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Subject: Re: Onkyo S-5300 and iPod Nano 1g

Re: Onkyo S-5300 and iPod Nano 1g

From: Hayden Pearce <>
Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2011 18:03:22 +1200

On Monday, 5 September 2011, Jammit Timmaj <> wrote:
> ---- My response at the bottom ----
> From:
> To:
> Subject: RE: Onkyo S-5300 and iPod Nano 1g
> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2011 15:16:08 -0400
> Thanks! Good idea... Will try that and see what happens. Just wondering,
any way i can get iTunes to recognize the music on the pod already and add
> THX, D!J!X!
> ________________________________
> From: []
On Behalf Of Jammit Timmaj
> Sent: Saturday, September 03, 2011 3:03 PM
> To:
> Subject: RE: Onkyo S-5300 and iPod Nano 1g
> I'm not an expert on Rockbox, and I don't have an Onkyo s5300 so I
probably don't have the right answer. I see the Onkyo is using a Buur-Brown
DAC in it. Normally I don't think this would be a problem, but I believe
Onkyo has made a deal with Apple to allow them to use the Apple proprietary
database on the iPod to pull the music off of the iPod via the USB
connection and using their own DAC to directly convert digital to audio. The
iPod dock you're probably using doesn't do that. It pulls the audio not from
the USB, but from the analog part that's built into the dock with the USB.
When the Onkyo tries to read the iPod database, it sees there's nothing in
the database and gives up. You may want to add a few test songs to the iPod
via iTunes just to see if it works. If it does work you need a way to edit
the proprietary iPod database that's on the iPod to point to the Rockbox
files. I'd probably just move the music onto the computer, remove the music
from Rockbox, add the music back to the iPod via iTunes and the iPod normal
OS. After transferring the music to the iPod the Apple way, reboot into
Rockbox and have it rescan for your music.That way, both Apple OS and
Rockbox have the same data.
> ________________________________
> From:
> To:
> Subject: Onkyo S-5300 and iPod Nano 1g
> Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2011 04:10:38 -0400
> My Onkyo s-5300 home theater comes with an accessory iPod dock. When I
dock my iPod nano 1g (running the latest iPod firmware and the latest
Rockbox official release) to my regular iPod docks, the iPod works with no
problems; meaning it plays instantly.
> However, if I turn on or restart the iPod and dock it onto the s-5300's
dock, nothing will happen. I've checked the manual, tried everything I know
of, including turning the TV on before docking etc, diferent power on
orders, still no audible playback, though rockbox shows the wps and is
actually playing the music, since you can hear it through the headphones if
you plug them in.
> If I put it on one of my regular iPod docks though, restart rockbox, start
playback of a song, then undock it from that dock and move it back to my
s-5300's dock, after about 30 secs or more, it'll start playing like
nothing. It however won't dock at all to my s-5300's dock unless I go
through the hassle of docking it on a regular iPod dock first and then
moving it over.
> My question is, what could the cause be? I don't think it has to do with
rb, just wondering if there's some settings I can look at, or if there's
something I should do different? Could it be an issue with the ht's dock?
Perhaps the iPod?
> Not sure why it works when the iPod is first docked and restarted on a
normal iPod dock. But if after it's working on the s-5300's dock, if I
restart it again, it won't work. The iPod does turn on, load rockbox etc,
but there's just no audible playback, so I have to do the same thing, take
it to a regular dock, dock it, restart it, start playback, then move it
back. Is there a startup flag or something that let's the pod know its
docked? How does rockbox handle docks, is it officially supported? As I
said, this is the first time I've encountered this, both of my regular docks
work fine though.
> Also, when the s-5300's dock is working, I should be able to control it
via the home theater, however that doesn't work either. Could this part be
related to the fact that rockbox responds differently to remote/dock
commands, or it perhaps doesn't support that feature?
> Sorry for the confusing explanations and bunch of questions, just trying
to give as many details as I can to reproduce the issue, since most people
might not know exactly what I'm talking about. I'm just trying to see if
anybody's ever encountered this problem/situation, or if anybody has any
ideas etc. I haven't loaded the iPod firmware and taken it for a spin on the
s-5300's dock directly, since I use rockbox exclusively, but I might try
that when I get a chance.
> Any thoughts, comments, suggestions, questions or ideas welcome!
> TIA, D!J!X!
> P.S. This is not such a big deal to me, but it's the first thing I find
that this awesome firmware (rockbox) can't do, so just want to see if I can
fix it or at least find the issue if it's not rb related.
> I put my response at the bottom because this list has a rule about
replying to a post by appending to the bottom. I noticed that your response
and my response wasn't posted like that. I thought I did respond at the
bottom, but it looks like I or my email program messed that up, and I hope
that this is at the bottom like its supposed to be. I also hope this doesn't
confuse anybody. If this response does get messed up and reposts this at the
top, I apologize to the list and will try and fix it.
> To your question about getting iTunes to recognize songs on the iPod under
Rockbox being recognized, that may be really difficult. Rockbox doesn't use
any external programs (external means you don't need to have anything
installed on a computer) to index the music. Rockbox searches itself for
music and adds a "link" to the song in its own database. The Apple OS
doesn't do this. When you sync with iTunes, iTunes not only copies the music
onto the iPod, but also adds a "link" to the song on the iPods database.
When you tell iTunes to play a song, the Apple OS only reads the database
and doesn't look for anything else. When you add a song under Rockbox and
then tell Apple OS to play, the Apple OS won't "see" anything because not
only does Rockbox not need another program to tell it where the music is,
but any program we make that runs on a computer would need to understand how
Apple writes this database of "links", and this database isn't done in any
easy or normal way.
> The easiest way to setup a dual Rockbox/Apple OS is:
> Tell the iPod to boot into Apple OS.
> Plug the iPod into the computer.
> When iTunes starts, ignore it and minimize it for now.
> Open "My Computer" and navigate to where you copied the music to the iPod.
> Copy the music from Rockbox onto the computer. You probably want to make a
new directory on the computer.
> Delete the music from Rockbox, but keep Rockbox installed.
> Go back to iTunes and tell it you want to manually manage music.
> Add the directory you just made on the computer to iTunes.
> Tell iTunes to sync the iPod.
> After iTunes does the copy, eject the iPod in the normal way.
> Reboot the iPod into Rockbox (if it hasn't booted that way after
> Tell Rockbox to rescan for music.
> This way may have a lot of steps, but is known to work. Any method of
recursively adding music from the iPod to iTunes and back to the iPod would
probably cause an infinite loop, and Apple has prevented iTunes from doing
this. Even if you were able to recursively add music from the iPod back onto
it, iTunes makes a copy on the iPod with a different name and then you'd
have two copies. If you went back into the iPod and deleted the original
copies, iTunes would see you deleted the originals and the delete the copies
it just made on the iPod.

You might want to note that this way *only* works if you're using the
Database, the option to use the File Browser to play your music is now gone
if you go with this method.


Received on 2011-09-05

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