--- Log for 23.06.109 Server: simmons.freenode.net Channel: #rockbox --- Nick: @logbot Version: Dancer V4.16 Started: 20 days and 7 hours ago 00.00.54 # yes that would be a lot better 00.01.08 # Any reason to not put runclient and rbclient in tools (or some other place in trunk)? 00.01.19 # would make the barrier to entry even smaller 00.01.42 # the reason was simply that we didn't want to trigger builds for every commit... 00.02.05 # we can put it there later on 00.02.15 # Isn't there a script to prevent that? 00.02.15 # also, this shouldn't be very rockbox specific. It could be useful for other things 00.02.34 # Makes sense. With the added bonus that it ensures things are in the right location 00.02.40 Quit funman ("free(random());") 00.02.48 # lol 00.02.53 # just wanted to talk to him 00.03.05 # (funman) 00.03.06 # well, it might not be that wise to always run the script off svn though 00.04.37 # I suppose 00.07.25 Quit __lifeless (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 00.07.42 Join __lifeless [0] (n=lifeless@188.16.102.157) 00.08.16 Quit evilnick ("Page closed") 00.08.54 Join dfkt [0] (i=dfkt@unaffiliated/dfkt) 00.09.45 # New commit by 03zagor (r21471): Uh, don't run waitpid non-blocking... This should fix the "leftover build dirs" bug. 00.10.47 # Ironically, I now have a leftover build dir 00.12.17 # New commit by 03bagder (r21472): match build names exactly, not just prefix, and added some basic logging 00.15.25 Join saratoga [0] (i=9803c6dd@rockbox/developer/saratoga) 00.15.53 Join n00b [0] (n=1824bf02@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-e92075057dad7077) 00.17.22 # New commit by 03rasher (r21473): We don't want this. 00.18.16 # * JdGordon| wonders what we dont want 00.18.27 # this! 00.18.42 # http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi?view=rev&revision=21473 00.19.11 Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("Fwump") 00.19.52 # * kugel hands JdGordon| a rXXXXX parser 00.19.57 Join Hillshum_ [0] (n=chatzill@unaffiliated/hillshum) 00.20.08 Quit icebrian ("Leaving") 00.20.39 # I'm off to bed, and tomorrow morning I'm heading to greece for a week. I'll be back here july 1st. Have fun! 00.20.49 # Have fun! 00.21.08 Quit Zagor ("Clint excited") 00.21.53 Quit n00b ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 00.25.01 # New commit by 03kugel (r21474): FS#10284 - "Sansa e200v2 & Fuze: Merge the button driver into 1 file" by Dustin Skoracki ... 00.28.14 Part CaptainKwel 00.39.07 Quit bmbl ("Bye!") 00.41.24 # New commit by 03kugel (r21475): Actually adapt SOURCES too. 00.42.01 # * rasher commends kugel on not using "fix red" as the commit message for that 00.42.34 # "fix red" is a pretty bad commit message :) 00.42.57 # I twitch a little each time it happens 00.43.14 Quit efyx (Remote closed the connection) 00.44.26 # 0-length pipe msg from 4! 00.44.33 # oops, zagor left :) 00.44.58 Part wincent ("Kopete 0.12.7 : http://kopete.kde.org") 00.45.51 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 00.46.08 # yeah, zagor did most of the client parts and I did most of the server parts 00.46.14 # bad news: I have build-* folders left 00.46.23 # kugel: with the update? 00.46.33 # it's supposed to autoupdate 00.46.35 # ie r21471 00.46.55 # check if it didn't autoupdate or if the fix didn't work :) 00.46.56 Quit agaffney (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 00.47.15 # Bagder: i guess that just means the socket was closed? 00.47.22 # indeed, the timestamp is quite old 00.47.47 # Mikachu: I didn't check that yet 00.47.59 Quit shotofadds ("Leaving") 00.48.33 # I'm guessing it didn't autoupdate? 00.48.41 # revision 6 here 00.48.42 # it didn't 00.48.44 # Bagder: the autoupdate didn't work this time 00.48.55 # well it doesn't just update on any change 00.49.12 # I see, so someone forgot to trigger it? 00.49.24 # just ignored it I'd say 00.50.05 # the "Project News" thing on the homepage should be updated to state that devcon is over 00.51.08 # gevaerts, since all meizus use the same pin for the backlight, I think I can make a backlight pwm driver that is common for all meizus. How about I call it firmware/target/arm/s5l8700/backlight-meizu.c ? 00.51.21 # sounds goof 00.51.25 # even good 00.51.55 # grml 00.52.05 Join agaffney [0] (n=agaffney@gentoo/developer/agaffney) 00.52.17 # I wish the AMSes had still backlight issues, so bertrik was looking at them again :( 00.52.56 Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) 00.53.05 # wheres are since 3.2 SVN link? 00.53.17 Join Jmclark [0] (n=lolwhoca@cpe-72-227-77-47.maine.res.rr.com) 00.53.18 # or perhaps a since 3.2 and a since 3.3 one 00.53.25 # there's just very few people owning a meizu, but the documentation is pretty good. It's the other way around with the ams sansas ... 00.53.42 # you mean the AMS docs? 00.54.03 Quit tessarakt ("Client exiting") 00.54.21 # also, i'm thinking of posting candiate bootloaders for the AMS targets, I don't expect we'll need to change anything before supporting them, and I dislike the idea of encouraging people to build bootloaders for targets, even if it should be safe 00.54.35 Quit nibbler_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 00.54.56 # saratoga, yes, well they mostly ok, but e.g. the codec communication part was hard to figure out and we're still not sure about USB 00.55.07 Quit Jmclark (Client Quit) 00.56.12 # saratoga: there's this sd driver issue... 00.56.55 # kugel: does that matter for the bootloader? 00.57.23 # no, but it's still a blocker IMO 00.57.35 # though I didn't experience any SD problems so far 01.01.21 Quit dfkt ("-= SysReset 2.53=- Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn.") 01.01.31 # so you want to wait until thats fixed to post canidate bootloaders? 01.02.52 # available candidate bootloaders seem to me like: we're releasing soon if we don't find a major issue. We know a major of a issue 01.03.05 # We know of a major issue* 01.03.25 # kugel: you don't have to announce them officially. Just upload them to the wiki 01.03.33 # patch tracker 01.03.47 # we've had the canidate PP bootloaders on their for 3 or 4 months now 01.04.03 Quit jgarvey ("Leaving") 01.05.10 # is mkamsboot already fixed? 01.05.38 # kugel: it just worked for me, what was the problem? 01.05.48 # we should at least also make it 1.1 and put it on again if we're having bootloaders available 01.06.14 # Hillshum_: the version which was once online accepted unknown OF versions, which we considered bad 01.06.32 # not sure if it was fixed 01.07.00 # New commit by 03dave (r21476): Add an explicit rule to compile bin2c - r21272 broke compilation of sansapatcher on at least Linux because Make's implicit rule for compiling bin2c ... 01.07.25 # r21189 fixed that 01.07.45 Quit bertrik ("De groeten") 01.07.56 # yup 01.08.11 # gevaerts: I don't like the idea of binaries in the wiki (where they can be changed by anyone). 01.08.24 # good point 01.08.28 Quit jordan` (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 01.09.02 Join dfkt [0] (i=dfkt@unaffiliated/dfkt) 01.09.09 # Don't we have a "testing builds" forum now? 01.09.14 Join ash002 [0] (n=ash004@adsl-99-180-193-35.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) 01.09.17 # yeah 01.09.45 # Although the description says "When a new feature needs user testing in a custom build before going into SVN, a thread will be started here." 01.09.58 # does the fuze manual already have the installation instructions? 01.10.17 # I think we could actually put something into that test forum 01.10.59 Join jordan` [0] (i=gromit@78.235.252.137) 01.11.20 Nick ash002 is now known as ash (n=ash004@adsl-99-180-193-35.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) 01.11.26 # Maybe change the description (like adding "or new targets in the pre-release phase")? 01.11.50 Nick ash is now known as Sarang (n=ash004@adsl-99-180-193-35.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) 01.12.17 Quit jordan` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 01.12.30 # Hi. I was reading through the chan logs, and I noticed that C200V2 is almost useable... thanks to funmen 01.12.46 # I would love to compile/test it out... 01.12.53 # s/funmen/funman 01.12.55 # He'll gladly read that :) 01.12.59 # though were all fun 01.13.12 # But am hesistant for c200v2 not having any recovery mode (yet). 01.13.15 # :D 01.13.27 # theres probably no recovery mode for the c200v2 01.13.38 # Sarang: It's probably as safe now as it will ever be... 01.13.55 # I rockboxed my E200v1 already.. and bricked numerous times.. and including overwriting the recovery partition twice.. 01.14.16 # By definition, you can't brick something numerous times... 01.14.29 # But thanks to Dan Haxxes? I was able to use linux +firmware uploader to erestore partitions. 01.14.43 # Has anyone here bricked C200v2 yet? 01.14.56 # i don't think so 01.14.58 # sorry English is not my native language 01.15.03 Quit BeChris (Ping timeout: 180 seconds) 01.15.08 # ic... I just have bad luck with bios/firmware upgrades... 01.16.23 # The secret mode on c200v2.. does anyone know what it actually do? 01.16.39 # if you overwrote the firmware partition, it sounds like you didn't use our installer 01.17.03 Quit lilltiger (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 01.17.28 # On E200v1, I accidentally formated the recovery partion... 01.17.33 # but it was recoverable 01.17.59 # that can't happen on the c200v2 01.18.00 # There was this utility that lets you create new blank partitions through USB connection in linux 01.18.18 # kugel, so not possible to format the recovery partition? 01.18.24 Quit BlakeJohnson86 (Remote closed the connection) 01.18.27 # there's no such partition 01.18.30 # ic. 01.18.47 # Don't use such abbreviations please. 01.19.22 # Not here at least, we're having guidelines on proper English (as proper as you can) 01.19.26 # Kugel, btw, nice work on your previous custom firmware builds. 01.19.29 # Okey. 01.19.43 # I mean Okay 01.19.52 # thanks, but that's past 01.20.17 Join BlakeJohnson86 [0] (n=bjohnson@c-24-118-162-123.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) 01.20.32 # kugel, what are you working on? 01.20.45 # I notice a lot of AMS units are now supported.. esp. Fuze... 01.20.48 # Rockbox 01.20.49 # I see some where on View asd well. 01.21.04 # I mean some work on Sansa View.. 01.21.14 # Where do you have that information from (because it's wrong)? 01.22.17 # Sarang: "supported" has a specific meaning in Rockbox - the AMS devices are not supported. 01.22.40 # Rockbox-dev newgroup.. Saturday post. 01.23.05 # Sorry. Some initial works (like working lcd) on most AMS units, and now Sansa view 01.24.18 # BTW, do you mean the email list or an actual newsgroup somewhere? 01.24.26 Quit HellDragon (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 01.24.37 # Actual newsgroup 01.24.51 # gmane.comp.systems.archos.rockbox.devel 01.25.00 Quit JdGordon| ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") 01.25.18 # Sarang: That's just the rockbox-devel mailing list. 01.25.32 # I see. 01.26.31 # Does the clip have album art? 01.28.10 Join Sen [0] (n=4b8ff2ac@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-5a038622197ee1a0) 01.28.48 Quit Sen (Client Quit) 01.29.50 Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection) 01.32.03 Join HellDragon [0] (i=jd@modemcable178.248-201-24.mc.videotron.ca) 01.32.18 # Hillshum_: No 01.33.28 # hillshum: only in pictureflow 01.33.36 # that's not really worth it though :) 01.38.13 Join JdGordon| [0] (i=ae914f7d@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 01.39.16 Quit kugel (Remote closed the connection) 01.44.57 # rasher: why is english.lang being selected if no language is set? seems unnessacary and could lead to misunderstandings 01.46.09 # also, none of that will work if the used file (.fnt, .wps etc) is not in the expected folder 01.46.44 Join waran [0] (n=MirandaI@dslb-084-063-241-170.pools.arcor-ip.net) 01.49.39 # JdGordon|: No language set means (as far as I know) first run, in which case the language is in fact english. 01.49.57 Quit Hillshum_ ("ChatZilla 0.9.83 [Firefox 3.0.3/2008092417]") 01.50.47 # And yes, if the active file is not in the relevant dir, it won't work, and it will simply pick the first file. I don't think that's so terrible 01.51.43 # yeah the 2nd point was just a fyi.... english.lng is not the language used if none is set... the internal one is and they *could* be different 01.51.59 Part heftig 01.52.03 # sure it wont happen often, but I dont see the need to special case that one 01.52.38 # It can't be different unless people have modified Rockbox 01.52.53 # In which case this is just something else they should modify 01.53.11 # JdGordon|: The special case is there so that the language selection is correct on first run 01.53.57 # anyway, its not really a big deal, just I dont see the need for it.. but ok 01.54.19 # Why not? If the user has not selected a language (ie. first run), arabic will be selected, which is clearly wrong 01.55.12 # which is why I tihnk it would be better to change the icon for the item instead of the selection 01.55.21 # And we *know* in that case that the builtin language is used. And we *know* that that is English. 01.55.52 # someone could change their build to use a different one as the base 01.56.14 # If they go to that lengths, that's not our problem at all 01.56.46 # Changing the icon won't work if icons are turned off by the way 01.56.47 # I know.... ok... 01.57.01 # Personally, I would like to strip GUI on Rockbox of a lot of more advanced features. 01.57.45 # Sarang, the code is available. you're more than welcome to edit it as you like 01.57.47 # or Hide them, as it is easy for non-technical users to mess up the configuration. 01.58.31 # Fork it and create a "rockdummies"? 02.00.28 Quit JdGordon| ("Page closed") 02.03.16 # Or is it possible to hide the features through themes? 02.03.23 Join BHSPitMonkey [0] (n=stephen@unaffiliated/bhspitmonkey) 02.05.12 # no 02.09.28 # While the topic rests on themes: I made some minor changes to the old Clix_Brownstone to make it run under newer Rockbox-Versions (Progress-Bar was slightly off). However the tick-marks used by the A-B-repeat-mode suffer from heavy graphical glitches (they are basically huge [top of the bar down to the corner of the window] inverted triangles. When both ticks are set they are displayed as thin inverted lines) 02.10.35 # Has anyone an idea how to fix it / what could cause these glitches? 02.10.42 Join jordan` [0] (i=gromit@78.235.252.137) 02.12.39 Quit ze ("drive installation") 02.15.22 Quit martian67 (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 02.16.21 Join martian67 [0] (n=xP@2001:470:b:356:221:91ff:fe8c:d8a7) 02.22.37 Quit martian67 (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 02.23.07 Join martian67 [0] (n=xP@2001:470:b:356:221:91ff:fe8c:d8a7) 02.25.11 Quit martian67 (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 02.25.42 Join martian67 [0] (n=xP@2001:470:b:356:221:91ff:fe8c:d8a7) 02.27.04 # does anyone have an idea what to call the actual logic behind the wps system? or a better name to call the actuall wps screen? 02.27.37 # what's wrong with calling the wps screen the wps screen? 02.28.17 # "while playing screen screen"? 02.28.23 # * JdGordon slaps krazykit 02.28.26 # hm, good point 02.28.44 # 'the playing screen' ? 02.28.57 # why not call it "the wps"? 02.29.01 # I want to move the wps specific code into apps/gui/wps and have the actual screen code seperate from the buisness logic of the wps engine 02.29.23 # thinking ahead to it being used by other screens like fm and maybe rec 02.30.19 # * JdGordon actually contemplates using it for drawing simple screens like the top of the time/date screen... save a bunch of code by pushing that logic off to code that exists already 02.30.33 # ok so there's the playing screen, the recording screen, the radio screen; all implemented using the "wps logic(tm)" ? 02.31.07 # admittedly the wps acronym no longer makes sense in that context but it doesn't really need to be renamed 02.31.26 # JDGordon, that's a great idea! 02.31.53 # Doing what you suggest would enable a rockbox GUI for technically challenged.. 02.31.57 Quit robin0800 (Remote closed the connection) 02.32.26 Join robin0800 [0] (n=root@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust436.brig.cable.ntl.com) 02.32.28 # Sarang: right, execpt it would be hard coded :) and a pipe dream which probably wouldtn ever happen 02.32.31 Join cool_walking_ [0] (i=cb3b81c3@gateway/web/freenode/x-7081e96a4ee27d27) 02.32.37 # could the main menu even be implemented as a wps-logic-enabled screen? 02.32.46 # in theory anything could.... 02.33.18 Quit faemir (Remote closed the connection) 02.33.25 # * stripwax wonders what a configurable wps tag for graphical lists would look like.. 02.33.28 Quit BHSPitMonkey (Remote closed the connection) 02.33.30 # JdGordon, i was thinking stripping out more complex config settings and put that into advanced setting page...and make it harder to access 02.33.52 # but I also want to have the a very clear division in the related files, I want apps/gui/wps/ and in that parser.c, interpreter(?).c and tag_values.c or something so its obvious what each does 02.34.10 # right now gwps-common.c and gwps.c are a mix of the last 2 and its a nightmare 02.34.35 # * Mikachu agrees there, took an hour to make it always draw the statusbar in a specific color while in the wps and the theme one outside 02.34.47 Quit stripwax (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 02.35.12 # also, a simple setting page with shuffle, simple equalizer, etc. 02.37.42 Quit martian67 (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 02.39.10 Join martian67 [0] (n=xP@2001:470:b:356:221:91ff:fe8c:d8a7) 02.40.30 Join robin0800_ [0] (n=root@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust436.brig.cable.ntl.com) 02.42.00 Part toffe82 02.43.38 Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) 02.44.16 Quit stripwax (Client Quit) 02.44.30 Quit JdGordon ("Leaving.") 02.45.55 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 02.46.55 # Ok, my little A-B-problem is fixed. Seems like somebody set a ridiculously huge pb-height in the wps file -.- 02.48.32 Join webguest07 [0] (n=befe8501@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-964e791c9eabfe8d) 02.49.38 Quit martian67 (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 02.49.59 Quit webguest07 (Client Quit) 02.50.56 Join JdGordon [0] (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 02.57.15 Quit robin0800 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 03.00.24 Quit robin0800_ (Remote closed the connection) 03.04.38 Join _lifeless [0] (n=lifeless@188.16.112.66) 03.04.55 Quit waran (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 03.13.00 Quit hillshum ("Leaving") 03.13.57 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) 03.15.43 Quit Chesteta (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 03.18.01 Quit __lifeless (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 03.18.04 Join AlexP_ [0] (n=alex@rockbox/staff/AlexP) 03.19.22 Quit AlexP (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 03.28.35 Join Llorean [0] (n=DarkkOne@adsl-99-182-52-92.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net) 03.37.12 Quit dfkt ("-= SysReset 2.53=- Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn.") 03.37.43 Join lilltiger [0] (n=lilltige@82.145.152.217) 03.46.44 Join amiconn_ [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 03.46.45 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.) 03.47.02 Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 03.47.12 Quit pixelma (Nick collision from services.) 03.47.13 Join pixelma_ [50] (n=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) 03.47.32 Nick pixelma_ is now known as pixelma (n=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) 04.06.30 Quit BlakeJohnson86 (Remote closed the connection) 04.08.55 Join BlakeJohnson86 [0] (n=bjohnson@c-24-118-162-123.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) 04.12.16 Join kperri [0] (i=18ac0c41@gateway/web/freenode/x-bfc7a42991a6bc21) 04.15.19 Quit kperri (Ping timeout: 180 seconds) 04.15.54 Join BHSPitLappy [0] (n=BHSPitLa@unaffiliated/bhspitmonkey) 04.17.40 Join ash003 [0] (n=ash004@99.41.252.63) 04.19.29 Quit Sarang (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 04.25.17 Nick ash003 is now known as Sarang (n=ash004@99.41.252.63) 04.28.50 Quit Sajber^ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 04.29.21 Quit Sarang ("Leaving") 04.32.37 Quit kkurbjun (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 04.33.31 Join Sarang [0] (n=thanaton@adsl-99-31-117-100.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) 04.45.56 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 05.41.15 Quit Horscht ("Verlassend") 05.58.21 Join evilnick_home [0] (n=evilnick@pool-173-52-144-203.nycmny.east.verizon.net) 06.08.28 Join evilnick_home1 [0] (n=evilnick@pool-173-52-144-203.nycmny.east.verizon.net) 06.08.33 Join kkurbjun [0] (n=kkurbjun@rockbox/developer/kkurbjun) 06.14.25 Quit jkl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 06.17.18 Join advcomp2019_ [0] (n=advcomp2@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 06.17.54 Join Xerion_ [0] (i=xerion@82-170-197-160.ip.telfort.nl) 06.19.49 Quit kadoban (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 06.20.09 Join kadoban [0] (n=mud@cpe-24-93-17-195.rochester.res.rr.com) 06.27.38 Quit evilnick_home (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 06.34.37 Quit Xerion (Connection timed out) 06.34.38 Nick Xerion_ is now known as Xerion (i=xerion@82-170-197-160.ip.telfort.nl) 06.35.39 Quit advcomp2019 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 06.39.56 Join antitrons [0] (n=Mudkips@119.224.12.185) 06.40.02 Quit antil33t (Nick collision from services.) 06.45.59 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 06.56.35 Join n1s [0] (n=n1s@rockbox/developer/n1s) 06.57.14 Quit jfc (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 06.58.04 # we need to get a date for the dev con.... its already $340 seattle<->nyc... dont want to pay too much more for flights... 07.00.16 Join jfc [0] (n=john@dpc691978010.direcpc.com) 07.06.14 Quit jfc (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 07.06.45 Join __lifeless [0] (n=lifeless@188.16.127.156) 07.06.53 Join jfc [0] (n=john@dpc691978010.direcpc.com) 07.07.05 Quit jfc (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 07.11.57 Join jfc [0] (n=john@dpc691978010.direcpc.com) 07.17.34 Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) 07.19.37 Join ze [0] (i=ze@76.91.72.105) 07.23.12 Quit _lifeless (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 07.29.08 Join einhirn [0] (n=Miranda@bsod.rz.tu-clausthal.de) 07.36.55 Join BHSPitMonkey [0] (n=stephen@unaffiliated/bhspitmonkey) 07.46.28 Quit kkurbjun (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 07.47.50 Quit n1s (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 07.50.43 Join LinusN [0] (n=linus@rockbox/developer/LinusN) 07.50.46 Quit timc (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 07.53.04 Quit jordan` (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 07.53.42 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) 07.54.44 Quit kachna (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 07.54.47 Quit BHSPitLappy (Remote closed the connection) 07.57.31 Join jordan` [0] (i=gromit@78.235.252.137) 08.04.47 Join jkl [0] (n=jlp@cpe-74-65-31-43.rochester.res.rr.com) 08.20.01 Join planetbeing [0] (n=planetbe@c-71-236-164-204.hsd1.or.comcast.net) 08.20.20 Join Rob2223 [0] (n=Miranda@p4FDCE5BB.dip.t-dialin.net) 08.21.11 Quit Sarang (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 08.22.51 Join soap [50] (n=soap@rockbox/staff/soap) 08.23.00 Quit BHSPitMonkey (Remote closed the connection) 08.23.46 Join BHSPitMonkey [0] (n=stephen@unaffiliated/bhspitmonkey) 08.31.23 Join CaptainKwel [0] (n=jason@cpe-68-173-40-122.nyc.res.rr.com) 08.33.13 Join ender` [0] (i=krneki@foo.eternallybored.org) 08.37.25 Quit Rob2222 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08.39.16 Quit CaptainKewl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08.42.14 Join martian67 [0] (n=martian6@about/linux/regular/martian67) 08.42.29 Join pondlife [50] (n=Steve@rockbox/developer/pondlife) 08.43.29 Quit martian67 (SendQ exceeded) 08.44.23 # BryanJacobs: If you read this, another way to look at buffering (my original intention) is that it's a layer over file i/o. i.e. it pre-reads data from which ever files you bufopen(). Think SMARTDRV on DOS! This isn't quite how it's ended up, but might be a useful way to look at it... 08.44.38 Join martian67 [0] (n=martian6@about/linux/regular/martian67) 08.45.17 # I think it's inevitable that it will end up with non-contigiuous space, but that's why we have the guard buffer and memcpy. 08.46.01 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 08.46.29 # Codecs and other users can only assume one guard buffer (32K?) will be returned. i.e. a read of less that you wanted doesn't indicate an error or EOF. 08.46.43 Join bertrik [0] (n=bertrik@ip117-49-211-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) 08.47.14 # Also, buffering ought not to be metadata specific really, but I understand why it's had to have some specialties added. 08.51.22 Join flydutch [0] (n=flydutch@host87-202-dynamic.15-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) 08.51.27 Quit martian67 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 08.51.55 Join martian67 [0] (n=martian6@about/linux/regular/martian67) 08.52.16 Join timc [0] (n=aoeu@221.201.151.173) 08.59.08 Quit planetbeing () 09.01.42 Join AndyI [0] (i=AndyI@212.14.205.32) 09.03.05 Quit martian67 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 09.05.08 Join martian67 [0] (n=martian6@about/linux/regular/martian67) 09.06.19 Join petur [50] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) 09.06.46 Part safetydan ("Leaving.") 09.07.01 Join Grahack [0] (n=chri@ppp-193.net-62-100-132.static.magiconline.fr) 09.10.39 Join tmzt_ [0] (n=tmzt@adsl-99-164-52-98.dsl.akrnoh.sbcglobal.net) 09.14.19 Quit AndyIL (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 09.16.29 # cool_walking_: is that your first official Expert response ? 09.20.38 Quit martian67 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 09.21.09 # Why, is it broken? 09.22.23 Quit flydutch ("/* empty */") 09.22.25 Join martian67 [0] (n=martian6@about/linux/regular/martian67) 09.23.40 # no it's great :D 09.23.55 Quit Grahack (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 09.23.59 # oh good :) 09.24.22 # * GodEater is wondering about the "UserCon" email he sent to the dev list this morning 09.24.53 Quit bertrik ("De groeten") 09.26.40 Quit tmzt (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 09.27.47 Part Ashex ("Leaving") 09.30.00 Join Thundercloud [0] (i=thunderc@persistence.flat.devzero.co.uk) 09.31.51 Join CaptainKewl [0] (n=jason@cpe-68-173-40-122.nyc.res.rr.com) 09.32.19 Join robin0800 [0] (n=root@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust436.brig.cable.ntl.com) 09.33.12 Part pondlife 09.38.28 Quit scorche (Nick collision from services.) 09.39.15 Join scorche [50] (n=scorche@rockbox/administrator/scorche) 09.39.37 Join mt [0] (n=MTee@rockbox/developer/mt) 09.41.01 Join nibbler_ [0] (n=Nibbler@pD9E3171C.dip.t-dialin.net) 09.43.20 Quit CaptainKwel (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 09.44.55 Join funman [0] (n=fun@rockbox/developer/funman) 09.50.55 Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection) 09.55.43 # Are there any functions like (time.h/clock() ) which I could use to time some portion of a code in a sim build ? 09.57.07 # you can use current_tick (10ms precision) 09.57.34 # else any function available on UNIX (and OSX) & windows 09.57.37 Join Grahack [0] (n=chri@ppp-193.net-62-100-132.static.magiconline.fr) 09.58.26 # Thanks. Will try. 09.58.27 # mt: aren't clock_gettime/gettimeofday more suited? 09.59.35 # funman : I don't want to get the current time, I want to determine how much time is needed to execute a certain part of the code. 09.59.56 # i would get the current time before and after the code and make the difference 10.00.18 # I tried in the test program (rm-wav converter) to measure the average time needed for decoding. 10.00.29 # It's in the order of microseconds 10.00.42 # clock() is a C89 function so it's more suited i believe 10.01.10 # and its precision is 1µs 10.02.02 # Yes, that's what I used in the test program. I was just asking for something equivalent to it in rockbox, because I couldn't find it in firmware/time.h. 10.02.57 # sorry , firmware/include/time.h 10.03.05 # there is nothing that much precise on target, except target-specific timers. If you only need it in the sim then clock() is a good choice 10.06.47 # I'm a bit confused, when using time.h for example in a sim, isn't it the one in firmware/include/ ? 10.09.59 # perhaps you need to use ? firmware/include/time.h has a special case for CHECKWPS 10.11.30 # OK. Thanks :) 10.15.09 Join bmbl [0] (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/bmbl) 10.15.52 Join efyx [0] (n=efyx@lap34-1-82-224-140-171.fbx.proxad.net) 10.20.02 Join kugel [0] (n=kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel) 10.21.21 Nick zitune[afk] is now known as zitune (n=zitune@bearstech/zitune) 10.23.48 Quit Grahack (No route to host) 10.38.57 Quit BHSPitMonkey (Remote closed the connection) 10.45.21 Join kachna [0] (n=kachna@r3g248.net.upc.cz) 10.46.05 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 10.51.06 Join PaulJam [0] (i=Paule@vpn-3002.gwdg.de) 10.51.56 Join CaptainKwel [0] (n=jason@cpe-68-173-40-122.nyc.res.rr.com) 10.52.31 Join ocean [0] (i=d59c23e8@gateway/web/freenode/x-3856c406dd361f52) 11.01.02 Quit cool_walking_ ("Page closed") 11.02.01 Quit einhirn ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") 11.02.20 Join einhirn [0] (n=Miranda@bsod.rz.tu-clausthal.de) 11.02.23 Quit CaptainKewl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 11.03.06 # funman : it seems that includes the one in firmware/include/ .. 11.03.59 # put an #error in it to be sure 11.05.08 # #error I_CAN_HAZ_SYSTEM_TIME.H? 11.08.50 Quit Zarggg () 11.08.59 Join Nick [0] (n=E-mail@ppp59-167-36-135.lns2.cbr1.internode.on.net) 11.09.27 Nick Nick is now known as Guest59953 (n=E-mail@ppp59-167-36-135.lns2.cbr1.internode.on.net) 11.09.52 Part Guest59953 11.09.54 Join Guest59953 [0] (n=E-mail@ppp59-167-36-135.lns2.cbr1.internode.on.net) 11.11.23 Quit Guest59953 (Client Quit) 11.16.37 # yes, it does include rockbox's time.h 11.20.51 # rockbox doesn't use standard lib 11.21.10 # but there's a way to get those for the sim 11.21.15 # not sure which 11.22.02 Quit ocean (Ping timeout: 180 seconds) 11.22.28 Join Zarggg [0] (n=zarggg@65-78-69-194.c3-0.eas-ubr6.atw-eas.pa.cable.rcn.com) 11.23.28 Join kachna|lappy [0] (n=kachna@r3g248.net.upc.cz) 11.23.47 Quit kachna (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 11.29.22 # I included "/usr/include/time.h" which seems to work. 11.30.13 Join flydutch [0] (n=flydutch@host87-202-dynamic.15-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) 11.31.19 # s/.$/around your problem./ 11.31.25 # :) 11.32.03 # s,$/a,$/ a, 11.32.55 # isn't "workaround" a real verb? 11.33.27 # workaround is a noun, work around is a verb (and another word) :) 11.33.36 # thanks 11.33.38 # funman : :) 11.34.38 # Mikachu: i'll ignore your regexp anyway since you didn't escape the '$' 11.36.09 Quit einhirn (Connection reset by peer) 11.36.28 Join einhirn [0] (n=Miranda@bsod.rz.tu-clausthal.de) 11.36.35 # s/\$/\\$/ 11.36.53 Quit einhirn (Client Quit) 11.37.12 Join einhirn [0] (n=Miranda@bsod.rz.tu-clausthal.de) 11.38.21 Join grdxyxy [0] (n=chen@222.134.69.114) 11.42.25 Nick zitune is now known as zitune[afk] (n=zitune@bearstech/zitune) 11.44.11 # zitune[afk]: please don't use away nicks on this channel 11.46.59 Quit kugel (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 11.49.10 Join pyro_maniac [0] (n=pyro@91-64-227-210-dynip.superkabel.de) 11.49.58 # is it possible to define two usb ids for one model in device detection? 11.50.11 # detection in what? 11.50.39 # pyro_maniac: no 11.51.16 # funman: so i have to define a second device for the second 920 id? 11.52.16 # well we have to use one id, i don't really see the problem if the id reported by rockbox is different from the one reported by the OF on some models 11.53.25 Join Sajber^ [0] (n=Sajber@h-143-12.A213.priv.bahnhof.se) 11.53.39 # but i have to detect for the second id in rbutil 11.56.05 # ah i don't know rbutil, since you didn't precise i thought you were speaking about the id reported by rockbox usb mode 11.57.10 # no i want to detect both ids in rbutil 11.58.00 # looks possible, search rbutil.ini for iaudiox5 11.58.10 # funman: whats the name of your firmware file on the yh-920? PP5020 or FW_YH920? 11.58.37 # FW_YH920 11.59.35 # thants the next problem 12.01.10 # What's the next problem? 12.02.21 # there are two versions of the yh-920 with different usb ids and different firmware file names. 12.02.42 # But the same Rockbox build I assume? 12.02.48 # yes 12.03.12 # so its the same like the usb ids right? 12.03.18 # I think you should try and catch bluebrother or domonoky... 12.04.54 Quit einhirn (Connection reset by peer) 12.05.13 Join einhirn [0] (n=Miranda@bsod.rz.tu-clausthal.de) 12.05.39 Quit einhirn (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 12.05.58 Join einhirn [0] (n=Miranda@bsod.rz.tu-clausthal.de) 12.06.17 Quit einhirn (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 12.06.31 Join einhirn [0] (n=Miranda@bsod.rz.tu-clausthal.de) 12.08.04 Quit grdxyxy ("Leaving.") 12.15.28 # pyro_maniac: Do the two versions of the yh-920 look any different to a user? 12.19.22 Join funman_ [0] (n=fun@169.131.193-77.rev.gaoland.net) 12.21.12 Quit funman ("Reconnecting") 12.22.07 # the branding on the cover is different too. 12.22.25 # there is a napster and a yepp branding 12.24.22 # and maybe there are two different display colors, but i am not sure in this case 12.25.48 Quit nibbler_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 12.31.08 # pyro_maniac: Maybe it would make sense to have them as two separate targets in rbutil, but sharing the same build? That way, a user can double-check the detection has worked, and override it as necessary. 12.31.41 # Also, the manual install instructions will need to differentiate between the two, so the user gives the bootloader the correct name. 12.31.59 Quit evilnick_home1 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 12.32.39 # i can't compile rbspeex 12.33.15 # We're going to need more info than that ;) 12.35.09 # sorry. i missed that again. i tried to compile rbutil but it failed because rbspeex. "/bin/sh: cannot create build/dep-speex: Directory nonexistent" 12.35.52 # Do you have a full svn checkout, or just the rbutil directory? 12.36.35 # full checkout 12.37.51 Join kugel [0] (n=kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel) 12.38.13 Join nibbler_ [0] (n=Nibbler@82.113.121.165) 12.46.08 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 12.49.06 # i tired the source tarball from the wiki but that failed to. "base/autodetection.cpp:28:17: error: usb.h: No such file or directory" 12.49.28 Mode "#rockbox +o gevaerts " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) 12.49.33 Mode "#rockbox -b *!*n=perrik*@*.midsouth.biz.rr.com " by gevaerts (n=fg@rockbox/developer/gevaerts) 12.49.39 Mode "#rockbox -o gevaerts " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) 12.49.45 Nick funman_ is now known as funman (n=fun@169.131.193-77.rev.gaoland.net) 12.49.56 Mode "#rockbox +o gevaerts " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) 12.50.24 Mode "#rockbox -o gevaerts " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) 12.55.20 # pyro_maniac: you need to create an empty "build" directory under rbspeex 12.55.27 # this is a bug in the Makefile apparently 12.55.37 # (and was detailed by bluebrother in a recent forum post) 12.55.55 # http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=22013.msg152119#msg152119 12.57.16 Quit kugel (Nick collision from services.) 12.57.24 Join kugel [0] (n=kugel@141.45.206.12) 12.57.52 # GodEater: thanks, the rbspeex problem is solved. 12.59.17 # * rasher thinks it might make sense to select the most recently activated theme (like the font, lang etc thing of yesterday) 13.00.16 # It will usually be completely correct or almost correct. If not, the user should know 13.15.58 Join FlynDice [0] (n=FlynDice@c-24-19-225-90.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) 13.16.20 Quit kugel (Nick collision from services.) 13.16.26 Join kugel [0] (n=kugel@141.45.181.41) 13.26.40 # rasher: You mean keep track of the .cfg filename? 13.31.09 # Yep. Technically it's not accurate, but I think it'll be good enough. And better than doing nothing. 13.31.52 # So you would save this to the main .cfg file? 13.34.29 # Yeah. But not use it for anything else. 13.36.00 Quit gevaerts (Nick collision from services.) 13.36.10 Join gevaerts [0] (n=fg@rockbox/developer/gevaerts) 13.38.59 Join evilnick_home [0] (n=evilnick@pool-173-52-144-203.nycmny.east.verizon.net) 13.40.24 Quit nibbler_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 13.44.07 # People, I want some opinions on this please : I'm trying to measure the speedup gained by using our mdct code vs the current cook mdct code. what I'm doing is just measuring the average decoding time using both mdct's, timing is done by calling clock() before and after decode_frame(), adding up the time till the sample is finished and then dividing by the number of frames. 13.44.51 # mt: Speedups in the sim are not that interesting - you want to know the speedup on target... 13.45.26 # linuxstb : I thought it would give a rough figure of the speedup on target. 13.45.34 # Also, this seems like optimising too early - do you have the codec working on target yet? 13.47.18 # No not yet. I was just changing the code to use rockbox's mdct and thought I'd do this comparison too. 13.47.54 # But now I'm reminded I shouldn't be really focusing on this now. ;) 13.48.17 # ;) 13.49.06 # What's more important (IMO) is checking that the output is accurate - e.g. comparing WAVs produced with the two versions. 13.49.11 # I'm going to make a patch soon so you and saratoga (and anyone else who wants to) could be able to see what's going on. 13.49.28 # I see. 13.49.34 # it's not outside the realm of possibility for the results to be reversed between sim and target performance-wise :) 13.50.05 # hilarious microoptimised loops behave weirdly when run on radically different architectures to the ones they were written for 13.50.43 # The results where pretty close on the sim anyway, so I'll just be patient till I have something on target. :) 13.51.34 # It's also easier to measure things on target, as there's no pre-emptive multi-tasking getting in the way. You just time how long it takes using the system tick. 13.51.45 # test_codec does that for you... 13.52.31 # well there is still the tick_tasks 13.53.18 # but test_codec is still accurate 13.53.19 # Yes, but I guess they're predictable. i.e. two runs of test_codec should give the same time. 13.54.37 # linuxstb : by the way, the test program might probably have its copies of rm.[c/h] back. (I don't know if you have seen that in the logs) 13.54.59 Quit robin0800 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 13.55.47 # mt: couldn't you use #ifdef TEST_PROGRAM or something in these lines? 13.55.52 # for codecs librm needs to implement only the get_packet function. The rest of the code (rm.c specifically) is just needed by the test program 13.56.00 # (inside common rm.[c,h]) 13.56.07 # funman : That's what I did first. 13.56.14 # mt: Have you seen BryanJacobs' patch that allows him to run the Rockbox wavpack codec on his PC? (i.e. outside Rockbox). 13.56.39 Quit funman ("free(random());") 13.57.26 # yes I've seen it, it's very good, and I might use it for cook too. 13.58.48 # funman : But I found out I'm #ifdef'ing almost the whole file. (except for that one function needed by the codec) 14.02.01 # linuxstb : What do you think about copying rm* files ? Or are you with the conditional compilation solution ? 14.02.36 Join robin0800 [0] (n=quassel@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust436.brig.cable.ntl.com) 14.03.17 Quit robin0800 (Client Quit) 14.03.40 Join robin0800 [0] (n=quassel@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust436.brig.cable.ntl.com) 14.04.34 # mt: Looking at the rm.[ch] currently in svn, they don't seem useful for codecs - it's reading from a file descriptor. So yes, that looks like test-only code. But you need to rewrite that code to work in your codec(s). 14.04.36 Quit robin0800 (Client Quit) 14.05.54 Quit ch4os (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 14.05.58 Join robin0800 [0] (n=quassel@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust436.brig.cable.ntl.com) 14.06.11 Join ch4os [0] (n=ch4os@gentoo/user/ch4os) 14.08.35 # rm.h is needed by the codecs and the parser for the different decalrations. (like RMContext ), but, the only part of rm.c that is actually used by cook (or, later, any rm codec) is the get_packet function. So it's actually just a matter of removing some unneeded code than rewriting it. 14.11.06 # I think I would just the test code into your main.c 14.11.15 # ^move the test code 14.11.45 # And if possible, use that get_packet function from rm.c 14.12.08 Join barrywardell [0] (n=barrywar@dhcp-892b3c76.ucd.ie) 14.14.29 Quit barrywardell (Remote closed the connection) 14.14.43 Join barrywardell [0] (n=barrywar@dhcp-892b9bca.ucd.ie) 14.17.46 # Just to make sure I'm following, librm will remain intact (except for the part that should be moved from rm.c to main.c ) ? 14.19.31 # mt: I think so, yes. 14.20.56 # mt: Although why is there cook-specific data in the RMContext? Is that still needed? 14.23.47 # in cook's init function, it needs to copy some parameters from RMContext. 14.24.14 # I thought those were stored in the "id3" metadata struct? 14.26.15 # I wanted the test program and the codec to use the same cook library. So I copy back RMContext from id3 into a new instance of RMContext and send that to cook's init() 14.27.51 # linuxstb : I'll try not to do any more 'heavy' modifications and get the patch ready asap for the sake of an easier discussion. :) 14.27.56 # Maybe this test program is just confusing things, and it would be better to forget it (for now at least), and just concentrate on getting it in Rockbox. 14.29.55 Quit __lifeless (Remote closed the connection) 14.30.11 Join __lifeless [0] (n=lifeless@188.16.127.156) 14.31.44 Join barrywardell_ [0] (n=barrywar@dhcp-892b3c76.ucd.ie) 14.32.29 Quit barrywardell_ (Client Quit) 14.32.58 Quit barrywardell (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 14.33.20 Part pyro_maniac ("Leaving.") 14.46.05 Join Grahack [0] (n=chri@ppp-193.net-62-100-132.static.magiconline.fr) 14.46.12 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 14.55.47 Join barrywardell [0] (n=barrywar@79.97.85.223) 15.00.29 # Hi, I'm playing with the lua plugin on my iPod video and I'm having problems to separate clicks on SELECT and RIGHT. I'm reading the spacerocks.c file which uses rb->button_get(false); and doesn't use the ACTION_STD_... constants, but on the lua side, rb.button_get(false) always returns 0. How can I get distinct codes? 15.01.14 # if it returns 0 then there's no keys pressed.. 15.02.03 # are you trying to wait for akeypress or just get what keys are pressed at that instant? 15.02.17 # button_get() returns a bitmask of the different buttons currently pressed - which is completely different to the "action" API. 15.02.19 Quit barrywardell () 15.02.39 # if you want to *wait* for a keypress you need to do rb.button_get(true) 15.02.55 # passing false means it returns immediately, so if no button is pressed at that exact moment it will return 0 15.03.06 # Here is the lua code I have to test this: http://pastealacon.com/3450 I commented the ACTIONS test and tried rb.get_button 15.03.16 # ok I'll try with true then 15.03.46 # works with true thanks 15.03.49 # if you're going to use button_get you don't want to be calling any of the action stuff 15.03.56 # one or the other 15.04.20 # spacerocks polls for buttons while it's doing other things (moving the rocks around :) 15.04.23 # so it doesn't want to block 15.05.25 # next time, check what the parameters to functions mean :) 15.07.40 Join evilnick [0] (i=0c140464@gateway/web/freenode/x-56558c6518369968) 15.09.45 # But apart from the code (the source luke), where can I find this info. I once found http://mcuelenaere.alwaysdata.net/rockbox_api_example_3/__button.html. 15.10.06 # I'm not a C master and the code is huge. 15.12.37 # it's not huge 15.12.46 # try reading the linux source some time. *That's* huge :) 15.13.23 # finding out how to call something in the rockbox code should be as simple as grepping for the function definition 15.14.02 # Grahack: plugin.c and plugin.h would be the first places to look. And then, as GodEater just said, you can always look for where that function is actually implemented to see exactly what it is doing. 15.15.13 Join fml [0] (n=4fd3ceea@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-fda040e1fccb806c) 15.15.33 # button_get() is one of the functions which *is* documented in docs/API for example :) 15.16.08 # ok sorry guys, once again :) and thanks for the answers and explanations 15.16.17 # no problem :D 15.16.28 # No need to apologise - we're here to help ;) 15.18.50 # Hello. I have a little problem with the "goto wiki page" field (in the top right corner). I visit some wiki pages from time to time. To do that, I just enter the page name into the field and press Enter. If I start to enter the name of a page I visited before, the browser shows a list of visited pages with matching names. I select the desired name in the list (using UP and DOWN) and press TAB to let the list disappe 15.19.46 # try again - we only saw up to "the list disappe" 15.20.07 # A remedy would be to have a "Go button" right to the input field. Pressing TAB while in the input field would move the focus to that button which, when pressed, would submit the HTML form. 15.20.28 # ...ear. But then the input focus seems to have moved somewhere else so that pressing Enter does not take me to that wiki page. 15.20.52 # I would say that's a bug in the browser 15.20.59 # Can't you press other buttons, such as the right cursor, or enter, instead of TAB? 15.21.35 # works with enter 15.21.59 # linuxstb: yes, Right works! I'm just used to press TAB in such cases 15.22.36 # Pressing Right leaves the focus in the input field. While pressing TAB not only hides the list but also moves the focus. 15.23.12 # About the lua plugin, it could be nice to have a kind of repository page for rb-lua apps/demos. Does someone here have some code like this already ? 15.23.29 # don't think so 15.23.34 # feel free to start a wiki page for them :D 15.24.03 Join kkurbjun [0] (n=kkurbjun@rockbox/developer/kkurbjun) 15.24.27 # * GodEater wonders if kkurbjun has come to tell us off for being so fearless with our gigabeat flashing 15.24.32 # Is target-agnostic lua code easy/likely? 15.24.36 # haha 15.24.50 # No, technically it should always work 15.24.54 # Llorean: good question 15.24.58 # the only problem might be with dual booting 15.25.06 # who wants to do that ? :) 15.25.08 # GodEater: Otherwise more organization than a single page is probably wise. 15.25.19 # indeed 15.25.53 # I guess it could just start as a single page, and then split if needed - something like the WpsGallery used to be. 15.25.58 # Ideally I'd have a single page for simple demo scripts that must be target agnostic, and then anything more complex that's useful rather than just a scripting demo should be submitted for inclusion like normal plugins. 15.26.19 # But I just imagine it being a big table, with one line per lua script, so a single page may be easier to use. 15.26.41 # (with perhaps separate tables for different types of scripts or target groups) 15.26.58 # kkurbjun: it does dual booting? 15.27.22 # gevaerts: hush. No-one in their right mind would want that. :D 15.27.25 # Are we talking F/X? 15.27.33 # linuxstb: we are 15.27.38 # well, F at least 15.27.51 # Then no need to think about or mention dual-boot ;) 15.27.52 # * GodEater is well impressed with the boot speed of his F now 15.28.16 # GodEater: the flasher modifies the reset vector which immediately jumps to the rockbox bootloader, as long as there is nothing wrong with the bootloader in memory you should always be able to boot back to rockbox, the only problem might be is in the dual boot. if that original reset vector points to a different address than is coded in the rockbox bootloader then the doal boot function won't work right 15.28.36 # so far I have not seen a flash image that uses a different reset vector location 15.28.45 # Shouldn't we strive to incapsulate the RB API (for Lua) in such a way that all code is runnable on all targets? Lua should be platform independant IIUC. 15.29.03 # and with everyone turning up different flash versions I'm wondering if there is something unique to each player stored in flash 15.29.11 # kkurbjun: I also have the bootloader in flash now :) 15.29.20 # fml: Yes, but it would still need the script author to take account of differences. Although #ifs will be runtime ifs. 15.29.31 # markun: you still need to upload your backup.bin and md5! 15.29.38 # It should work on the X too, but I've never seen a flash image for one 15.29.39 # gevaerts: can do that now 15.29.43 # markun: nice 15.30.12 # linuxstb: I mean, all this stuff should be #if'ed in the wrappers. 15.30.18 # You can dual boot by holding menu while pressing power 15.30.19 # fml: Hardware's too different to be able to ensure all scripts work everywhere without developers doing some of the work. 15.30.27 # and it should follow the OF boot routine 15.31.01 # kkurbjun: assuming you didn't do as gevaerts did, and delete the GBSYSTEM folder ? :) 15.31.05 # the main reason I wanted to dual boot is so that I could use the gigabeat to copy pictures from my camera 15.31.13 # Llorean: couldn't we agree on some standard Lua API and implement that API for all platforms? I.e. drawing color lines on b/w platforms would produce grey lines 15.31.18 # GodEater: :), yes 15.31.25 # fml: And what about buttons? Do we just limit the number of buttons they get? 15.31.28 # fml: what about different screen sizes ? 15.31.36 # Lines can only be within a 112x64 range because that's our smallest screen? 15.31.42 # GodEater: I was using the dummy gbsystem before anyway :) 15.31.51 # gevaerts: I think I was too :) 15.31.59 # You *could* make sure Lua scripts would be universal, but it would be very restrictive of them./ 15.32.01 # like I said, I'm not in any way interested in dual boot 15.32.06 # gevaerts: where should I upload my files? 15.32.16 # Llorean, GodEater: procentual coordinates? Or virtual screen (i.e. always 1000x1000)? 15.32.17 # markun: FS#7505 15.32.29 # fml: Doesn't work for use of bitmapped graphics. So we ban those? 15.32.33 Quit kachna|lappy (Success) 15.32.46 # you forget the charcell displays. lines shouldn't be possible at all ;) 15.32.50 # Llorean: we can scale those 15.33.13 # you still didn't cover buttons 15.33.14 # PaulJam: that calls would translate to NOP on those platforms 15.33.20 # fml: So we force bad graphics and slowdown. But even ignoring that. Buttons? 15.33.50 # PaulJam: Does hwcodec even run Lua? 15.33.55 # Somehow I guessed it'd be a larger plugin. 15.33.58 # I just thought that we have enough hell with #if in C and could get rid of that in Lua. 15.34.34 # fml: I think if it were possible to get rid of it in Lua, we'd have gotten rid of it for the C plugins too. 15.34.51 # By providing a library that makes it unneeded in the actual plugins, for example. 15.35.45 # gevaerts, kkurbjun: ok, uploaded my files. Don't know if they are the same as some of the other ones 15.35.54 # Llorean: i must admit i havent really looked at the lua stuff. i have no idea if it runs on hwcodec. 15.36.06 # Llorean: maybe. How does it work now? Are there some predefined magic objects (e.g. LCD) for testing the HW capabilities? 15.36.10 # Llorean: I think with some clever thought quite a few of the target specific stuff could be removed in the plugins 15.36.15 # I don't think it does run on hwcodec 15.36.59 # brickmania is one good example, scaled graphics on the targets would not loose much information for the user, they are just blocks that could be linearly scaled for most of the targets 15.37.07 # kkurbjun: Yes, but keymaps and use of the screen are always going to be target specific (though the screen can be generalized if performance and graphics quality isn't an issue) 15.37.14 # and then the positions of the text and menus could be relatively placed 15.37.28 # fml: "testing"? 15.37.59 # Llorean: like "if LCD.width > 1000 then blah" 15.38.40 # yes, keymaps will be specific more plugins could use the pluginlib buttons though which would make supporting new targets and screens less of a PITA 15.39.24 # fml: Isn't that essentially the same as #ifs anyway, just doing it runtime instead? 15.39.32 # getting 640x480 and 480x640 working on the M:robe 500 takes alot of time to scale the graphics and make sure the hard coded positions are right, etc. 15.40.00 # so at the moment I'm looking at potentially changing brickmania around, but there's a ton of plugins that are similar 15.40.05 # Llorean: yes, it's the same. Is this the way it must be done now? 15.40.34 # markun: thanks for uplaoding those 15.40.40 # I mean, is the advantage of Lua just in avoiding write-compile cycle? 15.40.55 # fml: As far as I know, there are defines for LCD width and LCD height, plugins usually test those early on to determine which images to use, as well as where to position them 15.40.56 # I need to take a look at the different images and see where the differences are 15.40.59 # kkurbjun: do you think we'll ever have a sleep mode? 15.41.20 # fml: That's always going to be the advantage of lua. That and being another language people can learn instead of C. 15.41.34 # that would be nice, but it will take quite a bit of code for rockbox to support it 15.41.52 # Ideally any problem we could solve in the Lua wrappers to make programs need less ifs is a problem we could also solve in the plugin libraries to make plugins need less #ifs 15.42.03 # Llorean: so the goal was not to avoid the target specific code? Then I'm ok with it. 15.42.07 # since you need to account for conditions where other devices need to be re-initialized, but rockbox itself can just resume from where it left off 15.42.09 # please where can I find constants like BUTTON_LEFT (rb.buttons.BUTTON_LEFT?) as there is rb.actions.ACTION_NONE ? I think they are not exposed to lua. 15.42.17 # kkurbjun: sleep mode is also needed for the 1g/2g (original big bars of soap) ipods as well, so it's generally useful... 15.42.25 # amiconn had some ideas on how to do a sleep mode 15.42.26 # But yes, it's far from trivial. 15.43.57 # sleep mode is something I would like to look at someday, but I have enough to do already with the M:robe 500 and eventually getting that flash writer in SVN 15.44.18 # Grahack: It looks like they're not.... They're defined in a target-specific way in the button-target.h file for your device (under firmware/target/) 15.47.07 Quit fml ("Bye") 15.47.19 # mmf, here is the first lua cross-target issue I meet 15.48.13 # Yes, buttons will be tricky. The cross-target way will be to use actions, but they're very limited. 15.51.52 # i don't think lua makes any effort to export target-specific constnats at all atm 15.53.01 # There are some - LCD_WIDTH and LCD_HEIGHT 15.53.33 # that actually exists on all targets, though, i guess :) 15.54.09 # New commit by 03funman (r21477): Sansa AMS debug: small fixes ... 15.54.37 # Torne: Yes. What kind of things do you mean then? 15.55.13 # I guess we need things like: 15.55.16 # #ifdef BUTTON_MENU 15.55.20 # yeah.. 15.55.54 # and then define that to be a constant containing the value of BUTTON_MENU or (e.g.) 0 if it's not defined. 15.56.09 # eurgh. :( 15.56.35 # button mapping appears to be a perpetual issue for everything :) 15.57.15 # If your plugin can survive with just up, down, left, right and select it shouldn't be a problem. :-P 15.57.35 # Disclaimer: May not hold true on Ondio 15.57.49 # And things like "up+left" may work on some targets, but not others... 15.58.05 # Or on the meizu m3 (once that one actually boots rockbox that is) 15.58.45 # Llorean: except if you know nothing about some targets you can even get that wrong 15.59.14 # e.g. i hate things that think up and down should be the scrollwheel on ipod :) 15.59.18 # rather htan using menu/play 15.59.22 Join Lss [0] (n=Lss@cm33.zeta237.maxonline.com.sg) 15.59.24 # It's still usable though, just not ideal 15.59.33 # well, yah 15.59.36 # what does the H10 use for left and right ? 15.59.44 # Doesn't it have buttons for those? 15.59.51 # * GodEater has no idea, which is why he asked 16.00.28 # On iPod left and right are ACTION_STD_CANCEL and ACTION_STD_OK, and the select button is also ACTION_STD_OK, so these two last are coupled. That's why Iinvestigated thorough the buttons code 16.00.38 # GodEater: I think it has prev/next buttons on the side. I'm not *certain* 16.00.51 Join TBOL3 [0] (i=180ac800@gateway/web/freenode/x-ceb671376f6ac8d4) 16.01.17 # yah, the actions lib tries to map buttons to what they generally do in the main rockbox ui 16.01.26 # the above is what they mostly do there. :) 16.01.38 # Dumb question, how can I unsubscribe to the rockbox mailing list? I've tried going to the unsubscribe button, and it claims it sends me a conformation email, but I don't get it. 16.01.52 # The next day, I get the rockbox updates, on schedule. 16.02.01 # TBOL3: did you check your spam folder ? 16.02.18 # Also, when clicking on send me my password (I don't remember making one), I still don't get anything. 16.02.26 # Thank You 16.02.29 # TBOL3: again, did you check your spam folder ? 16.03.23 # It's not in there 16.03.29 # * Bagder detects the user list now having 1016 subscribers 16.03.38 # But maybe I had it sent to a different address, and forwarded to me, let me check... 16.03.50 # 50 more and we can invade England! 16.03.59 # * GodEater detects that Bagder's status is a fib 16.04.02 # hey, don't invade england 16.04.40 # Torne: they have to, DevCon is here next year. 16.04.40 # Nope, there's nothing. 16.04.46 # ooh, it is? 16.04.51 # Although, I think that might have helped me, thank you. 16.05.00 # GodEater: only if we get these 50 users :) 16.05.01 # * GodEater wonders how 16.05.07 # gevaerts: hehe ok 16.05.41 # I still need to work out where to host it as well. It'll take me the best part of a year to work that out. 16.05.51 # It might have to be a hotel room job as like DevConWest 16.06.18 # Allright, I think I'm off of it. 16.06.23 # Thank you very much. 16.06.28 # no problem 16.06.34 # * GodEater wonders how it helped mind you 16.06.39 # GodEater: try to poke the other UK folks. One of them might have a location (maybe in Glastonbury?) 16.06.44 Quit TBOL3 ("Page closed") 16.06.50 # * GodEater is not going to DevCon in a field 16.07.52 # * GodEater thinks linuxstb is more than aware now. The only other UK peeps I know are pondlife, who is not London based, so not a big help, and shotofadds, and I have no real contact details for him. 16.08.04 # * Torne is in the UK, though he probably doesn't count.. :) 16.08.25 # Torne: how close to London ? 16.08.31 # 'waterloo'? :) 16.08.40 # Torne: Waterloo is Belgium! 16.08.41 # apparently i work right around the corner from linuxstb 16.08.41 # that's in Belgium isn't it ? :) 16.09.04 # * GodEater wonders why the bloody hell Torne hasn't attended a single DevConPub then 16.09.13 # because i don't pay attention 16.09.27 # * GodEater docks marks from Torne's end of term report 16.09.27 # also i only realised linuxstb was so close the other day 16.09.43 # heh, my salary is already frozen :( 16.09.49 # my marks don't matter any more :) 16.09.54 # :( 16.10.30 # well that's one more person who knows it's in London then 16.10.36 # so you can think of a venue too! 16.10.38 Join jgarvey [0] (n=jgarvey@cpe-098-026-065-013.nc.res.rr.com) 16.11.07 # Torne: how about a DevConPub sometime in the next week or so? =P 16.11.09 # safetydan is in the UK too. He traditionally promises to turn up to DevConPubs and never does. 16.11.13 # if you like 16.11.25 # if someone hilights me on the day i'll show up :) 16.11.29 # scorche is arriving tomorrow night 16.12.03 # scorche|sh: btw, I have the day off on Friday 16.12.07 # what do you want to do ? :) 16.12.33 Join LambdaCalculus37 [0] (n=rmenes@rockbox/staff/LambdaCalculus37) 16.12.38 Join nibbler_ [0] (n=Nibbler@pD9E33CD1.dip.t-dialin.net) 16.14.37 # * Torne wonders if anyone would notice at work if he just booked a meeting room for it :) 16.14.59 # * GodEater proposes Friday night for an impromptu devconpub 16.15.44 # is there a mean to know on which target I am in this mysterious rb lua object? 16.16.21 # Torne: which lucky establishment pays for your services then ? 16.16.24 # nokia 16.18.22 # Grahack: Why do you need to know specifically what target it's being run on? 16.21.33 Join pondlife [50] (n=Steve@rockbox/developer/pondlife) 16.21.55 # I could map the values found in button-target.h to lua constants (#define BUTTON_SELECT 0x00000001) 16.22.03 # * pondlife hears beertalk from afar... 16.22.25 # you'll be at Glastonbury 16.22.30 # so pretend you didn't hear 16.22.31 # but maybe I can play target-specificly waiting for the lua plugin to grab those constants 16.22.33 # Yep, in the thunder 16.23.06 # I'm certainly up for a DCP soon after though 16.23.34 # you'll miss scorche though 16.23.39 # he's going home on Tuesday 16.24.14 # Unless he gets lost in beer and misses the flight. 16.25.20 # I'l raise a recyleable paper cup of cider to y'all anyway. 16.25.54 # * pondlife has to pack 16.25.56 Part pondlife 16.26.27 # if someone hilights me on frida ywith a location and time i'll come along anyway :) 16.26.44 Part LinusN 16.27.00 Join Hillshum [0] (i=cd7ae8fa@gateway/web/freenode/x-0c664167408ba5b1) 16.31.15 Join kachna|lappy [0] (n=kachna@r4ax178.net.upc.cz) 16.40.04 Join lymeca [0] (n=lymeca@terminus-est.gnu.org) 16.40.31 Part Hillshum 16.40.39 Join Hillshum [0] (i=cd7ae8fa@gateway/web/freenode/x-0c664167408ba5b1) 16.40.46 Quit kkurbjun ("Leaving.") 16.44.59 Join dberg918 [0] (n=ae6a45d6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-dc695fe3695b4d46) 16.46.13 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 16.55.20 Join funman [0] (n=fun@rockbox/developer/funman) 16.56.43 Join faemir [0] (n=faemir@78.33.109.163) 16.58.13 Nick funman is now known as funman_ (n=fun@rockbox/developer/funman) 16.58.45 Nick funman_ is now known as funman (n=fun@rockbox/developer/funman) 17.05.23 # http://lambdacalculus379.pastebin.com/m2b7b4d2 <-- Keymaps coming along for SA9200. 17.05.59 # Is the Clip keymap set in stone? 17.06.33 Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) 17.06.51 # Hillshum: What problem are you having with it? 17.07.06 # Hillshum: you're welcome to improve it if you have ideas 17.07.35 # What's the home button supposed to do? It's confusing me 17.08.51 # depends the context, i think the keymap is not really consistent across the multiple screens/plugins 17.09.06 # It should usually be what the "Menu" button does elsewhere, right? 17.09.47 # the current exit/goback button is power 17.09.56 # Yes, and stop 17.10.03 Quit Grahack ("Leaving.") 17.11.35 # So, is there a specific problem somewhere you wish to address? 17.11.36 Join Xakh [0] (n=xakh@217.151.116.9) 17.11.58 Quit Cory` ("I was raided by the FBI and all I got to keep was this lousy quit message!") 17.12.20 Join Cory` [0] (n=Cory@h86.179.89.75.dynamic.ip.windstream.net) 17.13.33 # Llorean: I havn't yet identified anything specific 17.13.51 # linuxstb, saratoga and anyone else who's interested : I've added a patch in FS#10182 for rm playback in the sim. 17.14.17 # Hillshum: Keymaps are unlikely to be changed unless there's a pretty solid reason for change, though the time to do it is now before it gains "supported" status 17.15.00 # so how goes the port over to the sansa view? 17.15.01 # Llorean: yeah. Are plugin keymaps easier to get changed? 17.15.13 # Llorean: the clip keymap is quite inconsistent so i believe it's welcome to do so :) 17.15.29 # Xakh: check the SansaView wiki page 17.15.38 # Hillshum: easier than what? 17.15.57 # funman: then core keymaps 17.16.01 # Xakh : you could check the dev mailing list (weekly updates go there) or check the project's wiki. 17.16.14 # Hillshum: Plugins, yes. 17.16.33 # funman: Inconsistent in what way? It's very limited in terms of buttons anyway 17.18.01 Quit Xakh (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 17.18.15 # mt: I'll try and look at it later. So it doesn't work on target? 17.18.20 # Llorean: searching a relation between button and function can be quite difficult - i do not have a precise exemple on mind. 17.19.35 # is there a way to dump readings from the scrollpad on the H10 to a text file? I looked on the website and couldn't find anything about the debug menu... 17.19.36 # linuxstb : No it freezes when on target. 17.19.47 # mt: At what point? 17.20.05 # funman: I think the main thing is that "home" should take you to the menu from the WPS (possibly duplicating the functionality) 17.20.08 Quit kugel (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 17.20.13 # linuxstb : Once a rm file is opened. 17.20.29 # mt: Can you tell if it's in get_metadata() or in the actual codec? 17.21.21 # Llorean: currently home is the record button 17.21.35 # the keymap was mostly copied from c200 keymap, replacing rec button by home button 17.21.36 # From the WPS? 17.21.37 # linuxstb : Not really, I was focused on fixing the bugs I see on the sim first so I didn't try any on-target debugging. 17.21.37 Join Hillshum_ [0] (i=cd7ae8fa@gateway/web/freenode/x-f43af4405f9490be) 17.21.44 Quit Hillshum (Ping timeout: 180 seconds) 17.21.50 # yes - just tested 17.22.00 # mt: OK. So is it reliable in the sim now, or are there still bugs? 17.22.29 # * GodEater is shortly off to visit stripwax's place of work 17.22.49 # funman: Since there's no record button, and the player has so few buttons total, it's probably best to limit recording access to using the menus 17.22.55 # mt: Also, it may be easier if you don't call all your patches "rm_in_sim.patch" ;) e.g. use something like rm_in_sim-v1.patch 17.23.24 Nick Hillshum_ is now known as Hillshum (i=cd7ae8fa@gateway/web/freenode/x-f43af4405f9490be) 17.23.25 # Llorean: good idea 17.23.30 # linuxstb: hehe, sure :) 17.23.43 # you could also add "since i can't get recording to work on Sansa ams" :) 17.24.03 Join Xakh [0] (n=xakh@217.151.116.9) 17.24.05 # linuxstb: That bug about id3v1buf isn't fixed yet. 17.24.15 # Also, when can I buy a Lyre? 17.24.34 # Xakh: contact the lyre project about that, not rockbox 17.25.07 # where's their IRC? 17.25.16 # don't know that they have one 17.25.20 # aww 17.25.43 # or build your own hardware? :) 17.25.49 # I don't have much cash 17.25.53 # at least not for that 17.25.59 # I was hoping it was almost ready 17.26.02 # since it's mid june 17.26.27 # I don't think it's going to be a cheap player at all 17.26.30 # Xakh: http://lyre.sourceforge.net they don't tell about any deadline 17.26.35 # wouldn't building it yourself be cheaper? 17.26.49 # on the rockbox website it talks about the lyre project 17.26.57 # there's a link to it on that sf page 17.27.03 # Hillshum: depends what size you are aiming for 17.27.10 Quit AlexP_ (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 17.27.21 Join AlexP [0] (n=alex@rockbox/staff/AlexP) 17.28.33 # Xakh: Just because they link to Rockbox doesn't mean Rockbox is responsible for them. 17.28.52 # I know, but I figured since I couldn't find much more info you guys might know 17.28.53 Quit Cory` ("Going!") 17.28.59 # lowlight: (for the logs) Want to discuss some SA9200 keymaps for the plugins? 17.29.12 Join Cory` [0] (n=Cory@h86.179.89.75.dynamic.ip.windstream.net) 17.29.12 Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("Fwump") 17.29.33 # Xakh: A good rule of thumb here is "just because they might know doesn't mean this is the right place to ask the question" 17.29.40 # kk 17.29.57 Quit Cory` (Client Quit) 17.30.20 Join Cory` [0] (n=Cory@h86.179.89.75.dynamic.ip.windstream.net) 17.30.24 # Xakh: the lyre guys don't come here much, so we don't have much of a clue about what they're doing 17.30.30 # aww. 17.41.21 Quit Sajber^ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 17.43.00 # * preglow reappears 17.43.14 # * linuxstb slams the lid back on the box 17.43.33 # * preglow thumps the lid and makes muffled noises 17.43.54 # * linuxstb locks the door and walks away 17.44.01 # * Hillshum shoves linuxstb away and tries to pry open the lid 17.44.20 # preglow: Welcome ;) 17.44.21 # that might not be wise! 17.53.03 # this new build system sounds cool indeed 17.54.28 Join Rondom [0] (n=Rondom@dslb-084-057-180-249.pools.arcor-ip.net) 17.55.04 # oh and btw, i read paul's post, am i on the steering commitee now, or has something else happened that i'm not aware of? 17.56.20 # preglow: I think you are 17.56.25 # yeah, looks like it 17.56.32 # damn, i missed shotofadds again :/ 17.56.36 # but the vote is due again early July? 17.56.37 # I don't think anyone has said anything regarding that. But being on it has so far been the same as not being on it... 17.56.44 # problem is, I don't know if the other members remember that they're members :) 17.56.50 # linuxstb: yeah :P 17.57.09 # can't remember ever having seen anyone invoke it's judgement 17.57.12 # but i guess that's all good anyway 17.57.19 # its its its its its! 17.57.26 # No, people just seem to get worn down in arguments, then give up... 17.57.42 # which is also, in a way, good :> 17.57.44 # code > talk 18.01.57 # I apologize for repeating my question, but I don't think anybody saw it the first time... 18.02.02 # is there a way to dump readings from the scrollpad on the H10 to a text file? I looked on the website and couldn't find anything about the debug menu... 18.02.38 # sounds like the kinda thing you need to code yourself 18.02.56 # primarily since i can't ever think of needing such a feature :> 18.03.24 # I was hoping to graph the dump to see what it looks like 18.03.25 # debugging new drivers maybe, but the H10 isn't old 18.03.33 # *new 18.04.03 # but nah, it might not even be trivial, depending on if the scrollpad driver is polling or interrupt based 18.04.07 # i dunnoes 18.05.12 # I also saw FS#6041 18.06.09 # the svn server seems unhappy today, i've been downloading the fonts folder forever 18.06.09 # it looks like someone has figured out a filter to make the scrollpad readout more manageable 18.06.28 # but the last post there was in October, not sure if anyone is working on it 18.07.17 # we have too many fonts 18.07.30 # agreed 18.07.44 # of varying quality 18.08.02 Part Hillshum 18.08.07 # but our art direction is kinda fuzzy, so it's to be expected 18.08.12 Join Hillshum [0] (i=cd7ae8fa@gateway/web/freenode/x-f43af4405f9490be) 18.08.58 # are the 35 point fonts actually usable on any target? 18.09.21 Join bertrik [0] (n=bertrik@ip117-49-211-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) 18.09.54 # no idea... 18.10.04 # That m:robe thing? 18.10.48 # saratoga: define usable. Some people can accept just two lines, provided they can actually read those 18.11.00 # preglow: Some people like huge fonts for use in-car 18.14.28 Quit Zarggg (Excess Flood) 18.14.53 Join Zarggg [0] (n=zarggg@65-78-69-194.c3-0.eas-ubr6.atw-eas.pa.cable.rcn.com) 18.15.22 # bertrik: i'm looking at recording support on AMS, i'm looking at the OF and i see it mentions a 0x55 register in as3514, does that tell you something? 18.15.52 # I'd have to look that up in the datasheet, doesn't ring a bell right now 18.16.19 # the datasheet only goes up to 0x3f 18.16.36 # it might be an invalid value however 18.16.48 Quit bmbl ("Woah!") 18.17.52 # hm, I think I did see some aliases for the ascodec registers when looking into them for the e200v1 18.18.03 # so it could be that is simply aliases back to 0x15 for example 18.18.53 # does the value written to reg 0x55 make sense if it were meant for reg 0x15? 18.19.03 Part Xakh 18.21.10 Join kugel [0] (n=kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel) 18.21.35 # is there a way to find all rockbox wiki edits done by me, by date? 18.22.16 # yes, I found out how 18.23.45 # funman, on the as3514 (used for example in the e200v1), the registers repeat every 0x40, so 0x55 would map to register 0x15 18.25.00 Quit Rondom ("Ex-Chat") 18.26.54 Quit einhirn ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") 18.27.08 # Llorean: sure, i can see them being used by people with poor eyesight too 18.30.01 Quit HellDragon (Client Quit) 18.30.19 Join HellDragon [0] (n=jd@modemcable178.248-201-24.mc.videotron.ca) 18.31.41 # bertrik: seems to be the case on AMS SoC as well ('as3514+'), thanks 18.38.13 Join notlistening [0] (n=tom@94-195-105-95.zone9.bethere.co.uk) 18.39.11 Quit wark ("Leaving... for now. But I'll be back.") 18.39.26 Join `VL [0] (n=vl@82.138.2.25) 18.42.23 Join domonoky [0] (n=Domonoky@rockbox/developer/domonoky) 18.43.37 Join planetbeing [0] (n=planetbe@c-71-236-164-204.hsd1.or.comcast.net) 18.43.56 Quit petur ("now sports") 18.46.18 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 18.47.00 # Does battery_bench fully drain the battery or end with some left to prevent damage? 18.47.42 # I would expect it to drain until Rockbox's normal low-battery shutdown happens. 18.48.10 # battery_bench doesn't care. It just logs things 18.48.19 # generally the hardware makes it impossible to drain the battery to the point of damage anyway 18.48.26 # unless you explicitly go and program the power controller wrong 18.48.40 # Torne, that depends on the specific target I think 18.48.54 # well, yes. 18.49.05 # On the Clip, when's the shutoff point? 18.49.06 # ok, you said "generally" 18.49.15 # but generally it's true :) 18.49.31 # Hillshum, I'll look it up 18.49.35 # power controllers rarely need software control to prevent li-ion fires 18.49.50 # that's a bit of an extreme tradeoff between cheapness and safety :) 18.50.18 # Hillshum, it shuts down at 3.3V 18.50.50 # Do you know (how to figure out) what percent that is? 18.52.01 # 0% :P 18.52.38 Join JdGordon| [0] (n=Miranda@nat/microsoft/x-bd23820e17c7e540) 18.52.47 # Can that damage the battery? 18.52.49 # the discharge curve is from 3.3V (0%) to 4.14V (100%) 18.53.07 # the other direction though 18.53.29 # Hillshum: The whole point of cutoffs like that is to insure the battery *isn't* damaged 18.53.56 # So it won't go too low? 18.54.46 # Isn't that answered by my previous sentence? 18.55.45 # just making sure (yes, it was implied) 18.55.48 # Hillshum, the sansa hardware shuts down when the battery voltage is < 2.7V 18.56.46 # the website of the battery manufacturer mentions a cut-off voltage of 3.0V, so the 3.3V software limit that rockbox uses is still above both of those 18.57.27 Quit Hillshum ("Page closed") 18.57.29 # In battery benches I've seen so far, the discharge voltage goes down pretty linearly downto 3.6V then drops very quickly 18.57.59 Quit robin0800 (Remote closed the connection) 19.00.51 Quit kugel (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 19.02.17 # markun, for the interrupts on the meizu m3, we can keep using the "default_interrupt" macro and don't need to create a "handled_interrupt" macro or something 19.03.05 # I think the "weak" attribute maps the interrupt to the default UIRQ, but allows other modules to override it 19.04.15 Join robin0800 [0] (n=quassel@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust436.brig.cable.ntl.com) 19.04.24 Join robin0800_ [0] (n=quassel@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust436.brig.cable.ntl.com) 19.06.05 Join barrywardell [0] (n=barrywar@79.97.85.223) 19.07.04 Quit robin0800 (Client Quit) 19.07.35 Join robin0800 [0] (n=quassel@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust436.brig.cable.ntl.com) 19.07.37 # bertrik: ah, nice 19.07.47 # how do you assign another function to it? 19.08.14 # I didn't, I just declare a function called TIMERA_INT 19.08.34 # INT_TIMERA rather 19.09.59 # bertrik: what do you want to get working now? USB? Then maybe we can dump the NAND to a file and start on the FTL driver 19.11.00 # I thought about doing the RTC driver, it should be very easy to get that running 19.11.13 # not very useful though 19.11.53 # bertrik: I remember someone wrote code for it, might be in the tracker or maybe on my PC somewhere 19.12.07 # radio and communication with the codec would be nice too, to see if we can get some audio out of it 19.13.07 # I don't know why communication over i2c didn't work. Probably something stupid. 19.13.39 # USB just looks quite complicated to get working to me 19.14.25 # according to gevaerts it shouldn't be too much work. Most of the code is there. 19.15.00 # btw, the meizu's have 2 RTC. Don't know why. 19.15.16 # Maybe the internal one doesn't get power when the device is off 19.16.06 # or maybe it took too much power, IIRC the dedicated external ones generally use less current 19.16.09 Join robin0800__ [0] (n=quassel@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust436.brig.cable.ntl.com) 19.16.12 Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) 19.16.17 Join robin0800___ [0] (n=quassel@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust436.brig.cable.ntl.com) 19.16.17 *** Alert Mode level 1 19.16.17 DBUG Sent KICK robin0800_ to server 19.16.17 DBUG Sent KICK robin0800 to server 19.16.17 *** Alert Mode level 2 19.16.17 DBUG sent MODE #rockbox +b *!*n=quassel@*.brig.cable.ntl.com 19.16.17 DBUG Sent KICK robin0800__ to server 19.16.17 DBUG Enqueued KICK robin0800___ 19.16.17 *** Alert Mode level 3 19.16.17 Kick (#rockbox robin0800_ :*bang* too many joined users) by logbot!n=bjst@rockbox/bot/logbot 19.16.17 *** Alert Mode level 4 19.16.17 Kick (#rockbox robin0800 :*bang* too many joined users) by logbot!n=bjst@rockbox/bot/logbot 19.16.17 *** Alert Mode level 5 19.16.17 Mode "#rockbox +b *!*n=quassel@*.brig.cable.ntl.com " by logbot (n=bjst@rockbox/bot/logbot) 19.16.17 Kick (#rockbox robin0800__ :*bang* too many joined users) by logbot!n=bjst@rockbox/bot/logbot 19.16.17 *** Alert Mode level 6 19.16.18 DBUG Q-Sent KICK robin0800___ to server 19.16.19 Kick (#rockbox robin0800___ :*bang* too many joined users) by logbot!n=bjst@rockbox/bot/logbot 19.16.19 *** Alert Mode level 7 19.22.06 Join Blue_Dude [0] (n=chatzill@adsl-235-206-197.mco.bellsouth.net) 19.23.53 # i compiled cook for the e200 but it crashes with an undefined instruction, i think do to problems with the ffmpeg bitstream.h/.c files 19.23.59 # All right. I've been working on this thing for a couple of weeks and it looks ready for public criticism: FS#10375. It adds a transparent lookahead buffer to the DSP functions to allow a process to look into the future and process current samples referring to future samples. Any comments gratefully accepted. 19.24.07 # i had to hack those up to get them to work with wma 19.26.20 *** Alert Mode OFF 19.26.21 Join Sajber^ [0] (n=Sajber@81-235-177-115-no54.tbcn.telia.com) 19.29.47 Join Setup [0] (n=chatzill@205.122.232.88) 19.32.04 Nick Setup is now known as hillshum (n=chatzill@205.122.232.88) 19.32.36 Nick hillshum is now known as Hillshum (n=chatzill@unaffiliated/hillshum) 19.40.13 Join kugel [0] (n=kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel) 19.44.05 Join bmbl [0] (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/bmbl) 19.44.56 # kugel: Hi! Got time for a look at my latest spare time killer? FS#10375 19.46.46 # Blue_Dude: please dont bug the dev ml as soon as a patch in on flysrapy... just about all of us subscribe to the FS emails anyway... 19.46.55 Join robin0800 [0] (n=robin080@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust436.brig.cable.ntl.com) 19.47.25 # Sorry. I didn't know there was a FS mailing list to notify anyone of new submissions... 19.48.05 # Blue_Dude: You can bug people once it hasn't had any responses for a bit :) 19.48.16 # Chalk it up to too much enthusiasm. 19.48.48 # For all I knew, things just sat in FS unless you told someone about them. 19.48.57 # The often do :) 19.49.02 # *They 19.49.16 # But they'll sit there even if you do tell someone about them, since the key isn't "people knowing" but "people having time to do" 19.50.44 Ctcp Ignored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood 19.50.44 # * JdGordon| shuold have sent the email off he wanted to last week 19.51.20 # So the attack buffer comes before the PCM buffer? 19.52.04 Join Rondom [0] (n=Rondom@dslb-084-057-180-249.pools.arcor-ip.net) 19.52.12 # The attack buffer is integrated with the DSP process, and holds back 512 samples during processing. So yes, it's before the PCM buffer. 19.52.21 # is it legal to include string.h in plugins? 19.52.26 # sorry codecs 19.52.51 # saratoga: I don't think so, no. 19.53.15 Quit Lss (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 19.53.20 # well that probably explains why cook works in the sim but not on target 19.53.36 # But I'm not sure what harm it would do.... 19.53.53 Join Lss [0] (n=Lss@cm33.zeta237.maxonline.com.sg) 19.53.59 # i see stdlib.h, string.h, math.h, stddef.h all over the place 19.54.01 # Do you get compile errors if you remove it? 19.54.17 # so far no, but i probably haven't gotten rid of all of them yet 19.55.32 # Blue_Dude - in what cases do you need to look at future samples? (is it equivalent to holding back past samples and outputting only when the future samples become present?) 19.55.55 # unfortunately, cook uses the new staticly defined huffman decode that ffmpeg added after i forked wma, while wma uses the old dynamic way but hacked to allocate into fixed buffers 19.56.12 # so i can't just drop cook's files into wma without changing how huffman decoding works 19.59.29 # stripwax: I intend it for a DSP process I'm writing. I need to implement an attack function and the only way to do that is look ahead for a bit. And you're exactly right, it only let's through samples when the attack buffer is full and more samples come in. But the buffer is so much smaller than the PCM buffer that it is imperceptible. 20.02.54 # linuxstb, mt: heres a hacked up version of cook that takes some code from WMA and removes most of the includes that I wasn't sure about: http://www.duke.edu/~mgg6/rockbox/cook.patch 20.03.07 # it still crashes on target though with an undefined instruction 20.03.34 # 0x10141D30 on Sansa v1, which i don't even think is in memory 20.03.48 # patch is against current svn 20.04.04 Join BryanJacobs [0] (n=bryanjac@e33.cs.rochester.edu) 20.04.15 # sansav1 has no MMU/MPU ? 20.06.24 # i don't think so 20.06.31 # arm7tdmi doesn't have them i believe 20.10.19 Join Horscht [0] (n=Horscht2@xbmc/user/horscht) 20.11.08 # New commit by 03bertrik (r21478): Implement PWM backlight driver for the Meizus. Update Meizu M3 bootloader to control brightness with the touch strip. 20.15.15 Quit flydutch ("/* empty */") 20.25.33 Quit kugel (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 20.25.40 Quit `VL (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 20.27.25 Join kugel [0] (n=kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel) 20.28.56 Join Thundercloud [0] (i=thunderc@persistence.flat.devzero.co.uk) 20.33.16 Join `VL [0] (n=vl@82.138.2.25) 20.43.47 # markun, do you know what pins the codec is on in the meizu m3? 20.44.02 # I guess P10.0 and P10.1 20.46.21 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 20.55.12 Join mirak [0] (n=mirak@85-169-201-135.rev.numericable.fr) 20.56.09 # do most targets use the hold switch for dual boot and/or resetting settings? (assuming they have one) 20.56.28 # or is that just ipods? 20.56.33 # Torne: No, most don't. The ipods only do because that's the only button we can reliably detect at boot. 20.56.56 # ah 20.57.03 # i was wondering because i'd rather like it not to do that ;) 20.57.22 # the ipod bootloader goes to OF if you hold down menu to power on.. 20.57.31 # i've not noticed that being unreliable but i've not done it often :) 20.57.38 # i have a patch that doesn't reset settings with hold on if the phones are plugged in 20.57.53 # well yah i can do a patch for it myself pretty trivially :) 20.58.00 # i was just wondering why it was like that 20.58.29 # Torne: I think it depends on the user... Lots of people complained that MENU wasn't working for them, so hold was added as an option 20.58.36 # yah 20.58.39 # (and on the ipod - Nano users seemed to complain the most) 20.58.47 Join n1s [0] (n=n1s@rockbox/developer/n1s) 20.58.48 # i guess i'll just patch it locally then 21.00.16 # then i can hit the button and put it in my pocket and nothave to wait :) 21.00.31 # i think that's why i ws getting the boot-back-to-OF thing 21.00.43 Join CaptainKwel_ [0] (i=2669ecc2@gateway/web/freenode/x-094e771dae7343bc) 21.00.46 # the alarm timer that you mentioned, combined with me accidentallybooting OF by turning hold on too early 21.01.34 # ..talking of that, does rockbox already know about the alarm timer? 21.01.51 # if so it would be fairly easy to check if it was already set to test if that theory was correct.. 21.03.20 # you can set a wakeup time from rockbox, if that's what you mean 21.03.34 # that's a neat trick, Mikachu, (headphones + hold = no reset) 21.04.02 # soap: yeah, since you often want those two properties to be true while having it in your pocket 21.04.16 # http://comm.it.cx/?p=rockbox-svn.git;a=commitdiff;h=8b7d9f880d5e2e 21.04.19 # Mikachu: yah, so maybe i'll try that out later 21.04.42 # actually i say "you mentioned" but iirc that was dreamlayers actually 21.04.54 # so i'm probably talking to the wrong person 21.05.01 # :) 21.05.06 # an issue I see, though, (perhaps a minor one) is that I would consider the settings reset to be a basic core function, and complicating it makes it less reliable. How sturdy is the headphone-detect switch? 21.06.01 # well, i was just going to patch my build to not have settings reset at all 21.06.03 # :) 21.06.07 # since i have no use for that 21.06.08 # though, in counter, I guess you can always mount the DAP and delete the cfg file if you have hardware issues AND software issues. 21.06.13 # which saves any usability issue 21.06.14 Join merbanan [0] (n=banan@c-83-233-243-100.cust.bredband2.com) 21.06.40 # i'm not endorsing it for inclusion in svn :) 21.06.41 # and i'd want it to not reset without headphones either, so hey 21.06.59 # Torne: can you write that last sentence again, differently? :) 21.07.08 # i don't want it to reset settings ever 21.07.15 # ah 21.07.19 # if i need to do that i can mount it and delete cfg 21.07.22 # :) 21.07.40 # but yah, for general use it's a desirable feature 21.07.43 # if you always have a computer handy, why do you need an ipod? :) 21.07.54 Quit Blue_Dude ("ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox 3.0.11/2009060215]") 21.07.54 # oh, i don 21.08.04 # but i can't imagine caring enough that i couldn't wait to fix it 21.08.38 # i'd rather be able to not care about whether hold was on at boot. :) 21.08.53 # i can't seem to boot the of at all, i wonder if i did something strange (last time i fiddled with my nano was >2 years ago :) 21.08.57 Quit dberg918 ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") 21.08.57 # so, yah. i'll just do it in my build, job done 21.09.13 # Mikachu: oh? poke at the new instructions i added to the ipodpatcher wiki page perhaps 21.09.16 # i know i fiddled a lot with this, for example if hold was on, but the usb is in, it booted OF instead 21.09.27 # ah 21.09.29 # i haven't updated my bootloader in those two years :) 21.10.05 # i only boot of because i haven't gotten around to testing the dma patches yet 21.10.16 # and thus rockbox usb is slower 21.10.21 # i don't particularly want to boot OF :) 21.10.28 # oh, yah 21.10.29 # there's always the rescue disk mode 21.10.34 # rescue disk mode is slower too 21.10.37 # though not as much 21.10.41 # not by much, since the 1.1 update 21.10.49 # i have an ipodvideo so it's probably different 21.10.54 # with the 1.0 firmware, it did take a few minutes to copy over rockbox :) 21.10.56 # but it's noticable if you are copying 60GB 21.11.06 # 1.1? 1.0? 21.11.12 # of the ipod nano firmware 21.11.14 # it's worth a little bit of fiddlingto boot OF first 21.11.22 # saves quite a few minutes :) 21.11.24 # yeah 21.11.40 # ahh, emergency disk mode is faster in Nano firmware 1.1 than 1.0? 21.11.45 # yes 21.11.53 # the numbers might not be 1.0 and 1.1 though :) 21.11.54 # Did someone mention that the fully overlapped usb/disk io gives a better benefit than the DMA patch, or did I imagine that? 21.12.13 # on my 80GB Video (5.5G) OF, EDM and Rockbox have huge differences 21.12.15 # ^the fully overlapped io patch, that is 21.12.15 # sounds like something i read somewhere 21.12.23 # but i've not tried any of those yet 21.12.24 # :) 21.12.30 # OF writing at 3 times the speed of the EDM and stock Rockbox 21.12.40 # yah, that's what i have too, Horscht 21.12.46 # Horscht - EDM is USB1.1 for me I think, but more recent OF versions improve that (but I never upgraded by ipod OF) 21.13.00 # But I find rockbox >> EDM 21.13.04 # for me EDM is still faster than rockbox 21.13.08 # but not as fast as OF 21.13.13 # i have a 1.3 based firmware on my ipod 21.13.17 # i.e. the latest 21.13.35 # EDM performs about the same as Rockbox for me (4Mb/s) 21.13.46 # stock rockbox that is 21.14.12 # ah well 21.14.31 # keeping the OF around for that is why i went to the trouble of patching the bootloader for dual booting from OSOS :) 21.14.48 # iirc i even formated the hibernation area as a third partition 21.14.57 # (when you only have 2GB, 64MB makes a difference :) 21.15.02 # hehe. 21.16.04 Quit HBK () 21.16.35 # ah. I remembered my results wrong: http://horscht.googlepages.com/rockboxbench 21.16.43 # Rockbox is indeed faster than EDM 21.17.11 # but it drains the battery, i.e. I can't do a "full sync" to my ipod because it would take too long 21.17.37 # ah, the usb charging patch fixes that 21.17.42 # i do have that one in my build 21.18.17 # FS#8802 21.18.42 Join tessarakt [0] (n=jens@e180077188.adsl.alicedsl.de) 21.18.54 # I need to make my own build with 10239, 8802 and 9708 (and blackjack and hookers) 21.19.06 Quit tessarakt (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 21.19.09 Join tessarakt2 [0] (n=jens@e180077188.adsl.alicedsl.de) 21.19.50 # well when i get around to it mine will have those in. you can have it if you like. :) 21.19.55 # it also has a bunch of others, though 21.20.02 # well, Torne. my ipod still charges, but the drive drains the battery faster than the usb port charges... 21.20.10 # yah 21.20.12 # i can make my own build, thanks :) 21.20.18 # i've got the current measuring patch as well and tested it in various combinations 21.20.23 # so i'm pretty sure it works 21.20.55 # i think i might give it a shot... later... bookmarked, though 21.20.55 # the concern about it being committed is potentially overloading accessories and htings i think 21.21.15 # apple have *some* kind of way for a device attached to the dock port to signal how much power it can deliver 21.21.19 # could you not throttle disk writes when battery level is under some threshold? 21.21.22 # and the patch doesn't pay any attention to that 21.21.34 # Mikachu: the problem is that current ipod builds only charge from usb at 100mA 21.21.34 # "overloading accesories"... that sounds bad. I have an alarm clock i plug my ipod into every night (via dock) 21.21.48 # Horscht: tat would be a good data point for the patch 21.21.53 # why does what it does with usb affect what it does with accessories? 21.22.06 # the usb-power-present thing is what's used to trigger charging 21.22.14 # some accessories might activate that 21.22.28 # but not have sufficient regulation to prevent themselves being damaged by the ipod pulling 500mA 21.22.30 # well, my alarm clock charges the ipod, that's for sure. 21.22.38 # ah, accessories that also provide the ipod with power? 21.22.50 # Mikachu: accessories that are not *intending* to provide the ipod with power 21.22.56 # when you use the word accessory, i think of something that draws power, not gives it :) 21.22.57 # but may be doing so somewhat unwillingly :) 21.22.58 # so... my alarm clock might break/melt/catch fire? 21.23.03 # maybe. 21.23.05 # it's just a theory 21.23.10 # nobody has any evidence that this will happen 21.23.14 # it's just a concern :) 21.23.23 # can't you make it an option for now, with some appropriate big flashing red warning? 21.23.27 # I will give it a shot then. I hope it won't burst into flames. 21.23.31 # it is an option in the patch 21.23.34 # ah 21.23.40 # i only ever connect mine to PCs via USB 21.23.44 # I don't think i'll find a nice ipod-alarm clock for 10€ again :( 21.23.46 # so from rockbox we can't tell if it's usb for a real computer or some accessory? 21.23.54 Join HBK [0] (n=hbk@pool-71-96-74-73.dfw.dsl-w.verizon.net) 21.24.00 # Mikachu: well you can, but the problemis you still want to charge fast sometimes when it's *not* a computer 21.24.05 # namely, when using the apple power brick 21.24.15 # Horscht: you don't need an accessory for that, you can set wakeup from inside rockbox, have it plugged into usb, and connect your speakers to the ipod 21.24.17 # which provides loads of current on the usb pins, but no data connection 21.24.29 # i don't have speakers... 21.24.32 # anyways. 21.24.46 # oh, weird :) 21.24.50 # i think apple's power brick provides particular inputs on the usb data pins to tell the ipod that it's a mains charger and it can draw as much as it wants 21.24.57 # and other accessories may do similar things 21.24.59 # did anyone ever measure what power the OF pulls? 21.25.01 # but we don't have a spec for that 21.25.11 # i think so, ther eare various numbers on the FS# 21.25.11 # because I doubt it only pulls 100mA 21.25.15 # no, it doesn't 21.25.21 # if you want to make an ipod accessory, do you get specs from apple or do you just guess? 21.25.21 # but the point is they might be using additional logic to decide 21.25.28 # there are specs you can buy from apple 21.25.38 # some manufacturers just guess, though, undoubtedly 21.25.40 # :) 21.25.51 # well... can't one just measure it? 21.26.02 # what do you mean? 21.26.24 # by some voltmeter inbetween the charger and the ipod? 21.26.29 # it's been measured 21.26.37 # but my point is that's not enough to know for sure we're doing the right thing 21.26.45 # ah 21.26.48 # i see 21.26.51 # the OF charges at 500mA after negotiating USB with a host pc, or when plugged into a mains plug 21.27.00 # but we don't know *how* it decides that that's ok in the latter case 21.27.13 # the suspicion is the mains plug sets certain voltages on D+ and D- to tell it what to do 21.27.16 # and we don't know for sure it's a host pc in the first case either? 21.27.29 # Mikachu: it's some kind of usb host in that case 21.27.36 # but it may not be a PC with proper regulators :) 21.27.40 # Horscht, I believe the questing is: "Is there an Apple commandment Rockbox doesn't know which says 'As an accessory manufacturer, if you don't want the iPod to pull 500ma you can drop xOhm across pins y and z and the iPod will only pull 100'" 21.27.45 # it might be a smart dock that uses the ipod as a disk 21.27.53 # which may be cheaply made and not regulate properly, assuming the ipod will do it for it 21.27.56 # *question 21.28.01 # ah, i see 21.28.05 # soap: yes. that's much better put. thanks ;) 21.28.27 # does rockbox stop charging when the battery is full, or does the hardware handle that? 21.28.41 # Depends on which target I think 21.28.47 # ipods :) 21.29.04 # different ipods have different charging circuits. 21.29.12 # the ipodvideo is hardware regulated 21.29.15 # dunno about others 21.29.15 # IIRC they are all HW chargers, though. 21.29.20 # you just set bits to turn things on and off 21.29.29 # there's just a bit you set that controls 100mA vs 500mA, for this patch 21.29.46 # someone was concerned the other week that rockbox would overcharge the battery and destroy it 21.30.00 # could happen on SW charging devices. 21.30.09 # Torne, can I set that "on the fly", i.e. is there a setting in the debug menu for example? 21.30.35 # or is it a bit in the source? 21.30.40 # there's a setting in the regular battery options that says "enable full power usb charging" or similar 21.30.48 # if you turn that off it behaves as without the patch 21.30.52 # ah, i see 21.30.56 # that's nice. 21.30.57 # so you could do that 21.31.01 Quit stripwax (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 21.31.03 # and just remember to turn it off if you were worried 21.31.19 # i will turn it off when my alarm clock caught fire, ok? 21.31.24 # hehe 21.31.45 # you would probably feel it getting hot for a while first 21.32.03 # it's ok. it's right next to my head 21.32.16 # i will notice when it's suddenly all bright in the room 21.32.32 # well have fun with that 21.32.40 # you probably want the current measurement patch as well 21.32.47 # so you can check what it draws when plugged into the alarm clock ;) 21.32.57 # ..that should really get committed, tbh :) 21.33.51 Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) 21.34.07 Quit stripwax (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 21.34.09 # 9728? 21.35.28 # yah 21.35.45 # dreamlayers' graph shows his scaling factor is almost certainly correct 21.35.56 Join slam_ [0] (n=grndslm@68-243-72-66.pools.spcsdns.net) 21.35.57 # so it looks done to me 21.38.53 Join Hendrik__ [0] (n=chatzill@xdsl-87-78-20-44.netcologne.de) 21.40.00 Quit tessarakt2 ("Client exiting") 21.46.11 # I wouldn't know, I am just a clueless user 21.46.26 # this is very interesting, I always wondered why my iPod slow-charged from an off laptop 21.48.44 Quit n1s (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 21.50.11 # your off laptop charges? 21.50.27 # mine doesn't. If I turn it off, it's off. No power from USB 21.50.50 # mine has a BIOS option to continue to provide power 21.51.13 # but obviously it doesn't negotiate USB 21.53.11 Quit Sajber^ (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 21.53.13 # BryanJacobs: it will slow-charge from an on laptop too... 21.53.20 # at least without the above patch :) 21.53.36 Join tessarakt [0] (n=jens@e180077188.adsl.alicedsl.de) 21.55.42 Join LambdaCalculus37 [0] (n=rmenes@rockbox/staff/LambdaCalculus37) 21.55.45 # Torne: under OF too 21.55.51 # oh, yes 21.56.21 # the OF definately will do that ;) 21.56.35 # that's how you are supposed to do USB :) 21.56.47 # forbidden to draw more than 100mA from USB without negotiating it with the host. 21.57.31 # unfortunately, if you do that, people complain 21.57.34 # and the OF keeps the lcd on while charging too, so it draws most of that just to power itself and barely charges 21.57.39 # I never read the USB specs, I just reasoned "if the computer can provide fast charging while it's on it should provide fast charging while off too" 21.58.02 # it doesn't have to keep the LCD on... you can click "sleep" and then it doesn't 21.58.12 # really? 21.58.14 # yes 21.58.22 # i must be dumb :) 21.58.29 # i never managed to get it to go to sleep while plugged in.. 21.58.42 # but, hey. i can charge properly in rockbox now so who cares :) 21.58.43 # well, the other day I discovered how to turn the thing off without using a menu option under Rockbox 21.58.55 # I had missed that for years 21.58.58 # 21.59.01 # hehe 21.59.02 # whatwherehow? 21.59.11 # apparently you hold the menu button 21.59.18 # or was it the play button? 21.59.20 # no, the play button 21.59.23 # yeah, it was the play button 21.59.30 # aha wait... 21.59.50 # same as OF uses for sleep 21.59.50 # you are talking about actualy shutting the player off... yeah i remember that conversation 22.00.01 # Horscht: ^_^ 22.00.14 # I thought you found a way to turn of the lcd while charging 22.00.22 # I have one for the OF 22.00.31 # you just click "sleep" on the menu when you're plugged in 22.00.56 # * Horscht tries 22.01.33 # bertrik: Nice work with the Meizu M3 so far. :) 22.01.37 # waiting for of to boot... 22.01.53 # LambdaCalculus37, thanks, you have an meizu m3 I suppose? 22.02.40 # well... I gues that works 22.03.05 # Horscht: why so skeptical? That always worked for me 22.03.24 # keeps the charge info on the screen but turns off the backlight 22.03.36 # bertrik: Sadly, no. 22.03.49 Quit Hillshum ("ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox 3.5/20090616224221]") 22.03.54 Quit barrywardell () 22.03.59 # because I never cared to try... :) 22.04.27 # LambdaCalculus37, I borrowed the meizu m3 from gevaerts and an atmt from AlexP at devcon 22.05.17 # bertrik: markun told me about that. 22.06.17 # http://lambdacalculus379.pastebin.com/m2b1baea7 <-- Now, I know these numbers are possibly outright wrong, but can someone help me get good screen dimensions setup in rockblox for the SA9200 screen? 22.06.25 # BryanJacobs: aah, that's what i meant 22.06.29 # BryanJacobs: it still has the LCD on 22.06.37 # just not the backlight. 22.06.53 # which means it charges slower than rockbox, once you fix rockbox's charging with the patch :) 22.07.03 # since rockbox will turn the whole lcd off 22.07.30 # * gevaerts thinks that this belongs in #apple :) 22.07.41 # yah, ok. 22.07.55 # just test that patch so we can get it committed instead, folks, and charge in RB :) 22.07.55 # Torne: killer feature :-P 22.08.28 # what will this do to things like car chargers? 22.08.35 # we're not sure 22.08.37 # their inverters might not like high current 22.08.38 # that's why it needs testing 22.08.42 # :) 22.08.57 # it works fine for PCs and for the Apple mains adapter. 22.09.00 # anything else is unknown 22.09.06 # hmm, sounds like danger pay - give me double my normal salary and I'll start next week! 22.11.23 # pretty sure the inverter in a car can handle a 500mA ipod if it can start a 100 Amp car engine 22.11.37 # zero times two is how much nowadays? 22.11.38 # err not start, but sustain 22.11.38 # I meant the AC/DC transformer 22.11.51 # Horscht: exactly :-D 22.12.14 # that's still called an "inverter" these days, right? 22.12.24 # the thing that takes car power DC and converts into wall-plug AC 22.14.02 # every charger I've tried works fine with the unrequested 500ma. 22.14.41 # the car's engine drives an alternator which is then rectified to give DC 22.14.51 Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) 22.15.14 # the concerns I've heard raised are regarding accessories (a big unknown) and situations like hubs, where one 500ma device might not break the current bank, but multiple devices on the hub and you're talking real juice. 22.15.17 # usually a car charger then has a voltage regulator that steps that down to 5v 22.15.20 # I'm not worried about dedicated chargers being unable to supply 500mA. The problem is other devices that do USB host, and hubs 22.15.49 # i doubt any accessory can't suppy 500mA safely 22.15.53 # thats not very much power at all 22.15.58 # I suppose I could test against my old Zaurus, a USBotG host 22.16.15 # if anything's going to fail that'd be it 22.16.19 # well the problem is not *testing* so much 22.16.31 # there almost certainly *is* a device out there, somewhere on earth, which it will asplode. 22.16.32 # what would be the point of failure? The voltage regulator? 22.16.42 # the proble is knowing if apple have a magic method to prevent this that we should've implemented 22.16.44 # i think the only place you really have a risk is when you have multiple devices on an unpowered hub 22.16.55 # and the only way to find that out is really to reverse it or to get a copy of the accessory spec ;) 22.16.55 # how does the USB spec intend to deal with that situation? 22.17.15 # saratoga: USB hubs are generally expected not to have enough ports for that to go wrong 22.17.17 # won't a PC shut off the port if it pulls more than spec? 22.17.20 # if they are unpowered. 22.17.31 # If we find a USB data connection, we ask. Easy. If we don't, it gets complicated. This could be a charger, but it could also be something that can only supply 100mA and a broken cable 22.17.40 # Torne: you can chain hubs and get problems, I knew a guy who did that 22.17.49 # BryanJacobs: not if the hubs are implemented properly 22.17.57 # an unpowered hub should only really be giving its children 100mA each 22.18.02 # and the second hub should know that the first hub said that 22.18.07 # so it should in turn probably just refuse to operate :) 22.18.21 # exactly. I don't see chained hubs as a problem 22.18.32 # hm,.. 22.18.42 # basically we should be fine doing the obvious thing for things that actually have a USB data connection 22.18.44 # What if you have hubs that don't have power switching? 22.18.49 # this guy had a Pertelian that would brighten or dim based on how many things were plugged into the upstream hub 22.18.58 # if the host said we can draw 500mA and we do and itt fails it's not our fault really. 22.19.05 # it's things *without* the data connection that's the issue.. 22.19.41 # how much are the specs to buy from apple? :p 22.20.04 # Torne: we could take the easy way, and do what the iriver h300 firmware does (and also rockbox on h300), i.e. make it a setting 22.20.17 # well the patch does make it a setting 22.20.20 # Horscht: apple can't solve this problem either. They also have to guess 22.20.38 # er, but we have reasont o believe they don't guess, no? 22.20.52 # there was some suggestion somewhere that the D+ and D- pins are used to signal it 22.20.59 # but we don't know exactly how 22.21.04 # Torne: But that would only work with Apple accessories, right? 22.21.08 # gevaerts: i am skeptical that powered devices exist that cannot supply 500mA 22.21.09 # So they still have to guess everywhere else. 22.21.11 # apple can solve the problem if they have a spec which says "thou shall set dock pin X high if you can't give 500 or suffer the consequences." 22.21.16 # 'everywhere else'? 22.21.21 # saratoga: can the h300 supply it? 22.21.22 # the probelm is already solved for real usb hosts 22.21.25 # USB itself solves it 22.21.36 # and if people don't implement their hosts properly that's not apple's problem any more than it is ours 22.21.37 # gevaerts: ? 22.21.46 # saratoga: it does USB host 22.22.03 # and if apple's system defaults to 100mA then it's unlikely that some random device would accidentally do the right magic with D-D+ to trigger fast charging 22.22.07 # does it supply any power at all? 22.22.09 # this is why I was going to test my Zaurus - it's about the smallest device I know that does USB host 22.22.12 # this is all speculation, though 22.22.20 # i have no personal knowledge of this, just going by random stuff from the internet :0 22.22.21 # i thought most of those USB host devices assumed that the peripheral had its own power 22.22.35 # saratoga: not if they implement USB correctly 22.22.44 Join wincent [0] (n=wincent@host-091-097-067-213.ewe-ip-backbone.de) 22.22.45 Quit funman (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 22.22.46 # USB always expects devices to negotiate for power :) 22.22.53 # USB keyboards would never work if people assumed all devices were powered 22.22.59 # are there actually power pins on an H300? 22.23.07 # saratoga: it should provide 5V. It's allowed to restrict that to 100mA, but the problems start when negotiation fails for whatever reasons 22.23.09 # i don't think usb keyboards are supposed to work on the H300 22.23.35 # saratoga: still talking about the Zaurus, another tiny USBotG device 22.23.50 # BryanJacobs: actually, is it really OTG? 22.24.03 # BryanJacobs: the point is that it doesn't matter really :) if rockbox or the OF manage to kill the zaurus like that, then the zaurus is faulty. :) 22.24.33 # BryanJacobs: the problem is with things that are *not* usb hosts, but still supply power on the USB 5v pin 22.24.33 Join Sajber^ [0] (n=Sajber@h-143-12.A213.priv.bahnhof.se) 22.24.33 # gevaerts: the Zaurus says it is 22.25.31 # for USBOTG devices, can't we just ask if they support power? 22.25.43 # i thought the problem was non-USB devices like chargers and docks 22.26.10 # gevaerts: http://www.serialio.com/info/zaurus/notes/SL-6000USB.php 22.26.10 # Torne: I'm not sure that can be assumed - if Rockbox kills the Zaurus and the OF doesn't, Rockbox is from a user's perspective faulty 22.26.10 # I was planning on plugging in with the USB host functionality disabled 22.26.10 DBUG Sent KICK BryanJacobs to server 22.26.10 # and just providing power 22.26.11 Kick (#rockbox BryanJacobs :No flooding!) by logbot!n=bjst@rockbox/bot/logbot 22.26.13 # BryanJacobs: I'm asking because many people seem to confuse OTG with host support 22.26.20 Join BryanJacobs [0] (n=bryanjac@e33.cs.rochester.edu) 22.26.26 # arr, flood protection 22.26.34 Join n1s [0] (n=n1s@rockbox/developer/n1s) 22.27.04 # BryanJacobs: we're probably not doing anything the OF doesn't in the case where there's a usb data connection, though 22.27.12 # BryanJacobs: with or without the patch 22.27.18 # so that *shouldn't* happen 22.27.24 # Torne: again, no data connection, just providing power 22.27.33 # ah. then yes :) 22.28.00 Join funman [0] (n=fun@rockbox/developer/funman) 22.29.04 # the wikipedia page implies that hooking a device up to a USBOTG device that can't supply enough power should result in the device failing to work 22.29.51 # saratoga: "the device" being the client? 22.30.00 # that's still for USB things. Charging really wasn't considered when these specs were written 22.30.05 # device being they keyboard or whatever 22.30.26 # i don't see how drawing 400mA to charge and drawing 400mA to run a usb disk drive is much different 22.30.55 Join Grahack [0] (n=chri@stc92-1-82-227-106-100.fbx.proxad.net) 22.31.13 # if you run a USB disk, you *ask* 22.31.36 # what we're talking about here is just *taking* 22.31.49 # If you connect a usb disk to a pure charger, *nothing* happens 22.32.00 Quit tchan (Remote closed the connection) 22.32.05 # i'm pretty sure they still spin up 22.32.34 Quit slam_ ("Leaving") 22.32.36 Join tchan [0] (n=tchan@lunar-linux/developer/tchan) 22.32.45 # saratoga: they are not supposed to, unless they can spin up in under 100mA 22.32.53 # a correctly implemented usb disk will *not* spin up :) 22.32.57 Quit stripwax ("http://miranda-im.org") 22.32.57 # saratoga: mine doesn't spin up when it's connected to the same off laptop I was talking about 22.33.04 Quit `VL ("happines is a positive cache flow") 22.33.22 # to be clear, the problem here is when you recieve power from a device that can't talk over usb right? 22.33.28 # yes 22.33.32 # bbl 22.33.41 Quit Horscht ("Verlassend") 22.33.48 # these are chargers, which we agree can provide 500mA, and what else? 22.34.07 # er, not all devices that give power but don't talk usb are chargers 22.34.21 # that's exactly the problem :) 22.34.22 # read last clause of sentence 22.34.24 # There are two main cases there I think. Chargers, and 500mA really shouldn't be a problem at all, and normal USB ports that don't negotiate for whatever reason (software issues, slightly broken hardware,...) 22.34.41 # A lot of chargers with USB-style plugs provide 1000mA 22.34.44 # Do any provide less than 500? 22.34.50 # no 22.35.06 # * Llorean seems to also recall 6V ones. 22.35.09 # saratoga: and the evidence for this? :) 22.35.19 # they'd blow up if anyone tried to use them 22.35.27 # Those would be broken by design 22.35.29 # not if they were ipod accessories 22.35.34 # saratoga: Unless they came with something, and said "Don't use them with anything else" 22.35.35 # and thus would only plug into ipods 22.35.46 # and signalled to the ipod in a way we don't have docs for 22.35.49 # "USB-style plugs" 22.35.49 # I mean, people regularly plug the Nokia charger into the H100 and break it 22.36.00 # saratoga: but they might not be 22.36.10 # it might be anything that attaches to the dock connector and powers the usb 5v pin 22.36.12 # Llorean: most people only do that once though 22.36.18 # I guess the real question boils down to "do we try to be safe with everything you can throw at it, or make the assumption that people won't try to use it with strange chargers" 22.36.39 # I vote for using the h300 way. Provide a setting, and default to 100mA 22.36.47 # if it's the latter, the proposed solution is already good enough because we don't really need to worry about non-USB <500mA device, or at least shouldn't. 22.36.47 # a user can always disable any overcurrent protection you try to design if they really want 22.36.54 # except of course for real USB connections 22.36.55 # we should assume they know what they're doing when they plug in a charger 22.37.06 # gevaerts: i'm not sure if the patch currently does do that 22.37.13 # gevaerts: So default to 100, but try to negotiate, and do 500 if we can regardless of setting? 22.37.25 # Llorean: the slight issue there is it's not really a negotiation 22.37.27 # gevaerts: "most people only do that once"?! 22.37.32 Part Grahack 22.37.33 # you say "i want 500mA" 22.37.38 # the host says "sod off then" 22.37.40 # you now can't connect 22.37.43 # Llorean: yes. If the host tells us that 500mA is OK, and it isn't, well, there's nothing we can do 22.37.43 # how many people break their H100 twice the same way? :-P 22.37.51 # Torne: Well, by "negotiating" I mean "doing whatever it is USB devices are supposed to do to get 500 from a real host" 22.37.52 # you have to actually tear down the usb connection and then start over to re-request with a lower current 22.37.57 # which we don't have code for 22.37.59 # BryanJacobs: there is such a thing as getting anew one :) 22.38.11 # and thus if someone's host port was *actually working* and reporting it can't provide enough, USB mass storage stops working 22.38.13 # it breaks the charger or the mp3 player 22.38.14 # Torne: But we're open source, so such code can be invented. 22.38.16 # e.g. if they have a laptop 22.38.17 # Torne: no, but conceivably we could add it 22.38.18 # yah, it can 22.38.21 # but it's not in the patch atm, i mean 22.38.35 Join Horscht [0] (n=Horscht2@xbmc/user/horscht) 22.38.40 # But we're discussing what the patch needs too, since that's part of "can it be used now?" 22.38.50 # ok. so it'd probably be nice if it did do that. :) 22.39.18 # but it's not fatal if it doesn't 22.39.19 # it would be nice, but not required I think 22.39.22 # Torne, you mentioned a setting which woul allow me to select the current... 22.39.22 # because you can just disable the charging setting 22.39.23 # and plug in again. 22.39.26 # i can't find it 22.39.30 # * Llorean is pretty sure apple claims the iPod won't work on low-power ports on their website. 22.39.41 # Llorean: rockbox currently does work on low power ports, though 22.39.55 # * gevaerts wishes that people would stop talking about ipods. This is a general problem! 22.40.04 # Torne: Rockbox currently doesn't charge at all. 22.40.06 # back in the day apple would provide you with a dock connector that could plug into a USB port and an AC wall socket 22.40.08 # Llorean: yes it does 22.40.16 # Llorean: it charges at 100mA minus the power tit takes RB to idle 22.40.18 # Not on the iPod. 22.40.19 # which is about 60mA or so 22.40.22 # thus side stepping the issue neatly 22.40.24 # i've measured it 22.40.29 # Llorean, it does, but not if you transfer files 22.40.30 # it charges extremely slowly if the ipod is idle 22.40.36 # and discharges if you are using the disk. 22.40.49 # It depends on your settings 22.40.56 # well yes. 22.41.00 # Many people have it set to turn the backlight on if plugged in, which I imagine negates that. 22.41.02 # but it *tries* to charge 22.41.04 # So perhaps "it doesn't reliably charge" 22.41.18 Quit Thundercloud (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 22.41.32 # * gevaerts thinks that the patch is fine as it is, in the sense that more can be added later, except for the questions about suitability for all ipods 22.41.34 # Llorean: it does charge, it just usually discharges more 22.41.37 # gevaerts: I thought the problem was really just iPods (in terms of the patch under discussion) 22.41.39 Join Thundercloud [0] (i=thunderc@persistence.flat.devzero.co.uk) 22.41.40 # gevaerts: yes, i would agree 22.41.46 # it should be fine for ipodvideo, at least 22.41.50 # BryanJacobs: "Charging" is a net effect. It draws power, but still discharges. 22.42.11 # I viewed "charging" as a gross effect 22.42.16 # Horscht: settings, general, system, battery, charge during usb connection 22.42.24 # * soap has had issues getting the patch _and_ battery bench to work at the same time. 22.42.26 # Llorean: yes and no. The patch is about enabling charging on ipods. It doesn't address behaviour when no USB connection is there, and that's a general issue 22.42.35 # mh... 22.43.01 # BryanJacobs: You could view it as "the iPod draws 90% of its power from teh cable, and 10% from the battery" mentally as well, as opposed to "100% goes into the battery, but then a bit more than that comes right back out" 22.43.02 # or the general issue of what if the host says no to 500mA 22.43.22 # gevaerts: Well, the Sansa's apparently getting away with whatever our current behaviour is without problems? Can't we just mirror that? 22.43.22 # hm... no menu entry there... Gonna rebuild later 22.43.29 # Horscht: oh, er 22.43.35 # Horscht: you need to edit config-ipodvideo.h as well 22.43.40 # ah 22.43.42 # to add the "i have usb charging" feature 22.43.46 # that's not in the patch 22.43.47 # Llorean: except that view doesn't describe what's actually happening 22.43.51 # Llorean: that will happen once the patch is in 22.43.51 # it says in teh FS# though 22.44.05 # gevaerts: I didn't think the Sansas had a menu option. 22.44.06 # laptop batteries heat up when the laptop is plugged in 22.44.36 # * gevaerts turns off the music. He can't think properly 22.44.55 # BryanJacobs: It depends on how the hardware is hooked up. Sometimes current goes into the battery first, then out and into the player. Sometimes it doesn't. I don't know what order it happens in the iPods. Can you turn yours on with the battery disconnected? 22.45.00 # There are about seventeen different behaviours by different players right now 22.45.48 # Llorean: dunno, but after running dry it won't turn on for a while plugged in, so survey says all power flows through the battery 22.45.59 # and I think all of them are wrong in some way 22.46.21 Quit Hendrik__ ("ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox 3.0.11/2009060215]") 22.46.23 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 22.46.50 # The beast charges when USB is connected and the host OKs the 500mA, but not in any other conditions (i.e. not on a pure USB charger) 22.47.03 # The sansas always charge (I think) 22.47.07 # BryanJacobs: Have you tried menu+select reset to try to boot it? I've never had problems booting it, at least up until Rockbox checks the battery level, decides it's too low, and immediately shuts back down. 22.47.09 # The ipods never charge 22.47.40 # Llorean: never tried that, but it does go on on its own after a while in OF 22.47.51 # BryanJacobs: yah, you may be encountering the *other* problem with booting the ipod, the whole hard-reset-needed thing 22.48.01 # which there is also a patch for which needs testing/work, incidentally ;) 22.48.40 # gevaerts: Speaking of the Beast - can we do anything about the USB charging capabilities while off or is that something we'd have to reflash for (if you even know)? 22.48.53 # * Llorean just wonders if it's about the state we leave the hardware in at shutdown, or something else. 22.49.00 Quit n1s (Success) 22.49.45 # when the CPU is powered down i'd imagine the register settings in the charger are lost 22.49.46 # I have no idea 22.49.59 # since i'm 90% sure its an on board charger like on the sansas 22.50.37 # That's my least favorite thing about the Beast. If it's "low" (which can mean at 70% on some days) you can't boot without the real charger attached 22.51.07 # someone send karl a beast with jtag attached 22.53.47 Quit funman ("free(random());") 22.54.11 Quit BryanJacobs ("Java user signed off") 22.56.15 Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("Python time is now") 22.56.54 # Torne, do I simply have to add "#define HAVE_USB_CHARGING_ENABLE" before the last #endif? 22.57.22 # yah 23.00.04 Quit Cory` ("There are two major products that come out of Berkeley: LSD and UNIX. We don't believe this to be a coincidence.") 23.04.38 Join Thundercloud_ [0] (i=thunderc@persistence.flat.devzero.co.uk) 23.05.22 Quit Thundercloud (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 23.07.26 # Llorean: the flash shuts it off if it's "too low". i think our only solution is RB in flash. my WinMo phone has the same problem, incidentally. 23.07.53 # Unhelpful: Yeah, but the flash stuff will recognize a normal charger and ignore the battery state. 23.08.08 # I was wondering if there was a way to leave it "waiting" for a USB charge too when we shut down, or something. 23.08.16 # yes, it will. 23.08.18 Join Cory` [0] (n=cory@h86.179.89.75.dynamic.ip.windstream.net) 23.08.48 # * Llorean likes the fact that the Gigabeat F can even USB charge while turned off, and finds some disappointment that the S has such disappointing USB charging. 23.13.40 # The S is disapointing in many ways 23.13.47 # Especially as it has such promise 23.22.12 # New commit by 03funman (r21479): fix a typo in comments (audio CD duration is not 74 or 80 hours) 23.22.19 Quit merbanan (Remote closed the connection) 23.23.03 Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) 23.31.06 Quit ender` (" The reward for work well-done is more work.") 23.32.10 # * GodEater coughs 23.32.21 # apparently we all missed Lamba's other expert nomination 23.32.28 # from god knows how long ago 23.32.31 # which was? 23.32.34 # karashata 23.32.52 # ah...another furry.. 23.33.07 Quit stripwax (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 23.33.37 # Doesn't really have anything to do with their ability to be an expert though. 23.33.41 # * Llorean can't really check any more. 23.33.44 # http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?action=profile;u=8529;sa=showPosts 23.33.45 # Did I comment on Karashata at the time? 23.33.48 # nope 23.33.50 # no-one did 23.34.16 # he seems very full of clue 23.35.44 # I did see the nomination. I'm not sure why I didn't comment. I remember at one point not entirely feeling confident in him, but looking back through his posts I can't seem to see what would've made that happen. 23.35.59 # Seems fine to me 23.36.19 # he seems clueful about the H10 23.36.22 # which is useful 23.36.27 # I know very few people that even own one 23.36.30 # Nobody else is 23.36.42 # At the time, I wanted experts to be people who were trying to help about everything, when they had time. 23.36.45 # That may have been it. 23.37.08 # * GodEater thinks that the time for generalists, if not already over, is rapidly approaching 23.37.14 # we have SO many targets coming up now 23.37.25 # The goal (for me) wasn't to have "many" but to have a very high degree of confidence when they got involved. 23.37.30 # I wouldn't care to try to advise on anything AMS based at the moment 23.37.31 # I think that as long as they don't talk rubbish about others, it isn't so important if they just stick to their area 23.37.34 # But definitely now, generalists are less useful. 23.37.56 # The key should always be, they need to be people who won't give advice unless it has a high degree of confidence. 23.37.58 # indeed, and I see nothing there where he's jumped into something he clearly knows nothing about 23.38.05 # Llorean: yep 23.38.18 # Looking through his posts, looks good tom e 23.38.30 # Any objections to a PM? 23.38.31 # * GodEater will drop him a PM then 23.38.36 # or you can :) 23.38.38 # There we go :) 23.38.44 # Will do :) 23.38.54 # then you can work out how to promote him :D 23.39.03 # Good practice :) 23.39.06 # assuming scorche didn't already show you 23.39.10 # GodEater: Go to view their profile, click their "Account Settings" link, and there's a dropdown for their primary group 23.39.23 # Llorean: I know, I did evilnick already ;) 23.39.26 # Ah, good. 23.39.33 # I hear you tried a ban earlier. 23.39.48 # yes, less successfully 23.39.52 # got on the second try 23.39.53 # :D 23.40.02 Join safetydan [0] (n=deverton@rockbox/developer/safetydan) 23.40.05 # I personally only ever banned username and email address for spammers. 23.40.12 # seems most useful 23.40.18 # I'll stick to that as they turn up 23.40.21 # it seemed unlikely the host would be repeated, so it was really just killing off the account. 23.40.48 # * GodEater waves to safetydan 23.40.55 # seems the lua code is proving popular already :) 23.41.01 # really? 23.41.05 Quit Cory` ("( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.22 :: www.esnation.com )") 23.41.06 # sent 23.41.08 # One of my favorite games was written in Lua. Want to port it? 23.41.14 # yeah, we've had someone in here today asking all sorts of difficult questions about it 23.41.20 # Llorean: yeah...i mentioned a few things like that to him.. 23.41.24 # (re: banning) 23.41.39 # mentioned it? 23.41.41 # you mocked me! 23.41.46 # =) 23.41.50 # "you suck you suck" 23.41.53 # Llorean: if I actually knew how to write lua... :) 23.42.10 # Llorean: daurn seems quite proficient 23.42.14 # maybe you could ask him 23.42.22 # "nice reaction for the ban...too ban it isnt actually a ban on anything..." 23.42.38 # :P 23.42.40 # s/too ban/too bad 23.42.48 Quit mirak ("Ex-Chat") 23.44.20 # It only required a 133mhz processor and 32MB of RAM. It should be no problem! 23.44.24 # * GodEater is still chuckling at cool_walking_s intro in the experts thread 23.44.47 # * Llorean will admit he misses seeing a few parts of the forum sometimes already. 23.45.01 # Habits may take a little while to relax out of. 23.45.04 # you can ask for a cut and paste anytime 23.45.08 # * scorche|sh can make a "Llorean" usergroup with read-only permissions.. 23.45.28 # with population one 23.45.33 # to go with the "user" cloak :) 23.45.39 # much like @rockbox/user/ 23.45.40 # Nah. I'm happy. 23.45.47 # :) 23.46.08 # (which i havent mentioned still allows op rights here, but i dont have to say anything, really..) 23.46.15 # hahaha 23.46.19 # lol 23.47.42 # Llorean: for your peace of mind, it wasn't karashata you had reservations about, it was cool_walking 23.48.02 # GodEater: No, I had reservations about a lot of people. :) 23.48.18 # * scorche|sh still has reservations about a lot of people.. 23.48.21 # "People. I am suspicious of them" 23.48.35 # well lots of people have reservations about you scorche|sh 23.48.38 # and rightly so! 23.48.49 # yes, but i already have a shiny badge =) 23.48.55 # * Llorean has now places all the responsibility in other hands, so doesn't need those reservations any more. 23.48.58 # hehehehe 23.49.37 # Llorean: my view is really, "what's the worst that could happen?" 23.49.47 # if any of the new peeps screw up bad, they lose the badge 23.49.49 # easy enough 23.50.09 # not that I expect that to happen of course 23.50.25 # GodEater: I'll remove yours forthwith :) 23.50.41 # AlexP: thanks 23.50.55 # always happy to help :) 23.50.56 # can I have that tarnished rusty badge lying in the corner over there instead ? 23.51.05 # * scorche|sh isnt sure if AlexP can or not 23.51.19 # or it might be equal level and below, so you could.. 23.51.27 # scorche|sh: I haven't tried :) 23.51.34 # Nor am I planning to 23.51.36 # * GodEater can't be bothered to look 23.51.48 # anyway, it's now past my bedtime 23.51.51 # so nn all 23.51.53 # has anyone suggested a increasing pitch for the FM tuner feature when manual tuning the radio for blind users? 23.52.02 # scorche|sh: If I recall, the "Membergroup" permission is automatically equal level or below, but the levels are only "Admin" "Global Mod" and "other membergroups" 23.52.35 # Llorean: so AlexP could remove GodEater and restore him again 23.52.59 # I think 23.53.41 # notlistening: that would be difficult because i dont think the fm audio goes through the software dsp at all... it goes stright to the headphones 23.54.11 # JdGordon|: I don't think that's what he means. 23.54.18 Quit nibbler_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 23.54.22 # JdGordon|: I think he just means playing a tone that increases as you increase the station 23.54.27 # increases in pitch 23.54.46 # well in that case.... /me shuts up 23.54.55 # * Llorean isn't sure though, as it is a bit unclear 23.55.29 # yeah an increase in pitch to indicate you position in the frequency range 23.56.19 # It'd still be wildly inaccurate. I'm not sure it'd be terribly useful. 23.56.37 # A button to "read" the station name to you is probably better. 23.56.48 # Just tune until something is coming in, then press the button to read it to find out what you've landed at. 23.57.06 # you would have to have perfect pitch to know what it is :) 23.57.29 # yeah but to have an idea where you are helps a lot trust me, blind users are not so much into precision at times in the ball park usually does 23.57.41 # notlistening: What does it help with? 23.57.59 # like you know something is around 104? 23.58.18 # a rough idea where you are in the range 23.58.25 # Yeah, but wouldn't an exact idea help more? 23.58.28 Join Cory` [0] (n=cory@h86.179.89.75.dynamic.ip.windstream.net) 23.58.40 # If you tap and hear "nine six" it's a lot better than trying to gauge from the tone whether you're in low, mid, or high 90s 23.58.45 # If you're looking for, say, 95. 23.58.56 # New commit by 03bagder (r21480): better upload path, fixed logging timestamp, lowered to 3 parallel builds per client by default, counts build/kill time, counts kills, renames uploads ...