--- Log for 27.10.111 Server: leguin.freenode.net Channel: #rockbox --- Nick: logbot Version: Dancer V4.16 Started: 23 days and 16 hours ago 00.00.04 # saratoga: i dd'd the entire disk to a file and md5'ed that 00.05.18 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 00.09.38 # and that matched the md5 from the sandisk firmware? 00.19.40 Quit domonoky (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 00.22.20 Quit z180 (Remote host closed the connection) 00.23.46 Quit tjb0607 (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 00.24.01 # saratoga: no, because it is bigger than the firmware file 00.24.09 # yeah 00.24.14 # so how were you comparing? 00.24.36 Quit bertrik (Quit: And That, My Liege, Is How We Know the Earth to Be Banana Shaped) 00.25.03 # saratoga: I was comparing the disk after I dd'd the OF to it, and after I turned it off and on again. 00.25.16 Quit Jerom (Quit: Leaving.) 00.25.20 # and again after I dd'd /dev/null and then the OF 00.25.36 # did you check that the disk actually contained the firmware? 00.25.51 # saratoga: no. I don't know how I would do that 00.26.12 # write the OF and then read it back after a reboot 00.26.16 # see if its the same 00.26.26 # saratoga: I did that 00.26.29 # it was the same 00.26.46 # what did you do? 00.27.50 Quit ender` (Quit: Our chances of being caught by the RIAA or IFPI are somewhat less than being hit by lightning - or choking on a wasabi-flavoured peanut. -- TheRegister) 00.28.21 # dd'd the OF to the disk. md5 the disk. reboot. md5 the disk. they were the same 00.28.47 # by md5 the disk, i mean I dd'd the whole disk to a file and md5'ed that 00.29.02 # what i'm suggesting is that you check that what youv'e read back actually contains the file you wrote to it 00.29.11 # for all you know the file you're reading back is all zeros correct? 00.29.46 # saratoga: yes. I could dd /dev/null to the disk, and see if that returns a different checksum 00.30.07 # why not just look at what you've read back and see if it matches the OF bin file? 00.30.28 # saratoga: using what? just open the file in less or something? 00.30.39 # notepad for all i care . . . 00.30.47 Quit liar (Remote host closed the connection) 00.31.08 # saratoga: sorry, i didn't realize you could just open it and read it 00.32.45 # saratoga: it's different. less shows that the sansa disk was full of these: @^ 00.32.47 # repeating 00.36.17 Join Scromple [0] (~Simon@115-64-195-104.static.tpgi.com.au) 00.36.31 # why was dd reporting success but not succeeding 00.37.44 # saratoga: http://paste.ubuntu.com/720167/ 00.38.23 # probably because theres nothing actually connected 00.39.39 # so fdisk reports the disk, but I can't connect to it 00.43.20 # just because you give a USB device data doesn't mean its backed by storage 00.44.06 Join zchs [0] (~zchs@ool-ad02eb3f.dyn.optonline.net) 00.50.54 Join tjb0607 [0] (~quassel@bc108216.bendcable.com) 01.01.49 Quit tjb0607 (Ping timeout: 259 seconds) 01.03.51 Quit AlexP (Remote host closed the connection) 01.11.28 # does anyone have any idea why dircache seems so sensitive to file system corruption? 01.11.49 # it seems to crash readily on disks that rockbox would happily read/write without incident 01.15.50 Quit hilbert (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 01.17.05 Join hilbert [0] (~hilbert@adsl-89-217-161-153.adslplus.ch) 01.17.48 Quit dfkt (Quit: -= SysReset 2.55=- Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc.) 01.23.03 # saratoga: because it reads every file? 01.23.39 # but why does an error in the file system crash the parser? shouldn't it just find a file that has the wrong size or something similar? 01.24.28 # i mean its just walking the allocation table right, not actually scanning the disk? 01.24.40 # dunno, depends on the corruption probably 01.37.56 Join DerPapst [0] (~4fcaf435@www.haxx.se) 01.40.01 Join Strife89 [0] (~Strife89@207.144.201.128) 01.40.44 # just on a side note... the multipart/mixed "server push" method works fine again in firefox version 7 and up (probably for older versions except ff4 as well). it would be nice if someone could reenable this feature for the irc reader :) 01.43.01 Quit DerPapst (Quit: CGI:IRC) 01.49.25 Quit hilbert (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 01.51.17 Join mshathlonxp [0] (msh@87.110.149.7) 01.52.33 # JdGordon: just skimming the parser it does things like run strlen and then use the result to increment pointers, so I suspect that could end badly if the entry is corrupt 01.52.35 Quit GodEater (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 01.53.08 Join Acorn [0] (2e4019ad@gateway/web/freenode/ip.46.64.25.173) 01.53.50 # Is there a quick way to get back to the music playback screen without going via the main menu? 01.54.03 # And is there a way to get back to that screen without resuming playback? 01.54.24 # depends on the target 01.56.45 Quit Stummi (Quit: Leaving...) 01.56.58 # sansa clip+ in this case 01.58.30 # menu+select iirc 01.59.33 # saratoga: yeah, sounds likely... I know nothing about dircache and the FS layer, just seems obvious to me that dircache stresses the fs more than normal browsing might, so with some corruption it oculd kill it 02.05.19 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 02.05.24 # i don't know anything about fat32, but it seems logical to me that the system should at least check that the lengths of strings and such are consistent with the maximum values allowed by the file system and if they aren't stop trying to build the cache 02.05.59 # unless the file system driver is already doing that somewhere 02.06.15 # dunno 02.06.46 # JdGordon: hmm, looks like you can't get to the playback control with a plugin running.. 02.06.57 # correct 02.07.02 # some plugins provide it in a menu 02.07.17 # yeah, noticed the blackjack plugin had a menu 02.07.29 # shame you can't have a plugin running in the background 02.08.02 # you can 02.08.17 # only battery bench supports that though 02.08.17 # ah, that's good news 02.08.27 Join GodEater [0] (~bibble@cl-711.lon-02.gb.sixxs.net) 02.08.27 Quit GodEater (Changing host) 02.08.27 Join GodEater [0] (~bibble@rockbox/staff/GodEater) 02.09.31 # I was going to write a simple plugin to make beeping noises at specific intervals to help with jogging, probably in LUA, and it would be nice to be able to use the proper playback control interface while it was running 02.10.11 # the LUA pluign probably doesnt support it either 02.10.18 # ah 02.24.25 Quit ReimuHak_ (Quit: Leaving...) 03.04.21 Quit Strife89 (Quit: Reboot.) 03.04.31 # FS#12350 is really weird 03.04.33 # http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/12350 3Clipv2 - Rockbox duplicates samples - effectively halves samplerate (bugs, unconfirmed) 03.05.06 # when you record in stereo the left channel gets sample 1 two times, then the right channel gets sample 2 two times, and so on 03.05.14 # like the interleave logic got reversed 03.05.21 # anyone know where that happens in the recording code? 03.14.00 Join ChickeNES [0] (~ChickeNES@wireless-169-169.uchicago.edu) 03.15.40 Quit Zarggg (Quit: Rebooting client...) 03.15.56 Join Zarggg [0] (~zarggg@24.229.139.169.res-cmts.sm.ptd.net) 03.17.58 Join ReimuHak_ [0] (~reimu@wireless.sit-co.net) 03.26.53 Nick scorche` is now known as scorche (~scorche@rockbox/administrator/scorche) 03.32.20 Quit ReimuHak_ (Quit: Leaving...) 03.32.52 Join ReimuHak_ [0] (~reimu@wireless.sit-co.net) 03.35.30 Quit ChickeNES (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 03.53.58 Join Lars_G [0] (~Lars@unaffiliated/lars-g/x-000001) 03.54.36 # Hi all. 03.54.49 # <[Saint_]> o/ 03.55.54 # hi. I think I'm better at community :D 04.05.23 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 04.18.16 Quit ageis (Quit: Leaving) 04.20.45 Quit [7] (Disconnected by services) 04.20.57 Join TheSeven [0] (~TheSeven@rockbox/developer/TheSeven) 04.24.24 Join tjb0607 [0] (~quassel@bc10753.bendcable.com) 04.24.28 Join ageis [0] (~ageis@c-76-127-201-198.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) 04.27.33 Quit tjb0607 (Remote host closed the connection) 04.29.57 Join tjb0607 [0] (~quassel@bc10753.bendcable.com) 04.30.15 Quit linuxstb (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 04.32.53 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@94-193-103-239.zone7.bethere.co.uk) 04.32.53 Quit linuxstb (Changing host) 04.32.53 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 04.37.02 Quit saratoga (Quit: Page closed) 04.47.23 Quit amiconn (Disconnected by services) 04.47.24 Quit pixelma (Disconnected by services) 04.47.24 Join amiconn_ [0] (quassel@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 04.47.26 Join pixelma_ [0] (quassel@rockbox/staff/pixelma) 04.47.28 Nick pixelma_ is now known as pixelma (quassel@rockbox/staff/pixelma) 04.47.46 Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (quassel@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 04.51.35 Quit sinthetek (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 04.56.05 Join sinthetek [0] (~sinthetek@unaffiliated/sinthetek) 05.04.30 Quit Lars_G (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 05.32.16 Quit linuxstb (Read error: Operation timed out) 05.33.54 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@94-193-103-239.zone7.bethere.co.uk) 05.33.54 Quit linuxstb (Changing host) 05.33.54 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 05.34.12 Quit ps-auxw (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 05.34.32 Quit MethoS- (Remote host closed the connection) 05.36.03 Join ps-auxw [0] (~arneb@2001:470:c807:0:1532:4e5f:2ad3:4123) 05.37.15 Join Rob2223 [0] (~Miranda@p4FFF1B4E.dip.t-dialin.net) 05.41.02 Quit Rob2222 (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 05.44.11 Quit Horschti (Quit: Verlassend) 06.05.24 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 06.06.53 Quit Acorn (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 06.26.25 Quit tjb0607 (Quit: kthxbai.) 06.34.19 Quit linuxstb (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 06.35.26 Quit robin0800 (Quit: Leaving) 06.35.33 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@94-193-103-239.zone7.bethere.co.uk) 06.35.34 Quit linuxstb (Changing host) 06.35.34 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 07.21.28 Quit Scromple (Quit: Leaving) 07.25.27 Join Scromple [0] (~Simon@115-64-195-104.static.tpgi.com.au) 07.58.45 Join Prodicus [0] (~45a990ef@www.haxx.se) 08.03.55 Join Stummi [0] (~Stummi@rockbox/developer/Stummi) 08.04.14 Join Kuitsi [0] (~Kuitsi@a88-113-118-171.elisa-laajakaista.fi) 08.04.22 # New to Rockbox here- what communication channels are best for feature requests and discussing them? Forums, user list, dev list, tracker? 08.05.11 Quit Stummi (Client Quit) 08.05.27 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 08.05.38 # <[Saint_]> I'm not sure we really *do* feature requests... 08.05.52 # <[Saint_]> We have "feature ideas", that's it. 08.06.10 # <[Saint_]> a request kinda implies that someone will do something about it :) 08.06.32 # Well I didn't say feature demands :) 08.06.50 # the forum is probably best for feature ideas 08.06.51 # or here 08.07.40 # but yeah, very few feature ideas make it anywhere unless someone comes up with a patch from the start 08.07.54 # Couple thoughts then- first off, has anybody looked into doing CELT/Opus? You already do speex, CELT/Opus has a fixed-point decoder, and it outperforms speex at every bitrate 08.08.58 # I don't know how much work they've done on ARM optimization yet though, probably not much 08.09.33 # I did browse my music via "Database -> Year" and in some cases it shows pretty strange years, like 204 or 3107. why? in amarok those tags seems to be correct. i'm using that "unusable" ipod classic port which otherwise seems to be working fine exept much shorter battery life 08.09.41 # especially with audio codecs.. if the license is acceptable and there is a patch, it will probably be accepted 08.09.55 # I dont tihnk a codec has ever been rejected because it wasnt wanted 08.10.02 # we *even* have wma :p 08.13.42 Join nosa [0] (~m00k@adsl-74-235-79-233.clt.bellsouth.net) 08.14.43 # Ok; good to know. CELT/Opus is a collaboration between Xiph (esp. jmvalin, the guy behind speex) and Skype, and its license is a BSD variant. Should be accepted as an IETF standard pretty soon here. 08.15.11 Quit nosa-j (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 08.15.11 Nick nosa is now known as nosa-j (~m00k@adsl-74-235-79-233.clt.bellsouth.net) 08.16.24 Join fyre^OS [0] (~nnscript@cpe-24-90-84-81.nyc.res.rr.com) 08.17.10 Quit fyrestorm (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 08.17.58 # Second- I did a the default/recommended "complete" install on a Sansa Clip+, and after finding that Doom took up as much space as everything else combined, I removed it. Tossing the other extras into a default install comes at very little cost but I wonder whether you might want to rethink putting Doom in the defaults. 08.18.44 Join GodEater_ [0] (93722cd0@rockbox/staff/GodEater) 08.19.25 Join Zagor [242] (~bjst@rockbox/developer/Zagor) 08.21.24 # Third, I noticed that the etiquette page linked from your mailing list page is completely empty. While I suppose that could be construed to mean something about expected etiquette I doubt it's the message you mean to send :) 08.24.54 Quit fyre^OS (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 08.34.23 Quit factor (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 08.37.29 # grr... there is no way to know if the user left the filebrwoser with the menu button or by backing out :/ both cases return GO_TO_ROOT :( 08.38.34 Join factor [0] (~factor@74.197.205.204) 08.46.11 Join einhirn [0] (~Miranda@bsod.rz.tu-clausthal.de) 08.55.49 Join wodz [0] (~wodz@87-206-240-131.dynamic.chello.pl) 08.58.02 # yesterday I hit rather odd behaviour: from file browser select file for playback -> change repeat mode to one -> play a few loops -> change repeat mode to off -> and skip (short ff) do nothing 08.58.39 # Perhaps sometime soon I may find time to set up a build environment and see whether I can manage to get opus to build under the cross compiler. TTFN. 08.59.07 Quit Prodicus (Quit: CGI:IRC 0.5.9 (2006/06/06)) 08.59.26 Join nick-p [0] (~nick@82-69-105-120.dsl.in-addr.zen.co.uk) 09.00.57 Join ender` [0] (~ender@foo.eternallybored.org) 09.05.53 Join hilbert [0] (~hilbert@7-111-204-62-static.cable.fcom.ch) 09.21.20 Join mortalis [0] (~mortalis@77.108.98.176) 09.21.53 Quit Scromple (Quit: Leaving) 09.23.35 # might do a call for translators as we're still frozen? 09.23.54 # good idea 09.26.15 Quit mshathlonxp () 09.26.25 Join Kiwi_CAM [0] (~Kiwi_Cam@206.192.69.111.dynamic.snap.net.nz) 09.34.03 # whats actually at the root of your questions KiwiCam ? 09.34.10 # whats actually at the root of your questions Kiwi_CAM ? :) 09.34.18 # * GodEater_ gets the right nick finally 09.38.42 Join LinusN [0] (~linus@giant.haxx.se) 09.40.06 # GodEater: That most iPod users won't have even heard of Rockbox. I can understand that, but it's a shame when you consider the potential number of RB users out there. 09.43.05 Join bluefoxx [0] (FuzzyLomba@S0106e0cb4e0a6d8a.vs.shawcable.net) 09.43.30 # Kiwi_CAM: most iPod users are special kind of people not really interested in anything not Apple branded 09.43.51 Quit wodz (Quit: Leaving) 09.47.43 # So, the cool kids come here? ;) 09.49.35 # the kids who want more than came in the box, yes 09.50.03 # if that is "cool" or "stupid" depends on your perspective 09.50.42 # I was fantasizing about spreading the RB word, by the use of stickers. Sort of like the ones you find of your laptops. Mine say Mint. They would be wasted on iPod users though, unless somehow, you could make it a cool thing to do. 09.51.41 # I suppose, for your guys, it's just doing this, is what's important.Not the number of RB users. 09.52.12 # pretty much, yes. we have no reason to convince people to use rockbox. 09.52.41 # Nah. Stickers wouldn't work. I could never get one on my Clip ;) 09.52.53 # we do want users, because a percentage of users are potential developers 09.53.25 # Mmm. The developers would know where you were. 09.53.33 # Eventually. 09.53.53 # I think we're victims of our own success in a lot of ways 09.54.07 # I know a reasonable number of people here at work who are ex-rockbox users 09.54.08 # How so? 09.54.13 # Kiwi_CAM: you mean like https://plus.google.com/u/0/102969486368377382090/posts/BbkAw1kqMH8 ? 09.54.13 # who are surprised to find the project is still going 09.54.18 # You can brag. I don't mind. 09.54.37 # they came here "back in the day", installed rockbox, loved it, but never came back 09.54.44 # it already did so much for them they never bothered with upgrades 09.54.57 # JdGordon: I got a 404 there. 09.55.06 # and then when they moved on to new devices, they figured the thing was so old now, there was no point going back to see if there were ports for their new toy 09.55.19 # a lot of them were absolutely staggered to discover the android port 09.55.34 # ok, i fail at g+ 09.57.50 # https://plus.google.com/u/0/102969486368377382090/posts/R5pNpvAgKPJ 09.59.23 # That's the beauty of Rockbox. It evolves. You can always come back. There are always new players. But, I can see why you're doing Android. I have a droid, but I'm not giving up my MP3 Player. 10.01.52 # WTF is that?!? Scale's hard to tell. A subwoofer? You could make a small sticker with a capital RB (grey B). "I've been Rockboxed" or Rockbox is Me!" 10.03.01 # thats my laptop 10.05.28 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 10.06.05 # I should have known by the bulge ;) Too much heat isn't good for the family jewels mate. Where can one get a Rockbox sticker then? Pretty please? 10.19.24 # * Kiwi_CAM sulks in the RB non community corner. 10.23.58 Join pamaury [0] (~quassel@213.103.191.81) 10.23.59 Quit pamaury (Changing host) 10.23.59 Join pamaury [0] (~quassel@rockbox/developer/pamaury) 10.32.52 Quit linuxstb (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 10.34.40 # * [Saint_] wonders if a: its possible to, and b: if there's ay reason not to allow RaaA to rotate 180 degrees on devices that can support it. 10.35.17 # <[Saint_]> I end up using my phone upside down quite a bit. 10.35.21 # it's not possible today, since they are hardcoded to a specific resolution and orientation 10.35.28 # oh, 180 10.35.40 # that should be perfectly doable 10.36.51 # we already have an upside down setting for other targets 10.37.18 # <[Saint_]> Not all devices support app rotation at 180 degrees, but I know the CM ROMs defintely do, for apps that allow it. 10.37.33 # <[Saint_]> And it could also be an actual on/off/sensor setting presumably. 10.40.05 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@94-193-103-239.zone7.bethere.co.uk) 10.40.05 Quit linuxstb (Changing host) 10.40.05 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 10.50.22 Quit linuxstb (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 10.54.14 Quit bluefoxx (Quit: bluefoxx) 11.04.00 Join bluefoxx [0] (fuzzylomba@S0106e0cb4e0a6d8a.vs.shawcable.net) 11.06.00 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@94-193-103-239.zone7.bethere.co.uk) 11.06.00 Quit linuxstb (Changing host) 11.06.00 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 11.15.22 # Kiwi_CAM: scorche and bluebrother made some stickers but I don't know if any are left 11.19.39 # pixelma: I pinged because I wanted to ask you about hte german transaltion on the tracker 11.22.25 # mc2739: ping 11.24.22 Quit scorche (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 11.26.55 Quit Kiwi_CAM (Quit: Leaving) 11.32.42 Join scorche [0] (~scorche@rockbox/administrator/scorche) 11.35.59 # jhMikeS: ping 11.41.43 Join Topy [0] (~Topy44@f049107187.adsl.alicedsl.de) 11.42.34 Quit T44 (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 11.49.03 # I wonder one again why *does the fucking hell* kernel.c contains the documentation of the kernel function but NOT the header kernel.h, this makes no sense ! 11.49.06 # *once 11.50.07 Join dfkt [0] (~dfkt@unaffiliated/dfkt) 11.51.14 # probably because they were written while writing the code 11.51.35 Quit bluebrother (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 11.51.59 Quit fs-bluebot (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 11.53.39 Join fs-bluebot [0] (~fs-bluebo@g231120102.adsl.alicedsl.de) 11.53.41 Join bluebrother [0] (~dom@rockbox/developer/bluebrother) 11.56.36 Quit hilbert (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 11.59.28 Quit linuxstb (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 11.59.58 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 12.05.31 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 12.05.40 # yes but this is weird 12.07.34 # "Topit" is a forum spammer who has gotten past the filter 12.07.39 # bumped a load of threads with obvious junk 12.07.59 # also Tonglimit 12.08.00 Quit linuxstb (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 12.14.44 Join hilbert [0] (~hilbert@adsl-89-217-161-153.adslplus.ch) 12.18.22 Quit mortalis (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) 12.20.18 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 12.20.22 # that's really strange, on my fuze+ the usb thread is created but does not appear in the os stack list :-/ 12.20.33 Join mortalis [0] (~mortalis@77.108.98.176) 12.26.05 Join lorenzo92 [0] (~chatzilla@host20-105-dynamic.51-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) 12.28.10 # apparently something is calling usb_close 12.30.28 # lol, there is a buggy switch fallback in usb.c !! 12.30.40 # really really weird 12.31.24 Join MethoS- [0] (~clemens@134.102.106.250) 12.31.52 Quit linuxstb (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 12.35.47 # New commit by 03pamaury (r30843): usb: add forgotten break in usb switch, this could lead to unwanted code being execute like USB_QUIT to be sent on hotswap ! 12.38.01 # r30843 build result: All green 12.38.20 # New commit by 03pamaury (r30844): fuzeplus: rework button handling to use a queue instead of a blocking semaphore in the thread 12.39.42 # I thought we were in feature freeze? 12.39.57 # r30844 build result: All green 12.39.57 # oh, sorry - new port 12.39.59 # ignore me 12.44.01 # and bugfix 12.44.15 # r30843 is clearly a bug 12.44.38 Quit nick-p (Quit: Leaving) 12.49.09 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@94-193-103-239.zone7.bethere.co.uk) 12.49.09 Quit linuxstb (Changing host) 12.49.09 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 12.57.56 Quit linuxstb (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 12.58.18 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 13.08.24 # pamaury: well, we have no established policy regarding that, so everything is correct (unfortunately including no documentation at all) :( 13.09.06 # yes I know, it's just that it's not the first time I look at kernel.h, grumbles because there is no, so I go to kernel.c to read it and bam ! there is doc :-/ 13.09.10 # I think documentation in headers has one major flaw. implementation and its documention are separated, which leads to outdated documenation 13.09.30 # but in this case, the doc is not even complete 13.12.59 Quit Bagder (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 13.13.46 # pamaury: exactly. it's not doc as much as a few descriptive code comments. 13.13.48 Quit hilbert (Quit: Textual IRC Client: http://www.textualapp.com/) 13.16.13 # lorenzo92: let's talk here 13.19.09 # okay 13.19.22 # so r0 application manages everything 13.19.28 Join HaimN [0] (~HaimN@31.44.133.180) 13.19.32 # the kernel is not supposed to be used with other apss 13.19.36 # *apps 13.19.56 # I can believe that 13.19.57 # that's why we need to manage everything in rockbox too 13.20.32 # it seems strange they don't use a sensible cpu governor 13.20.57 # eh there are a lot of strange things in their firmwares...trust me hehe. Just ask lebellium too :) 13.21.33 # even keypad for example 13.21.49 # they didn't implement it as a normal input device in kernel...no!...they used a module 13.22.01 # polling everytime /dev/r0Btn 13.22.27 # mgue has tried to build a kernel module to implement it as keyboard but he failed... 13.24.07 # I cant find sys/platform/cpu/.../cur_cpu_freq on my system 13.24.16 # wait I give you the exact path 13.24.44 # anyway here the doc too: http://www.mjmwired.net/kernel/Documentation/cpu-freq/governors.txt 13.25.12 # "/sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/" 13.25.29 # hit ls on there and see... 13.25.52 # I looked there :) 13.26.02 # what are you discussing? 13.26.12 # YP-R0 port 13.26.36 # does it run linux? 13.26.44 # in 2 words: the player runs a linux kernel, so I'm porting rb as an application, but we need to control HW directly like in a normal rb port 13.27.01 # yay, more hybrids :-) 13.27.06 # yes :D 13.27.19 # lorenzo92: I found scaling_cur_freq there 13.27.23 # yes 13.27.31 # that never gives the lowest frequency for me 13.27.43 # probably because reading it means load 13.27.48 # eh it depends on config and acrive governor 13.27.54 # *active 13.27.59 # ondemand here 13.28.19 # uhm ok...well so it depends on the cpu type 13.28.35 # for example here on r0 we have 200-400-532 MHz only 13.28.36 # dont think so 13.28.55 # I see various higher frequencies but never the lowest one 13.29.06 Quit linuxstb (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 13.29.18 # I'm thinking reading that file isn't the best measure to read the current frequency 13.29.20 # uhm try to cat scaling_min_freq or something similar 13.29.27 # yes it is 13.29.52 # at least on my player... 13.29.54 # scaling_min_freq gives the lowest 13.30.12 # that gives 532 on the r0? 13.30.28 # 200 mhz lowest, 532 max 13.30.41 # I've seen the kernel sources too, that's right 13.31.09 # wait I turn on rockbox to see values with text viewer 13.31.26 # the text viewer doesnt refresh I think 13.31.42 # yes indeed...everytime i need to do manually :) 13.32.11 # I'm questioning that it runs at 532 all the time, and that reading that file is a good way to find out 13.32.50 # yes it is. trust me hehe. it runs everytime at 532 by default. Samsung developers are not so clever indeed 13.33.08 # what does scaling_min_freq give you? 13.33.18 # and which governor? 13.33.19 # 200000 13.33.26 # by default userspace 13.33.37 # now I setted it to conservative to test 13.33.43 # and freq is scaled down to 200 mzh 13.33.55 # (i can see because rb is a bit laggy) 13.34.03 # brickmania for example 13.34.05 # hehe 13.34.05 # ah okay. if userspace is the governor than it is believable 13.34.41 # oh I just discovered we have stats too 13.34.45 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 13.34.54 # I personally think ondemand is the best; but yea, if userspace is the default governor we should do something about it 13.35.29 # why? 13.35.37 # I can set it to ondemand 13.35.41 # before loading rb... 13.36.02 # with something could mean to set ondemand :) 13.36.07 # s/with// 13.37.54 # Zagor: looks like we need to do power management, backlight, sound output (i.e. not using alsa/sdl/whatever) in rockbox 13.38.07 # so not quite an normal app port 13.38.35 # * kugel almost doesnt dare to ask 13.38.41 # lorenzo92: what about usb? 13.39.15 # brb... 13.40.20 # btw sound is ok throug sdl (i'm listening fine)...it's volume that we need it to be hw (as3543 codec) 13.41.59 # is this really going to be any easier than a native port? 13.42.46 # Hi, Can I interrupt you for a minute? I can't download rockbox for android from http://rasher.dk/rockbox/android/ it's always stop at the middle, there is another way to download it? 13.52.00 # kugel: I may have some time today in the evening 13.52.41 # HaimN: it works fine for me 13.53.45 Quit ReimuHak_ (Quit: Leaving...) 13.55.16 # back... 13.55.48 # native port would be quite impossible: bootloader is not possible to be flashed without a samsung tool that's no public 13.56.00 # ok 13.56.42 # but sound is working and backlight too (I've already found the ioctl code to manage ascodec registers through afe.ko module) 13.57.06 # we need "just" to understand how to implement ascodec full management for hw audio (to keep sdl volume at 100%) 13.58.32 # ...and for other goodies such as rtc alarm + time management 13.59.04 # ah yeah another issue...time isn't managed by the kernel :S...samsung app saves a value in /dev/stl1, like a time diff 13.59.14 # I now go to understand it 14.00.46 # for example, in the last dump I have this value 14.01.04 # 88293553273...maybe they are milliseconds or what else uhm uhm 14.01.52 Join Thra11 [0] (~thrall@87.114.72.124) 14.03.19 # kugel: pong 14.03.27 # Zagor: strange, Is there a site that I can upload the file directly from the Internet and then download it? Maybe this will solve my problem 14.03.31 # kugel: usb is easy to make it work, they are usb gadgets. The fact I cannot understand is that sharing partitions with usb in a script works in the original kernel, but not in the recompiled one 14.03.44 # mc2739: I posted a patch to the usb screen corruption task 14.04.13 # lorenzo92: can you load a custom kernel? 14.04.25 # via kexec you mean? 14.04.31 # ah flashing it? yes... 14.05.10 # I saw it. I will try to test, but am leaving for work shortly 14.05.16 # so what stops you doing a native port again? :-) 14.05.32 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 14.05.53 # knowledge hehe 14.06.06 Quit bluefoxx (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) 14.06.22 # I'm still on high-level things :D 14.07.09 # Zoiah: did you think about the decryption/encryption method I told you about in my mail ? 14.07.15 Join bluefoxx [0] (fuzzylomba@S0106e0cb4e0a6d8a.vs.shawcable.net) 14.10.07 # zagor: and of course to flash something you need a special cable + special software if you want to be sure... 14.10.07 # pamaury: we're missing each nicely every day. ;) 14.10.07 # pamaury: you mean in your mail from 25-10-2011 20:39? 14.10.07 # I think so yes 14.10.07 # yes, this week I'm in holydays in a foreign conntry so I'm not online quite often, except today 14.10.07 # I responded with 'I'm totally up for it. :)', etc. right? 14.10.10 Quit LinusN (Quit: disconnecting from stoned server.) 14.10.27 Join LinusN [0] (~linus@giant.haxx.se) 14.10.34 # strange, I didn't get answer, let me check 14.11.14 # oh strange, I got your answer but gmail never told me so :( 14.12.09 # ok, then I'll try to do that, modify my sbtools to work with a device to encrypt/decrypt, that will be fun :) 14.12.27 # I'm just curious: do you plan to port rockbox to it if it works ? 14.13.37 Quit HaimN (Remote host closed the connection) 14.14.26 # I could give it a try. 14.14.46 # I'm not very skilled at this stuff, but http://etherhack.wordpress.com/ is an example of some other (non-finished) work I did. 14.15.53 # I already wrote much of the code for the imx233/stmp3780 so you "just" need to reverse engineer the missing part: LCD init is the first major step. Actually, it would be awesome it you could put photos of the inside of your device on the wiki, if you can open it 14.16.21 # so that we know what is the hardware 14.16.30 # But encryption, let alone OTP, fuse, chip, etc. stuff is way out of my league. I think I kinda understand what you're getting at, but I don't think I would be able to think of it, or reproduce it. :) 14.17.03 # I could try cracking it open, I don't think there is a teardown on the net. 14.17.55 # it doesn't really matter, I know it because I spent hours reversing the ROM, reading the manual and reversing the fuze+ firmware :) Yes, with nice picures of it. 14.17.59 # so for my R0 the things to be discussed are: how to implement the ascodec management in a clean way? 14.18.46 # I've already prepared basic things for reading/writing registers. And this is working like a charm for the backligh 14.18.47 # I'll got out for an hour, to put things on the wiki you need to register and then ask for write access I think, just ask on the channel 14.18.50 # *go 14.19.23 # Any idea why the fuze+ wasn't encryped? 14.19.32 # Or encrypted with zeros AES key, actually, right? 14.19.36 # is was, but with default key (0) :) 14.19.45 # just lazyness I guess 14.20.10 # or perhaps it required something special during manufacturing process ? 14.20.12 # Didn't Sandisk support Rockbox in the past? 14.20.55 # they kind of supported us without support :) They offered us to send free fuze+ but not the documentation so they might want to see a Rockbox port so that people buy more of they devices :D 14.20.58 # Maybe Sandisk supports freedom. ;) 14.21.31 # Actually I won't complain, I see this as an opportunity :) 14.21.41 # I understand why the OTP bits don't want to be read, but I don't understand how you want to try to make the thing encrypt a binary. 14.21.57 # Embedded hardware is cool though, it's always been a random interest of me. 14.22.25 # That's the nice point: AES is so strong that even if you have a black box that encrypt/decrypt, it will take you years to find the key 14.22.56 # Yup, there are some attacks that make the searchable keyspace less, but still more than the heatdeath of our universe. ;) 14.22.57 # so you write the key somewhere, lock it so noone can read it except the hardware and then you use the hardware to encrypt/decrypt (which is the point of AES) 14.23.06 # How come you can run your code on it? 14.24.24 # Also,I thought you needed to go? ;) 14.25.18 # because the ROM is buggy. The encrypted updater.sb with two keys, knowing one key is sufficient to encrypt/decrypt, except that if you do this, you have to be able to produce a file with a known SHA-1 cipher which is at least as hard as breaking AES I think. Here is the point: the SHA-1 is a control sum of the *whole* image the ROM doesn't check it :D 14.25.34 # yes, I'll go, I'll give you the details later if you want 14.25.41 # Yes, I'm interested in this. :) 14.29.11 Quit lorenzo92 (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 14.30.16 Quit zchs (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 14.36.47 Quit GeekShad1w (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 14.38.03 Join chkktri_ [0] (~chikakita@ip-78-139-196-175.danet.in) 14.39.22 Quit chkktri (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 14.40.31 Join GeekShadow [0] (~antoine@178.89.193.77.rev.sfr.net) 14.43.06 Join lorenzo92 [0] (~chatzilla@host214-110-dynamic.17-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) 14.43.21 Join zchs [0] (~zchs@ool-ad02eb3f.dyn.optonline.net) 14.50.51 Join tails___ [0] (chikakitaa@ip-78-139-196-175.danet.in) 14.50.51 Quit chkktri_ (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 14.52.32 # okay the governor settings are quite fine now 14.52.45 # just need to lower the frequency of control 14.55.59 Quit tails___ (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 14.56.06 Join chkktri_ [0] (chikakitaa@ip-78-139-196-175.danet.in) 14.58.37 # anyone knows if imx37 display can be switched off? I mean, not only backlight...because I'm guessing that 15.00.10 Quit Farthen (Excess Flood) 15.00.26 Join Farthen [0] (~Farthen@2a01:4f8:101:2a4:0:bc28:b2e1:9) 15.00.59 Quit antil33t (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 15.01.22 Join antil33t [0] (~antil33t@203-100-223-143.callplus.net.nz) 15.07.03 # Zagor: the restarting playback of the current track *does* still for sure happen in svn 15.07.06 # the crashes dont though 15.07.16 # argh, ok 15.07.17 # so not sure if that should be reopened 15.07.31 # probably a new task made to more explain it 15.08.48 # I think the task is fine. I'll just downgrade it. 15.09.21 Quit Farthen (Excess Flood) 15.10.56 Join Farthen [0] (~Farthen@2a01:4f8:101:2a4:0:bc28:b2e1:9) 15.13.30 # okay to put framebuffer in sleep mode this should do the job: 15.13.31 # # echo 1 > /sys/class/graphics/fb0/blank 15.14.59 Quit nosa-j (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 15.15.35 Quit zchs (Read error: Operation timed out) 15.16.17 Quit linuxstb (Read error: Connection timed out) 15.17.53 Join nosa-j [0] (~m00k@adsl-74-235-79-233.clt.bellsouth.net) 15.22.59 # I go now see you all ;) 15.23.03 Quit lorenzo92 (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 7.0.1/20111008085652]) 15.27.32 Join matze` [0] (~pflaume@p5498B0EB.dip.t-dialin.net) 15.28.14 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 15.32.22 Quit antil33t (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 15.32.48 Join antil33t [0] (~antil33t@203-100-223-143.callplus.net.nz) 15.38.14 Join benedikt93 [0] (~benedikt9@unaffiliated/benedikt93) 15.40.43 Join WalkGood [0] (~4@unaffiliated/walkgood) 15.41.32 # Zoiah: still here ? 15.47.19 Join TheLemonMan [0] (~LemonBoy@adsl-ull-227-206.50-151.net24.it) 15.48.19 Quit GodEater_ (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 15.50.41 Join zchs [0] (~zchs@ool-ad02eb3f.dyn.optonline.net) 15.50.57 # pamaury: yeah. :) 15.51.04 # pamaury: but kinda busy during the day usually. 15.53.47 # Ok, so here is basically how it works. The SB file format has a small weirdness: it doesn't use the OTP key to encrypt the file. Instead it uses a random key. So that it does is the following: generate a random key, encrypt it using the OTP key, write the encrypted key in the image and then encrypt everything with the real random key. So far so good except that the SB format has support for *several* OTP keys and here is the flaw: if you have N 15.53.47 # keys, you encrypt the *same random key* with the N keys and generate N encrypted form of the key. The consequence is that if you know any of the key, you can recover the real key 15.55.01 # you can? it's doing XOR? 15.55.01 Join GodEater_ [0] (93722cc8@rockbox/staff/GodEater) 15.55.03 # or similar? 15.55.11 # AES 15.56.36 # Oh, wait 15.56.40 # Sorry, yes, I see what you mean 15.57.21 # you can recover the "session" key, and thus encrypt other files and just copypaste the encrypted bit we don't have the key for 15.57.35 # That's idea, details are coming :) 15.58.54 # You can call it a feature but this is actually a flaw because of the following fact. Assume now that you have an encrypted image with two keys: K1 and Z, you don't know K1 but you know Z (before it's 0 for example). Then with Z you decrypt the real key and then use it to encrypt your data. Then at the end you don't use the header you should have constructed but the one of the image you've got. Of course the header doesn't fully match the file 15.58.54 # content because it doesn't have the same length and same section but here comes the second, fatal flaw of the SB format. Is was designed to be streamed and not access randomly, which means that even though the mastee header tells you everything about the file, most of information is duplicated later for the ROM to stream everything and avoid keeping information. So once the header has been read and validated, it's forgets everything and just 15.58.54 # apply the commands as long as there are properly encrypted :D 15.59.43 # *they 16.00.48 # Using this technique, you can craft a file that get data through USB, use the hardware to encrypt/decrypt using the OTP key K1 (that you don't know and will never know) and then give it back through USB. 16.01.32 # Then you're done because you can encrypt any file you want 16.03.49 Join GeekShad1w [0] (~antoine@178.89.193.77.rev.sfr.net) 16.04.09 Quit GeekShadow (Remote host closed the connection) 16.04.14 # That's theory, now the last step needs to be done: write the magic encrypter/decrypter. But the inital mistake was to release a file with two keys: the OTP and zero. 16.05.35 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 16.09.59 # pamaury: I'll save this text for future reading, it looks like I should understand it, but it's not hitting me yet. ;) 16.10.16 # Anyhow, I understand how you can run your own code now. 16.10.37 # Any code can encrypt stuff? 16.12.20 # As a feature? 16.12.49 # what do you mean ? 16.13.10 # Do I understand correctly that the flaw you explained allows you to run your own code on ARM core? 16.14.01 # yes, you can send a file and the ROM will think it's valid and run it 16.14.22 # In theory, you could always use this to bootstrap rockbox? 16.14.33 # s/always/already/ 16.14.44 # yes 16.14.49 # except there is a little problem 16.15.21 # you need to reverse engineer the OF to be able to port rockbox to this target (thing like LCD for example). 16.15.33 # and to reverse engineer the OF you need to decrypt it :) 16.15.56 # Right. 16.16.35 # That's why I want to write the tool that decrypt/encrypt, I'll start it in a minute, it *shouldn't* be too long to get it work 16.16.44 # But the LCD is probably some standard component? So opening up and identifying stuff is probably a step in the right direction? 16.17.09 Join hilbert [0] (~hilbert@7-111-204-62-static.cable.fcom.ch) 16.17.21 # identifying stuff is useful, but pretty much every target has a number of things that either don't have public docs, or are sufficiently complicated that things like "how exactly is it wired up" are significant 16.17.32 # so reverse engineering the OF is pretty much always also required 16.18.06 # But it probably helps that the i.mx233 has a LCD controller integrated, so at least this part is standard? 16.18.19 # this is partly standard yes 16.18.39 # but things like backlight, chip enable might not be and even then you usually can't tell what the lcd model s 16.18.40 # is 16.18.47 # But there seems to be a few different ways to talk to the LCDs. 16.19.03 # talking is one thing 16.19.06 # LCD panels have a nasty habit of the panel/controller mdoel numbers and so on facing inwards :p 16.19.15 # such that you can only raed them if you pry the LCD module apart 16.19.24 # which is usually destructive due to thin ribbon cables 16.20.35 # and lcd is not the only problem 16.20.43 # It's a 2.4", 320x240, how many of those could there be. ;) 16.20.56 # haha 16.21.11 Join y4n [0] (y4n@unaffiliated/y4ndexx) 16.21.44 # things like buttons, chip enable, radio enable, ... are difficult to find out without the schematics. And if by chance it uses a raw nand with a FTL, you need to figure out the FTL as well :-/ 16.22.29 # I think there are a number of them ? 16.22.37 # there are quite a lot 16.22.50 # and people often invent their own 16.22.52 # because they are idiots 16.23.25 # pamaury: which we've never successfully done with any great degree of reliability have we? 16.23.28 # if they use the standard i80 protocol, you can read register 0 which might help you figuring out the model 16.23.32 # (re: FTL layer) 16.23.41 # GodEater_: don't think so, indeed :) 16.24.09 # it's just too complicated to understand without the doc 16.24.20 # black and evil magic indeed 16.24.37 # pamaury: how did you end up disassembling the bootrom of the Sansa? 16.24.39 # fuze+* 16.24.48 # one day if you all are very, very nice to me i might try reversing one of the FTLs ;P 16.24.58 # how nice? 16.25.13 # Were you able to find a copy? Or did you dump it from flash with a in-system-header-thing? 16.25.18 # are we talking a bottle of champagne, or a weekend in Vegas nice? 16.25.51 # Zoiah: I dump it because it's at a know address 16.25.53 # *dumped 16.25.55 # I have quite a list of things to be reversing :p 16.25.56 # *known 16.26.06 # i've been fiddling with ipodvideo diagmode on and off lately 16.26.14 # i should probably actually have a go at implementing positive charger detection 16.26.19 # I think it's only going to work on ipodvideo, though 16.26.27 # it looks like none of the other models do it the same way :/ 16.26.43 # it's pretty trivial there, though 16.26.44 # pamaury: so you were already able to run your own code before you started disassembling this? 16.28.34 # GodEater_: the nano2g has ftl 16.28.34 # Zoiah: yes :) Because even before I disassembled the Freescale tool which build SB file so I was able to figure out the SB format before Freescale put it online and then I was to decrypt the fuze+ OF and that was enough information. I only dumped the ROM because I needed to undersand a precise detail (which I did) but now it's seems rather pointless because Freescale released some doc 16.28.56 # reversed from the apple os, and it works well afaik 16.29.07 # The only useful knownledge was that the ROM load the file in streaming mode and doesn't check SHA-1 sum at the end 16.29.24 # pamaury: ahh, ok, that makes sense. 16.29.31 # pamaury: IDA? 16.29.42 # kugel: doesn't the apple os erase itself sometimes and ask for recover ? 16.29.44 # Zoiah: yes 16.29.56 # dont know 16.30.08 # the nano2g port is stable, though 16.31.10 # wow, just noticed in the imx manual that they derived their AES hardware from an opencores implementation 16.33.16 Quit Thra11 (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 16.33.22 # Freescale published most of the original Sigmatel docs? 16.33.59 Quit antil33t (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 16.34.22 Join antil33t [0] (~antil33t@203-100-223-143.callplus.net.nz) 16.34.47 # pamaury: I'll be at home in 1-1.5 hours or so, and then I'll quickly try to pop it open before I have to leave again. ;) 16.35.06 # There don't seem to be any visible screws on the outside, so this should be fun. 16.36.25 # A knife is a good tool to open players :) 16.36.55 # Zoiah: they published the SoC manual, the elftosb and sbtools source and the doc of the tools/format 16.37.08 # they didn't published some things related to the ROM though 16.37.15 Join liar [0] (~liar@clnet-p09-185.ikbnet.co.at) 16.37.16 # *publish 16.41.22 # Not the SDK, right? 16.45.23 # no :) I would dream of it since I spent hours and hours reverse engineering it 16.50.43 # STMP36xx is probably too different? Because that SDK seems leaked. 16.52.07 Part LinusN 16.58.44 # it's quite different 17.02.45 # the sdk of the stmp37xx is based on ThreadX 17.02.50 # It's atleast an ARM core, compared to the MP35xx CPU craziness. 17.03.01 Part Zagor 17.04.18 # definitely 17.05.26 # SigmaTel uses Express Logic's ThreadX® real-time operating system (RTOS) in its STMP3600 System on Chip (SoC) which provides …/, 17.09.46 # really ? Didn't know that. In any case, there are lots of hardware differences and it's doesn't solve the fundamental problem that it's a sdk so it's meant to be modified and you are interested in the modification :) 17.24.53 Quit einhirn (Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org) 17.25.08 Join Darko [0] (5fb434a9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.95.180.52.169) 17.25.19 # Hello! 17.25.26 # I have compiled my Tutorial here 17.25.28 # http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php/topic,29115.0.html 17.25.34 # and registered to Wiki 17.25.45 # can someone grant me access to write/editi Wiki pages 17.26.07 # also, do you have any suggestion where to put this Tutorial in? What section is best? 17.26.54 Quit GodEater_ (Quit: Page closed) 17.28.48 Quit chkktri_ (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 17.29.09 Join tails___ [0] (chikakitaa@ip-78-139-196-175.danet.in) 17.34.20 Join chkktri_ [0] (chikakitaa@ip-78-139-196-175.danet.in) 17.36.04 Quit hilbert (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 17.36.09 Join ChickeNES [0] (~ChickeNES@128.135.100.102) 17.36.22 Quit Llorean (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 17.37.51 Quit tails___ (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 17.37.52 Quit chkktri_ (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 17.38.02 Join chkktri_ [0] (chikakitaa@ip-78-139-196-175.danet.in) 17.41.03 Join Llorean [0] (~DarkkOne@rockbox/user/Llorean) 17.43.21 Quit chkktri_ (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 17.46.21 # Darko: What's your wiki name? 17.52.32 Quit Darko (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 17.52.40 Quit MethoS- (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 17.55.11 # pamaury: with 'random key' in your sb 'exploit', does this mean IV? 17.55.29 # Bear with me if I'm asking stupid questions. ;) 17.56.53 Join Bagder [0] (~daniel@1-1-5-26a.hud.sth.bostream.se) 17.56.54 Quit Bagder (Changing host) 17.56.54 Join Bagder [241] (~daniel@rockbox/developer/bagder) 17.57.22 Join bertrik [0] (~bertrik@rockbox/developer/bertrik) 18.02.31 Join Darko [0] (5fb434a9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.95.180.52.169) 18.02.59 # it is Darko 18.03.01 # my Wiki name 18.04.55 # mortalis 18.05.38 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 18.05.43 Join fyrestorm [0] (~nnscript@cpe-24-90-84-81.nyc.res.rr.com) 18.07.47 # Darko: your wiki name should be first name + last name 18.08.02 # Darko Angeleski 18.09.24 # Darko: access granted 18.09.34 # thanks 18.09.50 # can you recommend section where to put this tutorial in? 18.10.13 # I will work on it later this evening 18.11.10 # probably as a branch of SansaAMSunbrick 18.12.15 Join dv_ [0] (~quassel@chello080108009040.14.11.vie.surfer.at) 18.12.20 # hi 18.12.48 # I have a sansa clip+, and want to put rockbox on it 18.13.13 # ok, so go ahead 18.13.30 # however, this wiki page speaks of USB problems: http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/SansaAMS according to this, I could get the svn code and apply the USB patch, 18.13.44 # but it is not recommended, because it gives me only USB 1.1 on windows. 18.13.48 # is this the only problem? 18.16.33 # well, you can always boot into the original firmware for usb, if it really bothers you 18.18.20 Join The_Seeker [0] (~seeker@5ac899e4.bb.sky.com) 18.20.52 Quit Darko (Quit: Page closed) 18.25.47 Join hilbert [0] (~hilbert@adsl-89-217-161-153.adslplus.ch) 18.26.41 Join domonoky [0] (~Domonoky@rockbox/developer/domonoky) 18.31.28 Quit WalkGood (Quit: ♪ ♫ ♪ ♫ ♪ ♫ ♪ ♫) 18.32.49 # Zoiah: IV and key are two separate things in AES, I don't really have time to explain I need to leave, let's say it's a tricky detail of the format :) 18.32.52 Quit pamaury (Remote host closed the connection) 18.34.24 Quit The_Seeker (Quit: I know your passwords) 18.34.26 # mc2739: bummer! 18.37.45 Join Jerom [0] (~jerome@79.132.42.48) 18.37.45 Join Thra11 [0] (~thrall@87.114.72.124) 18.45.14 # I want to start hm801 port. Can i get svn access? Or I should use FS for posting patches? svn access would be much more handy for me as i plan to continue work on RB for hifimans. 18.49.09 # people are invited to become committers after we have seen their work 18.49.23 # not because they are doing some work in future :) 18.49.41 # We're trying to transition to using git, which will make this easier 18.49.57 # there is a git mirror of svn at the moment that you could use. 18.51.01 Quit ChickeNES (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.) 19.00.32 Join acorn [0] (2e4019ad@gateway/web/freenode/ip.46.64.25.173) 19.01.50 # is it possible to write a playlist that specifies start end times within mp3 files that can be played in rockbox? 19.02.07 # No. 19.02.47 Join thomasjfox [0] (~thomasjfo@rockbox/developer/thomasjfox) 19.03.19 # Using a cue sheet wouldn't help? 19.03.41 # A cue sheet is for subtracks within a single file. It's a bit different than a playlist. 19.04.03 # can you refer to subtracks within a file from a playlist? 19.04.10 # No, as I said. 19.04.28 # This isn't defined within standard M3U as far as I know, and this is what we currently support. 19.04.42 # Torne: I've done some work allready. hifiman hm-601 initial port, which was commited by wodz. Do i need some permissions on git mirror to commit my work so everyone could see it? 19.04.53 # I suppose it could be done with a plugin using the playback controls API 19.05.04 Quit tmzt (Remote host closed the connection) 19.05.23 Join lorenzo92 [0] (~chatzilla@host198-168-dynamic.245-95-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) 19.07.23 Quit fyrestorm (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 19.10.19 Join saratoga [0] (98034408@gateway/web/freenode/ip.152.3.68.8) 19.16.36 Quit lorenzo92 (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 19.19.46 # mortalis: usually people doing a new port get svn invites pretty quickly 19.20.06 Quit linuxstb (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 19.27.14 Quit fs-bluebot (Quit: So long, and thanks for all the fish.) 19.28.39 Join ReimuHak_ [0] (~reimu@165.139.179.10) 19.29.25 Join fs-bluebot [0] (~fs-bluebo@g231120102.adsl.alicedsl.de) 19.31.46 Quit y4n (Quit: To those frustrated with their marginal existence, we transmit: your time is now.) 19.32.27 Join y4n [0] (y4n@unaffiliated/y4ndexx) 19.34.42 Join Horscht [0] (~Horscht@p57B578B4.dip.t-dialin.net) 19.34.42 Quit Horscht (Changing host) 19.34.42 Join Horscht [0] (~Horscht@xbmc/user/horscht) 19.36.57 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@94-193-103-239.zone7.bethere.co.uk) 19.36.58 Quit linuxstb (Changing host) 19.36.58 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 19.37.35 # * user890104 wonders why http://www.rockbox.org/since-release.html shows changes since 3.8 and not since the last release 19.38.48 # probably because nobody updated it :) 19.41.23 Quit linuxstb (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 19.42.53 Join chkktri [0] (chikakitaa@unaffiliated/chkktri) 19.43.15 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 19.45.23 Join T44 [0] (~Topy44@f048043151.adsl.alicedsl.de) 19.45.49 Join robin0800 [0] (~robin0800@149.254.61.232) 19.48.44 Join lorenzo92 [0] (~chatzilla@host46-172-dynamic.245-95-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) 19.49.03 Quit Topy (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 19.57.34 Quit robin0800 (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) 19.59.19 Join robin0800 [0] (~robin0800@149.254.61.232) 20.05.41 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 20.07.10 Quit robin0800 (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) 20.08.42 Join robin0800 [0] (~robin0800@149.254.61.232) 20.10.17 Quit matze` (Remote host closed the connection) 20.12.13 # kugel: no longer a bummer! 20.13.33 Join Buschel [0] (~chatzilla@p54A3A2C2.dip.t-dialin.net) 20.13.49 # mc2739: hmm; I also tried the mass-files trick (my dircache was ~3MB) 20.13.53 # without success 20.17.01 Join Buschel_ [0] (~chatzilla@p54A3A2C2.dip.t-dialin.net) 20.18.24 Quit Buschel (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 20.18.29 Nick Buschel_ is now known as Buschel (~chatzilla@p54A3A2C2.dip.t-dialin.net) 20.18.57 Quit robin0800 (Ping timeout: 252 seconds) 20.20.29 Quit Thra11 (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 20.20.29 Join robin0800 [0] (~robin0800@149.254.61.43) 20.23.19 Quit ReimuHak_ (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 20.25.11 # once I have the clip zip (and it has a rds capable fm tuner indeed) I can finally start to work on RDS support for real 20.25.58 # saratoga: Please remind me, what's this channel swap good for? 20.26.17 # it looks like a GPIO is used as interrupt to notify receipt of a new RDS packet 20.27.42 # I think I'll use a thread to read the RDS data over i2c and use the interrupt to wake up the thread 20.28.02 Quit Zambezi (Quit: Reconnecting) 20.28.12 Join Zambezi [0] (Zulu@80.67.9.2) 20.28.37 # * jhMikeS doesn't think "channel swap" should be a stereo mode at all, nor should it need to copy anything. 20.32.43 Join Thra11 [0] (~thrall@81.174.198.249) 20.33.00 # hmm? 20.33.50 Quit Zambezi (Changing host) 20.33.50 Join Zambezi [0] (Zulu@unaffiliated/zambezi) 20.34.06 # its' not really a stereo channel mode like karaoke but that's how the patch was implemented, as part of the stereo mode menu 20.34.26 # second, pointer swapping should be all that's needed, not swapping the channel data 20.34.56 Quit robin0800 (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 20.35.10 # (a) it's an additional option. (b) if we want it at all, on hwcodec the only way to implement it is to use the stereo matrix 20.35.32 # as for what it's good for, who knows. I suspect it's to get around some PCM driver bug on one target. 20.37.17 # If it's only that, I'd say it's silly to add such an option. Instead of that, the bug should be fixed 20.37.42 # amiconn: dfkt and linuxstb came up with it ages ago, i'm not sure what the use case was 20.37.52 # i don't think it was a device bug though 20.38.16 # "don't know what this ancient patch is for...let's commit and see!" 20.38.37 # was it? I remember it being suggested due to channel swap on newer ipods. I also recall dicussing it here briefly, but noone was exactly enthusiastic. 20.39.17 # well we have mono and karaoke modes, so channel reverse seems sensible enough 20.39.21 # the former was recent, the latter years ago 20.39.39 Quit benedikt93 (Quit: Bye ;)) 20.39.43 # FS#12355. One more HiFiMAN. Comments are welcome. 20.39.45 # http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/12355 3First patch for HiFiMAN HM-801 target (patches, unconfirmed) 20.39.49 # oh nice 20.40.04 # yeah, but channel swap can be applied along with the other modes 20.40.19 # which other modes would it make sense in? 20.40.58 # i guess the cross feed type mode? 20.41.34 # stereo, karaoke, custom 20.42.03 # I was thinking it should just be a separate step if it's to be there at all 20.42.43 # i guess the custom mode could be used in parallel with some of the others as well 20.42.47 # saratoga, the case for channel swap was that some in-ear phones are designed for use with the cables hanging down, which is uncomfortable, insecure, and adds cable noise. with channel swap one can reverse them and use them over the ear 20.43.11 # like radius ddm, jays q-jays, etc 20.43.22 # ah yes, i had a pair of sony headphones like that years ago 20.43.43 # jhMikeS, saratoga: Depending how the stereo mixing stage is implemented, adding channel swap should be easy 20.44.14 Quit kugel (Remote host closed the connection) 20.44.19 # i'm actually surprised it doesn't already 20.44.20 Join kugel [0] (~kugel@141.45.176.104) 20.44.20 Quit kugel (Changing host) 20.44.20 Join kugel [0] (~kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel) 20.44.39 # The MAS has a stereo matrix with 4 values, L -> L gain, R -> R gain, L -> R gain and R -> L gain 20.44.43 # a gain of 0 and a cross of 1 ought to flip the channels (although with substantially more overhead then pointer swapping) 20.44.53 # if the channel swap patch gets committed, i would think it would be better to put it above karaoke mode in the list menu, below the mono modes. karaoke is rather "special", while swap is more related to regular channel modes 20.44.55 # Channel swap means just swapping the straight gains with the cross gains 20.45.00 Quit mortalis (Quit: KVIrc 4.1.1 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/) 20.45.12 Join advcomp2019_ [0] (~advcomp20@97-114-233-50.sxcy.qwest.net) 20.45.13 Quit advcomp2019_ (Changing host) 20.45.13 Join advcomp2019_ [0] (~advcomp20@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 20.45.40 # dfkt: Making it a mode in that list doesn't make sense. It should be a separate option that can be used in conjunction with any of these modes 20.45.52 Join mortalis [0] (~4d6c62b0@www.haxx.se) 20.45.54 # amiconn: while I have your attention, another dsp related question: I'd like to add L/R volume balance to the DSP engine 20.46.03 # (technically it doesn't make sense for karaoke and pure mono though) 20.46.23 # right now its done in hardware, which has some drawbacks (e.g. RAAA) 20.46.39 # using it in conjunction with mono mode doesn't make much sense either, methinks? 20.46.41 # sort of does in karaoke since one channel is the inverse of the other 20.46.44 # i'm guessing this is because the dsp code evolved from hwcodec? 20.47.38 # why add volume balance to the DSP engine 20.47.40 # ? 20.48.44 # so that it works on devices that can't do it in hardware (e.g. RAAA, various line out ports, etc) 20.49.04 Quit advcomp2019 (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 20.49.08 # ahh, nvm. it'd be better done in the pcm driver (as well as sw volume control) 20.49.27 # also i kind of dislike doing it in hardware in general just because it means that on some devices you'll get different outputs between the line out and headphone jack which is kind of confusing 20.49.39 # yeah, balance on RaaA would be awesome... my ears are imbalanced, and i have to use a bridged inline volume control to get balanced sound 20.49.40 # Why can't raaa do it in hardware? It's just outside rockbox... 20.49.43 # right now its kind of random weather or not balance will actually do anything depending on which device and output you're using 20.50.33 # * amiconn actually prefers using the hardware controls over software where possible 20.51.07 # yeah thats what i was going to ask you, whats your preferred way to handle this on devices like the X5 where the headphone jack does balance but the line out jack does not 20.51.44 # i'm leaning towards just doing software on devices where not all outputs can handle it in hardware so that output is consistent 20.52.33 # Well line out is line out - it shouldn't be affected by any of the sound controls imo 20.53.08 # it shouldn't be affected by volume adjustments, but balance is something else 20.53.28 # you might reasonably have a stereo where you need more power on one side of the room then the other 20.53.50 # just as you might want more power at lower frequencies, etc 20.54.02 # Line shouldn't be affected by balance, tone controls, volume, anything 20.54.24 # and EQ? 20.54.45 # Same (not possible with sw eq, unfortunately) 20.55.04 # could you explain that point of view to me? 20.55.13 # Line out is for connecting better equipment. If you feed the signal to an amp for listening in a large room and you need to adjust balance, you should do so using the amp controls 20.55.22 # Same for tone etc 20.55.50 # The controls on the device are for listening using the built-in amplifier 20.56.19 # its relatively unlikely that built in controls are any better though for a great many of these things 20.56.25 # if they are even available 20.56.43 # e.g. how many speaker docks have a parametric eq? 20.57.05 # If the amp doesn't have its own control, it should be connected to headphone out instead of line out 20.57.11 # *controls 20.57.43 # but line out makes more sense since it won't be affected by volume control 21.00.04 # basically on these devices line out is just headphone out with fixed volume (and sometimes a dock connector) and higher impedance so its not clear to me why we should be telling users which one they should be using for a given task, imo we should try and make them work the same and let each user pick the right one for a job 21.01.42 # If line out doesn't respond to volume controls but other sound controls, that's inconsistent 21.02.02 # its consistent with what a line out is supposed to do 21.02.16 # nope 21.02.18 # its supposed to be an output with fixed level and impedance 21.02.24 # nothing more, nothing less 21.02.33 # A line out should supply a linear signal response 21.02.45 # so should all outputs 21.02.55 # no 21.02.59 # a nonlinear response would be useless in audio 21.03.26 # Tone controls aren't linear 21.03.34 Quit mortalis (Quit: CGI:IRC) 21.03.36 Quit Buschel (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 7.0.1/20110928134238]) 21.03.55 # technically frequency adjustmnet is linear, but i suspect thats not what you're trying to tell me 21.04.25 Quit thomasjfox (Remote host closed the connection) 21.04.50 # Imo the rule is simple. If one person listens using the built-in headphone output and (an)other person(s) listens using an amplifier connected to line out. Person #1 adjusting tone/ volume/ balance shouldn't affect the others 21.04.53 # basically you're saying that line out should disable as much of the effects as possible rather then expect the user to pick the correct settings himself? 21.05.40 # while i can see how that would be useful in some cases, I don't think thats a good idea in general 21.06.33 # That's how any line out is supposed to work, otherwise it should not be called line out 21.06.42 # i also disagree that theres any expectation that a line out will somehow have less processing then a headphone out (or any other output) 21.10.03 # What if person #2 is not actually a person, but e.g. a recording device? Okay, analog recording is probably not used often these days, but sometimes it still is... 21.10.32 # The same reasoning applies to digital outputs, btw 21.13.30 # I'm not saying that an adjustable output doesn't make sense, but it should not be limited to this mode, because it reduces versatility 21.13.53 # Also if it's called line out it should not default to adjustable mode 21.16.00 # as far as i know, mp3 player manufacturers use the line-out definition rather loosely anyways. i don#t know of any device that puts out -10dbV or 0.3 VRMS 21.18.24 # amiconn: if an analog device is hooked up I expect it to record what I hear, transmitted at the correct level and impedance 21.18.50 # i don't think line output typically work in the way you seem to imply they should 21.26.31 Join fdm [0] (~moser@67-198-30-111.dyn.grandenetworks.net) 21.27.10 Quit linuxstb (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) 21.28.15 # Nearly all lineouts I dealt with so far do work that way 21.29.34 Join Strife89 [0] (~Strife89@207.144.201.128) 21.30.38 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 21.36.41 Join robin0800 [0] (~robin0800@149.254.61.208) 21.44.09 Quit linuxstb (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 21.45.28 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@94-193-103-239.zone7.bethere.co.uk) 21.45.30 Quit linuxstb (Changing host) 21.45.30 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 21.48.48 # amiconn: which devices are you thinking of? 21.50.16 Quit Jerom (Quit: Leaving.) 21.56.14 Quit Thra11 (Quit: kthxbai) 21.59.10 Quit linuxstb (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 22.00.15 Quit saratoga (Quit: Page closed) 22.02.12 Join AlexP [0] (~alex@rockbox/staff/AlexP) 22.04.05 Join webguest15 [0] (~5b1535e9@www.haxx.se) 22.05.10 # Will the new <8and temporarily reverted) swap channels feature allow to change the deepness? I.e. combine "custom" and "swap"? 22.05.45 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 22.07.16 Join Horschti [0] (~Horscht@xbmc/user/horscht) 22.07.50 # * jhMikeS was arguing in that direction that it should and be a separate setting if anything 22.08.24 Quit y4n (Quit: HOLY SHIT! WE'RE ALL JUST LIVING ON A GINORMOUS FUCKING SPINNING ROCK FLOATING THROUGH SPACE CIRCLING A BIG FUCKING BALL OF FIRE!!!) 22.10.59 Quit Horscht (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 22.19.41 Quit Kuitsi (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 22.23.52 Quit mystica555 (Remote host closed the connection) 22.24.22 Quit dfkt (Quit: -= SysReset 2.55=- Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc.) 22.27.06 Join Kuitsi [0] (~Kuitsi@a88-113-118-171.elisa-laajakaista.fi) 22.27.34 Join Darko [0] (5fb434a9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.95.180.52.169) 22.27.41 # Hi 22.27.54 # can someone help me how to start new Wiki page? 22.28.09 Quit webguest15 (Quit: CGI:IRC) 22.28.28 Join wodz [0] (~wodz@87-206-240-131.dynamic.chello.pl) 22.29.01 # jhMikeS: Is it correct that playback is always 44.1kHz and anything else is resampled? 22.29.40 # I want to create page that branches from this section 22.29.42 # http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/Main/SansaAMS#Unbricking 22.30.38 # Darko: you start new wiki page by entering correct wiki address which does not exist yet 22.31.08 # ok thanks 22.36.31 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@94-193-103-239.zone7.bethere.co.uk) 22.36.32 Quit linuxstb (Changing host) 22.36.32 Join linuxstb [0] (~linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 22.43.08 Join ReimuHak_ [0] (~reimu@wireless.sit-co.net) 22.52.31 # alright, the core page has been created with some basic editing, still needs formating of pictures and url's 22.52.32 # http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/SansaClipV2UnbrickingTutorial 22.53.47 Quit TheLemonMan (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6) 22.54.38 Quit ReimuHak_ (Quit: Leaving...) 22.54.56 Join ReimuHak_ [0] (~reimu@wireless.sit-co.net) 22.57.47 Quit robin0800 (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 23.03.20 Quit lorenzo92 (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.87 [Firefox 7.0.1/20111008085652]) 23.04.08 Join dhrasmus [0] (~dhrasmus@173-21-232-221.client.mchsi.com) 23.06.03 Quit Strife89 (Remote host closed the connection) 23.06.58 Join robin0800 [0] (~robin0800@149.254.61.208) 23.09.14 Quit domonoky (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 23.10.11 Join MethoS- [0] (~clemens@134.102.106.250) 23.17.55 Quit [Saint_] (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 23.24.52 Join z180 [0] (~chatzilla@ip-109-42-124-59.web.vodafone.de) 23.29.56 Quit ender` (Quit: /* Return code=1: generic error condition, Return code=2: all other error conditions */) 23.34.16 Quit bertrik (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 23.45.55 Quit Darko (Quit: Page closed) 23.48.49 Quit Llorean (Read error: Connection reset by peer)