--- Log for 12.10.108 Server: brown.freenode.net Channel: #rockbox --- Nick: logbot Version: Dancer V4.16 Started: 7 days and 3 hours ago 00.02.20 Quit gp_g (Remote closed the connection) 00.08.03 Quit n1s () 00.09.58 Join dabujo [0] (i=xx@p4FDB38B7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) 00.10.58 Quit nuonguy ("This computer has gone to sleep") 00.17.32 Quit bluebrother ("leaving") 00.19.58 # gevaerts: I see there has been some action regarding the crt0.s for s5l8700 00.20.40 # gevaerts: isn't crt0.s where setting up the memory, the memory protection and copying stuff from rom to the runtime address should happen? 00.21.06 # gevaerts: because at least setting up the memory is target dependent and not generic on arm 00.21.26 # gevaerts: afaik 00.22.25 Quit avis () 00.22.55 # amiconn: Any idea why a RecorderV1 wouldn't boot from an firmware file then? 00.23.07 # ? 00.23.16 # That's a bit... vague 00.23.29 # gevaerts: perhaps I am wrong, and setting up the memory etc. should be done in the bootloader 00.23.59 # amiconn: A rockbox ajbrec.ajz is present, but it's simply booting into the OF. 00.24.15 # I assume this is a non-flashed archos? 00.24.40 # amiconn: It's a used one he picked up at a store, no knowledge of previous history. 00.25.09 # Check the versions displayed at boot and in the OF 00.25.36 # I suspect that it's non-flashed, and the in-flash OF is rather old 00.26.16 # I've asked him for the firmware version number (in the forums). I'm not sure if he's ever coming back, though. 00.26.26 # Older versions sometimes don't pick up an ajbrec.ajz from disk if the rootdir is large/ fragmented or similar 00.26.34 # Aaah 00.27.16 # What might help is defragmenting the disk. If that doesn't help, reformat and put back ajbrec.ajz as the first thing 00.27.36 # Thanks. 00.27.50 # Another reason for an ajbrec.ajz not picked up would be a wrong one (i.e. one made for a different archos) 00.32.38 Join Waldo000000 [0] (n=roy@203-219-228-242-gee-ts1-2600.tpgi.com.au) 00.32.51 Part Waldo000000 00.35.42 Join blkhawk- [0] (i=HydraIRC@g227066151.adsl.alicedsl.de) 00.39.29 Quit Tetracomm (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 00.40.01 Quit dabujo ("( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.2 :: www.regroup-esports.com )") 00.40.05 Join Tetracomm [0] (n=nicholas@72.252.29.2) 00.41.22 Join reacocard [0] (n=reacocar@WL-358.CINE.HMC.Edu) 00.42.37 # linuxstb: hi, are you here? 00.47.19 Join MethoS- [0] (n=clemens@host-091-097-243-025.ewe-ip-backbone.de) 00.50.07 Quit blkhawk (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 00.54.03 Part Llorean 00.54.22 Join Llorean [0] (n=DarkkOne@ppp-70-242-15-169.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net) 00.57.26 # anybody: I don't get it. is the crtS0.s in ipod executed from rom? or is it loaded by some bootloader into ram first? 00.57.55 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 00.57.57 Join Waldo000000 [0] (n=roy@203-219-228-242-gee-ts1-2600.tpgi.com.au) 00.58.13 # because it can't be in rom, if it allocates the FIQ/IRQ stacks in crt0s itself 00.58.17 Quit robin0800 (Remote closed the connection) 01.00.35 Part Waldo000000 01.04.01 Quit ajonat (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 01.04.52 Join ajonat [0] (n=ajonat@190.48.116.113) 01.05.23 # denes_: On ipod none of our code is executed from rom 01.06.59 Quit tvelocity (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 01.09.49 # amiconn: ok 01.10.27 # amiconn: thanks. and how does the code get into (i)ram then? there is a bootrom that does that? 01.10.32 # We don't touch the rom at all 01.10.53 # The apple loader (in rom) loads the OF from the firmware partition 01.10.59 # amiconn: i see thanks 01.11.14 # amiconn: because the thing is, meizu m3 will be executing from rom 01.11.15 # We patch that on-disk firmware and insert our bootloader 01.11.31 # amiconn: ok thanks, that clears things up 01.11.45 # (well, patch by default, we can also replace it, making it boot faster) 01.12.09 # amiconn: is there a target that runs from rom? 01.12.35 # That disables dual-boot, obviously. ipods are brick-safe due to the fact that the rom also contains a disk mode 01.12.44 # amiconn: right 01.13.13 # Iirc no arm target executes our bootloader from rom 01.13.31 # The irivers do, but they're coldfire 01.13.40 # (H1x0 and H300 I mean) 01.13.41 # amiconn: i see 01.14.19 Join bmbl [0] (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/bmbl) 01.14.20 # amiconn: and another question: what is the bootloader supposed to do when everything is running from rom? 01.14.54 # amiconn: it just loads stuff to (i)ram and hand execution to the firmware main function? 01.15.22 # amiconn: i mean crt0.s loads stuff into ram and iram, and zeros out bss 01.15.40 # amiconn: before that of course the ram controller has to be set up 01.15.58 # amiconn: and then we jump to the firmware entry point 01.16.07 # amiconn: does that sound right? 01.16.15 Quit bertrik ("Leaving") 01.16.25 # That depends a lot on the actual target. Targets need quite different handling depending on ROM, size, partitioning, method/ possibility to load the OF for dual boot etc 01.17.04 # what options do I need to compile gcc with to build rockbox successfully? 01.17.17 Quit reacocard (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 01.18.28 # aarcane: I'd use the rockboxdev.sh script in tools - it will apply the required patches then build for you 01.18.48 # On all swcodec targets the bootloader loads the main rockbox binary from disk (with the exception of the still unofficial H1x0 flashing) 01.18.58 # amiconn: i see 01.19.18 # BigBambi, o,.,0 will it install it in a private prefix, or in my main path somewhere? 01.20.10 # aarcane: it puts it in /usr/local by default, but you can of course edit the script if you like 01.20.10 # amiconn: is there a target, where the whole firmware executes from rom (that's how I am planning to do it on the meizu m3) 01.20.28 Quit domonoky (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 01.20.52 Join HBK- [0] (i=hbk@pool-71-96-74-73.dfw.dsl-w.verizon.net) 01.20.53 # aarcane: Also, we recommend/need specific versions of gcc depending on the architecture - rockboxdev.sh will get the correct versions for you too 01.21.39 # denes_: The archoses can be flashed to load the firmware from ROM. It *could* also be executed directly from ron if it hadn't grown too big meanwhile 01.21.49 Quit Tetracomm ("Leaving") 01.22.08 Join Tetracomm [0] (n=nicholas@72.252.29.2) 01.22.16 # But this isn't the standard method, and imho it shouldn't be the standard method on any target 01.22.26 # denes_: Why not load from disk? 01.22.46 # Updating rockbox is much easier if you load the rockbox binary from disk. 01.22.54 # It means to update you don't constantly need to flash 01.23.00 # amiconn beat me to it :) 01.23.13 # The bootloader could of course run directly from rom if possible 01.23.24 # (saves boot time) 01.23.53 # Another reason to not execute from ROM would be that the ROM is almost always slower than RAM 01.24.13 # That's okay for a bootloader, but nasty for main rockbox 01.24.19 # Hello. 01.24.28 # Rockbo does not work on the Ipod Nano, right? 01.24.49 # It works on the first gen Nano just fine 01.24.55 # As www.rockbox.org says 01.25.21 # amiconn: and on other targets how does the bootloader load the firmware? just copies it to ram and jump to the start? 01.25.23 # How do I tell which generation my Nano is? 01.25.38 # okay, anything I need to know for between running rockboxdev.sh and tools/configure in my build dir ? 01.25.47 # denes_: Yes, basically 01.25.53 Quit ajonat (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 01.25.59 # Tetracomm: The very first link on google for "What ipod do I have" is a hint 01.26.12 # The firmware should depend as little as possible on the bootloader, and set up things itself 01.26.36 # aarcane: At the end rockboxdev.sh will tell you to add things to your path, that's it 01.26.52 # okie 01.27.12 # you will need to run rockboxdev.sh as root incidently 01.27.38 Join druidu [0] (n=root@213.164.231.5) 01.27.46 Quit gregzx ("ChatZilla 0.9.83 [Firefox 3.0.3/2008092417]") 01.28.22 # hello! 01.28.24 # The main firmware always has a crt0.S as well, which does things like zeroing bss/ibss, copying data (for optional rom execution - right now only applies to archos and H1x0), setting up the main stacks etc 01.28.52 # any tips for finding which GPIO pins are for each button on a device (iRiver X20)? 01.29.46 # I know from the datasheet the address of all the registers and also the special function each can have (like external interrupts -- I am guessing they use one of those pins for the power button so it can wake up the device from sleep state) 01.30.01 Quit bmbl (Client Quit) 01.31.18 Quit bughunter2 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 01.32.15 # amiconn: yes, I am looking at the HXX0 linker scripts 01.33.38 # time for me to poof 01.34.14 # druidu: Most targets don't use sleep state, but true poweroff. One of the buttons typically doubles as a power switch, and then the CPU needs to enable a "hold power" signal before the users releases the button 01.34.22 # amiconn: so you are suggesting that the meizu m3's 8 Mbit flash should be used for a 4KB bootloader? 01.34.33 # yes 01.34.38 # In the simplest case this "hold power" is a switching transistor that's enabled via a GPIO output 01.35.04 # denes_: The bootloader is typically much larger than that, around 40..50KB 01.35.31 # denes_: Given the speed at which Rockbox changes, we really don't want people flashing multiple times per day 01.35.37 # It needs the ata (or sd, or similar) driver, file system driver etc 01.36.17 # Of course you can offer flashing main rockbox, but this shouldn't touch our bootloader, and it should be optional 01.36.18 # BigBambi: which one wears of faster, the nor flash or the mlc nand flash? 01.36.31 Quit HBK (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 01.36.39 # denes_: It isn't just that, it is the danger/ease of use too 01.36.53 # Nor flash can take less cycles, because you cannot do wear leveling on it 01.36.54 # denes_: And I wouldn't have thought eaither wear quickly enough for that to matter 01.37.11 # Plus flashing a nor flash is quite slow 01.37.14 # BigBambi: even if the firmware is not flashed to rom, if you break it on the nand flash, you can't do anything (usb is done from software) 01.37.37 # Then the bootloader also needs the usb stack 01.37.45 # bootloader usb.... 01.37.48 # yup 01.37.56 # dammit - amiconn beat me again :) 01.39.21 # just a side note, there is no usb stack yet on the m3 01.39.44 # The typical rockbox boot sequence is that the OF loader loads our bootloader from disk (usually a firmware partition, but may also be a file), and then that bootloader loads main rockbox (from the data partition) or the OF (if the ttarget supports dual boot) 01.39.46 # denes_: If you have a usb enabled bootloader in flash then rockbox is updated on disk, then any temporary glitch in Rockbox can be repaired by the stable tested bootloader in flash. If we are relying on having only main Rockbox in flash, then if that glitches it it causes major problems 01.39.56 # ok, so regardless of that... I can have some visual output (lcd backlight on/off and a led on/off) and also disassembled the original firmware 01.40.08 # what's the best way to detect which gpio is for which button? 01.41.13 # I tried some kind of bruteforce (setting all the pins to input & enabling pull-up resistors then checking if some gpio pins change state), but didn't get anywhere... some gpio pins kind of fuck everything up when I mess with them 01.41.24 # BigBambi: i don't understand. you can always use dfu upload - it is stored in the bootrom baked into the chip. 01.41.27 # There are some targets with a different sequence though. The mentioned irivers have no separate OF loader, so we inject our bootloader to an OF, and that patched OF is then flashed using the OF. SO on these, our bootloader is actually the first thing that gets executed. It then either loads rockbox from disk, or jumps to the of 01.41.37 # denes_: That isn't very user friendly 01.41.47 # It can also load rockbox from ROM on the H1x0 (unofficially) 01.41.50 # I got usb boot to work 01.41.55 # Or rather less userfriendly 01.42.35 # You have to put it in the mode, use a tool to send a firmware etc. If it is on disk you just plug it into usb, use bootloader usb and copy a new build 01.43.47 # BigBambi: sounds great. one problem though: nothing of all this has been written. and if the bootlader has to be perfected to 100% utility first, all of this will be written even later. 01.43.52 # acutally, I'm not at that point yet -- I still have a lot of parameters to figure out before the device could do something useful (make the lcd to work, figure out controls etc) 01.44.01 # Archos and the coldfire based iaudios are again different 01.44.08 # denes_: Everything you need for the bootloader, you need for main rockbox 01.44.13 # I don't see the issue. 01.44.31 # The only difference is that you try it, say it works, and there you go, that is a bootloader release 01.44.50 # BigBambi: you could already use a half working (but working) rockbox, without usb support for example 01.45.03 # Sure, for development 01.45.03 # denes_: Tae a look at how our swcodec bootloaders are built. All of the driver code is taken from firmware/, with just a single file representing the apps/ code 01.45.14 # amiconn: yes, I have seen all that. 01.45.53 # It basically *is* a cut-down rockbox, which can just load rockbox from disk, charge, provide usb (the latter 2 depending on whether the hardware requires it) 01.45.57 # denes_: The only reason we get away with no usb for e.g. ipod is because Apple disk mode still exists 01.46.06 # In the simplest case this "hold power" is a switching transistor that's enabled via a GPIO output 01.46.12 # BigBambi: yes, for development. but final release quality is many months away. 01.46.27 # Of course, but that is what you want to work for 01.46.28 # this means that if I set all pins to output and write FF everywhere, it should turn off? 01.46.41 # denes_: Why do it one way now, then have to change it all before release? 01.47.04 # Why not work in the final way now, it'll save time in the long run 01.47.24 # Do you have a bot that answers FAQ? 01.47.33 # Tetracomm: No, not really 01.47.33 Quit culture (Connection timed out) 01.47.42 # Tetracomm: We have a fine manual :) 01.48.04 # Ok. What can your current bot (if any) do? 01.48.09 # druidu: No. It means you need to research, either by reverse engineering the OF, or by trying things and measuring what happens(could be potentially dangerous), or by getting a defective device, stripping all parts, and then use a multimeter to trace the board 01.48.36 # Tetracomm: kick people if they flood. Certain people can prompt it to explain stuff I think. It also logs the channel 01.48.49 # Ok. 01.49.03 # denes_: Nothing stops you from working on the bootloader and rockbox in parallel 01.49.03 # Also, certain people can get it to kick people 01.49.15 # amiconn: well, this is what I want to ask, tips for doing that... already tried a lot of stuff and I'm not really getting anywhere, maybe you guys have experience with other devices 01.49.17 # Oh. 01.49.29 # BigBambi: why do it one way when it will have to be changed later? because getting rockbox itsself to work first, is much more entertaing - and remember, i am not paid for this, i am planning to do this in my free time. 01.49.37 # for example, patterns to look for in the OF... I tried searching for some register addresses, but they don't help too much 01.49.40 # denes_: As is everyone else 01.49.55 # Also, as I already mentioned, rockbox should be self contained, meaning you should be able to flash rockbox *instead* of a rockbox bootloader (provided there's enough space in ROM) and it should work 01.49.59 # denes_: But why do all the work if it won't get accepted because of the way you did it? 01.50.21 # Surely the idea is that it becomes a full target and therefore gets the value of everyone else changes too? 01.50.53 # If you do a port that isn't accepted because of the approach it takes, then it won't become a part of Rockbox as a whole (extreme case) 01.51.20 # BigBambi: you don't have to threaten me that my work will not be included. all that you can gain by that is me loosing interest (not a tragedy, but still... ;) ) 01.51.25 # Note that I used 'bootloader' in the sense we use it on the swcodec targets. Archos is a bit different as our system is a bit more modular there 01.51.37 # I'm not threatening at all, I have zero say in this 01.52.03 # I'm just trying to persuade you that doing it in the 'correct' or preferred way would be a good idea 01.52.10 # amiconn: yes, i understand all you have said. it's true that the bootloader is mostly a subset of rockbox. 01.52.26 # amiconn: and with a little linker script tinkering, rockbox can run standalone 01.52.35 # Anything you do would be hugely appreciated 01.52.43 # I just don't understand the opposition 01.52.54 # amiconn: now that's why I wanted to have rockbox run standalone from rom - less work and faster results 01.53.12 Quit faemir (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 01.53.47 # amiconn: which of course doesn't mean it can not - or should not - be fixed up later correctly (that again is not much work as we might agrree) 01.54.09 # Well, you can develop this way if you want, but it should not become the standard way of running rockbox on your target 01.54.28 # Exactly my point 01.54.36 # Although, I really think that it's more difficult to do it that way 01.55.14 # amiconn: the question is will it get accepted to svn like that - as a first try at the things. 01.55.19 # Having the bootloader load rockbox from disk makes it so much easier to work on (non-bootloader) rockbox stuff... 01.55.29 Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection) 01.55.53 # amiconn: because if it doesn't then I just work on my own, nothing gets back to the other developers, work gets duplicated and lost, etc. 01.56.10 # denes_: Surely you will still post patches? 01.56.27 # Then at least others could fix it up if they had the desire? 01.56.54 # BigBambi: well yes. 01.57.30 # ok guys thanks for clearing some questions up 01.57.30 # denes_: As amiconn says, you are free to develop as you like. However, it would make it much easier all round if you did it in a rockbox way 01.58.05 # denes_: Don't get me wrong, I'm very much looking forward to any and all progress :) 01.58.28 # BigBambi: look, at the current stage, when nothing is working (except for lcd) it doesn't matter if one works on the bootloader or rockbox itself - same thing. 01.58.35 # very true 01.58.54 # but we were talking about a future stage 01.59.10 # certainly drivers etc is applicable to both 01.59.22 # BigBambi: but when things already work, but there is no usb stack for example, then things get stalled - as progress could continue on sound etc., but it cannot because a perfect bootloader is the first priority 01.59.34 # no, that isn't true 01.59.58 # And I din't think anyone said that 02.00.07 # BigBambi: that's how I understood it. 02.00.08 # *don't 02.01.26 # Well, to an extent I guess - all I was saying was is that the bootloader should load Rockbox from disk 02.02.05 # So what we don't want is a full Rockbox as the bootloader 02.02.26 # But if you want to do that to work on the sound output, then brilliant, let's get sound! 02.02.45 # I'm talking as in eventual design for release etc 02.03.01 # BigBambi: ok, that is understood. 02.03.28 # In general, as amiconn said, having Rockbox on disk makes development easier - I guess this all mainly depends on how hard USB is :) 02.04.31 # so thanks again for answering my questions. so I will start working on the bootloader first - especiall as it doesn't really matter at this stage at all :) 02.04.33 # denes_: I'm very sorry if I came across as negative at all - I've contributed pretty much sod all and I want to encourage, not the other way round :) 02.05.06 # An usb stack already exists, so usb support shouldn't be too difficult. It just needs the driver for the chip 02.05.13 Quit soap () 02.05.45 # s/especiall as it doesn't really matter/especiall as it doesn't really matter what I am working on 02.05.50 # I think the actual disk support is the biggest problem on many of the new flash-based targets, due to the lack of a hardware flash controller 02.06.03 # amiconn: possibly 02.06.59 # BigBambi: ok, at least I understand the idea behind the bootloader and main firmware stuff 02.07.06 # Without disk support there isn't much point in working on sound, so disk support is needed anyway. And if you have that, you basically have the bootloader 02.07.18 # amiconn: indeed 02.08.12 # * amiconn *knows* how difficult it is to do development without disk access 02.09.36 # ok so thanks for the help again - i will hopefully get back to you with some patches soon - good night all 02.09.49 # night 02.12.03 Nick JdGordon|zzz is now known as JdGordon (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 02.15.35 Join BHSPitLappy [0] (n=BHSPitLa@unaffiliated/bhspitmonkey) 02.20.40 Quit MethoS- (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 02.22.42 Join Waldo000000 [0] (n=roy@203-219-228-242-gee-ts1-2600.tpgi.com.au) 02.23.14 Part Waldo000000 02.23.23 Join MethoS- [0] (n=clemens@host-091-097-243-025.ewe-ip-backbone.de) 02.23.36 Quit ender` (" Sex is dirty - if you do it right. -- Isaac Asimov") 02.31.38 # Can I run Rockbox in Qemu? 02.32.43 Quit ompaul (Client Quit) 02.33.11 # Tetracomm: no, but it can be run as a simulator so you dont need to 02.34.13 # Oh, how? 02.34.48 # in the configure script choose simulator instead of normal build 02.35.30 Quit BlakeJohnson86 ("Leaving.") 02.36.39 # Ok. 02.36.56 # Will it ask me? Or would I have to edit configure? 02.38.51 # I want to try and get Rockbox to work on the Zen, what can I start by doing? 02.38.56 # CReative Zen* 02.39.48 Join BlakeJohnson86 [0] (n=bjohnson@c-24-118-162-123.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) 02.42.09 # Tetracomm: a sim build makes a sdl app simulates the UI... if you want to actually get code working on target its not very sueful 02.42.46 # Ok. 02.44.21 # are any of the sansa v2 hackers still around? 02.45.01 # Are any Creative player hackers around to help me get started? 02.50.25 # Or at least tell me where you left off. 02.51.58 Join funman [0] (n=fun@AAnnecy-257-1-54-118.w90-28.abo.wanadoo.fr) 02.51.59 Join Soap [50] (n=Soap@rockbox/staff/soap) 02.52.11 # JdGordon: you called? 02.52.15 # hey 02.52.40 # do any of the v2 hackers have a e200 yet? 02.53.19 # the e200 owners are not very active 02.53.49 # for testing they are present, but not working on any driver 02.53.58 # ok, ill try swapping my v1 for my bro-in-laws v2 so i can help out 02.54.21 # cool :) 02.57.04 Quit Schmogel (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 02.57.58 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 02.59.11 # if I buy a v2 by accident when collecting v1s, JdGordon, would you want it? 02.59.42 # I think one is enough :p 02.59.58 # I'm starting to get wierd looks by my family over the amount of mp3 players :) 03.00.05 # what is a v2 03.00.38 # funman: last week of uni now, so ill get into it soonish 03.00.52 Join reacocard [0] (n=reacocar@WL-358.CINE.HMC.Edu) 03.01.54 # nice, I get mad trying to use the SD ;) 03.02.34 # lyte: something like http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaE200v2 03.15.35 # oh oh it seems the SD answers my commands, but with a wrong crc 03.16.33 Quit fdinel ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") 03.20.17 Quit Tetracomm ("Leaving") 03.22.42 # ah 03.23.10 Join homielowe [0] (n=homielow@d206-116-134-81.bchsia.telus.net) 03.23.20 Quit homielowe (Remote closed the connection) 03.41.14 # but I never got the busy bit set in acmd41 response :( 03.45.26 # it means the card power up procedure never finishes 03.48.13 # if it answers the commands at all, that must mean it is powered; so maybe not enough ? 03.55.09 Join Thundercloud [0] (n=thunderc@84-51-130-71.judith186.adsl.metronet.co.uk) 03.55.26 # saratoga: any news about your jtag wire ? 03.55.30 Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@unaffiliated/jhulst) 03.58.34 Join Tetracomm [0] (n=nicholas@72.252.29.2) 04.00.54 Join homielowe [0] (n=homielow@d206-116-134-81.bchsia.telus.net) 04.01.56 Quit funman ("leaving") 04.08.11 Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection) 04.14.19 Quit wpyh ("Leaving.") 04.16.01 Nick blkhawk- is now known as blkhawk (i=HydraIRC@g227066151.adsl.alicedsl.de) 04.16.20 Quit kugel ("ChatZilla 0.9.83 [Firefox 3.0.3/2008092510]") 04.24.58 Join blkhawk- [0] (n=blkhawk@f051101080.adsl.alicedsl.de) 04.28.37 Quit thegeek (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 04.29.58 Quit agaffney (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 04.30.23 Join agaffney [0] (n=agaffney@gentoo/developer/pdpc.active.agaffney) 04.41.50 Join DaCapn [0] (i=dacapn@using.your.wireless-inter.net) 04.42.10 Quit blkhawk (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 04.42.43 Quit reacocard (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 04.42.56 Nick blkhawk- is now known as blkhawk (n=blkhawk@f051101080.adsl.alicedsl.de) 04.43.37 Join ddalton [0] (n=ddalton@203-217-66-102.dyn.iinet.net.au) 04.44.08 # what is the maximum size sd the sansa e260 can take? 04.44.13 # sd card 04.45.48 # my other question: can rockbox play video on the e200? if so do I need to convert the video to suit the smaller screen? 04.45.50 Join reacocard [0] (n=reacocar@134.173.59.155) 04.48.26 # hello? am i getting through? 04.48.35 # yes 04.49.00 # so wats da answer to me question? 04.49.07 # sorry the im used to msn chat 04.49.31 # have a bit of patience...and as for your answers: the maximum rockbox can take i assume? - theoretically much more than exists 04.49.32 Join thegeek [0] (n=nnscript@s080a.studby.ntnu.no) 04.49.51 # as for the second question, yes and you will need to convert it, yes 04.50.18 # ok, i thought it said somewhere (not regarding rb the of) that the sansa could only take up to 2 gb? 04.50.34 # the original firmware can 04.51.05 # so the of can only take up to 2 gb and rockbox can take the highest that is available? 04.51.40 # is that correct? 04.52.27 Quit thegeek (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 04.52.39 Quit MethoS- (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 04.52.51 # the OF cannot read SDHC cards...rockbox can...theoretically, Rockbox supports the same size as defined in the SDHC standard 04.55.28 # wow that sounds complicated ok 04.55.43 # so how much could rockbox take would u estimate at max? 04.56.25 # the SDHC specifies 2TB as the theoretical limit 04.56.59 Join evilnick [0] (i=60e81b07@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-a1a2cf9971339dc1) 04.57.36 # wow 04.57.38 # ok 04.57.47 # and with converting videos wat do I do? 04.57.49 # what* 04.57.59 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 04.59.49 Join miepchen^schlaf_ [0] (n=miepchen@p579ECB21.dip.t-dialin.net) 05.00.10 # there are instructions on the PluginMpegplayer wiki page 05.00.36 # got a link? or where do I look? 05.01.33 # i think i got it 05.01.55 # http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/PluginMpegplayer write? 05.03.52 Join thegeek [0] (n=nnscript@s080a.studby.ntnu.no) 05.07.07 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 05.08.19 # there isnt any other page named that.. 05.18.06 # scorche|sh: I actually thought 32 GB was the theoretical max of the microsdhc specification 05.19.35 # ameyer: "SDHC uses a different memory addressing method (sector addressing vs byte addressing), thus theoretically reaching a maximum capacity of up to 2 TB (2048 GB). However the SD Card association have artificially defined the maximum limit of SDHC capacity to 32 GB" 05.20.41 # similar to how they fudged sd cards from 1 gb to 4 gb 05.23.10 # although on a larger scale, apparently 05.38.36 Join mokkurkalve [0] (n=eivind@212251191056.customer.cdi.no) 05.40.41 Join webguest79 [0] (n=d4fbbf38@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-07cb9371585beb84) 05.40.49 Quit webguest79 (Client Quit) 05.42.09 Join webguest20 [0] (n=d4fbbf38@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-0ca6f4535a274cad) 05.43.01 Part mokkurkalve ("Not the spoon! Oh, no! Not the spooon!!! AAAAAAAAARRRHHH......") 05.46.36 Join avis [0] (n=ident@pdpc/supporter/student/avis) 05.49.12 Join kkurbjun [0] (i=ksec@silenceisdefeat.org) 05.49.15 Quit Tetracomm ("Leaving") 05.53.00 # hey kkurbjun 06.03.47 Quit XavierGr () 06.03.59 # Hey JdGordon 06.04.06 # how's it going? 06.05.19 # not too bad, u? 06.05.27 # feel like trying to get sound working on the mr500 again ? :D 06.07.02 # pretty well, but got back from a local hockey game. :), I do want to work on it, I've been slowly coding some more. I am about to finalize the gigabeat flash boot code and the mr500 was the next on my list to tackle 06.07.27 # Have you talked to Cat recently? I wonder if he's still doing anything with it 06.11.23 Quit agaffney (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 06.12.38 Join agaffney [0] (n=agaffney@gentoo/developer/pdpc.active.agaffney) 06.18.35 Quit evilnick ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") 06.21.18 Join Tetracomm [0] (n=nicholas@72.252.29.2) 06.23.08 Join AndyI [0] (i=AndyI@212.14.205.32) 06.25.51 Join nicholas__ [0] (n=nicholas@72.252.29.2) 06.26.07 Quit Tetracomm (Nick collision from services.) 06.26.25 Nick nicholas__ is now known as Tetracomm (n=nicholas@72.252.29.2) 06.27.58 Quit sarixe ("Ex-Chat") 06.33.43 Join Makuseru [0] (n=max@163.106.40.24.aeneasdsl.com) 06.43.53 Quit Makuseru (Remote closed the connection) 06.46.51 Join Makuseru [0] (n=max@163.106.40.24.aeneasdsl.com) 06.47.34 Join someone972 [0] (n=97760872@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-baa5cae7edc48e7d) 06.47.37 Quit agaffney (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 06.47.41 Join agaffney_ [0] (n=agaffney@gentoo/developer/pdpc.active.agaffney) 06.47.55 # Hello? 06.48.49 # Anyone here? 06.48.57 Nick agaffney_ is now known as agaffney (n=agaffney@gentoo/developer/pdpc.active.agaffney) 06.49.37 Quit someone972 (Client Quit) 06.57.49 Join evilnick [0] (i=60e81b07@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-fd8d35e840a5d1c4) 06.58.03 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 07.06.53 Join Darksair [0] (n=user@218.94.142.3) 07.11.39 Quit Makuseru ("Konversation terminated!") 07.18.51 Quit Darksair (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 07.19.10 Nick HBK- is now known as HBK (i=hbk@pool-71-96-74-73.dfw.dsl-w.verizon.net) 07.37.39 Part toffe82 07.41.13 # kkurbjun: nup, havnt heard from him in ages.... id like to get stuck into it again after exams 07.45.23 Join pierre- [0] (n=pierre@89.179.93.176) 07.54.58 Quit Tetracomm ("Leaving") 08.18.12 Quit PaulJam (".") 08.26.34 Quit Seed ("cu, Andre") 08.36.47 Quit lyte ("bye") 08.38.04 Join Rob2222 [0] (n=Miranda@p4FDCDEF9.dip.t-dialin.net) 08.43.40 # * JdGordon almost has a new abomination ready for the wps! 08.45.09 Join nplus [0] (n=nplus@141.25.Globcom.Net) 08.48.17 Join Schmogel [0] (n=Miranda@p3EE22895.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) 08.51.03 Join J-23 [0] (n=aldwulf@a105.net128.okay.pl) 08.52.34 Quit Schmogel (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 08.56.13 Quit Rob2223 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08.58.00 Quit midkay_ ("Leaving") 08.58.06 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 09.00.16 Quit jhulst (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 09.01.15 Quit reacocard (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 09.04.49 Join nuonguy [0] (n=john@c-71-198-1-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) 09.09.18 Quit gevaerts (Nick collision from services.) 09.09.30 Join gevaerts [0] (n=fg@rockbox/developer/gevaerts) 09.10.29 # * JdGordon thinks we need to talk about upping the wps image buffer size 09.11.42 # JdGordon: What's up your sleeve? 09.12.04 # 9477 09.12.12 Join midkay [0] (n=midkay@rockbox/developer/midkay) 09.12.31 # bassically I've added a tag so the entire wps can change modes with a button press 09.12.43 # so it could very easily go over the buffer limit 09.14.21 # I don't understand it... If you replace the "go to file browser" button, then how do you go to the file browser? 09.14.36 # you'd have to go through the menu 09.15.07 # And from the description (I haven't looked at the patch), I don't understand how the tag is used in the WPS. 09.15.09 # I doubt the people that will use the tag will complain about that 09.15.40 # replace one|two|three in the example with the tag to enable viewports 09.15.41 # It means that a usual button press won't work, depending on your theme. 09.16.28 # if there is a better button to steal then I'll swap, but I dont think there is 09.16.52 # Don't forget "char" is unsigned on arm... 09.18.09 # bah, OK, ill force unsigned and use 255 for "not being used" then 09.18.38 # actually, no I can use 0 for that seen as the conditionals apparently start at 1 09.18.51 # * amiconn wonders what that should be good for 09.19.15 # JdGordon: Btw, don't forget that not all targets even have a "go to browser" button in the wps 09.19.27 # so you dont have to try cramming everything into 1 tiny screen 09.19.30 # oh? which dont 09.19.31 # ? 09.19.39 Join ompaul [0] (n=ompaul@gnewsense/friend/ompaul) 09.19.50 # Ondio 09.20.01 # bah 09.20.12 # Ah no, I confused something 09.20.27 # They can browse from the wps, but you can't go directly to the menu 09.21.02 # You need to go through the context menu (not a separate item, but a button press there) 09.21.34 # hmm.. ondios would benefit from this, maybe we change the button for it then? 09.21.44 # ? 09.21.59 # Guess why the Ondio can't go directly to the menu? 09.22.06 # not enough buttons :D 09.22.11 # There simply are no buttons left. 09.23.54 # well, this would only affect people who actually use a theme with the tag, but maybe the last mode can be browse like normal then? 09.23.56 # I think that making button behaviour depending on the chosen WPS will be rather confusing (on all targets) 09.24.14 # I dont think so 09.24.39 # Besides, did you actually use any of our small-screen targets yet? 09.24.52 # (Archos, c200 or similar) 09.25.40 # no, e200 only 09.25.48 # dinner.. back in 30 09.25.58 # I nnever really felt the need to cramp more into the wps than what fits on those screens 09.26.36 # It might be that someone else would appreciate modes, but I think that going wps->browser is more important functionality than switching those modes 09.27.23 # * amiconn would like to see some of the viewport and list bugs fixed :\ 09.42.15 # when they show up on the tracker they can be fixed.... 09.46.22 Join dabujo [0] (i=xx@p4FDB374E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) 09.52.01 # 9360 would be one.. 09.53.15 # There are at least 2 others which I didn't put on the tracker yet, but mentioned several times 09.58.49 Join bmbl [0] (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/bmbl) 10.04.30 Quit nuonguy ("This computer has gone to sleep") 10.07.14 # * JdGordon thought 9360 was fixed ages ago... probably forgot to commit the fix 10.09.45 # amiconn: you sure thats still a bug? the code is all there to handle it... 10.13.19 # Hmm, then someone seems to have forgotten to close the task 10.15.06 # * amiconn just entered fs #9478 on your special request 10.16.27 Quit Horscht ("I got raided by the FBI and all i got is this lousy quit message") 10.17.00 # The simplelist bug seems to be gone now. Weird, since I didn't see the fix for it entering svn. 10.17.19 # which was that? 10.17.27 # Ah, no 10.17.41 # No fs# yet 10.17.48 Quit evilnick ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") 10.18.14 # I was about to enter it, and first checked whether it's still there. It is, I just remembered wrong where it happens 10.19.20 Join Horscht [0] (n=Horscht@xbmc/user/horscht) 10.23.04 Join gregzx [0] (n=chatzill@dsj250.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) 10.23.27 # another minor thing... we need a single place to define the different app/ level events... 10.23.54 # atm there are 3 different users in 3 places and I wouldnt be surprised if they actually overlap already 10.24.01 # FS #9479 10.24.35 Quit Dementio (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 10.25.00 # ok, they dont, but new ones may easily accidently overlap 10.25.18 # adding apps/ level defines to firmware/export/events.h feels wrong 10.26.09 Quit jeffdameth (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 10.26.32 Join reacocard [0] (n=reacocar@WL-358.CINE.HMC.Edu) 10.26.57 Join jeffdameth [0] (n=jeff@dyndsl-080-228-178-123.ewe-ip-backbone.de) 10.28.56 Join bluebrother [0] (n=dom@rockbox/staff/bluebrother) 10.37.43 Join cyantific [0] (i=c@24.140.120.47) 10.41.46 Join bertrik [0] (n=bertrik@ip117-49-211-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) 10.42.21 Join Dementio [0] (n=dementio@211.45.234.45) 10.58.07 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 11.00.51 Quit cyantific () 11.09.10 Join cyantific [0] (i=c@24.140.120.47) 11.13.40 Join n1s [0] (n=nils@rockbox/developer/n1s) 11.18.04 Join pixelma [0] (n=Marianne@rockbox/staff/pixelma) 11.18.57 Quit pixelma2 ("-") 11.19.23 Quit n1s () 11.26.59 Join culture [0] (n=none@cpc1-bele3-0-0-cust658.belf.cable.ntl.com) 11.36.03 Quit amiconn (" l8er") 11.39.27 Join bughunter2 [0] (n=Jelle@77.164.66.126) 11.42.24 Quit J-23 (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 11.44.48 Join J-23 [0] (n=aldwulf@a105.net128.okay.pl) 11.45.23 Part WarpTI 11.45.52 Join tvelocity [0] (n=tony@195.167.65.111) 11.50.02 Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@rockbox/developer/mcuelenaere) 11.51.42 Join ender` [0] (i=krneki@foo.eternallybored.org) 11.52.40 Join fml [0] (n=4fd3f684@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-ea577b4ed59381e9) 11.57.28 # Hello developers. Any comments on FS#9457 (Replace multiple usage of the same condition with a locally defined symbol)? 11.59.28 # * JdGordon saw it and cant think of a reason to not commit it 12.00.23 # JdGordon: I don't understand "* Make %t stricter by aborting if a value is not given. ". I thought that plain %t will also fall back to a default value if no value is given... 12.00.41 # but I'm off to lunch now, later 12.00.50 # previously it defaulted to 0 which is meaningless? 12.01.37 # huh, I thought it was 2 seconds or something? At least that's what I remember reading in the description (wiki or so) 12.01.55 # I was going by the code... 12.02.30 # maybe that was lost at some point in time (WPS tokenizer)? 12.02.53 # could be... just had another look... there is no defalt value handling for it 12.03.05 # I'll try to find out where I read that 12.04.26 # pixelma: %t without a value should not be used. Either don't use %t at all (which then results in the default 2s) or provide a parameter. 12.05.20 Join Nico_P [0] (n=nicolas@jau31-3-82-239-20-145.fbx.proxad.net) 12.06.05 Quit BHSPitLappy (Remote closed the connection) 12.06.17 # So I think the commit was ok. %mv is a different thing. It specifies a behaviour and hence should allow to omit the param. In the case of %t the behaviour is specified by the ';', and %t is used to specify a param. 12.19.41 # denes_: USB shouldn't take too long. It's the same controller as in the tcc chips, and support for that is well underway 12.22.29 # gevaerts: you wanna look after fml's patch there? iirc its fiddling with your usb code 12.25.05 # jdgordon: so i see ur not a fan of my idea re accssibility patches in svn? 12.25.47 # JdGordon: it's not really touching usb, it's ata.c :) Anyway, I think it's technically obviously correct, but I still feel too much of a n00b to decide whether that sort of preprocessor-symbol-consolidation should go in 12.26.05 Join lasser [0] (n=chatzill@W9a56.w.pppool.de) 12.27.06 # ddalton: the way I read that thread you're basically asking to have a branch with code that the authors explicitelly didn't feel like making as good as possible 12.29.12 # no, not exactly, blind users in a perfect world would want a lot of stuff that would interfear with sighted people's use of enjoyment of the player eg. wasting a keymap on voice or modifying the quickscreen just for blind people so then the user can choose whether they want full accessibility all they shall do is apply all patches or just some form the accessibility dir otherwise they dont have too... 12.29.39 # also other people may come across patches that are out of sync and can help fix them eg people interested on working on accessibility 12.29.56 # like the archoes they are holding voice back i believe 12.30.31 # "I just did my own quick way since it was just for me and I didn't care about coding styles or anything". Sorry, but that sort of thing really isn't helping 12.31.01 # ddalton: why should the archos hold anything back? It can always get ifdef-ed 12.31.44 # yeah i guess so y are massive voice files an issue... 12.32.09 # * gevaerts tries to translate again 12.32.11 # y == why ? 12.32.49 # Please use real words. Those shortcuts make your text really hard to read 12.33.08 # and well i just code because i want things and what ever I want wI'll do I'll share it but if you dont like it that is ok, but I can have a big voice and dont have time to push for it to be comitted so I just code and use one big voice file since y waste my time making it do something i dont need only the sighted people need 12.33.24 # yeah 12.33.30 # sorry im used to msn chat 12.33.31 # i'm 12.33.53 # * gevaerts isn't on msn, but he would also complain there 12.34.00 # gevaerts: sounds good, I didn't know that it was the same controller 12.35.43 # ddalton: as long as patches are obviously not fit for commit from a technical point of view, a lot of people are not even going to think about whether the actual feature would be good to have 12.36.48 # And people are never going to want to endorse such code in any way, such as by giving it an svn branch 12.37.13 # ok 12.37.26 # i gtg but ill discuss this later when i can 12.37.49 # * bluebrother suggests grouping a17y diffs using a category in the tracker 12.37.55 # denes_: as soon as vitja commits his code, we can get busy. 12.39.28 # gevaerts: I'm also an absolut newbe in the ata.c code, but I just saw the repeating (and rather complicated) #if's and thought that it might be worth to do it only once. 12.40.00 # fml: I fully see your point. I just don't know how this is usually handled 12.40.09 Join crazy_bus [0] (n=philip@CPE-138-130-142-64.nsw.bigpond.net.au) 12.40.49 # I'm converting videos using winff and the medibuntu 8.04 package of ffmpeg. But the videos while playing fine in xine are sometimes going out of sync in rockbox. I.e the audio gets ahead so things are out of sync and you end up with a few seconds of just video. Is this a rockbox or encoding problem? 12.41.25 Quit ddalton ("leaving") 12.42.19 # crazy_bus: maybe you're using too high bitrates for rockbox to handle properly. What player is this? 12.42.36 # it's a sansa e200 12.43.30 Quit fml ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 12.43.59 # the ffmpeg code it uses is this -acodec mp3 -ab 128 -ar 44100 -vcodec mpeg2video -s 224x176 -b 320kb -strict -1 12.44.48 Join jon-kha [0] (n=jon-kha@kahvi.eu.org) 12.45.50 # crazy_bus: What do you have mpegplayer's frame skip and frame rate limit settings set to? 12.45.58 # You could try various framskipping options as described on the wiki 12.48.54 Join domonoky [0] (n=Domonoky@rockbox/developer/domonoky) 12.49.25 # whoops I turned frame skipping off :) 12.51.37 # gevaerts: I try to get busy with the setup code (setting up the memory controller, etc.) 12.52.23 # denes_: great! For usb we'll also need working interrupts I think, but we can handle that when we get there 12.58.11 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 13.00.05 Quit dabujo ("( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.2 :: www.regroup-esports.com )") 13.02.47 Part jon-kha ("[IRSSI] the choice of a GNU generation") 13.03.04 Join jon-kha [0] (i=jon-kha@kahvi.eu.org) 13.04.21 # gevaerts: I think we have to write the testcode/bootloader into the flash rom, because at least on the m3, it doesn't really fit in the available half of iram 13.04.31 # gevaerts: and then having interrupts is not a problem 13.05.04 # gevaerts: and the nor flash should endure many thousand writes, so even the mp3 player will not break 13.05.16 # Yes. It shouldn't be too hard to do 13.06.23 Quit crazy_bus (Remote closed the connection) 13.07.09 Join amiconn [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 13.14.02 Join faemir [0] (n=quassel@88-106-165-155.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) 13.17.06 # I don't get fml's response about the %t completely - does he mean using ";" alone? And I don't see the difference to %mv at the moment, well except that sublines need the "%t" and the ";" and %mv is a single tag 13.19.26 # JdGordon: I haven't looked very hard at FS#9477 yes, but I can imagine that some people would like automatic cycling as well 13.21.26 # ok, ill do it if it means being able to get commited :p 13.22.42 # * gevaerts thinks that this patch is very useful. It made him find out that there is a button to go from the wps straight to the file browser :) 13.22.55 # * Llorean thinks that WPS tags absolutely should not be able to remap buttons. 13.23.11 # pixelma: I tihnk if you split it with just ; you get the 2s gap, the only reason for the %t is to change that time... it could/(should?) be changed so one of those tags be removed.. but thats a relic from the early wps system 13.23.27 # gevaerts: haha, happy to help then 13.23.48 # Llorean: in principle i agree... but i also like this patch and think its an ok exception 13.24.59 # JdGordon: Maybe add an option in the settings somewhere that defaults to "No" that lets you pick whether the WPS can take control of that key. 13.25.07 # Basically, the tag only works if you say "Yes, it's okay for this tag to work." 13.25.13 # yeah, i tihnk i said that in one comment 13.25.24 # if everyone is happy with that then so am I 13.25.35 # I'm not sure I am. 13.25.46 # But at least it's better, since by default WPSes will never change the controls. 13.26.16 # JdGordon: ok, that's the meaning I slowly worked out myself. I don't see how you could remove one of the two tags while still keeping the same functions (being able to set the time) 13.26.18 # * linuxstb would like to see a useful use of this feature before it's committed (yes, I know it's chicken and egg...) 13.26.23 # although, that can easily be defeated by a them .cfg anyway so is probably pointless 13.26.42 # linuxstb: yeah, I was hoping the themers in the forum would get onto it quickly 13.27.10 # * gevaerts finds a bug in the manual 13.27.12 # pixelma: the same way %mv is done... i.e ;