--- Log for 26.12.116 Server: verne.freenode.net Channel: #rockbox --- Nick: logbot Version: Dancer V4.16 Started: 19 days and 15 hours ago 00.09.46 Quit alexweissman (Remote host closed the connection) 00.19.49 Join alexweissman [0] (~alexweiss@pool-71-166-108-44.bltmmd.east.verizon.net) 00.22.09 Quit alexweissman (Remote host closed the connection) 00.36.53 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 00.50.35 Join alexweissman [0] (~alexweiss@pool-71-166-108-44.bltmmd.east.verizon.net) 00.53.15 Quit paulk-collins (Quit: Leaving) 00.58.22 Quit alexweissman (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 00.59.55 Join alexweissman [0] (~alexweiss@pool-71-166-108-44.bltmmd.east.verizon.net) 01.20.28 Quit ender` (Quit: There are three deaths. The first is when the body ceases to function. The second is when the body is consigned to the grave. The third is that moment, sometime in the future, when your name is spoken for the last time. — David Eagleman) 01.45.46 Join madk [0] (~noneofyou@2604:a880:0:1010::93d:2001) 01.51.58 # hello. I just got a Fiio X1 for Christmas and was researching Rockbox on it. Seems some work has been done by pamaury but I'm not sure what the progress is at. I've read the wiki on it and this thread: http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php/topic,51047.15.html already. Looking into it more and where to go from here. Perhaps something else has been done that I'm not aware of, and if so would someone here know? 01.53.19 # also: Merry Christmas! 02.36.55 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 02.46.34 Quit ZincAlloy (Quit: Leaving.) 02.57.49 Quit skapazzo (Quit: Lost terminal) 03.01.57 Quit alexweissman (Remote host closed the connection) 03.04.22 Quit Moarc (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 03.05.18 Join Moarc [0] (~chujko@a105.net128.okay.pl) 03.22.58 Join alexweissman [0] (~alexweiss@pool-71-166-108-44.bltmmd.east.verizon.net) 04.00.37 Quit alexweissman (Remote host closed the connection) 04.10.08 Join JanC_ [0] (~janc@lugwv/member/JanC) 04.10.08 Quit JanC (Killed (rajaniemi.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services))) 04.10.08 Nick JanC_ is now known as JanC (~janc@lugwv/member/JanC) 04.11.20 Quit munch (Excess Flood) 04.11.47 Join fIorz_ [0] (nobody@rain.florz.de) 04.12.09 Quit fIorz (Remote host closed the connection) 04.13.07 Join uwe_mobile__ [0] (~uwe@static.173.76.9.176.clients.your-server.de) 04.13.18 Quit preglow (Write error: Broken pipe) 04.13.20 Join munch [0] (pls@unaffiliated/munch) 04.13.22 Quit aevin (Remote host closed the connection) 04.13.26 Quit munch (Changing host) 04.13.26 Join munch [0] (pls@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-afwdnrjchbajghxa) 04.13.31 Join preglow [0] (~thomj@2001:840:4243:3::101) 04.13.31 Join aevin [0] (eivindsy@unaffiliated/aevin) 04.14.20 Quit uwe_mobile (Write error: Broken pipe) 04.25.30 Join nlogex [0] (~filip@CPE30469a4d21ac-CMa84e3f5c8560.cpe.net.fido.ca) 04.30.45 Quit nlogex (Quit: WeeChat 1.6) 04.30.51 Quit aptzero (Quit: Leaving.) 04.36.59 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 05.11.43 Join wyatt8740 [0] (~wyatt8740@184.17.237.88) 05.12.37 # I've got a 7.5g ipod classic running rockbox, here. I am moving over to a compactflash card and run linux on my desktop. What do I need to do to format a bootloader onto the compactflash card? 05.12.58 # I feel like I remember seeing disk images I could write to it, but I can't find them now 05.14.41 # maybe it was a MBR image 05.16.03 # (I get that rockbox doesn't officially support the classic 7.5g but I've been using it on mine for over half a decade, now. Just would like some help getting it to boot, please :\) 05.22.30 # https://www.rockbox.org/wiki/IpodConversionToFAT32 doesn't contain classic bootloaders, of course 05.23.58 # (or does emcore cover that?) 05.25.13 # if you don't bother about the apple firmware, just format it as one big fat32 partition 05.25.46 # what about the partition table? 05.25.54 # should I just not put a table on> 05.25.56 # *? 05.25.56 Join treaki_ [0] (~treaki@p54BF242C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) 05.26.08 # how exactly that looks like only matters for the apple firmware 05.26.28 # e.g. mkfs.vfat /dev/cfcardorwhatever 05.26.35 # oh okay 05.26.48 # well I haven't used apple's firmware in years and don't intend to go back :) 05.26.52 # either create a partition on it using parted, or format the card directly (as superfloppy) 05.26.59 # rockbox supports both 05.27.19 # still, how should I install the actual OS without access to windows? 05.27.20 # also, emcore does reformat the disk during installation, but it's recommended to use the rockbox bootloader instead these days 05.27.38 # I am not opposed to the rockbox bootloader but there are only windoze instructions :| 05.27.54 # what firmware is on the ipod right now? 05.28.16 # this is a blank, brand new CF card 05.28.25 # but the old dying hard disk in it is using emcore 05.28.26 # and rockbox 05.29.05 # I installed it years ago when I still used XP occasionally 05.29.05 # ok, so you have flashed emcore to the ipod already? 05.29.14 # yeah in the distant past 05.29.20 # (that's *not* on the HDD, but on the ipod's main board) 05.29.33 Quit treaki__ (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 05.29.37 # ohh okay 05.29.42 # it's actually in _flash_ 05.29.43 # okay 05.29.54 # if so, just plug in the new card and boot up the ipod 05.30.12 # emcore should start up just fine, go to the tools menu, select "reformat data partition" 05.30.13 # emcore 0.2.3 r868 05.30.23 # sweet. 05.30.40 # gonna have to figure out how to crack my ipod open now 05.30.41 # :\ 05.30.50 # then attempt to start rockbox, it will complain about missing files and boot up the fallback image, use that to unpack rockbox.zip onto the new CF card 05.31.08 # the fallback's on flash as well? 05.31.09 # that part works exactly like the second part of the initial installation 05.31.12 # yes 05.31.14 # good 05.32.19 # gonna have to figure out how to open the case and actually put the card in first :\ 05.32.52 # anyone done it with a leatherman before? 05.33.01 # ifixit has a guide 05.33.08 # suggests a plastic tool 05.33.10 # which I don't have 05.33.11 # :\ 05.33.35 # there are pretty nasty metal clips inside, the back (and clips) will get damaged to some degree no matter what you do 05.33.47 # and strongly warns about breaking crap. (most of my experience with hardware is on old amiga 500's and commodores) 05.33.57 # well, that's apple for you 05.34.24 # but have you done it with, say, a knife>? 05.34.29 # or is that a very bad idea (tm)? 05.35.03 # not too worried about damaging the case, just the hardware itself 05.35.07 # you'll need something thin to get into the gap at the beginning, once I managed to pry that open a bit I've used screwdrivers 05.35.22 # not ideal, and will leave scratches everywhere etc., but it worked well enough for my testing device 05.35.25 # ah okay 05.35.32 # that's fine for me then 05.35.49 # just worried about destroying the motherboard with the knife while I'm trying to get it opened 05.36.10 # the board is right behind the clickwheel - you can't really get at that before you've got rid of the back 05.36.22 # ah okay 05.36.37 # i'll go in from the clickwheel side rather than the screen side, though, I guess? 05.36.53 # the battery's near the screen as i understand it 05.37.05 # yes, the battery is at the top, the hdd at the bottom 05.37.19 # I'd probably try to get in on a side, those (longer) edges can be bent more easily 05.37.42 # I'm just worried about shattering the screeen or something 05.37.44 # okay 05.39.00 Quit Senj_ (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) 05.42.16 # there are known issues with that old emcore build and some CF adapters btw 05.42.43 # so you might need to upgrade to a newer emcore (development) build or to the rockbox bootloader 05.43.18 # it's possible. 05.43.23 # this is a cheapo one 05.43.41 # how does one flash emcore from linux, though 05.43.51 # my machine doesn't have VT-d 05.44.42 # (or the rockbox bootloader) 05.44.50 # there was a recent chat about that on #freemyipod-support, here is the log: https://paste.ee/r/COm8Q 05.45.37 # not sure if that works if there's already emcore on it - prof_wolfff can probably answer that ;)O 05.46.24 # welp, drew blood with my screwdriver 05.46.28 # just a second 05.46.31 # :\ 05.47.19 # alright its opened 05.47.33 Join Senj_ [0] (~Senji@85.187.103.250) 05.52.49 Quit Senj_ (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 05.54.25 # hm, my classic doesn't have one of those flipping plastic zif connectors for the hard disk i dont think 05.57.30 Join Bilgus [0] (ae6611d9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.174.102.17.217) 05.58.15 # nah, I'm just dumb, nevermind 06.12.01 # okay, think I'm good to go now 06.12.30 # just one more question theseven: the 7.5g still uses the ipod6g builds right? 06.12.54 # (I actually am not sure this was ever the case) 06.13.15 # I'm not aware of any official generation names for anything post 6g 06.13.20 # oh, okay 06.13.28 # I see 7.5g some places, maybe i was mislead 06.13.34 # that's just a huge mess, and the hardware is basically all the same except for HDDs, LCDs and headphone remote circuitry 06.13.34 # this is like the iphone all over again 06.13.42 # (2g is the original( 06.13.44 # *) 06.14.07 # so ipod6g it is 06.14.14 # so yeah, everything that's "ipod classic" is covered by the "ipod6g" rockbox build 06.15.03 # I dont remember if this laptop has my toolchain for building rockbox or not 06.15.18 # I did build it years ago when I was having trouble with the gb emulator and the hold switch 06.15.20 # IIUC you don't need that 06.15.34 # I'm just grabbing the build bot zipfiles 06.15.35 # :\ 06.16.11 # you just need a normal host toolchain to build that flasher tool 06.16.24 # yeah, I know. I'm not building a flasher 06.16.26 # (yet) 06.16.40 # just talking about the ARM (i think) toolchain for rockbox itself 06.17.47 # what kinds of problems should I be looking for to tell if I need to update emcore? 06.19.02 # (or rockbox bootloader) 06.20.49 # it would fail to boot with ATA error messages 06.21.49 # emcore would mostly work, but rockbox would fail to boot up 06.25.59 # it's booting finr 06.26.00 # *fine 06.27.27 # I am in awe of how much faster the CF card is 06.27.45 # Wondering how much of the difference is due to the fact that the HDD was failing 06.27.47 # :\ 06.30.20 # one more minor question 06.30.34 # is there any way to force rockboy's audio sample rate higher? 06.30.44 # i'm aware it will suck 06.33.25 Quit The_Prospector (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 06.37.00 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 06.46.09 Join The_Prospector [0] (~The_Prosp@unaffiliated/cornman) 06.56.43 # this wouldn't work, right? I don't see any IC's on it (at least not in the pic) http://www.ebay.com/itm/ZIF-CE-1-8-Inch-HDD-to-SATA-22-Pin-Male-Adapter-/161817078394 06.57.00 # (for reading files off the old hard disk without cracking open the ipod again) 06.57.14 # oh nvm 06.57.17 # just saw more pics 06.59.52 Quit TheSeven (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 07.00.03 Join [7] [0] (~quassel@rockbox/developer/TheSeven) 07.10.44 Join alexweissman [0] (~alexweiss@pool-108-51-84-48.washdc.fios.verizon.net) 07.54.13 DEBUG EOF from server (Connection reset by peer) (snapshot: netstuff.c line 545) 07.54.13 *** Cleanup 07.54.13 *** Cleanup 07.54.13 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 07.54.13 *** Exit 07.54.16 *** Started Dancer V4.16 07.54.16 *** Connected to irc.freenode.net on port 6667 07.54.16 *** Logfile for #rockbox started 07.54.17 Mode "logbot :+i" by logbot 07.54.23 *** Server message 501: 'logbot :Unknown MODE flag' 07.54.23 Join logbot [0] (~rockbox@giant.haxx.se) 07.54.23 Join Moarc [0] 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07.54.23 Join Staphylo [0] (~Staphylo@2a01:4f8:190:126a:d70a:378:c354:a3a3) 07.54.23 Join ender| [0] (krneki@2a01:260:4094:1:42:42:42:42) 07.54.23 Join Rondom [0] (~rondom@modo.nonmodosedetiam.net) 07.54.23 Join Topy44 [0] (topy@ns3.kurz.pw) 07.54.23 Join kugel [0] (~kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel) 07.54.23 Join rogeliodh [0] (~rogeliodh@ec2-52-90-241-120.compute-1.amazonaws.com) 07.54.23 Join funman [0] (~fun@rockbox/developer/funman) 07.54.23 Join @ChanServ [0] (ChanServ@services.) 07.54.23 Join ved [0] (ved@ddsbox.tk) 07.55.08 Join Petri152 [0] (~Petri@petritrebs.ca) 07.56.02 Quit idonob (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 07.57.27 Quit alexweissman (Remote host closed the connection) 08.00.11 Join tomflint [0] (~tomflint@unaffiliated/tomflint) 08.05.02 Join Corwin_3085 [0] (54fd4716@gateway/web/freenode/ip.84.253.71.22) 08.05.07 # hey 08.05.11 # i have a problem 08.05.21 # cant convert ttf font file to fnt 08.05.43 # Rockbox Font Convertor is crashing 08.07.48 # i trying convert Ubuntu-B font because can't see arabic words 08.11.26 # corwin_3085: can't help there, but try GNU Unifont 08.11.36 # there's a FNT version somewhere I think 08.12.20 # corwin_3085 08.12.21 # https://github.com/yallie/RaaA-CabbieV2/raw/master/fonts/font-pack/18%20GNU%20Unifont.fnt 08.12.32 # that covers most of unicode plane 1 08.12.38 # including arabic I think 08.14.03 # i need 19 size 08.14.06 # can u give? 08.14.34 # also i need cyrilyc 08.14.38 # russian 08.16.06 # and Bolt 08.16.19 # It supports cyrilyc 08.16.24 # but it's not in 19pt, sorry 08.16.50 # it's a bitmap font so it's only got support for 16px*16px or 8px*16px 08.16.58 # i test it now, looks shit 08.17.05 # ah, sorry 08.17.06 # :( 08.17.13 # :( 08.17.39 # I'm wrestling with fonts for other reasons right now, too. I'll tell you if I figure something out 08.18.48 # Ubuntu-B 19 looks nice on my theme in iPod Classic https://pp.vk.me/c630419/v630419502/125c1/Xv-e5JdS94U.jpg 08.19.07 # but i think its some old version wothout arabic 08.19.16 # without* 08.20.23 # that DOES look nice 08.22.55 Join alexweissman [0] (~alexweiss@pool-108-51-84-48.washdc.fios.verizon.net) 08.23.19 # corwin_3085: is your problem with unifont that its not anti-aliased? 08.23.34 # (because for me, this is how I like it http://i.imgur.com/J0R5xdl.png ) 08.23.53 # too small and tiny 08.23.58 # ah, yeah 08.24.04 # high-dpi iPod screen 08.25.55 # corwin_3085: I have some other fonts and an iPod classic I just resurrected from the grave today (CF card) 08.26.03 Quit tomflint (Excess Flood) 08.26.03 # I'll try some and let you know 08.26.17 # ok thanks 08.26.21 Join tomflint [0] (~tomflint@159.203.211.54) 08.26.21 Quit tomflint (Changing host) 08.26.21 Join tomflint [0] (~tomflint@unaffiliated/tomflint) 08.35.10 # trying to convert in Fontforge 08.35.23 # by this steps http://stackoverflow.com/questions/24529369/how-to-convert-ttf-to-fnt-with-fontforge 08.35.34 # and crash :) 08.35.37 # lol 08.35.44 # corwin_3085: only ever tried converting fnt to TTF's before 08.35.48 # (which is very hard) 08.36.03 # https://www.dropbox.com/s/8so4fjrkksp0gni/fnts.zip?dl=0 all of the .fnt extras from rockbox 08.36.12 # in case you needed them 08.51.56 Quit Corwin_3085 (Quit: Page closed) 08.52.15 Join Corwin_3085 [0] (4e198f53@gateway/web/freenode/ip.78.25.143.83) 08.52.52 # thanks theseven, I was able to listen to the entire first Procol Harum album without crashing. Pretty sure that's due to getting rid of the bad hard disk 08.52.53 # :) 08.52.56 Quit amiconn (Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.) 08.52.57 Quit pixelma (Quit: .) 08.53.07 Join pixelma [0] (~pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) 08.53.11 Join amiconn [0] (~amiconn@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 08.54.27 # (BTW, if you're at all into the hammond organ sound, I highly highly HIGHLY recommend the first three Procol Harum albums. 08.54.29 # ) 08.54.50 # Matthew Fisher is spectacular 09.07.58 Quit alexweissman (Remote host closed the connection) 09.19.29 # does rockbox support progressive jpegs yet? If not, is this due to memory consumption or just additional work? Because I'd be willing to put some work into it 09.52.09 Quit n17ikh (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) 09.52.24 Join n17ikh [0] (~n17ikh@unaffiliated/n17ikh) 09.54.17 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 10.08.27 Quit shrizza (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) 10.08.49 Join shrizza [0] (~shrizza@oki-dc-urasoe01-187.glbb.ne.jp) 10.18.34 Join alexweissman [0] (~alexweiss@pool-108-51-84-48.washdc.fios.verizon.net) 10.19.24 Quit krnlyng (Ping timeout: 265 seconds) 10.22.57 Quit alexweissman (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 10.30.08 Join edhelas [0] (~edhelas@145.133.43.230) 10.30.48 Join Senj_ [0] (~Senji@85.187.103.250) 10.32.30 Join krnlyng [0] (~liar@178.112.157.159.wireless.dyn.drei.com) 10.32.35 Join ender` [0] (krneki@foo.eternallybored.org) 10.47.28 Join paulk-collins [0] (~paulk@armstrong.paulk.fr) 11.21.50 Join paulk-aldrin [0] (~paulk@armstrong.paulk.fr) 11.54.18 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 11.58.17 Join robertd1 [0] (~root@201.242.214.237) 12.09.59 Join skapazzo [0] (~skapazzo@151.9.205.1) 12.17.32 Quit ChristW1 (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 12.19.51 Part robertd1 12.32.07 Quit soap (Ping timeout: 245 seconds) 12.51.54 Quit edhelas (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 12.52.00 Join edhelas1 [0] (~edhelas@145.133.43.230) 13.12.40 Nick gevaerts_ is now known as gevaerts (~fg@rockbox/developer/gevaerts) 13.19.14 Join robertd1 [0] (~root@201.242.214.237) 13.36.53 Quit shrizza (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 13.38.27 Join shrizza [0] (~shrizza@oki-dc-urasoe01-187.glbb.ne.jp) 13.54.20 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 14.13.07 Quit PurlingNayuki (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) 14.17.21 Join soap [0] (~soap@rockbox/staff/soap) 14.26.23 Join ZincAlloy [0] (~Adium@2a02:8108:8b80:1700:9ca7:bcc6:a740:bb0a) 14.39.27 Quit chrisjj (Quit: Page closed) 14.41.00 Join chrisjj [0] (5001d87b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.80.1.216.123) 14.43.57 Join soap_ [0] (~soap@rockbox/staff/soap) 15.16.49 # WTH is a progressive jpeg is that like an interlaced jpeg? 15.17.03 Join aptzero [0] (~Adium@c-69-140-168-118.hsd1.md.comcast.net) 15.18.35 # ohh that is interesting indeed wyatt8740 15.28.05 # No Rb doesn't support progressive jpegs 15.28.11 # AFAICT 15.54.24 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 16.08.05 Join pamaury [0] (~pamaury@rockbox/developer/pamaury) 16.24.36 Quit edhelas1 (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 16.57.53 Quit StaticAmbience_ (Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.) 16.58.22 Join StaticAmbience [0] (~Quassel@host86-177-251-220.range86-177.btcentralplus.com) 17.01.36 Join edhelas [0] (~edhelas@145.133.43.230) 17.07.02 Quit pamaury (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 17.54.25 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 18.21.49 Quit shrizza (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 18.22.11 Join shrizza [0] (~shrizza@oki-dc-urasoe01-187.glbb.ne.jp) 18.32.14 Quit skapazzo (Quit: Lost terminal) 18.35.32 Quit edhelas (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 18.38.55 Join edhelas [0] (~edhelas@145.133.43.230) 18.39.45 Quit edhelas (Client Quit) 18.42.31 Quit shrizza (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 18.43.41 Join shrizza [0] (~shrizza@210.154.134.187) 18.50.31 # bilgus: it doesn't 18.50.34 # just tried it 18.51.14 # (also managed to ruin my ipod LCD opening it up again, so there goes another $15 18.51.15 # ) 18.51.36 Join alexweissman [0] (~alexweiss@50-195-86-70-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) 18.56.37 # Are all the replacement LCDs on ebay the same part as the original? 18.56.49 # (transflective displays are preferred which is why I ask) 18.57.47 # I don't think anyone could answer that for you, if it originated in China I doubt even the vendor could tell you 18.57.57 # haha 18.57.58 # true 18.58.08 # just wondered if anyone'd ever replaced his screen here before 19.02.58 # you can buy one of those "for parts" on ebay 19.03.09 # keep the rest as spares 19.11.00 Quit alexweissman (Remote host closed the connection) 19.24.00 # Perhaps the RB manual needs a warning: "Do not open your iPod LCD in an attempt to get progressive JPEGs working." :-) 19.40.19 Join edhelas [0] (~edhelas@145.133.43.230) 19.46.56 Join ImNotARobot [0] (18c0b1ad@gateway/web/freenode/ip.24.192.177.173) 19.48.18 # I just ended up grabbing one for $20 that had the same markings on the panel and same components on the flex cable 19.48.44 # (some of the ones on ebay/amazon didn't even have the trimmer potentiometer on the flex cable O.o) 19.49.04 # (and I ended up using amazon just because I have $70 of gift cards) 19.51.56 # Amazon has very good customer service even if their (soon to be ex-)vendors don't 19.54.27 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 19.54.38 # TorC, JohnB2, (TWIMC) Latest Selective backlight/ Advanced Softlock builds are uploading https://www.mediafire.com/?tl0828dq7lq1c This should be it unless you guys find a bug or want some feature still 19.57.34 # <[Saint]> wyatt8740: a little column a, a little column b, fwiw. 19.57.38 # <[Saint]> re: progressive jpeg 19.57.58 Join alexweissman [0] (~alexweiss@50-195-86-70-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) 19.58.23 # [saint]: I'm going to take a look at jpegtran because it can losslessly convert a progressive jpeg to a baseline one 19.58.25 # <[Saint]> initially - it would've been a combination of hardware and lack of need, want, and effort. Now it is primarily the latter. 19.58.36 # I have the feeling that there's an efficient way to read thenm 19.58.38 # *them 19.59.18 # <[Saint]> well, when I say lack of resources, one must think of the fact that the players of over a decade ago had ~2MB of RAM. 19.59.30 # <[Saint]> Now we regularly have between 8 and 64MB... 19.59.53 # <[Saint]> It's significantly less of an issue now. 19.59.58 # [saint]: I know exactly what you mean 19.59.59 # :| 20.00.10 # I program for the NES and commodore VIC-20 as a hobby 20.00.45 # [Saint]: it's still an issue 20.01.02 # https://www.c64-wiki.com/images/5/5a/Einschaltmeldung_VC20.gif 20.01.20 # I mean, last time I sent a photo from my camera straight to a raspberry pi (1) running xbmc, the thing crashed 20.01.21 # <[Saint]> Another factor in it could very well be: 20.01.22 # <[Saint]> "JPEG is a piece of shit image compression container - use bitmap" 20.01.42 # hahaha 20.01.43 # My rockbox devices showed the same file just fine 20.01.45 # <[Saint]> I suspect that to be the case. 20.02.20 # I do not like jpeg very much, but as a common format I'd like to see about supporting it. Not at all familiar with the rockbox codebase though 20.02.29 # does it use libjpeg or something custom? 20.03.08 # <[Saint]> custom magic AFAIK, it;s actually faster and more efficient than any decoder I've ever found before or since. 20.03.18 # I believe it 20.03.27 # Well, I don't know if it's *faster* 20.03.43 # It's just that it knows what scale to render to, so it avoids decoding irrelevant stuff 20.03.44 # better memory usage 20.04.00 # <[Saint]> significantly 20.04.35 # oh, neat. It just uses the YUV colorspace's "Y" channel on black and white devices 20.04.43 # I appreciate things like that 20.05.15 # <[Saint]> But..something something, use bitmap. Just don't fuck up the colorspace if you include bitmaps with an alpha channel (yep, we can do that). 20.05.43 # as a general purpose image viewer it should be able to cope with as many formats as possible. 20.05.54 # I agree that for most cases a plain bitmap or png is preferable. 20.06.19 # <[Saint]> it's not really a general purpose image viewer, though. 20.06.19 # <[Saint]> that's the thing. 20.06.48 # <[Saint]> that's more of a bi-product of album art. 20.06.51 # if my ipod can play pokemon or doom, I think it should be able to view a progressive jpeg. :\ 20.06.57 # I understand your point though 20.07.14 # case 0xCF: /* SOF Arith - Differential spatial*/ {return (-4); /* other DCT model than baseline not implemented */} 20.07.21 # from jpeg_decoder.c 20.07.40 # (there are more cases than that, just pulled in the last one) 20.09.27 Join smoke_fumus [0] (~smoke_fum@dynamic-vpdn-93-125-14-78.telecom.by) 20.10.34 # <[Saint]> May I ask how it is you're regularly running into progressive scan jpegs? 20.10.56 # <[Saint]> Most encoders go out of their way to avoid progressive scan and/or hide it as an option from the user. 20.11.13 # <[Saint]> It usually takes a deal of deliberate action. 20.12.02 # Manga 20.12.04 # :\ 20.12.37 # I am assuming photoshop does not hide it 20.12.38 # :\ 20.12.53 # (I use GIMP so I don't know.) 20.13.25 # <[Saint]> You poor bastard. You're actually using the image viewer in its intended function and getting your monies worth out of the scaling engine I'll bet. 20.13.34 # heh, it's alright 20.13.39 # I like challenges 20.13.45 # from the wikipedia page: "When progressive JPEGs are received by programs that do not support them (such as versions of Internet Explorer before Windows 7)[15] the software displays the image only after it has been completely downloaded." 20.13.47 # <[Saint]> :) 20.14.05 # so it should be possible to just skip by all the smaller resolution images 20.17.46 # https://github.com/komakai/libjpeg-turbo this fork of turbojpeg also looks promising 20.18.19 # he was working with 64-128mb of ram 20.18.36 # so a bit more than we have 20.22.16 # <[Saint]> A bit more? 20.22.24 # <[Saint]> that's "the max, and double the max" 20.22.37 # <[Saint]> that's a bit more than a bit more. ;) 20.22.45 # that was a euphemism 20.22.49 # ;) 20.22.59 # hard to convey tone in text 20.23.22 # but it'd be like if I said "it wasn't entirely unlike our use case" 20.23.29 # I think the image viewer (at least as jpeg viewer) existed way before album art, think of the Archos's monochrome lcds etc. 20.23.38 # <[Saint]> And, keep in mind, that's _total_ for the device...mind you. 20.23.50 # yes, I get it. 20.23.58 # again, I used a VIC-20 20.24.08 # <[Saint]> we regularly have as little as 8MB total, of which available is going to be about 5MB at any given time. 20.24.11 # (which had 5k of RAM, but only about 3k available for the user once BASIC was loaded) 20.24.43 # <[Saint]> pixelma: yes - you're right, but it was just bitmap then was it not? 20.24.49 # Megabytes are irrelevant :) 20.25.25 # <[Saint]> Bah. Bits...bytes. +/- 24 and you're good. 20.25.30 # IIRC our jpeg decoder needs enough RAM to store a few lines of pixels and then a few kilobytes more 20.26.59 # bmp is supported in the core for WPS and fonts etc., IIRC the viewer was first jpeg and only jpeg 20.27.10 Quit The_Prospector (Read error: Connection timed out) 20.27.21 # you only need 9 megabytes for a 24 bit color 640x480 framebuffer if I did the math correctly 20.27.37 # not a 100% sure though 20.27.41 # whoops, 900kb 20.27.47 Join The_Prospector [0] (~The_Prosp@unaffiliated/cornman) 20.27.59 Quit alexweissman (Remote host closed the connection) 20.28.21 # <[Saint]> I'm not sure the imageviewer does 24 bit jpegs does it? 20.28.31 # jpeg is a yuv colorspace 20.28.36 # so probably not applicable 20.28.43 # pixelma: yes, I think the image viewer plugin did jpeg fairly early. It wasn't as efficient as it is now though 20.28.43 # <[Saint]> I know the skin engine does...but we ab(use) it. 20.29.14 # <[Saint]> we do 24 bit jpegs there but we kinda abuse it for an alpha channel and transparency. 20.29.20 # looks like yuv2rgb.c uses 16-bit rgb 20.29.32 # <[Saint]> not sure if that follows through to the pictureviewer or not. 20.29.33 # *15 20.29.49 # *scaled is 15 bit 20.29.52 # fullsize is 24 21.09.08 Quit GodEater (Quit: Coyote finally caught me) 21.13.03 Join GodEater [0] (~whoknows@176.253.28.187) 21.13.04 Quit GodEater (Changing host) 21.13.04 Join GodEater [0] (~whoknows@rockbox/staff/GodEater) 21.20.03 Quit smoke_fumus (Read error: Connection reset by peer) 21.40.25 Join Saratoga [0] (ac660d62@gateway/web/freenode/ip.172.102.13.98) 21.40.40 # wyatt8740: the problem with progressive jpeg is memory 21.41.09 # Coefficients are not stored sequentially so you must load the entire jpeg before you can resize it 21.41.27 # This means a you need enough RAM to decide the entire image 21.42.16 # With no progressive you can resize block by block and only need to allocate enough RAM for the out put size, not input size 21.42.39 # Which is why we can decode a 1MB jpeg with a few kilobytes of RAM 21.43.38 # You could decode very small progressive JPEGs, but larger would force you to stop playback to get ram back from the codecs and audio buffer 21.45.10 # <[Saint]> damn it would be nice if we could dynamically shrink and grow buffers. 21.45.35 # <[Saint]> instead of just asking for a portion or all of what remains. 21.47.17 # <[Saint]> in situations like that when you need to steal the playback buffer it would be nicer if it could just be deflated to a few hundred Kb or so instead, and inflated after the fact when the large allocator no longer requires it. 21.47.22 # On many players, the RAM you'd commonly need would be more than the audio buffer anyway, so who cares? 21.48.00 # Actually by using the lowest resolution dct coefficients to save some memory, but not nearly as much as the no progressive case 21.48.05 # <[Saint]> I think there's more large-mem targets around these days. 21.48.57 # Yeah if you're clever it's probably doable on 64 MB devices 21.49.09 # But forget it on ams 21.49.33 Join lebellium_z3c [0] (~AndChat73@80.215.131.39) 21.49.44 # <[Saint]> Rockbox in general supports more lowmem targets by an overwhelming margin. 21.49.47 # so which targets would be left by this definition? 21.49.52 # <[Saint]> But lets face it...how many people are using them? 21.51.05 # [Saint]: every time someone asks for help with a bricked clip zip, one less :) 21.51.44 # <[Saint]> Hah 21.51.59 # <[Saint]> I really hope that guy building the Rockbox player isn't full of shit and gets to market. 21.52.32 # <[Saint]> Not seeing a single goddamn thing from them on Gerrit or git is troubling though. 21.52.57 # <[Saint]> You'd think they would want to work with a couple of key players directly. 21.53.16 # * gevaerts isn't sure there is a rockbox player 21.53.41 # Depending on how you read things, it sounds like a rockbox *capable* player 21.53.44 # <[Saint]> I'm about 80% confident there isn;t and that guy is talking complete shit. 21.53.59 Join saratoga_ [0] (ae125263@gateway/web/freenode/ip.174.18.82.99) 21.54.09 # <[Saint]> that number goes up by ~2% every couple of weeks. 21.54.29 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 21.54.31 # [Saint]: not expecting much in the way of source from them, probably those smaller chinese vendors are worried the competition will take the same source and slap it on another near-referencec device and put them out of business 21.54.36 # but we will see 21.55.05 # probably theyre still hoping someone else ports it without their code 21.55.40 # <[Saint]> That's a good point. And that explains source I guess...but I still would've thought they would want hands on help, so to speak. 21.55.52 # <[Saint]> you'd think there would be at least one of you guys with a dev unit by now. 21.55.56 # well they offered to send us free units 21.56.22 # <[Saint]> And no one took them up on it? I never saw this... 21.56.44 # yeah i gave them my address, if i get one I can pass it on to someone interested in a port 21.57.00 # i made it clear that these days i'm too busy to dive into porting 21.58.01 # <[Saint]> they, or rather, that one guy who keeps implying there's more people every possible instance, keeps saying that the port itself is largely done. 21.58.05 # i should send it to Mihale :) 21.58.41 # <[Saint]> I offered to do their graphical work and never heard shit from them after a single very eager response. 21.58.44 # plus i think these are MIPS right? working on MIPS after ten years of painfully optimizing ARM codecs would be too much for me 21.59.10 # <[Saint]> have you had much luck talking to this guy outside the forum? 21.59.20 # <[Saint]> perhaps I should try again. 21.59.35 # <[Saint]> see where they're at, or if they even retained the theme engine. 22.00.05 # no, he just PMed me a while ago about demo units 22.00.23 # <[Saint]> I got one very enthusiastic response when this dude first popped up and then nothing for aaaaaaages. 22.00.54 # sounds like a normal company response 22.00.59 # <[Saint]> heh 22.01.29 # i remember telling sandisk what was wrong with their Vorbis codec and they wrote me back immediately asking for a solution, i sent it to them, and then they never replied and never fixed it 22.02.00 # companies have their own deliverables, so even free help is often not interesting to them if its a direction they aren't working on 22.03.36 Quit michaelni (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) 22.03.38 # <[Saint]> I've had a half dozen similar dealings with my telco, who buys piece of shit barebones tplink reference boards and slaps their own skin on it that breaks half the functionality and hides the other half. 22.04.25 # <[Saint]> they actually did pay me though. 22.04.40 # <[Saint]> the work (afaik) never made it out to anyone though. 22.13.49 Quit ImNotARobot (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 22.14.52 Quit The_Prospector (Ping timeout: 268 seconds) 22.15.58 Join michaelni [0] (~michael@213-47-41-20.cable.dynamic.surfer.at) 22.17.49 # saratoga: thanks for the explanation 22.19.19 # [Saint]: "Rockbox in general supports more lowmem targets by an overwhelming margin." True, but by the same metric the linux kernel supports more non-x86 targets than x86 targets 22.19.30 Join The_Prospector [0] (~The_Prosp@unaffiliated/cornman) 22.19.36 # but how many people actually use, for example, the m68k target? 22.20.08 # I have suspicions that the majority of rockbox users have ipods now, if only because of how many ipods apple sold 22.20.27 Join alexweissman [0] (~alexweiss@2601:143:8001:e5f1:174:6ee2:8865:24e1) 22.24.42 # I mean, if I could actually find an amiga 4000 at a decent price, I'd be using linux m68k 22.24.45 # but I can't 22.24.47 # :\ 22.32.05 # I don't have a single Ipod but 3 other Rockbox targets 22.41.21 # I think AMS targets were in the lead for a while, but maybe iPods are more popular again since they last longer and can be repaired more easily 22.41.42 # whereas AMS devices eventually die when the soldered on NAND fails 22.49.00 Quit alexweissman (Ping timeout: 258 seconds) 22.51.18 Quit wyatt8740 (Remote host closed the connection) 22.52.27 Quit saratoga_ (Quit: Page closed) 22.56.59 Quit Saratoga (Ping timeout: 260 seconds) 23.01.16 Join alexweissman [0] (~alexweiss@c-73-87-250-225.hsd1.dc.comcast.net) 23.02.22 Quit lebellium_z3c (Quit: Bye) 23.11.49 Join JanC_ [0] (~janc@lugwv/member/JanC) 23.13.04 Quit JanC (Killed (hitchcock.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services))) 23.13.04 Nick JanC_ is now known as JanC (~janc@lugwv/member/JanC) 23.16.29 Join Bilgus_ph [0] (~Bilgus_ph@108.115.37.209) 23.17.08 # Anything special that keeps you from replacing the flash? 23.17.16 Quit Bilgus_ph (Remote host closed the connection) 23.28.10 Quit paulk-aldrin (Remote host closed the connection) 23.54.31 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 23.58.45 Quit edhelas (Quit: Leaving.)