--- Log for 26.07.114 Server: morgan.freenode.net Channel: #rockbox --- Nick: logbot Version: Dancer V4.16 Started: 1 month and 8 days ago 00.39.07 Quit benedikt93 (Quit: Bye ;)) 00.48.26 Quit ZincAlloy (Quit: Leaving.) 00.54.32 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 01.00.58 Quit alucryd (Quit: alucryd out) 01.01.17 Quit bertrik (Quit: leaving) 01.05.08 Join alucryd [0] (~alucryd@archlinux/trusteduser/alucryd) 01.07.45 Quit SolarAquarion (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 01.22.28 Join KiwiCAM_ [0] (~quassel@121-99-191-123.bng1.nct.orcon.net.nz) 01.22.44 Quit amiconn (Disconnected by services) 01.22.45 Join amiconn_ [0] (quassel@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 01.22.49 Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (quassel@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 01.23.23 Join bluebrother [0] (~dom@rockbox/developer/bluebrother) 01.23.29 Join soap_ [0] (~soap@cpe-174-102-103-175.woh.res.rr.com) 01.23.30 Quit soap_ (Changing host) 01.23.30 Join soap_ [0] (~soap@rockbox/staff/soap) 01.24.30 Join Naked_ [0] (~naked@naked.iki.fi) 01.24.31 Join shuffleb1t [0] (~ec2-user@ec2-54-198-117-181.compute-1.amazonaws.com) 01.24.45 Join uwe_mobile__ [0] (~uwe@static.88-198-8-117.clients.your-server.de) 01.24.46 Join Marex_ [0] (~Marex@195.140.253.167) 01.25.40 Quit pixelma (Disconnected by services) 01.25.40 Join pixelma_ [0] (quassel@rockbox/staff/pixelma) 01.25.43 Nick pixelma_ is now known as pixelma (quassel@rockbox/staff/pixelma) 01.28.37 Join AKBlindy_ [0] (~jticket@jt-lx.info) 01.29.27 Quit bluebrother^ (*.net *.split) 01.29.27 Quit Naked (*.net *.split) 01.29.27 Quit Pessimist (*.net *.split) 01.29.27 Quit AKBlindy (*.net *.split) 01.29.28 Quit kiwicam (*.net *.split) 01.29.28 Quit Marex (*.net *.split) 01.29.28 Quit shufflebot (*.net *.split) 01.29.28 Quit soap (*.net *.split) 01.29.28 Quit uwe_mobile (*.net *.split) 01.29.28 Quit ps-auxw (*.net *.split) 01.31.28 Join ps-auxw [0] (~arneb@2001:470:c807:0:1532:4e5f:2ad3:4123) 01.36.21 Quit Scall (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 01.44.49 Join Scall [0] (~chat@unaffiliated/scall) 02.07.20 Join ender` [0] (krneki@2a01:260:4094:1:42:42:42:42) 02.08.51 Quit ender| (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 02.54.36 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 03.00.00 Quit AlexP (Remote host closed the connection) 03.14.19 Quit bp0 (Quit: Leaving) 03.15.20 Quit ender` (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 03.15.23 Join ender^ [0] (krneki@2a01:260:4094:1:42:42:42:42) 03.16.17 Join TD-Linux [0] (~Thomas@about/essy/indecisive/TD-Linux) 03.16.31 # hello, I have a sansa clip+ that had rockbox firmware on it previously 03.16.46 # it appears as a block device but I can't seem to read anything off it 03.17.06 # the sansa firmware tells me that there is 90MB of space left and can't get past refreshing media 03.17.31 Quit WakiMiko (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 03.17.57 Join WakiMiko [0] (~WakiMiko@unaffiliated/wakimiko) 03.21.58 # anything to do before I try unbricking? 03.24.27 Join Strife89 [0] (~Strife89@adsl-98-80-212-179.mcn.bellsouth.net) 03.53.16 Join ygrek [0] (~user@108.59.6.97) 03.55.52 Quit lebellium (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 31.0/20140716183446]) 03.57.12 Quit Strife89 (Remote host closed the connection) 04.00.17 Quit jhMikeS (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 04.10.07 Quit amiconn (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 04.10.35 Quit pixelma (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 04.13.01 Join amiconn [0] (amiconn@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 04.13.01 Join pixelma [0] (pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) 04.52.44 Join cmhobbs [0] (~cmhobbs@fsf/member/cmhobbs) 04.54.39 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 05.01.36 Join test [0] (79363625@gateway/web/freenode/session) 05.09.33 Quit test (Quit: Page closed) 05.12.05 Join Raptors [0] (~Raptors@216-58-33-198.cpe.distributel.net) 05.12.24 # preglow, I think you're the fuze+ dev right? 05.12.36 # I'm kind of stuck 05.12.56 # My battery is too low to boot so I can't get it to boot to the OS 05.13.10 # when I plug it in, it goes to usb mode which doesn't seem to charge 05.32.30 Quit steffengy (Disconnected by services) 05.32.32 Join steffengy1 [0] (~quassel@p5088FB75.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) 05.49.45 # <[Saint]> Raptors: AFAIK, it _should_ charge over USB/bootloader USB 05.50.11 # <[Saint]> If it is deep discharged, it may take a while to register a charge. 05.50.18 # [Saint], it doesn't. I figured it out through google though. You have to press down while it's powering up 05.50.27 # and it goes to original firmware charging 05.50.45 # so plug it in and press volume down really fast 05.50.53 # it wont work if you try to charge it through comp 05.51.00 # you need a power plug 05.51.11 # <[Saint]> Hmmm...it can definitely charge over USB in Rockbox, I thought it could via bootloader USB too...hmmm. 05.52.17 # <[Saint]> Blindly reading the config tells me this should work. 05.52.23 # <[Saint]> Odd. 06.26.00 Join advcomp2019 [0] (~advcomp20@unaffiliated/advcomp2019) 06.27.33 Quit advcomp2019_ (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 06.54.43 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 07.19.46 Quit Provel (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 07.38.09 Join pamaury [0] (~quassel@rockbox/developer/pamaury) 07.52.46 Quit ygrek (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 08.01.08 Join AlexP [0] (~alex@rockbox/staff/AlexP) 08.31.38 Join bp0 [0] (~bp@216.254.236.232) 08.31.38 Quit bp0 (Changing host) 08.31.38 Join bp0 [0] (~bp@unaffiliated/bp0) 08.36.53 Quit pamaury (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 08.40.46 Join jhMikeS [0] (~jethead71@c-68-43-2-35.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) 08.40.46 Quit jhMikeS (Changing host) 08.40.46 Join jhMikeS [0] (~jethead71@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS) 08.54.45 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 08.55.33 Quit Raptors (Quit: Leaving) 09.22.09 Join Provel [0] (Provel@75-132-0-140.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com) 09.22.09 Join Pessimist [0] (Elite8188@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-kkedrllhzwofvkhb) 09.22.30 Quit Pessimist (Changing host) 09.22.30 Join Pessimist [0] (Elite8188@unaffiliated/pessimist) 09.29.39 Quit Pessimist (Changing host) 09.29.40 Join Pessimist [0] (Elite8188@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-kkedrllhzwofvkhb) 09.40.25 # [Saint]: yes it can 09.40.29 # bootloader v2 though 09.41.07 # or whatever is the last version 09.44.06 # it even displays it's charging status 09.44.17 # but I definitely had to update the bootloader 09.44.28 # its* 09.57.44 Join ender` [0] (krneki@foo.eternallybored.org) 10.54.46 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 11.25.58 Join ygrek [0] (~user@108.59.6.97) 11.26.08 Join piknockyou [0] (4d149e31@gateway/web/freenode/ip.77.20.158.49) 11.28.35 # hi there, does rockbox delete the default operating system of the clip+? 11.42.41 # no 11.42.48 # and you can dual boot, check the manual 11.46.27 Join bertrik [0] (~bertrik@dhcp-089-098-143-039.chello.nl) 11.46.27 Quit bertrik (Changing host) 11.46.27 Join bertrik [0] (~bertrik@rockbox/developer/bertrik) 12.00.37 # I formatted my 64 gb microsdxc for clip+ to FAT32, Sandisk OS recognizes it which is good, but I read it limits of around 8,000 songs, does anyone know if this really means songs or any data? le't say cover art count in, do you think so? 12.01.02 # *counts 12.01.59 # and do they mean just the database? if yes, I wouldn't care since I am only using folder navigation 12.08.03 Quit bertrik (Remote host closed the connection) 12.26.55 # Hi there, what does the limit really of the sandisk OS stand for? Is it like songs in the library? any single piece of data in the library? I was wondering, because I wouldn't care about library limits since I am using folder navigation. Would the clip+ also limt the "titles" in the folder navigation? Why should it? Thanks. 12.31.36 # piknockyou: why are you asking in #rockbox about a firmware that Rockbox is designed to replace? 12.31.47 # ask on the Sansa forums 12.32.04 # SanDisk* 12.34.30 # cause I can't get rockbox installed. may I ask you to help me? It says no mountpoint given. 12.34.46 # But it is mounted clearly as a device. 12.35.28 # And when I press auto-detect, Rockbox fails, doesn't work anymore and needs to be closed. 12.36.42 # If I open rockbox, it says "Your configuration is invalid. This is most likely due to a change of device path. ..." 12.49.11 Join pamaury [0] (~quassel@rockbox/developer/pamaury) 12.54.48 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 12.54.53 # i try manually, where do I get this stuff "Create a folder called “rbinstall” on your desktop, and then extract the OF, the bootloader and mkamsboot into it." 12.54.56 # ? 13.05.59 # piknockyou: click on the Change button 13.06.15 # there, you can manually set boht the device, and the mount point 13.06.31 # there, click on "Refresh" if need be 13.06.49 # all the while, making sure your Clip+ is actually mounted where you think it's mounted 13.07.14 # also, note that the Clip+ presents TWO drives: one for the Clip+ itself, and another one for the sd card reader 13.09.05 # stay with me, please. doesn't work. 13.09.24 # I chose the device but there is no mount point, the line is empty white. 13.09.32 # i can not chose a mount point at all. 13.09.49 # no change by refreshing. 13.10.22 # no mountpoint given. 13.10.32 # can you upload a screenshot please? http://imgur.com/ 13.10.57 # dou you want teamviewer? 13.12.10 # what? 13.12.47 # http://www.teamviewer.com/en/ 13.12.54 # controlling my computer 13.13.08 # no 13.13.25 # okay, what screenshot do you exactly need? 13.13.44 # <[Saint]> copper: aha! thankyou. 13.13.50 # guys 13.13.59 # I can't change the mountpoint in the RB utility either 13.14.09 # <[Saint]> I didn't think to look at the past history of changes, I just looked at the code and saw that it /should/ work. 13.14.11 # it's stuck on '/media/clip' no matter what I do 13.14.22 # <[Saint]> I don't actually have the hardware laying around. 13.15.07 # http://imgur.com/mn1wUrT 13.15.10 # "Select your device in the filesystem" is a dropdown menu containing only that one entry, and it cannot be edited 13.15.52 # <[Saint]> Is the device in MSC or MTP mode? 13.16.03 # <[Saint]> IIUC, autodetect failing here implies the former. 13.16.47 # piknockyou: click on the dropdown meny 13.16.48 # menu 13.17.20 # what is the dropdown menu? 13.17.43 # the bar to the left of the refresh button 13.17.45 # opkay, and then? 13.18.00 # what does it display? 13.18.07 # it is empty 13.18.13 # ok 13.18.18 # but you can see on the screenshot there is a device mounted 13.18.27 # boot the original firmware and set the Clip+ to MSC 13.18.35 # [13:09] I chose the device but there is no mount point, the line is empty white. 13.19.32 # how to do this? where to do this? 13.19.44 # you mean taking the device and starting it up? 13.20.42 # and thenI am at it 13.21.00 # got it 13.21.11 # "working on it" 13.21.35 # * [Saint] notes that the manual covers this 13.21.40 # <[Saint]> http://download.rockbox.org/daily/manual/rockbox-sansaclipplus.pdf 13.21.50 # <[Saint]> "2.1. Before Starting" 13.24.20 # (my problem was that nothing was mounted on my system) 13.24.21 # you are right, sorry about that, I have overseen that, but I am actually using the manual. :-/ 13.24.35 # what is the most detailed theme in terms of ? 13.24.44 # information 13.25.20 Join ygrek_ [0] (~user@108.59.6.97) 13.25.25 # see for yourself 13.25.31 # on themes.rockbox.org 13.26.32 Quit ygrek (Remote host closed the connection) 13.28.34 # thank you so much so far 13.39.51 Quit piknockyou (Quit: Page closed) 13.47.23 Join ZincAlloy [0] (~Adium@pD9EEA446.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) 13.56.13 Join kugel [0] (~kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel) 14.49.18 Join benedikt93 [0] (~benedikt9@frbg-4d028526.pool.mediaWays.net) 14.49.26 Quit benedikt93 (Changing host) 14.49.26 Join benedikt93 [0] (~benedikt9@unaffiliated/benedikt93) 14.54.50 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 15.01.38 Join stripwax [0] (~Miranda@rockbox/developer/stripwax) 15.02.19 Quit kugel (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 15.03.26 Quit stripwax (Client Quit) 15.25.51 Join f[x] [0] (~user@108.59.6.97) 15.28.53 Quit ygrek_ (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 15.43.42 Join b0hoon [0] (~quassel@public-gprs473765.centertel.pl) 15.47.01 # Build Server message: 3New build round started. Revision 6bbfb35, 253 builds, 28 clients. 15.53.09 # Build Server message: 3Build round completed after 369 seconds. 15.54.06 # pamaury: any news about the Sansa View? 15.54.56 Join kugel [0] (~kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel) 15.57.25 Join RiD [0] (~RiD@2.83.0.55) 16.12.07 # b0hoon: not really, I have been very very busy recently, but I'll throw some work at it today and tomorrow 16.13.25 # pamaury: that's great. 16.15.43 Part b0hoon ("GTG... Bye.") 16.21.43 Quit kugel (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 16.30.49 Join y4n [0] (~y4n@unaffiliated/y4ndexx) 16.53.32 Quit cmhobbs (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 16.54.53 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 17.18.38 Join bertrik [0] (~bertrik@dhcp-089-098-143-039.chello.nl) 17.18.38 Quit bertrik (Changing host) 17.18.38 Join bertrik [0] (~bertrik@rockbox/developer/bertrik) 17.30.12 Join ygrek_ [0] (~user@108.59.6.97) 17.32.49 Quit f[x] (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 17.46.01 Join japc [0] (~japc@bl16-10-41.dsl.telepac.pt) 17.48.21 Quit japc (Client Quit) 17.51.08 Join HeadWhacker [0] (84934c34@gateway/web/freenode/ip.132.147.76.52) 17.52.22 # Hi, I have Rockbox completely running on iBasso DX90. Using the same sources from DX50 17.52.52 # Now there is a small problem 17.54.38 # When quickly skipping tracks by pressing the fwd or prev button, there is a soft cracling noise at at the beginning of the track that last between 2 to 5 seconds 17.55.48 # it's quite random and if I hear the noise on a track I just rewind to the beginning and the noise is not there 17.56.21 # anyone has any idea where this noise is coming from? 17.58.15 Quit bertrik (Remote host closed the connection) 18.09.58 Join notben [0] (~ben@99-122-84-33.lightspeed.spfdmo.sbcglobal.net) 18.09.58 Part notben 18.24.01 Quit RiD (Quit: A good plan today is better than a perfect plan tomorrow.) 18.32.21 Quit pamaury (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 18.35.17 Join RiD [0] (~RiD@bl22-0-55.dsl.telepac.pt) 18.51.14 Join sakax [0] (~sakax@unaffiliated/sakax) 18.54.54 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 19.08.55 Quit ygrek_ (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 19.17.35 Join ulmutul [0] (~chatzilla@wprt-5d835ae0.pool.mediaWays.net) 19.30.16 Join zoktar [0] (~zoktar@unaffiliated/zoktar) 19.31.27 Join ygrek [0] (~user@108.59.6.97) 19.35.02 Quit bluebrother (Disconnected by services) 19.35.07 Join bluebrother [0] (~dom@rockbox/developer/bluebrother) 19.36.33 # b0hoon: ping 19.37.23 Quit fs-bluebot (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 19.40.37 Join fs-bluebot [0] (~fs-bluebo@g231123020.adsl.alicedsl.de) 19.47.18 Join cmhobbs [0] (~cmhobbs@fsf/member/cmhobbs) 19.49.44 Join benedikt93_ [0] (~benedikt9@frbg-5f731148.pool.mediaWays.net) 19.53.21 Quit benedikt93 (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 20.06.29 Join b0hoon [0] (~quassel@public-gprs444182.centertel.pl) 20.06.51 # ulmutul: pong 20.08.06 # I've tested the latest battery monitoring patch. The results are here: http://imgur.com/7SBjsKO,Vt0Tera#1 20.09.09 # ulmutul: so? 20.09.17 # Strange to say that the voltages of the two devices are quiet different. 20.12.08 # ulmutul: ah, ok - two pictures 20.12.59 Quit RiD (Quit: A good plan today is better than a perfect plan tomorrow.) 20.13.04 # The old ones are here: http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=1730d0-1405177222.jpg and http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=5ab675-1405177258.jpg 20.13.15 # ulmutul: maybe just different baterriesin different stages of wear 20.14.26 Join saratoga [0] (123e1c18@gateway/web/freenode/ip.18.62.28.24) 20.14.48 # ulmutul: i don't have an idea, OF has one way of calculate the level 20.15.05 # kugel: (for the logs) this might be interesting to you http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=48058.msg228993;topicseen#msg228993 20.15.46 # And the voltage code hasn't changed since the last test. So maybe different loading state or temperature or something. 20.17.28 # ulmutul: aaa, one thing i didn't change the values for charging so the chart maybe be like this 20.18.09 # All battery benches are made discharging. 20.18.54 # ulmutul: right, i don't know then 20.19.24 # Charging values are problematic anyway, because full voltage is reached very early. 20.19.58 # yes, it's for all Portal Player based players 20.20.23 # well, i would like to commit this patch anyway 20.20.48 # and work on The mystery of RTC for YH820 20.21.50 # Yes, definitively. 20.22.39 # I think I'll go in for the keymaps. 20.22.45 # ulmutul: can you make some pictures of the mainboard for v2.0? as close as possible? 20.23.30 # Yes, already made some :) I thought about uploading them to the wiki. 20.23.41 # ulmutul: i see that for version 1.7 CLKOE is connected somwhere 20.23.50 # of RTC 20.24.02 # and on the schematic is not 20.24.25 # great 20.25.35 Quit cmhobbs (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 20.30.43 # b0hoon: here's the interesting part: http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=4d737a-1406399368.jpg 20.33.15 # connected too, looks the same :S 20.34.10 # it will be hard to find the bug... 20.35.47 Join kugel [0] (~kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel) 20.39.02 # ulmutul: anyway, thanks if you could add the pictures on the Wiki it would be great. 20.41.59 Quit benedikt93_ (Quit: Bye ;)) 20.42.28 Join benedikt93 [0] (~benedikt9@unaffiliated/benedikt93) 20.48.57 Quit HeadWhacker (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 20.54.58 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 20.57.45 Join cmhobbs [0] (~cmhobbs@fsf/member/cmhobbs) 21.00.02 Quit krnlyng (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 21.04.50 Quit benedikt93 (Quit: Bye ;)) 21.17.32 Join TheSeven [0] (~quassel@rockbox/developer/TheSeven) 21.20.38 # how does the USB/charging detection code work these days? 21.20.42 # IIRC the samsung ipods are using some deprecated way of handling that 21.20.49 # and as I need to change some of that code anyway, I'd rather do it right from the beginning 21.23.16 Join Rower [0] (~husvagn@h176n2-aeg-a11.ias.bredband.telia.com) 21.24.36 Join krnlyng [0] (~liar@83.175.90.24) 21.26.06 Quit ygrek (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 21.26.14 # TheSeven: IIRC basically you want to define USB_DETECT_BY_REQUEST 21.26.47 # And I have *no* idea why it was problematic on the new ipods 21.27.02 # what does that change? 21.27.08 # http://gerrit.rockbox.org/r/#/c/317/ 21.27.56 # It sets "host present" when an actual USB transfer has been seen (i.e. the first get_descriptor usually) instead of when an insert is detected 21.28.43 # so this is something that shouldn't require any further changes... 21.29.10 # With any luck :) 21.29.10 Quit sakax (Quit: Leaving) 21.29.35 # what exactly are the consequences of "host present" being set? IIUC that should only affect charging, mass storage, etc., but not the lowlevel USB driver? 21.29.51 # are we doing anything fancy such as re-enumerating with a different set of descriptor based on what we have seen? 21.30.08 # It will change the exact time when usb_core_enable_driver() is called, which might expose bugs I guess 21.30.33 # what does that function do? 21.30.47 # does it call any usb_drv_*? 21.31.02 # * gevaerts checks 21.32.04 # I've found this weird thing in the s3c6400x driver: 21.32.04 # void usb_attach(void) { usb_enable(true); // s5l only ? /* Nothing to do */ } 21.32.17 # and I have no idea why it's there, usb_enable doesn't seem to do anything useful 21.32.29 # maybe that might be related somehow? 21.32.44 # Looking at the code, I don't think usb_drv_* will see anything different 21.32.48 # * gevaerts checks the usb_enable thing 21.32.53 # anyway, I'll revisit that with the new USB driver 21.33.39 # is it a known issue that rapid reconnections of the USB port will crash with various kinds of errors? (OOM panics, hangs, ...)? 21.36.42 # Hmmm 21.37.03 # I don't remember specific issues, but I wouldn't be surprised 21.40.44 # we have a slightly tricky situation on the classic with charging state detection... 21.40.44 # as far as I know, we have these GPIOs: 21.40.44 # b4: IN not charging (no external power or fully charged) 21.40.44 DBUG Enqueued KICK TheSeven 21.40.44 # b5: IN discharging (can go high during disk activity even with external power present) 21.40.44 # b6: OUT enable fast charging (500mA instead of 100mA) 21.40.45 *** Alert Mode level 1 21.40.45 # b7: OUT disable charging altogether 21.40.48 # c3: USB Vbus present 21.40.50 # when I say "external power" above, I mean "at least one of USB or firewire" 21.40.52 # there are also separate GPIOs for "USB power present" and "firewire power present" in the PMU, but we can't access those safely from IRQ mode (e.g. tick tasks) due to the I2C mutex 21.41.32 # our rather cautious handling of GPIO b6 currently breaks firewire charging 21.42.47 # do you think it's adequate to assert POWER_INPUT_MAIN_CHARGER for both USB and firewire (USB is kind of the main charging method), or should I use the dedicated USB power state for that? 21.43.18 # and how should situations where external power is present but the battery is discharging regardless be handled? 21.43.40 # to make matters even worse, I think charging and discharging can both be true at the same time 21.44.07 # (charging is more of a "wants to charge, and has external power, but current limiting might not actually allow charging") 21.44.07 Ctcp Ignored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood 21.44.07 # * gevaerts isn't sure 21.44.22 # I've never done actual charging code... 21.46.18 # who did rework charging a while ago? was that Torne? 21.46.25 # Yes 21.46.32 # I think 21.50.46 *** Alert Mode OFF 22.09.41 Quit kugel (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 22.11.39 Join krabador [0] (~krabador@unaffiliated/krabador) 22.19.26 Join Gallomimia [0] (~gallomimi@S0106c8fb267813e0.ca.shawcable.net) 22.19.39 # Hello, can somebody give me write permission for the wiki? My username is "SebastianLeonhardt" 22.22.40 Join franklin [0] (47474769@gateway/web/freenode/ip.71.71.71.105) 22.25.18 # Does adding password protection to DAPs go against open-source priniciples? Is there a need/demand for it? 22.26.58 # franklin: why would that go against open source principles? 22.27.47 # gevaerts: I have suggested a lock-out feature here: http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php/topic,48411.0.html 22.27.52 # ulmutul: if I didn't do anything wrong, you should have write access now 22.28.02 # Thank you! 22.29.50 # franklin: for the record, my laptop runs entirely on open source software, and it asks me for a password before I can do anything with it :) 22.29.59 # gevaerts: is a lock-out feature wrong? I imagine many people would forget the password and brick their players without saving the unlock key to their computers first. 22.30.26 # gevaerts: is an iOS-like lock-out feature wrong, I mean 22.30.35 # The user would control this 22.31.09 # So I don't see any philosophical issue with this 22.31.35 # gevaerts: I just feel bad writing this code. I'm just not sure why. Maybe it smells to much like Apple 22.31.59 # Apple didn't invent security 22.32.27 # gevaerts: do you understand their passcode lock feature? 22.32.27 # Still, this sort of thing means disabling dualboot and recovery modes 22.32.36 # gevaerts: that's why 22.32.53 # * gevaerts is confused 22.32.57 # that's why what? 22.33.09 # gevaerts: this sort of thing means disabling dualboot and recovery modes 22.33.59 # The possible problem with disabling all of that is that you basically have no means of recovery left if things go wrong 22.34.10 # And things *do* go wrong 22.34.28 # gevaerts: and it would be very hard without bricking a player or two :D 22.34.58 # Not really. You don't disable dualboot until you get everything else working 22.35.37 # But then of course I'd just grab your device and take the hard drive out to see what's on there :) 22.35.57 # gevaerts: but for targets with separate bootloaders (ipod6g), it could be bypassed easily by wiping the HDD from emCORE 22.36.13 # When would you wipe? 22.36.25 # To reset the password lock 22.36.58 # Yes, but I'd just take the disk out and use some usb/ata adapter to read it. I wouldn't reset the lock 22.38.08 # franklin: what are you trying to achieve in the first place? 22.38.13 # data security? theft prevention? 22.38.22 # TheSeven: theft prevention 22.38.36 # so you need to make it unrecoverable 22.38.45 # Well, not really 22.38.58 # gevaerts: the reason iOS passcode is so secure is that you *CAN'T* reset it, no matter what you do. In other words, it's a walled garden, completely against open-source principles 22.39.02 # By the time the thief sees he has an unusable device, you've lost the device anyway 22.39.10 # gevaerts: Hm, I can't edit and I don't find myself in the WikiUsersGroup ... 22.39.27 # franklin: security is *not* against open source principles *at all* 22.39.38 # gevaerts: but making walled gardens is 22.40.00 # franklin: yes, how is a walled garden involved in this discussion? 22.40.34 # gevaerts: to achieve security, it must be impossible or very hard to access the filesystem while waiting for a password 22.40.41 # Yes 22.41.01 # gevaerts: just smells bad to me 22.41.32 # franklin: please tell me your email account details 22.41.42 # If you don't, that must mean you're against open source 22.41.49 # Or isn't that what you're saying? 22.42.18 # ulmutul: that's weird. As far as I can see, you're on there 22.42.45 # Hm, ok, I'll try again. 22.43.28 # OK, it works now, thanks. 22.43.35 # Good :) 22.43.36 # * TheSeven probably just fixed it 22.44.32 # for some reason it looks like the contents of the page is getting ignored these days 22.45.20 # gevaerts: just to confirm, you just edited him into the WikiUsersGroup page's text content, right? 22.45.29 # Yes 22.45.38 # that doesn't seem to be in sync with the actual group at all 22.45.41 # gevaerts: what email? 22.45.59 # the actual group is listed below, and there's an "administration" section at the very bottom of the page 22.46.10 # franklin: you mean you don't want to give me your email password? 22.46.25 # Why not? 22.46.28 # adding him using that seems to have worked, despite just showing a page with the text "Attention" and nothing else... 22.46.32 # this wiki is just weird ,) 22.46.33 # ;)* 22.46.35 # gevaerts: it's my password! :; 22.46.37 # ;) 22.46.58 # franklin: yes, so how is that different from a password on a device? 22.47.08 # franklin: are you planning to do this for ipod classics specifically? 22.47.19 # TheSeven: no 22.47.33 # because there is definitely no way to lock these things down 22.47.39 # gevaerts: the password for webmail is always on, and it is stored on a remote server 22.47.45 # Encryption and password protection is definitely not against open source principles. Linux, FreeBSD and other open source operating systems implement both. 22.47.47 # (otherwise we wouldn't have been able to run rockbox on them in the first place) 22.48.41 # the-kyle: DAPs are different from computers in that it is very easy to read/modify the hard drive. 22.49.06 # well I wouldn't store that kind of information on the hard drive in the first place 22.49.23 # the lock would typically have to be implemented inside the bootloader flash 22.49.31 # TheSeven: how does iOS do it? 22.49.38 # Well that and disk encryption would be rather hard to implement on a low-end device I would think. 22.49.45 # iOS doesn't have easily removable storage 22.50.10 # TheSeven: you're right (and it you can't read the disk easily, you mean?) 22.50.10 # the-kyle: at least on ipod classic and ipod nano2g it would actually be easy and fast 22.50.21 # TheSeven: why? modify emcore? 22.50.33 # those chips have hardware crypto accelerators 22.50.44 # Disk encryption would be the most secure form of password protection, but it most likely would only work on a few targets. 22.50.48 # i.e. a fast AES256 hardware implementation 22.51.16 # TheSeven: no, just hash the password somewhere and record that password protection is enabled 22.51.21 # disk encryption only provides data protection though, it isn't really a theft deterrant 22.51.23 # Oh that's not bad at all. But it would probably be limited to those devices. 22.51.49 # franklin: *no* password thing is going to be a theft deterrent for a DAP 22.52.02 # gevaerts: so, it's useless :( 22.52.02 # franklin: yes, that's what I'd store on the bootloader flash if anywhere, to prevent people from taking out the HDD and messing with that information 22.52.14 # however they can also mess with it on the bootloader flash on ipods, so that's pointless ;) 22.52.25 # If you want to prevent theft, either use conventional means (keep the thing in a safe place at all times, chain it to your body, ...), or make it look broken 22.52.43 # * franklin wonders what you mean by broken 22.52.56 # probably "not worth stealing" 22.53.10 # Dents, a cracked screen, ... 22.53.17 # TheSeven: like, every DAP nowadays :P 22.53.17 # Apply physical damage to the device that is cosmetic only. 22.53.33 # the-kyle: I want my DAP to look somewhat nice 22.54.08 # In that case, it will look to a potential thief like something worth stealing. 22.54.32 # Or, just add some secret way to turn it on (hold down center button), and not commit it to Git :D 22.54.43 # Or you could *also* carry something much more expensive, so the thief goes for that instead :) 22.54.59 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 22.55.10 # Or better yet, something that *looks* more expensive. 22.55.20 # Fake gold watch... 22.55.26 # franklin: *how* exactly does a thief know you've added such a thing? Surely they'd just steal the thing and notice this later when they get home? 22.55.26 # how about getting a cheap player? 22.55.36 # Do you expect them to then bring the thing back to you? 22.57.37 # gevaerts: well..... 22.57.41 # If I'm carrying around a fake something that I would hope a thief would go for instead of my less expensive DAP, I would expect the thief to be gone and not be able to find me by the time the item is discovered to be a fake. 22.58.08 Join stripwax [0] (~Miranda@rockbox/developer/stripwax) 22.58.19 # the-kyle: ok, ok :) 22.58.20 # the-kyle: yes, exactly. Same as with the password thing :) 23.05.33 Join RiD [0] (~RiD@2.83.0.55) 23.06.03 # I fear rockbox is slowly becoming obsolete as DAPs lose popularity to smartphones :( 23.06.34 # No music player on my phone can even come close to the features and power of Rockbox. 23.07.10 # Still, only two DAPs on http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/BuyersGuide are still in production (unstable targets are, though) 23.07.13 # Not to mention that the battery needs to be used to make phone calls and do web stuff, and playing music would subtract from the battery live. 23.08.32 # the-kyle: but even though rockbox IS far superior than smartphones in many ways, it doesn't fully support enough new players to gain many new users 23.11.21 # BTW, when will 3.14 be released? Any pi easter eggs? Pi Day 2015? 23.13.29 Quit stripwax (Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org) 23.19.54 Join bertrik [0] (~quassel@rockbox/developer/bertrik) 23.23.18 # so thats why i use rockbox in my phone :v 23.25.35 Join kugel [0] (~kugel@p5DC53E23.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) 23.25.35 Quit kugel (Changing host) 23.25.35 Join kugel [0] (~kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel) 23.26.31 # android rockbox still works better than any other android players i've been able to find 23.26.38 # so it's still got tons of merit 23.26.43 # and a long way to go... 23.26.43 Quit kugel (Client Quit) 23.31.13 Quit y4n (Quit: AMIGAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAAA) 23.34.26 # preglow: "I have this amazing piece of software, but you need the Android NDK and SDK as well as a computer to build it all." 23.36.01 # preglow: "Oh yeah, I also need to have a *nix-like system to build it" 23.39.25 # our VM image should work, although you'll need to install the NDK 23.41.57 # saratoga: exactly. it will have zero usage outside the developer community until it is accessible through "official" channels (Play Store) 23.42.46 # doesn't really take that much to get a build 23.42.52 # i haven't compiled it from source in years 23.43.03 # but sure, it should be easier to install 23.43.06 # like i said 23.43.20 # tons of potential for improvement 23.43.21 # preglow: saratoga: seriously, though. will it ever get on the Play Store? 23.43.36 # with the developer interest it has currently: doubtful 23.43.48 # and that is without me knowing anything of google's guidelines 23.44.02 # preglow: I though you would know :) 23.44.27 # might be stuff going on behind the scenes i know nothing of, i haven't been an active dev for ages now 23.44.32 # but sure doesn't look like it 23.46.46 # saratoga: do you know? how far along is RaaA? 23.46.59 # i still haven't been able to find anything i'd rather use, but with my fervent hatred of library based players, that's no big wonder 23.47.24 # preglow: library based? 23.47.42 # yeah, you know, insisting on accessing your music as a metadata based library 23.47.55 # preglow: don't get me started :) 23.47.59 # browsing through artists/genres/albums and shit, with no alternative 23.48.18 # preglow: I want to see all my directories with all my files and all my games 23.48.23 # amen 23.48.56 # preglow: and 2048 :) 23.49.06 # i hate that too preglow :v 23.50.17 # saratoga: there is no malloc() in RB!? 23.50.35 # yes, most devices dont' have virtual memory, so theres no way to malloc 23.51.46 # saratoga: so I need to make a huge char array to use malloc?! 23.52.06 # you probably shouldn't use malloc at all, but yes, you could do that 23.53.03 # saratoga: I do understand the philosophy behind it, though. most DAPs don't have MMUs 23.53.14 Quit Rower (Quit: Hmmm...)