--- Log for 21.11.117  Server: orwell.freenode.net  Channel: #rockbox
--- Nick: logbot  Version: Dancer V4.16  Started: 1 month and 21 days ago

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00.58.37 #       <[Saint]> Fuck it.
00.58.43 #       <[Saint]> I'm unifying the settings icons.
00.59.13 #       <[Saint]> I don't really see why we need 4 different icons for settings, and a different icon still for the settings menu header.
00.59.41 #       <[Saint]> tango iconset in cabbie already doubles up a couple of settings icons.
00.59.57 #       <[Saint]> so i figure i'll just finish the job.
01.00.22 #       <[Saint]> I'll see how it looks after I've actually finished stitching the bitmap strip and made the icon pack.
01.00.44 #       <[Saint]> if anything looks weird I'll change it.
01.03.03 #       <_Bilgus> do they have the same indices?
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01.51.30 #       <[Saint]> __builtin: https://imgur.com/a/PbMib
01.51.42 #       <[Saint]> I removed the alpha layer so you can actually see the icons on imgur
01.51.57 #       <[Saint]> normally it's transparency
01.52.38 #       <[Saint]> I very much like the...simplicity of it. I do believe this is going to be a very nice looking theme in the end.
01.52.56 #       <[Saint]> I need to build the viewers icon bitmap strip now.
01.53.40 #       <[Saint]> but I'll have a break, have a coffee, and get stoned and rest my eyes for a bit, then I'll get back into it.
01.54.54 #       <[Saint]> It's been annoying, even using a 1440p flatscreen television as a monitor and being quite close there's still a lot of tedious positioning and my eyes aren't too great.
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01.55.38 #       <[Saint]> I need new glasses, bah. anyway...there's the start of the material design icon set for the immaterial theme.
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02.01.15 #       <[Saint]> I really want to keep the Rockbox icon as a nod to history, but it looks /sooooooooo/ out of place.
02.01.29 #       <[Saint]> I guess it's kinda cool having such a sharp contrast there.
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02.03.46 #       <[Saint]> I've decided I'll make at least two icon and viewer icon sets.
02.05.06 #       <[Saint]> one static black with the colour Rockbox logo, and one in 1bpp with a flat Rockbox icon that I'll whip uo so that users can colour their icons depending on the foreground colour set.
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02.05.43 #       <[Saint]> I was also planning on letting users pick the accent colour in the main themes with the background colour.
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02.34.53 #       <__builtin> [Saint]: nice! 
02.35.35 #       <__builtin> I like the idea of a new logo as well
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02.40.21 #       <__builtin> I think we shouldn't completely replace cabbie, though
02.40.32 #       <__builtin> maybe ship the two alongside each other
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02.50.44 #       <Kempster> Been using Rockbox for years on a number of Sansa devices.  Many thanks to the devs and other supporting characters.
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02.51.57 #       <__builtin> Kempster: thanks!
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02.56.40 #       <Kempster> I'm stiil limping my Sansa e200 along.  Had to open it up and resolder the headphone jack connections recently.  (Too many drops on the floor.)
03.00.47 #       <Kempster> Still thinking ahead to the time when I won't be able to fix the Sansa anymore...  Has anyone considered the possibility of porting Rockbox to the Adafruit Feather boards?
03.01.15 #       <__builtin> not that I know of
03.01.36 #       <__builtin> we have an SDL app that can run on many platforms
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03.04.24 #       <__builtin> you could probably wire up a raspi to an LCD if you wanted
03.06.08 #       <Kempster> Yep.  The RaspPi was my fallback position in case anything went wrong with the Sansa...
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03.07.23 #       <Kempster> Just an FYI for those not familiar with it, the Feathers are a system of boards that can be stacked together (processor board, music processor board, OLED, pushbutton control) in a smaller package than the Pi or Arduino boards.
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03.08.33 #       <Kempster> There are a number of processor boards with varying levels of horsepower that can be added to the stack depending on what's needed to run Rockbox.
03.11.40 #       <Kempster> The Feather seemed like a good fit for Rockbox from what I read (and my limited understanding of the requirements to run Rockbox.)
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03.12.18 #       <__builtin> well, it'd be easiest if you didn't have to port rockbox at all
03.12.22 #       <__builtin> i.e. the SDL app
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03.14.51 #       <[Saint]> Strife89: would you perhaps prefer this one?
03.15.30 #       <Kempster> What's required to run the SDL app?  I've run SDL on Linux boxes before but wasn't aware it was something for devices like MP3 players, etc.  Is the SDL app for smartphones, etc?
03.16.28 #       <Strife89> Wait, which one, [Saint]?
03.17.05 #       <[Saint]> it should be highlighted from that url, I guess it might depend on browser cache stuff.
03.17.05 #       <[Saint]> It's called "equalizer".
03.17.20 #       <[Saint]> It's just three vertical bars of varying height.
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03.20.32 #       <__builtin> Kempster: no, the SDL app runs on a computer
03.20.41 #       <__builtin> it's basically rockbox for desktops
03.21.24 #       <Strife89> [Saint], I haven't seen a new URL since 19:51 EST (1.5 hours ago)
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03.21.44 #       <Strife89> Not sure if I flat-out missed something or what
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03.25.24 #       <Kempster> I'll have to check out the SDL app for when I'm home.  Sounds interesting.
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03.25.56 #       <Kempster> Still need a backup plan for portable use when the Sansa dies though.
03.26.36 #       <Kempster> I'd prefer not to use a smartphone my podcast listening.
03.28.15 #       <Kempster> That should be: "I'd prefer not to use a smartphone FOR my podcast listening."
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03.31.25 #       <Kempster> IMO, one of the best features of Rockbox is the spoken menu system for 'eyes-off' operation.  I'm unaware of any smartphone app that can do that.  (Here's where someone jumps in and tells me it's been done)
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03.34.43 #       <Kempster> Anyway, thanks for hearing me out.  I've got to go for now but I'll check the log of the channel tomorrow to see if there are anymore responses.  Thanks again to everyone who makes Rockbox possible.
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03.37.20 #       <__builtin> hmm, anyone have an ipod6g on hand?
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03.49.42 #       * Strife89 has an iPod Mini :P
03.50.54 #       <__builtin> I'm getting some weird crashes when connecting USb
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03.54.57 #       <_Bilgus> my latest patch touches the USB notify stuff..
03.55.24 #       <__builtin> I'm running a version before your patch, albeit with some of my changes
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03.59.53 #       <_Bilgus> If you forgot to reply with usb_acknowledge(SYS_USB_CONNECTED_ACK); somewhere it can cause some weird stuff
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04.12.01 #       <__builtin> it seems to only happen after running a sgt- plugin
04.12.04 #       <__builtin> big surprise, eh?
04.12.21 #       <__builtin> could you try and reproduce this?
04.12.50 #       <__builtin> basically start an sgt- game, play it, close it, and plug USB
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04.23.03 #       <_Bilgus> yeah I think I have something with a recent compile
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04.27.10 #       <__builtin> darn, probably the plugin buffer or something
04.27.16 #       <__builtin> this is on the Mini?
04.28.33 #       <_Bilgus> I can't reproduce with the clipzip
04.28.51 #       <_Bilgus> strife has the mini
04.31.07 #       <__builtin> wait, what device did you have that was causing issues?
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04.33.41 #       <_Bilgus> sorry I was saying I might have a device with a recent build I tried the clip+ zip and fuze plus no issues so I'd say its probably not a general issue
04.34.01 #       <__builtin> oh
04.34.45 #       * _Bilgus needs to learn to IRC apparently
04.36.31 #       <__builtin> speaking of which, do experts get rockbox/staff cloaks?
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04.39.25 #       <_Bilgus> Not that I know of I asked in freenode for the one I'm under
04.39.58 #       <_Bilgus> I was using TOR but that was getting downright unstable
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05.51.18 #       <[Saint]> __builtin, Soap, Strife89: could you take a look at these please?
05.51.30 #       <[Saint]> I have made the changes that we discussed.
05.51.51 #       <[Saint]> Do these suit? Please scroll right down, as there is a set of viewers icons there now as well.
05.52.01 #       <[Saint]> I would appreciate your input.
05.52.17 #       <[Saint]> copper: I'm sorry, I forgot to tag you in this. Please see above.
05.52.54 #       <[Saint]> Bonus points to anyone who can spot the easter egg I have included.
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05.55.56 #       <Strife89> [Saint], using the same Imgur link from earlier? I don't see anything new/different there ...
05.57.18 #       <[Saint]> bah, I'm an idiot. https://imgur.com/a/rEpMh
05.57.25 #       <[Saint]> there we go mate. sorry.
05.58.08 #       <[Saint]> If there is anything else you think that I should change, please let me know.
05.58.33 #       <[Saint]> I'm doing this for the community, but I figure there'
05.58.41 #       <[Saint]> s nothing wrong with a little nepotism
05.58.54 #       <[Saint]> You guys are community too. ;)
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06.46.53 #       <Strife89> [Saint]: Yeah, I like those icons more
06.47.58 #       <[Saint]> I'm about to package it all up as a standalone icon pack so people can try them out.
06.48.13 #       <[Saint]> I have to go out for a few hours, but I'll get it done after that.
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09.32.11 #       <[Saint]> Here we go, first look:
09.32.12 #       <[Saint]> https://imgur.com/a/4z4DE
09.32.55 #       <[Saint]> It's not doing anything fancy yet, I don't have a .wps, .rwps, or .fms yet.
09.33.24 #       <[Saint]> just the .sbs for now, well...the .wps template is there and it has a status bar but no other content.
09.34.16 #       <[Saint]> I think it looks very clean and modern, but obviously I'm biased.
09.34.47 #       <[Saint]> I'm using the "rockbox yellow" and "rockbox grey" as well as black as a recurring theme throughout the screens.
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09.37.20 #       <[Saint]> the theme detects and adapts font sizes from 24, 32, 48, 64 and 96
09.38.49 #       <[Saint]> so /in theory/ anything that's currently using a ~24pt font or can comfortably can load the same theme as xxxxhdpi displays.
09.39.19 #       <[Saint]> I've tested it in 4k with 96pt font and 96px icons and it actually looked very nice.
09.39.55 #       <[Saint]> also on 1440p and 1080p w/ 64 and 48px fonts and icons respectively.
09.41.16 #       <[Saint]> Normally there would be a battery display there too, but it's not being shown on a desktop in SDL. Theme also works with touch though very few touch actions are implemented so far.
09.41.44 #       <[Saint]> Anyway, that's the story up until now.
09.42.34 #       <gevaerts> How's your macro processor to handle all this coming along?
09.43.42 #       <[Saint]> The logic to do it all is fairly sound, the only thing I can't do as a physical limitation of the skin engine is switch the icons at the same time as the font.
09.44.40 #       <[Saint]> but I can do that with touchscreen as that has a settings_set function, so I can let the user set the display size between xxs, xs, s, m, l, and xxl from within the theme.
09.45.11 #       <[Saint]> on non-touch targets people are going to have to load the main theme and a theme that does nothing but set the icon size.
09.45.58 #       <[Saint]> I would still very much like to store arbitrary values in a theme .cfg and refer to them from the theme engine, but I can do without that.
09.46.50 #       <[Saint]> Eventually once everything is bolted down I need to think about letting checkwps ignore it because it does a lot of things that checkwps doesn't allow.
09.47.29 #       <[Saint]> like shipping multiple .cfg files and shipping files that aren't explicitly referred to.
09.49.09 #       <[Saint]> the biggest challenge for me so far was localizing the status bar.
09.49.56 #       <[Saint]> It took me forever to get that right but now it handles rtl and ltr text and automatically left or right justifies values and self heals missing values.
09.50.23 #       <[Saint]> the logic to get that done is about 600 characters
09.50.47 #       <[Saint]> one giant single line conditional function.
09.51.29 #       <gevaerts> How much CPU does the theme use when idle? :)
09.52.16 #       <[Saint]> 22% idle, lol
09.52.41 #       <[Saint]> switching between screens and watching it in htop it jumps up to ~40% utilization.
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09.52.52 #       <[Saint]> that might be a bit of a problem.
09.53.12 #       <[Saint]> screen switching on the lower powered targets might just blink visibly.
09.53.24 #       <[Saint]> it won't be super super slow, but it won't be super fast either.
09.53.53 #       <[Saint]> you might see some visible loading in the battery, volume and titlebar.
09.53.54 #       <[Saint]> maybe.
09.54.10 #       <[Saint]> I'll test it out on a real world target sometime tomorrow.
09.55.02 #       <[Saint]> it's using 1.2MB of RAM currently, but that's really not terrible seeing as how it has a giant font loaded right now.
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09.56.56 #       <[Saint]> yeah, 1.206588MB total.
09.57.03 #       <[Saint]> not bad, but it will get worse.
09.57.41 #       <[Saint]> I should think it will sit at about 4MB with everything loaded using the 32pt assets
09.57.58 #       <gevaerts> Wait. When you say 1.206588MB, did you take earlier discussions about MiB vs MB into account?
09.58.55 #       <[Saint]> ok...1206588b :p
09.59.08 #       <[Saint]> no ambiguity there.
09.59.39 #       <gevaerts> Really? Lowercase b might (and usually does!) mean "bit"! :)
10.00.16 #       <[Saint]> Anyway, what do you think gevaerts? petur? __builtin, Strife89, copper, and JdGordon?
10.00.38 #       <[Saint]> here we go, because I ranted heaps: https://imgur.com/a/4z4DE
10.00.53 #       <JdGordon> ?
10.01.32 #       * gevaerts wonders
10.01.39 #       <gevaerts> Is that a paint roller icon?
10.02.45 #       <gevaerts> Anyway, it's the same as usual I suspect. On first contact I never really like new UIs, then I get used to them, and then I can't stand the old ones
10.03.18 #       <gevaerts> So it's hard to say
10.03.42 #       <[Saint]> why yes, it is a paint rollor.
10.03.55 #       <gevaerts> "While Painting Screen"
10.04.17 #       * gevaerts doesn't understand icon set choices sometimes
10.05.11 #       <[Saint]> I just tried to replicate tango! for now.
10.05.23 #       <[Saint]> I've made a hit list going through the screens now though.
10.05.44 #       <[Saint]> seeing them actually applied I now know what I need to change and where.
10.05.50 #       <[Saint]> I never thought some of the Tango! icons made any sense to begin with.
10.05.56 #       <[Saint]> but it made a decent starting point.
10.06.10 #       <gevaerts> Well, I mean the original MD set
10.06.34 #       <[Saint]> oh.
10.06.55 #       <[Saint]> I think most of them are designed to be kinda ambiguous so they can convey a specific meaning /in context/.
10.07.27 #       <gevaerts> Oh, indeed, but what's in there and what isn't seems so random
10.07.27 #       <copper> hehe
10.07.38 #       <[Saint]> they don't mean much by themselves but with a setting header and derived context with what you're trying to do or expect to happen they can convey a lot of meaning.
10.07.44 #       <gevaerts> The other day we were looking at icons for work. We needed cycling, walking, driving, horse riding. A consistent set ideally. Good luck!
10.07.51 #       <[Saint]> but, yeah, there's at least four of them that I'll be changing.
10.07.54 #       <copper> the L's are wrong with that font rendering
10.08.16 #       <copper> the i and l and too close to one another in "Files"
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10.08.36 #       <copper> (which is why I never use antialiased fonts)
10.08.47 #       <copper> the icons are fine though!
10.09.11 #       <[Saint]> I've just spun up that font quickly, that's another thing I need to fine tune through observation.
10.09.48 #       <[Saint]> I need to add ~2% padding to each glyph in the RobotoRegular font.
10.10.23 #       <[Saint]> I also need to get it to monospace the numeric glyphs, but that's easy enough.
10.10.52 #       <[Saint]> This is the first real time I've seen all the parts come together myself, so I'm learning too and taking feedback and observations.
10.11.13 #       <[Saint]> That "rockbox yellow" is really something as a hero/accent colour.
10.11.14 #       <[Saint]> wow.
10.15.44 #       <[Saint]> But, yeah, on touchscreen themes there's going to be an overflow panel that will let you set the theme asset size from within the theme itself.
10.16.06 #       <[Saint]> I have the guts of it kinda working in my wip branch.
10.19.14 #       <[Saint]> The plan is to get most of the .wps done tomorrow, which will also get most of the .fms done in turn due to their similarities.
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10.40.06 #       <pixelma> I find white on orange text hard to read, I would probably let the text stay black (the line already is highlighted with the background colour change). I also think that there could be a bit more padding between icon and text. Just my 2 cents (even though I haven't been asked) ;)
10.44.52 #       <copper> But it's a touchscreen interface, though, right?
10.45.13 #       <copper> Doesn't the highlight appear only for a fraction of a second as the user taps the menu entry?
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11.38.49 #       <fs-bluebot> Build Server message: 3New build round started. Revision aced667, 273 builds, 11 clients.
11.43.46 #       <pixelma> copper: maybe also the "active" line when you scroll through a list longer than screen height
11.45.11 #       <pixelma> can't remember how it was, been trying Rockbox as an App when I still had an old enough Android version installed on my phone
11.56.59 #       <fs-bluebot> Build Server message: 3Build round completed after 1090 seconds.
11.57.00 #       <fs-bluebot> Build Server message: 3Revision aced667 result: 430 errors 285 warnings
12.09.42 #       <fs-bluebot> Build Server message: 3New build round started. Revision 12bc24a, 273 builds, 11 clients.
12.22.43 #       <fs-bluebot> Build Server message: 3Build round completed after 781 seconds.
12.22.44 #       <fs-bluebot> Build Server message: 3Revision 12bc24a result: All green
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14.32.41 #       <fs-bluebot> Build Server message: 3New build round started. Revision f4c4221, 273 builds, 12 clients.
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14.42.48 #       <fs-bluebot> Build Server message: 3Revision f4c4221 result: All green
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15.38.09 #       <Riku> my ipod classic isn't connecting in mass storage mode and it seems to be charging extremely slowly if at all over USB
15.40.20 #       <Riku> it's also been behaving like it's posessed, it was scrolling up and down without any input from me
15.41.04 #       <Riku> I suspect a corrupted rockbox install but I can't exactly flash a new one if it won't go in mass storage mode
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16.21.51 #       <Riku> the battery seems to be floating between 9% and 10% but not really charging
16.44.17 #       <Riku> it seems to have cleared itself up
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16.55.55 #       <Strife89> [Saint]: (logs) Seems good to me, so far
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17.17.51 #       <Strife89> Why is there no Rockboy.rock in the 3.14 release .zip for the iPod Mini 1G?
17.19.01 #       <Strife89> Or in the current dev build? (f4c4221)
17.22.10 #       <Strife89> I'm guessing it's disabled for the target, but I'm wondering what the exact reason for that is.
17.25.53 #       <pixelma> *IIR*C the Mini has a yet different greyscale display which needs a different drawing mechanism and that has never been implemented. I forgot the details
17.26.45 #       <pixelma> I mean for Rockboy
17.27.38 #       <pixelma> https://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7546
17.28.02 #       <pixelma> seems like it was never completed
17.29.09 #       <pixelma> ^ Strife89
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23.39.31 #       <Strife89> pixelma: Ooof, that patch is old
23.39.43 #       <Strife89> Wonder if it'll patch in to the current source ...