--- Log for 21.11.115 Server: orwell.freenode.net Channel: #rockbox --- Nick: logbot- Version: Dancer V4.16 Started: 6 days and 17 hours ago 00.04.46 # [Saint]: exfat is a pain in the rear 00.05.17 # <[Saint]> It's pretty simple really. Implementing exFAT wouldn't be a huge pain in the arse. 00.05.26 # <[Saint]> ...I just don't see any reason why anyone should. 00.05.33 # because SDXC cards would work out of the box. 00.06.40 # <[Saint]> I just think it'll open up a floodgate. 00.06.47 # <[Saint]> Some asshole will want NTFS next. 00.06.54 # <[Saint]> ...then it begins. 00.07.02 # :D 00.12.24 # ntfs is HUGE to impliment... and there's NO reason for it! 00.14.38 # <[Saint]> Honestly the only reason I see exFAT ever happening is a side effect of that singular weird target that pamaury was working on that seems to use exFAT natively for some reason where dualboot gets all fucky on it and dualbooting means wiping out the FAT container for Rockbox each time. 00.15.06 # <[Saint]> That's the only reason I would see exFAT hitting mainline, honestly. 00.15.06 # it was the ZEN and it was not exFAT but a proprietary FS 00.15.23 # <[Saint]> Oh, my mistake. I thought it was exFAT, hmmm. 00.15.47 # I don't know how exFAT works, don't know how widespread it is, I don't even know if it's a huge change compared to regular FAT 00.16.53 # <[Saint]> It wouldn't be difficult to implement, it's not massive. There's some fairly simple implementations of exFAT floating around that could be pretty easily crammed into our tree. 00.17.08 # <[Saint]> It all just seems to hang on the balance of there being little to no reason to do so. 00.19.04 # to watch 4GB videos through the MPEG player \o/ 00.20.08 # <[Franklin]> most targets don't even have 4GB of internal storage 00.20.28 # <[Franklin]> s/most/some/ 00.21.50 Nick suYin`OFF is now known as suYin (mysuyin@server2.shellfire.net) 00.22.37 # but many targets have microsd slots. and microsdxc cards come formatted as exFAT 00.27.59 # <[Franklin]> out of curiosity, how did the wikipedia plugin manage huge files? 00.28.30 # <[Saint]> It doesn't, just like anything else in Rockbox. 00.28.46 # <[Franklin]> did it split them into multiple chunks? 00.28.50 # <[Saint]> Yes. 00.28.58 Quit krnlyng (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 00.29.36 # * [Franklin] can't think of a reason you would /ever/ need to use 4GB+ files in rockbox then 00.30.01 # <[Saint]> continuous recording perhaps, but, even then, you could stitch the files manually. 00.30.07 # <[Franklin]> videos on small screens don't use that much disk space anyways 00.30.46 # <[Franklin]> ~500M for a 2-hour movie perhaps 00.31.20 # <[Franklin]> any longer than that, and the battery's dead :P 00.31.24 # <[Saint]> yeah, I think we worked it out at one point, and those people mentioning videos, on a common "high res" 240x320 target, were thinking they were going to be watching a ~17h movie. 00.31.39 # <[Saint]> a few people pointed out video as a use case, but, sorry guys, nope. 00.32.05 # <[Saint]> I will NOT let you watch every episode of F.R.I.E.N.D.s ever, concatenated into a single file, sorry. I'm mean. 00.32.38 Quit lebellium (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92 [Firefox 43.0/20151116155110]) 00.32.43 # <[Saint]> 00.33.31 # why are you being so mean? what's up with you? noone told you life was gonna be this way? your job's a joke? you're broke? your love life's d.o.a.? 00.34.05 Nick [Franklin] is now known as [[Franklin] (~me@unaffiliated/franklin) 00.34.11 Nick [[Franklin] is now known as [Franklin] (~me@unaffiliated/franklin) 00.34.43 Quit [Franklin] (Quit: ?f u cn rd ths, u cn gt a gd jb n sftwr tstng.? ? Anonymous) 00.34.50 # <[Saint]> It's 1234 on a Saturday afternoon, and I'm 3-glasses-of-wine-drunk. I'm doin' OK. ;) 00.35.01 # <[Saint]> Denying people 4GB+ files is food for the soul. 00.36.00 # I don't care about 4+GB files 00.36.34 Join [Franklin] [0] (~me@unaffiliated/franklin) 00.36.48 # but it would be user friendly if people could simply take sdxc cards out of their phones and put them into their DAPs 00.37.29 # <[Saint]> My honest opinion is that if someone is going to be completely replacing their original firmware with a version they decided to modify with a tool from some guys on the infowebz, they can format an SDXC volume as FAT. 00.38.03 # <[Saint]> In a perfect world, and opinions differ on this, I actually think Rockbox should be capable of formatting the sdcard itself. 00.38.39 Join jtdesigns01 [0] (~quassel@2601:400:8000:2669:230:bdff:fe71:cebd) 00.38.48 # <[Saint]> Being able to reset/setup the devices own filesystem is a fairly handy feature for embedded devices like this. 00.39.36 # * gevaerts thinks that if someone implements a new potentially useful filesystem (this probably means exfat or possibly hfs) cleanly, with a proper abstraction layer and with a reasonable memory cost (ideally zero if compiled out), there isn't really a good reason to leave it out 00.40.10 # I happen to think it's not very likely to happen, but who knows? 00.40.39 Quit girafe (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 00.40.40 # <[Saint]> IS there a decent license compatible HFS? 00.40.44 # <[Saint]> *Is 00.40.55 # I have no idea 00.41.33 # linux has hfs support I think? 00.41.35 # <[Saint]> Aha. I know I could do exFAT, but the sources I have are of questionable origin and would need to be reimplemented. But I believe there's leaner ones out there. 00.41.41 # gevaerts: it does 00.41.45 Join krnlyng [0] (~liar@178.112.137.46.wireless.dyn.drei.com) 00.41.50 # <[Saint]> Oh. Hmmm. 00.42.51 # [Saint]: I haven't looked at *how* it's implimented, but testdisk/photorec seems to have a solidly working implimentation 00.42.52 # I'm not sure that's where the issue is though. Currently we support fat, and *only* fat. That has lead to various "nice" interdependencies that are going to be fun if you want to support multiple filesystems 00.43.16 # <[Saint]> right 00.45.48 # is there any particular reason why progressive jpegs are not supoorted? 00.46.08 # I don't think so 00.46.39 # * gevaerts thinks exfat will become irrelevant for rockbox fairly soon 00.46.42 # having to resave every image just in case it's progressive is a bit annoying. 00.47.16 # frakly, i'm not worried about exfat.. from a user stand-point it seems illogical to try to put music that's not "name-of-song.xyz" and improperly tagged unless you're exceptionly lazy.. from a development stand-point it's also stupid... just more, uneeded work 00.48.08 # * pamaury thinks everything will become irrelevant for rockbox fairly soon 00.48.35 # The thing is that as far as I can see most more or less recent stuff that does removable cards has a "sansa" label, and the build quality of those isn't *that* great 00.48.37 Quit Electricguy (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 00.48.57 # The more solid players will last the longest :) 00.50.16 # I retired my h340 two years ago. it was still working fine, but carrying that huge brick around with me for nearly a decade was more than enough 00.50.36 # yay for happy meal toy players! 00.50.42 # gevaerts: yea, my e250 is gone >.< or rather the wheel is... after my friend's austistic 2 year old got ahold of it >.< 00.50.51 # well i would certainly like to be able to support a wikipedia dump in a single file. 00.51.08 # but thats about the only good reason for exfat i can see 00.51.23 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 00.51.35 # jtdesigns01: implement raw partition support in the wikipedia plugin! :) 00.51.46 # um... no. 00.52.03 # * gartral hits gevaerts with a trout 00.52.15 # waaaaaayyy too much work 00.53.15 # * gevaerts thinks the wikipedia plugin is even more of a smartphone victim than the rest of rockbox 00.53.25 # i agree 00.53.32 # yup 00.54.09 # and honestly, who doesn't have a pocket computer now-a-days? 00.54.09 # <[Saint]> I dunno. It was a victim of piss poor control over contributos. 00.54.20 # smartphone victim? 00.54.25 # <[Saint]> It killed itself before smartphones did. 00.54.31 # That too 00.54.59 # jtdesigns01: "phones can do it, why can't rockbox" 00.55.05 # <[Saint]> If the licensing wasn't an issue, it'd be in there, I posit. 00.55.12 # jtdesigns01: more and more people have a data plan on their smartphone that's cheap enough to access wikipedia without having to go through lots of effort 00.55.18 # <[Saint]> and *then* smartphones could kill it! 00.55.19 # <[Saint]> :) 00.55.44 # well, i for one dont have a phone, so every thing i would do with a phone i have to implement in rockbox. 00.55.48 # sigh... 00.55.49 # And to be fair, the soft keyboard on my smartphone is a *lot* better than the one in rockbox :) 00.56.05 # OMG i feel ya there! 00.56.36 # <[Saint]> stabbing at the device with a broomhandle would yield better typing results than with the virtual keyboard. 00.56.46 # <[Saint]> its impossible to use. 00.57.01 # it is a lesson in patience, thats for sure 00.57.04 # * gevaerts thinks carrying a backpack with an encyclopedia in it would be less effort than trying to look for things in wikipedia on rockbox with that keyboard regularly! 00.57.14 # [Saint]: try doing it with a half-ass sansa wheel! 00.57.30 # <[Saint]> if I have to save anything in Rockbox, like a config or whatever, it generally ends up as AAAAAAA and saved without an extension. 00.57.37 # <[Saint]> then I fix it up over USB later. 00.57.38 # <[Saint]> lol 00.57.53 # [Saint]: lol 00.57.56 # yep, same here unfortunately 00.58.05 # <[Saint]> I also really dislike the save mechanism. 00.58.26 # <[Saint]> it's really unintuitive. I forget how to actually save the file every same time. 00.58.34 # <[Saint]> so I always end up doing it 2 or three times. 00.58.38 # wow really? 00.58.46 # <[Saint]> yeah. :-/ 00.58.49 # its pretty simple on the fuze+ touchapd 00.59.05 # <[Saint]> I find it really non-obvious, I use iPods, we have a distinct lack of buttons. 00.59.15 # i've never had a problem with the save function, then again, I'm also *VERY* Patient 00.59.24 # <[Saint]> you need to go down onto the text input area, and push, I think, select? 00.59.27 # <[Saint]> fukken, play? 00.59.30 # <[Saint]> one of the two. 00.59.46 # <[Saint]> shits hard, yo. 00.59.47 # play/pause to enter char, back for backspace, and hold center for enter 01.00.13 # wow that rhymes. 01.00.17 # <[Saint]> yeah, but play changes function on the text input area. 01.00.23 # <[Saint]> it magically turns into save there iirc. 01.00.37 # well i dont have to ever go there 01.00.45 # why can you go there anyway? 01.00.59 # <[Saint]> to save... 01.01.13 Nick suYin is now known as suYin`OFF (mysuyin@server2.shellfire.net) 01.01.38 # not me, guess the fuze+ isnt really as bad people say 01.01.49 # at least its got enough buttons 01.01.59 # <[Saint]> well, the ipods only have, like, 5 buttons. 01.02.03 # <[Saint]> gotta get creative I guess. 01.02.38 # <[Saint]> yeah, I just tested it then, with the cursor on the input area play saves it. 01.02.52 # <[Saint]> I absolutely guarantee I'll forget that when I need to use it. 01.03.26 # [Saint]: post-it on the back of the device? 01.03.33 # <[Saint]> lol 01.03.50 # background? 01.04.14 # <[Saint]> backgrounds are for people who hate audiobuffer. 01.04.17 # No, that won't work 01.04.19 # just make an animated help file for the background and youll be all set. 01.04.26 # :D 01.04.36 # You can't see the background properly while doing stuff 01.04.42 # You need an audioguide 01.05.08 # i`ll narrate! 01.05.56 # or even better, record google translate previewing it with a microphone held next to your speaker at mp3 50 kbps!!!! 01.06.56 # <[Saint]> my config is very simple. there's no backdrop (which I couldn't see in vkeyboard anyway even if there were), I use sysfont and the default (non-cabbie) icons. I use the fallback wps/sbs. No database, no dircache, the only things on the main menu are 'Files; Resume Playback; Settings'. 01.07.00 # * [Saint] is a simple man. 01.08.35 # <[Saint]> I'm getting old and blind though, so I'm going to have to start using a larger font soon I think. 01.27.26 # <[Franklin]> Mr. Someone could always reimplement the wikipedia plugin 01.31.36 # <[Franklin]> or at least the questionable portions of it 01.34.26 Nick [Franklin] is now known as [1] (~me@unaffiliated/franklin) 01.34.41 Nick [1] is now known as [0xDEADBEEF] (~me@unaffiliated/franklin) 01.35.29 Nick [0xDEADBEEF] is now known as DeAdBeEf (~me@unaffiliated/franklin) 01.35.59 Nick DeAdBeEf is now known as Guest50095 (~me@unaffiliated/franklin) 01.36.43 Nick Guest50095 is now known as [Franklin] (~me@unaffiliated/franklin) 01.37.22 Quit ender` (Quit: The whole principle is wrong; it's like demanding that grown men live on skim milk because the baby can't eat steak. -- Robert A. 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i need toask someone who's from germany a question in the community room >.> 21.48.22 Join saratoga [0] (123e11e0@gateway/web/freenode/ip.18.62.17.224) 21.48.32 # exfat would be nice to have for SDXC cards at least 21.53.59 Quit saratoga (Quit: Page closed) 22.05.24 Quit chrisb (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 22.06.07 Join preglow [0] (~thomj@2001:840:4243:3::101) 22.11.31 Quit shamus (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 22.11.55 Join shamus [0] (~shmaus@ip-206-192-194-12.marylandheights.ip.cablemo.net) 22.13.07 Quit GeekShadow (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) 22.13.56 Join GeekShadow [0] (~antoine@78.223.130.14) 22.13.56 Quit GeekShadow (Changing host) 22.13.56 Join GeekShadow [0] (~antoine@reactos/tester/GeekShadow) 22.18.37 Quit alucryd (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.) 22.20.03 Join alucryd [0] (~quassel@archlinux/developer/alucryd) 22.51.56 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 22.54.51 Nick Strife89|Quassel is now known as Strife89 (~quassel@adsl-98-80-224-221.mcn.bellsouth.net) 23.01.18 Quit krnlyng (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 23.06.43 Join pamaury [0] (~quassel@rockbox/developer/pamaury) 23.11.53 Quit JanC (Ping timeout: 240 seconds) 23.15.39 Quit rela (Ping timeout: 246 seconds) 23.24.15 Join fifthshiftathome [0] (~fifthshif@184-88-168-193.res.bhn.net) 23.25.24 Join JanC [0] (~janc@lugwv/member/JanC) 23.27.39 Join krnlyng [0] (~liar@178.114.101.251.wireless.dyn.drei.com) 23.37.54 Quit uwe_ (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) 23.38.07 Join uwe_ [0] (~uwe_@dslb-084-056-052-123.084.056.pools.vodafone-ip.de)