterday 17:35? (Should I repost them now?) 10.02.59 # _quester: Why are you only asking LinusN? 10.06.22 Quit hasmind ("Leaving") 10.06.26 # <_quester> linuxstb: because he made the change and thus must have had a reason to do it that way. 10.07.59 Join pixelma [0] (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) 10.08.43 # <_quester> But I'd be of course grateful if someone else would answer the questions :-) 10.09.35 # _quester: it would be easier if you would ask the question again 10.13.12 # <_quester> petur: ok, here we go. I just wasn't sure if a repost is a violation of the irc rules. 10.13.16 # <_quester> Why was it necessary to introduce INCREPEAT? Couldn't the last field just be changed to BUTTON_LEFT (for DECREPEAT for keymap-x5.c)? Since in the end the two actions do exactly the same. So why the difference on the action level? Or do I miss something? 10.15.31 # _quester: I assume you're talking about this commit? http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi?view=rev&revision=15811 10.17.43 # <_quester> linuxstb: yes 10.19.39 # If I was to unify some of the number formatting functions, where would a could place for it be in the code? 10.20.02 # At the moment, recording.c, settings_list.c and option_select.c all have their own version of the number format code 10.20.12 # there's probably others, but those are the ones I've noticed 10.20.40 # I think there is some code in misc.c already 10.23.00 # hrm, not seeing anything exactly like this. There's output_dyn_value but that's not quite right for this. 10.23.10 # but seems like a good place to put this sort of code 10.23.46 # output_dyn_value is what I was thinking of 10.37.01 Nick parafin|away is now known as parafin (i=parafin@paraf.in) 10.39.02 # _quester: INCREPEAT/DECREPEAT aren't new actions, they already exist in other context 10.39.22 # And I think that they should be used like that commit does, for consistency 10.43.58 # _quester: i can't really say why we have different actions for dec and decrepeat, but since we have them, i decided to make use of them in a consistent manner 10.45.33 # The reason for the separate repeat events is rather obvious 10.45.47 # It's the wrap suppression in lists 10.46.21 # ah of courese 10.46.24 # jfdkölhjs 10.46.44 # :) 10.47.02 # <_quester> amiconn: ah, then I understand! Thanks! So repeat is essentially the same as many single actions but different with respect to list wrapping. 10.47.43 # <_quester> amiconn: hrm... but OTOH isn't wrapping handled at a lower level? 10.48.05 # <_quester> amiconn: i.e. sync list level? 10.48.21 # _quester: not in the recording screen 10.48.31 # which was the bug i fixed 10.48.53 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 10.49.08 # anmother solution could have been to invent new actions for the gain adjustment in the recording screen 10.49.22 # instead of reusing the setting actions 10.49.31 Nick OlivierBorowski_ is now known as OlivierBorowski (n=OlivierB@ANancy-157-1-81-109.w86-218.abo.wanadoo.fr) 10.50.07 # http://daniel.haxx.se/blog/2007/11/27/sansa-v2-and-view-roundup/ 10.50.15 Quit OlivierBorowski (Remote closed the connection) 10.52.08 # <_quester> LinusN: ok. That's another question. My concern was understanding the keymaps code :-) 10.52.20 # <_quester> Thanks and bye 10.52.22 # :-) 10.52.22 Part _quester 10.54.15 Quit linuxstb (Nick collision from services.) 10.54.20 Nick linuxstb_ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 10.55.52 Join OlivierBorowski [0] (n=OlivierB@ANancy-157-1-81-109.w86-218.abo.wanadoo.fr) 10.56.32 Quit GodEater_ (Remote closed the connection) 11.01.47 Join advcomp2019_ [0] (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 11.13.56 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 11.14.15 Quit GodEater (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 11.15.06 # Hmm, so time for another cup of coffee at AMS, maybe... 11.15.25 # Who visited them last time round? 11.15.32 # rp and austriancoder 11.18.38 Quit advcomp2019 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 11.23.40 Quit Soap_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 11.24.15 Join Soap [0] (n=Soap@rockbox/staff/soap) 11.35.06 Quit crashd_ (Connection reset by peer) 11.38.43 Join crashd_ [0] (i=foobar@lostnode.org) 11.39.43 Nick Soap is now known as Soap_ (n=Soap@rockbox/staff/soap) 11.50.04 # pondlife: That 'access denied' error in voicebox is because the script fails to write its log. The script needs write permissions in its own directory 12.02.01 Join Siku [0] (i=Siku@e81-197-68-206.elisa-laajakaista.fi) 12.02.46 # buh? red ipod builds? 12.03.05 # oh, disk full on the build server 12.04.22 Join J3TC- [0] (n=jetc123@pool-71-125-77-210.nwrknj.east.verizon.net) 12.07.46 # woo, 200 bytes saved by moving the units out of the sound drivers 12.08.58 Join Bagder_ [0] (n=daniel@1-1-5-26a.hud.sth.bostream.se) 12.09.58 # have to finish later I guess 12.10.00 Quit safetydan ("Leaving") 12.14.11 Join Nico_P [0] (n=nicolas@rockbox/developer/NicoP) 12.16.09 Join FOAD_ [0] (n=dok@dinah.blub.net) 12.19.52 Join f4de [0] (n=fade@3.13.233.220.exetel.com.au) 12.20.00 # hey i was wondering if i can ask a question? 12.20.32 # Apparently you can. 12.21.17 # thanks 12.21.30 # I have a ipod nano i was replacing with rockbox 12.21.33 # and i was just wondering 12.21.41 # it comes up with found new hardware and says rockbox player 12.21.46 # and i havent got any drivers for it 12.22.21 Join Thundercloud [0] (n=thunderc@resnet09.nat.lancs.ac.uk) 12.22.22 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 12.22.54 # What generation? 12.23.13 # 1st 12.23.21 # i used the QT program 12.23.24 # was working all fine 12.23.34 # till i took it out to reboot got rockbox on it 12.23.45 # but now comes up with add new hardware instead now 12.24.22 # f4de: rockbox' USB support is in very early stages. You should enable diskmode or reboot to the Apple firmware to connect 12.25.20 # thanks 12.25.29 Quit Bagder (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 12.25.31 # but if i cant connect to it 12.25.38 # how can i reboot to the apple firmware? 12.26.12 # You hold some button-combination.. Someone with an ipod should tell you - I don't know the details. 12.26.23 # yeah im just doing it for my mum 12.27.15 # f4de: ignore that driver popup. 12.27.20 # i just cancelled and it let me in 12.27.22 # thanks :) 12.27.47 # it's a temporary kludge to enable full-power charging in rockbox 12.30.28 # oh thanks alot zagor :) 12.31.48 Quit J3TC- (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 12.33.15 Quit FOAD (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 12.33.15 Nick FOAD_ is now known as FOAD (n=dok@dinah.blub.net) 12.33.39 # amiconn: Cache problem it seems after all. Now that I can run it with the cache off correctly, even the battery level is good from startup. Next thing is a proper fix I suppose whatever that end up as. 12.33.59 Quit linuxstb (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 12.38.06 Quit f4de (" HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Chicks dig it") 12.38.39 Nick linuxstb_ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 12.42.37 Nick billenium is now known as billeniumZzZ (n=billeniu@c-69-249-243-110.hsd1.pa.comcast.net) 12.46.17 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 12.48.37 Quit linuxstb (Nick collision from services.) 12.48.38 Nick linuxstb_ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 12.51.05 Join homielowe_ [0] (n=iPod@d207-81-67-190.bchsia.telus.net) 12.51.44 # Zagor, Bagder_: one of you already looked into the rbclient.rockbox.org issue? Thought I'd ask in case you weren't aware... 12.52.20 # what issue is that? 12.53.27 # the build table shows failed builds on that one, seems to be no space left on device (see failed M5 sim build a bit down in the table) 12.54.54 # the red in the last build round is also on that server but the error message is a bit confusing 12.56.02 Join rp- [0] (n=rp@193.154.222.107) 12.57.22 # fixing... 12.57.52 # looked like /var has a tad too little space 12.57.58 # yeah 12.58.54 # it's only 19G, which is obviously too small :) 13.00.09 # i wonder why sdoyon modified rbspeexenc to have a volume flag when espeak itself has that... 13.01.13 # For symmetry, I think. 13.01.28 # symmetry?? 13.01.36 # With mp3, some people used the lame --scale parameter 13.01.43 # right 13.01.48 # Not all tts systems have a volume setting 13.02.47 Join barrywardell [0] (n=barrywar@dhcp-892b9aab.ucd.ie) 13.03.50 Join iamben [0] (n=ben@adsl-70-134-52-160.dsl.spfdmo.swbell.net) 13.05.03 Join stewball`ghost [0] (n=WTFOMGBB@91.104.222.73) 13.14.00 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 13.14.48 Quit iamben_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 13.15.33 # when you set a wake-up alarm, you should be able to switch the unit on and off as many times as you want, and still have it wake up after you finally turn it off, yes? 13.16.05 # Sounds reasonable... 13.16.45 # well, ipods don't do that now 13.17.07 # and i don't really know how to solve it, i had to nerf that when i fixed the "mysteriously waking ipods" problem 13.17.24 # That would need additional handling, making sure the alarm doesn't fire while rockbox is running 13.18.25 # what's the harm in that? 13.18.48 # Zagor: do you think firmware/usb_serial.c can easily be converted to work with the new USB stack? 13.20.37 # I think it would probably be both easier and better to write a new one using that as documentation/inspiration. first it's got all the driver details mixed into the protocol handling, and second it is for a full-speed driver which work very different from high-speed ones 13.22.22 # however as serial typically uses only very small packages, it is not unlikely that we could get serial to work even without solving the big block bug 13.22.37 # the Gigabeat F is only full-speed. Does that mean it will be difficult to port your USB stack? 13.23.49 # no I don't think so 13.24.25 # full-speed is what? 13.24.30 # more than 1.1, i hope? :> 13.24.49 # the main difference is that on high-speed devices you prepare the controller to respond to requests before they are sent by the host. full speed is much more linear request/response. 13.25.04 # full speed is 12 Mbit/s, high speed is 480 Mbit/s 13.25.08 # Zagor: Btw, does that special array in the usb driver really need 2048-byte alignment 13.25.12 # ? 13.25.24 Quit homielowe_ (Remote closed the connection) 13.25.36 Quit Zom (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 13.26.05 # amiconn: yes it does. or at least the manual says so. I don't remember if I've tried it unaligned. 13.26.29 Join J3TC- [0] (n=jetc123@wlrsvd-148.njit.edu) 13.28.36 # weird... 13.30.32 # also if you want to use the full 20K buffer capability, that too must be aligned to 2K... it's something to do with using very few bits for index counters, I think. 13.33.14 Join Zom [0] (n=zom@h-182-168.A166.cust.bahnhof.se) 13.34.17 # haha unzooming plasam a lot can produce interesting effects 13.34.29 # plasma* 13.36.15 Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) 13.38.35 Join Llorean [0] (n=llorean@cpe-70-113-103-34.austin.res.rr.com) 13.39.48 Join aliask [0] (n=chatzill@c58-109-97-210.eburwd4.vic.optusnet.com.au) 13.42.22 # aliask: hi 13.42.42 # Howdy Nico_P 13.42.46 Quit atsea-104 (Remote closed the connection) 13.42.56 # thanks for editing the wiki page :) 13.43.31 # I hope I didn't miss anything. Would a cross compiled sendfirm file work on windows? 13.43.55 # I don't think so, as libmtp is only for POSIX systems AFAIK 13.44.24 # A shame. 13.45.00 # have you tried anything new? 13.45.28 # I began looking at disassembling the OF bootloader in IDA 13.45.38 # I didn't get very far though 13.46.39 Join atsea-104 [0] (i=atsea-@gateway/tor/x-92b3ec3fde81b319) 13.47.33 # do you thinkw e could attempt to load the firmware from a file? 13.50.52 # Sure 13.51.23 # You need to change the DRAM start address in firmware/app.lds to 0x88000000 and then load the firmware binary to that address, and branch to it. 13.51.24 # OK, I'll start by getting the main binary to compile 13.51.37 # I had some thoughts on how to ID the file, it'd be slow, but work. The rockbox.gigabeat file has an ID at the top, the first four bytes would be "gigs", so we could scan files larger than x kb for that string 13.51.50 # linuxstb: I guess I can look at the dual boot code for inspiration? 13.52.07 Quit atsea-104 (Remote closed the connection) 13.52.08 # do any of you people know if fopen() and co expects a filename with the system locale encoding, or something else? 13.52.11 # Nico_P: Probably the other ARM bootloaders would be better. 13.52.22 # linuxstb: ok 13.53.12 # aliask: yes, that and it also appears that the firmware file doesn't have an extension 13.53.32 # and maybe for now we can assume it'll be 02 too 13.53.49 # Nico_P: We can't assume it'd be 02 for a player which already has media on it 13.54.10 # yes but I think for testing I'll start by making that assumption 13.54.19 # That sounds reasonably 13.54.22 # *reasonable 13.54.37 # Will we be able to have our own non-MTP USB mode eventually? 13.54.48 # I certainly hope so... 13.54.58 # probably with Zagor's USB stack 13.55.01 # If so, you should never have to make an assumption. Just have them install a bootloader with USB, then do a normal USB connection and copy the build over 13.55.13 # Well "never after things work" 13.55.24 # So it's a purely software USB device? 13.55.29 # Llorean: yes, that's what I was thinking too 13.56.33 # Besides, a build can't really work if the rest of it doesn't have the filenames Rockbox wants... 13.57.52 # Nico_P: Could I have a binary of the libmtp sendfile, I can't manage to compile mine - complains about a missing config.h 13.57.57 # I could really use some help from some of the sharp minds (and eyes) here. 13.58.17 # aliask: you need the whole source I think, but yeah I can send you the bin 13.58.39 # I do have the whole source, there's no config.h file in there. 13.58.41 # aliask: You're trying to compile the version in SVN? 13.59.11 # 0.2.2 tarball 13.59.24 # basically my driver code needs to be closely scrutinized, side by side with the usb controller reference manual. there is a bug in there that's preventing big blocks from working. and I'm not finding it. 13.59.34 # aliask: Sorry, I thought you meant sendfirm... 13.59.52 # aliask: have you run make in the main src dir? 14.00.14 # Yep. I have libmtp installed from there 14.00.49 # aliask: Did you run ./configure ? 14.02.19 # Hrm, I don't remember. I'll try rebuilding again 14.02.42 # someone with Archos knowledge read today's log? There was someone describing weird behaviour on an FM Recorder (starting at around 5 o'clock) with the latest builds, the details look "interesting"... 14.04.08 # Nico_P: Do you get a "sendfile" executable, or is it part of "connect" ? 14.04.29 # linuxstb: it's part of connect, with a symlink pointing to it 14.04.52 # most of the example programs actually use connect 14.05.02 # Have you tried creating new folders? 14.05.05 # Zagor: where do you think the bug is likely to be? 14.05.05 # Zagor: Current code is in SVN, and the manual is in the wiki somewhere? (More for the logs, I find it somewhat unlikely I'll be able to spot something) 14.05.16 # linuxstb: on the device? 14.05.19 Join MethoS- [0] (n=clemens@pD955C84A.dip.t-dialin.net) 14.05.31 # Nico_P: Using "connect --newfolder [foldername]" 14.05.43 # Nico_P: And then putting files in there? 14.05.47 # no, I'll try 14.06.15 # Ah, connect compiled for me. I'll just use that 14.08.15 # linuxstb: mtp-newfolder reported success, but mtp-folders doesn't show anything 14.08.29 Quit MethoS- (Remote closed the connection) 14.09.30 # I sent a file to the device, asking to put it in the folder I tried to create... when loading the rockbox bootloader the file appeared in the same place as the other files 14.10.07 # I got the main binary to compile btw 14.12.05 Join MethoS- [0] (n=clemens@pD955C84A.dip.t-dialin.net) 14.12.12 # barrywardell: I think it's most likely in the usb-drv-pp502x.c driver. init_queue_heads(), init_endpoints() and prime_transfer() are prime candidates 14.14.01 Join PaulJam [0] (i=PaulJam_@vpn-3069.gwdg.de) 14.14.10 # Nico_P: When connect wants a destination, what do you give it? 14.14.21 # aliask: just / 14.14.31 # it's the destination dir 14.14.50 # Ok 14.16.17 # Llorean: yes, the source is in svn: http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi/trunk/firmware/target/arm/usb-drv-pp502x.c?view=markup and the controller reference manual is here: http://www.freescale.com/files/32bit/doc/ref_manual/MCIMX31RM.pdf 14.17.13 # Nico_P: I think adding something like asm volatile("mov pc, #0x88000000"); to the end of bootloader/gigabeat-s.c will do what we want - after you load the Rockbox binary to that address. 14.18.20 # Nico_P: And don't forget to change 0x80000000 to 0x88000000 in firmware/app.lds (DRAMORIG for IMX31L) 14.18.41 # linuxstb: ok. for now I'm checking that I'm able to read the file correctly 14.19.46 Join GodEater [0] (i=c2cbc95c@rockbox/staff/GodEater) 14.22.46 # I'm having doubts 14.23.16 Quit Febs (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 14.25.43 # Zagor: remind me...RX and TX both don't work with big blocks? 14.25.57 # correct 14.26.36 Join hannesd__ [0] (n=light@gate-hannes-tdsl.imos.net) 14.28.00 # linuxstb, aliask: unless I'm doing something stupid, the first bytes of what I'm reading don't match with the first bytes of the file I sent 14.28.18 # Filesize is correct? 14.28.21 # yes 14.28.42 Quit JdGordon ("Konversation terminated!") 14.28.55 # It could be that ATA isn't really working properly 14.29.20 Quit homielowe (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 14.31.29 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection) 14.31.56 # Maybe the OF is encrypting the files... 14.32.50 # hmm actually read is returning -1, I had forgotten to check the return value 14.33.32 Join OlivierBorowski_ [0] (n=OlivierB@ANancy-157-1-37-131.w81-50.abo.wanadoo.fr) 14.38.03 # * Nico_P slaps forehead 14.38.53 # I should've considered the "I'm doing something stupid" option more seriously... I was closing the file before reading it 14.39.08 # now it's fine 14.39.28 # Zagor: what do I need to do to make try MSC mode in Rockbox? 14.40.32 # barrywardell: change at the top of usbstack/usb_core.c to define USB_STORAGE instead of USB_CHARGING_ONLY 14.40.49 # ok, thanks 14.41.30 # btw. rebooting on usb connect isn't currently working 14.41.38 # on which player? 14.41.43 # e200 14.41.58 Quit hannesd_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 14.42.04 # do you have bagders commit from late yesterday? 14.42.49 Quit GodEater ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") 14.43.05 # I just did svn up, r15833 14.43.21 Join atsea- [0] (i=atsea-@gateway/tor/x-c3e34d7edfbf7117) 14.43.28 # ok. does it crash or does it just not respond? 14.43.34 # linuxstb: can't I use kernel_entry to load the firmware? 14.43.37 # just not reboot 14.44.11 # sometimes crashes, sometimes the screen goes black and the wheel light stays on and nothing happens 14.44.32 # linuxstb: basically, just reenable the code that is in #if 0 14.45.12 # barrywardell: ok. bagder said his commit fixed that issue on his e200. 14.45.15 # Nico_P: You would need to look in crt0.S to see what it does... 14.45.36 # barrywardell: apparently more investigation is needed to get a safe system_reboot() for e200. 14.46.03 Quit J3TC- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 14.46.29 Join J3TC- [0] (n=jetc123@wlrsvd-148.njit.edu) 14.47.26 # Nico_P: No, I don't think you can - the crt0.S for the S doesn't support that. 14.48.07 # linuxstb: where is it? 14.48.11 # linuxstb: Out of interest, why not? 14.48.15 # and more importantly, what is it? 14.48.46 # ah, target/arm/crt0.S ? 14.49.08 # Nico_P: That's the one 14.49.27 # It's the assembly code that gets run at the very start of the bootloader 14.49.42 # amiconn: if the english.voice, english-1.voice, english-2.voice thing was very intentional, sdoyon just broke it 14.49.42 # (and also the main build, in the appropriate sections) 14.50.14 Join GodEater [0] (i=c2cbc95c@rockbox/staff/GodEater) 14.51.10 # aliask, Nico_P: Forget what I said, I was confused. That kernel_entry() thing has nothing to do with crt0.S, so should work fine. 14.51.20 Quit OlivierBorowski (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 14.52.01 Quit axionix (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 14.52.22 # Nico_P: You'll need to add "int(*kernel_entry)(void);" to the start of main() in bootloader/gigabeat-s.c (see bootloader/gigabeat.c) 14.53.03 # thanks 14.53.04 Join axionix [0] (n=axion@cpe-74-70-239-192.nycap.res.rr.com) 14.53.59 # wow it kinda worked 14.54.22 # Awesome! 14.54.36 # I got the rockbox boot screen (logo and version), but with a weird yellow line and it's frozen 14.54.45 # I wonder why it never worked for me... 14.55.21 # Where were you loading it to? 14.56.08 # Probably some really wrong address, and I probably left the app.lds pointing to 0x80000000 14.56.17 # Anyway, that's great news Nico_P 14.57.12 Join japc [0] (n=japc@194.65.5.235) 14.57.19 # I guess a patch is in order 14.57.42 Join spiorf [0] (n=spiorf@host22-211-dynamic.20-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) 15.03.40 # anyword on the 3G ipod firmware being fixed at all? 15.04.04 Quit Siku (Nick collision from services.) 15.04.10 Join Siku [0] (i=Siku@e81-197-68-206.elisa-laajakaista.fi) 15.05.05 Join Febs [0] (n=chatzill@38.98.196.75) 15.06.14 # aliask, linuxstb: the checksum seems to fail... things were loading because I had removed the check 15.07.37 # san|chez: There was a commit last night - see http://www.rockbox.org/recent.shtml#svn (second to last entry) 15.07.49 # hmm yeah the logo being displayed seems to have been pure luuck 15.07.55 # luck* 15.08.20 # thanks linuxstb 15.09.14 Join MethoS-- [0] (n=clemens@pD955CC48.dip.t-dialin.net) 15.09.14 # i was really upset when i have to uninstall rockbox 10 minutes after flashing :) 15.09.20 # * san|chez cant stand iTunes 15.14.01 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 15.14.44 Quit Siku (kubrick.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 15.14.44 NSplit kubrick.freenode.net irc.freenode.net 15.14.44 Quit rasher (kubrick.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 15.14.44 Quit Slasheri (kubrick.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 15.14.44 Quit Jon-Kha (kubrick.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 15.14.44 Quit Hadaka (kubrick.freenode.net irc.freenode.net) 15.14.56 # preglow: rasher wrote that, and it was intentional as far as it was meant to allow for building several voice files (with different voices, tts parameters etc) in one go 15.15.02 # But that never worked afaik 15.17.11 # Nico_P: Sounds like ATA issues to me... 15.17.29 Join nicktastic [0] (n=nick@unaffiliated/nicktastic) 15.17.31 # aliask: I'm not sure... the checksum is really close to what it should be 15.17.55 # Where is it missing I wonder? 15.18.02 Join rasher [0] (n=rasher@62.79.64.148.adsl.hs.tiscali.dk) 15.18.13 # and it appears that the file is read correctly, but the bootloader is checking against the wrong checksum 15.18.36 # What do you mean? 15.19.28 # hmm no I think I hadn't understood how the check is done 15.20.33 # amiconn: well, i've been confused several times, using wrong voice files, so i don't mourn seeing that feature go, heh 15.20.55 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) 15.21.09 Join Naked [0] (i=naked@naked.iki.fi) 15.21.09 NHeal kubrick.freenode.net irc.freenode.net 15.21.09 NJoin Siku [0] (i=Siku@e81-197-68-206.elisa-laajakaista.fi) 15.21.09 NJoin Slasheri [0] (i=miipekk@rockbox/developer/Slasheri) 15.21.10 Join Jon-Kha [0] (i=jon-kha@80-248-247-190.cust.suomicom.fi) 15.21.10 # aliask: where does gigabeat_s_code come from? 15.21.12 *** Server message 505: 'logbot :Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems, but you can always message a staffer. Please register! ( http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#privmsg )' 15.21.13 Nick Naked is now known as Hadaka (i=naked@naked.iki.fi) 15.21.51 # In scramble.c? 15.22.25 # aliask: in tools/gigabeats.c... did you write it? 15.22.38 # It looks like MODEL_NUM is wrong in firmware/export/config-gigabeat-s.h - it should be 21 (to match tools/scramble.c) 15.22.56 # Nico_P: Is the checksum wrong by 2? 15.23.04 # linuxstb: yes 15.23.06 # I did. I'm actually working on it right now. Most of it's copied from the OF nk.bin in an attempt to get the gigabeat V updater to accept it 15.23.15 # Nico_P: That's the problem then. 15.23.21 # linuxstb: thanks :) 15.23.51 # But I'm simplifying it in the hope that sendfile will get it there and it'll work anyway 15.23.57 Quit Siku (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) 15.24.05 # Nico_P: "tool" is set to be "scramble -add=gigs" in tools/configure - this is the standard 8-byte header consisting of a 32-bit checksum and four character model name. 15.24.54 # Nico_P: The gigabeat_s_code() function is used when calling "scramble -gigabeats" 15.25.23 # yes, I was looking at it and didn't understand what it does 15.25.27 # now I get a data abort 15.26.45 # at 80040DC0 15.27.03 # Something is still wrong then - there shouldn't be any code there... 15.27.11 Quit MethoS- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 15.27.16 # You changed firmware/app.lds ? 15.27.54 # linuxstb: yes, I changed 0x80000000 to 0x88000000 for DRAMORIG 15.28.26 # Do you get it immediately Rockbox loads? 15.28.35 # yes 15.30.06 # linuxstb: I randomly set buffer_size to 1024*1024 for load_firmware 15.30.40 # linuxstb: does an apps.lds change warrant a reconfigure? 15.30.52 # Woo! 15.30.54 # No, it shouldn't do, it's just used at the final linking stage. 15.31.02 # I just ran a generated nk.bin file 15.31.25 # aliask: no OF in it? 15.31.28 # None 15.31.38 # So just two chunks - the eboot disable and the bootloader? 15.31.44 # ice :) 15.31.49 # +n 15.31.57 # Three. One for 0x88000000 15.32.12 # ldr pc, =0x8a000000 15.32.40 # It supprised me, I thought something had gone wrong because it loaded so fast 15.32.46 # Did you try with just two, and setting the entry point to 0x8a000000 ? 15.32.58 # I can imagine - there's 13MB of OF to load normally... 15.32.59 # Nope. I can do that now though. 15.33.24 # But that's good - it means we can generate a clean nk.bin we can distribute. 15.33.34 # But windows users are left in the dark 15.33.41 # The gigabeat V updater won't send it 15.33.47 # Let's not worry about them yet... 15.34.18 Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.) 15.34.24 Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS) 15.34.36 # Without the OF we must use the recovery mode to update the bootloader unfortunately. 15.34.37 # I wonder if there is an official win32 API for MTP that acts in a similar way to libmtp... 15.35.04 # linuxstb: Can windows users use vmware? 15.35.13 # I guess we could ask the libmtp devs about that... they ought to know 15.35.13 # Llorean: You tell us... ;) 15.35.38 # At the moment I'd have to load a vmware image of debian within a vmware image of windows, not a fair test. ;) 15.35.51 # linuxstb: maybe this can help http://opensource.creative.com/mtp_xfer.html 15.35.57 # linuxstb: about the apps.lds change, I'm not sure I recompiled my binary after making the change, I'll do it again 15.36.15 # linuxstb: Two records works fine 15.36.32 # aliask: Nice... 15.36.43 # markun: Looks useful... 15.37.05 # markun: Nice indenting here ;) http://opensource.creative.com/mtp_xfer_code.txt 15.37.21 # Wow 15.37.54 # haha 15.38.37 # * markun wonder what he's missing.. 15.38.40 # wow 15.38.49 # markun: it's rather ... wide 15.38.58 # No 80 column guideline there... 15.39.03 # how do you fit that in 80 columns? 15.39.15 # :) 15.39.23 # You don't have 40 nested if() statements... 15.39.44 # oops, didn't see that file :) 15.39.53 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection) 15.40.12 # I love the scattered little "else" lines at the bottom. 15.40.53 # Did anyone listen to the test file? 15.41.18 # probably not terribly interesting 15.41.29 # compared to "catch the digital flow" for example ;) 15.42.05 # preglow: rbxspeexenc just creates speex data without a container? Am I remembering correctly? 15.43.18 Join n1s [0] (n=nils@nl104-209-88.student.uu.se) 15.43.40 # hmm, usb works slightly better in full speed mode 15.43.59 # Slightly better? 15.44.16 # yeah I can send one full 16KB buffer, and then it fails at the second 15.44.35 # or I can send a dozen 512 KB buffers 15.44.47 # in high speed, it always failed on the first buffer I try to send 15.44.54 Quit rp- ("leaving") 15.45.38 # linuxstb: now I'm back to getting a slightly corrupted splash screen 15.46.18 # Llorean: yes 15.46.24 # Llorean: i'm going to elaborate on the ml 15.46.41 # linuxstb: what is the entry point? 15.47.02 # 0x88000000 15.47.04 # also in full speed I don't have any problems with receiving. 102400 bytes in 103 ms = 994 kB/s 15.47.11 # Nico_P: i.e. the first instruction in the binary. 15.47.21 # Llorean: for voice files, the voice file itself is a container. using proper .ogg files for talk clips would be nice, but would bloat the core 15.47.26 # linuxstb: yes, but what's there once I've loaded the binary there? ie where in the source is the first intruction? main()? 15.47.35 # linuxstb: Shouldn't it be 0x88000008 15.47.47 # Nico_P: The first instruction is in firmware/target/arm/crt0.S 15.47.50 # aliask: Why? 15.47.50 Join nanok [0] (n=nanok@194.145.183.75) 15.48.04 # 4 bytes for the "gigs", and 4 bytes for the csum 15.48.09 # Nico_P: Which then calls main() in apps/main.c 15.48.13 # aliask: You don't load those 8 bytes. 15.48.19 Nick Bagder_ is now known as Bagder (n=daniel@1-1-5-26a.hud.sth.bostream.se) 15.48.23 # linuxstb: ok, thanks 15.48.31 # Ok. I misunderstood 15.48.33 # aliask: Or rather, you load them separately to check, and load the rest of the file to 0x88000000 15.49.30 # aliask: Do you know what is happening with interrupts and memory remapping in both the bootloader and main firmware? 15.49.43 # i.e. are interrupts enabled, and is any memory being remapped? 15.50.23 # linuxstb: Memory is certianly being remapped. DRAM is supposed to be 0x80000000 according to the datasheet. 15.50.43 # Who wrote that code in crt0.S? 15.50.44 # But no idea about anything else. 15.51.00 Quit animeloe (No route to host) 15.51.04 # ptw419 did. But I think it was taken from the linux bsp 15.52.35 # linuxstb: Should I commit my work on generating the nk.bin file? 15.54.32 Join animeloe [0] (n=animeloe@unaffiliated/animeloe) 15.54.57 Quit CaptainSquid ("Miranda IM!") 15.55.34 # aliask, linuxstb: http://pastebin.ca/799298 15.56.50 # aliask: Sure. A couple of things I noticed from the code in SVN - it's not 64-bit safe (use of longs) and it's not endian-safe. 15.57.04 # linuxstb: I see that the Cowon iaudio A3 plays APE, do you know which compression level? 15.57.18 # markun: No idea... 15.57.24 # linuxstb: I'll borrow some code from mknkboot to fix those up before I commit. 15.58.00 # It's powered by the TI Davinci 15.58.29 # markun: how powerful arm does that have? 15.58.44 # markun: There was a post recently to the flac-dev mailing list advertising the flac capabilities of the A3 - it supports FLAC in .flac, .ogg and .mkv and also supports realtime FLAC encoding from line-in. 15.59.14 # mkv? Wow - you don't see that too often! 15.59.21 # That's what I thought... 15.59.22 # Bagder: http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/tms320dm355.html 15.59.45 # that's matroska I assume ? 15.59.49 # Yes 15.59.56 # ok, ARM9 up to some 270MHz 15.59.56 # wonder what the "v" is for 16.00.02 # I thought "mkv" was specifically Matroska Video... 16.00.23 # The email said "mkv/mka" but I was lazy... 16.00.31 # Ah, okay. 16.00.47 # I guess there is no difference - just a convention for the filenames depending on how many streams there are in the file, and what types they are. 16.01.26 # Similar to the recent change to use "oga" for audio-only Ogg streams, and ogv for audio/video. 16.01.45 # and the tms320dm355 is... *publicly documented* 16.01.47 # yeah, the finally realized how it should have been in the first place... 16.02.20 # Bagder: yay 16.02.22 # man, I've started to forget how the times were when our targets had docs 16.06.54 # I wonder what made them change their mind 16.07.23 # yes, and why they then didn't release the docs for the other models too... 16.08.00 # Yes, why don't the same reasons they used to have apply to this processor.. 16.08.35 # mayse someone in the company got replaced 16.09.02 # could be the same reason they now let us use their compiler 16.09.52 Quit Zagor ("Client exiting") 16.13.02 # Nico_P: I've just looked at your patch - how did you choose the filename (/Content/0B/0000/05) ? 16.13.42 # linuxstb: from the recursive dir listing I have... I'm chaging things so that the first firmware file is loaded 16.15.15 # So it searches for a file with "gigs" in the header? 16.15.27 # that's what I'm writing now 16.15.35 # OK, I was about to suggest you did that ;) 16.17.02 # hehe - reminds me of that Penny Arcade cartoon with "Gigs" in it 16.18.15 # GodEater: http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2000/01/03 ? 16.18.33 # yep - that one ;) 16.30.53 # linuxstb: I'd like to commit but I need to load the second partition... I hack disk.c to do that but I can't commit in that state 16.31.04 # s/hack/hacked/ 16.31.23 # #ifdef GIGABEAT_S? 16.31.54 # is the plan to support the two parition layout forever ? 16.32.05 # GodEater: I doubt it 16.32.21 # then yeah, #ifdef it temporarily 16.32.29 # with a view to removing it further down the line 16.33.44 # * n1s is happy to see nice gigabeat s progress :) 16.34.20 Quit Thundercloud (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 16.35.28 # * linuxstb tries to tempt GodEater and n1s to join the S-fun... 16.36.07 # linuxstb: my lowlevel skills are not quite there yet... 16.36.22 # linuxstb: my home PC died properly today - I have no development platform :( 16.36.30 # Ouch 16.36.43 # GodEater: You have a ps3 ;) 16.36.54 # however, I have new bits in the post - so will have a whole new PC by the weekend hopefully 16.36.55 # n1s: mine are very flaky too but I find things to do :) 16.37.03 # linuxstb: :P 16.37.37 # I can't see Mrs. GodEater being very keen on the TV being covered in source code rather than "I'm a celebrity" going down very well! 16.37.45 # Double ouch 16.37.54 # You have that problem too :/ 16.38.38 # "I'm An Open Source Developer- Let Me Deal With The Bugs!" 16.38.42 # pondlife: I try to ignore it =/ 16.39.46 # nice play on words 16.43.45 Nick OlivierBorowski_ is now known as OlivierBorowski (n=OlivierB@ANancy-157-1-37-131.w81-50.abo.wanadoo.fr) 16.44.49 Join Arathis [0] (n=doerk@p508A74F4.dip.t-dialin.net) 16.45.04 # What's the deal with gcc choking on uint32_t in function arguments and function types? 16.45.26 Nick advcomp2019_ is now known as advcomp2019 (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 16.46.23 Quit GodEater ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") 16.46.42 # Wait... gcc isn't letting me declare ANY uint32_t's... 16.47.01 # include 16.47.56 Quit atsea- (Remote closed the connection) 16.47.56 # Bingo. Thanks n1s. 16.49.00 Quit mokkurkalve ("leaving") 16.50.18 # whoops... nice yellow line :/ 16.55.16 # Yeah, the stray 'i' 16.55.39 # amiconn: yes, I just committed the fix 17.01.00 Join scorche|w [0] (n=42c007b2@rockbox/administrator/scorche) 17.02.52 # * pondlife wonders if we'll ever have a fully green build table. 17.03.10 # Blimmin' argument 5... 17.03.16 # It happens more often than eclipses. 17.03.52 # There's no sensible cast for cfft.c? 17.06.22 # linuxstb: are you able to do more than one mtp operation on your S without having to disconnect and reconnect? 17.07.20 Join Thundercloud [0] (n=thunderc@resnet11.nat.lancs.ac.uk) 17.08.20 # Nico_P: I haven't tried. But I don't think MTP is working very well - the device is constantly connecting and disconnecting when I plug it in, and I need to run sendfirm repeatedly until it catches the S connected.... 17.09.26 Join webguest10 [0] (i=415fa2c6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-1e4965e600d2d618) 17.09.34 Quit webguest10 (Client Quit) 17.10.57 # linuxstb: ah, I used to have that too before, but not anymore... now I need to disconnect between each operation 17.11.52 Join Arathis2 [0] (n=doerk@p508A74F4.dip.t-dialin.net) 17.12.32 # Nico_P: How did you stop that? 17.12.39 # no idea 17.12.59 # pondlife: That seems to be a gcc bug (IIRC) 17.13.36 # Indeed, but I was wondering if some ridiculous casting might get a green build :/ 17.13.40 Part LinusN 17.13.49 Join jgarvey [0] (n=jgarvey@cpe-024-163-032-204.nc.res.rr.com) 17.14.02 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 17.14.14 # Or some very local way of disabling that warning? 17.22.25 # * aliask gives up 17.22.29 # linuxstb, aliask: have you tested the firmware loading? 17.22.37 # aliask: what are you giving up? 17.22.47 # The md5 hashes of two files are identical. One file loads. The other does not. 17.23.26 # aliask: permissions something? 17.23.27 # aliask: you got linux? try the cmp command 17.23.54 # lostlogic: Didn't return anything. I'm guessing that means they ARE the same 17.23.58 # lostlogic: that probably won't return anything if the files are identical 17.23.59 # yep 17.24.09 # if md5 are identical and the files not, i think you are the luckyest man ever to have walked this planet 17.24.12 # just checking, always the 1 in 120398120398120398123098123098123098120398 chance of an md5 collision 17.24.16 # Not some freak of nature having different md5s 17.24.21 # lostlogic: btw, do you have any comments on my fix for FS#8092? 17.24.33 # Nico_P: that's what I said "Yay" about yesterday ;) 17.24.46 # haha... apart from that? 17.25.05 Nick hannesd__ is now known as hannesd (n=light@gate-hannes-tdsl.imos.net) 17.25.08 # nothing comes to mind -- it looks good to me. 17.25.09 # I fixed a problem Lear made me notice 17.25.14 # yeah, I saw that 17.27.08 # Nico_P: I'll review it carefully later, but conceptually it is exactly what it should be. 17.27.56 # So, is MoB now complete? 17.27.57 # cool. I decided to go with a flush instead of making the buffering thread close handles... seemed simpler and it gives the user a chance to decide which handles are most important 17.28.13 # aye 17.28.16 # pondlife: there is still the ID3v1 issue left 17.28.22 # Ah, yes 17.28.22 # and cue sheets possibly? 17.28.36 # yes, that too... I have the start of it 17.28.52 # and I have a plan for id3v1 but haven't started coding yet 17.29.06 # I also want to add the buffering funcs to the plugin API and play with them a bit 17.29.10 Quit Arathis (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 17.29.14 Quit axionix ("leaving") 17.29.24 Nick Arathis2 is now known as Arathis (n=doerk@p508A74F4.dip.t-dialin.net) 17.29.26 # aliask: do you want me to try your files? 17.29.27 Join axionix [0] (n=axion@cpe-74-70-239-192.nycap.res.rr.com) 17.29.40 Join Frazz [0] (n=Fraser@thelawsons.plus.com) 17.30.03 # Nico_P: It just started working again 17.30.09 # :p 17.30.16 # I think I'm just making dumb mistakes because it's 3:30am 17.31.50 Join BigBambi [0] (n=alex@rockbox/staff/BigBambi) 17.32.03 # I'm going to commit this and go to sleep 17.32.09 # * BigBambi does the S progress dance 17.32.11 # aliask: cool 17.32.19 # Congrats all so far 17.32.42 # Still a long way to go yet 17.32.55 # we need to figure out how to init everything 17.33.09 # I guess it's time to look at the linux BSP 17.33.15 # Yeah, but progress is progress 17.33.18 # Nico_P: You brave man, taking on #2687 :) 17.33.23 # :) 17.33.26 # That's two devs it's eaten now 17.33.41 # pondlife: I think FS#8206 is pretty much the same 17.34.09 # note the task names end the same too :) 17.34.43 # Yes. Need to make sure all the relevant variables/interfaces are clearly labeled as codec_ or wps_ related transitions.. 17.35.03 # pondlife: the problem is that the WPS always assumes a seek is possible 17.35.09 # Well, it should be 17.35.22 # Even if it needs a rebuffer 17.35.26 # hmm 17.35.43 # And there's a bit of a delay while the codec gets back to work 17.36.01 Join mokkurkalve [0] (n=eivind@084202221248.customer.alfanett.no) 17.36.14 # Internal weaknesses of playback.c are no concern to the UI 17.36.22 # good point 17.37.08 # That's a tricky bug though; I had a hack at it once. 17.37.24 # Might result in further code cleaning ;) 17.37.28 # I guess with low latency it would go away on its own 17.37.39 # Not completely 17.37.44 # But the window would be very small 17.38.00 # I think we should fix it anyway, it's still a bug 17.38.08 # indeed 17.40.16 # Ok, I'm going to sleep. If the build goes all red, blame solar flares. 17.40.20 # Whoo-hooo! Got my e280 today. Luckily we're a few weeks behind here in Norway. It's a v1 (and not "Rhapsody" either). Now my rockboxed H340 can get a rockboxed little brother... 17.40.25 # aliask: nice :) good night 17.40.31 # g'night 17.40.33 Quit aliask ("ChatZilla 0.9.79 [Firefox 2.0.0.8/2007102213]") 17.41.29 Quit petur ("*plop*") 17.43.25 # lostlogic: there is one we haven't dealt with... double skipping in cases of codec error 17.45.03 Quit jhulst ("Konversation terminated!") 17.48.14 Quit hcs ("Leaving.") 17.52.22 Quit J3TC- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 17.52.43 Join J3TC- [0] (n=jetc123@wlrsvd-148.njit.edu) 17.55.49 Join Domonoky [0] (n=Domonoky@f051101000.adsl.alicedsl.de) 17.57.25 # linuxstb: aliask's commit works nicely and blazingly fast here... not very useful for now but very nice for when we'll have made more pregress 17.58.59 # Nico_P: oh, we haven't dealt with that? blah. 18.07.23 Quit pill (Nick collision from services.) 18.07.35 Join pill [0] (i=pill@sloth.shellfx.net) 18.08.22 Join spiorf [0] (n=spiorf@host22-211-dynamic.20-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) 18.09.55 # mokkurkalve: congrats! 18.18.45 Part pondlife ("Gone") 18.20.49 Quit axionix ("Lost terminal") 18.21.45 Quit pill (Nick collision from services.) 18.21.57 Join _pill [0] (i=pill@sloth.shellfx.net) 18.29.01 Join bertrik [0] (n=Bertrik_@249-022-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) 18.29.46 # haha 18.30.03 # rockbox just played the last track in a dir, then spat a couple of codec failures, then plays the last track again :D 18.30.10 # * preglow feels there are still bugs 18.30.39 # preglow: is auto dir change enabled? what's the repeat mode? 18.30.45 # auto dir change is indeed enabled 18.31.01 # repeat is off 18.31.17 # auto dir change feels a bit glitchy after mob 18.31.28 # Wasn't auto dir change always kinda hacky? 18.31.40 # hacky, but it worked 18.31.43 # now it's glitchy 18.31.57 # it failed again when playing the last track, and skipped an entire directory 18.32.07 # very weird 18.32.10 # ahahah 18.32.13 # now it disabled my dircache 18.32.27 Join Ebert [0] (n=EbErT@adsl-156-29-3.asm.bellsouth.net) 18.32.52 # after the last codec failure, everything spins the disk up 18.33.00 # it worked nicely here 18.33.17 # preglow: does it consistently fail? 18.33.27 # Nico_P: not consistently, no, but often 18.33.42 Quit Ebert (Client Quit) 18.33.51 # this isn't the latest build, btw, but it's recent 18.34.07 # how recent? 18.34.28 # it always never does what it should, though 18.34.36 # likes to skip files and dirs 18.35.01 # it's from five days ago 18.35.26 Join hcs [0] (n=agashlin@rockbox/contributor/hcs) 18.35.54 # should be fine then 18.37.39 # i'd love it if auto dir change was less hacky :/ 18.42.06 # * amiconn would rather remove it :> 18.42.34 Join Lear [0] (i=chatzill@rockbox/developer/lear) 18.42.48 Join Fraser [0] (n=Fraser@thelawsons.plus.com) 18.42.52 # * preglow can't stand using playlists 18.42.54 Part keanu ("Leaving") 18.43.29 # my music habits aren't so predictable that i can just put down a three hour playlist and know i'm not going to want to listen to something else halfway 18.43.41 Quit san|chez (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 18.44.19 # preglow: that's why we can insert and remove tracks in aplaylist :) 18.44.34 # insert space where appropriate 18.45.38 # sure, but i can't be bothered to insert, i just play it 18.45.40 # One can not use playlists, and at the same time, not use the auto-change-directory 18.46.18 # I'd still kinda like a one-click "Play this folder" (possibly optional) for targets that have both "Right" and "Select" as enter folder. 18.47.21 # tried to install rockbox on e280 - can't boot rockbox nor original firmware with |<< Guess I'll have to use recovery mode. Used sansapatcher on Linux and it said "Bootloader installed successfully" 18.47.25 # Llorean: i'd dig that too 18.47.40 Join pondlife [0] (n=Steve@rockbox/developer/pondlife) 18.47.42 Part pondlife ("Gone") 18.47.55 # preglow: There's currently a one-click-insert patch, but iiuc it doesn't work very well (breaks menus for people who use the insert button as their normal navigation button there, etc) 18.48.00 # Llorean: think that'd be a nice action for "select", really 18.48.06 # Llorean: it makes more sense for "right" to enter 18.48.11 # And I'd rather it be one-click "Start playing this now" rather than insert. 18.48.28 # agreed, agreed 18.49.36 # mokkurkalve: "boot _with_ |<<" ? Maybe just a misunderstanding but you press power before and then hold the "left" button? 18.50.34 # Llorean: personally I'd like one-click inser more that one-click-start-playing 18.50.40 # yes. "Cant load /system/OF.bin" 18.51.09 # won't boot either firmware now 18.51.43 # n1s: There's already a very quick method of inserting files or folders anyway. A one-click insert just makes it easier to accidentally mess up your playlist and not realize you've done it yet. 18.52.08 # n1s: Whereas one-click play-now, you'd know it at least. Not to mention Party Mode would make it one-click insert instead of one-click play-now, I should hope 18.52.19 # Llorean: so a one-click-start-playing would not mess up yout playlist? 18.52.37 # n1s: Read what I said. The key isn't whether it messes it up, but whether you know that you've done it. 18.52.58 # also to just start playing something is currently a lot easier than inserting... 18.53.01 # Can't load rockbox.m4i Cant load rockbox.e200 - when I try to start normally 18.53.04 # If you accidentally insert, say, the next track in an audiobook, you could end up listening to the book out of order and not being aware at all. 18.53.13 # n1s: To just start playing a folder? 18.53.30 # n1s: The whole point of this was having Select just start playing a folder, while Right enters it, rather than both acting the same when you click on a folder. 18.53.33 # jes, click select, click select on first track, voila 18.53.53 # n1s: And "Artist" folders with six albums in them, that I want to play the whole artist? Or whole genre? 18.53.58 # You're making assumptions... 18.54.17 # I have ofcourse extracted .rockbox to the root before running sansapatcher 18.54.32 # Besides, if "Select" is *always* Play Now, and "Right" enters folders, "Right" could also insert when done on an individual song, perhaps 18.54.39 # Llorean: that is just a one click insert with a "kill your playlist first" 18.54.49 # Exactly 18.54.58 # Stop playback, then insert. 18.55.00 # * n1s thinks that is just wierd 18.55.14 # So... clicking on a song to start playing it isn't weird, but clicking on a folder to do so is? 18.55.42 # so whit a regular one click insert you could have your thing with a simple press of stop first 18.56.05 # Llorean: i think so, yes 18.56.27 # n1s: And with existing, a long press and two short presses inserts anyway. Which is already very fast. 18.57.34 Join DerPapst [0] (n=DerPapst@p5B23F22E.dip.t-dialin.net) 18.58.20 # I think a lot of users just play music, rather than fiddling with playlists... 18.58.33 # Llorean: as it is basically the only thing i do in the file browser I think it is slow enough to be annoying 18.58.52 # guess I'll have to follow "recovery mode" instructions? I downloaded SKU_E-PP5022.mi4, this I should copy to recovey patition? 18.59.25 # n1s: Considering many MP3 players don't even have on-player playlist building, I think the more "normal" method is just to play songs that the user wants to play, than to spend time inserting, etc. 18.59.34 # Llorean: I'm just talking about what I think, i have noi ide what the users do... 18.59.37 Join mf0102 [0] (n=michi@85.127.180.92) 19.00.08 # Ah, well I'm thinking at least that a "Play Now" would be more useful, to most users, than an "Insert this" one-button. But that's of course still an opinion. 19.00.28 # We get enough people asking how to play all their music, or a whole artist, I think just telling them 'Click select on the artist folder' makes a lot of sense. 19.00.34 Quit Frazz (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 19.00.34 # Especially if having shuffle on will shuffle it, etc. 19.01.01 # mokkurkalve, you just need to start over like you said 19.01.12 # sounds like something that would be a suitable configurable option, "select does... a) insert into playlist b) play directory c) w/e" 19.01.28 # Talking about the users I think most would expect a SELECT click on a dir woul open it not play it... 19.01.51 # n1s: I think left and right to navigate in and out of folders is acceptable. 19.02.00 # With select actually "invoking" whatever you click it on 19.02.09 # hcs: yes, I think this would be one place where a configurable button would be nice 19.02.34 # n1s: Again, why not use party mode then? 19.02.39 Quit J3TC- (Connection timed out) 19.02.50 # Llorean: ah, I always forget there's that mode 19.02.51 # Llorean: because I like being able to skip tracks. 19.03.17 Join Psy-Krow [0] (n=krow@rrcs-67-53-12-150.west.biz.rr.com) 19.03.25 # Okay, see, that's so unlike my listening style I can't describe it. 19.03.42 # If I shuffle a large folder or something, yeah, I skip around. But if I actually craft a playlist, I'm very unlikely to want to skip 19.04.19 # The rest of us are bad predictors of our own preferences. 19.04.24 # I usually insert a lot of alnums into a playlist and then turn on shuffle... 19.04.27 # Llorean: but why do we need a special button to do something that is already possible with playlist=>insert in the context menu? it'll save only one (or two) buttonpress. 19.04.47 # PaulJam: I'm NOT suggesting a special button to insert... 19.04.54 # PaulJam: That's n1s suggestion 19.05.24 # Llorean: well, insert is the same as play when playback is stopped. 19.05.28 # PaulJam: I'm suggesting a special button to play the highlighted folder. Which saved either three shorts and a long, or two shorts and two longs depending on target. 19.05.38 # WHEN playback is stopped. 19.05.51 # But the discussion is over whether it should insert or start anew when playback is already active. 19.06.16 # PaulJam: And, for that matter, can you defend why we should have two buttons that do the exact same thing as opposed to giving one of them a shortcut to a frequently desired feature? 19.06.34 Quit Psy-Krow (Remote closed the connection) 19.07.49 Join Psy-Krow [0] (n=krow@rrcs-67-53-12-150.west.biz.rr.com) 19.08.06 # n1s: Do you frequently insert songs, or folders? 19.08.11 # Well... Now I got "Load main image fail." 19.08.21 # Llorean: usually folders 19.08.47 # Can't have been correct firmware file.... 19.09.10 # mokkurkalve, do you have a R or plain e200 19.09.10 # Llorean: because there were always two buttons doing the same and many people get used to either using the one or the other button. i always use NAVI/SELECT to enter a dir, and i wouldn't like if that behaviour changed (but i guess this isn't a very strong argument, maybe i'll come up with something better). 19.09.43 # PaulJam: The "Record" button always did nothing, and we changed that... it's hardly an argument at all 19.09.52 # Llorean: nothing for the Ondio then (but you already said that) :) 19.10.07 Join Redbreva_ [0] (n=Miranda@host86-144-108-57.range86-144.btcentralplus.com) 19.10.15 Quit barrywardell (Remote closed the connection) 19.10.18 # pixelma: I did in fact cover my basis by saying "targets where there are both a right and select button that do the same thing" :) 19.10.22 # bases 19.10.26 # That ondio is tricky 19.10.38 # I need to get one just so I can use it for a while and stop forgetting about it. 19.10.51 # nothing indicates an R. backside says "e200" and there was no mention of "Rhapsody" in the orignal frimware 19.11.13 # Llorean: thats different, the REC button did _nothing_, so there was no reason to press it before. 19.11.41 # PaulJam: Rec could be held down to prevent USB connection. 19.11.43 # PaulJam: I heard quite a few people used it to turn on the backlight :> 19.11.53 # And plenty of people used a short press for the backlight. 19.12.04 Quit hcs ("Leaving.") 19.12.14 # pixelma: a short press still doen't do anything. 19.12.17 # I think that any keymap should really be considered flexible up until a "release" version is made. 19.12.38 # I did upgrade to latest official firmware before trying to install rockbox 19.12.38 # Being afraid to change it just ties you into what may have been bad design decisions earlier on 19.12.42 # Such as having redundant buttons. 19.13.05 # mokkurkalve, what version is that 19.14.03 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 19.15.16 # I think the Sansa Firmware Updater said 01.02.18F was installed 19.15.51 # Llorean: i just don't see the need. on h300 you save one long buttonpress if playback is stopped and two buttonpresses (short,long) if something is playing. I mean wasn't this your arguement yesterday when someone asked for a button to play all songs? 19.16.32 # PaulJam: You save A long and a short, or a long and two shorts 19.16.58 # On iPod you save as much as two longs and a short. 19.17.06 # jeah, i was wrong, you save one buttonpress more in bothe cases 19.17.31 # PaulJam: My argument yesterday was more pertaining to the fact that the button couldn't be used for anything BUT playing all songs with his recommendation 19.17.56 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 19.18.05 # Being able to tread albums, or genres, or whatever as simply and cleanly as treating songs when you click them in the file browser or database does increase convenience 19.18.08 # treat rather 19.18.46 # And this function would in fact solve his problem more elegantly by far 19.19.20 # Llorean: using the button as a regular insert would be more flexible as you would only have to press stop first to get what you want, thus two short presses ore one long one short, depending on target 19.19.34 # PaulJam: And frankly, I don't see the need for preserving a redundant button, and that surely has as much wait as your not seeing the need for streamlining the ability to play things 19.19.58 # n1s: Honestly, I'd accept that if not for two things 19.20.03 # well, i think i'll just get used to it if someone implements it. i don't think i have any influence on the decision anyway :) 19.20.04 # I can now only enter recovery mode, but it's no help if I cant transfer a working .mi4 file 19.20.05 # 1) Stop is frustrating on iPods 19.20.30 Quit Domonoky (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 19.20.36 # 2) There's discussion of preserving the playlist when playback is stopped, and enough in favour of it that it may happen, meaning that stop then insert would actually insert while keeping music stopped, and not clear the playlist 19.21.07 # n1s: On iPods it's entirely possible to accidentally shutdown while trying to stop playback. 19.22.49 # Llorean: why stop at all if you are preserving the playlist? currently we start playing when something is inserted... 19.23.04 Join DM| [0] (n=dm@cpe-65-24-163-189.columbus.res.rr.com) 19.23.25 # n1s: Don't ask me, I'm strongly opposed to preserving the playlist when stopped 19.23.33 # I believe the argument is "to allow playlist editing while playback is stopped" 19.23.37 # so one press on that button would just insert with an unecessary stop... 19.23.47 # Llorean: we have pause... 19.24.00 # n1s: Again, don't argue to me, I'm not in favour of it. 19.24.13 # But you can't pause *before* playback starts. 19.24.20 # but then there's the argument that pause == stop because both makes it go silent :> 19.24.29 # Yep 19.25.11 # Anyway, even ignoring whether or not the Pause/Stop Clear/Don't Clear functionality changes, there's still the issue of the fact that on iPods long-play is Stop and longer-play is Shutdown 19.25.36 # In fact, I'd wager the majority of iPod users don't know that "Pause" isn't stop, and that there IS a stop. 19.25.39 # Llorean: move shutdown to another button? 19.25.52 # There's not a better button 19.26.08 # Stop is used less than Context Menu, FF, RW, or probably even Quickmenu 19.26.14 # And those are all the buttons you got 19.27.03 # maybe something like doubleclick for shutdown would work? 19.27.07 # Yes. What I need is 01.02.18F which is "Europe (with FM)" 19.27.55 # Llorean: IMHO the low number of buttons shouldn't make other targets' keymaps less usable... 19.28.11 # *on ipods 19.28.39 # n1s: That's a faulty argument 19.29.02 # It's shaping the added usability, rather than making it less usable. 19.29.28 Quit linuxstb (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 19.30.02 # Llorean: you stated that the reason you wanted this button was because stop is annoying, it isn't on h300 for example so the more flexible solution would make both the stop-insert and regular insert easier 19.30.07 # Considering on all targets it's equally easy to Insert, while on some targets it's harder than others to Stop before inserting... 19.30.26 # n1s: No, I didn't say the reason I wanted it. I said the reason I favourted it over simply inserting. 19.30.30 # favoured. 19.30.48 # You're basically saying we should favour a specific player rather than picking the solution that works best all around... 19.31.54 # There are no players with difficulty inserting, afaik, so making it less difficult is less "gain" than making playing a new folder (which already takes more button presses on all targets) easier. 19.32.10 # And one-click-playing is something people expect out of the UI anyway, as can be seen by frequent questions or expectation by people 19.32.11 # Llorean: no, the reason I think it's a strange ide to inser one action that does something that I don't ever do myself and really don't think most people do either so it isn't "best all around" 19.32.18 # Though usually they expect to play something with the "Play" button 19.32.37 # n1s: What basis makes you think most people don't want to play folders? 19.33.28 Join J3TC- [0] (n=jetc123@wlrsvd-148.njit.edu) 19.33.29 # n1s: Have you not seen the new users who frequently ask how to play a folder, artist, or whatever, and have to be told to stop, then insert it? Or how many ask why pressing "Play" doesn't play the folder they have highlighted and have to be told it's resuming playback, and doesn't actually play? 19.33.50 # Llorean: I think people like to add stuff to a playlist easy, this thing basically moves away from playlists to a "directory mode" sort of thing IMO 19.33.57 Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) 19.34.02 # n1s: I asked "on what basis" 19.34.26 # This means "what have you seen that suggests this". I've seen many users *expect* the functionality I described to already be there, and be disappointed that it's not. 19.34.40 # Personally *I* have more use for "one-click insert" and would prefer it on a purely personal basis. 19.34.51 # Llorean: I have made no scientific studies if that's what you are asking 19.34.54 # The reasons I favour one-click play are based more on what I've seen apparently desired and needed 19.35.14 # I'm not asking for scientific studies. "People keep coming in here and expecting to be able to use it" is hardly a scientific study in favour of my side 19.35.25 # But so far all you've told me is that *you* prefer it, and because of that you think that's how most other people would do it too 19.35.42 Quit Febs (Remote closed the connection) 19.38.09 # OK. I can still enter "recovery mode" but the .mi4 image downloaded fails. What do do? 19.38.13 Quit japc (Remote closed the connection) 19.38.20 # Llorean: btw, what makes you think that people DO frequently want to play folders that contain several subfolders with music? i havent seen many requests of that kind. 19.38.33 # PaulJam: As I said, I have seen many requests of that kind 19.38.52 # i have seen people using their players in very different ways but have never seen anyone use rockbox. I think most people accept the limitations and abilities of their respective player and so would expect to be able to do something similar to what they are used to. BUT when they have more freedom, like using computers ALL the people I have been secretly studying make playlists 19.38.56 # PaulJam: Including people who expect to be able to, and are surprised when the can't, and people confused because pressing "Play" on a folder resumes playback of something else rather than playing that folder 19.39.18 # Lear: hi, I see you closed FS#8158... I guess things are good for you too now? 19.39.49 # mokkurkalve, do you have the right pp5022.mi4 file 19.40.19 # Nico_P: Yes, can't reproduce it any more. No more MoB-related problems for me. :) 19.40.24 Join styleism [0] (n=sfgfadga@87-194-104-214.bethere.co.uk) 19.40.25 # cool :) 19.40.32 # Llorean: i hope you don't want to change the function of the play button. 19.40.52 # PaulJam: I never said that I did. 19.41.35 # Llorean: good, your last anwer somehow sounded like that. 19.41.50 # I have the one downloaded from page linked from rockbox wiki page. It's obviously not the right 19.42.05 # My point was just that from all the time I've spent helping new users, I frequently encounter confusion that there's not some button to "Play" a folder. 19.42.26 # Because in a *lot* of OFs there's a "Navigate" button that shows you the list of songs (or albums) by an artist, and a "Play" button that just plays that artist 19.42.56 Join GodEater [0] (n=bryan@rockbox/staff/GodEater) 19.43.49 # What I had before running sansapatcher was firmware 01.02.18F, which is for european e200 with FM. Don't know how to get that .mi4 file 19.44.09 # And while duplicating OF functionality is not necessarily a strong reason to do something, I see a lot more people expect to be able to do that, than expect to be able to one-click insert. 19.44.41 # And I very honestly think that a one-click insert will produce a lot of confusion among new users. "Why, when I click on the folder, does nothing at all happen?" 19.44.48 # Insert is essentially transparent if music is already playing 19.44.59 # And it may be 100 songs before you get to it. 19.45.05 Join webguest02 [0] (i=18b2733e@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-0b16cad59982e017) 19.45.23 # What I downloaded now was SKU_E-PP5022.mi4, and it don't work... 19.46.00 # mokkurkalve, did you rename the mi4 file to pp5022.mi4 19.46.30 # no, I didn't 19.46.48 # I'll try that 19.46.48 # mokkurkalve, that might be your issue 19.47.57 # i have a sansa e280r with rockbox installed. things look fine (small but fine) however i can't locat or play flac files. they exist in the musc dir. where can i find reference to play flac on this device. 19.48.20 # Llorean: We will never be able to make our UI not confuse users and we already expect them to read the manual so I don't think that is a strong point. 19.48.41 # n1s: But it's not a non-point either. 19.49.09 # webguest02, you need to show all files since the music folder is hidden 19.49.15 # Llorean: I agree and I also disagree with you and I don't think this discussion is going any further :> 19.49.22 # n1s: A new user can at least pick up Rockbox right now, and from trial and error get most of the functionality pretty quickly. A button that provides no apparent action, and no user feedback adds confusion 19.49.28 # webguest02: AFAIK you should be able to just select a flac file to play it, not any different than opening an mp3 19.49.46 # n1s: I can agree with that last point. It's good to have all the cards on the table. 19.49.56 # Llorean: do you think it would be a good idea to start a poll which of the two buttons should do the play now action? i personally would prefer the right button, but i don't know how others think about it. 19.50.00 # when i use the database the flac files do not show up. 19.50.29 # i would reply to specific nicks but i don't recall how. been too long since i used irc. 19.51.12 # i thought i should just be able to play the files. must be something wrong on my end. 19.51.45 Quit stewball`ghost (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 19.51.49 # PaulJam: Left and Right should stay "navigation", in my opinion at least. I'd rather not poll it, because honestly the feedback you get isn't really useful 19.52.05 # webguest02: are the flac files tagged somehow? 19.52.06 # PaulJam: When you poll, you're getting feedback from a subset of users that aren't really indicative of "all users" in any way. 19.52.26 # The average user could have completely different expectations, but also doesn't expect to have to check the forums to make sure things don't change. 19.52.39 # yes. the flac files are tagged with artist, title, track and some other info. 19.52.50 # It's kinda better just to make a decision based on whatever other factors you can include than any sort of "guess" at "user preference" 19.53.01 # Llorean: but then you can say "Hey, there was a poll, so don't complain" :) 19.53.31 # PaulJam: Yeah, but at the same time, after you start the poll, you may find a significant reason to do it the way other than the way they voted. 19.53.42 # I think it's better to just try to come up with objective reasons for one way or the other 19.53.51 # webguest02: did you add the flac files recently? perhaps the database is not updated yet 19.54.28 # added the flac files last night and have done two updates to the database but they don't show up. 19.54.42 # webguest02: In that case, I'm out of ideas 19.54.48 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.) 19.54.49 # PaulJam: I received slightly more positive feedback than negative for my e200 keymap change. One week before I posted final warning to the mailing list and forums. People didn't really respond until *after* the change was in SVN 19.54.57 Join amiconn [0] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 19.55.12 # webguest02: also what type of tags are those (Rockbox only supports vorbis comments in flac files)? 19.55.16 # PaulJam: And then, when I said "You have months to respond" the response was invariably "How was I supposed to know?". Basically, keymaps will always step on toes. 19.56.26 # ah. perhaps that is it. i think the comments are the flac formatted ones. i'll create a set with the vorbis comments and see if that works. i have to access the comments using metaflac. 19.57.37 # webguest02: and to see the files in the file browser, you need to either put them in a different folder (the sansa original firmware marks the "music" folder as hidden) - or as already suggested set the file view option to "all" 19.57.53 # vorbis comments are the native tag format for flac 19.59.07 # the flac files are in the music dir. i'll try changing the view option for files. thanks. 19.59.08 Join Bagder_ [0] (n=daniel@1-1-5-26a.hud.sth.bostream.se) 19.59.55 Join przemhb [0] (n=przemhb@fan115.internetdsl.tpnet.pl) 20.00.10 Quit J3TC- (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.00.40 Join J3TC- [0] (n=jetc123@wlrsvd-148.njit.edu) 20.00.41 # Hi 20.00.43 # ok. that did it. once i set the file view option to all they showed up. 20.01.17 # amiconn: what do you think may cause FS#8238 ? 20.02.10 # Umm, no idea... 20.02.33 # * amiconn didn't try wake up alarm at all, on any target 20.02.57 # And I always have startup screen == browser 20.04.05 # thanks for the help. this will make using the device a lot simpler. now i won't have to convert from flac to mp3 before i listen to music. excellent! have a good day folks! thanks for the help. 20.04.21 Quit mokkurkalve ("leaving") 20.05.00 # and have you got any idea concerning tuner's i2c problems some users experience? 20.05.06 Quit webguest02 ("CGI:IRC") 20.05.45 # przemhb: shouldn't really be a wakeup alarm thing, wakeup alarm just calls the screen like usual 20.05.52 Join Robin0800 [0] (n=Robin080@cpc1-brig8-0-0-cust97.brig.cable.ntl.com) 20.06.05 # for example FS#8144 or FS#8177 20.06.44 # maybe some init isn't done in correct order or given enough time when waking up 20.07.48 # it may be - normally tuner starts in some 1-2 seconds 20.08.10 # first you hear only noise and then a station tunes in 20.10.00 # maybe a new i2c data is send to the tuner before it tunes-in and so spoils frequency setting? 20.10.35 Quit advcomp2019 ("Never look down on someone unless you're helping them up.") 20.15.37 Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (n=hihi@p54BF6195.dip.t-dialin.net) 20.15.52 Quit Bagder (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 20.15.59 Join linuxstb__ [0] (n=linuxstb@i-83-67-212-170.freedom2surf.net) 20.17.40 Quit Robin0800 (" HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- In tests, 0x09 out of 0x0A l33t h4x0rz prefer it :)") 20.18.03 Join Robin0800 [0] (n=Robin080@cpc1-brig8-0-0-cust97.brig.cable.ntl.com) 20.23.27 Quit Robin0800 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.25.33 Quit BigBambi (Remote closed the connection) 20.25.41 Join TMM [0] (n=hp@ip565b35da.direct-adsl.nl) 20.26.43 Join toffe82 [0] (n=chatzill@h-74-0-180-178.snvacaid.covad.net) 20.27.51 Quit linuxstb_ (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 20.28.29 Join ompaul [0] (n=ompaul@gnewsense/friend/ompaul) 20.31.48 Quit J3TC- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 20.31.53 Join advcomp2019 [0] (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 20.32.28 Join J3TC- [0] (n=jetc123@wlrsvd-148.njit.edu) 20.36.16 Join JdGordon [0] (n=jonno@c210-49-113-143.smelb1.vic.optusnet.com.au) 20.36.43 Join lids_ [0] (n=lds@213.251.185.142) 20.36.43 Quit lids (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.38.13 Join Rincewind [0] (i=C5OiHy0Y@nat-wh-1.rz.uni-karlsruhe.de) 20.40.46 Join Arathis2 [0] (n=doerk@p508A634D.dip.t-dialin.net) 20.41.44 Join iamben_ [0] (n=ben@ppp-70-129-187-9.dsl.spfdmo.swbell.net) 20.47.13 Quit J3TC- (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.47.38 Join J3TC- [0] (n=jetc123@wlrsvd-148.njit.edu) 20.48.11 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection) 20.49.28 Quit ompaul (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 20.51.01 Join ompaul [0] (n=ompaul@gnewsense/friend/ompaul) 20.53.11 Quit iamben (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 20.53.25 # przemhb: Hmm, I really have no idea. Tuning, scanning and switching between presets works here both at 30MHz and at 80MHz 20.53.46 Join adrenergic [0] (i=sorry@203.101.184.29) 20.53.48 # And starting in FM screen returns to the last played station fine 20.54.00 # hey 20.54.11 # i need help 20.54.22 # so it is very dependend upon H10 unit... 20.54.40 # anyone can hear me :$ 20.54.56 # my friend's H10 tuner hardly works 20.55.13 Join Robin0800 [0] (n=Robin080@cpc1-brig8-0-0-cust97.brig.cable.ntl.com) 20.55.21 # hello.... 20.55.28 # adrenergic: just ask and be patient as per the guidelines (see topic)... 20.55.29 # anyone that can help me :( 20.55.30 # Maybe there's a difference in hookup between the 5/6 GB and the 20GB 20.55.41 # I have a 6 GB 20.55.44 # oh ok 20.55.51 # I don't think so 20.56.08 # I've got 5G - I'll try it 20.56.15 # adrenergic: someone who knows will answer 20.56.22 # and see how tuner works on it 20.56.27 # where can i find the TAA english version for Gigabeat MEG200J 20.57.30 Quit Arathis (Nick collision from services.) 20.57.37 Nick Arathis2 is now known as Arathis (n=doerk@p508A634D.dip.t-dialin.net) 20.58.02 # przemhb: My build is r15832 if that matters. And btw, the i2c clock cannot be too fast 20.58.34 # adrenergic: does that have anything to do with Rockbox? Besides, I have no idea what version you are talking about... 20.58.36 # We use udelay(2) for each half-period, that makes (at least) 4 us for the full preriod, i.e. (max) 250kHz 20.59.06 # The TEA5767 can handle fast i2c (up to 400kHz), and the driver handles clock stretching 20.59.15 Quit J3TC- (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.59.38 # amiconn: I have tried to increase it up to 50 - it did not helped my friend's H10 to work any better... 20.59.51 # I thought that possibly the SDA line might also miss a pullup on some H10's, but that can't be 20.59.56 # (udelay(50) 20.59.57 Join J3TC- [0] (n=jetc123@wlrsvd-148.njit.edu) 21.00.11 # Yeah, as I'd expect 21.00.19 # There must be a different problem. 21.00.24 # Is that a 20GB model? 21.00.44 # yes 21.00.46 # 20GB 21.01.01 # Okay, so I *bet* there's a difference between the 5/6 and the 20 21.01.20 # jhMikeS, who commented on fs #8177, also has the 20GB model 21.02.06 Part adrenergic 21.03.02 # maybe there were introduced some changes to H10 circuits during mass production(?) 21.04.31 Quit Seed (Nick collision from services.) 21.04.37 Join Seedy [0] (i=ben@bzq-84-108-237-178.cablep.bezeqint.net) 21.05.09 Join FOAD_ [0] (n=dok@dinah.blub.net) 21.05.50 Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) 21.06.20 # There could also be a difference in rockbox 21.08.18 # there was no RB version that has worked good for my friend, so the problem exist from the begining 21.11.06 # I have just checked how my second H10 (5GB) behaves - simply saying just fine 21.11.19 # there's no problem at all 21.12.51 Join CrumbCat [0] (n=crumbcat@adsl-75-6-255-44.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) 21.13.20 Quit CrumbCat (Client Quit) 21.13.44 Join Zagor [0] (n=bjst@46.35.227.87.static.tab.siw.siwnet.net) 21.14.05 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 21.14.25 Join Rob2222 [0] (n=Miranda@p54B14FB0.dip.t-dialin.net) 21.14.55 # preglow: The button driver uses non-atomic GPIO handling. Not sure whether this might cause that kind of problems, but atomic port handling is better anyway. Will change and test 21.18.35 Join Febs [0] (n=chatzill@38.98.196.75) 21.21.50 Join obo [0] (n=obo@rockbox/developer/obo) 21.22.03 Quit FOAD (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 21.22.03 Nick FOAD_ is now known as FOAD (n=dok@dinah.blub.net) 21.22.27 # amiconn: what problem? 21.22.44 # Unstable tuner operation on H10 20GB 21.23.20 # Was that maybe supposed to have been directed at przemhb? 21.23.51 # my guess too :) 21.23.52 # eh, yes 21.23.58 Quit mf0102 ("Verlassend") 21.24.01 Quit Zagor ("Client exiting") 21.24.08 # amiconn: oh, right, that certainly is possible and worth doing anyway 21.24.09 # Too many nicks matching pr 21.24.36 Quit J3TC- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 21.24.52 # amiconn: don't worry, i am very sympathetic to that problem :P 21.24.56 Join desowin [0] (n=desowin@hdp186.internetdsl.tpnet.pl) 21.24.56 # Right now I just did the H10 button driver, because it uses GPIO D like the fm tuner driver 21.25.29 # There are a lot more places which could (and probably should) be converted 21.26.20 Join safetydan [0] (n=safetyda@rockbox/developer/safetydan) 21.28.33 Quit Rob222241 (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 21.30.47 Quit zicho (Remote closed the connection) 21.31.17 Quit JdGordon ("Konversation terminated!") 21.31.42 Join zicho [0] (n=martin@c-5f9fe355.68-7-64736c14.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) 21.32.55 Quit stripwax ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") 21.34.14 Join stewball [0] (n=WTFOMGBB@91.104.222.73) 21.38.41 Join japc [0] (n=japc@bl8-1-101.dsl.telepac.pt) 21.43.05 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.) 21.43.13 Join amiconn [0] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 21.44.33 # Is tuner operation stable on e200, or does it have the same problems as on c200? 21.44.48 # amiconn: Unstable how? Slight drift? 21.44.59 # No, flaky operation 21.45.26 Quit DM| ("*bashes head against keyboard*") 21.45.31 # Sometimes working sometimes not, sometimes even requiring to enter the radio in the OF to get radio back in rockbox 21.46.00 # I've heard some people say that the signal is a lot weaker than it is in the OF. And others say that if they load a preset for 95.5 or some such, that it'll actually tune in a bit off, but inconsistently so that it's not a constant offset. 21.46.12 # As well people have had their radio appear and disappear across boots. 21.50.58 # P[-]\ 21.51.22 # F 21.51.24 # F 21.52.53 # animeloe: what are you trying to say? 21.58.27 # animeloe, my radio is off by .1 mhz 21.59.47 # oops, amiconn i mean 22.01.04 Join Zagor [0] (n=bjst@46.35.227.87.static.tab.siw.siwnet.net) 22.03.26 # amiconn: I've checked what is H10 tuner's frequency drift on alarm wake-up - it must be in -1.45 -1.7MHz range 22.04.54 # the actual frequency is 1.45 to 1.7 lower from the required frequency 22.06.30 # atomic GPIO setting did not improve anything 22.09.54 # amiconn: did you even try setting the delay in the lv24020lp driver to 2? the udelay of 1 may often end up too short. I asked low_light to check that but never got word if it was. 22.12.41 # Well the datasheet says that the 3wire bus can operate up to 700kHz 22.13.04 # udelay(1) should keep the clock <= 500kHz 22.13.30 # I can't try that now, because I normally don't have access to a Sansa 22.13.37 # pixelma could test that 22.14.13 # sure, what do I need to change and where? 22.14.21 # yeah, but udelay(1) will actually delay until the next uS which may be too short 22.15.44 Join J3TC- [0] (n=jetc123@wlrsvd-148.njit.edu) 22.16.39 # ok, will try in a bit 22.16.54 Join Matteo_M [0] (n=matteoma@81-208-36-83.ip.fastwebnet.it) 22.17.24 Quit Matteo_M (Client Quit) 22.18.07 Join Matteo_M [0] (n=matteoma@81-208-36-83.ip.fastwebnet.it) 22.18.12 # hi guys 22.18.23 # * jhMikeS hopes its that simple anyway :) 22.18.41 # I've just downloaded rbutil for osx, and I have problems installing themes 22.19.09 # it gives me a network error, but I have installed with no problem the rockbox firmware and fonts 22.19.16 # any suggestion? 22.20.33 Quit styleism (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 22.20.54 # jhMikeS: Any idea about the PP5002 cache problem yet? 22.20.58 # here a shot that can explain: http://img115.imageshack.us/img115/7843/immagine1yn3.png 22.21.12 # I put an svn bootloader on my 2nd Gen - no change :( 22.21.29 # amiconn: that's turning out be a bugger on how to get it started without corrupting things. :\ 22.22.30 # Maybe the problem is a bug of rbutil that can't connect to the right server in order to download themes... 22.22.57 # Matteo_M: I think the theme server is just going through changes right now 22.23.30 # ok, is what I was expecting to heat llorean, thank you 22.23.46 Quit Matteo_M ("Leaving") 22.25.56 Join LinusN [0] (i=linus@rockbox/developer/LinusN) 22.29.54 # jhMikeS: any clues as to why queue_wait causes a data abort and sleep freezes on the S? 22.31.21 Quit w0rd54 (Remote closed the connection) 22.31.29 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 22.33.16 # linuxstb_: ping 22.34.47 Nick Bagder_ is now known as Bagder (n=daniel@1-1-5-26a.hud.sth.bostream.se) 22.34.48 # Nico_P: on the S? can speculate it's something to do with core sleep 22.35.13 # jhMikeS: yes, on the S. what does that mean? 22.35.45 Join sandisk [0] (n=sandisk@adsl-074-165-218-035.sip.mco.bellsouth.net) 22.36.27 Join w0rd54 [0] (i=blackdev@100mbit.top-site.us) 22.36.27 Quit sandisk (Client Quit) 22.36.28 # no ports to new processors have bothered implement sleep_core 22.36.31 # jhMikeS, amiconn: increasing that delay doesn't help 22.36.50 # pixelma: argh...worth a short anyway 22.37.29 # jhMikeS: ah I see now... is it really critical? if so, what should I look for to try implementing it? 22.37.36 # * jhMikeS can't see the point in not implementing the basics before doing everything else...yes it's boring as hell, but needed 22.37.54 # * amiconn agrees 22.38.21 # * Nico_P will try, but needs a few pointers 22.38.31 # I can quite reliably reproduce if I listen to some music files before trying to enter the radio -> frequencies off. Maybe that helps someone to get an idea... 22.38.32 # and I need to learn ARM too :p 22.38.41 # Nico_P: it's spelled out on how the implement it in thread.c 22.39.05 Quit Lear ("ChatZilla 0.9.79 [Firefox 2.0.0.10/2007111504]") 22.39.34 # just fill in the right part with the processors sleep command 22.39.53 # jhMikeS: thread.c:411? 22.40.51 # thread.c 100. these have to be done according to how the processor behaves (whether or not it may sleep with interrupts disabled and such). 22.42.05 # ah yes... I'll try doing it then 22.42.06 # reason for all that is to never have to wait out a tick when something should be running _now_ which is quite a long wait 22.42.28 Nick parafin is now known as parafin|away (i=parafin@paraf.in) 22.43.00 Quit linuxstb__ (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 22.43.09 # jhMikeS: it's likeley to be like the other ARM versions, isn't it? and is the interrupt disabling/enabling code the same, 22.43.10 # ? 22.44.09 Quit stewball (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 22.45.57 # s2c2440 and pp are quite different in the approach 22.46.09 # s3c2440 22.48.30 # that one with not wake up if interrupts are disabled when the core clock is cut, but it takes several cycles to actually stop. that sets the idle bit then enables the interrupts in the next instruction. if one is pending it will basically abort the idle. 22.49.15 # SH is similar to that. PP and Coldfire can just leave them disabled. 22.51.20 # the idea is to keep the interrupt pending at the time the core is trying to sleep because that interrupt may have made a task ready to run 22.53.22 Quit rasher ("leaving") 22.55.38 Join rasher [0] (n=rasher@rockbox/developer/rasher) 22.58.42 Quit nicktastic ("Leaving") 22.59.20 Join nicktastic [0] (n=nick@unaffiliated/nicktastic) 22.59.38 # * ender` yawns 23.00.15 Join advcomp2019_ [0] (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 23.00.34 Quit Redbreva_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 23.00.41 Quit advcomp2019 (Nick collision from services.) 23.00.49 Nick advcomp2019_ is now known as advcomp2019 (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 23.05.17 Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) 23.06.35 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye") 23.06.42 Quit desowin ("use linux") 23.07.00 Join webguest90 [0] (i=47bf1606@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-7b8134353c951caa) 23.07.58 Quit webguest90 (Client Quit) 23.08.32 # Nico_P: any chance there's still a problem with the BSS inits on the S? 23.08.59 # jhMikeS: I have no idea... I'm not even what the implications would be or how to check :/ 23.09.16 # add "sure" after "even" 23.09.32 # I'm a complete noob 23.10.08 # try enabling the kernel and thread checks and see if you get any interesting panics 23.10.37 # where are the checks? 23.11.04 # a #define at the top of kernel.c and thread.c 23.11.06 Quit linuxstb_ (Remote closed the connection) 23.11.38 Join linuxstb [0] (n=chatzill@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 23.13.10 # testing 23.13.29 # Does H1xx support albumart? 23.13.39 # I get a data abort which I'm pretty sure comes from queue_wait 23.14.07 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 23.14.30 # stripwax: look in config-h100.h... you can also enable it there if it's not 23.14.50 # Nico_P which queue wait? 23.15.08 # * Llorean can't imagine Album Art looking particularly good at 2bpp 23.15.22 # Llorean: in some cases it's quite recognisable 23.15.25 # It seems to 'work' 23.15.36 # In others, not so much. 23.16.10 # Any devices have a bitmap lcd but not albumart? 23.16.44 Quit male ("User disconnected") 23.17.10 # jhMikeS: I get a data abort at 8804140C... the .map seems to place queue_wait there IIUC 23.17.31 # * stripwax guesses recorder 23.18.12 # sliding_puzzle seems to build and run fine for h120, just testing for recorder. Anything else I need to take a look at? 23.18.17 # stripwax: Just do "grep HAVE_ALBUMART firmware/export/config-*.h" to see which targets have it. 23.19.22 Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.) 23.19.28 Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS) 23.19.29 Quit Fraser (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 23.19.50 # linuxstb - right -- thanks 23.20.12 Quit idnar (Nick collision from services.) 23.20.14 Join idnar_ [0] (i=mithrand@unaffiliated/idnar) 23.22.00 Quit nicktastic ("Leaving") 23.22.09 # Gigabeat-S and mrobe500 don't HAVE_ALBUMART but do have 16-bit displays - is that expected? 23.22.32 # stripwax: I didn't enable it because it's not very useful ATM 23.22.42 # tpj1022 also 23.22.48 # Nico_P: of course it could be a bad pointer jumping it there too 23.23.19 # Nico_P - what isn't useful - the build or the albumart? 23.23.34 # stripwax: AA on these builds in their current state 23.24.09 # jhMikeS: should system-arm.h:set_interrupt_status work ok on the S? 23.24.24 Join hcs [0] (n=agashlin@rockbox/contributor/hcs) 23.24.29 # Nico_P: are interrupts working at all? 23.24.37 # n1s: I don't know 23.24.58 # I seem to recall aliask saying they didn't, but I don't know how to check 23.25.21 # Nico_P: it should work on any ARM I'd think 23.25.30 # Nico_P - is that just because the build isn't working fully? should sliding_puzzle on these targets be able to access the cover.bmp files, or not? I think my patch won't build on those so I'll try that. 23.26.09 # Nico_P: i'm not too familiar with these things either but there should be some sort of interrupt status register we could check. 23.26.22 # stripwax: I don't think you need to care much about these targets right now... also if your code is enclosed in #ifdef HAVE_ALBUMART, it should be fine 23.26.26 # It follows ARM's own guidelines re: the way to set the cpsr 23.27.32 # jhMikeS: is there a way I can check interrupts work? 23.27.52 # Nico_P - right. sliding_puzzle currently does not test HAVE_ALBUMART for the albumart-specific puzzles and I wanted to see if HAVE_ALBUMART was defined always whenever bit depth > 1 (seems not though) 23.28.07 # Adding HAVE_ALBUMART sounds like it will be necessary after all. thx 23.28.23 # on that you can put a splash screen in the handler for the interrupt your want to check 23.29.09 # stripwax: HAVE_ALBUMART is basically independant from any other #define. I added it in a bunch of config files and target maintainers can do it for recent ports. if you use AA you need those #ifdef checks 23.29.23 Quit bertrik ("bye") 23.29.30 # aren't ticks running? 23.29.44 # yep 23.29.52 # jhMikeS: I don't know... sleep seems to be problematic though 23.30.02 # it seems t simply freeze the player 23.30.07 # just wanted to understand why it's a separate #define that's all 23.30.33 # Nico_P: no panics then I take it? 23.30.48 # jhMikeS: haven't seen any, I'll disable queue_wait to check though 23.31.04 Join zajacattack [0] (i=42617a92@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-5b3ddbf6d23fe17b) 23.31.36 # stripwax: it's separate to allow per-target fine-tuning 23.31.46 # fair enough 23.31.54 # zagor: what remains left to be done with the USB stack? 23.32.14 # Is the S allowing nested interrupts to occur (not disabling interrupts in interrupt mode)? 23.32.29 # zajacattack: get it to work 23.33.11 # zajacattack: Please don't come in here every day and ask that. It'll be done when it's done. 23.33.18 # jhMikeS: as per my previous experiments, no more data abort with queue_wait disabled, and no panics either 23.33.27 Nick idnar_ is now known as idnar (i=mithrand@unaffiliated/idnar) 23.33.40 # Llorean: i know; i only asked cuz yesterday zagor wasn't here 23.33.42 # chill 23.33.57 # I have a few printf calls that allow me to say the player freezes in ata_init(), and I'm thinking it's on the sleep() call 23.34.19 # * jhMikeS wonders about that comment in kernel-imx31.c "the following needs to be fixed". It's completely archaic. 23.34.37 # jhMikeS: regarding nested interrupts, I have no idea 23.35.15 # Nico_P: any idea which queue_wait is causing it though? Is the queue one with queue_send enabled? 23.35.56 # jhMikeS: it's hard to say, the panic error message clears the screen so I can't see which steps were done OK 23.36.03 Quit J3TC- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 23.36.20 # * jhMikeS notices no interrupt ackknowlege code on the S 23.36.52 # which panic? 23.37.04 # err sorry I meant the data abort 23.37.27 # hmmm...make it not clear it? 23.37.42 Quit hcs ("Leaving.") 23.37.49 Part zajacattack 23.37.59 # do you know where that error message is defined? 23.38.09 # in system.c 23.38.49 # the interrupt code is rather fishy looking 23.40.37 Join Lars_G [0] (n=Lars@unaffiliated/lars-g/x-000001) 23.40.45 # I see lots of work on the usb side of things. how's it comming along? 23.41.21 # ok, it's EPIT_HANDLER...hmmm 23.43.28 Join DM| [0] (n=dm@cpe-65-24-163-189.columbus.res.rr.com) 23.44.13 Join Skail [0] (n=colin@static24-72-51-82.regina.accesscomm.ca) 23.46.10 # the avic code appears that it should be using set_interrupt_status during the avic calls or at least setting INTDISNUM _before_ removing a handler 23.47.35 # eh, blah, no...looks fine. (sucks trying to evaluate for a device you don't own) :p 23.48.26 # heh 23.49.11 # though, do we really need dynamic handler installation? 23.49.46 # jhMikeS: the data abort seems to happen because of ata_init too 23.50.22 # any part of ata_init in particular? 23.50.34 # err that I already knew... I'm starting to be sleepy 23.51.06 # * jhMikeS didn't know that though :) 23.51.30 Quit Rincewind ("bye") 23.51.39 Part Lars_G 23.52.06 # actually I didn't either :p I'm starting to get confused 23.52.43 # I'll try to see more precisely where it happens 23.55.59 # * jhMikeS wonders if cache handling is right over there or a factor at all 23.57.52 Join kclaf [0] (i=kclaf@85.95.211.245) 23.58.59 Quit Skail ("Concoction recent by Pier.")